We are increasingly concerned about Chinese made motorbikes and associated products, due to numerous quality control issues and also illegally copying designs. We have been unable to find out whether the manufacturer has purchased the rights to copy all the parts used from the various manufacturers. We are also concerned about China's behaviour on the international stage and toward their own people (especially minority groups). We have been exploring much of this in the videos below: Helmets made in China: th-cam.com/video/Veh90IU3gUU/w-d-xo.html Boots made in China: th-cam.com/video/TRdCDb3dzRg/w-d-xo.html Pros and cons of Chinese gear: th-cam.com/video/-QtdWRN5VjI/w-d-xo.html New KTMs made in China: th-cam.com/video/0DpQ1pHVlnE/w-d-xo.html
A couple giant "IF" if they hold up.... it will take 5 years to see if they hold up.... IF parts are available... that will take 10 years to determine.... good luck
One of my biggest gripes with Chinese bikes and some other products for that matter is that they are too keen to knock off someone else's design. Another company paid all the money to R&D the product and get it sorted out. Then someone comes along and copies it and sells it for less without paying their dues. If a Chinese or company from any country for that matter wants to start with a a clean slate and design and make their own bike then more power to them. But to flat copy a Honder or Yamahoo just grinds my gears as someone who works at the pointy end of manufacturing. If you are going to make something. Make it your own!!!
you will find some of these companies are already in partnership with the big 4 in producing their smaller displacement engines and are licensed to use their designs
I remember a time when the Datsun 240Z was billed as "bolt for bolt an Austin Healy without the oil leaks." The Japanese were ruthless in their pursuit of the Western automobile market. Not saying it's alright just saying "lest we forget."
Gasgas ripped their complete my19 (in non gasgas years my18) design off from a prototype Enduro, from a even smaller manufacturer (don't remember the name right now, the bike was on a trade fair in 2011). But no one noticed, that's not really the Chinese problem. The Chinese problem is really quality, their qm is really bad. It's not particularly the bike manufacturers fault but rather the material suppliers. For example a Chinese automotive company called wuling once called in issues with their German machines, but the problem was the supplied steel. There were bicycle spokes of a higher quality steel with a higher melting point in the raw material for engine blocks... Just to name one of the horror stories a German machine supplier has to deal with in this market.
Adam Butler capitalism drives the world good on them for using there brain and making some money on an old design than most people arnt interested in anyway
I've had six of them over the past two and a half years 70cc, 110cc, 125cc and 250cc. 2 XMotos - 1 Tao Tao, 1 Apollo - 1 Coolster - 1 Hawk respectively. They all ran like a charm, admittedly some better than others but they come "80" percent built. Not much to put together in the end, very cheap and from what I have experienced reliable machines. We had to have put at least 3000 miles on the 70cc before my son outgrew it. One issue im having this new riding season is a leaky fuel tank on my 250. No big deal. I would recommend these to anyone wanting to get onto two wheels off road. Just have to make sure you go over it, dont want any loose nuts and bolts.
I am an Expat Englishman living in Indonesia. I have just purchased a VIAR CrossX 150 which though assembed here is a Chinese product. It is less than half the price of the equivelant Honda or Kawasaki. Yes it is a bit rough round the edges but I love it. Yes I am sure these products have a great future.
I bought a CSC TT250 street legal enduro. CSC is a California company selling Chinese built motorcycles. $2200 brand new delivered to my door. I really just wanted to see what a $2000 motorcycle was like, and I have to admit, I've been pleasantly surprised. I've had close to zero problems, and researching parts I've found top end rebuild kits for under $400 with new head, and if I order parts direct from China through some place like AliExpress I've found top end rebuild kits for under $175. Yeah, there is a difference in performance to a comparable Honda product, but at these prices the Japanese market is going to be in trouble when people realize how fun these bikes are! Unless you're competition racing, the Chinese dual sport is a really fun, cheap alternative in my experience!
After seeing a heap of content on Chinese bikes with a lot of mixed reviews, I decided to buy one to see what they’re all about. I picked up a used Zongshen RX-3 for a whopping $2,200 and it has been great. Easy to work on, no mechanical issues to speak of, fuel injected, etc. I am fortunate enough to own several bikes and will be offloading the RX-3 to try an EGL or Trailmaster enduro this spring. Initial reports are excellent less the need to tune the carbs upon arrival. A minor task given the cost. To each their own I encourage individuals to shelve any doubts or xenophobia and give these bikes a chance, I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised just as I was.
Nice loncin 125 4t engine... surrounded by poorly welded frame, Pop bottle plastic, pop bottle bushings, chinesium sprockets and brake rotors, hydraulic brakes made with rubber that disintegrates when in contact with brake fluid...seat had 1" foam and pan made of popbottles. Air filter that doesn't even filter out flies..... weirdest shock valving/ spring combo/rake ever But yah the motor and trans runs ....edit mint
A few years ago... say 5-8 years I turned all Chinese mentions away. Mostly because of serviceability in the US. I've heard that parts and services are becoming more available. That said... idk man. I'm sticking with Japan, Germany, Italy and Austria for now. I think the Chinese bikes in the US have reachable a viable option status for parents wanting to test the waters with their kids to see if they like riding. But even then... I personally would take an old Frankenstein'ed KLX 110 over a shiny new Chinese small displacement thumper of the same price. Excellent video as always and fairly reviewed the same. Story Moto ADV ...out.
That's the main problem: the world hat its share of experiences with Chinese bikes, and they were horrible. Especially in terms of serviceability and availability of dealerships and parts. That's something that needs to change first. Not only product quality, but also consumer perceived quality and trust. But China has proven itself in many other market niches. When riding through Thailand, Lao or Vietnam you see lots of copies of Japanese bikes. Look at the Honda Wave for example. Built in Thailand and very reliable. Copied by Chinese brands in many ways (most of them now banned from bigger online platforms)... but they are all not as reliable as the original ones. But people don't care down there because they are able to get it fixed everywhere. Here in Europe Chinese Scooters and motorcylces are sold, but not serviced by many. So you throw them aways when something breaks. And that's not cheap in the long run. As long as they don't get quality control and serviceability / parts availability right that will stay like that forever. But IF the do get it right, then the other contenders are in big trouble. Especially in other Asian countries Chinese exports have already a very big market share. If the prove to be reliable at one point in time, then there's really no reason to buy more expensive Japanese or western products at all.
I’ll stick with the Japanese made bikes PERIOD !! KTM will be manufacturing their engines in China 🇨🇳 beginning in 2020 , Italian 🇮🇹 made SWM are being made in China 🇨🇳, BMW and Kawasaki and many others are made in India 🇮🇳 and Thailand 🇹🇭. I’ll support the Japanese 🇯🇵 Yamaha and Honda and some Suzuki. 🇬🇧 UK Triumph is still good but I heard something about their bikes also being made elsewhere?? Maybe India 🇮🇳
We have a fleet of 5 CF Moto quads at the farm I work at. At AUD$5500 for an EFI 4x4 400 they're an absolute steal. We haven't had any major failures but there are constant smaller problems. They all needed a new set of bushings/balljoints/wheelbearings ect at 3000-5000kms. For us that's not far off normal, they live a hard life in mud. Brake pads last about 3 weeks in winter. We replaced needed bearings and bushes at similar or slightly larger mileages with the Polaris and Yamahas, the Kawasakis and Hondas lasted longer with these wear items. We have a large turnover of bikes, we get a new fleet every 12-18 months and they're generally pretty well buggered with 8-12'000kms. We've needed a number of new dashes and switch gear, CF need to up their game here. I think every bike has had at least 1 kill switch fail. That said, compared to the Chinese bikes I've had in the past they're miles ahead on fit and finish, they don't rust as soon as they get wet and they don't fade as soon as they see sunlight. Honestly, the finish is as good as respected brands, yet the CF moto we had 4 years ago was a steaming pile of shit with all the finish quality of a cheap pitbike. These CF400s aren't very fun to ride, they're very slow for a 400, they have very little clearance and you wouldn't believe they're EFi by how they run. My biggest gripe is parts supply. We've waited months for parts several times, being told there is no stock in the country. We've found it's significantly quicker and often cheaper to get your own parts out of China. Dealer support has been practically 0, warranty is negligible. If you buy one of these I think you're totally on your own. I think this generation of CF Motos is pretty close to the mark, the quality is almost there and they're priced half what comparable bikes are but the minimal dealer support just sucks arse. If CF Moto could get that together then I think they would be really competitive with the respected manufacturers.
What you describe seems to be a similar story to what other report. Generally engines are pretty good but the smaller stuff still lets them down in terms of quality control. And of course some factories are still churning out terrible crap! But there's hope that some are getting closer to the mark....
I've had a few chinese bikes and I'd very well agree with that. The motors and major mechanicals have always been great but the rest is utter crap. This generation of CF Motos are really a large step above that in my opinion. That said I personally wouldn't lay down the cash on one. In terms of CF moto problems we've had: Multiple 4wd actuators fail on every bike. The dealer claims there was a bad batch and we haven't had any fail for a while so that may well be true. I reckon every bike has had 3-5 actuators replaced. CF don't foot the bill and we've had to wait over a month every time for them to get actuators in stock. Overheating. The cooling system is inadequate. The computer pulls power as the motor gets hotter so boiling over has only happened a couple of times. Normal riding on a hot day is often enough to see the temp gauge pegged. Even in winter working the bike hard in mud will peg the gauge. One bike was particularly bad and went back to the dealer 4 times. As it turns out they never tried replacing anything, the problem was a bung radiator cap. 2 rear tailshafts fail, they have a funky splined misalignment joint that frets away until the spline strips. I think they're made out of good steel but the seal is inadequate and there is very little surface area on the spline. We've had to replace the unis in all the front tailshafts. Something I don't remember ever having to do on any other brand. The EFI needs tuning. They run like an old carby bike that's been sitting in the shed for 10 years. Spluttering, bogging and not really dealing with quick throttle transitions. On the plus side, that start and idle well. I'm sure I'm forgetting things, but you get the idea. With that said, they've generally done better for us than the Kawasakis and Yamahas did but those brands we were able to get parts easily and have the bikes back in use in a timely fashion. The Kawas had multiple diff failures, rear brake failure (it's a multiple plate oil bath setup, so more of a drama to fix than normal brake issues) and constant clutch/cvt issues. The Yamahas had gearboxes require rebuiling and multiple blown head gaskets. For us the Hondas were the most reliable but they would bloody well want to be for the price, though I did also find the Hondas the most enjoyable to ride.
Interesting... if CF Moto jump on these problems quickly then things could go well for them. But of course if they just stick with a more traditional approach (low price above everything else) then their reputation will probably sink too.
@@crosstrainingenduro I Agree, though our experience on CFs Involvement has been thoroughly negative. However it may well just be this dealer. I really appreciate you going into these bikes with your eyes wide open, you only have to look at other comments to see how ingrained the bias culture is.
You know I remember back in the day everyone would say don’t buy anything from Japan now everyone wants Japanese products, cars,electronics, motorcycles, maybe that’s what will happen to Chinese products, who knows all the USA companies are going for cheap labor, maybe we unionized too much
That was a 1973 Honda Elsinore. Not sure where the 2016 came from. When this bike came out is WAS a high quality reasonably priced motorcycle that revolutionized the burgening sport of motocross in America in the early 1970s. Along with it's little brother the 125cc, they were more than a match for any overpriced Euro brand.
Here in Mexico we can afford a new Japanese dire bike so l'm interesting to see how good are going to be. Can you send me a link of the side of this motorcycle brand
there is no 'brand', vicente. you need to search online and see if anyone is importing these to mexico. importers just invent their own name and put stickers on them.
The main problem other than parts break way to easily, is the engine vibration is HORRENDOUS at any speed other than idle. It just shakes it self apart. But they are fun for what they are my Gio 125cc is a very fun bike for ripping around on technical trails and all round foolery. But will never keep up to a real bike of equal cc. Slow, shotty suspension, no real powerband, and the stock parts are fragile, like made from wishes.
Bring them to thailand, ill try one. My only sensible choice here is a crf250l. I can ride it all day, fix it cheaply the same day and i dont have to sell a kidney to buy 1. If i buy a husky or ktm id have to do without many vital organs and die of old age waiting for ANY part to arrive from europe.
@@Gowieee because ive no interest in overpriced parts that take weeks to arrive and then i get assraped 200% import duty on the parts and the shipping plus whatever bullshit extra charges they invent once they know its for a foreigner, thats why.
Motorcycles aside, you always get what you pay for. I'm not saying that they can't build good stuff, they can and do. But then the price is similar to the equivalent western product. No-one will sell gold at the price of crap, but every one would like to sell crap at the price of gold. But maybe I'm biased, i have a titanium rod inside my tibia because a chines bar riser broke while riding.
@@painmagnet1 Keep in mind before chinese garbage tools, the average Joe had no tools. I remember when the whole cordless drill phenomena was occurring. The price on a cordless drill came low enough (due entirely to chinese economies of scale manufacturing) that plebes could justify owning one. No longer the privy of contractors etc, wives bought them for husbands for fathers day. I have a garage full of tools, tablesaw, compound miter, drill press, bandsaw, planer, MIG welder etc not possible in the old days before chinese manufacturing power came online. Personally I like having tools, your mileage may vary.
I have 250cc Chinese atv for 5 years now and didn't have any problems with it yet just oil changes and refuelling it was really cheap I could buy 5 of these of same price as one yamaha. Sure it's way worse build quality but for normal trail and road riding without jumping it does the job suprisengly well and I don't regret buying it one bit but next time I'll buy yamaha or honda so I don't have to worry about breaking it if I take a jump or two ;)
I would rather have a used Honda I can buy parts for all day and trust. Been around a lot of these types of toys. They are fine for flat riding but not for me for jumps and trusting to get me home 50 miles up in the mountains away from my truck
Not sure about power supply being ify anymore from China. I have a lifan125 engine in my bike and recently I ordered cylinder piston,piston rings gudgeon pin and gaskets €46 delivered to my door how much would thatI have been in if it was a Honda? I might have to wait a few weeks for the parts but it's worth it. People thought the same about Japanese bikes back in the 60s.
unfortunately only directly from china, tim. the guy hoping to import them into canada finally gave up when he found out it's an illegal copy of the honda. apparently the factory kept saying they had bought the rights to copy the design and our guy kept demanding proof. eventually the factory confessed they never had the rights. we've heard on the grapevine honda is suing a group who import these into the USA for the same reason. 😢
I find myself often sticking up for Chinese made because I feel a lot of good stuff coming out of China is lumped in with the cheap crap unfairly. Having said that, I accept that China produce a heap of motorcycle parts but I reluctant to buy an entire Chinese motorbike, especially when the DR650 is cheap, the abundance of aftermarket parts available and it's a legend.
a very balanced viewpoint nev, something quite rare in these comments lol. they have made plenty of garbage in the past and while there are encouraging examples emerging i am hopeful but sceptical at the same time. for example it turns out the factory has lied about buying the patents for this 450 so honda is taking legal action against a guy importing them into the USA. so even if the bike is reasonably good their business ethics suck (in this case at least). it's still a long road ahead....
i have a AsiaWing Enduro CRF250X Clone ..... nothing bad to say about it... the only thing you should do it recheck the routing of the Electric/Cables and secure them well with zipties, the chinese use less zipties the rest is very okay so far
Personally I wouldent race one, but if they really are getting pretty good they would likely be spectacular beginner and hobby rider bikes and last i read thats 90% of the dirt bike market, only 10% of new race bikes actually see a track (with there first owner) even for learning on a track and doing your first few races they might be okay
YES , just like the new electric bikes(Stark) coming to the US later in 2022. But at a fraction of the cost. Nicot, Pantera, EGL and others I'm researching are worth giving a shot comparing the deprication of a new Japan made MX bike .It's fun to try something new without breaking the bank . As far as the legality it will help reset some of the way over paid execs. in japan that probably never rode. When GM designed the new C8 vette the bought a 488 and a 911 took them apart and made thier own version, dought any of this would end up in International court they would have a hard time enforcing it.
Chinese dirt bikes are good if you take very good care of them, also you have to get better bolts or tighten them. I have an Apollo RFZ DB X15 and it works just fine.
I have had experience with Chinese ATV's (childrens models) as well as various dirt bikes produced there as well. They have all been bullet proof, parts are cheap if ever needed, and they are great for the non-pro rider. They are using designs from many years ago, so they arent state-of-the-art, but they are good enough for the average consumer.
I agree with that. I will say that THAT was not the case 10 years ago though you know. They shipped the bikes but no one had ANY parts. That has changed over the past 5 years or so. There are dedicated mechanics as well now. So yup I concur. Not that you were looking for my approval haha. But you get the point. Ride well my friend
I’ve owned a Chinese dirt bike (Tekken 250). It does so much for so little money. I’ve taken it up mountain paths in the Himalayas, driven it across my country in deserts. It’s easy to fix, rugged and dependable. I don’t know about other Chinese bikes, but in my experience, generalisations are often wrong in some cases. I’m happy that it’s wrong in mine - planning to drive my bike from Karachi to Kashgar (China), I think it would be awesome!
from what i've seen so far i'd agree qasim. sure the vast majority of chinese bikes were crap by western standards in the past.... i'm sure many still are but there seem to be a rising number of better quality ones that give hope some brands will present good budget alternatives in the near future.
$8.5k AUD for the TSE... I can get a 1y/o Beta 250 RR for that money. I really wanted the TSE to do well, that engine is a trail dream but it's 30 year old tech in a stolen frame, there's no way I could justify the price.
Another thing I forgot to mention with the price is ADR... The TSE doesn't have ADR, fine in Vic where we have recreational registration, terrible elsewhere. When you look at the pricing of some road going Chinese bikes which are arguably more complex, the TSE seems more and more ridiculous. It's a crying shame given the excellent marriage of engine and frame.
You could buy 4-5 Chinese ones for the price of one KTM 500 Exc in Australia...that’s a lot of spares. You might even be able to start a parts business on the side
shipped direct that's not far off the mark, ronan. except shipping is the killer of course, unless you brought in a container load. unfortunately when importers bring in this sort of bike they have to put a pretty big profit margin on to cover the costs of warranty, particularly if the quality control is shit on some parts. for example the GPX 450 is US$5900 which IS cheap, but for most riders still too expensive when it's an unknown quantity. it was probably only US$3300 from the factory but then they factor in shipping, cost of warranty, added bling and finally their profit margin.
i think GPX is selling their 450 model (not based on this one) for $6900. when it's a completely unknown bike i think it would need to be closer to half price before i took the risk. once there was plenty of good rider feedback i think that price would be more tempting...
Until the proof is made, quality and part availibility for decades to come, I think one is better with a good lightly used reputed brand that will last and will be repairable and usable for a long time. I was almost shocked to see this CRF450 clone since I own a CRF of the same generation. Looks very close, except for the headlight and enduro stuff, as mine is the motocross version. Time will tell, as always. But one thing is sure, a well kept CRF of those years is pretty cheap to buy, you can rebuilt it with original and aftermarket quality parts and end with a perfect proven bike for less than a new chinese copy, which is an older 10/15 years old design anyway. For now, it is a bit hard to believe that the tolerances, the materials and the build quality can be the same as a Honda. Just my 2 cents. :)
"CRF of those years is pretty cheap to buy, you can rebuilt it with original and aftermarket quality parts and end with a perfect proven bike for less than a new chinese copy" Amen to that! And you don't have to worry about dodgy manufacturing... because Honda can actually be sued, unlike some fly by night Chinese con man who cares about nothing except turning a quick buck.
"Innovation is not likely to drive significant market shift in dirt bike purchases over the next decade". I'm pretty sure that if/when segway technology is incorporated into bikes, many super gumbies will want them. Wheelies all the way!
The clones are great, you can switch most parts with honda or yamaha genuine parts. In places where labor cost for bike technician isn't high, you can always find japanese bike substitute parts and let them fit it in. No hassle, cheap overall prices. Work just great.
Mate its a discussion / debate from 50 years ago, lot of it revolves around vanity, and Brand "loyalty" status, reality is great proportion (99%) of products are made in China and for some people the price is not everything.
I ride a crossfire cfr250 and love it can replace my entire engine for less then a YZF rebuild. Parts are cheap and makes 21hp and that's enough for me in the bush lol
In the late 40s and 50s the Japanese market had the same reputation as the Chinese markets do now. There is no quality control. So, products are hit or miss. Maybe they'll get there ducks in a row before long...
agreed eric. there seem to be a few models where they've largely got it together (for the price that is) but it's still very very hit and miss at the moment.
Thanks for your review, I do have a Benelli TNT 250 , chinese, motorcycle, two years now , and more than 10.000 miles, and really no problems, it all depends how you take care of it. Chinese had been improving, and if you look for a good manufacturer in China, you may find a good product as well. My experience, no problem, would I buy a Japanese, no, you pay tooo much for the name brand.
You pay too much for name-brand?? When you can get a loan for about $60 a month I think it's worth buying the original instead of these copycats. Chinese knockoffs are invading online stores like Amazon, stealing patents left and right while putting original inventors out of business. I understand the Chinese knockoffs may be the only option for someone who can't afford the real thing but is it the RIGHT thing to do??
Even the Chinese in China don't want them so why should the rest of the workd want them, I ride with a group of Enduro riders here in the South of China, most have old Ktms and Huskys ( I have a 2019 Gasgas EC 300) that give little or no trouble and still give and enjoyable ride. Whenever a used KTM or Husky is for sale it gets snapped up right away. A coupe of riders have tried Chinese brand bikes with disasterous results, one guy dismantled his Chinese bike and threw in the bin in after 4 months of hassle, breakages and trouble. He ended up getting a hard worked 2012 Ktm Freeride. Moral of the story it is better to get an old top brand bike than a New Chinese bike, unless you like to challenge your sanity,.
A very interesting article about illegal Chinese copies of bikes from BMW, Honda, Ducati and Harley Davidson. The gist? In most cases it's illegal but it is very difficult and expensive to take any action (and I suspect that the Chinese factories would simply shut down then re-open under another name). www.advrider.com/so-sue-me-say-the-chinese-factories/
We were there importing into the US chinese bikes in 2003. Same story back then "are these chinese bikes going to be a new revolution!?" Seems not much has changed in terms of mechanical advancement. Honda clones, small displacement... except for a few bigger 450-650 engines I've seen developed. They've gotten slightly better at making more attractive plastic/appearance. They have a long way to come in terms of matching other bigger companies when it comes to value price combined with a (lower end) but still quality/well-functioning product. The one area the chinese have been ahead of the world, is in 2-wheel electric motorcycle/scooter total saturation.. building way more way earlier than anyone else!
agreed jager. i suspect eventually china will undergo the same changes although possibly it could take longer as their culture is currently geared more toward short-term profit and not on quality, relative to japan and germany.
This is 2021 they can build them with higher quality of course but they won't. Their target is cheap bikes for more customers . Replacement parts are also cheap .
Agree just bought one. I live in a country (Thailand) where 90% of the products are poorly made Chinese items. I am just plain tired of everything breaking. So no Chinese bike for me.
HI i just parted out a lifan (china) 125 for spares 8000 miles- chrome literally falling off, parts of VERY poor quality.It was v similar to the one you rode in vietnam.i have pics if you would like my e mail.Some of the scooters work well in hot dryish climates like Greece where they are typically bought by workers to commute short distances for around 5 years on finance (finance =low weekly transportation cost) then sold as they start dropping to bits by then if not before.Once they start going wrong-it never stops.
certainly be interested in pics, nick. we rode the 175 versions in vietnam. most of the 28 bikes in their fleet have between 50000 to 150000km on the clock and the engines are almost indestructible despite being on full throttle a fair bit of the time. and no rebuilds needed. gearboxes seem sturdy except really stomping on the gear shift can bend the selector so they occasionally fix those. indicators are crap, they regularly have to replace those. mirrors droop all the time. and the fuel level indicators are useless and almost never work. that's about it. oh and they spend plenty of time muddy and wet in vietnam too. maybe they got most things right on this model?
Love my GPX tse 250. China makes the parts for most bikes . They are as good in my opinion. Go ahead pay 10.000 bucks for the name . I saved 5.000 bucks. 😃
This is surprising that Vietnamese would appraise Chinese made bike as generally Vietnamese do despise anything made in China, but that said I did build Chinese 450 ktm clone here in Vietnam and was pretty happy with quality.
SSR is the way to go for chinese bikes. A little more than a cheap ass Tao Tao or something, but well built and long lasting for 1/2 the price of a Honda. Most China bikes are built cheaply as possible, but they use literally millions of these same machines to get around daily. I've owned various chinese made things and have always been fairly impressed for what you get for the start price. They need a person who knows how to do their own maintenece and theyre great. Ignition coil? 10$ carburetor? 20$ check your own valve clearances, and your good to go. And check every damn bolt for tightness, possibly add loctite or change bolts and nuts to hardened steel ones. After that its basically a Honda if you can do your own QC.
People like drawing comparisons with Japanese manufacturers, but the reality is that Chinese manufacturers will probably not reach the recognition of Japanese or even South Korean products. Why? The Chinese on the mainland are not particularly interested in branding and marketing . Name a Chinese company that makes and markets a mid to high level consumer product under their own name which is sold in 1st world countries and widely recognized by the buying public . I can only think of Huawei. There might be a few others, but for a country that make almost everything that's quite surprising. Taiwan has quality manufacturing, but even brand recognition of Taiwanese manufacturers is close to zero in the western world. Taiwan and China are more than happy enough to make anything for mass consumption , be it crap or quality and leave the marketing and branding to other manufacturers/companies. Dirt Bikes are luxury/recreational items in 1st world countries. That means marketing and brand image are almost as important as performance. You have to have both to sell. Racing creates a Halo effect around your product. If the Chinese start selling competitive race machines with recreational models at a significant cost savings combined with a somewhat successful racing effort they would grab chunks of market share. It's the racing and marketing that would probably never happen to any great degree, relegating Chinese branded dirt bikes to things you buy because you don't have the cash and Japanese and Euro bikes you aspire when you do have the cheddar.
motocross racing in china is getting very big, and there are already some companies that want to prove themselves by competing there. I think with time, they will try to get into the world racing scene. They arent there yet though. And yeah, they arent good at even naming their products for the international market lol
Bullshit. Quality products sell themselves. Who heard of GasGas before 1999? Who heard of Beta before 2001? Who has seen an ad for either other than 'X' won on it? I haven't but I have an old $5K GG bike and $30K in Beta machines. I also own a lot of Klim gear. Quality sells to serious buyers whether or not it's advertised, enthusiasts spread the word. Then there are companies like Alpinestars and Ducati that make rubbish spend millions in advertising. Nothing to be done but laugh at these poor cucks, they have a lot of fun at sponsored events but are stuck buying a crap product.
Chinese branded products are not known for their quality . The point is that in order for Chinese motorcycles to sell in 1st world countries they must improve the quality , remain competitive with prices and drive marketing that would remove the low quality stigma associated with chinese branded motorcycles. Quality they can do , if motivated enough, low price is a no brainer, but marketing that's a big if.
Yeah my last 3 pit bikes were/are Chinese bike I buy them to race them and prove to myself and others that lower quality bikes can be competitive.. ONLY if your on top of maintaining them and keeping them in tip top shape
At the moment, when these bikes will be the same quality as European dirt bikes and when manufacturers will establish sales and service network, bikes won't be cheap any more.
I'd never buy Chinese goods. Yamaha or nothing from now on. I made a REALLY BIG MISTAKE buying POLARIS atvs... total shit... always something broken or built so cheap it hurts to look at it. Lots of bells n whistles and great riding and gobs of power but built REALLY CHEAP.. problems with snapping drive belts, front diff bearing plate exploding, axle shafts, wheel bearings over n over n over, brake pads fall out of the caliper ( really wtf is this shit... sounds safe eh) glowing red hot exhaust warping and catching plastics and Bush on fire... relays turning green steady, voltage regulators back ordered for months n months n months cuz these atvs eat them for breakfast... these 3 polaris atvs nearly put me broke... worst part ... RESALE IS TOTAL SHIT.... YAMAHA forever from now on...
if you want a reliable bike buy Husqvarna or KTM. Its true that parts are a little bit more expensive than the parts of Japanese bikes, but Husqvarna and KTM don't break. Husqvarna even better than KTM.
Never, never, never, ever. I don’t buy bikes based on price, but rather for my appreciation of the ride, technology, performance and styling. And I don’t believe in rewarding the Chinese for their ability to copy and package someone else’s innovations. But I can appreciate other buyers rank price higher in their decision process. Each to his / her own.
q9powersportsusa.com/collections/new-dirt-bikes-pit-bikes-and-enduro-motorcycles-q9-powersports-usa/products/tao-motor-tbr7-250cc-enduro-motorcycle Here's a good one. It's actually pretty decent especially for the cheap price. There's plenty of replacement parts as it's basically a hawk. The only issue is, out of the box the stock carb has an 85 jet (to comply with the EPA import bs). there's a kit on eBay that's like $25 that is a complete overhaul for the carb, a bigger jet and gaskets and such. Once you get the carb sorted out it works well!
Innovation will always drive dirt bike sales, as non of us are as good as we think we are or want to be... So anything that improves our riding is something we think we must have ! Just remember when you’re at the top of the hill laughing at your mates struggling their way up, You quite quickly forget how much you spent on your new bike 😃😂👍
Nah I don't see the specialist market taking off. My reasons being the following: Reliability is not a priority for Chinese manufacturers and never will be. Parts availability (UK) is cr*p, it really is. There's a combination of so many manufacturers supplying almost identical bikes and a complete lack of service centers and actual parts availability. Chinese bikes here are either thrown when a major part fails or bodged together with almost the same parts until they all eventually implode and the machine is thrown away. I was around when the Japanese invaded the motorcycle market in the UK. Reliability was brilliant and far far better than what we already had here. The reliability is what allowed the Japanese machines to take over. I still see 40 year old untouched Hondas being ridden daily here. Sure the brakes and tyres and some cables have been replaced but the engines are unmolested - there's not a single chance a Chinese bike will make it even a quarter of that distance. I ride a British supermoto, albeit with a Suzuki engine (CCM 404). I chose this machine more because of the engine - parts availability for the DRZ400 lump is unreal. The rest of the bike is cobbled together from the best of the best: White Power shocks, Brembo brakes etc etc. Chinese machines are all in house copies of current machines made by other manufacturers but they do not take quality control seriously. My point? Yes people will buy that stuff but they'll come to regret it. We all know there will be casting sand left in oil galleries and hammered on bearings because someone machined a crank incorrectly. We'll see thousands of the things on Gumtree 12 months later with a sh*gged engine. People will be dropping DRZ400 lumps into bouncy frames!
At this stage I'm happy to buy a small Chinese bike for the kids to cruise around the local trails on, but It will take a lot of long term positive reviews before I'd buy one for myself. Reliability is key when in remote locations, not saving a few dollars... Good vid as always.
Buying a GPX bike in the USA? Remember it's a just a cheap Chinese clone that is rebranded! Here is one owner's nightmare. 😢 "The GPX arrived too me with mal-fitting plastics, stripped fasteners, a blown, fully leaked rear shock and majorly a faulty ECU. It took two months of back and forth with USA Motortoys to get the bike functional. Once those matters were taken care the bike did okay for about 3 months...until it started falling apart. It had numerus issues, electrical shorts a failed voltage regulator, failed N2 seal in the shock, brake line failures and the list of problems went on & on. The electrical system issues put me out of action for an entire fall riding season. In a nutshell trying to find information on any issues is a massive headache or impossible. There's a FB group but you know how that goes...100x opinions or it was my fault a problem happened. If I needed something for the GPX, it meant hours of research and guessing. Most of the time, including parts sent from the distributor, they didn't fit or need modification to work...This was a total pain in the ass. This is because GPX are designed by copies of other manufacturers work, with multiple aspects combined into each machine. In the end, GPX bikes are nothing but cheap Chinese copies. An okay engine and frame wrapped in any combination of cheap Chinese shit. Yes they are inexpensive, but there is a reason they cost half of what established brands do.... I believe most owners of these bikes and caught up in the hype are deluding themselves they got a bike "just as good as a KTM for half the cost" ... The truth is FAR from that."
I got my 160 Chinese bike fixed the same day Within an hour Clutch Broken Bars Bent Front tire flat I would recommend saving for a good Reliable Japanese bike like Honda Kawasaki Yamah
I was owning one 450 from China, if you accept shity forks that doesn’t work, carburetor from scooters and faulty decompressor that prevent you from starting bike, oh, and I forgot about sit - worst I ever tried in my life, then Chinese bikes are quite ok :)
The problem with Chinese steel is that it is heavy, filled with dirty particles and low quality, from a metallurgical standpoint. Their plastics are low quality too. And their electrical systems have a ways to go. Many of their bikes have stators and other electric components that readily fail. They still have a ways to go to improve quality.
@@motox2051 I was just confused why buying Chinese is un-american...but buying say Japanese or something European is fine. Nothing more American than spending your hard earned money on whatever the hell you want...because its your money...even if that might be a Chinese dirt bike.
careful what you are criticizing, Chinese companys only do what they can get away with in terms of quality, after sale support etc. it is an expedient and profitable model especially in a price driven market. Keep in mind they are very capable of producing reliable parts and entire bikes as they do for BMW (Kymco makes all BMW scooters). and Honda has been producing a large percentage of their bikes in China for years.
Chery is a chinese car brand I see in my country a fair deal, I learned not long ago they had troubles with Chevrolet for stealing a "design" or whatever you'd call it. Basically a Chevy Spark's door would fit perfectly into a Chery's QQ car, that looks exactly the same, the car is so simple it baffles me how they would be so lazy as to steal that design, I can't really trust them now. Land Rover has sued another chinese company of a similar thing with their Evoque model.
sometimes the patent has lapsed but there are definitely many cases where they have illegally copied someone's design... they will need to really lift their game if they want credibility in western markets.
The plastics are a copy of the Honda but the engine, frame, and suspension are not even close and the Honda is superior for sure. With that said I had the opportunity to ride one that my buddy owns and yeah it has far less power than my honda but for the price I think it's a decent bike. I don't think anybody will ever ride it on a professional level but as long as parts are available when you need them it could be a good option if you can't, or don't want to spend the money on one of the big 5 brands. 😁🇺🇲
They're going to have to prove that their bikes and components can take the punishment of off road use. I don't want something breaking and sending me into the trees. The Chinese did a great job of restricting access to their consumer market unless you partnered with their manufacturers. Now those Chinese partners have license to last generation engines, etc. The parts and bikes I've seen so far seem too inexpensively made to last the distance. That old saying, "you get what you pay for" surely applies.
I want to make bike spending higher priority than mortgage, kid's tuition, taxes, food, water, clothing, electric bills and gas. But the reality is hard to challenge..... Cheaper and good enough Chinese bikes are always welcome.
Oh no I won't buy Chinese because bolts just snap or strip in vital parts in about a year. If you want a rusty piece go for it but my 1995 Honda is bulletproof and never let me down. Worth paying 4 times the price any day. 👌🏻
Oh baloney. My first bike was an old 77 honda xl250. The forks leaked, the exhaust was completely rusted apart and it had charging system problems. The exhaust was a 300 dollar fix back in the mid to late 80's. My next bike was a '85 gpz550 with 28000 miles on the clock. Needed new fuel lines, wheel bearings, spark plugs, brakes, fuel tank, fuel tank float, rear shock, petcock, carb seals, and pod filters. Bike was classic and a hoot to ride. Mechanical stuff wears out, honda or otherwise.
In my collection i still have the Pibike i bought 10yr ago, its the Xsport FYM, copy of the THUMPSTAR, just be prepared to take it apart & build it correctly 😂 apart from that they are good for the money. ........apart from the cruisers. ..that look shit' . Buy a VMAX 👍
The breakthrough will come when the Chinese manufacturers realise that they can produce a seriously good bike by just charging 5 per cent more and fitting higher quality suspension, wheels and brakes. Due to sheer volume and purchasing power they could even get away with fitting their bikes with European suspension like Sachs and brembo brakes and still be much cheaper than main brands. Their engines are now reliable so that is all they really need to do.
that's my position at the moment too. so far there's only one dirt bike shaping up to possibly fit that category... the TSR250R. some guys have 150 hours on them now and are pulling them apart to see how everything is wearing - looking good so far but it's early days still.
Ditto, Stephen. This video was done quite a while ago, and since then China's behaviour has gone from bad to worse. I'm actively encouraging everyone to reconsider buying anything Chinese. th-cam.com/video/-QtdWRN5VjI/w-d-xo.html
With the BMW 850 engine being made China by Loncin and all the KTM LC8 C bikes being made by CFMoto as of the first quarter of 2020 . “ European “ bikes being made in China is already happening.
And all of them have electronics, at least parts, made in China. It's really nearly impossible to avoid SOME Chinese content in almost anything you buy anymore.
We are increasingly concerned about Chinese made motorbikes and associated products, due to numerous quality control issues and also illegally copying designs. We have been unable to find out whether the manufacturer has purchased the rights to copy all the parts used from the various manufacturers. We are also concerned about China's behaviour on the international stage and toward their own people (especially minority groups). We have been exploring much of this in the videos below:
Helmets made in China: th-cam.com/video/Veh90IU3gUU/w-d-xo.html
Boots made in China: th-cam.com/video/TRdCDb3dzRg/w-d-xo.html
Pros and cons of Chinese gear: th-cam.com/video/-QtdWRN5VjI/w-d-xo.html
New KTMs made in China: th-cam.com/video/0DpQ1pHVlnE/w-d-xo.html
@@stephenday1520 Idiot. Did you even read the comment above or watch the links? 😂
As long as they hold up and have parts available, change is inevitable. That's life!
A couple giant "IF" if they hold up.... it will take 5 years to see if they hold up.... IF parts are available... that will take 10 years to determine.... good luck
I bought a Chinese apollo db 36 and rode it damn near every day for two years then sold for 100 dollars more than what i paid for it.
One of my biggest gripes with Chinese bikes and some other products for that matter is that they are too keen to knock off someone else's design. Another company paid all the money to R&D the product and get it sorted out. Then someone comes along and copies it and sells it for less without paying their dues. If a Chinese or company from any country for that matter wants to start with a a clean slate and design and make their own bike then more power to them. But to flat copy a Honder or Yamahoo just grinds my gears as someone who works at the pointy end of manufacturing. If you are going to make something. Make it your own!!!
you will find some of these companies are already in partnership with the big 4 in producing their smaller displacement engines and are licensed to use their designs
I remember a time when the Datsun 240Z was billed as "bolt for bolt an Austin Healy without the oil leaks." The Japanese were ruthless in their pursuit of the Western automobile market. Not saying it's alright just saying "lest we forget."
Gasgas ripped their complete my19 (in non gasgas years my18) design off from a prototype Enduro, from a even smaller manufacturer (don't remember the name right now, the bike was on a trade fair in 2011). But no one noticed, that's not really the Chinese problem.
The Chinese problem is really quality, their qm is really bad. It's not particularly the bike manufacturers fault but rather the material suppliers. For example a Chinese automotive company called wuling once called in issues with their German machines, but the problem was the supplied steel. There were bicycle spokes of a higher quality steel with a higher melting point in the raw material for engine blocks... Just to name one of the horror stories a German machine supplier has to deal with in this market.
Adam Butler capitalism drives the world good on them for using there brain and making some money on an old design than most people arnt interested in anyway
I couldn't agree more.
Their build quality is coming along more quickly.
I've had six of them over the past two and a half years 70cc, 110cc, 125cc and 250cc. 2 XMotos - 1 Tao Tao, 1 Apollo - 1 Coolster - 1 Hawk respectively. They all ran like a charm, admittedly some better than others but they come "80" percent built. Not much to put together in the end, very cheap and from what I have experienced reliable machines. We had to have put at least 3000 miles on the 70cc before my son outgrew it. One issue im having this new riding season is a leaky fuel tank on my 250. No big deal. I would recommend these to anyone wanting to get onto two wheels off road. Just have to make sure you go over it, dont want any loose nuts and bolts.
All of that said, I ride a Kawasaki versys 650 on the road. And would stick with a Japanese made motorcycle for that.
I bought cfmoto 450ss and it’s a menace on road. I beat Kawasaki n400 with ease. And quality is on pair too
made in China....assembled everywhere
Robert Thurman was just about to say that
You can buy this off Alibaba for 450.00
@@Sms8668 800-2000 dollars
I am an Expat Englishman living in Indonesia. I have just purchased a VIAR CrossX 150 which though assembed here is a Chinese product. It is less than half the price of the equivelant Honda or Kawasaki. Yes it is a bit rough round the edges but I love it. Yes I am sure these products have a great future.
Do they come with a hepa-filter on the carb so the engine doesn;t catch COVID?
Price is smaller when you don't need R&D as you copy&paste.
True
When you look at the DRZ who CAN'T innovate cos they wouldn't have passed EPA if they release a new design, the whole industry is in stagnation as is.
How do I get best deal,lower cost,lowest price.
I rode wheelies on a moped in the 80s. Rode a couple fat chicks also. Won't tell much about either now.
Fat chicks are the best. They make the most of what comes along because they know their next chance will be years away!
I bought a CSC TT250 street legal enduro. CSC is a California company selling Chinese built motorcycles. $2200 brand new delivered to my door. I really just wanted to see what a $2000 motorcycle was like, and I have to admit, I've been pleasantly surprised. I've had close to zero problems, and researching parts I've found top end rebuild kits for under $400 with new head, and if I order parts direct from China through some place like AliExpress I've found top end rebuild kits for under $175. Yeah, there is a difference in performance to a comparable Honda product, but at these prices the Japanese market is going to be in trouble when people realize how fun these bikes are! Unless you're competition racing, the Chinese dual sport is a really fun, cheap alternative in my experience!
At 1:54 the ad states "Radically designed stickers for more power" 😂
After seeing a heap of content on Chinese bikes with a lot of mixed reviews, I decided to buy one to see what they’re all about. I picked up a used Zongshen RX-3 for a whopping $2,200 and it has been great. Easy to work on, no mechanical issues to speak of, fuel injected, etc. I am fortunate enough to own several bikes and will be offloading the RX-3 to try an EGL or Trailmaster enduro this spring. Initial reports are excellent less the need to tune the carbs upon arrival. A minor task given the cost. To each their own I encourage individuals to shelve any doubts or xenophobia and give these bikes a chance, I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised just as I was.
i had zongshen 250 about 10 years ago , shocks werent good but it was better than a scooter , only had 12kw but was fun
Nice loncin 125 4t engine... surrounded by poorly welded frame, Pop bottle plastic, pop bottle bushings, chinesium sprockets and brake rotors, hydraulic brakes made with rubber that disintegrates when in contact with brake fluid...seat had 1" foam and pan made of popbottles. Air filter that doesn't even filter out flies..... weirdest shock valving/ spring combo/rake ever
But yah the motor and trans runs ....edit mint
A few years ago... say 5-8 years I turned all Chinese mentions away. Mostly because of serviceability in the US. I've heard that parts and services are becoming more available. That said... idk man. I'm sticking with Japan, Germany, Italy and Austria for now. I think the Chinese bikes in the US have reachable a viable option status for parents wanting to test the waters with their kids to see if they like riding. But even then... I personally would take an old Frankenstein'ed KLX 110 over a shiny new Chinese small displacement thumper of the same price. Excellent video as always and fairly reviewed the same. Story Moto ADV ...out.
That's the main problem: the world hat its share of experiences with Chinese bikes, and they were horrible. Especially in terms of serviceability and availability of dealerships and parts. That's something that needs to change first. Not only product quality, but also consumer perceived quality and trust. But China has proven itself in many other market niches. When riding through Thailand, Lao or Vietnam you see lots of copies of Japanese bikes. Look at the Honda Wave for example. Built in Thailand and very reliable. Copied by Chinese brands in many ways (most of them now banned from bigger online platforms)... but they are all not as reliable as the original ones. But people don't care down there because they are able to get it fixed everywhere. Here in Europe Chinese Scooters and motorcylces are sold, but not serviced by many. So you throw them aways when something breaks. And that's not cheap in the long run. As long as they don't get quality control and serviceability / parts availability right that will stay like that forever. But IF the do get it right, then the other contenders are in big trouble. Especially in other Asian countries Chinese exports have already a very big market share. If the prove to be reliable at one point in time, then there's really no reason to buy more expensive Japanese or western products at all.
I’ll stick with the Japanese made bikes PERIOD !! KTM will be manufacturing their engines in China 🇨🇳 beginning in 2020 , Italian 🇮🇹 made SWM are being made in China 🇨🇳, BMW and Kawasaki and many others are made in India 🇮🇳 and Thailand 🇹🇭.
I’ll support the Japanese 🇯🇵 Yamaha and Honda and some Suzuki.
🇬🇧 UK Triumph is still good but I heard something about their bikes also being made elsewhere?? Maybe India 🇮🇳
@@oceandweller2314 I’ll take it over that Harley trash all day long 😎
Man I’m so keen for cheap but quality bikes. The cfmoto series has been great.
the SWM and AJP brands are doing okay here in australia and don't see to have any big known issues so far.
Anyone know where to find the CRF 450 knock off
We have a fleet of 5 CF Moto quads at the farm I work at. At AUD$5500 for an EFI 4x4 400 they're an absolute steal. We haven't had any major failures but there are constant smaller problems. They all needed a new set of bushings/balljoints/wheelbearings ect at 3000-5000kms. For us that's not far off normal, they live a hard life in mud. Brake pads last about 3 weeks in winter. We replaced needed bearings and bushes at similar or slightly larger mileages with the Polaris and Yamahas, the Kawasakis and Hondas lasted longer with these wear items. We have a large turnover of bikes, we get a new fleet every 12-18 months and they're generally pretty well buggered with 8-12'000kms.
We've needed a number of new dashes and switch gear, CF need to up their game here. I think every bike has had at least 1 kill switch fail. That said, compared to the Chinese bikes I've had in the past they're miles ahead on fit and finish, they don't rust as soon as they get wet and they don't fade as soon as they see sunlight. Honestly, the finish is as good as respected brands, yet the CF moto we had 4 years ago was a steaming pile of shit with all the finish quality of a cheap pitbike. These CF400s aren't very fun to ride, they're very slow for a 400, they have very little clearance and you wouldn't believe they're EFi by how they run. My biggest gripe is parts supply. We've waited months for parts several times, being told there is no stock in the country. We've found it's significantly quicker and often cheaper to get your own parts out of China. Dealer support has been practically 0, warranty is negligible. If you buy one of these I think you're totally on your own.
I think this generation of CF Motos is pretty close to the mark, the quality is almost there and they're priced half what comparable bikes are but the minimal dealer support just sucks arse. If CF Moto could get that together then I think they would be really competitive with the respected manufacturers.
What you describe seems to be a similar story to what other report. Generally engines are pretty good but the smaller stuff still lets them down in terms of quality control. And of course some factories are still churning out terrible crap! But there's hope that some are getting closer to the mark....
I've had a few chinese bikes and I'd very well agree with that. The motors and major mechanicals have always been great but the rest is utter crap. This generation of CF Motos are really a large step above that in my opinion. That said I personally wouldn't lay down the cash on one.
In terms of CF moto problems we've had:
Multiple 4wd actuators fail on every bike. The dealer claims there was a bad batch and we haven't had any fail for a while so that may well be true. I reckon every bike has had 3-5 actuators replaced. CF don't foot the bill and we've had to wait over a month every time for them to get actuators in stock.
Overheating. The cooling system is inadequate. The computer pulls power as the motor gets hotter so boiling over has only happened a couple of times. Normal riding on a hot day is often enough to see the temp gauge pegged. Even in winter working the bike hard in mud will peg the gauge. One bike was particularly bad and went back to the dealer 4 times. As it turns out they never tried replacing anything, the problem was a bung radiator cap.
2 rear tailshafts fail, they have a funky splined misalignment joint that frets away until the spline strips. I think they're made out of good steel but the seal is inadequate and there is very little surface area on the spline.
We've had to replace the unis in all the front tailshafts. Something I don't remember ever having to do on any other brand.
The EFI needs tuning. They run like an old carby bike that's been sitting in the shed for 10 years. Spluttering, bogging and not really dealing with quick throttle transitions. On the plus side, that start and idle well.
I'm sure I'm forgetting things, but you get the idea.
With that said, they've generally done better for us than the Kawasakis and Yamahas did but those brands we were able to get parts easily and have the bikes back in use in a timely fashion. The Kawas had multiple diff failures, rear brake failure (it's a multiple plate oil bath setup, so more of a drama to fix than normal brake issues) and constant clutch/cvt issues. The Yamahas had gearboxes require rebuiling and multiple blown head gaskets. For us the Hondas were the most reliable but they would bloody well want to be for the price, though I did also find the Hondas the most enjoyable to ride.
Interesting... if CF Moto jump on these problems quickly then things could go well for them. But of course if they just stick with a more traditional approach (low price above everything else) then their reputation will probably sink too.
@@crosstrainingenduro I Agree, though our experience on CFs Involvement has been thoroughly negative. However it may well just be this dealer. I really appreciate you going into these bikes with your eyes wide open, you only have to look at other comments to see how ingrained the bias culture is.
You know I remember back in the day everyone would say don’t buy anything from Japan now everyone wants Japanese products, cars,electronics, motorcycles, maybe that’s what will happen to Chinese products, who knows all the USA companies are going for cheap labor, maybe we unionized too much
We didn't, the government just wasn't equating tariffs. We are now thanks to Trump and American jobs are coming back.
What's really a joke is how everyone laughed at my Austrian made pile 20 years ago...
A Puch Maxi? ;)
Nah but I do see what you mean. Mind you, Austrian is almost German and we all know how good German engineering is.
That was a 1973 Honda Elsinore. Not sure where the 2016 came from. When this bike came out is WAS a high quality reasonably priced motorcycle that revolutionized the burgening sport of motocross in America in the early 1970s. Along with it's little brother the 125cc, they were more than a match for any overpriced Euro brand.
Here in Mexico we can afford a new Japanese dire bike so l'm interesting to see how good are going to be.
Can you send me a link of the side of this motorcycle brand
there is no 'brand', vicente. you need to search online and see if anyone is importing these to mexico. importers just invent their own name and put stickers on them.
@@crosstrainingenduro thank you
The main problem other than parts break way to easily, is the engine vibration is HORRENDOUS at any speed other than idle. It just shakes it self apart. But they are fun for what they are my Gio 125cc is a very fun bike for ripping around on technical trails and all round foolery. But will never keep up to a real bike of equal cc. Slow, shotty suspension, no real powerband, and the stock parts are fragile, like made from wishes.
Bring them to thailand, ill try one. My only sensible choice here is a crf250l. I can ride it all day, fix it cheaply the same day and i dont have to sell a kidney to buy 1. If i buy a husky or ktm id have to do without many vital organs and die of old age waiting for ANY part to arrive from europe.
Why not just order KTM parts from Australia? Number one selling brand here.
@@Gowieee because ive no interest in overpriced parts that take weeks to arrive and then i get assraped 200% import duty on the parts and the shipping plus whatever bullshit extra charges they invent once they know its for a foreigner, thats why.
Plus i can buy a crf fully kitted for the dirt for 90,000bt but a ktm is 360,000bt
@@theravedaddy geez that sucks, KTM parts are cheap here
Let me know if you do!! Have not seen a decent Chinese bike in The Kingdom of Smiles. I bought a Gasgas not wanting an electronic injection system.
Motorcycles aside, you always get what you pay for. I'm not saying that they can't build good stuff, they can and do. But then the price is similar to the equivalent western product. No-one will sell gold at the price of crap, but every one would like to sell crap at the price of gold.
But maybe I'm biased, i have a titanium rod inside my tibia because a chines bar riser broke while riding.
@@painmagnet1 Keep in mind before chinese garbage tools, the average Joe had no tools. I remember when the whole cordless drill phenomena was occurring. The price on a cordless drill came low enough (due entirely to chinese economies of scale manufacturing) that plebes could justify owning one. No longer the privy of contractors etc, wives bought them for husbands for fathers day. I have a garage full of tools, tablesaw, compound miter, drill press, bandsaw, planer, MIG welder etc not possible in the old days before chinese manufacturing power came online. Personally I like having tools, your mileage may vary.
I have 250cc Chinese atv for 5 years now and didn't have any problems with it yet just oil changes and refuelling it was really cheap I could buy 5 of these of same price as one yamaha. Sure it's way worse build quality but for normal trail and road riding without jumping it does the job suprisengly well and I don't regret buying it one bit but next time I'll buy yamaha or honda so I don't have to worry about breaking it if I take a jump or two ;)
I would rather have a used Honda I can buy parts for all day and trust. Been around a lot of these types of toys. They are fine for flat riding but not for me for jumps and trusting to get me home 50 miles up in the mountains away from my truck
Not sure about power supply being ify anymore from China. I have a lifan125 engine in my bike and recently I ordered cylinder piston,piston rings gudgeon pin and gaskets €46 delivered to my door how much would thatI have been in if it was a Honda?
I might have to wait a few weeks for the parts but it's worth it.
People thought the same about Japanese bikes back in the 60s.
You must be living under a rock. Not all but the ones are even more reliable than the " Brand ones" so get a grip because they are taking over.
Some China bikes are crappy. Some are vary good .
Do not buy a Chinese bike..... I learned from experience. The engine was fine but all the other parts break way to easily.
Chinese dirtbikes?? Naaa forget this 😂😂😂 best wait and earn some more cash to buy a real moto
Yep I lost my front wheel junked it and have a xr200r and a yz250f now much better
the electricals break down easily..
Got one cheap,found out why. P. O. S.
Keep your advice im buying
Whatever said here, will be interesting to see after 5-10 years.
Wonder how this pandemic will affect Chinese perceptions...
In time, when they have built a reputation. Quality will improve, the price will go up.
Where can I get one of these bikes?
unfortunately only directly from china, tim. the guy hoping to import them into canada finally gave up when he found out it's an illegal copy of the honda. apparently the factory kept saying they had bought the rights to copy the design and our guy kept demanding proof. eventually the factory confessed they never had the rights. we've heard on the grapevine honda is suing a group who import these into the USA for the same reason. 😢
I find myself often sticking up for Chinese made because I feel a lot of good stuff coming out of China is lumped in with the cheap crap unfairly. Having said that, I accept that China produce a heap of motorcycle parts but I reluctant to buy an entire Chinese motorbike, especially when the DR650 is cheap, the abundance of aftermarket parts available and it's a legend.
a very balanced viewpoint nev, something quite rare in these comments lol. they have made plenty of garbage in the past and while there are encouraging examples emerging i am hopeful but sceptical at the same time. for example it turns out the factory has lied about buying the patents for this 450 so honda is taking legal action against a guy importing them into the USA. so even if the bike is reasonably good their business ethics suck (in this case at least). it's still a long road ahead....
i have a AsiaWing Enduro CRF250X Clone ..... nothing bad to say about it... the only thing you should do it recheck the routing of the Electric/Cables and secure them well with zipties, the chinese use less zipties the rest is very okay so far
good to hear, let us know how it goes in the long term too. 🤞
What's the dirt bike model in the video please
Explained in the video, Dany. It's a fairly complicated answer as there's no single brand as such
They’re about to start manufacturing some KTM models to....
Personally I wouldent race one, but if they really are getting pretty good they would likely be spectacular beginner and hobby rider bikes and last i read thats 90% of the dirt bike market, only 10% of new race bikes actually see a track (with there first owner) even for learning on a track and doing your first few races they might be okay
Their*
YES , just like the new electric bikes(Stark) coming to the US later in 2022. But at a fraction of the cost. Nicot, Pantera, EGL and others I'm researching are worth giving a shot comparing the deprication of a new Japan made MX bike .It's fun to try something new without breaking the bank . As far as the legality it will help reset some of the way over paid execs. in japan that probably never rode. When GM designed the new C8 vette the bought a 488 and a 911 took them apart and made thier own version, dought any of this would end up in International court they would have a hard time enforcing it.
I did all the 'Chicken' tracks on an MSG 621e last weekend
Not sure why, but It sure left me wanting more.
Chinese dirt bikes are good if you take very good care of them, also you have to get better bolts or tighten them. I have an Apollo RFZ DB X15 and it works just fine.
I have had experience with Chinese ATV's (childrens models) as well as various dirt bikes produced there as well. They have all been bullet proof, parts are cheap if ever needed, and they are great for the non-pro rider. They are using designs from many years ago, so they arent state-of-the-art, but they are good enough for the average consumer.
I agree with that. I will say that THAT was not the case 10 years ago though you know. They shipped the bikes but no one had ANY parts. That has changed over the past 5 years or so. There are dedicated mechanics as well now. So yup I concur. Not that you were looking for my approval haha. But you get the point. Ride well my friend
@@StoryMotoADV Stay safe......prayers to you form the USA
@@border411 will do. May we all bust a billion bugs brother. Chinese bike or not. haha. Ride well man.
I’ve owned a Chinese dirt bike (Tekken 250). It does so much for so little money. I’ve taken it up mountain paths in the Himalayas, driven it across my country in deserts. It’s easy to fix, rugged and dependable.
I don’t know about other Chinese bikes, but in my experience, generalisations are often wrong in some cases. I’m happy that it’s wrong in mine - planning to drive my bike from Karachi to Kashgar (China), I think it would be awesome!
from what i've seen so far i'd agree qasim. sure the vast majority of chinese bikes were crap by western standards in the past.... i'm sure many still are but there seem to be a rising number of better quality ones that give hope some brands will present good budget alternatives in the near future.
$8.5k AUD for the TSE... I can get a 1y/o Beta 250 RR for that money. I really wanted the TSE to do well, that engine is a trail dream but it's 30 year old tech in a stolen frame, there's no way I could justify the price.
Beta is sick. Went to buy a 350rr 4 Stroke and it was sold. Riding a 2012 Husky 310txc.
Nice, my mate has a 310... They're not far behind the 350 :-)
agreed, i know they have put quite a bit of bling on it but i think they overpriced them here in australia. at least until they are proven bike.
Another thing I forgot to mention with the price is ADR... The TSE doesn't have ADR, fine in Vic where we have recreational registration, terrible elsewhere. When you look at the pricing of some road going Chinese bikes which are arguably more complex, the TSE seems more and more ridiculous. It's a crying shame given the excellent marriage of engine and frame.
You could buy 4-5 Chinese ones for the price of one KTM 500 Exc in Australia...that’s a lot of spares. You might even be able to start a parts business on the side
shipped direct that's not far off the mark, ronan. except shipping is the killer of course, unless you brought in a container load. unfortunately when importers bring in this sort of bike they have to put a pretty big profit margin on to cover the costs of warranty, particularly if the quality control is shit on some parts. for example the GPX 450 is US$5900 which IS cheap, but for most riders still too expensive when it's an unknown quantity. it was probably only US$3300 from the factory but then they factor in shipping, cost of warranty, added bling and finally their profit margin.
it costs 10k for a new 450 here in the US for casual riders Chinese might be the way to go
i think GPX is selling their 450 model (not based on this one) for $6900. when it's a completely unknown bike i think it would need to be closer to half price before i took the risk. once there was plenty of good rider feedback i think that price would be more tempting...
I'm getting a a dual sport 250 to compliment my KLR soon.
Could you please post a link? Thank you
a link to what, angel?
@@crosstrainingenduro to buy the bike
Until the proof is made, quality and part availibility for decades to come, I think one is better with a good lightly used reputed brand that will last and will be repairable and usable for a long time. I was almost shocked to see this CRF450 clone since I own a CRF of the same generation. Looks very close, except for the headlight and enduro stuff, as mine is the motocross version. Time will tell, as always. But one thing is sure, a well kept CRF of those years is pretty cheap to buy, you can rebuilt it with original and aftermarket quality parts and end with a perfect proven bike for less than a new chinese copy, which is an older 10/15 years old design anyway. For now, it is a bit hard to believe that the tolerances, the materials and the build quality can be the same as a Honda. Just my 2 cents. :)
"CRF of those years is pretty cheap to buy, you can rebuilt it with original and aftermarket quality parts and end with a perfect proven bike for less than a new chinese copy"
Amen to that! And you don't have to worry about dodgy manufacturing... because Honda can actually be sued, unlike some fly by night Chinese con man who cares about nothing except turning a quick buck.
Why would you want or expect decades of reliability and parts for a 1300 dollar vehicle?
"Innovation is not likely to drive significant market shift in dirt bike purchases over the next decade".
I'm pretty sure that if/when segway technology is incorporated into bikes, many super gumbies will want them. Wheelies all the way!
EGL is now selling one for $4,499 which includes shipping...
I've got the A16 250 dirt bike. Unable to find parts ANYWHERE.
do you knov XG YAO brand?
No, I haven't heard of it before.
Same engine (Zongshen 250 4 stroke)= Ajp PR5,Gas Gas Cami ,Fantic Casa;
The clones are great, you can switch most parts with honda or yamaha genuine parts. In places where labor cost for bike technician isn't high, you can always find japanese bike substitute parts and let them fit it in. No hassle, cheap overall prices. Work just great.
Can you get parts for them???
It's a Honda clone. If Honda is still making the parts, yes.
Mate its a discussion / debate from 50 years ago, lot of it revolves around vanity, and Brand "loyalty" status, reality is great proportion (99%) of products are made in China and for some people the price is not everything.
I ride a crossfire cfr250 and love it can replace my entire engine for less then a YZF rebuild. Parts are cheap and makes 21hp and that's enough for me in the bush lol
In the late 40s and 50s the Japanese market had the same reputation as the Chinese markets do now. There is no quality control. So, products are hit or miss. Maybe they'll get there ducks in a row before long...
agreed eric. there seem to be a few models where they've largely got it together (for the price that is) but it's still very very hit and miss at the moment.
Thanks for your review, I do have a Benelli TNT 250 , chinese, motorcycle, two years now , and more than 10.000 miles, and really no problems, it all depends how you take care of it. Chinese had been improving, and if you look for a good manufacturer in China, you may find a good product as well. My experience, no problem, would I buy a Japanese, no, you pay tooo much for the name brand.
You pay too much for name-brand?? When you can get a loan for about $60 a month I think it's worth buying the original instead of these copycats. Chinese knockoffs are invading online stores like Amazon, stealing patents left and right while putting original inventors out of business. I understand the Chinese knockoffs may be the only option for someone who can't afford the real thing but is it the RIGHT thing to do??
Jay Ryan can you tell me what original inventors were put out of business?
Even the Chinese in China don't want them so why should the rest of the workd want them, I ride with a group of Enduro riders here in the South of China, most have old Ktms and Huskys ( I have a 2019 Gasgas EC 300) that give little or no trouble and still give and enjoyable ride. Whenever a used KTM or Husky is for sale it gets snapped up right away. A coupe of riders have tried Chinese brand bikes with disasterous results, one guy dismantled his Chinese bike and threw in the bin in after 4 months of hassle, breakages and trouble. He ended up getting a hard worked 2012 Ktm Freeride. Moral of the story it is better to get an old top brand bike than a New Chinese bike, unless you like to challenge your sanity,.
A very interesting article about illegal Chinese copies of bikes from BMW, Honda, Ducati and Harley Davidson. The gist? In most cases it's illegal but it is very difficult and expensive to take any action (and I suspect that the Chinese factories would simply shut down then re-open under another name).
www.advrider.com/so-sue-me-say-the-chinese-factories/
We were there importing into the US chinese bikes in 2003. Same story back then "are these chinese bikes going to be a new revolution!?" Seems not much has changed in terms of mechanical advancement. Honda clones, small displacement... except for a few bigger 450-650 engines I've seen developed. They've gotten slightly better at making more attractive plastic/appearance. They have a long way to come in terms of matching other bigger companies when it comes to value price combined with a (lower end) but still quality/well-functioning product. The one area the chinese have been ahead of the world, is in 2-wheel electric motorcycle/scooter total saturation.. building way more way earlier than anyone else!
Made in Germany was once looked at in the same light as made in china, things change given time and effort.
Japan as well, now both are held in very high regard.
agreed jager. i suspect eventually china will undergo the same changes although possibly it could take longer as their culture is currently geared more toward short-term profit and not on quality, relative to japan and germany.
This is 2021 they can build them with higher quality of course but they won't.
Their target is cheap bikes for more customers . Replacement parts are also cheap .
Just buy a Gas Gas EC 300 for the best of everything.
Agree just bought one. I live in a country (Thailand) where 90% of the products are poorly made Chinese items. I am just plain tired of everything breaking. So no Chinese bike for me.
@@billshuey7422 really? Never seen a Chinese bike on the road here. Mostly honda and Yamaha with some Suzuki
HI i just parted out a lifan (china) 125 for spares 8000 miles- chrome literally falling off, parts of VERY poor quality.It was v similar to the one you rode in vietnam.i have pics if you would like my e mail.Some of the scooters work well in hot dryish climates like Greece where they are typically bought by workers to commute short distances for around 5 years on finance (finance =low weekly transportation cost) then sold as they start dropping to bits by then if not before.Once they start going wrong-it never stops.
certainly be interested in pics, nick. we rode the 175 versions in vietnam. most of the 28 bikes in their fleet have between 50000 to 150000km on the clock and the engines are almost indestructible despite being on full throttle a fair bit of the time. and no rebuilds needed. gearboxes seem sturdy except really stomping on the gear shift can bend the selector so they occasionally fix those. indicators are crap, they regularly have to replace those. mirrors droop all the time. and the fuel level indicators are useless and almost never work. that's about it. oh and they spend plenty of time muddy and wet in vietnam too. maybe they got most things right on this model?
@@crosstrainingenduro hi how do I get in touch with you is it the Tim Coleman website Email address or another oneCheers nick
info@crosstrainingenduro.com
Love my GPX tse 250. China makes the parts for most bikes . They are as good in my opinion. Go ahead pay 10.000 bucks for the name . I saved 5.000 bucks. 😃
This is surprising that Vietnamese would appraise Chinese made bike as generally Vietnamese do despise anything made in China, but that said I did build Chinese 450 ktm clone here in Vietnam and was pretty happy with quality.
SSR is the way to go for chinese bikes. A little more than a cheap ass Tao Tao or something, but well built and long lasting for 1/2 the price of a Honda. Most China bikes are built cheaply as possible, but they use literally millions of these same machines to get around daily. I've owned various chinese made things and have always been fairly impressed for what you get for the start price. They need a person who knows how to do their own maintenece and theyre great. Ignition coil? 10$ carburetor? 20$ check your own valve clearances, and your good to go. And check every damn bolt for tightness, possibly add loctite or change bolts and nuts to hardened steel ones. After that its basically a Honda if you can do your own QC.
People like drawing comparisons with Japanese manufacturers, but the reality is that Chinese manufacturers will probably not reach the recognition of Japanese or even South Korean products. Why? The Chinese on the mainland are not particularly interested in branding and marketing . Name a Chinese company that makes and markets a mid to high level consumer product under their own name which is sold in 1st world countries and widely recognized by the buying public . I can only think of Huawei. There might be a few others, but for a country that make almost everything that's quite surprising.
Taiwan has quality manufacturing, but even brand recognition of Taiwanese manufacturers is close to zero in the western world. Taiwan and China are more than happy enough to make anything for mass consumption , be it crap or quality and leave the marketing and branding to other manufacturers/companies.
Dirt Bikes are luxury/recreational items in 1st world countries. That means marketing and brand image are almost as important as performance. You have to have both to sell. Racing creates a Halo effect around your product. If the Chinese start selling competitive race machines with recreational models at a significant cost savings combined with a somewhat successful racing effort they would grab chunks of market share. It's the racing and marketing that would probably never happen to any great degree, relegating Chinese branded dirt bikes to things you buy because you don't have the cash and Japanese and Euro bikes you aspire when you do have the cheddar.
Olight
motocross racing in china is getting very big, and there are already some companies that want to prove themselves by competing there. I think with time, they will try to get into the world racing scene. They arent there yet though. And yeah, they arent good at even naming their products for the international market lol
Bullshit. Quality products sell themselves. Who heard of GasGas before 1999? Who heard of Beta before 2001? Who has seen an ad for either other than 'X' won on it? I haven't but I have an old $5K GG bike and $30K in Beta machines. I also own a lot of Klim gear. Quality sells to serious buyers whether or not it's advertised, enthusiasts spread the word. Then there are companies like Alpinestars and Ducati that make rubbish spend millions in advertising. Nothing to be done but laugh at these poor cucks, they have a lot of fun at sponsored events but are stuck buying a crap product.
Chinese branded products are not known for their quality . The point is that in order for Chinese motorcycles to sell in 1st world countries they must improve the quality , remain competitive with prices and drive marketing that would remove the low quality stigma associated with chinese branded motorcycles. Quality they can do , if motivated enough, low price is a no brainer, but marketing that's a big if.
Yeah my last 3 pit bikes were/are Chinese bike I buy them to race them and prove to myself and others that lower quality bikes can be competitive.. ONLY if your on top of maintaining them and keeping them in tip top shape
At the moment, when these bikes will be the same quality as European dirt bikes and when manufacturers will establish sales and service network, bikes won't be cheap any more.
True Dat!!
I'd rather pay top money for something that's reliable and continues to work than something cheap that's thrown away in two years.
I'd never buy Chinese goods. Yamaha or nothing from now on. I made a REALLY BIG MISTAKE buying POLARIS atvs... total shit... always something broken or built so cheap it hurts to look at it. Lots of bells n whistles and great riding and gobs of power but built REALLY CHEAP.. problems with snapping drive belts, front diff bearing plate exploding, axle shafts, wheel bearings over n over n over, brake pads fall out of the caliper ( really wtf is this shit... sounds safe eh) glowing red hot exhaust warping and catching plastics and Bush on fire... relays turning green steady, voltage regulators back ordered for months n months n months cuz these atvs eat them for breakfast... these 3 polaris atvs nearly put me broke... worst part ... RESALE IS TOTAL SHIT.... YAMAHA forever from now on...
@@motox2051 ya sucks cuz polaris has really awesome sleds... but my experience with my 3 atvs says stick with YAMAHA.
Ernie Desjardins Thanks for that I’ll stay away from Polaris
Yamaha or Honda. Maybe Suzuki, ktm, Kawasaki or can am. Everything else is junk.
if you want a reliable bike buy Husqvarna or KTM. Its true that parts are a little bit more expensive than the parts of Japanese bikes, but Husqvarna and KTM don't break. Husqvarna even better than KTM.
KTM/Husky is way better than any Chinese bike but my experience, bikes made in Japan are far more reliable.
Most major manufacturers use chinese to make parts for their bikes
Never, never, never, ever. I don’t buy bikes based on price, but rather for my appreciation of the ride, technology, performance and styling. And I don’t believe in rewarding the Chinese for their ability to copy and package someone else’s innovations. But I can appreciate other buyers rank price higher in their decision process. Each to his / her own.
looking for a chine ktm 300
Where can you buy one cheap in the US?
q9powersportsusa.com/collections/new-dirt-bikes-pit-bikes-and-enduro-motorcycles-q9-powersports-usa/products/tao-motor-tbr7-250cc-enduro-motorcycle
Here's a good one. It's actually pretty decent especially for the cheap price. There's plenty of replacement parts as it's basically a hawk. The only issue is, out of the box the stock carb has an 85 jet (to comply with the EPA import bs). there's a kit on eBay that's like $25 that is a complete overhaul for the carb, a bigger jet and gaskets and such. Once you get the carb sorted out it works well!
Innovation will always drive dirt bike sales, as non of us are as good as we think we are or want to be...
So anything that improves our riding is something we think we must have !
Just remember when you’re at the top of the hill laughing at your mates struggling their way up,
You quite quickly forget how much you spent on your new bike 😃😂👍
on the other hand if i could get a new 1990 kx 250 or something like it on the cheep i would be so happy. i sold that bike to buy my first car
i have use to have an atomic 250 and that lasted me ages
Nah I don't see the specialist market taking off. My reasons being the following:
Reliability is not a priority for Chinese manufacturers and never will be.
Parts availability (UK) is cr*p, it really is. There's a combination of so many manufacturers supplying almost identical bikes and a complete lack of service centers and actual parts availability. Chinese bikes here are either thrown when a major part fails or bodged together with almost the same parts until they all eventually implode and the machine is thrown away.
I was around when the Japanese invaded the motorcycle market in the UK. Reliability was brilliant and far far better than what we already had here. The reliability is what allowed the Japanese machines to take over. I still see 40 year old untouched Hondas being ridden daily here. Sure the brakes and tyres and some cables have been replaced but the engines are unmolested - there's not a single chance a Chinese bike will make it even a quarter of that distance.
I ride a British supermoto, albeit with a Suzuki engine (CCM 404). I chose this machine more because of the engine - parts availability for the DRZ400 lump is unreal. The rest of the bike is cobbled together from the best of the best: White Power shocks, Brembo brakes etc etc.
Chinese machines are all in house copies of current machines made by other manufacturers but they do not take quality control seriously.
My point?
Yes people will buy that stuff but they'll come to regret it. We all know there will be casting sand left in oil galleries and hammered on bearings because someone machined a crank incorrectly. We'll see thousands of the things on Gumtree 12 months later with a sh*gged engine. People will be dropping DRZ400 lumps into bouncy frames!
At this stage I'm happy to buy a small Chinese bike for the kids to cruise around the local trails on, but It will take a lot of long term positive reviews before I'd buy one for myself. Reliability is key when in remote locations, not saving a few dollars... Good vid as always.
Buying a GPX bike in the USA? Remember it's a just a cheap Chinese clone that is rebranded! Here is one owner's nightmare. 😢
"The GPX arrived too me with mal-fitting plastics, stripped fasteners, a blown, fully leaked rear shock and majorly a faulty ECU. It took two months of back and forth with USA Motortoys to get the bike functional. Once those matters were taken care the bike did okay for about 3 months...until it started falling apart. It had numerus issues, electrical shorts a failed voltage regulator, failed N2 seal in the shock, brake line failures and the list of problems went on & on.
The electrical system issues put me out of action for an entire fall riding season. In a nutshell trying to find information on any issues is a massive headache or impossible. There's a FB group but you know how that goes...100x opinions or it was my fault a problem happened. If I needed something for the GPX, it meant hours of research and guessing. Most of the time, including parts sent from the distributor, they didn't fit or need modification to work...This was a total pain in the ass. This is because GPX are designed by copies of other manufacturers work, with multiple aspects combined into each machine.
In the end, GPX bikes are nothing but cheap Chinese copies. An okay engine and frame wrapped in any combination of cheap Chinese shit. Yes they are inexpensive, but there is a reason they cost half of what established brands do.... I believe most owners of these bikes and caught up in the hype are deluding themselves they got a bike "just as good as a KTM for half the cost" ... The truth is FAR from that."
I got my 160 Chinese bike fixed the same day
Within an hour
Clutch Broken
Bars Bent
Front tire flat
I would recommend saving for a good Reliable Japanese bike like
Honda
Kawasaki
Yamah
Why does no one give love to suzuki
What type of China bike did you get
yar but absolutely no dealer near me will service them, so no back up or parts. every shop here want touch anything other then named brands the big 4
the big four? gas gas, beta , AJP and SWM? 😁
I was owning one 450 from China, if you accept shity forks that doesn’t work, carburetor from scooters and faulty decompressor that prevent you from starting bike, oh, and I forgot about sit - worst I ever tried in my life, then Chinese bikes are quite ok :)
Chinese bikes are coming a long way including fuel injected ones that some of the brand ones don't have, so all the "Big Brands " better watch out.
Where did you see these Chinese bike?
The Asiawing looks exacly like the Christini 2 Wheel Drive Enduro xD
Both come out of the same factory.
@@canadaler which factory?
@@mikegro8502 www.asiawing.com/
It’ll be a long time before I buy an unproven Chinese bike.
@@motox2051 What dirt bike do you ride? Very unlikely its made in America...
The problem with Chinese steel is that it is heavy, filled with dirty particles and low quality, from a metallurgical standpoint. Their plastics are low quality too. And their electrical systems have a ways to go. Many of their bikes have stators and other electric components that readily fail.
They still have a ways to go to improve quality.
@@motox2051 I was just confused why buying Chinese is un-american...but buying say Japanese or something European is fine. Nothing more American than spending your hard earned money on whatever the hell you want...because its your money...even if that might be a Chinese dirt bike.
@@motox2051 What made you think I thought they care? I hate Chinese stuff. Its garbage.
Don't hold back, tell us what you really think.
I agree. None of them have any manuals.
Aloha
Cross fire/cross x is very populer in Nepal..
Anybody seen the thumpstar 2 stroke range ?
careful what you are criticizing, Chinese companys only do what they can get away with in terms of quality, after sale support etc. it is an expedient and profitable model especially in a price driven market. Keep in mind they are very capable of producing reliable parts and entire bikes as they do for BMW (Kymco makes all BMW scooters). and Honda has been producing a large percentage of their bikes in China for years.
And you reckon BMW scooters are reliable?
Kymco also make some single cylinder lumps for B
Chery is a chinese car brand I see in my country a fair deal, I learned not long ago they had troubles with Chevrolet for stealing a "design" or whatever you'd call it. Basically a Chevy Spark's door would fit perfectly into a Chery's QQ car, that looks exactly the same, the car is so simple it baffles me how they would be so lazy as to steal that design, I can't really trust them now. Land Rover has sued another chinese company of a similar thing with their Evoque model.
sometimes the patent has lapsed but there are definitely many cases where they have illegally copied someone's design... they will need to really lift their game if they want credibility in western markets.
The plastics are a copy of the Honda but the engine, frame, and suspension are not even close and the Honda is superior for sure. With that said I had the opportunity to ride one that my buddy owns and yeah it has far less power than my honda but for the price I think it's a decent bike. I don't think anybody will ever ride it on a professional level but as long as parts are available when you need them it could be a good option if you can't, or don't want to spend the money on one of the big 5 brands. 😁🇺🇲
They're going to have to prove that their bikes and components can take the punishment of off road use. I don't want something breaking and sending me into the trees. The Chinese did a great job of restricting access to their consumer market unless you partnered with their manufacturers. Now those Chinese partners have license to last generation engines, etc. The parts and bikes I've seen so far seem too inexpensively made to last the distance. That old saying, "you get what you pay for" surely applies.
Go look at rs85 elstar replica ktm snd ird a proper 3 stroke racing mx bike
Its a propper 2 stroke ** mx motorcross bike
I want to make bike spending higher priority than mortgage, kid's tuition, taxes, food, water, clothing, electric bills and gas. But the reality is hard to challenge..... Cheaper and good enough Chinese bikes are always welcome.
There is a local shop that sells these bikes. My main concern is reliability and availability of parts.
Oh no I won't buy Chinese because bolts just snap or strip in vital parts in about a year. If you want a rusty piece go for it but my 1995 Honda is bulletproof and never let me down. Worth paying 4 times the price any day. 👌🏻
Oh baloney. My first bike was an old 77 honda xl250. The forks leaked, the exhaust was completely rusted apart and it had charging system problems. The exhaust was a 300 dollar fix back in the mid to late 80's. My next bike was a '85 gpz550 with 28000 miles on the clock. Needed new fuel lines, wheel bearings, spark plugs, brakes, fuel tank, fuel tank float, rear shock, petcock, carb seals, and pod filters. Bike was classic and a hoot to ride. Mechanical stuff wears out, honda or otherwise.
In my collection i still have the Pibike i bought 10yr ago, its the Xsport FYM, copy of the THUMPSTAR, just be prepared to take it apart & build it correctly 😂 apart from that they are good for the money. ........apart from the cruisers. ..that look shit' .
Buy a VMAX 👍
The breakthrough will come when the Chinese manufacturers realise that they can produce a seriously good bike by just charging 5 per cent more and fitting higher quality suspension, wheels and brakes. Due to sheer volume and purchasing power they could even get away with fitting their bikes with European suspension like Sachs and brembo brakes and still be much cheaper than main brands. Their engines are now reliable so that is all they really need to do.
that's my position at the moment too. so far there's only one dirt bike shaping up to possibly fit that category... the TSR250R. some guys have 150 hours on them now and are pulling them apart to see how everything is wearing - looking good so far but it's early days still.
I dont care how good their bikes are, not a chance im supporting that.
Ditto, Stephen. This video was done quite a while ago, and since then China's behaviour has gone from bad to worse. I'm actively encouraging everyone to reconsider buying anything Chinese. th-cam.com/video/-QtdWRN5VjI/w-d-xo.html
@@crosstrainingenduro Respect! 🙌
With the BMW 850 engine being made China by Loncin and all the KTM LC8 C bikes being made by CFMoto as of the first quarter of 2020
. “ European “ bikes being made in China is already happening.
And all of them have electronics, at least parts, made in China. It's really nearly impossible to avoid SOME Chinese content in almost anything you buy anymore.