4:00 sounds like ATC screwed up.. initially told China Air Lines to expect 24R, then when the pilots read it back to ATC, they are told “Negative, it’s 24L”.
pilot on vista jet also made an incorrect readback , ATC, did not catch. ATC said, 2000 for altitude, the pilot read back, 6000. It was caught obviously when they starated ascending above 2000 but dang
@@peterthegreat996 Yeah the fact that radios cannot transmit and receive at the same time is a huge problem. Honestly the quality of radio calls is horrible to understand. I hope they advance it a bit with a clearer digital signal. I wonder if they can do something similar to the "HD audio" that went on LTE and 5G type voice in the cell world.
@@paulstejskalThe problem is the sheer distance these transmissions have to make. LTE and 5G would not have the range for it. It’s similar to police radio, you get use to it the more you use it.
Totally agrees. It's not a question of semantic, MAYDAY doesn't not only say everything it's needed in a quick way, but alert others to keep the frequency clear also.
I was headed to the comments to complain about "declaring an emergency" after that already being abundantly clear from the mayday call. My complaint is less about the pilot and more about the number of atcs who ask mayday aircraft "are you declaring an emergency?" which necessitates pilots to make redundant double emergency declarations.
Controller's own mistake though, kinda: Vistajet pilot(s) may have misheard the altitude, and so their readback was wrong and the controller didn't catch that, which I think is understandable with the extra workload from the emergency in progress. But when the Vistajet pilot(s) got told to go back to 2000ft they didn't want such an error to happen again so after that, with every series of numbers they got from the controller, they asked for extra confirmation to make sure they got their readback right.
Yes but the controller's voice particularly with the word "three" seemed garbled. Comes through as "tree" to me. Clearly a stressful situation for all involved. Glad it worked out in the end.
@@SeligTiles Thanks for the insight. I had no idea and am a bit surprised given how many of these I have heard over the years. Never picked up a three stated so obviously as three before. I'll have to listen again to see if I pick this up. Makes sense in a way to help overcome the "th" difficultly most people have,
I assume the US (like here in Germany) has published missed approach routes, that are part of the approach - but why are they NEVER used??? They eliminate soooo much stress from both ATC and pilots, because pilots brief for them and ATC only would have to say "ABC123, go around, follow missed approach as published and contact departure". Those missed approach routes are also designed in a way (at least here in Germany) that they don't interfere with SIDs. Also - as a phraseology nitpicker: "continue holding short" is a recipe for disaster...
100% correct. We brief the Missed Approach every time, and any time I have had to go missed I have yet to receive those instructions outside of training. They always give me something else.
I just literally pulled up the charts and wow... Climbing to 2000ft and a heading of 236 when passing the shoreline is LITERALLY the published missed approach for the ILS25L. That's just soooooo inefficiant and unnecessary frequency congestion - especially when also dealing with an emergency. Just clear them on the published, send them to departure and they will usually take you off of the published as quick as possible to re-sequence you for the approach. That's at least how it's done here in Germany almost all of the time...
@@SeligTiles None, Frankfurt (our busiest) has roughly 50-60 Million passengers a year I believe - but that's not part of the issue here, because the Tower controller is LITERALLY giving the instructions for the published missed approach for ILS 25L...
Man that is crazy. I heard the Vistajet read back and thought that's how accidents happen... And then the brief mixup of runways 24L instead of 24R. Scary stuff. But all in a day's work...
ATC should have picked up the incorrect read back on altitude from Vistajet. A little understandable in the heat of the moment but it was something that jarred me and was picked up… sorry for back seat ATCing!
Yeah it's for part of the video I was pondering why 6,000 because that's somehow what I also heard and saw in three back figuring it must have been correct then is confused later when it seemed like it was wrong...
I didn't hear the ATCs call but I heard the 6000 in the read back and thought it was strange since everyone else was getting 2000. No hate on either the pilot or the ATC. He did catch it later after the were a bit higher than he anticipated. All in all that was good work by the ATC considering the mayday at the last moment with planes stacked to land IMO.
@@JohnDoe-wg2hn Same, I maybe heard a gambled "continue/track rwy heading", nothing about an altitude. They were probably all on the visual approach; a standard missed is very useful for this kind of situation (which twr was manually assigning them, and probs the reason he didn't ask for a clear readback)
Yeah, that annoyed me too. Even if the mistake was missed, ATC corrected the issue and put them back at the correct altitude, but then continued to be passive aggressive over frequency, which was uncalled for
In reality there are two controllers working that one position - a secondary controller is helping them coordinate by calling approach and informing them of the situation. Additionally you have a supervisor behind them who is calling rescue services and airport ops to coordinate.
ATC missed the 6000 altitude readback, should have corrected it right then and there. Clearly VistaJet had a bit of a language issue. ATC was a bit fast for them. Overall, well done by all!
@@VASAviation I looked at the map, and now I see that Foxtrot is way down at the landing end of the runway. I thought it would be partway down the runway closer to "Hotel short of Juliet", but they have several H exits from the runway, so Foxtrot is not two exits away from H short of J as I thought following the sequence of F, G, H.
I feel like the vistajet is more eventful than the emergency aircraft. But yeah tower is busy. Edit: clearly I need to watch till the end before commenting, just what's up with the vistajet tho😂
@@SeligTiles runway heading and ATC gives an altitude. The missed approach for SFO on 28 is runway heading and they usually give 3000 for the initial altitude, which I believe is the chart MA altitude.
@@Tiger313NLHe’s probably got 3 or 4 people talking to him at the same time. The pilot needs to be paying closer attention….it wasn’t a difficult, unclear instruction.
When a pilot doesn't understand what you're saying it's a good indicator that you need to slow down. This ATC was in the rush of the event and it's understandable but the first thing to do when things get heated is to slow down or else pilots will need you to repeat and you'll lose even more time.
Wait what did the delta pilot saying "Blocked" mean after they were told to go around? Were they trying to get out of having to go around or something?
The beginning of the controller's transmission was blocked because someone else was also transmitting on the frequency. When two transmit at the same time, the result is usually a distinctive tone which you hear on this recording. In this case, just the words "Delta 673" were blocked, but that's an important part! Saying "blocked" is a common and quick way to let someone know that their transmission was partially or entirely blocked in that way.
So the dynasty flight was told they would be moved over to 24R because of the emergency to the south and when they gave the read back the tower told them no they are going 24L then they approve vehicles to enter 24L for an inspection with aircraft on final, way to much is wrong here and way to many safety concerns, non of the controllers are talking to each other and just guessing on the pilots to do the work
@@Michael_K_Woods even with cut transmissions, the emergency aircraft landed 24L operations shifted to 24R but aircraft where still cleared to land 24L even before the inspection and there was atleast two aircraft cleared for 24L before the runway inspection so the runway should have been closed awaiting clearance from the inspection personnel
@@nickluther263 no, LAX has 4 runways. North field is 24R and 24L, south field is 25R and 25L. The emergency plane landed on 25L and Ops inspected that runway. Dinasty was moved on 24L, on the north field, from 25L on the south field.
When I was in high school many years ago I contemplated becoming an air traffic controller. Thank God I did not take that course in life. I would never have been able to handle the pressure.
It's not like you're thrown into a chaos of a KLAX on your first day. The job starts at some sort of academy and once you're ready you move on to an actual ATC unit. And again not KLAX or EGLL during rush hour but a calmer corner of airspace and chances are there's a coworker nearby for help and boosting your confidence. There may be others near you such as somebody preparing flight control strips. And if there's a major emergency, a controller will be dedicated to that event while another runs the remaining normal business. Controllers seem to be a bit of stress addicts - but so are players of action games. ATC is dominated by a safety culture and that means to never burn out people or have them do the impossible. I'm pretty sure you can have a calmer position if KLAX tower isn't what you want. Up in the air it's similar. The outbound leg of my first navigation flight felt a little overwhelming even though the instructor was operating the radio I still had to watch out for traffic, fly the airplane, navigate according to my navigation plan and map, keep an eye on fuel and make sure the engine is happy, whatnot. After half hour of this I turned back. On the return leg I also had to operate the radio coordinating with ATC units. By that time it all felt like I was busy, and having fun but no longer overwhelming. You get used to it surprisingly quickly.
@@sbalogh53 You're welcome - and yes it was clear that the time of carrer choices was over for you but I felt a few things about the jobs as an ATC controller had to be said. Cheers!
@@Xanthopteryx They misheard the first one which is WHY they did an incorrect readback. Asking tower for repeats when there's an emergency on the field is unprofessional. Turn the volume up and pay attention.
@mkkm945 I don't know about you but I'd rather confirm with the tower my instructions and take a few extra seconds than cause a ton of other problems all because I misheard something and didn't clarify
Again a poor job by the ATC. He need a stress management course. He took out his frustration on pilots. He made mistakes and also didn’t shut down ppl blocking the channel.
Somehow thousands of people can share the bandwidth of an Ethernet cable, but we have yet to figure out how to share the bandwidth of a radio signal without walking over one another. Oh wait, we have! Just need to implement it in this archaic system. It may take 80 years I'm guessing. So embarrassed for them.
Right, we just need to simultaneously obsolete every aircraft radio in the entire world and switch to a new system so we don't occasionally get blocked calls. Makes sense. Nothing could possibly go wrong with that.
@@ChrisKr-ue3kethere isn’t though. Radio works over Berlin the same it does in Anchorage or Cape Town or Laos or… It’s simple, reliable, and works all over the world.
@@DeltaEntropy The most important difference between internet and radio, is that the radio works in broadcast mode. Anyone can hear you, as long as they are in the range, and have proper equipment, and there is no client limit. There could be 2 million people listening to a single aircraft and it would work just fine, whereas the internet must have some kind of server to redirect the data packets and send a packet to each client separately. So if you want to talk to 2 million people through internet, you need to send 2 million transmissions, instead of just one.
Sure they missed the altitude, but the blame is on ATC for not catching 6,000' on the readback. Other than that, ATC handled the entire situation exceptionally well.
LAX has a special flight rules area that lets VFR traffic cross over the field at 3500' flying southeast or 4500' flying northwest (see the Los Angeles VFR terminal area chart). Go-arounds at LAX are kept to altitudes below that. So if Vistajet thought they heard 6000' I would hope they'd realize that was unusual and ask for confirmation.
@VASAviation this one too, especially maintaining no situational awareness. Two and six sound nothing alike either, and they were on frequency with other aircraft with the same instructions. IFR aircraft cross LAX at 4000-6000. VFR aircraft cross at 3500-6500. These guys were flying right into all of that, and that is all well published on the charts.
If it was engine n2, they possibly lost the yellow hydraulic system which does the nose wheel steering. They can cross feed, but they wouldn't do it unless they were sure they weren't leaking anything, hence the firetruck inspection.
I could be wrong, but I’m sure there is a ‘h’ in ‘three’. Seems wild that a (presumably) native English speaking person, working as an ATC can’t correctly pronounce a word you learn on Sesame Street when you’re an infant.
Sesame Street is not part of the FAA nor ICAO curriculum, the pronunciation of digits is standardized to avoid common mixups with other words so 3 must be pronounced tree and 9 becomes niner: www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/fs_html/chap2_section_3.html
You are indeed wrong, they’re using phonetic numbers as is the case for military / aviation / public safety radio comms. This is especially important to use at an international airport and doubly so when there’s an emergency in progress to minimize confusion or ambiguity. 3 is tree just like 5 is fife , 9 is niner and other subtle changes.
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4:00 sounds like ATC screwed up.. initially told China Air Lines to expect 24R, then when the pilots read it back to ATC, they are told “Negative, it’s 24L”.
Well, that’s why they verify calls. It is part of the Swiss cheese model to add another layer to prevent human error.
it will be all reveiwed
pilot on vista jet also made an incorrect readback , ATC, did not catch. ATC said, 2000 for altitude, the pilot read back, 6000. It was caught obviously when they starated ascending above 2000 but dang
@@peterthegreat996 Yeah the fact that radios cannot transmit and receive at the same time is a huge problem. Honestly the quality of radio calls is horrible to understand. I hope they advance it a bit with a clearer digital signal.
I wonder if they can do something similar to the "HD audio" that went on LTE and 5G type voice in the cell world.
@@paulstejskalThe problem is the sheer distance these transmissions have to make. LTE and 5G would not have the range for it. It’s similar to police radio, you get use to it the more you use it.
finally a clear and precise MAYDAY call, declaring emergency without doubt. very nice.
What a pеthatic comment from someone probably living in their mom's basement
Totally agrees. It's not a question of semantic, MAYDAY doesn't not only say everything it's needed in a quick way, but alert others to keep the frequency clear also.
I was headed to the comments to complain about "declaring an emergency" after that already being abundantly clear from the mayday call.
My complaint is less about the pilot and more about the number of atcs who ask mayday aircraft "are you declaring an emergency?" which necessitates pilots to make redundant double emergency declarations.
Mayday for an engine out though, versus a Pan Pan? Practically it does not make much difference to the response, but surprised to see Mayday here.
"Are you declaring a MAYDAY?"
"Well... uhm... perhaps just and APRILDAY for now"
A mayday and a “continue” at a U.S. airport? Next thing you know there’s going to be decent baguette, pastry shops on every corner, maybe even trains.
You have made my day, sir :D
Remarkably enough, LAX will have a train connection in the near future!
@@philmiller2465 Texas is also supposed to get proper HSR between 3 cities in the next few decades
@@philmiller2465 With luck, SFO figures it out sometime in my lifetime as well
The tower consuming his mic in frustration at the end was so fucking hilarious when VistaJet Couldnt get it together 5:50
Controller's own mistake though, kinda: Vistajet pilot(s) may have misheard the altitude, and so their readback was wrong and the controller didn't catch that, which I think is understandable with the extra workload from the emergency in progress. But when the Vistajet pilot(s) got told to go back to 2000ft they didn't want such an error to happen again so after that, with every series of numbers they got from the controller, they asked for extra confirmation to make sure they got their readback right.
Yes but the controller's voice particularly with the word "three" seemed garbled. Comes through as "tree" to me. Clearly a stressful situation for all involved. Glad it worked out in the end.
@@BLAB-it5un That's not garbled, that's training, they're supposed to do that. "Tree" "Fife" "Niner" to all be distinct.
@@BLAB-it5un tree is the correct pronunciation of 3 in atc / pilot comms.
@@SeligTiles Thanks for the insight. I had no idea and am a bit surprised given how many of these I have heard over the years. Never picked up a three stated so obviously as three before. I'll have to listen again to see if I pick this up. Makes sense in a way to help overcome the "th" difficultly most people have,
I assume the US (like here in Germany) has published missed approach routes, that are part of the approach - but why are they NEVER used???
They eliminate soooo much stress from both ATC and pilots, because pilots brief for them and ATC only would have to say "ABC123, go around, follow missed approach as published and contact departure".
Those missed approach routes are also designed in a way (at least here in Germany) that they don't interfere with SIDs.
Also - as a phraseology nitpicker: "continue holding short" is a recipe for disaster...
Excellent comments. “Continue holding short” is not good, especially for non-native.
100% correct. We brief the Missed Approach every time, and any time I have had to go missed I have yet to receive those instructions outside of training. They always give me something else.
I just literally pulled up the charts and wow... Climbing to 2000ft and a heading of 236 when passing the shoreline is LITERALLY the published missed approach for the ILS25L. That's just soooooo inefficiant and unnecessary frequency congestion - especially when also dealing with an emergency. Just clear them on the published, send them to departure and they will usually take you off of the published as quick as possible to re-sequence you for the approach. That's at least how it's done here in Germany almost all of the time...
@@marcel1416 which airport in Germany has the same airport configuration, traffic amount and noise abatement procedures as LAX?
@@SeligTiles None, Frankfurt (our busiest) has roughly 50-60 Million passengers a year I believe - but that's not part of the issue here, because the Tower controller is LITERALLY giving the instructions for the published missed approach for ILS 25L...
That was chaotic. Lots going on...
Well handled.
Man that is crazy. I heard the Vistajet read back and thought that's how accidents happen... And then the brief mixup of runways 24L instead of 24R. Scary stuff. But all in a day's work...
VistaJet casually climbing (and then descending) through the LA Special Flight Rules Area :)
ATC should have picked up the incorrect read back on altitude from Vistajet. A little understandable in the heat of the moment but it was something that jarred me and was picked up… sorry for back seat ATCing!
Yeah it's for part of the video I was pondering why 6,000 because that's somehow what I also heard and saw in three back figuring it must have been correct then is confused later when it seemed like it was wrong...
I didn't hear the ATCs call but I heard the 6000 in the read back and thought it was strange since everyone else was getting 2000.
No hate on either the pilot or the ATC. He did catch it later after the were a bit higher than he anticipated. All in all that was good work by the ATC considering the mayday at the last moment with planes stacked to land IMO.
I didn't even hear his read back. I'm not sure how anyone can say they heard him say 6000 lol. Listen to it without reading the text.
@@JohnDoe-wg2hn Same, I maybe heard a gambled "continue/track rwy heading", nothing about an altitude. They were probably all on the visual approach; a standard missed is very useful for this kind of situation (which twr was manually assigning them, and probs the reason he didn't ask for a clear readback)
Yeah, that annoyed me too. Even if the mistake was missed, ATC corrected the issue and put them back at the correct altitude, but then continued to be passive aggressive over frequency, which was uncalled for
Rumor has it VistaJet still descending to 2,000
No VistaJet's altitude was amended to 3000 by the end of the video.
@@jamesphillips2285 yes, they were eventually given a new altitude of 3,000ft after apparently not leveling at 2,000ft as initially instructed
@@rickenzuela They were above 4000ft when ATC noticed that they were high.
Wow, is all I can say. Fascinating workload for ATC, i think the multi tasking was A1.
"When he told him to fly Tree Fiddy, I just knew that was the Loch Ness Monster!"
Tree is the correct pronunciation of 3 in atc / pilot communications
@@SeligTiles Yeah, but the correct pronunciation of 350 is "tree fife zero". Only the got damn Loch Ness Monster would pronounce it "tree fiddy"
@@Geoff69420 how I miss Boston John. He always said 3 and 5 correctly. 😊
I heard South Boston. I never tire of hearing it. It's just a smattering of the Irish immigrants.
Some people here need to watch more South Park.
Thank you very much for picking this incident up!🙂👍
Workload sounded way too high for one controller in that situation.
In reality there are two controllers working that one position - a secondary controller is helping them coordinate by calling approach and informing them of the situation. Additionally you have a supervisor behind them who is calling rescue services and airport ops to coordinate.
Omg! The traffic is backing up. I would not want that job!
ATC missed the 6000 altitude readback, should have corrected it right then and there. Clearly VistaJet had a bit of a language issue. ATC was a bit fast for them. Overall, well done by all!
Whenever somebody lands with an engine problem, shouldn't they check the runway in case they were dropping parts?
They did, they had an Airport Operations car inspect the runway before it was reopened
Which they did?
@@VASAviation I looked at the map, and now I see that Foxtrot is way down at the landing end of the runway. I thought it would be partway down the runway closer to "Hotel short of Juliet", but they have several H exits from the runway, so Foxtrot is not two exits away from H short of J as I thought following the sequence of F, G, H.
I feel like the vistajet is more eventful than the emergency aircraft. But yeah tower is busy.
Edit: clearly I need to watch till the end before commenting, just what's up with the vistajet tho😂
Legend has it that Vistajet is still confirming departure on 124.3
2:00 who keeps blocking 😂
Geesh guys, the radio critiques in the comments are a little overkill.
At SFO, ATC will say go around, fly published missed approach. They will give the pilot the altitude to fly.
What’s the published missed approach for a visual approach?
@@SeligTiles runway heading and ATC gives an altitude. The missed approach for SFO on 28 is runway heading and they usually give 3000 for the initial altitude, which I believe is the chart MA altitude.
The ATC managed it very well
better than east coast ATC for sure
Kinda missed Vistajet's readback though.
You can hear ATC move his mic towards his mouth for the departure frequency lol
@@Tiger313NLHe’s probably got 3 or 4 people talking to him at the same time. The pilot needs to be paying closer attention….it wasn’t a difficult, unclear instruction.
@@Tiger313NL ATC also messed up CAL5162 rwy change @4:00.
"Fly heading 2🌳6."
Yes, this is the correct way to pronounce it: www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/fs_html/chap11_section_1.html
That is correct aviation pronunciation
As Markus said, that's the correct phonetic pronunciation for radio communications. 3 is pronounced TREE, 5 is FIFE, 9 is NINER.
When a pilot doesn't understand what you're saying it's a good indicator that you need to slow down. This ATC was in the rush of the event and it's understandable but the first thing to do when things get heated is to slow down or else pilots will need you to repeat and you'll lose even more time.
No, not two tree, two tree six. TWO TREE SIX!
At what point do you continue your approach or abort when you have an engine failure?
ATC seemed all over the place on this one.
Wait what did the delta pilot saying "Blocked" mean after they were told to go around? Were they trying to get out of having to go around or something?
The beginning of the controller's transmission was blocked because someone else was also transmitting on the frequency. When two transmit at the same time, the result is usually a distinctive tone which you hear on this recording. In this case, just the words "Delta 673" were blocked, but that's an important part! Saying "blocked" is a common and quick way to let someone know that their transmission was partially or entirely blocked in that way.
I don't think he stopped on the runway. I believe he said he stopped on hotel which is a taxiway not a runway.
He stopped on taxiway H, not on the runway.
Surprise surprise a Vistajet did not follow Controller instructions lol.
Did he not?
Amateur hour at LAX
Confusion city😂
Let's check it out.
So the dynasty flight was told they would be moved over to 24R because of the emergency to the south and when they gave the read back the tower told them no they are going 24L then they approve vehicles to enter 24L for an inspection with aircraft on final, way to much is wrong here and way to many safety concerns, non of the controllers are talking to each other and just guessing on the pilots to do the work
Remember the time between radio transmissions is cut. Runway inspections don’t take much time.
The inspection was on 25L though (where the emergency landed).
@@Michael_K_Woods even with cut transmissions, the emergency aircraft landed 24L operations shifted to 24R but aircraft where still cleared to land 24L even before the inspection and there was atleast two aircraft cleared for 24L before the runway inspection so the runway should have been closed awaiting clearance from the inspection personnel
@@nickluther263 no, LAX has 4 runways. North field is 24R and 24L, south field is 25R and 25L. The emergency plane landed on 25L and Ops inspected that runway. Dinasty was moved on 24L, on the north field, from 25L on the south field.
You should watch again
What type of engine was it? 👀👀👀
To quote Dr. McCoy, "It's dead, Jim." :)
chevy 350
@@mtsky-tc6uw That would have not broken down lol
IAE V2500
When I was in high school many years ago I contemplated becoming an air traffic controller. Thank God I did not take that course in life. I would never have been able to handle the pressure.
It's not like you're thrown into a chaos of a KLAX on your first day. The job starts at some sort of academy and once you're ready you move on to an actual ATC unit. And again not KLAX or EGLL during rush hour but a calmer corner of airspace and chances are there's a coworker nearby for help and boosting your confidence. There may be others near you such as somebody preparing flight control strips. And if there's a major emergency, a controller will be dedicated to that event while another runs the remaining normal business. Controllers seem to be a bit of stress addicts - but so are players of action games. ATC is dominated by a safety culture and that means to never burn out people or have them do the impossible. I'm pretty sure you can have a calmer position if KLAX tower isn't what you want.
Up in the air it's similar. The outbound leg of my first navigation flight felt a little overwhelming even though the instructor was operating the radio I still had to watch out for traffic, fly the airplane, navigate according to my navigation plan and map, keep an eye on fuel and make sure the engine is happy, whatnot. After half hour of this I turned back. On the return leg I also had to operate the radio coordinating with ATC units. By that time it all felt like I was busy, and having fun but no longer overwhelming. You get used to it surprisingly quickly.
@@ralfbaechle ... too late for me because I am retired but your answer will be useful to a young one contemplating a career. Thank you.
@@sbalogh53 You're welcome - and yes it was clear that the time of carrer choices was over for you but I felt a few things about the jobs as an ATC controller had to be said. Cheers!
@@ralfbaechle I wish I could have tried for ATC, but, I missed the age cut off
ok
Vistajet needs an ear cleaning!
And to stop mumbling.
They did an incorrect readback that the controller failed to hear.
After that, Vistajet just wanted to be really sure the instructions was correct.
@@Xanthopteryx They misheard the first one which is WHY they did an incorrect readback. Asking tower for repeats when there's an emergency on the field is unprofessional. Turn the volume up and pay attention.
@mkkm945 I don't know about you but I'd rather confirm with the tower my instructions and take a few extra seconds than cause a ton of other problems all because I misheard something and didn't clarify
All Jetblue ENGINEs are Coin Operated machines.
That's Spirit. Jet Blue takes credit cards.
Again a poor job by the ATC. He need a stress management course. He took out his frustration on pilots. He made mistakes and also didn’t shut down ppl blocking the channel.
Somehow thousands of people can share the bandwidth of an Ethernet cable, but we have yet to figure out how to share the bandwidth of a radio signal without walking over one another. Oh wait, we have! Just need to implement it in this archaic system. It may take 80 years I'm guessing. So embarrassed for them.
Right, we just need to simultaneously obsolete every aircraft radio in the entire world and switch to a new system so we don't occasionally get blocked calls. Makes sense. Nothing could possibly go wrong with that.
Since there is mobile internet service everywhere, they could create a Whatsapp group and handle their communication in that group ;)
@@ChrisKr-ue3keBut you have pilots like Vistajet do you think the what’s up app would work for him.
@@ChrisKr-ue3kethere isn’t though.
Radio works over Berlin the same it does in Anchorage or Cape Town or Laos or…
It’s simple, reliable, and works all over the world.
@@DeltaEntropy The most important difference between internet and radio, is that the radio works in broadcast mode. Anyone can hear you, as long as they are in the range, and have proper equipment, and there is no client limit. There could be 2 million people listening to a single aircraft and it would work just fine, whereas the internet must have some kind of server to redirect the data packets and send a packet to each client separately. So if you want to talk to 2 million people through internet, you need to send 2 million transmissions, instead of just one.
ATC and VistaJet:
"Roger! Huh?
LA departure frequency 123.9. Roger! Huh?
Request vector, over. What?
We have clearance, Clarence. Roger, Roger. What’s our vector, Victor?
Tower radio clearance, over. That’s Clarence Oveur.
Over. Roger. Huh? Roger, over. What? Huh? Who?"
Vistajet was terrible man…
vista did read back 6000 and atc did not catch it
If he read back 6000'??
Sure they missed the altitude, but the blame is on ATC for not catching 6,000' on the readback. Other than that, ATC handled the entire situation exceptionally well.
And after that Vistajet wanted confirmation on his read backs to be extra sure and ATC gave him attitude smh
LAX has a special flight rules area that lets VFR traffic cross over the field at 3500' flying southeast or 4500' flying northwest (see the Los Angeles VFR terminal area chart). Go-arounds at LAX are kept to altitudes below that. So if Vistajet thought they heard 6000' I would hope they'd realize that was unusual and ask for confirmation.
Vistajet is a joke
The controller missed the incorrect readback earlier so...
Why?
@VASAviation they don't seem to properly train their pilots on flying in US airspace. Look at how they behaved at BFI
Only one example you have?
@VASAviation this one too, especially maintaining no situational awareness. Two and six sound nothing alike either, and they were on frequency with other aircraft with the same instructions. IFR aircraft cross LAX at 4000-6000. VFR aircraft cross at 3500-6500. These guys were flying right into all of that, and that is all well published on the charts.
With one good engine, could have taxied off the runway,
If it was engine n2, they possibly lost the yellow hydraulic system which does the nose wheel steering. They can cross feed, but they wouldn't do it unless they were sure they weren't leaking anything, hence the firetruck inspection.
They have. They were on taxiway Hotel. The runway was closed until it could be inspected.
They did.
I could be wrong, but I’m sure there is a ‘h’ in ‘three’. Seems wild that a (presumably) native English speaking person, working as an ATC can’t correctly pronounce a word you learn on Sesame Street when you’re an infant.
Yes, you’re wrong: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_phonetic_alphabet
Sesame Street is not part of the FAA nor ICAO curriculum, the pronunciation of digits is standardized to avoid common mixups with other words so 3 must be pronounced tree and 9 becomes niner: www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/fs_html/chap2_section_3.html
You are indeed wrong, they’re using phonetic numbers as is the case for military / aviation / public safety radio comms. This is especially important to use at an international airport and doubly so when there’s an emergency in progress to minimize confusion or ambiguity.
3 is tree just like 5 is fife , 9 is niner and other subtle changes.
You show your knowledge in English and your ignorance in aviation
@@g00rb4u 3 is tree, 5 is fife, 9 is niner
TH-cam Boston John
Stick to Sesame Street