Ikoria: Lair of Behemoths - Set Review | The Command Zone 329 | Magic: The Gathering Commander
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ก.ย. 2024
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Show Notes:
On this episode we go over all of the new non-legendary cards from Ikoria: Lair of Behemoths and discuss which ones we think will make the biggest splash in Commander.
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Ikoria: Lair of Behemoths card info:
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Anyone else binge watching all these podcasts in quarantine? Jimmy and Josh keeping me sane
Matty Knowles yep, rewatched all of them.
Yup. These guys are keeping my excitement pumped up.
One of the main channels I keep notifications on for
Of course, how else doea one stay sane
can't binge, my boss thinks, i'm essential...
"all the ultimatums are difficult to cast"
Laughs in jodah
For the low low cost of five mana you too can get 18 mana worth of cards!!!
@@MJBrown901 that's too much power!!!!
yo I ain't even think of jodah 😳
And chromatic lantern and dryad of ilysian grove. And basic fucking mana fixing.
Golos cast 3 of ultimatums and yawns
Hey jimmy and josh, you two have been one of the only things keeping me sane during quarantine and listening to old episodes of the podcast always makes me happy. Keep making awesome content. ❤️❤️
90
_Trampley_ tribal in the video: "- Idk, Surrak maybe?"
The minds of jankylords storming: *- Stonebrow time has finally come.*
M.L. W.L. Yes... It has...
*cackles in darkness*
Emergent Ultimatum pile:
Omniscience, Tooth and Nail, and Behold the Beyond. Only prerequisite is to have any 2 creature card infinite combo.
Other options include Omniscience, Enter the Infinite, and Expropriate. No prerequisites, just... Thassa's Oracle is overpowered (I guess you do have a prerequisite of "have a Lab Man/Thassa's Oracle/Jace Wielder of Mysteries still in your deck")
No.. A two card win con and a tutor
Jace, Omniscience, Enter the Infinite
The only problem with two card win con+tutor in general is that you may not have enough mana to make it happen immediately. Now, if you do have the extra mana to cast whichever part of the combo they don't give you... great. But it can be slightly more subtle than just any two card game winning combo and a tutor. Incidentally, that's kinda why I like Expropriate if you're doing the Thassa's Oracle win, because the only way you don't automatically win without going through a full turn cycle is if they give you Omniscience and Expropriate (Omniscience+Enter the Infinite=cast Thassa's Oracle or Jace and win; Enter the Infinite+Expropriate=cast Thassa's Oracle or Jace on the extra turn I get and win), but I feel like the odds of losing when I get a couple of extra turns and have an Omniscience are still pretty close to 100%. Anyway, even then, exactly what cards you choose should depend on the exact situation (I mean, if I have enough mana left after casting Ultimatum then I go ahead and grab a tutor and follow your plan), but the point is that Emergent Ultimatum can be constructed as "I win the game," and I think we all agree on that.
With my pile, you don't need extra mana, extra setup, and you don't need to wait. You win immediately with 7 mana.
If they don't give you Tooth and Nail, you get get Omniscience and Behold the Beyond. Go tutor your 2 card creature combo and any other card, then cast them for free since you have Omniscience. Win.
If they don't give you Omniscience, use the Behold the Beyond first to tutor for the two creatures and any other card, then use Tooth and Nail to put them on the battlefield for free. Win.
If they don't give you the Behold the Beyond, use Tooth and Nail to go find the 2 creatures, then cast them for free using Omniscience. Win.
Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and Triskelion are the creatures I've been using in my examples, but you can use any 2 creature combo.
Multiple Mothra's exist at the same time in her films, so she's not subject to legendary rule.
Genius!
This made me happy that it not being legendary makes sense,but now I'm sad knowing there will never be a legendary mothra.
I feel like Drannith Magistrate was designed for countering Companion cards not necessarily Commander cards
Your right
But also with Light up the stage, Escape, and Cast from the top of the library as well.
In any limited format yes but also works with commander.
If only they hadn't had to errata Companion so it happened to get around that restriction...
I am sooo exited for the next episode of Game Knights!
Sure thing! My favourite show in youtube, it’s like watching a good movie! I wish they will do it more often!
As am I!!
For sure!
will they have already recorded it? and if not how can they record it during quarantine
They recorded it like 8 months ago. I was thought that too
1:28:36 "but I have player removal"
*pulls out knife*
With vivien, I would minus 2 her and play a worldspine wurm, then tutor out for a impervious greatwurm.
Vivian the caller of ( WURMS)!!!!!...
My favorite play is God-Eternal Rhonas into Questing Beast when I already have a wide board.
Can't you cast Deadeye Navigator and then tutor up the Peregrine Drake and make infinite mana?
I have both of these in a deck so maybe I’ll actually use this, thank you good sir
Wurm tribal-someone should do it!
1:00:23 I did that! Tapped down a blocker with colossification, swung for lethal (the blocker had double-strike). It was pretty cool
I’m not exaggerating when I say in the past week I have watched over a hundred episodes of this show. Not kidding.
:o
Same!
Lol every second I’m not doing school work I’m watching old episodes of both your podcast, game knights, extra turns, well everything really. It’s keeping me sane. Keep up the awesome work! Looking forward to your next episode.
your actually insane dude
What else am I supposed to do? My schoolwork? Bah. I would much rather watch the Command zone in my room by myself with the door closed and the lights turned off.
I’ve been waiting for this! Time to grab some popcorn, a blanket, and my card collection to find great synergies and things to improve.
Edit: Oxford Comma
Honestly, the whole Luminous Broodmoth not being legendary thing bothers me so much. My friends and I are hopefully going to do a Godzilla commander game after the set release and I know I'm on board to overlook the legendary rule for a commander to let someone play Mothra.
Eerie ultimatum really emphasizes how good cyclonic rift is. Even giving everything haste isn't good enough if they got it lol
Ultimatums have there cost based upon how the wedge or shard is set up. The middle color is always the top point of the triangle. So for wedges its the shared enemy color and the shared ally color for shards. Great work as always though guys! Thank you so much for all the work you have been doing.
"11 Doubling Season"
Oh noes.
"Exponentially Growing Season"
@@Hornswroggle Sounds like an Un-set card
I’m surprised you didn’t mention doubling season with Ozolith. When the creature dies, those counters get doubled when put on ozolith. When ozolith moves them onto a creature they’re doubled again
It's one of those things that doesn't seem like it should work that way. Ozolith is meant to "move" the counters from the dead creature to a live one, like picking up the die off one and putting it in another, but the game defines that as two separate instances of creating new counters on a permanent while simultaneously destroying the old ones.
The mana design of each Ultimatum card is such that the non-adjacent color gets 3. You mentioned something about the costs with the Mardu one. Since white is not adjacent to black or red on the color wheel for those unaware (or look at the back of your magic cards), it gets 3 on the Mardu. Every one of them has this for this cycle.
actually, when you guys were talking about the ozolith, you were correct in saying that technically they are new counters of the exact same number and types as the creature that died. However... the wording there with “those” was entirely intentional so as to not imply that players had to put all new dice/glass beads/whatever on the ozolith. it was meant to imply that you CAN just use the exact same dice/glass beads/whatever and just slide them over to the ozolith (in most cases, a notable exception being skullbriar who actually doubles the counters)
Josh and Jimmy: Talking about Reconnaissance Mission
Deepfathom Skulker: Am I a joke to you?
But actually though
Dear Command zone team, even though you feel numb about making all this content, I still think you did a very good job of evaluating all the cards from C20 and Ikoria!
To the listener response: I think in hindsight the dual release was not the best way to do it. I think it would have been better to release the main set first and then commander set 2 weeks to a month later, because as Jimmy and Josh said it was a lot of content at once, with one crazy new mechanic and it would have been easier to on my mind and wallet if they were spaced out.
Also huge thank to Jimmy, Josh and the rest of the command zone team for putting all the content you did out, it's all content I can reference back to for updating or brewing new decks.
Important note quartzstone crasher is for each opponent, so if you trample to 2 opponents you get 2 tokens each with x/x for trample to that player, so 3 dmg to one player and 5 to another create 2 tokens, one as a 5/5 and another as a 3/3
The manache and blaglakle section had me in stitches. Please never stop the menache.
Jimmy and Josh intro > The command zone intro.
Instant thumbs up!
Little trick: you can populate land tokens created by mythos of illuna.
More lands!!!!!!!
@@xiawangphipps3327 can't populate noncreature
When they started talking about Crystal Shard and Voracious Greatshark, I began thinking about the times that I have a Chulane, Teller of Tales on the battlefield and a Mystic Snake in hand and a lot of mana. Sometimes it even happens with a Biomancer's Familiar. So fun.
Will people stop asking about game knights? Jimmy and Josh still have problems to deal with too
Coastal Piracy is an Uncommon from Mercadian Masques, also reprinted at Rare in 8th Edition-now Reconnaissance Mission(with cycling bonus). Also. Slight messup at 1:57:14-19 "Toothy Imaginary Fiend"=it should be fRiend. Great video. Thanks.
20:22 I love Morality Shift so much. It's my favourite "oops I win" button in my Syr Konrad deck as it pings everyone for ~50 damage depending on the current state of my library and graveyard and how many creatures are in hand.
One really strong card I think you missed is Slitherwisp, it's UBB for a 3/2 Elemental Nightmare with Flash, and it says "Whenever you cast another spell that has flash, you draw a card and each opponent loses 1 life"
So its card draw, damages your opponents, reasonably cheap, has flash itself. Seems super good for a flash deck.
The argumentations are wild sometimes.
With one card they'll be like
"You cast this 4-mana sorcery on your turn and then you have no mana and your shields are down"
and then the next card it's
"This 7-mana enchantment works great with this 5-mana sorcery because you can cast them on the same turn" smh
Kinekamaru it depends on the effect. 4 cmc spells often aren’t game-winning or must-answers. Eerie ultimatum at 7 cmc needs a board wipe, and if you’re filling your yard with things that make your board indestructible, the list of useful wipes becomes very narrow. Context is key, and the comparisons aren’t 1 to 1.
@@chrisstropki280 Yea, I was using hyperbole.
My current example was about Mythos of Vadrok and how JLK deemed it worse because it's sorcery speed and then later they talked about how Chandra's Ignition is good with Colossification and can even be played on the same turn.
I know that what I said isn't universally applicable, I just sometimes disagree with how different they treat cards when they try to show one card's strengths vs. when they seem not to like a card and show why it's worse than other alternatives ^^
Kinekamaru gotcha. And yeah, mythos vs ignition + colossification is a better example of incongruences in power rating. I see what you meanZ
A cute cheat to Emergent Ultimatum is to include Demonic Tutor in it, then you can tutor up the card they put away. So your pile could be:
- Omniscience
- Expropriate
- Demonic Tutor
If they go Omniscience + Expropriate, you should win the game. If they go Omniscience + Demonic Tutor, you tutor Expropriate back up and win. If they go Expropriate + Demonic Tutor, you tutor up Omniscience and cast it during Expropriate's extra turn after stealing the opponent's lands with Expropriate.
In the beginning of magic, the idea was that no one would know all the different magic cards and there would be no widely available lists for each set. That way it would be a mysterious game everytime you sat down to play. WotC has recaptured that by printing so many sets and cards at the same time that no one can keep track or remember them all.
You 2 sure have been busy with all these releases. Thanks for all the content and information guy. You rock!
With escape protocol and basalt monolith you could cycle for 1 or 2 mana, pay the 1 to blink basalt and tap it for 3 more to cycle and continue the process
5:04 topic starts
Ty!
DecrepitFlunky not all heroes wear capes. thank you.
Missed a big part of Mythos of Iluna
It copies any permanent, meaning opponents stuff too.
I think they mentioned that in terms of it being just a removal spell. I thought they meant in terms of copying an opponent's creature then having it fight itself.
They did not miss that
As a primarily 1 v 1 constructed player its funny to hear you guys talk about Shark Typhoon. In pretty much every other form of Magic the cycling is the primary mode and casting it as an enchantment is the niche case.
My favourite combo with Titan’s Nest is something Mnemonic Betrayal or Gonti, where you can use any type of mana to cast the cards you steal
They finally made mythics feel like mythics again in this set! I’m so happy *sheds tear*
Fun facto: with Vivien, Monster's Advocate you can get Kiki combos without using Temur. If you're straight Gruul you can use Hyrax Tower Scout, if you're in Naya you can get Felidar Guardian, Village Bell-Ringer or Restoration Angel (Zealous Conscripts are too big)
I think the prof made a great point, the flavor of every commander being from ikoria impacted the feel and made it blend together but also you guys mentioned seemed like sensory overload almost.
Emergent Ultimatum doesn't say may be cast these cards until end of turn. In other words, they can be cast on another players turn if the exiled cards can be cast at instant speed, or they can be cast on a later turn.
The intro: Greeting humans, you are... should probably be "Greetings Planeswalkers, you are...
Also if we have "entered the Command Zone" did we just die?
@@EloquentTroll Yes, but it was planned...
22:18 THIS card's so mana intensive, they cannot even say the cost correclty. haha.
"Black black, green green, blue blue."
Love you guys.
1:50:14 This is even better than it sounds because there are creatures that threaten other creatures as activated abilities, so Fiend Artisan can get the other combo piece.
Great episode! Kinda surprised you mentioned Cunning Nightbonder but not Slitherwisp. Discounting all your flash spells is nice, but I feel like making them all cantrip _and_ ping each opponent is even better. Though I get that, with the timestamp already well over 2 hours, some things had to get cut.
On Bonder’s Enclave- I agree that the ability at 4 mana does hurt Monowhite, but I believe it’s not because white doesn’t have enough density of things with 4+ power. A lot of monowhite commanders fulfill the condition, and those commanders also often are part of the strategy, I mean you don’t run just any white commander “for the color”. 4 mana does put this in top deck range, where monowhite will often be fine taking a turn off drawing a card than taking a turn off to draw a land. Sun Titan is a staple that shows up, voltron/equipment strategies will push more creatures into the threshold for it, Divine Visitation turns all those tokens into a good time and sees lots of play, or even in token strategies that have anthem effects this will do well. Theoretically tribal strategies have a shot at this since a lot of tribal pay offs are anthem effects. Green loves this because it has mana and creatures accidentally, but I’m not sure green decks jam this in as much when it’s 4 mana. But what if it was 3? Or what if it was 2?! Either way you’d see Bonders Enclave in a significant amount of white, but also nonwhite decks. As much as it’d help white, it wouldn’t feel like catching up. But also can monowhite give up a utility land slot for something like this? Since a lot of monowhite ramp cares about plains specifically, there needs to be a careful balance of any non basics. Is it fair to say monowhite should care about it’s utility land slots more, since it is considered the weakest color in EDH and therefore has the most to gain from utility lands? So does this even make the cut now? What about boros, is it better? I think this wasn’t designed as a bone thrown for white, but rather for strategies that overlap higher power In any color for a budget. It’s a solid upgrade card If you haven’t put much thought into nonbasics for real cheap.
Mostly what I like about Crashing Drawbridge is that, in Brawl, it’s Etrata’s only haste enabler (she can have a few flash effects, but sometimes you specifically need haste), and the multiple-creature haste works amazingly with Spark Double (the surprise extra hit counter is SO big). Generally Swiftfoot Boots are prolly better when you have the option, though
an uncommon I'm looking forward to is Ominous seas. Most cards like this either sacrifice themselves, or remove all the counters when you activate it. None of those restrictions here, meaning you can continue to create krakens, and you don't have to go all in so you have board wipe recovery, plus you can create them at instant speed.
also, it comes out the turn before a wheel effect (around 8 cards drawn for that turn), perfect curve going there.
Jimmy and Josh sing a line. Scroll Scroll. Continues singing
Hey, do you know if the Ikoria game knights episode will come out? Like with Covid?
I thought it was today to, LOL
I believe i saw that it was gonna be on Friday.
I heard that they already recorded it, they're probably waiting for wizards to allow them to post it, or maybe they're doing all the post-production
I believe it is coming soon
Murilo Kappes TBH tho
Esseeayen Maybe I heard may 11th but I am probably wrong
For menace tribal you missed Sonorous Howlbonder, which makes it so your menace creatures can't be blocked except by 3 or more creatures.
Mythos of brokkos with the incarnations that like to be in the graveyard.
I actually agree with you Jimmy that the crystals have names that sound like they belong in the wedge. Maybe Josh is just a bad guesser haha
49:30 Don't worry Jimmy, I'm with you - something about the names fits the colors well!
Yay! Command Zone helps make me feel happy!
I want to respond to the final question. I think my biggest issue with the double release that for people who are on a tighter budget it really sucks. I really wanted buy the decks and the set but because I had to wait on one or the other one inevitably got more expensive and I couldn't do all the preorders I may have wanted. Really stressful on the budget players.
"I don't feel like they really needed it." I mean... At the end of the day this set was constructed with sealed primarily in mind, not EDH.
Morality Shift is an instant win for Syr Konrad ;) As long as you have Ulamog or Kozilek in the library, the graveyard will get reshuffled into your library :)
You know personally I think that it’s safe to say based upon the ultimatums to begin with, out of all of the three color combination options, some of the absolute strongest ones have golgari in them (abzan, sultai, and jund)
Now that you guys put the realease date made me think. As a exclusively EDH player, i used to really pay attention to the EDH related product, but, with both coming out (standard and EDH) makes kinda hard to really pay attention to the possibilities of the cards, because there are to much to see. I still like it in the matters of creating commanders to the set mechanics, but, since the mechanics are complex (mutate and counters) i think it make hard to us, EDH players to really evaluate correctly what we want to buy because we are not totally sure how things so unique are gonna play.
I was so surprised that Jimmy didn't account for colossification synergy with dreadhorde butcher with fling. 21 from fling, 21 from butcher, 21 if you can get the hit connected. That's 63!
I didnt expect to get my cards from Card Kingdom until the 15th or after, but I actually got them on the 4th 😏😎 The force was with me.
From a Listener:
I think tying the Commander precons to a set release is a pretty clever move from Wizards to get us Commander players more interested in the new sets.
I liked the idea of having the precons tied to the new sets as a player too, because they seem like a better product to go alongside the set than the Planeswalker decks to me. Looking forward to, and hoping that it will be more like what they're planning to do around the new Zendikar set etc into future.
I'm planning to put Luminous Broodmoth and Bastion of Remembrance into my Aristocrats deck, but Nethroi's mutate ability is the one that had me the most excited.
There are a lot of cards in the set that seem pretty powerful in the right decks, but in terms of generically powerful, I think Kinnan probably has to be up there.
But if you're doing Abzan aristocrats, Eerie Ultimatum is insane.
My favorite emergent ultimatum pile Is swarm intelligence+ time stretch+expropriate.
The "if this was spent" is a conditional statement in the reminder text, not rhs rules text....its not an activation or cost for the mythos cards so it doesnt affect the mana identity....
that ozolith is looking REALLY nice for my varolz scavenger deck
Ruinous Ultimatum is certainly going in my Kaalia deck :)
If you use Lukka with Aminatou you could find out what is on top then you can play it if that is how it works.
I agree that releasing a large commander set alongside a main set is absolutely overwhelming. I'm excited for new cards, but it feels like there's way too much at once. A ton of new products coming out makes me worried I'm not going to be able to play with all of it sufficiently.
I feel like either one or two fewer commander decks (or just a separation of their release dates by a month or two) would help to rectify this, similar to the sets planned later this year that will launch with only two commander decks each. With that method, if they make three main sets a year we'd still be getting six commander decks, which is two more than we'd have been getting under the previous method of four per year each August. More commander-centric products, but spaced out so that the players/consumers don't suffer from burnout.
I feel like the Jeskai Ult. Should have had storm or something along those lines. Or rebound maybe.
Or maybe it should have created a 5/5 token so that it could literally be the Hearthstone card it ripped off
Just making it all 7s would have been fine.
@@StretchyPlays I agree with this
For proud wildbonder combine that with aggressive mammoth and all your creatures are basicly unblockable but still take damage
Jimmy i guessed the colours from the names! You aint alone
Lukka is definitely going in my mogis deck. Getting to raving dead or master of cruelties is a necessity.
Hey guys,
I wanna say I’m really excited for this next game knights using the new commanders.
Specifically I wanna see Kathril, Aspect Warper in action. I’ve noticed when you did a review of that commander deck you picked another card to be the ideal commander for that deck but I wanna see Kathril, Aspect Warper as the commander very badly as the commander. Doesn’t mean you can’t use the other one later which in fact I would love but I just wanna see a good game involving this guy specifically.
Thanks for listening.
Creo
I think the word “numb” was perfect. I wish they tiered the releases. I’ve watched all of your videos, and I can”t remember a lot of the cards even though I saw them several times. You guys worked hard, and I’m grateful. Now hopefully you guys can get a break.
We really lucked out that Command Zone came out with so much content right when having to be shut in. I mean, so much about it has been unfortunate, but a small but very cherished bright spot has been seeing the guys talk shop so much over the past weeks. They deserve the rest but I'm gonna miss seeing them so much.
I'm planning on putting Narset and Shark Typhoon into my Narset Enlightened Master deck.
Really surprised that Narset the creature wasn't mentioned.
Obosh is one way the cat oven shenanigans can be built in standard with things like mayhem devil and knight of the ebon legion adding to the aggro plan
I can't stress enough how much your videos have impacted how I build my decks 😂👌
Library of Leng just discard to the top of your library so you can get the cards back so song of creation kicks ass
Titan's Nest can only be used to cast spells, so it can't be used to pay for madness, taxes, activated abilities, etc.
I'm excited to get my hands on this set. Already got me a booster ordered and pre orders 3 of the precon decks
Colossification. Thank you for giving me the idea to throw this in my Hapatra deck that I'm building.
I also order the Ozolith for this deck the moment I could
I’ve been playing menace tribal on arena and it’s a lot of fun, and actually does fairly well. There is also a card that means menace creatures have to be blocked by three creatures (sonorous howlbonder)
I don't know if anyone else has mentioned this, but here's something for Colossification:
Arcanum Wings.
You're all welcome
I cast hydra's growth and colossification on charmed stray. Basic but so fun. The life gain was hilarious. I purposely didn't put any trample on it just so I could use it to gain life off chump blockers
Divergent references in 2020 - file that under things I did not expect.
In the Sultai enchantment Titan's Nest, the mana can only be spent to cast colored spells. This means no Eldrazi Titans (yay) and no abilities and no artifacts unless colored.
Love that you guys had fun with the key words
bag of holding shenanigans with song of creation sound fun
Everyone always forgets Ranger's Path :-( The only difference between it and Skyshroud is the lands enter tapped, so I would put it above Circuitous, Explosive, and Migration Path
I built a deck in Arena around copying Genesis Ultimatum to flood the board with goodness...It's a bit expensive to make it go off, so it doesn't win much, but it's fun.
You (Thwart the Enemy) vs. the guy she tells you not to worry about (Obscuring Haze).
Lukka would be great in a Purphoros, Bronze-Blooded commander deck. Sneak Attack in a massive creature, then either pre or post combat, minus Lukka to get an even bigger creature out that doesn't die at the end of the turn.
I've been a fan since Tarkir, gotten back into magic since the big shut-in. i'm so glad to se that you guys are still going strong
Inspired ultimatum is pretty good in standard tho