Chip Reese went to Dartmouth. He was on his way to Stanford Law when he diverted to poker. You don't think he's smart enough to play today if he came up today? That's just dumb, Doug. If, OTOH, you put the online pros in live games where, as you point out, there was real physical danger, would they be able to handle it, much less thrive in it? Skeptical.
Berri Sweet is maybe the best PLO player of all time HU and 6max, beat Linus HU in a 1/2 NLH 1/2 PLO challenge, made Makeboifin quit him in HUNL, and sent Raul Gonzalez into retirement after a 3m+ HU mixed games win. If he played live poker and tournaments, he could be #1.
Would he be able to seamlessly transition and be the exact same player in the live arena? --- we always tend to auto-award online guys a "yes" in these spots. I'm not sure we should.
@@shamirbrown8160I agree that we shouldn’t auto award online guys, but berri is just different. Skill wise he’s absolutely an all time great. His play style online would translate to live even better than most guys cuz he’s more exploitative than anyone else at his level
I dont even play poker but for some reason listened to about 5 hours of this podcast discussing poker goats in the last day... interesting discussion I guess
Doug's "how will I ever best them question" is odd... the players he's referring to do lose and in some cases its Doug's himself that does beat them. Those players aren't always the victor in every tourney or cash game, and the reason is... there is not perfect strategy. Poker isn't played in a vacuum, and the variables force everyone to adjust their strategies (to their current opponents) or lose on that given day
It's interesting that Doug says that he could never catch up to the top HUNLH guys regardless of how much work he did. Phil Galfond came back, worked with the solvers and is near the tof of HUPLO. Is it just a matter of Nlh being more memorizable.
There was a “baseball boom” in 1947 when baseball was desegregated. The level of play went up considerably. So the baseball analogy to poker while discussing Doug’s list holds up.
What you have to ask is if the person you discussed stopped playing poker tomorrow, would they be considered a top all time player and would they be remembered? This is why success over the long term has to be the #1 criteria, not someone who was great for a few years or is good now. This is not pro sports where 5-10 years of excellence makes you an all timer. Long term for poker is 20-30 years (or more). This is why Brunson, Chip, and now Ivey have to be at the top of the list. Many of the others you rate may surpass them over time but at the moment, you can't make that call. Check back in 15-20 years and if you are still talking about them as a top player, then they probably deserve to be at the top of your list.
That's not really fair, because the reason most top pros today won't have the longevity is not because they're worse than brunson or Reese. The nature of the game today and the competition means it's basically impossible to stay at the top for too long. If brunson had been 60 years younger, its super unlikely he could build a long poker career today at the top.
First, I Love playing poker - my comment: It seem to me that poker pros are taking advantage/steeling from amateur when they put together meet up games - I enjoy meeting pros but when they sit down and take money for amateur is wrong. Pennington Select Black Oil Sunflower Seed Wild Bird Feed, 20 lb. Bag
Cross-books probably shouldn't factor in when considering biggest cash game winners. It warps the calculations, and isn't actually $ that was in-play on the table for the opponent(s) to win, which if it were... it likely alters their approach Love that u and the squad put this ranking together though
My Top 5 GOAT Poker Players for someone who learned how to play poker on youtube in the 2020s: 1. Doug Polk 2. Daniel Negreanu 3. Phil Galfond 4. Phil Ivey (have barely seen this other guy play everyone seems to like him though) 5. Phil Hellmuth (#1 in bracelets, #1 in eating food at the table, #3 in people named Phil)
HONEY! Honey, did you see what this guy did? He three-bet me with sevens! Get me a sandwich honey, these guys are idiots. Good list, except Doyle Brunson takes the top spot and Polk comes in somewhere in the 80s
Competing in a larger pool means the chances of people with elite ability Competing against you is higher. The people with the greatest poker potential probably weren't poker pros in the 70s.
interesting overall list where the top 4 players would be minus EV at 10-25 cent zoom cashgame just as they would at any turnament with 22 dollar or higher buy in at pokerstars.
regarding hellmuth and the hand where he jammed 100k vs you with the QT vs T7, you say he wasnt right, but he kinda was right though? you had a hand that probably like 99%+ of poker players would call off in a heartbeat and wanted to get all the money. (im not saying his play was good or that i think he belongs in top 5, i agree with your points)
Youre starting from the position that Doug has the second nuts. But absolutely no reason to assume he had that hand necessarily. Second, Doug is a top 1% player so even by your own logic its a bad play. And third, most players are getting it all in eith the second nuts at some point (or most of their stack), so bo reason he has to jam on the flop and have e.g. a set or a draw fold.
It is an error in assessment and analysis to believe present-day top players are always superior to their predecessors (i.e. live game counterparts). It's always more nuanced than such weak/lazy analysis. I do know online arenas are often tougher than live ones, but there are also legions of bluegill in those circles that are easier to get a hold of, because they round themselves up and play in shark 🦈 infested waters more frequently than they do in live circles. We also know that many online players cease to be the same 007-level operatives they were in online arenas (when they go live). It's a wholllllle lot easier to do certain things behind the shields of an avatar, screen name, and monitor. But when that battle is up close and personal....
Nope, this is absurd. Wayyy more fish live. And plenty of elite online players win live. No old school guy could be profitable at online high stakes today though. Not even Ivey.
Ivey, Brunson, Chip. The new kids need computers to win. They also need to hide behind a computer. Sorry, using solvers to play makes you a cheater not a top player. Hiding behind a screen takes away half of the game. If you haven't proven yourself in the live field you shouldn't be considered in top 100
Reuploaded to replace deleted video (originally streamed March 22, 2022)
Why was the original video deleted?
Reupload because of CoinFlex?
Chip Reese went to Dartmouth. He was on his way to Stanford Law when he diverted to poker. You don't think he's smart enough to play today if he came up today? That's just dumb, Doug. If, OTOH, you put the online pros in live games where, as you point out, there was real physical danger, would they be able to handle it, much less thrive in it? Skeptical.
@@SpicyNuggs562 Polk deleted heaps of podcasts that was full of scam advertising for Coin Flex. Its just part of trying to hide mistakes made.
Berri Sweet is maybe the best PLO player of all time HU and 6max, beat Linus HU in a 1/2 NLH 1/2 PLO challenge, made Makeboifin quit him in HUNL, and sent Raul Gonzalez into retirement after a 3m+ HU mixed games win. If he played live poker and tournaments, he could be #1.
Berri is the GOAT
Would he be able to seamlessly transition and be the exact same player in the live arena? --- we always tend to auto-award online guys a "yes" in these spots. I'm not sure we should.
@@shamirbrown8160I agree that we shouldn’t auto award online guys, but berri is just different. Skill wise he’s absolutely an all time great. His play style online would translate to live even better than most guys cuz he’s more exploitative than anyone else at his level
Live I think Thuritz could be the best overall poker player
I dont even play poker but for some reason listened to about 5 hours of this podcast discussing poker goats in the last day... interesting discussion I guess
Eric Seidel being disrespected in this
Mike Postle at #1 🏆
Absolutely. Dude just knows what the other guy has
Hellmuth given no respect
Rightfully so
Can't believe I didn't make the list
1. H@LL
2. Twin
3. OmgClay
4. Muckemsayuhh
5. AeJones
Doug's "how will I ever best them question" is odd... the players he's referring to do lose and in some cases its Doug's himself that does beat them.
Those players aren't always the victor in every tourney or cash game, and the reason is... there is not perfect strategy. Poker isn't played in a vacuum, and the variables force everyone to adjust their strategies (to their current opponents) or lose on that given day
Dunno if it's just me, but it looks like you shot this using a potato back then...
How can you possibly say Negreanu was never number 1 at anything when he was HM all time money list #1 for the longest time of any holder ever?
Look into the beef between Doug and Daniel. Polk tried to ruin his career.
He also played more high stakes tourneys than possibly anyone I history because they were all free to him. Doesn't mean he's the best at them.
Reuploads because of CoinFlex????
Exactly!
He was sponsored by coinflex in these original videos? That's why they were deleted?
It's interesting that Doug says that he could never catch up to the top HUNLH guys regardless of how much work he did. Phil Galfond came back, worked with the solvers and is near the tof of HUPLO. Is it just a matter of Nlh being more memorizable.
There was a “baseball boom” in 1947 when baseball was desegregated. The level of play went up considerably. So the baseball analogy to poker while discussing Doug’s list holds up.
Where is Mike Postle on this list?! He is a poker GOD! Should be number 1a. Dude never made a mistake. 😂
Don't forget to buy coin flex
What you have to ask is if the person you discussed stopped playing poker tomorrow, would they be considered a top all time player and would they be remembered? This is why success over the long term has to be the #1 criteria, not someone who was great for a few years or is good now. This is not pro sports where 5-10 years of excellence makes you an all timer. Long term for poker is 20-30 years (or more). This is why Brunson, Chip, and now Ivey have to be at the top of the list. Many of the others you rate may surpass them over time but at the moment, you can't make that call. Check back in 15-20 years and if you are still talking about them as a top player, then they probably deserve to be at the top of your list.
That's not really fair, because the reason most top pros today won't have the longevity is not because they're worse than brunson or Reese. The nature of the game today and the competition means it's basically impossible to stay at the top for too long. If brunson had been 60 years younger, its super unlikely he could build a long poker career today at the top.
I am shocked to see haxton on almost every list... I'm gonna do some research on him, all I know is he's one of the wizards.
First, I Love playing poker - my comment: It seem to me that poker pros are taking advantage/steeling from amateur when they put together meet up games - I enjoy meeting pros but when they sit down and take money for amateur is wrong.
Pennington Select Black Oil Sunflower Seed Wild Bird Feed, 20 lb. Bag
Maybe remove the logo on the top right of your Lodge Championship Series posted at 1:13. You know, the Coinflex logo.
Cross-books probably shouldn't factor in when considering biggest cash game winners. It warps the calculations, and isn't actually $ that was in-play on the table for the opponent(s) to win, which if it were... it likely alters their approach
Love that u and the squad put this ranking together though
Well done you guys. Very informative, veyr interesting. Appreciate the thought and hard word that went into these two long vids.
Wonderful stuff!
Trueteller is one of the goats for me - extremely strong and versatile player
My Top 5 GOAT Poker Players for someone who learned how to play poker on youtube in the 2020s:
1. Doug Polk
2. Daniel Negreanu
3. Phil Galfond
4. Phil Ivey (have barely seen this other guy play everyone seems to like him though)
5. Phil Hellmuth (#1 in bracelets, #1 in eating food at the table, #3 in people named Phil)
HONEY! Honey, did you see what this guy did? He three-bet me with sevens! Get me a sandwich honey, these guys are idiots. Good list, except Doyle Brunson takes the top spot and Polk comes in somewhere in the 80s
1.Linus
2.Haxton
3.Teller
4.Jungle
5.Ivey
Doug Polk’s Top 5:
1) Doug Polk
2)Doug Polk
3)Doug Polk
4)Doug Polk
Honorable last place mention: DNegs
Oh man Rob is gonna love this podcast
Rob lives to counter all those who believe they are superior to others.
1:47:20 is this a real hand that happened? A2 7betting flop on 842?
Oh Glorious 480p camera
Ivey >>
Ivey and Hollywood Haxton are my two guys I know for sure are in my top 5. The rest I'd have to do a really deep analysis.
Can you explain why haxton is? Serious question.
Competing in a larger pool means it’s watered down
Competing in a larger pool means the chances of people with elite ability Competing against you is higher. The people with the greatest poker potential probably weren't poker pros in the 70s.
Mikael "nu blir det en stor pott" Thuritz
interesting overall list where the top 4 players would be minus EV at 10-25 cent zoom cashgame just as they would at any turnament with 22 dollar or higher buy in at pokerstars.
scotty nguyen nowhere on the list ?
That nigga would get destroyed against these new age GTO nerds
Just no...
Where is tony g?
regarding hellmuth and the hand where he jammed 100k vs you with the QT vs T7, you say he wasnt right, but he kinda was right though? you had a hand that probably like 99%+ of poker players would call off in a heartbeat and wanted to get all the money. (im not saying his play was good or that i think he belongs in top 5, i agree with your points)
That may be true but the point is that most players won’t have T7
Youre starting from the position that Doug has the second nuts. But absolutely no reason to assume he had that hand necessarily.
Second, Doug is a top 1% player so even by your own logic its a bad play.
And third, most players are getting it all in eith the second nuts at some point (or most of their stack), so bo reason he has to jam on the flop and have e.g. a set or a draw fold.
I agree so much with Garry
Not a word about Bonomo.
1. Ivey
2. Jungle
3. True Teller
4. Ike
5. DNegs
6. Chadwick
7. Antonius
8. Galfond
9. Holz
10. Dwan
Honorable Mebtion for being OGs: Doyle, Chip, Hellmuth, Ungar, Chan...
Who is chadwick
Wasn’t this filmed before Jungleman won back to back $50k Bracelets???
Yea. Polk pulled a bunch of videos bc they had lots of Coin Flex scam advertising.
The PPC bracelet was super lucky. He avoided busting because his opponent made one of the worst folds in WSOP history.
13:00
It is an error in assessment and analysis to believe present-day top players are always superior to their predecessors (i.e. live game counterparts). It's always more nuanced than such weak/lazy analysis.
I do know online arenas are often tougher than live ones, but there are also legions of bluegill in those circles that are easier to get a hold of, because they round themselves up and play in shark 🦈 infested waters more frequently than they do in live circles.
We also know that many online players cease to be the same 007-level operatives they were in online arenas (when they go live). It's a wholllllle lot easier to do certain things behind the shields of an avatar, screen name, and monitor. But when that battle is up close and personal....
Nope, this is absurd. Wayyy more fish live.
And plenty of elite online players win live. No old school guy could be profitable at online high stakes today though. Not even Ivey.
Robbi Lew #1
Who is the biggest scumbag, scammer poker wannabe? I'll nominate Doug Polk!
Jesus that Top 20 list.. half off them would not best 0.5-1 zoom at Pokerstars 2024.
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Kane is completely wrong with the thought experiment around greatest NLH player today vs 1960. The answer is obviously 1960.
Yeah it would be hard to find an opportunity to play and learn, but the potential edge you could gain is enormous.
Negraneau’s vaccinated. You can’t be a top poker player making decisions like that..
I’m sure lots of the top players are honestly. It’s a shame but yeah
Doug too
@@throwaway6405 It's a shame to get vaccinated?
@@mark5071It’s a damn shame if you got that pre planned jab
@@Hedonism96 Why?
Rampage
Mariano
Airball
Bobo
Pepe
Top 5 current day players.
That I would like to share a poker table with.
Top 5 Action lol
Ivey, Brunson, Chip. The new kids need computers to win. They also need to hide behind a computer. Sorry, using solvers to play makes you a cheater not a top player.
Hiding behind a screen takes away half of the game.
If you haven't proven yourself in the live field you shouldn't be considered in top 100
You're overstating, but your base point is dead-on accurate
Which of the players on these lists haven't proven themselves in the live field?
And how is using solvers cheating? Was reading Super System cheating?
Basically all of the best online players have been competent live. The best live only players have no chance being profitable at high stakes online.
barry greinstein another one
are you just naming players youve heard of?
@@Andrew-yf3lu that’s honorable mention i gave my top 5
garret addelstein
doug polk
andy stacks
daniel negruanu
stu ungar
Uh, no.
Bro Negraneaus not even top 100
@@Hedonism96 lmao what