I suspected the master cylinder until I found one line leak. I had viewed many videos in the last two weeks. Your was the first to say how to test master cylinder in place with two plugs! Thank you for teaching!!!
Glen, I hate to admit to ignorance of this as I pulled wrenches for many years and that was new to me!! Thanks for sharing that as I learned something new....
Trust, there's mechanics out here for 40+ and still learning something new. Tricks of the trade didn't come from a mechanic book or school. Technique comes from the brain, knowledge is power. This a good guy right here.
This is probably the 8th to 10th ABS troubleshooting video I've watched in the last couple of hours, and yet it is the only one that actually showed how to diagnose the ABS Pump itself. Some people jumped to re-soldering joints in the ABS Module and they didn't even mention to try this first. Once you have eliminated; leaks (at each wheel, all the lines, master cyl, brake booster), blown fuses and relays, wiring/connectors/grounds, this should be the next thing to look at.
I have been fighting a slight brake pedal sink for about 5 years. After a ton of break fluid, 2 master cylinders, several trips to the break shop, all I can say is ..... Thank You! My issue is very minimal, and is intermittent. 1 pump of the brakes, and the pedal wont sink, but sometimes the pedal will sink after I've come to a complete stop. A quick pump of the pedal and its solid again. NOW, I know what to do to fix it. You're awesome.
Thanks for another precise explanation of system operation and diagnosis. You do a great job getting your point across with the video. The folks in your area are fortunate to have a good technician like you 👍
I have been rebuilding my 2001 f150 for a while now cleaning the whole thing up and this is the biggest problem that I have had and I think you just rectify that for me God bless you and thank you so much
Thank you. I have been fighting with my 2012 Lincoln Mkz for about 4 months now. I couldn't get any fluids to come out of the brake calipers. Hopefully this method help me diagnose my problem. Great job explaining this 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
That's a stuck open de-pressurisation ('dump') valve in the ABS module... The hole is just a hole on the dry side of the accumulator piston. What's happening here is when the brake pedal is depressed, it's routing master cylinder line pressure straight through the open valve into the sprung accumulator (the 'spring' sound you hear when the piston is pushing the piece if wire out...) Normally this valve only opens as the second stage of ABS intervention after the isolation valve closes first, in order to reduce pressure in the caliper and allow the wheel to rotate again. But in this case it's always open, so master cylinder pressure is just going to move an accumulator piston instead of the pistons in the caliper... I had this same issue on a Nissan GTR on track.
@@ozzstars_cars No problem! The other symptoms I had, which helped give clues on the GTR, was that the brake pedal would get firmer when you drove the car hard and got it to slide on track in the wet, with the stability control still on! This was really confusing, but again what was happening here was the stability control applying assymetric rear brake in the corner, via the ABS motor pump. This is a bit like pumping the brake pedal with your foot, taking up some of the movement in the accumulator and giving a shorter pedal stroke. But the pressure soon bleeds off... Slow down again and the pedal went to the floor again! Only resolved by replacing the module.
@@ozzstars_cars That’s really interesting, sounds right! The ECU software I have for my Nissan doesn’t allow testing individual valves unfortunately, but it runs a complete valve calibration, and it failed on the rear circuit. Funnily enough I had massive problems with overheating front brakes, but the rear pads barely wearing at all…
This is a description on function I was looking for. Now can I rig it? Or just get the valve/pump body? I felt this on my 250 the first time the other day under hard braking with my 7000 lb trailer behind it. I didn't have the warm a fuzzies about it and now I'm here. 😂
Thanks , ur video goes into my '97 E350 rebuild library . Saved me Hours of 2nd guessing myself & my work especially with the camera work on coat hanger
I drove my wife's Kia Sorento after she returned from a trip out of town, and I noticed the brake pedal seemed to have a lot of travel and would sink to the floor if held. I saw somewhere to check master cylinder versus ABS module problem, to drive on a dirt road about 20 MPH and lock up the brakes a few times. If the problem goes away--at least temporarily--the problem is in the ABS module. I tried it and sure enough, the problem went away for about three weeks before returning. Each time I did the locked- brakes thing, the problem stopped, but for shorter and shorter periods. Eventually I got an ABS warning light. The ABS module was $1300 plus labor, so I traded the POS in. KIA mechanics, as I found out over several trips for repairs, are not the upper end of skilled mechanics.
Wow, that's a topic I never understood, thanks for the info! Your method of testing the MC is elegantly simple. I imagine there's a lot of force on the fluid coming out of the MC, so you'd need threaded caps for each end to test it properly. I don't remember those test ports on my GM abs sensor, I'll have to look again. Too bad the replacement is so expensive. Removing the ABS would be more complicated than people think, one would have to add in a diverting valve for safety, it wouldn't be easy.
@daduze, i also have a 2005 w/ this problem. The trk is currently at the mechanic shop for changing out the shift lever cable. I asked the manager to check the brakes - explained the issue and he stated to fix the 'floating brake pedal' would be around $1800....I asked him if the issue would continue to degenerate... he told me it wouldn't - i felt like he didn't want to deal with it....prob. go somewhere else after the shift lever cable is repaired ~ thanks for the vid!!!
the new Master cyl seals worked great but with the engine running the pedal still goes to the floor . A Foxwell NT 630 pro ABS bleed scan tool bleed has improved things but the brakes are still acting up . I need to go find a dirt road and have a play .. maybe the ABS unit just needs a good workout .
Your conclusion appears to be that fluid is leaking into the piston that is effectively a pressure blow-off accumulator. Therefore a valve is not closing completely. Is there a way to nondestructively remove clean/replace the valve?
@@ozzstars_cars Yes. If the valve can be serviced, then no need to replace anything but the valve. It looks like they are press fit, which means some sort of removal and then re-pressing would be required. Removal appears certain to be destructive. And there's a seat that the valve tip contacts. So seat removal also might be necessary. It may be a 5 minute job, but it will take the usual 1000 hours to figure it out the first time, make the necessary pressing tool, etc. It's also possible that a solenoid is not passing current, so the valve is not being held closed. But regardless, that initial time investment may be big.
Was not aware of this trick! Have seen this happen twice before and basically ruled it out by process of elimination and only the ABS module could be the cause but I never knew of a way to test it directly.
The untold Ford ABS pump secret until now! haha It's model specific but I was able to confirm the pump was bad off camera using a scan tool (Autel 906BT) ABS test but figured the DIY test method shown in the video could help the masses. Thanks for stopping by! -Glen
@@ozzstars_cars So if the pump is fine but the module is bad (stuck valve or something) how would you know? Just eliminate all other possibilities? I'm asking because I'm having a sinking pedal issue on a 2014 Fiesta ST and I want to be sure of what the issue is before I start throwing parts and money at it.
@@ozzstars_cars Another question that I never thought about previously, if the ABS is seemingly functioning as it should, but the pedal goes to the floor, can it still be an ABS issue? I still have a gut feeling that it's the ABS module or pump in in some way, because while the ABS engages my pedal is super firm as it should be. To me that seems like confirmation that the master cylinder is not leaking. What are your thoughts?
I just replaced my master cylinder in my 99 burban because I thought that was the problem. If I test this thing and it's busted I hope you have a video on how to bypass it.
on the 1996 E Vans the HCU is under the Drivers seat on from Rail before the Fuel filter.. It gets wet. and the HCU controller on top will Short out.. You can remove and replace it with out removing the hcu.. IF those solenoids get wet like mine did it can cause the Van to Shake and Shimmy without even touching the pedal.
coming back for a second look .. My Citroen C5 pedal to the floor was worn out master cylinder seals .. €6 euros for a service kit and a lot of my time and I now have a like new brake pedal feel .
Great video, your expertise is much appreciated. I can’t wait to run this “rod” test. But I thought I heard you say that you tested the module before you did the pump. How do you test the module?
Excellent video, one of a kind, and thanks to your daughter as well. My question is, can I use a 2-way scan tool to check the pump/solenoid valves? I can't see those ports on my vehicle ABS pump.
Yep used a friends Autel XB.. to actuate the abs pump and do the bleeding. 2 pints or so of old brake fluid came out from the pump. Pedal feels great now.
When I clicked on your video I was expecting to see about the RABS module/unit on the driver side rail, but I'm always glad to discover new info. Would a 91 diesel van have that pump in addition to the module? I'm having the same issue with pedal fade, trying to track down the issue, man it's a headache! Haha. Great video, thanks for sharing!
Well, I have the same year, same model van as you and did this test with a similar result! So, if I understand you correctly, we need an ABS pump, but NOT the module, correct? Any compatible vehicles with a similar pump? Not having much luck sourcing it as of yet. Thank you for this!
Sorry but unfortunately I can't tell you over the internet what is wrong with your van. I know the owner of the van could not source an ABS pump, he sold the van shortly after I diagnosed it.
Bmw x3 just had my rear brakes replaced and before I paid I checked and yes they are Spongy and they say they would have to go deeper and check the master cylinder $$$
Nice job Glen, I use a brake line U adapter I made to close off the MC works good... gotta love when the helpers are like are you all set now? All set? Lol my 15yr son got his patience from his mom 😂 girls are essier lol
Ha ha, I was gonna say the same thing, a home made U shaped adapter with flare nuts on each end would avoid having to search for end caps. Guess you'd have to bleed it well before testing to rule out a false positive.
And all you have to do for that is go down the road and slam on the brakes a couple of times to activate the pump and get it working and I’ve done another trick take a hammer or brass hammer and slightly tap the pump because the valves get hung up in it and it’s mainly on Fords drive down the road 30 to 40 miles an hour slam on the brakes get that ABS system active do it 3 to 4 times your problems gone you got a full pedal it won’t go to the floor no more I’ve seen people replace their ABS pump and had the same issue. You have to activate the pump get it working again.
Thank you sir. That's is 100% my problem. My first go-to was the master cly. Nope. Ive had cars that cost less then that pump. I feel like I should bronze the coat hanger tool. Snap-On would sell that for $$$. thaks again.
@@ozzstars_cars okay will do the master cylinder test tommorro disconnect the the 2 brake lines and cap it I will have to to autozone to get caps I guess ...
Thank you im going through that now but my freestyle is a 2005 with 297,500 miles , I'm not putting 800- 1,000 into a used part . O yippee looks like trade in car payment time
I have to agree with you. It's not worth throwing good money after bad. Sometimes we have to bite the bullet and eat it. Good luck with your car search.
done the dirt road abs test which worked great but the pedal still sinks to the floor . Got a second hand ABS module coming from EBAY. I have a sneaky feeling thone of the valves is sticking in the ABS valve body .
Hey Ozzstar. I think you did a great job showing the steps to test. My ABS is from a chevy silverado 01. I did your test but I have the opposite effect in my test. I get no movement at all. What do you think?
@@ozzstars_cars With no codes or abs light as mentioned, my dumb old butt would of loaded a master cylinder in the barrel and fired. LOL My DD don't even have ABS Winning!!! (cautiously)
Pretty cool. My GM van (and apparently most of them) burns through wheel speed sensors like candy corn. Sends both the ABS and the traction control running for the hills.
My brake pedal sinks after changing the front brake calipers. They have changed the brake master cylinder, they have bled the ABS module with a scanner and it remains the same. I can't find the problem, any ideas?.
Thanks for that test idea! Working on '02 Tahoe w/zero pedal resistance (eng on) no leaks, new master cylinder bench bled, lines bled & no air, Autel ABS brake bleed "passed" w/no DTC's. Will try that test next. Question: Of the two lines between the master cylinder and ABS, is one a "return line"?? Wondering where all the pedal pressure is going, if there's no leaks. Many thanks!
@@ozzstars_cars Many thanks again and understood. The “stick test” passed, it didn’t move at all. Not even a mm. I painted notches on one of those plastic brake cleaner nozzle inserts at 1/4” marks. Didn’t budge at all. Back to the drawing board.
Do many, or most, other makes and models cars and vans have these same two test ports on their ABS pumps, too? If not, why, I wonder. Thanks. Also, can ABS pumps leak externally through these piston test ports (the ones that have them)?
@@ozzstars_cars Thanks. I know my 2007 Hyundai Accent ABS pump doesn’t have these test ports. I’m having soft pedal issues and ordered a used replacement ABS pump for it, anyway, hoping that’s the problem. The master brake cylinder is good so that only leaves the ABS pump as the culprit, I’m hoping.
We’ve taken my dad’s 2009 Ford Explorer to 2 mechanics so far - a local mechanic up the street from us (who said they couldn’t figure out what the issue was for the soft brake pedal) & we then took it to a Ford dealership, to see if they could diagnose the problem. (I don’t know how long they sent on looking for problems - but they also said that they couldn’t figure out the issue. They now say they need at least 2 extra hours, for diagnosis, which will cost over $300!) My questions are these - do you know how thorough these initial inspections are, through the dealerships (or do they do as little as possible, especially if they’re busy like this dealership was) & wound you recommend, at this point, of just giving the vehicle to charity & investing in a newer vehicle? I’m not a mechanic myself & know very little about fixing vehicles - (other than what I learn from videos like yours) - & want to know what the best course of action would be, in this particular case. (To save both time & money.) I’m planning on asking Ford to provide a list of “tests” they did, while they’ve had my dad’s vehicle - but I don’t know if they will do this or how detailed the list will be, if I can obtain it.
First time I've ever seen this, too! I think it sounds vaguely familiar, though - I might have read about it in a Haynes manual, or online, many years back. If that were my van, I'd be bypassing that $1,000 headache! Great vid, Glen! 👍🍻
@@ozzstars_cars - LOL! It's on life support! Reminds me of the Jaguar my neighbor owns. Also built by Ford. Was just back here the other day for being stuck in 3rd gear again. I wiggled and sprayed the tranny connector again, got it shifting, and advised him to dump it as soon as possible, LOL. What a turd!
@@ozzstars_cars NO it wouldn't fix the problem but it would prove where the problem is which is the important issue. In my case, I removed the abs fuses and the problem persists. Not sure, however, if that necessarily means, that the problem isn't with the abs system.
I think I have an extraordinary problem here, zero resistance on the brake pedal but the brakes are working strong and good. The resistance from the pedal disappears when the vehicle is moving. What is the cause to this problem?
I hit a pothole while slaming the brakes notice my pedal sinking slowly. i had replace the booster and powerstreering 3 months ago because had hard steering wheel and spongy pedal. Right now i replace master cylinder all 4 caliper because seems like one was sticking rear pasanger side.i get the brake pedal hard enough while truck shut off bleed complete already but when I start the truck and press the brakes starts pulsating contantly just while i press . 1999 ford f350 7.3 dually 4wd
Thanks for the video. Does a 09 Ford Escape have test ports? Got one doing the same but the pumps configuration is a little different. Thanks in advance.!!!
I'm having this problem on my '03 escape, - decent pedal when engine off, but low pedal engine on. Sadly, there's no way to get to those ports. 😢 What do you think about putting a used abs on? Do they have to be reprogrammed?
@@ozzstars_cars I plugged the ports on a new MC and pedal was rock hard. Bled the hell out of the system and get a good pedal with engine off, but like you said, it's when the engine is running that the pedal goes nearly to the floor. Also, ran the abs scanner bleed several times and no change.😤 EBay has a seller of used abs units for $150. Might go that route or junk the truck. It has 210K on it. I will admit that I may have unknowingly wrecked the abs myself by pushing the caliper pads in during a pad change without opening the bleeder, but I'd never seen that required in the Haynes book.
@@ozzstars_cars I know. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me, since the abs should be able to handle 100's of lbs of pressure. My issue did occur after a front brake job, though. Could have been a failing pump, but...🤷♂️
@@ozzstars_cars What is considered a "newer vehicle", in this case. And how much $$ is it to have the ABS programmed? Can one do it themselves with a fairly inexpensive scan tool "that does ABS" testing, or does it take a very expensive one such as only a professional mechanic has? Thanks
Trouble shooting a 2011 Ford Edge with intermittent sinking brake pedal. I can restore the brake pedal by driving on dirt road and slamming on the brakes which engages the ABS system. This lasts for anywhere between 2 weeks to 2 months then the pedal sinks again. I can also restore the pedal by using ThinkDiag OBDII diagnostic software which allows me to turn on the ABS pump while sitting still in the driveway. Does it make sense to you that I probably have a sticking dump valve? When stuck open it is allowing fluid to circulate internally in the HCU I think. A new ABS ECU & HCU is not available for purchase through Ford (Nationwide outage). Are you aware of a way to rebuild or clean out the HCU, specifically the dump valve and possibly restore the normal operation? I know I would then have to bleed the HCU as well as the entire system. Thoughts? Thanks!
You could try all new fluid and if there was any junk inside the abs pump hopefully it would be flushed out. I would use a bidirectional scan tool to bleed the entire system and add new brake fluid. Good first try otherwise plan B.
@@ozzstars_cars Thank you for the reply. That is next on my list to try. Thinking that maybe when I have done previous brake pad replacement and pushing the pistons back in possibly some trash got past the seals. Thanks for your videos!!
My 1998 f150 4 wheel drive has 3 rubber capped ports on the bottom of my abs pump . Going to test these soon . My abs light is on and some times it bounces off the bottom which tells me it's going into abs mode . I still have ok brakes but oveisly something is going on which is not right .
Hey 👋man I have a question with similarities to this. my test port is leaking on the left port behind the dust cap any way I can possibly fix that in the garage ??
Hi , good video 👍 I have a 2000 F150 The ABS light has been on a long while but my brakes still work fine. Besides the ABS not working and my brakes locking up on a sudden stop, should I be worried about driving my Ol Bessie?
I suspected the master cylinder until I found one line leak. I had viewed many videos in the last two weeks. Your was the first to say how to test master cylinder in place with two plugs! Thank you for teaching!!!
@joeharvie8362 you're welcome Joe! Glad the video was helpful.
Glen, I hate to admit to ignorance of this as I pulled wrenches for many years and that was new to me!! Thanks for sharing that as I learned something new....
We all try to learn something new everyday. 👍
@@ozzstars_cars Knowledge can never be taken away.
Trust, there's mechanics out here for 40+ and still learning something new. Tricks of the trade didn't come from a mechanic book or school. Technique comes from the brain, knowledge is power. This a good guy right here.
Same here brother
Awesome
This is probably the 8th to 10th ABS troubleshooting video I've watched in the last couple of hours, and yet it is the only one that actually showed how to diagnose the ABS Pump itself. Some people jumped to re-soldering joints in the ABS Module and they didn't even mention to try this first. Once you have eliminated; leaks (at each wheel, all the lines, master cyl, brake booster), blown fuses and relays, wiring/connectors/grounds, this should be the next thing to look at.
It's called proper diagnostics, most people don't know how to test and not guess! Thanks for.your comment.
@@ozzstars_cars Well you've got a new subscriber :-D! What part of the country are you in?
@@PapaSmurf337 thanks for subscribing. Delaware.
I have been fighting a slight brake pedal sink for about 5 years. After a ton of break fluid, 2 master cylinders, several trips to the break shop, all I can say is ..... Thank You!
My issue is very minimal, and is intermittent. 1 pump of the brakes, and the pedal wont sink, but sometimes the pedal will sink after I've come to a complete stop. A quick pump of the pedal and its solid again.
NOW, I know what to do to fix it.
You're awesome.
Thanks for your awesome comment James. Good luck with the diagnosis. 👍
Thanks for another precise explanation of system operation and diagnosis. You do a great job getting your point across with the video. The folks in your area are fortunate to have a good technician like you 👍
Thanks Devin I appreciate your comment. I try my best to give good info. 👍
I have been rebuilding my 2001 f150 for a while now cleaning the whole thing up and this is the biggest problem that I have had and I think you just rectify that for me God bless you and thank you so much
Glad I could help
4:04 she's so happy to help. thank sir !! good info, my Ford Escape have same issue but goes and come around.
She's an excellent helper!
That was a great visual of a bad ABS pump.
Thank you. I have been fighting with my 2012 Lincoln Mkz for about 4 months now. I couldn't get any fluids to come out of the brake calipers. Hopefully this method help me diagnose my problem. Great job explaining this 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Hate that feeling like you stepped on a plum when you go for a panic brake. Nice work Glen diagnosing and getting the Ford back on the road.
That's a great analogy, a plum.
@@ozzstars_cars - Or, in the case of modern vehicles, a turd ... 😃
Wow at all the movement in the abs pump
Great video. Amazing hand-camera coordination. Thanks.
Thank you very much!
That's a stuck open de-pressurisation ('dump') valve in the ABS module... The hole is just a hole on the dry side of the accumulator piston. What's happening here is when the brake pedal is depressed, it's routing master cylinder line pressure straight through the open valve into the sprung accumulator (the 'spring' sound you hear when the piston is pushing the piece if wire out...) Normally this valve only opens as the second stage of ABS intervention after the isolation valve closes first, in order to reduce pressure in the caliper and allow the wheel to rotate again. But in this case it's always open, so master cylinder pressure is just going to move an accumulator piston instead of the pistons in the caliper... I had this same issue on a Nissan GTR on track.
Thanks for the detailed explanation.
@@ozzstars_cars No problem! The other symptoms I had, which helped give clues on the GTR, was that the brake pedal would get firmer when you drove the car hard and got it to slide on track in the wet, with the stability control still on! This was really confusing, but again what was happening here was the stability control applying assymetric rear brake in the corner, via the ABS motor pump. This is a bit like pumping the brake pedal with your foot, taking up some of the movement in the accumulator and giving a shorter pedal stroke. But the pressure soon bleeds off... Slow down again and the pedal went to the floor again! Only resolved by replacing the module.
@chillyfly off camera I tested the ABS module in that van with a scan tool. Commanding the valve(s) to close and open. It failed.
@@ozzstars_cars That’s really interesting, sounds right! The ECU software I have for my Nissan doesn’t allow testing individual valves unfortunately, but it runs a complete valve calibration, and it failed on the rear circuit. Funnily enough I had massive problems with overheating front brakes, but the rear pads barely wearing at all…
This is a description on function I was looking for. Now can I rig it? Or just get the valve/pump body? I felt this on my 250 the first time the other day under hard braking with my 7000 lb trailer behind it. I didn't have the warm a fuzzies about it and now I'm here. 😂
Ooh very helping...it has costed me more than 130 dollars trying to solve it here in kenya. .but thank God i will change Abs Pump
Nice tip. I need to check my son's ABS pump on his '06 Escape when he comes home for Spring Break because he's got a soft pedal.
Let us know what you find if you can. 👍
Good advice Glen. Looks like that van is keeping you busy.
It's gone, for now. 🤣
Thanks , ur video goes into my '97 E350 rebuild library . Saved me Hours of 2nd guessing myself & my work especially with the camera work on coat hanger
Nice!
Great tips Glen and looks like you're getting that van back to its glory days! Keep up the good work!
Haha this van is hanging by a thread. 😬
Good video Glen! I didn't know that ford had that test port! Thanks for the tip!
The secret is out now. 🤣 Thanks for stopping by
Lol
I drove my wife's Kia Sorento after she returned from a trip out of town, and I noticed the brake pedal seemed to have a lot of travel and would sink to the floor if held. I saw somewhere to check master cylinder versus ABS module problem, to drive on a dirt road about 20 MPH and lock up the brakes a few times. If the problem goes away--at least temporarily--the problem is in the ABS module. I tried it and sure enough, the problem went away for about three weeks before returning. Each time I did the locked- brakes thing, the problem stopped, but for shorter and shorter periods. Eventually I got an ABS warning light. The ABS module was $1300 plus labor, so I traded the POS in. KIA mechanics, as I found out over several trips for repairs, are not the upper end of skilled mechanics.
Must have been an old car with high miles?
Wow, that's a topic I never understood, thanks for the info! Your method of testing the MC is elegantly simple. I imagine there's a lot of force on the fluid coming out of the MC, so you'd need threaded caps for each end to test it properly. I don't remember those test ports on my GM abs sensor, I'll have to look again. Too bad the replacement is so expensive. Removing the ABS would be more complicated than people think, one would have to add in a diverting valve for safety, it wouldn't be easy.
A couple of brass plugs and test away the MC.
Nice video. Thanks for your time to produce this and your helper did a great job I have 2005 F150 with this problem
I agree, good help! Thanks for the comment and good luck with your fix. -Glen (Ozz)
@daduze, i also have a 2005 w/ this problem. The trk is currently at the mechanic shop for changing out the shift lever cable. I asked the manager to check the brakes - explained the issue and he stated to fix the 'floating brake pedal' would be around $1800....I asked him if the issue would continue to degenerate... he told me it wouldn't - i felt like he didn't want to deal with it....prob. go somewhere else after the shift lever cable is repaired ~ thanks for the vid!!!
the new Master cyl seals worked great but with the engine running the pedal still goes to the floor . A Foxwell NT 630 pro ABS bleed scan tool bleed has improved things but the brakes are still acting up . I need to go find a dirt road and have a play .. maybe the ABS unit just needs a good workout .
Thanks a million, 1st video I have came across that showed how to test and show what plugs to remove to test.
You're welcome Dewayne! We try to go all out here on the Ozzstar's Cars channel.
Your conclusion appears to be that fluid is leaking into the piston that is effectively a pressure blow-off accumulator. Therefore a valve is not closing completely. Is there a way to nondestructively remove clean/replace the valve?
I do not know of any way to rebuild an ABS pump if that's what you are asking?
@@ozzstars_cars Yes. If the valve can be serviced, then no need to replace anything but the valve. It looks like they are press fit, which means some sort of removal and then re-pressing would be required. Removal appears certain to be destructive. And there's a seat that the valve tip contacts. So seat removal also might be necessary. It may be a 5 minute job, but it will take the usual 1000 hours to figure it out the first time, make the necessary pressing tool, etc. It's also possible that a solenoid is not passing current, so the valve is not being held closed. But regardless, that initial time investment may be big.
@@idahoviking and be 100% sure it functions correctly because that is some serious liability if things go wrong.
Thanks for the info, was doubting myself but this confirms my ABS problem on my Honda CRV, cheers
Thank you so much for your video. I've been trying to find a way to test that pump for a while now. Very well done. {tongue twister and all)
👍
I had no idea about this on a ford. Man this van sure needed a lot of work. Great info Glen 👍
Like most commercial vehicles it has lead a hard life with little love shown.
Yeah Steve, he's been working on this thing for months LOL. I wanted to say, since last year, but that was just yesterday.
@@diymisfit_Mechanic_UDX404 🤣🤣🤣
@@diymisfit_Mechanic_UDX404 🤣🤣🤣
Excellent job! Great visual!
Thanks Cuba
Was not aware of this trick! Have seen this happen twice before and basically ruled it out by process of elimination and only the ABS module could be the cause but I never knew of a way to test it directly.
The untold Ford ABS pump secret until now! haha It's model specific but I was able to confirm the pump was bad off camera using a scan tool (Autel 906BT) ABS test but figured the DIY test method shown in the video could help the masses. Thanks for stopping by! -Glen
Thanks for the video, good job! I worked in the business and have never had an abs module go bad, so this is the first car that has happened to.
You're welcome. In this case the module was fine, the pump was shot.
@@ozzstars_cars So if the pump is fine but the module is bad (stuck valve or something) how would you know? Just eliminate all other possibilities? I'm asking because I'm having a sinking pedal issue on a 2014 Fiesta ST and I want to be sure of what the issue is before I start throwing parts and money at it.
@@anthonyantoine9232 fire up a scan tool and test/check that way.
@@ozzstars_cars Gotcha. I kinda figured as much, but was hoping I could do it easier or without spending money lol.
@@ozzstars_cars Another question that I never thought about previously, if the ABS is seemingly functioning as it should, but the pedal goes to the floor, can it still be an ABS issue? I still have a gut feeling that it's the ABS module or pump in in some way, because while the ABS engages my pedal is super firm as it should be. To me that seems like confirmation that the master cylinder is not leaking. What are your thoughts?
I just replaced my master cylinder in my 99 burban because I thought that was the problem. If I test this thing and it's busted I hope you have a video on how to bypass it.
on the 1996 E Vans the HCU is under the Drivers seat on from Rail before the Fuel filter.. It gets wet. and the HCU controller on top will Short out.. You can remove and replace it with out removing the hcu.. IF those solenoids get wet like mine did it can cause the Van to Shake and Shimmy without even touching the pedal.
coming back for a second look .. My Citroen C5 pedal to the floor was worn out master cylinder seals .. €6 euros for a service kit and a lot of my time and I now have a like new brake pedal feel .
Nice feeling being able to stop!
Thanks I will start with master cylinder test. Hope thats it If it is the abs pump i will go to pick your part with a helper and some dot 3
Great video, your expertise is much appreciated. I can’t wait to run this “rod” test. But I thought I heard you say that you tested the module before you did the pump. How do you test the module?
Using a bidirectional scan tool. Also checking for proper power and ground. I made this video for the masses that don't own a bidirectional scan tool.
Never heard of it. Thanks for all this.
Awesome video! This helped me diagnose and fix the sinking brake pedal on my 2003 F150.
Nice! Smash the thanks button if you get a chance Donnie.
What route did you go to fix the truck?
Got a used ABS pump off a like vehicle in a salvage yard.
@@commonsense1557 How difficult was it to replace? I have the same issue and the local Ford dealership wants $2100 for the repair.
And did the module have to be reprogrammed?
Very helpful thank you for the great detailed video! Haley did a great job !!
I agree, yes she did! Thanks for your comment.
Excellent video, one of a kind, and thanks to your daughter as well. My question is, can I use a 2-way scan tool to check the pump/solenoid valves? I can't see those ports on my vehicle ABS pump.
Yes a bidirectional scan tool can be used to test the abs pump valves.
@@ozzstars_cars Thank you very much Glen!
I learned something today.thanks !
Awesome! I did to but had nothing to do with cars. 😁👍
I have this symptom in my '07 Expy. Now I have a solution for verifying the problem.
Hopefully you can report back here your findings. 👍
Sinking also could be the brake booster is the booster is leaking good informative video
Leaking booster is the opposite effect, hard pedal with not much braking
@@ozzstars_cars yeah that's correct been a long week bro sorry I did 4 brake boosters in last 2 days just tired I miss spoke your right
@silverbird58 very true
Great useful information! Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
Yep used a friends Autel XB.. to actuate the abs pump and do the bleeding. 2 pints or so of old brake fluid came out from the pump. Pedal feels great now.
@@CarbonConcept25 what type of vehicle?
When I clicked on your video I was expecting to see about the RABS module/unit on the driver side rail, but I'm always glad to discover new info. Would a 91 diesel van have that pump in addition to the module? I'm having the same issue with pedal fade, trying to track down the issue, man it's a headache! Haha. Great video, thanks for sharing!
Not sure that a 1991 model us that advanced.
Waw! I learned something new! Thanks.
You got room up there for more, stay tuned. 👍👍
Well, I have the same year, same model van as you and did this test with a similar result! So, if I understand you correctly, we need an ABS pump, but NOT the module, correct? Any compatible vehicles with a similar pump? Not having much luck sourcing it as of yet. Thank you for this!
Sorry but unfortunately I can't tell you over the internet what is wrong with your van. I know the owner of the van could not source an ABS pump, he sold the van shortly after I diagnosed it.
Bmw x3 just had my rear brakes replaced and before I paid I checked and yes they are Spongy and they say they would have to go deeper and check the master cylinder $$$
Sounds like there could possibly be air in the hydraulic system.
@@ozzstars_cars after $939 they bled the brakes finally
@@SeasonsOFcolors so I was right?
yes you were right
Nice job Glen, I use a brake line U adapter I made to close off the MC works good... gotta love when the helpers are like are you all set now? All set? Lol my 15yr son got his patience from his mom 😂 girls are essier lol
Haha so true, my kids are like that but they are great helper at times.
Ha ha, I was gonna say the same thing, a home made U shaped adapter with flare nuts on each end would avoid having to search for end caps. Guess you'd have to bleed it well before testing to rule out a false positive.
And all you have to do for that is go down the road and slam on the brakes a couple of times to activate the pump and get it working and I’ve done another trick take a hammer or brass hammer and slightly tap the pump because the valves get hung up in it and it’s mainly on Fords drive down the road 30 to 40 miles an hour slam on the brakes get that ABS system active do it 3 to 4 times your problems gone you got a full pedal it won’t go to the floor no more I’ve seen people replace their ABS pump and had the same issue. You have to activate the pump get it working again.
That's an interesting trick.
Thank you sir. That's is 100% my problem. My first go-to was the master cly. Nope. Ive had cars that cost less then that pump. I feel like I should bronze the coat hanger tool. Snap-On would sell that for $$$. thaks again.
Haha, yeah they probably stole my idea already. 😏
I like the presentation
@vuyisambantsa4637 thanks buddy!
Okay love the VIDEO...my goes to the FLOOR.. and i just did that TEST mine has no movement
Have you tested the master cylinder for an internal leak? Checked for a leaking brake line?
@@ozzstars_cars okay will do the master cylinder test tommorro disconnect the the 2 brake lines and cap it I will have to to autozone to get caps I guess ...
this is a great peice of advice !!! thank you for the video!!
You're welcome Nova! -Glen
Thank you im going through that now but my freestyle is a 2005 with 297,500 miles , I'm not putting 800- 1,000 into a used part . O yippee looks like trade in car payment time
I have to agree with you. It's not worth throwing good money after bad. Sometimes we have to bite the bullet and eat it. Good luck with your car search.
👍Thanks!
You're welcome Richard! Thank you for the generosity.
done the dirt road abs test which worked great but the pedal still sinks to the floor . Got a second hand ABS module coming from EBAY. I have a sneaky feeling thone of the valves is sticking in the ABS valve body .
Thank you Buy Mine only when the engine is running
Good information
Cheers from Austin, Texas . New to your channel.
Thank you
Good video. To the point.
Thanks for the comment.
Great info my friend. Thank you for sharing 👍
That's what it's all about!
Hey Ozzstar. I think you did a great job showing the steps to test. My ABS is from a chevy silverado 01. I did your test but I have the opposite effect in my test. I get no movement at all. What do you think?
I am not sure if GM used the dame technology. A professional level scan tool with abs control features would be helpful.
Cool Tip, I didn't know that
And btw this issue does not cause the ABS light to glow on the dash.
@@ozzstars_cars With no codes or abs light as mentioned, my dumb old butt would of loaded a master cylinder in the barrel and fired. LOL
My DD don't even have ABS
Winning!!! (cautiously)
Great informative video. Thanks
I appreciate your comment. Thanks.
Pretty cool. My GM van (and apparently most of them) burns through wheel speed sensors like candy corn. Sends both the ABS and the traction control running for the hills.
That keeps things interesting and new. 🤣
My brake pedal sinks after changing the front brake calipers. They have changed the brake master cylinder, they have bled the ABS module with a scanner and it remains the same. I can't find the problem, any ideas?.
That's hard to diagnose over the internet.
Excellent video thank you very much
You are welcome.
Thanks for that test idea! Working on '02 Tahoe w/zero pedal resistance (eng on) no leaks, new master cylinder bench bled, lines bled & no air, Autel ABS brake bleed "passed" w/no DTC's. Will try that test next. Question: Of the two lines between the master cylinder and ABS, is one a "return line"?? Wondering where all the pedal pressure is going, if there's no leaks. Many thanks!
Usually one line is for the front brakes and the other line is for the rear.
@@ozzstars_cars Many thanks again and understood. The “stick test” passed, it didn’t move at all. Not even a mm. I painted notches on one of those plastic brake cleaner nozzle inserts at 1/4” marks. Didn’t budge at all. Back to the drawing board.
@@ronaldscott781 you're welcome Ron. Did you block off the master cylinder with brass plugs and test? New doesn't always mean it works.
Do many, or most, other makes and models cars and vans have these same two test ports on their ABS pumps, too? If not, why, I wonder. Thanks. Also, can ABS pumps leak externally through these piston test ports (the ones that have them)?
I have never seen this design on other makes of cars.
@@ozzstars_cars Thanks. I know my 2007 Hyundai Accent ABS pump doesn’t have these test ports. I’m having soft pedal issues and ordered a used replacement ABS pump for it, anyway, hoping that’s the problem. The master brake cylinder is good so that only leaves the ABS pump as the culprit, I’m hoping.
We’ve taken my dad’s 2009 Ford Explorer to 2 mechanics so far - a local mechanic up the street from us (who said they couldn’t figure out what the issue was for the soft brake pedal) & we then took it to a Ford dealership, to see if they could diagnose the problem. (I don’t know how long they sent on looking for problems - but they also said that they couldn’t figure out the issue. They now say they need at least 2 extra hours, for diagnosis, which will cost over $300!)
My questions are these - do you know how thorough these initial inspections are, through the dealerships (or do they do as little as possible, especially if they’re busy like this dealership was) & wound you recommend, at this point, of just giving the vehicle to charity & investing in a newer vehicle?
I’m not a mechanic myself & know very little about fixing vehicles - (other than what I learn from videos like yours) - & want to know what the best course of action would be, in this particular case. (To save both time & money.)
I’m planning on asking Ford to provide a list of “tests” they did, while they’ve had my dad’s vehicle - but I don’t know if they will do this or how detailed the list will be, if I can obtain it.
Unfortunately I can't diagnose a vehicle online. It's difficult to find a technician/mechanic that is competent.
First time I've ever seen this, too! I think it sounds vaguely familiar, though - I might have read about it in a Haynes manual, or online, many years back.
If that were my van, I'd be bypassing that $1,000 headache! Great vid, Glen! 👍🍻
That van needs 911 help! Thanks Smitty
@@ozzstars_cars - LOL! It's on life support! Reminds me of the Jaguar my neighbor owns. Also built by Ford. Was just back here the other day for being stuck in 3rd gear again. I wiggled and sprayed the tranny connector again, got it shifting, and advised him to dump it as soon as possible, LOL. What a turd!
I changed the brake pads and rotors on my vehicle. Is that normal for the brake pedal to go to the floor when first pressing
Would a bad ABS pump set a code? My brakes sink to the floor. I was getting ready to replace the brake master cylinder.
How would you bleed the lines after putting a new one in? Is there a special way to do it?
Pump the pedal method or use a bleeder tool with vacuum.
If the problem is with abs, would the problem be solved by removing the abs fuse and disabling the abs system?
@superdow1000 that's not fixing the problem.
@@ozzstars_cars NO it wouldn't fix the problem but it would prove where the problem is which is the important issue. In my case, I removed the abs fuses and the problem persists. Not sure, however, if that necessarily means, that the problem isn't with the abs system.
I got some brake fluid coming out of those plugs at the abs unit. Guess it’s the abs unit
That's not a good sign
Learned a lot from this thanks!
Glad you enjoyed the video, you're welcome.
I think I have an extraordinary problem here, zero resistance on the brake pedal but the brakes are working strong and good. The resistance from the pedal disappears when the vehicle is moving. What is the cause to this problem?
Test brake master cylinder, check for proper vacuum and test abs.
I hit a pothole while slaming the brakes notice my pedal sinking slowly. i had replace the booster and powerstreering 3 months ago because had hard steering wheel and spongy pedal.
Right now i replace master cylinder all 4 caliper because seems like one was sticking rear pasanger side.i
get the brake pedal hard enough while truck shut off bleed complete already but when I start the truck and press the brakes starts pulsating contantly just while i press .
1999 ford f350 7.3 dually 4wd
What about drilling a tapping one of them test ports with a 1/4x20 and running a bolt into it?
If it can't move it can't bypass.
I have no idea how that would be done.
Jason Jones did you try it? Any luck?
thanks man please make sure you compensate your helper
Absolutely
Thanks for keeping me from setting my 2010 escape on fire..😖
Well that's good and bad but you're welcome Rusty. lol
@@ozzstars_cars stupid girl next door bought a junk yard abs..😖
@Rusty Shackleford spend a penny now and spend a dime later. 😮
Thank you so much for this video
You are welcome!
Thanks for the video. Does a 09 Ford Escape have test ports? Got one doing the same but the pumps configuration is a little different. Thanks in advance.!!!
I don't know if that model has test ports. An observation mirror is what you need to find out.
@@ozzstars_cars Do many or most ABS pumps of other car makes not have test ports?
I'm having this problem on my '03 escape, - decent pedal when engine off, but low pedal engine on. Sadly, there's no way to get to those ports. 😢 What do you think about putting a used abs on? Do they have to be reprogrammed?
Newer vehicles must have the ABS programmed to the ECM. Have you tested the master cylinder for an internal leak?
@@ozzstars_cars I plugged the ports on a new MC and pedal was rock hard. Bled the hell out of the system and get a good pedal with engine off, but like you said, it's when the engine is running that the pedal goes nearly to the floor. Also, ran the abs scanner bleed several times and no change.😤 EBay has a seller of used abs units for $150. Might go that route or junk the truck. It has 210K on it. I will admit that I may have unknowingly wrecked the abs myself by pushing the caliper pads in during a pad change without opening the bleeder, but I'd never seen that required in the Haynes book.
@@Ronbo765 never had a damaged abs pump from compressing caliper pistons without opening the bleeder.
@@ozzstars_cars I know. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me, since the abs should be able to handle 100's of lbs of pressure. My issue did occur after a front brake job, though. Could have been a failing pump, but...🤷♂️
@@ozzstars_cars What is considered a "newer vehicle", in this case. And how much $$ is it to have the ABS programmed? Can one do it themselves with a fairly inexpensive scan tool "that does ABS" testing, or does it take a very expensive one such as only a professional mechanic has? Thanks
Trouble shooting a 2011 Ford Edge with intermittent sinking brake pedal. I can restore the brake pedal by driving on dirt road and slamming on the brakes which engages the ABS system. This lasts for anywhere between 2 weeks to 2 months then the pedal sinks again. I can also restore the pedal by using ThinkDiag OBDII diagnostic software which allows me to turn on the ABS pump while sitting still in the driveway. Does it make sense to you that I probably have a sticking dump valve? When stuck open it is allowing fluid to circulate internally in the HCU I think. A new ABS ECU & HCU is not available for purchase through Ford (Nationwide outage). Are you aware of a way to rebuild or clean out the HCU, specifically the dump valve and possibly restore the normal operation? I know I would then have to bleed the HCU as well as the entire system. Thoughts? Thanks!
You could try all new fluid and if there was any junk inside the abs pump hopefully it would be flushed out. I would use a bidirectional scan tool to bleed the entire system and add new brake fluid. Good first try otherwise plan B.
@@ozzstars_cars Thank you for the reply. That is next on my list to try. Thinking that maybe when I have done previous brake pad replacement and pushing the pistons back in possibly some trash got past the seals. Thanks for your videos!!
What do you do for a leaking ABS pump when Ford has discontinued the part (#3L3Z2C286AARM) for a 2000 Ford E350 Club Wagon XLT w/7.3 PowerStroke?
Used one, online
Very informative
Thanks Eddie
What are the lines called that run from the master cylinder to the abs module
You said it. Brake lines.
You never mentioned how much movement a normal operating pump should have, 1/4 inch?
Little to no movement.
Thanks for your help
You're welcome Isaac.
Great video thankyou
You're welcome Andrew
My 1998 f150 4 wheel drive has 3 rubber capped ports on the bottom of my abs pump . Going to test these soon . My abs light is on and some times it bounces off the bottom which tells me it's going into abs mode . I still have ok brakes but oveisly something is going on which is not right .
Hey 👋man I have a question with similarities to this. my test port is leaking on the left port behind the dust cap any way I can possibly fix that in the garage ??
Not that I know of.
My pedal sinks only when the motor is fired up. It’s holding 20hg vacuum for over an hour after it’s turned off. Motor off the pedal is hard as
Хорошее видео. Like
Very informative…how about “how to replace”? Thanks!
Do you have the ignition on?
Tested my 2002 sonoma like this and the pistons don't move at all.
(Master cylinder?)
Ignition on, engine off.
Hi , good video 👍
I have a 2000 F150
The ABS light has been on a long while but my brakes still work fine.
Besides the ABS not working and my brakes locking up on a sudden stop, should I be worried about driving my Ol Bessie?
Sure should. Have you tested the wheel speed sensors?
Thanks I have that problem.
Glad to help