[Origin of European 2/6] Aurignacians and Population of Europe in Ice Age

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ย. 2024

ความคิดเห็น • 135

  • @theowlfromduolingo7982
    @theowlfromduolingo7982 2 ปีที่แล้ว +52

    Love the overall theme of this channel, the individual topics, the detailed information and the effort you put into your videos. But the sfx like 6:16 are too loud sometimes (also try adding cross fades) and therefore distracting and if possible try to get a real human voice (with good sound quality) for the voice over. This would add both more personality and professionalism.
    Just my thoughts and feedback. Keep it up

    • @jorgeo4483
      @jorgeo4483 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      To the author: The Neanderthals, who are part of us, lived in three areas, The Ice Limit, where animals passed seasonally. In areas with a microclimate and hunting and in areas close to the sea since they were the first to cross areas without seeing land on the horizon, so they began to navigate and there are sites like Gibraltar where we see that they lived quite well thanks to the sea. Therefore, calculating its population is always an erroneous count, since its main settlements today are under the sea. They had the same preference for the sea as us.

  • @LuisAldamiz
    @LuisAldamiz 2 ปีที่แล้ว +21

    I refuse to believe in such small populations. Granted that it is the Aurignacian and not yet the Magdalenian but in this later Upper Paleolithic phase, any district over here (Biscay) would have hosted some 100 people (whose living habits are very precisely tracked via archaeology), probably 4x that figure in what I call the Paleolithic Metropolis of Europe: Dordogne. So, we quickly run into thousands, the Franco-Cantabrian Region alone should have many thousands.
    The Hadza people are at least one thousand and they live in a very small territory of Tanzania, where they can only hunt baboons most of the time, not even big game is usually available to them.
    I haven't yet read this paper but I did read the similar one: Jean-Pierre Bocquet-Appel et al. "Estimates of Upper Palaeolithic meta-population size in Europe from archaeological data". (Journal of Archaeological Sciences 2005). Lost the link but discussed it here 12 years ago: forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/2010/10/revisiting-bocquet-appel-2005.html
    He made the case for three quite different range estimates and not just one and I strongly lean for the highest variant, instead this paper seems rather favorable (why?) towards the lowest range. So, if in the lowest range, the Franco-Cantabrian Region would have (LGM, coldest era) some 1500 people, while in the upper range it'd be rather 25,000, what in my understanding is much much more reasonable.
    For Mediterranean Iberia it'd be 170 to 2700 and, honestly I can't fathom only 170 people (one or two clans) living in such vast area, which was quite attractive in this Solutrean deepest cold spell. For Central Europe (essentially Moravia, which acted as areal refuge very clearly), the lowest range is also ridiculously low: 280 people only, while the upper range is a more comfortable 4500. No figures are given for Italy and Eastern Europe, where we do know that people lived as well, but the density plots would suggest a dozen or so in the lowest range, what is too small a population to be viable, but maybe several hundreds in the upper range (a more credible figure IMO).

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      I am well aware that this is a very controversial topic. However, in a recent common study, it is known as an orthodoxy that mankind was on the verge of extinction at one time during the Ice Age. I want to believe it.

    • @LuisAldamiz
      @LuisAldamiz 2 ปีที่แล้ว +6

      @@geonomad1 - Meh. As far as I can discern you may mean the Toba supervolcano episode, which was long before any colonization of Europe (74 Ka ago vs 52 Ka ago per the latest data).
      The reality is that's almost certainly hype: while Toba had indeed a major impact in Asia (South and SE) and surely caused bottlenecks among the population already there (but not yet in Europe, which was then under Neanderthal control, as was West and Central Asia), it doesn't seem it had any major impact in Africa anyhow. It was an important crisis but I'm pretty sure it did not bring Humanity near-extinction at all. It did cause major cullings in South and SE Asia almost certainly but nowhere near extinction and that's apparent in the mtDNA trail (and maybe less apparently in the Y-DNA one).
      This is my best reconstruction of the coloniation of Asia by our species, Toba catastrophe slowing down of expansion included: forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/p/continuing-with-joint-series-in-spanish.html
      Here a synthesis in English of another more extensive work I made with a profesional prehistorian from Spain (scroll down for Asia): forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/2013/04/synthesis-of-spanish-language-series-on.html
      This is an old article explaining why the Toba mega-catastrophe hype should be disregarded as unreal: www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22355515 -> "... the investigation finds no changes in the composition of the sediments that would indicate a significant dip in temperatures in East Africa concurrent with the Toba eruption".
      There was anyhow another major supervolcano c. 39 Ka ago in South Italy, which surely helped to get Neanderthals near extinction and also several modern human cultures (at the very least the Uluzzian). It's more or less coincident with the rapid expansion of Aurignacian culture but AFAIK the dates are more recent for the supervolcano. While these supervolcanos were clearly seriously impactful, enough people survived even in the worst afected continental regions.

    • @colddarkness1798
      @colddarkness1798 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      ​@@LuisAldamizchill. Europeans are modern Europeans. Skoll! Slava!

    • @LuisAldamiz
      @LuisAldamiz ปีที่แล้ว

      @@colddarkness1798 - Whatever you may mean...
      Meh!

  • @k0ziolRD
    @k0ziolRD 2 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    Pls, dont make music so loud like in 8:50. Its like when you watch tv and then commercials start and they are 2x louder.
    Very curious video, do more!

  • @aresaurelian
    @aresaurelian 2 ปีที่แล้ว +18

    We can only estimate population in prehistoric times from sites already found and excavated. We therefore realize that there must have been more sites fluctuating and people moving around more using nomadic lifestyles. We can appreciate that the number of people living in as remote areas as Europe during the ice ages were low and most likely nomadic. There will be almost no remains or ruins to explore from those people just as there are no remains or ruins from Inuit like people - rationalized from the ice age lifestyles around the ice sheets and extensive glaciers. This also suggests that the number of areas were to find remains is low and mostly delegated to arid areas with low weather and climate impact on remains and ruins.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

      Yes. Population estimates still have such limitations.

    • @williamjordan5554
      @williamjordan5554 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      I'm sure mathematical calculations based on probability are involved.

    • @waynemarvin5661
      @waynemarvin5661 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      I agree, Ares. I had the same thought. If one discovers ten settlement areas, it may be an error to assume that one is dealing with ten groups. It could, for instance, be showing one group traveling to ten different sites while hunting, for instance. The population could have been much lower than we suppose.

    • @susannebrunberg4174
      @susannebrunberg4174 ปีที่แล้ว

      ​@@norml.hugh-mann
      And do we really have facts? No, we have some artefacts from some settlements, but we can't say for sure "this is the fact". We aren't that stupid.
      What was before the latest ice-age in regions affected, we can only make assumptions, theories etc. Simply because the heavy ice would have erased all evidence of 99% accuracy.

  • @jupphainkas3070
    @jupphainkas3070 2 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    I have just randomly found your channel and I'm so glad! Please keep up your great work🙏

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      thank you. It takes a lot of time to find and verify papers for video production, but I will do my best to make good episodes.

  • @fulhamchappie
    @fulhamchappie ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Looks like Basque / RH neg correlations

  • @dc8029
    @dc8029 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Well done sir! Fanfreakingtastic analysis and content.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      thank you. I also found the thesis interesting.

  • @y-dnkzokialeksic516
    @y-dnkzokialeksic516 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    In 1896, geologist Jovan Cvijic proved that the lakes of the northern Balkans originated after the glacial ice period.And that would mean that the Dfb zone was a zone of permanent ice, where there were no people and no normal life for them.And even this comment does not detract from your very accurate conclusions and story.Well done, we're looking at you.

  • @dontrotter1099
    @dontrotter1099 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    Nice info. some basic words or thoughts mis construed by your translator. Dont do the music thingy, way too loud, nasty surprise. other then those issues, pretty good.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Thanks for your kind advice.
      From the next episode, we will do more thorough verification.

    • @stefansoder6903
      @stefansoder6903 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@geonomad1 Why dont you narrate it with your own voice?

    • @miketackabery7521
      @miketackabery7521 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@stefansoder6903 creator may not be comfortable doing that, and it's probably too expensive to get someone else to do it. This video was hard for me to follow because the narrative was full of unfamiliar information, and it went too fast in a difficult to understand voice (odd pronunciations).A shame because the information looked to be really interesting.

  • @stevenfritz6891
    @stevenfritz6891 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Awesome!! Eye opening information! Well done!

  • @eleidal
    @eleidal ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Great video but the update sounds are so annoying! 😢

  • @csabakis4214
    @csabakis4214 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I am a bit confused - several times in the vid it is said annual average temperature of 22 Celsius ... eh ... what? That is tropics by far ... so ... what? And australian core areas ... eh ... what? Confused again? Correct me on these, thanks!

  • @Miki-fl9ez
    @Miki-fl9ez 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Haplogroup C existed in Europe. Today exists in remote places in Eurasia/Oceania (Mongolia & Australia).
    Seems that long ago was dominant

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Haplogroup C is one of the oldest genes.

    • @Miki-fl9ez
      @Miki-fl9ez 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@peacetrain5623 Interesting question.
      I noticed a pattern.
      They seem to like living in far away places like Mongolia or Aboriginal Australia.
      They sparsely populate those areas. And are prone to ride horses or hunt over long distances. Not settling in a particular place.
      Different from lets say, Chinese, who organize themselves in big numbers and form crowded cities.
      It's very likely that they got surpassed in numbers and were isolated from the centers of civilization.

    • @Miki-fl9ez
      @Miki-fl9ez 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@peacetrain5623 They just didn't want to be among people.
      Maybe pressured by F

  • @robertgotschall1246
    @robertgotschall1246 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    I've been following Dan Davis and his discussions on neolithic Europe. I thought that he was dense. It's interesting to compare his story in archeology to the genomics story. I always wondered where Conan the Barbarian came from,

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Interesting facts emerge as ancient DNA is analyzed and applied to history.

  • @Ch0ckl8
    @Ch0ckl8 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Great video, one question though: I feel like the extended Po Valley is omitted in these chapters. Evidence is probably hard to come by but shouldn't we assume that there might be something under the Adriatic sea?

  • @shibolinemress8913
    @shibolinemress8913 ปีที่แล้ว

    Please consider removing any "ding" sounds from your videos. I'm never sure if they're from you or my phone...

  • @jakeeasterling3501
    @jakeeasterling3501 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    What a mi d bending watch . Thank you

  • @McClarinJ
    @McClarinJ 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    Until the archaeology of the ice-age seacoast is known it is a bit silly to devise European population estimates of that time. Human populations have long been greatest along the seacoast and that might well have been the case during the ice age. The reason is two-fold. The sea is an abundant source of protein and, for those who have mastered it, an unequaled medium for travel. We are constantly pushing back the timeline of oceanic travel with new discoveries. Could it have existed during the ice age? If so, such a population would be concentrated in areas now under more than 100 meters of seawater and could have been eradicated by the very rapid rise of sea levels at the end of the ice age. Until undersea archaeology reveals the facts, human population estimates are highly speculative.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      I know that scholars are putting a lot of effort into estimating the population of the Ice Age. But not everyone can know for sure. Among the published papers, I introduced the contents of the papers I thought were reasonable.

  • @invit87
    @invit87 2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Nice video but those pop up sound are annoying.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      I'll try to improve it from the next episode.

    • @carterghill
      @carterghill 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@geonomad1 Thank you for listening to this person's feedback. I kept thinking a tab or app I had open was making the noise haha. Not super annoying once you know, but they do seem out of place I guess. Great video though, keep it up :)

  • @nickkuiper32
    @nickkuiper32 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Nice and interesting content! The android talking to me angers me, though. Voice it yourself (or at least a human being) and I am sure this channel will become something great!

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      As the channel grows, we will have a good narrator.

  • @jorgebarriosmur
    @jorgebarriosmur 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    5.000 sapiens, aded to the few neandertahls that were alive at this time (even in their peak, when they didn`t have to share the area with sapiens-populations their population was estimated to be max. 10.000).....
    For a modern eye this is like saying that Europe was an empty place.....
    Probably you could have traveled weeks without seeing another human beeing.....if you were looking for one

  • @canaryinacoalmine7267
    @canaryinacoalmine7267 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I understand you want a world audience, that's why you are using Celsius in the spoken dialogue, but, perhaps you could do a popup of the translation of Celsius to Fahrenheit?
    This is really interesting video.
    Great job.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Thank you. From the next video, we will display both Celsius and Fahrenheit.

    • @adamlouw9575
      @adamlouw9575 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

      @@geonomad1 Don't do that, they need to learn

    • @mikiohirata9627
      @mikiohirata9627 2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      imperial system needs to go. That's what makes kids from those countries that use imperial system to fall behind countries that uses metric system.
      They will learn how logical the metric system is.

    • @baassiia
      @baassiia ปีที่แล้ว

      @Canary O Celius is when water Freeze, so all vegetasion stop, how hard is to remember that??? Fahrenheit's are not convienient and make no sense...

  • @missadel20
    @missadel20 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    Looks like a new channel, love your content matter!!! Subscribed

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Thank you very much.

    • @jeroendijstelblom8614
      @jeroendijstelblom8614 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@geonomad1 thanks for your insights 🍀

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Thanks 😊 🙏 😊 🙏

  • @Super33Saiyan
    @Super33Saiyan 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Your videos are fantastic however you seriously need to reduce the volume of the notification type of sounds you add, the neanderthal video was too much sound effects... Please reduce them as they are interesting

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      I will improve it from the next episode.

  • @yusufkarahan8853
    @yusufkarahan8853 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    exellent work bro/i like it

  • @pattyshobbyworld2851
    @pattyshobbyworld2851 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Amazing research

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      👍👍👍👍👍👍😂

  • @therearenoshortcuts9868
    @therearenoshortcuts9868 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    if people lived in communities of 50-200 ppl
    that's about 100-25 communities in total...
    thats only a few villages in a vast continent ... one can easily get lost in that wilderness... wow

  • @thirdeyefocus6255
    @thirdeyefocus6255 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    The graphics are well done and good research, but I agree that the voice over is not very good. Too many spoken numbers (better display them on screen) and the computer voice is too monotonous.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Thank you for your sincere advice. From the next video onwards, I will make it with your advice in mind.

  • @pat8988
    @pat8988 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Interesting video, but the sound engineer needs to be fired…

  • @Вячеслав-ц1я5я
    @Вячеслав-ц1я5я 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Спасибо большое!

  • @marcorighi2156
    @marcorighi2156 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    One mistake on the maps;
    Black sea don't existed Before 12,000-15,000 years ago

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Thanks for pointing out something I didn't know.

    • @nade1231
      @nade1231 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@geonomad1 it was small lake - little bit more small.. afer from mediteranean - came water - and became more big...
      but chekc more clearly

  • @rogerdodger8813
    @rogerdodger8813 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Using Fahrenheit and describing European temperatures??????

  • @An-kw3ec
    @An-kw3ec ปีที่แล้ว

    Very interesting how climate in europe used to be more similar to north america and East Asia nowdays at the same latitudes. In Canada you already get permafrost at the level of England. In Asia there's continental climate at the level of Greece. It is imposible to find mild winters like southern sweden in the Hudson's bay Canada despite sharing latitude.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  ปีที่แล้ว

      If you watch the linked video, it will help you understand why there is a difference in temperature at the same latitude. th-cam.com/video/DXmqdJrGbj4/w-d-xo.html

  • @petarpan4234
    @petarpan4234 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Serbian civilization Lepenski Vir 9500BC and Vinca culture 5500BC, Starcevo culture 6200BC, Blagotin culture, Cucuteni Tripoli culture...

    • @Trontotario
      @Trontotario 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      None of these cultures were even related to each other lol

  • @mehowi
    @mehowi 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    looks like we still dont know much about anything

  • @WorkWithoutHuman
    @WorkWithoutHuman 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Greece is not in Europe? There are cities 40,000 years old and wall at the coast 80,000 years old. And you have shown zero dots on the map. I wonder.
    And Balkan peninsula only few dots at Bulgaria, while at Bosnia there are advanced structures you can't build even today, 20,000-30,000 years ago, and you have shown zero dots on the map, they can't be built with 5,000 as you told, so many thousands tons of cement.
    There are caves and tunnels and cities during the cold (ice-age) in undergrounds all over Europe, with underground farms/plants, WC's with recycling tech for the wastes and bathrooms on 9 degrees celzius (underground is everywhere that temperature-Earth) with water from condensation. You need more to research ... no offence.
    But you gave effort so I give 2/5.

    • @listenup2882
      @listenup2882 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      It's in the Middle East.

    • @WorkWithoutHuman
      @WorkWithoutHuman 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@listenup2882 What is Middle East? I though it's in Middle West.
      A? ok. And where is the middle mid? Center ? ah, ok, np

  • @zsoltpapp3363
    @zsoltpapp3363 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    How did Europes population grown to 1 billion? I dunno buddy, its like 5 seconds to look such things up

  • @_Artem
    @_Artem ปีที่แล้ว

    There is too small text for my iPhone XR on 7:50

  • @SIZModig
    @SIZModig 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    Oof the music when there is no narration is super loud.

  • @larryprimeau5885
    @larryprimeau5885 ปีที่แล้ว

    sound affects are way way too loud. I mean, come on.

  • @ronaldderooij1774
    @ronaldderooij1774 ปีที่แล้ว

    I had the Köppen climate charts in high school by virtue of choosing geography as one of my subjects. But that is a long time ago. A bit more elaboration would have helped. And to say that modern dispertion of people resemble the stone age dispertion in Europe is just wrong. It follows from the changes in climate and mainly river routes.

  • @augustiniumihaila4466
    @augustiniumihaila4466 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    I have big doubts about accuracy of this estimates. Seems that are some geographical facts that were ignored.....

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      The video was created based on the materials introduced in the academic journal. It was too long ago to estimate the population accurately, but a reasonably scientific approach was used to model the model. Other studies also report that modern humans in the Ice Age were almost on extinction.

  • @qovzaliterallegend4926
    @qovzaliterallegend4926 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    why did i thought that was an video for Ice Age the movie lmao

  • @rn4n63r
    @rn4n63r 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    pls lower volume on sounds and music.

  • @Aloisio799
    @Aloisio799 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    These people are not related to modern Europeans.

  • @Naturalook
    @Naturalook ปีที่แล้ว

    Decent material, some of it a bit postured, some parts contrived… …you need a better script…

  • @CarapaxSPb
    @CarapaxSPb 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    The population curve is more like our population knowledge curve, just look from right to left...

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Oh that's right. good.👍👍👍

  • @charelldrivessocal953
    @charelldrivessocal953 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Couldn't finish listening. The computer voice is too annoying.

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      sorry. I hope you understand.

  • @knotkool1
    @knotkool1 ปีที่แล้ว

    we are still in the ice age. humans have never existed outside of it.

  • @DanielKoolboy
    @DanielKoolboy 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    😱💫

  • @johnvoelker4345
    @johnvoelker4345 ปีที่แล้ว

    we are still in an ice age

  • @ljubodragnjagojev6074
    @ljubodragnjagojev6074 2 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    Oldest civilization in Europa was in Vinca, Serbia

    • @geonomad1
      @geonomad1  2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Thank you for the information.

    • @Edvin-gn1hr
      @Edvin-gn1hr 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      600 AD oldest?? Nahhh

    • @mladendjukic1061
      @mladendjukic1061 ปีที่แล้ว +9

      @@Edvin-gn1hr It's from 6500-4000 years BC. Before Vinca, there was Lepenski vir (9000-7500 years BC) and after Vinca there were Starcevo, Vucedol, Cucuteni, Yamnaja and other Danube civilizations. They all originated from the Vinca culture, which was the first civilization to use metalurgy.

    • @memer7118
      @memer7118 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      @@mladendjukic1061 Nothing to do with slavs, serbs have literally no traces of G2a

    • @ezzovonachalm9815
      @ezzovonachalm9815 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      In Vinca there were NO indoeuropeans yet, also NO B'lgurs.

  • @A3Kr0n
    @A3Kr0n 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I don't like computer voices.

  • @ivanmilkovic7719
    @ivanmilkovic7719 ปีที่แล้ว

    Vinčanska kultura Srbija halpogrupa I2a i I1 7500 pne

  • @veronicalogotheti5416
    @veronicalogotheti5416 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    Is art what they left

  • @احمدالريان-ف4ب
    @احمدالريان-ف4ب 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    th-cam.com/video/Kb0V2jhjlR8/w-d-xo.html
    No find niandertal

  • @maddie1446-c6w
    @maddie1446-c6w 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Human is verry funny ❤ all history is corupt 😢😢

  • @kanesozae
    @kanesozae 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    See topic, Really interested, then robotvoice, then block channel.

  • @hesgone6699
    @hesgone6699 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I watched this for 6 minutes and it's crap

  • @miroslavpopov7732
    @miroslavpopov7732 ปีที่แล้ว

    Пещера Бачо Киро , България, пещера Козарника..

  • @dusanzgonc5001
    @dusanzgonc5001 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Dezinformacia.

  • @bullfrog5037
    @bullfrog5037 ปีที่แล้ว

    Down vote for using only the metric system as to both of them.