This Guy REALLY Loves Bless - BG3 Spells Tier List - Level 1 Part 1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ก.ค. 2024
- BG3 Wiki complete stats for all level 1 spells: bg3.wiki/wiki/List_of_1st_lev...
Let's talk about the general principles you can use to build strong characters. Want to never need a build guide again? This is the video for you!
Hang on. I may not have thought this plan through.
Today we're talking about level 1 spells, which will serve you faithfully throughout your career! Covers the first half of level 1 spells, from Animal Friendship to Goodberry.
0:00 Intro
4:19 Animal Friendship
5:56 Armour of Agathys
8:11 Arms of Hadar
10:15 Bane
12:44 Bless
14:15 Burning Hands
15:22 Charm Person
17:29 Chromatic Orb
20:05 Colour Spray
22:38 Command
24:54 Compelled Duel
26:17 Create or Destroy Water
29:00 Cure Wounds
30:20 Disguise Self
31:54 Dissonant Whispers
33:12 Divine Favour
34:57 Enhance Leap
36:53 Ensnaring Strike
38:19 Entangle
39:38 Expeditious Retreat
41:06 Faerie Fire
42:26 False Life
44:29 Feather Fall
45:56 Find Familiar
47:36 Fog Cloud
50:30 Goodberry - เกม
Armor of agathys is also great for "my party totally needs a short rest, but i still have one warlock spell slot"
Yes, it is a great spell for this purpose. But because most warlocks multiclass to sorcerer (because of honour mode), most of the time better to use warlocks spellslots for sorcery points.
@@KirDmAThe game prioritizes normal spellslots over warlock spellslots. So the sorceror points trick only works if you used all the normal slots of that level; counter intuitive to the warlock play of using their slots first because they regenerate faster.
Therefore, AoA is always a good comversion of short rest to long rest resource.
@SkyNinja759
Only if the Warlock slots are the same. If warlock slots are higher (or possibly lower) the game will ask which level it is. I've used the elixirs that give you a slot and it always asks me.
A very important point that wasn't mentioned is that Command doesn't require concentration.
One of the best CC spells in the entire game for this simple fact and the up casting capabilities
Another feature of create/destroy water is that it can reveal invisible enemies by applying the wet condition. The spell is totally busted and way more useful than i would have ever assumed on my first play-through.
I don’t know how I’d ever have a party without a cleric. I feel like I’d go insane without bless and guidance
Pretty sure guidance isn’t exclusive to clerics. Idk if it’s the same for bless though
That's funny, because my impression is that clerics are borderline useless beyond act 2. Bless is obviously super good, but the pace at which clerics burn through their spell slots when they need to do something worthwhile, I'd rather have... any other character class with me.
@mausklick1635 I would try a life cleric with the bg3 healing gear if you haven't before. With a life cleric you can use your channel divinity to significantly heal your whole party and buff them without using a spell slot
@@jaime8013Paladins have bless
Heroes Feast and other all day Cleric buffs are overwhelmingly good in act 3, but yes, Clerics definitely drop off in value. I loaded Shadowheart up with scrolls and potions and she pretty much became a support caster.
Still not sure if Create Water is S tier, but more uses for it:
▪︎ reveal invisibles
▪︎ remove grease, acid
▪︎ protect someone against fire damage
Yep, and many more besides!
44:04 Scrolls of false life do exist and they're pretty good for that exact reason, if you can't generate temporary hp then it's just free hp for you
Fog cloud is criminally underrated here. It single handedly solves difficult fights on honour mode with its save free blind preventing the enemy from using legendary actions for basically free. The Apostle of Myrkul is completely neutered by a single fog cloud and semi decent positioning, and one fog cloud per round solves the Ansur fight as well as killing the dragon in the final battle if you want to take that fight.
Fog cloud is at least a A tier spell.
I agree the only two changes I would make to his tier list would be to move fog cloud up 1 tier and move colour spray down 1 tier.
Oh hey it's you, I know you from your ESO vids, great stuff. I've also never heard that Fog Cloud trick, that sounds awesome.
@@nyromath2195 😬😬 i make bg3 stuff too now! The building in this game is wildly fun. Glad to see some eso people getting around!
100% this. Make sure you can't be blinded, use Darkness or Fog to control the battlefield.
Came to the comments to say almost exactly this. Fog cloud is an amazing ability. So much so that I'm almost even tempted to put it in S tier. There's almost no situation that it isn't helpful. Especially if you have builds that can capitalize on it heavily. On HM this spell has saved my ass more times than I can physically count.
I've completed 5 runs, including jack of all trades and honour mode. I still learn so much from watching your videos man, keep up the good work!
Thanks so much! Glad you like them :D
I love Chromatic Orb because its just the most versitile spell in a wizard or sorcerer's kit. Sometimes you just forgot to bring a certain elemental damage type and you need a big fucking stack of dice in that type.
Well, an upcast chromatic orb against something vulnerable to it will usually be just the trick you need to remove someone from a fight entirely.
It’s also useful if you’re a divination wizard trying to regain their portent dice and don’t have an elemental type the prophecy wants.
Funny thing about Enhance Leap - it's called Jump in 5e (and I believe it's also referred to with that name internally in the game files), so whenever the game sorts spells alphabetically (e.g. if you sort spell scrolls) it won't be in the order you expect. The creator of this tierlist probably used that ordering scheme.
Larian likely changed the name to avoid confusion with the Jump action (since Jump is its own bespoke action instead of just telling your DM "I'd like to jump up here" in the tabletop).
Oh true, that explains it! Good catch
I just love the simplistic art style of the Spell Icons in BG3.
Thanks for making this. Not on topic but definitely on brand.. would love to see more Honor Mode content from you. I don’t see any content creators focusing on the differences that honor mode brings such as the nerfs to extra attack, tavern brawler, and radiating orbs to name a few. Think about it!
Appreciate your content, you have a great voice for narration, and amazing insight into the game. I hope you have a great day! 😄
Hey, thanks so much for the support! I really appreciate it :D Glad you're enjoying the videos!
insane effort making this tier list. gj man!
Thanks very much!
When I got the Ring of the Mystic Scoundrel for my Thief/Sword Bard, Dissonant Whispers started to get a lot of more use. Hold Person on a Bonus Action is still nicer (or making half of that room of Sharrans ogle a hypnotic pattern) but DW not needing concentration is just nice too.
Command is great but some bosses are immune to prone. Like Grym. But command can win the Adamantine Forge if you keep Grym halted in the lava and hit him while he is vulnerable and cannot hit back. Grym has low wisdom so if you have two casters who can cast command its very reliable. (or haste on one with sufficient spell slots). That way you don’t have to worry about catching him under the hammer.
True! There are a couple times halt is better for sure
After way too many playthroughs, Disguise Self has become an S tier spell for me. Generally, it can skip fights without needing ability checks (or by providing easier ability checks), and massively cut down on the amount of resources I use from combat and inspiration rerolls, while also letting me get xp that I might have trouble getting early on. On top of that, getting the shapeshifter ring for an extra Guidance is amazing. Some of my favorite uses include (spoilers)...
-Drow'ing my way through every goblin encounter
-Being a Githyanki to get through Voss' patrol
-Bullying Dhourn as a female Drow (more for humor than practicality)
-Making the Drider wander into the shadow curse after taking its moon lantern (as a Drow)
-Getting extra soup from the Tiefling grandma as a Halfling
There are probably loads of interesting dialogue options from this spell that I haven't seen yet (tell me your favorites). As a standard edition player, fitting Disguise Self into my party is one of the party comp decisions I need to make.
The problem is that the game (at least even on tactician mode) is too easy for all those tactics to have any value besides the convenience they provide. Crafting supplies are infinite, camp supplies also, most fights are manageable (even on honour mode) and after 1-2 playthroughs you can predict-prepare for any fight etc.
@@michaelgoudis344 yeah and just using a camp buff-bot trivializes most combats anyway even on honour mode in the early levels. Free longstrider for everyone, warding bond on your tank/whoever, mage armour for your mages, removing curses, chest unlocking using knock etc. As long as you prepare before you set out, you can have all party members just rock all damage builds and win 90% of combat in the first 2 rounds.
I think Disguise Self is really interesting since it goes up in value every time you play through the game, as you learn the encounters it can be used in. For later playthroughs it's definitely more powerful, but for first-time players it won't be as strong. Makes it hard to rate!
My favorite are the unique disguised-as-a-drow but not actually a drow dialogues in the underdark. Not powerful, but very fun.
The downside is, you may actually want your character to look as you designed him to look, rather than a generic version of another race/gender
Looking forward to next one!
On disguise self, another thing you can do with it is gain access to racial dialogue choices. Keeping it early, talking to the tiefling camp leader as a tiefling, or knocking on the first temple as a gnome has unique dialogue for those races, and disguise self can grant those to all. Also, if you have the preorder/deluxe bonus items, it should never be taken on any character, as the helm you get can cast it on a character, and you can pass it to the next character and get your whole party disguised for free.
I have 500 hours in the game and have beat Honor mode 3 times and in my opinion Command is literally the single best spell in the entire game, to the point where i think it's just broken and feels cheesy to use. You can stack spell save DC on your cleric and permastun every single boss in the game. I don't even know what Raphael does on honor mode because i have never seen him attack, he just spends the entire fight groveling with his cambions since you can target more people per upcast. It's ridiculous.
Such quality and helpful videos.
Thanks very much! :D
Was eating pretzels while listening to this, nearly choked and died because I was not expecting the create water joke, 10/10 guide.
Shout out to Command for getting the party frontliner the everburn blade every run at the start of act 1.
This is a lot of fun. Thanks.
I’d say Disguise Self is pretty incredible in act one (letting you skip fights when you’re at your weakest) and keeps coming in handy until the end of the game (for access to items if nothing else). I’d argue it’s A tier on average from being game changing in act one to meh in act 3.
What things can you do with Disguise Self in Act 1? Curious.
@@Aequilix goblins fear drow. Disguise self lets you skip multiple fights or even kill off some goblins without them fighting back. It also helps in a few places later (particularly to get better treatment from the Githyanki and to open up dialogue and item options), but it’s at the Blighted Village and in the Goblin Camp where disguise self really shines.
@@Aequilix you can turn into a halfing and get extra slop from the slop woman in the grove across from Dammon
And a free +1d4 to all checks with a certain ring.
One thing that might warrant Bane being B tier instead of C tier, is that it’s really useful in situations where enemies have to make repeat saves. Good examples include moving across an ice surface or skipping a turn due to Bestow Curse: Dread.
My biggest gripe with Bane is the poor range.
Expeditious Retreat singlehandedly makes Eldrich Knight better than Battlemaster or Champion in Act 1. You can get the Linebreaker Boot fairly early in Act 1. You can get a Maximum +7 to your attack without any penalty. It is flat 7, no dice. It does not have -5 penalty like GWM, and it stacks with it for a +17 extra attack. If you Action Surge and all the hit lands, that is 17x4=68 more damage, at level 5.
And being a fighter, you get Con Save proficiency, and assuming you have 16 Cons, you will have +6 to saving throw. If you get the spider armor, you get an advantage on the save. You are very unlikely to break concentration.
See this is why I come to the comments. Looking for those niche interactions. Act one is a mostly “solved” problem after a couple hundred hours of play. Line breaker boots have always been gale food. If he’s still eating by that point. Trying to think of different things to build around. This is a cool interaction. Ex retreat might just get prepared now. Zoom zoom.
@@anteyehero It's actually more viable than I thought, lol. If you can get the 'attacking already damaged enemies for bonus attack roll' Greatsword from the Fist early in Act 1, you'll get +17 without any downside, lol. And yet, some people still rank EK RP tier.
I would put self-disguise and fog up at least A-tier. Just at beginning of the game, can disguise yourself as Drow make all the difference. Fog have a lot out-of-combat use, aka stealing, or to avoid massacre when you want to loot the steel walkers in act3.
I think both of those are fair!
The Familiar, like most summons, has never disappeared when I’ve unprepared Find Familiar. I doubt all of my games are positively bugged. :-)
I love that spell. It eventually stops being as useful, but can be game changing in act one.
Same here. Not just find familiar, but all the summons I've tried. Extremely overpowered replacing a summon myrmidon with a chain lightning in your spellbook if you get that lvl6 slot back by various means.
Even in honour mode act 2 I'm getting tons of mileage from it. M'boi Quothe consistently blinds 1-2 targets and eats a similar number of hits thanks to Aid. Not bad for a free ritual cast.
Next time I play a run with cheese tactics I plan to give my familiars personal camp butlers to bestow them with mage armor and death ward, hehe.
@barkedog what's his health with aid lol
@@dinosuarman13 Depends on the spell slot used. Right now, 16 hp. :P
Divine Favor is an A for me. First, it uses a bonus action instead of an action, which is great for paladin who wants to smite. 2nd, there are a good number of gear that synergies with concentration.
Was waiting until I saw where you ranked command before liking the video haha Command is a game winner at every level as it makes it a level playing field with strong weapon wielding enemies, such as the paladin in the 1st act and then combined with high spell DC (especially the hat of arcane acuity) it wins the game as concentration free crowd control
Yes, there are scrolls of false life. Used it as you described before fights for a small bonus.
Interesting note about healing in bg3 is that there’s an item you can equip that maxes out healing done by each cast. It makes being a healer much more reliable in this version.
I Find bless to be great for about the first 5 levels but after that builds start to come online, and a cleric will have much better use for there concentration selection in most encounters.
Once martial classes get there second attack and third level spells become a thing I just do not find myself needing the extra dice to reliably hit targets like I do for the first few levels
It really depends on how often you long rest - if you're trying to minimize it, there's some fights where having a high-impact level 1 spell is useful. If you're long resting frequently then you'd definitely rather use higher level spells
I generally find bless the best for multiclassing builds. Someone like an Eldritch knight or Ranger doesn't mind taking 1 level of Life or War Cleric and concentrating on bless if they were not concentrating on anything in the 1st place.
I use the Whispering Promise ring from Volo for most of the game. Combined with the Blade Ward gloves, and a single mass healing word buffs the entire party without using concentration. Throw in the healing amulet, and it doesn't even cost a spell slot. To me, it feels vastly powerful in the last half of the game while letting my cleric concentrate on something bigger.
Great video.
30:24 Disguise self is an insane sleeper pick.
Ceph didn't mention the shapeshifter ring. A ring you get in the extreme early game that allows the character to roll +1d4 on all checks when "shapeshifted." (ie. Disguise Self and Wild Shape).
You aquire it without long term consquences by sacrificing one party member to the ox in the emerald grove, fight the ox, lose, then resurrect them with Withers, go make ammends with the ox and buying the ring from his inventory. This means you don't have to kill it in act 1 and forgo either his questline or the fire damage arcane aquity hat he has later on.
Stacking roll modifers on a party face like a bard that can cast disguise self can snowball out on control very early on:
Shapeshifter ring, actor feat at level 4, friends cantrip, and a guidance caster in the party means you can hit 8-11 bonuses to dialogue rolls while still above ground in act 1. Unless you roll double 1s you're not failing any checks at all until maybe midway through act 2 this way.
I'd say disguise self is a must take on any designated party face just for the free 1d4, let alone all the interactions a knowledgable power gamer can squeeze out; like unlocking multiple encounter bypassing dialogue by shifting into a drow to talk to scouts/members of the goblin camp.
All this for a non-consentration ritual casted spell. Which means the only price for constantly being shifted all day is one prepared/learned spell on your list. That's an easy S tier spell if there ever is one. It isn't straightforward, but it is more useful and powerful the more you learn about the game.
Agreed on most everything. One thing I'll say about bless is that on higher levels the opportunity cost is just too great. Which build would prioritize it as their concentration over something decidedly more powerful for its playstyle? Maybe a Fighter11/Cleric1? Or a Cleric/Wizard that has almost exclusively offensive spells scribed? I really can't thing of something else.
While I love bless, it most often will come second or third on your list sd a concentration priority. Other than that, this list a pretty similar to mine, with a few one level bumps or dumps not worth mentioning here.
Fun fact - that one lightning crown that works with lightning charges doesn’t overwrite a previous temp HP source, and instead acts as temp HP healing. You can use it to keep your armor of agathys “topped off”
Fog cloud is also pretty great for obscuring crimes you commit (stealing, killing, destroying other peoples’ stuff if needed, lockpicking illegal doors), which is fantastic out of combat utility (for a lower cost than darkness).
Burning Hands is pretty good on EK Evo Wizard builds. Particularly nice with Phalar Aluve. It's not hard to get 9D6 + 3D4 with that setup which is a pretty reasonable rate for a level 1 spell.
Create Water is no longer available as a cantrip. That was an unintended bug. You're supposed to just throw water bottles.
Compelled Duel + Sanctuary on the caster can give an enemy Disadvantage on all their attacks. This is useful in a couple of specific Boss fights to give yourself time to clear all the adds first. Such as Sarevok.
Wait you actually clear Sarevok's adds? Please tell me you're referring to the knights guarding the entrance, I got wiped real hard the only time I tried to take the ghosts out.
But if it is the knights... You can just dispose of them before meeting Sarevok so it's arguably just a waste of resources.
Disguise self is a secret s tier spell if you know everything you can do with it.
I think that's basically true! Once you've learned the encounters it goes up in value a ton, but for first-time playthroughs or where you're avoiding metagaming it won't be as strong
There's also the shapeshifters boon ring that bumps it up a notch.
I agree with that.@@Cephalopocalypse
I can take a rogue with 17 dex starting and expertise in slight of hand and that combined with a few items found in act 1 and I am averaging a 28 in slight of hand rolls... no shop keeper is safe.@@user-wv8yk3xu4h
That and a little gameplay knowledge go a LONG WAY to make yourself a God tier thief in Act 1@@user-wv8yk3xu4h
LOL, I was about to enter a battle on BG3 while watching this, so I used the Staff of Arcane Blessing to cast Bless before the fight.
I just realised that a way to build a Wildheart Barbarian with the 6th level Chimpanzee feature without "wasting" camp supplies would be to just have a camp druid cast the spell 2-3 times, and you have 8-12 possible blinding attacks that deal either 1 + STR mod or 1 + 2xSTR (Tavern Brawler)... Cloud Giant Tavern Brawler would deal 17 damage, and while the enemy does get a save for the blind (CON save with a DC 8 + Prof + Barbarian's DEX mod, as of Patch 5), it's still one spell giving 4 opportunities for Blinding and damaging...
Just started my second playthrough. First was 193 hours! On steam it actually said 250 lol. Anyways, you make the BEST videos Ceph, you know your shit! So, I wanted to say thanks and also for my second playthrough leaning toward your Necromancer build for Gale. For my main character I was thinking paladin/warlock do you have a build for that, Ceph? Or maybe you have a better recommendation for a fun/interesting build. How about a Monk multiclass of some sort? I might even start over and do a Dark Urge. One thing for sure is I AM getting Minthara this time around!😅
Lockadin took a hard hit for honor mode just an fyi. I imagine it’s still quite good outside of that. Take my words at surface value though as like you, I’m just starting my second play through after a long first campaign
@Saturday_Jones oh I'm not attempting honor mode until I'm very comfortable with all the mechanics of the game. Which even after play8ng for a month I still am not.
Thanks very much! I do indeed have a lockadin build up, called "Break the Lock(adin)" - it should work very well with a necromancer, though sadly the oathbreaker aura isn't as good as it sounds like it will be for undead since even the skeleton's bows don't count as weapon attacks.
RE: Honour mode, honestly lockadin is still a top-tier honour mode build, the nerf just brought it back in line with other classes by fixing the extra attack
@@Saturday_JonesLockadin is basically a fighter as far as attribute dependency, all the while being the best DPS/ Team Tank combo in the game if you get the aura(s). Still top tier, just not outright broken.
I'm grateful for the clarification on Lockadin from those more experienced than myself.
A better way to explain Bless vs Bane is: Buffs are always greater than Debuffs, as far as 5e is concerned. Why? Buffs always work. Debuffs have saves. This doesn't mean debuffs are bad, it just means that an equivalent buff would be better.
Anyway besides that I commented on your cantrips list, explaining why I disagreed with you, so I'm here to do it again. I also think you should have an F tier, and you try to argue in favor of honestly useless spells too often.
I would argue that animal friendship should be "useless" as I can't think of a fight where it's actually useful, even marginally. Definitely an F tier spell, since it's covered by friends, a cantrip, and has no readily available combat usage. Charm person can at least be used in.... maybe 1 combat? It's not a good one, I'd still put it in F, but I could at least see an argument for that to be in D. Neither of them should be above D though, and I would even put them in F.
On that note, I'd also put Color Spray in F tier. Short range cone like burning hands, but it inflicts blinded. That wouldn't be bad, if it didn't have an HP limit. The Hp limit kills the spell almost instantly, as you can't even reliably blind 3 goblins. Just use something like grease or something similar. Hell, use burning hands, you'll probably kill whatever you're hitting unless you only have one target.
Burning hands is a good spell. Fire is not a bad damage type; it's resisted often, but also hits vulnerabilities here and there. It also always does damage, even on a save, which makes it a useful spell. I would still prefer magic missile, but it should be moved up a tier.
Chromatic Orb should be moved down, it's not S. It's great, don't get me wrong, but most enemies will simply jump out of range of the effect, so Ice is less useful. And ice knife will do that slightly better anyway. The variable damage type and creating those surfaces for you to exploit otherwise, though, is still amazing.
Compelled Duel is way more painful to get hit by than use on an enemy. I'd put it in F as well.
Cure Wounds should go in F tier, and is an argument on it's own for why you need one.. Just use healing word instead. the value of the dice is not worth the range penalty, and healing is bad in 5e systems anyway. If you want out of combat healing, use prayer of healing, the second level spell, or potions. (or rest)
Disguise Self is S tier; it's a ritual that lets you bypass various racial checks and requirements, as well as dialogue options. This is pretty huge, but it doesn't even cost a spell slot on top of that! trivializes many sections of the game, and is helpful for some builds (shapeshifter's ring).
I would move ensaring strike down. Concentration entangle on a ranged hit is mediocre; but it's low cost so it's still good, but not *great*.
False life should be moved up a tier for the single reason that the warlock invocation lets you spam it, and it procs arcane ward for abjuration wizard. This is niche, but it's an incredibly overpowered build. Meaning it's Marginal, not weak.
Fog Cloud needs to be moved down as it is currently bugged. If it wasn't bugged, it would be worthwhile. As is, it's situational.
Goodberry should be moved up; life cleric/druid multiclass gets good use, and extra potions are never a bad thing. It's not a *lot* of healing, but it's more than enough to justify casting it if you have a druid, almost every day after level 4 or 5. Useful. Not great, but Useful.
If I didn't comment on a spell, it's because I have no notes.
Appreciate the detailed reply! I think most of your picks for a theoretical F tier are right
Are you sure about False Life as an invocation proccing ward? That shouldn't work, since it's a necromancy spell - not that the invocations proccing arcane ward should work at all anyways, so it's a little weird to say it's bugged since the whole interaction is already bugged. The Mage Armour one does work, but that's abjuration. Either way that's a use of the invocation not a use of the spell False Life and has no bearing on whether you should learn or prepare it though.
I very well could be misremembering that; however I know there *is* a build that uses false life on a regular basis to proc something, though without abjuration wizard I can't remember what it was. Likely wasn't as powerful, so in that case I agree it's probably best kept in D tier.@@Cephalopocalypse
That said, the invocation *does* have pretty solid usage on anything that isn't a fiend warlock. Those extra temp HP add up quite a lot over the course of a few fights. Decent argument for it in that regard, at least. Not good for wizards or sorcerers, however.
I have gotten a lot of good use out of Burning Hands when needing to finish off weaker / damaged enemies. I really value its flexibility, because it is a level 1 cone spell and there really aren't many other spells that can do what Burning Hands do at level 1. Ice Knife is obviously better in a vacuum, but risks damaging your own characters much more than a forwards directed spell. So I'd bump it up to Marginal.
Yeah I thought burn8ng hands could be bumped uo one as well. Agree with your comments
I definitely used Burning Hands a few times in act 1/2 versus stuff like the spider matriarch children, the ravens, and miscellaneous goblin fights or against the shadow plant things. It fills the role of being an effective way to take out groups of low health enemies without needing to waste a higher level resource like say a cast of Spirit Guardians or upcasted Magic Missiles.
Same. Burning hands did very well when I was fighting those skeletons in dank crypt. I know that they don’t have much health to begin with, but their ray of frost attacks are brutal if you don’t get rid of them fast.
Burning Hands is quickly replaced by the consumable grenades you get many of for free, Alchemists Fire. AoE fire damage from ranged without consuming spell slots is much better than the little melee range cone of Burning Hands.
Someone mentioned the Spider Matriarch eggs can be killed with a single cast of Burning Hands, but that is significantly more difficult and dangerous to do than throwing a bottle of Alchemists Fire from far away. I just did this on Honour Mode the other day and it trivialized the fight. 3 bottles of Alchemists Fire destroyed all the eggs without anyone getting caught, and I was able to easily surprise the boss and kill her without worrying about her children.
I definitely wouldn't want to use 3 spell slots and walk into melee range for the same outcome.
47:00 correction: find familiar doesn't allow you to enter small or tiny holes. Thats only available for wild shaped druids
It's odd because there's nothing I feel is super wrong on this list in a vacuum, but within the context of BG3 I do disageee with a few small things that are mentioned.
- Bless *does* absolutely slap since it's a prebuff... But because The Whispering Promise and Hellriders Pride is so prolific and can be applied with a singular bonus action to your whole team at fifth level, it doesn't feel as impactful as the rest of S
- Disguise Self is a weird one because I think it's an A tier spell for power when it's useful, but B is probably perfect for it. If you're using it to it's fullest potential it absolutely owns. It allows to skip/bypass a lot of checks that let you blaze through the early game which is nice, and then you can also use it in conjunction with reduce to fit into animal scoutable places.
- Command is somehow better than you mentioned as well because the lack of a concentration check, plus the usage in conjunction with Extend Spell making it two turns of hard CC, plus that gishy builds can very easily use Approach to set up massive AoE. It's to the point where it's basically better than the others in S aside from Find Familiar and Create Water, with the massive achilles heel of Undead ruining your hopes and dreams.
- Very small nitpicky point but I think Psychic as a damage type is stronger than listed because you can also very easily apply vulnerability to it with a frontliner like an Abjuration Wizard holding the Resonance Stone and absolutely mollywhop people with it.
- Enhanced Leap was technically in the right spot on the tier list, just for it being called "Jump", which is what the scroll calls it.
All in all I like basically 99% agree and am excited for the next vid
The fact that Bless can be applied as a bonus action with any cleric or druid or bard using a single ring that is BIS for most of the game, I say Bless is not only severely overrated here, but it's actually one of the worst spells in the game especially as it's a concentration spell.
Arms of Hadar does half damage on save, which makes it sort of like a very weak fireball. Guaranteed 1HP and in some cases more likely to do 2 or 3 than Eldritch Blast. The dream case is that you can hit a dozen single-digit HP enemies at once. For lethals, usually it's less reliable than Magic Missile, but you don't generally have the option.
I love this channel even if I make insane comments about how this man HATES level 1 spells.
Coincidentally the same fight where you would want create or destroy water to put out flames(or at least the first one) is also a fight where it is useful as a way to reveal invisible creatures. When revealing invisible creatures it does range in usefulness depending on how much you cheese enemy invisibility but it does at minimum make sight based spells and melee attacks work on the enemy which is super helpful especially in that specific fight. Plus the destroy part of destroy water can destroy some surfaces that can be annoying, I haven't used that part since act 1 tbh but if used well even for a cast that requires a spell slot it can be nichely extremely helpful
Also Cure Wounds is pretty good and one I'd label B tier. That is 90% personal bias as that heal spammer but there are moments where you need that extra healing especially if you commit to healing and have a beacon of hope up where the extra healing over healing word really shines. Losing an action when being healed up from downed is a pretty severe penalty compared to tabletop where there is no downside at all so extra healing really can matter long term. The only way it's outclassed is if you have a lot of healing potions since throwing potions can essentially be ranged cure wounds that only takes 1 attack and potions aren't in low supply but I think it's still marginal because there are just as many times that you want your bonus action to drink an elixer or whatever as there are that you want your action. I'd say B similar to the Tabletop but I think C tier also would make sense. It's never really a spell you don't end up using from my experience, it's utterly outclassed out of combat by prayer of healing but sometimes you either need a bigger heal than potions can give or can't throw a potion where you need it.
Yep - all excellent points about create water - it just has so much utility!
If you enjoy in-combat healing, I just posted a build that focuses on that a couple days ago ("The Best Healer in BG3"). Might be fun to try out! ;)
“just like your fanfiction” that was out of nowhere ceph lol xD
Literally said it in several other of his videos, so not really out of nowhere.
Fog Cloud also good for stealing and for sniping scrying eyes like in the Goblin Camp without being detected.
Having Shart command the general on the nautilus to drop his sword and then having Lae'zel pick it up makes the fight pretty easy.
Yup - also gets you the best weapon you'll have for the first several hours of the game!
If you want, and with little saves scamming, you can swap it with silver sword within 30-50 minutes)
I've had a somewhat hard time getting much use of surface type spells in my playthrough-enemies just jump over a lot of them unless they're quite large. I'm very interested in knowing what, if anything, you all do to combat this?
1: Place the surfaces where enemies won't have a chance to jump, like at the top of a ladder.
2: Toss water around before an obvious fight to freeze/electrify it later, making larger surfaces. Or toss a couple grease bottles.
3: I suspect blinding foes might limit their jumping range? I can't recall them ever jumping out of Hunger of Hadar.
4: It's not the worst thing to trade a casting of Grease for a few enemy bonus actions sometimes. If a paladin has to jump over to you, at least they won't be able to pommel strike-smite you on that turn.
5: Throw, shove, knockback arrows, Pushing Attack, etc. can be used to put enemies back in time out.
I wish they added more create water like interactions in game. It feels like a remnant of a system they had planned for all the elements and damage types but only water remained with all its insane effects.
one thing that really bugs me about Disguise Self that I don't think they ever fixed is that while it temporarily adds the racial tag of what you're disguised as, it removes ALL other tags while the spell is active. Anything special option in conversation that would proc because of your class, background, or chosen origin character will not appear while you are disguised. Somehow, disguise self seems to even suppress your dark urge.
The most important difference between Bane and Bless is Bane affects one enemy while Bless affects any enemy.
The most important difference is that bless is only useful to characters making attack rolls and bane is only useful to characters casting spells with a saving throw. Bless is borderline useless on a lore bard while bane serves no function when your party members are all two-handed fighters.
@@cthulhuwu_simply don’t bard.
I feel like I have to disagree on burning hands. On paper I think you’re right, however, in practice it does exceptionally well against most the goblin fights. It can definitely be a fight ending spell in many of those situations.
It does scale horribly, but between scrolls, learning spells, and being able to swap it out later on on a level up or through withers it doesn’t matter.
It’s a very high efficacy spell in the grove area early on, even if goblins save the dc most of them don’t really have the health pools to survive.
Disguise self is not just RP. Any item that requires a certain race will benefit from disguise self and is consider as being “shapeshifted “
I hope that undead patron warlocks end up in the game at some point. Warlocks would make great use of False Life and Bane
I'd like to mention that as of patch 6, the cantrip version of Create or Destroy Water was patched out due to being a bug. Perhaps it was a scrapped feature that mistakenly made it back into release? Either way, although create or destroy water is still an incredible spell, its no longer completely spellslot free to use in combat.
Goodberry might be the most efficient way to proc all that buff-on-heal gear you can build around. For one spell slot you get 4 charges and don't need to spend time grind purchasing health potions from merchants
True, good idea! I genuinely don't know - does it count as the caster healing the person who eats it, or them healing themselves, like a potion?
Just double checked it now, works like a potion. My dwarf cast goodberry on Karlach who was wearing Whispering Promise. Karlach eating a berry activated bless.@@Cephalopocalypse
I think you couldn't find enhance leap where it should be because it's just called "Jump" in game? So it was near Inflicted wounds and Longstruder Think I saw something about this in another video or maybe even patch notes.
Seems like it! The tabletop spell is just called Jump, and I guess it's named that still in the game files
Be careful with entangle if you are planning non lethal attacks. Twice now it’s killed an enemy I finished with melee combat.
Wait - create water as a cantrip at level 3?? I was today years old when I heard this one...
I just checked my spellcasters and don't have this - is it only a cantrip for a specific class/subclass?
Thanks! :)
You need to select it from the actual spell, rather than go into the cantrips section - you'll see 3 options when you click create water: create, destroy, and create (upcasted). It's the 3rd one. For some reason it shows the level 2 upcasting symbol, but has a small area and no spell slot cost
Thanks! @@Cephalopocalypse What a weird bug that upcast is a cantrip... but I'll be using it in my current Honour Mode run-through! 😂
WAIT, create or destroy water gets a cantrip version when you hit level 3 or spell level 2? What?!? I have 600 hours in the game, am at the Myrkul fight on Honour Mode on what is my 4th full playthrough of the game, have had that spell on every one of my runs, but I had no idea this was a thing. I knew that you could upcast to make it a larger area, but this cantrip version is news to me. How do you access/use it?
Yep! The icon is weird, it shows up as upcasted (with the little II in the corner of the spell icon) but makes a small puddle instead. You have to select it from the casting interface rather than the spell slot interface, and it's the third option. Should show as Create Water, Destroy Water, Create Water (Upcasted).
Just attempt to cast the spell as normal and it will give you an additional pop-up or radial, I guess, depending on your platform, that has the opportunity to cast the spell for only an action cost. No spell slots required.
The radius is really small, though, so only useful in specific battlefield settings. But I can basically have my party take a bath after a fight, so it still will get a lot of use.
@@Cephalopocalypse oh, I have actually noticed that icon, didn't understand why there was a new icon for upcasting but had such a small radius, and I just left it there and never investigated further. Thanks!
(Playing on console) has this changed? I only see the option for slot 1 and slot 2 for create water
I wouldn’t say Armor of Agathys is A-tier. As a concentration spell you usually don’t want to get hit while casting one… which is the whole point of the spell.
Luckily, it's not concentration :D
It is NOT yeah I just found out omg
So yea it’s a great spell once upgraded 😂😂
I've never seen create water as a cantrip spell... on my 3rd playthough what am I missing? If anyone could elaborate thanks! (Had to edit because auto correct changes cantrip into centripetal...)
If you select create water it's the third option - will show up as Create, Destroy, Create (upcasted). For some reason it has a little level 2 icon, but that's the cantrip version - it has a tiny area so you can tell if you're casting the right one by the size of the spell.
@@Cephalopocalypse Wow I had no idea. I never even payed attention to the 3rd option so thank you for the help! Great videos by the way keep it up!
!IMPORTANT! Create or destroy water cantrip was removed in a recent update since it was aparently never intended for players to have, it was only in the game for use by mage hand janitors in act 3.
Goodberry got a raw deal here. yeah better than the base heal, but on table top each goodberry feeds 1 person for a whole day. way stronger as camp supplies there
Goodberries should have been atleast 5 camp supplies a berry. So on balanced you can freely long rest for saving a single spell slot.
Then on higher difficulties it can help out with saving supplies, as the long rest cost exponentially increases.
Even if the level 1 spell invalidates a mechanic of the game, camp supplies are never a problem in BG3 and are ridiculiouslu abundant. All goodberry would do is negate the busywork of collecting them; solidifying it's niche in a co-op or speedrun setting.
S Tier for me is Magic Missiles, Shield, Mage Armor, False Life (staff of cherished necromancy baby), and every ritual spell since they are basically free cantrips.
Mage armour is not very good (basically anyone can use light armour, and multiclassing to draconic sorc 1 is a better option to, using your spell slot for mage armour is strange). False life a little better, but why even use this spell not from scrolls? But magic missiles are the great spell, mostly for evocation wiz, but useful for everyone.
@@KirDmA the best armor for wizards is the robe of the weave. There are no light, medium, or heavy armors that provide increases to spell save DC which for a caster is far more valuable than an increase to AC. Also a whole level into draconic sorcerer just to replace 1 level 1 spell is laughably bad since it limits your build options. If your worried about the spell slot cost just get a hireling to cast it on you for basically free.
As for False Life the Staff of Cherished Necromancy lets you cast it for free at level 6 (which is a massive plus and makes most Necromancy spells S tier in BG3) which gives you +32 temp Hp every turn if you desire. That level 6 cast is also why we don't cast it from scrolls.
42:30 If false life "shield gated" an attack it would be really good.
Shield gating is a term used when the breaking hit's extra damage doesn't bleed through to HP.
So if you had false life with the 7HP shield and something hit you for 30HP, false life would break and you'd only take the 7HP shield and still be at full actual HP.
As is though, it's a terrible source of temp HP and scales horribly. Larian should have looked into home brewing a additional effect to make the source unique; since it's a video game and temp HP isn't as scarce as it is on the table top.
It should give a single get out of jail free card for squishy wizards, and multi-attacks would easily bypass it anyways.
Divine favour is A, prebuff use just gives you 1-4 extra damage. Concentration slot being used isnt really a concern for the early game. bless can be used by a different character or by resto/whispering promise amulet/ring. Definitely shouldn't be D.
Instead of using create water, I just lob a bottle of water with one of my throw barb's bonus actions, but yeah... "wet" best status effect.
Hmm a bit late to the conversation.. While I agree that the "wet" condition is super strong and "S" tier worthy, I don't think the Create Water spell should be S tier because there are other ways to apply it that don't require a spell or an action even:
The most straight-forward comparison would be to simply throw a water bottle, it has a smaller radious but it's otherwise a fine replacement for the spell, or better yet have a mage hand throw it for you (which you can pre-cast making it action free) or you can also just palce the water bottle on the ground (any character can place items on the floor mid-combat without consuming any action) and then either use a hand crossbow off-hand attack to break it (so bonus action) or just cast the spell without breaking it and the spell itself will break the bottle and apply wet (that spell won't benefit from wet but the following ones will and if your alternative is casting create water only to apply the condition then might as well just use the action on an actual damaging spell that will also break the bottle and apply wet).
Create/destroy water have version that is free(not permanent and with smaller radius), so if you don't have water bottles(and sometimes you simply ran out of it), it is very good.
Please excuse my lack of testing, I don't have the game. You said that Larian implemented Fog Cloud this way to differentiate it from Darkness. From the wiki it I understand they cause the same effects but that Fog Cloud is one spell slot cheaper and can be upcast. My only thought is that Devil's Sight will see through Darkness but not Fog Cloud, but I'm not sure, and that's definitely not what I understand from ~"Larian implemented it this way to differentiate from Darkness." Please, what am I missing?
So in tabletop D&D, fog cloud blocks line of sight (ie, you can't see into the middle of it, so you can't attack things that are inside it). In BG3, it doesn't do that - you can still attack into it from outside. It *does* count as a fully unlit area for stealth, so a rogue can hide inside it easily, but it doesn't otherwise block attacks from outside it.
Darkness in BG3 still prevents ranged attacks from outside the cloud, so the two spells are pretty different in play.
Thank you so much!
@@Cephalopocalypse
When I have no idea what to do, which is often, I cast bless. If I have
I play this game using a mod that gives me a lot more spell slots. It’s kind of sad to see a lot of spells I use are pretty bad overall and it makes sense since vanilla gives you such a limited amount of spell slots so you’ll obviously wanna use the most utility/best ones
I had animal friendship slotted for awhile and yeah it’s not worth burning a spell slot. I’d rather use level one slots to heal companions in battle 😅
just started a new playthrough, currently don't have a bless OR guidance in my party. it HURTS.
Fortunately both are available from gear! The silver pendant (guidance) is just outside the emerald grove and the staff of arcane blessing (bless) is in the wizards tower in the underdark. I typically want to use bless more frequently than the staff will let you, but so many builds benefit from a 1 level dip in cleric which will get it for you.
I too am running a campaign without guidance and the amulet geenah mentioned has been a huge boon
I tend to make either Shadowheart or Astarion into Cleric/Rogue multiclass to cover these basics early game. At level 4, with the ring from Volo and gloves stolen from the head tiefling, lots of good buffs from the healing word (twice per turn).
That staff is like a super bless as well but can only be used once a day.
There is nothing great, only bonuses from staff is extra 1d4 to Spell Attacks rolls. All other bonuses is not changed from base bless.
44:00 yes, false life scroll does exist
My only problem with Create Water is that there is no equivalent to fire and acid damage.
The four base elements should be equal, but am currently running a cryomancer sorc, twin casting ice knife on some wet guys just kills anything.
If greace made enemies weak to fire on a direct hit, that would make fire so much better, and if acid had its equivalent as well, create water would be less OP (relatively speaking)
Yeah - "wet" is a house rule that's sort of a leftover from Larian's earlier Divinity Original Sin games, where elemental combos was a huge part of the gameplay. In BG3 beta they included a lot of that, but it's not really a thing in D&D, and during beta they slowly removed it all until only wet (and ice surfaces) remained. It's pretty bad for the game balance since it's not really part of this system!
@@Cephalopocalypse So am not terrible familiar with 5e, ive mostly played Pathfinder and 3.5, but to me, the reason wet is over powered is because there is no other equivalent for the other elements, making cold and electric much stronger then Acid and Fire, wich suck for Fire since its the most resisted element of them all.
As for Force, Tunder, Radiant and Psychic damage, they look to me as less resisted elements and most of those carry other benefits, tho i can remember you saying that Psychic was resisted by a bunch of late game enemies.
It could be cool to have more environmental effects in BG3, since entangle, fog cloud and greace is already an environmental effects, Slippery ice and electrocuted water fits quite nicely inn there.
And an other point is that BG3 is a single player pve game, the balance dosnt need to be perfect, it just needs to level the options so a single optimal strategy isnt blatantly obvious.
But then again, am from the hellscape that is Pathfinder 1e, the environmental effects you can put on the field there is nothing short of awe-inspiring.
Don’t think I’ve ever used a spell on a Paladin that isn’t a smite reaction… unless it’s a multi into sorc etc, maybe elemental weapon but only if I can recover that slot after using it 😂 divine favour though I have used on war clerics a bit, but only when out of war charges… and tbh only when I had nothing else to do with bonus action
divine favour is easily A tier imo, I always precast it in your eldritch thrower build and it elevates the level of the build by a significant margin (and have a ridiculously op synergy with luminous armour, an act 1 armor piece). I always precast bless and divine favour for every combat! When the fight is tough i like to precast a twinned haste with a 3rd charcater aswell! The game is trivialized with these tricks.
Edit: After a few minutes of thinking, i would put it even in S tier...it's effectively a better hex(unless using projectiles spells, of course)/hunter's mark, which consumes your bonus action every turn for a d6 of dmg(it's extremely rare to find an enemy which don't die in 1 turn)per attack, while divine favour gives you 3 turns of a free d4 of damage per attack, if you precast it...
Burning hands is great for an eldritch knight. You want to be in melee range anyway so that's not really a downside. I'm puzzled by your comment that it's "less damage than most other damaging effects at this level" - it's the best level 1 AoE damage, and none of the other multi-target level 1 spells (arms of Hadar, magic missile, thunderwave) can be enhanced with water or the like. I'd put it in B tier overall, A for an eldritch knight.
26:31 where? how? what? i have not seen in game or listed anywhere else that create/destroy water gains a cantrip version at level 3
edit: oh patch 6 happened
Putting bane c teir is crazy
In my experience Find Familiar does not require that it be kept prepared. Never. That’s true for the Summon Elemental spells too.
Yup, that's right - I was misremembering based on how it worked in early access!
bane and bless while similar have 2 separate instances where one should be used over the other. bless is better if your party makes attack rolls and the enemy forces your party to make saves. bane is better if the enemy makes attacks and your party is casting spells that force saves. for example bless is less useful than bane in the case that your party is full of casters that have very little use for attack rolls, and the enemies are full of strikers that rely only on doing attacks. bane is a useful spell for its level i would definitely choose it over bless if the fight calls for it.
True! Though even with a party full of casters, a lot of spells use attack rolls rather than saves.
They would be similar in this case if the enemies were always in range and you were often fighting only 4 enemies. However, you often fight more than 4 enemies so Bless gets far more value over the fight than bane since Bless lasts the whole fight and affects your whole party for a level 2 spell slot while bane requires higher-level spell slots to affect all enemies. Additionally, it's far more likely to be in range to bless all your allies than to bane all enemies you want to. Bane also always needs an action in combat while Bless being able to be casted pre combat makes Bless almost always worth casting and Bane almost never worth using. Also Bless always works and bane requires a saving throw.
Dissonant whispers has to be S tier. No concentration, prevents enemies from moving for 2 turns, and makes it easier to hit them? It destroys melee users on its own, can be doubled with silence to completely shut down a mage user (like the Hag), only costs a lvl 1 spell slot, and does damage on top of it? Not enough for you? A lvl 10 enchanter wizard can double cast it with a single dip into bard. Or just use the band of mystic scoundrel to cast this as your bonus action on your swords bard after ripping off 9 bow shots on everyone else in the room. Too much utility for its spell price point and almost every build can integrate it with a lvl 1 dip. Great on GOO Warlocks. Cast hex then cast dissonant whispers and it does some incredible damage while locking down the enemy from fleeing or charging you.
Command is in the right spot, however if you're choosing to use lvl 1 command over dissonant whispers I'd question why, outside of forcing them to drop their weapon, two turns of them standing still while doing damage feels slightly stronger IMO. Obviously lvl 2 and 3 command are a totally different story but still.
Save scuming command drop gets two of the best 2 handed weapons in act 1
In case ppl miss the important part: No easy access to friends -> prepare Charm Person xD
I normally agree with you, but here you fumbled. False life is a REALLY good spell for a pure Wizard build -- especially Necromancer or Summoner. A: It stacks with Aid. Yea, yea, you can start your wizard with one level White Dragon Sorcerer, and give yourself AoA which is better, for sure, but for some Wizard Builds you need all 12 levels. Also, pre-buffing your Gale with False Life at low levels 1-5 is super effective in tactician. If that momma Owlbear jumps on Gale in a fight, he's usually dead if he doesn't have false life up. Same goes with Anders and a few other mobs. Having False life on Gale is a better option than losing him for 2 rounds of combat and forcing your healer to use a spell slot to revive him. It's a definitive B tier spell for Wizard.
I firmly disagree. If your level 1 spell slots are getting less value than preventing 7 damage, you are not using them right.
I don't know about create water, I have never used it because... well I just throw a bottle of water instead, or a barrel. There are more bottles to found in the game than there are fights, and anybody in the team can do that.
"There is basically no character that has access to Bless that won't want it" You mean aside from literally anyone wearing the Whispering Promise, the best-in-slot ring on almost any cleric or support caster? The ring you can acquire by level 2 for only 100 or so gold?
Mass healing word is little late option. Even if you use amulet with it, sometimes you really want bless prepared for safety.
Regarding Charm person: you said it removes one enemy from the fight; this isn't actually true. The spell prevents the target from attacking the CASTER, it is 100% free to attack your other party members.
Also you said characters in combat with you receive advantage on the save, in reality all enemies whether in combat or not get advantage.
It's a spell that's hard to land and has marginal effect outside all but very few niche cases (playing solo triggering combat on non-hostiles by casting the spell), I would say it's one of the weakest spells in the game for combat use. The illithid power to charm attacker as a reaction is much much better, costing a reaction instead of action and no spell slot, and it is still terribly weak. Charm is D-tier spell, no reason to ever pick it
The only knock against Create Water, is that there are unlimited Jugs of Water that you can throw to get the same effect but with added benefits:
Thrown jug has double the throw range (vs casting range)
The throw action only uses 1/2 an action for characters with multiple attacks (or 1/3 for a high level fighter)
And you can also do damage to a target
And the wet effect is actually permeant (unlike the spell).
The only actual advantage Create Water has are the larger wet AOE radius if cast as a full spell. But you can also throw a Water Barrel for a larger AOE and more throw damage.
Just have your Tavern Brawler attack once, then throw a jug on an enemy, and let you caster zap them
Thrown water . . . better action economy, better range, bonus damage! Skip Create Water, its D Tier! 😉
Spell radius can't be beat for wiping out 10+ people at once.
True, but you need to upcast Create Water to 3rd level or higher to get a larger AOE than a thrown barrel . . . and a multi-attack character can always throw 2 barrels for the same single action that casting the spell would take.@@CAiNiAC
@@trengilly01I'll check it out and test it when i get home. If barrels actually explode as good as a level 2 slot thats not bad.
Barrels are funky because they explode in a square pattern instead of a circle! (don't ask how the physics work 🤣). But you can control the rotation of the square by rotating the throw. With two barrels you can make some longer rectangles or figure eight patterns giving you different options for including enemies.
@@CAiNiAC
Create water can also wet your party to make them resistant to burn