I Rewrote a Segment of the Steven Universe Video for Comparision
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"i _am_ a child. what's your excuse?" yep the person who wrote that definitely thought it was the most savage thing they'd written
You know, when I heard that the first time, I was like"Why was White affected by that?Does she know what a child is?Why?".Because, if you think about it, she had no reason to know what a"child"is, considering gems don't have genders or age.
@@CyberWarezz05 Yess, honestly I still don't get it lmao
@@mariabobia69 I think the point is, it was a weak 'burn' for a genocidal monster to 'reflect' on. We're not expecting swear words, we're expecting half decent burns though.
@Bacon lettuce tomato
scar , the lion king
king candy , wreck - it ralph
thrax , osmosis jones
maleficent , sleeping beauty
ursula , the little mermaid
gaston , beauty and the beast
lord farquaad , shrek
that wolf from the rugrats movie
mrs. tweedy , chicken run
shan li , mulan ( this is a great example because if she hadn't killed him then he would've continued starting war and killing off hundreds )
oh . would ya look at that .
kids' movies that involved the death of the villain :( almost as if this concept has been used before until recently when it's become a controversy of how much violence should be allowed in kid stuff :((((
and what's funny is that some movies today still involve the death of a bad guy . star wars , coco , it's really not uncommon or unheard of .
Also why would white diamond appropriate human terms if she hates them so much ?
On Steven's empathy: remember when he tried to force his dad to reconnect with his incredibly emotionally abusive parents who rejected every single aspect of greg's personality and then ignored greg's previous attempt to connect with them after cutting them off???? and then basically said why did you leave??? I personally found this weird as fuck
Especially since the diamonds are "family" and Steven supposedly hasn't forgiven them, he should understand where his dad is coming from
I also thought it was strange. More so because when Greg was going through his old room to find something important to him, Steven went off looking at the house. Looking at it in Awh of the life his Dad might have had. But he should know his dad! The house was devoid of anything you would actually associate with Greg, the one thing that wasn't, was HIDDEN IN A VENT. Steven didn't give a damn and went off on him for not having a normal life, even though he's an ALIEN. The fact that he almost killed his Dad for not wanting to have anything to do with his family is horrifying!!
that episode mad me so mad cuz after steven throws a hissy fit and nearly kills them. Greg is all like "im so happy you can communicate with me :)" i just like???? wtf lmao this family is messed up
i like the part when Steven tried to kill greg in a car crash because Greg left his abusive parents and tried to give his son a really healthy life
it definitely makes sense that steven's empathy was failing during future. a lot of his actions were self centered. in fact, MOST of them were. leaving little homeschool... the bluebird thing... the connie proposal thing? he was basically trying everything and anything to make himself feel better/ whole again. thats why he got so mad at greg for leaving a household that, from stevens surface level perception, was awesome. steven felt ashamed that he had no "normal" childhood and had to save the world and be the chosen one, so he saw greg's upbringing and was like Thats what i want!!! when in reality he wouldve hated it. but thats just how jaded teens are. so realistically it was kinda on point
How To Train Your Dragon 2 did the nonviolent arc correctly. The lesson learned by the main character is that sometimes people cannot be reasoned with or coerced with peace and you need to pick up your sword and fight. They wont stop otherwise.
HTTYD is exactly what SU tries to be but fails miserably: realistic pacifism
The main character does everything in his power to convince his people that dragons are not merciless creatures. And he succeeded because not only he himself proved he could tame and befriend a very dangerous species of dragon, but because he knew his father, as stubborn and stoic (pun intended) as he was, he did wanted to listen to his son, but they both just didn't know how to comunicate with each other. And once he proved him with actions, which is what his father had known all his life, he believed him
But when there was a villain whose motivations were against what the main character preached, and was simply impossible to convince, they resorted to violence
THAT is realistic. Neither being a war monger that wants to anihilate anyone that disagrees with you, nor being a complete airhead that thinks anything can be solved by talking
Exactly
Thank you for mentioning httyd the masterpiece of a trilogy and making a great point.
Everytime I remember Aang who was a freaking monk and despite preaching against violence have fought. And he didn't consider changing Fire Lords mind. He just didn't want to murder him and even then it was not just because he is such a pacifist but because he was raised as a monk and now is the only one left from his people so his culture is extra sacred now.
@@thedesensitizedsympathizer5307 You know how people say that in order to truly understand someone you need to put yourself at their shoes? That applies to this particular situation. Imagine someone trying to convince you about something that you completely disagree with. We all know that in fact earth is round, yet their are people that say it is flat despite the overwhelming evidence that says otherwise. You might think that flat earthers are ridiculous, but some flat earthers think YOU are ridiculous for thinking the earth is round. Everyone in society and almost everything in society is stating that the earth is round yet why are there still people that say otherwise? Why is it that you friend doesn't like you favorite candy, even thought you think its the best thing you have ever tasted? Its not that your friend is lying, it's just that he genuinely thinks its not tasty.
I like the bit about if Steven actually loves Garnet. That was really a good point, I've seen him be more sympathetic to pearl (who has almost killed him or harmed his love ones on occassions) but not give an ounce of that attention to Garnet.
Yezz, she seems to be like that black mama caricature, Garnet and Amethyst dont receive much attention nether from steven or from the writers
Well, she never threatened him or his loved ones. His empathy is largely reserved for those people.
it's so shitty bc it basically says "moms aren't real people and can't be emotionally harmed"
@@hiroribeiro2255 Jezz the white boy and white coded female had more prominent roles then the black and latino coded woman gosh what a mystery as to why that was done
@@willhiggins9563 that isn’t true
To be fair, Steven is also a diamond and they seem to just all have the genetic predisposition to be heartless monsters
Oh fu-
If being heartless monsters is in their nature then why are the diamonds converted to good guys in like 30 minutes and a comeback?
It’s funny. This comment was meant to be a joke, but two dumbasses got mad and started to attack anyone who they thought was making fun of their favorite thing.
lol
@@twisted_jinx1603 Wait this was a joke? I thought it was genuine albeit lighthearted. It's kinda true, especially looking through the lens of how Steven is a manipulative bastard that shows more sympathy with fascists than his own mother (figure). /srs
"non-violent solutions should not be a lesson for the hero, it should be a lesson for the villain" is a great point. It would be nice to see that expanded in a future Glass of Water.
@1800ibchillin No one thinks their the villain, that's a decision by the author. Because of how the quote was phrased, using hero and villain. I took it to be strictly writing advice rather than having real world application. Plenty of writing advice is helpful for writing but should not be taken as life advice. I think there's a large different between the words criminal and villain, and even if you want to apply villain to real life, you could just as much make the argument the cop is the villain, in which case the lesson applies.
Something like Steven Universe has the hero do it since among other things they're used as a self-insert or at least a vehicle for the author's ideals. And also them being the one who needs to "heal" others.
Even as someone who doesn't hate this show, I absolutely felt like it was a super missed opportunity when Jasper was shattered. Keeping Jasper shattered and finally making Steven deal with some damn consequences would've been nice. Also, the whole... Everything, with the diamonds, is terrible, but we all sorta knew that.
I agree, but I sometimes wonder if Jasper herself would have deserved death. I mean she was awful to Garnet so maybe not a redemption that ends with her as a crystal gem but she was still a victim of lapis and even the diamonds.
Like Lapis literally traps her and isolates her, which is a very undeserving punishment. And the Diamonds abused everyone and brainwashed all homeworld gems. But I dunno, letting Jasper die yet both of her abusers not only get off the hook but live good and healthy lives leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'm saying this about the show itself, not against your argument btw, like could him shattering someone like a random gem worked instead? Could Steven learn a similar lesson by killing a random passerby on accident?
@@metaknight1410 Oh no, I'm not saying Jasper deserved it. I greatly understand Jaspers struggle with anger issues, being an abusive person, struggling to improve. She did awful things, but she was on the way to healing, it seemed. Which would make it all the more tragic for her to be killed before she could ever fully change.
@@lionblaze0384 Oh i was just saying that to get it out there, not that you thought that or anything. And it kinda sucks that out of all the abusers in SU Jasper was the one who did the most but could still have a decent redemption arc. Like her perspective on Homeworld and how and why they basically brainwash their own people could have been fleshed out with her uniquely, but I guess Earth and Steven are totally more interesting.
Everyone hurt Steven, and Peridot didn't respect Garnet as a gem either so why is Jasper the one thrown under the bus?
@@metaknight1410 even though Steven cares about every gem, narratively, for the shatter to matter (heh) to the audience it does have to be a gem we care about. It could have been white pearl or someone introduced in Future though. Like that little cute one that likes screams.
@@metaknight1410 Jasper was one of my favorite characters because of the amount of nuance she has. Yes, she's done awful things, but that's because she was brainwashed and then traumatized when essentially her god was shattered. And since she was on the frontlines, she probably saw fusions shattering her friends and allies too. So her hatred of fusions, while not justified, I can understand where it comes from.
That moment Jasper says something along the lines of "everyone who fuses with me always leaves", I felt that. Obviously, by that time her views of fusion are warped, but that's because Lapis abused her the entire time she was fused. But that line is incredibly telling. She's lonely, and no one ever tries to help her. Arguably Amethyst tries but that's all off screen so I don't count it as character growth. Especially since in future, she's back to being 1 dimensional.
Honestly, I would have loved to see a redemption arc with Jasper and I think Garnet should have been the one to redeem her. Garnet could have shown her what a healthy fusion looked like and that may have helped her with her self-worth issues.
Jasper was done dirty in the series. They couldn't even kill her off so she would have a purpose. Her death could have taught Steven consequences, but no, Jesus boy just magics her back to life and everything is fine.
You know what's something I've never seen addressed? Ever?
The show strongly implies that the Gems have encountered multiple planets with organic life on them. It also implies that it strip-mines those planets to produce more gems and create outposts. and while it's not *explicitly* stated that they had sapient life on them, the fact that a soldier caste existed before the Gem Rebellion implies, *yes*, the Gem Empire has had to pacify planets before exterminating every living thing on them.
And we know the Gems arrived on earth in Prehistory. This has been going on for *millions of years*. The Diamonds have slaughtered so many living things, including entire civilizations of thinking beings, it's likely we don't have a name for the number.
And yet we're to sympathize with them.
Ehh, maybe not millions. The colony and rebellion was ~5-6000 years ago, so just within the earliest surviving examples of written language. Further, we have a rough idea of how many worlds the Gems have colonized, given the depictions of the Diamonds.
But we can also make a reasonable guess that most, if not all, of those worlds had life - The Kindergarden system explicitly drains a planet of some nebulous 'life force' to construct a Gem. Presumably, without this supply of energy, the process wouldn't work. The other abandoned colony we do see has at least one jungle-like biome, which implies a pretty lively biosphere.
It's perhaps worse that we *can* conceive of the scale of their monstrousness. Because it also implies a very dangerous question: Can Gem society actually coexist with organic life? Or has Steven just kicked the can down the road another few centuries?
@@watchm4ker 5-6000 years for humans. Other planets, we don't know.
@@watchm4ker I think it could because Gems don’t have lifespans, so they don’t NEED to kill off literally every living thing on a planet to live there, since they don’t need to repopulate, they just WANTED to.
@@off-the-grounder568 I mean, that's a big, unanswered question, right there: Why did the Diamonds *want* an Empire? What was their drive? The only resources that seem to be actively consumed are in the making of more Gems... But why do they need to make so many?
Humans need to eat, and need to breed if they want their ideas, their society, to live on past their lifespan. What's the Diamond's excuse?
@@watchm4ker My guess is that it's themes of colonialism and fascism.
Fascists need outside enemy and story of superiority to justify why everything sucks for average folk.
Everything Lily said about Steven reminds me of the Last Airbender episode where Toph was teaching Aang to Earthbend. He was trying to move the rock and thinking of ways to approach it and she was telling him there’s no way around it and no trick to it, you just have to move the rock. Then later he was confronted with an animal that wouldn’t back down from its attack. The message was sometimes there’s no way around your problems and some things you can’t change. It’s incredibly immature that SU liked to pretend otherwise. He needed to be confronted with people and situations he couldn’t talk his way out of and that should’ve been the diamonds if nothing else.
@@baconlettucetomato3894 No if anything that would encourage kids to become vigilantes. Also did you ever watch Avatar the Last Airbender? If you did I don't need to spoil the ending, but Aang brought balance without needing to kill Ozai. He took his power and put him in prison. The show never framed Aang as being in the wrong for needing to kill Ozai just that he didn't want to do it and gave a good alternative to a violent path because there was no changing Ozai's mind.
@@baconlettucetomato3894 Lily explains perfectly why that's very unrealistic writing so I won't bother just watch the video again.
@Bacon lettuce tomato yes, okay.. no.
if a story's point is to present a moral idea that has to do with the way the human psychology works and how we fucking interact with each other you have to at least *ASSUME* that it'd be done with the idea that we'd think of these walking talking breathing gems as _humans with superpowers_ . They talk like such, they interact with each other as such etc. Stories have core concepts- and no matter how *fucking unrealistic* it is that they present those core concepts, they're on a fundemental level, realistic and human-like in some way. *_Just because it's a cartoon doesn't make the idea's less problematic._*
@@Neo-qt1lc Can you sum up what this person said because they are a coward and deleted all of their comments
This is actually the best comment I've read on TH-cam in years
I know it’s not that related to your message but I’m so glad that you agree that Garnet was more of a mother to Steven than anyone else and yet he does not acknowledge that. It’s almost like an adopted kid looking for his birth family and telling his adopted one your not my real mom. You were the one who taught me the greatness of found family and these other lessons on bigotry, abuse, and gaslighting. and I am so thankful that you did.
It reminds of what they did with RWBY in regards to a character named Yang except in Yang’s it’s really weird: Yang is the half sister of the main character (Ruby), Ruby’s mom is a woman named Summer Rose, Yang at one point refers to Summer as “Super Mom” along with “baker of cookies and slayer of monsters”, however she later calls Summer by her first name or at one point “Ruby’s mom” as if she didn’t speak about her with admiration and love beforehand.
@@thomasraines1396 Checked the most recent Volume, she still calls her "my mom". Which episode did this bit you mentioned happen?
Garnet is Steven’s Piccolo
"Abusers prey on their victims empathy to make them stay longer."
YEEEEEESSSSSS!!!! 👏👏👏 SAY IT LOUDER SISTER!!!
Say it louder for the people in the back. This is why I love Lily's content.
My dad does this and it drives me crazy
@@erikthomsen4768 Ok look, I am German, and I, not even from relatives who lived through that time, ever heard that anyone gives the allied forces shit for bombing us. If they didn't end that, Hitler would have killed those children in one way or another. I mean that. I never in my life heard anyone say that the allied forces were shit.
this is why i didn't cut my abusive mother out of my life for years after she lost me, because she kept attempting to keep a relationship with me when i already gave up a long time ago, deciding there was just no point. the day i cut her off, she kept attempting to gaslight me and use my empathy to her advantage, forgetting i'm now in my mid-teens and am no longer a little child and have grown up a lot since then and so her tactics no longer work. it made me realize how childish she was because of how frustrated she got with me rightfully calling her out on her bullshit. i used to believe in staying empathetic, and i still am and stay kind as much as i can, but i'm no longer a pushover.
@Nicholas Negosian oh yes my sibling of the female gender say it louder/s
I think the episode “bismuth” was a real turning point in the show. I think that when Steven asked if shattering the diamonds would make the crystal gems bad people, if bismuth didn’t snap at him and instead explained why it wouldn’t, that the world isn’t black and white but full of shades of grey. It would’ve been an amazing lesson for a kids show. That sometimes, doing something that feel wrong, that you don’t want to do, (ie, standing up for yourself, leaving a bad situation, fighting for yourself and your friends) is necessary for things to change, to get better. To teach them the responsibility of making proper moral decisions which is a necessary skill to have as an adult.
@@baconlettucetomato3894 I’m not saying he would have to kill the diamonds in this scenario. I’m saying that turning it into an honest moral discussion between him and bismuth as equals would’ve made a better lesson. For bismuth to teach him that not every problem can be solved with friendship. And from there, they can come to a compromise. Possibly making another weapon similar to roses sword that could instantly bubble a gem so they can’t reform.
I'd personally say that Steven IS as bad as them, just not in the killing aspect. In fact, he's worse because of one thing. HE NEVER CHANGES HIS MIND. He fully expects to change everyone's mind to be on his side (and the show lets him), but not once does he ever question what he's doing. Even with all evidence is dead in his face and just doesn't care. At that point, why try to convince him and I think Bismuth had every right to express her anger. Bc Steven knows how bad this is, and he has seen the pain of the diamonds first-hand in people that he should love. But he can never seperate from his own ideal. I don't think there was anything Bismuth could have said because they already framed the story for Steven to be "right"
Yet another black coded character that has to be conveniently incompetent to let whitey make their point
Yes. Everyday we’re confronted with choices, do the difficult thing or do the easy thing. The easy choice usually doesn’t change anything, the difficult one usually makes life better for you in the future.
Isnt it also kind of weird how none of the gems questioned the bubbeling of Bismtuh?
I guess making the final arc about the ptsd of the boy who has to deal with the villains for a year instead of the ones that had to deal with them for centuries wasn't a good idea.
Another aspect of why the Steven only prospective doesn't work.
Honestly it came out of nowhere
Also the idea that having PTSD turns you into a violent murderous monster. Yikes!
@@Minkerdoodle01 I don’t think you were supposed to take that literally
@@a5tr4l Probably not, but Steven in general started lashing out at people. While that can definitely happen when you have trauma, it doesn’t always. It’s a little mean to portray a mental illness turning someone into a jerk. It may give ppl the idea that it’s universally that way.
There are some people who just don’t deserve mercy and forgiveness. Are you saying that serial killers deserve forgiveness just because they have a sad backstory? Of course not.
Flowey or Asriel from undertale in a nutshell
@@josega1753 yea Undertale is a weird case and you put it very well. It doesn’t help that Flowey could just erase all the consequences of his actions from before through his manipulation of time. Though I guess that also applies to the player? If you have the power to get the best possible ending for everyone (and death is of little consequence, anyways-you’re basically the god of this universe), shouldn’t you use it to achieve that end? That’s what I thought the true theme of Undertale was due to how meta it is. Or is that just another thermian argument?
@@josega1753 that makes a lot of sense to me. thank you for the insight!
So what are your thoughts on the criminal justice system?
@@josega1753 Just a small thing you don't need to forgive Azriel, you have a choice to say no, and if you choose it the ending doesn't change, and the game doesn't even give you a second choice or say you did something bad, but like the game tries to sell you to forgive him by showing that in the end, he was still a little kid that was without a soul, no moral compass and couldn't feel anything, so at least for me it was a good excuse of for his actions, like not saying it was right but makes sense
This was an extremely cathartic watch. I find myself going back on videos critical of SU a lot because I feel like they give me more closure than the actual show did, so I was very excited for this. This is the first time I've heard anyone else point out just how much of a POS Steven is or just how cruel this show actually is at its core. Seriously Steven is the worst kind of person but everyone ignores that because he's superficially nice.
I completely understand you. I really like Steven Universe but as time got on. I realized, I didn't like it. I just wanted closure after I lost so much time from it. So watching TH-camr rip it pieces, call out all the flaws, terrible lessons, how they wasted our time and validate a lot our problems with the show. It feels like they just gave me a hug, hot chocolate and said "I'm going to be the shit of them so don't worry I got this."
It's just cathartic and comforting.
i have a hard time myself with seeing past superficial niceness, even with people who've really hurt me specifically, and i'm grateful lily put this analysis out here, it's been helpful for me to reflect on.
He is Gaston
Back when I had the hots for this show I wanted to share it with my partner of the time, something he'd do, but while belittling me and my tastes all. The fucking. Time.
Later on I had to realize he was exactly like Steven: a real nice guy, whose manner of abuse came from constant chastising in the sake of "respectability"- in other words, ego politics.
I find his refusal to watch his avatar in a cartoon deliciously ironic.
@@3rebella honestly the story would work better without steven , like you could make it so the diamonds don't destroy earth because it's the tomb of pink diamond and that for them is more valuable than all life that exist on earth ,
the funerary pile of one of them is more important than billion of pepole ,
so the three crystal gems find a way to re organize a revolution find a cure to the curropted gems and over turn the diamonds ,
you'd then have a whole plot about humans and gems creating a society and you could have intresting stuff
Honestly the moment this show brought lars back to life not even a minute after his death i knew they were going to do the same with shattering and idk how no one else saw it coming lol
So true
It was because so many people wanted to believe that Rubeca Artificial Sweetner was smart and wasn't going to retcon a significant part of the story she claims to have planned out all along
@@kittygamer797 rubeca arificial sweetener💀
@@nicolovespanda What it's more accurate then suger after all you don't know what when in to it, you don't know why it exists, and it leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
Pretty much the big problem with Lars is that he reflects how the show made it too easy for Steven to jump across space into Homeworld/its empire and back to Earth since the showrunners never did figure out how make the sitcom/slice-of-life side flow well into the space opera/battle anime/magical girl/whatever side. Him dying then coming right back and becoming a Captain Harlock wannabe also reflects this, making one suspect Sugar was just too attached to him so shs just threw in whatever for him to get him taking part in space opera/battle manga/action show side.
I believe Amethyst was subjected to abuse as a direct cause of the diamonds actions, too, just in a more indirect way. I always read her being "overcooked" as being disabled, which the show affirms with Jasper's whole ableist "Gems are made for one purpose, and those who don't fit in and can't fulfill that specific purpose need to be purged" speech.
In Gem society, she would have been viewed as a second class citizen and seen as a disgrace for not being exactly like the diamonds want her to be. She already had deep self-esteem and self-hatred issues, so much so that she has a complete emotional breakdown when Pearl visits her kindergarten and sees the origin of her perceived failure.
And that was while she was living with the Crystal Gems. Imagine how much worse she would have been off if she had been found by homeworld soldiers instead the CG.
Fuck, Jasper even says "time to get rid of this embarrassment", which clearly translates to her wanting to kill Amethyst for not being perfect. Jasper berates her for being different, mocks her efforts, makes her feel inadequate as a person, and wants to fucking murder her over her flaws.
And why does she put Amethyst through that bullshit? Who is responsible for that ideology being spread?
Again, it's because of the diamonds. Everything Jasper says and does to Amethyst is a direct reflection of the beliefs the diamonds spread among their people.
That is really fucked up thinking about that. Poor amethyst...
One thing I found interesting that you didn't touch on in the original vid is that Steven was far more willing to tell of Connie for not being accepting of his gem family than he was for Andy or any of the Diamonds.
@@baconlettucetomato3894 Except he didn't "change". His outrage is always selective, in-universe because he's a myopic narcissist, but in reality because no one working on that show can write.
I was going to make a joke, but the stupidity of this response really does speak for itself.
@@baconlettucetomato3894
Are you serious!
Hey, as someone who just got out of an abusive situation with my own parents, thanks for this. I always have this tug of war going on in my head about whether I’d done something wrong, if I’d said or done the right thing if maybe I could have helped them become better. So I always appreciate how much you emphasize that you’re not a shitty person for not forgiving or being able to fix and change your abuser’s behavior.
On a less personal note- holy shit that part about Garnet was upsetting. Like, if the Diamonds are abusive parent metaphors they’re violently homophobic parents and Steven’s the straight guy who has a heart to heart with them and God Damn that’s disgusting.
@@peacehope8149 the feeling of starting to draw lines between Steven & people you know irl is something I'll never forget...
@@Boreddddpikapi the issue is not 'what could they have done'. the issue is that the writer decided to make the stakes so fucking high. the characters arent real people, theyre just pawns for the writers to use. they cant make one choice or another. why on earth are we pushed to sympathise with these nazi assholes in this show? why is that the case? bc the writers just want a redemption arc, and for some reason made the stakes really high for literally no reason.
also id say steven universe is a pretty irredeamably show. sugar has backed herself into a corner of 'we have to talk to these nazis and turn them to the light side' but that shouldnt be how it works. there is a reason hitler killed himself: bc he knew hed have the exact same fate if hed been captured. we did not sympathise with him bc he was a genocidal maniac who cared more abt his racist ideologies than living breathing people. this is the same with steven universe, but the genocidal maniacs are sobbing grieving diamonds, not what they shouldve been: angry driven assholes who didnt care about anyone else and COULD have been defeated
It really is tragic; Steven Universe was such a wonderful show at the start. It's genuinely amazing how quickly the show turned toxic.
I appsolotly agree with this. Steven universe was so good in the beginning (first 3 seasons)
but after that it went to shit. Like Jesus Christ it got so insufferably bad that I was genuinely questioning if Rebecca was even thinking straight
@@Ramsey276one do you mean the side that cyber bullied a girl into trying to kill herself over fan art?
If anything, it showcases the limits of the philosophy of acritical universal acceptance
it's funny how i only thought this show was briliant when i was in denial of being emotionally abused lol
I think you and I can relate 😔 I think I desperately need to forgive myself for how ignorant I was back then.... watching everything through a rose colored lens
This is the mood for me right now exactly
That struck right home. I'm better, hope you are too
most of the structures and morals in this show are now heavily mirrored from my past abusers beliefs. i only realised this now as i watched lilys video seminars. the show was reassuring me that what i'm watching is normal and okay. that what i was living with at the time was okay. it soothed my confusion on why i kept hurting and being blind to why. it's unbelievable how blind we can get.
Same
As someone with ptsd SU future was the most disgusting form of “representation” I’ve ever seen. If anyone I speck to ever thinks it’s a realistic portrayal then I know that that person isn’t a safe or trustworthy person to be around like holy fuck it was bad
Can you suggest a good movie or media (short series, nothing too long) that depicts PTSD in a respectful manner? I'd genuinely like to see it because I also think SU got some things wrong ... i feel it's important to see something that realistically depicts mental issued
@@XMarx-it1yj go watch kung fu panda 2 that shit slaps
...or just watch Kung Fu Panda in general, they're really good movies overall & a reccomend on my part...
@@xolco7081 kung fu panda does the whole "finding strength in who you are and embracing it" thing 1000x better than steven universe ever did
It really was like why did Stephen need to turn into a monster? Are you saying that people with mental illness become monsters?
I think the one thing I hate the most about the protagonist is that he always force everyone to agree with him, and doesn't even give them any space or a chance to think on their own: he literally chases them until they agree to do or act or think the way he wants. I find that disgusting for a "hero/protagonist".
@@lovelyheart3745 no, it’s a genuine criticism. steven always gets his way, & a good hero doesn’t always get his way. he faces challenges & sometimes cant change people’s minds.
PREACH I WAS JUST THINKING THIS WHEN I WAS WATCHING THIS VID. They're always seen as a "bad guy" when they don't agree with his values n beliefs!!
he was a kid 💀
My now ex used to do that to me, in one session before breaking up with her my psycologist told me that constantly harassing someone to agree with you is emotional abuse.
@@rotidedug8883 true but not the whole world revolves around him and if we say he is a kid for everything he could say that one german man doing the salute from WW2 is good and nobody should argue that he is bad because steven is a kid and when someone disagrees he forces them to agree with him
I just wish the Earth of Steven Universe actually felt like Earth. With Governments and untrustworthy humans.
Legitimate human villains?
I know right that was one of my big problems with it. Nobody challenges gems nobody reacts to them. Tons of humans realistically should have found gem tech and reverse engineered it so that humans could have those super weapons in case a gem attacks.
@@mrboerger1620 That's something I never knew, how did no government found out about the Kindergarten?
@@baconlettucetomato3894 That's not an excuse for not trying to give more depth of potential world building and conflict!
@@baconlettucetomato3894 he's right ya know it's kinda lazy. They should've explained things more about this world. At least have the government get involved once.
Thank you for that last bit. As someone who's mother is low key racist and high key homophobic I've been trying my best to get her to accept me as a bi woman dating a black man. She doesn't seem to like either of us beyond the fact that we can give her grandchildren and even then she hopes they look like me, not him. I needed to hear that it's not my fault that she continues to think like this. Thank you Lily
You and your husband are amazing people and deserve happiness as well as each other!
@@thatpunygirl___149yes8 Aww thank you! That means a lot. ❤
Please get away from her for the sake of yourselves and any children you may have. She could very much be a danger to them physically, mentally and emotionally.
Bless you guys 💕
Why do you still speak with her
"every creator who says everything was planned from the start is lying their ass off to you"
as a DM for my gaming group I cannot emphasize how true this is however I've been told by my players that they much prefer the stuff that I lie about planning (they don't seem to know that I'm lying about planning it but it seems like the idea that I did plan things makes them enjoy it more) than the stuff I admit I'm making up on the spot because I couldn't predict what they'd do.
I’m a new DM. I’m still getting used to improvising 30-60% of all sessions. My players think everything I do is amazing, so the important thing is that they’re having fun
If that were true hiatuses wouldn't be a thing
@@staringcorgi6475 hiatuses aren't always because something isn't planned yet, sometimes something can be planned but not ready.
This was honestly one of Lilly's best videos and I know Imma be playing this on repeat
But d' criticism is so dumb
@@caithlin I don’t think so, The Diamonds are HORRIBLE beings and they (quite honestly) should’ve died at the end.
I am writing this before the premiere, but I must say, Lily, I appreciate your willingness to actually rewrite previous work that you think could have been written/handled better. As a creator myself, one of the things that I worry about when I am writing scripts is what I might do if I later find out that I'm wrong. Watching you do this makes it obvious that when I do come to that, I can legit ass just rewrite it.
Edit: I tweaked a sentence to make it clearer what I was trying to say.
And that is how you can tell someone loves there work, is willing to admit when there wrong, and rewrite there work to more accurately potray there thoughts, feelings, and beliefs.
@@kittygamer797 I'm confused. I don't mean to criticize, but I think that you wanted to use portray instead of betray. But I'm an idiot so idk.
In the words of one screeching, Sonic-obsessed child, "When will you learn? When will you learn that your actions have consequences?"
recently rewatched season 1, and ur bit about how many of the self-contained stories are great is SO TRUE, and that's what makes the latter half of this show so...heart wrenchingly disappointing.
A lot of good shows were ruined for me because the went from self contained stories to a loosely connected saga. I love it at first because i love a good dramatic story but you can tell a lot of these writers arnt cut out for it, especially when they try to balance the 2 instead of picking one over the other.
I’d just like to say that the use of the LISA ost was amazing
Do you happen to know the name of the last track there?
Yes I heard Chopstick Suey (I think that"s what its called?) and I was very happy. Lily has mentioned Lisa in a few videos, but I still didn't see it coming, lol.
@@aydenwalker6093 Thanks much!
Yeeeeeeee I love LISA's ost so darn much
@@metaknight1410 actually its called 666 Kill Chop Deluxe, also the first song is called arrow to the head for anyone wondering
Plus, didn’t MLK said something like « violence is the voice of the unheard »
But, he doesnt excuse riots.
He said he couldnt condemn them without condemning the terrible conditions for black people.
Nowadays rioting and destroyed and looting isnt a way to be heard, back then it was hard to be heard otherwise. All we do is destroy the very communities we work to build.
Violence isnt the answer if this was only to be heard, be listened to.
In SU however, it isnt about being unheard, it isnt even about being dismissed or disrespectful. The opposition is outright dangerous, so you cant just take it lightly.
@@10thletter40 I have to disagree with modern rioting. This is my personal take thought. Nowdays, to be heard by commoners, you start youtube channel but that doesn't guarantee anyone doing anything.Your viewers will just sit, watch and cry.
Boycotts, and petitions can work with small racist buisnesses but nothing significant will change the justice system. The establishment won't do anything even if you were a popular youtuber activist. Of course there are donations but with the costs of living vs the average joe' salaries, you won't recieve enough
. It will take material damage to actually be heard unfortunately.
In SU, I think it's both. It just depends on the hierarchy. They will dismiss gems like Peridot but they will destroy some gems like rutile and garnet to not hear them.
@@10thletter40 What do you mean? The modern rioting and looting started with a Target that had allied themselves with local police. There was a vvv clear statement in that. Plus, big business that are all over the country are in no way “a part of the community.” If anything, they act as a sign of capitalism and do more harm than good
@@10thletter40 This is unironically the same centrist bullshit the entire video was addressing.
Let’s get to the meat of it. Rioting is a sociological inevitability, disgruntled people at the bottom of the hierarchy will riot if an incident angers them enough. This is universal and it is not different now, just because you’re alive to see it happening. The best and only civil way to deal with rioting is to fix what social issue causes it in the first place. You cannot just demand the people who are victims of violence to suddenly be peaceful because it makes you uncomfortable. That’s just sociologically impossible, it’s not how people work.
Case in point, if we didn’t have a police officer suffocate a black man to death in front of a scared crowd, no one would riot in anger.
“Yeah, don’t kill black people unjustly and we wouldn’t have to burn down your stuff,” is really the only agreement that would get through the establishment’s heads.
That arrangement pissed off racists. But it’s nevertheless the only agreement that works.
@@proton8689 Wellllllllll I agree with you mostly excepting that rioting has worked. Not to say that it's unjustified; I do believe rioting is wholly justifiable to address systemic racism and police brutality (kinda repetitive tbh but whatever). All I mean is that since the riot of last year it hasn't actually stopped or even really affected police brutality whatsoever, which just means that something more severe than rioting is destined to come to attack this issue. Though, it may just be another riot, as we've seen throughout history.
SU is a great example of "Does putting fantastical stuff on your story really makes your narrative better?" because serious if it wasn't the alien stuff we would get Ruby and Sapphire being Garnet mothers and be Steven grannies and that would fix a lot of the show just by them existing as different characters, and like Sugar wouldn't have allegories to hide behind forcing them not to touch heavy stuff, like you said the show when is trying to pass simple messages works so a show that is just a collection of simple messages and down to Earth would work much better for the narrative, but then again I can see SU gang screwing things up for being too incompetent too.
About Future, I never really took it as PTSD, but misdiagnosed PTSD.
It actually feels like the far rarer, but in terms of protagonists of media, common case of Hero Syndrome.
Hero Syndrome can affect anyone, but disproportionately affects police, doctors, soldiers, and especially, firefighters, who have been known to start fires just to put them out and receive praise.
Futurama actually had this as a plot for the first half of the episode "The Inhuman Torch", where the Planet Express Crew thought Bender was lighting fires just to put them out (in the second half it was found this isn't true, but this is known psychological behaviour).
Steven is used to the world revolving around him but it sort of doesn't anymore.
While no academic research has taken place on Hero Syndrome, it is theorised to be part of a broader group of withdrawal anxieties, a group of anxieties which contains separation anxiety, homesickness, gambling/gaming addiction withdrawal, etc.
Steven is not going through PTSD, but he definitely is not comfortable with the new changes in his life.
His symptoms far better match those of Hero Syndrome, and other withdrawal anxieties.
Wanna bet it was suppose to be PTSD but they goofed up
@@TechBlade9000 Of course, but the fact is we could read what Steven has as "bad take on PTSD", or we could read it as the very real "accidental take on Hero Syndrome". One makes the show worse, one makes the show better.
That reminds me on how Steven got upset with Greg in Future because Greg ran away without thinking of how Greg family treated Greg, he was upset of the life he could've had which was unlikely he would have that life considering his mother is pink diamond. Also when he proposed to Connie and got upset when she said not now. Even when he got upset that his other human friends had lives outside of him, Steven is self absorbed and needed real consequences that the show never gave him.
And the final arc was "poor baby, look at how he suffered for our sins" disguised as virtue signaling on PTSD
It's normal to get upset after being rejected, but he respected her choice. I don't see how he's self-absorbed? He's always trying to help others. And he is reasonably upset over not having a normal life (though I don't think he should've blamed it on Greg)
Steven is exactly the sort of person who says "but they're your family" to someone who has been mistreated by family and doesn't want anything to do with them.
@Coral except he didn't respect Connie's choice? He submerged in self pity, to the point he had to go to a doctor for the first time
(I stopped at 9:34 to type this, so I will update it if it's discussed.)
Listen listen: one thing I never see talked about is how White Diamond admonishes Steven for "acting like a child". Gems... don't have children. It completely threw me off, just like when Steven talked the other Diamonds out of attacking the Crystal Gems. This especially bugs me considering Steven was actually completely willing to fight in the earlier seasons. Like you said, writers almost never have everything ironed out from beginning to end, and the entire show kinda reeks of continuous editing.
"the comeback" to white was so cringy i would've dropped the show if it wasnt the last episode. I more just watched it to keep up at that point
@@baconlettucetomato3894 You're all up in these comments being a troll to people who don't agree with you. If anyone here has a 'sad lonely life' it's you.
Something that always really exhausts me is many "moderates" views on nonviolence. Specifically the idea that nonviolence is about being peaceful, and quiet, and polite because it's nice and respectful. BUT BEING NICE AND RESPECTFUL COMPLETELY MISSES THE POINT OF PROTEST. PROTEST IS ABOUT SHOWING BLATANT ANGER AND FRUSTRATION WITH AN ONGOING SYSTEM. The point of nonviolent protest isn't "see, we're here to hold hands and show we're nice people!". It is the threat of "if you don't do something, THIS IS HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO FUCK SHIT UP."
The point of a protest is exactly in the name. You are against what is happening. A peaceful protest is loud, it is noisy.
However, I disagree. Moderates usually implement this better, or at least, those to the right of the moderates you percieve as moderate and those a bit left of moderate
The farther left you go, the more violent the protests are. And yeah, the same can be true for the right.
@@10thletter40
Is it though? One thing I've been researching and learning about protests is that actual protesters hardly ever start getting violent on their own. The government are very good at being disruptive at protests, combining this with their power in the media they basically can start violence at a protest and just claim the protesters were the ones who did.
And if they dont do that they can just claim those protesters were being violent and use violence against them.
We've seen both tactics used during the civil rights movement and now. Every time the cops sprayed protesters with hoses and set dogs on them they claimed the protesters were being violent. Hell the media even accused king of inciting riots all the time.
The narrative that the civil rights movement was completely peaceful is only repeated now that the goals of king and others like them are seen as good.
@@genieglasslamp5028 No, the protestors are on video getting violent on their own. When it turns night, and a peaceful protest hasnt broken up, that is when lawbreakers take that and cause damage.
@@10thletter40
So which is it? Lawbreakers taking advantage or peacful protesters?
@@genieglasslamp5028 They arent mutually exclusive at times. _Usually_ the peaceful protests are out at day. Although not all the time, and there are some troublemakers. But at night it almost always turns violent or gets rowdy.
Really loved how you pointed out Steven's creepy insistence on calling the Diamonds "family" when the Diamonds actively tried to kill the actual family that loved and raised him. It always rubbed me the wrong way.
But also what did Abby Thorn do exactly
I believe another moment of Steven's empathy being good was when Steven saved the Cluster. Because the Cluster was simply several victims of Homeworld and while Steven did not have the power to fix them, he could find a way for them to achieve peace and take away their constant agony. He reached out to something that everyone viewed as bad and horrifying. I think that moment was another example of Steven's empathy being very beautiful.
Here’s a nice comparison for ya:
STEVEN UNIVERSE
Bismuth: Steven the diamonds literally oppresed, murdered, enslaved and discriminated us for millions of years
Steven: No, we have to talk it out.
AVATAR: THE LAST AIRBENDER
Zuko: I know what you’re gonna say, she’s my sister and I should be trying to get along with her
Iroh: No, she’s crazy and she needs to go down.
Or another one of the same premise.
Steven Universe
Bismuth: The Diamonds are literally space Nazis who have made life a living hell for everyone in the Universe, we need to ki--.
Steven: No we need to convince them to change, Killing is bad.
Tales of Vesperia
Flynn: You killed a well renowned Noble! That is a major crime punishable by death! We need Order in the kingdom t--
Yuri: So? If I were to let him live, we'd still have a psychopath on our hands manipulating the law again so he can feed people to monsters for fun. If it means avoiding that, I'll gladly take the mantle of Criminal.
funny thing is, azula is a victim of abuse and a literal child. you could even make the argument that not even ozai or azulon were as bad as the diamonds, they were raised in an environment of war by people who were the agressors in that war. if theres any fair comparison to the diamonds, it would be sozin. he tried to "expand" the fire nations glory across the world, similar to how the diamonds wanted to expand the gem empire to the galaxy. roku tried to talk to him and look how it turned out, 100 years of war, broken families, thousands of casualties across the nations, genocide of an entire nation and so much more. but somehow the diamonds were able to make a turnaround for themselves in a matter of days, minutes for while diamond. these are beings that existed for eons. i wish stevens gem was just a rose quartz, then he would be forced to accept the diamonds as the awful monsters they truly are. i wish this show had the decency to show that redemption is possible and very much a choice for minor evils and people who were misguided like peridot, but monsters like the diamonds deserve to be at the very least bubbled and kept away from all the gems they hurt
I just want to tell you that saying "your self worth doesn't hinge on whether or not you can change Andy's mind" was the one thing I needed because I've been trying to do that with my brother and I need to not do that. I love him but I can't change his mind...
But that's the whole principle of the show, the song "change ypur mind" is saying literally that, that IF the person does change it, then they can know you, you are more and not less than, like the person wants you to believe. And future is all about that, showing how Steven thought all his worth was dependant on how he could be a "hero" and change people's minds or soove conflicts
@@jplveiga sometimes you can't change someone's mind, sometimes you have to release people from your life so you can be happy.
@@skeletonsinscarves3965 thats exactly what he finds out, thats what I meant by he thinks so, in the beginning it's what he believes, then he comes to terms that he shouldn't have his worth on being useful
you know how in anime when theres a crazy villain theyre given an insane smile smirk? sugar gave them to the heroes, especially rose. that’s fascinating. she seems to fetishized insane people
Judging by the fact that SU wasn't an anime my guess is those are just smiles
Honestly, Steven is basically Naruto.
When in the video?
@@user-ev9yz1yb7l its not in the video but it’s definitely in the show, specifically rose does it a lot
I don’t think that’s really fetishizing….
The thing with trying to talk abusers down or to change their minds is that I feel like a lot of victims will have already wasted a lot of time trying to do it themselves? Speaking from personal experience, "abusers preying on their victims empathy to make them stay longer" is one of the things that makes it so hard to get out of these relationships. You end up feeling personaly responsible for trying to change your relationship with this person, and it never seems to work. The one time I brought up therapy to my mother I got shouted at and slapped, and I had to spend years trying to come to terms with that fact that I couldn't change her if she didn't want to, if she didn't think that she needed to change.
The concept of the diamonds together being the only ones able to heal a shattered gem would of been really interesting. Like, them hurting so many people and deserving punishment, but those who they hurt needing them to be around as the only chance to see their dead friends again.
If the abusive parent allegory was still kept if could of related to having sibling who still relied on that parent and who you'd have to bear seeing to get to. Or even the parent working through doing better with them and being glad for the sibling to have that, but having to deal with the fact that you didn't.
But then again, that couldnt be taken from Steven's view.
Oh yes everything I had to say about the diamonds.
Specifically the bit about people hanging with their friend's or loved one's abusers. I've had plenty of friends who will remain friends or on good terms with my bullies and abusers. Hearing that i'm not wrong and that remaining intact with a loved one's abusers is a massive betrayal was very cathartic. For so long everyone told me that I wasn't mature and that people just "change" and I shouldn't be so "rude" and hold them accountable for their past behavior. Thanks Lily!
@@baconlettucetomato3894
Yes lol I asked you something but honestly I don't really think you want to hear my perspective.
Basically what I said was I never believed or thought that Steven forgave to Diamonds. I don't think a lot of people actually do. I never said I did.
I also asked you to elaborate on why you think it's okay to hang around or forgive or whatever people who seriously hurt the people you love. I mean unless I misread what you said you basically said;
The people who say that I'm wrong to distance myself from people who still hang around with my abusers are actually right and I'm wrong. (I specifically mentioned abusers not people who only slightly wronged me.) ((Editing before you respond: That's what you meant by "and their right." I assumed.)
I also asked you to elaborate on why I shouldn't compare my own experiences to animation or media. I don't get it, isn't the point of SU (besides entertainment) to deliver a moral message? Like deeper themes in SU have to be there for a reason, and I think the point of that is for kids and anyone who watches it to understand them and apply or disregard them?
Haha well if you ever feel like elaborating you can come back.
You've definitely refined your ability to get at the heart of the issue for sure.
I'm not gonna lie, I really think it would be cool if you did another long video like you Steven Universe and Korra video, but on something you like and why you like it. Knights of the Old Republic springs to mind. Obviously you don't have to, but hey, something to put in the idea bucket for fun.
I would enjoy a video on content she likes too, and I know it would be real on what flaws that liked thing still has.
I will never understand why some people want to hear the positive thoughts on what another thinks after multiple arguments on why they dislike the topic so much.
I've even heard others complain that they talk to much about the negatives and should move on to the good side of things. As if they don't want to hear genuine criticism or criticism for the sake of comedy and just want people to praise things non-stop.
I can't explain why I roll my eyes at this complaint, (I might even sound like a jerk at this point), but I would love to hear from others.
@@octavianjoseph8633 It's not a complaint, it's a suggestion for a video idea. For example, going off the format that H.BomberGuy used that Lily emulated, his most popular video is explaining why Fallout 3, a massively popular and widely loved game, is actually really bad. But then later uploaded a somewhat follow up to that video years later about New Vegas and what it did right.
Just because I would like to see a video on what Lily likes is not because I'm afraid of people being mad, but rather understand her critiques more with a video in the same format but explaining what she likes about it and what it did right.
Thanks for making this. It's important people realise why this show is downright mentally damaging to victims of trauma. On another note about Future (aside from the whole 'giant monster' crap) there was a point when I was genuinely wanting to see how Steven would be helped. Because Steven was depressed and suffering and every character seemed to be reaching out to try and help him (especially Greg) but it wasn't working. They even tried to comfort and hug and listen to him but nothing was working. So I thought "Wow this is new, he's actually going to have to get real professional help for his problems this time. Friendship and hugging isn't working. This is actually a bit of an improvement." But nope, he turned into a monster and then everybody hugged him at once and then he was automatically okay. So the conclusion was that hugs can cure your mental illnesses as long as they are all done at once by lots of people. One at time they don't work. Stupid and lazy.
As a mental health professional the ending aggravated me to no end
Ya know.. I always wondered why I related to Steven so much, but after going through some therapy and, specifically in relation to the SU show, I came to the conclusion, that Steven/the whole cast are treated like narcissists and flying monkeys (people who let the narcissist do everything)..
I related because, being handled by a narcissist since childhood, easily turns you into one, and thats what I see steven doing. He doesn't even have his own agenda, it just turns into his bc it was his mother. The "my child must be exactly like me to be great, like me" thing is also a thing that happens a lot in narcissist households..
I really wonder if Rebecca was raised by one🤔
I did a quick google research on flying monkeys. I didn't know Wizard of Oz was used as a reference in psychology. Cool, I guess.
@@3rebella Dam that "bacon lettuce" tomato is quoted and has erased his comments everywhere
@Pabliski Malinowski wow, just because Greg is not that responsible, he still is masculine, you really wanna define masculinity as being "strong" or "daddy-like"???
That's a great question, and it makes total sense since: white diamond is the original narcissist and then it passed her ways onto her "daughter" pink, then onto Steven.
@@jplveiga Steven Universe redux, narcissist gets vibe checked and grow as a person and maybe some war
*2 and a half years ago i...*
Oh fuck does time fly, i didnt realize it had been this long
I always found it hard to accept that killing the bad guy is wrong. If people believed that same sort of ideology in LOTR then Sauron would've have won. You dont negotiate or bargain with evil. You crush it. The truth about non violence is that it only works against people with a conscience. If they have none then it wont matter how long you're non violent the end result will be the same. Honestly great video.
EXACTLY THIS. Let's say there's some guy standing there who says he's got a bomb and is going to walk over to a big red button and push it and blow up a building full of innocent people, particularly people that you know and love. You've got a gun in your hand and can get a shot before he reaches the button. Does taking that shot make you as bad as him? NO. FUCK NO OF COURSE IT DOESN'T, IT MAKES YOU SOMEONE WHO PREVENTED A BUNCH OF INNOCENT DEATHS.
It's part of why I hated the 'villain somehow kills themselves' thing that shows up in a lot of things, like Ginga Densetsu Weed or Harry Potter. They are fighting a tyrant who literally wants to kill them and *everyone* they love and has ALREADY killed many people they care about, but no, they're not going to kill them! They're just going to let them go because MUH MORALITY I DON'T WANT TO BE LIKE THEM - that ideology is so selfish, that your own feeling of being special and pure is more important than the lives of innocent people who you could save. Letting someone who you KNOW is going to keep hurting, keep killing, just...go, or trying to trap them somehow or chase them away so they leave your personal circle alone for a bit and hope they don't come back is absolute bullshit. It's part of why I don't like Batman much either, how many people would be saved if he just took the Joker out once and for all? He knows that Arkham is a revolving door. He knows that Joker is going to get out again and murder dozens or hundreds or even THOUSANDS more innocent people and ruin so, so many lives. But he won't kill because 'well then I'll be as bad as them' DEAL WITH IT. IF IT MAKES YOU BAD TOO, FINE, YOU CAN DEAL WITH THAT!
When a bear is fast asleep in its cave away from civilization and not disturbing anyone, you can afford to leave it alone. When a bear has gone rabid and is rampaging down Main Street mauling people, you shoot it until it dies.
Or, as Winston Churchill in some movie once said: "You cannot reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth".
@Alexander Hada I would guess that Sugar would call Sauron "one-dimensional" since Tolkien never even tried to suggest he was "fighting the right fight but he was too mean about it" or doing it since he was hurt so he needed to be healed without writing him as someone with goals beyond comprehension.
We had a generation of writers fell in love with Zuko and his redemption arc. He was Pink Diamond/ Kylo Ren/(Insert pity me villain here) done correctly. He never sought out to hurt people, not even Aang. He just wanted to return home and belong after years of denial. As such, Zuko's methods became increasingly ruthless and dishonorable. No one had to spell out his issues (Iroh giving him advice is not him laying out all the answers for him) because he realized the moral dilemma he found himself in. By the end of his arc, Zuko ushered in an era of peace for the Fire Nation and a lifelong friend of the Avatar. Such a shame to see people misunderstand redeeming a villain.
My personal pet peeve is that the entire cast shits on Pink Diamond but White Diamond who's objectively worse is treated as a soft boi with "feewings uwu"
Also Steven getting mad at his dad for having a fun and not abusive childhood in Future also pissed me off
Steven is that one kid with hippie parents who somehow became a conservative and constantly drags the parents for not being responsible or whatever.
The movie absolutely RUINED the idea that the diamonds were changed individuals. I never watched it because I would much rather have all my toes ripped off and my corpse dumped into boiling tar than sit through that hot mess, but I do remember hearing one line that went against the idea that the diamonds have changed.
WD: I’ve been saying “please” and “thank you,” even to lower life forms!
Steven: What did we talk about?
WD: Uhg, *equal* life forms.
That snippet from Let Us Adore You proves that their sudden change was only so they could keep Pink in their life and 1. They don’t see Steven and Pink Diamond as different people and reminds me way too much of *those* people who’s friends or family come out as trans dunno bout you. 2. They’re still trying to keep Steven or “Pink” away from their loving and supportive family. Reeks of abusers, even in the “honeymoon” phase of abuse, trying to make the victim dependent solely on them for everything.
TL;DR: the movie makes things worse for sugar once again by showing that the diamonds are still the most reprehensible people ever and haven’t changed from sugar’s convoluted idea that the diamonds are an abusive family.
So what I am hearing is Steven Universe is just Evangelion but the writers thought Shinji is a good role model for children.
Funnily enough SU Future's ending theme is a parody/interpretation(?) of Fly Me To The Moon.
No, but they probably thought NERV's treatment of Shinji was how parenting works.
Fuuuuuuuuu-
Thank you lily, i have been abused multiple times at a young age. Whenever i see someone defending the diamonds it seriously fucks me up.
Exactly.
People and this includes the writers, confuse Steven for a compasdive hero when in reality he is a pacifist survivor.
He is not that kind of caring as the show and fans wants to believe, he cares about his status quo before other people, and you nail a point that I have not realized before "he is less compassionate towards people that needs it more, and most of the time are disabled or non white people"
Example, he willingly send the rubies to die on space, fully knowingly that could kill them, and even though he had a ship that could save those gems, he was more worried about having fun in beach city.
The same goes for the off colors and Lars, he left them on homeworld surrounded by killer robots, and only make an effort to go check on them after several weeks passed (and still weirdly being praised as a compassive self-sacrifice hero)
He also does this towards the cluster, he never go to visit them with his mind powers to see if they are OK, and on SU future he was "I save the galaxy and there are no one else who needs my help", and the fusion experiments just as the cluster still exist.
He is supposed to not having forgiven the diamonds but then he send an abused victim of one of them to live with them and that was portrayed as a good solution.
And thank God someone else noticed the nonsense of future with the "portrayal of mental health", cause it was not a good portrayal if the person is a violent murderer who will transform into a monster, and we are gonna focus more into watching him being tortured into a breaking point and not at all to see his recovery.
That whole arc was an excuse to have an edgy Steven that "is corrupted and killed someone"
He did the same with Jasper
Jasper was abused and brainwashed into thinking she was perfect, sent to war, abused by Lapis and literally dropped on her knees, begging Lapis to please let her feel THAT way again (while Lapis was admitting she liked it...gross), when she was obviously confused about what her purpose in life was and how Steven literally told her to go away instead of helping or try to explain things to her AND LITERALLY SHATTERED
16:21 whoa that mouth sync timing
ME TOO
This sounds like it should be on the CW: they’re all apart reinforcing toxic relationships and having characters either forgive their abusers or simply forgetting about what they’re done.
Can you elaborate on this?
@@therotryzit some examples I can think of are Elena Gilbert wanting anything to do with Damon Salvatore after he confessed to murdering her friend (a man named Aaron Whitemore) simply because his feelings were hurt because “that’s how much control you have over me”and while Elena does chastise him claiming he “screwed up” the argument just devolves into a sappy declaration of love which ends with them sleeping together.
On the family side of things: Klaus Mikaelson from the Vampire Diaries/The Originals is a whiny, controlling, delusional obsessive man child who lords over his siblings and threatens to magically put them to sleep for anything ranging wanting to live their own lives away from him to “stealing from me”, all of his siblings would be well within in their rights to tell him to get fucked (and to be fair they do) but by the very end of the show one of his siblings (a man named Kol) is completely apathetic to fact Klaus is going to die (being bitter about Klaus being a controlling manipulative asshole) and his sister (Rebekah) chastises her brother despite the fact that she has suffered the most abuse at his hands (being put to sleep magically or having several suitors murdered by Klaus in the guise of “protecting” her, this happened “again, and again, and again” until Rebekah claimed to have “stopped falling in love”).
Back to romantic relationships: in regards to “The Flash” the main character (Barry Allen) unapologetically stalks his love interest later in the series (due to time travel shenanigans they never grew up around each other and this never had a strong friendship, so Iris is essentially a stranger minus Barry’s own past perceptions of her), and earlier on in the series he just comes off as a creepy weirdo who won’t take no for an answer, he doesn’t do anything “too bad” he just tries to get with her despite her insistence she isn’t interested in him in that way.
Iris is bad as well: she intentionally sabotages a relationship that Barry enters with another woman (Linda Park) by claiming Barry “never got over someone” (I’m paraphrasing as I don’t remember the exact quote).
Back to the Vampire Diaries: Caroline Forbes wanting anything to do with (and eventually sleeping with) the likes of Klaus despite the fact she unapologetically tore into him for being a monster who hurt several of her friends, used her boyfriend (Tyler) as a slave (Klaus being a hybrid of vampire and werewolf later gains the ability to create more hybrids and they’re magically enslaved to him due to the debt they owe him for freeing them of having to transform into werewolves) and just in general being a complete dick, this all happens while she unapologetically despises the likes of Damon and who she only seems to begrudgingly accept is around but is a lesser evil then Klaus simply based off the fact Klaus is centuries older.
@@thomasraines1396 I did not watch any of those shows nontheless that must have been really awful to watch through these series.
@@therotryzit it’s pretty bad yeah.
Legends of Tomorrow has had several episodes and even story arcs about forgiving abusive and/or neglectful father figures. Arguably the worst episode of the show is about Mick (Heat Wave) forgiving his physically abusive dad to the point where there's a scene of Mick literally doing self-harm and none of the characters take it seriously when they absolutely should.
As much as I like Legends of Tomorrow, I'm absolutely sick of those plotlines and how they ruin what could've been good episodes.
I appreciate that Dr. Doof reference
I genuinely dont get how writers can have this horrific of tunnel vision. I genuinely dont understand how you can botch a story this badly. Honestly, Steven shouldve just taken advantage of the diamonds weird trust of him, gotten into the inside, and started a revolution. That wouldve been a far more interesting twist to steven placating the diamonds than him going all the way.
Wow. I really enjoyed the original, but this just hit the real core problem so well.
It can take a lot to have to accept when someone is gaslighting you so that they can continue to do their toxic behavior unchallenged. You can't exactly reason someone out of an unreasonable position that they want to keep. Finally breaking away from a person like that can feel like maybe you failed them, please don't because one being unreasonable did that to themselves.
This whole video is what has been nagging at me for a fat minute, but I just couldn’t put it into words. Thank you, Lily!
the clip of the Bismuth episode and and privileged Pink Diamond was like a copy paste of a fight I had with a racist ex friend of mine, and that’s the problem with episodes like these. If you support behavior like this you give birth to a breed of mini Trumpets or a list of excuses for racists to have
@@baconlettucetomato3894 no I don’t hate the show because I was ‘abused’ first of all he and the girl barely spoke when I found out she was racist, and second, I hate the show for the same reason I hate her behavior: it’s blatantly racist
@@baconlettucetomato3894 I’ve never had a boyfriend. I wish but sadly no
I love this new update! Your format and writing is really to the point and doesn't dance around things for people's comfort. Really makes me consider my own position and feel more confident about not debating my rights with people who don't actually want me to have any.
Honestly i think one of the reasons why Steven isn’t ever growing as a character is because no one lets him say sorry they just say it’s fine and brush it off and continue to listen to everything he says so he’s never able to not be “perfect” because no one lets him improve so he doesn’t change and thinks he’s always right it really comes down to Rebecca honestly because i wish in the new series sense she fucced him up in the sense that she doesn’t let him improve i wish she explored that issue that he was always put on a pedestal because he’s half diamond and never became better sense she obviously doesn’t know how to handle a character that’s not “perfect” and she doesn’t know how to represent the trauma he went through
I know that Rebecca Sugar (and people like her) may not like to hear this, but they need to hear this. Not every character or people in life should be redeemed or forgiven. Some people are just awful toxic and hateful. They don't need a legit tragic reason to do they awful things they do. They do it either to keep themselves on top, or cause they love the trill of it. I know that some people don't believe or want to believe in a black and white world. Some people don't like the black and white morality, objectivism, or that Rorschach from the Watchmen might be right. But here's the thing. You can't tell people to stop being awful, and expect them to change. Life doesn't work that way, it never has. And the sad reality that most of us need to face is that some people are just too evil to live.
Yeah I think it comes down to many people belive in moral relativism. People say the diamonds shouldn't be held to morals because it's a human thing and their aliens.
well said.
The thing that always stuck me as weird regarding Steven Universe was the idea there was no other life-forms in the Universe that were just as unique as Humans? Like I wasn't expecting a 1:1 for humans but you mean to tell me there was no other aliens which cared for one another in a humane manner? It's just hard to swallow since they were out terraforming planets for their own reasons and I wanted to see Homeworld see the repercussion of their actions in the form of a rebellion coming for them.
It would have struck me as a cool idea to see aliens coming to recruit the Crystal Gems on the idea that they rebelled and wanted their assistance to end the Homeworld's reign. Would have been interesting to see, ya know.
This looks really interesting, can't wait to see how different your analysis of this is from more experience and more information the show itself
Update: I just finished the video and wow. Lily you've really outdone yourself with this one. I like how this was a lot clearer when it came to what the core problem so Steven Universe. The part where you we're talking about if steven loves garnet was just... wow, really good and probably my favorite thing you've ever put in a video. Keep up the good work :]
Using "Arrow to The Head" at the start immediately triggered my Lisa neurons.
5:09 Lily Orchard admits she like Steven Universe at some point. 2021 (Colorized)
People rarely get this passionate about things they didn't, at some point, either like, or at least see some degree of potential in. If the work never, on any level, stirred any sort of positive feeling, the person likely didn't force themselves to watch it.
In the rare cases I've seen where this is not the case, the resulting criticism is very brief, very blunt, and while venomous generally a great deal less detailed. To put it simply? Terrible things hurt worse when they manage to take down your guard, and render you vulnerable on some level.
She says she used to like it in the big video too
She did this a lot. The denouement of her original video is her explaining that part of the reason she's so pissed at the show was that she initially thought it had promise and it meant something to her.
what you did about peace fetishizers was so insightful and perfectly put. i’ve already loathed those types of people but i’ve never been able to put it intelligently into words. great video as always!
Im now really questioning a lot of stuff I see from both the left and the right because of a Steven universe critique of all things. Im still a minor and grew up watching this show. I always thought that peace and kind words were the answer to everything, but when it comes to much bigger issues that involve horrible people, those people never care. I really like this video
Why Bismuth was bubbled
She was the only character who knew that Roses sword couldn’t shatter a gem
That is NOT Lisa the painful rpg music I hear in a Lily Orchard video, what a pleasant surprise
You can only yell “ WHAT THE FUCK” at a show so many times before you’re completely done with it.
Holy Shit you blew my mind with this
I'm at a lack of words by how good this was, thank you so much for putting yourself through this again but I'd also love to see you make a long video about something you do enjoy and why you do so!
Steven universe to me was just great concept handled poorly,
1. I didn't really like Steven as a protagonist he felt meh
2. And they kinda ruined garnet for me in the later half of the series
3. Rose or pink diamond is complete garbage as a character, as a matter a fact all of the diamonds are garbage
The part of this show that I absolutely hate is when Steven bubbles Bismuth. As a black woman seeing a cis het white boy literally silence a black women until he allows to her to speak again made me unbelievably angry.
But knowing a white woman wrote those scenes like that makes the entire thing believable.
Same. It sucks
I wish I could apologize on behalf of Sugar, but she doesn’t deserve people making excuses for her in the slightest.
I am so incredibly sorry all the same that you and all it affects had to see her do something so disgusting 🙏
@@YaburuRunyaru
The thing no one should have to apologize for her because shes old enough to grapes that there are problematic elements to her show and fix them.
The worst part was Bismuth was right. The only way to truly liberate everyone to kill the diamonds. How could he silence Bismuth after seeing those gem experiments?
@@mollyganasa621 and none of her friends even *considered* letting her speak her piece before the wedding, and if it weren't for Steven, she wouldn't have been unbubbled for that, either.
I really appreciete you saying that people gaslight others into thinking they are bad for speaking out and defending themselves as a way to tell them to shut up
You know, it'd actually be cool for the white diamond scene if it was the cluster that started talking. Just because they found eachother doesn't mean they won't be forever damaged, even with Yellow starting to fix them. They'll still be cracked and unstable. If they get poofed by accident their forms will return to broken messes; literal symbols of what the diamonds did.
If they started talking to Steven, little lights to show the gems talking and bringing him back to the time they were all screaming for help, the imagery of Garnet nearly splitting and torn apart just knowing that she was the reason homeworld thought to try and replicate it.
Quick side note: It wasn't Garnet's fault they did so and that they did it in the way they did, but she knew that she gave the idea and that was far too close to it for her to emotionally handle. She blamed herself for giving them the idea when she didn't even mean to. Sapphire was going to be hurt, something by the way that homeworld conditioned her not to care about. She didn't even care about her own life nor form, but Ruby did. She blames herself for something she could have never prevented just because she was the first.
I think it would've been good if both white and Steven were reeling from that. It'd be good for White to see it up close. And then? Have her be in denial about it, have her dismiss it once the shock fades. Turn an eye, pretend it isn't there because 'oh we're fixing it now aren't we? We're reversing all the damage!' and then just have steven lose it because that's not how trauma works; because they'll still carry those emotional scars forever. They won't just be ok after they form, they'll remember the haze of being forced to fuse just to live and not kill others, the pain of being shattered just for an experiment and being deemed useless.
Actually they shouldn'tve been happy when yellow was fixing them. They should've reformed screaming for mercy or in shock or angry. They should've been messy crying or dissociated from the world because the person that shattered them was right there. They would be fixed physically.... but never mentally. If they showed that though then the utopia would be shattered.
I got on this channel because of LOK. Best decision I ever made. Love your content.
Me too
I got here because of the Steven universe video
I've been hoping you'd make a follow-up to your video after the season finale and Future, and while that's not actually what you did, I thoroughly enjoyed this rewriting and I can only agree with what you said. Seeing people excuse and "explain" (as if people who don't like the show don't UNDERSTAND what the show claims to have achieved) this show is frustrating and exhausting, and seeing someone put into words so well why they're... VERY wrong is cathartic.
Not only has lily once again made me think more about a situation with more actualy thought instead of skirting around the subject, but also has inspired me to carry on messages about abuse, empathy, and friendship correctly in my own works. Thank you lily!
i really did hate the fact that they used stevens morality as the shows morality as well. it means that steven can never be wrong, even if he’s being a brat or a dick to anyone and everyone around him, he’ll still never encounter consequences for his actions, because his views on good and bad have to be what’s right.
To contrast this, in ATLA aang has a seemingly pure morality by the end of the show, but many moments in the first season show him making mistakes and facing the consequences for those mistakes (i.e. “Bato of the Water Tribe”, “Warriors of Kyoshi”, etc) which shape him into a character similar to steven by the end of the show. but where they differ is that the shower doesn’t hesitate on making aang wrong. his views on not killing the fire lord is wrong. literally everyone else says this is wrong and it’s true. but when steven doesn’t kill the bad guys, it’s right, the villains not only live but get redeemed.
i’m so glad you made this video clear on how the morality of the show and the morality of the shows main characters need to be different to actually give the characters some depth and conflict rather than him always being in the right.
Choosing a non-violent route and not standing up properly for a cause are two different things. The latter isn’t being bigger than the situation; it’s being a coward who doesn’t understand what it takes to actually solve difficult problems standing up.
Whewwww Points were made! 👏🏾👏🏾
What really hurt me is the episode where blue diamond takes Greg. Garnet admits that it would've been game over if she was spotted by Blue Diamond, yet Steven still tries to call her family
That LISA comparison caught me by surprise, an unexpected, but welcome surprise
The fucking 666 kill chop deluxe bit got me. Also holy shit, I've been trying to put my feelings about Steven into words, and you did that entirely. He pisses me off so much, especially when it comes to the final Diamond arc.
Steven: says shattering gems is bad
Also Steven: proceeds to try to shatter White Diamond in future and does shatter Jasper.
Also the "non violent" shit doesnt stand up. Rebecca Sugar went tunnel vision *after* she wrote the first season, or thats what it feels like. During the end of the season when lapis is in prison she say the exact summary of the Steven at the end of the cartoon: that jasper is evil but we cant fight her cause she is too strong/doesnt deserve it *and Steven straight up denied it* like BRUH. He tells lapis that jasper is evil and deserve to die BRUH
And if not die, then at least to be bubbled for eternety.
Gah I have no idea how to praise this because there's so many ways I can fawn over this!
All you said is 100% correct, and i fuckin love it! I am at a loss for words on how to keep blabbering on my love for this!
Thank you so much for creating these SU videos, they've helped so much in my own analysises.
I’d love to see so much more of these long form criticism from you, lily. This is truly inspiring and honestly when I hear the complaints from the right of “I don’t mind BLM it’s just the rioting and destruction of their own property that negates what they’re saying” as if they ever tried to understand them before deciding that without respectability politics, they aren’t worth listening to. And honestly this one video on how violence to change oppression does not make you as bad as the oppressor makes more sense and is more concise than half of lefttube. Of which I do love, I just think it’s geared towards an already left audience and does little to change minds or opinions or educated. Just talk about the thing so we can all nod in agreement. So, thanks. This is so great. I’d love to see more long if less frequent videos. ❤️
oh hell yes, my life is blessed by Lily Orchard existing and spitting on abusers
this is why i have a problem with the anti-racism ads they're making with steven universe characters. i love the message and what they're advocating to children. i hate how they push away all the oppressive undertones of the characters origins
I would love it if Steven would have actually realized he silenced others. The whole theme of the show is to show others a chance to have there own will and opinions, but Steven just takes that away. If Steven would have actually realized this that would have been great. The diamonds to me are all horrible, minus blue sometimes? I mean Yellow and White are clearly horrid. Have you met the selfish brat we call pink? Blue just feels like a hodgepodge of I'm depressed but like also I abused Pink apparently? Personally I think every diamond maybe minus Blue should have just been bubbled or shattered. I mean I can see Blue being redeemable but I'd rather she just get the whole bubble treatment also. All in all, I feel the diamonds were just all extremely dislikeable. Even if you look past all there cruel acts, who would want them to be saved? There all 1 dimensional and like the worst character traits possible. If you took away all there space dictator crap, they'd feel like off brand Mean Girls and Heather's. Like literally Blue could be compared to McNamara, White to Chandler, Pink to Duke because of the selfishness of each of them, and Yellow to like Regina because literally she doesn't care about anything and she's intelligent. The fact I'm comparing space dictators to High school Popular girls already shows an array of problems within the show.
They're All equally terrible , just because one is " depressed 🥺 " doesn't mean she's redeemable