The Secret to Nymph Fishing // Drop Mend for Strike Indicator Fishing
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 มิ.ย. 2024
- This might be the best tip ever for nymph fishing. Often called a "drop mend" "pivot mend" or "anchor mend" - this trick will allow you to drop that nymph down fast and get your indicator to float right over the top and you can control the speed of the indicator. Surface currents are about 4X faster than the currents your nymph should be in, so this overhand style mending gives you the control you need to slowly drive the indicator where it needs to go.
0:00 Intro
1:25 The Problem With Indicators
2:15 TWO Solutions
3:12 The Correct Solution
4:14 Typical Mends
4:50 Overhand Mending... LIFE Changing.
6:40 Bonus Tip. Steering the Indicator.
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Paradigm shifting for a (so he thought) decent fly fisherman.
Thank you very much.
Thanks! Really appreciate it. Glad to help.
I love seeing these kind of tip videos and realizing I figured it out on my own and have been doing it that way for years😃
Me too! But I do appreciate joe and others who can communicate it better than I could
@@CarlosGarcia-507 Yeah I'm a horrible teacher. I'm like "I dunno, watch me and do the same thing."
Love the way you set up your camera in front of you to demonstrate suspension nymphing. Well done Joe.👍
Great tips as always, Joe!
Enjoyed the video. Excellent tip on controlling the flow of your indicator. I've been using what I call "Indicator Mends" for many years. You are so right about keeping your nymph at fish feed levels (which most times is near bottom). The varying speeds of current (Top vs Bottom) is not understood by many a flyfisher. Fishing from a moving drift boat changes things.
Really great info , I always learn great real world tips from your videos , and love your podcast
Thank you
That is a GREAT tip - it’s going to take some practice, but I am absolutely going to give this a try!
Fish on my man, fish on. 🥳😊🤣 joe is always fun to watch on TH-cam, he finds some biig fish.
😅 couldn’t agree more. It’s sad when you see the people teaching us how to fish handle fish wrong. Joe has never done that and his fishery is proof of it.
Two of my favorite TH-cam fly fishing mentors in one place!
Great content!! That’s some slick mending!!! I just bought a Sage r8 10’ 4 wt , Sage arbor xl and a Sage Trout LL 9’ 4 wt from Reds fly shop. The r8 10’ 4 wt is an awesome smaller Stillwater rod. The trout LL is unreal for throwing small bwo’s on my small streams. I just received this gear within the last week or so and Im catching fish on both. Thank you for your quick shipping services!!!!! I trust you folks when I want to purchase expensive items…..
Great info Joe. Hitting the river today and will explore this technique for sure since I will be strike indicator fishing!! Always a great day fly fishing eh!! Stay safe!!
Thanks, go get 'em!
Thanks Joe, I love the New Zealand indicator. Great info as always.. Thanks…..
Thank you for sharing your awesome tips. Greatly appreciated!
You bet James, I'm hoping to do more and continue improving the format. Appreciate the props!
Awesome tip. Can’t wait to practice this a catch a few more.
Really good stuff! Thanks for sharing!
Always informative videos.
Really useful technique. Thank you!
Great video, thanks for sharing your knowledge
Nice one Joe. With regards to mending I like to think of it as pushing line, not pulling line.
Thank you for the tip, definitely will be trying this on the water next time
No problem 👍
I have been doing this lately. Didnt know it was an actual technique lol. I just always try to put my flies in front of my indicator through mending.
When you demonstrated the typical mends my jaw dropped because that’s exactly what I did for 5 hours straight earlier today with no bites. Glad I found this video
Awe damn. That's fishing I suppose. Keep at it. Use the big pivot mend to set it up, then follow with stealth mends.
Great tip!
Great tutorial Joe, thanks!
Thank you so much!
Great tips there! That would work in any river in the World. And what a dramatic place you are fishing there! Just found your channel and have subbed! Off to watch some more now.
Thanks so much Carl, how kind of you. Stay tuned I'll try to keep the advice coming.
That's a great color for indicator...
Thank you. My best indicator days have been short casts, a mend and a high stick. I'd rather strip and/or swing but there's no reason to be a hard head.
Welcome to understanding non laminar flow. I tend to use a very bright very small piece of something so fairly close to the top fly 18"-24". Then with the very small indicator I am not fighting the drag of the indicator. Often my indicator will sink, however, as it is that close to the fly, I will actually see the fish flash on the fly. I use this in heavy spring run off. I like your ideas for different conditions.
I think too many people are afraid to move the indy when they mend. I have always done this because it just made sense in my head, cool to know its an actual technique!
Great tip!!!
Thanks for watching!
Awsome video
I’ve been the worst nymph fisherman for 40 years. My confidence is shot before I even tie on a fly. Your videos will keep me trying to improve
Ok! Good luck out there. I would also suggest fishing a single nymph. With the new style of Tungsten beadheads and jig hooks, you can get even a #16 or #14 to sink in fast current without any additional weights or flies to take it down. This results in fewer tangles, snags, and drifts nice. Allows you to stay focused on good drifts and less dinking around with knots and tippet.
@@redsflyshop I like simple
Can't wait to try this. (Need ice to melt first.) This technique makes a lot of sense but what is the effect on the nymph if that drop mend is a little too aggressive? I'd be worried that I'd jerk the fly out of the lane I dropped it in. I'm guessing that I want to make that first cast well above the lane I'm targeting so that when the nymph gets there it's down and the indicator is nicely above it. Is that the goal? Thanks for the great tips as always!
Great tips
Glad you like them! Thanks for the follow and the positive feedback.
😊that is so good, I have never even seeing that secret in any trout book, videos, or ever heard before, thank you so much, Mil. Ret., Disabled vet., MSG Leum
Thanks so much, it really drops that nymph in there into tight spots quickly!
GREAT TIP, this has worked great, since you showed me this in person last year. I highly recommend doing this with a long Euro Rod with any indicator type fly line , wouldn't you agree?
I'll say this might be the second-best tip you've ever given. Your right angle, "California", setup was a game-changer for me and you're using it in this video I see. Combining that tackle setup with this mending style, yes, best nymphing tip ever!
Thanks so much, combine these two and you’re a killer.
I’m looking through the videos and can’t seem to find the California set up. Could you share a link?
@@MuleResonatorGuitars I think this is what he is likely referring to. It's all about the "hinge" th-cam.com/video/FnEnSsf3Crc/w-d-xo.html
I've been doing this for over 20 years, you are correct, it takes all the pull off the fly so it sinks fast, just be careful about doing this overtop of weary browns and steelhead because flipping that fly line and indicator over their heads can spook them. The key is to do it immediately when the fly lands and set the fly up deep prior to the fly running through the area where the fish are.
Yes very good comment here, this mend is for "prep" upstream of the fish. Not right on top of 'em. They will see the enemy fire and retreat.
hmmm very interesting i taught myself how to tie and flyfish a year or so ago and this technique kinda came natural to me idk why it just made sense lol
other fly fishers give you weird looks until you catch a couple in a hard or fast drift then they watch to see whats different and it works so good
the fly line itself will shoot over the indicator giving you 90 degree drifts longer
Downloaded so I can review streamside while I’m cussin out the fish. Thanks bud
Cool. Skillful
Thanks, it's very advantageous to learn this mend. Play around and master this one.
FYI audio is only coming through on the left speaker. Great vid!
This approach relies on proper indicator to nymph line length. One thing that gets neglected in many of these videos (maybe discussed elsewhere?) is how does one easily determine water depth? How did you know the stream was 5' deep in that area? Experiment? Say I'm new to a stream, is there a preferred method to determine water depth (assuming the bottom isn't visible)?
First you have to make an educated guess and make your cast while mending to get your fly as vertical as possible. If you are getting regular bumps on the bottom, move your indicator down about 6” at a time until no artificial bumps on the indicator occur; usually you are at the point just off the bottom unless it starts to start bumping further down your drift, then you may have to lower it a bit more, unless you want to just fish the deeper ate thoroughly before fishing that shallow area subsequent to the deeper area by lowering your strike indicator again. That’s how I do it, and stay in that deep water until it’s thoroughly worked.
Good stuff as always Joe.
Question: Aren’t you moving the nymph every time you move (mend) the indicator, thus affecting the dead drift? 🤔
YEP
not as much as you think because of the angle of the fly to the indy
mostly just making it 90 degrees to the indy instead of like 45 degrees
Joe. Enjoy your videos. I am curious about the line and leader setup your using. Thanks
Thanks! That is a 6 weight Sage R8 with the fighting butt option, and a Scientific Angler's Infinity line (Amplitude version not smooth). I love this rig for my larger nymphs and streamers on any trout river.
Very nice! What kind of material was the indicator? It reminds of those New Zealand wool ones
I like the NZ wool, but I often use a "poly yarn". I bought it at a craft store about 20 years ago haha. The NZ wool is great, I also canibalize Loon Tip Topper yarn indicators because that yarn is crazy buoyant.
Great video and info Joe. I especially like your high-stick mini roll-cast method of repositioning the indicator
The method of nymph fishing you're showing here was originally developed by Dean Schubert and Dave Hickson back in the late 70's in California. It was published in Fly-Fisherman magazine as the "Hinged Nymphing Method". I taught the Orvis West Coast Fly-Fishing Schools based out of the Orvis San Francisco Store from 1987 through 1997. Dean was the Director and I was the coordinator of the schools. So I worked closely with Dean for 10-years. I typically spent about 140-days a year teaching schools on various spring creeks in CA and OR. Also taught Fastwater Clinics on the Truckee River. The hinged-nymphing method worked great on all of those. We liked to use Spring Creeks for the schools because they are typically clear and slow and your student can see everything that's happening in them.
There are a couple of real easy ways to get your nymph directly under your indicator. The first thing we'd teach folks to do, presuming the wind isn't too bad, is to just open up their loop 4 or 5-ft. above the surface. That allows the nymph and shot to enter the water first and the indicator will then land upstream of the fly and will be pushing slack towards your fly. As you pointed out in your video the fly will sink very quickly with no tension on it.
The second method when the wind is too strong is to slightly overpower your cast. That will cause the shot and fly (or bead-head or otherwise weighted fly) to hook underneath the line and enter the water first. This is basically Joe Humphrey's "Tuck Cast". You can also get the same result using another Joe Humphrey's cast called his "Up/Down cast" (after stopping the rod on the front cast use a short up/down movement to tuck the fly under the line). Both of these casting methods will give you the desired result.
One thing that I want to expand upon slightly is the difference in speed between the top and the bottom currents. They will vary quite a lot, and I wouldn't say it was always 4 times faster at the surface. Depends a lot on the water speed you're looking at and the obstructions on the bottom that slow it down and where you are in the water structure. There's an easy way to figure out when your fly is pulling or being dragged by the indicator, especially when using a yarn indicator. Trick is to be sure there's a longer tuft sticking up out of the middle of the indicator. If you make a good cast as this video shows, there should be no pull on the indicator as the nymph sinks. Watch your indicator closely as it drifts and if that tuft of fur is angling towards the front, your 'cator is pulling the fly and you need to reset the 'cator behind the fly. The high-stick mini-roll-cast that Joe demonstrates here is perfect for that.
If you end up with your 'cator too far back you will see that tuft of yarn angling towards the back because it's slowing the fly down. Most of the time you can just let it drift and it will self-correct because of the difference in current speed on the top vs. the bottom as you start your drift. However, in a sloping tailout, the current speeds reverse with the bottom current moving faster than the current on the surface. That's because the volume of water on the bottom is being pushed out of its place by the fast upward-sloping bottom. Try putting on a bright pink or orange fly sometime; make a cast that straightens out your line with the fly upstream of your 'cator, and then watch how quickly that bright fly passes your indicator as the slope shallows the water. You'll see it zoom. It's quite eye-opening actually.
A couple of other comments about setting up this system. We generally found it worked best if you put your split shot (no more than 1 BB shot in fast water is needed) about 6" away from your fly. The tippet between the shot and your indicator will have tension, but that last 6-inches allows the fly to move more naturally in the current as it passes through the mini-currents along the bottom. Then the fish only has to move the fly slightly to come tight to the split shot, which will twitch you 'cator. If you find yourself missing a lot of strikes, place the shot 4" away from your fly. You may not get as many strikes at that point because the fly doesn't move as freely, but you will get more hook-ups. If you are not getting strikes, and you know fish are there, move the split shot back to 8" from the fly. You won't detect as many strikes, but you will catch fish.
In any piece of water where you can actually see the fish holding (such as Spring Creeks), use the indicator as a "drift-indicator", not as a strike indicator. If you get a good cast that successfully places your fly in the current you need and you are getting a dead-drift, that fly will be within about a 1-foot circle under your indicator. as you indicator gets within 2-feet of the fish, watch the fish instead of an indicator. If you see the fish move his mouth to the side and then snap back, STRIKE - that's a feeding move. If you see him move over about 6" to 9" and come to a sudden stop - STRIKE - that may or may not be a feeding move and if you don't strike, you won't know. And finally if you are upstream of the fish and you see a flash of white - STRIKE!. That flash of white is the fish opening and closing his mouth to take your fly! It's very important to wait for him to close his mouth and then STRIKE! If you strike too soon on that last one, you'll pull the fly right out of his mouth before he closes it. And, big fish take longer to close their mouth than small fish. If your nymphing for steelhead, they really keep their mouth open a long time,. So I'll drop my rod tip to let the fly drift more deeply into their mouth and then strike to the side, which almost always hooks them in the corner of the jaw. You will be amazed how many times you will see a fish take your fly without your indicator moving at all. So if you can see the fish, set up the drift and then watch the fish.
One final comment about dead-drift nymphing. You don't actually have to get a dead drift to catch fish with this method, you just have to get "Close Enough to a Dead-Drift". I wrote an article by the title that was published by American Angler back in 1997 in their "Alaska" issue. I was asked by the editor to write an article about nymph fishing with sinking lines or non-dead drift methods and I went into it a bit there. Fish will actually take a drift that can be dragging slightly. Not motor-boat wake drag obviously, but dead drift with that yarn tuft leaning forward or back a little "close-enough". You have a wider range of drift variation they will accept in faster water than in slower water. In Spring Creeks, where the water moves so slowly, there is less room for drag than anywhere else. When you are using the dead-drift hinged-nymphing method, try to recognize the bucket first (prime holding spot) and arrange your drift so you perform your final mend before you drift through your fly through the bucket.
Good Fishing and Thanks to Joe for another great video.
I'm just starting flying fishing this winter and trying to learn. if I'm fishing for steelhead/salmon in a river that ranges from 5-30ft and sometimes fast and slow current from a boat/bank with an 8wt rod what line should i get to get my gear down I'm trying to use wet flies and get 'em deep and think ill try and use a strike indicator. but i dont know what line to get.
Mending was the hardest thing to learn for me, even though I picked it up within 20 minutes of watching TH-cam video's, I just picked up a 4# and a new Lamson reel, I'll definitely have to do this. Nymphing is my favorite way to fly fish, and I've caught 50x the amount of fish fly fishing as just spin casting
good vid. audio is a little jazzed up on the video but what can ya do?
Thanks Joe. What length/wt/action rod is going to allow for the best mend in this style of fishing. Seems I would need a pretty nimble rod? Also, best line and/or leader for this?
Long time customer. Thanks!
I like any rod with a snappy tip and a floating line. Any 9' 5 weight is great. A nice fresh line really helps too. A hot line will jump out of the water and beg to be mended.
Oh yes, Yarn for me is by far preferred. I like Loon Tip Toppers (small is better for me), but you can use most indicators. Yarn when combed out an fluffy will jump out of the water like a feather for that pivot mend.
my left ear enjoyed the tip
Good tip. Which line would you recommend for steelhead indicator nymphing with a 10’ 7wt (med-fast action) for winter steelhead on a mid sized to small river (Necanicum style):
Rio Elite Extreme Indicator
Rio Elite Indicator
S.A Amplitude Anadro Indicator …
?
Thanks in advance
Elite Indicator for me, it's a bit lighter. The Extreme is a bit heavy, and if memory serves me correctly the Anadro is also a bit bulkier. The thinner the line, the better the drift so there is a balance. Just my 2 cents.
Thanks 👍
Huh - I’ve been doing it like this for a while now just thinking about reducing drag on the fly.
Nice tip. what reel use in this video? tahnks
That is a Sage Arbor XL in the 5/6 - I recently used this in Patagonia half of the week. It's been a super reel, zero complaints from me. redsflyfishing.com/products/sage-arbor-xl-reels
thanks!
@@redsflyshop
This is how I’ve been mending for a couple years.
Great tip but wont a mend that moves the indicator make the nymph jump underneath it? I would assume this might spook trout
Great question, you are right. If your fly/indicator is right on the trout it could spook it for sure. This is more of a "setup" mend that you would make prior to where you might be targeting. You would make the indicator pivot and jump (possibly the fly too), and then follow up with much lighter more delicate mends to follow.
What kind of flyline are you using here? Do you like a euro style line for delicate mending or just a standard floating line for the casting advantage?
I can't remember exactly, but it's probably an SA Amplitude Infinity. I'm not super picky, RIO Gold or Infinity are typically fit my casting style for most "utility" situations for trout. I don't fish an indicator very often on my Euro lines, but that does work fine for short casting on small rivers. The Yakima is so big you really need a full blown floater to cover the water in these big runs.
Joe, are you fishing above Roza dam?
Yes.
This mending technique only works if your indicator is close enough to keep all of your line off the water, right? If you're casting over 20' or so, then you're stuck with the dropper going at the surface speed???
Good question, but no you're not stuck at 20' or 30'. While you do have to have all of your line out of the water, by elevating your rod tip, you can throw massive mends that will allow you to be effective out to 40' or even 50'.
Do you need to add flotant to tip toppers? Mine just sink almost immediately
Yes, add some Loon Aquel and if you can try to comb it through the yarn fibers.
The theory seems good, but I noticed that when you flip the indicator, it’s probably jerking the fly in an unnatural way.
Yes Michael, that's true and a valid point. But since the fly is attempting to sink it's not "setup" yet. There are fundamentally two types of mends. 1. Setup mends, that move the fly, line, and get you ready for the drift. 2. Fishing mends, these are just for maintaining a steady drift. This technique combines the two. Set it up to drop an sink with your first mend, back it up and hold it in place with the follow up mends.
What indicator, rod/ size and reel are you using?
I'm using a 9' 6wt Sage R8 with a Sage Arbor XL Reel. Topped of with a New Zealand yarn indicator. Great over all nymphing setup.
redsflyfishing.com/products/sage-r8?variant=41992267235527
redsflyfishing.com/products/sage-arbor-xl-reels
What fly line were you using?
@@adamkoontz6430 that is an SA Infinity Amplitude. Jumps out of the water for you.
“Look how elevated my rod tip is” heh
I wonder how it works with a foam style indicator?
Not quite as well, but you can use it with pretty much any indicator.
Bobber fishing vs fly fishing.
No tippet ring on this setup?
Maybe not on this video, but I do run a system like that much of the time yes. I position a tippet ring tied on an hinging loop knot just below the indicator.
mend, mend, mend.
I feel like when I do this it spooks the fish?
Great point, I should have better emphasized this is a "setup mend" designed not only to drop the fly(s) fast but to create a drift that will hold longer between mends.
@@redsflyshop ahhh good point. You ever feel like you’re “over mending” as in mending too often?
But don’t you miss strikes from constantly putting slack in the system?
Oh good question. Yes and no, first off you want to run the shortest effective distance between indicator and nymph. The closer they are, the more control you have and responsive your strike indicator. Next, the indicator is constantly drifting the slack out of it, the second you setup the mend the indicator is already trying to pull it tight so it doesn't really accumulate. One sweep of a 9' rod and you'll suck up the slack so fast it shouldn't matter. Most of the time anyway. Very well thought out question, just keep the indicator depth as short as possible to start.
i think this has been common sense nymphing since i can remember
Aren’t you just introducing slack between the indicator and fly again? As soon as the slack is gone the fly will begin to be pulled along by the indicator again. I. My modest experience, my intention when indi nymphing has always been to try to keep a tight line between the indi and fly and thus be able to detect strikes. I’ve observed the speed of the fly + indi system is somewhere in between the speed of the surface current and bottom current- they both effect each other. This is a necessary evil if you want to be able to see strikes on the indi.
Good question. When the nymph reaches terminal depth you’ll be tight. If you watch the back end of the video again you’ll see some follow up mends I’m using to slow the indicator down to help it track straight above the fly. If the nymph is “hanging” you’re tight.
Heads up, you might have an audio issue for this video. Your voice kept cutting out every 15 seconds for a couple of seconds for me. I thought it was me but watched other videos of yours and my audio was fine.
Thanks for the heads up. Which part? Ive watched it on TH-cam and can’t locate it. Can you give me a time? Thx!
@@redsflyshop Started happening at 0:11, between 0:11-0:31 it happened 3 times to me. It then continues on throughout the video if I skip around to different segments.
Also noticed, all the audio is only coming from my left speaker. Only video that this has happened to me to as well.
Hey dont give away all my steelhead secrets haha!
What are you fishing for here?
Wild Rainbow Trout. :)
No sound!
Anyone else?
It's playing fine here, sorry it isn't coming through!
No sound.
Weird. Must have a mute button on or something, give 'er another shot. Working fine on my Windows PC and iPhone.
I do not understand why fly fishermen call this devices an "indicator?" It already has a name...."BOBBER."
#true
But these fish Im targeting are bobber shy and you sure can’t slap the water with the mend like that or they are gone! And I prefer to show the fish my tippet, not the butt end of my leader. “But it’s effective.”
I should have done a better job of specifying that this is typically a "setup mend" or best used in swift currents with some chop (less spooky fish). Certainly not a technique for spring creeks or other glassy or spooky surfaces.
You are just figuring this out now? I am not sure I believe that.
I despise indicator fishing. I’d much rather be in touch with my fly
So why are you watching an indicator nymphing video?
@@angiekelley693 because I am subscribed to the channel, the title is “Secret to nymph fishing” and this is America, where I can do what I want. Now why do you have two first names?
@@JP-dz7zu good one
@@JP-dz7zu my apologies. You are absolutely right. Sorry about the negative comment.
We cannot call it a bobber like the peasants do.
Indicator? Just call it a Float. It’s not rocket science.
It's also called a bobber. Definitely not rocket science. More of an art than a science.
4 minutes in I had to stop video, that's how boring it was
Wow made it 4 minutes, that's pretty good actually for TH-cam. Lots of fun stuff to click on.
👍👍👍👍👍❤️
Yep I have been doing this for years !!
Older guy that have been fly fishing for year
As in old school if you lucky to have some one to show you !
There are a lot more tricks to this. !! Some will tell you !
Some will not !!
Thanks for sharing, feel free to share any additional tips you have here in the comments. Always love additional perspectives!
"Secret"?????, its called BOBBER FISHING!!!
Just go back to your worm dunking.
You just blow in from stupidville?
Yup…no secret there
It’s just how it’s done 🙄
This is the problem with fishing. Folks get into it for the status. Spend ungodly amounts on a fly rig; knowing nothing about fish, water, stewardship, etc., and just do it for style points. In the same body of water, a 90 year old woman will use a spin caster with a bit of kraft cheese on #8 bait holder and out catch you all day. She has no shame, no moral qualms, and no reverence for your "art". Are you fishing for likes on Instagram or to feed your family? Only one is for the right reason.
Fly fishing a bit diffrent lol
Hey Joe good stuff mr 👍👍🪳🎏🪳the Vermonter BS