This is excellent guidance for anyone getting into AA. There are dogmatic, pushy groups that use gaslighting and fear mongering to push their idea of the program-and this is dangerous for very vulnerable people.
Facts it is so disturbing and stressing that they would use prayer as a program that claims to not be religiously affiliated. Instant turn off and the current halfway house im in is very good as I've been in 10+ others and the majority were awful, this place forces you to work the 12 steps and attend aa meetings which are the only two complaints i have about this place. Religion should have NO place in recovery unless it advertises that!
Hey I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
Very helpful! My mom is still religious and has encouraged me to go to Al Anon meetings but even the higher power talk has been hard for me so hearing y’all talk about this from a secular perspective was 👌🏾
If you are an alcoholic like I am, you go to alcoholics anonymous, if you are the family or Associates of the alcoholic but you yourself are not an alcoholic, then you go to Al-Anon. Can you clarify your position? Also as an atheist one of my favorite videos on TH-cam is from the channel gii video titled top 10 reasons the Bible is repulsive. Check out the 10th reason the Bible is repulsive and it will shock you. The Christian Bible, King James fully promotes slavery against her black Brothers as well as pedophilia against our neighbor children. And it is absolutely repulsive
I’m an atheist in Aa and yes I’ve struggled with the god stuff. But I go because I need the fellowship of some sort in some degree. I have made sure that I’ve connected with others in Aa with similar disbelief and it’s very cool and refreshing really. Definitely not for everybody tho.
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
Something that caught me off guard about AA is that everyone is so supportive and friendly, SEEMINGLY they all just want to go out of their way to help you get clean…. But a sizeable percentage of them are really really shitty people that will totally exploit your vulnerability. A common one is a dude who will want to be your sponsor like strangely aggressively wanting to … because he wants something from you. You’ll figure this out and see him latch on to the next new guy. I was particularly blindsided by things like this because they have this religious smokescreen that can lower your defenses further.
That's human nature. It's in every religion and in AA as well. People will adopt an AA persona and it's not who they actually are. Watch the people closely before you trust.
Really nice talk guys. I'm absolutely supportive of secularism in AA. I know those folks can get and stay sober and work a good program without God. I personally choose to act as if there is a God. I'm a stoic also and some of those folks talked about God too. Thanks for putting this out there. Subscribed.
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
Great podcast! Thank you. I didn’t know that there’s secular/atheists AA meetings… 😂Clancy is hilarious to listen to, he’s sober and that’s what I get from his shares.
Despite the religiosity of AA, there is no organization that has the breadth. Recovery can be fragile and alcoholics and addicts who are atheists should not flee AA. While there are alternatives, they do not have the reach and formula AA has found. We need to get a message out that makes atheists, especially those in early recovery, comfortable in these meetings so they can stay alive.
I find it difficult to engage in conversation at AA because of my lack of belief and my religious trauma. I rarely go nowadays and I'm okay with that but sometimes I miss my old friends. I don't want them to know that I'm agnostic.
I have been religious for 60 years. Last December I was treated badly by my church and so called friends in my church. I am understanding now why people stop being God fearing folks. My emotional state is very fractured and millions of questions go through my mind about my entire life.
@lorrieannesilvey474 I hear you and I think I understand where you're coming from. I've been hurt by so-called religious folks and for a long time I blamed God for the way those people mistreated me. However, eventually, I learned that God, as I understand God, gave us all a free will. And what people choose to do with that free will is on them, not God. And it's about them, not me. I learned the following saying in AA and it's helped me to get through life untouched by others behaviors: Don't be oversensitive. Very few people are intentionally cruel and those are emotionally ill. You should pity them, not yourself, when they say or do unkind things." That is found under the heading of "Eight Ways to Conquer Self-pity" pg 5, Around The Clock with AA, In Memory of Bill Wilson. I've stayed sober for over 32 years by picking up tools like this, and applying them to my life, instead of walking away from the program or church over something a certain sick person or even a clique said or did. I hope this helps you as much as it has helped me.
One thing about Step 2, a "higher power"; in the official "The 12 Steps Illustrated", Step 2 merely says "There is help", there is a power other than my disease of alcoholism.
9 หลายเดือนก่อน +4
It's insane to me that opening readings say not religious. Then followed by a prayer to God. And I've heard you can't do it without faith or spirituality, ten times this week.. none of this vibes with me 😢
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
Been doing aa for a while now and all the religious bs talk is "only way to get sober is with god" which ik is absolute bs and its irritating really wish this stuff would stick to facts on getting better then a belief
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults. I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life. The truth is there is no such thing As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God . When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs. I can't take credit for anything. But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame. Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense... He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work. How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith.. Look up history for your selves. Repent and believe the gospel And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment. Amen 🙏
Keep in mind Bryan that like everything in AA or recovery for that matter, how one understands and describes the process is an individual thing. There are a lot of ways to view the steps secularly, here is one view: 1. I have a problem with alcohol. 2. I have hope that I can get and stay sober. 3. I am going to make a commitment to change. 4. I'm gong to get honest with myself and try to understand what I need to change. 5. I'll review what I learned with another person. 6. I'm ready to make some needed change with how I react to situations in life. 7. I am taking action to change those behaviors that don't work for me anymore. 8. I'm ready to mend my relationships. 9. I am changing the way I treat those around me, and I am making things right when it's appropriate. 10. I'm going to continue practicing self-honesty and living with integrity. 11. I will center myself through meditation, exercise or whatever helps ground me. 12. I'm going to give back and help others. You can also just leave out the list entirely and describe your recovery as if you were talking to someone. Describe your journey with your own words, list or no and you won't feel confused. You may very well feel empowered.
Very good discussion. I know of a fellow who is an AA member down south in the heart of "The Bible Belt" who does something unique. He like most of them was more or less raised to attend church. Most people in the groups in that area speak very freely of their affiliation with it, especially if they continue to do so. This man is very aware of how it all sounds to someone coming into AA that's new but not embracing the God concept of the program. He himself was raised the same way as many of the others but never alludes to it at AA meetings. In fact he takes on the role of an agnostic preferring to play "Devils advocate " so to speak because he feels the other side needs representation in AA. Many times people are shocked to discover he has only been playing a role even after knowing him for years. I really do admire him because he often gives Bible thumpers in AA fits! He knows more about it then they do. But you'd never guess by hearing him talk in AA meetings. You'd think he was a agnostic at best. And that's exactly the way he wants it.
Hoping someone will drink after you’ve been in for 5 years or so… Suggestion; sit at as many tables as you can with anyone you wish will drink. Keep coming back!
This is excellent guidance for anyone getting into AA. There are dogmatic, pushy groups that use gaslighting and fear mongering to push their idea of the program-and this is dangerous for very vulnerable people.
im a christian and i can tell you AA is a cult religion.
As an atheist, I can’t take any more of the religiosity of AA.
Just for today, this video is my meeting.
Good for you. It is a religion.
Facts it is so disturbing and stressing that they would use prayer as a program that claims to not be religiously affiliated. Instant turn off and the current halfway house im in is very good as I've been in 10+ others and the majority were awful, this place forces you to work the 12 steps and attend aa meetings which are the only two complaints i have about this place. Religion should have NO place in recovery unless it advertises that!
Hey
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
Very helpful! My mom is still religious and has encouraged me to go to Al Anon meetings but even the higher power talk has been hard for me so hearing y’all talk about this from a secular perspective was 👌🏾
If you are an alcoholic like I am, you go to alcoholics anonymous, if you are the family or Associates of the alcoholic but you yourself are not an alcoholic, then you go to Al-Anon. Can you clarify your position? Also as an atheist one of my favorite videos on TH-cam is from the channel gii video titled top 10 reasons the Bible is repulsive. Check out the 10th reason the Bible is repulsive and it will shock you. The Christian Bible, King James fully promotes slavery against her black Brothers as well as pedophilia against our neighbor children. And it is absolutely repulsive
I’m an atheist in Aa and yes I’ve struggled with the god stuff. But I go because I need the fellowship of some sort in some degree. I have made sure that I’ve connected with others in Aa with similar disbelief and it’s very cool and refreshing really. Definitely not for everybody tho.
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
Something that caught me off guard about AA is that everyone is so supportive and friendly, SEEMINGLY they all just want to go out of their way to help you get clean…. But a sizeable percentage of them are really really shitty people that will totally exploit your vulnerability.
A common one is a dude who will want to be your sponsor like strangely aggressively wanting to … because he wants something from you. You’ll figure this out and see him latch on to the next new guy.
I was particularly blindsided by things like this because they have this religious smokescreen that can lower your defenses further.
That's human nature. It's in every religion and in AA as well. People will adopt an AA persona and it's not who they actually are. Watch the people closely before you trust.
I believe you, but what kinds of things are we talking about that they want, it's not dirty is it?
Really nice talk guys. I'm absolutely supportive of secularism in AA. I know those folks can get and stay sober and work a good program without God. I personally choose to act as if there is a God. I'm a stoic also and some of those folks talked about God too. Thanks for putting this out there. Subscribed.
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
Wow! This video hits the nail on the head. Very very helpful. Video needs traction.
Great podcast! Thank you. I didn’t know that there’s secular/atheists AA meetings… 😂Clancy is hilarious to listen to, he’s sober and that’s what I get from his shares.
Despite the religiosity of AA, there is no organization that has the breadth. Recovery can be fragile and alcoholics and addicts who are atheists should not flee AA. While there are alternatives, they do not have the reach and formula AA has found. We need to get a message out that makes atheists, especially those in early recovery, comfortable in these meetings so they can stay alive.
I find it difficult to engage in conversation at AA because of my lack of belief and my religious trauma. I rarely go nowadays and I'm okay with that but sometimes I miss my old friends. I don't want them to know that I'm agnostic.
Thank you for listening and taking the time to comment.
It's okay to be agnostic.
@@KoolT thanks for understanding
I have been religious for 60 years. Last December I was treated badly by my church and so called friends in my church. I am understanding now why people stop being God fearing folks. My emotional state is very fractured and millions of questions go through my mind about my entire life.
@lorrieannesilvey474 I hear you and I think I understand where you're coming from. I've been hurt by so-called religious folks and for a long time I blamed God for the way those people mistreated me. However, eventually, I learned that God, as I understand God, gave us all a free will. And what people choose to do with that free will is on them, not God. And it's about them, not me. I learned the following saying in AA and it's helped me to get through life untouched by others behaviors: Don't be oversensitive. Very few people are intentionally cruel and those are emotionally ill. You should pity them, not yourself, when they say or do unkind things." That is found under the heading of "Eight Ways to Conquer Self-pity" pg 5, Around The Clock with AA, In Memory of Bill Wilson. I've stayed sober for over 32 years by picking up tools like this, and applying them to my life, instead of walking away from the program or church over something a certain sick person or even a clique said or did. I hope this helps you as much as it has helped me.
One thing about Step 2, a "higher power"; in the official "The 12 Steps Illustrated", Step 2 merely says "There is help", there is a power other than my disease of alcoholism.
It's insane to me that opening readings say not religious. Then followed by a prayer to God. And I've heard you can't do it without faith or spirituality, ten times this week.. none of this vibes with me 😢
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
It is religious
its a cult religion
36:00 This is me. Thank you!
Been doing aa for a while now and all the religious bs talk is "only way to get sober is with god" which ik is absolute bs and its irritating really wish this stuff would stick to facts on getting better then a belief
I'm against AA and NA witch are cults.
I've been to 3 rehabs and in and out of Jail and prison my whole life shooting drugs for Lil less then half my life.
The truth is there is no such thing
As a atheist.. deep down we know God exists but we try to suppress the truth and live a life that loves sin and hates God .
When I discovered the Truth and surrendered to Christ and His perfect love my whole l changed . He took all cravings and desires away. Been clean for over 4 yrs.
I can't take credit for anything.
But so great full. No more anxiety, depression, guilt, shame.
Now I shed tears of Joy, have perfect love that fills all void in the heart and have peace that makes no sense...
He is real And His Spirit that lives inside me who does all the internal work.
How do you think so many Christians went to the stake to be martyrdom burn to death singing praise to God while being burned because they wouldn't deny there faith..
Look up history for your selves.
Repent and believe the gospel
And save yourself from the wrath of God with eternal punishment.
Amen 🙏
So you guys skip step 2 and 3 and go from 1 to 4. I'm confused. Found an agnostic meeting near me. I never knew. Going to go Tuesday
Keep in mind Bryan that like everything in AA or recovery for that matter, how one understands and describes the process is an individual thing. There are a lot of ways to view the steps secularly, here is one view:
1. I have a problem with alcohol.
2. I have hope that I can get and stay sober.
3. I am going to make a commitment to change.
4. I'm gong to get honest with myself and try to understand what I need to change.
5. I'll review what I learned with another person.
6. I'm ready to make some needed change with how I react to situations in life.
7. I am taking action to change those behaviors that don't work for me anymore.
8. I'm ready to mend my relationships.
9. I am changing the way I treat those around me, and I am making things right when it's appropriate.
10. I'm going to continue practicing self-honesty and living with integrity.
11. I will center myself through meditation, exercise or whatever helps ground me.
12. I'm going to give back and help others.
You can also just leave out the list entirely and describe your recovery as if you were talking to someone.
Describe your journey with your own words, list or no and you won't feel confused. You may very well feel empowered.
I would like to know more about atheist thinking.
Very good discussion. I know of a fellow who is an AA member down south in the heart of "The Bible Belt" who does something unique. He like most of them was more or less raised to attend church. Most people in the groups in that area speak very freely of their affiliation with it, especially if they continue to do so. This man is very aware of how it all sounds to someone coming into AA that's new but not embracing the God concept of the program. He himself was raised the same way as many of the others but never alludes to it at AA meetings. In fact he takes on the role of an agnostic preferring to play "Devils advocate " so to speak because he feels the other side needs representation in AA. Many times people are shocked to discover he has only been playing a role even after knowing him for years. I really do admire him because he often gives Bible thumpers in AA fits! He knows more about it then they do. But you'd never guess by hearing him talk in AA meetings. You'd think he was a agnostic at best. And that's exactly the way he wants it.
I want to watch this video, but the narrator's voice prohibits me from doing so comfortably
Hoping someone will drink after you’ve been in for 5 years or so… Suggestion; sit at as many tables as you can with anyone you wish will drink. Keep coming back!
The steps are both fascist and narcissistic. Tread carefully if you choose to follow those “suggestions.”