Peter, I do single turn to final thickness. I will usually let them dry before sanding. I prefer the warped bowls, and they sell better that way for me. "Oh, they are soooo organic!" They are totally dry in 10 to 14 days max.
If you soak in the green or blue type soaps, they can leave a green or blue tint to the wood. I have used lemon color with no problems, the light brown ones, and there are now clear ones. I did try less than 50%/50% mix and it doesn't seem to work as well, but that is another on going experiment...
really enjoy your no nononsence approach. You mention using newspaper along with plastic wrapping after removing the jet bowls for the dishwasher/water Bath for 24 hrs. Do you use dry newspaper or dampened newspaper? Thank you!
The stretch film is pretty much all you need. I do not use it on maple, which has a lot of sugar in it and you will get mold in the wood that does not come out. Make sure to round over the rims, especially the outside rim. Inside rim too, but it isn't as important. Many will put their blanks inside paper bags. That does work, but I do a lot of bowls. Christian Burshard, some one who also turns a lot of madrone, will put the bowl or sculpture in a paper bag, and put that inside a plastic bag. The paper bag gets changed every day.
Great videos Reed and still liking the RoboRest! I really like the quick ,accurate adjustment. I have been turning more bowls now and experimenting with different drying methods including my unturned bowl blanks. I cut my blanks from logs (as in your video) then wrap with the shrink wrap. I've had good luck keeping these from cracking until I get to turning them. I've also tried the wrap on rough turned bowls and have experienced the mold issue. When that shows up, I usually unwrap then and let them to continue to air dry. Currently trying my rough turned bowls in shavings from the turning of those very same bowls. Not all are "wet" turned as some have been waiting their turn wrapped in the shelf for months.. Lots of words to get to my question: How dry is dry enough? How do I know when the bowls are ready for final turning, or in your method, when it's time to sand? I check my blanks and bowls with a moisture meter but that seems to only give me surface readings. When I turn the blanks, it seems to be much wetter deep inside. Is there a way to know when the bowl is done drying, whether using DNA, LDD, or wrapping alone methods?
I'm new at this but weighing is one way. From what I have read, the wood will lose about 30% of it's weight when drying. I would think that when the wood stops losing weight, it's dry. I am drying one now in a bucket with a heating pad (like for back aches) on the bottom with 2 vent holes (one at the top edge and another at the bottom edge) and a towel on top. the rough bowl sits on a shelf about half way up. Convection takes the moisture out. So far, it has lost about 1 ounce a day, with the target of losing about 12 ounces. I know it's a pain measuring but I think it may be the only way to know for sure.
I got side tracked, a couple of times.... Anyway, it seems to be good as long as it doesn't get too dirty. Worst thing for it is black walnut because some of the color comes out of the walnut and makes anything else black. Madrone leaves it purple. I can soak a lot of madrone and myrtle in it before it goes dark. I would guess I throw it out after maybe a year, but I don't do 700+ bowls a year any more. It can evaporate down to muck, and I can add some more soap and water, depending on how dirty it gets. Bowls do need to soak for 24 or more hours. It just doesn't work as well if I soak for shorter times.
Reed, how long is the dishsoap solution good for? Is it still good when it gets brown and cruddy? May I ask what do you get for your warped bowls? Thank you. Your videos are very good and helpful. I've learned a lot from you. Bob
I do the DNA method after rough turning. It takes longer in cold weather then warm. Warm weather I only need to soak them 24-36 hours. I take them out let them air dry hour or two then wrap in brown paper covering the foot of the bowl and leaving the top open a little. I turn them upside down on a wire rack about a week. There ready to turn. I do everything on the lathe sanding, finish, and waxing. Now once there dry with the paper on them is when I know weather there to badly cracked to turn.
I turn green bowls all the time. If there is not a defect in the wood from growth or felling stresses, I don't have a problem with warping, cracking, or cupping. Same with plates.
Hi Reed, great video - I didn't see this video over on WR, but wanted to ask you if you've tried the plastic wrap alone without using the DNA or LDD soak, and how effective it was.
+Bill Rockwood Bill, that is the way I do most of my bowls, but I do prefer the LDD soak as it makes things easier to sand out. Not all woods need the stretch film around the rim, but it does help to prevent cracking on the rim as that is the most vulnerable point. Rounding over the rims is important too.
+Bill Rockwood Oh, I have noticed that with Maple, which has a lot of sugar in it, that it can get moldy under the plastic, so watch it with that wood.
as i learned from you 3 .5 yrs ago turn to finish . i like that way better . also was worried about the molding on the bowls . as i live right up the road from you . thanks for the tips again gonna soak and rap and see how that doe's for me . vancouver wa
hey one more question so i dry my bowls in basement witch is around 50 degrees right now things do mold a little bit just some pieces of wood . so should i put a dehumidifier in there . to suck out moister in room doesnt get alot of air flow in there
If the wood is getting moldy, then it is drying too slowly, and/or is maple... I would consider 50 degrees to be a bit cool for drying. I do remember Mike Mahoney commenting that his wine cellar was ideal for temperature and humidity. A dehumidifier might work fine, even to the point of making a small enclosed area for drying. A very small light incandescent light bulb, 15 watt or so under a wire rack can make a big difference, but a 100 watt bulb might be too much. Not sure, more experimenting needed...
Gerald, no idea about what it would do to a surface finish. There is some glycerin in most soaps which may cause problems, but no idea. I know silicone can cause problems with adhesion. After the wood is dry, you can't feel or smell it. Maybe soak a piece and try it out.
To work in wood (a bowl, a spoon or a statuette) and mode to another raw tree when the product is ready, it can give a crack, to crack it was never that place Wooden finished product in highly salted water and cook for about 1 to 4 hours. Basically hour missing. Thereafter, winding articles with old newspapers leaving for absorption of moisture from wood, changing every day at about 1 week. After this tree will never crack. Salt kicks inside the water and dries the fast wood, protecting it from cracking. The paradox, but it works and is used. Can not treated with a piece of wood to boil in salted water and then cut after drying newspapers or paper or cloth.
for all you who have done lots of log turning, I received a lot of green logs and have no idea what it is. It has really rough bark and just under the bark it is intensely pink. It smells bad, too. the sap wood and heart wood don't have that much difference in color, a light creamy beige color. I have no idea what it is but it has some beautiful spalting that I hope will not bleed into the rest of the wood (the exposed part is already doing just that). I would like to know what kind of wood it is. THAnks!
If the pink colors are in stripes or streaks through the wood, most likely Box Elder, which is known to smell bad some times. This is a very common wood in the north central states. If you are on any of the turning forums, if you can post a picture, that would help.
@@robohippy it is intensely pink completely under the bark of the full tree, it's about a 1/4" thick band under the bark. I'm in Calif. so that's probably not it :>)
Well, there is a California Pepper tree that I had some pieces of once. It was pink on the outside and brown and green on the inside, kind of like spumoni Ice cream... No idea other than that.@@AffordBindEquipment
@@robohippy You nailed it! That's exactly what it is after doing some research on the tree. I turned some today (wet) and the spalting has caused separation in the growth rings, so I don't know how much I will get out of the logs I got. too bad...I started out with a large piece and by the time I got rid of the cracks I ended up with a little tray... Thanks for the info. love your channel and have learned a lot as a newbie...
hi robo, on bowls when i put them in shavings they get moldy. when I'm ready to finish turning them does all the mold spots need to be removed or that something I don't have to worry about . on one of your videos you said mold wasn't a bad thing but I just want to be sure .
+MANUEL GARZA Manuel, some times the mold can turn to spalting, which is good. I tried the wet shavings a few times, and some times it left bad colors, or ones that I didn't like in the wood. If you are twice turning the bowls, this is usually not a problem. Using dry shavings does pretty much the same thing, but you don't get the mold. Woods like maple have a lot of sugar in them, which the mold loves.
It makes a big difference in sanding out the bowls. The method was developed by Ron Kent of Hawaii who used it for the Norfolk Island pine bowls that he turned. Any of the pine type trees have a lot of sap or pitch in them, which really gums up the abrasives. The LDD method makes it much easier and not as much clogging of your abrasives. I don't add black walnut to the soak because it will make every thing after black, or much darker.
Another method for drying wood and products without the formation of cracks. For him, using silica gel, is any moisture from the desiccant things including wood. Silica gel for cats take in stores, He comes in bags for cat. He'll use for drying hardwood. Take 1/3 of silica gel-sorbent from the weight of the tree, covered it with a wooden product and close the jar tightly, to accelerate the drying process is better to pump air and make vacuum. Subject jar tree in vacuum and silica gel (or without) a few days or week. If the tree is much wet, the silica gel which has absorbed water (become white) pour and add as much again, and just leave the silica gel to absorb moisture wood. at This method, wood is not impregnated with salt and keeps clean without salt structure, which may sometimes protrude from the tree over time. So go ahead dry the product with the help of silica gel. Restore silica gel- roasting or put in a microwave oven for 5 minutes, and It can be used again.
I know it has been done, and not positive about results. If you are on any of the forums, AAW is the most frequented one, ask there. I think it is more gentle than any type of heat drying, but not positive. There are some who dry in the microwave also, but you have to do it in short bursts rather than all at once because they will catch fire...
Tried to figure that out, but it makes no sense.... Hot air rises, cooler air sinks. Relative humidity levels make no difference... Hot air can hold more water than colder because when colder it condenses...
![Woodturning - Twice Turned Bowls Simplified [My Easy Inexpensive Method for Drying Blanks]](/img/n.gif)
Peter, I do single turn to final thickness. I will usually let them dry before sanding. I prefer the warped bowls, and they sell better that way for me. "Oh, they are soooo organic!" They are totally dry in 10 to 14 days max.
Cool. Do you have any pictures of your final products?
robohippy h
Peter Brown g
So, you don't twice turn? Then, how long do you wait from first turning to sanding and finishing?
If you soak in the green or blue type soaps, they can leave a green or blue tint to the wood. I have used lemon color with no problems, the light brown ones, and there are now clear ones. I did try less than 50%/50% mix and it doesn't seem to work as well, but that is another on going experiment...
robohippy n
So I am guessing these bowls are not meant for food service.
You said you soak your bowls in brown dish detergent, I don't know what that is, could you explain? Thanks I enjoy your videos
Robo,
Does this method work for natural edge bowls also? Many thanks! Great videos!
really enjoy your no nononsence approach. You mention using newspaper along with plastic wrapping after removing the jet bowls for the dishwasher/water Bath for 24 hrs. Do you use dry newspaper or dampened newspaper? Thank you!
The stretch film is pretty much all you need. I do not use it on maple, which has a lot of sugar in it and you will get mold in the wood that does not come out. Make sure to round over the rims, especially the outside rim. Inside rim too, but it isn't as important. Many will put their blanks inside paper bags. That does work, but I do a lot of bowls. Christian Burshard, some one who also turns a lot of madrone, will put the bowl or sculpture in a paper bag, and put that inside a plastic bag. The paper bag gets changed every day.
Thank you very much for the info! I am just gettinging into wood turning and am trying to learn as much as possible.
Great videos Reed and still liking the RoboRest! I really like the quick ,accurate adjustment. I have been turning more bowls now and experimenting with different drying methods including my unturned bowl blanks. I cut my blanks from logs (as in your video) then wrap with the shrink wrap. I've had good luck keeping these from cracking until I get to turning them. I've also tried the wrap on rough turned bowls and have experienced the mold issue. When that shows up, I usually unwrap then and let them to continue to air dry. Currently trying my rough turned bowls in shavings from the turning of those very same bowls. Not all are "wet" turned as some have been waiting their turn wrapped in the shelf for months.. Lots of words to get to my question: How dry is dry enough? How do I know when the bowls are ready for final turning, or in your method, when it's time to sand? I check my blanks and bowls with a moisture meter but that seems to only give me surface readings. When I turn the blanks, it seems to be much wetter deep inside. Is there a way to know when the bowl is done drying, whether using DNA, LDD, or wrapping alone methods?
I'm new at this but weighing is one way. From what I have read, the wood will lose about 30% of it's weight when drying. I would think that when the wood stops losing weight, it's dry. I am drying one now in a bucket with a heating pad (like for back aches) on the bottom with 2 vent holes (one at the top edge and another at the bottom edge) and a towel on top. the rough bowl sits on a shelf about half way up. Convection takes the moisture out. So far, it has lost about 1 ounce a day, with the target of losing about 12 ounces. I know it's a pain measuring but I think it may be the only way to know for sure.
I got side tracked, a couple of times.... Anyway, it seems to be good as long as it doesn't get too dirty. Worst thing for it is black walnut because some of the color comes out of the walnut and makes anything else black. Madrone leaves it purple. I can soak a lot of madrone and myrtle in it before it goes dark. I would guess I throw it out after maybe a year, but I don't do 700+ bowls a year any more. It can evaporate down to muck, and I can add some more soap and water, depending on how dirty it gets. Bowls do need to soak for 24 or more hours. It just doesn't work as well if I soak for shorter times.
thanks again you always have some good info.
Thanks for the excellent video! This helps a lot!
Reed, how long is the dishsoap solution good for? Is it still good when it gets brown and cruddy?
May I ask what do you get for your warped bowls?
Thank you. Your videos are very good and helpful. I've learned a lot from you.
Bob
I do the DNA method after rough turning. It takes longer in cold weather then warm. Warm weather I only need to soak them 24-36 hours. I take them out let them air dry hour or two then wrap in brown paper covering the foot of the bowl and leaving the top open a little. I turn them upside down on a wire rack about a week. There ready to turn. I do everything on the lathe sanding, finish, and waxing. Now once there dry with the paper on them is when I know weather there to badly cracked to turn.
I turn green bowls all the time. If there is not a defect in the wood from growth or felling stresses, I don't have a problem with warping, cracking, or cupping. Same with plates.
Hi Reed, great video - I didn't see this video over on WR, but wanted to ask you if you've tried the plastic wrap alone without using the DNA or LDD soak, and how effective it was.
+Bill Rockwood Bill, that is the way I do most of my bowls, but I do prefer the LDD soak as it makes things easier to sand out. Not all woods need the stretch film around the rim, but it does help to prevent cracking on the rim as that is the most vulnerable point. Rounding over the rims is important too.
Thanks Reed, I appreciate you sharing your experience. I picked up a roll and will have to give this a try.
+Bill Rockwood Oh, I have noticed that with Maple, which has a lot of sugar in it, that it can get moldy under the plastic, so watch it with that wood.
as i learned from you 3 .5 yrs ago turn to finish . i like that way better . also was worried about the molding on the bowls . as i live right up the road from you . thanks for the tips again gonna soak and rap and see how that doe's for me . vancouver wa
Come see me at the Symposium. I will be in the Vendor area, which is free to the public, well unless you count spending money for 'toys'...
ill be there would love to chat with ya . happy turnings
hey one more question so i dry my bowls in basement witch is around 50 degrees right now things do mold a little bit just some pieces of wood . so should i put a dehumidifier in there . to suck out moister in room doesnt get alot of air flow in there
If the wood is getting moldy, then it is drying too slowly, and/or is maple... I would consider 50 degrees to be a bit cool for drying. I do remember Mike Mahoney commenting that his wine cellar was ideal for temperature and humidity. A dehumidifier might work fine, even to the point of making a small enclosed area for drying. A very small light incandescent light bulb, 15 watt or so under a wire rack can make a big difference, but a 100 watt bulb might be too much. Not sure, more experimenting needed...
Does LDD affect finishing with hard surface finishes like lacquer? Thanks for the video must have missed this one
Gerald, no idea about what it would do to a surface finish. There is some glycerin in most soaps which may cause problems, but no idea. I know silicone can cause problems with adhesion. After the wood is dry, you can't feel or smell it. Maybe soak a piece and try it out.
To work in wood (a bowl, a spoon or a statuette) and mode to another raw tree
when the product is ready, it can give a crack, to crack it was never that place
Wooden finished product in highly salted water and cook for about 1 to 4 hours.
Basically hour missing. Thereafter, winding articles with old newspapers
leaving for absorption of moisture from wood, changing every day at about 1 week.
After this tree will never crack. Salt kicks inside the water and dries the
fast wood, protecting it from cracking. The paradox, but it works and is used.
Can not treated with a piece of wood to boil in salted water and then cut after drying
newspapers or paper or cloth.
for all you who have done lots of log turning, I received a lot of green logs and have no idea what it is. It has really rough bark and just under the bark it is intensely pink. It smells bad, too. the sap wood and heart wood don't have that much difference in color, a light creamy beige color. I have no idea what it is but it has some beautiful spalting that I hope will not bleed into the rest of the wood (the exposed part is already doing just that).
I would like to know what kind of wood it is.
THAnks!
If the pink colors are in stripes or streaks through the wood, most likely Box Elder, which is known to smell bad some times. This is a very common wood in the north central states. If you are on any of the turning forums, if you can post a picture, that would help.
@@robohippy it is intensely pink completely under the bark of the full tree, it's about a 1/4" thick band under the bark. I'm in Calif. so that's probably not it :>)
Well, there is a California Pepper tree that I had some pieces of once. It was pink on the outside and brown and green on the inside, kind of like spumoni Ice cream... No idea other than that.@@AffordBindEquipment
@@robohippy You nailed it! That's exactly what it is after doing some research on the tree. I turned some today (wet) and the spalting has caused separation in the growth rings, so I don't know how much I will get out of the logs I got. too bad...I started out with a large piece and by the time I got rid of the cracks I ended up with a little tray...
Thanks for the info. love your channel and have learned a lot as a newbie...
hi robo, on bowls when i put them in shavings they get moldy. when I'm ready to finish turning them does all the mold spots need to be removed or that something I don't have to worry about .
on one of your videos you said mold wasn't a bad thing but I just want to be sure .
+MANUEL GARZA Manuel, some times the mold can turn to spalting, which is good. I tried the wet shavings a few times, and some times it left bad colors, or ones that I didn't like in the wood. If you are twice turning the bowls, this is usually not a problem. Using dry shavings does pretty much the same thing, but you don't get the mold. Woods like maple have a lot of sugar in them, which the mold loves.
When do you sand? Do you sand on the lathe or by hand? How do you remount it on the lathe too if you are going to sand?
+Taen That is in another clip:
th-cam.com/video/s4Pkr89STGY/w-d-xo.html
I know most of this is from six years ago but my question is , what does the soaking in dish soap do??
It makes a big difference in sanding out the bowls. The method was developed by Ron Kent of Hawaii who used it for the Norfolk Island pine bowls that he turned. Any of the pine type trees have a lot of sap or pitch in them, which really gums up the abrasives. The LDD method makes it much easier and not as much clogging of your abrasives. I don't add black walnut to the soak because it will make every thing after black, or much darker.
ok, thanks. I did watch the video but didn't understand the soap thing. Glad you're still around six years later.
Oops, need to get the link up. The pictures are a bit old, but pretty close to what I do.
www.robohippy.net/
Another method for drying wood and products without the formation of cracks. For him, using silica gel,
is any moisture from the desiccant things including wood. Silica gel for cats take in stores,
He comes in bags for cat. He'll use for drying
hardwood. Take 1/3 of silica gel-sorbent from the weight of the tree, covered it with a wooden product
and close the jar tightly, to accelerate the drying process is better to pump air and make
vacuum. Subject jar tree in vacuum and silica gel (or without) a few days or
week. If the tree is much wet, the silica gel which has absorbed water (become white) pour
and add as much again, and just leave the silica gel to absorb moisture wood. at
This method, wood is not impregnated with salt and keeps clean without salt structure, which may
sometimes protrude from the tree over time. So go ahead dry the product with the help of silica gel.
Restore silica gel- roasting or put in a microwave oven for 5 minutes, and
It can be used again.
If you leave the bark on, then no it wouldn't work because the plastic would break the bark off.
So, has anyone tried drying them in a frost free freezer?
I know it really dries out(freezer burn) improperly wrapped meat.
I know it has been done, and not positive about results. If you are on any of the forums, AAW is the most frequented one, ask there. I think it is more gentle than any type of heat drying, but not positive. There are some who dry in the microwave also, but you have to do it in short bursts rather than all at once because they will catch fire...
Different wood will act different.
Dry air is heavier than moist air.
Tried to figure that out, but it makes no sense.... Hot air rises, cooler air sinks. Relative humidity levels make no difference... Hot air can hold more water than colder because when colder it condenses...