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Aerith Will Be Revived Later On In Rebirth Part 3 And How She'll Know How To Trap His"Fake"Memories But Find His REAL Mother And Awaken The Actual Menories Of Sephiroth And If This Happens In Part 3 And Vincent Will Need Lucrecia In Order To Use The White Materia And Create A NEW Materia That'll Be Called The PURE Materia But Cloud Gets An Idea And Says This:"Aerith Why Not Bring Her Back And Lucrecia Accepts And They Move Back To The Forgotten Capital And Aerith Is Still There Napping Where She'll Be Able To Help Him
The theory about using the materia to seal away Cloud's memories of Sephiroth makes a ton of sense. I also wonder if carrying the clear materia allows "Omni Aerith"/Aeriths from other versions of reality/worlds to communicate with him..? Tying in to maybe the White Matieria is how Aerith seems able to coordinate amongst her selves in multiple worlds & the multiple versions/clips at game ending.
The Gi describe the Black as: “The Purest of materia made black by spite” “We went to the planet and stole its greatest treasure, into it we poured our desire for freedom” Implying that the black materia was once white and that they have parity. As well as desire, they also describe its contents as their dream of oblivion and their hope for freedom. Hopes & Dreams being a huge reoccurring theme of the trilogy. Its contents were hidden “between worlds” and recovered by Sephiroth. The Dream worlds are “between worlds” implying that the contents of the black Materia is a literal dream world, a dream of meteor. If they have parity then the contents of the white materia are most likely a dream of hope. We have possibly witnessed the creation of a dream world in which Aerith still exists much like Zack. A dream of a living Aerith. A huge amount of attention has gone into setting up these dream worlds in line with the games strong themes of hopes & dreams. It is likely that the empty materia will go on to contain or connect to that dream world.
I think the problem with it being filled with Cloud's memories of Sephiroth is that it will effectively turn it into a "new" black materia - because, like the original, it will be filled with hate and malice. Remember what Aerith said at the temple after the trials...she emphasized real power comes from the ability to forgive. I'm not sure how we get Cloud to THAT place with S, but that might ultimately neutralize him coming back. The other way of course, is for Cloud to die, which is still how I think this all ends.
I don't get the theory to seal away Clouds memories of Sephiroth, how would that work? If Cloud doesn't remember Sephiroth, all the other party members saw Sephiroth so they too have a memory of him , he could just anchor to another person to keep existing in the Lifestream. Like mentioned in the video you see a counterpart of the world in the clear materia, could potentially explain why Cloud sees the rift in the sky and Aerith. Would be nice if had another use like you could choose to hand over Sephiroth the clear materia or the black materia and depending on the choice you get different endings / key events.
4:24 That’s not Sephiroth my guy. The vid you got going here when you’re claiming Sephiroth doesn’t really know much of anything at this point is actually of Jenova taking Sephy’s form. It’s not Sephiroth. While Sephiroth and Cloud have a looser relation at this point, Sephy def remembers that Cloud was the one who killed him in Nibelheim. The only times you see Sephiroth (before the bottom of the Northern Crater) is when he hijacks the minds of the black cloaked figures and uses them from a distance in his image, hence their names as “Sephiroth clones”
I mean you're sort of right, it is Jenova's body. BUT, it's Sephiroth's will, it's him the whole game. At this early stage he doesn't recognise Cloud as he's only really seen Cloud once and doesn't view him as very important. Also, Cloud is in "Zack Mode" which is something Sephiroth has never seen, so again, makes him wonder "Who are you?" And finally, while this is a Jenova body and Sephiroth's will, Sephiroth may not have figured out how to properly puppet it yet as he's not long liberated it from the Shinra building. Many possibilities as to why Sephiroth doesn't immediately recognise Cloud, but it IS Sephiroth's will.
@ That’s where we disagree and need some clarification. I personally believe that in this particular case, it’s Sephiroth’s will only in the sense that it’s what he wants carried out. It’s still not him actually carrying it out. In fact, he and Jenova end up having the same goals in the end anyway. I implore you to follow this thread of thought I bring you here, and hope you tell me what you think about it afterwords. Once Sephiroth starts his return after dying in Nibelheim, he rattles the body of Jenova that’s being kept in the Shinra Headquarters. Having part/half of his being of her, he can communicate with her and reactivate her. Her body breaks free in parts that can move individually of their own accord, no different to what and how we’ve seen movies like “The Thing” portray Eldritch horrors when a body part of theirs is severed. Throughout the game, there are 3 portions of Jenova we meet. After you do, you fight them, but not before certain story elements occur. The one you brought here where we meet a piece of her on the ship is the first meeting. I believe she is working more as Sephiroth’s minion here than as his puppet per se, but I’ll continue to explain more of this later. Same thing when you meet her second part, the one that kills Aeris. It is Jenova that is speaking to Cloud after the battle when she called him a “puppet”, not Sephiroth. That’s objectively true and has no basis for refuting. And the last time you meet a piece of her is in the Whirlwind Maze when Sephiroth is almost on his way to full Ascension in the crystalized mako. I still believe Sephiroth has the ability to take Jenova’s power (shapeshifting) and use it for himself, but through Gaia’s lifeforms that have had cells of Jenova placed within them (again, Sephiroth clones). He was made of her, after all. At the core/crux of this view, I believe, is how Jenova works within AND outside of lifeforms on Gaia. With her body parts, she is the one moving those, IN ACCORDANCE to Sephiroth’s will (not actually Sephiroth himself), because he has essentially taken up her will to destroy the planet and siphon its energy. She essentially brought him to madness and got him to want the same thing as her and their goals are actually one in the same here- Sephy didn’t really come up with that idea first, it’s the instinctual purpose of the parasitic Jenova. So for Jenova, following Sephiroth is all she can do at this point, after being sealed by the Cetra and stripped of her agency for thousands of years and held away at Shinra Headquarters. It’s Sephiroth that unleashed her from these shackles to begin with. And again, where Sephiroth is special and has control is of those who have both lifeforms within him, humans with Jenova cells, just like himself. He is what Jenova nor regular humans could ever be, the perfectly synthesized fusion between the terrestrial and the extraterrestrial. Not even Jenova could hijack minds for a moment, almost as a form of teleportation in a sense, then decide to disappear back into the darkness. What she would do was infect, take over, and spread, much like a disease, but never could she mind warp the way Sephiroth can during the game. And that’s exactly how her cells react when placed in smaller quantities inside Gaian lifeforms (as opposed to her larger body parts we meet), they infect and break the minds of psyches during their moments of weakness with pure madness, creating the vessels that only Sephiroth can hijack and manipulate to do their bidding. Jenova is still in play here, but she NEEDS Sephiroth. He is the clear lead yes, but she is not a complete non-factor. Again, what’s not disputable is the fact that she actually has a line of dialogue in the main game right after they try to get Cloud to believe that he can’t have feelings/emotions after Aerith was killed, almost as if to “chime in” at the end and show that she’s here. All Jenova’s parts actually do come back together for the theorized reunion to be proven true and you do actually fight her in the end before you even fight Bizarro Sephiroth and Safer Sephiroth. When you look at the details laid out in this amazingly written piece of interactive literature, it’s hard not to see why it’s one of the best pieces of media out there to digest, experience, and frankly adore.
The clear materia is a red-herring....it doesn't physically exist. It is being used at the end in the same manner as Cloud's potential "imagining" of aerith and the rift. Further evidence to this is that the entire exchange of materia takes place within Cloud's unconscious/subconscious mind during the sleeping forest. Along this same line of thought is that this materia is a reference to the same yellowish one we saw during the end of FF7 OG as cloud goes into his subconscious to fight sephiroth. Our meteor-esque trip at the end of OG goes outward from "core" of the planet back to the surface, which appears void and barren except for some watery effects. The entire premise of what the edge of creation is in both OG and the Trilogy is summed up by the hollow materia as a depiction of what Cloud's mind wants....either to create or leave gaia desolate. These two meta-ideas can be packaged it into a third, more complex guess: As mentioned in a previous video of mine, our clear materia is "midgar" a.k.a the people's materia. A clue to this is the depictions of divine sanctuaries throughout rebirth. Every location on gaia has a summon materia associated with a diety. So too could midgar, specifically the church, an overt sanctuary that reflects the hopes and salvation of people. I'll leave the thought at that --- its up to each individual as to whether their hope is in Cloud, Aerith, Zack or the collective unconscious of humanity.
Those are all great ideas, but I still think the clear materia will be part of the solution. The wildcard, of course is Zack. The question is, who saved him? Was it really Aerith or Minerva (or Angeal allowed by Minerva to intervene as a way of balancing the scales of fate since Sephiroth has so much power now). I think Zack's part will exponentially increase in part 3 and we will see a Aerith and Zack reunion.
Or was it the white Whispers controlled by the Ancients in the Lifestream that saved him? I would really like to see a reunion of Aerith and Zack as well, in another world/in the Lifestream.
I'm with you on all these points but I'm still of the opinion that there won't be a significant reunion between Zack and Aerith in part 3. Currently I don't believe it was Aerith who saved Zack until more evidence comes to light. For now I think it was some other force that influenced those Gray Whispers to go to off course. Either the planet/Minerva and Angeal definitely had a hand in turning them away as evidenced by the white feather that falls down at the start of Rebirth.
@jesse1381 We have no other fotce at hand atm. And while it could be cool, it is stated in a book that Aerith Has the same powers as Sephiroth in the lifestream(making avatars and healing instead of geostigma).
I'm still of the opinion Floyd's memories of Sephiroth are going to be transferred into the clear materia and destroyed then fused and destroyed with the black Materia. In other words, who knows?
@@jacksonjack7838 Ah-Haha! You don't know Fast Fingers Flyod who never proof reads for auto-incorrects before he posts? Surely you've met him a time or two.
I was thinking that it could be just the holy materia, but also could be used to link the separated worlds back together to create one singular time line, where sephiroth will be defeated and permanently gone. This way, he cannot keep jumping around the worlds through the lifestream after being defeated. Maybe that they can bring the world's together at the end of the third remake and have zack be a part of the group and then they can all stand together in one last battle and aerith will be there too. Then they can break the materia, or something of the like, after sephiroth is defeated in the combined worlds. Then the aerith death scene will be more of a send off like at the end of advent children when her and zack return to the life stream. Just my little idea.
One thing I find really silly in all these theories is the hyperfixation on Cloud. Cloud is certainly important in FF7, but he is not the end-all force in the fight against Sephiroth. Contrary to popular belief, Cloud alone did not defeat Sephiroth in FF7. The entire team had to defeat Sephiroth's actual bodies, and then Cloud only defeated Sephiroth's influence in his mind. Cloud didn't beat Sephiroth in a real one on one battle. Even in Advent Children, Cloud BARELY got Sephiroth thanks to Sephiroth dropping his guard due to assuming Cloud had no strength left. So the Clear Materia is likely not going to be linked to Cloud only. Cloud, by himself, really isn't particularly impressive as an individual. As a person he is HEAVILY dependent on his friends, which I think is the main reason he was entrusted with the Clear Materia. It is because Cloud is the connection point of the team, he is the leader. At the end of FF7, Cloud asks the team to return to their loved ones and find a deep motivation to risk their lives in the fight against Sephiroth. He basically tells them all to find that hope or that dream that they will lay their lives down for. And this is what I think will be critical for the Clear Materia. Part 3 will take this moment from the end of FF7 and make it a much more important event, where the entire party will infuse their hopes and dreams into the Clear Materia and it will become the Holy Materia of their Beagle world. This will tie back in with the idea that there are multiple Black Materia. Aerith suggests as much when she says the one that they found at the Temple was "a fake". It apparently was not the real treasure that Sephiroth was seeking, but was merely a key to what he called "the true counterpart hidden between worlds". He may be seeking a greater version of the Black Materia. Perhaps one that he will acquire by way of uniting/fusing multiple Black Materia that he will acquire from various worlds. If this were the case, then it would make sense that Aerith and the Planet would need multiple Holy Materia to counteract Sephiroth's plan.
Cloud is impressive tho. What do you mean? When cloud was a normal human he overpowered sephiroth and threw him into the reactor. The final battle where he removes sephiroth INFLUENCE from his mind using his unique materia is when the clear materia would play a role. Cloud's true strength.
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Aerith Will Be Revived Later On In Rebirth Part 3 And How She'll Know How To Trap His"Fake"Memories But Find His REAL Mother And Awaken The Actual Menories Of Sephiroth And If This Happens In Part 3 And Vincent Will Need Lucrecia In Order
To Use The White Materia And Create
A NEW Materia That'll Be Called The
PURE Materia But Cloud Gets An Idea
And Says This:"Aerith Why Not Bring
Her Back And Lucrecia Accepts And
They Move Back To The Forgotten
Capital And Aerith Is Still There Napping
Where She'll Be Able To Help Him
@2:40 hey its me. Yeah i like all these ideas. It ties to the lifestream very well.
The theory about using the materia to seal away Cloud's memories of Sephiroth makes a ton of sense.
I also wonder if carrying the clear materia allows "Omni Aerith"/Aeriths from other versions of reality/worlds to communicate with him..? Tying in to maybe the White Matieria is how Aerith seems able to coordinate amongst her selves in multiple worlds & the multiple versions/clips at game ending.
Love the video
Thank you!
The Gi describe the Black as:
“The Purest of materia made black by spite”
“We went to the planet and stole its greatest treasure, into it we poured our desire for freedom”
Implying that the black materia was once white and that they have parity.
As well as desire, they also describe its contents as their dream of oblivion and their hope for freedom.
Hopes & Dreams being a huge reoccurring theme of the trilogy.
Its contents were hidden “between worlds” and recovered by Sephiroth.
The Dream worlds are “between worlds” implying that the contents of the black Materia is a literal dream world, a dream of meteor.
If they have parity then the contents of the white materia are most likely a dream of hope.
We have possibly witnessed the creation of a dream world in which Aerith still exists much like Zack. A dream of a living Aerith. A huge amount of attention has gone into setting up these dream worlds in line with the games strong themes of hopes & dreams.
It is likely that the empty materia will go on to contain or connect to that dream world.
I think the problem with it being filled with Cloud's memories of Sephiroth is that it will effectively turn it into a "new" black materia - because, like the original, it will be filled with hate and malice. Remember what Aerith said at the temple after the trials...she emphasized real power comes from the ability to forgive. I'm not sure how we get Cloud to THAT place with S, but that might ultimately neutralize him coming back. The other way of course, is for Cloud to die, which is still how I think this all ends.
Very intriguing indeed.
I don't get the theory to seal away Clouds memories of Sephiroth, how would that work? If Cloud doesn't remember Sephiroth, all the other party members saw Sephiroth so they too have a memory of him , he could just anchor to another person to keep existing in the Lifestream. Like mentioned in the video you see a counterpart of the world in the clear materia, could potentially explain why Cloud sees the rift in the sky and Aerith. Would be nice if had another use like you could choose to hand over Sephiroth the clear materia or the black materia and depending on the choice you get different endings / key events.
4:24 That’s not Sephiroth my guy. The vid you got going here when you’re claiming Sephiroth doesn’t really know much of anything at this point is actually of Jenova taking Sephy’s form. It’s not Sephiroth. While Sephiroth and Cloud have a looser relation at this point, Sephy def remembers that Cloud was the one who killed him in Nibelheim. The only times you see Sephiroth (before the bottom of the Northern Crater) is when he hijacks the minds of the black cloaked figures and uses them from a distance in his image, hence their names as “Sephiroth clones”
I mean you're sort of right, it is Jenova's body.
BUT, it's Sephiroth's will, it's him the whole game.
At this early stage he doesn't recognise Cloud as he's only really seen Cloud once and doesn't view him as very important.
Also, Cloud is in "Zack Mode" which is something Sephiroth has never seen, so again, makes him wonder "Who are you?"
And finally, while this is a Jenova body and Sephiroth's will, Sephiroth may not have figured out how to properly puppet it yet as he's not long liberated it from the Shinra building.
Many possibilities as to why Sephiroth doesn't immediately recognise Cloud, but it IS Sephiroth's will.
@ That’s where we disagree and need some clarification. I personally believe that in this particular case, it’s Sephiroth’s will only in the sense that it’s what he wants carried out. It’s still not him actually carrying it out. In fact, he and Jenova end up having the same goals in the end anyway. I implore you to follow this thread of thought I bring you here, and hope you tell me what you think about it afterwords.
Once Sephiroth starts his return after dying in Nibelheim, he rattles the body of Jenova that’s being kept in the Shinra Headquarters. Having part/half of his being of her, he can communicate with her and reactivate her. Her body breaks free in parts that can move individually of their own accord, no different to what and how we’ve seen movies like “The Thing” portray Eldritch horrors when a body part of theirs is severed. Throughout the game, there are 3 portions of Jenova we meet. After you do, you fight them, but not before certain story elements occur. The one you brought here where we meet a piece of her on the ship is the first meeting. I believe she is working more as Sephiroth’s minion here than as his puppet per se, but I’ll continue to explain more of this later. Same thing when you meet her second part, the one that kills Aeris. It is Jenova that is speaking to Cloud after the battle when she called him a “puppet”, not Sephiroth. That’s objectively true and has no basis for refuting. And the last time you meet a piece of her is in the Whirlwind Maze when Sephiroth is almost on his way to full Ascension in the crystalized mako.
I still believe Sephiroth has the ability to take Jenova’s power (shapeshifting) and use it for himself, but through Gaia’s lifeforms that have had cells of Jenova placed within them (again, Sephiroth clones). He was made of her, after all. At the core/crux of this view, I believe, is how Jenova works within AND outside of lifeforms on Gaia. With her body parts, she is the one moving those, IN ACCORDANCE to Sephiroth’s will (not actually Sephiroth himself), because he has essentially taken up her will to destroy the planet and siphon its energy. She essentially brought him to madness and got him to want the same thing as her and their goals are actually one in the same here- Sephy didn’t really come up with that idea first, it’s the instinctual purpose of the parasitic Jenova. So for Jenova, following Sephiroth is all she can do at this point, after being sealed by the Cetra and stripped of her agency for thousands of years and held away at Shinra Headquarters. It’s Sephiroth that unleashed her from these shackles to begin with. And again, where Sephiroth is special and has control is of those who have both lifeforms within him, humans with Jenova cells, just like himself. He is what Jenova nor regular humans could ever be, the perfectly synthesized fusion between the terrestrial and the extraterrestrial. Not even Jenova could hijack minds for a moment, almost as a form of teleportation in a sense, then decide to disappear back into the darkness. What she would do was infect, take over, and spread, much like a disease, but never could she mind warp the way Sephiroth can during the game. And that’s exactly how her cells react when placed in smaller quantities inside Gaian lifeforms (as opposed to her larger body parts we meet), they infect and break the minds of psyches during their moments of weakness with pure madness, creating the vessels that only Sephiroth can hijack and manipulate to do their bidding.
Jenova is still in play here, but she NEEDS Sephiroth. He is the clear lead yes, but she is not a complete non-factor. Again, what’s not disputable is the fact that she actually has a line of dialogue in the main game right after they try to get Cloud to believe that he can’t have feelings/emotions after Aerith was killed, almost as if to “chime in” at the end and show that she’s here. All Jenova’s parts actually do come back together for the theorized reunion to be proven true and you do actually fight her in the end before you even fight Bizarro Sephiroth and Safer Sephiroth.
When you look at the details laid out in this amazingly written piece of interactive literature, it’s hard not to see why it’s one of the best pieces of media out there to digest, experience, and frankly adore.
The clear materia is a red-herring....it doesn't physically exist. It is being used at the end in the same manner as Cloud's potential "imagining" of aerith and the rift. Further evidence to this is that the entire exchange of materia takes place within Cloud's unconscious/subconscious mind during the sleeping forest.
Along this same line of thought is that this materia is a reference to the same yellowish one we saw during the end of FF7 OG as cloud goes into his subconscious to fight sephiroth. Our meteor-esque trip at the end of OG goes outward from "core" of the planet back to the surface, which appears void and barren except for some watery effects. The entire premise of what the edge of creation is in both OG and the Trilogy is summed up by the hollow materia as a depiction of what Cloud's mind wants....either to create or leave gaia desolate.
These two meta-ideas can be packaged it into a third, more complex guess:
As mentioned in a previous video of mine, our clear materia is "midgar" a.k.a the people's materia. A clue to this is the depictions of divine sanctuaries throughout rebirth. Every location on gaia has a summon materia associated with a diety. So too could midgar, specifically the church, an overt sanctuary that reflects the hopes and salvation of people. I'll leave the thought at that --- its up to each individual as to whether their hope is in Cloud, Aerith, Zack or the collective unconscious of humanity.
Those are all great ideas, but I still think the clear materia will be part of the solution. The wildcard, of course is Zack. The question is, who saved him? Was it really Aerith or Minerva (or Angeal allowed by Minerva to intervene as a way of balancing the scales of fate since Sephiroth has so much power now). I think Zack's part will exponentially increase in part 3 and we will see a Aerith and Zack reunion.
The more poetic thing would be Zack seeing Minerva and thinking it's Aerith.
@wmen48 I think Minerva may end up using Aerith as an avatar
Or was it the white Whispers controlled by the Ancients in the Lifestream that saved him? I would really like to see a reunion of Aerith and Zack as well, in another world/in the Lifestream.
I'm with you on all these points but I'm still of the opinion that there won't be a significant reunion between Zack and Aerith in part 3. Currently I don't believe it was Aerith who saved Zack until more evidence comes to light. For now I think it was some other force that influenced those Gray Whispers to go to off course. Either the planet/Minerva and Angeal definitely had a hand in turning them away as evidenced by the white feather that falls down at the start of Rebirth.
@jesse1381 We have no other fotce at hand atm. And while it could be cool, it is stated in a book that Aerith Has the same powers as Sephiroth in the lifestream(making avatars and healing instead of geostigma).
If you genied all of Sephiroth/Jenova into a Poke-materia, it'd have to turn black, wouldn't it? Then you'd have freakin' two.
I'm still of the opinion Floyd's memories of Sephiroth are going to be transferred into the clear materia and destroyed then fused and destroyed with the black Materia. In other words, who knows?
Who the hell is Floyd?
@@jacksonjack7838 Ah-Haha! You don't know Fast Fingers Flyod who never proof reads for auto-incorrects before he posts? Surely you've met him a time or two.
I was thinking that it could be just the holy materia, but also could be used to link the separated worlds back together to create one singular time line, where sephiroth will be defeated and permanently gone. This way, he cannot keep jumping around the worlds through the lifestream after being defeated. Maybe that they can bring the world's together at the end of the third remake and have zack be a part of the group and then they can all stand together in one last battle and aerith will be there too. Then they can break the materia, or something of the like, after sephiroth is defeated in the combined worlds. Then the aerith death scene will be more of a send off like at the end of advent children when her and zack return to the life stream. Just my little idea.
Cait Sith describes it as a “tearful farewell” in loveless.
I think he was describing this.
One thing I find really silly in all these theories is the hyperfixation on Cloud. Cloud is certainly important in FF7, but he is not the end-all force in the fight against Sephiroth. Contrary to popular belief, Cloud alone did not defeat Sephiroth in FF7. The entire team had to defeat Sephiroth's actual bodies, and then Cloud only defeated Sephiroth's influence in his mind. Cloud didn't beat Sephiroth in a real one on one battle. Even in Advent Children, Cloud BARELY got Sephiroth thanks to Sephiroth dropping his guard due to assuming Cloud had no strength left.
So the Clear Materia is likely not going to be linked to Cloud only. Cloud, by himself, really isn't particularly impressive as an individual. As a person he is HEAVILY dependent on his friends, which I think is the main reason he was entrusted with the Clear Materia. It is because Cloud is the connection point of the team, he is the leader. At the end of FF7, Cloud asks the team to return to their loved ones and find a deep motivation to risk their lives in the fight against Sephiroth. He basically tells them all to find that hope or that dream that they will lay their lives down for. And this is what I think will be critical for the Clear Materia. Part 3 will take this moment from the end of FF7 and make it a much more important event, where the entire party will infuse their hopes and dreams into the Clear Materia and it will become the Holy Materia of their Beagle world.
This will tie back in with the idea that there are multiple Black Materia. Aerith suggests as much when she says the one that they found at the Temple was "a fake". It apparently was not the real treasure that Sephiroth was seeking, but was merely a key to what he called "the true counterpart hidden between worlds". He may be seeking a greater version of the Black Materia. Perhaps one that he will acquire by way of uniting/fusing multiple Black Materia that he will acquire from various worlds. If this were the case, then it would make sense that Aerith and the Planet would need multiple Holy Materia to counteract Sephiroth's plan.
Cloud is impressive tho. What do you mean? When cloud was a normal human he overpowered sephiroth and threw him into the reactor.
The final battle where he removes sephiroth INFLUENCE from his mind using his unique materia is when the clear materia would play a role.
Cloud's true strength.