Engineering And Mechanical Failures Off-Road
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ค. 2023
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You know your vehicle is having fun when it's toes curl.
I shot doritos out of my nostrils. Thanks.
GODDAMMIT
😂😂
"Engineering didnt answer any questions. It helped in no way. And I have learned nothing. But I didn't die..." greatest quote of all time.
I was designing an extremely long hydraulic cylinder and I found out there's at least three buckling equations, the johnson, cosine and eulers with eulers being the only one they teach in school. Each equation is suitable for a particular slenderness ratio and investigating each one can save you from an overly optimistic result
Sounds like another vote for nonlinear FEA
Your school is different than mine then. JB Johnson (aka short fat column) was taught. Which I doubly know because I came back and taught the course twice hahaa
If your Johnson buckles, you have bigger problems!
@@cflorenYet, hopefully an enthusiastic partner to help you with it... ....or a you need a gentler sex toy.
@@cfloren Then you put some JB on it and all is well... right?
When I almost broke my neck in 2nd grade, the whole class made "get well soon" cards for me, and one has stuck with me through the years. It said, "Dear A.J. Please Don't Die".
So this is my message to you... Dear Matt, Please Don't Die.
@8:00, vultures instinctively begin circling in.
I work in the rack and pinion rebuilding business , they put those necked down sections as a "fuse" to control what fails.
Oh you mentioned that, duh..
@@jasonwhite1244 great info anyway! :D
Yeah in the vid when he talking about making it stronger I was like, "noooo" just let the tie rod take the hit. Heck if you're really that worried about it keep a set in the truck.
@@TurboV8boi Well, he did say he wanted to make it stronger but he also said he still wanted it to be the weakest link...
That 45 degree angle was tough to watch.
I could have sworn it was going to roll over
The willpower I spent in teaching my dog to roll over, is nothing compared to the begging my truck not to…
i would've ask for some counterweight on the passenger seat
@@PabloDelafuria I was thinking that watching the video.
I had my hand out the driver's window as a reflex action to stop my vehicle's impending rollover....
then the Limited Slip Differential kicked in and the remaining on-the-ground rear wheel got enough grip to kick the truck around the hillside and the front end downslope......
ending the rollover motion.
A friend watching from outside and to the rear said he had never seen any vehicle at that angle..and not rollover.
Now I can understand why several sports codes require a net to stop arm and hand movements exiting via the driver's window whether involuntary or instinctive....
Even as a viewer it got me right into the butt puckering zone.
Catastrophic Buckling was the first, and hardest, graduate course I took and our book was last published in the 1930s I'm pretty sure because no PhD ever wanted to dedicate their lives to such a difficult subject ever again. Because the tie rod end doesn't apply a load at the exact center of the tie rod axis it decreases the force needed to buckle significantly (there are some kind of maths on this) since it induces a small bending load.
Yep...moment arm....
@@andrewd3439 silly as it may be, the image at 4:49 shows the force arrow slightly off cl. In this case, it is likely design factors like steering geometry, clearance, manufacturing, or intentional failure point that lead to the design of the tie rod end and tie rod itself over ultimate strength. It is far better to bend a tie rod than break the rack or upright.
I mastered catastrophic buckling in my 20s, but I can't talk about it again because it was too difficult.
@@andrewd3439 this is assuming that the ball joint does not articulate and is a rigid 90° angle. There is some amount of bending force on this even if the ball joint is at the cl.
I was told there would be no math.
I’ve gone through an evolution with my off-road damage response. It started with “oh fuck oh god I’m so fucked, this tire is fucked, my spare is inadequate, I don’t have the proper tools” but eventually developed to “ok, so my tires are perpendicular, I’m gonna have to hitch to town to get parts, this is gonna suck, but the victory beer I drink after getting this fixed will be the best I ever tasted”
I agree with your strategy of using the tie rods as your steering fuse. I've replaced a few sets over the years and it's for sure easier than replacing the steering rack. How do I know? I was the one that wrote that steering rack replacement article you referenced. It's not a fun job.
I always carry a spare inner and outer tie rod with me when I'm heading onto the trail. Swapping them out is super easy trail side.
“There it is!” That was genuinely funny. Glad you didn’t die. We would all be very sad.
I’m also glad Matt didn’t die, but there’s a difference between “death” from rolling your vehicle at low speeds, and actual death. I feel like Matt only would’ve been “mostly dead” in this case.
If by chance you do die, can I have the Jag?
@@amazeddude1780 Dibs on the giant scooter thing, whatever the fuck that is
How long would it take us to find out???
@@jcorkableWell, that buzzard (8:05) was getting hopeful.
I hope you ordered a spare tie rod or two. If you intend a part to act as a fuse then you should carry a spare fuse.
No automotive MCBs (press "reset" button) for mechanical parts yet...???
@@JohnSmith-yv6eq Sadly not
@@JohnSmith-yv6eq "Have you tried turning your tie rod off and back on again?"
@@JohnSmith-yv6eq there are materials which can snap back into place with no stress buildup in their structure. NASA uses one type of them for their space rover wheels now. Veritasium made a wheel video about it.
@@mm6705
That's good to know....
but how much would a tie rod made of that material cost????
There is a fourth way and my favorite way to calculate buckling. Have the DOD pay for material and just simply do destructive analysis. Makes the presentation very easy basically "too long, make it thicker because...this"
"ooooh, how much thicke?"
"thickerrr.....i can find out exactly how much more down to the gram so you can maximize strength, lower weight, and mathematically significantly lower cost. But that might be about 2 years of R&D with a 10mil budget....faster with more money...with what we currently know"
Even though I'm not an engineer of any measure, it feels like you might be way too comfortable with the phrase "it's probably fine" than you should be as an engineer.
If you’re doing engineering correctly, there is a thorough physical testing phase where you can really see what happens. This makes the math and analysis phases less critical. After a while you get pretty comfortable with ballpark math.
There is a surprising amount of "just make it out of a big hunk of steel" with no analysis
@@KnowledgePerformance7 That's 100% of aftermarket off-road engineering
^ I think part of what makes a good engineer is being able to judge what needs to be fully optimized and what can just be “good enough”.
Unless you’re designing for the razors edge of performance most things can be ballparked
@@SuperfastMatt"I've done this shit for too long to care about the specifics in my free time so I'm going to assume it's fine"
I appreciate that you didn't stiffen the control arm. Keeping the failure point there instead of pushing it further up the chain is certainly much easier. Unless of course you're planning on doing more and more aggressive 4x4 trails, but it doesn't seem like that's the case.
One thing to note is with the heading back down part and getting fairly, uh, tippy.... If you HAD started to roll, the human reflex to hit the brakes is the WORST thing to do, so instead try to just "let it go". Or even better, hit the gas hard while you're in reverse. That should keep you from rolling in the end, although it would make it a harder landing too...
I'm not sure what frame of mind you were in at that point, but it's worth considering for future reference if you weren't already aware of that.
The mechanical fuse concept often gets lost in the mission of making a machine tougher, but I am a big fan of making sure the weakest part is either easy to replace or cheaper than the other links in the chain. An old example was PTO winches with bronze sher pins in the drive. From factory they would have a spare pin for when it failed, that would get used and owners would get the shots with replacing them when they abused the winch, so it wasn't uncommon for owners to put in hardened pins. Not a good long-term idea.
Another one that comes to mind is the manual locking hubs on old school solid axle 4x4s. Typically the locking hub would fail before the axle shaft or diff, and that was a relatively easy repair and a small enough part to keep spares on board.
Please don't die. Its kinda hard to find youtubers who make funny engineering content about vehicle slaughter.
It’s often a small oversight in my experience in college of designing things to fail in a specific way.
It’s clever of them to have the cheap parts fail as a sacrificial layer to protect the expensive parts, hence the idea of a shear pin. Not only is the tie-rod relatively cheap, but it’s also easy to observe and easy to access should a failure occur.
I remember in Mechanical Design class, my professor told us to design a nut and bolt assembly with specific dimensions. It was easy as we can get the factor of safety to like 30+ when under axial load. But then he told us to modify it to where you had to get that factor of safety down to 2.0, and it noticeably got a lot more difficult.
great story and lessons learned as always. that thin section definitely appears to be an engineered "failure" point to protect the rack to me , why else would Toyota spec out the time and cost to turn that section down with the lathe? Someone smarter than me probably knows.
I cant speak for Toyota but a Buddy works for another Offroad Vehicle manufacturer and they do it too so this does seem to be a Purpose break point.
@@Nick-hm9rh
Hopefully a purpose BEND point?
don't you mean lathe that section down? you know, the thing you do with a lathe? lathing things? ^-^
@@xymaryai8283 touché
@@xymaryai8283It’s referred to as “turning” not “lathing”.
This video had everything. It's like distilled essence of Superfast Matt. Ambitious, skillful yet sketchy and the "near enough is good enough" attitude. Amazinf.
Maths nerd here - I’m not interested in doing the difficult math either, I’ll just trust your method
All the new Bronco folks out there installing tie rod sleeves are going to start learning about rack replacement soon. I always thought of the TRE as a mechanical fuse and would way rather that bend out on a trail, can hobble it together or replace it right there.
The broncos that come with the higher end off-road packages get stronger racks. So swapping out the rack itself might also be a good idea.
@@ILiketoBreakStuff Bronco R uses a wider F150 rack due to the wider track and massive 37s from my understanding. There is a company that sells a reinforcement sleeve deal that goes in the rack to sort of helps prevent the rack from failing easily.
yeah a bent tie rod you can even pull off and hammer approximately straight and be able to drive somewhere carefully.
Thumbnail is just the 4Runner saying 😳👉👈
Comment stolen from Instagram lol
Proper off-road mechanical fuse replacement procedure:
1. Identify the mechanical fuse through properly neglecting the spotter and finding a rock the hard way (as Matt did.)
2. Use a very sketchy method to return the vehicle to 90% of safe operation at the trail head. Possible methods include: ratchet straps, welding using jumper cables, two batteries and 10 year old muddy welding rods, nearby forest lumber, etc.
3. Buy and replace both right and left fuses despite only breaking one.
4. Throw old un-blown fuse into spare parts box in the back of the off-road vehicle
5. Go find new ways to come close to soiling your underwear off-road, knowing you're fully prepared in case of another blown fuse!
It's like he made that whole bit about the design of a steering rod just because he wants people to know how smart he is. I really want to judge him for it but can't, because he actually is this smart. A skill-set so wide and deep wtf, including communication. He knows exactly what his audience wants, which is detailed explanations on why steering rods are designed the way they are.
Matt, you have steel bars on the sides, when the car leaned to the left, someone should be standing on the right side to balance it (ofc it's dangerous, but in europe quite popular in offroading)
That offroading technique isnt available for City-boys.
At a 45⁰ Angle, that does hardly anything. If you draw a vertical line from where someone could be standing to the ground, it'll be very close to the contact patch of the lower tires. Thus, it just involves more people in the rollover.
I was leaning towards shifting loads inside the car to keep it from tipping over…
@@kain0m I disagree. I've seen cars on worse angles than 45 deg and it helped. You're standing on the bar, hold to roof rack or rails with hands and lean as far from the car as possible, this helps to shift the center of mass. Even if the car rolls over, you're on the 'higher' side so you will be fine most of the times
This is one of the most honest and realistic depictions of hobby off roading that I’ve ever seen.
I'm a new subscriber. I love the engineering prowess, and wicked dry sense of humor you bring to the table. Please keep the videos coming. Thank you.
Pro tip: Carry a few extra tie rods (inner and outer) in your 4runner, you can get them brand new online for less than $10. Literally everybody does that...I even have 2 in my 4runner for this reason. The tie rod was specifically designed to fail by Toyota in that exact circumstance and be easily replaced on the trail with minimal tools by one person in under 20 minutes.
I just came back from a fun weekend.
One buddy cracked the frame on his pathfinder, I smashed my skid plate into my t case oil pan into the gears inside, and buddy #2 tried an obstacle, blew up one CV in his pathfinder, figured it’s already broken tried again and grenaded the other side. Then packing camp anti-theft tried to lock him out.
All around a good time and many obstacles were conquered. Now time for “maintenance”
Order 2 identical tie rods and get 2 different ones in identical boxes... let me guess, Rock Auto? Been there done that!
Literally had the same thing happen with Rock Auto for my F150. One had grease fittings, the other was “greaseless”.
Your maintenance intervals on your 4Runner are kinda like my maintenance intervals on my FJ. I'll worry about it whenever it breaks. I carry 4 sets of tie rods because I know if I bend one I'll bend more immediately after.
I used to offroad in a jeep cherokee 2001. That thing had limped off the trail flooded, oil/coolant spewing out, on a donut, in FWD with the rear taken apart. The best part was you could goto pull a part a get basically OEM spares of anything out of the street queen 2wd cherokees. Plus it was a very light car with all kinds of upgrades you could literally pull out of other cars.
Back in the day we took tobacco advertising money. I am glad that Soylent green is giving you money.
I believe that Mr. Clever, Funnyman Matt has his "off road vehicle survival math" correct:
driving a motorcycle "intensely" off road will likely / eventually lead to damaging your motorcycle and / or your body.
driving a truck "intensely" off road will likely / eventually lead to damaging your truck.
I've had the same issue with buying parts off of Amazon - guessing you got a "return" where someone subbed a cheaper part for the return.
I found RockAuto to be good for actually getting the right part. But they are slightly more expensive and don't have free shipping last time I checked.
My wrench-turning buddies got me a tee-shirt with "It should be fine" on it. Apparently, it's my go-to engineering assessment.
Great video man! Pronghorn is a fun hill. Stay safe out there. Hope to see ya out on the trails one dsy
I love your maintenance mentality!!! It inspires me to......watch another video!!!!🤪 I'll work on my truck later!!!!
Replacing the windscreen will cross cleaning it off the list at the same time. Efficiency.
Small diameter section => bend here. This reminds me of an engineer co-worker who drag raced in his youth and had an endless amount of stories about breaking something, replacing it with a stronger part, then finding the next weak link.
Every windshield failure I have had was from hauling lumber. $60 in free wood has cost nearly $1200 in windshields.
Good stuff and a really good video, thanks for sharing 👍.
I love that during "that time I almost died" scene the shadow of a large bird circles the four runner. I like to think it was a vulture.
You should consider doing a thorough check of your steering rack after that bump. The aluminum mounting points on those aren't very fatigue prone, but offroading like you do is a bit outside Toyota engineers design envelope.
It would really suck if your steering rack desided to stop being mounted to your frame next time you stressed it.
Yeah, the 100 series Land Cruiser / LX470 has an 8 inch reverse cut ring and pinion in the front axle; it's a know weak point. (especially if going in reverse, as you wind up running on the coast side of the gear)
Man you need an off-road toy that is not your daily driver...
You should build an off-road viper!
🤯
Looks like the tie rod is the same for both sides. If it's a fuse in the system, carry a spare. I carry spare U joints in my Old Bronco. Same deal.
This channel is the perfect amount of geeky, no shouty hyper youtuber personality, and features little snippets of great music. Easy sub 👌
At least he has the old (unbent) one to take along as a spare. This will prevent the new ones from ever failing, because the law of spare parts works that way.
Super cool to see how you are able to apply your understanding of engineering to real world problems. Keep it up 👍👍👍
Excellent as always and I didn't fast forward during the ad. Thanks Sir Matt!
Love your work 👍
I just loveee your videos! Amazing, and I am glad you didnt die, good job 👍🏼
I sent a new viewer to your channel for landspeed streamliner content. Any idea when you'll pick that back up? Hopefully the salt dries out this year.
Next few weeks.
I love the raptor shadow circling your near-death moment …
I was out wheeling with a 1st gen xterra when something like this happened. They bent the pitman idler arm (I didn't realize 1st gen Xterra's had recirculating ball steering) and the wheels were point into each other like yours. We bent a few tools trying to get it a little better and eventually sorta did and he drove it a good 50 minutes home.
Part of me wants to try doing this with my dodge, but like you say, you break everything. love the vids Matt!
you know its gonna be bad when matt uploads a video named "sketchy...."
Was laughing most of the video, you crack me up!
Stay safe Matt 😎👍💪✌️
Glad you didn't die and thanks for sharing your stories. Have fun, be safe, stay dangerous :-) PS - did you keep the old tie rod for just in case? Also the title should end with "So Far" as you are putting together an off road Viper LOL
Matt, I work on steering racks for a living, and the part of the tie rod that failed is designed to buckle so it does not damage the steering rack.
That tie rod is an absolute hero. good call not beefing up the tie rod. i think youre right about the smaller diameter section, its most likely a designed failure point to protect the rack
You're deadpan sense of humor helps make my day! Love your channel
Your videos make my day better.
Way better.
From where I sit it's astonishing to see people pour time and money into a "project" that is designed to be abused until failure, when the whole thing can start over again. At first blush, one might think rock crawlers like to go out and, you know, crawl over rocks. And that is no doubt the section of the whole loop that sells the idea, but what makes it stick is a personality type that likes to generate more problems. My only remaining question for the kind of person that does this is whether you are peripherally aware of this or whether part of the loop is to avoid looking closely at why you like it/do it.
You have to invest a little. Or you'll be like me sitting in the passenger seat of a Kia sportage looking at the rear suspension trail out in the desert behind you.
We are aware..... We may not admit it to others or even ourselves, but somewhere deep down we all know.
Im also surprised that people do it with mass production cars, I just built a buggy and its way more fun
Welcome to all "Regular guy" motorsports.
You think drifting is any different? Point is, it's fun, and it's the fun and experience that matters in the end , not the destination... you break parts, you fix them, so you can break more parts etc. Nothing about this is efficient or economical , purely done as a hobby.
@@--LZ--- Yes, well thank you so much for the brochure copy.
Carry spare CV axles and tie rods, Offroading IFS 101. Keep your old tie rods when you change them out as they can save you in a pinch like this. Takes less than 10min to replace a tie rod on the trail. Also if you can afford it, avoid Moog like the plague.. Get some Sankei 555 stuff or OEM.
Videos like this make me glad that my front axle is live/solid and my steering components are long, sturdy tubes.
You sir, are my hero.
Nice video presentesion i agree with you that thus is an expensive hobby...
Hello from Off Road Adventures Greece 🇬🇷
Great job on the video Matt! Thanks for making it. Those new Tacomas look sick. Makes me really hopeful about the 6th Gen 4Runners. Trailhunter version? Factory-installed snorkel? Front sway bar disconnect? Yes to all the things, please!
Gorman! Sandstone! I did that with my 1st gen Tacoma without a locker. It was a bit of a challenge.
Loved the "wauffer Thin" reference. Classic John Cleese. The brake pads owed you nothing. The shock load on that right front could occur on any corner of any vehicle in that situation, resulting in similar failure. Rock crawlers beware! Such adventures are always controlled by the laws of physics!
Love that alignment.
A mechanical "fuse".... what a clever idea. But one as old as Engineering. I agree you made the best choice considering the lack of good information. Love or Hate Toyota as a company, but in my experience, their Engineering has always been top-notch.
Love your narratives … have you ever thought about a secondary career doing audio books?
I've seen the fun and games of buckling a tierod on a solid front axle. UK G-Wagon owners club - Back from the days where they basically the younger brother of Unimog trucks cosplaying as army jeeps had a few pics of member doing pretty much the same thing - very sad looking thing as it also caused the front end to dip alot more than you would expect (the top mounts might have sheered too but this wasn't mentioned).
On the flip side, G-Wagons roll over rather well even without a roll cage.
Love the video! Hope to see you do the Land Cruiser 200 steering rack swap. Although you probably don’t want to add more to your list…
Glad you survived. We need as many of us named Matt in the world as possible :-D
I see you installed one of those new 90 degree tie-rod ends. That's some cutting-edge technology!
Thumbnail gives me
"When you need a oil change but you are shy "
Vibes
I replaced the steering rack off my 03 Tacoma about a month ago. The point of failure was the input shaft seal. It's pretty much completely unprotected from sand. When I put the new one on I gave the hat above the seal a generous helping of thick sticky marine grease.
Or, you know, could have made a makeshift rubber boot for it...
I'm Parts guy. mog makes napa parts afik. They could have been mixed up at the factory. Or someone returned swamped that napa part for the mog one. In that case I'm shocked it was a new part at all. Either way the napa part is fine, but the mog ones are beefier.
Maybe you can retrofit tie rods from a tundra they are huge. Also I will be referring to your early microsquirt videos, I installed a honda L15 (out of a fit) into a wildcat 1000 4 seat utv and purchased the microsquirt ecu to manage it, thanks for the videos.
This is the best superfast matt video in quite some time, and I appreciate you for creating this content for me to consume for free. Thanks, Matt
I really enjoy this channel, it's always a double feature. First the main video, which is great and then you get to enjoy the comments! Love it all!
Today's award for "Random Obscure Place I've Been to Mentioned on TH-cam" goes to Matt bringing up Gorman, California.
I lived briefly in Frazer Park. Anyway love the content.
10:54 Nobody is going to talk about how you have your wheel turned 45° but the 4runner is driving straight.
When you "adjust" one tie rod to get the wheels parallel, the rack will always be off-center driving straight ahead (assuming it was centered driving straight before the adjustment).
Nobody talks about it because that was the only point of that clip.
So what you actually learned is the inner tie rod and required tools should be with you on off-road adventure
Great stuff. Love it. Congrats on not dying too.😂😂😂
nice racing setup on that toe. good for straightline stability and warming your tires up in F1 i heard.
I'm living the exact same things with my own 5th gen, so reassuring to see I'm not the only one giving a hard life to his 4Runner with poor maintenance ^^'... Now dealing with water in the trans fluid after a very long and deep water crossing...
You make some really good content. So I am more or less happy that you didn't die 👍
Dude, I love your videos. They’re awesome. And your dash looks almost just like my 4runner. Except my hula gir isn’t dearth Vader but my windshield is cracked. Gods stuff man.
Super scary moment there, brown zone for sure! Glad everything came out OK. 😅
your 4runner isnt designed to be pigeon toed
i love that 4runner set up
It is common for one of the rear upper links on the 4runners with 5 links to fail. The whole rear suspension works because of bushing deflection, if you were to make all the pivot points in the rear rod ends instead of bushings it wouldn't move at all and be frozen in place. If you want to make the rear smoother and flex better off road, remove one of the upper links all together. But if you don't believe me than model it.
Did you go a whole video without plugging SendCutSend? Inconceivable!
What about making a tierod out if a two-way suspension rod?
Automatic fuses are better than replaceble ones, but automatic overload protection is even better. I call it the Thomrod.
Congratulations, best segue ive ever seen