Ah Clarion...While the other boys were fawning over that blond, doe-eyed Aleena, my heart belonged to that raven-haired shieldmaiden with the dark eyes. That must be why I have always preferred brunettes to blondes....
@@becmiberserker I have told them stories about the style of play in the 80s and they look down their nose at it. You should see the look on their faces when I tell them about demihuman race is their class.
Creates a quarter-hour video. Says "it is long" at the end because of all the intro material. Says later episodes will refer back to this one. Proceeds to make 3 more half-hour videos.
We always took the XP bonus off of the total needed to reach the next level. Only calculate it once for the total XP needed, then add the XP the DM gives you to the XP you already had.
I totally forgot how fewer hit points you get in this edition. Even in 2nd edition, that I'm currently playing, you get so many more. Man I miss this 😊edition.
Very thorough presentation of how to generate a cleric! Easy to follow for a new player. It's a good reminder for experienced players to see how easy it was to roll up a character at any level for a quick session. 5e requires stepping through to make choices on abilities and class skills, and takes a bit longer. Thanks!
Nice video! I've been re-reading the Karameikos Gazetteer and I'm reminded that one thing I love about BECMI's Known World is that different religions really are different belief systems. In Karameikos, there are two major churches: the Church of Karameikos and the Church of Traladar. While both are Lawful, and basically what we'd recognize as good, they approach things in very different ways. So, once you choose the Cleric class, the next step is to choose your religion. The one you choose won't change your powers, but it will radically affect how you play your cleric, because different churches have different belief systems, which you presumably would be expected to uphold and presumably believe in. To me, that's a very different feel than Domains in 5e or even Mythos Priests in 2e. Your religion doesn't change your powers, but it does change the whole way you'd roleplay your character. It's a feel I like, because a lot of fantasy worlds, TBH, don't have very amazing religions, but Known World religions are usually really interesting.
You mention a really good point. They influence how you okay your cleric. Although it could be argued that Domains can have the same effect, I would argue that they’re actually just another build feature.
I love your videos! Thanks for doing this. I also have many questions: Who rolls for the turning? The player or the dm? I always thought the dm rolled for the turning and the player rolled for the hit dice turned? Also confused about how the undead should act. Do they run away - out of sight/room? Do they cease to be turned if they are attacked and hit? How long do they flee for? When/if they come back can they be turned again? Is it auto turn since you already proved you could turn them? Failures cannot be re-attempted in same encounter. So if you run away, you can come back and try again? You open a door and you see undead. You try and fail to turn them. You close the door. Open the door and try again? Perhaps I am overthinking it? Still seems like questions that will come up in game play. Can't wait for the other classes, keep up the good work! Lastly, where are the skills found? I didn't see them in the Basic book.
Hi. I’ll try to answer your questions one by one. 1. I’ve always played it that the player rolls the dice for both Turning and Hit Dice. 2. The Rules Cyclopedia states that the undead will retreat. The DM’s book in the Basic Rules boxed set states that undead will leave. I interpret both to mean flee from the cleric. 3. In the Red Box, it states that undead will stay away for 1-10 rounds. 4. There’s no specific information on attacking a turned undead, however I would have undead defend themselves if cornered and cannot get away. 5. Undead may return if they are hostile after a Reaction roll. 6. Turning attempt may be retried. There’s no auto success just for having turned the creature before. 7. Re-attempts are ambiguous. I would do whatever seems sensible. Obviously, walking out of a room and back in again does not seem sensible, but coming back at another time seems better. I would say at least an hour. 8. Not overthinking, just asking questions. Frank Mentzer always encourages players of BECMI to play it the way you want to. If you do that, you can’t go wrong because it’s right for you. Hope this helps. Take care.
Looking forwards to the rest of the series. The RC dropped level titles, which I always thought was a bit of a shame. It was extra bookkeeping and required players to either learn the titles or be bewildered by npc introductions, but I thought they brought a little extra to the game. Never forget the first time I met a halfling sword master, who massively outclassed our 1st level party
The front of the sheet I just found online and I’ve created extra pages in that design. I’ve had a few people ask this, so I’ll make it more user friendly (it’s on PowerPoint atm) and pop into a shared folder when I get a bit of time.
Your videos are great and I’m looking forward to seeing all the classes and races put up. Wonderful job! I also used Clarions picture when I made a cleric character all those many years ago! Such a BEAUTY.
Fantastic and what a good series idea! Can’t wait for the next one. May have said before - for ability scores, looking at the sample characters in the red box Basic, the rules clearly expected players to roll 4d6 and drop one. Ty BB!
I avoided including the adjustments in the tables, hence why I didn’t include the weapon mastery attack bonuses in the hit roll table, but I take your point. 🙂
One interesting point about reversed spells is that the Rules Cyclopedia (pg.33) says Clerics can choose at point of casting whether to cast them in normal or reverse form. However, in the original D&D Expert rules (pg.3) it notes that lawful Clerics, like the one in your example, prefer the normal version of spells and would only cast the reverse of a spell in life-or- death situations. This is a fun way to make your chaotic Clerics truely chaotic, as they would prefer Cause Light Wound over Cure Light Wound and Darkness rather than Light.
I always wondered why clerics were allowed to fight but not use edged weapons. I found an explanation I liked in of all places a conan comicbook. Conan met a priest of Mitra who used a mace. When asked, the priest claim he was not allowed by his god to shed blood, but as a mace had no edged points, thus was not intended to shed blood. When conan pointed out that his mace was drawing a lot of blood from bashing villains, the priest said that the inventions of men are imperfect and he cannot be at fault for that.
@@smithryansmith I think the root influence was actually a Norman priest at the Battle of Hastings called Odo of Bayeux, who is depicted wielding a club in the Bayeux Tapestry because he did not want to shed blood. 🙂
Race as class is the biggest bugbear for this edition of D&D for most people (me included), which is why I separate them out, rename the "race classes" as the closest multiclass appropriate, and race pretty much just adds flavor. Just a thought for anyone out there who also doesn't like race as class.
The front of the sheet I just found online and I’ve created extra pages in that design. I’ve had a few people ask this, so I’ll make it more user friendly (it’s on PowerPoint atm) and pop into a shared folder when I get a bit of time.
Rules as written, no. It’s not clear why, when the Avenger (high level chaotic fighter) can. Perhaps it was to make the Avenger extra special. All that being said, if you want your chaotic clerics to control undead then you go for it.
Cleric/Paladin is at once my favorite fantasy hero archetype and often my least-favorite when relating to the lore and worldbuilding of individual settings. In an explicitly and aggressively Christian fantasy setting with just the one Church and the one God and the Holy Symbols being Wooden and Silver Crosses, I'm all over it in every way. The class is expressly based on Dr. Van Helsing's opposition to Count Dracula and aesthetically cribs from the Knights Templar and other Christian crusaders to fit the medieval high fantasy vibe of knightly Fighting Men and Merlin- or Gandalf-like Magic-Users. Combined with fantasy Henotheism where there's hundreds or thousands of gods/immortals to worship and everyone still picks just one instead of praying to whoever in their pantheon actually fits the situation...and the clerics still use flanged maces, mail hauberks, surcoats with crosses on them, and pray in very Christian looking cathedrals and wear miters? Still having Biblical miracles fill out most of the "spell list"? Just feels off. Doesn't help that I usually hate every single individual god in any of such settings. Leaving it more vague and letting the class be vaguely aligned to something like a pursuit of Law, of Truth, of Justice, or the like feels better. A vaguely defined good Higher Power. Mechanically I'll always love mixed warrior/spellcasters, which the Cleric was compared to the Fighting Man and Magic User. I also don't like having a spell list that lacks the ability to heal injuries, which is a conspicuous shortcoming to my eye of the Elf. So for me in OD&D and BD&D, it's the Cleric as my mainstay; in later versions of the game, it's any mix of Paladin, Ranger, Bard, or subclasses/prestige classes that mix magic into a martial class or add a bit of weapon and armor proficiency to an otherwise squishy caster. Bladesinger, Eldritch Knight, Hexblade, and my personal setting's classes Swordcerer and Edgelord.
I'm not sure why TH-cam recommended this series to me (I got recommended the fighter video and came here since I have no idea what BECMI is). I remember watching Treantmonk's video talking about the previous editions of D&D and while he never mentioned BECMI, this definitely feels like the AD&D/2e-era of D&D. Very limiting on the type of characters you can play (especially with race restrictions, like what do you mean non-human races are their own classes?), seemingly lots and lots of tables to refer to, and weird math like THAC0 which I'm still unsure as to how it even works. Probably the part that hurts the most is that if you wanted to play a cleric and rolled poorly for Wisdom, you either should just play a different class entirely or be heavily penalized where everyone will start to outrank you... instead of being able to just fulfill your concept of a character. And the hard cap on health levels 10-36 is so bizarre. The video itself was perfectly fine, but as someone who's been playing D&D 5th edition and is looking to get into Pathfinder 2nd edition, BECMI doesn't sound fun just from character creation alone.
Hello. I’m pleased the video got recommended to you nonetheless, and thank you for your comment. Obviously, there is such a departure from older versions of Dungeons and Dragons with the latest 5th edition. I’ve done videos on why I left 5th, which might offer you a counter view. And I’ve also done a series about the BECMI edition of the game if you wish to learn more about the origins of the game and I can tempt you to spend your precious time watching them, just so that some of your questions might be answered. It’s all opinion anyway, so I hope you continue to enjoy whichever version of the game you prefer.
@@becmiberserker I'll consider it! Learning about the origins of the game is kinda interesting for me, I was surprised to recognize so many spells in the cleric's spell list.
I always rule that you can play any race you want when there are races as classes. But the 'racial classes' are the cultural fighting style of those people. But I have never had a player become a Cleric. Paladins sure, but never a Cleric.
That Elmore illustration of the Cleric in the Red Box makes me want to play D&D more than any other image.
Ah Clarion...While the other boys were fawning over that blond, doe-eyed Aleena, my heart belonged to that raven-haired shieldmaiden with the dark eyes. That must be why I have always preferred brunettes to blondes....
I have to agree with this statement.
I don't think I've played this flavor of D&D since about 1985. You make me miss it. My sons and I occasionally play 5e.
Try it out on your sons. 🙂
@@becmiberserker I have told them stories about the style of play in the 80s and they look down their nose at it.
You should see the look on their faces when I tell them about demihuman race is their class.
I’m going to have to do a video on that. 🤔
A Cleric was my first D&D character ever. I still have that character sheet. Fond memories ^^
Me too! No one else wanted to be the boring cleric. They regretted that later! 😜
Well dang, I guess now you're going to have to do a video on every class in the RC and the Gazeteers...
Erm… 🤔
Creates a quarter-hour video.
Says "it is long" at the end because of all the intro material.
Says later episodes will refer back to this one.
Proceeds to make 3 more half-hour videos.
My concept of time is questionable. 😊
i love the turn undead table. straight outta Chainmail!
I’m going to follow this series and create a party for Nights Dark Terror.
Don't forget to add the bonus XP for the prime requisite when gaining 300k XP. 😀
I already accounted for it in her reaching 300,000XP. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it! 👀
We always took the XP bonus off of the total needed to reach the next level. Only calculate it once for the total XP needed, then add the XP the DM gives you to the XP you already had.
@@jaybakata5566 Makes sense. Then just recalculate if your number changes.
I don't think you've missed on a video yet. Keep up the good work, Berserker.
I totally forgot how fewer hit points you get in this edition. Even in 2nd edition, that I'm currently playing, you get so many more. Man I miss this 😊edition.
Very thorough presentation of how to generate a cleric! Easy to follow for a new player. It's a good reminder for experienced players to see how easy it was to roll up a character at any level for a quick session. 5e requires stepping through to make choices on abilities and class skills, and takes a bit longer. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Nice video! I've been re-reading the Karameikos Gazetteer and I'm reminded that one thing I love about BECMI's Known World is that different religions really are different belief systems. In Karameikos, there are two major churches: the Church of Karameikos and the Church of Traladar. While both are Lawful, and basically what we'd recognize as good, they approach things in very different ways. So, once you choose the Cleric class, the next step is to choose your religion. The one you choose won't change your powers, but it will radically affect how you play your cleric, because different churches have different belief systems, which you presumably would be expected to uphold and presumably believe in. To me, that's a very different feel than Domains in 5e or even Mythos Priests in 2e. Your religion doesn't change your powers, but it does change the whole way you'd roleplay your character. It's a feel I like, because a lot of fantasy worlds, TBH, don't have very amazing religions, but Known World religions are usually really interesting.
You mention a really good point. They influence how you okay your cleric. Although it could be argued that Domains can have the same effect, I would argue that they’re actually just another build feature.
YES! Looking forward to this series. Thanks for your dedication to the BECMI rules system
More amazing content from the Berserker. BECMI lives!
It's interesting to see how similar things in BECMI are to B/X. Great video as always!
Hardly any difference at all.
excited by this new series. thanks for the great content, mate
Thank you, and you’re welcome.
Marvelous! Greatly looking forward to the demihuman classes!
I love your videos! Thanks for doing this.
I also have many questions: Who rolls for the turning? The player or the dm? I always thought the dm rolled for the turning and the player rolled for the hit dice turned?
Also confused about how the undead should act. Do they run away - out of sight/room? Do they cease to be turned if they are attacked and hit?
How long do they flee for? When/if they come back can they be turned again? Is it auto turn since you already proved you could turn them?
Failures cannot be re-attempted in same encounter. So if you run away, you can come back and try again? You open a door and you see undead. You try and fail to turn them. You close the door. Open the door and try again?
Perhaps I am overthinking it? Still seems like questions that will come up in game play.
Can't wait for the other classes, keep up the good work!
Lastly, where are the skills found? I didn't see them in the Basic book.
Hi. I’ll try to answer your questions one by one.
1. I’ve always played it that the player rolls the dice for both Turning and Hit Dice.
2. The Rules Cyclopedia states that the undead will retreat. The DM’s book in the Basic Rules boxed set states that undead will leave. I interpret both to mean flee from the cleric.
3. In the Red Box, it states that undead will stay away for 1-10 rounds.
4. There’s no specific information on attacking a turned undead, however I would have undead defend themselves if cornered and cannot get away.
5. Undead may return if they are hostile after a Reaction roll.
6. Turning attempt may be retried. There’s no auto success just for having turned the creature before.
7. Re-attempts are ambiguous. I would do whatever seems sensible. Obviously, walking out of a room and back in again does not seem sensible, but coming back at another time seems better. I would say at least an hour.
8. Not overthinking, just asking questions. Frank Mentzer always encourages players of BECMI to play it the way you want to. If you do that, you can’t go wrong because it’s right for you.
Hope this helps. Take care.
This really helpful as I am considering running a BECMI DnD campaign in the near future!
Looking forwards to the rest of the series.
The RC dropped level titles, which I always thought was a bit of a shame. It was extra bookkeeping and required players to either learn the titles or be bewildered by npc introductions, but I thought they brought a little extra to the game.
Never forget the first time I met a halfling sword master, who massively outclassed our 1st level party
Yes! Dropping the titles was a loss. It gave a little flavour to the game.
What a great idea for a series! ⚔🔥😎
Hope you like it!
Been waiting for you to do this kind of series! This is the type of information that will be of great benefit to someone looking at BECMI.
You’re welcome.
BECMI has so many great topics to make videos on so you shall have plenty to do!@@becmiberserker
Another great video. Well done man.
Much appreciated!
Great start to the series! Are you going to cover the Druid and Mystic classes too?
Honourable mention episodes after the core seven planned. 👍
I had a huge crush on Clarion growing up...
Using the RC you can make Demi humans with classes, the back of said book details how.
Love it! Thanks for all the great content!
Can you post a link to the version of character sheet you are using? Thanks for the great content!
Where can we get the character sheet you used? I've been looking for a BECMI character sheet that I like, and yours is spot on.
The front of the sheet I just found online and I’ve created extra pages in that design. I’ve had a few people ask this, so I’ll make it more user friendly (it’s on PowerPoint atm) and pop into a shared folder when I get a bit of time.
Your videos are great and I’m looking forward to seeing all the classes and races put up. Wonderful job! I also used Clarions picture when I made a cleric character all those many years ago! Such a BEAUTY.
Fantastic and what a good series idea! Can’t wait for the next one. May have said before - for ability scores, looking at the sample characters in the red box Basic, the rules clearly expected players to roll 4d6 and drop one. Ty BB!
Wisdom save +2 = that last saving throw= 13 vs spells
I avoided including the adjustments in the tables, hence why I didn’t include the weapon mastery attack bonuses in the hit roll table, but I take your point. 🙂
I love your content!
One interesting point about reversed spells is that the Rules Cyclopedia (pg.33) says Clerics can choose at point of casting whether to cast them in normal or reverse form. However, in the original D&D Expert rules (pg.3) it notes that lawful Clerics, like the one in your example, prefer the normal version of spells and would only cast the reverse of a spell in life-or- death situations.
This is a fun way to make your chaotic Clerics truely chaotic, as they would prefer Cause Light Wound over Cure Light Wound and Darkness rather than Light.
Hum... I need to look back at that HP thing while passing a lot of levels and rhe CON adj...
It was overlooked by many. Mostly deliberately. 🙂
I loved this! Thank you very much!
You're so welcome!
wow! Just found your channel very recently! Loving these videos, subbed and liked!
Thank you. That means a lot. 🙂
I always wondered why clerics were allowed to fight but not use edged weapons.
I found an explanation I liked in of all places a conan comicbook. Conan met a priest of Mitra who used a mace. When asked, the priest claim he was not allowed by his god to shed blood, but as a mace had no edged points, thus was not intended to shed blood. When conan pointed out that his mace was drawing a lot of blood from bashing villains, the priest said that the inventions of men are imperfect and he cannot be at fault for that.
@@smithryansmith I think the root influence was actually a Norman priest at the Battle of Hastings called Odo of Bayeux, who is depicted wielding a club in the Bayeux Tapestry because he did not want to shed blood. 🙂
@@becmiberserker That is very possible.
Can only use half that warhammer - naughty cleric - the Martel-de-fer (warhammer) it’s basically an ice pick
I miss these cleric arguments :)
Yeah. The ethics of beating someone to a pulp over slicing them up into salami is worth a debate by the Oxford Union, imho. 🙂
Race as class is the biggest bugbear for this edition of D&D for most people (me included), which is why I separate them out, rename the "race classes" as the closest multiclass appropriate, and race pretty much just adds flavor. Just a thought for anyone out there who also doesn't like race as class.
Where can I get that Character sheet ?? It looks awesome!!!!!!!!
The front of the sheet I just found online and I’ve created extra pages in that design. I’ve had a few people ask this, so I’ll make it more user friendly (it’s on PowerPoint atm) and pop into a shared folder when I get a bit of time.
Hello! Can a chaotic cleric control undead instead of turning them? thanks.
Rules as written, no. It’s not clear why, when the Avenger (high level chaotic fighter) can. Perhaps it was to make the Avenger extra special. All that being said, if you want your chaotic clerics to control undead then you go for it.
Don't know if you caught this mistake, but at 10:10ish you said clerics can turn Wights at 1st level and you ment to say Gouls.
Yup. I winced when I realised I made that mistake. Oh well. 🙂
Naww and the optional classes too - pleeeaaase lmao j/k - Great video as always tho - thanks.
They’ll get their shot. 🙂
May your God/ Goddess go with you.... .
will you be doing the demi- human classes?
Dwarf coming this weekend.
Cleric/Paladin is at once my favorite fantasy hero archetype and often my least-favorite when relating to the lore and worldbuilding of individual settings. In an explicitly and aggressively Christian fantasy setting with just the one Church and the one God and the Holy Symbols being Wooden and Silver Crosses, I'm all over it in every way. The class is expressly based on Dr. Van Helsing's opposition to Count Dracula and aesthetically cribs from the Knights Templar and other Christian crusaders to fit the medieval high fantasy vibe of knightly Fighting Men and Merlin- or Gandalf-like Magic-Users.
Combined with fantasy Henotheism where there's hundreds or thousands of gods/immortals to worship and everyone still picks just one instead of praying to whoever in their pantheon actually fits the situation...and the clerics still use flanged maces, mail hauberks, surcoats with crosses on them, and pray in very Christian looking cathedrals and wear miters? Still having Biblical miracles fill out most of the "spell list"? Just feels off. Doesn't help that I usually hate every single individual god in any of such settings.
Leaving it more vague and letting the class be vaguely aligned to something like a pursuit of Law, of Truth, of Justice, or the like feels better. A vaguely defined good Higher Power.
Mechanically I'll always love mixed warrior/spellcasters, which the Cleric was compared to the Fighting Man and Magic User. I also don't like having a spell list that lacks the ability to heal injuries, which is a conspicuous shortcoming to my eye of the Elf. So for me in OD&D and BD&D, it's the Cleric as my mainstay; in later versions of the game, it's any mix of Paladin, Ranger, Bard, or subclasses/prestige classes that mix magic into a martial class or add a bit of weapon and armor proficiency to an otherwise squishy caster. Bladesinger, Eldritch Knight, Hexblade, and my personal setting's classes Swordcerer and Edgelord.
No "point" in detailing equipment eh?
Hardee harr. ;)
Bloody useful for noobs. Cheers.
You’re welcome.
Promo sm
I'm not sure why TH-cam recommended this series to me (I got recommended the fighter video and came here since I have no idea what BECMI is). I remember watching Treantmonk's video talking about the previous editions of D&D and while he never mentioned BECMI, this definitely feels like the AD&D/2e-era of D&D. Very limiting on the type of characters you can play (especially with race restrictions, like what do you mean non-human races are their own classes?), seemingly lots and lots of tables to refer to, and weird math like THAC0 which I'm still unsure as to how it even works.
Probably the part that hurts the most is that if you wanted to play a cleric and rolled poorly for Wisdom, you either should just play a different class entirely or be heavily penalized where everyone will start to outrank you... instead of being able to just fulfill your concept of a character. And the hard cap on health levels 10-36 is so bizarre.
The video itself was perfectly fine, but as someone who's been playing D&D 5th edition and is looking to get into Pathfinder 2nd edition, BECMI doesn't sound fun just from character creation alone.
Hello. I’m pleased the video got recommended to you nonetheless, and thank you for your comment. Obviously, there is such a departure from older versions of Dungeons and Dragons with the latest 5th edition. I’ve done videos on why I left 5th, which might offer you a counter view. And I’ve also done a series about the BECMI edition of the game if you wish to learn more about the origins of the game and I can tempt you to spend your precious time watching them, just so that some of your questions might be answered. It’s all opinion anyway, so I hope you continue to enjoy whichever version of the game you prefer.
@@becmiberserker I'll consider it! Learning about the origins of the game is kinda interesting for me, I was surprised to recognize so many spells in the cleric's spell list.
@@Sunny_HavenEnjoy the journey! 😊
I always rule that you can play any race you want when there are races as classes. But the 'racial classes' are the cultural fighting style of those people. But I have never had a player become a Cleric. Paladins sure, but never a Cleric.