Disney Adults: Is Disney A Religion?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ก.ค. 2022
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Does Disney count as a religion?
Disney adults have been catching a lot of flack lately for their earnest devotion to all things Mickey Mouse. But is their fervor escalating to the level of religion? Or is it something else entirely? Let’s find out in Part 1 of our Wisecrack edition on Disney Adults: Is Disney a Religion?
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=== Watch More Episodes! ===
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Written by Corrigan Vaughan and Amanda Scherker
Hosted by Michael Burns
Directed by Kevin Lee
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Produced by Olivia "Orange Bird Superfan" Redden and Griffin Davis
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Someone else has to catch the irony of the balding host who always wears a hat being the one who does the hair loss prevention ad reads, right?
Kinda doubles down on my sentiment about gaming youtubers who do blatant ad reads for shitty mobile games - if you love the product enough to push it on us, why aren't you using it too? Like, for all the major game streamers who push Raid Shadow Legends, why is it none of them have ever done a 3 hour casual stream of themselves playing Raid and showing off all it's supposedly great content? Logically one would assume that the product itself is actually shit and not worth using, but the TH-camr will push anything if a company pays them to do it.
@@Madara8989 this is the kind of vitriol that open disdain brings about. Get him saiyan
Also huge miss video. Its a cult. Im in a cult. Catch me at the teacup line 😎🥳
@@Madara8989 Sometimes you've just got to oil your snake.
@@Madara8989 He needs to come to terms with his baldness and stop wearing hats...
If Disney sees this, they're definitely going to use it as an excuse to stop paying their taxes
Wait when did they start paying taxes
I think you are onto something, Nick! :D
And, if did not see it, that's the excuse as well.
It's a megacorp, and under American law, that makes it a person. Of course mad laws like that makes sure they don't need to pay taxes, l'm absolutely sure of it.
It's remarkable that they haven't already. It's ridiculously easy to start a tax-free religious organization.
The premise of this video is so hilarious: "I heard y'all didn't appreciate my dunking on you for liking Disney, allow me to explain why - you're in a cult" 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
My favorite 😂😂
And?? 😎
"Am I out of touch?
No, no it's the internet that must be wrong"
We simply love the doubling down
I put down a bunch of people for loving something, and now they're butthurt. We must gather a team of researchers to figure out why!
"Now there are adults without children who go to Disney, and they are called weirdos. Very nice people. Absolutely crazy." -Jim Gaffigan
I refute that wholeheartedly! As a Floridian (don't start, I didn't choose to be born here dude), every time I've ever gone out to Disney or any of the other theme parks, folks there with their kids are the crazy ones to me. Why pay hundreds of dollars for an experience your vomit and shit covered toddler won't even remember when you can just go there with your SO and laugh at all the parents there doing just that while sitting back and sipping a $14 Foster's? The lunacy!
Special K is my religion.
@@MsTurtledick that's why OG Disneyland California is SO much better
@@anubusx while I agree that the cereal is delicious, my lactose intolerance prevents me from partaking.
Here theres one
Honest take, I don't think Disney Adults are any weirder than any other fandom. Like in any fandom, there are the people who just simply enjoy something and they wanna express the enjoyment and there are the people who just go overboard and how to make it your whole identity. The main difference between most other fandoms and Disney Adults is that Disney Adults have somewhere to go on a nearly daily basis, unlike a convention that eventually ends. And yes I fully realize that Mickey Mouse is in my profile pic. 😂
Yeah, all of those fans are creeps. Sports teams enthusiasts, anime freaks, whatever... Lock them all up
maybe? But they might be a bit more morally dissociative. Disney is a worse company than many are willing to engage with
I can understanding being a fan of something, but being a fan of a super evil mega corp is like saying you're fan of Nazis because they dressed nice
I get what you're saying but a thing that really, really stands out to me with Disney Adults than other fandoms is that Disney Adults have much, MUCH weaker filters: if any at all. Otakus, Trekkies, Comic Book fans, etc., most of them will have an "Off/Low" setting when they're aware they're in a situation that it isn't best to blast their fandom. The Disney Adults I know, their lowest setting seems to be around how other fandoms behave when they're at a store/public gathering for said interest. They're never off.
I also remember once seeing a relative tell their child to not put the ornament they were just gifted on the "Good" Tree. They had two trees, one with nothing but Disney themed ornaments and the other... wasn't the "Good" Tree.
@@LaBlueSkuld I think you hit the nail on the head: it’s been a _socially acceptable_ fandom. If I got an anti-demon-possession tattoo I’d be an aberrance, but a Mickey Mouse tattoo is just cute and fun. It’s not the level of devotion that’s seen as weird, as evidenced by all the superstition in sports; it’s _what_ you choose to devote yourself to that makes people look at you funny.
13:13 Just a heads up, the disney-themed funeral packages are not real. At the bottom of the site it states that it is a parody and satirical website and offers no services.
I feel the capitalist aspect that plays into this cannot go unmentioned. You need money to truly get INTO Disney, class does play a role in this way
I’ve NEVER been to Disney World/ Land - my family couldn’t afford it . Ive always connected socio-economic statuts to Disney Park audience/ guest . If Disney is a religion …it’s an elitist one
More than just elitist in the sense it prices people out. It's also elitist ideologically too. All their films teach and support ideas of classism even when the film attempts to make the opposite point. It has Victorian ideas of poverty being a manifestation of bad morality and thus in some way deserved.
@Snowy I was simply saying that most people that can afford to visit Disney especially, families of 4 or more are well off . I’m not saying only the 1% can afford to visit Disney but I believe you have to be of a certain socio-economic background to go . Trust me , low-income Americans aren’t visiting Disney 2x a year .
@Snowy anything that is ascribed a price tag is inherently elitist and unequal. Even a chocolate bar. Yes most people can afford it. Some can afford it more than others and some not at all. I think you are tone policing here and being super PC because your saying that a poor person is not allowed to identify the fact that others are richer than them and that it is inherently unfair and unequal. Sorry if you're offended and that you feel like you're being called elite but maybe just listen to those less fortunate huh?
Do you know how much it costs to go to a theme park in North Korea???
Absolutely nothing
Agreed. I remember a vid going viral of a rich "Disney adult" who bought a home there. Like: One of those Disney mansions? And she literally said "oh, we could have taken the one with an elevator, but I wanted to be _frugal_ "
I just remember thinking "FRUGAL?! I eat Ramen for nearly every meal! I break one Mickey-Vase in your house and the grandchildren of my grandchildren will be paying of that debt?!"
Also kinda debunking a fundamental of "working" religion: Every religion attempts to appeal to the common person. Either by fate-declaration ("everyone is born a child of God"), or by swaying (Jesus/God helpipng the poor/sick). If you only cater to the rich, you won't have the majority backing.
That said, the developement does fit a religious cult: At the beginning, Disneypark was for families. Literally: Just $1 entrance. But with complete coorperate overtake, Disney gets PURPOSELY more confusing + expensive. So you have 2 main catered groups: 1.) rich folks who see a standard $109 ticket as their $1 ticket or 2.) People masochistically enough to put themselves through it.
Disney adults are often trapped by nostalgia -often those who went to Disney since they were small (better times = mental lovebombing), so they have some form of Stockholm Syndrom. Both getting "if you like Disney, you have to PROVE it", and "c'mon, you want the best right? Then it's only right that you should pay"
At least to me it feels that way. Had to buy socks recently, and it just...shivered me when I saw Mickey-socks in the shop box. Same feeling of seeing Jehova's witnesses
It's funny how they prove your point by threatening your life. Like that's a TOTALLY normal response.
Eh, that's more of an internet thing than a Disney-specific thing. Have any opinion as a public figure online and people will send you death threats, lol.
Why the hell are you lumping everyone who likes Disney in with those people? They're like less than 0.0001% of the fandom yet they get all the attention. I don't even like Disney but this is absurd.
It's not very sound of mind to lump the action of a small few with the whole of a group of people.
hmmm, it seemed to me like he was probably exaggerating though - as he said he receives "daily comments with abuse or threats from dummy accounts" and yet he didn't show any examples of that (he could have blurred some words if necessary), but just showed completely rational reasonable comments politely pointing out to him that his shunning of it is unnecessarily insensitive, when a lot of adults didn't have nice childhoods and many experienced abuse and the Disney experience helps them heal. So yeah, those do seem like totally normal responses.
@@killgriffinnowcalm down
Disney is cute and magical, with an occasional good film, but also an unholy corporate rat.
Calling it a religion would terrify everyone. With it's toxic positivity and pastiche adaptation of classic stories.
It's better than any religion but it's still shit.
I don't see anything cute or magical about worshipping a corporate overlord who exploits it's fans...
I’ve joked that Mickey Mouse is the Skaven Great Horned Rat for years
Ya but I think they don't mean Disney, the company, is a religion, but the people who enjoy disney forming a sort of religious group.
@@edumazieri - The people who enjoy Disney aren't "worshipping" anything though, that's only what their critics are saying.
The discussion only reminds me of the "satanic panic" people, who insisted D&D players thought they were actually casting spells and performing pagan rituals. It's hyping up the imagined absurdity of an out-group in order to justify hating them. Of course in the "satanic panic" times, the ones doing the accusing were the religious whackjobs, so take that as you will.
I went to Disney once as an adult because I was too broke to go as a kid, and I had a great time. There is nothing wrong with enjoying yourself going to theme parks, nothing wrong with visiting places that you always wanted to see but never had the chance. Just be respectful and kind wherever you go.
I was friends with a family at a church I used to attend who checked all the boxes of being Disney fanatics. Every party they ever hosted was Disney themed, the mom had a blog that reviewed Disney products, and going to Disneyland/world every year was equivalent to a Muslim's journey to Mecca. I used to joke to myself why they ever bothered coming to church since they already seemed committed to another religion (which was definitely hypocritical of me since I was obsessed with Star Wars and Marvel as a teen).
Worshiping a giant mouse is no different than worshiping an angry god and his magician son and """virgin""" mom.
@@youtubegarbage7876 - The difference is that no one is "worshipping" the mouse or thinks the character is real, lol.
This kind of equating "enjoying media" or "liking theme parks" with religious practices is exactly like the satanic panic weirdos from the 80's and 90's - the ones who insisted that D&D players thought they were participating in real pagan rituals to perform magic and join souls with their character or whatever. It's an intentional mischaracterization of a group you don't like to make them seem far more absurd than they are to justify preconceived criticism and hatred of the group.
Of course the group pushing satanic panic rhetoric were complete bona-fide religious whackjobs, which I think says a bit about the current discussion regarding Disney.
@@youtubegarbage7876 fedora
@@youtubegarbage7876 if you hate google/youtube so much why are you here in the first place?
@@youtubegarbage7876 you are cringe
"No one's going to call you a cultist for wearing your Tom Brady jersey for a week leading up to the Super Bowl".
Nah, that counts. Sports cultists can be pretty insufferable. If only their worst habit was wearing the same article of clothing for a week...
What about sport families? Dad loves hockey. Family makes hockey games tradition. Kids are expected to excel at hockey to make dad proud. The whole thing goes so far.
I think humans are naturally drawn to cults of one fashion are another.
If you devote yourself enough to something that becomes a core part of your life and most people don't take criticism very well. Also people assume that their favorite thing should be everyone else's favorite thing too because of the dificulteis in understanding that our bubble is not a representation of everything.
They can be horrible people (in Mexico for instance, about a year ago hundreds of people were assaulted and killed by the rival fans). But it's true that acting ridiculously in the name of sports is more socially acceptable that doing it in the name of other things, like a fandom or a political movement
@@elucified hockey families are on a whole nother level, they rule over local teams like inter-generational dynasties
I don't think there's anything wrong with adults going without kids. It's a problem when they are harassing the costumed characters, jumping out of the rides, climbing the scenery, getting into fights, obscenely swearing, wearing really inappropriate clothing, getting drunk/high, etc.
I agree. Adults need to treat it as a fun experience for EVERYONE, not just themselves.
Further, as a woman who is barren, I feel like I should be allowed to go and do whatever the hell I want even though I can't have kids. If that means I want to go to Disneyland, fine.
Most of the people who cause fights at theme parks are stressed out fathers and mothers getting entitled and upset.
It would break a Disney adults heart to act the way you are describing.
Honestly, sounds more like hooligan teenager antics
Now to think all of what you listed isn't describing teenagers but full grown adults
@@joshbrown8756 do you know that for a fact or are you just assuming it's true because it sounds right?
You don't need to have kids to be entitled unfortunately
@@santiagogarza8121 I used to work there
Nothing saddened me more than being unable to go to Disneyland as a child because I was poor and now that I have my own income, I still can't go because I don't want to be a Disney adult.
You can still go. Like anything else its healthy in moderation its just expensive
You can do whatever you want. I think Disney is pretty cool. I’m not in love with it, and do find it strange that non-cast member Disney goers go in full costume. But who am I to judge? It makes them happy, they aren’t hurting any one, and we all get to have a good time. It’s a win-win.
Just do it bro. As they say, yolo
I plan on it myself. I'm interested in Epcot as an idea and wanna check it out, and I wanna live in the water park I've seen videos hahah
@A Real Human Epcot is great, it is more adult oriented I'd say. Still has rides though!
by liberalist terms, disney is absolutely a religion. it assigns meaning to symbols, typically of its own design, and through cultural exposure influences people into accepting and interacting with these symbols. i think durkheim and eliade would agree with such an assertion at least.
aaight but by that defintion languages are a religion.
@@Juay_deRito and everything in the world.
@@Juay_deRito languages are living, there is no committee, no board, deciding the direction a language takes
Well there shouldn't be at least, many do try to control language.
What on earth are LiBeRaLiSt TeRmS?
I'm a Disney Adult, have a 9 to 5 job, and would never send someone death threats. That's absolutely ridiculous. Having been on the other end of some pretty nasty comments about being a fan of Disney. I see it very similar to being a sports fan or fan of anime or anything else. I'm passionate about it, but am aware of it's pros and cons. Just like hoping your team will improve and win the big game, I enjoy it for what it is and hope they improve and make another great film or ride for me to enjoy. If it doesn't harm anyone or affect anyone else, why does someone care if I enjoy something? I'm very excited for part two. This is fascinating.
I admit. I am a Disney Adult to an extent. I grew up (a small poor black autistic kid) watching the shows and films and know the songs by heart. I lways dreamed of a family vaction with my mom brothers and grandparents. I never got got to Disney world until I was 27 (by then both my grandparents had passed away, my grandmother passing the same year Moana came out, iykyk) when I was able to take myself. I had a f**cking blast. My inner child was healing so much. I did cry during the fireworks show when they did a Moana themed segment and shot fireworks resembling the stingray that was the spirit of Moana's grandmother. Thinking about how I was at least able to finally make i somewhere for the longest time was unattainable to me. I will never forget that.
I also understand Disney as a corporation is evil AF. I also cannot deny the impact the art has had on our lives and culture. Least we forget Don Bluthe, the creator of American Tale, All Dogs Go To Heaven, and Anastasia was at first a Disney animator. As were people who worked at DreamWorks with the Prince of Egypt and SHREK (a film that made its name explicitly mocking everything about disney.)
I understand that there are people who take things way too far. But ultimately it's pretty harmless. And I mean let's be real. It's the adults spending the money anyway.
If that makes me a cringey weirdo. So be it.🤷🏿♀️
youre black and autistic? the gift that keeps on giving
I cant help but feel like your original story ticked off so many people, because it comes off like that karen mom who posted how pissed she was to see young childless 20 somethings waiting in line at a disney park. Especally because whether it was 37 year old emotional disney adults, childless 20 something adults or just a bunch of parents with their kids, you will still be waiting in line to get on the teacups with your kids anyway. Its giving "I cant mind my own business, let alone my child" ya know?
Yeah, it was kind of a shitty imagined scenario for a number of reasons - the framing of the imagined group "getting emotional" over the teacup ride, like, what's that even supposed to mean? Does "enjoying time at a theme park" count as "getting emotional" now? Or does he think people are like breaking down crying because of the majesty of the teacups? That, and the assertion that the only acceptable activity for adults is to sit at the bar all day is just stupid and condescending.
Not worth the response he got, but it was absolutely a top-tier "bad take".
He is pissed because now he and his kid had to wait longer in line while those childless people should get drunk, because that is what adults do. I dont get why these kind of parents are in a theme park anyway.
At 13:18 I like Michael saying “*If* I ever die,“ subtly implying that he is immortal.
A person's mortality cannot be proven until they die. We are all currently immortal.
To quote Hob Gadling of Sandman, "The only reason people die, is because EVERYONE does it. You all just go along with it.
It's RUBBISH, death. It's STUPID. I don't want nothing to do with it."
13:16
Reminds me of an old Danish parody of a politician, who very disturbingly sang: "And should I one day pass on ...."
I love how this guy gets threats and hate and he turns around and says "oh you didn't like what I said? Wait till you hear this!" I'd high five you if I could, Michael.
The fact is he is probably not getting threats and is just saying it to get views. Like anything in Reddit, half the shit is fake in the attempt to get karma or, in this case, to get views and spur discussion as it helps his metrics and increases his revenue.
@@jtstacey83 This is the internet - I promise you any vaguely "public" figure on the internet is getting death threats
they arent going to do anything.
an obsessive fan is more likely to end a creator than a keyboard warrior.
@@darklight6921 either way, still entertaining.
He's just playing the victim...I HATE Disney, but I have nothing against people who enjoy it. This is very sad.
Any fan of a corporation is slightly worse than Disney adults. At least with Disney their primary business is entertainment. I'm looking at you apple fanatics
Some of my favorite posters are the collection of Dads responding to tweets from Raytheon like "cool! thank you for everything!"
I guess at the very least Disney tries to surround itself with moral lessons, Apple isn't exactly defeating evil even if both corporations are.
Cryptobros sweating profusely
@@kr1spness just like a religion tries to justify the absurd by surrounding themselves with moral lessons. It just proves the point that they are selling something and using whatever tactic is needed to sell the most amount possible for the larger profit possible, just like apple, not better not worst, equals in very bad game.
Making it my life's mission to outlive Michael so I can steal his ashes and scatter them at Disney to see if he makes good on his promise to haunt it.
Henry Jenkins is a completely awesome guy. He lived in a dorm as a faculty resource and was very involved with the students (unlike some of the other faculty residents). He also worked hard to develop a comparative media studies program at a very technical engineering school. He wasn't outside these communities, he probably helped some of the kids make their costumes. Hearing his name is like a shot of pure nostalgia!
He is alright...except that part where he disparages religion and religious people.
So, I think you need to read into the BITE model, it's the current model used by most people in the conversation about cults. It was written by Steven Hassan, and TH-camr Telltale improved on it by giving it a gradient based on the fibonacci scale.
It measures behavior control, information control, thought control, and emotional control, and what the organization in question does in each category
Reminds me a bit of the Harry Potter adults.
And I can name others, Sonic fans, anime fans, bronies, Nintendo fans, Star Wars fans, Marvel fans, Snyder cultists, etc.
Being an extreme fan of Disney is extremely weird and deserves to be scrutinized. Not because of the fandom, because of the Disney, one of the most evil corporations around.
One of the most liberating things i've done in my life is to realize that is meaningless to be angered by someones opinion on such trivial things. Why it matters so much to you that this particular individual dislikes something you enjoy? Is your taste and will so feeble that the smallest opposite opinion by some rando can absolutely colapse your entire system of entertaining yourself?
"oh man michael sure is salty about disney adults, but i don't know i kinda like it" and move on with your life, go use that energy somewhere else ffs
As the song goes: "it's ok to not like things, don't be a dick about the things you don't like."
Declaring adults who like Disney IPs or theme parks to be "religious fanatics" is no different from 90s era religious nutjobs declaring D&D players to be practicing witchcraft.
Adults at Disney parks is just as valid as kids there. Some people take it WAY too far, but the point of the parks is to make money and adults have money, especially if they DON'T have kids.
Ding ding ding ding! That's exactly why it's a thing. Disney markets to whoever's paying for the trip, much like McDonald's used the happy meal and playground to get parents to pay. Once they couldn't, they dropped the act and made the fake-Starbucksi we have nowadays. Just like an Apple watch, Disney trips are a HUGE status marker too and millennials might be the last generation to care about those so Disney is cashing out.
True, but the point of the adults bringing their kids is so that their kids can have as much fun as possible, so I understand why they’re annoyed when the unintended fanbase manifests itself and increases wait times and such
@@michaelh13 I think both can and should coexist. We all die in the end. Kids don't have any more of a right to be in that expensive, overpriced park than anyone else, IMO. I don't agree with the original statement that this video is following up about, but I do think that fandom and "Disney Adults" do have cult-like behavior. At the end of the day, Disney doesn't care if their income from the park came from families or childless adults. They want EVERYONE.
@@GeNRCSRNM "millennials might be the last generation to care about those so Disney" That's so wild to think about, but it makes so much sense. I wonder what younger generations will do concerning Disney.
@@michaelh13 Who cares? We're not going to step back for the kids. If we want to be there, we're going.
I mean I enjoy Disney movies and music well enough, have done since I was a kid. When I hear about a new Disney film coming out it definitely piques my interest. However, I also understand that Disney is an uncaring, monolithic megacorporation that wants only money and that everything they put out is designed to entice me to pay for it.
I don't really get the kind of adults that get deeply emotionally tied to Disney as a brand though. The kind of adults that will visit Disney parks without kids. Sure, I think that Disney parks look fun but I wouldn't dream of going there just for myself. Bizarre. Harmless, but bizarre.
Also don't let Disney catch on to the idea that they could be called a religion. The last thing the Mouse needs is tax-exempt status.
Thank you for this nicely researched take on this never ending topic. As a self described "Disney Adult" I greatly appreciate the amount of research lol
Also, not sure if you're going to mention it in your next video, but many Disney fans are very out spoken about the Disney corporation and overall "problematic" parts of the fandom. (The whole "Don't say Gay" bill in Florida, updates on allowing gender expression for cast members, etc.) I would say at least 95% of the fandom is very aware. And enjoy Disney for it's artistry, not the business. Like everything else, there are different levels of each fandom.
Ppl protesting that parental law in Florida are weird
You are already talking like a religious person. "I believe in God, but I don't like the church"
@@cristobalrojas3712 I don't know, it is kinda like me saying I liked the Jack Reacher movie, but I am not a fan of Tom Cruise as a person.
As an adult who loves and worked at Disney, I thoroughly endorse you,and everything you've said.
I went to Disneyland for my very first adult by myself trip, I was twenty two. It was a very emotional thing but I don’t think it was a Disney adult thing. I think it was cause I’d been sick since I was like five and i was finally healthy enough to enjoy a long trip. I saved up like a thousand dollars and got a hotel with breakfast and dinner and took a bus to a train to a bus eight hours both ways, and I went during October for my favorite holiday. I had a good time and a hard time and I also made a lot of friends with tired parents who were happy someone else was entertaining their kids in line. I also went on space mountain three times in a row cause no one could tell me not to.
Didn't you have any friends who could go with you?
Good for you :)
I think it's worth pointing our that being a fan or religious adherent to a specific canon (such as the Star Trek universe) is much different than worshiping the broad banality of a corporation (such as Disney). A canon often intentionally emphasizes themes, ethics, and perspectives that can enrich people's lives. A corporation, at its center, is always primarily focused on profit above all else, including the well-being of the people who feed it money.
and whats the difference in following disney or a religous corporation that acts the same way then.
@@baraodascolinas979 I'm not clear on your question. By "religious corporation" you mean something like the Catholic Church? Or like Hobby Lobby?
@@natsoray yes, the catholic church, televannelists churches, etc. corporations in all but name.
@@baraodascolinas979 I suppose a church operates around a curated canon of what they say the Bible means, and that belief structure can likewise provide positive meaning and purpose. I don't think churches and corporations are generally interchangeable, as the profit motive and use of funds varies between denominations and individuals in power. But money and power def are corrupting influences regardless of context. That's just my take. I don't know if I'm correct. Personally I think Disney and the Catholic church are both pretty freakin' evil, despite their ability to do some marginal good around the edges.
People don’t worship the corporation of Disney, they worship the media and experiences that comes from it. Nobody says, “I love that Bob Iger guy and I really love it when Disney makes billions of dollars.” They like Disney for the positive experiences that is personal to them whether it is a theme park or a movie.
I think one thing that isn't talked about is how Fandom is kind of seen as a young person's thing. Once you hit your mid to late twenties it's seen as something you should have grown out of by now. You have adult responsibilities (stereotypically job kids, mortgage) and childish pursuits like a fandom you were a part of in high school should be let go of. I don't think that's true necessarily I think you can be part of any Fandom at any age it just is probably a different level of commitment. Such as at 35 you likely wouldn't be a fifteen; conversely you could become even more intense as maybe you feel you have little else that truly makes you happy.
I've never understood this phenomenon. I can't think of any place I'd rather NOT be than Disney/Land/World.
Are religions just international corporations?
Walt Disney never intended the parks to be just for kids, nor his animated films ether. Though I'm critical of people worshiping the capitalist side of Disney, I'm pretty tired of people dunking on people for just enjoying things.
Next video: What is with our cultural obsession with keeping our hair?
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I love the humor you bring to the show, thanks for all the great content!
So, just starting the video, but here's my thing about disparaging the "Disney Adult"...it isn't just about that one niche fandom. The visceral reaction to criticising them is equally an issue for fandoms like comics fans (and I AM writing this as SDCC is currently underway), or trpg fans, or really any fandom where people are told it is inappropriate for them to still be a fan, because it's "for children" The problem is the society at large trying to dictate to you what entertainment is or isn't ok to enjoy... based entirely on your age. This is especially galling to those of us in the nerd community, because nobody is chastising the football fan that is sitting bare chested in blue paint at a game in New York in November for their being childish. No one is questioning people that consume true crime shows like their own personal pornography as having something wrong with them. Believe in any actual religion, and all of it's mythology? Perfectly reasonable. It's adults who enjoy things that are considered a little more family entertainment oriented that get called out as weirdos for what they enjoy.
So, yeah, when you talk about how creepy "Disney Adults" are for continuing to enjoy those parks and products, they get a little sensitive about what is bullying someone for the entertainment they choose to consume.
As a devote Agnostic myself, I found this a brilliant breakdown on religion and psychology.
Making wedding guest pay for ANYTHING besides gas/hotel to get there is DICK MOVE.
guests pay for hotel rooms also (but the host books them)
@@porsche911sbs noted, comment updated.
I grew up watching the golden age of Disney animation. I have nostalgia with a lot of Disneys programming. However, I do not understand the fervor for the theme parks. I know people that visit disney land once a week. That’s fucking weird.
Jesus. How's that even possible unless you live in Orlando and just have money to burn like that.
In this economy?
Fuck that
@@zaczane I think if you live in Anaheim you get deep deep discounts.
who has either the money or the time? What?
I get what you mean but... its not different from going to your local bar/restaurant/concert place/insert-place-you-enjoy-here every week is it? Its not that crazy to go and visit a place you like once a week.
I'm always concerned with the amount of diagnoses made for people who are fanatics of everything outside of what is attributed to "normal" interests. Be it Disney, Sci-Fi, Tabletop Games, or Serial Killer Podcasts, there's an implication that the individual liking them is outside the norm, and needs to have some sort of justification for enjoying their fandoms or interests, because the vast majority do not share this level of interests. It also begs the question, what is considered an "acceptable" interest for an adult? What's scary is that alcohol seems to be a root of all acceptable adult interests, or even one of the only ones out there for an adult to enjoy with low risk of judgment or needs to justify it.
And I find that concerning. Alcohol is perfectly fine, but what does that say about us as a culture if we can only empathize with each other's desire to inebriate ourselves in our free time as a form of entertainment? Why was wisecrack's first alternative to satiate a Disney adult to have them still be in the park, but in a section that serves alcohol? And why do some people take such great offense if someone just says "Hey, I don't really like drinking" (that's more of a personal story for me. I don't really like drinking and got chewed out by my boss because I didn't want to go drinking all night with them, and he accused me of hating my team).
So idk, I don't know why one has to justify liking anything, or why the things they don't have to justify are things like alcohol, sex, and football I think? I feel like for men at least, it's expected that we're supposed to have some passionate opinions about football. And what does that mean for people who just don't like some, or all of those things? Personally I'm just exhausted of having to validate my interests, or LACK of interests all the time, and feel like maybe I'm just broken and shouldn't even be here anymore. I'm just so tired dude.
What does the archetypical "normal person" even look like anymore in 2022? Are we at the point where "enjoys superhero movies" is OK for the "normal person" to partake in, or is that still nerdy as well? I like to imagine that in 2020, with all the bars closed and the sports not sporting, our archetypical "normal person" alternated between outdoor grilling 24/7 and staring at the paint on his walls.
It does seem though like "justify your interests and also your entire being" is less a concern for Gen Z though, which should be refreshing to you and me and everyone who doesn't like to constantly judge everyone else. Aside from the spectre of my own mortality, that's like the biggest reason I wish I was born ten years later.
I as someone outside the US who has dreamed of going to Disney for a long time will not let anyone discourage me just because they are uncomfortable about me been at a park having fun and spending my time and money about however I like, I guess this is just making fun of people on the US and what they like but that has been happening since Umberto Eco talked about Disney on his essays and well there are so many things to criticize about Disney but in a world where everything is going to shit any type of fun is welcome as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone so let people have their fun
Yeah, you come right on over when you can and enjoy yourself! There are so many people who for one reason or another couldn’t go to Disney as kids, whether they lived too far away or had no money to go even if it was a few hours away. No one should feel bad for finally getting to do something they just couldn’t before. I hope you get to go to one of the Disney parks and that you have a blast.
I would encourage you to take a hard look at several photographs of crowds at the Disney parks. You will notice mostly adults. Some have kids with them, but tons don't. If there are people who think the parks are only for families with kids, they have lost that argument.
Please feel free to come and enjoy the parks. They're fun.
Well written and well thought out. I’m looking forward to part 2. You’ve changed my mind about Disney and Disney adults in general. I was really against them for a long time because I never understood why they love it so much. The framing of Disney fandom as a part of a transcendental experience that to makes a lot of sense to me. Furthermore your point about how subversive stories are told in those fandoms makes me wonder if this sudden hate for Disney adults is really coming from forces that would rather have us divided and hating each other rather than gathering over a shared love for something.
Forgive the poor writing- it’s almost midnight and I’m very tired.
"The framing of Disney fandom as a part of a transcendental experience that to makes a lot of sense to me."
I think this is kind of a dangerous mentality though. The reality is that people like things, and not all people like the same things. Just because they like something you don't doesn't mean they're having some crazy "transcendental experience", it just means they like something you don't. This way of thinking is why the "satanic panic" happened in the 90's - insisting that D&D players "must" believe they're practicing witchcraft. Of course it was the insisters who were the religious loons, not the gamers. No, they just enjoy their hobby, it's that simple.
@@KingBobXVI I don't think they're framing the transcendental experience as something crazy though. Sure, I've never had euphoric religious ecstasy over playing D&D, but it would probably be pretty cool if it happened, and it's sometimes hard to deny the experiences you see at, say, old videos of The Beatles and Elvis, or even modern fan reactions to new movie trailers.
I’ve been saying Disney is turning into a religion for years.
Anything can be a religion. Even poop. The video mentioned fandom. Most of the video is about fans.
In that case, anime, Sonic, My Little Pony, Batman, and Star Trek are religions. Jediism is a recognized religion since 2001 before Disney bought Lucasfilm in 2012.
So, saying Disney is turning into religion didn't add any information. There was already a Disney fandom, like other movie companies.
Maybe those who "have been saying" should write papers to experts. Otherwise, why does it matter?
@@PedroCouto1982 Is that a Tenacious D reference?
@@quesoblanco444, no.
Ah, they had a poop religion song
@@quesoblanco444, I used it as an example just because it seems extremely silly and disgusting. But it's not impossible. Some people are sexually aroused by seeing poop or thinking that someone needs to go to the bathroom. There are lots of messed-up people. Hey! Don't waste grandma's poop.
There's another angle to this which overlaps with online adult fandom of children's media, which is that when an adult inserts themselves into a children's space, already an act that requires a justification, they then need to behave in a sensitive and appropriate manner. being an adult in those spaces, and acting in any form of egocentric manner is irresponsible and dangerous. An extreme example is 'Brony' fandom essentially flooding an online space frequented by minors with pron and some of the artists actually coming out of that into jobs on the shows themselves.
I feel like this hardly applies to Disney though, especially the parks. Have you _been_ to a Disney park? Like, the vast majority of people who go are over 20 already, it's not like it's exclusively for small children, and it never was.
People over the age of 20 are allowed to have fun, sorry if that upsets you, I guess.
I think this video's definition of Disney Adults is reductive. According to Wisecrack you're either a Disney Extremist or you're not. It allows no nuance for pragmatically enjoying the artistry of Disney films and attractions while acknowledging the realities of capitalism. It isn't kids or suits who are actually making the product. It's individual adults who are artists. The gatekeepers of their art form just happen to be a product of late stage capitalism. I don't like TH-cam as a gatekeeper, but I still appreciate Wisecrack videos.
This video didn't seem to notice the distinction of pathologizing fandoms of adults who are fanatics for children's media (Disney or My Little Pony or Marvel Movies) versus fandoms of intentionally adult behaviors or media (violent contact sports or sexual activities etc). That's where the creepiness of it comes from.
“My husband may be addicted to pornography and poisoning himself in various ways, and spending extra money on doing it in more social ways, and obsessed with the sight of men playing with balls, tackling and beating the shit out of eachother for his entertainment, but at least he doesn’t want to watch movies about people with super powers who aren’t Jesus!” Lord, our culture has become bizarre.
I think someone who is a fanatic of violence is an issue, and from an objective point of view it is definitely creepy.
I don't go by the label "Disney adult" but now that I am not only a DINK but my husband works for a major airline so I fly for free I have absolutely been taking advantage of being able to go to the Disney parks for a few days on the cheap. Our honeymoon was at the parks and planning that was also 1000% more fun than the hell of actually planning the wedding. I think it is essential to be able to be critical of the things you enjoy. I am very aware of the problems of the Disney company (ie their quest for global dominance) and have no issue talking about those problems. The ability to be critical and accept criticism about your favorite things to me is what separates it from being akin to a religion. In my view religion is structured in a way where you are not able to truly question doctrine and practices that people are socially pressured to adhere to it. If you interact in the Disney fandom spaces that do allow and encourage the questioning of the company and its practices you are having a much healthier relationship with the media. The Disney TH-camrs I watch as well not only speak about the issues of the company but in many cases have spoken directly TO those in power about their issues and those are the voices within the community I respect (The DIS and WDW Today as prime examples)
I wonder whether the difference between a cult and other cultural practices is that cults require the individual to set aside the type of reason you're talking about.
I think you're wrong on religion. Religious fundamentalists can't be seen to question dogma, but where I'm from there are 'liberal' religious types who feel it is normal to be unsure about their faith - they're reasonable people and don't tell you that you're dammed to hell if you disagree. I think you maybe are a Disney Adult. You're just not a fundamentalist. From what I've seen of them, that makes a nice change!
understandable but ur still giving them money
@@morganburt2565 Capitalism is interactacting with companies, governments, people, etc that you dont totally agree. Anyone who tells you that it is possible to be 100% pure and not give any money of these once they have reached a certain level of dominance in our society is lying to you. That is kinda the game we all play "living in a society" lol that's why keeping a critical eye is important even of you still use their products and services.
I personally think the Disney adult hate is also rooted in sexism and society’s need to tear down anything that isn’t inherently masculine or stereotypically male oriented. It seems as though the fandoms that get the most hate are those that cater toward a wide variety of people but “exclude” typical cis male interest. For example: sports, video games, WWE, etc. seem to have highly violent subset fan bases that have even spawned mass shooters and murders over events but no one is denouncing them. But yet a fandom filled with glittery princesses and cartoon characters is seen as the most fanatical interest akin to a cult or religion??
I also think the authors of this video should consider why so many people would flock towards being a Disney fan. I know I can’t think of many fandoms that center women and girls in a way they would find interesting from childhood to adulthood and be able to see themselves in. Same can be said for many other marginalized people. Disney is able to provide that outlet. So yeah I think it’s less about why so many people seem interested in Disney and more about why there are very few other pursuits to enjoy and why the few they have seem to get so much hate in comparison to all the other outlets people enjoy.
The arguments trying to frame Disney as a religion remind me a lot of the "Satanic panic" craze of the 80's and 90's - I think you kind of touched on it near the end, but yeah, none of these people think the costumed characters are real, that the fireworks are fairy magic, or that drinking the fountain water will give them super powers or whatever. But people looking to force critique and paint others as ridiculous will be incentivized to mischaracterize excitement or passion as an absurd religious experience, just like those who insisted that D&D players actually believed they had a magical connection with their characters, or that people playing the card game _Magic: the Gathering_ thought they were practicing literal witchcraft. I think this kind of really bad take comes from simply, you know, not talking to the people being criticized and instead relying entirely on preconceptions of what you think they're like, or to be blunt, strawmen.
In the end the real answer is simple: people like things, some people like different things, and some people like things more than other people like them. The response you got from people online about your comments regarding the teacup ride are obviously unacceptable, but that's more "it's the internet" than anything related to Disney specifically. However, your imagined scenario about it was also really silly and condescending - like I said above, some people like things; it's not up to you to decide if they're allowed to or not or what age is "too old", and mischaracterizing any form of interest in something as "getting emotional" is just kind of shitty on your part, as is insisting that the only valid form of entertainment for adults must be limited to sitting at the bar drinking all day. As someone who doesn't drink, that sounds absolutely miserable, and heck, what's stopping me from declaring drinking culture a religion by this logic, lol.
1. There´s simply a spectrum of adult childhood, which we´re all on, I´d say. And that´s more than allright: it´s important. We all need ease and relaxation and to be comforted in day dreaming and doing things for inherent joy and being openly curious and adventurous. 2. The problem is only in dependencies and self limitations out of lack of personal growth. Not when we choose to indulge in (nostalgic) fantasies, but when we feel we´re so deeply tied into them, that we can never grow. 3. Among those feeling unable to grow are always some with deeper problems and among those a few with violent tendencies. It´s not at all clear, though, that there´s statistically *more* of them in the subgroup of a given fandom, like Disney, than in the general population. 4. Like what you like, think and believe what you will, build your identity however it pleases you. Just never confuse that with it having to matter to anyone else, even in the slightest degree.
I think what makes Disney fandom more unsettling than other fandoms is just how massively powerful of a corporation Disney is. it's similar to, but definitely not on the same level as, the danger posed by the weaponized belief systems of Christofascism - the belief and practices are subject to corporate interests and have the power to significantly alter the sociocultural landscape.
What about Salman Khan Stans? They’re downright scary as heck.
That rap video gave us SO MANY laughs. I didn’t really expect you to play much more than you did though lol
Yeah, I really need part two of this video! Wisecrack always with the most amazing content!
I subscribe to "let people enjoy things." Like anything, people can go too far with their fandom, but hating on someone for being enthusiastic about something that brings them joy is just stupid and petty. Disneyland is for everyone (who can afford it, that is).
Damm. Quite brave of Keirkergard-adult to pick a fight with Disney adults. Will be watching the developments with great interest. Leaving this for engagement.
small correction, it's kirkegaard not keirkegard :D
While I do find the creepiest of the weird Disney Adults to be out there, I don’t care what a person spends their money on. What I don’t like are the ones who go there a gripe about kids being there. When you hear them complain that a kid has a better viewing spot during the fireworks than them or something like that. A lot of these adults are there for the umpteenth time in their lives while this kid may never be there again. Or what’s worse, are the vloggers who live there and go there everyday who complain that another guest messed up their shot. Who cares? You’ll be back tomorrow and you were there yesterday. It’s like they’ve forgotten that the parks were built with families in mind. Not adults with arrested development.
I guess you could call my wife and I Disney adults. While we don't get emotional, we genuinely enjoy it. We Honeymooned at Disney and revisited it once a year on our Anniversary, and have traveled around the world visiting all the other Disney Parks. It is fun for us, and as someone who grew up never getting to experience Disney as a child due to the religious beliefs of my father, it's something special to me. Granted, we are in our late 30s, and like all fanbases, there are extreme fans. Disney can be highly magical even as an adult. On our last visit in December, we will never forget coming out of Thunder Mountains' first drop right as the fireworks started, and it was terrific. Like all things in life, it is about making memorable moments with the people you love, as at the end of our life, it is the one thing we can look back on with joy. Now when we've traveled to Paris, Toyko, and the rest of Asia, we only spent two days at most at the other parks while enjoying the local culture the rest of our trip. People on the internet get outraged about everything, and some get off because other people aren't like them and don't like the things they do. It's sadly typical to see hatred by people concerning everything. If it makes someone happy, why should you care because who's to say what makes you happy can and probably does make someone out on the internet angry?
love how the comments are just angry disney adults proving your point
It's definitely true that what people get from fandom is pretty similar to what religion was traditionally supposed to have a monopoly on. The way I see it, religions have a habit of taking credit for things that are in fact universal human experiences.
Where is the universal human experience of a crusade? This experience crap would never take Jerusalem
I LOVE LOVE LOVE your sense of humor in this video!! More of your funny quips PLEASE!! 😂
As a former Disney fan and park enthusiast I can see both sides of this. In a cynical world that offers us nothing but grief and pointless struggle, Disney was a little gem of happiness where one could spend a few days feeling like the world could be as happy and wholesome as I wished it could be outside Disney. BUT letting a business control your emotions while it parasitically survives off your income while indoctrinating you with ever more corrupt political messaging is EXTREMELY dangerous. The more I take steps away from Disney and the happiest moments of my childhood, the more harmful it looks
This is real!
My daughter dated a guy who had an adult disney family.
They where only happy at disney or disney cruises going dozens of times a year.
They spent an entire income a year on it. 60 to 80K.
They are to be avoided. When the beast reared it's head in them it was terrifying!
Thank the good Lord She got out just in time to protect her assets before marriage!
*true story you zealots....
Honestly a lot of fandoms that are viewed as normal are even worse. There are sports fans who will actively get in fights, physical altercations because of their "fandom." If someone has a season pass to sporting events and wears jerseys in public I really don't see it being any weirder than going to Disneyland and wearing costumes, it's basically the same shit when you boil it down.
Exactly, just another fandom. I find it funny quite how easily he dismisses the comparison to sports without any actual discussion of just how similar it is and how many sports fans verge into obsession in such a bad and dangerous way that they cause actual physical harm to other people and there has been many deaths because of it in many countries. So sports fandom seems way more weird and obsessive than Disney fandom to me and yet he just dismissed the comparison - makes me think he might be a fan of some sports team...
I believe the distinction between ‘Disney Adults’ and regular people that might consume Disney content/visit Disney parks is the attention-seeking behavior on the part of the former. I’ve been living in Orlando for nearly a decade and visit all of the theme parks here regularly. But these people are compulsively going to the parks on a weekly basis, purchasing coordinated outfits (which wtf, it’s 10,000 degrees outside, stop wearing vintage dresses), taking Instagram photos, filming vlogs. The point is not their fandom for Disney-it’s the attention they get from SHARING it online. I wouldn’t go so far as to armchair diagnose a narcissistic personality disorder, but…yeah.
I think more important then the fact that it's a fandom/religion/cult and fanaticism is always dangerous is what this particular cult preaches: Pretty much anyone who based their ideals on Disney's movies is screwed for life. The problems with Disney in that sense are basically every single episode of how TV ruined your life.
I think if you're an adult you can go to Disney world without a kid. If they're not causing trouble I don't see the issue. Idk maybe because I have never been to Disney world or land I think this but if I ever had enough money to go with my friends I'd be annoyed if someone said that I can't go on the rides or be into the theme park because I'm an adult and I don't have kids. I mean if there are enough people who don't want childless adults there they could force Disney's arm to do the Chuckie cheese method of "if you don't have a kid don't come here".
It's definitely 100% a cult. As someone who used to be in the cult, I can say that they make it difficult to leave and they do take all your money. It's basically like that other big cult out there that begins with "S" but it also includes a theme park and media to consume.
Scientology with better PR
They ingratiate themselves to the family, so it makes it difficult to separate. 1000% cult status.
@@bazzfromthebackground3696 and slightly more ethical.
@@zaczane eh, Scientologists just have to scrub toilets with toothbrushes and other weird stuff. All while paying to do it of course, so it’s a scam. I haven’t heard any stories of Scientologist child stars being abused tho.
Disney isn't a cult. It's extremely easy to leave and no one is forcing you to do anything. It's a damn theme park. People act like this for everything, not just disney adults.
I don't know if its a new editor or new style but I like. Good job
I’m 21 years old and one of the biggest red flags for anyone my age or older is a Disney fanatic. All of my friends literally make fun of Disney adults if we see it on our feed, it’s disturbing and annoying
Why do adult Disney fans bother you? You talking a lot but I'm not hearing why it bothers you Michel. You do realize most adult Disney fans are not as obsessed as you have described them right?
I prefer the modern definition of religion because it depends on supernatural claims. That differentiates between "real" religion and fanaticism - people generally don't think Star Wars says anything about the nature of reality or a version of the self surviving death somehow.
i have met people who believe in some form of the Force being real, like a mix between karma and destiny, and also other believers in the Matrix. it helps these are also ideas present in real religions. i also think there is a jedi temple somewhere.
Confucianism is considered a religion, and it has no supernatural claims of note, just moral codes, rituals and a devotion to confucius and the old chinese dinasties.
"Don't put that in the video" could have certainly done with a wink Mike it wasn't subtle enough lol great video
great part 1 looking forward to part 2
i think finding happiness in a specific thing like this is beautiful, theres so much awful shit going on in the world and if something thats not hurting anyone brings you joy you shouldnt let anyone make you feel ashamed
Obviously theres different levels of hurting someone but disney adults, marvel fans, most nerdy shit, etc. is so obviously nonoffensive its useless to criticise or judge just because you find the focus weird or creepy
Literal death threats say other wise
Don’t tell me what’s useless I’ll be the judge of that.
Religion and fanaticism is not unique nor needs or deserves respect.
Creation shouldn’t mind intellectual sparing, as it created the conditions for it to.
We used to go to both Disneyland and Disneyworld as a kid. I have zero interest going as an adult. I don't want to see fake castles. If I want to see a castle, I go to places where there are real castles. And I have gone to many. Most people who fanatically go to Disney properties rarely venture out into the "real" world, and when they do, they expect it to be fake and sterile, just like Disney. They are the types who, when going to Yellowstone Park, ask if they can pet the brown furry cows. 🤣🤣
Agreed.. I getting tired of this “ oh it’s hard being adult so I need this childish wonder .. “ I was watching that Disney adult response video and got annoyed by it.. that’s not mature behavior of course but I just tired of it.. besides I hate theme parks.. too much noise too many people and tasteless objects which most of it I don’t or brave enough to try.. don’t get me wrong I also in that camp of so called childless things like figures collection, anime, manga etc so I not too judge but it is pretty annoying and besides as one from Scandinavia I sometimes gets annoyed by the shallowness of American culture.. I know it isn’t a nice thing to say but come on floating balloons of fictional characters at a holiday in the inner cities or emotional outcry because of some culture events is on display.. and ect ..
i don't get why people are getting pressed about humans enjoying life. so what they're 40 and love disney? why should it be a problem to get emotional and happy about going to disneyland when you're an adult? let people have fun! i don't know why anybody should get shamed for that!
"I'll make a man out of you" is awesome. Just don't forget it's entire context and turn it into an excuse for toxic masculinity, and never apologize
Of course dying is an "if" for Michael. He's a philosopher.
I love Disney I am adult. But not like obsessed with it in a unhealthy way. Also for me I love classic Disney movies and cartoon shows from the 80s and 90s and as far back as Walt Disney snow white Dumbo fantasia lady and the tramp. After that well know being an adult I've lost track of Disney movies and other stuff. I just stick to the classics. 2000s and beyond not much interests with some acceptions. I miss the nostalgia traditional hand drawn Disney animated movies.
My fav Disney film is Bedknobs and Broomsticks, mainly because of magic kicking Nazi rear. That's kickass.
We could sure use some magic armor kicking down fascist rats like the Proud Boys, Q-anon, Queerphobes, and Alt-righters.
Same here. The old movies seem to have a bit more I don't know magic to me but I watch the newer ones with my own kids. I'll love Disney for life cause I grew up with it but I'm not that crazy.
@@DemonChisae3112 same it's why I'll stick to the ones I grew up on. Watching beauty and the beast lion king Aladdin snow white Pinocchio were magical and still magical today
> I love Disney I am adult. But not like obsessed with it in a unhealthy way.
I've said the same thing about Dragon Ball, but then I remember that I have a DBZ tattoo, proceed to look over to my shelf with hundreds to thousands of dollars worth of DBZ shit I've refused to throw away over the years, take a moment to step out of my own head and into "therapist" mode (not a licensed therapist, but not unfamiliar with college-level texts on the subject), and see a clearly unhealthy addiction to a children's cartoon from 30+ years ago. I'm not harming other people with my obsession, but to claim that it's not unhealthy.
The rest of your comment points to you being more a big fan of traditional hand-drawn animation rather than specifically about Disney itself - If you'd love watching the OG Ghost in the Shell or Akira movies and get the same enjoyment out of their animation, then that speaks more towards the love of the art, not the brand) - but my main point is that those with obsessions often fail to recognize for themselves that they are exhibiting unhealthy behavior; the very act of obsessing over something is unhealthy.
A question I have about disney adults is, if you like star wars or marvel as an adult are you a disney adult (because disney owns them). Are all comic book fans disney adults (except DC, I don't think disney owns them).
I love this video so much. Good work.
During the pandemic and lock downs there was a related debate (spearheaded by an popular journalist/TV host) about the special status granted to religion in my country's constitution. This meant that religious activities were exempt from some of the more strict covid-measures. The argument was that the place that religion occupies in some people's lives, is filled by something like music or sports by others. For some, attending a sporting event or music performance, is as much a "religious experience" as attending a church. A good example is some of the self-identified "Metalheads" that I know. To them, music is more than a hobby or interest; its a major part of their lives in a way that's often even more pronounced than some religious folk. So why, in a secular country, should a sermon be exempt, but not a music festival? What is the fundamental difference that makes religion special?
That it's been established for a very long time and we're all accustomed to their antics? idk I'm not a sociologist
Had it ever occurred to you that some of those adults had parents that they couldn't afford a trip to Disney and as a kid they always wanted to travel there?
And now that they've got the resources they're fulfilling their childhood dreams. I was lucky my parents worked hard to take me there while I was a teen and I had the time of my life.
Thank you for making this video 👍
Weird way to avoid the actual problem. If you support Disney, you support a megacorp, and that's wrong.
It is really important to us as a grown adults to make critism of all things. We need to critique ourselves, to critique things that we think and to critique the things that we made.
Consuming the Disney experience is definitely a mid-tier+ ecclesiastical accomplishment according to 8 year old dopamine levels.
I've been to Disney multiple times every year for the past 6 years. My personal vacations I'm an explorer and love going island hopping or mountain exploring. The rest of my family is not, and my parents are also older now, but Disney is a good place to go for a big group. I go with family I love it, my sister and I have grown closer since spending so much time there, so while we didn't go as children, we go as adults and it's a place we're at our happiest. Relaxed, no life stress, (except for plane delays now) it's an adventure and lots of fun. Star Wars and Pandora are only making it better to be there as an adult. Luckily I've benefited from not having to go at full price each time. I don't buy into every single trinket and souvenir, but do enjoy more functional ones. (Wearing a park exclusive hoodie at this time) It's a fun get away, the sit down restaurants are some of the best food I've ever had. And if I lived there, I'd certainly be going to Epcot for most nights out for dinner since there are tons of options that constantly change. (Teppan Edo is my favorite hibachi I've been too) To counter that, I'd also be going to city walk just as much. I've still yet to play the minigolf there when we walk past it every time. Sadly for me, only 1 of my favorite movies gets attention, Lion King (others are Aladdin and Hercules) The closest thing at home we have to amusement is Six Flags, so as a park Disney takes the cake and also blew our minds when compared. I also enjoy Animal Kingdom and the safari as well as the education of the land in Epcot. Figment I love because it's a focus on imagination and creativity, something we should always strive for. And yes, for all it's pro's, the cons are Disney is an out of control corporate juggernaut, who will someday have to get clipped, and they can certainly do better by employees from knowing people who've worked there. I get there's extremes, but it's internet speak. Since I've yet to hear someone in a park actually confront our group and call us Disney Adults, or have yet to be invited to the ever elusive new Disney Adults cove in each park. And the internet is not a real place, so everyone go wild making up whatever you wanna make up.
Disney Adults, is just cringe outrage so that people get frickin views. And hey, it works for you too. People getting mad about getting lumped into a not real category, they need to stop. People getting mad at those who can qualify for a not real category, they can stop too.
Really interesting video, 3 points:
1. We seem to have a false impression that art somehow stands outside of and critiques culture, true to some extent but it largely ignores that fact that all art needs to be funded, and that for the most part art tends to be funded overwhelmingly by the richest few percent who have a very particular cultural agenda i.e. I would say that it's nothing new that we have a tension between Disney as a corporate power house and individual creatives telling stories that challenge (to some extent) cultural norms.
What I think fandom represents in some cases is an appreciation for the authorial voice and it's empowerment by the funding of the larger corporate body. Not that I agree or disagree, just that it seems clear that some people see it as a good thing that they get the heartfelt story because of the cash investment.
2. I disagree that storytellings main power is it's ability to be literal. To look at the diverse forms we have as a broader human culture to tell stories is to see the divergent ways individual authors and peoples have found to try and explicate positive traits and warn of potential suffering. Yes some of that can be done by a literal telling of a very this-world story, but it can also be done by mythologising and fantasy. Of course we can look at the worst examples of both and see either cynicism or naivety, but to look at the range of stories we have told over our history is to see the depth of the human condition, it's subtlety, how it changes over time and how ungraspable it still remains.
Buffy wasn't speaking about vampires, it was the experience of growing up, yet the power added by the vampires helped to express something of the experience of growing up that could never really be captured in any technical definition. Which I would argue is much closer to a more complete appreciation of reality than somehow making the case that our experiences are subjective and thus unreal.
3. People change and grow because of an interaction with their own ever changing identity. If someone sees themself as a failure or underachiever they tend to be caught in a negative cycle where the limit is more expectation and not capacity. And we know a lot now about how much of a difference role models have in our lives because they give us a model for how to be and behave. So one function of story and myth is to present role models and archetypes. Fingolfin doesn't make me wanna pick a fight with the biggest guy in the office, though what he does do is give me a pattern for a certain brand of courage, and a starting place to think about how courage, bravery and sacrifice play out in my own life.
So I'm sympathetic with peoples capacity to see role models in fictional characters because much like my previous point I would question the division between fiction and non-fiction. There was always an author, a voice that was drawing on real experiences and reflections in order to try and tell something of the human condition. I find it amazing that we can condense that down to Picard, Elzar Mann or Aviendha and present it such that it becomes a relatable experience, which quantifiably improves people's real lives.
I agree that there can be some pretty dodgy stuff going on as well, and not all stories and there qualities, are equa. But in terms of some of the positives with adults relating to popular media there's a lot to consider. Again great video and thanks for the usual high Wisecrack quality.
The Disney TH-camr who responded to you looks exactly how I expected
Disney biker gangs, Disney adults, Disney cults, it’s all the same.
The implicit argument is circular: "Disney fans exhibiting religious-seeming behaviors are acting as if they are in a religion." This is the danger in not nailing down your argument to a solid groundwork of definitions.
Okay, I know that webcam meeting was an old video, but you were really ignorant, there. You actually expect adults at Disney parks, who all pay a small fortune in tickets, travel & accommodation, to NOT go on any rides & just sheepishly drink beer & eat churros? Really?
The problem with the term "Disney Adult" on the internet is that it has been appropiated by cynical edgelords and people who hate all animation in general as a prescriptive derogatory term applied to anyone who says anything positive of a Disney show or movie. It equates liking Pinocchio, Hunchback, Gravity Falls and Treasure Planet to groveling at the altars of Eisner, Iger, and Chapek or writing capitalist apologia for them. In short it ignores any distinction between Disney Creative (Eric Goldberg, Alex Hirsh, everyone working on Owl House being screwed by Disney) and Disney Corporate (Chapek, Iger, stockholders and the people behind the Mickey Mouse copyright laws). It makes fans of anything made or owned by the megacorp out to be monolithic extensions of it.
I like how you brought in the Communist critiques, I recommend the Soviet film critic Sergei Eisenstein who argued that Disney was a polytheistic religion in many of his books and essays
Great video!
Can you make a video about Jodorowsky or any of his films?