Repairing an outboard that is jumping out of gear under load... for FREE
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 เม.ย. 2015
- In this DIY video I show how to repair an outboard motor gear set. Under heavy load, this outboard was jumping out of forward gear and you could hear an awful BANG BANG BANG and the outboard would shake violently. The problem was present when I purchased the boat so I immedately tore it down.
The method described in this video is not considered a 20 year fix... but cost me nothing and was worth a try. 2 years later, the outboard was running beautifully - it never slipped out of gear a single time... and there were no metal filings on the magnetic drain plug. I am very pleased with the outcome.
The motor was a 1989 US Marine Force 50 HP but I suspect this method would work on any outboard with a forward-neutral-reverse gear shifter. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
You could of also 180'd the dog clutch, so the little worn reverse side, can be used on the newly ground forward gear dogs. In some lower units, you can also swap the gears around, so you have a now, near new forward (The old reverse) and the machined old forward as the reverse gear. Since reverse is usually just idling for maneuvering, that's where you put the ground gear.
Great video. This is exactly what I'm trying to fix . Thank you
Let me tell you a little story, of my own, about how I was able to deal with that problem. My dad was a commercial fisherman. We caught and sold catfish caught in the Alabama/Tombigbee rivers and the channel connecting the two rivers. We had a 25 Hp Johnson (55 model) that wouldn't stay in forward gear. Couldn't even hold in in forward gear at anything near WOT. I had a load of fish, about 20-25 minutes run time to the landing (dock.) I had a pair of plyers, a screw drive, a turpentine cup (no other tools.) I was able to get the boat to a sandbar, remove the prop nut (it was screwed on with a cotter key for securing the nut onto the shaft. The shaft and gear assemble could be removed buy unscrewing the retain ring/nut. To shorten this description (I was able to rotate the shifter dog I80 deg., that gave four new surfaces to match and drive the gears) Only the inside of the dog ears make contact anyway. It lased through another powerhead. Hard to believe but that's exactly what happened to me when I was sixteen years old.
I'm going to take a look at my 18hp johnson. Runs mint but wont stay in gear, hopefully I can give it the ol 180 problem solved.
When you say it would not stay in gear did the shift lever move or would it say in place
Great job on the gear cut and great explaination. I did this to my 35hp unit that was jumping out of gear conpletely in both directions and it now has worked flawlessly all summer. Prussian blue is another name for the blue paste to check the trueness of the cut, I found it at the local NAPA. Great work and thank you for being brave enough to try it first!
Thanks for the great feedback. Another win for the good guys!
About to try it. Appreciate the help!
High idle can also cause premature gear failure .. nice video!
I like the look of this. If it lasted you two years without problems you did very little wrong. Like you said it's free to try and worth having a go. Thanks for the upload.👍
Your the best Sammy, thanks
Did it on two motors one works better than ever did ..other made it threw alot a Bridges but jumps out hope just need to add just shift rode..cable out to far both adjustment so has to be lower or bent shift cable holder..
Outstanding video
Thanks for the feedback
I'm having a similar problem I will keep you posted with my results thanks for the idea
Well? What happened.......... 2 years. Ni response
Been 5 still no response
Been 7 stil no response
A lot of OMC gears and dogs in later years did have a back cut angle on them from the factory. It's why stern drives used a shift ignition interrupter switch mechanism.
Fascinating! Thank you for sharing.
Thanks a bunch man!
I have the same issue with fwd jumping out of gear under load/high rpm. My brother suggested that I swap fwd and reverse gears as they are supposed to be identical on my outboard. The thinking is that reverse wouldn't jump out as it's not under heavy load when reversing.
I have heard people say they swap the fwd and rev gear. If you do that make sure you also flip the clutch dog as well. To only flip fwd and rev gears but not the clutch dog with drastically increase the stress on the much reduced mating surfaces. I still would do my method instead of a gear swap.
Can be done if they are in fact identical gears. Look the gears up and the you'll know if they are the same part number.
Wish I watched your video before I rebuilt my lower unit,had a helluva time finding detent balls cause I just ripped it apart
how do I go about getting the gears for my 40hp evinrude tracker don't really know the year but I believe it's in the 90's
I recently bought a 1985 20hp Johnson and the lower unit only had about one or so ounces of nasty oil come out when I checked it.I did three drains and refills since then.First one was pretty black upon draining it.Ok since then.Has not jumped out of gear yet.Supposedly it was in storage for years?I am hoping this was the case and the owner only ran it on the stand to test it and show it for sale.
hows it going? I would think it would be fine for a long time.
What cause the propeller doesn't turn and spin while the engine is running. I have hangkai 3.5 HP 2 stroke brand new. I filled up the gear oil housing in the propeller. the pin is installed properly and the pin lock outside is lock. But the propeller does not spinning while the engine running and accelerate the throttle but there is no result, can you help me please thank you
I did this procedure on my Yamaha motorcycle trans 6 years ago, worked wonderful, still working.
Wow thanks for sharing!
susuki DT75 goes in neutral under load pull back into neutral put in gear again away we go no noise from gearbox I take it the problem is rounded forward gear and clutch dog anything suggested before I go there or that's what it would be .
did it work old man`? greets from eu dinmark
need some one with a mill and a precise indexer to maintain the index with in .003 inch , carbide skim cut the the ratchet teeth. nice video thanks
This is great, thanks for sharing. Makes perfect sense, I'm about to do mine that way.
Good luck. Please report back with the result.
@@mrdiyguy123 would you please take a look at similar issue with my 2000 Mercury 40 HP. Short 1min video describing the issue with a flywheel
th-cam.com/video/CBuSNg5Ytvw/w-d-xo.html
@@tojadmka ok. First before you panic, take the flywheel off. I had the same symptom with a lawn tractor engine and found a magnet had broken free from the inside of the flywheel and was binding things up. If you check that, and are sure your outboard is in neutral, then I would think you have something internal that is binding. Also, make sure that your pistons are moving in and out as you rotate the flywheel... if a piston seems disconnected you likely have a broken connecting rod. Please report back.
@@mrdiyguy123 thank you! It's a months old fly wheel, stator and trigger so i doubt it, but there's a possibility something went wrong because I did that install myself
@@tojadmka I have seen relatively new parts fail before. Let me know what you find please. I'm interested in helping you and increasing my knowledge too.
Use drill press and high quality bits reground to a flat face or grinding bit or CNC bit if ya have
First I’m gonna try flipping my clutch dog. But I did buy some diamond bits with the thought of trying to trueing the gears ⚙️ up in my drill press.
do i have to have dent spring in a 1975 25 HP evinrude
A machinist could use a milling machine to handle this job but with reasonable care dressing it with the Dremel or similar should work just fine. I have a Suzuki DT85 that reputedly has bad reverse. Your technique should fix it if the clutch dog and reverse gear pawls are banged up. Given that reverse doesn't get as much use I trust that "fixed is fixed" for the foreseeable future if that's the case.
Russ G
so true!
Use a drill press for the repair
going to try this to a 1972 johnson evinrude 18 hp
I also have a 72 Evinrude 18hp with this problem. How did your repair go? Did the gears look similar to the ones in the video?
I have a 1977 Johnson. Lower Unit slipped under load. I bought a rebuilt lower unit and had the same problem. Could it be something else or likely just shift cable out of adjustment and rounded off the gears on the 2nd lower unit? Can I take off the shift cable and manually shift the motor in and out of gear?
I am learning myself, but maybe a spun hub? Did you use your old prop on the rebuilt lower unit?
@ trevor johnson, did you ever figure out what it was?
Who ever sold you the rebuilt lower unit ripped you off most likely... People with these old motors are always selling parts that are cleaned up or painted as rebuilt...
trevor if you had the same problem you probably need your shift cables adjusted. whatever happened?
seems like good technique to me..
Thanks alot
my 225 hp Johnson grinds bad going into reverse.. is that the cluck dog, I pulled out the lower unit plug there were no chunks of metal magnafied field to the plug? what else could cause this grinding it only happens when I put the motor in reverse forward seems fine.
It is either an out-of-adjustment shift cable or the same problem I fix in the video.
+mr diyguy123 thanks for your response
No noise into forward but noise into reverse means reverse gear is probably missing chucks of teeth. Grinding noise is gears and hammering is dog to gear noise
how did this hold up? I got one that is doing the same thing, to my eye, there is the most wear on the dog..
It worked fine for a year or 2 and then I sold the boat. My wear was on the gear, not the clutch dog which seemed to be made of much harder metal. However, the process would be the same to touch up the clutch dog.
I am thinking about replacing the bearing on the forward gear also, that little bit of extra clearance is part of the problem..I also notice that the total travel of the dog when not attached to the linkage is considerably more than when linked up. Design issue, I think. Once my drive disengages it does not BANG, it just acts like a severe cavitation, throttle down and I am good for about half throttle.. also seemed to get worse(happen at a lower RPM as the gear oil warmed up)
Nice video! Have you tested your work yet ???
PRACERZ yes. Ran it for a whole season with no issue
Fantastic !
Check that you don't have a spun prop. I did all this and then realized my prop was just spun.
were there detent balls in the drive shaft, if so where do they go?
Not all can use this system. The spring and balls detent system goes dead center of the dog travel on the shaft.
Hi could you swap the reverse cog with the forward cog & turn the clutch dog around because you use forward more than reverse ?
That was my first plan but i don't think it was an easy swap or i would have done exactly that. Try it and let us know.
I'm about to try that very approach. My forward gear and clutch dog both have rounded edges on one side. It slips out of gear when under load past 50% throttle. I'm going to try flipping the clutch dog before trying to replace anything. I'm reluctant to try grinding gears, but it's always an option if this doesn't work.
@@Ryan-ch1gp please let us know how it goes. Make sure you can flip fwd/rev gears and the clutch dog. If you only flip either the clutch dog or the fed/rev gears, the bad surface will quickly destroy/round off the good surface.
@@mrdiyguy123 I agree that I don't want to destroy the reverse surface. However, I was able to find the clutch dog for mine for $140 and the forward gear for $105, reverse for $11....all new. After hard consideration of availability of the parts in the future, I decided to spend the money, but I'm still going to flip the clutch dog and see how long it runs. My reasoning is that there may be some good use left out of this set and I want this boat back in action. I've probably already invested $500 in it so far (counting a new transom on the boat, rivets, marine battery and rebuilding the fuel intake/pump/carb paint and decals, new prop, etc...) But knowing I have a good gearset on the side will give me more confidence that I can keep it on the water even longer without selling out to something 4 cycle or electric. =P
@@mrdiyguy123 Flipping the clutch dog seems to have fixed the issue. I took it out last weekend and didn't have it slip once. I'm still having issues with fuel above 75% throttle, but can't tell if it's the carb or the chinese fuel pump I got off Amazon. I'm going to work that issue out and put those gears under real load soon. Perhaps the clutch to gear connection is actually under more load when the boat hasn't planed over anyhow. I just received a new forward/reverse/clutch dog set that I'm going to shelf.
Question about removing material from the dogs.
Are you keeping the same angle by grinding the surface evenly or,
Drawing a line through the center and cutting a wedge shape, like a tiny slice of pie?
Im about to try this and not sure which way to go.
Easiest for me to just flip the clutch dog over and use the good edges as guides and high-marking with ink.
that is a great plan if your clutch dog can be flipped over. some can, some can't
i tried to keep the same angle for the contact surface as original
Using air pressure and spinning a clean dry bearing at a high rate of speed will cause the bearing to come apart and send parts of the bearing flying every where. Ask me how I know. They need to be in the race to hold them together. And bathed in grease or oil.
Thank you so much for the feedback. Now that you have explained the risk I can understand how spinning a bearing with compressed air is potentially dangerous. Thanks for taking the time to teach me.
Hi, can you give me your opinion please: I own a Searay Sundance 290 from 1996 and a Bravo II drive. I was cruising at 3000 RPM, all good and as soon as I started to slow down, a massive BANG was heard and the throttle lever got stuck . In idle I tried to engage forward or reverse to no avail. What could happen? I had to be rescued and brought back to the marina (10 people on board).
Jaime Lopez that does not sound like fun. I'm more familiar with outboards. However, it is likely a clutch dog or gear tooth broke or a shaft sheared low in the outdrive. Please report back when you find out.
Ok, we found out that the basket that holds the U-Joint in place disintegrated because of material fatigue; the shaft got loose and destroyed the Bell bearing housing, transom and gimbal support. Big bill...
@@jaimelopez3991 ouch
or switch the gears from reverse and forward. put the reverse gear in the forward spot and the forward to the reverse spot. that will put in a new spot on the clutch teeth.
That is a great plan if your gears and clutch dog can be installed in reverse. That wasn't an option for my outboard.
@@mrdiyguy123 oh sorry! My 1957 evenrude 10hp can.
how do you get the roller bearing off the forward gear with out a press?
It has been been long time since I had this bottom end apart. I thin you would need a press.
Would it be possible to switch the gears. The worn forward being used for the reverse and the reverse used for the forward, therefore the drive turning against the the unused side of the gear?
I like that idea and believe I tried to do that unsuccessfully. I wouldn't have care if it jumped out of reverse.
My forward gear looks good how can I tell if this is my problem please help thanks
If it jumps out of gear under load you either have worn gears or a misadjusted shift rod.
@@mrdiyguy123Can I send you a pic of gear to see if you think its worn Thanks
@@mrdiyguy123
@@danavienneau754 Send me a private message with your email addr. tks
@@danavienneau754 that email address bounces :(
Yamaha 25 had a friend fixed shift cam by drilling holes in brackets that hold it oiled and heated worked good for a yr but I be a sailor and only use the motors in the inlets or threw bridges if other people near by.The shift cam can only be replaced if you pull power head.O r you remove the part of plastic that holds it in and always have a bungee cord to hold it s shift lever in place.Hay poor people poor ways it worked tell it didn't...
Is there a video on how to remove that shaft?
Take the lower unit out,prop shaft will slide out with it
@@kevinharrison4192 somethin came in the mail for you today??
i replaced my grars and now when i shif my motor into gear it dies :(
2 stroke? probably needs new rings.
How did this hold up for you over the years?!
I ran it hard for a season. No issues. Sold the boat after that so I cannot speak to the longevity of the repair. However, it cost me $0 and kept the motor going so I have no regrets.
Mine doesnt skip. But after putting in gear it will skip 20ft later. But thats it. Not sure why, its done it for years
L2fish make sure that the mechanism that is changing the gear is actually holding it into gear with a constant pressure. If it is a two piece downlink rod inside the lower housing open adjustment cover and make sure that the coupler is tight with no rod movement independent of the coupler. Could be shift fork at the shift dog. Could be any portion/piece of the shifting mechanism that has wear out allowing any movement releasing dog to gear interface pressure?
I've got one jumping out but gears look fine.
Check for bent shift for, bent or out of adjustment shift linkage, worn shift linkage, worn detent spring near the shift lever. Please comment back with what you find so we can all be more informed. Thanks.
Was it just coming out of gear and the shifter staying in the same place or would the shifter also move
Shifter also moved out of position
@@mrdiyguy123 ok mine acts like it’s coming out of gear under a heavy load but the shifter doesn’t move so hopefully it’s my prop spinning just order a new one will find out in a few days
@@seandrake7534 agreed. Let us know how you make out.
@@mrdiyguy123 well I now have the lower taken apart to fix the clutch dog and gear what do you mean buy back cut are you taking more off the back side of the gear so there is more material on the front of it ?
@@seandrake7534 by back cut, I mean cut it so that under load it is impossible for the gears to disengage. Back cut is the opposite of rounded off gears.
Why not throw a shim behind the gear to tighten them up ?
The problem in my case wasn't that the gears were too far apart, it is that the teeth had rounded. I don't think shimming would have worked because under load the teeth would generate incredible opposing force that would overcome the shift dog, continuing to allow the gears to slip..
tohatsu 25hp..gearbox
I guess there is a reason that you couldn't just swap the forward and reverse gear; they look interchangeable, but maybe they are not.
Nope. Not interchangeable
You could try changing the timing enough to run the motor in reverse;)
Yeah, you could swap the gears but it wouldn't do any good - for the simple reason that the reverse gear turns the opposite way so you've 'reversed the reverse' and the same surface engages with the dog. Plus, you'd have to re-shim to get proper gear contact and backlash.
Ur a very smart man. Salvage before u buy.
I mean good for those people who run their boat in the lake, but those run their boat on open ocean not good advice. especially single engine.
oh my tell us the facts
Dude, buy a micrometer
Tk
I strongly recomend to change for all those gears just for your own sarfty.
nobody would spend $1000 on a 20 year old motor. This fix is as good as it gets
tk
i love the audio. p.s i dont lol thx for the help
Just buy a referb lower unit. Sheesh
Refurbed lower units are $500 and up where I live... the repair/work around is not for everyone... but cost $0 and held up.
I did what you suggested.ground the fw .gear a few degrees plus the clutchdog, took it for a test run....runs great don't jump out of gear any more....thanks for the info.
George Nadeau
Once Upon A Disney yes
Good luck
how do I go about getting the gears for my 40hp evinrude tracker don't really know the year but I believe it's in the 90's
Look 👀 inside the motor and find the number. They are stamped ona round part that looks like a freeze plug. That number will give you a lot of information.
how do I go about getting the gears for my 40hp evinrude tracker don't really know the year but I believe it's in the 90's
how do I go about getting the gears for my 40hp evinrude tracker don't really know the year but I believe it's in the 90's