I do not believe that crazy good. You need t3 and upgrade, and mana is 200-250. At that time, UD destroyers can be 4-5 units and ready to anihilate your soceress.
UD is the only Race that doesn't have mass dispell by Tier 2, and because of that you almost always have to make Destroyers at T3. I like the change makes UD less reliant on rushing T3 to get dispell.
yeah I think the theory is to try adn give undead BOs outside of mass destroyer (or perhaps more tier 2 focused builds). Will it work...probably not because destroyers are just insanely good and having at-will dispel on tap is very hard to pass up....but its an option at least.
I honestly saw this idea for UD but think it would be too much for them to have a lot of shop item to use. Maybe buff banshees and make them strong enough to use anti magic shell in the game? For me they can give them a passive ability that when hit by piercing, has a chance to negate it or no damage so they have more survivability. It also plays on the idea of being hollow or a spirit.
Or... give banshees anti magic shell at rank 1 or without upgrades and have curse switch to adept training when unlock so that they have protection against spells.
@@009_Ghostly_Systematic problem with rank 1 shell is that it's garbage. Why would you ever make a rank 1 banshee ever if their cantrip is situational at the best of time? It's not like they are a ranged DPS unit.
Its also crazy how Orc is the only race now that does not really have a tier 3 unit anymore. (Yeah troll bersekers are tier 3 but its a upgrade rather than a different unit). Maybe the wind rider can be reworked to be a better tier 3 unit since most tier 3 units in the game fly after all.
@@Niwona112 I'd love that but i don't think they have resources for it. Plus they would have to give each race a new unit as well cuz it would be kinda unfair lol.
@@SkiesWRLD I have so many friends who turned into ogre like creatures within the span of those 10 years between 20 and 30. Same with coworkers. Same with friends of friends. If I line them up in an array facing the sun, I can probably create a death ray from the reflection of their bald heads alone. People change a lot. Grubby's genetics keeping him looking young is the exception, not the rule.
@@saimyintmyat9373grunts are generally good enough especially now that their upgrade was improved They are like the good compromise in terms of overall stats and cost between footie and knight
I think they are trying to untie undead's dispel from "rush tier 3 and go destroyers every game" with the rod change. To maybe enable some other tier 2 starts, which would otherwise be destroyed by enemy summoning/spellcasting
Plus Tauren Bloodlust is usually how people use them. Undead were the only race without an aoe dispel at tier 2. Which Tauren timing attacks will start like 70 seconds after they hit tier 3 now instead of like 800 seconds. So they need every race to have a reliable dispel option. I think they should also nerf the dispel multipliers to summons so dispels are less of a counter to them as well. They would at least be less efficient at beating them requiring so much mana you could probably out swarm their pools.
It's more like "ghoul rush at 9 minutes and you auto lose despite knowing it's going to happen and if it doesn't kill you outright, ghouls are still better than most tier 3 units and still kill you later".
Polymorph can now target heroes? This balance decision, while not in nature too wrong, it makes Hero channeling ults LESS viable when they are already not very viable in the first place. This would drive greater importance of Orc Spirit walkers and Undead Destroyer meta. But allowing this to affect heroes is basically giving a Hero ability to a basic unit (Hex). Tier 2 Tauren?... Then Knights, Aboms, and Druids of the Claw Bear form should also be Tier 2. Tier 2 Tauren will also completely power creep Grunts, which are viable melee units at Tier 2 despite being Orc's most basic melee unit. The Tauren costs 280 gold, which is 25% more gold than a Grunt, 80 lumber, but no additional gold cost for additional survivability, has 85% more HP for 66% more food. A better change would be to nerf Tauren HP at Tier 2, but then restore or better yet, INCREASE that HP upon the Tier 3 Pulverize upgrade. This still gives Orc the option to say they can still play with Grunts, but can also build up Tauren and upon going Tier 3 make them actual strong Tier 3 tanky units as opposed to just straight up making Grunts irrelevant past Tier 2. Curse affecting Mechanical units is way too OP as Banshees are UD's strongest/most versatile spellcaster which is on autocast. UD already trashes on human and human's only option is to go mechanical and try to do a different kind of fight. This also affects the Tinker lvl 6 Hero. Cripple is still a manual cast and Necromancers are not as versatile so this would be okay.
Buff for earthquake could be to disable any buildings in the radius. No training, moonjuice, or tower fire. Makes sense, everyone in the building would be hitting the floor.
Doesn't it just outright destroy buildings right now though. Sounds like a downgrade. If they haven't fixed the animation yet they should get on that as well.
@@YuyuHakurei it does damage to a few buildings, but if you are at the stage of the game where you can remove your farseer from the fight completely and deny any interrupts on him to do that, than you're already far enough ahead that earthquake isn't really adding anything to your stratagy it's just a flex. The only thing earthquake does well happens when you don't need it to do that anymore. Changing it from damage to shutdown keeps it's role as a siege spell, but gives earthquake it's own niche denying reinforcements completing
@@YuyuHakurei It damages buildings at 50 hp/s. That's not really enough to say it destroys. Maybe farms, it destroys. But also having it only slow enemies would be a big boon as well, I think.
I agree that Mountain Giants are really hard to balance. As soon as you buff them to be playable, they will be massed, which is no fun to play against. But if you nerf them again, they won't be played at all. I think we need a way to make MGs strong individually, but not as strong en masse. Here's one idea: - Remove taunt - Add "Resilience aura" - This gives all nearby friendly units +1 armor - Remove Resistant skin upgrade. This will now come with MGs by default - Hardened skin upgrade now has an additional effect of increasing Resilience aura from 1 armor to 2 armor This way, 1 or 2 MGs can provide a nice benefit to an army, but since the aura doesn't stack, massing MGs isn't usually desirable. I also think that having multiple upgrades that you need for a unit incentivizes you to mass them, since you dumped a bunch of time/money into the upgrades for the unit, so you'd better make it worth it by making a bunch of them. That's why the resistant skin upgrade would be removed and worked into the base unit
I don't think it's a problem that they can be spammed, but they may actually be too cheap for how powerful they are. They probably just don't want to have units that are like 800 gold and 400 lumber.
How about armor pulse? Make everyone else but him tanker, kinda like bear druid roar but shorter duration with weaker effect to accommodate manaless quality. This way, it doesn't screw with your controls, you still are """encouraged""" to focus the giant due to the armor
I would fix taunt first by giving it a 6 second cool down to ALL mgs and keep the 7 food. That way mgs cannot chain stun enemy units, by successive taunts in a 2 sec interval but in a 6 sec interval. Then the opponent still has to micro but is not completely fucked up.
the thing about polymorph now is that hu doesn't need MK anymore to interrupt channeling spells. level 6 kotg? pooped on. alchemist heal? pooped on. naga 6? pooped on. Then there's the DK coil animation. You see that sword go in the air, polymorph. no more coil because polymorph is a faster "turn rate" casting time. it's a game breaking change.
I haven't played a game of WC3 multiplayer since Frozen Throne launch (if you don't count DOTA), yet I still watch all your WC3 patch notes and theory crafting content in addition to most of your WC3 game content 😂 Even if I don't understand half the things that are going on, for some reason, I still find these really enjoyable to watch ❤
I feel like spells that units cast like polymorph and cyclone should cost different mana depending on what supply cost it is cast against. Like polymorphing or cycloning a hero or mountain giant should cost way more mana than on a knight or footman. So maybe something like 50 mana per supply cost of the unit.
About MGs: They could try making it so taunt is harder to get out of but puts a buff on the affected units that makes them immune to subsequent taunts for a time. Like stun resistance in Darkest Dungeon.
I've always felt that Tauren either need an upgrade that increases their move speed. Maybe something that, if they are out of combat for 2 seconds, their move speed increases to match a knight. OR a really slow air-only ranged attack. They summon a wind spirit or something, moves slowly towards a target, deals a tiny amount of damage but slows the air unit for a solid 5 seconds. Could be used against chims, frost wyrms to try to escape them, or to slow things like wyverns, gargs and hippo riders trying to escape.
I wish they would add a new campaign + heroes and added them as tavern heroes on certain maps. Look at Microsoft printing money with AOE Dlcs. Should be enough incentive for blizzard
I prerfer buffs to nerfs when it comes to balance patches. There was a time, long ago, when the game's jank was so bad the only armies fighting were druids of the talon with their tornadoes vs ancient protectors/ancient of wars slowly lumbering onwards
I don't know if it can already be done.. but the best approax for Polymorph would it to be able to be cast on your own units. You could sneak a Hero inside a base, very slowly. 😂
I wonder if Blizzard is seeing some new potential in the RTS genre with Stormgate getting new eyes on the genre. At least the influx of patches to SC2 and now this might point to that perhaps being the case?
17:20 - they actually removed most, if not all of the orb effects from the game. I think the only orb-ish mechanic that left is multishot which still prohibits any attack modifier usage on additional targets. However I don't even remember was the multishot even considered orb effect in the first place
Status Resistance versus Direct Dispels is how I like to THINK ABOUT these types of things (starting with faction change #1), where you can then fine-tune things to make them fit rather than just have yes-no + yes-no situations. Do you have mana for polymorph & can use your A.P.M. to use the spell? Yes-No. Does an opponent have the countre-spell to your use of polymorph? Yes-No. Both yes, enemy has advantage. Both no, enemy has advantage. Yes + No, you have advantage. No + Yes, they can dispel other things which means again they are advantaged. Give Status Resistance Processes & you can make that 3 second polymorph turn into a 0.75 or 1.0 second one, depending on when you cast dispel. Or maybe you PRECAST dispel (maybe give it 0.5 or 1.0 second increased duration as a buff) & when polymorph gets cast or other things they last for a reduced duration. Blizzard does have a habit of doing the same thing, the W.C.III VERSION - are DEAD Lings on Crack it seems (I would have guessed anyway)!
Ty grubby. You speek out of my soul. I say so long transfer Tauren into Baracks, bring Spirit walker back in his Lodge an cut the Totem. I like the Idea to bring Taurens out on Tier 2 but its still the same slow and expensive Unit so no one will play it. As a suprise unit out of the Baracks cool but not when you need a extra Building! It would also so help to bring the spirit walker back to Lodge. We need this unit back against Cyclone and Slow.
It won't be an outright hard counter, but their timings will now be similar T3 attacks because you still need the T3 for pulverize. The difference is you can attack now in T3 with like 5 tauren like 70 seconds after Tier 3 and not like 800 after you build all the buildings and do the upgrades.
That's the million dollar question though, how do you balance the game for all the different levels of play? Like Grubby pointed out, necromancer and mountain giant strats are both very very strong at lower level play, but drop off severely in higher level play. So how do you nerfbuff necros and buffnerf mgs to make them balanced for every level?
They could also reduce the dispel power versus summons to lower the difference. The only reason they drop off so hard is because dispel more than hard counters summons. Which you are going to do against undead/orcs/humans by default to prepare for the potential of their op buffs/debuffs/summons wrecking you.
28:05, btw, how does siege units work with miss chance/evasion. Their attack don't hit particular unit, but a place on a ground. And it damages every unit in the AoE radius for a portion of dmg dependant on how close the center of the AoE the unit is. So is it possible for Demon hunter to dodge siege unit attack even tho the attack is on the ground and not on the unit? Or is it possible for them to miss an attack after getting cursed?
@@GrubbyTalks do they really? I'm quite sure that it's possible to dodge demolishers/meat wagons/cannoniers attack with super fast units like DK with his aura after they launch attack on him by moving somewhere else. Every other units attack follows the target, meanwhile siege units attacks always hit the place where unit was standing when they launched a shot.
I would love if Orc got a real T3 unit. Taurens have never felt like chimeras or skeletal wyverns. Knights haven't either, but they've always been their own thing by being fast moving cavalry and not really priced as "super units," having a lower resource cost and especially a lower food cost and of course not having their own dedicated production building. I know they'll never add any actual new units to WC3, but imagine if they just pulled a total wild card and added, like, the orc warlock campaign unit as a real unit you could build as a t3 super-caster, which would be totally unique from other races' t3 units.
Orcs stuffed a lot of their units into the bestiary. So while their tier 3 is lacking their tier 2 is overstuffed. Plus Tauren and the Tauren spirit walkers are some of the strongest units in the game when used together. Now that Tauren will come out faster they may actually be a competitive army now.
the funny thing about doing coding on the editor is that you get the heads up on patches coming out as earlly as they come. I posted in the W3U discord a week ago and no one else has posted about it by then! btw, wand of negation is only 200 AOE, 500 range. I think it's fine.
I hope the devs would also add this to their idea. I don't like sundering blades given to the knight early but I understand it gives them value. I think another buff that human can enjoy so that they wouldn't be sacrificing a lot of supply (notoriously sacrificing footmen) is to make the upgrade more efficient cost for this strat. I suggest, let have footman have the sundering blades as well so that they still have value at late game and it would be cost effective to not mass knights for human.
I love your knowledgeable explaination of the mountain giant taunt. In general i love learning about all the weird mechanics this game has plus how you explain all these little facts.
Interesting change w.r.t. Orcs. I kinda agree with Grubby here, that this is probably the best way to make tham viable. If it appears to be OP, it can be balanced by making the basic build time very long and having the t3 upgrade to reduce it to the current level so you can still squeeze one for a meat shield role in headhunter build.
Semi-pro here, who has been in the top 150 of w3champions' ladder. Let me tell you something: To me, the last time competitive wc3 was ANY good and balanced was in ... *late 2020.* In fact, I'll go even FURTHER and say this: *Someone with ill intentions to RUIN the game **_INFILTRATED the Blizzard balancing team_** and started wrecking stuff !!!* *Yep... I BELIEVE IT.* Sorry, wc3, and ... goodbye!! :( .
I had a big thunk. I like the dispel item on undead because destroyers are the only choice they have for dispel. Giving them the item and not other races makes sense so now they have aoe dispel along with every other race, night elves I may want it with them as well but it's not as useful as on undead.
im really happy to see them still putting some thought into wc3 but im really sad for the custom game makers that the broken editor gets 0 attention at all...
5 acolytes are not enough to repair UD buildings after one tank with 2 attack upgrades(if it isn't slowed by nerub towers). Being able to curse it is a big deal. When human gets eco to spam them it won't be an auto win.
Of all the things here, I'm only principally aversed to being able to cripple mechanical units. It doesn't really make sense and a lot fo WC design, even if arbitrated, has traditionally had a flavor first approach. It made it stick out as a game identity. Not the end of the world ofc.
2:50 It is insane. Not fair actually. Tauren is a tier 3 unit, unless they nerf them suitable for tier 2. Yes, only a ground attack unit, but this is the most powerful ultimate melee unit in the whole game. Frost wyrms should be tier 2 as well.
I like how the comments are all freaking out over the Polymorph changes, but everyone sleeps on the fact that Blizz moved a Tier 3 unit to Tier 2 with zero nerfs. For Starcraft fans, it is like making Ultralisks available at Lair instead of Hive. Let that sink in. I agree with Grubby that while the Polymorph change] sound ridiculously OP, it isn't as impactful a change as it sounds. Think about it, what is stopping HU players from mass Polymorphing everything right now? The Polymorph buff doesn't change the fact that 1) It is very late game ability, 2) it costs a lot of mana, 3) dispels are cheaper and more available, 4) it is still on a squishy unit. If you want to chain Polymorph heroes, you need go mass Sorceress, research a lategame spell and get an Archmage for Brilliance. All that just so you can chain stun a single enemy Hero. Doesn't sound practical to me. Imo the biggest impact from this change is using Polymorph as a 3-second stun to disrupt Heroes from channelling. Making Curse and Cripple affect mechanical units is a pretty big change too - it kinda makes any kind of Siege Engine play unviable.
Tauren, while undeniably cool, are roughly on par with WoL release Ultralisks. You could make those Lair tech and it wouldn't make the slightest difference, nobody would build them except for banter.
pulverize still tier 3. For the good version. I don't think the mini pulverize will be enough to deal with mass ghouls, but it will make them not want to attack you. =3
Polymorph on heroes is interesting because sorcs are already pretty good and fit into a well balanced comp unlike talons. But talons are already generally out stating them, and don't see any play in the modern era.
I do think that Taurens shouldn't have their smaller pulverize with the new change. That way it enables easier transition into Taurens, or the addition of a couple Taurens early, but still heavily incentives you to go tier 3. Also Searing Arrows should have utility outside of damage or it will always be worse than Orb of Venom. Maybe it should give like a 5/10/15% damage buff (meaning it takes more damage) to the target for a few seconds. And MG's Taunt could be reworked to give a damage debuff that ONLY reduces damage to non-MG's by say 15%. That way it isn't frustrating and there's no way to 'command lock' with a ton of them, but actually is better for tanking and also is more useful in lower numbers. But I doubt the current 'team' can implement these changes.
I like the poly changes because the spell polymorph has been unbelievably game changing throughout wow. I know they're different games but same universe.
Tarens becoming a Tier 2 unit makes my suggestion of Necromancers becoming a Tier 1 unit closer to reality! (Still pretty darn unreal) Just give them a 1 skeleton summon and reduce the mana pool and regen, and remove the summon skeleton item from tomb of relics
Isnt Firelords Orb-attack like Ursa´s passive (Ursa from Dota 2, duh)? The longer you attack the same target, the more damage it deals. So in late game he should be viable with two or three gloves and boots.
Server frame rate should affect ping speed or something, nothing to do with visual on client side May be recalculating or applying some status efects. Anyway some operation on server side is done faster and you get result back faster
1)dont see a problem with poly on heroes when dispel is easy counter. 2)tauren t2 is necessary for orc as orcs are supposed to have the "beefiest units". So t2 having basically a better grunt is good. 3)ghoul frenzy change makes me sad. Zerg mood just got nerfed.
With that all changes in Blizzard and some love that they gave to Warcraft 3 i really hope for some upcoming Warcraft 4. I think that would be best rts game
Stormgate look into that. Made by the people who made wc1, 2, and 3, and SC1 and 2. They took every good developer from blizzard and threw them into 1 company that is already bigger than blizzard ever was. Frost Giant Studios/Dreamhaven.
tauren without pulverize are still a big pile of hp for spirit link to send damage to, even if they won't have the offensive punch until you get a fortress
They buffed pulverize actually to where they get a crappy version of it until they research it in tier 3. They are definitely not something ghouls want to attack into with the potential of bloodlust and spirit link support.
Is Blizzard really listening to us fans this time? When did we started to have fan service? Warcraft 3 was popping up back in 2003. Loved it❤❤ At least they need to increase the food unit upkeep???
"Change is good when the change is good"
-- Grubby, six time world championship master
Truly the Sun Tzu of the RTS community.
They saw your balance video and couldn't help themselves
We truly live in the craziest timeline, even Grubby is wearing his alternate character costume
This is Melon not Grubby
Melon has good fashion sense @@saimyintmyat9373
@@DedgyVanced Agreed
The difference between polymorph and cyclone is you can't kill things while they are cycloned.
And DTs can run out of mana
Poly = u cant cancel blizzard with stuns
the first glimpse of human patchnotes reading, polymorph can target heroes was like a pure shock to me
I honestly don't believe that whoever wrote these notes actually plays the game , but I'm excited to try it out non the less
@@Tchado1000 Mass Polymorphs + stun Abilities = No TP for Opponents 😂
@@saimyintmyat9373 YES SIR !!!!
I do not believe that crazy good. You need t3 and upgrade, and mana is 200-250. At that time, UD destroyers can be 4-5 units and ready to anihilate your soceress.
Yeah but What about NE? @@hainguyenhoang1031
Ngl, tier 2 Tauren makes me want to jump back into the game! I like creative changes like this since they’re never gonna add a few faction.
Crown of Kings now available in tomb of relics. Death Knight always spawns with one. THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE TRUE KING
This made me lol 😂
If you use the girl death knight she spawns with a snowman. XD
UD is the only Race that doesn't have mass dispell by Tier 2, and because of that you almost always have to make Destroyers at T3. I like the change makes UD less reliant on rushing T3 to get dispell.
yeah I think the theory is to try adn give undead BOs outside of mass destroyer (or perhaps more tier 2 focused builds). Will it work...probably not because destroyers are just insanely good and having at-will dispel on tap is very hard to pass up....but its an option at least.
@@travisdunlap4526 UD still needs to rush T3, as UD without Orb are completely trash.
I honestly saw this idea for UD but think it would be too much for them to have a lot of shop item to use.
Maybe buff banshees and make them strong enough to use anti magic shell in the game? For me they can give them a passive ability that when hit by piercing, has a chance to negate it or no damage so they have more survivability. It also plays on the idea of being hollow or a spirit.
Or... give banshees anti magic shell at rank 1 or without upgrades and have curse switch to adept training when unlock so that they have protection against spells.
@@009_Ghostly_Systematic problem with rank 1 shell is that it's garbage.
Why would you ever make a rank 1 banshee ever if their cantrip is situational at the best of time? It's not like they are a ranged DPS unit.
Its also crazy how Orc is the only race now that does not really have a tier 3 unit anymore. (Yeah troll bersekers are tier 3 but its a upgrade rather than a different unit). Maybe the wind rider can be reworked to be a better tier 3 unit since most tier 3 units in the game fly after all.
Best heroes overall tho
Lol wut? DK and DH are hands down the best. Also human has brilliance aura with any combo of mana users.
New unit instead
@@macsenhayes Am, and Tc are the 2 best heroes in the game
@@Niwona112 I'd love that but i don't think they have resources for it. Plus they would have to give each race a new unit as well cuz it would be kinda unfair lol.
This feels like 10 years ago. And Grubbs look like it too. Do you have THE ONE RING? You haven't aged a day.
His wife hasn't aged a day either. They must have done a dark ritual or something!
@@theshinken Sacrifices a target friendly Undead unit to convert its hit points into mana for the Lich?
yall acting as if he is 50 or something lol, you dont change much from your 20s to 30s if you live the same life
@@SkiesWRLD I have so many friends who turned into ogre like creatures within the span of those 10 years between 20 and 30. Same with coworkers. Same with friends of friends. If I line them up in an array facing the sun, I can probably create a death ray from the reflection of their bald heads alone. People change a lot. Grubby's genetics keeping him looking young is the exception, not the rule.
I always wondered I'm not a hardcore fan. Isn't he autistic or something?
Never played wc3 just watching Grubby talking about things I have no idea about
Fun game if you p the good version and use a virt network to connect to other players to play against.
Lol I haven't played it since like 2007 but still watch Grubby
Hi , i from peru and well , here playing all day too
Literally the only change i wait for is to finally add reconnect option if somebody disconnects due to internet issues or client issues.
Tauren headhunter is going to be the meta for Orc now mark my words.
Poor Grunts
@@saimyintmyat9373 It not easy being greeeen.
@@saimyintmyat9373grunts are generally good enough especially now that their upgrade was improved
They are like the good compromise in terms of overall stats and cost between footie and knight
taurents without their upgrade are not very good
@SeekerMissile maybe with t3 investment, but at t2 they are so much better bang for your buck compared to grunts
I think they are trying to untie undead's dispel from "rush tier 3 and go destroyers every game" with the rod change. To maybe enable some other tier 2 starts, which would otherwise be destroyed by enemy summoning/spellcasting
Plus Tauren Bloodlust is usually how people use them. Undead were the only race without an aoe dispel at tier 2. Which Tauren timing attacks will start like 70 seconds after they hit tier 3 now instead of like 800 seconds. So they need every race to have a reliable dispel option. I think they should also nerf the dispel multipliers to summons so dispels are less of a counter to them as well. They would at least be less efficient at beating them requiring so much mana you could probably out swarm their pools.
It's more like "ghoul rush at 9 minutes and you auto lose despite knowing it's going to happen and if it doesn't kill you outright, ghouls are still better than most tier 3 units and still kill you later".
Polymorph can now target heroes?
This balance decision, while not in nature too wrong, it makes Hero channeling ults LESS viable when they are already not very viable in the first place. This would drive greater importance of Orc Spirit walkers and Undead Destroyer meta. But allowing this to affect heroes is basically giving a Hero ability to a basic unit (Hex).
Tier 2 Tauren?... Then Knights, Aboms, and Druids of the Claw Bear form should also be Tier 2. Tier 2 Tauren will also completely power creep Grunts, which are viable melee units at Tier 2 despite being Orc's most basic melee unit. The Tauren costs 280 gold, which is 25% more gold than a Grunt, 80 lumber, but no additional gold cost for additional survivability, has 85% more HP for 66% more food. A better change would be to nerf Tauren HP at Tier 2, but then restore or better yet, INCREASE that HP upon the Tier 3 Pulverize upgrade. This still gives Orc the option to say they can still play with Grunts, but can also build up Tauren and upon going Tier 3 make them actual strong Tier 3 tanky units as opposed to just straight up making Grunts irrelevant past Tier 2.
Curse affecting Mechanical units is way too OP as Banshees are UD's strongest/most versatile spellcaster which is on autocast. UD already trashes on human and human's only option is to go mechanical and try to do a different kind of fight. This also affects the Tinker lvl 6 Hero.
Cripple is still a manual cast and Necromancers are not as versatile so this would be okay.
Buff for earthquake could be to disable any buildings in the radius. No training, moonjuice, or tower fire. Makes sense, everyone in the building would be hitting the floor.
Less damage, larger radius, total shutdown on building activities. Like frost breath, but appropriately scaled for a hero ultimate. I like it
Doesn't it just outright destroy buildings right now though. Sounds like a downgrade. If they haven't fixed the animation yet they should get on that as well.
@@YuyuHakurei it does damage to a few buildings, but if you are at the stage of the game where you can remove your farseer from the fight completely and deny any interrupts on him to do that, than you're already far enough ahead that earthquake isn't really adding anything to your stratagy it's just a flex.
The only thing earthquake does well happens when you don't need it to do that anymore.
Changing it from damage to shutdown keeps it's role as a siege spell, but gives earthquake it's own niche denying reinforcements completing
@@YuyuHakurei It damages buildings at 50 hp/s. That's not really enough to say it destroys. Maybe farms, it destroys. But also having it only slow enemies would be a big boon as well, I think.
First time that Blizz got my attention on WC3 since they sent me a feedback survey about my refund request on Reforged.
I agree that Mountain Giants are really hard to balance. As soon as you buff them to be playable, they will be massed, which is no fun to play against. But if you nerf them again, they won't be played at all. I think we need a way to make MGs strong individually, but not as strong en masse.
Here's one idea:
- Remove taunt
- Add "Resilience aura" - This gives all nearby friendly units +1 armor
- Remove Resistant skin upgrade. This will now come with MGs by default
- Hardened skin upgrade now has an additional effect of increasing Resilience aura from 1 armor to 2 armor
This way, 1 or 2 MGs can provide a nice benefit to an army, but since the aura doesn't stack, massing MGs isn't usually desirable. I also think that having multiple upgrades that you need for a unit incentivizes you to mass them, since you dumped a bunch of time/money into the upgrades for the unit, so you'd better make it worth it by making a bunch of them. That's why the resistant skin upgrade would be removed and worked into the base unit
"taunt now also taunts nearby allied mountain giants for alpha giant reasons" problem solved, you will only ever have 1 MG
@maruhto3508 lol that was funny 😁 😂
I don't think it's a problem that they can be spammed, but they may actually be too cheap for how powerful they are. They probably just don't want to have units that are like 800 gold and 400 lumber.
How about armor pulse? Make everyone else but him tanker, kinda like bear druid roar but shorter duration with weaker effect to accommodate manaless quality.
This way, it doesn't screw with your controls, you still are """encouraged""" to focus the giant due to the armor
I would fix taunt first by giving it a 6 second cool down to ALL mgs and keep the 7 food. That way mgs cannot chain stun enemy units, by successive taunts in a 2 sec interval but in a 6 sec interval. Then the opponent still has to micro but is not completely fucked up.
Next patch, "Volcano now does Siege type damage and has a raw 4x multiplier against buildings"
=))
I mean it is a volcano after all.
I mean look at Pompeii
the thing about polymorph now is that hu doesn't need MK anymore to interrupt channeling spells. level 6 kotg? pooped on. alchemist heal? pooped on. naga 6? pooped on. Then there's the DK coil animation. You see that sword go in the air, polymorph. no more coil because polymorph is a faster "turn rate" casting time. it's a game breaking change.
I haven't played a game of WC3 multiplayer since Frozen Throne launch (if you don't count DOTA), yet I still watch all your WC3 patch notes and theory crafting content in addition to most of your WC3 game content 😂
Even if I don't understand half the things that are going on, for some reason, I still find these really enjoyable to watch ❤
difference between cyclone spam and polymorph spam is going to come down to brilliance aura and the fact that you can attack polymorphed heroes.
Big true
Editor working overtime on this one. Great work
Thanks for covering the patch, Grubby! You are a strong pillar in the WC3 community.
Grubby: how can you possess a machine...
Dark Mechanicus: Are we a joke to you???
I feel like spells that units cast like polymorph and cyclone should cost different mana depending on what supply cost it is cast against. Like polymorphing or cycloning a hero or mountain giant should cost way more mana than on a knight or footman. So maybe something like 50 mana per supply cost of the unit.
About MGs:
They could try making it so taunt is harder to get out of but puts a buff on the affected units that makes them immune to subsequent taunts for a time. Like stun resistance in Darkest Dungeon.
Once again, his grandmother's cookie recipe eludes us.
One day, boys. Hold fast.
WC3 and HOTS patches. What even is? 😳
Miracle of Bobby Kotick's disappearance.
Looks like the UD changes were to help make them competitive at t2, instead of having everyone just teching to t3 for frenzy and destros
I've always felt that Tauren either need an upgrade that increases their move speed. Maybe something that, if they are out of combat for 2 seconds, their move speed increases to match a knight.
OR a really slow air-only ranged attack. They summon a wind spirit or something, moves slowly towards a target, deals a tiny amount of damage but slows the air unit for a solid 5 seconds. Could be used against chims, frost wyrms to try to escape them, or to slow things like wyverns, gargs and hippo riders trying to escape.
I wish they would add a new campaign + heroes and added them as tavern heroes on certain maps. Look at Microsoft printing money with AOE Dlcs. Should be enough incentive for blizzard
I prerfer buffs to nerfs when it comes to balance patches.
There was a time, long ago, when the game's jank was so bad the only armies fighting were druids of the talon with their tornadoes vs ancient protectors/ancient of wars slowly lumbering onwards
The big advantage of sorceresses versus talons is arch mage aura
2 mana per second is completely unreal. xD
dude, patch notes AND tier lists?! Grubby is killing it on this channel! :)
6:18 I actually laughed.
I don't know if it can already be done.. but the best approax for Polymorph would it to be able to be cast on your own units.
You could sneak a Hero inside a base, very slowly. 😂
I wonder if Blizzard is seeing some new potential in the RTS genre with Stormgate getting new eyes on the genre. At least the influx of patches to SC2 and now this might point to that perhaps being the case?
Your enthusiasm is so infectious Grubby, such a pleasant chap
17:20 - they actually removed most, if not all of the orb effects from the game. I think the only orb-ish mechanic that left is multishot which still prohibits any attack modifier usage on additional targets. However I don't even remember was the multishot even considered orb effect in the first place
Taurens from Barracks would be interesting. Maybe we could even swap Demolishers to the Warmill.
Status Resistance versus Direct Dispels is how I like to THINK ABOUT these types of things (starting with faction change #1), where you can then fine-tune things to make them fit rather than just have yes-no + yes-no situations.
Do you have mana for polymorph & can use your A.P.M. to use the spell? Yes-No.
Does an opponent have the countre-spell to your use of polymorph? Yes-No.
Both yes, enemy has advantage. Both no, enemy has advantage. Yes + No, you have advantage. No + Yes, they can dispel other things which means again they are advantaged.
Give Status Resistance Processes & you can make that 3 second polymorph turn into a 0.75 or 1.0 second one, depending on when you cast dispel. Or maybe you PRECAST dispel (maybe give it 0.5 or 1.0 second increased duration as a buff) & when polymorph gets cast or other things they last for a reduced duration.
Blizzard does have a habit of doing the same thing, the W.C.III VERSION - are DEAD Lings on Crack it seems (I would have guessed anyway)!
Ty grubby. You speek out of my soul. I say so long transfer Tauren into Baracks, bring Spirit walker back in his Lodge an cut the Totem. I like the Idea to bring Taurens out on Tier 2 but its still the same slow and expensive Unit so no one will play it. As a suprise unit out of the Baracks cool but not when you need a extra Building! It would also so help to bring the spirit walker back to Lodge. We need this unit back against Cyclone and Slow.
To be honest it will be fun to see this. Wand of negation. Tauren changes. Scroll of healing removal. This is some big stuff
Taurens on tier 2? Ghouls have left the chat.🤣
It won't be an outright hard counter, but their timings will now be similar T3 attacks because you still need the T3 for pulverize. The difference is you can attack now in T3 with like 5 tauren like 70 seconds after Tier 3 and not like 800 after you build all the buildings and do the upgrades.
33:32 How come? All other races have a dispel on tier 2. Why Undeads can’t have it?
They're the only one with flying Dispell though! But its'true they have just 1 source of Dispell, whereas all other races have 2. Maybe it's ok
"How can you possess a machine?"
Your local warp entity would like a word
I felt the "pls give us more" at the end.
They can't make the mistake starcraft 2 did who balanced around serral and reynor and made mid level zerg basically unplayable for a long time.
That's the million dollar question though, how do you balance the game for all the different levels of play? Like Grubby pointed out, necromancer and mountain giant strats are both very very strong at lower level play, but drop off severely in higher level play. So how do you nerfbuff necros and buffnerf mgs to make them balanced for every level?
@@ambion19making things less technical is usually the go to for skill disparity balance.
They could also reduce the dispel power versus summons to lower the difference. The only reason they drop off so hard is because dispel more than hard counters summons. Which you are going to do against undead/orcs/humans by default to prepare for the potential of their op buffs/debuffs/summons wrecking you.
What about raider ensnare?
Casts a net without any mana cost even on heroes?
How balanced is that?
28:05, btw, how does siege units work with miss chance/evasion.
Their attack don't hit particular unit, but a place on a ground. And it damages every unit in the AoE radius for a portion of dmg dependant on how close the center of the AoE the unit is.
So is it possible for Demon hunter to dodge siege unit attack even tho the attack is on the ground and not on the unit?
Or is it possible for them to miss an attack after getting cursed?
They only ground-target when you ground-target with them. But that's a damn good question when it comes to Demolishers. Will test.
@@GrubbyTalks do they really? I'm quite sure that it's possible to dodge demolishers/meat wagons/cannoniers attack with super fast units like DK with his aura after they launch attack on him by moving somewhere else.
Every other units attack follows the target, meanwhile siege units attacks always hit the place where unit was standing when they launched a shot.
I would love if Orc got a real T3 unit. Taurens have never felt like chimeras or skeletal wyverns. Knights haven't either, but they've always been their own thing by being fast moving cavalry and not really priced as "super units," having a lower resource cost and especially a lower food cost and of course not having their own dedicated production building.
I know they'll never add any actual new units to WC3, but imagine if they just pulled a total wild card and added, like, the orc warlock campaign unit as a real unit you could build as a t3 super-caster, which would be totally unique from other races' t3 units.
Orcs stuffed a lot of their units into the bestiary. So while their tier 3 is lacking their tier 2 is overstuffed. Plus Tauren and the Tauren spirit walkers are some of the strongest units in the game when used together. Now that Tauren will come out faster they may actually be a competitive army now.
@@YuyuHakurei It's not so much about orc being competitive (I believe they already are competitive), moreso the lack of a t3 unit.
the funny thing about doing coding on the editor is that you get the heads up on patches coming out as earlly as they come. I posted in the W3U discord a week ago and no one else has posted about it by then!
btw, wand of negation is only 200 AOE, 500 range. I think it's fine.
8:50 I can't stop laughing at Grub here.. i dont know why.. i just imagined grub's actual reaction at Taurens being tier2 😂
I hope the devs would also add this to their idea.
I don't like sundering blades given to the knight early but I understand it gives them value. I think another buff that human can enjoy so that they wouldn't be sacrificing a lot of supply (notoriously sacrificing footmen) is to make the upgrade more efficient cost for this strat.
I suggest, let have footman have the sundering blades as well so that they still have value at late game and it would be cost effective to not mass knights for human.
I still feel like Tauren need a new upgrade at tier3 next to pulverize, maybe something like thick hide: take 10% less damage, immune to slows.
I love your knowledgeable explaination of the mountain giant taunt.
In general i love learning about all the weird mechanics this game has plus how you explain all these little facts.
Interesting change w.r.t. Orcs. I kinda agree with Grubby here, that this is probably the best way to make tham viable. If it appears to be OP, it can be balanced by making the basic build time very long and having the t3 upgrade to reduce it to the current level so you can still squeeze one for a meat shield role in headhunter build.
Idk what's worse: polymorph on heroes or undead being able to completely deny tank rush now.
Semi-pro here, who has been in the top 150 of w3champions' ladder. Let me tell you something:
To me, the last time competitive wc3 was ANY good and balanced was in ... *late 2020.*
In fact, I'll go even FURTHER and say this: *Someone with ill intentions to RUIN the game **_INFILTRATED the Blizzard balancing team_** and started wrecking stuff !!!*
*Yep... I BELIEVE IT.*
Sorry, wc3, and ... goodbye!! :(
.
I had a big thunk. I like the dispel item on undead because destroyers are the only choice they have for dispel. Giving them the item and not other races makes sense so now they have aoe dispel along with every other race, night elves I may want it with them as well but it's not as useful as on undead.
im really happy to see them still putting some thought into wc3 but im really sad for the custom game makers that the broken editor gets 0 attention at all...
5 acolytes are not enough to repair UD buildings after one tank with 2 attack upgrades(if it isn't slowed by nerub towers). Being able to curse it is a big deal. When human gets eco to spam them it won't be an auto win.
Of all the things here, I'm only principally aversed to being able to cripple mechanical units. It doesn't really make sense and a lot fo WC design, even if arbitrated, has traditionally had a flavor first approach. It made it stick out as a game identity. Not the end of the world ofc.
11:30 didn't spirit walkers get moved to tauren totem instead of voodoo house because of that?
Haven't seen Grubby this excited before
1.36 is nothing like π. It's closer to the golden ratio or sqrt(2) but not quite. I wonder what you were recognizing :P
"Polymorph can now target heroes"
How many sorcs and how many levels of brilliance aura do you need to perma-poly a hero?
Before the hero dies or just perma poly so it eats up supply for the rest of the game?
2:50 It is insane. Not fair actually. Tauren is a tier 3 unit, unless they nerf them suitable for tier 2. Yes, only a ground attack unit, but this is the most powerful ultimate melee unit in the whole game. Frost wyrms should be tier 2 as well.
Boneyard tier 2 and you need it to make gargoyles and outhouse destroyer upgrade
I like how the comments are all freaking out over the Polymorph changes, but everyone sleeps on the fact that Blizz moved a Tier 3 unit to Tier 2 with zero nerfs. For Starcraft fans, it is like making Ultralisks available at Lair instead of Hive. Let that sink in.
I agree with Grubby that while the Polymorph change] sound ridiculously OP, it isn't as impactful a change as it sounds. Think about it, what is stopping HU players from mass Polymorphing everything right now? The Polymorph buff doesn't change the fact that 1) It is very late game ability, 2) it costs a lot of mana, 3) dispels are cheaper and more available, 4) it is still on a squishy unit. If you want to chain Polymorph heroes, you need go mass Sorceress, research a lategame spell and get an Archmage for Brilliance. All that just so you can chain stun a single enemy Hero. Doesn't sound practical to me. Imo the biggest impact from this change is using Polymorph as a 3-second stun to disrupt Heroes from channelling.
Making Curse and Cripple affect mechanical units is a pretty big change too - it kinda makes any kind of Siege Engine play unviable.
Tauren, while undeniably cool, are roughly on par with WoL release Ultralisks. You could make those Lair tech and it wouldn't make the slightest difference, nobody would build them except for banter.
Which pie is the number 1.36 close to?:) cause you need to have a very big 'close to range' to compare it it to π=3.14:)
That's so close honestly
Keep in mind that Torrance will have mini pulverize straight out of tier 2!
pulverize still tier 3. For the good version. I don't think the mini pulverize will be enough to deal with mass ghouls, but it will make them not want to attack you. =3
Love that they're still updating this game
If they are going to reduce the Food on Mountain Giants they should reduce the Food cost on Grunts.
Mountain Giant autocast on call could work, since it would "take" APM from your oponent without requiring it from you.
We just traveled back in time to Warcraft 2 days.
Polymorph on heroes is interesting because sorcs are already pretty good and fit into a well balanced comp unlike talons. But talons are already generally out stating them, and don't see any play in the modern era.
I know the poly thing seems crazy but orc already does that kinda with raiders and they dont cost mana so its really good but i get it
It's sad they didn't revert the recent moon well changes and add a pea shooter to all moon wells 😢
So can you now deny exp with polymorph? I wonder how it will change the meta
Yes, I tested it, and you can xD
I don't see that staying in the game though. xD They may leave that change in, but they will probably get rid of the exp denial.
17:46 Why tanks are not in this range of 6-7 food supply or at least 5.
WHAT?! I still want your Grandmothers Cookie receipe though i was waiting a really long time!
I do think that Taurens shouldn't have their smaller pulverize with the new change. That way it enables easier transition into Taurens, or the addition of a couple Taurens early, but still heavily incentives you to go tier 3. Also Searing Arrows should have utility outside of damage or it will always be worse than Orb of Venom. Maybe it should give like a 5/10/15% damage buff (meaning it takes more damage) to the target for a few seconds. And MG's Taunt could be reworked to give a damage debuff that ONLY reduces damage to non-MG's by say 15%. That way it isn't frustrating and there's no way to 'command lock' with a ton of them, but actually is better for tanking and also is more useful in lower numbers. But I doubt the current 'team' can implement these changes.
I love the disappointment tone when someone says "cripple" lol
Poor necromancer
I like the poly changes because the spell polymorph has been unbelievably game changing throughout wow. I know they're different games but same universe.
In wc2 it perma killed the unit. WoW technically made a in between version between the weakest in wc3 and the strongest in wc2.
Tarens becoming a Tier 2 unit makes my suggestion of Necromancers becoming a Tier 1 unit closer to reality! (Still pretty darn unreal) Just give them a 1 skeleton summon and reduce the mana pool and regen, and remove the summon skeleton item from tomb of relics
They changed how orb effects work in Dota 2 awhile ago, they can all mostly be stacked at the same time now.
i love how Grubby says MACHINE
Undead does need some other ways to use dispel. Every other race has dispel by T2. While undead is t3 tech with expensive 5 food unit.
I’d listen to a podcast of what’s behind the thought of nerfing volcano😀
Isnt Firelords Orb-attack like Ursa´s passive (Ursa from Dota 2, duh)?
The longer you attack the same target, the more damage it deals. So in late game he should be viable with two or three gloves and boots.
6:20 BLademaster being tornadoed with the scream meme. lamo
Server frame rate should affect ping speed or something, nothing to do with visual on client side
May be recalculating or applying some status efects. Anyway some operation on server side is done faster and you get result back faster
1)dont see a problem with poly on heroes when dispel is easy counter.
2)tauren t2 is necessary for orc as orcs are supposed to have the "beefiest units". So t2 having basically a better grunt is good.
3)ghoul frenzy change makes me sad. Zerg mood just got nerfed.
They can polymorph your dispellers. xD
With that all changes in Blizzard and some love that they gave to Warcraft 3 i really hope for some upcoming Warcraft 4. I think that would be best rts game
Stormgate look into that. Made by the people who made wc1, 2, and 3, and SC1 and 2. They took every good developer from blizzard and threw them into 1 company that is already bigger than blizzard ever was. Frost Giant Studios/Dreamhaven.
tauren without pulverize are still a big pile of hp for spirit link to send damage to, even if they won't have the offensive punch until you get a fortress
They buffed pulverize actually to where they get a crappy version of it until they research it in tier 3. They are definitely not something ghouls want to attack into with the potential of bloodlust and spirit link support.
Sorry am I noob? When does this patch go live cause there is no update yet...?
28:58 PauseChamp
Ghost
In the
Shell
KEKWAIT
Ironicly i think Tauren needs the Warcraft Rumble Tauren charge :D
Is Blizzard really listening to us fans this time? When did we started to have fan service? Warcraft 3 was popping up back in 2003. Loved it❤❤ At least they need to increase the food unit upkeep???