So Jon Lansman the founder of Momentum was Benn's campaign organiser...no surprise there then. He has been trying to move Labour more to the left for years. And look what happened in 2019 when it did...
Conrad Murray I have read his diaries and he admits he should have listened more about the deputy leadership election. He later admits it did a lot of damage.
Conrad Murray utter bollocks. Tony Benn is pretty much more responsible then anybody for keeping Thatcher in power during the 80s. Denis Healey was absolutely right about Benn - completely destructive naivety.
As someone from a working class background & a poor community I have a real distaste for posh kids who almost revel in slumming it with those poorer than themselves, a line from a famous UK song comes to mind... 🎶🎵 "I Wanna sleep with common people, I wanna sleep with common people like you!" 🎵🎶 Nothing worse than someone who exploits the less fortunate for their own ego, especially when espousing unrealistic ideological dreams and playing with people's livelihoods in the process.
"It's about production meeting people's needs and not just profit" is an admirable goal. The mistake lies in thinking that the way there is through comitees, nationalisation and politicisation.
I have huge respect for the integrity of Michael Foot; and huge disdain for the narcissicistic destructiveness of Tony Benn. Foot is underestimated for the work he did to try to hold the party together - he was faced with impossible odds to begin with. But he should never have been selected Labour leader - his gift was to be the powerful, articulate, and respected voice of Labour's conscience...from the sidelines. Cabinet minister and parliamentery house leader? Asbsolutely. Party leader? Never.
At 51:18 Kinnock says he "made his on programme and went rampaging round the country" He appears to be speaking to two kids on their bikes on a street corner. This is what Mandelson was up against.
Benn's vanity was as conspicuous as the ghastly failure of every country that followed the policies Benn yelled for. I guess a thank you is in order, because if it had not been for him and his minions, Thatcherism might not have seen more than 4 years.
@38:02 The documentary is less than honest about what happened at Bermondsey. The year before, Peter Tatchell and a group of far left activists took over the local party and selected Tatchell as candidate. Tatchell was deeply unpopular with the majority of local voters. The retiring MP who had held the seat since 1946 came out against him and he found little support within the Labour party as a whole aside from Tony Benn. In the previous election, labour had won the seat with 63% of the vote. Tatchell received 26% in the by-election while the liberal candidate received 57%. In the aftermath, the liberals were able to keep control of the seat for the next three decades.
Neil Kinnock "abstained" - yeah, what a real hero. Abstained over Healey/Benn, Abstained over Miners' Strike. He is "the front bencher" sitting next to Peter Tatchell and refuses to support him when he is savaged by the Press in by election. Amazes me why anybody gives him any respect.
Bit unfair. I really sympathise with Kinnock over the Miners' Strike as I don't see what else he could have done. The strike was idiotically-timed, badly run and couldn't have succeeded but he was right not to openly condemn it. What else was to be done?
Tony Benn's failure was how immensely political he was and everything had to be done in the perfect, democratic, pure way. Typical aristocratic intellectual. Most ordinary people don't give a shit! They just want to make enough money to live a nice life, nice house house, nice holiday and provide for their family etc
Benn himself lived in a very nice house, apparently (appropriately enough for a socialist obsessed with affectation) a ramshackle place, albeit at the end of a mile-long drive, overlooking the Essex coast. He built half a dozen sheds on his extensive land during his lifetime, to hold all his papers.
@@CA-ee1et The giveaway of old-money English aristocrats is shabby-chic: worn chintz furniture, covered in dog hair, dog waste ground into the aubusson rug, chipped tea cups, tracking mud into the parlor. It's only nouveau-riche arrivistes like Donald Trump who live in pristine, expensive surroundings.
It’s interesting that Denis Healey was clearly on the right of the party at this time, and considered to be a sort of proto-blairite. However he strongly opposed many of Blair’s more controversial policies such as the illegal invasion of Iraq, introducing university top-up fees thus breaking their 2001 election pledge not to do so, foundation hospitals, independent trust schools etc. Had both Healey and Tony Benn been back-bench MPs during Blair’s 10 years as PM, Healey’s voting record in parliament would probably have been more similar to Benn’s, than people like David Blunkett’s or Jack Straw’s.
Just shows how the left is more than willing to eat its own for immediate political ends. Benn tearing apart the party eventually gave way to Blair, not to mention ensuring the Tories would be in power for almost 20 years.
You're being selective there. Healey certainly had his differences with Blair, but his divisions with Benn were fundamental. Benn believed in things like massive nationalisation and the "commanding heights". Healey was fundamentally against that - a firm believer in the mixed economy. In summary, I think Healey's differences with Blair could be described as policy disagreements. His differences with Benn were ideological.
Michael Foot described the Cenotaph episode best: it was "a fake sensation". How anyone could criticize a man, whose behavior throughout that ceremony was nothing short of respectful, for his choice of coat is beyond me.
Yeah im a hard right winger but i didnt understand that part either. What these new far left wingers funded by elite george soros did to the cenotaph the other week was REAL disrespect. Michael just wore a scruffy looking coat, he didnt spray paint "white racists" or hammer and sickles all over it. These modern left wingers are completely different to benn and foot and the old left, they actually opposed the elites agenda, these new ones support it fully and are funded by them, the old decent left has been hijacked by totalitarian elite funded psychopaths and its a damn shame because now everyone hates the left because the modern ones outrageous rhetoric and actions.
Because his choice of coat was disrespectful. At the Cenotaph you wear a long black overcoat, not a short dark-green (almost olive green) reefer jacket. Foot also wore his reefer jacket open rather than closed as it ought to be.
@@thelastgreenelf you have to remember that this was 40 years ago. Many war veterans were still alive and most of that generation were brought up to believe that how you dressed expressed your attitude - if you wanted to show respect, you dressed smartly. Society was also much more socially conservative in general than it is now. Rightly or wrongly, it was perceived as grossly disrespectful to the war dead - it was akin to turning up to a funeral like that. Society changes a lot over the year and never stops changing. "The past is a different country. They do things differently there."
@@humanforfreedom9583 you have to remember that this was 40 years ago. Many war veterans were still alive and most of that generation were brought up to believe that how you dressed expressed your attitude - if you wanted to show respect then you dressed smartly. Society was also much more socially conservative in general than it is now. Rightly or wrongly, it was perceived as grossly disrespectful to the war dead - it was akin to turning up to a funeral like that. Society changes a lot over the years and never stops changing. "The past is a different country. They do things differently there." In 40 years time, they'll think things we find normal now to be weird.
For the people who wondered what's that song the Kinnocks are singing at the end ... Its a Italian-anti fascist song, sung in an Internationalist concept about the Spanish Civil War in the 1930s.
Well spotted David,indeed an anti fascist song sung during the spannish civil war,but it became a song throughout the International Brigades at that time...
Interesting in that I've just been watching a documentary about Orwellian double speak and here is Tony Benn indulging in it in a big way! The man really was dangerous.
@@sjewitt22 Orwellian isn't the same as Orwell policies. And actually, Benn seems an archetype of Socialists who do not love the poor but simply hate the rich.
The pile on Tony party! We could do with some more of his destructive innocence now. You can watch this now and shade in the direct line from Thatcher to Blair to Starmer, oh my! Baroness Kinnock indeed!
Bennites are the very definition of delusion. Imagine how Maggie would have ripped them to shreds, more than she did, had they won control of the party.
My dad was a copper during the riots all I remember being three at the time was not seeing my dad a lot at the time. My mum tells a story of him going to work ad coming back 48 hours later having dinner then going back to work he doesn't remember coming home that day
Brilliant set of programs documenting the Labour Party during the 80’s and early 90’s. No wonder Thatcher had an easy ride. Would have liked to seen more about the Minors strike which was a huge Labour failure
Jesus, even I, consider myself centre left in my politics, would never have voted for Foot's Labour in 1983. Utter shambles, total disaster. Played right into the hands of the tories and Margaret Thatcher.
Look at who that is. It's Thatchel. Ahaha, imagine what people would say then if they knew that PT is for men using the same toilets as women. That womanhood is achievable merely by a man saying "I'm a woman".
Neil Kinnock's use of the word bizarre (in other documentaries, speeches, etc.) when describing Tony Benn's challenge for the deputy leadership is accurate. My own theory is that it was Benn's way of atoning for the fact he did not seek the leadership in 1980, which he regretted. By running for the deputy leadership instead of the leadership, he could avoid direct accusations of hypocrisy and running out of personal ambition (he supported Michael Foot for leader only a few months earlier) while also satisfying his supporters who had opposed his running in an election decided by the old rules.
If anything I've gone further right since I've last seen this, but also more sympathetic to Benn and his starry-eyed band of Reds. Their short and mid term political instincts were abysmal but I think they, better than any other Labour element, had their finger on the pulse of the age. They sensed more than anybody what a turning point the late 70s/ early 80s was and they wanted to go in a different, socialist direction. They saw what was coming and fought like hell to avoid it. The moderates and Blairites were totally short term in their thinking, took 17 years to come to power anyway, and their "weightless hegemony" has long since evaporated into more successive Conservative governments. All that being said, I think Benn was clanging against the spirit of the age. The leftists were swimming upstream of history. The Thatcher-Reagan complex went on an absolute rampage in the 80s. This was the blood-soaked last act of the Cold War. I don't think Benn could've stopped the neoliberal turn if he had gotten the top role and probably would've been assassinated had he ever gotten close.
Hard to imagine how the Labour Party would have been in a stronger position had Tony Benn won the deputy leadership in 1981, as Chris Mullin claimed, when you consider, among other things, the election manifesto presented in 1983 and what Michael Meacher alluded to when describing Labour's "reaping the whirlwind of anger and disgust" over the infighting. Makes me suspect if Benn had been elected, the SDP-Liberal Alliance might have edged Labour out of 2nd place in popular votes. Agree or disagree?
I think it unlikely. I remember at the time, there was a view amoung people that the SDP might be an alternative but we all soon realised that they were just a top-down split from Labour, not a grass roots organisation. They didn't feel "real" to most people.
Simon Roberts That may be how it appeared in the Labour party but to the electorate the Labour party was off in cookoo land in 83, a Benite party would have been wiped out even more than the Foot parrty was.
Simon Roberts That's a good description of what the Labour party has become 32 years on - a top down, elitist organization that doesn't feel 'real' to most people.
Some of what you say is true, but your not being terribly even handed. For example, as for the miners, after what the unions had done to the largely ordinary people of Britain in the 1970s - cutting power, fire services, garbage services with no thought for anyone but themselves - the unions were deserving of total defeat.
I have offered wondered over the years what would have happened to the Labour Party if Tony Benn had become deputy leader in 1981 I have thought of this and believed that Labour heavy defete in 1983 would have been even bigger
Tony Benn was repulsive to most centre moderates which I am. I make no secret that I am not a hardened Thatcherite, but I can see the appeal of voting Tory when you look at Foot, Benn and Healy.
I agree with you John with your comment as I have said over the years if Margaret Thatcher had won by a 200 plus majority in 1983 the Consertives would have been in power for at least 30-40 year's and Labour would never have held power again
For example, she liked to spout meaningless crap about the virtues of her being an economical housewife, which has nothing whatsoever to do with how government budgets are run (unlike a ‘housewife’, a PM never really knows in government as to what’s going in and out). She also talked of putting the "Great" back into Britain when winning the Falklands War (“Great" was about geographical issues,not ‘prowess’ - check your history), and she also got lucky with the Labour-SDP split during the 80s.
13:30 Rule 283 of Politics: If you're a fat, middle-aged man, don't allow yourself to be interviewed wearing glasses floating around in a swimming pool.
What these people forget is that you need to convince the population as a whole not your mates in the Party. They will never ever learn that the British people will never accept far Left policies.
The condescension is oozing from Gerald Kaufman. "We only narrowly staved off a Socialist policy on puppy farms!" Yeah, because those aren't a problem, whatsoever.
Tont Benn a good man but delusional if thinks tht getting a slap on the back and a meeting supports you is the same as the general public. Most people care about their own lives than workers miles away.
"Despite a rare nervous condition, Tony ...." and then no more said. That was plopped in like it wasn't going to impact on the perception of the rest of the story. If it's so trivial as hardly worth the mention, why mention it? No, that was not an impartial bit of documentary making. At best it was disingenuous. We all know the tacit implications of a nebulous 'nervous condition'.
Nounismisation What a bizarre, paranoid comment to make - you've also completely misunderstood what they mean by "nervous" too. You could quite easily have looked it up online. He was suffering from Guillain-Barré syndrome, which is not a mental health issue - it attacks your nervous system and can leave you very physically incapacitated. The reason why the makers of this programme didn't go into further detail is out of respect for Benn's privacy. He was hospitalised and the worst elements of the press made a huge deal out of it. Indeed, the Sun newspaper even tried to infiltrate the hospital. It was a very traumatic time for Benn and his family, so naturally the makers of the programme didn't particularly want to dwell on what was clearly a painful and totally private matter.
I'm really grateful that thatcherite scot should post these videos, they are important political documentaries, but can he or she please be a little more mature and refrain from making mind numbingly ill-thought out comments at the end of a programme which otherwise appeals to intelligent people. Alternatively I think only a very naive person would portray Thatcher (or any politician, even Mandela) as being a saviour. He or she is having a laugh but it is cringeworthy.
30:45 - How could have the Labour Party allowed this man Foot to be in this state to attend the act of remembrance at the Cenotaph. Utter pathetic and totally disrespectful.
What's this?! Labour Party documentaries?! ;-) but thanks for uploading this. The only other upload of this was in parts and a pain in the arse it was! Btw, is it just me that really likes the theme tune? Happy Bday Mrs. T! (for Saturday!)
It's been much of the labour party's history I'm afraid. The labour party has shown an incredible tendency over the years to tear itself to shreds. As Neil kinnock said, there are far too many people in labour who are more interested in power within the party then power for the party. So very, very true.
Just trying to name those at the Cenotaph at 30:46. From the right, Thatcher, Foot, Steel, not sure of the next is, Heath, Hailsham, and then Carrington with the Foreign office wreath, Whitelaw? Strange now with so many had WW2 service medals.
Well your point has some validity re union dogma in the 1970s over pay claims. However your conclusion is too simple, even extremist. Yes, there was a dark side to this movement - EVERY political movement (including your favoured one) has one - but it should not have been destroyed because of its worst excesses. In the long term, since the "total defeat" of the unions, many more people have suffered through insecure and low paid employment than those who suffered through strikes in the 1970s.
thatcheritescot's bluff and bluster are meant to compensate for the real growth rates being higher during the Atlee consensus years than the Thatcherite consensus years. The arguments of relative decline that they then advance are based on completely devastated countries having higher growth rates during that period, as though the Chinese are the economic model of the world today with their higher growth rates than the Americans and Swiss. It's called catch-up effect, and the disingenous attempts to memory-hole it by people defending the neoliberal economic model make this Red Tory weep.
So Tony Ben lost his seat in spite of his overweaning self righteousness. Perhaps the best thing that could happen for the labour party. The trouble with all hardcore believers, from doctrinaire socialists to fundamentalist religious is the blindspot that makes then think that because they believe they are right that that somehow gives them right to impose their beliefs on everybody else.
His effect on the labour party over several decades has been absolutely malign. It's part of the reason why older voters always disliked him - they remembered the damage he caused the first time round.
@@MeTheRob His effect on the labour party over several decades has been absolutely malign. It's part of the reason why older voters always disliked him - they remembered the damage he caused the first time round.
My god. the hypocrite Kinnock singing Bandiera Rossa - 'Red flag will be triumphant Long live socialism and freedom'. Long live the Kinnock family at the EU trough.
Tom May The image was probably supposed to symbolise the fact, that Thatcher came to the rescue & rescued a sick nation (On the brink of collapse) because of Trotskyist hold over the Labour government, which resulted in more strikes & the infamous ‘Winter Of Discontent’. Thank you stupid Union officials for that. Before you start to mention about wages, etc, police officers wages were a pittance back then, but they didn’t go on strike & hold the country to ransom, did they? Derek Robinson the hero of Longbridge, who only wanted to fight management, not negotiate terms, etc. When there was no one else to fight, the hard-left fights the soft-left in the unions, back then.
***** You don't think that Labour being out of power from 1979 to 1997 was not a huge boon to the Class that Lord Stansgate ( with his American Heiress wife ) belonged to?
West Brit That's not the issue - you've implied that Tony Benn, a sincere man whatever else he is, is some sort of an establishment double agent. Ridiculous.
***** I raised it as a question, I didn't say it was so . Son of a Cabinet minister , Cabinet minister himself, Father of a Cabinet minister Big House in Holland Park Fabulously Rich wife. Pretty much definition of ruling class But spent his political life making Labour unelectable - you explain
West Brit I think you'd be better off going after members of the ruling class who demonstrably spend their lives furthering their own class self interest - like David Cameron, rather than Tony Benn who opted our of being ruling class and dedicated his life to causes of democracy, peace, human rights etc. You can call that making Labour un-electable, but I have to ask what the point is in a Labour party if it has flimsy values that change to whatever focus groups tell it well get it elected, and is essentially heartless, managerial and pragmatic - barely distinguishable from the tory party. If there had been no Falklands, a left wing Labour Party could easily have got in, instead the country went a different way and it's been a disaster for most people. Now Thatcherism is the new centre. That's totally unacceptable, and goes some way to explaining why Liz Kendall's campaign won't get off the ground, despite being the Blairite choice.
They were all great politicians that all had served in government but Michael Foot could not have won the 1983 election with Tony Benn blamed for trying to split the party plus the Falklands war and of course the dreadful mistake of one of his polices getting rid of nuclear missiles which at the time was suicidal with the Cold War with the Soviet Union . Though I respect Michael Foot and Tony Benn they were great men of there time and will always be remembered .
"I'm not sure if it's very British or very Welsh to sing in moments of triumph" Proceeds to sing Italian Communist song against Mussolini, who was dead 40 years before. A song filled with celebrations of "rivoluzione". Hint: It's neither British nor Welsh to sing Bandiera Rossa in moments of triumph, but it is very Italian Communist. Any wonder we didn't trust you? Any wonder the Sun ran articles like "Stalin will be voting Kinnock" by 1987? Most of the lads Kinnock left behind in the valleys did not sing Bandiera Rossa in the Tredegar Working Mens Club.
Watching Michael Foot's appearance at the Cenotaph, no one could see him as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. Sorry - even myself, a centre left man would not want him representing Britain in the world as our Prime Minister.
I believe Thatcher was a bully (who her colleagues would probably have hit in the mouth if she were a man) with the intellectual capacity of a London cabbie. She tried to appeal to people with little time or inclination to research economics or history and who were up for a bit of “straight talk” (you know the type who think we're "too poor" to give foreign aid). Everybody is capable of making intelligent judgements but Thatcher had a gift for appealing to the ignorant side of human nature.
Romanians and Bulgarians have pitched tents all over a nature reserve in Scotland recent figures have estimated the amount in its thousands, House break ins, begging, handbag theft, shop lifting all have tripled in the last few month here in Scotland, my sister is a Nurse for the NHS and she basically said the Hospital is at breaking point , also diseases which have not been in Britain for hundreds of years have remerged and studies have confirmed it is going to get worse ( Do we want this for our kids ? ) I'm all for immigration however us the British tax payer deserve quality control on who comes to this country, ( WE NEED A REFERENDUM NOW
Immeasurably valuable resources for students of current UK politics. Thanks!
So Jon Lansman the founder of Momentum was Benn's campaign organiser...no surprise there then. He has been trying to move Labour more to the left for years. And look what happened in 2019 when it did...
Watch this again today 16 Dec 2019....
Thanks for posting these. They bring back so many memories and seem so relevant at the moment.
Benn was actually an extremely arrogant man who wouldn't listen to anyone else and sacrificed his party's chances for his own desire for power.
The opposite of what you said is true. You should read some books.
Conrad Murray I have read his diaries and he admits he should have listened more about the deputy leadership election. He later admits it did a lot of damage.
Conrad Murray utter bollocks. Tony Benn is pretty much more responsible then anybody for keeping Thatcher in power during the 80s. Denis Healey was absolutely right about Benn - completely destructive naivety.
As someone from a working class background & a poor community I have a real distaste for posh kids who almost revel in slumming it with those poorer than themselves, a line from a famous UK song comes to mind... 🎶🎵 "I Wanna sleep with common people, I wanna sleep with common people like you!" 🎵🎶 Nothing worse than someone who exploits the less fortunate for their own ego, especially when espousing unrealistic ideological dreams and playing with people's livelihoods in the process.
amen
Foot was too eccentric
Yet he exuded genuine compassion unlike most politicians today
Boris is eccentric. lol
"It's about production meeting people's needs and not just profit" is an admirable goal. The mistake lies in thinking that the way there is through comitees, nationalisation and politicisation.
l could've done without the 20 seconds of obscenity at the beginning, otherwise, thanks for the upload.
There was no swearing?
I have huge respect for the integrity of Michael Foot; and huge disdain for the narcissicistic destructiveness of Tony Benn. Foot is underestimated for the work he did to try to hold the party together - he was faced with impossible odds to begin with. But he should never have been selected Labour leader - his gift was to be the powerful, articulate, and respected voice of Labour's conscience...from the sidelines. Cabinet minister and parliamentery house leader? Asbsolutely. Party leader? Never.
Absolute bullshit. Healy was in the wrong party. Such a shame we have had to fight facist Tories like him for so many years
Denis Healy fought against actual Fascists in Italy. What have you ever done?
Michael Foot was a true Parliamentarian in the best sense of that word.
27:50 'the left ran out of momentum' what a harbinger of the future.
Hehe well spotted 👍
Watching Kaufman's assessment of the 1983 election in 2019 is actually horrendously prophetic.
Huge difference in how Foot and Corbyn took it.
All I can picture are their Spitting Image puppets...man that show really nailed it...lol....
Jeremy Corbyn played a part in this debacle too.
At 51:18 Kinnock says he "made his on programme and went rampaging round the country" He appears to be speaking to two kids on their bikes on a street corner. This is what Mandelson was up against.
One of the best things John Smith did was to dismiss Peter Mandelson.
Benn's vanity was as conspicuous as the ghastly failure of every country that followed the policies Benn yelled for.
I guess a thank you is in order, because if it had not been for him and his minions, Thatcherism might not have seen more than 4 years.
@38:02 The documentary is less than honest about what happened at Bermondsey. The year before, Peter Tatchell and a group of far left activists took over the local party and selected Tatchell as candidate. Tatchell was deeply unpopular with the majority of local voters. The retiring MP who had held the seat since 1946 came out against him and he found little support within the Labour party as a whole aside from Tony Benn.
In the previous election, labour had won the seat with 63% of the vote. Tatchell received 26% in the by-election while the liberal candidate received 57%.
In the aftermath, the liberals were able to keep control of the seat for the next three decades.
Tatchell is a prat. Always has been always will be.
Neil Kinnock "abstained" - yeah, what a real hero. Abstained over Healey/Benn, Abstained over Miners' Strike. He is "the front bencher" sitting next to Peter Tatchell and refuses to support him when he is savaged by the Press in by election. Amazes me why anybody gives him any respect.
Bit unfair. I really sympathise with Kinnock over the Miners' Strike as I don't see what else he could have done. The strike was idiotically-timed, badly run and couldn't have succeeded but he was right not to openly condemn it. What else was to be done?
Kinnock was a bloody careerist scumbag
Reminds me of Burnham.
"We have principles and if you don't like them, we have others"
Principles don't matter if you can't win elections.
Kinnock was the worst case scenario. He couldn't win elections suffering 2 defeats and didn't have principles.
Tony Benn's failure was how immensely political he was and everything had to be done in the perfect, democratic, pure way. Typical aristocratic intellectual. Most ordinary people don't give a shit! They just want to make enough money to live a nice life, nice house house, nice holiday and provide for their family etc
Benn himself lived in a very nice house, apparently (appropriately enough for a socialist obsessed with affectation) a ramshackle place, albeit at the end of a mile-long drive, overlooking the Essex coast. He built half a dozen sheds on his extensive land during his lifetime, to hold all his papers.
@@CA-ee1et The giveaway of old-money English aristocrats is shabby-chic: worn chintz furniture, covered in dog hair, dog waste ground into the aubusson rug, chipped tea cups, tracking mud into the parlor. It's only nouveau-riche arrivistes like Donald Trump who live in pristine, expensive surroundings.
i would never vote Labour in a hundred years but Tatchell was treated in a disgraceful manor in Bermondsey by the press
It’s interesting that Denis Healey was clearly on the right of the party at this time, and considered to be a sort of proto-blairite.
However he strongly opposed many of Blair’s more controversial policies such as the illegal invasion of Iraq, introducing university top-up fees thus breaking their 2001 election pledge not to do so, foundation hospitals, independent trust schools etc.
Had both Healey and Tony Benn been back-bench MPs during Blair’s 10 years as PM, Healey’s voting record in parliament would probably have been more similar to Benn’s, than people like David Blunkett’s or Jack Straw’s.
Gizo02 just shows how much to the centre that labour was at that time that a once right wing MP was now to the left
Just shows how the left is more than willing to eat its own for immediate political ends. Benn tearing apart the party eventually gave way to Blair, not to mention ensuring the Tories would be in power for almost 20 years.
Many of the old Right couldn’t stomach Blairism. Gwen Dunwoody , Roy Hattersley are just 2 examples
You're being selective there. Healey certainly had his differences with Blair, but his divisions with Benn were fundamental. Benn believed in things like massive nationalisation and the "commanding heights". Healey was fundamentally against that - a firm believer in the mixed economy. In summary, I think Healey's differences with Blair could be described as policy disagreements. His differences with Benn were ideological.
Denis Healey and David Milliband are the two greatest leaders of the Labour Party that they never had.
Michael Foot described the Cenotaph episode best: it was "a fake sensation". How anyone could criticize a man, whose behavior throughout that ceremony was nothing short of respectful, for his choice of coat is beyond me.
Yeah im a hard right winger but i didnt understand that part either. What these new far left wingers funded by elite george soros did to the cenotaph the other week was REAL disrespect. Michael just wore a scruffy looking coat, he didnt spray paint "white racists" or hammer and sickles all over it. These modern left wingers are completely different to benn and foot and the old left, they actually opposed the elites agenda, these new ones support it fully and are funded by them, the old decent left has been hijacked by totalitarian elite funded psychopaths and its a damn shame because now everyone hates the left because the modern ones outrageous rhetoric and actions.
Because his choice of coat was disrespectful. At the Cenotaph you wear a long black overcoat, not a short dark-green (almost olive green) reefer jacket. Foot also wore his reefer jacket open rather than closed as it ought to be.
@@CA-ee1et That is ridiculous.
@@thelastgreenelf you have to remember that this was 40 years ago. Many war veterans were still alive and most of that generation were brought up to believe that how you dressed expressed your attitude - if you wanted to show respect, you dressed smartly. Society was also much more socially conservative in general than it is now. Rightly or wrongly, it was perceived as grossly disrespectful to the war dead - it was akin to turning up to a funeral like that. Society changes a lot over the year and never stops changing. "The past is a different country. They do things differently there."
@@humanforfreedom9583 you have to remember that this was 40 years ago. Many war veterans were still alive and most of that generation were brought up to believe that how you dressed expressed your attitude - if you wanted to show respect then you dressed smartly. Society was also much more socially conservative in general than it is now. Rightly or wrongly, it was perceived as grossly disrespectful to the war dead - it was akin to turning up to a funeral like that. Society changes a lot over the years and never stops changing. "The past is a different country. They do things differently there." In 40 years time, they'll think things we find normal now to be weird.
For the people who wondered what's that song the Kinnocks are singing at the end ... Its a Italian-anti fascist song, sung in an Internationalist concept about the Spanish Civil War in the 1930s.
Well spotted David,indeed an anti fascist song sung during the spannish civil war,but it became a song throughout the International Brigades at that time...
workers of the world....Unite!
David Cummings l o l yeah right, dream on
David Cummings Do you happen to know the title?
Sorry No!
34:56 is that Michael foot's twin brother?! They look identical. A pair of Feet you could say...
Interesting in that I've just been watching a documentary about Orwellian double speak and here is Tony Benn indulging in it in a big way! The man really was dangerous.
Orwell and Benn shared the same politics.
@@sjewitt22 Orwellian isn't the same as Orwell policies.
And actually, Benn seems an archetype of Socialists who do not love the poor but simply hate the rich.
The pile on Tony party! We could do with some more of his destructive innocence now. You can watch this now and shade in the direct line from Thatcher to Blair to Starmer, oh my! Baroness Kinnock indeed!
Bennites are the very definition of delusion. Imagine how Maggie would have ripped them to shreds, more than she did, had they won control of the party.
If he had won control of the party there wouldn’t be a Labour Party today, he was deeply delusional
My dad was a copper during the riots all I remember being three at the time was not seeing my dad a lot at the time.
My mum tells a story of him going to work ad coming back 48 hours later having dinner then going back to work he doesn't remember coming home that day
Labour has just been through this again
It's spooky to see how history is repeating itself
Labour also did the same in the 1950s. Over its history, it's shown an amazing tendency for self destruction.
Brilliant set of programs documenting the Labour Party during the 80’s and early 90’s. No wonder Thatcher had an easy ride. Would have liked to seen more about the Minors strike which was a huge Labour failure
Jesus, even I, consider myself centre left in my politics, would never have voted for Foot's Labour in 1983. Utter shambles, total disaster. Played right into the hands of the tories and Margaret Thatcher.
John King you would have voted SDP probably
We have the most right wing press in Western Europe so we have the most right wing politics.
Michael Foot was a thoroughly decent human being. He was however totally unsuited to being the Leader of a political party.
He was a man of great principles but was never a leader of a political party.
Look at who that is. It's Thatchel. Ahaha, imagine what people would say then if they knew that PT is for men using the same toilets as women. That womanhood is achievable merely by a man saying "I'm a woman".
Ironically kinnock was the incubating leader
He held power in order for Blair's leadership too become inevitable
Neil Kinnock's use of the word bizarre (in other documentaries, speeches, etc.) when describing Tony Benn's challenge for the deputy leadership is accurate. My own theory is that it was Benn's way of atoning for the fact he did not seek the leadership in 1980, which he regretted. By running for the deputy leadership instead of the leadership, he could avoid direct accusations of hypocrisy and running out of personal ambition (he supported Michael Foot for leader only a few months earlier) while also satisfying his supporters who had opposed his running in an election decided by the old rules.
He supported Foot
If anything I've gone further right since I've last seen this, but also more sympathetic to Benn and his starry-eyed band of Reds. Their short and mid term political instincts were abysmal but I think they, better than any other Labour element, had their finger on the pulse of the age. They sensed more than anybody what a turning point the late 70s/ early 80s was and they wanted to go in a different, socialist direction. They saw what was coming and fought like hell to avoid it. The moderates and Blairites were totally short term in their thinking, took 17 years to come to power anyway, and their "weightless hegemony" has long since evaporated into more successive Conservative governments.
All that being said, I think Benn was clanging against the spirit of the age. The leftists were swimming upstream of history. The Thatcher-Reagan complex went on an absolute rampage in the 80s. This was the blood-soaked last act of the Cold War. I don't think Benn could've stopped the neoliberal turn if he had gotten the top role and probably would've been assassinated had he ever gotten close.
I could swear this is a comedy!
Hard to imagine how the Labour Party would have been in a stronger position had Tony Benn won the deputy leadership in 1981, as Chris Mullin claimed, when you consider, among other things, the election manifesto presented in 1983 and what Michael Meacher alluded to when describing Labour's "reaping the whirlwind of anger and disgust" over the infighting. Makes me suspect if Benn had been elected, the SDP-Liberal Alliance might have edged Labour out of 2nd place in popular votes. Agree or disagree?
I think it unlikely. I remember at the time, there was a view amoung people that the SDP might be an alternative but we all soon realised that they were just a top-down split from Labour, not a grass roots organisation. They didn't feel "real" to most people.
Simon Roberts That may be how it appeared in the Labour party but to the electorate the Labour party was off in cookoo land in 83, a Benite party would have been wiped out even more than the Foot parrty was.
Simon Roberts That's a good description of what the Labour party has become 32 years on - a top down, elitist organization that doesn't feel 'real' to most people.
Totally disagree
Some of what you say is true, but your not being terribly even handed. For example, as for the miners, after what the unions had done to the largely ordinary people of Britain in the 1970s - cutting power, fire services, garbage services with no thought for anyone but themselves - the unions were deserving of total defeat.
52:17 "I warn you not to be ordinary" could still be a sogan of the left (and alas, many others, today, albeit with a very different meaning.
I have offered wondered over the years what would have happened to the Labour Party if Tony Benn had become deputy leader in 1981 I have thought of this and believed that Labour heavy defete in 1983 would have been even bigger
Thatcher won a 145 seat majority in 1983, maybe she could have reached the 179 figure which Blair did in 1997.
Well John I think Mrs Thatcher would have got a majority of over 200 in 1983 if Tony Benn had become deputy leader
Tony Benn was repulsive to most centre moderates which I am. I make no secret that I am not a hardened Thatcherite, but I can see the appeal of voting Tory when you look at Foot, Benn and Healy.
I agree with you John with your comment as I have said over the years if Margaret Thatcher had won by a 200 plus majority in 1983 the Consertives would have been in power for at least 30-40 year's and Labour would never have held power again
How about finishing third to the the libdem predecessor and going poff
Brilliant documentary. Could anyone put the Michael Foot campaign song (min 46-47) online in its entirety?
Michael Foot as prime minister would of been funny
For example, she liked to spout meaningless crap about the virtues of her being an economical housewife, which has nothing whatsoever to do with how government budgets are run (unlike a ‘housewife’, a PM never really knows in government as to what’s going in and out). She also talked of putting the "Great" back into Britain when winning the Falklands War (“Great" was about geographical issues,not ‘prowess’ - check your history), and she also got lucky with the Labour-SDP split during the 80s.
Love this intro.
Thatcher as superwoman? LOL🤪🤪🤪🤪 Dozy Ducker 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
13:30 Rule 283 of Politics: If you're a fat, middle-aged man, don't allow yourself to be interviewed wearing glasses floating around in a swimming pool.
The ultimate example of out of touch, insensitive to the voters and elitism.
What these people forget is that you need to convince the population as a whole not your mates in the Party. They will never ever learn that the British people will never accept far Left policies.
The condescension is oozing from Gerald Kaufman. "We only narrowly staved off a Socialist policy on puppy farms!" Yeah, because those aren't a problem, whatsoever.
Wasn't he the one called the manifesto the longest suicide note in history
Labour in more ways than the name suggests
The song is called Avanti Popolo!
43:30 "what was wrong with that document was, it was a stupid document"
Gerald Kaufmann was a very intelligent MP
Tont Benn a good man but delusional if thinks tht getting a slap on the back and a meeting supports you is the same as the general public. Most people care about their own lives than workers miles away.
"Despite a rare nervous condition, Tony ...." and then no more said. That was plopped in like it wasn't going to impact on the perception of the rest of the story. If it's so trivial as hardly worth the mention, why mention it? No, that was not an impartial bit of documentary making. At best it was disingenuous. We all know the tacit implications of a nebulous 'nervous condition'.
Nounismisation What a bizarre, paranoid comment to make - you've also completely misunderstood what they mean by "nervous" too. You could quite easily have looked it up online. He was suffering from Guillain-Barré syndrome, which is not a mental health issue - it attacks your nervous system and can leave you very physically incapacitated. The reason why the makers of this programme didn't go into further detail is out of respect for Benn's privacy. He was hospitalised and the worst elements of the press made a huge deal out of it. Indeed, the Sun newspaper even tried to infiltrate the hospital. It was a very traumatic time for Benn and his family, so naturally the makers of the programme didn't particularly want to dwell on what was clearly a painful and totally private matter.
+thatcheritescot: I love your intros! First class :-)
I'm really grateful that thatcherite scot should post these videos, they are important political documentaries, but can he or she please be a little more mature and refrain from making mind numbingly ill-thought out comments at the end of a programme which otherwise appeals to intelligent people. Alternatively I think only a very naive person would portray Thatcher (or any politician, even Mandela) as being a saviour. He or she is having a laugh but it is cringeworthy.
Labours never going to win
LETS PUT CAMERON HEAD ON A SPIKE!!!!!!!
Oliver Herbert Tories would still get ahead
nooooooooo
Tony Benn completely classless about Neil Kinnock at the end of this show.
If enthusiasm was a manifesto then labour should have won
30:45 - How could have the Labour Party allowed this man Foot to be in this state to attend the act of remembrance at the Cenotaph. Utter pathetic and totally disrespectful.
The dead service men he was sincerely honoring didn't wear frock coats, silk ties and dress shirts.
What's this?! Labour Party documentaries?! ;-) but thanks for uploading this. The only other upload of this was in parts and a pain in the arse it was! Btw, is it just me that really likes the theme tune? Happy Bday Mrs. T! (for Saturday!)
And with Keir Starmer Labour now stands for???? In 2023 what does Labour stand for????? I cannot answer this.
It breaks my heart to see my party at war with itself.
It's deja vu all over again
It's been much of the labour party's history I'm afraid. The labour party has shown an incredible tendency over the years to tear itself to shreds. As Neil kinnock said, there are far too many people in labour who are more interested in power within the party then power for the party. So very, very true.
Just trying to name those at the Cenotaph at 30:46.
From the right, Thatcher, Foot, Steel, not sure of the next is, Heath, Hailsham, and then Carrington with the Foreign office wreath, Whitelaw?
Strange now with so many had WW2 service medals.
It was 40 years ago. Nothing strange that they had world war II medals.
So basically Neil Kinnock assaulted somebody in a bathroom. The fact he shows off about it is hilarious.
Anyone got a copy of the Micheal Foot song on vinyl?
Well your point has some validity re union dogma in the 1970s over pay claims.
However your conclusion is too simple, even extremist. Yes, there was a dark side to this movement - EVERY political movement (including your favoured one) has one - but it should not have been destroyed because of its worst excesses.
In the long term, since the "total defeat" of the unions, many more people have suffered through insecure and low paid employment than those who suffered through strikes in the 1970s.
I Think Labour will win the next Election.
Thanks for your uploading these but your comments at the end of the videos are incredibly biased and out of place.
thatcheritescot's bluff and bluster are meant to compensate for the real growth rates being higher during the Atlee consensus years than the Thatcherite consensus years. The arguments of relative decline that they then advance are based on completely devastated countries having higher growth rates during that period, as though the Chinese are the economic model of the world today with their higher growth rates than the Americans and Swiss. It's called catch-up effect, and the disingenous attempts to memory-hole it by people defending the neoliberal economic model make this Red Tory weep.
Interesting. I do get fed up of the way Thatcher is so lionised by her supporters... "made Britain great again"... yawn...
Hardly surprising that a ‘Thatcherite’ channel is, erm, pro-Thatcher.
So Tony Ben lost his seat in spite of his overweaning self righteousness. Perhaps the best thing that could happen for the labour party.
The trouble with all hardcore believers, from doctrinaire socialists to fundamentalist religious is the blindspot that makes then think that because they believe they are right that that somehow gives them right to impose their beliefs on everybody else.
5:57 this is what tony benn is
What’s the song the song that Kinnock sings at the end
That's interesting how Jeremy Corbyn pops up.
+Felix Baxter
He popped up in episode 1 too.
Is he a Time Lord ?
His effect on the labour party over several decades has been absolutely malign. It's part of the reason why older voters always disliked him - they remembered the damage he caused the first time round.
@@MeTheRob His effect on the labour party over several decades has been absolutely malign. It's part of the reason why older voters always disliked him - they remembered the damage he caused the first time round.
I love it when the Far Left takes it on the chin
My god. the hypocrite Kinnock singing Bandiera Rossa - 'Red flag will be triumphant
Long live socialism and freedom'. Long live the Kinnock family at the EU trough.
Kinnock, ytaitor of the working class.
Ludicrous intro to the main programme here. 'Thatcher to the rescue' in superman garb - what a nonsense made of history there!
Maggie was more General Zod than Clark Kent
Tom May The image was probably supposed to symbolise the fact, that Thatcher came to the rescue & rescued a sick nation (On the brink of collapse) because of Trotskyist hold over the Labour government, which resulted in more strikes & the infamous ‘Winter Of Discontent’.
Thank you stupid Union officials for that.
Before you start to mention about wages, etc, police officers wages were a pittance back then, but they didn’t go on strike & hold the country to ransom, did they?
Derek Robinson the hero of Longbridge, who only wanted to fight management, not negotiate terms, etc.
When there was no one else to fight, the hard-left fights the soft-left in the unions, back then.
If Hattersely's comments at 41,20 about the NEC failing to put the manifesto into proper shape is true...what does it tell you about the Labour party?
That it was dominated by left wing eccentrics then. And during the Corbyn years.
@@zeddeka the shadow cabinet and PLP were not dominated by left wingers at all..
What was that song they were singing at the end of the programme?
Bandiera Rossa
Tony Benn did a huge service to his class
The only question is was he a fool who didn't mean to- or a sleeper agent
West Brit You can't be serious
***** You don't think that Labour being out of power from 1979 to 1997 was not a huge boon to the Class that Lord Stansgate ( with his American Heiress wife ) belonged to?
West Brit That's not the issue - you've implied that Tony Benn, a sincere man whatever else he is, is some sort of an establishment double agent. Ridiculous.
***** I raised it as a question, I didn't say it was so .
Son of a Cabinet minister , Cabinet minister himself, Father of a Cabinet minister Big House in Holland Park Fabulously Rich wife.
Pretty much definition of ruling class
But spent his political life making Labour unelectable - you explain
West Brit I think you'd be better off going after members of the ruling class who demonstrably spend their lives furthering their own class self interest - like David Cameron, rather than Tony Benn who opted our of being ruling class and dedicated his life to causes of democracy, peace, human rights etc. You can call that making Labour un-electable, but I have to ask what the point is in a Labour party if it has flimsy values that change to whatever focus groups tell it well get it elected, and is essentially heartless, managerial and pragmatic - barely distinguishable from the tory party. If there had been no Falklands, a left wing Labour Party could easily have got in, instead the country went a different way and it's been a disaster for most people. Now Thatcherism is the new centre. That's totally unacceptable, and goes some way to explaining why Liz Kendall's campaign won't get off the ground, despite being the Blairite choice.
Bandiera rossa? Really?
The X Thatcher. Haha.
8:55 a young Jeremy Corbin 😳
Micheal foot wasn’t to Blame the hole National committee was against
Labour Party never learn...majority of people in Britain don't want to have a Party too left wing
54:32 one of the best moments of my life
They were all great politicians that all had served in government but Michael Foot could not have won the 1983 election with Tony Benn blamed for trying to split the party plus the Falklands war and of course the dreadful mistake of one of his polices getting rid of nuclear missiles which at the time was suicidal with the Cold War with the Soviet Union .
Though I respect Michael Foot and Tony Benn they were great men of there time and will always be remembered .
"I'm not sure if it's very British or very Welsh to sing in moments of triumph"
Proceeds to sing Italian Communist song against Mussolini, who was dead 40 years before. A song filled with celebrations of "rivoluzione".
Hint: It's neither British nor Welsh to sing Bandiera Rossa in moments of triumph, but it is very Italian Communist. Any wonder we didn't trust you? Any wonder the Sun ran articles like "Stalin will be voting Kinnock" by 1987? Most of the lads Kinnock left behind in the valleys did not sing Bandiera Rossa in the Tredegar Working Mens Club.
Tony Benn is insufferably pompous and self-righteous...
Vote-"Good Old Labour".
Interesting to see, trouble is we dont need a tory lite Labour Party. I hope JC can find the right blalance.
Given the state of the current post-Brexit Tory Party, the triumphalist intros are not wearing well.
Watching Michael Foot's appearance at the Cenotaph, no one could see him as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. Sorry - even myself, a centre left man would not want him representing Britain in the world as our Prime Minister.
He looked smart as a Guardsman compared with the unmade bed of a man we now have in Downing Street.
@@mattdavies7398 Yes, I agree with you there.
when was this made??
Around the time the then Labour Party leader John Smith died in 1994 I think.
1995, when labour were STILL in opposition...
I believe Thatcher was a bully (who her colleagues would probably have hit in the mouth if she were a man) with the intellectual capacity of a London cabbie. She tried to appeal to people with little time or inclination to research economics or history and who were up for a bit of “straight talk” (you know the type who think we're "too poor" to give foreign aid). Everybody is capable of making intelligent judgements but Thatcher had a gift for appealing to the ignorant side of human nature.
Romanians and Bulgarians have pitched tents all over a nature reserve in Scotland recent figures have estimated the amount in its thousands, House break ins, begging, handbag theft, shop lifting all have tripled in the last few month here in Scotland, my sister is a Nurse for the NHS and she basically said the Hospital is at breaking point , also diseases which have not been in Britain for hundreds of years have remerged and studies have confirmed it is going to get worse ( Do we want this for our kids ? )
I'm all for immigration however us the British tax payer deserve quality control on who comes to this country, ( WE NEED A REFERENDUM NOW
Benn never really got it.