Thanks for reviewing this. In Cold Steel’s defense, a few of the negatives you mentioned; such as the half edge, knuckle bow, shiny patent leather, wire wrapping, and lack of a leather washer; I do believe we’re somewhat intentional in their attempt to make as close a copy to our authorized NCO sabers, so that we can sneak them into use. As I’m sure a few other career barracks Marines can attest to, the currently authorized swords are purely ornamental, and next to useless for settling matters of honor in the barracks.
It is NOT an officer's sword. The USMC officer's sword is different. This is only an NCO sword. I'd like to see a review of the actual officer's sword.
This is just a cheap knock off. Only three companies are certified to sell USMC swords and Cold Steel isn't one. The three companies are Marlow White, Officers' Equipment, and The Marine Shop.
There are 2 swords for the Marines, the NCO sword, which is what you have, and the Officer's sword. The Officers sword has a very different hilt grip ect. Cold Steel has one of those as well. The argument below, the Marine, who corrected the others about NCO and Staff NCO is friggin correct. This is coming from a fellow Marine.
The Marine NCO swords are based on the Civil War Infantry Officer's sword. All the modern one are strictly dress swords and are no better that a butter knife if you get in a fight. Cold Steel did an upgraded version of that, I am happy the revue mainly had fit and finish problems rather than, "This is a totally unsuitable piece of junk." sort of issue.
Great review. I like the meticulous details such as: - the raised leather on the sheath - the lack of a washer on the guard - insufficient twists on the wire wrap It's really hard to pick those details and, overall, they matter a lot in making an item enjoyable to own and use.
Good review. With regard to the blade coming blunt, I believe that UK law prohibits the ownership and sale of swords with curved blades longer than 50cm/20". Exceptions are made for custom or antique weapons. This was a response to the panic about criminals, teenagers and mentally unstable people being armed with "Samurai Swords". It's an overreaction in my opinion, but I don't make the rules.
Hmm, yes I'm aware of those laws, though there are exemptions for 'traditionally made' blades (open to interpretation) and anybody with insurance for martial arts/reenactment can buy, import or export them. So the law doesn't really apply to people like me, for example, but I can see that this may indeed be a reason for CS not shipping them sharp - to make the importation simpler.
It's likely because it's a ceremonial weapon. For what a Marine would actually do with one of these having a sharpened blade would be more of a hazard than anything else. It also explains why the seam on the back of the scabbard isn't flattened, you'll never wear one enough or for long enough periods of time for it to actually chafe.
For those wondering: Marines can buy their swords from several companies, but cold steel is not recognized. As such, the markings are not the same as the actual enlisted saber. The wire twist rate is _dramatically_ more dramatic on the real ones. There is no carbon steel versions of this blade recognized for use by the Corps. All in use are stainless steel. And finally, at the Marine Corps birthday, they use these swords to cut the cake. :P
A "Real" Marine NCO sword is stainless steel costume jewelry. They haven`t been made with combat in mind for more than a century. They also sometimes cost double what Cold Steel charges. It`s even worse for the Mameluke sword. Officers in OCS can expect to pay $800.00 for a sword made to the same standards as something you`d get at a flea market for $30.00. The Cold Steel version is 1/5 the price for hugely better quality. The only down-side to the Cold Steel version is that you have to take care not to let the blade tarnish.
Who gives a shit? Is anyone going to see that? It's on the onboard side if you're holding the sword at Carry, and it still has the EGA on the other side. The "Real" NCO swords say "Made in India." Even if anyone noticed, only the most anal 1st-Sgt would give you a hard time about it.
It's part of a uniform, used only for ceremony, so why would you want a real blade on it? Cold steel was not authorized to produce them and had to discontinue. You can spend a lot on fit and finish for a nice one from an authorized company (even with a carbon steel blade if you want), but they're more like $500 for an NCO and $600 for an officer.
@@peretiako1 Having a real blade is just cooler. And the brass finish on the Cold Steel version is just as good as the high-end authorized swords, but at half the price. Who cares if it's "Authorized?" as long as it meets specs and is good quality.
@@occamtherazor3201 i agree, the USMC are extremley proud of their combat prowess, so i think that carryng a sword that isn't an actual weapon would be an insult.
PeterP, you have obviously not been to bootcamp, these swords are in daily use on the drill field and are a signifier of who is in command at the time. The quality of issue swords is terrible(poor for a wall hanger) and fall apart in light use (ceremonial),a quality sword is highly sought after but financially beyond a USMC NCO paygrade. The USMC demanded Cold Steel
My experience with cold steel: good blade (steel, heat treatment sharpness), poor grip BAD fittings (misalligned, bad coating, sometimes loose). My CS Shamshir has a slippery grip (probably HD PE-plastic), a crossguard that was poorly aligned (side of the cross rubbing against my palm!) and the coating was pealing off at 3 spots right on delivery. The good thing to say is that the blade cuts way better than I anticipated and it takes a lot of abuse to dull it or make it rust (can touch it with my bare hands without worrying). Comparing it with Albion swords, I have to say: you get what you pay.
a lot of CS's swords cost as much as other options that are better quality according to reviews. also, since I don't need a sword for anything but aesthetics and enjoyment of swordplay, I feel that saving up for a higher quality blade (one that doesn't have a rattly handle straight from the factory) would be in my best interest.
Ive actually used the Cold Steel sword in the Marine Corps and it worked very well for me. I think its better than the more expensive Wilkinson sword that when I pulled out my issued Wilkinson sword all I got was the hilt with the blade still in the sheath. What sold me on the Cold Steel was that the swords supposedly would pass the old English Army sword proof test and could actually be used as a real sword as the Wilkinson could not. Also the Wilkinson was around $600 and the Cold Steel was only $190. It was a no brainer for me!
I recently bought the Cold Steel 1796 light Cavalry so I could mod the hilt -it has a pommel nut which makes it great for that. The profile of the blade, distal taper and all, is almost identical to a German antique version I have: they both have good distal taper, they're the same weight, point of balance is the same etc. The antique feels far better in the hand though, the reason being that the Cold Steel hilt is wider and bulkier. That affects handling massively. Appart from that it's perfectly fine and I hope to fix that hilt issue when I tear it appart and remake it.
Mine shipped sharpened to the same point from the factory and came with a leather washer in the packaging but not on the blade. The issue dress swords come in 1" increments from 30" - 35" or 36" as I recall. I used a 34" typically as that put the tip at my ear at "carry sword."
To be even even more technical, modern USMC NCO swords used for parade and drill are modeled on the M1859 NCO saber, which was modeled after the Model of 1850 US Army Foot Officers sword, which was modeled after the French 1845 design.
USMC Regulations state that the NCO sword can only be worn by the NCOs over combat units, and only for ceremony. The USMC Officers sword is very different in design and known as the Mameluke and easily recognized by the distinctive ivory hilt and Nickle scabbard. The design has historical reason, recognizing the Marines role in fighting Barbary Pirates.
Isn't there *technically* nothing in the Marine Corps Orders that say's you *can't* carry your sword in a combat environment? Probably just a rumor we pass around, but still.
I think it's distorted from the 1850 saber but it's not supposed to be exactly like the old one, the marines have made this into their own sword, also the blade is a lot skinnier then the original 1850 saber
The key word is "continuous." The officer's sword wasn't always issued. NCO Sword: Only NCOs authorized the privledge of wearing a sword in the US. This is also the oldest weapon in continious use in the U.S. Military. The Mameluke would be except for the gap in which officers wore what is now the NCO sword. Regulations adopted in 1859 outlined the specifications for the sword still carried by today's noncommissioned officers. The design is based on the 1850 Army foot officers' sword, which Marine officers carried from 1859 to 1875.
I have no idea how other militarys work but I can tell you this if my troops in the Marine corps would have referred to me or another NCO as an "officer" it would have been there worst day of their life.
So my question is, would this be an ok sabre for HEMA fencing if I came across one? In Australia so my options are quite limited unless I pay more than the sword for shipping in many cases.
i was always on the fence about buying into cold steel, hearing you, someone who deals with swords on a regular basis not give it a stellar review kinda makes me just want to get a basket hilt or something...
as a US Marine issued a sword we are issued different brands, mine is a sharpened Marlow White. since they are mostly for ceremonies the leather is suppose to match all the other lather on the uniform as well as the leather on others uniforms. This caused most of the leather to be switched to synthetic several years ago because our shoes' leather was changed. Very sad because the older style looks so much better.
As a us marine who's in a ceremonial billet I'd like to point out that that sword is made to look like every other nco sword so they couldn't do to much with the leather washer or hand grip, also they're not designed to be sharpened anymore. (This is more of nit picking but in the video you refered to it as the officer's sword while it is the enlisted non commissioned officer's sword (E4+) the officer's use the mameluke sword (O1+)
As a retired Marine Corps Chief Warrant Officer you missed our Corps Warrant Officer’s. I had been selected as a Warrant Officer in 1985 and promoted to Warrant Officer One (W-1) after serving as a Gunnery Sergeant for 3 years with 1st Radio Battalion in Hawaii and 1st Field Service Support Group at Camp Pendleton where I was selected as a Data Communications Maintenance Officer. I retired in Hawaii in 1994 as a Chief Warrant Officer 3 with the 1st Marine Brigade, G-6, Electronics Maintenance Officer after 21 + years in our Marine Corps. I own a Mameluke Officer’s sword. Semper Fi Marine!
I appreciate the "Tell it like it is" style for this review, the points about the loose hilt assembly and the etching are the most troublesome I'd assume, but at least it's balanced well enough. I wonder if their smallsword is any good considering it's supposed to be very light?
Cold Steel typically does include the leather washer you refer to, however, it isn't on the sword and no explanation for it is included. The first CS sword that I purchased, I tossed the thing thinking it was some piece of packing material and only too late realized its purpose. I don't own any of their older swords, and it seems that they had quite a few issues in the past. The only issue I have with their swords is that they are still heavier than other manufacturers, although not by a great deal.
The official NCO saber used by the Marine Corps and what they actually sell in Marine Corps Exchanges are produced in Germany with a German steel blade. The official saber does have the leather washer where the blade exits the hilt; the blade doesn't just extend through the guard. I believe the company that produces the sabers is the Officer's Equipment Company. It has a serial number stamped on the top edge of the blade near the hilt. I believe the engraving is deeper than that shown on the Cold Steel blade reviewed here and is slightly sharper in detail. Both sides of the blade are engraved as is the spine. The wire on the grip is two strands, but I think it's a bit tighter than that shown on the Cold Steel blade. Not absolutely sure. I will say the sword purchased from the Marine Exchange and that from Cold Steel are very much superior to blades obtained from China or India. The saber you are reviewing is the NCO sword. The Marine Officer's saber is a Mameluke patterned sword with what was originally an ivory hilt. It is a copy of a sword presented to Lt. Presley O'Bannon by the Bey of Tripoli after the capture of Derna in 1805. (That's the source of "the shores of Tripoli" line in the Marine Hymn.) It was adopted as the pattern of the Marine Officer's sword in 1825, although it was not carried by Marine officers for about 15 years starting in the Civil War when regulations required they carry the Army 1850 foot officers sword. It is secured with two brass round fixtures showing a star detail. There is no metal knuckle bow, only a brass cross guard. The hilt is pierced at the rounded end and a double strand leather braid is threaded through and tied around the brass cross guard with a clove hitch knot. The knot's crossing is always on the outside, visible when worn with the two parallel strands on the inside of the guard. The braid ends with a sword knot which today is a simulated piece. The braid is always present if the sword is worn. The officers scabbard is chrome steel today. In all it is very much like the 1831 British Officers Mameluke pattern sword you reviewed some years ago but the cross guard is not engraved, it's smooth brass. The shape of the hilt and the guard is essentially the same except for that detail.
I have researched a little bit and have found that the Marine Corps Systems Command has regulations in regards to the manufacturing of this sword (I'm a former Marine and was actually stationed at Quantico where MARCOR SYSCOM is, or was when I was there in the '90's). I didn't know this about the sword until recently. As NCO's we had to learn to the sword manual for drill. Bermejo of Toledo Spain might be the best. You're looking in the U.S. to spend about $500 or so. They claim to be the only certified USMC NCO sword in the world, however, there are one or two other manufacturers that claim to use the MARCOR SYSCOM specifications. I think it's key to look for that. Otherwise, who knows what you're getting. There seem to be so many for under $100 probably for display or just cake cutting. Anyway, you won't pay any less that $350 for a steal of a deal, possibly. The more you pay the better the result most likely.... from Bermejo, Toledo Spain.
I have a Cold Steel Navy 1917 Cutlass that's pretty heavy and the wooden grip on the hilt is hard keep firm without it sliding around in my hand..I want to wrap it with leather string and the basket guard cuts into your forefinger knuckle.
I hear these are intended to be a dress sword one could actually use in a pinch as dress swords are not made to be actually used. Better than a wall-hanger anyway.
The saber your reviewing is a USMC Noncommissioned Officers sword, it is a ceremonial sword. It is not supposed to be sharpened nor is it allowed to be. It does have little give to allow it be used during ceremonies, some NCO’s just get too nervous when preforming with this sword.
I have the (mis)fortune of owning a Cold Steel Talwar. I noticed a substantial amount of rattle when I first tested it. Lo and behold, the famous "disc" pommel was actually just a nut and a plate that was literally threaded on to the tang. I remember you said real talwars are glued on to the hilt and I didn't believe it. Well, if the manufacturers used white school glue, it would have been a lot better than the screw-on job that I had.
This is NOT the USMC Officer's SWORD, it is the USMC NCO Sword. (Sword is the term used by the USMC for both weapons.) Officers carry the Mameluke Sword to commemorate the battle of Tripoli. Just a fact check by an old USMC SGT. That said, very good product review.
scholagladiatoria I got to do a little sword drill in the Marine Corps, but the ones we had were pretty much strictly for show. Occasionally someone would try to cut something with them and the blade would snap and they'd have to go replace it. No idea what brand they were, but they were very cheap I believe. I didn't realize the cold steel version was actually capable of cutting something if sharpened. Thank you for the review.
I'll probably get one then. I was both an enlisted, then an officer way back when. I had both swords once, but they were the cheap ceremony ones. I want to put as real a version of both swords on my wall somewhere.
Since they're used in sword drill, they should be able to be handled reasonably with all the snappy wrist movements we had to do for parade... and for carrying it while marching for what seemed like eternity. Lol. I've thought about it only recently and figured they probably need to meet certain specs for drill if anything. They didn't bother telling us stuff about weights and quality. We used what the battalion or company had and you were lucky to find a sword that actually fit you. I do remember there were blades with different lengths, usually shorter than the standard 32 inch or something. We were told if we had the money, that we could order a sword with a shorter blade based on our height as the blade tip was supposed to reach to your ear, or no higher than your ear lobe or something like that.
I've heard that American military policy, at least for cavalry, was to sharpen only the tip of a saber and use the rest of the blade for parrying. The reason being that you would either thrust the weapon or only be able to slash with the tip due to the increased distance from a man on foot to a man on horseback.
Would love to see an actual antique of this NCO sword & the Mamaluk officer sword. Something that wasn't just a show piece. Please and thank you. BTW love this channel!
I own a cold steel 1917 cutlass (read klewang). I wasn't too comfortable with how it felt so I got ahold of a friend who owns several original 1917 cutlasses. Sure enough, the thing felt like a brick compared to the originals. The cold steel cutlass has a thicker blade and zero distal taper, so it's not surprise where the extra weight comes from. Its very well made, and of high quality. But Matt, as I'm sure you know, there's a difference between quality and functionality. :/ Good stuff you got here. I'd like to see more cold steel reviews in the future. Let me know you thoughts on their italian longsword if you get your hands on one. It has a distal taper and feels very lively in the hands, at least for me.
Hello Matt! I hope u're fine. I have some questions : 1) After Napoleon's Egyptian campaign , Some French and British officers started using " Mamleuke saber" a type of saber adopted from the Mamluks of Egypt very similair to the Shamshir. I'd like to know your opinion about this sword. 2) Was the Shamshir used excalty like the Tulwar ? Thnx for answering and have a good day :)
Napoleon's Mamelouks were an honorary Guard mainly: they had wild colorfull oufits and fancy weapons (flanged maces, daggers styled after Jambiyas, blunderbusses, axes, etc). Actually, they were a very tiny subdivision of the Garde Impériale, and always stayed an extremely low number (never more than 200). The crowd liked them at parades, so much that it started (along with the Egypt campaign itself) the whole orientalist trend. The early recruits were real "Arabs", and the shamshir was their native and usual saber they brought back with them to France, as long as they already belonged to fighting "casts" before entering Napoleon's army. So they probably used it quite well and as it should be. But sabers were also made in France, styled after oriental shamshirs. This wasn't a regulation pattern, but french-made shamshir used to be made in the Klingenthal manufacture, with a blade quite similar to the Cold Steel Shamshir, but various kinds of hilts. Klingenthal bladesmiths were very highly capable men, as capable as the Solingen ones, and given a blade they could have made a perfect copy of it, but with the experience they got from spending their whole life forging saber blades all day long, and tight quality control. Some sabers had engravings to accentuate the "fanciness" of the Mamelouk look: engravers basically put everything they thought was exotic and mysterious.
Matt, the American sold models are also only sharpened on the last 3rd of the blade. My understanding from my son who was a Marine,is that the actually NCO sword are almost blunted. The idea of the sharping of the last 3rd on the Cold Steel models is to have a trusting blade with limited cutting edge so that the maneuvers required by NCO can be performed safely.
William Phillips im pretty sure actual NCO swords are fully blunt, but sabers in general are usually only sharp at the end because thats all youre going to be cutting with, the rest is for blocking
turtle79070 Actually sabres in general are sharpened all the way down. Partial sharpening is a US idiosyncrasy and is mostly seen on swords from the civil war. English, French, German and other European sabres from the 18th century through to the first world war are all sharpened along the entire edge, at least on the antiques. As Matt pointed out there are partially sharpened European swords, but they are straight thrusting swords like the British 1895 infantry officers' sword and not sabres.
hey Matt - the grip wire 'rate of twist' on that particular { post 1900 } 1872 usmc NCO model is historically accurate , it looks cheap ,... but thats how the marines liked it
I'm surprised CS did as well as they have on it. Most of their other swords are big clunky beaters, not really suited to historical fencing. If I purchased anything from them it would likely be their tomahawks or their pole axe / dane axe models. Those tend to be a bit better in their execution though most still need some post purchase work.
it's based on the modern dress sword worn by Marine corps non commissioned officers sword that's based on the m1851 saber that sword matches regulations almost exactly but has more the weak sharpened in full the regulation version I've handled a few timed in two blade lengths
The U.S. 1860 heavy cavalry saber is modeled after the French 1822 light infantry saber... with a shorter blade. The French 1822 heavy cavalry saber had a straight blade with a 10mm thick spine at the guard. In the meanwhile, tactics had changed, and as far as I know the U.S. Army never had anything like what was the heavy cavalry from the French army (namely Cuirassiers and Carabiniers à cheval), this explaining that. But a heavy cavalry saber is supposed to be quite large and strong, as heavy cavalry doesn't manoeuvre much in workaround and flanking moves, but has a huge striking power to litterally smash and crush an ennemy formation with a frontal straight-in-the-middle charge. Their saber, in this kind of tactic, is supposed to be used almost as the spears of medieval knights. Gun progress outdated this kind of slow-moving units with few to no firing power. But everybody knows CS also has a tendancy to overbuild sabers... often in the wrong spots, which makes them feel tip heavy, or just "heavy", if you can't compare to an antique.
We Marines want this sword because it IS a sword and not a cake cutter. I am not interested in the little things as much. Thank you for the informative video.
I'm seriously just looking for a functional army NCO saber. I'm authorized to wear one, but don't want to drop 3-400 bucks on a "ceremonial" piece. all of which are stainless steel.
I assume these are Windlass swords from India like most of their swords. I own a Cold Steel baskethilt that was manufactured by Windlass. It's quite heavy and the balance is not quite there. It's good for whacking bottles and other objects and I removed the odd tassel and basket liner to make it look a bit less gaudy. Interestingly, it does have the leather washer between the hilt and the blade base.
Honestly, I never checked. I will when I get the chance. I bought mine at a discount (in the US), so I thought that the sword was okay for the price point. "Better" baskethilts (such as Armour Class) are much more expensive and difficult to find here. Holding my Cold Steel baskethilt in a hanging guard or trying any finer movements is somewhat difficult. It has proven to be quite durable though! I actually like many Cold Steel products, so I don't want to bash the company too badly. For what I paid for it, I'm happy. I just think that others who are HEMA practitioners need to know what they're in for when they are shopping.
I do not know if you have had a chance to handle one, but just so you are aware, the actual saber's issued to officer's and NCO's in the USMC today are made by Weyersburg Kirschbaum and Company in Solingen Germany. Rather than this Cold Steel copy.
To be fair, unless I am mistaken this is not meant to be entirely historically accurate since it is a ceremonial sword for modern US marines. Speaking as an American. So if it does not measure up to historical standards, I feel that it is acceptable
Matt, I don't want to sound like I fuss, but you keep refering to the French "1855" infantry saber. The real pattern is from 1845 actually, and in 1855 the modification was to swap to a metal scabbard. Otherwise, they have been so many different makes of that pattern over the decades it's hard to tell by the details is there should have been a regulation difference between the 1845 and 1855 version. It seems from 1855 the officier version had a slightly smaller blade, but that probably isn't blindingly obvious, even to the experienced eye. I have two of them (1845/55), one seems to be pre-1855 (it came with the remains of a leather scabbard), but is relatively poorly made (low hilt casting quality with crude details, uneven fullers, warped blade, relatively short and yet somewhat tip heavy, doesn't flex in an even arc, unpleasant grip shape -the one the US selected for their NCO saber, btw- and sloppy pommel fitting, etc), another seems more recent (the date on the spine has become illegible sadly) but is very very nice on every aspect (at there are traces the guard was gilded). It seems there is no rule at all regarding this pattern date and version, but the base model is from 1845. Mine both have a horn handle, by the way. Also, both the nice 1845 and an antique 1821 french infantry saber I have (which had engravings on the blade and a gilded hilt) do have the same "defect" of having the main guard branch sligthly tilted to the side. It's difficult to say if it was on purpose or fortuitous. While the U.S. Marines NCO saber has the worst kind of French 1845 hilt (pommel/handle transition making an angle), it does bear a British styled blade, with the single fuller design, centered "spear" point (while the French 1845 has a very distinctive blade style), relatively long ricasso and invasive etching, especially the King David star (it would have been shoking on a french sword, and I still really don't get why it's on British 19th century regulation patterns by the way). Quite wierd animal that U.S. Marine's NCO saber...
CS blades always look great on their own videos but I''ve heard nothing but criticism from independent reviewers re' handle durability. I'd certainly never pay money for one.
Really? I kind of get a little bit of that feeling when it comes to their swords, but I can say that the majority of their knives are 100% solid. Their machetes are also very good if you do not mind spending some time putting a good edge on it.
from all the older marine navy army and air force presentation swords none of them are ever sharpened, but then there are the ones that are specifically sharpened for parade for exhibition, and everyone has heard the stories of the ear getting hacked off when the sword is snapped upwards to attention, but when i was in in the early 1980s i never got to see it happen. but i did fall at attention when on parade and i landed face down hands at my side so i fell right
It would be cool if you would compare it to an actual marine NCO sword, cold steel only makes replicas, the USMC buys them from Weyersburg, Kirschbaum and Company,
True - the officer's mameluke is still patterned closely after one presented to Marine First Lieutenant Presley O'Bannon by the Ottoman Empire viceroy, Prince Hamet, on December 8, 1805, during the First Barbary War, as a gesture of respect and praise for the Marines' actions at the Battle of Derne. Sabers are for ground-pounding NCOs. ;-)
+Bj Hamblin Also - the USMC NCO Saber is actually quite closely patterned on the US Army's M1853 Officers Sword - Though it's understandable why French patterns would be very similar as even the last cavalry saber issued by the US Army was designed by Patton, an Olympic Fencer and huge fan of European Military History and Practice.
Hey there, I got their Civilian Saber..not thrilled with the fact that it came dull...they said I can send it back and they'll treat as a warranty issue..but that will be a nightmare and I may have to pay a lot in customs/shipping again...do you have a sharpening how-to video? If not could you? thanks
I remember reading once that the original Marine sabre was adopted after the U.S. defeated the Barbary Coast pirates, and an American naval officer was given a Mameluke sword as a gift. How closely is the modern American model based off of that Egyptian sabre, and how does it compare combat-wise?
The Mameluke sword (not the one reviewed here) was awarded to Lt Presley O'Bannon (USMC not USN) by Prince Hamet for his service during the Barbary Pirate Wars. The Marine Corp then adopted the design for its officers up to the US Civil War where they started to issue the saber that is the father of the sword reviewed here. After the Civil War, the officers went back to being issued the Mameluke sword, and the other swords were then given to NCO's in recognition of their service to the Corps.
Although I can't say for sure but I suspect that the original sword presented Lt. Presley O'Bannon probably had a more curved blade than the current one does. As for combat usability, the pattern used during the 1800s was found to be too light for combat by Marine officers so they went back to the Pattern 1850 sword which the Marine NCO sword is based on.
It could be that Marine regulations don't call for a washer and/or may expressly forbid a washer. Remember, this not a replica of a historical sword per se but a ceremonial weapon used by actual Marine NCOs. To see this, and the officer's sword in action just look up Marine change of command ceremonies or pass in reviews here on TH-cam and you'll see how they're used.
Being a mailler, I can tell you that brass wire isn't cheap. By putting fewer twists in it they're saving 30-50% of what they would otherwise use, if they were being historically accurate.
their swords are hella expensive for the amount of rattle they tend to have, and matt did say the brass fittings were a bit thicker than antique specimens, which would give you a decent amount of extra brass wiring.
morallyambiguousnet I'm guessing, since I haven't seen anything saying their brass is just aluminum that's been plated in brass, or something along those lines, even though I've read dozens of bad reviews on cold steel, that they're full brass. whether or not it's high quality brass through and through is another story. it could be shitty brass coated in a thin layer of high quality brass.
I came across a sabre looking like this, only it did not have "Cold steel" etched near the pommel but rather "440 stainless steel", any idea what kind of replica it would be? Edit: Seems like the etchings are not "frosted" either.
Real USMC swords are only manufactured by Weyersberg, Kirschbaum and Company in Germany. They're sold only to Marlow White, Officers' Equipment, and The Marine Shop, & they are purely ceremonial. Neither the officer or the NCO sword has a hand guard and both have a serial number at the bottom of the handle.
All Cold Steel Marine NCO swords now no longer are enscribed with United States Marines. The blade has Marines only. The Star of Damascus or Star of David is also no longer on the blade either. I sent the one I ordered back. The only thing I can figure out is that only certain blade makers are authorized by the Marine Corps and Cold Steel is not on the list. Either the Marine Corps or one of the authorized sword makers told them to stop.
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Thanks for reviewing this. In Cold Steel’s defense, a few of the negatives you mentioned; such as the half edge, knuckle bow, shiny patent leather, wire wrapping, and lack of a leather washer; I do believe we’re somewhat intentional in their attempt to make as close a copy to our authorized NCO sabers, so that we can sneak them into use. As I’m sure a few other career barracks Marines can attest to, the currently authorized swords are purely ornamental, and next to useless for settling matters of honor in the barracks.
It is NOT an officer's sword.
The USMC officer's sword is different. This is only an NCO sword.
I'd like to see a review of the actual officer's sword.
I do not know American swords very well. The officer's one is the mameluke type, yes?
Yes, supposedly from the barbary wars.
Supposedly the oldest weapon in US arsenal.
No, the oldest are the British swords we took during the Revolution.
Thank you! this is indeed an NCO's Sabre, not an officers sword by any means (which is a Mameluke).
This is just a cheap knock off. Only three companies are certified to sell USMC swords and Cold Steel isn't one. The three companies are Marlow White, Officers' Equipment, and The Marine Shop.
There are 2 swords for the Marines, the NCO sword, which is what you have, and the Officer's sword. The Officers sword has a very different hilt grip ect. Cold Steel has one of those as well.
The argument below, the Marine, who corrected the others about NCO and Staff NCO is friggin correct.
This is coming from a fellow Marine.
The Marine NCO swords are based on the Civil War Infantry Officer's sword. All the modern one are strictly dress swords and are no better that a butter knife if you get in a fight. Cold Steel did an upgraded version of that, I am happy the revue mainly had fit and finish problems rather than, "This is a totally unsuitable piece of junk." sort of issue.
Great review. I like the meticulous details such as:
- the raised leather on the sheath
- the lack of a washer on the guard
- insufficient twists on the wire wrap
It's really hard to pick those details and, overall, they matter a lot in making an item enjoyable to own and use.
Good review. With regard to the blade coming blunt, I believe that UK law prohibits the ownership and sale of swords with curved blades longer than 50cm/20". Exceptions are made for custom or antique weapons. This was a response to the panic about criminals, teenagers and mentally unstable people being armed with "Samurai Swords". It's an overreaction in my opinion, but I don't make the rules.
Hmm, yes I'm aware of those laws, though there are exemptions for 'traditionally made' blades (open to interpretation) and anybody with insurance for martial arts/reenactment can buy, import or export them. So the law doesn't really apply to people like me, for example, but I can see that this may indeed be a reason for CS not shipping them sharp - to make the importation simpler.
It's likely because it's a ceremonial weapon. For what a Marine would actually do with one of these having a sharpened blade would be more of a hazard than anything else. It also explains why the seam on the back of the scabbard isn't flattened, you'll never wear one enough or for long enough periods of time for it to actually chafe.
Si74l0rd Yeah, I didn't realize that at first. I initially thought that it was meant to be an actual dress sword.
+Si74l0rd Are you trying to tell me there aren't couch Rambos in other countries too?
It would be really funny to see British cops attempt to arrest a katana wielding criminal with their glorified dildos which they call truncheons.
Fewer twists per inch in the wire lets you use less wire to wrap the grip. It's possibly a cost or time saving measure, maybe both.
For those wondering:
Marines can buy their swords from several companies, but cold steel is not recognized.
As such, the markings are not the same as the actual enlisted saber.
The wire twist rate is _dramatically_ more dramatic on the real ones.
There is no carbon steel versions of this blade recognized for use by the Corps. All in use are stainless steel.
And finally, at the Marine Corps birthday, they use these swords to cut the cake. :P
That’s pretty cool tradition to celebrate the corps birthday
A "Real" Marine NCO sword is stainless steel costume jewelry. They haven`t been made with combat in mind for more than a century. They also sometimes cost double what Cold Steel charges. It`s even worse for the Mameluke sword. Officers in OCS can expect to pay $800.00 for a sword made to the same standards as something you`d get at a flea market for $30.00. The Cold Steel version is 1/5 the price for hugely better quality. The only down-side to the Cold Steel version is that you have to take care not to let the blade tarnish.
Who gives a shit? Is anyone going to see that? It's on the onboard side if you're holding the sword at Carry, and it still has the EGA on the other side. The "Real" NCO swords say "Made in India." Even if anyone noticed, only the most anal 1st-Sgt would give you a hard time about it.
It's part of a uniform, used only for ceremony, so why would you want a real blade on it? Cold steel was not authorized to produce them and had to discontinue. You can spend a lot on fit and finish for a nice one from an authorized company (even with a carbon steel blade if you want), but they're more like $500 for an NCO and $600 for an officer.
@@peretiako1 Having a real blade is just cooler. And the brass finish on the Cold Steel version is just as good as the high-end authorized swords, but at half the price.
Who cares if it's "Authorized?" as long as it meets specs and is good quality.
@@occamtherazor3201 i agree, the USMC are extremley proud of their combat prowess, so i think that carryng a sword that isn't an actual weapon would be an insult.
PeterP, you have obviously not been to bootcamp, these swords are in daily use on the drill field and are a signifier of who is in command at the time. The quality of issue swords is terrible(poor for a wall hanger) and fall apart in light use (ceremonial),a quality sword is highly sought after but financially beyond a USMC NCO paygrade. The USMC demanded Cold Steel
I'm not surprised that cold steel hasn't sent you their swords for review since you are so knowledgeable about historical swords.
My experience with cold steel:
good blade (steel, heat treatment sharpness), poor grip BAD fittings (misalligned, bad coating, sometimes loose).
My CS Shamshir has a slippery grip (probably HD PE-plastic), a crossguard that was poorly aligned (side of the cross rubbing against my palm!) and the coating was pealing off at 3 spots right on delivery.
The good thing to say is that the blade cuts way better than I anticipated and it takes a lot of abuse to dull it or make it rust (can touch it with my bare hands without worrying).
Comparing it with Albion swords, I have to say: you get what you pay.
a lot of CS's swords cost as much as other options that are better quality according to reviews. also, since I don't need a sword for anything but aesthetics and enjoyment of swordplay, I feel that saving up for a higher quality blade (one that doesn't have a rattly handle straight from the factory) would be in my best interest.
I wish Albion would make more curved swords like the kilij, shamshir, etc.
Ive actually used the Cold Steel sword in the Marine Corps and it worked very well for me. I think its better than the more expensive Wilkinson sword that when I pulled out my issued Wilkinson sword all I got was the hilt with the blade still in the sheath. What sold me on the Cold Steel was that the swords supposedly would pass the old English Army sword proof test and could actually be used as a real sword as the Wilkinson could not. Also the Wilkinson was around $600 and the Cold Steel was only $190. It was a no brainer for me!
Matt, I am very glad you were able to review one of CS's sabres, I had been wondering about their quality, and now we have your opinion on them!
I recently bought the Cold Steel 1796 light Cavalry so I could mod the hilt -it has a pommel nut which makes it great for that.
The profile of the blade, distal taper and all, is almost identical to a German antique version I have: they both have good distal taper, they're the same weight, point of balance is the same etc.
The antique feels far better in the hand though, the reason being that the Cold Steel hilt is wider and bulkier. That affects handling massively.
Appart from that it's perfectly fine and I hope to fix that hilt issue when I tear it appart and remake it.
german made or german version? probably solingen.
Mine shipped sharpened to the same point from the factory and came with a leather washer in the packaging but not on the blade. The issue dress swords come in 1" increments from 30" - 35" or 36" as I recall. I used a 34" typically as that put the tip at my ear at "carry sword."
I have friends and family that are USMC and have considered buying this sword for them. Thank you for your excellent information as always.
Just to be more techinical, this NCO sword was modeled after the Model of 1850 US Foot Officers Sword which was modeled after the french 1845 design.
To be even even more technical, modern USMC NCO swords used for parade and drill are modeled on the M1859 NCO saber, which was modeled after the Model of 1850 US Army Foot Officers sword, which was modeled after the French 1845 design.
The Officers sword is the Marmaluke, what you are reviewing is a Non Commissioned Officers sword -enlisted Corporal and above.
USMC Regulations state that the NCO sword can only be worn by the NCOs over combat units, and only for ceremony.
The USMC Officers sword is very different in design and known as the Mameluke and easily recognized by the distinctive ivory hilt and Nickle scabbard. The design has historical reason, recognizing the Marines role in fighting Barbary Pirates.
Isn't there *technically* nothing in the Marine Corps Orders that say's you *can't* carry your sword in a combat environment? Probably just a rumor we pass around, but still.
Which reg? Because we sure as hell used them for ceremony in the Airwing (3rd MAW)
Actually any Marine NCO can wear the NCO sword.
Cold Steel uses the same bade for their Civilian Saber, also marketed as the Gentleman's Saber. It has a folding guard.
What brand would you recommend when looking for Quality sabers?
I think it's distorted from the 1850 saber but it's not supposed to be exactly like the old one, the marines have made this into their own sword, also the blade is a lot skinnier then the original 1850 saber
the Marines NCO saber is the oldest continually issued weapon in the US Arsenal. but we've laxed up abit.
mostly because we use butons and dont use skill anymore.
+dillan mcdaniel fact.
The Marine's officer sword is older.
The key word is "continuous." The officer's sword wasn't always issued.
NCO Sword: Only NCOs authorized the privledge of wearing a sword in the US. This is also the oldest weapon in continious use in the U.S. Military. The Mameluke would be except for the gap in which officers wore what is now the NCO sword.
Regulations adopted in 1859 outlined the specifications for the sword still carried by today's noncommissioned officers. The design is based on the 1850 Army foot officers' sword, which Marine officers carried from 1859 to 1875.
Again, the oldest are the ones we liberated from the British Army.
This is actually one of the more positive reviews of a Cold Steel sword that I've seen.
USMC Officers carry a Mameluke.
Very true, this is a non-commisioned officers sword.
+Plight_of_Icarus NCO's are not officers.
tacsling kijaki I cant tell if you're trying to be funny.
How so?
I have no idea how other militarys work but I can tell you this if my troops in the Marine corps would have referred to me or another NCO as an "officer" it would have been there worst day of their life.
One other issue: the original has a more distinctly curved grip, while the Cold Steel example you are reviewing has a nearly straight one.
So my question is, would this be an ok sabre for HEMA fencing if I came across one?
In Australia so my options are quite limited unless I pay more than the sword for shipping in many cases.
Can you try a review of the US Army Officer's sword please?!
i was always on the fence about buying into cold steel, hearing you, someone who deals with swords on a regular basis not give it a stellar review kinda makes me just want to get a basket hilt or something...
as a US Marine issued a sword we are issued different brands, mine is a sharpened Marlow White. since they are mostly for ceremonies the leather is suppose to match all the other lather on the uniform as well as the leather on others uniforms. This caused most of the leather to be switched to synthetic several years ago because our shoes' leather was changed. Very sad because the older style looks so much better.
As a us marine who's in a ceremonial billet I'd like to point out that that sword is made to look like every other nco sword so they couldn't do to much with the leather washer or hand grip, also they're not designed to be sharpened anymore. (This is more of nit picking but in the video you refered to it as the officer's sword while it is the enlisted non commissioned officer's sword (E4+) the officer's use the mameluke sword (O1+)
As a retired Marine Corps Chief Warrant Officer you missed our Corps Warrant Officer’s. I had been selected as a Warrant Officer in 1985 and promoted to Warrant Officer One (W-1) after serving as a Gunnery Sergeant for 3 years with 1st Radio Battalion in Hawaii and 1st Field Service Support Group at Camp Pendleton where I was selected as a Data Communications Maintenance Officer. I retired in Hawaii in 1994 as a Chief Warrant Officer 3 with the 1st Marine Brigade, G-6, Electronics Maintenance Officer after 21 + years in our Marine Corps. I own a Mameluke Officer’s sword. Semper Fi Marine!
I appreciate the "Tell it like it is" style for this review, the points about the loose hilt assembly and the etching are the most troublesome I'd assume, but at least it's balanced well enough. I wonder if their smallsword is any good considering it's supposed to be very light?
Cold Steel typically does include the leather washer you refer to, however, it isn't on the sword and no explanation for it is included. The first CS sword that I purchased, I tossed the thing thinking it was some piece of packing material and only too late realized its purpose. I don't own any of their older swords, and it seems that they had quite a few issues in the past. The only issue I have with their swords is that they are still heavier than other manufacturers, although not by a great deal.
I wish we had more than one option for a real sword that matches the 1856 specs. This is pretty much it for real swords
The official NCO saber used by the Marine Corps and what they actually sell in Marine Corps Exchanges are produced in Germany with a German steel blade. The official saber does have the leather washer where the blade exits the hilt; the blade doesn't just extend through the guard. I believe the company that produces the sabers is the Officer's Equipment Company. It has a serial number stamped on the top edge of the blade near the hilt. I believe the engraving is deeper than that shown on the Cold Steel blade reviewed here and is slightly sharper in detail. Both sides of the blade are engraved as is the spine. The wire on the grip is two strands, but I think it's a bit tighter than that shown on the Cold Steel blade. Not absolutely sure. I will say the sword purchased from the Marine Exchange and that from Cold Steel are very much superior to blades obtained from China or India.
The saber you are reviewing is the NCO sword. The Marine Officer's saber is a Mameluke patterned sword with what was originally an ivory hilt. It is a copy of a sword presented to Lt. Presley O'Bannon by the Bey of Tripoli after the capture of Derna in 1805. (That's the source of "the shores of Tripoli" line in the Marine Hymn.) It was adopted as the pattern of the Marine Officer's sword in 1825, although it was not carried by Marine officers for about 15 years starting in the Civil War when regulations required they carry the Army 1850 foot officers sword. It is secured with two brass round fixtures showing a star detail. There is no metal knuckle bow, only a brass cross guard. The hilt is pierced at the rounded end and a double strand leather braid is threaded through and tied around the brass cross guard with a clove hitch knot. The knot's crossing is always on the outside, visible when worn with the two parallel strands on the inside of the guard. The braid ends with a sword knot which today is a simulated piece. The braid is always present if the sword is worn. The officers scabbard is chrome steel today. In all it is very much like the 1831 British Officers Mameluke pattern sword you reviewed some years ago but the cross guard is not engraved, it's smooth brass. The shape of the hilt and the guard is essentially the same except for that detail.
I bought mine some time ago and it did come with two washers in a little bag in the box, which i had almost thrown away by mistake.
OK, I get that Cold Steel are good but not great. So... where can I get a great replica?
Great question, too bad it was met with crickets.
I have researched a little bit and have found that the Marine Corps Systems Command has regulations in regards to the manufacturing of this sword (I'm a former Marine and was actually stationed at Quantico where MARCOR SYSCOM is, or was when I was there in the '90's). I didn't know this about the sword until recently. As NCO's we had to learn to the sword manual for drill. Bermejo of Toledo Spain might be the best. You're looking in the U.S. to spend about $500 or so. They claim to be the only certified USMC NCO sword in the world, however, there are one or two other manufacturers that claim to use the MARCOR SYSCOM specifications. I think it's key to look for that. Otherwise, who knows what you're getting. There seem to be so many for under $100 probably for display or just cake cutting. Anyway, you won't pay any less that $350 for a steal of a deal, possibly. The more you pay the better the result most likely.... from Bermejo, Toledo Spain.
I have a Cold Steel Navy 1917 Cutlass that's pretty heavy and the wooden grip on the hilt is hard keep firm without it sliding around in my hand..I want to wrap it with leather string and the basket guard cuts into your forefinger knuckle.
I got one of these a few days ago, it came with a leather washer and was sharpened all the way down the blade, but the etching on yours looks better
Hi, may I ask you where did you get it? I cannot find anywhere.
I hear these are intended to be a dress sword one could actually use in a pinch as dress swords are not made to be actually used. Better than a wall-hanger anyway.
I picked one of these up for £170 (Brand new) and for that it's very good value
I've had good experiences with their knives and utilities (machetes, shovels, kitchen ware), but I've never gotten a sword from them.
The saber your reviewing is a USMC Noncommissioned Officers sword, it is a ceremonial sword. It is not supposed to be sharpened nor is it allowed to be. It does have little give to allow it be used during ceremonies, some NCO’s just get too nervous when preforming with this sword.
I have the (mis)fortune of owning a Cold Steel Talwar. I noticed a substantial amount of rattle when I first tested it. Lo and behold, the famous "disc" pommel was actually just a nut and a plate that was literally threaded on to the tang.
I remember you said real talwars are glued on to the hilt and I didn't believe it. Well, if the manufacturers used white school glue, it would have been a lot better than the screw-on job that I had.
As owner of Albion - The Knight, a review would please me :D
This is NOT the USMC Officer's SWORD, it is the USMC NCO Sword. (Sword is the term used by the USMC for both weapons.) Officers carry the Mameluke Sword to commemorate the battle of Tripoli. Just a fact check by an old USMC SGT. That said, very good product review.
Matt, That isn't an officer's sword. It's an NCO sword (enlisted) , the officer's sword is the Mameluke Sword. Semper Fidelis! Love your videos.
Ah, you beat me to it ;)
Thanks - I have corrected.
scholagladiatoria I got to do a little sword drill in the Marine Corps, but the ones we had were pretty much strictly for show. Occasionally someone would try to cut something with them and the blade would snap and they'd have to go replace it. No idea what brand they were, but they were very cheap I believe. I didn't realize the cold steel version was actually capable of cutting something if sharpened. Thank you for the review.
My Father was a Gunny and he passed away in the 80's. Thank you for your service!!!
The Marine swords are made by a British Razor Blade company, Wilkinson sword . . . . I prefer German razors honestly.
Cold Steel should probably send him a couple of decent blades, if only as PR damage control.
They wont send him any examples because they cant handle good critiques aka they will get buthurt if he points what is wrong with them
In fairness, I was pleasantly surprised by this sabre. The distal taper on it was much better than I expected and it handles okay.
Yeah but cold steel over estimate their products and have huge prices wich as you said you could make something custom and much better quality
I'll probably get one then.
I was both an enlisted, then an officer way back when.
I had both swords once, but they were the cheap ceremony ones.
I want to put as real a version of both swords on my wall somewhere.
Since they're used in sword drill, they should be able to be handled reasonably with all the snappy wrist movements we had to do for parade... and for carrying it while marching for what seemed like eternity. Lol. I've thought about it only recently and figured they probably need to meet certain specs for drill if anything. They didn't bother telling us stuff about weights and quality. We used what the battalion or company had and you were lucky to find a sword that actually fit you. I do remember there were blades with different lengths, usually shorter than the standard 32 inch or something. We were told if we had the money, that we could order a sword with a shorter blade based on our height as the blade tip was supposed to reach to your ear, or no higher than your ear lobe or something like that.
I've heard that American military policy, at least for cavalry, was to sharpen only the tip of a saber and use the rest of the blade for parrying. The reason being that you would either thrust the weapon or only be able to slash with the tip due to the increased distance from a man on foot to a man on horseback.
Would love to see an actual antique of this NCO sword & the Mamaluk officer sword. Something that wasn't just a show piece. Please and thank you. BTW love this channel!
You say the Cold Steel 1796 Light Cavalry Saber is not as nimble as the originals (obviously); but in your opinion, is it still a good weapon on foot?
I own a cold steel 1917 cutlass (read klewang). I wasn't too comfortable with how it felt so I got ahold of a friend who owns several original 1917 cutlasses. Sure enough, the thing felt like a brick compared to the originals. The cold steel cutlass has a thicker blade and zero distal taper, so it's not surprise where the extra weight comes from. Its very well made, and of high quality. But Matt, as I'm sure you know, there's a difference between quality and functionality. :/
Good stuff you got here. I'd like to see more cold steel reviews in the future. Let me know you thoughts on their italian longsword if you get your hands on one. It has a distal taper and feels very lively in the hands, at least for me.
Many U.S. Civil war sabers are sharpened like this. I believe the thought behind it was for the base of the sword to be used only for parrying.
Interesting, great review.
As a former United State's Marine, You have no Idea how useful that'd be.
What do you mean by your comment please? Would you be willing to elaborate?
Eric Montford
I think he's just saying that actually having a sword would have been useful.
I mean a carbon sword capable of being used in an emergency and also cutting.
What a strange sight it would be to see U.S. Marines on patrol with swords on their hips.
Laitharex
Ah! Yes indeed. 8-)
Hello Matt! I hope u're fine. I have some questions :
1) After Napoleon's Egyptian campaign , Some French and British officers started using " Mamleuke saber" a type of saber adopted from the Mamluks of Egypt very similair to the Shamshir. I'd like to know your opinion about this sword.
2) Was the Shamshir used excalty like the Tulwar ?
Thnx for answering and have a good day :)
Napoleon's Mamelouks were an honorary Guard mainly: they had wild colorfull oufits and fancy weapons (flanged maces, daggers styled after Jambiyas, blunderbusses, axes, etc). Actually, they were a very tiny subdivision of the Garde Impériale, and always stayed an extremely low number (never more than 200). The crowd liked them at parades, so much that it started (along with the Egypt campaign itself) the whole orientalist trend.
The early recruits were real "Arabs", and the shamshir was their native and usual saber they brought back with them to France, as long as they already belonged to fighting "casts" before entering Napoleon's army. So they probably used it quite well and as it should be. But sabers were also made in France, styled after oriental shamshirs. This wasn't a regulation pattern, but french-made shamshir used to be made in the Klingenthal manufacture, with a blade quite similar to the Cold Steel Shamshir, but various kinds of hilts.
Klingenthal bladesmiths were very highly capable men, as capable as the Solingen ones, and given a blade they could have made a perfect copy of it, but with the experience they got from spending their whole life forging saber blades all day long, and tight quality control. Some sabers had engravings to accentuate the "fanciness" of the Mamelouk look: engravers basically put everything they thought was exotic and mysterious.
MadNumForce Thnx i appreciate that :)
Regarding the grip, NCO sabers have leather covered grips per regulation while officers have sharkskin.
Matt, the American sold models are also only sharpened on the last 3rd of the blade. My understanding from my son who was a Marine,is that the actually NCO sword are almost blunted. The idea of the sharping of the last 3rd on the Cold Steel models is to have a trusting blade with limited cutting edge so that the maneuvers required by NCO can be performed safely.
William Phillips im pretty sure actual NCO swords are fully blunt, but sabers in general are usually only sharp at the end because thats all youre going to be cutting with, the rest is for blocking
turtle79070 Actually sabres in general are sharpened all the way down. Partial sharpening is a US idiosyncrasy and is mostly seen on swords from the civil war. English, French, German and other European sabres from the 18th century through to the first world war are all sharpened along the entire edge, at least on the antiques. As Matt pointed out there are partially sharpened European swords, but they are straight thrusting swords like the British 1895 infantry officers' sword and not sabres.
You should make a video about the swords that look really good visually to you. I love your videos mate keep up the good work 👍👍👍
hey Matt - the grip wire 'rate of twist' on that particular { post 1900 } 1872 usmc NCO model is historically accurate , it looks cheap ,... but thats how the marines liked it
I like the most simple functional ambidextrous handle guards
Don't like those ornamented handle guard.
It not an officers sword, it is a noncommissioned officer sword ( corporals and above in the enlisted side of the service)
I'm surprised CS did as well as they have on it. Most of their other swords are big clunky beaters, not really suited to historical fencing. If I purchased anything from them it would likely be their tomahawks or their pole axe / dane axe models. Those tend to be a bit better in their execution though most still need some post purchase work.
How much is this in UK..just for curiosity ? Here in Romania this saber costs just 260 euros.
In the US, you can find these for as low as $130 ($115 Euros)
Please note that the Cold Steel brand is not an authorized (for use in drill and ceremony) version of the Marine NCO sword.
it's based on the modern dress sword worn by Marine corps non commissioned officers sword that's based on the m1851 saber
that sword matches regulations almost exactly but has more the weak sharpened in full
the regulation version I've handled a few timed in two blade lengths
I have a CS heavy cavalry sabre. Pretty decent item no complaints, super sturdy. It's just ridiculously huge, more of a spear than a sword.
The U.S. 1860 heavy cavalry saber is modeled after the French 1822 light infantry saber... with a shorter blade. The French 1822 heavy cavalry saber had a straight blade with a 10mm thick spine at the guard. In the meanwhile, tactics had changed, and as far as I know the U.S. Army never had anything like what was the heavy cavalry from the French army (namely Cuirassiers and Carabiniers à cheval), this explaining that. But a heavy cavalry saber is supposed to be quite large and strong, as heavy cavalry doesn't manoeuvre much in workaround and flanking moves, but has a huge striking power to litterally smash and crush an ennemy formation with a frontal straight-in-the-middle charge. Their saber, in this kind of tactic, is supposed to be used almost as the spears of medieval knights. Gun progress outdated this kind of slow-moving units with few to no firing power.
But everybody knows CS also has a tendancy to overbuild sabers... often in the wrong spots, which makes them feel tip heavy, or just "heavy", if you can't compare to an antique.
Thanks for the info, I never bothered to research it that deeply.
Matt you got any idea where to get some good quality sabers i.e British officer sabers ?
Anyone know of places I can get left handed or symmetrical sabers?
HOLY SHIT A SWORD THAT ACTUALLY GOES "SHIIINNK"
drew avery Most swords will if the scabbard has a metal throat.
Lindy does not approve
We Marines want this sword because it IS a sword and not a cake cutter. I am not interested in the little things as much. Thank you for the informative video.
I'm seriously just looking for a functional army NCO saber. I'm authorized to wear one, but don't want to drop 3-400 bucks on a "ceremonial" piece. all of which are stainless steel.
I assume these are Windlass swords from India like most of their swords. I own a Cold Steel baskethilt that was manufactured by Windlass. It's quite heavy and the balance is not quite there. It's good for whacking bottles and other objects and I removed the odd tassel and basket liner to make it look a bit less gaudy. Interestingly, it does have the leather washer between the hilt and the blade base.
Honestly, I never checked. I will when I get the chance. I bought mine at a discount (in the US), so I thought that the sword was okay for the price point. "Better" baskethilts (such as Armour Class) are much more expensive and difficult to find here. Holding my Cold Steel baskethilt in a hanging guard or trying any finer movements is somewhat difficult. It has proven to be quite durable though!
I actually like many Cold Steel products, so I don't want to bash the company too badly. For what I paid for it, I'm happy. I just think that others who are HEMA practitioners need to know what they're in for when they are shopping.
I do not know if you have had a chance to handle one, but just so you are aware, the actual saber's issued to officer's and NCO's in the USMC today are made by Weyersburg Kirschbaum and Company in Solingen Germany. Rather than this Cold Steel copy.
To be fair, unless I am mistaken this is not meant to be entirely historically accurate since it is a ceremonial sword for modern US marines. Speaking as an American. So if it does not measure up to historical standards, I feel that it is acceptable
Mine from the Marines was from Toledo Spain
Matt, I don't want to sound like I fuss, but you keep refering to the French "1855" infantry saber. The real pattern is from 1845 actually, and in 1855 the modification was to swap to a metal scabbard. Otherwise, they have been so many different makes of that pattern over the decades it's hard to tell by the details is there should have been a regulation difference between the 1845 and 1855 version. It seems from 1855 the officier version had a slightly smaller blade, but that probably isn't blindingly obvious, even to the experienced eye.
I have two of them (1845/55), one seems to be pre-1855 (it came with the remains of a leather scabbard), but is relatively poorly made (low hilt casting quality with crude details, uneven fullers, warped blade, relatively short and yet somewhat tip heavy, doesn't flex in an even arc, unpleasant grip shape -the one the US selected for their NCO saber, btw- and sloppy pommel fitting, etc), another seems more recent (the date on the spine has become illegible sadly) but is very very nice on every aspect (at there are traces the guard was gilded). It seems there is no rule at all regarding this pattern date and version, but the base model is from 1845. Mine both have a horn handle, by the way.
Also, both the nice 1845 and an antique 1821 french infantry saber I have (which had engravings on the blade and a gilded hilt) do have the same "defect" of having the main guard branch sligthly tilted to the side. It's difficult to say if it was on purpose or fortuitous. While the U.S. Marines NCO saber has the worst kind of French 1845 hilt (pommel/handle transition making an angle), it does bear a British styled blade, with the single fuller design, centered "spear" point (while the French 1845 has a very distinctive blade style), relatively long ricasso and invasive etching, especially the King David star (it would have been shoking on a french sword, and I still really don't get why it's on British 19th century regulation patterns by the way).
Quite wierd animal that U.S. Marine's NCO saber...
CS blades always look great on their own videos but I''ve heard nothing but criticism from independent reviewers re' handle durability. I'd certainly never pay money for one.
Really? I kind of get a little bit of that feeling when it comes to their swords, but I can say that the majority of their knives are 100% solid. Their machetes are also very good if you do not mind spending some time putting a good edge on it.
from all the older marine navy army and air force presentation swords none of them are ever sharpened, but then there are the ones that are specifically sharpened for parade for exhibition, and everyone has heard the stories of the ear getting hacked off when the sword is snapped upwards to attention, but when i was in in the early 1980s i never got to see it happen. but i did fall at attention when on parade and i landed face down hands at my side so i fell right
It would be cool if you would compare it to an actual marine NCO sword, cold steel only makes replicas, the USMC buys them from Weyersburg, Kirschbaum and Company,
Thanks for the video. This is a copy of the NCO sword. They weren't authorized by the USMC last I knew.
What would they need an authorization for? Its not like USMC has s patent on sabers
True - the officer's mameluke is still patterned closely after one presented to Marine First Lieutenant Presley O'Bannon by the Ottoman Empire viceroy, Prince Hamet, on December 8, 1805, during the First Barbary War, as a gesture of respect and praise for the Marines' actions at the Battle of Derne.
Sabers are for ground-pounding NCOs. ;-)
+Bj Hamblin Also - the USMC NCO Saber is actually quite closely patterned on the US Army's M1853 Officers Sword - Though it's understandable why French patterns would be very similar as even the last cavalry saber issued by the US Army was designed by Patton, an Olympic Fencer and huge fan of European Military History and Practice.
You may have from me the same, whether in steel or Spring steel Blades
Hey there, I got their Civilian Saber..not thrilled with the fact that it came dull...they said I can send it back and they'll treat as a warranty issue..but that will be a nightmare and I may have to pay a lot in customs/shipping again...do you have a sharpening how-to video? If not could you? thanks
I remember reading once that the original Marine sabre was adopted after the U.S. defeated the Barbary Coast pirates, and an American naval officer was given a Mameluke sword as a gift. How closely is the modern American model based off of that Egyptian sabre, and how does it compare combat-wise?
The Mameluke sword (not the one reviewed here) was awarded to Lt Presley O'Bannon (USMC not USN) by Prince Hamet for his service during the Barbary Pirate Wars. The Marine Corp then adopted the design for its officers up to the US Civil War where they started to issue the saber that is the father of the sword reviewed here. After the Civil War, the officers went back to being issued the Mameluke sword, and the other swords were then given to NCO's in recognition of their service to the Corps.
Although I can't say for sure but I suspect that the original sword presented Lt. Presley O'Bannon probably had a more curved blade than the current one does. As for combat usability, the pattern used during the 1800s was found to be too light for combat by Marine officers so they went back to the Pattern 1850 sword which the Marine NCO sword is based on.
All of the examples I have seen of the cold steel sabers have the leather washer on it. I wonder why this one did not have the washer?
It could be that Marine regulations don't call for a washer and/or may expressly forbid a washer. Remember, this not a replica of a historical sword per se but a ceremonial weapon used by actual Marine NCOs. To see this, and the officer's sword in action just look up Marine change of command ceremonies or pass in reviews here on TH-cam and you'll see how they're used.
Very well done review! Thank you very much for sharing. 8-)
it's thrust based that's why it sharped like that I forgot that
Being a mailler, I can tell you that brass wire isn't cheap. By putting fewer twists in it they're saving 30-50% of what they would otherwise use, if they were being historically accurate.
their swords are hella expensive for the amount of rattle they tend to have, and matt did say the brass fittings were a bit thicker than antique specimens, which would give you a decent amount of extra brass wiring.
PsylomeAlpha Brass guard, or brass plate guard? I'd wager the latter, based on the cost factor.
morallyambiguousnet
I'm guessing, since I haven't seen anything saying their brass is just aluminum that's been plated in brass, or something along those lines, even though I've read dozens of bad reviews on cold steel, that they're full brass. whether or not it's high quality brass through and through is another story. it could be shitty brass coated in a thin layer of high quality brass.
I came across a sabre looking like this, only it did not have "Cold steel" etched near the pommel but rather "440 stainless steel", any idea what kind of replica it would be?
Edit: Seems like the etchings are not "frosted" either.
I believe you were reviewing one british nonreg sword once, and it was dull in its first half by design.
That is an NCO sword! I don't think it is regulation/USMC authorized!!! -Gunny T sends
Would this sword be a good solo trainer in terms of balance, weight, handling, durability?
Sabres and swords are used for drill and ceremony right?
It’s built by Windlass India,I have done work on these swords
Pretty good *schwing*, heh
Real USMC swords are only manufactured by Weyersberg, Kirschbaum and Company in Germany. They're sold only to Marlow White, Officers' Equipment, and The Marine Shop, & they are purely ceremonial. Neither the officer or the NCO sword has a hand guard and both have a serial number at the bottom of the handle.
If the blade were to be straight, what would this sword be classiffied as?
Too bad cold steel won't send you samples. Youre the pro in my book and I would have loved to know
+Roberto Bravo They don't want a pro telling people their products are bunk.
What do you know about the 1913 US Cavalry Saber(the Patton Saber)? It's a straight blade, so i imagine it is used differently from curved sabers.
more thrusts, less cutting, but still a decent amount.
All Cold Steel Marine NCO swords now no longer are enscribed with United States Marines. The blade has Marines only. The Star of Damascus or Star of David is also no longer on the blade either. I sent the one I ordered back. The only thing I can figure out is that only certain blade makers are authorized by the Marine Corps and Cold Steel is not on the list. Either the Marine Corps or one of the authorized sword makers told them to stop.