Mariko being Operation Crimson Sky was a masterstroke. Everyone expected a huge army, meanwhile he sends one woman with one request that left Ishido with no possible way out without losing support. And with her death, his treachery is revealed and Toranaga becomes the liberator of Osaka. Also note how she calls herself Mariko Akechi at the end. Renouncing her husband once and for all as she goes beyond his reach forever.
It's gonna be hilarious when the finale reveals Mariko is the secret boss to Ishidi and Ochiba and this was a long con to draw out Toranaga and defeat him by a lovestruck puppet. All is revealed in the series finale epilogue, one year later, with Black throne finally haven gotten a trained sea crew (puhlease, don't go there) ready to sail him to England when he receives a letter saying in Japanese, "Bon voyage, from your eternal Gganbu, M." 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Absolutely love it when reactors let these shocking moments submerge in a sea of silence. Absence of sound and motion. Empty spaces in time... like a leafless branch in Spring, reminds us how beautiful blossoming flowers once were. Beauty worth fighting for. Lead the great houses to paradise!
The death poem of the real Hosokawa Gracia, who Mariko is based upon, goes Only by knowing when to fall Do flowers become flowers And people become people 🥹
I can't wait to now see "From the producers of Shogun" being the one big badge of honor stamped on any and all content for the next 5 years. And it will be deserved
@@alcor4670I have read Shogun maybe 20 times since I was a kid but I never read Clavell's other novels, because I always liked books in a pre-modern (think cars, phones, and electricity) setting. It always seemed the other novels were post industrial and I wasn't into that st the time. That being said, is Gai-jin, King Rat, and Noble House worth running out to get?
The Shinobi were sent to "take possession" of Mariko. Alive and unharmed. And that included not allowing her to harm herself. Her death destroys Ishido's honor, integrity, and credibility. Because, as one commenter has been putting it, "She is "totally not a prisoner "." If she dies, or Ishido actively holds her hostage, Toranaga wins. Ishido will lose all his supporters. If the Shinobi "kidnap" her, it is like the previous times "bandits" attacked people. He is blameless. Her guards failed to protect her. He has no reason to have her under guard. She is "totally not a prisoner".....
I have one small doubt. Couldn’t Ishido still say it was all bandits doing and that he had nothing to do with it (Just like he would have said if Mariko would have been kidnapped alive )
@@mananjain1699 He need her into his custody alive, if she died than many daimyo support will fade away from him. So happened in real life even how Gracia died become turning point Tokugawa wins other lord support.
I noticed your curious looks when Mariko tied the belt around her legs before her seppuku attempt. Historically accurate- women who committed seppuku would tie their legs so they wouldn't fall spread eagle and thus give them an undignified death pose
The term 'seppuku' (literally meaning 'cutting the belly') is not used for the methods of suicide employed by women, which involve stabbing the chest or throat. The ritual of cutting the belly was a ceremony permitted only for samurai men. The reason for cutting the belly is based on the belief that the human abdomen houses the soul and affections, and it was done to demonstrate sincerity and innocence by showing one's insides.Members of the samurai class, regardless of gender, were taught the etiquette of deciding their own fate and ending their lives from childhood.
Women didn't perform seppuku and it was never mandated as a punishment for women. Typically, when a woman chose to end her life voluntarily, she would cut her throat with a small blade. Nonetheless, the 8th-century chronicle ‘Harima no kuni Fudoki’ mention that the earliest instances of seppuku were by women. Historicaly, three women have performed seppuku, and two of them have forcefully thrown their intestines in an act of intense anger and disdain. It was a powerful protest and declaration of their convictions.
@@anthtan From what I heard from people I know they love it and enjoy the fact westerners are interested in their culture/history but some worry we may think it's real events and people lol
@@anthtan This drama has been well-received in Japan for its detailed depiction of Japanese culture. I was impressed by the attention to detail, such as Toranaga's traditional Japanese swimming style in the scene where he swims with Anjin, and the hanging scrolls and flowers in the tea ceremony between Mariko and Buntaro.
The life of Hosokawa Gracia, the model for Mariko, were conveyed to Europe by the Jesuits and became widely known through printed materials (although quite embellished for missionary purposes). In 1698, the Jesuit opera about her life was performed in Vienna. It seems that even Marie Antoinette, as a child, was impressed by the life of Gracia after seeing this opera. Both born into nobility yet tossed by the times, Gracia married Hosokawa Tadaoki at the age of 15, while Marie married Louis XVI at the age of 14. Both were subsequently swept up in major political upheavals, yet in adversity, they bravely protected their children, maintained their dignity, and, curiously, both also ended their lives at the age of 37.
*Hosokawa Gracia (1563 - 25th of August 1600)* Mariko-sama is based on this unparalleled historical woman. And here is her last written words. Her death poem: 散りぬべき 時知りてこそ 世の中の 花も花なれ 人も人なれ _Only by knowing when to fall_ _Do flowers become flowers_ _And people become people_ *Hosokawa Gracia walked the short road to perfection - short, but not easy. She died when she was only 37 years old.* _In her life, she endured burdens no one should have to bear - treachery destroyed her family, her husband was mentally and physically abusive, and she spent years in hiding for fear of death. Yet she emerged from these pressures as a diamond. I compare her to a gem, first, because her birth name, Tama, can mean stone, gem, or pearl, but second because of all the different sides or faces that composed her being, sides offering us different perspectives from which to view her life. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but no matter which of Gracia’s faces we choose to analyze, that of a samurai, a proto-feminist, a wife, a mother, or a Christian, they are all beautiful._
I have to stop here and come back AFTER I’ve seen it. That was not soda, that was sizzurp and I have to wait for my other half to get home before I can watch it.
@@user-dfgcxxsdfd4rtThere are various theories about the cause of Hosokawa Gracia's death, but the most prevalent in Japan is that she had her retainer, Ogasawara Hidekiyo, kill her because suicide is prohibited in Christianity. He then set the house on fire to ensure that no bodies remained, before committing suicide himself.
I was like "Why are they rooting for the Shinobi?" And then I realized you guys thought it was Toranaga's plan. Great reaction fellas, you never disappoint!
All I could think of was SpongeBob and Patrick when they were laughing and chanting crimson sky. 😂😂😂😂😂 Their reaction when it clicked what was really going on was priceless. 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Excellent point about the pacing! It happened so fast and boom, right to a black screen. It was masterful. So I'll add a few things that may have escaped you in the ninja scene. Yabu betrayed them, but not to kill Mariko. Ichido couldn't do that. The plan seems to have been let the shinobi kill her retinue and then capture and confine her. The look on Yabu's face when she says no, I can't go to the gate, I can't risk being captured says it all. Also, in the dojo, Mariko knew. It was either her being killed or her escaping. They couldn't blow the door and capture her. She saw the chance for her to be killed and for it to be on Ishido. I love how she figures it out and does it faster than we can even put it together. This is easily the best show of the year, but for me, possibly my favorite of all time. I can't look at anything else and find something this intense and well done. It's up there among the best anyway. All the Emmys!
Mariko did whats called a 'big brain' move. They were only trying to abduct her. If she's abducted, she can't kill herself or leave. She knew if she died in this attack, she not only saves her own soul from damnation from suicide but also frees all the hostages and discredits Ishido as she is a noblewoman who was 'totally not a hostage' And Father dome-head drops his soundcloud rap and historically is the one who buries her christianly Also Mariko's death was so poetic cos she tried to die by ice but died by fire but not by her own hand. John Wick also did the 'shoot where the head should be' move Poetry also cos she died by fire when she tried by ice in flashback
Read somewhere that the poem she recited in front of Ishido was actually bad, but Ishido thought it was good because he doesn't know any better. He's lowborn and didn't have a higher education, which Mariko basically pointed out in front of everyone.
I loved that you guys noted that Father Alvito does care about Mariko. The Church may have its designs, but I believe he does wish to be able to say a proper Mass for her. I think he's an overall good person. By the way, the actor did not have to cut his hair. Almost everyone in the cast are wearing wigs.
Alvito and Mariko are the two true believers among the Catholic characters in this story. Giving Alvito these moments in this episode was an unexpected nice touch.
Trivia Mariko's descendants married into the imperial family and gave birth to the emperor. Therefore, the current Emperor of Japan is a descendant of Mariko. （mariko＝Hosokawa Gracia）
The strength that Japanese people most admire is not strength against external pressure, but strength towards oneself. If you don't understand the deep psychology of the Japanese people, this story will seem like a mere outrage.
R.I.P to my favorite character Mariko. It's very important to the Japanese in this story 'how they die'- taking one's fate into one's own hand. She created an epic story and powerful catalyst for change in Japan with her death. Flowers are only flowers because they fall.
During the intro when talking about Crimson Sky, Adam said, “The plan is in motion”…I thought he said, “The plan’s emotion”…and I thought ….you have no idea…
When I watched this episode. I took a break just after Blackthorn and Mariko have the fade to black moment. Then I had the horrible "Wait, what was the favor? WHAT WAS THE FAVOR!" This show deserves all the awards. Even the ones it does not qualify for, like best musical.
i watched this when it came out at like 1 am tuesday morning… not a good idea. i was HEARTBROKEN and it lingered in my dreams; bummed me out the entire day. oh mariko 🥺💔
My favirite scean "I,Mariko Akechi, A daughter of Jinsai. I'm a descendant of the Akechi family, highest-ranking Samurai family has been in existence for over 1000 years. " Standing up in that place means the highest ranking person and the act of turning her back signifies Mariko is the highest atatus. Eventually, Mariko's death causes 90,000 soldiers all over Japan to rally to Toranaga. It'a true story. Mariko’s story continues・・・
And because she said that in front of everyone, they all knew and respected her. It wasn’t just about her father’s “betrayal;” her family had centuries of nobility in Japan. That was an assassination, and Ishido is gonna pay for that. Should have let her go when she asked nicely. lol 🤷🏾♂️
To be fair to you guys, the level of confusion at the end I think was largely the point. Yabushige's character has been on the fence the whole time, and we finally saw the uncertainty that betrayal brings. HOWEVER...... Toronaga is a master chess player. He's got his opponent in 'check' sending Mariko like this, and I'm sure he recognized the limited number of options Ishido would have to get himself out... so I'm wondering if he can't have foreseen what would happen.... And whether it even matters in the overall scheme of things that it was Yabushige who unlocked the gate. It was an inevitability. (yes- I know she was supposed to be kidnapped, but Toronaga recognizes Mariko's integrity and it's foreseeable that she would not allow herself to be taken alive) Toronaga has the 'Check-Mate' now. Everyone played their part to get him there. Even the 'betrayal' was just another predictable move from the goshawk 🤔 Can't wait to find out how this all plays out next week
Great reaction, guys. Mariko did outplay Ishido in her final act yet again, though. He was trying to kidnap and hold her through force. Wether he claims she left or decided to stay and confine herself, by sacrificing herself it will be known she was attacked and killed. Which is even worse than the other two original outcomes.
Bruh 😂, the depth of how much I was laughing when you guys were rooting for and cheering on the bad guys cannot be expressed in text. It was hilarious 🤣
I'm old and watched the original on TV back when so I knew who would die but man did they do a great switcheroo here. Lure everybody into feeling safe and then five minutes later literally bang.
Well, when she said "Let's go to the storeroom with the sturdy door", I immediately said out loud "No! Don't go anywhere with a heavy door!" I rememoried.
This episode was the crescendo of the series. Mariko played her part and single handedly undermined Ishibo's authority. She, by example, reminded the leaders to behave like Free Samurais. I do not expect much in the next episode. I expect forces of the five leader gather, and most will switch alliance and side with Toronaga. So he becomes the Shogun.
Non book reader theory: What if they were Toronaga AND Ishidos men lol Yabushige kills the guards and you see the grappling hooks Then he walks a ways away to completely separate side gate and let's people in But on re-watch, yabushige attempts to get the group of John and Mariko to go to the Gate NOT the store house they say they're going to Someone says "we should go to the store house, it has thick doors and we'll be safe" And yabushige says "No! We have to get to the gate!"
For most of her life she bore a stain of dishonor because of her father. But now she'll be a hero and will be remembered with respect. Mariko as Crimson Sky was brilliant.
As a longtime fan of the book and having seen the 1980 miniseries, can I say I am loving the reactions from people new to the story. This was the big moment we knew was coming, and seeing how it affects people takes me back to how it hit me all those years ago. This show got it right and then some.
this show is the show of the year, if not the past few years. The acting from Sakai is amazing. and her sacrifice was not wanting to die per see, they were there to take her away and give Ishido pausable deniability. but by dying she has dealt Ishido a crippling blow,, he can be accused of being unable to protect his "guests" or maintain the safety of the heir himself, and the lords, seeing that their families might just die anyway are emboldened to rebel. not to mention this might have just killed any chance for the marriage to occur. Ishido is finished, the only thing that remains is for him to be crushed in battle by Toranaga for the defeat to be absolute, and, without the other lords, Ishido can't win. Superb.
13:36, if you watch this scene in slo-mo you can see Mariko’s guard cut off the sword hand fingers of the first Ishido guard before going to the second guard. I didn’t even think to check this out until a commenter in another video pointed this out. To include a detail so fine that you can only practically see it while watching that one scene in slow motion shows a peerless devotion to the craft and storytelling. Wow.
As much as we all wanted Crimson Sky to be a final battle, Crimson Sky is the name of a red rose, symbolizing deep love, and grief. Mariko is the Crimson Sky.
I also was confused and thought the assassins were sent by Torunaga, and then remembered the conversation where the guy had to do one favor for Ishido first.
The boys: Yeah! Marijo has gamed the system. No win situation for Ishido. Strut that arrow filled runway, mama. She's got HIM boxed in! Yeah! 🤣🤣🤣 15 minutes later ... The boys: NNNOOOOOO!!! 😱😱😱😱😱
It’s not that she wanted to die. She was performing her duty because the last card to be played was her dying by the hands of her enemies. They will now be blamed and there will be an uprising or the city high families will join Toranaga. I think that’s what Crimson Sky is all about. To directly assault the city would never work. But to turn the city into an ally and embrace the victim who can actually bring peace means a sure victory. In the previous episode they linked Hirumatsu’s act with Toranaga’s reveal to Mariko. And when she realized what really happened, he asked her if now SHE was ready to do her duty. Her mission was to put them in a corner but the last option was her actual death. They stopped her from killing herself, then wanted to kidnap her. But instead she out maneuvered them and made sure her blood was on their hands. This was brilliant. This show is one of the best things I’ve watched in years. And Anna Sawai better get an Emmy.
Having read the book, I felt so bad for you guys when you were celebrating Mariko's reprieve & not understanding the attack. :( It made your rollercoaster ride have all the more abrupt a fall/ending. ((HUGS))
As a huge fan of the book (though I haven't seen the show except through reactors), the emotional roller coaster of watching you guys watch it was wild. 😅 Your excitement at her confronting Ishido and planning to leave was ironic, cause I knew she wouldn't succeed. Your anxiety at her seppuku was amusing cause I knew they would stop her at the last minute. But your elation and relief at her living felt tragic, cause I knew she wasn't making it out of this episode alive.😅 The Crimson Sky confusion and realization of Yabu's betrayal was just icing on the cake.😁 Anyway, Mariko was a G. Raise a glass.🍺 Great reaction, guys!
I read Shogun in 1977 while stationed in Japan. Mariko's death DECIMATED me. The dual revelation that she got what she wanted - oblivion - and that SHE was Crimson Sky just left me stunned for days. Like any film, this series has to take liberties, but for the vast majority of it, it is spot-on, pristine, magical story telling. If Anna Sawai doesn't get an Emmy, it will be a travesty.
Literally every reactor thought that the scene at the end was crimson sky. I think the actor did such a good job of making Yabushige likable that when he CLEARLY betrays them all, people trick themselves into thinking it is them killing Ishido. Such a gut punch when you realize that instead he helped kill Mariko.
Some reactors thought so. However it you paid attention it was clear from the start that letting in the shinobi was the favor Yabushige owed to Ishido for sparing his live. It was planted in Ishido's mind when Ochiba pointed out the dilemma.
To be fair in the Shogun Ep 9 reactions I’ve watch most people were totally duped by Yabushige & the shinobi. Everyone thought it was Toranag’s doing to get to Ishido & not a betrayal meant for Mariko, Blackthorne, et al. That’s one of the many brilliant facets of this incredible show. There’s so much intrigue, subterfuge & stratagems happening that it takes a very sharp eye to figure out all the machinations & intricate moves that are being done.
I'm watching reactions as my recap / pre-game before the finale, and I'm 2-for-2 with people not realizing the ninjas were bad guys. It doesn't make me want to razz you guys; it just makes me feel like a very special boy for catching things when I saw it myself! B-)
The color of the sky at dusk when Mariko tried to commit suicide was The Crimson Sky. It would be great if Mariko were still alive, but the historical facts are as follows. Mitsunari Ishida (Ishido in SHOGUN), who was an enemy of Ieyasu(Toranaga in SHOGUN), tried to take Garasha Hosokawa (Mariko Toda in SHOGUN) hostage at Tamatsukuri's Hosokawa mansion in Osaka, but Garasha refused. The next day, Mitsunari went out to use his force and had his soldiers surround the mansion. When the vassals told Garasha everything, Garasha prayed a little, then gathered all the maids and ladies in the mansion and said, ``As my husband has commanded, I alone want to die,'' and led them outside. . Later, as suicide is prohibited in Christianity, the chief retainer, Hidekiyo Ogasawara (Shosai), intervened with Garasha and committed suicide by setting explosives in the mansion and setting it on fire so that no body would be left behind. Her death haiku was, ``Only when you know when it is time to scatter can flowers in this world become flowers and people become people.'' A few hours after her death, Father Niecchi Sordi Organtino visited the burnt remains of the Hosokawa mansion, picked up Garasha's bones, and buried them in the Christian cemetery in Sakai. Ishido must have tried to imprison Mariko somewhere. Rather than killing Mariko in the video, he was trying to kidnap her. If he kills Mariko, he will make enemies and divide his allies. That is Toranaga's aim. Before the full-scale battle begins, the outcome of the Battle of Sekigahara will be decided by how many daimyo join your side.
I wonder if there’s something in the uncut Patreon version that explains why Adam did a low key Jeff Goldblum impression while delivering the “walk & talk/Aaron Sorkin” joke? Don’t get me wrong, I loved it. It just came from way out of left field is all. 😂
A part of me still wonders if Toranaga himself sent the shinobi. He granted Mariko's wish for death by having her pin the sacrifice on Ishido's "treachery". She wasn't Crimson Sky, but was the catalyst. At least that's a theory floatin around in my head. Guess Ill see on Tuesday.
Thank you. This was a great reaction. Just want to comment on why this episode was titled "Crimson Sky". That is because Crimson Sky is a who not a what. Mariko was Crimson Sky. What she accomplished was the unification of the most powerful lords for Toranaga. There is only one person smarter than Mariko and that is Toranaga. Toranaga and Mariko have been planning this for a long, long time. Can you imagine the conversations that Toranaga and Mariko had. Her choosing a Christian lord as a second was absolute genius not only about his religion but of the hypocrisies being taught to her son. This is Buntaro's son. What do you think he will do? The women are the heroes of this series. Thank you again.
Mariko was the Crimson Sky. She was sent there for that purpose. Leave Osaka or die trying. Either way, it causes ripples among the regents. It's definitely a brilliant chess move, and she dies with honor.
Anna Sawai deserves all of the awards for her role as Mariko! So subtle and powerful!
Yeah!
Mariko being Operation Crimson Sky was a masterstroke. Everyone expected a huge army, meanwhile he sends one woman with one request that left Ishido with no possible way out without losing support. And with her death, his treachery is revealed and Toranaga becomes the liberator of Osaka.
Also note how she calls herself Mariko Akechi at the end. Renouncing her husband once and for all as she goes beyond his reach forever.
Jay's soul leaving his body for a good 50 seconds is just so sweet and wonderful. Yeah, we're there too. You are not alone. It's ok.
It's gonna be hilarious when the finale reveals Mariko is the secret boss to Ishidi and Ochiba and this was a long con to draw out Toranaga and defeat him by a lovestruck puppet.
All is revealed in the series finale epilogue, one year later, with Black throne finally haven gotten a trained sea crew (puhlease, don't go there) ready to sail him to England when he receives a letter saying in Japanese, "Bon voyage, from your eternal Gganbu, M." 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Absolutely love it when reactors let these shocking moments submerge in a sea of silence. Absence of sound and motion. Empty spaces in time... like a leafless branch in Spring, reminds us how beautiful blossoming flowers once were. Beauty worth fighting for. Lead the great houses to paradise!
Great timing with that subscribe button during that round of silence as well 🤣
The death poem of the real Hosokawa Gracia, who Mariko is based upon, goes
Only by knowing when to fall
Do flowers become flowers
And people become people
🥹
“You fool! As if it matters how a man falls down.' 'When the fall's all that's left, it matters a great deal.'"
@@ohnhai You too. Cool your head. ( joj)
So beautiful, thanks for sharing
@ohnhai the lion in winter. One of my favorites
I can't wait to now see "From the producers of Shogun" being the one big badge of honor stamped on any and all content for the next 5 years.
And it will be deserved
Hopefully Hiroyuki Sanada would still be part of that production team. And hopefully that next project would be Gai-jin.
Really deserved!
@@alcor4670I have read Shogun maybe 20 times since I was a kid but I never read Clavell's other novels, because I always liked books in a pre-modern (think cars, phones, and electricity) setting. It always seemed the other novels were post industrial and I wasn't into that st the time. That being said, is Gai-jin, King Rat, and Noble House worth running out to get?
@@alcor4670i hope he keeps making Japanese historical dramas after this! There's a huge market clearly.
The Shinobi were sent to "take possession" of Mariko. Alive and unharmed. And that included not allowing her to harm herself. Her death destroys Ishido's honor, integrity, and credibility.
Because, as one commenter has been putting it, "She is "totally not a prisoner "."
If she dies, or Ishido actively holds her hostage, Toranaga wins. Ishido will lose all his supporters.
If the Shinobi "kidnap" her, it is like the previous times "bandits" attacked people. He is blameless. Her guards failed to protect her. He has no reason to have her under guard. She is "totally not a prisoner".....
I have one small doubt. Couldn’t Ishido still say it was all bandits doing and that he had nothing to do with it (Just like he would have said if Mariko would have been kidnapped alive )
@@mananjain1699 No because it happened in his castle. The other guy who was killed was killed off premises so he had plausible deniability.
@@mananjain1699 He need her into his custody alive, if she died than many daimyo support will fade away from him. So happened in real life even how Gracia died become turning point Tokugawa wins other lord support.
I noticed your curious looks when Mariko tied the belt around her legs before her seppuku attempt. Historically accurate- women who committed seppuku would tie their legs so they wouldn't fall spread eagle and thus give them an undignified death pose
Oh thank you. I was wondering about that.
The term 'seppuku' (literally meaning 'cutting the belly') is not used for the methods of suicide employed by women, which involve stabbing the chest or throat. The ritual of cutting the belly was a ceremony permitted only for samurai men. The reason for cutting the belly is based on the belief that the human abdomen houses the soul and affections, and it was done to demonstrate sincerity and innocence by showing one's insides.Members of the samurai class, regardless of gender, were taught the etiquette of deciding their own fate and ending their lives from childhood.
Women didn't perform seppuku and it was never mandated as a punishment for women. Typically, when a woman chose to end her life voluntarily, she would cut her throat with a small blade.
Nonetheless, the 8th-century chronicle ‘Harima no kuni Fudoki’ mention that the earliest instances of seppuku were by women. Historicaly, three women have performed seppuku, and two of them have forcefully thrown their intestines in an act of intense anger and disdain. It was a powerful protest and declaration of their convictions.
@@shirankedo-ib8uv whoa, brutally badass.
I give you credit for not editing out such a large misunderstanding of what was going on.
Anna Sawai deserves an Emmy for this episode alone.... Full Stop
Certainly!
I had the exact same reaction. I verbally yelled "noooo!"...man
彼女が名誉ある死を遂げる事で、父親や息子も立派であると褒め称えられる
さすが明智の娘であった、素晴らしいと
マリコは皆んなは人質なんだと示す為にも名誉の為にも絶対に捕まえられる訳にはいかなかった
そして最後に爆発から皆んなを守る為に盾になった
この感覚は日本人でないと分からないのかもしれない
名誉は自分の為ではなく、愛する家族や仲間の為に得ようとする
Thank you for your well written comment, I hope to see more series in Japanese historical settings. Best TV series in years! Love from Sweden.
What is the reception of the show in Japan itself?
@@anthtan From what I heard from people I know they love it and enjoy the fact westerners are interested in their culture/history but some worry we may think it's real events and people lol
@@anthtan This drama has been well-received in Japan for its detailed depiction of Japanese culture. I was impressed by the attention to detail, such as Toranaga's traditional Japanese swimming style in the scene where he swims with Anjin, and the hanging scrolls and flowers in the tea ceremony between Mariko and Buntaro.
Don't kick yourselves too hard Jake and Adam. For those last moments, we thought it was Crimson Sky too.😂
The life of Hosokawa Gracia, the model for Mariko, were conveyed to Europe by the Jesuits and became widely known through printed materials (although quite embellished for missionary purposes). In 1698, the Jesuit opera about her life was performed in Vienna. It seems that even Marie Antoinette, as a child, was impressed by the life of Gracia after seeing this opera. Both born into nobility yet tossed by the times, Gracia married Hosokawa Tadaoki at the age of 15, while Marie married Louis XVI at the age of 14. Both were subsequently swept up in major political upheavals, yet in adversity, they bravely protected their children, maintained their dignity, and, curiously, both also ended their lives at the age of 37.
*Hosokawa Gracia (1563 - 25th of August 1600)*
Mariko-sama is based on this unparalleled historical woman.
And here is her last written words.
Her death poem:
散りぬべき 時知りてこそ
世の中の
花も花なれ 人も人なれ
_Only by knowing when to fall_
_Do flowers become flowers_
_And people become people_
*Hosokawa Gracia walked the short road to perfection - short, but not easy. She died when she was only 37 years old.*
_In her life, she endured burdens no one should have to bear - treachery destroyed her family, her husband was mentally and physically abusive, and she spent years in hiding for fear of death. Yet she emerged from these pressures as a diamond. I compare her to a gem, first, because her birth name, Tama, can mean stone, gem, or pearl, but second because of all the different sides or faces that composed her being, sides offering us different perspectives from which to view her life. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but no matter which of Gracia’s faces we choose to analyze, that of a samurai, a proto-feminist, a wife, a mother, or a Christian, they are all beautiful._
cool thank you so much for the true history.
Garasha Hosokawa, who was the model for Mariko, actually committed suicide due to a bomb explosion😢
@@user-dfgcxxsdfd4rt History is crazy sometimes.
I have to stop here and come back AFTER I’ve seen it.
That was not soda, that was sizzurp and I have to wait for my other half to get home before I can watch it.
@@user-dfgcxxsdfd4rtThere are various theories about the cause of Hosokawa Gracia's death, but the most prevalent in Japan is that she had her retainer, Ogasawara Hidekiyo, kill her because suicide is prohibited in Christianity. He then set the house on fire to ensure that no bodies remained, before committing suicide himself.
the little celebration after the sepukku interruption was painful 🤣
For the last two days I wander around TH-cam watching reactions to this episode. And yours is one of the greatest.
I was like "Why are they rooting for the Shinobi?" And then I realized you guys thought it was Toranaga's plan. Great reaction fellas, you never disappoint!
😂😂😂😂
Not gonna lie... I thought the same thing at first. I was confused for a moment when they went after her.
yabushige did his job too well. tricked many reacters that the ninja attack was crimson sky. 😅
The way you guys were rooting for those Ninjas had me rolling lmao
This episode ends with a BANG!
Nani?
TOO SOON
dynamite!
Somebody on another channel commented "we all have a little bit of Mariko on us now" and I have not been able to get past that.😂 Dark humor is dark
All I could think of was SpongeBob and Patrick when they were laughing and chanting crimson sky. 😂😂😂😂😂 Their reaction when it clicked what was really going on was priceless. 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Excellent point about the pacing! It happened so fast and boom, right to a black screen. It was masterful. So I'll add a few things that may have escaped you in the ninja scene. Yabu betrayed them, but not to kill Mariko. Ichido couldn't do that. The plan seems to have been let the shinobi kill her retinue and then capture and confine her. The look on Yabu's face when she says no, I can't go to the gate, I can't risk being captured says it all. Also, in the dojo, Mariko knew. It was either her being killed or her escaping. They couldn't blow the door and capture her. She saw the chance for her to be killed and for it to be on Ishido. I love how she figures it out and does it faster than we can even put it together. This is easily the best show of the year, but for me, possibly my favorite of all time. I can't look at anything else and find something this intense and well done. It's up there among the best anyway. All the Emmys!
This ep was so brutal, but so beautiful
The quality of this show is on another level .... absolute beauty.
Mariko did whats called a 'big brain' move. They were only trying to abduct her. If she's abducted, she can't kill herself or leave. She knew if she died in this attack, she not only saves her own soul from damnation from suicide but also frees all the hostages and discredits Ishido as she is a noblewoman who was 'totally not a hostage'
And Father dome-head drops his soundcloud rap and historically is the one who buries her christianly
Also Mariko's death was so poetic cos she tried to die by ice but died by fire but not by her own hand. John Wick also did the 'shoot where the head should be' move
Poetry also cos she died by fire when she tried by ice in flashback
There you are! I've literally started saying "totally not a hostage"!
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
@@scotthewitt258 *sits on smol cat butt and smiles* ☺️
Read somewhere that the poem she recited in front of Ishido was actually bad, but Ishido thought it was good because he doesn't know any better. He's lowborn and didn't have a higher education, which Mariko basically pointed out in front of everyone.
Ochiba means "Fallen Leaf". It was a dig at Ochiba, right in front of the whole room.
Oh man Jay, you were right with what you said on stream last night. This is definitely one of y’all’s finest reactions ever
I had the same reaction at the end, just sat there teary eyed in shock through the credits
I loved that you guys noted that Father Alvito does care about Mariko. The Church may have its designs, but I believe he does wish to be able to say a proper Mass for her. I think he's an overall good person.
By the way, the actor did not have to cut his hair. Almost everyone in the cast are wearing wigs.
Alvito and Mariko are the two true believers among the Catholic characters in this story. Giving Alvito these moments in this episode was an unexpected nice touch.
Trivia
Mariko's descendants married into the imperial family and gave birth to the emperor. Therefore, the current Emperor of Japan is a descendant of Mariko.
（mariko＝Hosokawa Gracia）
The strength that Japanese people most admire is not strength against external pressure, but strength towards oneself.
If you don't understand the deep psychology of the Japanese people, this story will seem like a mere outrage.
R.I.P to my favorite character Mariko. It's very important to the Japanese in this story 'how they die'- taking one's fate into one's own hand. She created an epic story and powerful catalyst for change in Japan with her death. Flowers are only flowers because they fall.
During the intro when talking about Crimson Sky, Adam said, “The plan is in motion”…I thought he said, “The plan’s emotion”…and I thought ….you have no idea…
I thought the same damn thing! The plan's emotion! And then I thought, oohh, poor guys.
@@MsJoniGibson I’m embarrassed to admit that I read the book 20yrs ago and forgot what happened to Mariko…so it hit me between the eyes as well.
This episode was the most intense emotional thing I’ve watched or read in a long time. What a fantastic character she was.
Note: Shinobi didn’t come to kill her, they wanted to capture Marilko… that’s why with her final act she sacrificed herself to mess up Ishidos
As soon as John asked Mariko to consider living for him, I was in shambles until the end of the episode. Anna Sawai deserves every award 😭
When I watched this episode. I took a break just after Blackthorn and Mariko have the fade to black moment. Then I had the horrible "Wait, what was the favor? WHAT WAS THE FAVOR!"
This show deserves all the awards. Even the ones it does not qualify for, like best musical.
13:37 (hehe leet) the reason one of the guards couldn’t draw his sword is Mariko’s samurai cut his fingers off before he could grab it.
29:06...the entirety of planet Earth had the same looks on their face. This show wreked - everyone.
i watched this when it came out at like 1 am tuesday morning… not a good idea. i was HEARTBROKEN and it lingered in my dreams; bummed me out the entire day. oh mariko 🥺💔
Fuji took my heart, Mariko stole my soul!
My favirite scean "I,Mariko Akechi, A daughter of Jinsai. I'm a descendant of the Akechi family, highest-ranking Samurai family has been in existence for over 1000 years. "
Standing up in that place means the highest ranking person and the act of turning her back signifies Mariko is the highest atatus. Eventually, Mariko's death causes 90,000 soldiers all over Japan to rally to Toranaga. It'a true story. Mariko’s story continues・・・
And because she said that in front of everyone, they all knew and respected her. It wasn’t just about her father’s “betrayal;” her family had centuries of nobility in Japan. That was an assassination, and Ishido is gonna pay for that.
Should have let her go when she asked nicely. lol 🤷🏾♂️
To be fair to you guys, the level of confusion at the end I think was largely the point. Yabushige's character has been on the fence the whole time, and we finally saw the uncertainty that betrayal brings.
HOWEVER...... Toronaga is a master chess player. He's got his opponent in 'check' sending Mariko like this, and I'm sure he recognized the limited number of options Ishido would have to get himself out... so I'm wondering if he can't have foreseen what would happen.... And whether it even matters in the overall scheme of things that it was Yabushige who unlocked the gate.
It was an inevitability. (yes- I know she was supposed to be kidnapped, but Toronaga recognizes Mariko's integrity and it's foreseeable that she would not allow herself to be taken alive)
Toronaga has the 'Check-Mate' now. Everyone played their part to get him there. Even the 'betrayal' was just another predictable move from the goshawk 🤔
Can't wait to find out how this all plays out next week
Great reaction, guys.
Mariko did outplay Ishido in her final act yet again, though.
He was trying to kidnap and hold her through force. Wether he claims she left or decided to stay and confine herself, by sacrificing herself it will be known she was attacked and killed.
Which is even worse than the other two original outcomes.
Shows have to have stakes in order for people to care, this is what the last Star wars movies didn't understand. People have to die.
They fucking Glenn’d us. They made us feel safe, and then they ripped her away from all of us 😢RIP Mariko, your death won’t be for nothing!
Bruh 😂, the depth of how much I was laughing when you guys were rooting for and cheering on the bad guys cannot be expressed in text. It was hilarious 🤣
I'm old and watched the original on TV back when so I knew who would die but man did they do a great switcheroo here. Lure everybody into feeling safe and then five minutes later literally bang.
Well, when she said "Let's go to the storeroom with the sturdy door", I immediately said out loud "No! Don't go anywhere with a heavy door!"
I rememoried.
This episode was the crescendo of the series. Mariko played her part and single handedly undermined Ishibo's authority. She, by example, reminded the leaders to behave like Free Samurais.
I do not expect much in the next episode. I expect forces of the five leader gather, and most will switch alliance and side with Toronaga. So he becomes the Shogun.
Non book reader theory:
What if they were Toronaga AND Ishidos men lol
Yabushige kills the guards and you see the grappling hooks
Then he walks a ways away to completely separate side gate and let's people in
But on re-watch, yabushige attempts to get the group of John and Mariko to go to the Gate NOT the store house they say they're going to
Someone says "we should go to the store house, it has thick doors and we'll be safe"
And yabushige says "No! We have to get to the gate!"
For most of her life she bore a stain of dishonor because of her father. But now she'll be a hero and will be remembered with respect. Mariko as Crimson Sky was brilliant.
I thought Jay really was on his way to the undertaker. The emotions will kill him. LOL
Yeh. When I saw the unadulterated relief you guys showed when Mariko was spared seppuku, I'm like...oh jeeze, they are about to be crushed.
As a longtime fan of the book and having seen the 1980 miniseries, can I say I am loving the reactions from people new to the story. This was the big moment we knew was coming, and seeing how it affects people takes me back to how it hit me all those years ago. This show got it right and then some.
This episode had me so stressed out and hit me in the feels.. god damn.. This show is too good..
Every episode of this show has become the best episode of TV each week. The absolute best!! The finale better be 2 hours long.
Y’all’s reaction to all the reversals in this episode were just 👌
this show is the show of the year, if not the past few years. The acting from Sakai is amazing.
and her sacrifice was not wanting to die per see, they were there to take her away and give Ishido pausable deniability. but by dying she has dealt Ishido a crippling blow,, he can be accused of being unable to protect his "guests" or maintain the safety of the heir himself, and the lords, seeing that their families might just die anyway are emboldened to rebel. not to mention this might have just killed any chance for the marriage to occur. Ishido is finished, the only thing that remains is for him to be crushed in battle by Toranaga for the defeat to be absolute, and, without the other lords, Ishido can't win.
Superb.
This is the 4th speechless reaction I've seen to this ending lol
They done good
13:36, if you watch this scene in slo-mo you can see Mariko’s guard cut off the sword hand fingers of the first Ishido guard before going to the second guard. I didn’t even think to check this out until a commenter in another video pointed this out.
To include a detail so fine that you can only practically see it while watching that one scene in slow motion shows a peerless devotion to the craft and storytelling. Wow.
We are witnessing perfect tv entertainment. This show should clear up at the award ceremonies.
Seeing the relieve on your faces when Mariko did not comitt sepuko, knowing what comes next, heartbreaking... and priceless 😂
Thanks so much, Jay and Adam! 🗾
fun to watch u guys. just like a roller coaster, buddy!
As much as we all wanted Crimson Sky to be a final battle, Crimson Sky is the name of a red rose, symbolizing deep love, and grief. Mariko is the Crimson Sky.
28:58 "Watch this, Lis. You can actually pinpoint the second when their hearts rip in half."
I was eating combos while watching this. I feel a bit attacked. Rooting for the bad guys was hilarious.
The peace of Osaka Castle broke. So Mariko and the samurai who died fighting to leave successfully broke the castle. It is a form of Crimson Sky...
Oh boy....here we go..
Haha, Adam with the Fallout butt jerky reference, and Jay completely missed it. 😂
Thank you catching that, we’ve taped up to eps 5 when we taped this Shogun react.
These two have always been kings of false assumptions
And proud of it…..? 🤔
"Enjoy the lobby!" lol
That made me laugh so hard.
I also was confused and thought the assassins were sent by Torunaga, and then remembered the conversation where the guy had to do one favor for Ishido first.
The boys: Yeah! Marijo has gamed the system. No win situation for Ishido. Strut that arrow filled runway, mama. She's got HIM boxed in! Yeah! 🤣🤣🤣
15 minutes later ...
The boys: NNNOOOOOO!!! 😱😱😱😱😱
It’s not that she wanted to die. She was performing her duty because the last card to be played was her dying by the hands of her enemies. They will now be blamed and there will be an uprising or the city high families will join Toranaga. I think that’s what Crimson Sky is all about. To directly assault the city would never work. But to turn the city into an ally and embrace the victim who can actually bring peace means a sure victory. In the previous episode they linked Hirumatsu’s act with Toranaga’s reveal to Mariko. And when she realized what really happened, he asked her if now SHE was ready to do her duty. Her mission was to put them in a corner but the last option was her actual death. They stopped her from killing herself, then wanted to kidnap her. But instead she out maneuvered them and made sure her blood was on their hands.
This was brilliant. This show is one of the best things I’ve watched in years. And Anna Sawai better get an Emmy.
Adam slapping his face like he is during the seppuku scene lead to an uncomfortable second-screen/audio experience
Oh my boys, my sweet sweet boys, I was waiting for that final reaction and you did Not disapoint. Thank you
Having read the book, I felt so bad for you guys when you were celebrating Mariko's reprieve & not understanding the attack. :( It made your rollercoaster ride have all the more abrupt a fall/ending. ((HUGS))
The Office gave us 27 seconds of silence whilst cruising for a boozing. You guys done 55 seconds. Well done!
As a huge fan of the book (though I haven't seen the show except through reactors), the emotional roller coaster of watching you guys watch it was wild. 😅 Your excitement at her confronting Ishido and planning to leave was ironic, cause I knew she wouldn't succeed. Your anxiety at her seppuku was amusing cause I knew they would stop her at the last minute. But your elation and relief at her living felt tragic, cause I knew she wasn't making it out of this episode alive.😅 The Crimson Sky confusion and realization of Yabu's betrayal was just icing on the cake.😁 Anyway, Mariko was a G. Raise a glass.🍺 Great reaction, guys!
You guys are hilarious, near the end when the shinobi attacks, your reactions are like sponge bob and patrick, until they realized they're f'ed up.
I read Shogun in 1977 while stationed in Japan. Mariko's death DECIMATED me. The dual revelation that she got what she wanted - oblivion - and that SHE was Crimson Sky just left me stunned for days. Like any film, this series has to take liberties, but for the vast majority of it, it is spot-on, pristine, magical story telling. If Anna Sawai doesn't get an Emmy, it will be a travesty.
Literally every reactor thought that the scene at the end was crimson sky. I think the actor did such a good job of making Yabushige likable that when he CLEARLY betrays them all, people trick themselves into thinking it is them killing Ishido. Such a gut punch when you realize that instead he helped kill Mariko.
Some reactors thought so. However it you paid attention it was clear from the start that letting in the shinobi was the favor Yabushige owed to Ishido for sparing his live. It was planted in Ishido's mind when Ochiba pointed out the dilemma.
In the last episode Lord T would not yield but in this episode the other Lord did. Love the comparison.
(1) Your reactions are FANTASTIC; and
(2) This show should be nominated for (and win) in just about every Emmy/SAG category, please and thank you!
To be fair in the Shogun Ep 9 reactions I’ve watch most people were totally duped by Yabushige & the shinobi. Everyone thought it was Toranag’s doing to get to Ishido & not a betrayal meant for Mariko, Blackthorne, et al. That’s one of the many brilliant facets of this incredible show. There’s so much intrigue, subterfuge & stratagems happening that it takes a very sharp eye to figure out all the machinations & intricate moves that are being done.
I'm watching reactions as my recap / pre-game before the finale, and I'm 2-for-2 with people not realizing the ninjas were bad guys. It doesn't make me want to razz you guys; it just makes me feel like a very special boy for catching things when I saw it myself! B-)
"WE'VE BEEN BOOZLED!" Happens to the best of us!
lol i even looked at Adam when she said "vengeance." The moment wasn't wasted LOL
The color of the sky at dusk when Mariko tried to commit suicide was The Crimson Sky.
It would be great if Mariko were still alive, but the historical facts are as follows.
Mitsunari Ishida (Ishido in SHOGUN), who was an enemy of Ieyasu(Toranaga in SHOGUN), tried to take Garasha Hosokawa (Mariko Toda in SHOGUN) hostage at Tamatsukuri's Hosokawa mansion in Osaka, but Garasha refused. The next day, Mitsunari went out to use his force and had his soldiers surround the mansion. When the vassals told Garasha everything, Garasha prayed a little, then gathered all the maids and ladies in the mansion and said, ``As my husband has commanded, I alone want to die,'' and led them outside. . Later, as suicide is prohibited in Christianity, the chief retainer, Hidekiyo Ogasawara (Shosai), intervened with Garasha and committed suicide by setting explosives in the mansion and setting it on fire so that no body would be left behind. Her death haiku was, ``Only when you know when it is time to scatter can flowers in this world become flowers and people become people.''
A few hours after her death, Father Niecchi Sordi Organtino visited the burnt remains of the Hosokawa mansion, picked up Garasha's bones, and buried them in the Christian cemetery in Sakai.
Ishido must have tried to imprison Mariko somewhere.
Rather than killing Mariko in the video, he was trying to kidnap her.
If he kills Mariko, he will make enemies and divide his allies.
That is Toranaga's aim.
Before the full-scale battle begins, the outcome of the Battle of Sekigahara will be decided by how many daimyo join your side.
You've earned all the slack and more, friends. Your authenticity is appreciated.
*whispers* crimson sky
This is now going to be permanently stuck in my head when ep10 comes out.
Adam is trying to ignore all the fingerprints on his glasses at the end
I wonder if there’s something in the uncut Patreon version that explains why Adam did a low key Jeff Goldblum impression while delivering the “walk & talk/Aaron Sorkin” joke? Don’t get me wrong, I loved it. It just came from way out of left field is all. 😂
who knew X Men 97 episode 5 could turn these two so bloodthirsty so quickly... "Crimson Sky!!!" XD
A part of me still wonders if Toranaga himself sent the shinobi. He granted Mariko's wish for death by having her pin the sacrifice on Ishido's "treachery". She wasn't Crimson Sky, but was the catalyst. At least that's a theory floatin around in my head. Guess Ill see on Tuesday.
What’s crazy about the fight scene the samurai literally cut the guy fingers so he can’t draw his sword shit was crazy 😂
Thank you. This was a great reaction. Just want to comment on why this episode was titled "Crimson Sky". That is because Crimson Sky is a who not a what. Mariko was Crimson Sky. What she accomplished was the unification of the most powerful lords for Toranaga. There is only one person smarter than Mariko and that is Toranaga. Toranaga and Mariko have been planning this for a long, long time. Can you imagine the conversations that Toranaga and Mariko had. Her choosing a Christian lord as a second was absolute genius not only about his religion but of the hypocrisies being taught to her son. This is Buntaro's son. What do you think he will do? The women are the heroes of this series. Thank you again.
I deeply love the book and probably read it every 3 years or so. Going in knowing Mariko's fate doesn't make it worse.
X-men 97 and Shogun, there has been alot of FEELINGS boys.
Mariko was the Crimson Sky. She was sent there for that purpose. Leave Osaka or die trying. Either way, it causes ripples among the regents. It's definitely a brilliant chess move, and she dies with honor.