Use a 50% white vinegar to 50% water in a spray bottle to clean the toilet. Agree with others on maybe easing up on disinfectant use. Well done for tackling this subject publicly though. Unfortunately money will always be the biggest hurdle but there are some great proposals here.
For our food waste, we buy compostable/ biodegradable bags, so just a thought, you could buy compostable bin bags for your toilet rather than using standard plastic ones.
I don't know if they've changed the compostable plastic bags but when they were first sold, they will only decompose when exposed to light and air, so in a dump situation they didn't always have time to decompose before getting covered up.
@@chuggingalong A Co-op just opened in our village and the bags you can use at the self service section are a decent size and biodegradeable - just looked and seem to be no holes - you could always use a plastic bag to cart them to the dumping place and tip biodegradable one out and reuse the placcy one.
Lydibrown as soon as you put and sealed even into one of these bags that you talk about the composting process is Halted until the bag and the contents get a supply of oxygen so the bacteria can break down the product.
I've built several compost toilets on land (straight on the ground on top of some straw and "wet theory" -without separation). 12 months is really the minimum for safe compost, so there's always an active chamber and holding one one where the pile is just sitting there for a year+. That holding chamber / composting heap needs air circulation, but the air inlets need to be protected from both flies and rats. Perforated steel plate with scaff netting on the inside does the trick. What you have in mind will be "dry theory", of course, and presumably just a single chamber. "Dry theory" reduces smell problems. However, all the compost toilets I've built have been vented by either a pipe or a double wall at the back to take any smell up high and into a hedge or whatever. That's mainly venting the active chamber of course (there being air circulation between the two). Not so practical in most situations beside a canal, though. I guess protected air vents at the bottom and something similar to the carbon filter your fancy toilet has near the top might work. The ultimate answer to smell, though, is a layer of wood ash. Strictly wood ash, I hasten to add, not coal or coke if you're hoping to make useable compost. As you'll gather from the above, a composting system does need to be managed. Just a big pile in a box isn't likely to work. However, maybe the best solution beside the canal WOULD be just a big pile in some sort of sealed steel box or skip, with just small flaps to open, empty your stuff and close again. Those boxes or skips can then be lifted, taken away and emptied in some suitable place to be properly managed and produce good compost. A working canal boat with a small crane for this job? That would certainly be better than a lorry driving them along roads.
@@deth3021 If you have access to a proper composting site near the canal, that is not affected. But such places are few. What was happening was that the stuff was being double-bagged and put in with the general waste. In other words, not composted at all.
U2 are an absolute delight! It really doesn’t matter the topic, your energy and presentation complement each other so well. Thanks for sharing not only your narrow boat experience but yourselves with us.
Human waste is considered a medical hazard as faeces can contain everything from Hepatitis to other hazards. Likewise urine contains everything from hormones through to remains from antibiotics which can leech into the land. The bags will also take a long time to decompose, whereas waste dealt with via the Rlsan will be dealt with as per the "norm". Love your honesty and your thoughts that you were being eco friendly too. Looking at this perhaps the Elsan costs need to be considered too by "da management".
There are plenty of us who burn our solid toilet waste in the stove. As long as the stove is already hot, it doesn't take long for everything to be reduced to a tiny amount of ash. If it has already mixed with sawdust it will be fairly dry. I also mix a small amount of diesel into it to help the process along. Its only a matter time before crt ban chucking ash in the hedge though.
Good one. Glad you made the effort to highlight this. CRT will cause untold issues with this mandate. They will force the issue underground (ie digging a hole where possible and burying) but more often than not, inconsiderate dumping, using private skips, household bins, street bins etc. in urban areas etc. Stopping the use of Biffa bins is not fixing the issue, it's just pushing it elsewhere. Saying that, it's highlighted the need for people to actually compost on board. It takes less space and resources than many think. I will still get a similar loo when I move on board. If there's no alternative, I'll compost completely, however I'm working on a system to turn the compost into briquettes which will be burnt on the fire. I'm still doing trials at the moment, but I think it could be a simple, workable and effective solution. Saves on coal and wood too...
@@phenogen8125 I doubt we'll see more pump out facilities, I think a more likely future will be CRT removing waterside pump outs and telling everyone to go to the marinas. Less hassle for them and more profit for the marinas.
@@phenogen8125 There is no disposal system that doesn't have some environmental impact. We use quantities of treated clean water to flush our poo away. Our rivers and coastline are suffering from untreated discharge every time there is a storm, incinerating uses fossil fuel to cook the contents, humanure going to landfill adds to the creation of methane (as does any organic material, so if any of your food scraps are going into Biffa bins that's adding to that problem). Arguably composting is the only approach that does have integrity! The current problem has been entirely caused by CRT recommending that separating toilet users bin their dry waste not by those who fully compost.
@@phenogen8125 As far as CRT's stance is concerned, I would agree with you - other than it was them who created the issue in the first place. If they hadn't carried the recommendation to bin on their website for just over three years those of us who have been composting for years would have continued to tell people that it's 'fully compost or stick with the potta porti'! We are very much of the view that this will prove a good moment to sort the confusion out and get good practice going. If you're hoping that several hundred people will throw away up to £1000 of loo (Separett and Airhead may even be more than that) and install a pump out I fear you may be disappointed. CRT are concerned about the pressure on the system - everything from sheer numbers to the self pump outs and/or wet wipes that overwhelm and block elsans. They aren't going to magically provide composting facilities but they are definitely open to innovation. You mentioned a travelling pump out boat (there is one, on the lower GU), there is a project in development that started as a PhD study at UCL to collect humanure from boats for central composting. And collecting dry bagged humanure is a lot more pleasant and safer than raw sewage.
Having been a live aboard for 2 years now, I have yet to come across refuse points where general waste, dry recycling and glass only bins are respected. If people have so little regard for considerate recycling of general rubbish, what hope is there for considerate composting? And as for CRT providing compost heaps away from the canal, the logistical problems that would create are monumental. I’m now very glad I kept my pump out loo, as I was thinking about composting. Just feel sorry for those who thought they were doing the right thing by going down the composting loo route.
Its not a sensible solution it is land contamination plain and simple 🤦🏻♂️ even if you own the land its not reasonable long term solution, it would be more reasonable for the CRT to provide 10 times as many toilet facilities
We also took the plunge and will be leaving the Philippines and have our boat now waiting for us thanks to the help of good mates back home. See you on the cut soon :) Thanks for keeping us inspired and positive through a stressful time!
Hi Jam, that's great you already have your boat waiting. That would be fantastic if we could meet on the canals one day. Good luck to both of you and have a safe trip back 🌟😃👍
Firstly, as always, great video folks. You two would be naturals on the telly. As a plumber, I'm always keen to make sure nothing I do contravenes the Water Regulations. In a nutshell, keeping any 'Class Five Contaminants' (ie No.2s) out of the clean water system is paramount. 'Composting Areas' full of No.2s would have to be very well designed to make sure that nothing gets back into the ground or contaminates the area around them. But we do already have them. They're called sewage farms! Sadly, for the C&RT, I fear the idea is really not going to be practical, especially as after this crisis, there will be no spare money for anything. But perhaps the two top chaps at C&RT, on a combined salary of £450,000 a year (remember that next time a volunteer tries to 'chug' you at one of their stalls), can come up with something.... Yes, I am cynical. Anyhow. Roll on April 12th (Boris permitting) when we can actually do some chugging once more.
Hi Coddy, thanks for your kind words about our videos, we are glad your like them 🌟👍🙂 Hopefully there is quick and simple solution but yes, using the existing sewerage system like cassettes and pump outs seem like a better option at the moment. Yes, roll on April (hopefully)
There are fuel boats. How about a compost boat that collects everyone's compost, processes it then sells it to markets and farmers as compost???? It could be named The Butt Buddie.
There are boats including fuel boats that will pump out toilets and dispose of the contents safely and responsibly. Unlike dumping human waste (Biohazardous materials, which is illegal). Into bins. The future will be that you will not get a Boat safety certificate if you do not have a cassette or pump out toilet on board.
You pair are great, very civilised with the sherry, as long the sun was over the yardarm! All the hype of composting loos is fine when they have the time to actually compost, otherwise theyre just 'separated'. I remember being fairly grossed out when I first saw canaltuber's vids of composting loo solids disposal into the general waste bins so have to agree with the CRT on this one. Hopefully a biodegradable solution (well , solute anyway) will be sorted out for you all soon.
@@chuggingalong CRT are being helpful and are working with boaters from the 'Compost toilets for boats and off grid living'. I've had several meetings with them. They are supporting a pilot collection by Circular Revolution in London; we've worked with them to improve the info on their website and they are willing to give permission for community composting schemes on their land. Personally I don't think they are the right people to provide composting facilities - we've got quite enough trouble with the bins and blocked elsans!! And I've just come across someone who is looking at starting a collection service that might span your area, I'll send her over to watch :-)
I'm not in UK these days, so have not encountered these compost loos first hand, although I've looked at the "tech". From the first look I was left confused since I remember we had a large compost system in the garden as a kid. Everything from the garden and a lot from the kitchen went in this 8 ft x 8 ft construction and about once every 6 months a lower portion would be removed, the now composted material from the bottom would be dug out for use on the garden and the hole reclosed. It really is not compost until it has really had time to process naturally - a long time. I saw these compost toilets advertised and talked about on narrowboat vlogs and wondered where to keep the stuff until it had become compost and then where to utilise it given the most a narrow boat has is a few plant pots on the roof. Then I saw that people were bagging and binning and thought this is not going to end well. I also realised that dumping it down elson points wasn't going to work because the sawdust content is likely to bind it all together into nice sewer pipe blocking clumps. I was also curious about what is done with the bottles of urine. When we go for a walk in the woods if taken short a quick diversion off the path results in a small amount of free urine - only a small amount, so in general nature can handle it. 6 litre bottles of aging urine perhaps with added disinfectant is pure poison when dumped in the open. It seems that the way these toilets are used is the complete opposite of going green. In fact unless anyone can prove they are keeping the waste for the 6 moths it takes to break down properly and that they are then using it properly on the land then they should not be called composting toilets. I understand there are systems beginning to emerge that use osmosis based tech to render urine so pure it can be discharged into the canal (or even drunk if you so wished) For solids their are micro incinerators but I fail to see any green credentials in that either - it requires fuel to burn the waste and it is done at a very high temperature to avoid smoke and smell. I see it as a serious problem in the long term - especially as the number of continuous cruising boats increasing. I know the above is a negative but it is not intended as such. I believe that if a solution is not sorted then the canal and river trust will be under pressure from government to clean things up and to cover than boating licenses could drastically increase in price. Even centralised "compost" drop off points will be difficult. If too much in one place it will tend to stink instead of turning to compost unless some very expensive tech in employed and then neighbouring land owners won't want it. If it is hard to provide sufficient elsan points which just need a mains sewerage pipe and a water supply are hard to provide in sufficient numbers then a new system for an extra set of problems is going to be even harder. I don't pretend To have an answer for narrowboat sized utilisation (I do have one I had to design for some floating chalets 30 years ago that runs on 12V and with an end result certified clean to discharge into waters subsequently used for water to water works for piped domestic supply, but that could not work on canals due to size.) I think that for now toilets and power gen will remain the two biggest issues for narrowboaters. Annoy your brother at your peril - you are shortening the number of times he will offer to help you!
I really enjoy your blogs. Thank you Only problem with having composting sites will be that you will have very unhappy times trying to empty the solids from a plastic bag. As you will not be able to put plastic in the composting site. There are bags you can use that will compost but they are not very strong and transporting them any distance will be a problem. I have a pump out and have looked into this composting for many years. Pump out is so so simple and clean. Yes it costs if you use a marina for pump out but I have never had a problem. I knew CRT would put a stop to human waist being put in the general waist buns. There waist sites are atrocious. They know it but are not willing to spend money putting it right. Keep on chugging your both wonderful Gail x
The fan for compost toilet...a small 12 volt computer fan use a tiny solar panel to power it. Check out "AIR HEAD" compost toilets they have a tiny roof 12 volt exhaust with a tiny solar panel on top to run 24/7....because the compost needs air circulation to work they also use a fine screen to keep white fly & gnats from getting in. For your existing system of using a scoup of sawdust each time, you can use horse pellets from a feed store they are odorless & cheap for the Honey Pot keep a spray bottle of mostly water vinegar or Pinesol.
Hi guy's thanks for covering this subject I'm going to move to a canal boat and I definitely want a composting loo. Where are you going to dispose of your waste now? I will also be on the K & A. Mandy
Hi ive used a compost toilet for 6 years now it's so easy. I have 3 buckets i line them with bio degradable liners when the first buket is full put the lid on and store for 3 months and continue with the cical this is now classified as fertilizer not surige, i then discard which helps the plants grow happy days,
Thanks for showing this, I'm thinking of getting one for the cottage and its difficult to see the size of the carbon bit on the website. Do you wipe around the inside bowl when you have used the loo, so that you can move the solids flap aside with a certain amount of hygiene. There is a business opportunity there for people to collect the waste from boats compost toilets and to take it to an offside composting site and then sell it, in addition to a small charge to boaters for removing the waste-just like on land.
Good thoughts. We use compost toilets at the farm and have honey and chocolate together. Composts faster that way. But there are still considerations for sanitation and you couldn’t just dump your load in a pile somewhere and leave it there, it would need some monitoring so it doesn’t leach pathogens into the environment and so it remains covered by sawdust gets aerated. Keeping critters out keeps the smell down too. I mean, it’s doable with a big enough facility or tumbling compost bins though. CRT are going to have to catch up with the times because the number of continuous cruisers and live-aboards seems to be increasing and compost toilets are great. I guess there’s always incinerating toilets but they’re expensive and use a lot of power.
Hi Elizabeth, thanks for your comment and that's very interesting that your composting toilets work well on your farm. Yes, we will see if the CRT / boaters themselves will adapt or go back to old ways 👍🙂🌟
From the sales pitches on the composting toilets- I was under the impression that separating the liquids from the solids keeps the smell down. The solids with the composting material is supposed to not smell at all.
@@ledzepcleo we’ve found close to zero smell with our compost piles. But I guess it depends how fast you empty your bottle and how warm the weather is. The liquid and solid together with the cover material have the right amount of moisture to compost fast and we have a dedicated pile just for human compost. It works surprisingly well, visitors are always amazed. We use the method of composting in the humanure handbook. I’m interested to see what the CRT come up with. 🙂
Hi Sam and Tim, I am hoping to close a deal on my very own Narrowboat the 1st of April. Your vlog about composting toilets is great but devastating news for me as that was the very first thing I wanted to change post purchase. I am anticipating the CRT will have to act fairly quickly as you point out there is not much to do in terms of making room for disposing of such waste. Not much different to horse manure in a pile. As composting toilets are very popular they must have it in hand as it’ will not be convenient to locate a general council waste tip. All they need to do is place a large bin similar to a household garden waste bin at each Elsan station and empty it on a regular basis. Since the councils have complained they should provide an appropriate alternative in my opinion. Fliss
Hi Fliss, thanks for your comment. That's very exciting that you're moving onto your boat soon! We will see what will happen with the composting, hopefully this will all get sorted. If you see us on the canals come and say hi 👍🙂🌟
@@antonyjh1234 Hi you are absolutely correct there is a huge difference between the two. However, I meant by referring to a horse manure tip. I was loosely suggesting that there are companies that deal with environmental waste. A tank or container could be placed in the areas where you can get water or empty cassette tanks and could be removed as needed. As the composting toilets are becoming more popular and better for the environment it seems poor planning for the RCT not to embrace it rather than attempt to ban them which may cause further problems down the line.
@@antonyjh1234 Hi, point taken. Obviously, you would have to use composting bags the same as you do when getting rid of vegetable waste. It sounds like I am blaming CRT and the councils. The point I am making is composting toilets are very common and there are solutions that can be incorporated to get rid of this problem whilst looking after the environment and ensuring it’s safe. I work in a hospital and know there are companies that deal with environmental waste. Obviously, this will of course come with a cost. But what doesn’t? Fliss
What happened about this please? I’ve tried looking on CRT website and can’t find a recent clarification. Does this remain a no no? I’d really appreciate you building this in as a follow up when you can. Thank you for all the great videos !
Living on these boats are so much more work than i was aware of. Weed pots, compost toilets, leaking locks, finding moorings, avoiding noisy neighborhoods etc. I think you guys have taken on a major job. Very proud of you guys!! And no you can't take advantage of your big brother. He may come back for revenge! Sam what kind of sherry do you guys drink or recommend?
I found you video very amusing. Keep up the good work. I am not a boater but I used to write design briefs for wastewater projects before I retired from one of the larger utility companies. If I did have a boat I would definitely only use a pump out system. The Victorians over 150 years ago decided that it was better to treat human waste in a central treatment works. There were very sound reasons for adopting this method.
They used to have "night soil" collectors in London back in the 18th century, then take this to farms - bring this back! The eco lifestyle is important to a lot of boaters so this would be really cool initiative. Wonder if you could have a night soil collection in the same way that there are fuel boats? but then I guess you would have to ration your excrement in the same way that you ration your fuel...
It's definitely a business opportunity! Just like fuel boats, why not poo boats? Cruise up and down the canals, collect the product (for a fee) and deliver it to a disposal or use facility.
Use compostable bags and take a spade along with you to dig a hole two spades deep drop your produce in to the hole cover with soil , choose either the 2nd 3rd 4th tree to the left or the right of where you are parked up. Feed the trees.
Dear Tim and Sam, we have a toilet and business solution for you. Wouldn't it be nice if you could leave your full toilet cassette on deck and someone else could take it and leave a clean one in its place? Like the coal and fuel traders, a narrow boat could chug down the canal to boats that have signed up for the service, collect their full cassettes and leave a new clean one. The toilet boat ("Switch-a-poo?") would then empty the cassettes at the Elsan points and clean them, ready for the next use. Even if you are not home, you could still leave your cassette on deck and find a new clean one when you return home. Your friends Rick and Heidi, Ottawa Canada
Ah, the 'Night Soil Man'. Back to the Victorian era! Residents of Honeypot Lane in Husbands Bosworth, Leics, will have been familiar with him. They had a sense of humour there back in the day. It leads to the sewage farm nowadays (and the canal), but it was where all the waste was taken in the good old days.
I must admit as much as I like boating, we spent our honeymoon on the Norfolk Broads in 1972 and have owned several boats over the years both on the broads and now on the sea in Kent . Listening to the difficulties you have experienced with the water points being few and far apart and the bucket showers and trying to conserve your internet use and electric I’m really glad we live in a house with with those things taken for granted. Good health and happiness to you. Xx
Loads of opportunities for someone to make money: several semi-centralised composting locations for drop-off, perhaps a service (much like the coal and fuel delivery boats-but taking away) to fetch and haul in more removed areas…interesting conundrum.
Ive had a Natures Head composting toilet for five years here in the states. It works really well and doesn't need emptying the solids more than every couple of months. The secret is actual composting. It's an aerobic bacterial system. You need the right airflow and temp with a way to agitate (mine has a crank on the side) if that is done the aerobic bacterial degrade it quickly. In addition I toss the composted material in a worm bin. The worms (red wigglers) actually eat bacteria not compost like kitchen waste. They're exudate promote bacterial breakdown that they eat and turn into incredible soil usually called worm castings. No smell except dirt smell. Not to mention a good way to use the kitchen scraps. My gardens are incredibly productive. I don't need fertilizer. There's a Natures Head on my 26ft sailboat as well.
As a chef I'm always interested in how you do your cooking on board. How long do your gas bottles last. What type of cooker do you have. And what type of foods do you cook. Do you find a particular food difficult/easy to cook?
Yer nice vid about composting. I am really interested in changing to composting but as you mentioned their are no proper facilities and I do not want to dump my stuff if it can be harmful. I do have some friends in Cornwall who live on the land and have compost toilets. So I will get in contact with them and get the run down on what the right way is. I know there is a long time for you solid waste to decompose. Yes we all need to get our heads, if you pardon the pun, together. I will get back once I have found other info. All the best Chris
Going back to the power generation question: 1 solar So narrowboaters are limited by the usable square footage on the roof of their narrowboat. One way to cheat this is to have solar panels that are stacked and when moored (or simply when space isn’t an issue those panel can slide out from their stacking rack and you can increase your square footage of solar collection. This is a trick many people who live in vans will do to increase solar collection while parked but cut down on wind resistance when on the move.
If there are any allotmemts near the canals.... Some system of container/small skip, which can be taken to the allotmenmts, where there can be the composting area. I'm sure the gardeners would be quite happy to get free compost! The drop off locations don't have to be at the CRT facility points. Just somewhere mutually convenient for canal and allotment/compost site.
Hi Gonzo, thanks for your comment. Yes, we agree that there is a chance that they could be in multiple locations, not just elsan points. Let's see what happens 👍🙂🌟
What about these new incinarator toilets, which i know some already use. My worry would be setting fire to the boat, but it gets rid of waste on the spot i believe.
Love, love, love you guys - you are so positive, creative and real. I don't even have a boat but I can see there is a business opportunity there somewhere and obviously a definite need. Keep doing what you are doing and at some point, I am sure, when we can travel we will catch up with you with a replenishment for your sherry cabinet. The first thing I knew about MOH was that he loved , and still does, sherry. My engagement present to him was a sherry decanter - but it broke in one of many of our house moves (over 37 years)!!! Are you a sweet cream (Harveys) or Amontillado???
Hi Juanita, we absolutely love the sound of the sherry decanter! shame it broke. Hope you're well 🙂👍👍🏾Tim prefers a sweet cream and Sam prefers a lighter dryer one
This is very interesting. I suspect you are right that it was Biffa that stepped in and said this was an issue. Setting up composting points is a great idea although not without it's challenges. I had read people were double bagging and using hazardous waste marked bags. Maybe some of the fuel boats could consider setting something up and charging for the carting service. There's issues there too - they're trying to UNLOAD their boats not load them up. :P Lovely to see you both and happy for a discussion of this issue which hasn't been addressed yet in depth in any of the vlogs I follow.
Harvey's Bristol cream sherry girl myself!!!! CHEERS! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 I want you to do the app, because more than anything I want it to be called "Soil Yourself!" That is hilarious (and very clever play on words)!!! Although it would be a crap job!!! 🤣
Hi guys something i bought in an antique shop back in 1998 how or where do I post to also you may need to supaglue there arsed to the tiller or wherever you want cheers n beers Marty Qld oz
Have you looked at getting a small or medium generator? I know that they are ugly and the quieter ones are expensive but they do provide electricity reliably and consistently.
Hi Steve, yes we've done a little bit of research and they seem like a good option. We are already thinking about the summer now so it would be for next winter 😂 thanks for your comment and support 👍
@@chuggingalong Generators are not cheap and you have to be careful about the fumes. The standard ones are very noisy. I do have another comment. If you watch American RV shows you would see that people run water filters when taking on water. These are not expensive and provide a fair amount of protection. I never see any canal people either use a water filter or disinfect the water tap with a wipe cloth. Love you two, a breath of fresh air.
I reckon a Hot Bin composter is a good shout, these are very well insulated and can break down solids fully into compost in a couple of months + a good use for kitchen waste as well. The company does a 100 litre mini version which might not be ideal in terms of fitting onto the stern or bow of every narrowboat but could definitely be squeezed onto many. The compost could be used for a little on board garden, or palmed off to someone very unsqeamish & horticulturally inclined!
Fantastic ! Great subject Ur choice of words are clever concerning the bog ,..... I’d go as far as saying Poetry about the bowl ,.... 😂 Mm? Best poem about a bog perhaps ? Compition? 😂😂 Love ya laughs and smiles 👍❤️
"Soil Yourself" 🤣 Tim, be sure to carefully consider your present for the next birthday or valentine's day... Sam's face when you mentioned the "box of chocolates " was hilarious.
Hi David, the CRT have retracted that statement and given themselves til the end of the year to come up with an alternative. Thanks for your comment 😁👍👍🏾
So these composting areas, do you suggest the waste is left in the triple black bags or would you just decant it into a massive fly blown pile? I really cannot image what they would look like. What we really need is a system where liquified waste can be tipped or sucked from the boat into an existing sewer system, we could call them Elsans, or pump outs. Hang on a minute.🤔
Hi Phil, thanks for your comment. There's definitely an argument that the old guard of cassettes and pump outs are here to stay and composts have hit a brick wall 👍
@@chuggingalong I thought about one for my boat when they first became popular, they do cure some of the problems cassette and pump outs have but in doing that create a whole new set of problems. If you had a cabin in the woods they would be perfect, but on a boat, not so much.
Phil, in my opinion you’ve hit the nail on the head. The most efficient/hygienic disposal system for the human waste generated on the network already exists. It’s not pleasant, and facilities could/should be better. Investment should focus on improving and maintaining the pump-out/elsan system, not trying to reinvent the wheel. If large containers for ‘dry’ waste were sited at Elsan points can you imagine the state of it in the summer when they are full to overflowing? And if the energy expenditure for removing and processing this type of waste is greater than the net benefit to the environment, what’s the actual point?
Hi guys, I am considering moving back to the UK from Vietnam after spending 14 years as a teacher. Do you have any recommendations for online teaching companies that don't mind boat dwellers, and the associated possible internet problems? Thanks a million.
My home mooring is on a river, I had the same water wheel idea myself, and have spent the last decade experimenting. An undershot water wheel which can be popped over the side on a river sounds very attractive but undershot designs are by far the least efficient, generating only a fraction of the power associated with other designs. Unless I'm missing something, I reckon the idea is a bust, I'm getting more power from a £30 folding solar panel than from a 30" wide undershot wheel. Allotment enthusiasts are usually eager to take all the compost you want to give away, all that's needed is something to connect boaters and gardeners.
Hi guys we bought our boat the same time as you at whilton marina we headed up north. We were about to buy a compost toilet but saw the crt notice & will now have to wait till this gets sorted. Not sure how crt are going to be able to arrange the disposal of waste but it's going to take some figuring out. It's a crap job but someone's going to have to do it🤣
I am guessing sticking extra special logs in a multi fuel stove isnt an option. I am not talking about fresh wet logs, but I am thinking it may fill the boat or outside with a special aroma that would turn some noses as well as some eyes. The best solution that I can think of is installing an incinerating toilet. If more people were buying them then the price would fall dramatically as companies would price war. The ash could then be scattered without issues. Maybe this could also be used to heat up the boat. Maybe the exhaust from the engine could be used to pre heat/dry the chocolate box. Maybe on sunny days the excess power from solar could be used to dry it all out. I think a solar panel costing £150 with the sole purpose of incinerating poop would be a good investment.
Hi there some great ideas there! Not sure about sticking those kind of logs into our diesel stove 😂 but the incinerator seems to be popular solution and having its own solar panel is a good shout 🙂👍
@bootjesgek48 ive seen both gas burner and electric. The electric is indeed very very power hungry and 1 solar in USA wouldnt be enough. But a solar panel could dry it. Its the mositure in a poopy that smells.
In the video you mention people's suggestions on how to generate energy. My apologies, I didn't read all the comments so I'm not sure if anyone suggested a water turbine. I'm wilderness camp and am always looking for ways to charge my devices. I haven't used anything like this before, I use solar. There maybe a product out there and you can use while chugging along. Another idea would be a wind generator, I see them on sail boats. Just a couple of ideas. Have a great one.
even horse manure has to be broken down as it will burn plants and add too many nitrates to the soil. Human waste would mostly contain meat proteins and is pretty toxic to plants
I am not a boater myself but love the way of life Re: Compost toilets, I would think that now is the time to consider going over to a compost toilet as the authorities now recognise that this is the direction technology is going and are willing to provide facilities in the near future. I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if I where a boater I think this is the way foreward and a great answer to a stinky problem...good luck
You made my day. I wasn't expecting to see you this week and was surprised to see your lovely faces. I think the CRT has created more problems for themselves and the community by saying you can't use the bins before they had a solution. It has to go somewhere, so now what are boaters going to do? Not everyone will be considerate or give a .... It might be up to young people like you both to put your heads together and come up with a solution. Stay positive we love you.
I disagree Penney sorry. They are saying quite rightly that the bins are provided and should only be used for the purpose of rubbish removal not human waste. Now don’t flame me because we love them and the convenience but the infrastructure isn’t in place yet. For the same reason I wouldn’t buy an electric car for at least 5 years.
Penney Noss it’s the boaters that have made the problem. The waste takes at least six months to compost down with oxygen to assist the process. Bagging it up and sealing it in plastic bags after 4 to 7 days it won’t decomposed. Boaters need to store it unbagged for six months and then it will be safe to dispose it. If boaters do not wish to empty there cassettes at a Elsan point then they should move back into bricks and mortar.
@@pippashaw8224 No the CRT need to give out compostable bags or we buy them and then dump them instead. Buy compostable bags from the start?I have a cassete. The burner toilets are the best option but they are over £2500
I would think that the CRT are having to think of the financial implications of having to provide a separate service for the disposal of composting waste. A simple solution would be to charge a small premium on the annual licence fee for those boats using a composting toilet and provide a separate bin at each services point for disposal of sealed bags. To assist the disposal contractor they could also supply zip ties with each boats licence number on and a space for a month/year date to be added so that they can check the system is not being abused and when the bags should be ready for processing.
In Germany, it's standard practise for sit-downs for guys. You get signs in every public restrooms/restaurants reminding you to do so. Not everyone follows though.
This might sound strange but i was watching Rich house Poor house on My 5 catch up and you two appear in the photo but not the episode... any idea why that may be?
On the subject of power use, the suggestion about a water wheel is not so far fetched. There are micro hydro turbines that can generate power while a boat moves through the water. The problem is their cost. I think the boating community could come together and investigate the development of inexpensive versions that can work (1) while boat is moving and/or (2) when the flow of the canal or river can generate power. So that is my landlocked liver contribution to the brilliant narrowboat community.
I would guess that the amount of additional drag caused by any kind of turbine in the water while the boat was moving would far more than offset any gain in power. Yes, it would generate power, but at the cost of using more diesel to make up for the additional drag. Same reason why putting a wind turbine on top of your electric car doesn't result in perpetual motion. Those pesky laws frictional loss, efficiency, and entropy and such. But I had thought about having one when you're in a flowing river; that might work. Although I think most micro-hydro setups tend to funnel the water flow into a restricted area so your turbine doesn't have to be the size of a paddle wheel on a riverboat to work. We're looking at moving to the UK and living on a narrowboat in the relatively near future, but as yet I have no personal experience. One thing I also wondered about would be the option of having small vertical-axis wind turbines, possibly on telescoping poles, on the roof for when you're moored. Again, they'd generate additional drag when you were cruising, depending on the wind direction, so you'd probably want to take them down if you weren't stationary. I'd be interested to experiment with solar water heating as well.
One consequence of pressuring dog owners to clear up after their dogs is that all council operated public litter bins go for incineration along with the contents of the dedicated dog waste bins - some councils encourage people to use either type of bin for dog waste now. Therefore, local councils are best placed to suitable provide bins at points where minor roads away from houses cross towpath accessible bridges. That sort of sensible solution seems a bit beyond bureaucracy Britain these days, but it is a public sanitation issue, and one that effects motorhomes and campers with composting toilets as well, who could equally use the same bins. The incremental cost to councils would be minimal.
I’m not surprised - it was always a grey area how compost toilets disposed of their waste. Dumping human waste in an uncontrolled manner is not acceptable and in any case - is that really “composting” ?
I was surprised when CRT started suggesting it in Nov 2017, until then it was always about fully composting and that's what I've always done (and encouraged others to do) - not only am I not dependent on elsan facilities but I'm producing compost not waste! But I do agree that dumping in an uncontrolled manner is unacceptable. I've done a lot of reading these last few weeks and learned how many thousands of litres of untreated sewage gets dumped in our rivers and coastline. 'Untreated human waste was released into streams and rivers for more than 1.5m hours in 2019' (Guardian July 2020). Raw sewage released on to English and Welsh beaches around 3000 times in 2019 (Surfers Against Sewage). When you get down to it, every toilet system has an environmental impact. Not that I am suggesting binning dry material from separator toilets should be acceptable and I am doing my absolute best to help those who find the goalposts have moved to grasp the nettle and get composting!
It's not composting at all, really. I think the companies that are selling these as "composting toilets" have some serious explaining to do, possibly in court, for misleading people into thinking their poop would magically turn to harmless garden soil in a matter of days in these toilets. It's really a scam.
Years ago you took your shovel, dug a hole and buried the waste and put the old soil back on top, leaves a small mound but you know where it was deposited. No smell and becomes soil again.
Hilarious. First video we've watched of yours. Love the sherry drinking. As you reach more mature years you'll find middle of the night visits to any throne requires a seated position.
Hello you two lovelies. Great conversation. Looking forward to broadening my sherry palate. Why compost your biz? At best 3mths to work? and bagging in plastic bags, and pouring a gallon of pee into a woodland every two days? NOT: greener, easier or simpler. After many years of camping, boating and motorhoming my simple, easy green way is......cassette toilette.....clear distilled vinegar. Works a treat! But please do not try it because for some reason supplies of the squirty bottle from super markets at 29p a bottle, lasting me easily one week (inc. the sink drain and waste water tank) are sometimes out of stock. 😎👍
Here in the states (specifically in North Carolina coastal region), we are allowed to bury compost contents. I've had a composting toilet on my sailboat for 2 years now and live part time on it... I row my solids to shore at a wooded location with a folding camping spade and bury mine... never had a problem in that respect.
I'm not surprised either. Always thought it a bit dodgy to put 'chocolate' in the standard waste bins from the point of hygiene, even if double bagged. I can't help wondering if it would be possible to fully compost the waste on a boat. I'm a wanna-be boater still at the research stage so not much personal experience. How much volume of matter is created per month by two people? ( Maybe I should install one at home to find out!) Could there be a storage solution that could be emptied every, say, 6 months? If so there would be plenty of time to find someone who might appreciate some free compost from time to time.
What about setting up composting sites near farm land and garden allotment spaces? If you setup a system where one bin is filled at a time (giving it time to totally breakdown for use) before starting the next bin, gardeners and farmers would have an endless supply of safe garden compost. From the narrowboat videos I've seen, it seems there's endless areas to setup something like this. Interesting idea anyway (CRT setting up composting sites).
I have a toilet just like yours, its a Separette. The solution I think to the challenge of disposal is a standalone incinerating chamber where you can take out the compostable bag place it inside the chamber and turn everything to ash in short order; much like the one designed into incinerating toilets. I don't fancy throwing waste wrapped in plastic into municipal waste.
There's a gap in the market here for a poo boat. It cruises down the canals and everyone throws their waste in it as it passes. It would be see-through so you could see how full it was and you could pay a small monthly fee to use the service. Just don't ever crash into it!
I come from fields and jobs where poop is black gold. I'd need more data, but I think it's possible to come up with a composting system that's canal side and doesn't require further collection like rubbish and recycling do. Three or four bins, their size dependant on location and expected use, would be colour coded. Blue = Jan-Mar, or some other system that's easy and boater friendly. Throughout the system, boaters would fill that bin for those three or four months, then move to a different coloured bin after. Each bin would then have nearly a year to compost, and utilizing various macro and micro organisms this process can be sped up or modified as needed. At years end the finished compost can be safely used to remediate the soil and plants around the canal, shared amongst boaters, donated, sold or simply left in the bin as most of the original volume will have been reduced. Bins could be above or below ground and made of recycled materials. Either aerobic or anaerobic processes can be used, though aerobic is more costly but won't produce odor while anaerobic is cheaper and simpler but quite smelly. It would take time to establish, and require a united effort by boaters, but think it could work. I also think it should be a fairly closed circuit system to reduce complication and be more inline with nature. Locations could also be taken up or adopted by local towns, clubs, schools/uni, etc., and decorated, themed, used as test beds to experiment with novel approaches or solutions, or go towards supporting worth while causes or needs like community gardens and co-op farms.
Really useful comments. I always think we have to look at other areas, industries and adapt. At Laverstock organic farm they take green garden waste and sell it as compost after only 6 weeks. As opposed to 12months in a compost bin. As you say it takes energy. There is a lot if wasted energy at each lock when they fill. Perhaps that could be utilised.
I would think that if the compost was used as soil amendment, boaters could add other organic garbage (like banana peels) to reduce the stress on the normal garbage collection system.
@@jamessprandel7020 Ideally you'd have two compost bin options; one for human waste and another for general composting. Human waste is quit toxic and has special guidelines and codes for handling and disposal so it might easier to separate the the two.
I vent to the outside and always used coco coir but when I switched to sawdust termites started showing up! I carry the waste bags in a bucket. There was that one time...
Hello! I like your style and your jokes. I'm going to be laughing about the magic lantern for a while! 🤣 But you handled the subject very well indeed. I think the community-maintained compost heaps sound like a great idea... but I don't know if I'd install an app with that name! 🤣
I do understand the reasoning behind it as human waste is a biohazard so they can be held liable if they don't dispose of it properly. But a solution does need implementing ASAP for everyone's benefit :) Thanks for the info! Very good to know
Agree with ideas for using composting toilets in the way intended, community allotments could be built alongside to encourgage healthy eating too. Obviously human waste needs careful handling but people can do training for this? I have an allotment and think we could do with a community run compost site too, for all kinds of organic waste that needs breaking down and using for growing fruits and vegetables for the wider community..
I’ve always wondered about the disposal of urine in the trees at side of canals, as many more have compost toilets surly the build up of urine dumps will eventually cause smells and health issues , am sure you may one day be told to dump urine in the elsan stations for health reasons
Sam I still playing on the simulation narrow boat game this is not easy mooring back the boat 🥺🥺 but I will keep as at it brilliant game thank you guys 👍😊😊❤️
to help with a 'point disposal' site....I use a biodegradable plastic bag[s]. they r NOT tough....but double bagging works. USA, V ps I bought a bunch from amazon
I think most people fitted compost loos to free them from having to head for elsan or pump out facilities every few weeks.. crt aren't going to build a compost site every couple of miles because access will be needed for equipment to empty it once a year.. I'd imagine it would need to be covered to prevent rain run off and very large as it wouldn't be catering for just one family but possibly several dumps a day... and you would be emptying your bag so there would need to be rubbish collection nearby. . All I can see is crt building compost sites at already existing elson points which will put compost loos users back in exactly the same position as those with elsan and pump outs.. having to get to services every few weeks.... I would imagine that more popular compost sites will fill up well before 6 months and have to be emptied with a digger or shovel. ... elsan waste and pump out waste is removed with hose and tanker...a much nicer solution. ..also there will be the issue of neighbouring houses and buisness not wanting a steaming pile of chocolate next to them... in my opinion the compost loos should never have been suggested to boat users. ..it will come to the point where biffa refuse to supply bins and camera's and fines will be issued to those dumping poo in bins.. coz most people won't stop dumping it..or it will end up in fields and hedges. . The only toilet that offers complete freedom is an incinerator loo but they do have similar running costs or slightly higher costs than having a pump out..I think the best option would be a cassette loo and and incinerator loo... using the cassette for honey occasionally chocolate depending on elsan availability and then using the incinerator for stays away from facilities. ....perfect compromise. ..😊
Yeah, I think incinerator has to be the way to go with this one. if in doubt....burn it. I think they cost about 3k but I think its worth it for convienience and sanitary issues.
Hi Robert, thanks for your comment and some great points there. If composting is to work there needs to be some kind of logistics issue sorted. Yes, we agree that Biffa don't seem happy at all! 👍
Use a 50% white vinegar to 50% water in a spray bottle to clean the toilet. Agree with others on maybe easing up on disinfectant use. Well done for tackling this subject publicly though. Unfortunately money will always be the biggest hurdle but there are some great proposals here.
Did I actually just sit and watch people drinking Sherry and talking about their loo? 🤣 brilliant vlog as always. X
Haha! Glad you enjoyed it. Thanks for your comment Kelly 🙂👍👍🏾
For our food waste, we buy compostable/ biodegradable bags, so just a thought, you could buy compostable bin bags for your toilet rather than using standard plastic ones.
@bootjesgek48 No, I know but either way bags will be needed, they might as well be ones that will breakdown at the same speed as the content.
Thanks for your comment Lydi, that's a good idea, we'll look our for them 👍🙂
I don't know if they've changed the compostable plastic bags but when they were first sold, they will only decompose when exposed to light and air, so in a dump situation they didn't always have time to decompose before getting covered up.
@@chuggingalong A Co-op just opened in our village and the bags you can use at the self service section are a decent size and biodegradeable - just looked and seem to be no holes - you could always use a plastic bag to cart them to the dumping place and tip biodegradable one out and reuse the placcy one.
Lydibrown as soon as you put and sealed even into one of these bags that you talk about the composting process is Halted until the bag and the contents get a supply of oxygen so the bacteria can break down the product.
I've built several compost toilets on land (straight on the ground on top of some straw and "wet theory" -without separation). 12 months is really the minimum for safe compost, so there's always an active chamber and holding one one where the pile is just sitting there for a year+. That holding chamber / composting heap needs air circulation, but the air inlets need to be protected from both flies and rats. Perforated steel plate with scaff netting on the inside does the trick.
What you have in mind will be "dry theory", of course, and presumably just a single chamber. "Dry theory" reduces smell problems. However, all the compost toilets I've built have been vented by either a pipe or a double wall at the back to take any smell up high and into a hedge or whatever. That's mainly venting the active chamber of course (there being air circulation between the two). Not so practical in most situations beside a canal, though. I guess protected air vents at the bottom and something similar to the carbon filter your fancy toilet has near the top might work. The ultimate answer to smell, though, is a layer of wood ash. Strictly wood ash, I hasten to add, not coal or coke if you're hoping to make useable compost.
As you'll gather from the above, a composting system does need to be managed. Just a big pile in a box isn't likely to work. However, maybe the best solution beside the canal WOULD be just a big pile in some sort of sealed steel box or skip, with just small flaps to open, empty your stuff and close again. Those boxes or skips can then be lifted, taken away and emptied in some suitable place to be properly managed and produce good compost. A working canal boat with a small crane for this job? That would certainly be better than a lorry driving them along roads.
Except the reason they wanted to compost was to not onoy be able to dump at special places...
@@deth3021 If you have access to a proper composting site near the canal, that is not affected. But such places are few. What was happening was that the stuff was being double-bagged and put in with the general waste. In other words, not composted at all.
U2 are an absolute delight! It really doesn’t matter the topic, your energy and presentation complement each other so well. Thanks for sharing not only your narrow boat experience but yourselves with us.
Hi Terry, thanks for your comment as always. You are very kind. We enjoy making videos 👍🌟🙂
Human waste is considered a medical hazard as faeces can contain everything from Hepatitis to other hazards. Likewise urine contains everything from hormones through to remains from antibiotics which can leech into the land. The bags will also take a long time to decompose, whereas waste dealt with via the Rlsan will be dealt with as per the "norm". Love your honesty and your thoughts that you were being eco friendly too. Looking at this perhaps the Elsan costs need to be considered too by "da management".
Oh someone is a books believer.
Drinking chlorine is good for you.
Uranium for shelf life..
There are plenty of us who burn our solid toilet waste in the stove. As long as the stove is already hot, it doesn't take long for everything to be reduced to a tiny amount of ash. If it has already mixed with sawdust it will be fairly dry. I also mix a small amount of diesel into it to help the process along. Its only a matter time before crt ban chucking ash in the hedge though.
Hi Ian, yes that's very interesting! Sounds effective. Thanks for your comment 😁🙂👍👍🏾
Good one. Glad you made the effort to highlight this. CRT will cause untold issues with this mandate. They will force the issue underground (ie digging a hole where possible and burying) but more often than not, inconsiderate dumping, using private skips, household bins, street bins etc. in urban areas etc. Stopping the use of Biffa bins is not fixing the issue, it's just pushing it elsewhere. Saying that, it's highlighted the need for people to actually compost on board. It takes less space and resources than many think. I will still get a similar loo when I move on board. If there's no alternative, I'll compost completely, however I'm working on a system to turn the compost into briquettes which will be burnt on the fire. I'm still doing trials at the moment, but I think it could be a simple, workable and effective solution. Saves on coal and wood too...
Oh great to hear you will composting on board! This is definitely a bullet proof approach. Thanks for your comment 👍🙂🌟
@@phenogen8125 I doubt we'll see more pump out facilities, I think a more likely future will be CRT removing waterside pump outs and telling everyone to go to the marinas. Less hassle for them and more profit for the marinas.
@@phenogen8125 There is no disposal system that doesn't have some environmental impact. We use quantities of treated clean water to flush our poo away. Our rivers and coastline are suffering from untreated discharge every time there is a storm, incinerating uses fossil fuel to cook the contents, humanure going to landfill adds to the creation of methane (as does any organic material, so if any of your food scraps are going into Biffa bins that's adding to that problem). Arguably composting is the only approach that does have integrity! The current problem has been entirely caused by CRT recommending that separating toilet users bin their dry waste not by those who fully compost.
@@phenogen8125 As far as CRT's stance is concerned, I would agree with you - other than it was them who created the issue in the first place. If they hadn't carried the recommendation to bin on their website for just over three years those of us who have been composting for years would have continued to tell people that it's 'fully compost or stick with the potta porti'! We are very much of the view that this will prove a good moment to sort the confusion out and get good practice going. If you're hoping that several hundred people will throw away up to £1000 of loo (Separett and Airhead may even be more than that) and install a pump out I fear you may be disappointed. CRT are concerned about the pressure on the system - everything from sheer numbers to the self pump outs and/or wet wipes that overwhelm and block elsans. They aren't going to magically provide composting facilities but they are definitely open to innovation. You mentioned a travelling pump out boat (there is one, on the lower GU), there is a project in development that started as a PhD study at UCL to collect humanure from boats for central composting. And collecting dry bagged humanure is a lot more pleasant and safer than raw sewage.
ps but I confess to a sneaky sympathy with your view on widebeams!
Having been a live aboard for 2 years now, I have yet to come across refuse points where general waste, dry recycling and glass only bins are respected. If people have so little regard for considerate recycling of general rubbish, what hope is there for considerate composting? And as for CRT providing compost heaps away from the canal, the logistical problems that would create are monumental. I’m now very glad I kept my pump out loo, as I was thinking about composting. Just feel sorry for those who thought they were doing the right thing by going down the composting loo route.
It can be a brilliant off grid system for boaters who have connections to a piece of land to take the properly composted compost to
Its not a sensible solution it is land contamination plain and simple 🤦🏻♂️ even if you own the land its not reasonable long term solution, it would be more reasonable for the CRT to provide 10 times as many toilet facilities
We also took the plunge and will be leaving the Philippines and have our boat now waiting for us thanks to the help of good mates back home. See you on the cut soon :) Thanks for keeping us inspired and positive through a stressful time!
Hi Jam, that's great you already have your boat waiting. That would be fantastic if we could meet on the canals one day. Good luck to both of you and have a safe trip back 🌟😃👍
Firstly, as always, great video folks. You two would be naturals on the telly.
As a plumber, I'm always keen to make sure nothing I do contravenes the Water Regulations. In a nutshell, keeping any 'Class Five Contaminants' (ie No.2s) out of the clean water system is paramount. 'Composting Areas' full of No.2s would have to be very well designed to make sure that nothing gets back into the ground or contaminates the area around them. But we do already have them. They're called sewage farms!
Sadly, for the C&RT, I fear the idea is really not going to be practical, especially as after this crisis, there will be no spare money for anything.
But perhaps the two top chaps at C&RT, on a combined salary of £450,000 a year (remember that next time a volunteer tries to 'chug' you at one of their stalls), can come up with something.... Yes, I am cynical.
Anyhow. Roll on April 12th (Boris permitting) when we can actually do some chugging once more.
Hi Coddy, thanks for your kind words about our videos, we are glad your like them 🌟👍🙂
Hopefully there is quick and simple solution but yes, using the existing sewerage system like cassettes and pump outs seem like a better option at the moment.
Yes, roll on April (hopefully)
CRT are saving well over £1m per month in staff pay. By furloughing all their staff.
Sack the diamond cuff link wearing person at the top and that would free-up money for ar least10 composting facilities: that would be a start!
There are fuel boats. How about a compost boat that collects everyone's compost, processes it then sells it to markets and farmers as compost???? It could be named The Butt Buddie.
Very creative! I second the motion.
Haha! That's the kind of buddie we all need at the moment 😂👍🌟 Thanks for your comment
Something for you to do for extra income maybe?
There are boats including fuel boats that will pump out toilets and dispose of the contents safely and responsibly. Unlike dumping human waste (Biohazardous materials, which is illegal). Into bins.
The future will be that you will not get a Boat safety certificate if you do not have a cassette or pump out toilet on board.
Could be used in orchards or flower beds but i wouldnt suggest using in vegetable garden . To many pathogens that might not be killed.
You pair are great, very civilised with the sherry, as long the sun was over the yardarm! All the hype of composting loos is fine when they have the time to actually compost, otherwise theyre just 'separated'. I remember being fairly grossed out when I first saw canaltuber's vids of composting loo solids disposal into the general waste bins so have to agree with the CRT on this one. Hopefully a biodegradable solution (well , solute anyway) will be sorted out for you all soon.
Humor is a good thing in this situation. You two have a good sense of humor about this.
Thank you very much for your kind words Brenda 🙂👍👍🏾
The CRT should ask the Centre for Alternative Technology
Machynlleth Powys for advice on Composting human waste solutions, great bookshop too.
Hi S, that's interesting. We will see what the CRT will do next! Thanks for watching 🙂🌟👍
@@chuggingalong CRT are being helpful and are working with boaters from the 'Compost toilets for boats and off grid living'. I've had several meetings with them. They are supporting a pilot collection by Circular Revolution in London; we've worked with them to improve the info on their website and they are willing to give permission for community composting schemes on their land. Personally I don't think they are the right people to provide composting facilities - we've got quite enough trouble with the bins and blocked elsans!! And I've just come across someone who is looking at starting a collection service that might span your area, I'll send her over to watch :-)
I'm not in UK these days, so have not encountered these compost loos first hand, although I've looked at the "tech". From the first look I was left confused since I remember we had a large compost system in the garden as a kid. Everything from the garden and a lot from the kitchen went in this 8 ft x 8 ft construction and about once every 6 months a lower portion would be removed, the now composted material from the bottom would be dug out for use on the garden and the hole reclosed. It really is not compost until it has really had time to process naturally - a long time. I saw these compost toilets advertised and talked about on narrowboat vlogs and wondered where to keep the stuff until it had become compost and then where to utilise it given the most a narrow boat has is a few plant pots on the roof. Then I saw that people were bagging and binning and thought this is not going to end well. I also realised that dumping it down elson points wasn't going to work because the sawdust content is likely to bind it all together into nice sewer pipe blocking clumps. I was also curious about what is done with the bottles of urine. When we go for a walk in the woods if taken short a quick diversion off the path results in a small amount of free urine - only a small amount, so in general nature can handle it. 6 litre bottles of aging urine perhaps with added disinfectant is pure poison when dumped in the open. It seems that the way these toilets are used is the complete opposite of going green. In fact unless anyone can prove they are keeping the waste for the 6 moths it takes to break down properly and that they are then using it properly on the land then they should not be called composting toilets.
I understand there are systems beginning to emerge that use osmosis based tech to render urine so pure it can be discharged into the canal (or even drunk if you so wished) For solids their are micro incinerators but I fail to see any green credentials in that either - it requires fuel to burn the waste and it is done at a very high temperature to avoid smoke and smell.
I see it as a serious problem in the long term - especially as the number of continuous cruising boats increasing. I know the above is a negative but it is not intended as such. I believe that if a solution is not sorted then the canal and river trust will be under pressure from government to clean things up and to cover than boating licenses could drastically increase in price. Even centralised "compost" drop off points will be difficult. If too much in one place it will tend to stink instead of turning to compost unless some very expensive tech in employed and then neighbouring land owners won't want it. If it is hard to provide sufficient elsan points which just need a mains sewerage pipe and a water supply are hard to provide in sufficient numbers then a new system for an extra set of problems is going to be even harder. I don't pretend To have an answer for narrowboat sized utilisation (I do have one I had to design for some floating chalets 30 years ago that runs on 12V and with an end result certified clean to discharge into waters subsequently used for water to water works for piped domestic supply, but that could not work on canals due to size.)
I think that for now toilets and power gen will remain the two biggest issues for narrowboaters.
Annoy your brother at your peril - you are shortening the number of times he will offer to help you!
@yta ... brilliant comment, thank you
I really enjoy your blogs. Thank you
Only problem with having composting sites will be that you will have very unhappy times trying to empty the solids from a plastic bag. As you will not be able to put plastic in the composting site.
There are bags you can use that will compost but they are not very strong and transporting them any distance will be a problem.
I have a pump out and have looked into this composting for many years. Pump out is so so simple and clean. Yes it costs if you use a marina for pump out but I have never had a problem. I knew CRT would put a stop to human waist being put in the general waist buns. There waist sites are atrocious. They know it but are not willing to spend money putting it right.
Keep on chugging your both wonderful
Gail x
Hi Gail, thanks for your comment and kind words. Yes, we hope there can be a solution but a pump out seems like a sensible option for sure 👍🙂🌟
Probably the best toilet discussion ever!
Haha! Thanks for your kind words Mark. What a fantastic specialist subject we have 😅😂👍
Lovely, bright, happy and informative vlog. I love your positive attitude. Subscribed xx
The fan for compost toilet...a small 12 volt computer fan use a tiny solar panel to power it. Check out "AIR HEAD" compost toilets they have a tiny roof 12 volt exhaust with a tiny solar panel on top to run 24/7....because the compost needs air circulation to work they also use a fine screen to keep white fly & gnats from getting in. For your existing system of using a scoup of sawdust each time, you can use horse pellets from a feed store they are odorless & cheap for the Honey Pot keep a spray bottle of mostly water vinegar or Pinesol.
Hi guy's thanks for covering this subject I'm going to move to a canal boat and I definitely want a composting loo. Where are you going to dispose of your waste now? I will also be on the K & A.
Mandy
Hi ive used a compost toilet for 6 years now it's so easy. I have 3 buckets i line them with bio degradable liners when the first buket is full put the lid on and store for 3 months and continue with the cical this is now classified as fertilizer not surige, i then discard which helps the plants grow happy days,
Thanks for showing this, I'm thinking of getting one for the cottage and its difficult to see the size of the carbon bit on the website. Do you wipe around the inside bowl when you have used the loo, so that you can move the solids flap aside with a certain amount of hygiene. There is a business opportunity there for people to collect the waste from boats compost toilets and to take it to an offside composting site and then sell it, in addition to a small charge to boaters for removing the waste-just like on land.
Good thoughts. We use compost toilets at the farm and have honey and chocolate together. Composts faster that way. But there are still considerations for sanitation and you couldn’t just dump your load in a pile somewhere and leave it there, it would need some monitoring so it doesn’t leach pathogens into the environment and so it remains covered by sawdust gets aerated. Keeping critters out keeps the smell down too. I mean, it’s doable with a big enough facility or tumbling compost bins though. CRT are going to have to catch up with the times because the number of continuous cruisers and live-aboards seems to be increasing and compost toilets are great. I guess there’s always incinerating toilets but they’re expensive and use a lot of power.
Hi Elizabeth, thanks for your comment and that's very interesting that your composting toilets work well on your farm. Yes, we will see if the CRT / boaters themselves will adapt or go back to old ways 👍🙂🌟
From the sales pitches on the composting toilets- I was under the impression that separating the liquids from the solids keeps the smell down. The solids with the composting material is supposed to not smell at all.
@@ledzepcleo we’ve found close to zero smell with our compost piles. But I guess it depends how fast you empty your bottle and how warm the weather is. The liquid and solid together with the cover material have the right amount of moisture to compost fast and we have a dedicated pile just for human compost. It works surprisingly well, visitors are always amazed. We use the method of composting in the humanure handbook. I’m interested to see what the CRT come up with. 🙂
Hi Sam and Tim, I am hoping to close a deal on my very own Narrowboat the 1st of April. Your vlog about composting toilets is great but devastating news for me as that was the very first thing I wanted to change post purchase. I am anticipating the CRT will have to act fairly quickly as you point out there is not much to do in terms of making room for disposing of such waste. Not much different to horse manure in a pile. As composting toilets are very popular they must have it in hand as it’ will not be convenient to locate a general council waste tip. All they need to do is place a large bin similar to a household garden waste bin at each Elsan station and empty it on a regular basis. Since the councils have complained they should provide an appropriate alternative in my opinion. Fliss
Hi Fliss, thanks for your comment. That's very exciting that you're moving onto your boat soon! We will see what will happen with the composting, hopefully this will all get sorted. If you see us on the canals come and say hi 👍🙂🌟
Eye skipper, will keep a bottle of fortified wine on board for when we buck up lol 😂
@@antonyjh1234 Hi you are absolutely correct there is a huge difference between the two. However, I meant by referring to a horse manure tip. I was loosely suggesting that there are companies that deal with environmental waste. A tank or container could be placed in the areas where you can get water or empty cassette tanks and could be removed as needed. As the composting toilets are becoming more popular and better for the environment it seems poor planning for the RCT not to embrace it rather than attempt to ban them which may cause further problems down the line.
@@antonyjh1234 Hi, point taken. Obviously, you would have to use composting bags the same as you do when getting rid of vegetable waste. It sounds like I am blaming CRT and the councils. The point I am making is composting toilets are very common and there are solutions that can be incorporated to get rid of this problem whilst looking after the environment and ensuring it’s safe. I work in a hospital and know there are companies that deal with environmental waste. Obviously, this will of course come with a cost. But what doesn’t? Fliss
Just about to buy a boat, and this was No1 on the list to buy. Thanks for the insight guys. 👍
What happened about this please? I’ve tried looking on CRT website and can’t find a recent clarification. Does this remain a no no? I’d really appreciate you building this in as a follow up when you can. Thank you for all the great videos !
Living on these boats are so much more work than i was aware of. Weed pots, compost toilets, leaking locks, finding moorings, avoiding noisy neighborhoods etc. I think you guys have taken on a major job. Very proud of you guys!! And no you can't take advantage of your big brother. He may come back for revenge! Sam what kind of sherry do you guys drink or recommend?
A pretty good estimate of boatlife without a mooring is 'can you manage a part time job on tope of whatever else you are doing?' !!
I found you video very amusing. Keep up the good work. I am not a boater but I used to write design briefs for wastewater projects before I retired from one of the larger utility companies. If I did have a boat I would definitely only use a pump out system. The Victorians over 150 years ago decided that it was better to treat human waste in a central treatment works. There were very sound reasons for adopting this method.
Thank you Bernard. Keep chugging 😁👍👍🏾
They used to have "night soil" collectors in London back in the 18th century, then take this to farms - bring this back! The eco lifestyle is important to a lot of boaters so this would be really cool initiative. Wonder if you could have a night soil collection in the same way that there are fuel boats? but then I guess you would have to ration your excrement in the same way that you ration your fuel...
Still had them in the early 1980s in Lincolnshire when we moved up there.
It's definitely a business opportunity! Just like fuel boats, why not poo boats? Cruise up and down the canals, collect the product (for a fee) and deliver it to a disposal or use facility.
@@roblloyd1879 As late as that? I remember my father describing night soil collection in the village they lived in when they got married in 1940.
Use compostable bags and take a spade along with you to dig a hole two spades deep drop your produce in to the hole cover with soil , choose either the 2nd 3rd 4th tree to the left or the right of where you are parked up.
Feed the trees.
Hi, guys ! Always happy to see your new episodes. Thank you.⭐️
Hi there, thanks for your support and watching our videos 👍🙂
Dear Tim and Sam, we have a toilet and business solution for you. Wouldn't it be nice if you could leave your full toilet cassette on deck and someone else could take it and leave a clean one in its place? Like the coal and fuel traders, a narrow boat could chug down the canal to boats that have signed up for the service, collect their full cassettes and leave a new clean one. The toilet boat ("Switch-a-poo?") would then empty the cassettes at the Elsan points and clean them, ready for the next use. Even if you are not home, you could still leave your cassette on deck and find a new clean one when you return home. Your friends Rick and Heidi, Ottawa Canada
Ah, the 'Night Soil Man'. Back to the Victorian era! Residents of Honeypot Lane in Husbands Bosworth, Leics, will have been familiar with him. They had a sense of humour there back in the day. It leads to the sewage farm nowadays (and the canal), but it was where all the waste was taken in the good old days.
How can I buy stock in Switch-a-Loo, Inc.?
Brilliant
I must admit as much as I like boating, we spent our honeymoon on the Norfolk Broads in 1972 and have owned several boats
over the years both on the broads and now on the sea in Kent . Listening to the difficulties you have experienced with the water points being few and far apart and the bucket showers and trying to conserve your internet use and electric I’m really glad we live in a house with with those things taken for granted. Good health and happiness to you. Xx
Thanks for your comment William. Yes, there's definitely comprimises but we are enjoying it so far 🙂👍👍🏾
Watched quite a number of canal vlogs and often watch yours , love both your sense of humour about this subject , very dry.
Hi JJ, we are glad you enjoy narrowboat videos 🙂👍👍🏾 Thanks for watching us
what a lovely pair of folks..wierdly enjoyable..thank you
We cant wait for the latest updates Mr and Mrs. You are such a lovely couple.
Love it. 20 mins of you guys drinking and talking shit and it was the best. Ty
Loads of opportunities for someone to make money: several semi-centralised composting locations for drop-off, perhaps a service (much like the coal and fuel delivery boats-but taking away) to fetch and haul in more removed areas…interesting conundrum.
Hi Chory, yes we agree there's definitely a gap in the market!
I think drinking more sherry will solve this complex problem.
I have yet to watch the video, but I am quite sure you are right!
Haha! Great suggestion Roger. You should be running the country 👍🙂🌟
Ive had a Natures Head composting toilet for five years here in the states. It works really well and doesn't need emptying the solids more than every couple of months. The secret is actual composting. It's an aerobic bacterial system. You need the right airflow and temp with a way to agitate (mine has a crank on the side) if that is done the aerobic bacterial degrade it quickly. In addition I toss the composted material in a worm bin. The worms (red wigglers) actually eat bacteria not compost like kitchen waste. They're exudate promote bacterial breakdown that they eat and turn into incredible soil usually called worm castings. No smell except dirt smell. Not to mention a good way to use the kitchen scraps. My gardens are incredibly productive. I don't need fertilizer. There's a Natures Head on my 26ft sailboat as well.
Hi Kent, great to hear that the Nature's Head works well for you 👍🙂🌟 Thanks for your comment
You guys are genuinely funny! Thanks will probably get one of these loo's for my camper van.
As a chef I'm always interested in how you do your cooking on board. How long do your gas bottles last. What type of cooker do you have. And what type of foods do you cook. Do you find a particular food difficult/easy to cook?
Hi Nic, we could definitely go into more detail in a future video. Thanks for the suggestion 👍🌟🙂
Yer nice vid about composting. I am really interested in changing to composting but as you mentioned their are no proper facilities and I do not want to dump my stuff if it can be harmful.
I do have some friends in Cornwall who live on the land and have compost toilets. So I will get in contact with them and get the run down on what the right way is. I know there is a long time for you solid waste to decompose. Yes we all need to get our heads, if you pardon the pun, together. I will get back once I have found other info. All the best Chris
Going back to the power generation question:
1 solar
So narrowboaters are limited by the usable square footage on the roof of their narrowboat. One way to cheat this is to have solar panels that are stacked and when moored (or simply when space isn’t an issue those panel can slide out from their stacking rack and you can increase your square footage of solar collection. This is a trick many people who live in vans will do to increase solar collection while parked but cut down on wind resistance when on the move.
If there are any allotmemts near the canals....
Some system of container/small skip, which can be taken to the allotmenmts, where there can be the composting area. I'm sure the gardeners would be quite happy to get free compost!
The drop off locations don't have to be at the CRT facility points. Just somewhere mutually convenient for canal and allotment/compost site.
Hi Gonzo, thanks for your comment. Yes, we agree that there is a chance that they could be in multiple locations, not just elsan points. Let's see what happens 👍🙂🌟
What about these new incinarator toilets, which i know some already use. My worry would be setting fire to the boat, but it gets rid of waste on the spot i believe.
Hi have you been to the Anderton boat lift in your boat?
Love, love, love you guys - you are so positive, creative and real. I don't even have a boat but I can see there is a business opportunity there somewhere and obviously a definite need. Keep doing what you are doing and at some point, I am sure, when we can travel we will catch up with you with a replenishment for your sherry cabinet. The first thing I knew about MOH was that he loved , and still does, sherry. My engagement present to him was a sherry decanter - but it broke in one of many of our house moves (over 37 years)!!! Are you a sweet cream (Harveys) or Amontillado???
Hi Juanita, we absolutely love the sound of the sherry decanter! shame it broke. Hope you're well 🙂👍👍🏾Tim prefers a sweet cream and Sam prefers a lighter dryer one
This is very interesting. I suspect you are right that it was Biffa that stepped in and said this was an issue. Setting up composting points is a great idea although not without it's challenges. I had read people were double bagging and using hazardous waste marked bags. Maybe some of the fuel boats could consider setting something up and charging for the carting service. There's issues there too - they're trying to UNLOAD their boats not load them up. :P Lovely to see you both and happy for a discussion of this issue which hasn't been addressed yet in depth in any of the vlogs I follow.
Harvey's Bristol cream sherry girl myself!!!! CHEERS!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 I want you to do the app, because more than anything I want it to be called "Soil Yourself!" That is hilarious (and very clever play on words)!!! Although it would be a crap job!!! 🤣
Hi guys something i bought in an antique shop back in 1998 how or where do I post to also you may need to supaglue there arsed to the tiller or wherever you want cheers n beers Marty Qld oz
Hi Martin, sounds interesting! Thanks for your comment! Email us at chuggingalongcanals@gmail.com
Biodegradable bags are available. We use them for home composting. So why not for composting loos?
Have you looked at getting a small or medium generator? I know that they are ugly and the quieter ones are expensive but they do provide electricity reliably and consistently.
Hi Steve, yes we've done a little bit of research and they seem like a good option. We are already thinking about the summer now so it would be for next winter 😂 thanks for your comment and support 👍
@@chuggingalong Generators are not cheap and you have to be careful about the fumes. The standard ones are very noisy.
I do have another comment. If you watch American RV shows you would see that people run water filters when taking on water. These are not expensive and provide a fair amount of protection. I never see any canal people either use a water filter or disinfect the water tap with a wipe cloth.
Love you two, a breath of fresh air.
I reckon a Hot Bin composter is a good shout, these are very well insulated and can break down solids fully into compost in a couple of months + a good use for kitchen waste as well. The company does a 100 litre mini version which might not be ideal in terms of fitting onto the stern or bow of every narrowboat but could definitely be squeezed onto many. The compost could be used for a little on board garden, or palmed off to someone very unsqeamish & horticulturally inclined!
Hi Chris, thanks for your comment. Yes, using that for your own garden really is an experience 😂👍🌟🙂
Fantastic !
Great subject
Ur choice of words are clever concerning the bog ,.....
I’d go as far as saying
Poetry about the bowl ,....
😂
Mm?
Best poem about a bog perhaps ?
Compition?
😂😂
Love ya laughs and smiles
👍❤️
Haha! Thanks for your poetry Richard 🙂👍👍🏾
Is the charcoal filter enough on its own, or does the pipe run on to an external position?
"Soil Yourself" 🤣 Tim, be sure to carefully consider your present for the next birthday or valentine's day... Sam's face when you mentioned the "box of chocolates " was hilarious.
Haha! Thanks for saving me there 😂👍🌟 Cheers for the comment
Hi. Five months later: has the situation changed and have the CRT provided a solution?
Hi David, the CRT have retracted that statement and given themselves til the end of the year to come up with an alternative. Thanks for your comment 😁👍👍🏾
@@chuggingalong Cheers for coming back. I’m currently looking for a boat to live on and your videos have been really helpful!!
So these composting areas, do you suggest the waste is left in the triple black bags or would you just decant it into a massive fly blown pile? I really cannot image what they would look like. What we really need is a system where liquified waste can be tipped or sucked from the boat into an existing sewer system, we could call them Elsans, or pump outs. Hang on a minute.🤔
Hi Phil, thanks for your comment. There's definitely an argument that the old guard of cassettes and pump outs are here to stay and composts have hit a brick wall 👍
@@chuggingalong I thought about one for my boat when they first became popular, they do cure some of the problems cassette and pump outs have but in doing that create a whole new set of problems. If you had a cabin in the woods they would be perfect, but on a boat, not so much.
Phil, in my opinion you’ve hit the nail on the head. The most efficient/hygienic disposal system for the human waste generated on the network already exists. It’s not pleasant, and facilities could/should be better. Investment should focus on improving and maintaining the pump-out/elsan system, not trying to reinvent the wheel.
If large containers for ‘dry’ waste were sited at Elsan points can you imagine the state of it in the summer when they are full to overflowing?
And if the energy expenditure for removing and processing this type of waste is greater than the net benefit to the environment, what’s the actual point?
Great vlog guys, I am interested in what you are going to do now, since you cannot bag and bin it anymore?
Hi Mrs K, we have only just found out about this news. We are still working it out. Thanks for your comment 🙂
Hi guys, I am considering moving back to the UK from Vietnam after spending 14 years as a teacher. Do you have any recommendations for online teaching companies that don't mind boat dwellers, and the associated possible internet problems? Thanks a million.
My home mooring is on a river, I had the same water wheel idea myself, and have spent the last decade experimenting. An undershot water wheel which can be popped over the side on a river sounds very attractive but undershot designs are by far the least efficient, generating only a fraction of the power associated with other designs. Unless I'm missing something, I reckon the idea is a bust, I'm getting more power from a £30 folding solar panel than from a 30" wide undershot wheel.
Allotment enthusiasts are usually eager to take all the compost you want to give away, all that's needed is something to connect boaters and gardeners.
Hi Dave, we're very interested in seeing your water turbine! Please could you send us an email - chuggingalongcanals@gmail.com
Cheers, Tim and Sam
You guys are excellent and hilarious 😆❤🌱
Thanks Emily that's very kind of you 🙂👍🌟
Hi guys we bought our boat the same time as you at whilton marina we headed up north. We were about to buy a compost toilet but saw the crt notice & will now have to wait till this gets sorted. Not sure how crt are going to be able to arrange the disposal of waste but it's going to take some figuring out. It's a crap job but someone's going to have to do it🤣
I am guessing sticking extra special logs in a multi fuel stove isnt an option. I am not talking about fresh wet logs, but I am thinking it may fill the boat or outside with a special aroma that would turn some noses as well as some eyes.
The best solution that I can think of is installing an incinerating toilet. If more people were buying them then the price would fall dramatically as companies would price war. The ash could then be scattered without issues. Maybe this could also be used to heat up the boat. Maybe the exhaust from the engine could be used to pre heat/dry the chocolate box. Maybe on sunny days the excess power from solar could be used to dry it all out. I think a solar panel costing £150 with the sole purpose of incinerating poop would be a good investment.
Hi there some great ideas there! Not sure about sticking those kind of logs into our diesel stove 😂 but the incinerator seems to be popular solution and having its own solar panel is a good shout 🙂👍
@bootjesgek48 ive seen both gas burner and electric. The electric is indeed very very power hungry and 1 solar in USA wouldnt be enough. But a solar panel could dry it. Its the mositure in a poopy that smells.
In the video you mention people's suggestions on how to generate energy. My apologies, I didn't read all the comments so I'm not sure if anyone suggested a water turbine. I'm wilderness camp and am always looking for ways to charge my devices. I haven't used anything like this before, I use solar. There maybe a product out there and you can use while chugging along. Another idea would be a wind generator, I see them on sail boats. Just a couple of ideas. Have a great one.
Hi Neil, thanks for your comment. Yes we have been looking into wind turbines, they might come in handy for next winter 🙂👍👍🏾
How about contacting local allotments on the way
even horse manure has to be broken down as it will burn plants and add too many nitrates to the soil. Human waste would mostly contain meat proteins and is pretty toxic to plants
Hi Paul, thats a good idea! Thanks for commenting 🙂👍
No worries or local council website to find out where the allotments are.
Please tell me, do both of you teach online and if so, how do you screen out each other's voices and the pupils voices?
I am not a boater myself but love the way of life Re: Compost toilets, I would think that now is the time to consider going over to a compost toilet as the authorities now recognise that this is the direction technology is going and are willing to provide facilities in the near future. I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if I where a boater I think this is the way foreward and a great answer to a stinky problem...good luck
You made my day. I wasn't expecting to see you this week and was surprised to see your lovely faces. I think the CRT has created more problems for themselves and the community by saying you can't use the bins before they had a solution. It has to go somewhere, so now what are boaters going to do? Not everyone will be considerate or give a .... It might be up to young people like you both to put your heads together and come up with a solution. Stay positive we love you.
Such a lovely comment Penney, thank you so much. Yes, boaters putting our heads together can only be a good thing! 👍🙂🌟 keep chugging
I disagree Penney sorry. They are saying quite rightly that the bins are provided and should only be used for the purpose of rubbish removal not human waste. Now don’t flame me because we love them and the convenience but the infrastructure isn’t in place yet. For the same reason I wouldn’t buy an electric car for at least 5 years.
I don't disagree, I just think they should have some plan. It has to go somewhere. Have a great weekend
Penney Noss it’s the boaters that have made the problem. The waste takes at least six months to compost down with oxygen to assist the process. Bagging it up and sealing it in plastic bags after 4 to 7 days it won’t decomposed. Boaters need to store it unbagged for six months and then it will be safe to dispose it. If boaters do not wish to empty there cassettes at a Elsan point then they should move back into bricks and mortar.
@@pippashaw8224 No the CRT need to give out compostable bags or we buy them and then dump them instead. Buy compostable bags from the start?I have a cassete. The burner toilets are the best option but they are over £2500
I would think that the CRT are having to think of the financial implications of having to provide a separate service for the disposal of composting waste. A simple solution would be to charge a small premium on the annual licence fee for those boats using a composting toilet and provide a separate bin at each services point for disposal of sealed bags. To assist the disposal contractor they could also supply zip ties with each boats licence number on and a space for a month/year date to be added so that they can check the system is not being abused and when the bags should be ready for processing.
Hi MRP good ideas there. I'm sure something will be sorted out 👍🌟🙂 Thanks for your comment
In Germany, it's standard practise for sit-downs for guys. You get signs in every public restrooms/restaurants reminding you to do so. Not everyone follows though.
Haha! Interesting
This might sound strange but i was watching Rich house Poor house on My 5 catch up and you two appear in the photo but not the episode... any idea why that may be?
Hi Reece, yes a few people have told us that. It's a mistake from Channel 5! Thanks for your comment :)
On the subject of power use, the suggestion about a water wheel is not so far fetched. There are micro hydro turbines that can generate power while a boat moves through the water. The problem is their cost. I think the boating community could come together and investigate the development of inexpensive versions that can work (1) while boat is moving and/or (2) when the flow of the canal or river can generate power. So that is my landlocked liver contribution to the brilliant narrowboat community.
Hi Junco, that's very interesting. It's something we'd like to see in action 🙂👍👍🏾 Thanks for your comment
I would guess that the amount of additional drag caused by any kind of turbine in the water while the boat was moving would far more than offset any gain in power. Yes, it would generate power, but at the cost of using more diesel to make up for the additional drag. Same reason why putting a wind turbine on top of your electric car doesn't result in perpetual motion. Those pesky laws frictional loss, efficiency, and entropy and such. But I had thought about having one when you're in a flowing river; that might work. Although I think most micro-hydro setups tend to funnel the water flow into a restricted area so your turbine doesn't have to be the size of a paddle wheel on a riverboat to work. We're looking at moving to the UK and living on a narrowboat in the relatively near future, but as yet I have no personal experience. One thing I also wondered about would be the option of having small vertical-axis wind turbines, possibly on telescoping poles, on the roof for when you're moored. Again, they'd generate additional drag when you were cruising, depending on the wind direction, so you'd probably want to take them down if you weren't stationary. I'd be interested to experiment with solar water heating as well.
One consequence of pressuring dog owners to clear up after their dogs is that all council operated public litter bins go for incineration along with the contents of the dedicated dog waste bins - some councils encourage people to use either type of bin for dog waste now.
Therefore, local councils are best placed to suitable provide bins at points where minor roads away from houses cross towpath accessible bridges. That sort of sensible solution seems a bit beyond bureaucracy Britain these days, but it is a public sanitation issue, and one that effects motorhomes and campers with composting toilets as well, who could equally use the same bins. The incremental cost to councils would be minimal.
I’m not surprised - it was always a grey area how compost toilets disposed of their waste. Dumping human waste in an uncontrolled manner is not acceptable and in any case - is that really “composting” ?
I was surprised when CRT started suggesting it in Nov 2017, until then it was always about fully composting and that's what I've always done (and encouraged others to do) - not only am I not dependent on elsan facilities but I'm producing compost not waste! But I do agree that dumping in an uncontrolled manner is unacceptable. I've done a lot of reading these last few weeks and learned how many thousands of litres of untreated sewage gets dumped in our rivers and coastline. 'Untreated human waste was released into streams and rivers for more than 1.5m hours in 2019' (Guardian July 2020). Raw sewage released on to English and Welsh beaches around 3000 times in 2019 (Surfers Against Sewage). When you get down to it, every toilet system has an environmental impact. Not that I am suggesting binning dry material from separator toilets should be acceptable and I am doing my absolute best to help those who find the goalposts have moved to grasp the nettle and get composting!
It's not composting at all, really. I think the companies that are selling these as "composting toilets" have some serious explaining to do, possibly in court, for misleading people into thinking their poop would magically turn to harmless garden soil in a matter of days in these toilets. It's really a scam.
Years ago you took your shovel, dug a hole and buried the waste and put the old soil back on top, leaves a small mound but you know where it was deposited. No smell and becomes soil again.
My mate takes his to the allotment his grandad uses and adds it to his mulching compost pile (not the compost pile used to grow food, just flowers).
Hilarious. First video we've watched of yours. Love the sherry drinking. As you reach more mature years you'll find middle of the night visits to any throne requires a seated position.
What a wonderful topic 🤔🤔 but very interesting. Are you ever not smiling or laughing, great to watch😍
Thanks for your kind words and comment Clive 👍🙂🌟
Hello you two lovelies. Great conversation. Looking forward to broadening my sherry palate. Why compost your biz? At best 3mths to work? and bagging in plastic bags, and pouring a gallon of pee into a woodland every two days? NOT: greener, easier or simpler. After many years of camping, boating and motorhoming my simple, easy green way is......cassette toilette.....clear distilled vinegar. Works a treat! But please do not try it because for some reason supplies of the squirty bottle from super markets at 29p a bottle, lasting me easily one week (inc. the sink drain and waste water tank) are sometimes out of stock. 😎👍
Here in the states (specifically in North Carolina coastal region), we are allowed to bury compost contents. I've had a composting toilet on my sailboat for 2 years now and live part time on it... I row my solids to shore at a wooded location with a folding camping spade and bury mine... never had a problem in that respect.
I'm not surprised either. Always thought it a bit dodgy to put 'chocolate' in the standard waste bins from the point of hygiene, even if double bagged. I can't help wondering if it would be possible to fully compost the waste on a boat. I'm a wanna-be boater still at the research stage so not much personal experience. How much volume of matter is created per month by two people? ( Maybe I should install one at home to find out!) Could there be a storage solution that could be emptied every, say, 6 months? If so there would be plenty of time to find someone who might appreciate some free compost from time to time.
What about setting up composting sites near farm land and garden allotment spaces? If you setup a system where one bin is filled at a time (giving it time to totally breakdown for use) before starting the next bin, gardeners and farmers would have an endless supply of safe garden compost. From the narrowboat videos I've seen, it seems there's endless areas to setup something like this. Interesting idea anyway (CRT setting up composting sites).
Hi Annie, yes let's hope something like this can work 🙂🌟👍 Thanks for your comment
Propane fired incinerators are the way forward. I burned horse maure to heat a workshop for years. If it’s dry, it will burn
I have a toilet just like yours, its a Separette. The solution I think to the challenge of disposal is a standalone incinerating chamber where you can take out the compostable bag place it inside the chamber and turn everything to ash in short order; much like the one designed into incinerating toilets. I don't fancy throwing waste wrapped in plastic into municipal waste.
There's a gap in the market here for a poo boat. It cruises down the canals and everyone throws their waste in it as it passes. It would be see-through so you could see how full it was and you could pay a small monthly fee to use the service. Just don't ever crash into it!
Cheers for the comment. A see-through narrowboat would be great to see. Yes, maybe a waste boat will be the future 👍🌟🙂
I come from fields and jobs where poop is black gold. I'd need more data, but I think it's possible to come up with a composting system that's canal side and doesn't require further collection like rubbish and recycling do.
Three or four bins, their size dependant on location and expected use, would be colour coded. Blue = Jan-Mar, or some other system that's easy and boater friendly. Throughout the system, boaters would fill that bin for those three or four months, then move to a different coloured bin after. Each bin would then have nearly a year to compost, and utilizing various macro and micro organisms this process can be sped up or modified as needed. At years end the finished compost can be safely used to remediate the soil and plants around the canal, shared amongst boaters, donated, sold or simply left in the bin as most of the original volume will have been reduced. Bins could be above or below ground and made of recycled materials. Either aerobic or anaerobic processes can be used, though aerobic is more costly but won't produce odor while anaerobic is cheaper and simpler but quite smelly.
It would take time to establish, and require a united effort by boaters, but think it could work. I also think it should be a fairly closed circuit system to reduce complication and be more inline with nature. Locations could also be taken up or adopted by local towns, clubs, schools/uni, etc., and decorated, themed, used as test beds to experiment with novel approaches or solutions, or go towards supporting worth while causes or needs like community gardens and co-op farms.
Really useful comments.
I always think we have to look at other areas, industries and adapt.
At Laverstock organic farm they take green garden waste and sell it as compost after only 6 weeks. As opposed to 12months in a compost bin. As you say it takes energy. There is a lot if wasted energy at each lock when they fill. Perhaps that could be utilised.
I would think that if the compost was used as soil amendment, boaters could add other organic garbage (like banana peels) to reduce the stress on the normal garbage collection system.
@@jamessprandel7020 Ideally you'd have two compost bin options; one for human waste and another for general composting. Human waste is quit toxic and has special guidelines and codes for handling and disposal so it might easier to separate the the two.
@dolymite The neighbours will love this idea
I vent to the outside and always used coco coir but when I switched to sawdust termites started showing up! I carry the waste bags in a bucket. There was that one time...
Hello! I like your style and your jokes. I'm going to be laughing about the magic lantern for a while! 🤣 But you handled the subject very well indeed. I think the community-maintained compost heaps sound like a great idea... but I don't know if I'd install an app with that name! 🤣
Haha! Thanks for your comment
Hi, what keeps the jug of liquid from smelling bad, sometimes people at work forget to flush on Friday, and Monday, pew.
Hi Myka, we use disinfectant 👍🌟 thanks for your comment
I guess you could empty the compost bags into the Elsan point, but perhaps that would take away some of the convenience.
I do understand the reasoning behind it as human waste is a biohazard so they can be held liable if they don't dispose of it properly. But a solution does need implementing ASAP for everyone's benefit :) Thanks for the info! Very good to know
Thanks for your kind words Amy. Glad you enjoyed the video 🌟🙂👍
Agree with ideas for using composting toilets in the way intended, community allotments could be built alongside to encourgage healthy eating too. Obviously human waste needs careful handling but people can do training for this? I have an allotment and think we could do with a community run compost site too, for all kinds of organic waste that needs breaking down and using for growing fruits and vegetables for the wider community..
I’ve always wondered about the disposal of urine in the trees at side of canals, as many more have compost toilets surly the build up of urine dumps will eventually cause smells and health issues , am sure you may one day be told to dump urine in the elsan stations for health reasons
Hi Andy, thanks for your comment. Yes, you're probably right
Sam I still playing on the simulation narrow boat game this is not easy mooring back the boat 🥺🥺 but I will keep as at it brilliant game thank you guys 👍😊😊❤️
to help with a 'point disposal' site....I use a biodegradable plastic bag[s].
they r NOT tough....but double bagging works. USA, V
ps I bought a bunch from amazon
Hi VooDoo, yes this is something we should definitely look into. Thanks for commenting 👍🌟🙂
What happens if you have the runs? Would that mess your liquids system up?
Hi jack, thanks for your comment. Luckily, we haven't crossed that bridge yet 😂😅🙂😅🌟
I think most people fitted compost loos to free them from having to head for elsan or pump out facilities every few weeks.. crt aren't going to build a compost site every couple of miles because access will be needed for equipment to empty it once a year.. I'd imagine it would need to be covered to prevent rain run off and very large as it wouldn't be catering for just one family but possibly several dumps a day... and you would be emptying your bag so there would need to be rubbish collection nearby. . All I can see is crt building compost sites at already existing elson points which will put compost loos users back in exactly the same position as those with elsan and pump outs.. having to get to services every few weeks.... I would imagine that more popular compost sites will fill up well before 6 months and have to be emptied with a digger or shovel. ... elsan waste and pump out waste is removed with hose and tanker...a much nicer solution. ..also there will be the issue of neighbouring houses and buisness not wanting a steaming pile of chocolate next to them... in my opinion the compost loos should never have been suggested to boat users. ..it will come to the point where biffa refuse to supply bins and camera's and fines will be issued to those dumping poo in bins.. coz most people won't stop dumping it..or it will end up in fields and hedges. . The only toilet that offers complete freedom is an incinerator loo but they do have similar running costs or slightly higher costs than having a pump out..I think the best option would be a cassette loo and and incinerator loo... using the cassette for honey occasionally chocolate depending on elsan availability and then using the incinerator for stays away from facilities. ....perfect compromise. ..😊
Yeah, I think incinerator has to be the way to go with this one. if in doubt....burn it. I think they cost about 3k but I think its worth it for convienience and sanitary issues.
Hi Robert, thanks for your comment and some great points there. If composting is to work there needs to be some kind of logistics issue sorted. Yes, we agree that Biffa don't seem happy at all! 👍