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We just bought our first RV a couple months ago. We were debating new or used so we visited several dealers looking at options and prices. General RV tried using typical salesman techniques to get us to sign for a brand new RV. I got tired of their constant pressure so I told my wife we are leaving. We just stood up and walked away leaving the salesman and his boss sitting at the desk. We eventually bought a nice used unit at a local dealer who didn't use any pressure tactics and didn't try to sell us a bunch of crap. We will go back to that dealer when we are ready to upgrade.
Another thing I see is that campgrounds are getting stupid expensive, especially privately owned ones. There's no reason prices should have doubled, even with inflation. I live in Lexington, KY and both our major dealers are bad to do business with. One of them tried to charge me double the cost of materials on a repair. I went to Camping World, ironically, and they gave a quote, and the cost of the materials was half, to the penny. But, I am not a fan of Camping World either. I would never buy an RV from them. Just remember, if you think car dealers are crooked, they can't even come close to RV dealers. There should be a special place in hell for most of them. Thank you for the great service you provide to everyone!
RVs and Camping have been (and always will be) synonymous with "affordability." Unfortunaely, when the industry raised prices during the RV & Camping boom, many in the industry got greedy and now that the RV & Camping boom is over/gone bust, the inflated prices are coming back to haunt the industry.
@@__WJK__ I don't understand the general term re "going bust" ... try getting a reservation at some well-located RV parks. They are full. The state of Michigan allows you to reserve 6 months in advance. Key state parks get full within hours of the dates that open up. People are buying used coaches like crazy. They have the cash. Your used coach has to be worth your asking price. These buyers are spending their time doing research and asking questions.
Ernie, the conditions your describing haven't been our experience this year. We have camped mainly in state parks from Florida to Maine this year. With the exception of snowbird season in Florida, which we book as early as possible, the state parks have had availability even on Holiday weekends. Many parks have gone back to pre pandemic levels on weekdays resembling "ghost towns". A lot of the pandemic entry campers have returned to their regular activities and are attempting to unload their impulse purchases at unrealistic price points.
When we were looking at campers 3 years ago, I found your TH-cam channel. I looked all over the net in my area with 250 miles. Of course, world hounded me for weeks and months on end. After watching your and other videos and seeing some of the horror stories we ended up buying at a local dealer that a good friend of ours said he and his wife bought at and was happy with their purchase. We didn't buy any extended warranties. No hidden fees. They even pulled our vin number to make sure our truck could safely pull the camper we bought. We ended up buying a WDH and they set up for us.
Math is hard for most these days, pretty much since they mandated common core in schools. I've financed many cars & 3 RV's & never once would I buy into "Where do you want your payment to be?" Thats the oldest sales trick in the book. I will only accept the sale breakdown with each line item and the OTD total, period end of story. Those who go in with a payment in mind always get ripped.
Geez, buying a Camper that’s the last damn thing I need to own. My wife said we should buy a camper. I tell her she got to go to the Head Doctor and get some rocks removed. Camper what are you Frigging crazy. We got a beautiful Lake Home with 3 boats. What the hell do you want with a camper? If you think I’m going to drop a 100K on a pickup truck to pull around another 100K Plus for an Air Stream. Because anything else we buy is absolute junk. So just do yourself a me a favor and Fuggetaboutit we are not going to buy a Camper. Plus many of those Camper Dealerships can make car dealerships look like pre schoolers. They are crooked as the day is long. We can buy a lot of hotel suites for 200k and drive away with zero up keep. Plus every time we drive to the lake home we always see a camper on the side of the road with broken leaf springs. Shocks, Blown Bearing. Or a blown out tire. When they have to use the cabinets or countertops that are junk anyway as structural components. Your buying junk because they have to make then so light. And our 100k pickup truck is getting 9 mpg. Nope we’re not buy anything related to camping.
My Daughter is a former State Supreme Court Attorney, currently a Assistant State Prosecuting Attorney...she knows her stuff. She has always stood by that when these vultures attack with these dishonest schemes it's time to file a complaint with your State's Attorney General's Office.
Let’s say in 2018 we were taken by Camping World. There sales to the Financial department to the store manager seen us coming and they sure did add all the extras to the amount of the camper. We were told so may lies and regretted going through them for a camper. We were told if you buy from them you can take it to any CW for repairs. Number 1 lies we had to argue to even make an appointment for repairs in another State… Let’s say when we purchased on a Saturday it was back to the service department on Monday. They had it from December-March and still didn’t complete all the stuff that was written down. Took our first trip in May came back 2 months later and the camper back to CW . I could go on and on but I’ll stop..
Just to let you know you're not alone. I could tell you stories, but I won't even begin. Let's just say, I was totally hoo dooed by CW - still making payments as proof.
I just bought an RV from Campers Inn of Mocksville NC. They pulled that 2 price scheme on me. “The price is discounted 5k only if you finance with us” nowhere in the paperwork could I find anything in writing to back that up. Jokes on them. First payment will be a payoff and a refi with my credit union for 2 and a half percent LESS than what they arranged. If I had known the law, I would have financed from the start with my CU and when they tried to charge me more, busted them on it!!!
Aww. Thanks. This channel is built on truth, honesty, education and common sense. I appreciate those who put their trust in me. While I'm certainly a flawed man, I will never knowingly lie or lead folks astray. All the best.
@@TheRVWingman there is no human walking on this earth that is not flawed. Alan you do a great job informing people and telling the truth. I have always enjoyed your videos and will continue to watch and sit around your virtual campfire.
In 2017 we bought a Class A motor home. Took it to CW for some minor work. Got a call from their service manager pushing a complete recaulking job to ensure it wouldn’t leak because they do a poor job at the factory. Normal cost is $4,000 but I can get it today for $3,000. I said hold on. I hung up the phone, drove straight to CW, drove our motor home away and never returned. CW is the absolute worst.
My wife and I bought our first RV about 12 years ago, and not from Camping World. Our first was a gently used one from a nearby dealer which we traded in a year later for a new one from same dealer. That manufacturer quality sucked so when we wanted to upgrade to a 5th wheel a couple years later we went to another smaller nearby dealer. We ended up trading in that 5th wheel for a class A at the same dealer. During all this we went to Camping World more than a few times, and came to the conclusion they are rip off artists. Even talking to them at RV shows, they will say anything. And the "freebies" that they offer are a joke.
Thank you for the information on buying an RV. We were first time buyers a few years ago on a used Travel Trailer, a 2017 Passport Elite 27 RB which we paid 33,000 for. Two years layer we have found out the truth on how we were taken. The story is long and the nightmare sad. We recently were looking to upgrade to another RV, possibly a 5th wheel at Camping World. After much consideration by my wife and I we have decided to backoff until we do more research for fear of getting taken again by shady RV dealers. I appreciate you bringing these tricks and scammers to light. We maybe taking a flight to your dealer when we are ready to move up. We are looking for true honesty and absolutely no gimmicks when buying another. We appreciate your videos in educating the public in the world of RVing..Thank you..
I appreciate the information. This helps when dealing with sales people. It is important to do the research ahead of time and know the costs of additional items above the sales price of an rv/trailer. Also, it is best to get pre approved loans outside of the dealership.
You're right, dealers don't like pre-approved loans. Arranging customer financing is another way they make money, as well as selling useless "warranties." Pre approaved lenders will only finance loan-to-value on a purchase. The rest is up to the buyer's out of pocket. The finance charge is a front-end expense that will take years to pay. Ignor "MSRP" stickers. It's a tactic to make you think you're saving $1000's. Moreover, selling warranties (another significant dealer profit) is also the dealers way to sell (expensive but worthless) crap and not be responsible. Bottom line? Don't buy an RV. In the long run you'll save money by staying in hotels and eating out. You do the math, you'll see.
I always do business with people and businesses that treat me fairly. Not perfectly, but fairly. We were treated right by a small RV dealer in Tulsa, OK back in 1996. That RV is still going strong. The dealer has trained hands, but they treated us right, and gave us a great trade on our 8 year old diesel.
I was looking for Class A RV . When I found one I asked dealer ? How much ? I go to Bank and bring cash or cashier check . He told me . " Cash is trash He will lose money if I didn't buy on credit " No deal ....
I had a similar experience 6 years ago with General. We were wise to most of it. But they still got us for extras that sound legit and not horribly expensive. Never again. Our last purchase went very well, with no pressure, and no added extras. An extended warranty was offered, but we weren't interested, and we weren't pressured.
This happened to me in Ripon. Talk about con-job pushed through finance. When I read the terms I was shocked. Financing equaled more than the RV which was the lowest price I had ever see for that model. Now I know how. I’m keeping my old Lance camper. Doing a restoration at a fraction of the cost.
My comments: Sold RV’s for three years. What I learned? There are absolutely NO rv’s worth the money you pay. None! Ever! If you buy a new rv, no matter what brand, make or model, none are worth what you pay. The markup is ridiculous. Not saying they don’t serve a purpose or that they shouldn’t be bought but knowing their deceitful ways in which they get you, is just called good salesmen ship in the industry. They may not lie at all, but will definitely mislead you by leading. So called good salesmen will be extremely confident in their delivery making a person feel as if they really DO need what they’re selling besides the rv. BS! The more they cost, the more you’re getting screwed. Period! So listen to this guy because he is absolutely correct. Even if the dealer is on the up and up and giving a so called good deal, the markup is so high it really is NOT a deal at all. They took this guy for 10K, just like that. That was by adding all kinds of stuff they simply did not need, or could have gotten much cheaper elsewhere. Buying used is the same thing. You think you’re getting a deal and that the original buyers took care of the depreciation. Nope, I promise they mark everything up. There are better deals than others but absolutely no good deals. The horror stories you will hear if only you do your research will make you sick to your stomach. But, the owners of these dealers are rich af and they are the very best sellers of all. Hey, some folks don’t mind and some don’t care if they spend more. I get it. You May have plenty of money, but wow, what a way to just blow it. Even the makers who are or claim to be better. Plywood floors, special chassis, extra a/c, whatever. It’s ONLY worth what someone will pay and when Covid hit, people went bonkers buying them. Waiting times for months just to be over charged for pieces of crap. After the purchase, your troubles have just started as getting service on one is next to impossible. Their schedule. Their word. Not their fault. It’s like a politician always blaming others. Learn all you can before buying. You may laugh at me, but I camp a lot. A whole lot. While I watch as some spend hours setting their rig up, I’m hanging in my hammock, smoking the very best weed because of all the money I DIDN’T spend. My friends have rv’s and they end up at my campfire telling me all their problems they had since the last time they were out. The majority of people don’t even use their rv. They sit in a rented space collecting dust, depreciating and getting full of mice. My best to all. You CAN find a deal but it’s likely from an individual who tried to trade or sell back and found they were lied to or scammed. I’m not disgruntled. Just know the business. Ask around.
I would never buy an RV from Camping world, I have bought a direct tv dish the price was the same as everywhere else. No harm there, but there’s a saying that every dog has his day! Thankfully I have found your videos and are making me a better informed buyer.
The problem is, it’s hard to find a mom and pop dealer these days, they are all getting bought up by the chains. In Michigan a small dealer is difficult to find, especially if you want a particular brand.
Yep. AND...AND, some of those Mom and Pop dealers (those who're swimming in remaining 2022's) may have a VERY difficult next 12 months as will some of the chains. I expect to see more small dealers getting gobbled up by the chains; leaving fewer options for buyers. Hey. Don't get mad at me for saying what "I see". Seriously. I hope I'm wrong! Thanks for watching.
Perhaps my dad was the exception. He always told his customers " If I can't help you, I won't hurt you. " He made a good living off of his repeat business.
@@nzobrist6525 There’s always an exception to the rule . I’ve just never met one . My father in law was a salesman his entire life . When he was in his 80’s he told me there was no way around lying to customers! Or stretching the truth ? Just saying 🤔. 🤷🏼♂️
Exactly....treat people right and you will have a customer for life.....something earned not given. Your Dad sounds like my Dad....he was the same way.@@nzobrist6525
You are correct! We have a 2021 Highland Ridge Roamer 354 MBH 5th wheel and we are $30000 upside down. I’m tempted to just call the bank and ask them to pick it up. Ugh!
So why did you buy it if you had to finance it? I struggle to understand why people seem to think that they "need" so much stuff but they can't afford to pay cash for it. Imo people shouldn't be buying this sort of crap unless they have everything paid off, have a very healthy rainy day fund and their retirement savings sorted.............and they they're still a waste of money.
@@oldbloke204 we sold our home and went from the east coast to the west coast and back for a year. High inflation took us off the road. We are retired. Btw, I’m glad you can afford to pay cash. Even if we did pay cash, it would still be a $30000 loss either way.
@@scottowen20 I just don't get people, especially if they're retired, doing this sort of thing if your finances are so parlous tbh. Our home is basically a cornerstone of our retirement and even though we have way more cash and retirement savings than many others I wouldn't dream of spending any of it in this manner. I don't live in your country but it's mind boggling to me how many do this sort of thing. Economic conditions are likely to get worse, imo, so I shall continue to get ready for that. Good luck to you.
Greetings! Don't think there aren't sleazy, lying individual sellers out there. I assure you, there are plenty. The problem? They look and sound just like the honest ones. A healthy dose of skepticism is always a good idea IMO.
I have a friend that worked at the Columbia store. He didn't work there very long because of all the dishonest things they do. Warranty items were useless because they would say it wasn't covered.
'Buried up to their eye sockets.' I'm sorry, but that made me laugh out loud. Seriously, good work on educating people and saving them from getting fleeced.
There is a Congressional investigation regarding Hertz' falsely reporting rental car theft by customers. Perhaps they should also look into the financing practices of some of the large RV retailers.
WOW, Alan, what a shocking revelation about a specific transaction at CW! Glad I never shopped there for an RV. One would hope that with enough information available we would see smarter consumers who would avoid them like the plague and they would be forced to change their practices! Maybe wishful thinking on my part. Combining rapid depreciation with a small downpayment and long-term payments is a recipe for financial disaster!
Right on point wingman. Bought a 2006 Georgetown 36 ft. Class A. I Told them my family was going on a trip to Montana. I asked them about the tires. They said they look great. Come to find out the tires were 10 years old. These people could have caused a big problem? They did not care. 9 years is maximum for heavy coaches. Live and learn. I bought a diesel pusher after Georgetown. You can bet it was not from camping world! I tell all my friends and family about theses crooks!
I have been an RVer for almost 50 yrs. I have had minimal problems with my last two dealers because I will not accept what they try to pull. My major griefs are with the RV manufacturers themselves. They think they know better and will not even listen to a real experienced RVer. I purchased a new 2016 Class C from Forest River by ordering exactly what options I wanted on it. And was very pleased with that unit. I now purchased a new 2023 Class A from Forest River but could no longer order or even select the options I wanted on it; I couldn't even get the same options that were on the 2016s. And the quality of the 2023 does NOT even come close to the quality of the 2016 within the unit itself, nor the options. nor the appliances, nor anything. Quality control has been replaced with giving themselves larger bonuses. When one spends over 100 thousand dollars for anything they should be more receptive and take corrective action!!! Be absolutely hard nose on all your wants and qualities and don't accept anything less. Write to the RV manufacturers about all the issues because even the dealers and the company representatives do not listen !!! If the manufacturers don't listen do not buy any of their products !!!
As if the dealers aren't making enough profit off of the units already, they have to lie, cheat and steal on the back end. My position in the RV Industry allows me to see exactly what the dealers are paying for the units they receive from the manufacturers. My wife and I love camping and have three RV's that we use depending on what type of excursion we are going on. We always enjoy looking at new campers at various dealers. I am amazed at there retail pricing based upon the knowledge I have about what they are actually paying for the units.
I have only bought 3 RVs (motorhomes) in my life and bought those from private individuals. But now I know to that **IF** I ever buy from an RV dealer then I will need use the same tactic I use when buying automobiles from dealers, and when doing that I usually say something to the effect of "I don't want to know about all your miscellaneous charges, I want to know what the 'Out the door, cash price' is so that I can make a reasonable comparison between you and other dealers". I would then have the option of paying case, using their financing, or my bank or credit union financing. I let the "high pressure" sales tactics persuade me into buying a timeshare condo back in the early 1980s and once I learned my life lesson with that event I have never been scammed again.
Thank you so much for this information!!!!!!! You have saved me from buying my Class B from Camping World!!! Do you know of any reputable dealers in Louisiana that I can trust? Thanks!!
you could almost stay in a 5 star hotel for the price of a campsite and your monthly RV payment. Not to mention there are a lot more places to go worldwide if you stay in a hotel.
I agree 100%. We have enjoyed camping for years, and no matter the dealer, the quality from the factory is not great, and new equipment warranties full of exclusions. Going through a lot of units at a lot of places, it’s hard to find honesty and information in the same dealership. But financing from a private owner is extremely difficult and age of the buyers really changes the terms offered.
I personally think someone should think long and hard before getting a loan of more than around 5-6 years for an RV. Yes that may increase your monthly payments, but the amount going to interest will be substantially less with a shorter loan. A 10-12 year loan for an RV will likely result in the borrower likely being upside down for the entire length of the loan, and will likely have sold the trailer with several years worth of payments left. (Maybe class A's and C's depreciate slower than 5th Wheels and TTs? I'm not experienced in motor homes ownership, just the towables.)
I financed through USAA;however I did purchase from camping world. I have sold the RV and am now out of the loan;however after watching this video I get a little shot of pain in the rear end. I don't know how but I am sure I got shafted at Camping World,
Much like a car, one should only pay cash. Then you know exactly what you are paying. We found CW was very transparent about their fees. We agreed to pay shipping and TTL fees and eliminated the rest. Our out the door price was $21,984 that had an advertised price of $18,999. I do not think we were badly treated or that we overpaid. CW must be doing some things right. They are the largest RV dealer in the world. Wingman just has a bias against CW.
You don't have to pay cash to not be screwed. Take time and go get your own financing if you don't have the cash. Never ever accept the rate from the seller until you check the rate you can get from thousands of banks on the Internet. Banks charge dealers the going rate. The dealer then marks that rate up to the legal extent which could be 30 percent. The difference between what the bank charges the dealer and what the dealer charges your ID called retention and once again the banks allow these dealers to steal from you. We need laws ending this but for years Congress has made it easier to screw the public. A few states put limits on how much interest can be charged but most don't. GO TO YOUR OWN BANK OR CREDIT UNION OR EVEN THE INTERNET TO GET QUOTES ON INTEREST TO BUY AN RV . WAKE UP
Just maybe you should take a look at the BBB complaints and the FTC company's filed against Camping World. Being large and profitable does not mean honest. Bernie Madoff took Billions from very smart people just like Camping World. Maybe your remember ENRON! There is no bias here unless they bias is against con men. I would suggest it's you that has a bias. Facts don't lie.
I just bought a new RV from CW in Draper, UT. I had a good experience. I went in knowing what I wanted, they had one. I did my research on the internet before going in. I did add to it things I wanted. They didn’t try talking me into anything extra, and gave me a fair price on my trade.
Camping world makes more on used units. Only had good experiences there. I’ve used several different dealers over the years. Big or small I was always treated well.
Before Buy my camping trailer, I had checked on a few trailer at CW, I then got a call everyday for 1 1/2 months about the trailer I was interested in. I found a great used trailer off a car dealers lot later for a much better price, and much shorter loan than what CW offered. Was my Camper perfect? No but show my a Perfect brand new trailer. I have seen folks get new trailers that leak like its raining inside. My used shows NO signs of leaks anywhere. I have even sat in trailer in heavy downpours just to look for leaks. Zero leaks. I am so Glad I stayed away from CW.
CW is at it again with their $5 / day ads. They’re pushing the worst of the worst in every category. I researched just a couple of their cheapest trailers. The reviews were terrible. Leaks, breakage, A/C and appliances not working! God help any buyers that fall for this crap!
I had a local camping world refuse to sell me a camper. I walked in and took (and maintained) control of the transaction. Told them that I wanted a specific trailer on the lot, ZERO PDI, ZERO ADD ONS, and i had cash. 2 Salesmen tried to up sell me, but I refused. After the "negotiation" process, they told me that I could not take the righome with me because they had to prep it first. They never called me back, and when I tried to contact the salesman he refused to take my calls, l o l
Rv’s are not an item anyone should be financing, unless you are living in it full time. Buy a previously owned one, after a thorough professional inspection, and let the initial owner take the loss. They are really stacking up on used RV websites now.
Ahh...but consumers are hypnotized by the payments Max. And they lose sight of the real financial burden/expense of their purchase. This isn't something new either as you know. Financial responsibility requires discipline and the ability to say "no". Everyone says they have it. Few actually do!
@@TheRVWingman if people then are so hypnotized then if they get themselves into trouble it is really their own fault. people need to take responsibility for their own foolishness and poor financial decisions. If you have to have every shiny bauble then sooner or later you will get yourself in trouble. Hard way to learn but many need that hard lesson. Maybe next the shot object won't need to be purchased and they will do their homework first
I got this email this morning (Sunday 9-17). CW is being forced to liquidate their NEW 2023 inventory as 2024's are coming. If that isn't proof that sales suck, I don't know what is. Dear Jay, As a customer, I always give you first access to our best offers because you deserve the greatest value. Right now, I’m liquidating my new 2023 RV inventory. My 2024 RVs are starting to arrive and I have over 15,000 new 2023 RVs that need to go. Get the most value for your money with these liquidation discounts. Shop 2023 RV Liquidation Thank you for being a Camping World customer. Sincerely, Marcus Lemonis Chairman and CEO, Camping World & Good Sam
Fantastic video with great information. I watched the original one you posted a few weeks ago. And have learned a lot. My wife and I are going to be looking at buying an RV. Probably a class c in the next year. But we have done our homework thanks to you Wingman and Steve Fraizer
hi... RV's do get bought and sold via the various Facebook groups. Just put out as much information as possible. Add as many pictures as possible. Beware of ANYONE that talks about book values. Imho, they are setting you up to accept a low value. Imho, no 2 RV's are the same, and no 2 RV's ought to be worth the same amount. As I just heard on Wingman, "don't get rolled by the pro's."
Why would you "beware" of people wanting to reference RV book values, how else are people supposed to establish base value!? Book values exist so sellers don't sell too low OR too high (ie/eg) like sellers who think their 10yr old RV is showroom new & worth its weight in gold...lol
@__WJK__ I thought I replied but I don’t see it. Hmm. I was told my coach had a book value of $23,000. A 2001 diesel pusher with 2 slides and lots of upgrades and recent high dollar repairs, and with 6 relatively new Michelin tires. I have been told my others that I might get $60k. I priced it at $40k. The first couple that looked at it bought it. I could have EASILY sold 4 more CASH. My "old coach" will likely last another 10 years. It has an Amish refrigerator: does your B.S. "book value" include that? H no! It has Tyron Bands on the front rims. How many people reading this even know what they are? Does your B.S. "book value" factor that in? He!! no! Imho, the book value proponents are using that concept, so faulty, to make $$$. Does this make sense now. So, my suggestion: do not "get rolled by the pros" as was quoted today by the expert Allen had on. Thank you for asking.
@@ernie7065 Hi Ernie! I agree with you about "book values". They are a GENERAL guide and do not factor in certain exceptions/additions like your coach had. You had an impeccably cared for unit with expensive upgrades that makes it in the (probably) in the 3-5% of all motorhomes the age of yours. IMO, "THAT" is what some buyers want and will gladly pay more than some ambiguous "book" may say. When someone sees a unit like yours, they're willing to pay far more than "book". IMO, Dealers can't afford to count on the 3-5% of all RVs to cover their overhead and instead must look at volume and "where the market is". Unfortunately, the "market" does not seem to be interested in Quality as much as they are interested in "getting a great price". They may get a good price but then complain about quality. Such is life. Congratulations on selling your baby. I'm happy for you! And as always, thanks for being here around our virtual campfire.
@WingmanWisdom Thank you Allen. We had a great 25 year run with both our Winnebago Adventurer and our Monaco Diplomat. We realize how fortunate we are. I still have one item to repair, but we have the wire transfer for full price. The buyer has the signed title. After failing to find the 2 inch by 7 inch "bracket" that I need (the installed one cracked by metal fatigue), I am having it machine made. I had to have a slide out gear machined a few years back. The buyers are much younger. They realized the difference between "bright & shiny" and "well cared for." They confided they had looked at other coached and found the cheaper tires, etc. I have also begun transferring our "experiences" as the difference in Cherry Hill Park (very nice) outside DC vs our preference, The Fairfax County park south of DC. I don't know if other sellers realize this, but that was important to my buyers. They appreciated our desire (and willingness) to stay in touch with them. Translated: we knew our coach is in great shape and are not going to not answer any calls later. We even want them to visit us at our place in Naples. And yes, we will stay subscribed to your wisdom.
I would never buy any rig from camping world. Looking at rigs and see them take parts off other new rigs left and right was an eye opener. All the horror stories about service after the fact. Just another reason not to buy from a corporation!
One important point to remember is CW also operates as other brands so please do your homework. We live close to a CW that bought out a large independent dealer that many liked in our area near Nashville. This was Cullem and Maxey which is next door to CW near Opryland. Their sign now says Gander RV but otherwise they're CW. Unfortunately, CW buys out numerous smaller chains or independents and seems like some they convert to CW branding and others they use something else. If this was discussed in the video and I missed it, I'm sorry. Travel safe
My thought is just Wow. I do read every word in a contract and am a numbers person and I would have questioned every line. I would have walked out long before because I can usually spot con salesperson and red flags appear very quickly. I actually enjoy playing with them and I can frustrate them fairly quickly.
Don't want to get political here, but I feel the need to. Remember when the CEO ? of Camping World publicly asked people who supported Trump for president to not support his business. Well guess what folks !!!
Hey! Enough about "the Chicago way" ... I'm from Chicago, and though it has its share of graft and greed, Camping World is based in Lincolnshire IL, an upper-class suburb 40 miles north of the city, not even in Cook County. You can call it "the Lincolnshire way" ;-)
Whatever mom and pop RV dealers are left, are about to BE GONE. The coming depression will have MAJOR consolidation or small dealers into the big corporations.
Walked into a camping world in florida to buy my 1st rv. New in 10 seconds I wasn't gona buybfrom them when I saw the amount of cubicles and people in suits conducting business through computers. I'm too poor to help anyone get rich. Bought used instead
A good friend worked for a camper sales place until Camping World bought them out. Now I know why he doesn't work there anymore. I'm pretty sure he could not swindle people for them like that but he never told me the why!
The average consumer doesn't have a clue how purchasing contracts screw them without reading ALL the fine print and asking a lawyer to read the contract first.
I have had motorhomes and trailers and I barely ever use them so I have learned to think hard before buying again but now that I'm retired I might do so and you can bet I will be buying second-hand and paying cash don't borrow money from one of these things you might not even hardly ever use
It sounds like the best route you can take would be to either have the cash to pay for the camper up front and not the extra add on fluff or get a loan from somewhere else.
Still must scrutinize each and every line on the contract thoroughly, slowly, and watch as many of these videos about what services and add-on items that are commonly pushed by finance managers are truly needed, or that can be purchased separately yourself the next day from a dealer or company for much cheaper if you do want that add-on option. Plus always get pre-approved for the loan from at least 1 or 2 credit unions, or banks if you must, so you know the higher rate they will probably first offer you is due to their adding on extra profit for themselves in the form of a kickback from the bank they used to finance you. So ask them to beat the percentage rate your credit union pre-approved you at, and if they can't, then use your credit union to finance the rv, not the dealer's bank. Try to get the OUT THE DOOR line itemized contract with no extra add-ons you did not specifically request to be printed up and given to you to review overnight. Then you can more thoroughly review it without them breathing down your neck. Go watch the free educational videos about how to buy a car without getting screwed by dealers at CarEdge.com, as those lessons will be applicable when buying an rv also. Maybe one day they will expand and start to include rv reviews, pricing guides and dealer reviews as well as for traditional automobiles and dealers and manufacturers.
Makes me glad I bought a camper from a small local dealer that stands behind their products. 😮💨. So what if you walked into these places with a wad of cash and tried to buy? Would they even sell it to you?
@@TheRVWingman didn't really ever think about it until this video... I remember they adjusted the Payment a few times. If I wasn't sure canceling the deal was a good move, I am now. Car loans didn't seem as bad, there was no change from the cost or the payments from the initial take it or leave it
Thank you for posting this. Marcus has total disdain for middle America who make up the overwhelming majority of rv owners. Word is that he lives with a secret 🏳️🌈 🤫
You're most welcome. Not sure about any secret but I am pretty sure he's perfected strategies to separate consumers from as much money as possible in every transaction. While that business approach may work well for stock holders, the real cost/burden is on the consumer and will have a negative effect on future sales of RVs. Caveat emptor.
@@kensmart1976 that doesn’t mean he is doing something right. The masses usually don’t know what they are getting themselves into. McDonald’s serves billions so does that mean they are providing quality food?
Probably not allowed, maybe a list of dealers that screw over the buyers? Of all the things this government is focused on, maybe bad business actors should be one... Last thing, I noticed the MSRP is touted as the sell price to show a "savings", I guess it works if you always buy at MSRP...
One reason we set up our 24 hour voice mailbox is for RVers to call and share their experiences (both good and bad). We've got some doozies to play in the coming weeks.
When we started RVing we would go there to see everything and I always got a very creepy feeling with bad energy fr9m the staff as if they talk behind your back while you are still there. One time they tried to charge me 175.00 to look at my camera and tell me what was wrong with it...they could not tell me because they didn't try to diagnose it so I left and they called me to tell me I owed them money for something they did not do....spoke to manager and finally got it squared away...I feel better when we stay the heck away from C.W.
RV or Timeshare, the buyer knows what they're getting and at least for campers can see it. Its the buyers decisions as to buy or not. Never heard of a single dealer of either holding anyone at gunpoint. Neither is ever and investment.
I agree with what you say basically. I think the difference here is the lying & con artist tactics camping world uses. I purchased my RV from camping world in 2021. How I wish I'd seen something like the information presented here 1st. I was a new buyer, new to RVing, & they took advantage of me in every way possible.
Hi wing man the past rv shows that I been to no camping world gee I wonder way I live in Illinois when I go up to Wisconsin to visit my sister I drive by like 4 camping world stores when I look out my window I feel like yelling out my window no don't go there
I think that was a corporate strategy. Personally, I think they should get back IN the RV Shows. If I was a dealer in a show and talking with potential buyers, I would WANT them to go over to the CW area to visit. I'd encourage them to "listen with their gut" as well as their brain and be on the lookout for sleaze. Videos like this one may be nice/educational and a bit entertaining but when a customer can "feel the sleaze" it is far more powerful than any video. Thanks for watching!
Traveling I don't need a huge rv. I just need a bathroom bed and cooking/stoves. I buy my vehicles from private party. And I'm about to buy a 2014 jaco 20 footer. I will buy private party as well. buying new was $42,000.00. buying this one as a 2014 for $11,000.00. I'm sure I can enjoy this and sell it for with maybe $2,000.00 less.
Camping World conned me in 2018, right now I'm upside down about $10,000. I'm going to have to sell it for $10,000 less than I owe. But I really don't have a choice. I made the mistake. I just don't know how or whom I can sell it to.
In 2018 I bought a Wolf Pup from Camping World, Nashville, and they tried to pull all the same stuff. I had previously worked in sales for Mike Thompson in Orange County, California, and I knew about contracts. I had them match another dealer's price. They tried all the same tricks, They also wanted twelve hundred dollars for a battery, to fill the propane and show me around the RV. No way. That wasn't going to happen. I got the RV and got out of there with my shirt on my back.. I had good credit, and I paid less than ten percent. In my year working for the other RV dealer, I had never seen them do any of these con man tactics. Camping world had promised to do a few things on the RV that they never came through with. I did do some posting back a few years ago. About them and I will pass on this video with my story.
Whenever buying anything on credit, you should always check your interest for that loan $20,000 trailer a 15 year loan payment could cost you $45,000 if you don’t check these things
Explore USA tried to get me for a dealer prep of $5995 so I just gave up on new dealers and bought used and I got a nicer trailer for less and the seller didn't add anything for prep.
If you can't pay cash, you can't afford it. Put the payment aside each month for years and then buy without worry about making payments. If you can't do that before making a non-essential purchase you can't afford the payments.
O.K. The one guy was a dealer, but the guy that supposedly got ripped off was an actor. Get an itemized price list, true interest rate and the true out-the-door price before signing anything. Where are you going to park it? How much is insurance? What are the current rates for camping spaces? Price of gas? Maybe just forget the whole idea!
Biggest kept secret!!!! How many motor homes have had people die in them!!!! I used to do " REPOS" ALL OF THE VERY NICE RIGS!!! HAVE HAD MORE THAN ONE COUPLE DIE OF OLD AGE IN THEM !
I would never buy a camper from them but I have used their store and their prices are fair and some good sales periodically. I had them install a brake controller on my truck and they did a good job at a reasonable price.
I met a young man who was a camping world employee, in a smaller town, and he was very honest and helpful, and with their volume and variety he explained and shared a lot of information about brands and preferred finance options. Being older, we were skeptical about looking at newer and better equipped units, but with the help of a great finance team and local banks, our retirement plan became a reality. There are good people and as a high volume dealer, no one could come close to prices or financing options offered. Not all salespeople are bad, and the recently acquired dealership was determined to keep their good reputation. The man that took us through and explained everything was an eight year employee and very knowledgeable and professional.
If you think the information in this video is important for others to know, please share it on social media and in Facebook Groups about Camping and RVing that you're in. Thanks in advance!
Thank you for showing what crooks Camping World are. Why isn't the attorney general doing something about Camping World?
We just bought our first RV a couple months ago. We were debating new or used so we visited several dealers looking at options and prices. General RV tried using typical salesman techniques to get us to sign for a brand new RV. I got tired of their constant pressure so I told my wife we are leaving. We just stood up and walked away leaving the salesman and his boss sitting at the desk. We eventually bought a nice used unit at a local dealer who didn't use any pressure tactics and didn't try to sell us a bunch of crap. We will go back to that dealer when we are ready to upgrade.
Same here. Just tell cheers and walk out, that's all.
Another thing I see is that campgrounds are getting stupid expensive, especially privately owned ones. There's no reason prices should have doubled, even with inflation. I live in Lexington, KY and both our major dealers are bad to do business with. One of them tried to charge me double the cost of materials on a repair. I went to Camping World, ironically, and they gave a quote, and the cost of the materials was half, to the penny. But, I am not a fan of Camping World either. I would never buy an RV from them. Just remember, if you think car dealers are crooked, they can't even come close to RV dealers. There should be a special place in hell for most of them. Thank you for the great service you provide to everyone!
RVs and Camping have been (and always will be) synonymous with "affordability." Unfortunaely, when the industry raised prices during the RV & Camping boom, many in the industry got greedy and now that the RV & Camping boom is over/gone bust, the inflated prices are coming back to haunt the industry.
@@__WJK__ I don't understand the general term re "going bust" ... try getting a reservation at some well-located RV parks. They are full. The state of Michigan allows you to reserve 6 months in advance. Key state parks get full within hours of the dates that open up.
People are buying used coaches like crazy. They have the cash. Your used coach has to be worth your asking price. These buyers are spending their time doing research and asking questions.
Ernie, the conditions your describing haven't been our experience this year. We have camped mainly in state parks from Florida to Maine this year. With the exception of snowbird season in Florida, which we book as early as possible, the state parks have had availability even on Holiday weekends. Many parks have gone back to pre pandemic levels on weekdays resembling "ghost towns". A lot of the pandemic entry campers have returned to their regular activities and are attempting to unload their impulse purchases at unrealistic price points.
This is true. The price of a campsite is almost as expensive as a hotel room.
@@__WJK__ We're definitely in a rough patch for many dealers who were thinking the Gravy Train would never end. ♥
When we were looking at campers 3 years ago, I found your TH-cam channel. I looked all over the net in my area with 250 miles. Of course, world hounded me for weeks and months on end. After watching your and other videos and seeing some of the horror stories we ended up buying at a local dealer that a good friend of ours said he and his wife bought at and was happy with their purchase. We didn't buy any extended warranties. No hidden fees. They even pulled our vin number to make sure our truck could safely pull the camper we bought. We ended up buying a WDH and they set up for us.
Congrats. Sounds like y'all did it right!
This needs to be shared, if they don't like people hearing the truth they should change their business practices and be more transparent.
Will never forget one piece of advice (of many) that my dad gave me. "Travel light, carry money". Thanks, dad.
"The more you know the further your money will go." THANK YOU for the education ! This will be shared.
Math is hard for most these days, pretty much since they mandated common core in schools. I've financed many cars & 3 RV's & never once would I buy into "Where do you want your payment to be?" Thats the oldest sales trick in the book. I will only accept the sale breakdown with each line item and the OTD total, period end of story. Those who go in with a payment in mind always get ripped.
Geez, buying a Camper that’s the last damn thing I need to own. My wife said we should buy a camper. I tell her she got to go to the Head Doctor and get some rocks removed. Camper what are you Frigging crazy. We got a beautiful Lake Home with 3 boats. What the hell do you want with a camper? If you think I’m going to drop a 100K on a pickup truck to pull around another 100K Plus for an Air Stream. Because anything else we buy is absolute junk. So just do yourself a me a favor and Fuggetaboutit we are not going to buy a Camper.
Plus many of those Camper Dealerships can make car dealerships look like pre schoolers. They are crooked as the day is long. We can buy a lot of hotel suites for 200k and drive away with zero up keep. Plus every time we drive to the lake home we always see a camper on the side of the road with broken leaf springs. Shocks, Blown Bearing. Or a blown out tire. When they have to use the cabinets or countertops that are junk anyway as structural components. Your buying junk because they have to make then so light. And our 100k pickup truck is getting 9 mpg. Nope we’re not buy anything related to camping.
My Daughter is a former State Supreme Court Attorney, currently a Assistant State Prosecuting Attorney...she knows her stuff. She has always stood by that when these vultures attack with these dishonest schemes it's time to file a complaint with your State's Attorney General's Office.
Nowadays, the AGs care more about the criminals. Look at Ellison in MN for example.
😅I went to camping world and the salesman said this is his retirement job that he worked off shore for 30 years. First thing I thought was Alcatraz
Probably making license plates.
Let’s say in 2018 we were taken by Camping World. There sales to the Financial department to the store manager seen us coming and they sure did add all the extras to the amount of the camper. We were told so may lies and regretted going through them for a camper. We were told if you buy from them you can take it to any CW for repairs. Number 1 lies we had to argue to even make an appointment for repairs in another State… Let’s say when we purchased on a Saturday it was back to the service department on Monday. They had it from December-March and still didn’t complete all the stuff that was written down. Took our first trip in May came back 2 months later and the camper back to CW .
I could go on and on but I’ll stop..
Just to let you know you're not alone. I could tell you stories, but I won't even begin. Let's just say, I was totally hoo dooed by CW - still making payments as proof.
I just bought an RV from Campers Inn of Mocksville NC. They pulled that 2 price scheme on me. “The price is discounted 5k only if you finance with us” nowhere in the paperwork could I find anything in writing to back that up. Jokes on them. First payment will be a payoff and a refi with my credit union for 2 and a half percent LESS than what they arranged. If I had known the law, I would have financed from the start with my CU and when they tried to charge me more, busted them on it!!!
Thank you for exposing these dishonest ripoffs.
Great job and we appreciate you for keeping us informed.
🙏🙏🙏
Aww. Thanks. This channel is built on truth, honesty, education and common sense. I appreciate those who put their trust in me. While I'm certainly a flawed man, I will never knowingly lie or lead folks astray. All the best.
@@TheRVWingman there is no human walking on this earth that is not flawed. Alan you do a great job informing people and telling the truth. I have always enjoyed your videos and will continue to watch and sit around your virtual campfire.
im a repo driver, and tonight were traveling the roads of camping world florida, we tow with all aboard, buckle up sleeping.
In 2017 we bought a Class A motor home. Took it to CW for some minor work. Got a call from their service manager pushing a complete recaulking job to ensure it wouldn’t leak because they do a poor job at the factory. Normal cost is $4,000 but I can get it today for $3,000. I said hold on. I hung up the phone, drove straight to CW, drove our motor home away and never returned. CW is the absolute worst.
My wife and I bought our first RV about 12 years ago, and not from Camping World. Our first was a gently used one from a nearby dealer which we traded in a year later for a new one from same dealer. That manufacturer quality sucked so when we wanted to upgrade to a 5th wheel a couple years later we went to another smaller nearby dealer. We ended up trading in that 5th wheel for a class A at the same dealer. During all this we went to Camping World more than a few times, and came to the conclusion they are rip off artists. Even talking to them at RV shows, they will say anything. And the "freebies" that they offer are a joke.
Thanks for watching.
Thank you for the information on buying an RV. We were first time buyers a few years ago on a used Travel Trailer, a 2017 Passport Elite 27 RB which we paid 33,000 for. Two years layer we have found out the truth on how we were taken. The story is long and the nightmare sad. We recently were looking to upgrade to another RV, possibly a 5th wheel at Camping World. After much consideration by my wife and I we have decided to backoff until we do more research for fear of getting taken again by shady RV dealers. I appreciate you bringing these tricks and scammers to light. We maybe taking a flight to your dealer when we are ready to move up. We are looking for true honesty and absolutely no gimmicks when buying another. We appreciate your videos in educating the public in the world of RVing..Thank you..
love love love this CW reference video. tyvm. Hope more people see it. I will definitely share it. 😊
Thanks Sandra!
I appreciate the information. This helps when dealing with sales people. It is important to do the research ahead of time and know the costs of additional items above the sales price of an rv/trailer. Also, it is best to get pre approved loans outside of the dealership.
Financing an RV is a very stupid move
You're right, dealers don't like pre-approved loans. Arranging customer financing is another way they make money, as well as selling useless "warranties." Pre approaved lenders will only finance loan-to-value on a purchase. The rest is up to the buyer's out of pocket. The finance charge is a front-end expense that will take years to pay. Ignor "MSRP" stickers. It's a tactic to make you think you're saving $1000's. Moreover, selling warranties (another significant dealer profit) is also the dealers way to sell (expensive but worthless) crap and not be responsible. Bottom line? Don't buy an RV. In the long run you'll save money by staying in hotels and eating out. You do the math, you'll see.
I always do business with people and businesses that treat me fairly. Not perfectly, but fairly. We were treated right by a small RV dealer in Tulsa, OK back in 1996. That RV is still going strong. The dealer has trained hands, but they treated us right, and gave us a great trade on our 8 year old diesel.
I was looking for Class A RV . When I found one I asked dealer ? How much ? I go to Bank and bring cash or cashier check .
He told me . " Cash is trash He will lose money if I didn't buy on credit " No deal ....
I had a similar experience 6 years ago with General. We were wise to most of it. But they still got us for extras that sound legit and not horribly expensive. Never again. Our last purchase went very well, with no pressure, and no added extras. An extended warranty was offered, but we weren't interested, and we weren't pressured.
This happened to me in Ripon. Talk about con-job pushed through finance. When I read the terms I was shocked. Financing equaled more than the RV which was the lowest price I had ever see for that model. Now I know how. I’m keeping my old Lance camper. Doing a restoration at a fraction of the cost.
Yep. It's amazing how much someone may find when they actually READ the fine print!
You cannot beat the Lance.Good call.
Where is the best place to buy in the valley? Best RV in Turlock has plenty of choices, but definitely overpriced…
My comments: Sold RV’s for three years. What I learned? There are absolutely NO rv’s worth the money you pay. None! Ever! If you buy a new rv, no matter what brand, make or model, none are worth what you pay. The markup is ridiculous. Not saying they don’t serve a purpose or that they shouldn’t be bought but knowing their deceitful ways in which they get you, is just called good salesmen ship in the industry. They may not lie at all, but will definitely mislead you by leading. So called good salesmen will be extremely confident in their delivery making a person feel as if they really DO need what they’re selling besides the rv. BS! The more they cost, the more you’re getting screwed. Period! So listen to this guy because he is absolutely correct. Even if the dealer is on the up and up and giving a so called good deal, the markup is so high it really is NOT a deal at all. They took this guy for 10K, just like that. That was by adding all kinds of stuff they simply did not need, or could have gotten much cheaper elsewhere. Buying used is the same thing. You think you’re getting a deal and that the original buyers took care of the depreciation. Nope, I promise they mark everything up. There are better deals than others but absolutely no good deals. The horror stories you will hear if only you do your research will make you sick to your stomach. But, the owners of these dealers are rich af and they are the very best sellers of all. Hey, some folks don’t mind and some don’t care if they spend more. I get it. You May have plenty of money, but wow, what a way to just blow it. Even the makers who are or claim to be better. Plywood floors, special chassis, extra a/c, whatever. It’s ONLY worth what someone will pay and when Covid hit, people went bonkers buying them. Waiting times for months just to be over charged for pieces of crap. After the purchase, your troubles have just started as getting service on one is next to impossible. Their schedule. Their word. Not their fault. It’s like a politician always blaming others. Learn all you can before buying. You may laugh at me, but I camp a lot. A whole lot. While I watch as some spend hours setting their rig up, I’m hanging in my hammock, smoking the very best weed because of all the money I DIDN’T spend. My friends have rv’s and they end up at my campfire telling me all their problems they had since the last time they were out. The majority of people don’t even use their rv. They sit in a rented space collecting dust, depreciating and getting full of mice. My best to all. You CAN find a deal but it’s likely from an individual who tried to trade or sell back and found they were lied to or scammed. I’m not disgruntled. Just know the business. Ask around.
I would never buy an RV from Camping world, I have bought a direct tv dish the price was the same as everywhere else. No harm there, but there’s a saying that every dog has his day! Thankfully I have found your videos and are making me a better informed buyer.
Thanks for watching!
The problem is, it’s hard to find a mom and pop dealer these days, they are all getting bought up by the chains. In Michigan a small dealer is difficult to find, especially if you want a particular brand.
Yep. AND...AND, some of those Mom and Pop dealers (those who're swimming in remaining 2022's) may have a VERY difficult next 12 months as will some of the chains. I expect to see more small dealers getting gobbled up by the chains; leaving fewer options for buyers. Hey. Don't get mad at me for saying what "I see". Seriously. I hope I'm wrong! Thanks for watching.
My brother got fleeced by camping world 7 years ago ! He lost thousands to them ! There is no such thing as a honest salesman! 😬
Perhaps my dad was the exception. He always told his customers " If I can't help you, I won't hurt you. " He made a good living off of his repeat business.
@@nzobrist6525
There’s always an exception to the rule . I’ve just never met one . My father in law was a salesman his entire life . When he was in his 80’s he told me there was no way around lying to customers! Or stretching the truth ? Just saying 🤔. 🤷🏼♂️
Exactly....treat people right and you will have a customer for life.....something earned not given. Your Dad sounds like my Dad....he was the same way.@@nzobrist6525
You are correct! We have a 2021 Highland Ridge Roamer 354 MBH 5th wheel and we are $30000 upside down. I’m tempted to just call the bank and ask them to pick it up. Ugh!
How much you want for it.
So why did you buy it if you had to finance it?
I struggle to understand why people seem to think that they "need" so much stuff but they can't afford to pay cash for it.
Imo people shouldn't be buying this sort of crap unless they have everything paid off, have a very healthy rainy day fund and their retirement savings sorted.............and they they're still a waste of money.
@@oldbloke204 we sold our home and went from the east coast to the west coast and back for a year. High inflation took us off the road. We are retired. Btw, I’m glad you can afford to pay cash. Even if we did pay cash, it would still be a $30000 loss either way.
@@Rednek444 $68900
@@scottowen20 I just don't get people, especially if they're retired, doing this sort of thing if your finances are so parlous tbh.
Our home is basically a cornerstone of our retirement and even though we have way more cash and retirement savings than many others I wouldn't dream of spending any of it in this manner.
I don't live in your country but it's mind boggling to me how many do this sort of thing.
Economic conditions are likely to get worse, imo, so I shall continue to get ready for that.
Good luck to you.
Makes me happier every day my wife and I converted a school bus. It will last the rest if our lives and I dont have a loan.
Not me. You wouldnt catch me at a dealership of ANY kind. Private owner, (with cash) or nothing!
The problem there is they’ll sell from underneath you while you are trying to secure an inspector!! Had this happen to me twice!!
Greetings! Don't think there aren't sleazy, lying individual sellers out there. I assure you, there are plenty. The problem? They look and sound just like the honest ones. A healthy dose of skepticism is always a good idea IMO.
I have a friend that worked at the Columbia store. He didn't work there very long because of all the dishonest things they do. Warranty items were useless because they would say it wasn't covered.
'Buried up to their eye sockets.' I'm sorry, but that made me laugh out loud. Seriously, good work on educating people and saving them from getting fleeced.
There is a Congressional investigation regarding Hertz' falsely reporting rental car theft by customers. Perhaps they should also look into the financing practices of some of the large RV retailers.
WOW, Alan, what a shocking revelation about a specific transaction at CW! Glad I never shopped there for an RV. One would hope that with enough information available we would see smarter consumers who would avoid them like the plague and they would be forced to change their practices! Maybe wishful thinking on my part. Combining rapid depreciation with a small downpayment and long-term payments is a recipe for financial disaster!
Right on point wingman. Bought a 2006 Georgetown 36 ft. Class A. I Told them my family was going on a trip to Montana. I asked them about the tires. They said they look great. Come to find out the tires were 10 years old. These people could have caused a big problem? They did not care. 9 years is maximum for heavy coaches. Live and learn. I bought a diesel pusher after Georgetown. You can bet it was not from camping world! I tell all my friends and family about theses crooks!
I have been an RVer for almost 50 yrs. I have had minimal problems with my last two dealers because I will not accept what they try to pull. My major griefs are with the RV manufacturers themselves. They think they know better and will not even listen to a real experienced RVer. I purchased a new 2016 Class C from Forest River by ordering exactly what options I wanted on it. And was very pleased with that unit. I now purchased a new 2023 Class A from Forest River but could no longer order or even select the options I wanted on it; I couldn't even get the same options that were on the 2016s. And the quality of the 2023 does NOT even come close to the quality of the 2016 within the unit itself, nor the options. nor the appliances, nor anything. Quality control has been replaced with giving themselves larger bonuses. When one spends over 100 thousand dollars for anything they should be more receptive and take corrective action!!! Be absolutely hard nose on all your wants and qualities and don't accept anything less. Write to the RV manufacturers about all the issues because even the dealers and the company representatives do not listen !!! If the manufacturers don't listen do not buy any of their products !!!
As if the dealers aren't making enough profit off of the units already, they have to lie, cheat and steal on the back end. My position in the RV Industry allows me to see exactly what the dealers are paying for the units they receive from the manufacturers. My wife and I love camping and have three RV's that we use depending on what type of excursion we are going on. We always enjoy looking at new campers at various dealers. I am amazed at there retail pricing based upon the knowledge I have about what they are actually paying for the units.
They do NOT have to lie. But they should go out of business. Hell waits for the liar.
I have only bought 3 RVs (motorhomes) in my life and bought those from private individuals. But now I know to that **IF** I ever buy from an RV dealer then I will need use the same tactic I use when buying automobiles from dealers, and when doing that I usually say something to the effect of "I don't want to know about all your miscellaneous charges, I want to know what the 'Out the door, cash price' is so that I can make a reasonable comparison between you and other dealers". I would then have the option of paying case, using their financing, or my bank or credit union financing. I let the "high pressure" sales tactics persuade me into buying a timeshare condo back in the early 1980s and once I learned my life lesson with that event I have never been scammed again.
Thank you so much for this information!!!!!!! You have saved me from buying my Class B from Camping World!!! Do you know of any reputable dealers in Louisiana that I can trust? Thanks!!
It is so expensive to stay at a campground nowadays you have to consider that in the total cost which is becoming prohibitive.
you could almost stay in a 5 star hotel for the price of a campsite and your monthly RV payment. Not to mention there are a lot more places to go worldwide if you stay in a hotel.
I agree 100%. We have enjoyed camping for years, and no matter the dealer, the quality from the factory is not great, and new equipment warranties full of exclusions. Going through a lot of units at a lot of places, it’s hard to find honesty and information in the same dealership. But financing from a private owner is extremely difficult and age of the buyers really changes the terms offered.
I personally think someone should think long and hard before getting a loan of more than around 5-6 years for an RV. Yes that may increase your monthly payments, but the amount going to interest will be substantially less with a shorter loan. A 10-12 year loan for an RV will likely result in the borrower likely being upside down for the entire length of the loan, and will likely have sold the trailer with several years worth of payments left. (Maybe class A's and C's depreciate slower than 5th Wheels and TTs? I'm not experienced in motor homes ownership, just the towables.)
I remember that Video Wingman ! Was a bit late for many people! Oh well!!😬
Car dealers are doing very similar things. Beware!
Perhaps. But car dealers don't finance for 15-20 years (at least not yet). There's a special place in hell for those who rip people's heads off.
So does new boat and used boat brokers ! Read the contracts carefully ! ! I almost was burned.
An educated consumer is the best customer.
Yep. Yep. Yep!
I have never stepped foot on a camping world parking lot, and I never will step foot. Camping World sucks!
If you have to finance a frivolous purchase like an RV that sits in your storage area 95% of the time, you should not buy one.
For some, it isn't a "frivolous" purchase; they live in their RV full time, they have no other housing.
If you can't pay cash for something like a trailer, you can't afford it.
Never understood the camping/ RV thing. Seems to me a tent for camping would be the way to go. Otherwise get a hotel
Right? Just don't buy your tent at Camping World.
I financed through USAA;however I did purchase from camping world. I have sold the RV and am now out of the loan;however after watching this video I get a little shot of pain in the rear end. I don't know how but I am sure I got shafted at Camping World,
Some people don't have a basic understanding of how a loan works.
Much like a car, one should only pay cash. Then you know exactly what you are paying. We found CW was very transparent about their fees. We agreed to pay shipping and TTL fees and eliminated the rest. Our out the door price was $21,984 that had an advertised price of $18,999. I do not think we were badly treated or that we overpaid. CW must be doing some things right. They are the largest RV dealer in the world. Wingman just has a bias against CW.
You don't have to pay cash to not be screwed. Take time and go get your own financing if you don't have the cash. Never ever accept the rate from the seller until you check the rate you can get from thousands of banks on the Internet. Banks charge dealers the going rate. The dealer then marks that rate up to the legal extent which could be 30 percent. The difference between what the bank charges the dealer and what the dealer charges your ID called retention and once again the banks allow these dealers to steal from you. We need laws ending this but for years Congress has made it easier to screw the public. A few states put limits on how much interest can be charged but most don't. GO TO YOUR OWN BANK OR CREDIT UNION OR EVEN THE INTERNET TO GET QUOTES ON INTEREST TO BUY AN RV . WAKE UP
Just maybe you should take a look at the BBB complaints and the FTC company's filed against Camping World. Being large and profitable does not mean honest. Bernie Madoff took Billions from very smart people just like Camping World. Maybe your remember ENRON! There is no bias here unless they bias is against con men. I would suggest it's you that has a bias. Facts don't lie.
I just bought a new RV from CW in Draper, UT. I had a good experience. I went in knowing what I wanted, they had one. I did my research on the internet before going in. I did add to it things I wanted. They didn’t try talking me into anything extra, and gave me a fair price on my trade.
And what about General RV? Just as bad in my humble opinion
Camping world makes more on used units. Only had good experiences there. I’ve used several different dealers over the years. Big or small I was always treated well.
Before Buy my camping trailer, I had checked on a few trailer at CW, I then got a call everyday for 1 1/2 months about the trailer I was interested in. I found a great used trailer off a car dealers lot later for a much better price, and much shorter loan than what CW offered. Was my Camper perfect? No but show my a Perfect brand new trailer. I have seen folks get new trailers that leak like its raining inside. My used shows NO signs of leaks anywhere. I have even sat in trailer in heavy downpours just to look for leaks. Zero leaks. I am so Glad I stayed away from CW.
CW is at it again with their $5 / day ads. They’re pushing the worst of the worst in every category. I researched just a couple of their cheapest trailers. The reviews were terrible. Leaks, breakage, A/C and appliances not working! God help any buyers that fall for this crap!
Ahh....$5 a day. Isn't that awesome! And some people actually believe it! 🤣🤣🤣
The submersible Titan that recently imploded used interior lighting from Camping World. That should tell you everything you need to know.
I had a local camping world refuse to sell me a camper. I walked in and took (and maintained) control of the transaction. Told them that I wanted a specific trailer on the lot, ZERO PDI, ZERO ADD ONS, and i had cash.
2 Salesmen tried to up sell me, but I refused.
After the "negotiation" process, they told me that I could not take the righome with me because they had to prep it first. They never called me back, and when I tried to contact the salesman he refused to take my calls, l o l
There's a reason it's known as Scamping World.
Rv’s are not an item anyone should be financing, unless you are living in it full time. Buy a previously owned one, after a thorough professional inspection, and let the initial owner take the loss. They are really stacking up on used RV websites now.
Given the inflationary/recessionary state of the economy + the post-pandemic RV, motorhome & camping bust, it's starting to rain used RVs.
Ahh...but consumers are hypnotized by the payments Max. And they lose sight of the real financial burden/expense of their purchase. This isn't something new either as you know. Financial responsibility requires discipline and the ability to say "no". Everyone says they have it. Few actually do!
FYI.........
READ YOUR WARRANTY.
IF YOU LIVE IN AN RV, CAMPER FULL TIME YOUR WARRANTY IS VOID.
Do not let them know when asked.
@@TheRVWingman if people then are so hypnotized then if they get themselves into trouble it is really their own fault. people need to take responsibility for their own foolishness and poor financial decisions. If you have to have every shiny bauble then sooner or later you will get yourself in trouble. Hard way to learn but many need that hard lesson. Maybe next the shot object won't need to be purchased and they will do their homework first
We live in sad times. To top it off, many are now saying most of the Homeless are stealing all the ebikes.
I got this email this morning (Sunday 9-17). CW is being forced to liquidate their NEW 2023 inventory as 2024's are coming. If that isn't proof that sales suck, I don't know what is.
Dear Jay,
As a customer, I always give you first access to our best offers because you deserve the greatest value. Right now, I’m liquidating my new 2023 RV inventory. My 2024 RVs are starting to arrive and I have over 15,000 new 2023 RVs that need to go. Get the most value for your money with these liquidation discounts.
Shop 2023 RV Liquidation
Thank you for being a Camping World customer.
Sincerely,
Marcus Lemonis
Chairman and CEO, Camping World & Good Sam
Fantastic video with great information. I watched the original one you posted a few weeks ago. And have learned a lot. My wife and I are going to be looking at buying an RV. Probably a class c in the next year. But we have done our homework thanks to you Wingman and Steve Fraizer
And thank YOU, Mr. Lewis. Glad you found the info to be helpful. ❤
hi... RV's do get bought and sold via the various Facebook groups. Just put out as much information as possible. Add as many pictures as possible. Beware of ANYONE that talks about book values. Imho, they are setting you up to accept a low value. Imho, no 2 RV's are the same, and no 2 RV's ought to be worth the same amount. As I just heard on Wingman, "don't get rolled by the pro's."
Why would you "beware" of people wanting to reference RV book values, how else are people supposed to establish base value!? Book values exist so sellers don't sell too low OR too high (ie/eg) like sellers who think their 10yr old RV is showroom new & worth its weight in gold...lol
@__WJK__ I thought I replied but I don’t see it. Hmm. I was told my coach had a book value of $23,000. A 2001 diesel pusher with 2 slides and lots of upgrades and recent high dollar repairs, and with 6 relatively new Michelin tires. I have been told my others that I might get $60k. I priced it at $40k. The first couple that looked at it bought it. I could have EASILY sold 4 more CASH. My "old coach" will likely last another 10 years. It has an Amish refrigerator: does your B.S. "book value" include that? H no! It has Tyron Bands on the front rims. How many people reading this even know what they are? Does your B.S. "book value" factor that in? He!! no! Imho, the book value proponents are using that concept, so faulty, to make $$$. Does this make sense now. So, my suggestion: do not "get rolled by the pros" as was quoted today by the expert Allen had on. Thank you for asking.
@@ernie7065 Hi Ernie! I agree with you about "book values". They are a GENERAL guide and do not factor in certain exceptions/additions like your coach had. You had an impeccably cared for unit with expensive upgrades that makes it in the (probably) in the 3-5% of all motorhomes the age of yours. IMO, "THAT" is what some buyers want and will gladly pay more than some ambiguous "book" may say. When someone sees a unit like yours, they're willing to pay far more than "book". IMO, Dealers can't afford to count on the 3-5% of all RVs to cover their overhead and instead must look at volume and "where the market is". Unfortunately, the "market" does not seem to be interested in Quality as much as they are interested in "getting a great price". They may get a good price but then complain about quality. Such is life. Congratulations on selling your baby. I'm happy for you! And as always, thanks for being here around our virtual campfire.
@WingmanWisdom Thank you Allen. We had a great 25 year run with both our Winnebago Adventurer and our Monaco Diplomat.
We realize how fortunate we are. I still have one item to repair, but we have the wire transfer for full price. The buyer has the signed title. After failing to find the 2 inch by 7 inch "bracket" that I need (the installed one cracked by metal fatigue), I am having it machine made. I had to have a slide out gear machined a few years back. The buyers are much younger. They realized the difference between "bright & shiny" and "well cared for." They confided they had looked at other coached and found the cheaper tires, etc. I have also begun transferring our "experiences" as the difference in Cherry Hill Park (very nice) outside DC vs our preference, The Fairfax County park south of DC. I don't know if other sellers realize this, but that was important to my buyers. They appreciated our desire (and willingness) to stay in touch with them. Translated: we knew our coach is in great shape and are not going to not answer any calls later. We even want them to visit us at our place in Naples. And yes, we will stay subscribed to your wisdom.
I would never buy any rig from camping world. Looking at rigs and see them take parts off other new rigs left and right was an eye opener. All the horror stories about service after the fact. Just another reason not to buy from a corporation!
One important point to remember is CW also operates as other brands so please do your homework. We live close to a CW that bought out a large independent dealer that many liked in our area near Nashville. This was Cullem and Maxey which is next door to CW near Opryland. Their sign now says Gander RV but otherwise they're CW. Unfortunately, CW buys out numerous smaller chains or independents and seems like some they convert to CW branding and others they use something else. If this was discussed in the video and I missed it, I'm sorry. Travel safe
My thought is just Wow. I do read every word in a contract and am a numbers person and I would have questioned every line. I would have walked out long before because I can usually spot con salesperson and red flags appear very quickly. I actually enjoy playing with them and I can frustrate them fairly quickly.
READING every word and understanding is always a good strategy.
Is there is some correlation between loud garish shirts and being a RV owner?
Don't want to get political here, but I feel the need to.
Remember when the CEO ? of Camping World publicly asked people who supported Trump for president to not support his business.
Well guess what folks !!!
Hey! Enough about "the Chicago way" ... I'm from Chicago, and though it has its share of graft and greed, Camping World is based in Lincolnshire IL, an upper-class suburb 40 miles north of the city, not even in Cook County. You can call it "the Lincolnshire way" ;-)
Whatever mom and pop RV dealers are left, are about to BE GONE. The coming depression will have MAJOR consolidation or small dealers into the big corporations.
Walked into a camping world in florida to buy my 1st rv. New in 10 seconds I wasn't gona buybfrom them when I saw the amount of cubicles and people in suits conducting business through computers. I'm too poor to help anyone get rich. Bought used instead
A good friend worked for a camper sales place until Camping World bought them out. Now I know why he doesn't work there anymore. I'm pretty sure he could not swindle people for them like that but he never told me the why!
Today an RV isn’t worth it w campground prices.
The average consumer doesn't have a clue how purchasing contracts screw them without reading ALL the fine print and asking a lawyer to read the contract first.
I have had motorhomes and trailers and I barely ever use them so I have learned to think hard before buying again but now that I'm retired I might do so and you can bet I will be buying second-hand and paying cash don't borrow money from one of these things you might not even hardly ever use
It sounds like the best route you can take would be to either have the cash to pay for the camper up front and not the extra add on fluff or get a loan from somewhere else.
Still must scrutinize each and every line on the contract thoroughly, slowly, and watch as many of these videos about what services and add-on items that are commonly pushed by finance managers are truly needed, or that can be purchased separately yourself the next day from a dealer or company for much cheaper if you do want that add-on option. Plus always get pre-approved for the loan from at least 1 or 2 credit unions, or banks if you must, so you know the higher rate they will probably first offer you is due to their adding on extra profit for themselves in the form of a kickback from the bank they used to finance you. So ask them to beat the percentage rate your credit union pre-approved you at, and if they can't, then use your credit union to finance the rv, not the dealer's bank. Try to get the OUT THE DOOR line itemized contract with no extra add-ons you did not specifically request to be printed up and given to you to review overnight. Then you can more thoroughly review it without them breathing down your neck. Go watch the free educational videos about how to buy a car without getting screwed by dealers at CarEdge.com, as those lessons will be applicable when buying an rv also. Maybe one day they will expand and start to include rv reviews, pricing guides and dealer reviews as well as for traditional automobiles and dealers and manufacturers.
Makes me glad I bought a camper from a small local dealer that stands behind their products. 😮💨. So what if you walked into these places with a wad of cash and tried to buy? Would they even sell it to you?
An eye opening for sure.
payment.. yeah, when I was going to buy that B last year, they didn't mention the increase in cost, just the PAYMENT! interesting
I think they offered me a 20 year loan, too!
Payments, payments, payments...."are you getting sleepy"? Sign here please. Too many people are waking up with one helluva financial hangover.
@@TheRVWingman didn't really ever think about it until this video... I remember they adjusted the Payment a few times. If I wasn't sure canceling the deal was a good move, I am now.
Car loans didn't seem as bad, there was no change from the cost or the payments from the initial take it or leave it
Thanks for the update.
Thank you for posting this. Marcus has total disdain for middle America who make up the overwhelming majority of rv owners. Word is that he lives with a secret 🏳️🌈 🤫
You're most welcome. Not sure about any secret but I am pretty sure he's perfected strategies to separate consumers from as much money as possible in every transaction. While that business approach may work well for stock holders, the real cost/burden is on the consumer and will have a negative effect on future sales of RVs. Caveat emptor.
He sells way more RVs than any other dealer. He must be doing something right to have that many customers.
@@kensmart1976 that doesn’t mean he is doing something right. The masses usually don’t know what they are getting themselves into. McDonald’s serves billions so does that mean they are providing quality food?
Probably not allowed, maybe a list of dealers that screw over the buyers? Of all the things this government is focused on, maybe bad business actors should be one... Last thing, I noticed the MSRP is touted as the sell price to show a "savings", I guess it works if you always buy at MSRP...
One reason we set up our 24 hour voice mailbox is for RVers to call and share their experiences (both good and bad). We've got some doozies to play in the coming weeks.
When we started RVing we would go there to see everything and I always got a very creepy feeling with bad energy fr9m the staff as if they talk behind your back while you are still there. One time they tried to charge me 175.00 to look at my camera and tell me what was wrong with it...they could not tell me because they didn't try to diagnose it so I left and they called me to tell me I owed them money for something they did not do....spoke to manager and finally got it squared away...I feel better when we stay the heck away from C.W.
RV or Timeshare, the buyer knows what they're getting and at least for campers can see it. Its the buyers decisions as to buy or not. Never heard of a single dealer of either holding anyone at gunpoint. Neither is ever and investment.
I agree with what you say basically. I think the difference here is the lying & con artist tactics camping world uses. I purchased my RV from camping world in 2021. How I wish I'd seen something like the information presented here 1st. I was a new buyer, new to RVing, & they took advantage of me in every way possible.
Hi wing man the past rv shows that I been to no camping world gee I wonder way I live in Illinois when I go up to Wisconsin to visit my sister I drive by like 4 camping world stores when I look out my window I feel like yelling out my window no don't go there
I think that was a corporate strategy. Personally, I think they should get back IN the RV Shows. If I was a dealer in a show and talking with potential buyers, I would WANT them to go over to the CW area to visit. I'd encourage them to "listen with their gut" as well as their brain and be on the lookout for sleaze. Videos like this one may be nice/educational and a bit entertaining but when a customer can "feel the sleaze" it is far more powerful than any video. Thanks for watching!
Thanks wing man
Traveling I don't need a huge rv. I just need a bathroom bed and cooking/stoves. I buy my vehicles from private party. And I'm about to buy a 2014 jaco 20 footer. I will buy private party as well. buying new was $42,000.00. buying this one as a 2014 for $11,000.00. I'm sure I can enjoy this and sell it for with maybe $2,000.00 less.
I am sorry to say I have a friend who is a finance manager in the RV business.
He basically told me they do the same thing.
Camping World conned me in 2018, right now I'm upside down about $10,000. I'm going to have to sell it for $10,000 less than I owe. But I really don't have a choice. I made the mistake. I just don't know how or whom I can sell it to.
In 2018 I bought a Wolf Pup from Camping World, Nashville, and they tried to pull all the same stuff.
I had previously worked in sales for Mike Thompson in Orange County, California, and I knew about contracts.
I had them match another dealer's price. They tried all the same tricks, They also wanted twelve hundred dollars for a battery, to fill the propane and show me around the RV. No way. That wasn't going to happen.
I got the RV and got out of there with my shirt on my back..
I had good credit, and I paid less than ten percent.
In my year working for the other RV dealer, I had never seen them do any of these con man tactics.
Camping world had promised to do a few things on the RV that they never came through with. I did do some posting back a few years ago. About them and I will pass on this video with my story.
Whenever buying anything on credit, you should always check your interest for that loan $20,000 trailer a 15 year loan payment could cost you $45,000 if you don’t check these things
Explore USA tried to get me for a dealer prep of $5995 so I just gave up on new dealers and bought used and I got a nicer trailer for less and the seller didn't add anything for prep.
If you can't pay cash, you can't afford it. Put the payment aside each month for years and then buy without worry about making payments. If you can't do that before making a non-essential purchase you can't afford the payments.
Bought 1 RV at Camping World, never again--not in a billion years!!
Always buy from an individual,do your homework,save thousands
ALL of these desired, but unnecessary TOY'S,(when financed) can bite us on the bumper like a copperhead or a rattlesnake!!
O.K. The one guy was a dealer, but the guy that supposedly got ripped off was an actor. Get an itemized price list, true interest rate and the true out-the-door price before signing anything. Where are you going to park it? How much is insurance? What are the current rates for camping spaces? Price of gas? Maybe just forget the whole idea!
Shame on you Marcus L ,I am glad I saw this because I am looking for a RV.
Biggest kept secret!!!! How many motor homes have had people die in them!!!! I used to do " REPOS" ALL OF THE VERY NICE RIGS!!! HAVE HAD MORE THAN ONE COUPLE
DIE OF OLD AGE IN THEM !
I would never buy a camper from them but I have used their store and their prices are fair and some good sales periodically. I had them install a brake controller on my truck and they did a good job at a reasonable price.
I met a young man who was a camping world employee, in a smaller town, and he was very honest and helpful, and with their volume and variety he explained and shared a lot of information about brands and preferred finance options. Being older, we were skeptical about looking at newer and better equipped units, but with the help of a great finance team and local banks, our retirement plan became a reality. There are good people and as a high volume dealer, no one could come close to prices or financing options offered. Not all salespeople are bad, and the recently acquired dealership was determined to keep their good reputation. The man that took us through and explained everything was an eight year employee and very knowledgeable and professional.