would like to see the two of you work together!!!! This is a good match all around , Engine, Truck, and two guys I follow on you tube working together!!!!
Plenty of great info available on these engines. They are pretty easy to build. I have done several 2 stroke Detroit’s and 3406 Cats. The Detroit is simple and you will have zero problems building this.
I like the idea of the old Jimmy, since they came with a Dee-troit in them most of the time. The old time drivers around here always joked that the motors were Dee-troit. Detroit is a city in Michigan. The humor of those old guys was always good. They also said that the Dee-troit motors didn't leak oil, they were marking their territory. There sure was lots of bs thrown around among those old drivers about their truck and engine choices. I miss those old guys. They were good teachers of the profession.
Ol2stroker almost only works with the two stroke Detroit’s he legitimately has a tattoo of the logo and has multiple trucks with em such as a 359 and a 362 cab over I believe with the v12 in it I’m sure his videos would be educational for u as he does very in depth videos on freeing injectors etc I highly recommend watching his videos especially working on project mossybroke the 359.
Brockway conventional. There is a couple of dirt haulers out on Long island NY that still use them. Brockway and Detroit perfect match. There is a couple of examples of 12 V 71 Brockway on TH-cam even a cabover...watching for shop vids brings back memories. I started with a 1962 B 61 back in 1980. Also had a 1980 Astro with a 350 Cummins that I did a brake job on. Funny I through the brake drums in the back seat of my Lincoln to get turned at a shop, man did that turn some heads... All the Best, thanks for the detail.
Great Video! Greyhound actually did use a 12V71N in the MCI MC-6. It was the first 102 inch wide coach in North America in the late 60s. But they were rare as most states didn't allow them. I love all buses, trucks, and all diesel engines, but I will always be a Detroit man at heart! Thanks for another great video! How about putting it in a Chevrolet Bison or GMC General?
I drove a couple of boats with 8V/71s and they are awesome, you are correct about their versatile configuration. Any military personell should be able to help and Detroit should have good archives of these engines. I think I may be going out on a limb, but a FWD engine, twin steer, bogie drive Kenny with a tilt tray (also know as roll back) and large knuckle boom crane would get some views, throw on a lazy axle and you can carry some weight. Good presentation and just my 2C worth.
Hello Sir, I just subscribed to your channel and looking forward to this Detroit build. A cab over or conventional would both be cool. But like your friend or son was saying - I agree that a conventional would show the engine off easier. Great video!!! 😀
R mack with a dog house on the back....that would be awesome or 359...either way it's gonna be sick...and be sure to get the chrome valve covers on it they always look great on them
About the accessory drive. The rear accessory drive setup was generally only used in cabover applications. Conventionals used the standard front drive setup.
I can't tell what to put it in,but as a young boy growing up in the Yukon a mining company called Cassiar Asbestos had a small fleet of 9 International Transtar 4300's that were powered by 12v71's,15 speeds and pulled B trains at 126,000 lbs.I always loved those trucks and the sound of 12v71 at full song
The first truck application was a livestock hauler from Kansas who put it in a Pete cabover. Detroit's leak oil, when they quit leaking oil then you worry. Because it's out. The v12 was offered in the GMC Astro and the Chevrolet Titan 90
Extended hood truck is perfect for the swap they are what they came in the parts are exchange easy to move parts water pumps up fr0nt mack super liner and rsl 700 are easy fit for that motor i drove a 68 petebuilt 12v71 with a 5x4 trans set up
I like the idea of putting it in a conventional, a Peter built, they do go well in a White Road Boss, as I have one with a 18 speed Road Ranger behind it.
If that 12V71 is from a Terex, my guess is that it's likely from a late-'60-early-70's- vintage S-24 model scraper. If so, the engine in naturally exasperated form was rated at 423 hp at 2100 rpm. That would also explain why the engine has a flywheel setup for an automatic transmission.That 423 hp rating is extremely moderate, if not low even for a 12V71. With appropriate mods - ie - lower compression 'turbo-spec' pistons, a pair of 6 or 8-71 turbos, bypass-type blowers in place of the n.a ones,, an air-to-air intercooler before the blowers in addition to the factory aftercooler below the blowers, bigger injectors, and a pair of high-output marine camshafts would give an easy and still dead reliable 600 or so hp at the ground at 2100 rpm and about 2200-plus ft/lbs of torque at about 1400 rpm. I know this, because these the exact mods and specs that were done to the12V71 powered long-haul freight and produce hauler that I drove for a while back in 1987. That engine by the way - swapped into an '80 Freightliner FLC120 - was originally a 12VTTAC genset engine, modded and converted to truck use. You can see the specs, including the engine specs for the S-24 scrapers here contractormag.co.nz/classic-machines/terex-s-24/ Hope some if this helps.
I was in marine engine side of things. The 12V71 TI Were typically at the setting of 675 hp at 2300 rpm. They were routinely turned up to 1000 hp so I’m at 2300 RPMs and some even did it at 2500. The rods were the weak link to go above that setting . Getting 600 horse out of one is pretty easy
@@jonnycash6909 I agree with you totally about the hp of some of the marine-spec 12V71s. In a truck application, producing 600 hp at the ground - again, not a big deal for a well built, lightly modded single or twin turbocharged 12V71 - means the engine is actually producing somewhere between 700 and 725 hp at the flywheel. That was huge power for a working OTR truck back in the day, and is still pretty impressive today.
Theres really only one answer to the question. You need to check the for sales for a GMC General. A Marmon, Brockway, Hayes, anything not run of the mill. KW's and Petes have been done to death, id probably still watch though.
Titan 90, or Bison would be cooler. Much rarer than Generals and Astros. I saw 2 of the bisons with sleepers sell at auction in Minnesota a while back. If he could find one of those, it would be very cool.
@@4321grp.... the 12 would be an Extremely tight / hard fit under that hood... he would have more clearance problems than you can imagine.... Not a good swap candidate.
In my opinion, try to find a needle nose butterfly, and then slap on also a mercury sleeper. That would be epic for views. But for me, I must say, that it doesn’t matter what you build, I like the content.
To bad I was thinking Freightliner with the old aluminum hood. I thought it might be easier to stretch the hood to fit. My next choice would be KW A model
in school we swapped one into a butterfly Pete, we had to stretch the hood and push the cap back to make it fit, the instructor was going to use it to tow his fifth wheel when he retired, don't know what happened with it, it was in the body shop when i finished the program. sadly when the diesel and body shop instructors retired both programs ended
if it were me i would try to find an old gmc general to throw that in. I drove a general for a farming outfit and it was an awsome ride. the truck was a 1978 model. had a 13 speed eaton fuller in it but the engine i believe was a cummings. they ran biodiesel in it. perhaps an autocar or yeah a good old fashon mack truck. i must admit though it was Orwell that caught my attention for your channels. extremely entertaining stuff for a cabover enthusiast.
The sound of these is the thing for me. It’ll sound good in either type truck, but like you said, it’ll be easier to show it off in a conventional truck.
The country life channel, he has some videos, with a friend of his who is very proficient with the 2 stroke Detroit's. One video the fire up his old drag racing semi, 12v Detroit powered I believe. I also don't care cabover or conventional. Just make it 80s or older
I would love to see another Peterbilt cabover, but I understand the desire to want to easily be able to show off that 12V71 too. But I’ll continue watching no matter what you decide to do.
HEY....................... I'M COOL WITH WHATEVER YOU CHOOSE...... I LOVE THE CONTENT; I FIRST CAUGHT YOU WHEN YOU WERE REBUILDING ORWELL'S ENGINE.... WAS SO IMPRESSED I STAYED..... ALSO YOU HELPED ME REBUILD MY CAT (C12; 455) IN THAT I'M GRATEFUL.......... SHE RUNNING STRONG STILL....SO DO YOUR THING........... A 12V71 WILL BE AWESOME TO SEE .... START TO FINISH...... ROLL UP YOUR SLEEVES MATT ...... LOL... BSAFE
Steve, make sure the truck that you want to get for this engine is already plumbed & wired for a Detroit 2 stroke. If this engine came out of a Terex,most likely it's from a dump, loader, or a scraper with an Allison behind it. The turbo engines have a bypass valve set up. For a con- ventional truck, you have your choices. Besides a KW or a Pete, how about a White Western Star, I-H Transtar 4300, Mack Western R- 700 model, Marmon or a Brockway with the Sheller- Globe R cab.Just make sure it's already set up for that 12V two stroke to avoid issues & more money.
P.S. Steve get in touch w/ Scott at Bus Grease Monkey as he's been repair- ing and fixing these engines for many of his coach clients. He also worked on one of the old MCI coaches that were made for the Grey- hound Corp. for Canada.It had a 12V- 71 in it. Scott and his son Tyler are excellent at the work they do.
Gregory Scott, Being as I worked as a mechanic in a GMC Truck dealership, I agree wholeheartedly. I remember when those Generals were new, they were beautiful trucks.
I'm a little late to the party, but figured I'd let you know that my vote is for a cabover! I personally first found and subscribed to your channel while looking for videos featuring cabover trucks, so I can't get enough of them! I think a Kenworth K100 Aerodyne would be sweet with that 12v71 in it. Good luck with whatever you decide! Edit: If you're considering a heavy haul build, I certainly haven't seen many (if any) tri-drive cabovers in the U.S. Maybe build an old school U.S. version of the 8x6 K200s they sell in Australia. That would be even sweeter!
1987, OSU Tech, Okmugee, OK, sememer 1, Tear and rebuild 3-71 Detroit Diesel. 50 engine +/-, all 3-71 Detroit Diesel! Four WW11 Higgins boats, 8-92, 16V-71, etc. WW11 engine, (Gray Marine), governor idle to fast, hand more up, "Battle". COOL!!!
We had a 30 ton crane with inline 6 had cracked sleeves and it still ran would only go about 5 mph and first off you can't put a turbo on these unless you change the pistons.
When you had the airbox covers open, I noticed that your rings looked like they're in good shape, even the fire ring (top ring) is in good shape. The way to inspect a Detroit's rings is to see if the groove in the center of the ring is still there. If it still has that groove in it, That means there's not much wear on the ring. Also if an engine has a lot of hours on it, many times the fire ring will be broken up with pieces in the airbox cover. You may not need to overhaul your engine. Your engine looks like it's an industrial engine instead of a highway vehicle engine. The pulleys on the front of the engine are normal, they're supposed to be located where they are. The accessory drive pads on the rear of the engine can have pulleys mounted there as needed. The flywheel housing looks like an industrial housing and therefore the mounts probably won't be right for a truck, also the flywheel may not be right for a truck. That crack in the block needs to be repaired by brazing it. Like you said, it would help to have an old truck engine for parts..
4321grp..... The Model No. 7123-7030..... with the "3" in the first group denoting that, yes... it is an Industrial F/F (Fan to Flywheel) engine. Depending on what exactly it was used in or on.... he may have to change out the governor, as it "may" be equipped with a Variable Speed..... and will need a SWLS instead (Single Weight Limiting Speed).
I love the idea of building a heavy haul truck with it. If it’s more for show, I think something rare would be awesome (such as a Marmon, White, ect). If you’re going to actually use the truck for heavy haul, I would go the Paccar route or something where parts are more readily available. The Mack Superliner would be a good bet too. Whatever you decided to do though, I bet it will be worth watching!
If you're gonna use it for heavy haul you'll need to blow it, 80-85 cc high pressure injectors, then there's the transmission story I'd advise a 15 speed Fuller roadranger, to handle all that I'd advise 44 rocks !!! The conventional would show it off more at a show but the intake and exhaust system would be simpler on a coe not easy to pin that one down is it. Take care.
They originally put a data plate on the valve cover that told you the build,whether it was an Industrial,marine or OTR. The type of flywheel housing,pulleys and governor is going to be an issue if you want to put it in OTR truck
I knew a guy that had a 12v71 in a cab over day cab gmc Astro , I thought it also had twin turbos on it also. I could be wrong , it’s been 30+ years ago. He hauled bricketts in double dump Michigan trains with it.
There is a bonneted Mack 700 also But whatever you decide it needs to work for you unless just for show? You do a lot of Oshkosh work so maybe something from them or they might suggest something maybe even scale a chassis down if too much for your needs/economy but if hauling 4 axle plus units need something more substantial on Heavy/Over size Hauling
Have a look down under here in New Zealand and Aus we have a lot of 4 axil cab over rigs even brand new Kenworths otherwise pick a brand that hasn't been over done
it’d be cool to see it in an old gmc general you might need to lengthen the hood a lil or buy a long hood but it would be cool to see it in one of those, that was what i was planning on doing with my truck before i got looking to much and found out my truck was completely screwed. also i know quite a bit about detroits and i know how to get the engine the info from the model number such as application and variations as long as it’s original.
the man you want to talk to about the v-12 is tom price -price trucking beacon street buffalo, n.y. that is if he is still around he had several tractors years ago hauling steel out of bethlehem in lackawana,n.y. he had a few good drivers working for him , i seen the back in over to bethelhem and put three 40,ooo pound loads onthe deck at the very least . they pulled heavy 3 axle cover wagons mostly to NYC he had these v-12 pumped up and they sure could haul the mail. I always ran a 1693 cat and would put sixty or seventy thousand on a five axle outfit and it was all i wanted to run with these guys.
I would go with a conventional w900a or a superliner that would be sweet either way i love watching your videos so whatever you do decide i know its going to cool
I'm interested in what each individual guy is doing out there in the world - that's why I watch different videos and channels. Since you're asking, I say buy and build the truck YOU want. It will probably be more interesting in the long run.
I'm a big fan of the old-school Detroit Diesel engines. Would you please create a playlist of all the Detroit Diesel videos you have to make finding and watching them easy?
Kenworth c500 prime mover unless you want to make money with it then a wide grill cab over. A lot of the cab overs with 12v had the monster grill to get a big enough cooling package
Steve what would be real rare if you can find one that's for sale is the longhorn DODGE conventional put it in that with a true 5 an 4 transmissions and put a mercury sleeper on it or the DODGE cabover would be rare there's a guy that's working on one of those with a box bed on it I think his channel is cm. works maybe wrong on that but either of these is definitely the rare of the trucking world but that's my picks but your the one that's gonna be driving it and working it so you build what fits your needs that's the important thing about this is a user friendly truck so stay safe and keep the video's coming
I put an industrial 12v71 similar to yours in a Peterbilt chassis with a 1934 Ford cab on it. Lots of work. Find a truck engine. Your engine has oil pump mounted in the base that makes the engine tall. You need to get an oil pump that runs off th front of the crank. This will require a hunt for an oil pan. I took 2 and made one. You need donor engines. 12v71 series did not use bypass blowers when turbocharged. They all have pulleys on the front. You will need a flywheel from any v71. I would check for stuck injectors then start that before you overhaul it. Make sure it is correct rotation. Looks like the correct governor must have been in a rock truck.
The availability of a Western Star or a Mack Western set up for your American Honda motor are very possible in the eastern part of the country or maybe resting in Wyoming, Colorado or any ole oil patch in the Rockies. Stuffing that motor in a older large car is a hell of an ambitious plan, but remember it is the reliability of the rest of the drivetrain that matters. Detroit's love cool air and cool water temps. Your radiator has to be able to take in fresh air and its capacity must meet the needs of hills of West Virginia when grossing #120,000. That motor deserves either a 13 double overdrive or a 6x4 twin stick. Tall rubber with gearing to hit 90 mph across the flatlands of Iowa. As you know, a fresh motor does not react kindly with million mile rear ends or a stock clutch. Building a 4 axle with that powerplant is admittedly a awesome path, but break down in Parsippany, NJ, and who is going to give you any sound roadside service on that motor? Hell, Cat parts will break the bank for most people. Sticking a small block in a Vega is one thing, sticking the Detroit in a 1975 Kenworth W900 is another. Probably much easier to piece together the 75 W900. Look for a 1969 GMC 9500 Long Hood and build a Sunday driver.
FSC..... I just found your videos, and watched your video where you found the crack & bulge on the right rear of the block and were also inquiring about the Serial & Model numbers.... I just responded to those questions for you (7.28.2021), along with some other info / suggestions. One thing that I forgot to bring up in my response to that other video, was.... Why or Who, bypassed the Oil Cooler on the Front Right side (as Factory Viewed from the Rear of the block), with a braided stainless steel "looped" hose connection?? There is a very good reason why they go through the expense and time to design and build oil coolers for these (and other) diesel engines, and it's not just to add more parts. By the way, those pulley's at the Front of the engine... are right where they need to be. Any accessories mounted on the back end, are either "direct drive" (bolted directly to the housing), or... pulley's added to drive whatever... all depends on the set up for any particular application... Automotive, Marine, Genset or Industrial in its numerous forms. I think, personally... whoever sold it to you, sold you a "bill of goods".... I hope it was really Cheap. By the way, the Engine Rotation on these engines, and for correctly sourcing parts... is Always, as viewed from the FRONT of the engine.... however the Starter and Oil Cooler(s) are Always "as viewed", from the REAR of the engine for proper engine arrangements and part numbers.... and that is how this info is dictated from Detroit Diesel in the shop manuals..... which, may I suggest... you might want to seriously consider obtaining for your engine, if you don't have one already.... as well as some of the Specialty Tools that you will need for this engine... and any other Series 71 you might obtain in the future. As far as Excellent Detroit Diesel sources.. I have a list of every "Reputable" (Independent & Factory Authorized) Detroit Diesel Re-manufacturer, Re-builder and Parts distributor in the continental US, Canada, Mexico and South America, as well as most of Europe, Asia and Africa. Two of the best in the US with outstanding reputations is... 1) PCI - PC Industries, in Afton, Wyoming.... and 2) Stewart & Stevenson Inc... the Largest Detroit Diesel Distributor in the world. S&S was to DD, as was Carroll Shelby to Ford.... before DD's ownership went to Germany. Any customer specific set-up orders with the 2 cycles, was Designed, engineered and built "in house" at S&S, for DD.... and one that was memorable to myself, back in the mid 1980s was some custom built 32-71's!!.... that were built by them for oil field use in Saudi Arabia. They also custom built new cylinder heads for some Vertical 12-71's that were set up to run as dual fuel engines... diesel and LNG, so they redesigned & built new heads with spark plugs And injectors. They sounded just as "sweet" on LNG as they did on diesel. You mentioned joining two 12-71's.... DD did produce 24-71's at the factory, for marine use, but only a small number were built (850+/-) between 1994 and 1997, which was the final year of production for the 2 cycles..... for "public consumption".... they continued building new 6-53TA's, 8-71TA's and 8-92TA's under contract for the government and numerous allied & US military applications... into the 20teens, except for the 8-71TA which was dropped sometime after 2008. To be honest... Currently, I think PC Industries (PCI) is handling more of the 2 cycles, than S&S is... they're more focused on the MTU / Detroit Diesel side of things on a regular basis, plus a good number of their 2 cycle people have retired now... but they certainly still deal with parts, etc. Please read my Serial & Model ID numbers explanation in the other video I mentioned above. Also, keep in mind that there are multiple variants of mechanical governors of the Series 71 engines.... if you're going to put that engine in a truck.... make sure that you have the SWLS - Single Weight LIMITING Speed governor. If you really want to do something Really Different with Detroit power for a truck.... find a 6-110T.... a really tremendous and Reliable engine that can rival the hp and torque of the 12... and have better lugging power (ability to "hold" the torque on grades) due to its longer stroke and higher piston speed (per rpm), and longer "Usable" power stroke travel. The 6-110's were massively "over-built" on the bottom end, and I know that GMD had them in their test cells putting out well over 730hp under load, back in 1962. I think a 6-110T/TA in a "Crackerbox" with sleeper (pre-Astro/Bison), or a COE (w/sleeper cab) Emeryville (IH), would be "classic". But, as you said that you might want to use whatever you build for Heavy haul... the frame rails and suspension on those earlier 1960s trucks that I mentioned would be too light for that work. There is a guy from ID (??)... that has a big bunk COE / 352 Pete (110" cab) with a 16-92TA, that he uses for short (mostly in-state) heavy haul, ... but rarely, and only when it's "nice" out... weather wise. I believe he running an HD-750 Allison behind it, if I remember right... could be mistaken... been quite a while since I seen it last. He also has an extended hood "A" model KW with a KTA Cummins under the hood, with sticks, that he runs quite a bit. Also, in reference to changing the blowers in light of turbocharging (single or twin).... there are Two types of "bypass" blowers (and drive gear ratios).... depending on what turbo's you're using and at what rpm you planning to set the engine up for......... and if it were me, I would get rid of that block (crack & bulge) in favor of a really solid one... because the added internal stresses from the increased pressurizing by turbocharging WILL enhance the weakness that is now present, as the increase in hp & torque is transmitted throughout the lower end of the block. Cold or reverse polarity welding it, may last forever... in its N/A form, or in a "stationary" application... but I wouldn't trust it in the form of turbocharged "high outputs" (and parallel torque increases), especially in a truck frame which induces block flexing, not found in other applications. PS: Just so you know... I have a Four (4) year degree in Diesel Engine Design and Theory... specializing in 2 cycle from the mid 1960s (no, I'm not a "kid"... but am, at heart). Enjoy and by all means, have fun with whatever you build.
Recently replaced the 8v71 in my bus, gotta love them things. Subbed, and looking forward to updates. Two Stroke Detroit Diesel group on FB is ran by an old timer (like since the depression era) guru, lots of knowledgeable guys on the Vintage Bus Mechanics group also.
Late 70s - early 80s 359 ex hood , just sound and music of your buzzin dozen going though it passes will get the views , at least I know I am gonna watch it 👍🏻👌🏻
2 things before you start , 1 you should get a truck engine for key components ,oil cooler, oil pan? Flywheel,flywheel hsg ,2 bore cylinder out to true bore in block if not already done , very critical this is a must not maybe!!! oh 3 full blown oh can go up to $25,000.oo be careful!!! Putting silver 6-92 bypass blowers only if you turbocharge,but it gets tricky ,because bypass blowers stack up .560 thousands longer than v- 12 blowers on a v-12 I did over 14 different machinings.!! to get silver bypass blower on a v-12.
Get in contact with Ol2Strokes, he is very up on these engines. They used these engines in Alaska during the pipeline build because at the time they were the most powerful. Mostly in GM trucks because that was the only ones they could get quickly from what I understand. Cabover would be awesome but I think go with a 4 axle conventional from the late 70's early 80's. Its the fact its old and cool is all that this is about. Yes there are many new engines that would kill this engine but this is so cool, this is what people want to see because they don't see much of these. Also you will actually work this truck!
I don’t think it matters whether or not it’s a conventional or a cabover. Most truck enthusists will watch as long as it’s old iron 😎💪
I’d watch this beast in whatever you put it in brother!! Super excited to see where you take it.. I have a peterbilt we could work something out on
would like to see the two of you work together!!!! This is a good match all around , Engine, Truck, and two guys I follow on you tube working together!!!!
See a lot of Brockways with 12v71's in them, sound awesome.
Brockways with 12v71’s didn’t have room for power steering
Plenty of great info available on these engines. They are pretty easy to build. I have done several 2 stroke Detroit’s and 3406 Cats. The Detroit is simple and you will have zero problems building this.
Conventional General or Bison would be sticking to the GM theme
Definitely a General with a 13 speed to keep her singing and gear it to the moon. Pull a 45’ RV with it.
I like the idea of the old Jimmy, since they came with a Dee-troit in them most of the time. The old time drivers around here always joked that the motors were Dee-troit. Detroit is a city in Michigan. The humor of those old guys was always good. They also said that the Dee-troit motors didn't leak oil, they were marking their territory. There sure was lots of bs thrown around among those old drivers about their truck and engine choices. I miss those old guys. They were good teachers of the profession.
The idea sounds super cool to be honest
I dont think you'll be able to see the whole engine because those trucks have doghouses
Ol2 stroker, look him up Steve.
He's got a cabover that has same engine as yours
I was going to recommend him too. He’s experienced with V Detroits.
Ol2stroker almost only works with the two stroke Detroit’s he legitimately has a tattoo of the logo and has multiple trucks with em such as a 359 and a 362 cab over I believe with the v12 in it I’m sure his videos would be educational for u as he does very in depth videos on freeing injectors etc I highly recommend watching his videos especially working on project mossybroke the 359.
Yep he is in the process of rebuilding a 12v71/92 if I’m not mistaken, either to make it into a show or everyday use type truck
Tim gentry knows quite a bit about Detroits
Mack R700 with the 12V71 would be awesome
That would be sacrilegious
Joe Maeser in Oregon.
Master builder of Detroits
Brockway conventional. There is a couple of dirt haulers out on Long island NY that still use them. Brockway and Detroit perfect match. There is a couple of examples of 12 V 71 Brockway on TH-cam even a cabover...watching for shop vids brings back memories. I started with a 1962 B 61 back in 1980. Also had a 1980 Astro with a 350 Cummins that I did a brake job on. Funny I through the brake drums in the back seat of my Lincoln to get turned at a shop, man did that turn some heads... All the Best, thanks for the detail.
Great Video! Greyhound actually did use a 12V71N in the MCI MC-6. It was the first 102 inch wide coach in North America in the late 60s. But they were rare as most states didn't allow them. I love all buses, trucks, and all diesel engines, but I will always be a Detroit man at heart! Thanks for another great video! How about putting it in a Chevrolet Bison or GMC General?
I wish my old shop boss was still around!! He did my 12v project in my 73 Pete and was a whiz..
I drove a couple of boats with 8V/71s and they are awesome, you are correct about their versatile configuration. Any military personell should be able to help and Detroit should have good archives of these engines. I think I may be going out on a limb, but a FWD engine, twin steer, bogie drive Kenny with a tilt tray (also know as roll back) and large knuckle boom crane would get some views, throw on a lazy axle and you can carry some weight. Good presentation and just my 2C worth.
My 8v92TA in my 1978 K123CR Kenworth was a direct drive alternator with a composite coupler
Watching you doing repairs and other stuff? Oh hell yeah! I alwsys loved that. Keep the good work up! 💪
Hello Sir, I just subscribed to your channel and looking forward to this Detroit build. A cab over or conventional would both be cool. But like your friend or son was saying - I agree that a conventional would show the engine off easier. Great video!!! 😀
Nice channel. Look forward to the long journey ahead. Keep up the good work.
i really like the 9500 long nose GMC not many left lots of room under the hood
I have considered that. I like the idea if one day I can find one.
R mack with a dog house on the back....that would be awesome or 359...either way it's gonna be sick...and be sure to get the chrome valve covers on it they always look great on them
About the accessory drive. The rear accessory drive setup was generally only used in cabover applications. Conventionals used the standard front drive setup.
My conventional Bison has the rear accessories drive
On side of block there's air box covers u can pop them off and look and u can check your pistol rings
I can't tell what to put it in,but as a young boy growing up in the Yukon a mining company called Cassiar Asbestos had a small fleet of 9 International Transtar 4300's that were powered by 12v71's,15 speeds and pulled B trains at 126,000 lbs.I always loved those trucks and the sound of 12v71 at full song
Yes!! Subscriber #99!!! This one will be for the record books when this channel hits 1 million
The first truck application was a livestock hauler from Kansas who put it in a Pete cabover. Detroit's leak oil, when they quit leaking oil then you worry. Because it's out. The v12 was offered in the GMC Astro and the Chevrolet Titan 90
What about putting it in a big ol' A-Car conventional?! What an awesome brute of a truck that would be, and some came with 12V71s.
Steve good luck with the v 12 take care buddy
Extended hood truck is perfect for the swap they are what they came in the parts are exchange easy to move parts water pumps up fr0nt mack super liner and rsl 700 are easy fit for that motor i drove a 68 petebuilt 12v71 with a 5x4 trans set up
I like the idea of putting it in a conventional, a Peter built, they do go well in a White Road Boss, as I have one with a 18 speed Road Ranger behind it.
If that 12V71 is from a Terex, my guess is that it's likely from a late-'60-early-70's- vintage S-24 model scraper. If so, the engine in naturally exasperated form was rated at 423 hp at 2100 rpm. That would also explain why the engine has a flywheel setup for an automatic transmission.That 423 hp rating is extremely moderate, if not low even for a 12V71. With appropriate mods - ie - lower compression 'turbo-spec' pistons,
a pair of 6 or 8-71 turbos, bypass-type blowers in place of the n.a ones,, an air-to-air intercooler before the blowers in addition to the factory aftercooler below the blowers, bigger injectors, and a pair of high-output marine camshafts would give an easy and still dead reliable 600 or so hp at the ground at 2100 rpm and about 2200-plus ft/lbs of torque at about 1400 rpm. I know this, because these the exact mods and specs that were done to the12V71 powered long-haul freight and produce hauler that I drove for a while back in 1987. That engine by the way - swapped into an '80 Freightliner FLC120 - was originally a 12VTTAC genset engine, modded and converted to truck use.
You can see the specs, including the engine specs for the S-24 scrapers here
contractormag.co.nz/classic-machines/terex-s-24/ Hope some if this helps.
I was in marine engine side of things. The 12V71 TI Were typically at the setting of 675 hp at 2300 rpm. They were routinely turned up to 1000 hp so I’m at 2300 RPMs and some even did it at 2500. The rods were the weak link to go above that setting . Getting 600 horse out of one is pretty easy
@@jonnycash6909 I agree with you totally about the hp of some of the marine-spec 12V71s. In a truck application, producing 600 hp at the ground - again, not a big deal for a well built, lightly modded single or twin turbocharged 12V71 - means the engine is actually producing somewhere between 700 and 725 hp at the flywheel. That was huge power for a working OTR truck back in the day, and is still pretty impressive today.
Theres really only one answer to the question. You need to check the for sales for a GMC General. A Marmon, Brockway, Hayes, anything not run of the mill. KW's and Petes have been done to death, id probably still watch though.
A GMC General would be the best choice for that engine, especially if it had a Detroit 8v-71 so that he could rob parts to make it fit
@@4321grp I think it would get good views too. So would an Astro.
@@bobbob-fg5wy I think so too. The 9500, Astro, and General were all the same truck, but different cabs.
Titan 90, or Bison would be cooler. Much rarer than Generals and Astros. I saw 2 of the bisons with sleepers sell at auction in Minnesota a while back. If he could find one of those, it would be very cool.
@@4321grp.... the 12 would be an Extremely tight / hard fit under that hood... he would have more clearance problems than you can imagine.... Not a good swap candidate.
In my opinion, try to find a needle nose butterfly, and then slap on also a mercury sleeper. That would be epic for views. But for me, I must say, that it doesn’t matter what you build, I like the content.
I think it's totally up to you I think whatever you put it in it's gonna be cool drive the hell out of it God-bless
a Hayes or a Reo would be interesting to see but an old Autocar also would be a rare sight to see.
To bad I was thinking Freightliner with the old aluminum hood. I thought it might be easier to stretch the hood to fit. My next choice would be KW A model
in school we swapped one into a butterfly Pete, we had to stretch the hood and push the cap back to make it fit, the instructor was going to use it to tow his fifth wheel when he retired, don't know what happened with it, it was in the body shop when i finished the program. sadly when the diesel and body shop instructors retired both programs ended
I really think an old 359 exhd would be super super cool
if it were me i would try to find an old gmc general to throw that in. I drove a general for a farming outfit and it was an awsome ride. the truck was a 1978 model. had a 13 speed eaton fuller in it but the engine i believe was a cummings. they ran biodiesel in it. perhaps an autocar or yeah a good old fashon mack truck. i must admit though it was Orwell that caught my attention for your channels. extremely entertaining stuff for a cabover enthusiast.
The sound of these is the thing for me. It’ll sound good in either type truck, but like you said, it’ll be easier to show it off in a conventional truck.
The country life channel, he has some videos, with a friend of his who is very proficient with the 2 stroke Detroit's. One video the fire up his old drag racing semi, 12v Detroit powered I believe. I also don't care cabover or conventional. Just make it 80s or older
Love the IDEA! Plan on a hearing preservation plan on the long haul!
I would love to see another Peterbilt cabover, but I understand the desire to want to easily be able to show off that 12V71 too. But I’ll continue watching no matter what you decide to do.
old GM truck good with engine
thank your detail video
Man I love these old Detroit I have a 8v92 in my rollback
HEY.......................
I'M COOL WITH WHATEVER YOU CHOOSE......
I LOVE THE CONTENT; I FIRST CAUGHT YOU WHEN YOU
WERE REBUILDING ORWELL'S ENGINE.... WAS SO IMPRESSED
I STAYED..... ALSO YOU HELPED ME REBUILD MY CAT (C12; 455)
IN THAT I'M GRATEFUL.......... SHE RUNNING STRONG STILL....SO
DO YOUR THING........... A 12V71 WILL BE AWESOME TO SEE .... START
TO FINISH...... ROLL UP YOUR SLEEVES MATT ...... LOL... BSAFE
You can set these up to turn conter or clock wise
Steve, make sure the truck that you want to get for this engine is already plumbed & wired for a Detroit 2 stroke. If this engine came out of a Terex,most likely it's from a dump, loader, or a scraper with an Allison behind it. The turbo engines have a bypass valve set up. For a con- ventional truck, you have your choices. Besides a KW or a Pete, how about a White Western Star, I-H Transtar 4300, Mack Western R- 700 model, Marmon or a Brockway with the Sheller- Globe R cab.Just make sure it's already set up for that 12V two stroke to avoid issues & more money.
P.S. Steve get in touch w/ Scott at Bus Grease Monkey as he's been repair- ing and fixing these engines for many of his coach clients. He also worked on one of the old MCI coaches that were made for the Grey- hound Corp. for Canada.It had a 12V- 71 in it. Scott and his son Tyler are excellent at the work they do.
have a look at the "excellent work" they did on the lacroix cruiser bus, they're top quality wannabe mechanics for sure!
it being a Gm Detroit would love to see you put it in a gmc general. that would make an awesome build
Gregory Scott, Being as I worked as a mechanic in a GMC Truck dealership, I agree wholeheartedly. I remember when those Generals were new, they were beautiful trucks.
I'm a little late to the party, but figured I'd let you know that my vote is for a cabover! I personally first found and subscribed to your channel while looking for videos featuring cabover trucks, so I can't get enough of them! I think a Kenworth K100 Aerodyne would be sweet with that 12v71 in it. Good luck with whatever you decide! Edit: If you're considering a heavy haul build, I certainly haven't seen many (if any) tri-drive cabovers in the U.S. Maybe build an old school U.S. version of the 8x6 K200s they sell in Australia. That would be even sweeter!
Big rig videos interviewed Ed Davis with his 1979KW with a 12v71 engine. Absolute beautiful truck. Something to check out.
1987, OSU Tech, Okmugee, OK, sememer 1, Tear and rebuild 3-71 Detroit Diesel. 50 engine +/-, all 3-71 Detroit Diesel! Four WW11 Higgins boats, 8-92, 16V-71, etc. WW11 engine, (Gray Marine), governor idle to fast, hand more up, "Battle". COOL!!!
Long hood r models always look cool.
We had a 30 ton crane with inline 6 had cracked sleeves and it still ran would only go about 5 mph and first off you can't put a turbo on these unless you change the pistons.
Try OshCosh trucking. I used to work on them. These motors were OshCosh firetrucks that I used to work on.
When you had the airbox covers open, I noticed that your rings looked like they're in good shape, even the fire ring (top ring) is in good shape. The way to inspect a Detroit's rings is to see if the groove in the center of the ring is still there. If it still has that groove in it, That means there's not much wear on the ring. Also if an engine has a lot of hours on it, many times the fire ring will be broken up with pieces in the airbox cover. You may not need to overhaul your engine. Your engine looks like it's an industrial engine instead of a highway vehicle engine. The pulleys on the front of the engine are normal, they're supposed to be located where they are. The accessory drive pads on the rear of the engine can have pulleys mounted there as needed. The flywheel housing looks like an industrial housing and therefore the mounts probably won't be right for a truck, also the flywheel may not be right for a truck. That crack in the block needs to be repaired by brazing it. Like you said, it would help to have an old truck engine for parts..
4321grp..... The Model No. 7123-7030..... with the "3" in the first group denoting that, yes... it is an Industrial F/F (Fan to Flywheel) engine. Depending on what exactly it was used in or on.... he may have to change out the governor, as it "may" be equipped with a Variable Speed..... and will need a SWLS instead (Single Weight Limiting Speed).
@@Romans--bo7br , At 10.18 in the video you get a good view of the top of the governor, and it's definitely a limiting speed governor.
Shesh man… an R model Mack with a V12 Detroit in it would be sick as heck
Steve good luck with the 2nd channel
I love the idea of building a heavy haul truck with it. If it’s more for show, I think something rare would be awesome (such as a Marmon, White, ect). If you’re going to actually use the truck for heavy haul, I would go the Paccar route or something where parts are more readily available. The Mack Superliner would be a good bet too. Whatever you decided to do though, I bet it will be worth watching!
If you're gonna use it for heavy haul you'll need to blow it, 80-85 cc high pressure injectors, then there's the transmission story I'd advise a 15 speed Fuller roadranger, to handle all that I'd advise 44 rocks !!!
The conventional would show it off more at a show but the intake and exhaust system would be simpler on a coe not easy to pin that one down is it. Take care.
Diamond Rio ant eater, nice big radiator behind the cab nothing but engine out front.
Suggest having non-destructive examination (NDE) performed on the block, heads, and load carrying engine internals (i.e. crankshaft).
If you check truck paper they have a heavy haul Marmon in Texas for sale if you want to go that route.
They originally put a data plate on the valve cover that told you the build,whether it was an Industrial,marine or OTR.
The type of flywheel housing,pulleys and governor is going to be an issue if you want to put it in OTR truck
I knew a guy that had a 12v71 in a cab over day cab gmc Astro , I thought it also had twin turbos on it also. I could be wrong , it’s been 30+ years ago. He hauled bricketts in double dump Michigan trains with it.
A nice gmc general would be a good fit for that
Would have to be a long hood
There is a bonneted Mack 700 also But whatever you decide it needs to work for you unless just for show? You do a lot of Oshkosh work so maybe something from them or they might suggest something maybe even scale a chassis down if too much for your needs/economy but if hauling 4 axle plus units need something more substantial on Heavy/Over size Hauling
Have a look down under here in New Zealand and Aus we have a lot of 4 axil cab over rigs even brand new Kenworths otherwise pick a brand that hasn't been over done
it’d be cool to see it in an old gmc general you might need to lengthen the hood a lil or buy a long hood but it would be cool to see it in one of those, that was what i was planning on doing with my truck before i got looking to much and found out my truck was completely screwed. also i know quite a bit about detroits and i know how to get the engine the info from the model number such as application and variations as long as it’s original.
the man you want to talk to about the v-12 is tom price -price trucking beacon street buffalo, n.y. that is if he is still around he had several tractors years ago hauling steel out of bethlehem in lackawana,n.y. he had a few good drivers working for him , i seen the back in over to bethelhem and put three 40,ooo pound loads onthe deck at the very least . they pulled heavy 3 axle cover wagons mostly to NYC he had these v-12 pumped up and they sure could haul the mail. I always ran a 1693 cat and would put sixty or seventy thousand on a five axle outfit and it was all i wanted to run with these guys.
I would go with a conventional w900a or a superliner that would be sweet either way i love watching your videos so whatever you do decide i know its going to cool
I'm interested in what each individual guy is doing out there in the world - that's why I watch different videos and channels. Since you're asking, I say buy and build the truck YOU want. It will probably be more interesting in the long run.
I'm a big fan of the old-school Detroit Diesel engines. Would you please create a playlist of all the Detroit Diesel videos you have to make finding and watching them easy?
Kenworth c500 prime mover unless you want to make money with it then a wide grill cab over. A lot of the cab overs with 12v had the monster grill to get a big enough cooling package
Steve what would be real rare if you can find one that's for sale is the longhorn DODGE conventional put it in that with a true 5 an 4 transmissions and put a mercury sleeper on it or the DODGE cabover would be rare there's a guy that's working on one of those with a box bed on it I think
his channel is cm. works
maybe wrong on that but either of these is definitely the rare of the trucking world but that's my picks but your the one that's gonna be driving it and working it so you build what fits your needs that's the important thing about this is a user friendly truck so stay safe and keep the video's coming
I put an industrial 12v71 similar to yours in a Peterbilt chassis with a 1934 Ford cab on it. Lots of work. Find a truck engine.
Your engine has oil pump mounted in the base that makes the engine tall. You need to get an oil pump that runs off th front of the crank. This will require a hunt for an oil pan. I took 2 and made one. You need donor engines. 12v71 series did not use bypass blowers when turbocharged. They all have pulleys on the front. You will need a flywheel from any v71. I would check for stuck injectors then start that before you overhaul it. Make sure it is correct rotation. Looks like the correct governor must have been in a rock truck.
Kevin young
Ok found it great
The availability of a Western Star or a Mack Western set up for your American Honda motor are very possible in the eastern part of the country or maybe resting in Wyoming, Colorado or any ole oil patch in the Rockies. Stuffing that motor in a older large car is a hell of an ambitious plan, but remember it is the reliability of the rest of the drivetrain that matters. Detroit's love cool air and cool water temps. Your radiator has to be able to take in fresh air and its capacity must meet the needs of hills of West Virginia when grossing #120,000. That motor deserves either a 13 double overdrive or a 6x4 twin stick. Tall rubber with gearing to hit 90 mph across the flatlands of Iowa. As you know, a fresh motor does not react kindly with million mile rear ends or a stock clutch. Building a 4 axle with that powerplant is admittedly a awesome path, but break down in Parsippany, NJ, and who is going to give you any sound roadside service on that motor? Hell, Cat parts will break the bank for most people. Sticking a small block in a Vega is one thing, sticking the Detroit in a 1975 Kenworth W900 is another. Probably much easier to piece together the 75 W900. Look for a 1969 GMC 9500 Long Hood and build a Sunday driver.
You should do a bull noise cab over of if you go conventional you should do a needle noise or 359
A Mack super liner would be badass to
Country life on here seems to know a lot about Detroit motors
Keep your eyes open for four valve heads for a great start on high horsepower especially with twin turbos.
FSC..... I just found your videos, and watched your video where you found the crack & bulge on the right rear of the block and were also inquiring about the Serial & Model numbers.... I just responded to those questions for you (7.28.2021), along with some other info / suggestions. One thing that I forgot to bring up in my response to that other video, was.... Why or Who, bypassed the Oil Cooler on the Front Right side (as Factory Viewed from the Rear of the block), with a braided stainless steel "looped" hose connection?? There is a very good reason why they go through the expense and time to design and build oil coolers for these (and other) diesel engines, and it's not just to add more parts.
By the way, those pulley's at the Front of the engine... are right where they need to be. Any accessories mounted on the back end, are either "direct drive" (bolted directly to the housing), or... pulley's added to drive whatever... all depends on the set up for any particular application... Automotive, Marine, Genset or Industrial in its numerous forms.
I think, personally... whoever sold it to you, sold you a "bill of goods".... I hope it was really Cheap. By the way, the Engine Rotation on these engines, and for correctly sourcing parts... is Always, as viewed from the FRONT of the engine.... however the Starter and Oil Cooler(s) are Always "as viewed", from the REAR of the engine for proper engine arrangements and part numbers.... and that is how this info is dictated from Detroit Diesel in the shop manuals..... which, may I suggest... you might want to seriously consider obtaining for your engine, if you don't have one already.... as well as some of the Specialty Tools that you will need for this engine... and any other Series 71 you might obtain in the future.
As far as Excellent Detroit Diesel sources.. I have a list of every "Reputable" (Independent & Factory Authorized) Detroit Diesel Re-manufacturer, Re-builder and Parts distributor in the continental US, Canada, Mexico and South America, as well as most of Europe, Asia and Africa. Two of the best in the US with outstanding reputations is... 1) PCI - PC Industries, in Afton, Wyoming.... and 2) Stewart & Stevenson Inc... the Largest Detroit Diesel Distributor in the world. S&S was to DD, as was Carroll Shelby to Ford.... before DD's ownership went to Germany.
Any customer specific set-up orders with the 2 cycles, was Designed, engineered and built "in house" at S&S, for DD.... and one that was memorable to myself, back in the mid 1980s was some custom built 32-71's!!.... that were built by them for oil field use in Saudi Arabia. They also custom built new cylinder heads for some Vertical 12-71's that were set up to run as dual fuel engines... diesel and LNG, so they redesigned & built new heads with spark plugs And injectors. They sounded just as "sweet" on LNG as they did on diesel.
You mentioned joining two 12-71's.... DD did produce 24-71's at the factory, for marine use, but only a small number were built (850+/-) between 1994 and 1997, which was the final year of production for the 2 cycles..... for "public consumption".... they continued building new 6-53TA's, 8-71TA's and 8-92TA's under contract for the government and numerous allied & US military applications... into the 20teens, except for the 8-71TA which was dropped sometime after 2008.
To be honest... Currently, I think PC Industries (PCI) is handling more of the 2 cycles, than S&S is... they're more focused on the MTU / Detroit Diesel side of things on a regular basis, plus a good number of their 2 cycle people have retired now... but they certainly still deal with parts, etc. Please read my Serial & Model ID numbers explanation in the other video I mentioned above.
Also, keep in mind that there are multiple variants of mechanical governors of the Series 71 engines.... if you're going to put that engine in a truck.... make sure that you have the SWLS - Single Weight LIMITING Speed governor.
If you really want to do something Really Different with Detroit power for a truck.... find a 6-110T.... a really tremendous and Reliable engine that can rival the hp and torque of the 12... and have better lugging power (ability to "hold" the torque on grades) due to its longer stroke and higher piston speed (per rpm), and longer "Usable" power stroke travel. The 6-110's were massively "over-built" on the bottom end, and I know that GMD had them in their test cells putting out well over 730hp under load, back in 1962.
I think a 6-110T/TA in a "Crackerbox" with sleeper (pre-Astro/Bison), or a COE (w/sleeper cab) Emeryville (IH), would be "classic". But, as you said that you might want to use whatever you build for Heavy haul... the frame rails and suspension on those earlier 1960s trucks that I mentioned would be too light for that work.
There is a guy from ID (??)... that has a big bunk COE / 352 Pete (110" cab) with a 16-92TA, that he uses for short (mostly in-state) heavy haul, ... but rarely, and only when it's "nice" out... weather wise. I believe he running an HD-750 Allison behind it, if I remember right... could be mistaken... been quite a while since I seen it last. He also has an extended hood "A" model KW with a KTA Cummins under the hood, with sticks, that he runs quite a bit.
Also, in reference to changing the blowers in light of turbocharging (single or twin).... there are Two types of "bypass" blowers (and drive gear ratios).... depending on what turbo's you're using and at what rpm you planning to set the engine up for......... and if it were me, I would get rid of that block (crack & bulge) in favor of a really solid one... because the added internal stresses from the increased pressurizing by turbocharging WILL enhance the weakness that is now present, as the increase in hp & torque is transmitted throughout the lower end of the block.
Cold or reverse polarity welding it, may last forever... in its N/A form, or in a "stationary" application... but I wouldn't trust it in the form of turbocharged "high outputs" (and parallel torque increases), especially in a truck frame which induces block flexing, not found in other applications.
PS: Just so you know... I have a Four (4) year degree in Diesel Engine Design and Theory... specializing in 2 cycle from the mid 1960s (no, I'm not a "kid"... but am, at heart). Enjoy and by all means, have fun with whatever you build.
it has the right governor called dual weight limiting speed governor
Your prime install would be a 74 or 75 Pete. I had a 359 extended hood pete. that hauled 150,000 on the New York state thruway..
Take a look at some of the trucks from down under.
Recently replaced the 8v71 in my bus, gotta love them things. Subbed, and looking forward to updates. Two Stroke Detroit Diesel group on FB is ran by an old timer (like since the depression era) guru, lots of knowledgeable guys on the Vintage Bus Mechanics group also.
When you rebuild it use the turbo parts
I think an older conventional is a good idea but I'll watch whether it's a conventional or COE.
Ill be happy to see it in some old iron like K100 big sleeper or something newer like Freightliner Argosy, that may be interesting
Second thought. International 4070B
Ole2stroker he knows everything Steve he's on you tube
Pete 359 would be a great candidate!
Late 70s - early 80s 359 ex hood , just sound and music of your buzzin dozen going though it passes will get the views , at least I know I am gonna watch it 👍🏻👌🏻
Used to be a guy in Elmira NY guessing he’s retired/dead. If your in Northern NJ you should be able to find a great machine shop.
I am looking forward to hearing this engine run and seeing it in a truck.
2 things before you start , 1 you should get a truck engine for key components ,oil cooler, oil pan? Flywheel,flywheel hsg ,2 bore cylinder out to true bore in block if not already done , very critical this is a must not maybe!!! oh 3 full blown oh can go up to $25,000.oo be careful!!! Putting silver 6-92 bypass blowers only if you turbocharge,but it gets tricky ,because bypass blowers stack up .560 thousands longer than v- 12 blowers on a v-12 I did over 14 different machinings.!! to get silver bypass blower on a v-12.
Get in contact with Ol2Strokes, he is very up on these engines. They used these engines in Alaska during the pipeline build because at the time they were the most powerful. Mostly in GM trucks because that was the only ones they could get quickly from what I understand. Cabover would be awesome but I think go with a 4 axle conventional from the late 70's early 80's. Its the fact its old and cool is all that this is about. Yes there are many new engines that would kill this engine but this is so cool, this is what people want to see because they don't see much of these. Also you will actually work this truck!
R700 Mack like the one off of convoy