@@gersonbatres5826 Wow, l wrote this comment a yr ago and you read it now That is a Blessing. Yes l am a witness, the Joy of the Lord does give me strength or l would never make it. May the Lord Bless Thee and Keep Thee 🌸🕊❤️✝️
Such a stark difference between his older & newer videos of students asking questions: 20/30 years ago, students listened to the answer patiently, _maybe_ interjecting clarification if Cliffe wasn't answering the question asked; 2 students in this video now were _already_ ready with their next question, regardless what Cliffe & Stuart answered, they didn't listen, they just wanted to speak "their truth", not *THE* truth, it wasnt a dialogue, it was an interrogation, that's why they moved on. Great questions though & better answers, as no other worldview has an objective foundation for morality cohesive with reality we all live in. I always pray the triune God of the supernaturally prophetic (Romans 1:26-31/2 Timothy 4:3/Matthew 24:6/1 Corinthians 1:18), historically verified (archaeologically & anthropologically, enemy/early/multiple attestation, internal consistency, embarrassing reports, etc.) & transcendentally, objectively moral (Exodus 20/Matthew 22:37-40) Bible reveal Himself to you in Spirit & objective truth (John 16:13). May God bless you, Knechtle's & reader!
I love seeing Cliff and Stewart tag teaming together. I remember years ago watching this show on the weekend as a kid when I lived in CT. Little did I know I’d end up rooming with Stewart’s cousin David in college. Wonderful family.
"And my speech and my preaching were not with enticing words of man’s wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power" 1 Corintios 2:4 "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God" Ephesians 6:17 Just more word of God :) Great thing you do. God bless.
Bring forth righteousness and fortitude upon thine own being, upon thy holy shield of power and glory, let it be so ..Book of Bonnie 1:6 . it's quite easy to combine lots of nice looking words into a rambling sentence that people can make their own interpretation of. And then argue about what it really means. I dare say I could write an entire passage of vague ramblings.
I need to share the gospel more, you set a great example. Interesting to contrast your method with Ray Comforts. I wonder which method is more effective. He appeals to the persons conscience using the law, whereas you use logic, reason, and evidence.
It depends on the person. Some will acknowledge philosophical arguments. Some evidential. Others presuppositional. You have to use the method the person would respond to.
I think college kids generally think they are too smart for religion (I did) and so when they are faced with someone who can out intellectualise them, they become humbled and realize they should listen up. Whereas if you were to "street preach" to them, they would write you off as crazy. Apologetics serves as the base for these students.
Have you ever lied, stolen, used God's name in vain, looked wuth lust? if so you need to repent today and Believe in Jesus Christ to save you from Hell and go to heaven instead
That was a very hard question I wouldn’t know how to answer. I think I understood what the gentleman was trying to communicate and truly I don’t know how ego and pride came about onto Lucifer with feeling the fullness of His presence
I dont think we know enough about what happened through biblical text. I assume an all loving God would have given Lucifer an opportunity to turn away from his sin by repenting. Yet, the same all loving God gave Lucifer essentially what he wanted-his own kingdom.
what i’ve learned in my limited studies is lucifer was a worship leader and so he was able to hear his voice and see his reflection because he was one of the only angels allowed behind the throne of God, and when he heard a plan of God to develop man with free will, he revolted believing that a lesser being would not be able to serve God. Take it with an grain of salt, it requires some texts that aren’t cannon like book of enoch
The Gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing ( "major flaw" like the gentleman said ) but it is the power of God to salvation to christians. A stumbling block to the jews and foolishness to the gentiles.
I dunno if you know your comparative religions, but the Lucifer character is thought by a number of scholars to be stolen from Ahriman (the Accuser) of neighboring, contemporary religion of Zoarastria.
If I may try to clarify, God created angels and humans with free will. Free will to choose to reject or accept God's ways. Otherwise there is no real love because real love allows us the ability to choose. I cannot force a woman to marry me, that's not love. Lucifer chose to reject God's ways from the beginning, that's why Jesus said lucifer was a liar and murderer from the beginning. God has appointed a time where all the fallen angels will be in the lake of fire forever, to us seems like we've been waiting a long time for that day but to God all this may be just a millisecond. Who knows. But by definition God is merciful and patient, so the question is why not God snuff out lucifer from the start. The answer is similar to why doesn't God snuff out every human the moment they committed their first sin? If God destroyed every human at their first sin there would literally be no life in the universe right now. That's not God's design or ultimate plan for us. Fallen angels don't get a chance at forgiveness but humans do. That's part of the reason why lucifer wants to deceive as many of us as possible before his appointed time in the lake of fire. Nobody will ever live a sinless life, but God's love is so great he is willing to be patient with us humans. We think it's taking a long time but in God's time this is a blink of an eye.
@@Tunnelvision29 You clarify nothing. None of what you said explains, and in fact it all obfuscates. It is dishonest to assert as if fact that which is not evidently verifiable. You don't get clarity without facts that are 'truthfully' indicative. Your lot redefine love when it suits you for women anyhow. Cheap, but fairly broad shot accurate swipe, that.
@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESS you're terribly misinformed if you think what I said isn't backed by biblical principle. Also you believe lucifer is this idea stolen from another religion, tells me you have a preconceived notion of Christianity with no basis to even understand biblical principle. Also the example I gave about real love and the ability to choose for oneself is as honest as it gets. If you don't agree you're probably that weirdo that would stalk his high school crush around school. You should do like your name says and mind your own business.
If you are looking for another good topic to study look into the behaviors of nihilism, we don't always realize it but these behaviors are demonstrated around us often. It was Nietzsche who admitted people would replace religion and belief in God with nihilistic behaviors. One of the most common is the method to reduce something to it's elements to suggest it is less meaningful. Such as taking a person and reducing them to another animal, a clump of cells, or a set of quantum fields. Saying a hug is just a momentary close proximity. Another example is taking words and replacing them with other words that have reduced meaning like many of the issues in politics. Suggesting apathy instead of facing something that effects the common good is a form of nihilistic behavior. Perhaps more should be discussed about this and why nihilism is bad for the common good of civilization. Unified evidence of the world, people, and all the systems together require a designer to be trusted. The way to disregard this evidence is to deconstruct and reduce things to their elements with nihilism, then declare from your limited position there is no evidence. Curiosity is the default position, many have been taught deconstructive nihilism along the way and now repeat it. The world, universe, and people as a whole require meaning and purpose or it withers, weakness emerges, and fails. When something is true because it is self-evident and when there exists the impossibility of the contrary it shifts the burden of proof to the claim of the negative. Read the Federalist Papers and the Declaration of Independence for the idea of God given rights and self-evident truth, that have built and unified people to escape the nihilism that many are trying to substitute in it’s place.
Is nihilism a big thing where you are boltrook?, I don't personally know ANY nihilists, no one has ever said to me they are a nihilist, I have of course met lots of atheists, none of us are claiming that life has no meaning, we all have meaning and purpose in our lives. I don't think it comes up on any population census when people are asked about belief in God, certainly not here in the UK.
@@bonnie43uk Nihilism isn’t always a conscious behavior. It’s a symptom of certain ways of thinking, a psychological phenomenon. I study psychology as an amateur, I find it fascinating how ideas generate common detectable psychological markers. A common nihilistic behavior is reducing a whole and complete thing to it’s elements in how you think about them, a whole person has a unified meaning we can detect but if you reduce a person to seeing them as a collection of atoms they blend with everything else with atoms as having no distinguishable importance. Atheism is closely related to nihilism because of it’s logical conclusions. Atheism doesn’t allow purpose and meaning to exist in reality, in the make-up of things, it lacks intellectual grounding for that, you admit it yourself that you create the meaning and purpose in your mind, it’s not inherent to material reality in that framework. This way of thinking is much more drawn to nihilism because your mind is as temporary as your life and meaning so it is prone to the existential dread of the loneliness of inevitably being pulled apart from everyone and everything.
@@boltrooktwo Like i said my friend, I don't know of anyone who claims to be a nihilist, is it a big thing where you live? Your view of atheism sounds really bleak, but my life is pretty pretty good. I'm sure there are just as many lonely Christians as there are lonely atheists. Loneliness is certainly not something that I suffer from.
@@bonnie43uk Nihilism isn’t something a lot of people know about but it is something a lot more people do in recent years. Someone can convince themselves in their head they are the greatest but really behave like a nihilist.
respectfully, you are incorrect. Genesis 6 :4 says the nephilim had children with the daughters of men. those nephilim were the offspring of fallen angels and humans.
The last guy's question was so deep and if cliffe was not so stubborn and listened he may have liked it. He was asking about the father-son relationship of god and Lucifer and how god could have shown love then and avoided all this suffering.
@@nikokapanen82 Yes, pray for him. I think nihilism fit his current worldview. He mentioned ‘Yolo(you only live once)’ as motivation for his worldview. Pretty simplistic understanding of life.
I think the kid who brought up the question of why would God go through the drama brings up some interesting points, one’s I’ve definitely contemplated myself. If I was to have any response to it, I think that it would need to have an answer that more relates to things that are not within the confines of time, what we perceive as millennia , God sees as an instant, God is not allowing huge amounts of time and suffering within that to go on, his correction from his perspective has already happened. In addition you also have to also take into consideration of the process that mind has to go thru in order to be healed of lower thoughts. God creating of itself while being of perfection, also has to embody that which is imperfect in order to be perfect. That seems contradictory but it’s not, if God encompasses everything then even his creations, his thoughts and life force, has to have everything in it to be considered flawless, even the flawed.
Also Satan has never asked God for forgiveness and unfortunately will never ask. Satan represents our egotistic, selfish, proud world. This is a simple point I would of brought up to that student asking why God just didn’t nip it in the bud
For the man that basically asked "why did God remove the fallen angels, rather than converse with them?" He's presuming God didn't. Whether or not God did have the conversation, He still gave them the free will to stay in faith or to fall from grace. Just as The Lord gave Adam and Eve not to eat the fruit from The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
These postmodernists often think 'it's a social construct' inherently negates the importance of things. Of course we have social constructs, and they're deeply important and inherent to who we are as humans. Every one of these people whos says this turns right around and uses social constructs all day, every day in their lives. It's like trying to pretend language isn't important because they're just 'made-up sounds.' Our conventions, traditions, beliefs, etc are what give us meaning, depth, connection, and culture.
We live in a world of intellect,knowledge and answers . So many people in this world will go to hell because of their lack of knowledge and intellect of God because they can't get all their answers. So sad and so lack of faith will send them to hell.
What shall be said of those who turn many to righteousness? Daniel 12:3 King James Version 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
My council to pastors of churches is to have church on Saturdays and Sundays. Tell the people that Saturday is the true Sabbath but nevertheless it’s going to be a double whammy. Because we’re going have church on Sunday too. This will be a peaceful transition. By the way you’ll notice the difference between the two days.
It's difficult to fathom how there was such a thing as the fallen Angel's, and there was war in Heaven, but I guess we have to remember God is a holy God, and his ways, though they may seem to be a round about way to us, is God's own way. We need to dig deep to know Gods character, and our only source for that is the Bible.
I believe the guy at 16:00 questions was really supposed to be phrased “if sin originiated outside of the earth to begin with. Why did god not deal with Satan then , instead of creating the earth and all of us to go through the sin problem we have now all because of how satan tried to be God.” Lol
Yes, I think you're right. And sometimes Cliffe doesn't answer the questions very directly. But that guy was pretty, umm, sassy...especially when Cliffe asked him his thoughts on Jesus. Atheists don't understand that this is a relevant question when trying to explain this stuff. Instead they get annoyed. Cuz most atheists are so....angry. And I believe the answer to his question is: If God had destroyed Satan the angels would have begun to serve Him from fear rather than from love. This would defeat the very purpose He had in creating beings with the power of choice and free will.
Big difference between the students in the videos 20 years ago and the ones now. 20 years ago the atheist students at least had logical questions and answers and were capable of reason. The students now just want to spew a phrase, and then not listen to the answer.
MY SABBATH TESTIMONY. Not knowing what day to keep, I kept both Saturday and Sunday as the Sabbath; But I noticed a distinct difference on Saturday. My concentration was particularly enhanced. However because I was a person with very low concentration, with subsequent low intellect, I really noticed this concentration. But now that my concentration levels have risen to at least average intelligence, I hardly notice this increase in concentration that’s happening on the 7th day sabbath. But nevertheless it’s still happening although most of the time imperceptibly. And as we all receive the same amount of light when we get born again; However those who were in great darkness particularly notice it because of the greatness of the contrast. So too was it with me, with the noticing this extra concentration that God is pouring onto us on the sabbath. I particularly noticed it because my concentration levels were so low. However you’ll notice that the congregation will more easily be able to pay attention on the Saturday compared to the Sunday and also they will become mentally stronger and grow intellectually. In all work, be it big or small, we obtain a healthy God given motivation, as we admire our achievements, and give ourselves a pat on the back. And this is totally ok. But by ceasing from the admiration of ourselves on the 7th day, by refraining from work, as much as possible, and resting, it allows us to more fully admire God, without the impediment of our own self admiration, which we obtain when doing our chores. Also in Isaiah 58 it says to abstain from our pleasures on the sabbath. Go without them. And by doing this we don’t tap out of the noticeable blessing that God is generously pouring forth. Believe me, you’ll be mightily blessed. God bless you. The servant of all, that’s me, that’s Paul, The son of John and Winnifred Hunt, from New Zealand.
Do you think God is concerned that most, if not all Christians regard the day of rest and prayer on a Sunday as opposed to Saturday Paul?, all my life I've known Sunday as the traditional Holy day of the week. I'm well aware that for Jews it's the Saturday.
Has God actually changed the Sabbath day? Is it really Sunday and not Saturday? Yes the sabbath day has been changed. But God didn’t change it. Constantine did this. Therefore the day has never changed although man might say otherwise. It’s written in stone by God Himself. The 4th commandment is changeless.
@@BrockJamesStory Yes well I wasn’t sure either, but just as our Christian testimony with the Lord of Lords, and King of Kings, Jesus Christ, Our Saviour, makes us sure, because it validates that God is in our lives; My sabbath testimony makes me sure that Saturday is indeed the right day. The 7th day is Saturday.
@@paulwilfridhunt of course the 7th day is Saturday, but it’s more of a question of why did God give us the sabbath? It was a day of rest because we need to rest. I treat everyday as the Lords day the best I can, of course there are times I fail.
@@robertmitchell-tv5yf I’m not sure what’s really going on here. Of course your interesting! Look if you want to have a debate then I’ll hear you out. Announce your position. Form a strong argument. Stick to what you know. Communicate your position clearly. Form a conclusion.
I think what the young man at 22.00 minutes was asking was why did God create Lucifer with a sinful nature? And when lucifer sinned, instead of dealing with it in the heavenly realms, why did God chased Lucifer and his angels out into earth and thereby causing Adam and Eve to sin ; and from then onwards man was born with a sinful nature. Then later God sent his son, Jesus , to earth to save mankind. That’s why the young man commented that God loves a drama. 22:03
lol no.. i remember when i was a atheist nihilist.... i wasnt happy at all.....like you cant be happy..... well unless you have the memory of a goldfish which is like what 15 seconds....
I love cliff, and typically, his(and his sons) answers are spot on but when it comes to the guy at 16:06 idk if they didn't understand what he was asking or just didn't break down there answer well enough but that could've been handled more meticulously The guys issue was virtually why God didn't deal with Satan and his followers initially in heaven whether it be by talking to them and/or eradicating them and secondly how its just for God to judge them in the manner he did if everything they were was the image of himself. This guys questions have a few assumptions, but those aside the root of it is just misunderstanding one God and Satan (lucfier).
The man’s thoughts on why God didn’t snuff Lucifer when he rebelled wasn’t answered by Cliff and Stewart. The answer is, God gave angels free will just as he gave to mankind. Free will makes us accountable to what we say, do, and think. Snuffing Lucifer would have eliminated his free will instead of making Lucifer accountable at the time of judgement. We will all be judged. Seek Jesus while He may be found.
The question of why did God not discipline Lucifer right after he rebelled back into humility is not answered. We just do not know why God allows so much evil to thrive for such a long time.
@@nikokapanen82 Why evil occurs on earth, is because God is arguably giving everyone a "fair shot" where he does not directly impede on anyone's free-will. For example I could bully you, God respects both of our free-will therefore will not interfere directly. However on my death, I will be dealt with accordingly
I dont think we know enough about what happened through biblical text. I assume an all loving God would have given Lucifer an opportunity to turn away from his sin by repenting. Yet, the same all loving God gave Lucifer essentially what he wanted-his own kingdom.
There have been different nihilist positions, including that human values are baseless, that life is meaningless, that knowledge is impossible. I believe it would be difficult for a nihilist to make many friends, on the other hand, an atheist is not troubled by an angry, jealous, needy god - so free thought and joy is possible.
The reason that there have been different nihilist positions is because there are many types of nihilism. The most common types are: Existential Nihilism Cosmic Nihilism (Cosmic Pessimism) Ethical Nihilism (Moral) Epistemological Nihilism Political Nihilism. So, I believe it is like painting with a broad brush when someone says it would be difficult for a nihilist to make many friends. I wouldn't think it would be any more difficult than someone who has social anxiety or a certain level of being an introvert. Just saying.
@@Generatorman59 Is nihilism a big thing in the US Jim?, it's something Cliffe mentions quite often in his debates with the students, i personally don't know of anyone who would claim to be a nihilist, all of us find our own purpose and meaning in life regardless of whether we believe in a God or not.
@@bonnie43uk I have not known any in my lifetime. I spent most of my life living in the South. It is known as the Bible Belt. Most people are Southern Baptist. They get their meaning from an imaginary sky daddy.
@@bonnie43uk True. And I am always amazed when theists say that I am the one who is indoctrinated. They say that I am so entrenched in my lack of faith.
When a Christian says that I'm "rebelling" against God it's the most frustrating thing. First off how can I rebel against something I'm not sure exists? How can I rebel against something that I'm actively seeking? It's condescending and need to stop. It's exactly like when when a Christian says "I'm turning away from God because I love my sin". This couldn't be further away from the truth and once again it's very condescending.
Thats the Christian shtick . What these Christians don’t understand is atheists can make similar declarations like Oh, you know God doesn’t exist. You’re just afraid of the consequences of being honest with yourself. Lol
Don't let it frustrate you. They have no choice but to believe those things, they are just being consistent with their ideology. Their claims are unfalsifiable so they can't possibly know that what they're saying is true. They're just going off of faith
@@Kenpachi_White707 what do you mean "prove it" can you prove anything? Prove you exist, that you are not just in my imagination. You can not. There is very little you can prove outside of mathematics, rather we look for evidence.
If I were there, I wouldn’t be able to stand the guy with the mask. He was asking questions yet he was talking over Cliffe and Stuart and not really listening to their responses.
Beside the weekly sabbath were there were special days every year in the Jewish calendar which in the Scriptures are often referred to as sabbaths? Leviticus 23:24 King James Version 24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
The guy who asked the question about how God should have sat satin down and have a deep conversation with him, and said the same with Adam and Eve, needs to understand the concept of God’s holiness and righteousness. The perfectly righteous Father doesn’t just hate our sin and rebellion, He cannot stand it. He is set apart from it. It cannot be in His presence. He can’t and won’t “hang out and talk” with it. This is why Christ Jesus is said to be our advocate. We are given His righteousness by His grace through faith alone. You have to be willing to talk about Christ to understand God’s nature…
Bringing Islam as an objective basis for morality, when the Quran keeps contradicting itself and says that what is evil in the Bible is good according to their false prophet, is either ignorant or just plain evil. I love what he is doing, but there is nothing good in Islam. Also, Islam is not monotheistic, it has daughters of Allah in it, and the tawhid means to make one, not one, so it means its making many false gods becoming as one. There is nothing Abrahamic about the death cult of Islam. Al = El = god, Lah = moon, Allah is a moon demon.
I have to say the hardest of the questions was the young man at 16:09 - 23:30 who raised a big concern with the way GOD addresses Sin and his loved creations. I love Cliffe and Stuart but I wish they would have taken what he said more seriously and addressed it. Anyone else feel this way?
I know what he’s saying. He’s basically asking why God gave us free will. Free will is where God limited his power so we may have choice. Going way back to Lucifer, God had strict rules and Lucifer was arrogant and wanted to do his own thing, being self centered. God made him to be the beautiful right hand to him and he wanted to be bigger than God so he got casted out. True love isn’t love if it’s not free that’s brainwashing/forcing you to do something because the creator has the overall say so. So there’s no flaw in His creation it’s the free will of us who choose not to follow him. So basically the punishment is to join the first being to be self centered and egotistical in hell in the kingdom of egos. We can still live we just have to live responsibly and justly that’s what Jesus Christ came down and laid down. Love one another cause you’re all the same and love God your creator. Sorry if that’s a lot
When Paul speaks of Sabbath days is he referring to the 7th day sabbath, or the feast days that are often called sabbath days in the Scriptures? Colossians 2:16 King James Version 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the SABBATH DAYS.
What has God commanded men to observe in memory of making this world we live in? Exodus 20:8-11 KJV Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
I think the young man in the gray tee-shirt does not understand that Gods love is free. He is in full control of everything even the chaos on the planet. He allows his creation to have free will so they can choose to love him, love each other and also to flourish with him. Lucifer chose to move outside of that love and try to create a love for himself that is not actually love. Lucifer understands that creating confusion creates rebellion and rebellion creates sin. Man did not understand that until Jesus Christ came to earth. Sin was in the old testament but we are even more aware of sin now than ever before. The spirit of God convicts the world of sin. I think this young man wants to know the truth but he is confused about the full understanding of Gods love for his creation.
22:29 I don't think turning towards God means you become God. It means you love and then obey God. But Lucifer looked at God and said "I know what You're about I can do that. I can be You" and then walked away from. God
I believe the young man asking about why God did not eliminate satan instead of sending him to the earth, I think Gods love and mercy has a role in that. Even though he sinned and or betrayed God, that He still viewed him as a creation of His and showed mercy and instead of initially eliminating him maybe He sent him to earth to allow for His plan with us to have freewill be effective, if He gave us the ability to choose without a choice then our free will would be useless. satan was in the absolute presence of God and satan made his choice to not love God at that moment just like the tree that Jesus cursed because it was in the face of eternity and did not bear fruit. So they are bound to their choices, just as we are with our choice to believe on His Son and or not to. He never wanted satan to fall and even more he does not want us to fall. When the kingdom of God is at hand we must choose to be apart of it or we miss it. DO NOT MISS IT.
Just some kids, finding a new toy and playing with it. These teens found a new word to use and try and use it in a way that "seems to make sense", but then throws it at Cliffe like it means something spiritual? "Not"! "Jesus is Our only Salvation and the way to Heaven...is to believe in Jesus and that He died for our sins and came back from the dead three days later! With His blood, washed away "all" of our sins so we have a path to be with Him in Heaven! God loves us all and He doesn't want anyone to be cast into the lake of fire! Take Jesus into your heart and life as your Savior before it's too late! "John 3 in the KJB", as there is are many passages like this in the KJB! God bless you Cliffe for trying to bring these youths to Our Lord! With 🙏's and 💖! (I know... "truth hurts").
It can be a bit painful to listen to young people try and find themselves intellectually, but it's ok, but the thing is they don't know when their answer is answered, and that is to me the thing that is frustrating.
If we love God we will want please God by obeying Him. We all know that our deeds speak louder than words. But do we really love Christ, as we say we do, if we don’t keep the 4th commandment, by keeping the sabbath day holy? Why are we not doing this? What is our excuse?
Why and for what may every child of God rejoice? Isaiah 61:10 King James Version 10 I will greatly rejoice in the Lord, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of RIGHTEOUSNESS ……
So... there is actually no "flaw" in this story. The reason it seems like God loves the "drama" is because there is a purpose behind it. God is sovereign and ultimately created everything for love and glorification. God wrote the perfect story to best show his grace, power, mercy, love, righteousness, divine nature, justice and everything else. God used Satan's rebellion to glorify himself.
Why isn't a human putting words into the gods mouth for you blasphemy? I find it profoundly diminishing to the character of a deity to accept that they need human agents, or books to communicate. That kind of god is indistinguishable from a god that doesn't actually exist.
@@mmorphy4258 What the heck are you talking about? Why is a human speaking for a potent god not an insult to your intelligence? You made a judgement, and you chose to throw insult, but you haven't actually answered the question at all. Why do you want to protect the idea of an incompetent, impotent deity? Why isn't that blasphemy? How about you keep your judgements to yourself and answer the question, jackass.
@@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESS Wasn't meant as an insult. My last comment was a serious one. My point is we are both in no position to judge the method God chooses to reveal Himself. God is Spirit. The claim of the Bible is that it is all INSPIRED by God. God did not PHYSICALLY write anything with His own hands, Jesus did not PHYSICALLY write anything with His own hands. He had His faithful servants record it all. Whether God used inspired men to write his Word, or if Jesus Himself wrote everything you still would find some thread to pull on and try to justify not believing. Because believing would mean things we do are wrong. And we would have to change. Anyways, I don't know who you are or what you have been through. But I know we both are a part of this same intense reality. It is my personally realization through experience and reasoning that God is real, the Bible is true, and Jesus is the answer to your suffering. I just ask you humble yourself, get down on your knees, cry out to God and ask for help to see Him and to KNOW HIM. If you're still reading this maybe there is hope in the near future. The key to all of this is humbling yourself. The proud and arrogant never find God.
@@mmorphy4258 What kind of world are you living in where one of us calling the other arrogant for asking a FLAMING QUESTION isn't an intended insult? I meant what I darn well said - if more of us were like you, they would have thrown rocks at anyone suggesting we 'leave Platos cave'. As far as the logic you are employing goes, they would be right to do so, 'the shadows on the wall of the cave are all there are, all there ever will be, and how ARROGANT of you to think there a world beyond the shadows on the wall of the cave?' , in your words, paraphrased. AGAIN you insult and commit blasphemy against what I would describe as a greater god than the one you are defending. If god gave us reason, you are committing blasphemy against THAT god by saying there could ever be anything wrong with curiosity, or wanting to know how something even works. If someone keeps stepping over the green vine with stripes (a snake, hidden), it is the fool who doesn't need to know why. As you perhaps might caution someone from a hell that I don't accept, I would tell you, you are entertaining a blasphemy to a god that values reason and wisdom and a human spirit capable of learning. Only ignorance is perpetuated by those who discourage questions - a question that has not been answered is far better than a Truth That Must Not Be Questioned. In all the text you wrote, not once did you even try to answer the question I asked, and you had the ARROGANCE to demand I do as you say, when you can't even attempt to answer the question. You are NOT dispensing wisdom, you're perpetuating ignorance.
To live without purpose is miserable. It is nicer to have some kind of purpose. I have a cat. He has no purpose. But he’s sitting on me purring and I’m stroking him. He looks happy and that makes me happy. That is all.
@@chesterdonnelly1212 But why happy if you're a true nihilist? Why be happy? If there is no God and life is meaningless, why not be a bum or worst? How about being more homeless than you can't afford to be homeless? Why not dream of nothing, which is what rocks dreamed of in the first place? Rocks are too stupid to know that they are stupid. It's an insult to a rock who cannot comprehend the mass persecution that we do to them. For example, we use rocks for houses and molding. Yet, what's funny is that rocks don't know how to feel pain. According to Jordan Peterson, conscience zero is a rock. At least a plant is a little smarter than a rock. I see nihilism to be a pessimistic dreamer. Imagine God created you to be a rock. You won't know what happiness is. You won't know what existence means. You're not even alive because you were meant to be enslaved for tools. If a human throws you into war, you will crack into two as a rock. Aristotle pondered about rocks one time. I now know what rocks are. They are worthless scum to the point they don't know that we can insult them however we wish them to be. If you're not conscience level three, you're not human or even sentient.
What scripture shows that God’s remnant people will have a right conception of the proper relation between the law and the gospel? Revelation 14:12 “Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.” King James Version (KJV)
Brothers what you should have said was that God allowed sin into the world so He can manifest His glory. Remember, we were created for His own good pleasure...so the fello was right when he suggested that God takes pleasure in what He does in some ways..
I want to give an honest answer to the question in the title of this video "Can A Nihilist Be Joyful?". The obvious answer is, no, a nihilist cannot be joyful by definition because if someone is convinced that life is meaningless then that idea they are convinced is true will cause them to be emotionally indifferent, at best, they won't feel anything at all and at worst, they will be depressed all of the time, however, that wouldn't necessarily mean they are not factually correct, and the question of whether or not they are factually correct is much more important than whether or not they are happy with what they are convinced is true. I'm not an atheist because atheism makes me happy, let me be very clear and honest here, atheism does NOT make me happy, there are OTHER things that make me happy in life and get me out of bed in the morning, sure, but being an atheist is NOT one of those things, in fact, I find atheism depressing in principle because if for argument's sake, there is no God and no life after death then whilst there maybe meaning within the moment and there might be some things that give me a sense of meaning and happiness for a while as I said, there will be no ultimate meaning to my life or any of our lives, I agree, Cliffe is right in that ultimate sense. That thought is certainly a depressing one, not a happy one at all, but the reason I am an atheist is that I can see a big question mark over God's existence and the claims of Christianity, as well as other theistic claims such as Islam and over the idea that there is a life after death and whether I like it or not (and I don't like it) the question mark is, nevertheless there and it won't go away by me just wanting to believe God exists and wanting to believe there is a life after death and some grand purpose to it all just because it makes me feel joyful to believe it and it's not going to go away by telling me that if there is no God then life is ultimately pointless, I AGREE with those of you who say that but that still doesn't tell me whether or not there is a God or any subsequent ultimate purpose. The only way to get rid of this question mark once and for all is either for someone to come up with such a brilliant argument for theism that I would have no choice but to renounce atheism, or better still if God/Jesus were to manifest himself to me face to face in such a way that his existence would be an indisputable fact to me. If there really is a God/Jesus and he confirmed his existence to me once and for all, try stopping me from being a Christian, I'd be just like Cliffe is here, doing what he's doing, you wouldn't be able to shut me up about Christianity if I thought it was all true. I know I type a lot but if you think I write 'essays' now, just give me five minutes face to face with God/Jesus to confirm he is real to me and then you'll REALLY get essays from me, not to mention videos of me telling the world why I renounced atheism. Five minutes face to face with God/Jesus and I would JOYFULLY throw atheism in the incinerator. Five minutes, face to face with God/Jesus, that is all I would need and if there is a God/Jesus then he will know my heart and he will know that I mean every single word that I have typed here and I do absolutely, wholeheartedly do mean it.
Did you watch the video or try to answer the question blind? I suggest you watch, if you did, watch again please, Cliffe tells how nothing has meaning without God, a transcendent, objective foundation for truth & morals. Epistemological, how do you make sense of origin of universe/life, meaning of life, objective morality, destiny, order, logic, beauty we see in reality cohesive together with your worldview? What is your objective foundation for truth/morality? How do you know its reliable? "the reason I am an atheist is that I can see a big question mark over God's existence and the claims of Christianity" Care to cite any specific examples to discuss? "if God/Jesus were to manifest himself to me face to face in such a way that his existence would be an indisputable fact to me. " How would you know you're really seeing Jesus/God face to face & not a drug induced trip or bad food poisoning? You're subjective experience wont convince you if He appeared to you, as Cliffe said, look at the objective evidence beyond your subjective, fallible perception, the supernaturally prophetic (Romans 1:26-31/2 Timothy 4:3/Matthew 24:6/1 Corinthians 1:18), historically verified (archaeologically & anthropologically, enemy/early/multiple attestation, internal consistency, embarrassing reports, etc.) & transcendentally, objectively moral (Exodus 20/Matthew 22:37-40) Bible of the triune God. That, along with the cohesive explanation of the universe in my first paragraph. I eagerly await your response. I pray the triune God of the Bible reveals Himself to you, God bless, John!
@@robmc120 Thanks for your reply, sure, I'll respond. I take your point about the origin of the universe, life and reality etc. I don't claim to have an explanation for any of it, and if any atheist here tries to claim they do have all the answers to it then they are mistaken, I'm being very straight with you here but as I have said here before, not having an explanation for these things doesn't equal 'therefore God must be the answer'. My response to these big questions about the origin of reality and life etc, at the moment, is simply to say I DO NOT KNOW. I can't rule God out, I'll give you that much, I'm an agnostic atheist, not a hard atheist. Now, you also asked me in response to my point about God/Jesus showing himself to me "how would you know you're really seeing Jesus/God face to face & not a drug-induced trip or bad food poisoning?" Hope you won't be offended when I say this, because I'm not trying to offend anyone, I'm trying to have an honest discussion about this but I always find this question odd coming from what I presume is a Christian or some kind of a theist. I will, however, try to answer it in such a way that you will hopefully understand why I find the question odd coming from you all. For a start, let me put it this way, do you believe that God/Jesus will one day appear in front of us all, face to face to judge the world? If not, then let me know. I presume you do believe that though, now, here comes my point, if and when this happens and he is standing face to face with me and judging me, do you think I will be able to deny it and wonder if I might be having a drug-induced trip THEN or do you think I will have to accept that it is really happening?? Can you see my point? God/Jesus ought to be able to show himself in such a way that it is beyond all reasonable doubt. Look, if God/Jesus truly exists, this God/Jesus, who is the supposedly most powerful and omniscient being of all who supposedly brought everything into existence and he showed himself to me, do you honestly believe that I could even think about dismissing it as some kind of a delusion? With the greatest respect to you my friend and I appreciate your response but please do me a favour, and think about what you're saying to me here more carefully. What you're actually doing here is you're underestimating the very being that you profess to believe in by even suggesting that if he showed himself to me I could possibly dismiss it as a trip, this is meant to be the creator of the whole of this reality we're talking about here, coming face to face with such a being by virtue would have to be an absolutely undeniable reality if it happened. Now, if I, as an agnostic atheist can understand that, then surely YOU must understand that, so let's stop all of this "if God/Jesus showed himself to you how would you know you're not tripping?" stuff, can we? And instead, let's have a SENSIBLE discussion about it because I am willing to change my mind but all that kind of gaslighting kind of stuff isn't going to change my mind, and I don't think you're purposely gaslighting me, I think you're responding honestly in yourself but to ask someone "hey, if Jesus showed himself to you how would you know it's not a delusion?", that is a form of inadvertent gaslighting.
I didn't read your whole comment carefully, so forgive me if I ask something you've already addressed. I've been a nihilist my entire life. I've never been made aware of any objective meaning to life. I experience joy every day. I'm joyful that I'm alive and that I get to have happy and beautiful experiences with others. You might be depressed if you were a nihilist but how can you know what is happening in my mind?
@@spooky6902 I know. I guess what I'm actually doing here is presenting the best case scenario for the theist position against nihilism in order to demonstrate that it's STILL irrelevant as far as whether it's factually correct or not goes. In other words, even IF you turned around and said "yeah, I am convinced that life is meaningless and this belief has left me without joy and is making me miserable" that STILL wouldn't mean that you're wrong, and that's all that matters. If life is meaningless then it's meaningless, whether that makes us depressed or not wouldn't change that if that is a fact.
@@JohnCashin I agree that our joy or depression is irrelevant to the truth of whether there is objective meaning or not. You started your comment by saying you were answering the question in the video title. My answer is, yes, I am a nihilist who is often joyful and generally happy that I get to have any quality of life at all. I don't need objective meaning to be joyful, even though it might make me more joyful. Is there anything wrong with that answer?
17:00 I might *completely* wrong here but I'll say what I have to say so that somebody can challenge me to refine the ideas God created everything. Everything that is Godly is good. And everything that is ungodly is evil. This means that evil exists only in so far as it is the corruption of good (paraphrase CS Lewis) But maybe good and evil exist separate from God. It's like a substructure to reality eg. the roads we walk on. If you walk on the road, you are doing good. But if you don't, then you are doing evil. Angels are a creation of God but they aren't all good. They are servants of God, but still have the capacity to rebel. They can walk behind God on the road, or like Lucifer they can say "To heck with that I'm going my own way". But God doesn't condemn them. They condemn themselves by walking off the road, onto the dirt path that ends up in the desert instead of paradise. But why did God create angels that can turn away? I have no idea. If he didn't, then we probably wouldn't be asking these questions, which is kind of a loose version of the anthropic principle perhaps?
When asked the question about what about those who haven't heard. Why did you not go to Romans 1 and discuss how all are without excuse and how men suppress the truth in unrighteousness?
What else must we do beside saying Lord, Lord, to enter into the kingdom of heaven? King James Version Matthew 7:21 21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
What did God cause to cease when Jesus died on the cross? Daniel 9:26-27 King James Version 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate
is it possible that because god is literally the characteristics of goodness itself and also being eternal and also a holy trinity, wen it is just a cycle of love between the trinity then there is nothing else to do but spread that love, and we know self sacrificial love for true good transcendental values for god and others, is true love that this is the first time in eternity, where in order to create and spread that type of true love, he has to begin this chains of true evil beginning to fall, and so all these stories and words fall into place, to produce suffering, to build us character. so ultimately, we can find true love and happiness that would be about the only explanation that god would allow angels to fall and not just nip it in the bud, but because it needs to happen to produce a true love, in free will creation, which is probably the first time god is trying to work with, hence we see him change methods like from using one people to justly judge another, and realizing another methods needs to happen like jesus christ and then finally ending all of evil at the end, but its not without fruit, its the end of evil, and the idea and true love that came from human beings that managed to listen to his word correctly is very poetic, and just, than just the eternal trinity loving each other in cycle, nothing else happening, they really wanted to have free will creation experience true love, and thus true love has true evil, which creates true love, its the only way that can actually be true love i think i also understand cliff on the idea of all powerful all knowing as in being able to see the future like hes said before , the foundation of how god could understand how to work with humanity is, not in the sense if knowing the future in the mind like being able to prevent things automatically at the flick of a second and not just nipping evil in the bud, but rather being able to look into past present future, and literally looking at moments or the passage of time, at any place and person and he can decide what to do from there, also highly possible he can understand and know a person, their every thought but only in a way that he can sense the current emotion and thought, and of course he's the creator of creation, he knows exactly how it works and what is suppose to feel like, makes predictions based off the current human, message, and place, and setting, and of course in order for free will to exist, he cannot directly control, thus he has to just predict, and he's a very good predicter, perfect and yes, its possible to be a creator, all knowing, and limit his power, which isnt a paradox, in fact should change the term into, holding his power, not limit in the sense of reducing his power thus making the claim for him to be all powerful all knowing untrue, but hes basically being full power and basically just choosing to not do anything (not choosing to do nothing in the sense of letting free will creation have their free will ruined but that he is not doing anything in the sense so we can have free will) , unless hes doing a indirect action to progress a persons building of character to find true meaning and fulfillment of love, now i know executing indirect actions or directly helping human beings learn about god or give them a discplinary lesson, seems like it contradicts free will and how god is suppose to not contradict free will, but it does make sense, we still have free will, an intelligent mind, critical thinking skills, that still allow us to ultimately, choose to believe or not believe in god, or support or reject him, which is literally a real relationship, and we should treat it seriously and respect it as such sorry everyone, idk if im even being biblical or logical anymore talking out of my imagination or mouth , but this is what i try to bring my logical reasoning to, if that is what you can call it
I love their tag team and how quick they are. When Cliffe says: “Good, Stuart, go”, he doesn’t waste a second. 😂
This means that Stuart has to listen very carefully to what Cliffe is talking about and be constantly ready to add something to your own.
Unfortunately he is trying to talk over the person he is trying to have a discussion with. One talker at a time.
@@artificialintelligence8388 Arguably the student is the one jumping in. He is finishing his point
@@artificialintelligence8388 Its pretty obvious that the student isn't letting Stuart finish his sentence. The student does similar with Cliffe later.
Great work guys!
The Joy of the Lord is my strength🙏✝️🕊
The joy of the Lord is thine strength ❤
@@gersonbatres5826 Wow, l wrote this comment a yr ago and you read it now
That is a Blessing.
Yes l am a witness, the Joy of the Lord does give me strength or l would never make it.
May the Lord Bless Thee and Keep Thee 🌸🕊❤️✝️
Cliffe and Stuart, you are doing God's work speaking to these college students. God bless you and your ministry.
Cliff and Stuart roll off each other like Dre and snoop back in the day. Lol
This comment is based
Such a stark difference between his older & newer videos of students asking questions: 20/30 years ago, students listened to the answer patiently, _maybe_ interjecting clarification if Cliffe wasn't answering the question asked; 2 students in this video now were _already_ ready with their next question, regardless what Cliffe & Stuart answered, they didn't listen, they just wanted to speak "their truth", not *THE* truth, it wasnt a dialogue, it was an interrogation, that's why they moved on.
Great questions though & better answers, as no other worldview has an objective foundation for morality cohesive with reality we all live in.
I always pray the triune God of the supernaturally prophetic (Romans 1:26-31/2 Timothy 4:3/Matthew 24:6/1 Corinthians 1:18), historically verified (archaeologically & anthropologically, enemy/early/multiple attestation, internal consistency, embarrassing reports, etc.) & transcendentally, objectively moral (Exodus 20/Matthew 22:37-40) Bible reveal Himself to you in Spirit & objective truth (John 16:13). May God bless you, Knechtle's & reader!
Jesus loves you ❤
SALVATION IS ONLY IN YESHUA (JESUS) 🙌
Been watching these videos for two years, these guys are patiently and effectively doing the Lord’s work. So proud of them.
I love seeing Cliff and Stewart tag teaming together. I remember years ago watching this show on the weekend as a kid when I lived in CT. Little did I know I’d end up rooming with Stewart’s cousin David in college. Wonderful family.
Stuart*
Great job Cliffe and Stuart! We admire the work you're doing with college aged young people
Praise to our Lord Jesus Christ for Stuart and Cliffe. God bless you guys.
Love the point made by Cliffe on faith. He is 1000% correct.
I'm new to watching your channel. I must say, you guys blow me away. The examples you use, the precision you have is just inspiring. I love you guys!
God loves you ❤
"And my speech and my preaching were not with enticing words of man’s wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power" 1 Corintios 2:4
"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God"
Ephesians 6:17
Just more word of God :)
Great thing you do.
God bless.
Bring forth righteousness and fortitude upon thine own being, upon thy holy shield of power and glory, let it be so ..Book of Bonnie 1:6 . it's quite easy to combine lots of nice looking words into a rambling sentence that people can make their own interpretation of. And then argue about what it really means. I dare say I could write an entire passage of vague ramblings.
@@bonnie43uk I am so inspired by your words, where can I send my tithes and offerings? 😇
God bless you Cliffe and Stuart 🙏
Stuart. Man. That was awesome. I love that.
I need to share the gospel more, you set a great example. Interesting to contrast your method with Ray Comforts. I wonder which method is more effective. He appeals to the persons conscience using the law, whereas you use logic, reason, and evidence.
It depends on the person. Some will acknowledge philosophical arguments. Some evidential. Others presuppositional. You have to use the method the person would respond to.
@@chriseasterly5142 that’s right. I find myself using a mix of all evangelists I’ve seen, plus a bit of my own methods.
@@chriseasterly5142 I second this, adjusting based on who you are talking to is key. You must meet them in their own playing field.
I think college kids generally think they are too smart for religion (I did) and so when they are faced with someone who can out intellectualise them, they become humbled and realize they should listen up. Whereas if you were to "street preach" to them, they would write you off as crazy. Apologetics serves as the base for these students.
such a good one! nice job guys
I wish I could go to Grace community church
Have you ever lied, stolen, used God's name in vain, looked wuth lust? if so you need to repent today and Believe in Jesus Christ to save you from Hell and go to heaven instead
@@JesusisGodandKingofkimgs I've already been born again. Thank you!
That was a very hard question I wouldn’t know how to answer. I think I understood what the gentleman was trying to communicate and truly I don’t know how ego and pride came about onto Lucifer with feeling the fullness of His presence
I dont think we know enough about what happened through biblical text. I assume an all loving God would have given Lucifer an opportunity to turn away from his sin by repenting. Yet, the same all loving God gave Lucifer essentially what he wanted-his own kingdom.
OK "lucifer" is mentioned ONCE in the entire bible ( Isaiah I think ) it refers to a BABYLONIAN KING and REPEADLY refers to him as *"A MAN"*
what i’ve learned in my limited studies is lucifer was a worship leader and so he was able to hear his voice and see his reflection because he was one of the only angels allowed behind the throne of God, and when he heard a plan of God to develop man with free will, he revolted believing that a lesser being would not be able to serve God. Take it with an grain of salt, it requires some texts that aren’t cannon like book of enoch
@@JonnyHalftoni don’t remember reading that in Enoch. What else u got?
Would love to have a conversation to that two guys and the people whichever would be around 😊
The Gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing ( "major flaw" like the gentleman said ) but it is the power of God to salvation to christians. A stumbling block to the jews and foolishness to the gentiles.
I was really hoping they had an answer for the Lucifer point because that was a great point
I dunno if you know your comparative religions, but the Lucifer character is thought by a number of scholars to be stolen from Ahriman (the Accuser) of neighboring, contemporary religion of Zoarastria.
If I may try to clarify, God created angels and humans with free will. Free will to choose to reject or accept God's ways. Otherwise there is no real love because real love allows us the ability to choose. I cannot force a woman to marry me, that's not love. Lucifer chose to reject God's ways from the beginning, that's why Jesus said lucifer was a liar and murderer from the beginning. God has appointed a time where all the fallen angels will be in the lake of fire forever, to us seems like we've been waiting a long time for that day but to God all this may be just a millisecond. Who knows. But by definition God is merciful and patient, so the question is why not God snuff out lucifer from the start. The answer is similar to why doesn't God snuff out every human the moment they committed their first sin? If God destroyed every human at their first sin there would literally be no life in the universe right now. That's not God's design or ultimate plan for us. Fallen angels don't get a chance at forgiveness but humans do. That's part of the reason why lucifer wants to deceive as many of us as possible before his appointed time in the lake of fire. Nobody will ever live a sinless life, but God's love is so great he is willing to be patient with us humans. We think it's taking a long time but in God's time this is a blink of an eye.
@@Tunnelvision29 You clarify nothing. None of what you said explains, and in fact it all obfuscates. It is dishonest to assert as if fact that which is not evidently verifiable.
You don't get clarity without facts that are 'truthfully' indicative.
Your lot redefine love when it suits you for women anyhow. Cheap, but fairly broad shot accurate swipe, that.
@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESS you're terribly misinformed if you think what I said isn't backed by biblical principle. Also you believe lucifer is this idea stolen from another religion, tells me you have a preconceived notion of Christianity with no basis to even understand biblical principle. Also the example I gave about real love and the ability to choose for oneself is as honest as it gets. If you don't agree you're probably that weirdo that would stalk his high school crush around school. You should do like your name says and mind your own business.
@@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESSwhat a nothingburger you wrote. Free will is the answer if you can’t comprehend it that’s on you.
If you are looking for another good topic to study look into the behaviors of nihilism, we don't always realize it but these behaviors are demonstrated around us often. It was Nietzsche who admitted people would replace religion and belief in God with nihilistic behaviors. One of the most common is the method to reduce something to it's elements to suggest it is less meaningful. Such as taking a person and reducing them to another animal, a clump of cells, or a set of quantum fields. Saying a hug is just a momentary close proximity. Another example is taking words and replacing them with other words that have reduced meaning like many of the issues in politics. Suggesting apathy instead of facing something that effects the common good is a form of nihilistic behavior. Perhaps more should be discussed about this and why nihilism is bad for the common good of civilization.
Unified evidence of the world, people, and all the systems together require a designer to be trusted. The way to disregard this evidence is to deconstruct and reduce things to their elements with nihilism, then declare from your limited position there is no evidence. Curiosity is the default position, many have been taught deconstructive nihilism along the way and now repeat it. The world, universe, and people as a whole require meaning and purpose or it withers, weakness emerges, and fails. When something is true because it is self-evident and when there exists the impossibility of the contrary it shifts the burden of proof to the claim of the negative. Read the Federalist Papers and the Declaration of Independence for the idea of God given rights and self-evident truth, that have built and unified people to escape the nihilism that many are trying to substitute in it’s place.
Is nihilism a big thing where you are boltrook?, I don't personally know ANY nihilists, no one has ever said to me they are a nihilist, I have of course met lots of atheists, none of us are claiming that life has no meaning, we all have meaning and purpose in our lives. I don't think it comes up on any population census when people are asked about belief in God, certainly not here in the UK.
@@bonnie43uk Nihilism isn’t always a conscious behavior. It’s a symptom of certain ways of thinking, a psychological phenomenon. I study psychology as an amateur, I find it fascinating how ideas generate common detectable psychological markers. A common nihilistic behavior is reducing a whole and complete thing to it’s elements in how you think about them, a whole person has a unified meaning we can detect but if you reduce a person to seeing them as a collection of atoms they blend with everything else with atoms as having no distinguishable importance. Atheism is closely related to nihilism because of it’s logical conclusions. Atheism doesn’t allow purpose and meaning to exist in reality, in the make-up of things, it lacks intellectual grounding for that, you admit it yourself that you create the meaning and purpose in your mind, it’s not inherent to material reality in that framework. This way of thinking is much more drawn to nihilism because your mind is as temporary as your life and meaning so it is prone to the existential dread of the loneliness of inevitably being pulled apart from everyone and everything.
@@boltrooktwo Like i said my friend, I don't know of anyone who claims to be a nihilist, is it a big thing where you live? Your view of atheism sounds really bleak, but my life is pretty pretty good. I'm sure there are just as many lonely Christians as there are lonely atheists. Loneliness is certainly not something that I suffer from.
@@bonnie43uk Nihilism isn’t something a lot of people know about but it is something a lot more people do in recent years. Someone can convince themselves in their head they are the greatest but really behave like a nihilist.
Angelic beings also had free will, what they didn’t/don’t have is the ability to reproduce.
respectfully, you are incorrect. Genesis 6 :4 says the nephilim had children with the daughters of men. those nephilim were the offspring of fallen angels and humans.
soo good
The last guy's question was so deep and if cliffe was not so stubborn and listened he may have liked it. He was asking about the father-son relationship of god and Lucifer and how god could have shown love then and avoided all this suffering.
I'm just saying, if I watched this video without sound, it would look like an epic tag team rap battle
Dude said nihilism is correct while have a cross tattoo on his arm? Confused.
Clearly, he wasn't certain about his nihilism, you could see it from his attitude. I wish him to keep searching and get to the truth.
@@nikokapanen82 Yes, pray for him. I think nihilism fit his current worldview. He mentioned ‘Yolo(you only live once)’ as motivation for his worldview. Pretty simplistic understanding of life.
He is like the 99 sheep story, like he said he went to bible school, he knows Jesus but is lost right now in worldly ways
I think the kid who brought up the question of why would God go through the drama brings up some interesting points, one’s I’ve definitely contemplated myself. If I was to have any response to it, I think that it would need to have an answer that more relates to things that are not within the confines of time, what we perceive as millennia , God sees as an instant, God is not allowing huge amounts of time and suffering within that to go on, his correction from his perspective has already happened. In addition you also have to also take into consideration of the process that mind has to go thru in order to be healed of lower thoughts. God creating of itself while being of perfection, also has to embody that which is imperfect in order to be perfect. That seems contradictory but it’s not, if God encompasses everything then even his creations, his thoughts and life force, has to have everything in it to be considered flawless, even the flawed.
Also Satan has never asked God for forgiveness and unfortunately will never ask. Satan represents our egotistic, selfish, proud world. This is a simple point I would of brought up to that student asking why God just didn’t nip it in the bud
I live in Austin by the way:)
I wouldn't use the cyanide argument maybe an untraceable toxin would be a better fit for your point.
For the man that basically asked "why did God remove the fallen angels, rather than converse with them?" He's presuming God didn't. Whether or not God did have the conversation, He still gave them the free will to stay in faith or to fall from grace. Just as The Lord gave Adam and Eve not to eat the fruit from The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
love jesus
These postmodernists often think 'it's a social construct' inherently negates the importance of things. Of course we have social constructs, and they're deeply important and inherent to who we are as humans. Every one of these people whos says this turns right around and uses social constructs all day, every day in their lives. It's like trying to pretend language isn't important because they're just 'made-up sounds.' Our conventions, traditions, beliefs, etc are what give us meaning, depth, connection, and culture.
We live in a world of intellect,knowledge and answers . So many people in this world will go to hell because of their lack of knowledge and intellect of God because they can't get all their answers. So sad and so lack of faith will send them to hell.
What shall be said of those who turn many to righteousness?
Daniel 12:3
King James Version
3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
My council to pastors of churches is to have church on Saturdays and Sundays. Tell the people that Saturday is the true Sabbath but nevertheless it’s going to be a double whammy. Because we’re going have church on Sunday too. This will be a peaceful transition. By the way you’ll notice the difference between the two days.
It's difficult to fathom how there was such a thing as the fallen Angel's, and there was war in Heaven, but I guess we have to remember God is a holy God, and his ways, though they may seem to be a round about way to us, is God's own way. We need to dig deep to know Gods character, and our only source for that is the Bible.
I want to visit your church some day but I live in FL. Once I save up some money I would love to come up there
Their church have their own youtube channel: www.youtube.com/@gracecommunitychurchnewcanaan
I believe the guy at 16:00 questions was really supposed to be phrased “if sin originiated outside of the earth to begin with. Why did god not deal with Satan then , instead of creating the earth and all of us to go through the sin problem we have now all because of how satan tried to be God.” Lol
Yes, I think you're right. And sometimes Cliffe doesn't answer the questions very directly. But that guy was pretty, umm, sassy...especially when Cliffe asked him his thoughts on Jesus. Atheists don't understand that this is a relevant question when trying to explain this stuff. Instead they get annoyed. Cuz most atheists are so....angry.
And I believe the answer to his question is:
If God had destroyed Satan the angels would have begun to serve Him from fear rather than from love. This would defeat the very purpose He had in creating beings with the power of choice and free will.
yes !
Big difference between the students in the videos 20 years ago and the ones now. 20 years ago the atheist students at least had logical questions and answers and were capable of reason. The students now just want to spew a phrase, and then not listen to the answer.
I do not agree, a lot of them had the same attitude
This is always so dire
Fire
Play word game 😂😂" 23:20 cliff trying to change the topic
❤️
When they go on and on about "a major flaw in Christianity" and then avoid talking about Christ.... they don't want an answer they want to complain.
MY SABBATH TESTIMONY.
Not knowing what day to keep, I kept both Saturday and Sunday as the Sabbath; But I noticed a distinct difference on Saturday.
My concentration was particularly enhanced.
However because I was a person with very low concentration, with subsequent low intellect, I really noticed this concentration.
But now that my concentration levels have risen to at least average intelligence, I hardly notice this increase in concentration that’s happening on the 7th day sabbath. But nevertheless it’s still happening although most of the time imperceptibly.
And as we all receive the same amount of light when we get born again; However those who were in great darkness particularly notice it because of the greatness of the contrast.
So too was it with me, with the noticing this extra concentration that God is pouring onto us on the sabbath.
I particularly noticed it because my concentration levels were so low.
However you’ll notice that the congregation will more easily be able to pay attention on the Saturday compared to the Sunday and also they will become mentally stronger and grow intellectually.
In all work, be it big or small, we obtain a healthy God given motivation, as we admire our achievements, and give ourselves a pat on the back. And this is totally ok.
But by ceasing from the admiration of ourselves on the 7th day, by refraining from work, as much as possible, and resting, it allows us to more fully admire God, without the impediment of our own self admiration, which we obtain when doing our chores.
Also in Isaiah 58 it says to abstain from our pleasures on the sabbath. Go without them. And by doing this we don’t tap out of the noticeable blessing that God is generously pouring forth. Believe me, you’ll be mightily blessed. God bless you.
The servant of all, that’s me, that’s Paul,
The son of John and Winnifred Hunt, from New Zealand.
Do you think God is concerned that most, if not all Christians regard the day of rest and prayer on a Sunday as opposed to Saturday Paul?, all my life I've known Sunday as the traditional Holy day of the week. I'm well aware that for Jews it's the Saturday.
Has God actually changed the Sabbath day?
Is it really Sunday and not Saturday? Yes the sabbath day has been changed. But God didn’t change it. Constantine did this. Therefore the day has never changed although man might say otherwise. It’s written in stone by God Himself. The 4th commandment is changeless.
@@paulwilfridhunt he gave it to man as a day of rest though so I’m not so sure it has to be Saturday
@@BrockJamesStory Yes well I wasn’t sure either, but just as our Christian testimony with the Lord of Lords, and King of Kings, Jesus Christ, Our Saviour, makes us sure, because it validates that God is in our lives; My sabbath testimony makes me sure that Saturday is indeed the right day.
The 7th day is Saturday.
@@paulwilfridhunt of course the 7th day is Saturday, but it’s more of a question of why did God give us the sabbath?
It was a day of rest because we need to rest.
I treat everyday as the Lords day the best I can, of course there are times I fail.
How constant should our rejoicing be?
Philippians 4:4
“Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.”
King James Version (KJV)
Cliffs hands are very well manicured. He speaks with his hands. He offers his hands. The kids are hiding their hands. Who’s hands do you trust?
@@robertmitchell-tv5yf I’m just an observer. You’ll have to look within yourself that answer.
@@robertmitchell-tv5yf if you want to open a dialect with me then your going to need to do better than sinister.
@@robertmitchell-tv5yf I’m not sure what’s really going on here. Of course your interesting!
Look if you want to have a debate then I’ll hear you out. Announce your position. Form a strong argument. Stick to what you know. Communicate your position clearly. Form a conclusion.
@@j_p_jr.487 I got a buddy who is an ER surgeon. He works 24 hour shifts. He’s got nice hands. He is a very hard worker.
@@j_p_jr.487 I used to be a latent print examiner.
Occupational hazard. Lol
I think what the young man at 22.00 minutes was asking was why did God create Lucifer with a sinful nature? And when lucifer sinned, instead of dealing with it in the heavenly realms, why did God chased Lucifer and his angels out into earth and thereby causing Adam and Eve to sin ; and from then onwards man was born with a sinful nature. Then later God sent his son, Jesus , to earth to save mankind. That’s why the young man commented that God loves a drama. 22:03
lol no.. i remember when i was a atheist nihilist.... i wasnt happy at all.....like you cant be happy..... well unless you have the memory of a goldfish which is like what 15 seconds....
The kids at 4:30 does not wait his turn 💀
I love cliff, and typically, his(and his sons) answers are spot on but when it comes to the guy at 16:06 idk if they didn't understand what he was asking or just didn't break down there answer well enough but that could've been handled more meticulously
The guys issue was virtually why God didn't deal with Satan and his followers initially in heaven whether it be by talking to them and/or eradicating them and secondly how its just for God to judge them in the manner he did if everything they were was the image of himself.
This guys questions have a few assumptions, but those aside the root of it is just misunderstanding one God and Satan (lucfier).
The man’s thoughts on why God didn’t snuff Lucifer when he rebelled wasn’t answered by Cliff and Stewart. The answer is, God gave angels free will just as he gave to mankind. Free will makes us accountable to what we say, do, and think. Snuffing Lucifer would have eliminated his free will instead of making Lucifer accountable at the time of judgement. We will all be judged. Seek Jesus while He may be found.
The answer is Lucifer is part of God's plan. If Jesus wasn't "murdered", we wouldn't be saved.
The question of why did God not discipline Lucifer right after he rebelled back into humility is not answered. We just do not know why God allows so much evil to thrive for such a long time.
The truth the that question is we do not know why god allowed lucifer to do that
@@nikokapanen82 Why evil occurs on earth, is because God is arguably giving everyone a "fair shot" where he does not directly impede on anyone's free-will. For example I could bully you, God respects both of our free-will therefore will not interfere directly. However on my death, I will be dealt with accordingly
I dont think we know enough about what happened through biblical text. I assume an all loving God would have given Lucifer an opportunity to turn away from his sin by repenting. Yet, the same all loving God gave Lucifer essentially what he wanted-his own kingdom.
Amen 🙏🏼
There have been different nihilist positions, including that human values are baseless, that life is meaningless, that knowledge is impossible.
I believe it would be difficult for a nihilist to make many friends,
on the other hand, an atheist is not troubled by an angry, jealous, needy god - so free thought and joy is possible.
The reason that there have been different nihilist positions is because there are many types of nihilism.
The most common types are:
Existential Nihilism
Cosmic Nihilism (Cosmic Pessimism)
Ethical Nihilism (Moral)
Epistemological Nihilism
Political Nihilism.
So, I believe it is like painting with a broad brush when someone says it would be difficult for a nihilist to make many friends. I wouldn't think it would be any more difficult than someone who has social anxiety or a certain level of being an introvert. Just saying.
@@Generatorman59 Is nihilism a big thing in the US Jim?, it's something Cliffe mentions quite often in his debates with the students, i personally don't know of anyone who would claim to be a nihilist, all of us find our own purpose and meaning in life regardless of whether we believe in a God or not.
@@bonnie43uk I have not known any in my lifetime. I spent most of my life living in the South. It is known as the Bible Belt. Most people are Southern Baptist. They get their meaning from an imaginary sky daddy.
@@Generatorman59 Therein lies the problem, ... uncritical thinking and indoctrination.
@@bonnie43uk True. And I am always amazed when theists say that I am the one who is indoctrinated. They say that I am so entrenched in my lack of faith.
@askcliffe
When do y’all come to the UT campus?
When a Christian says that I'm "rebelling" against God it's the most frustrating thing.
First off how can I rebel against something I'm not sure exists?
How can I rebel against something that I'm actively seeking?
It's condescending and need to stop. It's exactly like when when a Christian says "I'm turning away from God because I love my sin".
This couldn't be further away from the truth and once again it's very condescending.
Thats the Christian shtick . What these Christians don’t understand is atheists can make similar declarations like
Oh, you know God doesn’t exist. You’re just afraid of the consequences of being honest with yourself.
Lol
Don't let it frustrate you. They have no choice but to believe those things, they are just being consistent with their ideology. Their claims are unfalsifiable so they can't possibly know that what they're saying is true. They're just going off of faith
All have sinned and come short of the glory of God,
@@dentonhahn2907 ok. Prove it.
@@Kenpachi_White707 what do you mean "prove it" can you prove anything? Prove you exist, that you are not just in my imagination. You can not. There is very little you can prove outside of mathematics, rather we look for evidence.
If I were there, I wouldn’t be able to stand the guy with the mask. He was asking questions yet he was talking over Cliffe and Stuart and not really listening to their responses.
Beside the weekly sabbath were there were special days every year in the Jewish calendar which in the Scriptures are often referred to as sabbaths?
Leviticus 23:24
King James Version
24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
The guy who asked the question about how God should have sat satin down and have a deep conversation with him, and said the same with Adam and Eve, needs to understand the concept of God’s holiness and righteousness. The perfectly righteous Father doesn’t just hate our sin and rebellion, He cannot stand it. He is set apart from it. It cannot be in His presence. He can’t and won’t “hang out and talk” with it. This is why Christ Jesus is said to be our advocate. We are given His righteousness by His grace through faith alone. You have to be willing to talk about Christ to understand God’s nature…
You apparently haven't read the beginning of Job, where God and Satan had a direct conversation with each other. Boink Tok Bing Flop.
17:00 he believed the demons when they told him they are equal to God. he on that mojo. He needs some milk.
Bringing Islam as an objective basis for morality, when the Quran keeps contradicting itself and says that what is evil in the Bible is good according to their false prophet, is either ignorant or just plain evil. I love what he is doing, but there is nothing good in Islam. Also, Islam is not monotheistic, it has daughters of Allah in it, and the tawhid means to make one, not one, so it means its making many false gods becoming as one. There is nothing Abrahamic about the death cult of Islam. Al = El = god, Lah = moon, Allah is a moon demon.
I have to say the hardest of the questions was the young man at 16:09 - 23:30 who raised a big concern with the way GOD addresses Sin and his loved creations. I love Cliffe and Stuart but I wish they would have taken what he said more seriously and addressed it. Anyone else feel this way?
I know what he’s saying. He’s basically asking why God gave us free will. Free will is where God limited his power so we may have choice. Going way back to Lucifer, God had strict rules and Lucifer was arrogant and wanted to do his own thing, being self centered. God made him to be the beautiful right hand to him and he wanted to be bigger than God so he got casted out. True love isn’t love if it’s not free that’s brainwashing/forcing you to do something because the creator has the overall say so. So there’s no flaw in His creation it’s the free will of us who choose not to follow him. So basically the punishment is to join the first being to be self centered and egotistical in hell in the kingdom of egos. We can still live we just have to live responsibly and justly that’s what Jesus Christ came down and laid down. Love one another cause you’re all the same and love God your creator. Sorry if that’s a lot
When Paul speaks of Sabbath days is he referring to the 7th day sabbath,
or the feast days that are often called sabbath days in the Scriptures?
Colossians 2:16
King James Version
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the SABBATH DAYS.
Can I come get trimmed by you guys to evangelize
What has God commanded men to observe in memory of making this world we live in?
Exodus 20:8-11 KJV
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
I think the young man in the gray tee-shirt does not understand that Gods love is free. He is in full control of everything even the chaos on the planet. He allows his creation to have free will so they can choose to love him, love each other and also to flourish with him. Lucifer chose to move outside of that love and try to create a love for himself that is not actually love. Lucifer understands that creating confusion creates rebellion and rebellion creates sin. Man did not understand that until Jesus Christ came to earth. Sin was in the old testament but we are even more aware of sin now than ever before. The spirit of God convicts the world of sin. I think this young man wants to know the truth but he is confused about the full understanding of Gods love for his creation.
Let Stuart talk bro like dang 💯
22:29 I don't think turning towards God means you become God. It means you love and then obey God. But Lucifer looked at God and said "I know what You're about I can do that. I can be You" and then walked away from. God
I believe the young man asking about why God did not eliminate satan instead of sending him to the earth, I think Gods love and mercy has a role in that. Even though he sinned and or betrayed God, that He still viewed him as a creation of His and showed mercy and instead of initially eliminating him maybe He sent him to earth to allow for His plan with us to have freewill be effective, if He gave us the ability to choose without a choice then our free will would be useless. satan was in the absolute presence of God and satan made his choice to not love God at that moment just like the tree that Jesus cursed because it was in the face of eternity and did not bear fruit. So they are bound to their choices, just as we are with our choice to believe on His Son and or not to. He never wanted satan to fall and even more he does not want us to fall. When the kingdom of God is at hand we must choose to be apart of it or we miss it. DO NOT MISS IT.
Life is meaningless... Why wear a mask? 😂
Good One!! 😂🤣
He's a disciple of Lord Fauci
GOT EM! lol...... Funny how thay contradict themselves all the time and sad.
Because they subjectively care about their lives. Nihilists don't believe in objective meaning. They still subjectively care about things
In my understanding, a nihilist doesn't believe in objective (intrinsic) meaning. That doesn't stop him/her from enjoying life and taking care of it.
Cliff do you ever come to California
Just some kids, finding a new toy and playing with it. These teens found a new word to use and try and use it in a way that "seems to make sense", but then throws it at Cliffe like it means something spiritual? "Not"! "Jesus is Our only Salvation and the way to Heaven...is to believe in Jesus and that He died for our sins and came back from the dead three days later! With His blood, washed away "all" of our sins so we have a path to be with Him in Heaven! God loves us all and He doesn't want anyone to be cast into the lake of fire! Take Jesus into your heart and life as your Savior before it's too late! "John 3 in the KJB", as there is are many passages like this in the KJB! God bless you Cliffe for trying to bring these youths to Our Lord! With 🙏's and 💖!
(I know... "truth hurts").
It can be a bit painful to listen to young people try and find themselves intellectually, but it's ok, but the thing is they don't know when their answer is answered, and that is to me the thing that is frustrating.
How old are these videos because looking outside I don't see any leaves on the trees
Remember be ye followers of Paul
Actually it can spontaneously happen 🤷🏻♀️ people can go from an unbeliever to a believer
If we love God we will want please God by obeying Him. We all know that our deeds speak louder than words. But do we really love Christ, as we say we do, if we don’t keep the 4th commandment, by keeping the sabbath day holy? Why are we not doing this? What is our excuse?
There is your weakness, your speaking to them through the natural man, who will see your rationale and reason as foolishness!
Just give nihilist mushrooms, get joy
Why and for what may every child of God rejoice?
Isaiah 61:10
King James Version
10 I will greatly rejoice in the Lord, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of RIGHTEOUSNESS ……
So... there is actually no "flaw" in this story. The reason it seems like God loves the "drama" is because there is a purpose behind it. God is sovereign and ultimately created everything for love and glorification. God wrote the perfect story to best show his grace, power, mercy, love, righteousness, divine nature, justice and everything else. God used Satan's rebellion to glorify himself.
Why isn't a human putting words into the gods mouth for you blasphemy? I find it profoundly diminishing to the character of a deity to accept that they need human agents, or books to communicate. That kind of god is indistinguishable from a god that doesn't actually exist.
@@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESS I find it incredibly arrogant for you to judge how God should choose to reveal Himself.
@@mmorphy4258 What the heck are you talking about? Why is a human speaking for a potent god not an insult to your intelligence? You made a judgement, and you chose to throw insult, but you haven't actually answered the question at all.
Why do you want to protect the idea of an incompetent, impotent deity?
Why isn't that blasphemy?
How about you keep your judgements to yourself and answer the question, jackass.
@@MINDYOUROWNBUISINESS Wasn't meant as an insult. My last comment was a serious one. My point is we are both in no position to judge the method God chooses to reveal Himself.
God is Spirit.
The claim of the Bible is that it is all INSPIRED by God. God did not PHYSICALLY write anything with His own hands, Jesus did not PHYSICALLY write anything with His own hands. He had His faithful servants record it all.
Whether God used inspired men to write his Word, or if Jesus Himself wrote everything you still would find some thread to pull on and try to justify not believing. Because believing would mean things we do are wrong. And we would have to change.
Anyways, I don't know who you are or what you have been through. But I know we both are a part of this same intense reality. It is my personally realization through experience and reasoning that God is real, the Bible is true, and Jesus is the answer to your suffering. I just ask you humble yourself, get down on your knees, cry out to God and ask for help to see Him and to KNOW HIM.
If you're still reading this maybe there is hope in the near future. The key to all of this is humbling yourself. The proud and arrogant never find God.
@@mmorphy4258 What kind of world are you living in where one of us calling the other arrogant for asking a FLAMING QUESTION isn't an intended insult?
I meant what I darn well said - if more of us were like you, they would have thrown rocks at anyone suggesting we 'leave Platos cave'. As far as the logic you are employing goes, they would be right to do so, 'the shadows on the wall of the cave are all there are, all there ever will be, and how ARROGANT of you to think there a world beyond the shadows on the wall of the cave?' , in your words, paraphrased.
AGAIN you insult and commit blasphemy against what I would describe as a greater god than the one you are defending.
If god gave us reason, you are committing blasphemy against THAT god by saying there could ever be anything wrong with curiosity, or wanting to know how something even works.
If someone keeps stepping over the green vine with stripes (a snake, hidden), it is the fool who doesn't need to know why.
As you perhaps might caution someone from a hell that I don't accept, I would tell you, you are entertaining a blasphemy to a god that values reason and wisdom and a human spirit capable of learning.
Only ignorance is perpetuated by those who discourage questions - a question that has not been answered is far better than a Truth That Must Not Be Questioned.
In all the text you wrote, not once did you even try to answer the question I asked, and you had the ARROGANCE to demand I do as you say, when you can't even attempt to answer the question.
You are NOT dispensing wisdom, you're perpetuating ignorance.
I have a question for Nihilism. What's the purpose of having a purpose and the existence of a purpose to exist?
To live without purpose is miserable. It is nicer to have some kind of purpose. I have a cat. He has no purpose. But he’s sitting on me purring and I’m stroking him. He looks happy and that makes me happy. That is all.
@@chesterdonnelly1212 But why happy if you're a true nihilist? Why be happy? If there is no God and life is meaningless, why not be a bum or worst? How about being more homeless than you can't afford to be homeless? Why not dream of nothing, which is what rocks dreamed of in the first place? Rocks are too stupid to know that they are stupid. It's an insult to a rock who cannot comprehend the mass persecution that we do to them. For example, we use rocks for houses and molding. Yet, what's funny is that rocks don't know how to feel pain. According to Jordan Peterson, conscience zero is a rock. At least a plant is a little smarter than a rock.
I see nihilism to be a pessimistic dreamer.
Imagine God created you to be a rock. You won't know what happiness is. You won't know what existence means. You're not even alive because you were meant to be enslaved for tools. If a human throws you into war, you will crack into two as a rock.
Aristotle pondered about rocks one time. I now know what rocks are. They are worthless scum to the point they don't know that we can insult them however we wish them to be.
If you're not conscience level three, you're not human or even sentient.
What scripture shows that God’s remnant people will have a right conception of the proper relation between the law and the gospel?
Revelation 14:12
“Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.”
King James Version (KJV)
Stuart is Cliff’s Timothy
The gospels are not eye witness testament. These two are so deceitful.
Brothers what you should have said was that God allowed sin into the world so He can manifest His glory. Remember, we were created for His own good pleasure...so the fello was right when he suggested that God takes pleasure in what He does in some ways..
I want to give an honest answer to the question in the title of this video "Can A Nihilist Be Joyful?". The obvious answer is, no, a nihilist cannot be joyful by definition because if someone is convinced that life is meaningless then that idea they are convinced is true will cause them to be emotionally indifferent, at best, they won't feel anything at all and at worst, they will be depressed all of the time, however, that wouldn't necessarily mean they are not factually correct, and the question of whether or not they are factually correct is much more important than whether or not they are happy with what they are convinced is true.
I'm not an atheist because atheism makes me happy, let me be very clear and honest here, atheism does NOT make me happy, there are OTHER things that make me happy in life and get me out of bed in the morning, sure, but being an atheist is NOT one of those things, in fact, I find atheism depressing in principle because if for argument's sake, there is no God and no life after death then whilst there maybe meaning within the moment and there might be some things that give me a sense of meaning and happiness for a while as I said, there will be no ultimate meaning to my life or any of our lives, I agree, Cliffe is right in that ultimate sense.
That thought is certainly a depressing one, not a happy one at all, but the reason I am an atheist is that I can see a big question mark over God's existence and the claims of Christianity, as well as other theistic claims such as Islam and over the idea that there is a life after death and whether I like it or not (and I don't like it) the question mark is, nevertheless there and it won't go away by me just wanting to believe God exists and wanting to believe there is a life after death and some grand purpose to it all just because it makes me feel joyful to believe it and it's not going to go away by telling me that if there is no God then life is ultimately pointless, I AGREE with those of you who say that but that still doesn't tell me whether or not there is a God or any subsequent ultimate purpose.
The only way to get rid of this question mark once and for all is either for someone to come up with such a brilliant argument for theism that I would have no choice but to renounce atheism, or better still if God/Jesus were to manifest himself to me face to face in such a way that his existence would be an indisputable fact to me.
If there really is a God/Jesus and he confirmed his existence to me once and for all, try stopping me from being a Christian, I'd be just like Cliffe is here, doing what he's doing, you wouldn't be able to shut me up about Christianity if I thought it was all true. I know I type a lot but if you think I write 'essays' now, just give me five minutes face to face with God/Jesus to confirm he is real to me and then you'll REALLY get essays from me, not to mention videos of me telling the world why I renounced atheism. Five minutes face to face with God/Jesus and I would JOYFULLY throw atheism in the incinerator. Five minutes, face to face with God/Jesus, that is all I would need and if there is a God/Jesus then he will know my heart and he will know that I mean every single word that I have typed here and I do absolutely, wholeheartedly do mean it.
Did you watch the video or try to answer the question blind? I suggest you watch, if you did, watch again please, Cliffe tells how nothing has meaning without God, a transcendent, objective foundation for truth & morals. Epistemological, how do you make sense of origin of universe/life, meaning of life, objective morality, destiny, order, logic, beauty we see in reality cohesive together with your worldview?
What is your objective foundation for truth/morality? How do you know its reliable?
"the reason I am an atheist is that I can see a big question mark over God's existence and the claims of Christianity"
Care to cite any specific examples to discuss?
"if God/Jesus were to manifest himself to me face to face in such a way that his existence would be an indisputable fact to me. "
How would you know you're really seeing Jesus/God face to face & not a drug induced trip or bad food poisoning? You're subjective experience wont convince you if He appeared to you, as Cliffe said, look at the objective evidence beyond your subjective, fallible perception, the supernaturally prophetic (Romans 1:26-31/2 Timothy 4:3/Matthew 24:6/1 Corinthians 1:18), historically verified (archaeologically & anthropologically, enemy/early/multiple attestation, internal consistency, embarrassing reports, etc.) & transcendentally, objectively moral (Exodus 20/Matthew 22:37-40) Bible of the triune God.
That, along with the cohesive explanation of the universe in my first paragraph. I eagerly await your response. I pray the triune God of the Bible reveals Himself to you, God bless, John!
@@robmc120 Thanks for your reply, sure, I'll respond. I take your point about the origin of the universe, life and reality etc. I don't claim to have an explanation for any of it, and if any atheist here tries to claim they do have all the answers to it then they are mistaken, I'm being very straight with you here but as I have said here before, not having an explanation for these things doesn't equal 'therefore God must be the answer'.
My response to these big questions about the origin of reality and life etc, at the moment, is simply to say I DO NOT KNOW. I can't rule God out, I'll give you that much, I'm an agnostic atheist, not a hard atheist.
Now, you also asked me in response to my point about God/Jesus showing himself to me "how would you know you're really seeing Jesus/God face to face & not a drug-induced trip or bad food poisoning?"
Hope you won't be offended when I say this, because I'm not trying to offend anyone, I'm trying to have an honest discussion about this but I always find this question odd coming from what I presume is a Christian or some kind of a theist. I will, however, try to answer it in such a way that you will hopefully understand why I find the question odd coming from you all.
For a start, let me put it this way, do you believe that God/Jesus will one day appear in front of us all, face to face to judge the world? If not, then let me know.
I presume you do believe that though, now, here comes my point, if and when this happens and he is standing face to face with me and judging me, do you think I will be able to deny it and wonder if I might be having a drug-induced trip THEN or do you think I will have to accept that it is really happening??
Can you see my point? God/Jesus ought to be able to show himself in such a way that it is beyond all reasonable doubt. Look, if God/Jesus truly exists, this God/Jesus, who is the supposedly most powerful and omniscient being of all who supposedly brought everything into existence and he showed himself to me, do you honestly believe that I could even think about dismissing it as some kind of a delusion?
With the greatest respect to you my friend and I appreciate your response but please do me a favour, and think about what you're saying to me here more carefully. What you're actually doing here is you're underestimating the very being that you profess to believe in by even suggesting that if he showed himself to me I could possibly dismiss it as a trip, this is meant to be the creator of the whole of this reality we're talking about here, coming face to face with such a being by virtue would have to be an absolutely undeniable reality if it happened.
Now, if I, as an agnostic atheist can understand that, then surely YOU must understand that, so let's stop all of this "if God/Jesus showed himself to you how would you know you're not tripping?" stuff, can we? And instead, let's have a SENSIBLE discussion about it because I am willing to change my mind but all that kind of gaslighting kind of stuff isn't going to change my mind, and I don't think you're purposely gaslighting me, I think you're responding honestly in yourself but to ask someone "hey, if Jesus showed himself to you how would you know it's not a delusion?", that is a form of inadvertent gaslighting.
I didn't read your whole comment carefully, so forgive me if I ask something you've already addressed. I've been a nihilist my entire life. I've never been made aware of any objective meaning to life. I experience joy every day. I'm joyful that I'm alive and that I get to have happy and beautiful experiences with others. You might be depressed if you were a nihilist but how can you know what is happening in my mind?
@@spooky6902 I know. I guess what I'm actually doing here is presenting the best case scenario for the theist position against nihilism in order to demonstrate that it's STILL irrelevant as far as whether it's factually correct or not goes. In other words, even IF you turned around and said "yeah, I am convinced that life is meaningless and this belief has left me without joy and is making me miserable" that STILL wouldn't mean that you're wrong, and that's all that matters. If life is meaningless then it's meaningless, whether that makes us depressed or not wouldn't change that if that is a fact.
@@JohnCashin I agree that our joy or depression is irrelevant to the truth of whether there is objective meaning or not. You started your comment by saying you were answering the question in the video title. My answer is, yes, I am a nihilist who is often joyful and generally happy that I get to have any quality of life at all. I don't need objective meaning to be joyful, even though it might make me more joyful. Is there anything wrong with that answer?
17:00 I might *completely* wrong here but I'll say what I have to say so that somebody can challenge me to refine the ideas
God created everything.
Everything that is Godly is good. And everything that is ungodly is evil.
This means that evil exists only in so far as it is the corruption of good (paraphrase CS Lewis)
But maybe good and evil exist separate from God. It's like a substructure to reality eg. the roads we walk on. If you walk on the road, you are doing good. But if you don't, then you are doing evil. Angels are a creation of God but they aren't all good. They are servants of God, but still have the capacity to rebel. They can walk behind God on the road, or like Lucifer they can say "To heck with that I'm going my own way".
But God doesn't condemn them. They condemn themselves by walking off the road, onto the dirt path that ends up in the desert instead of paradise.
But why did God create angels that can turn away? I have no idea. If he didn't, then we probably wouldn't be asking these questions, which is kind of a loose version of the anthropic principle perhaps?
Dude wearing a mask outside, trying to debate says it all.
Why is rising from the dead proof of trustworthiness? It could be an alien. These guys are the worst apologist I have ever heard.
When asked the question about what about those who haven't heard. Why did you not go to Romans 1 and discuss how all are without excuse and how men suppress the truth in unrighteousness?
What else must we do beside saying
Lord, Lord, to enter into the kingdom of heaven?
King James Version
Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
How many atheists will get triggered and respond to this post with their irrational views and nihilistic lifestyle?🍿
The Christian God doesn’t exist.
Have a nice day 👍😎🍻
@@jasonnoble7302 Atheist don't exist nether.... just irrational people that use whatever they can to justify living in a lie 😎🍻💪🏻
@@blackhaze8233
Can irrational people believe God doesn’t exist?
@@jasonnoble7302 to be an atheist one must become willfully ignorant....
@@jasonnoble7302 atheist..... because even flat earthers need someone to laugh at. 😂
What did God cause to cease when Jesus died on the cross?
Daniel 9:26-27
King James Version
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate
💝🙏💝🙏💝🙏💝
🎉🎉🎉
is it possible that because god is literally the characteristics of goodness itself
and also being eternal and also a holy trinity, wen it is just a cycle of love between the trinity then
there is nothing else to do but spread that love, and we know self sacrificial love for true good transcendental values for god and others, is true love
that this is the first time in eternity, where in order to create and spread that type of true love, he has to begin this chains of true evil beginning to fall, and so all these stories and words fall into place, to produce suffering, to build us character. so ultimately, we can find true love and happiness
that would be about the only explanation that god would allow angels to fall and not just nip it in the bud, but because it needs to happen to produce a true love, in free will creation, which is probably the first time god is trying to work with, hence we see him change methods like from using one people to justly judge another, and realizing another methods needs to happen like jesus christ and then finally ending all of evil at the end, but its not without fruit, its the end of evil, and the idea and true love that came from human beings that managed to listen to his word correctly is very poetic, and just, than just the eternal trinity loving each other in cycle, nothing else happening, they really wanted to have free will creation experience true love, and thus true love has true evil, which creates true love, its the only way that can actually be true love
i think i also understand cliff on the idea of all powerful all knowing as in being able to see the future like hes said before , the foundation of how god could understand how to work with humanity is, not in the sense if knowing the future in the mind like being able to prevent things automatically at the flick of a second and not just nipping evil in the bud, but rather being able to look into past present future, and literally looking at moments or the passage of time, at any place and person and he can decide what to do from there, also highly possible he can understand and know a person, their every thought but only in a way that he can sense the current emotion and thought, and of course he's the creator of creation, he knows exactly how it works and what is suppose to feel like, makes predictions based off the current human, message, and place, and setting, and of course in order for free will to exist, he cannot directly control, thus he has to just predict, and he's a very good predicter, perfect
and yes, its possible to be a creator, all knowing, and limit his power, which isnt a paradox, in fact should change the term into, holding his power, not limit in the sense of reducing his power thus making the claim for him to be all powerful all knowing untrue, but hes basically being full power and basically just choosing to not do anything (not choosing to do nothing in the sense of letting free will creation have their free will ruined but that he is not doing anything in the sense so we can have free will)
, unless hes doing a indirect action to progress a persons building of character to find true meaning and fulfillment of love, now i know executing indirect actions or directly helping human beings learn about god or give them a discplinary lesson, seems like it contradicts free will and how god is suppose to not contradict free will, but it does make sense, we still have free will, an intelligent mind, critical thinking skills, that still allow us to ultimately, choose to believe or not believe in god, or support or reject him, which is literally a real relationship, and we should treat it seriously and respect it as such
sorry everyone, idk if im even being biblical or logical anymore talking out of my imagination or mouth , but this is what i try to bring my logical reasoning to, if that is what you can call it
If being joyful is the meaning of life, then there's no reason to follow "God". After all, he's already forbidden half of life's pleasures.