I believe that the hardware manufacturers should mandate 60fps on all games. Stop with this quality/performance nonsense. Force devs to target a fixed frame rate
It's so funny to me that these people are out here spending $800 on a PS5 Pro and the real problem is lazy Developers that do piss poor optimization Android lie on upscaling technology to do the work for them. I am so glad that I am working my way completely out of Gaming because it is just become dumb and not worth it
@@walter_the_wobot2349 I totaly get where you are going, but consider that you give people games with this graphical fidelity and then take it all away - granted being 60 fps - for 1440 with shitty sw ray tracing. The train left the station and if you want you can hop onto PC side, that is capitalism at its finest. Honestly I may be biest because i have 4080 system, but AW2 is amazingly optimized game when not in dense forest areas. The Lake House basicaly run 90+ fps on my PC. Cyberpunk too, but consider that 40s have RT Reconstruction (DLLS 3.5) that performs better than native denoiser and producis more stable/better image. The problem is that AMD is simply just not competing right now with Nvidia in terms of ray tracing computing and every major or new game will lean on RT features. We have yet to know what 50s will be like and new consoles are 3 years out. I dont think that anyone that wants to play games with RT feature will be getting console when you can get 4070/ti that will give you nice experience in 1440p. Or we go your way as you said and devs will make games that will look like potatoes compater to their PC counterparts. Idk but i dont think that will happen.
So, after a few days with the PS5 Pro, my takeaway is that while the ray tracing is noticeable, I just don't think it's worth the hit to performance. I would take a game that runs at 60 fps with no RT over a game that runs worse and has RT 10 out of 10 times.
If i look to the past to some games with great reflections, but without RT, it think developer should try to find different solutions again. There are so many tricks to create great reflections (or giving the illusion) without beeing a 100% accurate and realistic reflection. Performance, physics and objects are more important to me. A dead world with realistic reflections, but poor performance is not worth it. We see developer using more and more AI solutions, while performance with native resolution and fps is getting worse. Should be not the case. We need new engines for better performance.
Wow can’t believe the pro can do this, it’s a lazy port by the devs without a doubt but I struggle big time with this game even on my 4080 super have too dial back a lot of settings to hit any RT the game is way to demanding and it’s not impressive enough for the specs!
@@Da-ikenray tracing is more than reflections. it’s creates physically accurate lighting while making it a lot easier for devs. we should definitely want to see ray tracing improve because not only does it make the workflow easier for developers, but it’s goes a long way in creating mood and tone. advancements in lighting is going to be huge for the future of graphics and design. look at the ue5 megalights video. that kind of lighting being so easily accessible is going to create amazing looking games. as far as “old ways of doing things” there is only so much you can do. we’ve really hit a peak with the level and quality of graphics. now it’s onto these other things like ray tracing to help push things forward.
@@seanpitt27 PS5 Pro isn't running max settings, the best upscaling, or high end RT with high resolution RT reflections. The difference is someone optimized the PS5 version for a target frame rate, whereas you have to optimize the PC version, and sounds like you are struggling with doing so, even with much more capable hardware.
Yea this is my opinion too. I can’t play games at 30fps anymore and will choose a 60fps mode over ray traced 30fps any day. It doesn’t matter how much better it looks, those nice reflections and lighting doesn’t look better than a nice smooth image at 60fps and 60fps does more for the image/game at making it look and play nicer than any ray tracing can ever do on console. If they can’t offer ray tracing at 60fps imo it’s a waste of time even implementing it to begin with. This is why I want to buy a pro to play games with ray tracing at 60fps, If it can’t do that then what’s even the point of upgrading? Il just stick to my base ps5 on performance mode 😂.
I guess in '24 it is safe to say that it is not worth mentioning & wasting time with a "quality" mode running at 30FPS, especially when it comes to a piece of hardware at a cost of 800€+ 🤷♂️
Yeah. A massive open world game that performs greatly no matter what with RT and great image quality. How devs are still getting away with 864p as an internal resolution is baffling to me.
@@TheAmazingSpiderGuy_99 blame the cheap, trash engine these devs are using. Playstation devs have arguably the best engines possible, along with RAGE engine.
They half assed this update and are more concerned with the dlc which will also look half assed. I was waiting for the Pro to play this but won’t support them if this is what they come out with.
@@lewishague123 The shimmering looks worse. The only thing that is better currently is the frame rate when looking up and down is smooth now in fidelity mode.
I just uncovered yet another instance of dishonesty from our dear NXGamer. He compared the performance of the RX 6800 to the PS5 Pro in Alan Wake 2 with RT enabled, but here’s the catch: the PS5 Pro only enables ray-traced reflections, while the PC version, even on the lowest RT settings, activates ray-traced global illumination. Digital Foundry proved this today. At no point did NXGamer bother to mention this *“minor detail.”*
lets be straight about it - this is ridiculous. ps5pro upgrade is actually good area for DF guys to shine, with their precise measures and in-depth testing - difference from standard ps5 is so miniscule you need some effort to even point it out.
@@bmarcinczyk14where is this true? can you link a source because that’s the exact opposite of what every test has shown. what games on the pro look worse than the base console? this game isn’t indicative of every experience.
As far as I have understood it, you pretty much need a 4k HDR TV to see the difference, which is then pretty noticeable. On lower quality monitors on the other hand there is virtually no difference at all.
what's really sad is that this new console isnt a nessesary buy for any group of players/customers EXCEPT for rich upper class dudes who always have to have the most recent gadgets to show off/feel better - sadly its a pretty big demographic (ie when comparing to 15 years ago). same people that always buy new apple products, or just people with too much money - they wont be using this hardware as often to be noticing better picture or 5-10 frames more...
@@sampopaukkonen4014 Every TV sold for the past 5 years is 4K HDR. The RTngs best budget fall 2024 4k HDR tv is only $347 on Amazon for a 55"!! For the adults in the room that's only $261 in 2014! I think the vast majority of people purchasing any flavor of PS5 are rocking 4k displays.
The internal res is still too low for the best results, pSSR is not a miracle worker, i'm just really surprised they couldnt achieve atleast 1440p internal res in quality mode.
@@evostu7814You’re surprised? Do you know how demanding AW2 is? Maybe go watch DF’s PC review of AW2 again. You need a 4080 at minimum if wanna render AW2 to internally at 1440p with RT on etc. By the way, RTX 4080 in 4K with DLSS quality (internal 1440p) with RT runs at an avg of 43 fps.
All I wanted was the ps5 console settings in performance mode running at a higher base res upscaled to like 1440p and a stable 60 fps on the pro.... Remedy dropped the ball with this one trying to do too much and not putting much effort into it
Comparing the performance and fidelity of PCs versus consoles is so much more interesting than analysing two very similar consoles like the Xbox series x and the PS5 Thanks for diving into this topic-this is exactly the kind of content that makes me love DF! 👍
I have a PC that makes my PS5 look like a PS4. On YT, never seen anything like the real thing, unfortunately. Keep in mind, just as a AMD PS5 is to a AMD Xbox, many AMD PCs are like that to other AMD PCs as well, with the variance of GPU size, CU units, and GPU generation. It is all the same. Because of YT compression, it would be hard to see the real difference between the PS5 and the PS5 Pro, as DF has warned about even about those two not long ago, that you would have to see it with your own eyes to really get the difference. Most peoples life experience in tech, is streamed and compressed YT video comparisons though.
@@lukastemberger Honestly, if it feels annoying to you, don’t bother with it-just turn it on and enjoy playing with the default settings 👍. However, if you enjoy into tweaking and want the best graphics, you’re probably an enthusiast. In that case, consider getting a PC, it's the better option for that. More power, more choice in games, settings and hardware. etc. Console and PC each have their own strengths.
It's basically closer to PSSR Ultra performance which should be reserved for 8K output, not 4K. 1080p is a hard limit for 4K. 864p is just too low. They shouldn't abuse upscalers this much (until they are so advanced that you can't tell the difference from a normal viewing distance)
Been playing on the Pro for a week non-stop. *Not impressed to be honest.* For some games it works exceptionally well (e.g. Horizon Forbidden West) but there are still too many compromises and Alan Wake 2 is a perfect example. PSSR is promising for sure, but it has a long way to go to reach DLSS levels of quality/performance.
It is just in „beta stage“ getting prepared for PS6. If you think about how this is the first „release“ like 1.0, i think it is good. DLSS has been around way longer and if Sony had been able to compete and even beat it then it would have been surprising.
They aren't even at the level of path tracing yet, which is where DLSS denoising actually worked. Originally thats where RR was implemented, was path tracing and not ray tracing. They may had implemented it for ray tracing since then. AMD is still pretty far off, but at least with PS5 Pro you are getting a taste of RT implementation to actually be able to value it, rather than having it so watered down it tanks performance and barely gives you anything visual.
I've been playing through AW2 for the first time on PS5 Pro in Quality mode. Despite the many compromises noted in this video, it's certainly a visually impressive and wonderfully atmospheric experience. The flickering wine glasses in the lodge (which Oliver mentions at 05:04) are perhaps the only point where I found the image flawed enough to take me out of the experience and make me wonder just what exactly is going on under the hood to cause that behaviour.
RT does not work on well Devices under $1500. It just to much for consoles and lower end PCs. People will always chose 60fps with a less shiny floor over 30fps with gops of Ray-Tracing.
@ Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart and Spider-Man 2 would like to have a word with you. Those games ray tracing was very well done on the base ps5 and are even better on the ps5 pro.
Unfortunately, Alan Wake 2 is particularly prone to VRR flicker on OLEDs. I’ve found that disabling G-Sync in the NVIDIA Control Panel for AW2 (Manage 3D Settings > Program Settings) is the only reliable way to eliminate it. While setting a framerate cap can help, it’s not always reliable - even if the target framerate is consistently maintained. Hope this helps anyone dealing with similar issues!
@ I am aware of that. However, setting a framerate cap to a value that you can reach 99,9% of the time does drastically mitigate that problem. And the occasional stutter if affected games is, in my opinion, much better than constant flickering.
It’s all about the frametimes not framerate. Limiting framerate usually helps a little bit but most of the the time you’ll still get VRR flicker. I have also noticed in Cyberpunk for example that frame generation will destroy the frametimes.
@@Simon_Denmark exactly! While I get a perfectly even frametime graph in RTSS when limiting FPS to the lowest value I could reach in any given scene, I still get VRR flickering in dark scenes. That’s why I now disabled G-Sync for games like Alan Wake 2 because I much rather loose out on G-Sync than having to deal with strobe-like flicker all the time
Yeah, I also did this for Alan Wake 2. This would also be a good game to cap at 40fps but because there are so many prerendered videos that run at 30 that also looks bad at times.
We're going to look back on this whole generation of games and their constant visual artifacts the same way we look back on PS1 games and their polygon jiggling. It's just such a baffling thing to allow in a final product.
@@Dd-fb2tjIt takes a beast of a PC to get this game really shining, this engine it's running on and it's optimisation is 💩, someone needs to develop a better engine than this resource hog
It's not an optimization problem. It's hardware limitations. PSSR is nowhere near as good as DLSS at the same resolution in any game. AMD gpu's are not as powerful as Nvidia gpu's in terms of ray tracing. And the PS5 Pro's zen 2 cpu is still a bottleneck. Digital Foundry was spot on when they predicted that the upgrade from PS5 to PS5 pro would be less of a jump as compared to the previous gen's upgrade from the PS4 to the PS4 pro.
i think it’s really important to look at the whole. if there are 60 enhanced games then what’s the performance looking like across the board. if alan wake 2 isn’t stepping up to the plate, that doesn’t negate all the other games that do. just something to consider.
What the HELL were Sony's TARGETS for the PRO model? It seems like every title is SLIGHTLY better, but still not improved enough to actually achieve EXPECTED performance in any of the modes? Like the new hardware delivers a better experience in something like Elden Rings, but it still doesn't provide a 60fps presentation... It seems like they just didn't push the increases enough to make a really substantial difference. I figured their goal should have been to actually HIT the Performance/Quality targets in the majority of games, but in most cases you still don't see the locked resolution/framerates that you'd expect in each mode.
Ps5 fidelity settings at 60fps, it doesn't need to look better, it needs to look the same as the best settings on ps5 but run at double the frame rate.
It's basically getting pc upgrades since that's what happens with a pc, you pay more for the same graphics but you get double or even triple the frame rate, I have a RTX 4080 but play games at 1440p ultra (something a card like the 3070 can do) but then I run the game at 200+ FPS whilst the 3070 can hit 120fps max and that's pushing it.
I don't know maybe future games like monster Hunter which ran like ass on the base PS5. FFVII Rebirth is night and day on how it looks and runs having been having a blast. Granted they need more games it's still fucking stupid they haven't released a patch or made a remaster for Bloodborne.
I got to 3:37 and decided that if I find a ps5 for €200 I'll buy it, otherwise it's not worth having a similar console at a higher price, under any circumstances. The only "advantage" is the exclusivity of certain releases, a shameful fact in 2024. Deep respect for Square Enix who has decided to interrupt this vicious circle.
Not true. There are plenty of games that have used the new Pro features properly. FF7R, both Horizon games, any Insomniac games, and F1. This was just badly optimized by Remedy.
@ lol that’s my point. The Xbox series x can run it 120fps and it was released side by side with ps5 original. I tried playing mad max on my ps5 pro, it can only reached 30fps. Doesn’t matter if it optimized or not.. a powerful console is a powerful console and it should have no issue running older games lol
@@LIK3SQUAD_CEO What? Its a hard software lock from the devs. The developers of Mad Max would have to do a software update for the PS5 Pro. I'm very confused by your argument.
I will say that even though this may be the worst implementation of PSSR, I still noticed a sizable difference in clarity between base PS5 / PS5 Pro in Performance mode on my 85” TV. The “blur” seen on the base system has been removed and the Pro offers a more detailed image overall. The fps difference was imperceptible to my eye, since they’re so close. I much prefer the Pro experience. PSSR is brand new, I’d say this is a good start. Give it a year or two, like we did with DLSS, and the benefits will be even better. In most cases PSSR offers the best image quality I’ve ever seen on a console. That’s a win in my book.
While the dithering/alpha on Saga's hair at 8:23 definitely looks softer and more natural, the specular highlight/response from the base PS5 looks to be totally missing. I can't tell if this is a bug, or if it was never intended to look like it did on the base PS5, or if it's just a result of this particular lighting environment combined with the lower quality hair strands on the OG PS5? Either way, even though the overall quality is objectively better, this *almost* looks worse. It's an odd-tradeoff.
Its a shame the first big Pro coverage of ONE game is on probably the worst patch (with star wars outlaws). In my opinion Dragon's Dogma 2 and The Crew Motorfest are way better use of the hardware. Remedy clearly have to fix a LOT and Sony have to improve on PSSR too, which has big issues with some artstyles (as opposed to FF7 Rebirth which benefits from PSSR hugely without visible issues)
you won't see many improvements in Dragon's Dogma 2, because that title is CPU heavy. sure, if you lock it to 30 fps and improve visuals, that can work, but again, 30 fps was not the selling point of the pro.
@@arturiaarthus8367 Oh my god stop with this BS, Dragon's Dogma 2 is almost always 60 fps on Pro now. The CPU is more than fine, you just don't understand how computers work, and that's fine too because it's an hard subject but please stop talking about it.
I'm waiting to play AW2 with maxed settings once I upgrade my PC. It's too demanding for current consoles and that makes for a compromised experience. Having said that, I've been quite impressed with the pro so far. There have been some significant upgrades over the bace ps5. So im a happy camper !
It's a hard sell convince people to buy 900 euros console and market it as "boost mode with every game". I dont think that DF dunked on PS5 Pro, but it seemed like what they say that for PS5 Pro to achieve PCs performance with RT features is not realistic.
I love these PS5 pro videos. I really hope we get some sort of compilation video of a lot of the other games that don't need an in depth look but would still be interesting to see such as call of duty and Star wars Outlaws
This is like when devs would crank the resolution on Xbox One X because of the stronger hardware but games often tended to run slower on it compared PS4 Pro which used a lower resolution.
700$ + "120" 800$ + "120" Congratulations Sony. This year you have managed to break two world records, the biggest failure in history in the launch of a video game and the biggest scam in the entire video game industry.
Good comparison video. That said, I play on PC and have a 4090. I don’t even use RT. It absolutely tanks performance and you can hardly tell the difference when you’re playing lol
I honestly feel like games on consoles should just run at 30fps and maximize the graphics because for them to run at 60fps, devs have to make a lot of comprises to be possible, hence low internal resolution. On top of this, games still have performance issues.
Might be the biggest thing I miss from my nvidia card, reason i switched is price to performance and my honestly pretty mixed experience with nvidia drivers (somehow always had less issues with AMD) I just really hope that AMD is actually gonna release a competent AI upscaler at some point, they already teased that its gonna be happening but if its like XeSS 1.0 its not gonna be worth it either. Until then XeSS is honestly just far better than FSR
Right they did all that talking about the features they added do the power of the Pro and made an half ass game were the base Ps5 in some areas is getting better proformance. At the minimum the Pro should do alot better than the base ps5
@@MrSmith17 that's an overstatement. When playing pssr is miles better in most games. Some games are getting a shimmer but I guess that can be updated. Don't overblow it. Clearly the attempt here is lackluster
It would be interesting to compare quality and performance mode with AMD GPUs. To find out if there was a real gain in RT on the ps5pro compared to AMD's 6000 and 7000 series.
This is great new Quality mode. Now developers will find another profitable reason to make better looking games with real noticeable RT for console that will also make PC games look even better. Also the compasrison vs PC GPUs on 40:18 , maybe the 4060 TI 16GB is the best equivalent since the 3070 will get beat on certain high VRAM games but not on most
If PSSR can’t be retroactively updated like DLSS, these first few “enhanced” games will forever be tainted by shimmery artefacts. That’s a shame. At this point I’d rather take the PS4 Pro approach - just bump the resolution and enable a few effects please. No need to ruin the image quality with an undercooked AI upscaler. I was looking forward to Silent Hill 2 Remake patch (because that will show off how PSSR deals with upcoming UE5 titles), Jedi Survivor and Alan Wake 2 the most and all three seem to be severely underperforming on the PS5 Pro. I would be okay with the price, with the missing disc drive if the machine delivered on the promise, but now it just seems like an opportunity for people to buy into an expensive PS6 beta program.
@@METROIDROCKSXP98On PC the end user can drag and drop's .dll file with a newer version of DLSS. On PlayStation a developer has to put in effort to push the update on the platform and the update also has to be approved by Sony.
It’s such a demanding game to the point where a 4090 struggles so not much of a shock. I think there should have been. A LOT more focus on non-rt quality improvements here. Shimmering, artifacting, and broken lines or edges are much more important to me than RT.
I think people are expecting too much of an upgrade out of a “pro” console but at the same time if you’re charging 700$ before the disc drive and stand then people are and should be expecting much more power. The price to power ratio just do not match up here. I’ll be waiting for the PS6. Or a deep sale on the pro.
@alexanderulv3886 sadly not other than "soon" :( can't wait to play through it again but without the patch there are visual bugs in all the SSR reflections in puddles outdoors.
While it’s fun seeing developers shoot from the hip with these pro settings at these early days, there will have to be some kind of uniformity at some point. It would be difficult to apply it at higher settings, but it may be possible to have a setting that will run at a flat 120 fps at 1080 or 60 at 1440p as a minimum “pro performance” I think anyone that wants a ps5 pro already has one and being able to guarantee some kind of uniform improvement would probably win over more people on the fence
With how these patches work, I doubt it. I think the developer would have to manually implement, just like how on PC DLSS 2.0 do not get DLSS. 3.7 automatically
Gosh, that made me less optimistic about whole PS5 Pro, PS6 thing. On the other hand that is wrong developers decisions put PS5 Pro in a bad light here. They could simply increase resolution without changing anything at all - and that would be better than what we have now. Or add third "Resolution" mode with settings from PS5 Perf mode and higher internal and output res
The RTX 4070 is 43% faster than the Pro 40:02. But sure the Pro is EQUAL to 4070. Even the RX 6800 is faster than the Pro. And it turns out that PSSR is not as good as DLSS either. What a joke for $700/€800. 😂
The only way RT is involved on this game with a Ps5pro is if you play at 30fps . So the topic of RT is not even a issue. Nobody with a Ps5 plays in 30fps mode . A 4070 PC cost $1500 a Ps5Pro is $700. The 4070 should be 110% faster not 40%.
@Crashed131963 Yeah, no way should the PS5pro be compared to a 4070. AMD lags way behind in ray tracing and pssr is no match for dlss. I suspect that the PS5 pro gpu is closer to an RTX 2080 or RTX 2080ti gpu.
@@Crashed131963 You are out of touch with reality. The Pro is even slower than the RX 6800 which is a $350 GPU. Fast 2TB SSD starts at $100. CPU is $80. Mobo is $80 too. 16GB DDR4 $30. PSU $60 and a case another $50. Around $700-$800 I can build a PS5 Pro equivalent easily.
Not sure if anyone pointed this out, but there is a RT reflections option in the ini file hidden in local appdata. Enable that along with Transparency and you should get close to PS5 Pro image quality.
@@BlacklistMegaT they have feature and image quality parity though. The point of all these videos is to illustrate the difference between the existing console versions of these games and the upgraded console version, and help people determine if the price increase to move to the Pro is worth it. Adding the X to the discussion doesn't change the discussion because feature and image quality wise, it's at parity with the PS5.
@RyneLanders but is it? I don't know that. that's what I'm saying. the series X also would be good as I don't need to watch multiple videos to see if it's the same as the p5.. which I know it isn't it's a bit different so yh. still my point. bro just an extra thing to add could be move . simple
To compare DLSS and ray tracing with a 4070 to a PS5 Pro that's equivalate to a 4060 Ti which has about 30% less head way then at 4070 is uh interesting...
Man, I wish I liked this game as much as everyone else. I gave it 6 hours and was bored to say the least. A lot of walking, the mindspace ruined the flow, and it didn't scare me in the slightest. I thought the jumpscares every five minutes were the cheapest of cheap, and not effective at all.
The PS5 Pro just came out developers rushed out updates for previously released games give it some time the true test will be future games with proper optimizations
Initially, I was really enthusiastic for the Pro, but as time goes on, it becomes clearer that canceling the pre-order was the right choice. It's disappointing, especially since many games were passed up in anticipation of a worthwhile upgrade. At this stage, the idea of transitioning to a PC feels more feasible than ever.
Think for yourself and don’t let others think for you. I know this isn’t a high end PC. If you want that experience it will cost you 2 to 3 times the PRO and then some. If you want the best plug and play experience in the living room that will make your high end display look it’s best this is it and it will only get better as more developers spend time with the machine and as the models for PSSR get trained more and Sony deploys More updates. I’m happy with my purchase and so are a lot of others that own the system. I believe a lot of negativity is around the price as I’m sure is this launched at 499 or even 599’witb disc drive there would have been overwhelming positive reviews. The issues are people which includes TH-camrs that put out content to try and influence the market to what they believe and want. This isn’t going anywhere to happen. Sales are doing well and Sony will keep it at 699.00. It is what it is.
I switched to PC a while ago. You will not regret it, it is an excellent platform for enthusiasts. There's a lot of freedom of choice in game and hardware options and tweaking your graphic settings can be a lot of fun.
@ I have both a PRO and PC and believe each one has their own strengths and weaknesses. Do what is best for your use case. You can’t go wrong with either option
@@Patrick-tw7nr Good point they are very different products in some aspects. Simplicity versus complexity. But with that complexity comes better graphics and more freedom of choice.... but PC's are more expensive.... etc.
Oof, PSSR got slaughtered here. I vastly prefer the FSR2 resolve on PS5 & the PSSR output is an absolute turnoff with that pixel swimming going on at all times 😬
The Performance mode on the pro is absolutely ridiculous. What were they thinking? Also with the comparisons between the baked shadows and volumetric light...both consoles are shimmering af! I'm watching this video on my 55"LG CX and both versions look utterly THE SAME!! Also PSSR runs the game worse in some ways than FSR2!? If I had fallen for the PS5 Pro hype train now would be the time to absolutely regret a purchase. What a scam.
DF needs to do a 5 minute video of the games suffering from these awful artifacts and send it onto the developers. I doubt they'd pay attention to these longer discussion videos (which I love). But a quick video of all these visual problems may be addressed in a more timely manner if DF showed them. If this was a casual persons console it would be of smaller importance but this is for people who want a high end experience and we shouldn't be getting equal to or worse performance/visuals than the base console for £700.
When you consider how much more resources NVIDIA have for training their AI, its not at all surprising that PSSR still falls short, especially on the more challenging input resolution. I do think it was possibly a mistake to not keep the settings the same on performance mode and try to push the resolution up a bit, but perhaps that didn't work in their testing.
When are you going to compare against the series x i remember yall comparing the one x to the ps4 pro how come you haven’t done it this time??????????????
I want a stable image and higher crisp resolution, before I care about ray-tracing. This upgrade in my opinion does not do the PS5 PRO justice. If I was looking at this game I would not waste 700 dollars on the pro. Honestly is this a joke?
Absolutely loving my PS5 Professional. I think that Alan Wake 2 isn't the best example of what PSSR can achieve, but still a sizable improvement over the previous console versions of the game.
Agreed, I wasn’t initially impressed with the perceived res jump but then you notice overall image stablitly is a lot better and no horrible occlusion fizzle along with much better settings on performence mode. Such a shame that the frame rate still falls a lot in that mode, surprised remedy let it out that way
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat it ran like crap on pc too though. Most people couldn't run it well until like months to a year later an optimization patch came out for older hardware because their sales were terrible.
![PS5 Pro Is Selling Better Than PS4 Pro. | New PS3 Streaming Games Coming To PS5. - [LTPS #648]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/86mXY0V7OvE/mqdefault.jpg)
![PS5 Pro Is Selling Better Than PS4 Pro. | New PS3 Streaming Games Coming To PS5. - [LTPS #648]](/img/tr.png)
For the love of god developers need to start building games from the ground up to be 1440p 60 and stop overextending the hardware and visual fidelity.
I believe that the hardware manufacturers should mandate 60fps on all games. Stop with this quality/performance nonsense. Force devs to target a fixed frame rate
That is the silliest thing I've seen today. Most console gamers don't even use 1440p displays.
It's so funny to me that these people are out here spending $800 on a PS5 Pro and the real problem is lazy Developers that do piss poor optimization Android lie on upscaling technology to do the work for them. I am so glad that I am working my way completely out of Gaming because it is just become dumb and not worth it
@@Mcnooblet I think the idea is that a guaranteed 1440p60 will turn into a guaranteed 4k60 using AI anti-aliasing.
@@walter_the_wobot2349 I totaly get where you are going, but consider that you give people games with this graphical fidelity and then take it all away - granted being 60 fps - for 1440 with shitty sw ray tracing. The train left the station and if you want you can hop onto PC side, that is capitalism at its finest. Honestly I may be biest because i have 4080 system, but AW2 is amazingly optimized game when not in dense forest areas. The Lake House basicaly run 90+ fps on my PC. Cyberpunk too, but consider that 40s have RT Reconstruction (DLLS 3.5) that performs better than native denoiser and producis more stable/better image. The problem is that AMD is simply just not competing right now with Nvidia in terms of ray tracing computing and every major or new game will lean on RT features. We have yet to know what 50s will be like and new consoles are 3 years out. I dont think that anyone that wants to play games with RT feature will be getting console when you can get 4070/ti that will give you nice experience in 1440p. Or we go your way as you said and devs will make games that will look like potatoes compater to their PC counterparts. Idk but i dont think that will happen.
So, after a few days with the PS5 Pro, my takeaway is that while the ray tracing is noticeable, I just don't think it's worth the hit to performance. I would take a game that runs at 60 fps with no RT over a game that runs worse and has RT 10 out of 10 times.
If i look to the past to some games with great reflections, but without RT, it think developer should try to find different solutions again. There are so many tricks to create great reflections (or giving the illusion) without beeing a 100% accurate and realistic reflection. Performance, physics and objects are more important to me. A dead world with realistic reflections, but poor performance is not worth it. We see developer using more and more AI solutions, while performance with native resolution and fps is getting worse. Should be not the case. We need new engines for better performance.
Wow can’t believe the pro can do this, it’s a lazy port by the devs without a doubt but I struggle big time with this game even on my 4080 super have too dial back a lot of settings to hit any RT the game is way to demanding and it’s not impressive enough for the specs!
@@Da-ikenray tracing is more than reflections. it’s creates physically accurate lighting while making it a lot easier for devs. we should definitely want to see ray tracing improve because not only does it make the workflow easier for developers, but it’s goes a long way in creating mood and tone. advancements in lighting is going to be huge for the future of graphics and design. look at the ue5 megalights video. that kind of lighting being so easily accessible is going to create amazing looking games. as far as “old ways of doing things” there is only so much you can do. we’ve really hit a peak with the level and quality of graphics. now it’s onto these other things like ray tracing to help push things forward.
@@seanpitt27 PS5 Pro isn't running max settings, the best upscaling, or high end RT with high resolution RT reflections. The difference is someone optimized the PS5 version for a target frame rate, whereas you have to optimize the PC version, and sounds like you are struggling with doing so, even with much more capable hardware.
Yea this is my opinion too. I can’t play games at 30fps anymore and will choose a 60fps mode over ray traced 30fps any day.
It doesn’t matter how much better it looks, those nice reflections and lighting doesn’t look better than a nice smooth image at 60fps and 60fps does more for the image/game at making it look and play nicer than any ray tracing can ever do on console.
If they can’t offer ray tracing at 60fps imo it’s a waste of time even implementing it to begin with. This is why I want to buy a pro to play games with ray tracing at 60fps, If it can’t do that then what’s even the point of upgrading? Il just stick to my base ps5 on performance mode 😂.
I guess in '24 it is safe to say that it is not worth mentioning & wasting time with a "quality" mode running at 30FPS, especially when it comes to a piece of hardware at a cost of 800€+ 🤷♂️
This makes me appreciate Insomniac's efforts even more now
Yeah. A massive open world game that performs greatly no matter what with RT and great image quality. How devs are still getting away with 864p as an internal resolution is baffling to me.
@@TheAmazingSpiderGuy_99 blame the cheap, trash engine these devs are using. Playstation devs have arguably the best engines possible, along with RAGE engine.
Wild that the light shimmering in the lodge is still there on the Pro, it looked terrible on the original
Also the same in Silent Hill 2 Remake at the hotel. Not sure what it is about that material.
They half assed this update and are more concerned with the dlc which will also look half assed. I was waiting for the Pro to play this but won’t support them if this is what they come out with.
@@twocityfoodies8476 I don't think Silent Hill 2 has received a Pro patch yet, loads of people saying it looks worse than the normal PS5 version.
@@lewishague123 The shimmering looks worse. The only thing that is better currently is the frame rate when looking up and down is smooth now in fidelity mode.
@@fenixa2z936 Lmao, what did you expect from this half assed 35%faster console ? LOL
I just uncovered yet another instance of dishonesty from our dear NXGamer. He compared the performance of the RX 6800 to the PS5 Pro in Alan Wake 2 with RT enabled, but here’s the catch: the PS5 Pro only enables ray-traced reflections, while the PC version, even on the lowest RT settings, activates ray-traced global illumination. Digital Foundry proved this today. At no point did NXGamer bother to mention this *“minor detail.”*
It is comparable to a RX 6800. Remedy just did a bad job at optimizing. Plenty of games have proved this with the Pro.
@@drizzydragon7800xt or 4070
NXGamer is a Sony fanboy who tried claiming the Pro would match a 4070 Super which was always a ridiculous statement. It’s not even close
@@teddyholiday8038 Right on the Nvidia side its closer to a 4060 Ti which is not even close to a regular 4070.
100% comparable to a non xt 6800. Console does well on a hard game to run, but not on a par with the 4070.
lets be straight about it - this is ridiculous. ps5pro upgrade is actually good area for DF guys to shine, with their precise measures and in-depth testing - difference from standard ps5 is so miniscule you need some effort to even point it out.
And in many cases image quality is worse than the base ps5.
@@bmarcinczyk14where is this true? can you link a source because that’s the exact opposite of what every test has shown. what games on the pro look worse than the base console? this game isn’t indicative of every experience.
As far as I have understood it, you pretty much need a 4k HDR TV to see the difference, which is then pretty noticeable. On lower quality monitors on the other hand there is virtually no difference at all.
what's really sad is that this new console isnt a nessesary buy for any group of players/customers EXCEPT for rich upper class dudes who always have to have the most recent gadgets to show off/feel better - sadly its a pretty big demographic (ie when comparing to 15 years ago). same people that always buy new apple products, or just people with too much money - they wont be using this hardware as often to be noticing better picture or 5-10 frames more...
@@sampopaukkonen4014 Every TV sold for the past 5 years is 4K HDR. The RTngs best budget fall 2024 4k HDR tv is only $347 on Amazon for a 55"!! For the adults in the room that's only $261 in 2014!
I think the vast majority of people purchasing any flavor of PS5 are rocking 4k displays.
PSSR trading blows with FSR 2 is not what I had on my PS5 Pro Bingo card. Sony really has to fix the image instability issues and the film grain look.
Do you even own Alan Wake II? Because film grain effect is part of the game. You can turn it of in the settings.
@@electrikoptik No dude it does not look like that at native res. PSSR does some weird shit to the film grain filter
The internal res is still too low for the best results, pSSR is not a miracle worker, i'm just really surprised they couldnt achieve atleast 1440p internal res in quality mode.
@@evostu7814You’re surprised? Do you know how demanding AW2 is? Maybe go watch DF’s PC review of AW2 again. You need a 4080 at minimum if wanna render AW2 to internally at 1440p with RT on etc.
By the way, RTX 4080 in 4K with DLSS quality (internal 1440p) with RT runs at an avg of 43 fps.
@@electrikoptik like I've been saying. Console gamers expect a 4090 build in a 500-700 dollar console.
DLSS is king
Straight up. Pisser is worse than I was expecting.
All I wanted was the ps5 console settings in performance mode running at a higher base res upscaled to like 1440p and a stable 60 fps on the pro.... Remedy dropped the ball with this one trying to do too much and not putting much effort into it
Comparing the performance and fidelity of PCs versus consoles is so much more interesting than analysing two very similar consoles like the Xbox series x and the PS5
Thanks for diving into this topic-this is exactly the kind of content that makes me love DF! 👍
No it’s not.
@@ShaneDanger42069 I meant to say interesting 😅
I wish consoles didn't have this mess of settings though. I don't want to be dealing with that.
I have a PC that makes my PS5 look like a PS4. On YT, never seen anything like the real thing, unfortunately. Keep in mind, just as a AMD PS5 is to a AMD Xbox, many AMD PCs are like that to other AMD PCs as well, with the variance of GPU size, CU units, and GPU generation. It is all the same. Because of YT compression, it would be hard to see the real difference between the PS5 and the PS5 Pro, as DF has warned about even about those two not long ago, that you would have to see it with your own eyes to really get the difference. Most peoples life experience in tech, is streamed and compressed YT video comparisons though.
@@lukastemberger Honestly, if it feels annoying to you, don’t bother with it-just turn it on and enjoy playing with the default settings 👍. However, if you enjoy into tweaking and want the best graphics, you’re probably an enthusiast. In that case, consider getting a PC, it's the better option for that. More power, more choice in games, settings and hardware. etc. Console and PC each have their own strengths.
It's basically closer to PSSR Ultra performance which should be reserved for 8K output, not 4K. 1080p is a hard limit for 4K. 864p is just too low. They shouldn't abuse upscalers this much (until they are so advanced that you can't tell the difference from a normal viewing distance)
Yes. Should have left the settings alone and pushed for 1080p base resolution
8k gaming doesn’t exist, not even a 4090 can run properly
@@aseretto015 PS5 Pro runs No Man's Sky just fine at 8K.
@@aseretto015The Tourist runs at native 8k on base PS5, and LTT did a 8k gaming video on the 3090. It does exist, but it effectively doesn’t.
@@aseretto015 Not even the TV manufacturers are trying to push 8K yet. Even they are starting to understand, that's too many Ks.
Been playing on the Pro for a week non-stop. *Not impressed to be honest.*
For some games it works exceptionally well (e.g. Horizon Forbidden West) but there are still too many compromises and Alan Wake 2 is a perfect example.
PSSR is promising for sure, but it has a long way to go to reach DLSS levels of quality/performance.
I agree. I have the 3060 Ti and DLSS look so much sharper, even with a weak card.
The problem is that the ps5 pro suffers in the same games that made people want a ps5 pro upgrade. First party Sony games were never an issue.
Maybe because the DLSS had around 6 years in the field while pssr is only out…
Bro ran out of ideas before gta 6 came
It is just in „beta stage“ getting prepared for PS6.
If you think about how this is the first „release“ like 1.0, i think it is good.
DLSS has been around way longer and if Sony had been able to compete and even beat it then it would have been surprising.
Not as impressive an upgrade as was hyped tbh
Pro native res is 840p but still cant hold steady 60. That is really great for a 800€ console. Such a sad reality
Those RT sparkles tho. I don't think AMD has an answer for the DLSS denoiser yet.
They aren't even at the level of path tracing yet, which is where DLSS denoising actually worked. Originally thats where RR was implemented, was path tracing and not ray tracing. They may had implemented it for ray tracing since then. AMD is still pretty far off, but at least with PS5 Pro you are getting a taste of RT implementation to actually be able to value it, rather than having it so watered down it tanks performance and barely gives you anything visual.
Black Ops 6 has the same shimmering and flickering after the pro patch. Seems to be a problem with pssr.
Same with Silent Hill 2
PSSR being a straight downgrade from FSR2 is very funny.
I've been playing through AW2 for the first time on PS5 Pro in Quality mode. Despite the many compromises noted in this video, it's certainly a visually impressive and wonderfully atmospheric experience. The flickering wine glasses in the lodge (which Oliver mentions at 05:04) are perhaps the only point where I found the image flawed enough to take me out of the experience and make me wonder just what exactly is going on under the hood to cause that behaviour.
8:59 Defeats the point of having RT reflections when the image just pops in like that.
RT does not work on well Devices under $1500. It just to much for consoles and lower end PCs.
People will always chose 60fps with a less shiny floor over 30fps with gops of Ray-Tracing.
@ Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart and Spider-Man 2 would like to have a word with you. Those games ray tracing was very well done on the base ps5 and are even better on the ps5 pro.
I really love my RTX 4070 Super ❤
Unfortunately, Alan Wake 2 is particularly prone to VRR flicker on OLEDs. I’ve found that disabling G-Sync in the NVIDIA Control Panel for AW2 (Manage 3D Settings > Program Settings) is the only reliable way to eliminate it. While setting a framerate cap can help, it’s not always reliable - even if the target framerate is consistently maintained.
Hope this helps anyone dealing with similar issues!
G sync is VRR. If you disable it, the whole image stutters a lot. But that's only one reason i don’t want an oled anytime soon.
@ I am aware of that. However, setting a framerate cap to a value that you can reach 99,9% of the time does drastically mitigate that problem. And the occasional stutter if affected games is, in my opinion, much better than constant flickering.
It’s all about the frametimes not framerate. Limiting framerate usually helps a little bit but most of the the time you’ll still get VRR flicker. I have also noticed in Cyberpunk for example that frame generation will destroy the frametimes.
@@Simon_Denmark exactly! While I get a perfectly even frametime graph in RTSS when limiting FPS to the lowest value I could reach in any given scene, I still get VRR flickering in dark scenes. That’s why I now disabled G-Sync for games like Alan Wake 2 because I much rather loose out on G-Sync than having to deal with strobe-like flicker all the time
Yeah, I also did this for Alan Wake 2. This would also be a good game to cap at 40fps but because there are so many prerendered videos that run at 30 that also looks bad at times.
Man thats a shame. Alan Wake 2 was probably the title I was most looking forward to.
That speckling floor on the PS5 Pro looks horrendous, like it's supposed to be raining.
And Remedy released this crappy “upgrade” 🤦🏻♂️🤡 Juts makes them look really bad and lazy.
We're going to look back on this whole generation of games and their constant visual artifacts the same way we look back on PS1 games and their polygon jiggling. It's just such a baffling thing to allow in a final product.
Alan Wake 2 still looks miles better on PC with path tracing though the performance in forests could definitely be a lot better.
PSSR has that same weird film grain effect in Spider-Man 2 also. That's something that needs to be fixed over time.
It should be fixed, they said it is just the first version of PSSR
That's what happens when you upscale. You're stretching something to fit your target. They should be able to clean it up more in later versions.
@@ralfiejr34 that's not at all how that works
no
@@ralfiejr34 FSR 3 doesn't have that effect at all, neither does DLSS, XeSS, or TSR. This is exclusively a PSSR issue.
At the end of the day it all comes down to how much effort the developer put in to their game and they didn’t do that great here.
It's a Nvidia sponsored game. Implementing FSR 2 and PSSR was just an afterthought to them.
Well it's not, at the end of the day it's optimisation combined with hardware limits
ps5 pro is pretty weak, what do you expect them to do with the just 30 to 35% in gpu power bump?
@@Dd-fb2tjIt takes a beast of a PC to get this game really shining, this engine it's running on and it's optimisation is 💩, someone needs to develop a better engine than this resource hog
It's not an optimization problem. It's hardware limitations. PSSR is nowhere near as good as DLSS at the same resolution in any game. AMD gpu's are not as powerful as Nvidia gpu's in terms of ray tracing. And the PS5 Pro's zen 2 cpu is still a bottleneck. Digital Foundry was spot on when they predicted that the upgrade from PS5 to PS5 pro would be less of a jump as compared to the previous gen's upgrade from the PS4 to the PS4 pro.
My parasocial relationship is getting worse: I am disappointed in Alex sweater
he took his mom's
lol
😭😭😭😭
-Alex
Man, remedy needs to go back to the drawing board. Disappointing effort.
Why? Yes, optimization is spotty, but the game itself is exceptional
@Pelayum You answered your own question in the first half
@@andymontanez56 ps5 pro is pretty weak, what do you expect them to do with the just 30 to 35% in gpu power bump?
Let this mark the all time END of Digital Foundary's Coverage of this game.
So still no 60fps with benefits from quality modes. Wtf why then 800€ for pro. I want one mode where everything is active + 60fps.
Buy a pc then
i think it’s really important to look at the whole. if there are 60 enhanced games then what’s the performance looking like across the board. if alan wake 2 isn’t stepping up to the plate, that doesn’t negate all the other games that do. just something to consider.
"Everything active" 😂😂😂 You guys are so clueless. Get a $2000 PC then.
What the HELL were Sony's TARGETS for the PRO model?
It seems like every title is SLIGHTLY better, but still not improved enough to actually achieve EXPECTED performance in any of the modes?
Like the new hardware delivers a better experience in something like Elden Rings, but it still doesn't provide a 60fps presentation... It seems like they just didn't push the increases enough to make a really substantial difference. I figured their goal should have been to actually HIT the Performance/Quality targets in the majority of games, but in most cases you still don't see the locked resolution/framerates that you'd expect in each mode.
Ps5 fidelity settings at 60fps, it doesn't need to look better, it needs to look the same as the best settings on ps5 but run at double the frame rate.
It's basically getting pc upgrades since that's what happens with a pc, you pay more for the same graphics but you get double or even triple the frame rate, I have a RTX 4080 but play games at 1440p ultra (something a card like the 3070 can do) but then I run the game at 200+ FPS whilst the 3070 can hit 120fps max and that's pushing it.
I don't know maybe future games like monster Hunter which ran like ass on the base PS5. FFVII Rebirth is night and day on how it looks and runs having been having a blast. Granted they need more games it's still fucking stupid they haven't released a patch or made a remaster for Bloodborne.
I got to 3:37 and decided that if I find a ps5 for €200 I'll buy it, otherwise it's not worth having a similar console at a higher price, under any circumstances. The only "advantage" is the exclusivity of certain releases, a shameful fact in 2024. Deep respect for Square Enix who has decided to interrupt this vicious circle.
It looks like the ps pro tries to show more eye candy But it Struggles
Not true. There are plenty of games that have used the new Pro features properly. FF7R, both Horizon games, any Insomniac games, and F1. This was just badly optimized by Remedy.
@@drizzydragon he is correct. mad max can only play 30fps on the ps5 pro but on xbox series x and pc it can play 120fps smh
Mad Max? an non optimised game from years ago? The Pro is far more powerful than a XSX@@LIK3SQUAD_CEO
@ lol that’s my point. The Xbox series x can run it 120fps and it was released side by side with ps5 original. I tried playing mad max on my ps5 pro, it can only reached 30fps. Doesn’t matter if it optimized or not.. a powerful console is a powerful console and it should have no issue running older games lol
@@LIK3SQUAD_CEO What? Its a hard software lock from the devs. The developers of Mad Max would have to do a software update for the PS5 Pro. I'm very confused by your argument.
Oliver has a tendency to repeat himself. Oliver has a tendency to repeat himself. 😂
I will say that even though this may be the worst implementation of PSSR, I still noticed a sizable difference in clarity between base PS5 / PS5 Pro in Performance mode on my 85” TV. The “blur” seen on the base system has been removed and the Pro offers a more detailed image overall. The fps difference was imperceptible to my eye, since they’re so close.
I much prefer the Pro experience.
PSSR is brand new, I’d say this is a good start. Give it a year or two, like we did with DLSS, and the benefits will be even better. In most cases PSSR offers the best image quality I’ve ever seen on a console. That’s a win in my book.
Finally a game comparison where a magnifying glass isn’t necessary to see the differences.
While the dithering/alpha on Saga's hair at 8:23 definitely looks softer and more natural, the specular highlight/response from the base PS5 looks to be totally missing. I can't tell if this is a bug, or if it was never intended to look like it did on the base PS5, or if it's just a result of this particular lighting environment combined with the lower quality hair strands on the OG PS5?
Either way, even though the overall quality is objectively better, this *almost* looks worse. It's an odd-tradeoff.
Remedy games have always been trash on consoles.
Its a shame the first big Pro coverage of ONE game is on probably the worst patch (with star wars outlaws). In my opinion Dragon's Dogma 2 and The Crew Motorfest are way better use of the hardware. Remedy clearly have to fix a LOT and Sony have to improve on PSSR too, which has big issues with some artstyles (as opposed to FF7 Rebirth which benefits from PSSR hugely without visible issues)
you won't see many improvements in Dragon's Dogma 2, because that title is CPU heavy.
sure, if you lock it to 30 fps and improve visuals, that can work, but again, 30 fps was not the selling point of the pro.
@@arturiaarthus8367 Oh my god stop with this BS, Dragon's Dogma 2 is almost always 60 fps on Pro now. The CPU is more than fine, you just don't understand how computers work, and that's fine too because it's an hard subject but please stop talking about it.
So good that you mentioned about the grass ambient occlusion not working when switching from quality to performance. I was getting crazy about it...
Wait for PS6 and enjoy these PS5 Pro enhancement 😎😎
I honestly think DLSS is one of the most amazing features to ever be added to gaming.
The performance gains and image quality is some sort of sorcery.
I'm confused. why are there separate modes? they made it sound like the whole point of the ps5 pro was to remove the need for different modes
That's not the point, the point is "the new performance mode looks like the old graphics mode, but at a much higher frame rate".
The point is "consume product, then get excited for next product". This thing is mid AF and the cope is HARD.
You guys aren't very bright
@@marrow94 if that's not the point, then the presentation with mark cerny shouldn't have worded it to sound like it was
I'm waiting to play AW2 with maxed settings once I upgrade my PC. It's too demanding for current consoles and that makes for a compromised experience. Having said that, I've been quite impressed with the pro so far. There have been some significant upgrades over the bace ps5. So im a happy camper !
Pro 30 fps modes isnt the way to go. Shouldnt even be a mode.
It's a hard sell convince people to buy 900 euros console and market it as "boost mode with every game". I dont think that DF dunked on PS5 Pro, but it seemed like what they say that for PS5 Pro to achieve PCs performance with RT features is not realistic.
I love these PS5 pro videos. I really hope we get some sort of compilation video of a lot of the other games that don't need an in depth look but would still be interesting to see such as call of duty and Star wars Outlaws
I dont think pc owners need to sweat anytime soon lol
This is like when devs would crank the resolution on Xbox One X because of the stronger hardware but games often tended to run slower on it compared PS4 Pro which used a lower resolution.
700$ + "120"
800$ + "120"
Congratulations Sony. This year you have managed to break two world records, the biggest failure in history in the launch of a video game and the biggest scam in the entire video game industry.
This will be my last gen with consoles and then I'm going to build a PC. I had great memories and fun with consoles but I'm done haha.
$700 for that🤣🤣🤣
Thanks Remedy
@@fenixa2z936 lol
Good comparison video. That said, I play on PC and have a 4090. I don’t even use RT. It absolutely tanks performance and you can hardly tell the difference when you’re playing lol
I can't trust a man that likes motion blur
Motion what?
I honestly feel like games on consoles should just run at 30fps and maximize the graphics because for them to run at 60fps, devs have to make a lot of comprises to be possible, hence low internal resolution. On top of this, games still have performance issues.
I continue to be amazed with DLSS. One of the biggest reasons I choose Nvidia over AMD.
Truly black magic
1080p native realm, your magic is in no need here
@@moomeuh13421080p native (even when using DLAA) is pretty blurry in motion. Only higher resolutions can fix that.
@@moomeuh1342not true. There’s lots of games that DLSS quality looks better than 1080p native soft look.
Might be the biggest thing I miss from my nvidia card, reason i switched is price to performance and my honestly pretty mixed experience with nvidia drivers (somehow always had less issues with AMD)
I just really hope that AMD is actually gonna release a competent AI upscaler at some point, they already teased that its gonna be happening but if its like XeSS 1.0 its not gonna be worth it either. Until then XeSS is honestly just far better than FSR
@@moomeuh1342DLSS Quality on 1080p is better for most games (except DD2)
Sony and the rest of us thank PS5 Pro buyers for helping subsidize the PS6 and beta testing PSSR!
I replaying a bunch of games on the PS5 Pro, just did a NG+ of The last of us 2
Oh my god. Are you a masochist? Are you okay? That's the most depressing game ever created
Ps4 3.0
16:48 curb your enthusiasm theme
Half-ass attempt from remedy. Very underwhelming
Right they did all that talking about the features they added do the power of the Pro and made an half ass game were the base Ps5 in some areas is getting better proformance. At the minimum the Pro should do alot better than the base ps5
Why do you think it's Remedy problem. Many games are suffering because of pssr
@@MrSmith17 that's an overstatement. When playing pssr is miles better in most games. Some games are getting a shimmer but I guess that can be updated. Don't overblow it. Clearly the attempt here is lackluster
It would be interesting to compare quality and performance mode with AMD GPUs. To find out if there was a real gain in RT on the ps5pro compared to AMD's 6000 and 7000 series.
Unoptimized game on all platforms.
>literally the heaviest path traced visuals on any dedicated game in history up to date
>average gamer bro: UNOPTIMIZED
@@gargean1671 Yes bro, unoptimized.
This is great new Quality mode. Now developers will find another profitable reason to make better looking games with real noticeable RT for console that will also make PC games look even better. Also the compasrison vs PC GPUs on 40:18 , maybe the 4060 TI 16GB is the best equivalent since the 3070 will get beat on certain high VRAM games but not on most
If PSSR can’t be retroactively updated like DLSS, these first few “enhanced” games will forever be tainted by shimmery artefacts. That’s a shame.
At this point I’d rather take the PS4 Pro approach - just bump the resolution and enable a few effects please. No need to ruin the image quality with an undercooked AI upscaler.
I was looking forward to Silent Hill 2 Remake patch (because that will show off how PSSR deals with upcoming UE5 titles), Jedi Survivor and Alan Wake 2 the most and all three seem to be severely underperforming on the PS5 Pro.
I would be okay with the price, with the missing disc drive if the machine delivered on the promise, but now it just seems like an opportunity for people to buy into an expensive PS6 beta program.
You’re so full of crap 😂
"A PS6 beta program"
Finally, someone gets it!
It can
what makes you think it will not be updated?
@@METROIDROCKSXP98On PC the end user can drag and drop's .dll file with a newer version of DLSS. On PlayStation a developer has to put in effort to push the update on the platform and the update also has to be approved by Sony.
This game on PS5 Pro vs PC isn't even a comparison. PC will always win.
It’s such a demanding game to the point where a 4090 struggles so not much of a shock. I think there should have been. A LOT more focus on non-rt quality improvements here. Shimmering, artifacting, and broken lines or edges are much more important to me than RT.
I think people are expecting too much of an upgrade out of a “pro” console but at the same time if you’re charging 700$ before the disc drive and stand then people are and should be expecting much more power. The price to power ratio just do not match up here. I’ll be waiting for the PS6. Or a deep sale on the pro.
curious to hear what's going on with silent hill 2
Its unplayable for me in the moment, it looked better on base PS5...
The funniest thing is that I bought the Pro specifically because of Silent Hill 2.
@@DimetriusYT the pro update isn't out for it yet. There are some odd bugs running the base version
@@FungeHuckerWhen will it be out? We got a date?
@alexanderulv3886 sadly not other than "soon" :( can't wait to play through it again but without the patch there are visual bugs in all the SSR reflections in puddles outdoors.
While it’s fun seeing developers shoot from the hip with these pro settings at these early days, there will have to be some kind of uniformity at some point. It would be difficult to apply it at higher settings, but it may be possible to have a setting that will run at a flat 120 fps at 1080 or 60 at 1440p as a minimum “pro performance”
I think anyone that wants a ps5 pro already has one and being able to guarantee some kind of uniform improvement would probably win over more people on the fence
In short: Quality mode is a mayor improvement with ray tracing and look way better & no effort was put into perf mode and it performs worse.
Yeah, mostly impressed with the RT in quality mode, but still huge image stability issues. I'm going to skip this game on current gen consoles :(
John recommend a PC with a 4070. 💪
I’m surprised they didn’t talk about how Oliver MacKenzies review appeared on the ps5 pro trailer
Wait what
a quote of his appeared on the official trailer
Depends when it was filmed
Will PSSR improvements over time apply retroactively to these older implementations?
With how these patches work, I doubt it. I think the developer would have to manually implement, just like how on PC DLSS 2.0 do not get DLSS. 3.7 automatically
Show me the champion of light ☺️
still not hitting a constant 60fps in performance mode is hilarious
Gosh, that made me less optimistic about whole PS5 Pro, PS6 thing. On the other hand that is wrong developers decisions put PS5 Pro in a bad light here.
They could simply increase resolution without changing anything at all - and that would be better than what we have now. Or add third "Resolution" mode with settings from PS5 Perf mode and higher internal and output res
I hope FSR 4 doesn't look this bad.
The RTX 4070 is 43% faster than the Pro 40:02. But sure the Pro is EQUAL to 4070. Even the RX 6800 is faster than the Pro. And it turns out that PSSR is not as good as DLSS either. What a joke for $700/€800. 😂
The only way RT is involved on this game with a Ps5pro is if you play at 30fps .
So the topic of RT is not even a issue. Nobody with a Ps5 plays in 30fps mode .
A 4070 PC cost $1500 a Ps5Pro is $700. The 4070 should be 110% faster not 40%.
@Crashed131963 Yeah, no way should the PS5pro be compared to a 4070. AMD lags way behind in ray tracing and pssr is no match for dlss. I suspect that the PS5 pro gpu is closer to an RTX 2080 or RTX 2080ti gpu.
pssr is still being compared, because its initial start is good compare to 6 year old dlss
@@Crashed131963 You are out of touch with reality. The Pro is even slower than the RX 6800 which is a $350 GPU. Fast 2TB SSD starts at $100. CPU is $80. Mobo is $80 too. 16GB DDR4 $30. PSU $60 and a case another $50. Around $700-$800 I can build a PS5 Pro equivalent easily.
@@Crashed131963 PC with 4070 cost 1099$ (on NEwegg ATM) and if you build by yourself then it can be cheaper.
Not sure if anyone pointed this out, but there is a RT reflections option in the ini file hidden in local appdata. Enable that along with Transparency and you should get close to PS5 Pro image quality.
shoulda put the series x here too
Isn't that at parity with the PS5?
@@RyneLanders series x is 10-ish fps faster in the forest
yes but isn't the same still a difference. so would be kl to remind us what it is compared to the ps5 pro
@@BlacklistMegaT they have feature and image quality parity though. The point of all these videos is to illustrate the difference between the existing console versions of these games and the upgraded console version, and help people determine if the price increase to move to the Pro is worth it. Adding the X to the discussion doesn't change the discussion because feature and image quality wise, it's at parity with the PS5.
@RyneLanders but is it? I don't know that. that's what I'm saying. the series X also would be good as I don't need to watch multiple videos to see if it's the same as the p5.. which I know it isn't it's a bit different so yh. still my point. bro just an extra thing to add could be move . simple
To compare DLSS and ray tracing with a 4070 to a PS5 Pro that's equivalate to a 4060 Ti which has about 30% less head way then at 4070 is uh interesting...
The PS5 is a black box in a white trench coat
Those msi monitors are freaking great, I have one and it looks stunning
Fantastic work, thank you for your videos and your seriousness, a pleasure to watch you🙏🏻
Oh my gosh, this dude again ☺️
Man, I wish I liked this game as much as everyone else. I gave it 6 hours and was bored to say the least. A lot of walking, the mindspace ruined the flow, and it didn't scare me in the slightest. I thought the jumpscares every five minutes were the cheapest of cheap, and not effective at all.
I hear the gunplay still isn’t fun, like part 1.
@fenixa2z936 I enjoyed the gunplay in the original game a lot more.
Thanks to you digital foundry.
Can you do an SOC PS5 pro xray analysis !
Not unexpected. Very disappointing.
The PS5 Pro just came out developers rushed out updates for previously released games give it some time the true test will be future games with proper optimizations
Initially, I was really enthusiastic for the Pro, but as time goes on, it becomes clearer that canceling the pre-order was the right choice. It's disappointing, especially since many games were passed up in anticipation of a worthwhile upgrade. At this stage, the idea of transitioning to a PC feels more feasible than ever.
Think for yourself and don’t let others think for you.
I know this isn’t a high end PC. If you want that experience it will cost you 2 to 3 times the PRO and then some.
If you want the best plug and play experience in the living room that will make your high end display look it’s best this is it and it will only get better as more developers spend time with the machine and as the models for PSSR get trained more and Sony deploys
More updates.
I’m happy with my purchase and so are a lot of others that own the system. I believe a lot of negativity is around the price as I’m sure is this launched at 499 or even 599’witb disc drive there would have been overwhelming positive reviews.
The issues are people which includes TH-camrs that put out content to try and influence the market to what they believe and want. This isn’t going anywhere to happen. Sales are doing well and Sony will keep it at 699.00. It is what it is.
I switched to PC a while ago. You will not regret it, it is an excellent platform for enthusiasts. There's a lot of freedom of choice in game and hardware options and tweaking your graphic settings can be a lot of fun.
@ I have both a PRO and PC and believe each one has their own strengths and weaknesses. Do what is best for your use case. You can’t go wrong with either option
@@Patrick-tw7nr Have you ever heard of TLDR? This isn't a forum... it's TH-cam "comments".
@@Patrick-tw7nr Good point they are very different products in some aspects. Simplicity versus complexity. But with that complexity comes better graphics and more freedom of choice.... but PC's are more expensive.... etc.
Oof, PSSR got slaughtered here. I vastly prefer the FSR2 resolve on PS5 & the PSSR output is an absolute turnoff with that pixel swimming going on at all times 😬
Im playing this on pc and it looks amazing. Loving over 130 fps too
The Performance mode on the pro is absolutely ridiculous. What were they thinking? Also with the comparisons between the baked shadows and volumetric light...both consoles are shimmering af! I'm watching this video on my 55"LG CX and both versions look utterly THE SAME!! Also PSSR runs the game worse in some ways than FSR2!? If I had fallen for the PS5 Pro hype train now would be the time to absolutely regret a purchase. What a scam.
First time someone actually created visual improvements for the pro. Rest of the games all still look the same or too grainy.
Me when I'm confidently incorrect.
They should've thought about performance first, though. Visual improvements mean little when the performance is worse.
F1 and Gran Turismo had some nice upgrades.
DF needs to do a 5 minute video of the games suffering from these awful artifacts and send it onto the developers. I doubt they'd pay attention to these longer discussion videos (which I love). But a quick video of all these visual problems may be addressed in a more timely manner if DF showed them. If this was a casual persons console it would be of smaller importance but this is for people who want a high end experience and we shouldn't be getting equal to or worse performance/visuals than the base console for £700.
Alex please continue to laugh and annoy the fanboys
When you consider how much more resources NVIDIA have for training their AI, its not at all surprising that PSSR still falls short, especially on the more challenging input resolution.
I do think it was possibly a mistake to not keep the settings the same on performance mode and try to push the resolution up a bit, but perhaps that didn't work in their testing.
When are you going to compare against the series x i remember yall comparing the one x to the ps4 pro how come you haven’t done it this time??????????????
Because the Series X is not a mid gen refresh
I want a stable image and higher crisp resolution, before I care about ray-tracing. This upgrade in my opinion does not do the PS5 PRO justice. If I was looking at this game I would not waste 700 dollars on the pro. Honestly is this a joke?
Absolutely loving my PS5 Professional. I think that Alan Wake 2 isn't the best example of what PSSR can achieve, but still a sizable improvement over the previous console versions of the game.
Agreed, I wasn’t initially impressed with the perceived res jump but then you notice overall image stablitly is a lot better and no horrible occlusion fizzle along with much better settings on performence mode. Such a shame that the frame rate still falls a lot in that mode, surprised remedy let it out that way
it still looks bad to me. Remedy is bad with optimization.
@@atomickaiser1934 Lmao no, it's a PC first experience that's just it.
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat it ran like crap on pc too though. Most people couldn't run it well until like months to a year later an optimization patch came out for older hardware because their sales were terrible.
is the visual upgrade of RT worth the performance cost in this game?