@@insertoyouroemail I think I'm going with a black Nord, with blonde zoomer mini-dreadlock hairstyle (shaved on the sides), whose backstory as a newly-inducted vampire whose skooma blood accidentally killed their master will drive the revenge arc in the hunt for their 14th boyfriend who refused to sit in the cuck chair
Poor Malacath, guy has one of the most indignant falls from grace . Gets crapped out by Boethia, the Nords call him "Mountain Fart", none of the other Daedric princes like him.
and he doesnt like them his scourge banishes even princes trickery downed him but he passed through and no less powerful even passing his new form to his followers superior to their former selves
its kinda cool if u think about it. the reclamations teach the dunmer that tamriel is a great trial, so boethia gave trinimac the greatest trials as a parting lesson@@AD-en5dq
@@Mary_Beth_Reimerthe story is correct, just symbolic. Malacath is the daedric prince of the spurned and ostracized so it makes sense that he'd get called dookie just for fun
@@augustsmith9553 Why don’t you explain everything you meant with that sentence in graphic detail so we all REALLY understand where you’re coming from, huh? If it’s actually funny it shouldn’t be too hard.
I must make a note that you could describe them by their height and weight without mentioning race/species and determine they are an orc. Say in a note or book.
@@drawndown except you can't they might mistake an overly large redguard for an orc. Or any of the other races if you withhold actual indicators of species. Like the green skin colour. The tusks, etc. Like irl I wish you good luck describing someone of sub-saharan african descent without mentioning their complexion at all. People are surprisingly bad at understanding what is meant if you keep descriptions too vague.
If the nords consider malacath a god who tests them in war, it could just be that overtime they began to associate that warring with death itself and combined the gods into one, or think of orkey and malacath as two aspects of the same god. Like death itself and death by battle. And if they hear other cultures around them refer to the orsimer as orcs, maybe that influenced them aswell.
My favorite race. My orc dragonborn uses the Way of The Voice to fight his rage (berseker rage)... His stronghold was burned by the Thalmor during their war against the Resguards and now he seeks vengance.
The Orsinium DLC and Kurog are some of the best things ESO has to offer, I loved this story a lot. Really fascinating to hear you talk about how holding onto Malacath is like holding onto vengeance, which holds the Orsimer back from truly progressing.
I always figured the dwarve orc conection was that they have the same mer ancestor. When trinimac was eaten and became malacath half of the mer who witnessed this stayed faithful and followed him in his transformation, while the other half lost their faith in gods and became the dwemer.
It's a fun theory but Nords definitely embellish, and the most likely explanation is just that Nords traditionally really hate Orcs and try to associate anything they dislike with Orcs (eg Ar'kay, god of Death, is Orkey, god of Orcs and Death, according to the Nords, who make no distinction between Arkay and Malacath since death is bad and Orcs are bad).
@@FernBlackwood1995 Sure we do - if we talk about 6-nippled-orc adult content. There is no way Milk Mod Economy wouldn't support 6 nipples if they where in the base game - they got 4 right now after all...
@@thomasrosendahl2783 Bruh. Skyland AIO 2k is already 5.5 GiB. And that's just the baseline for visual modding. Only allowing users of your consoles to have 5 GiBs of mods is basically showing them the middle finger. The game is old and console makers are enforcing completely ridiculous restrictions. Of course you want to add a texture overhault to a ten years old game. Of course you also want some extra content with extra assets and also extra textures. Skyrim is the most modded singleplayer game on the planet. But only on PC you can actually mod it without someone else telling you what and how much you are allowed to add or change. You poor console users don't even get automatic load order management because you aren't even allowed to use a proper mod manager. You are literally second class players. Not because some stupid PC master race bro like me says so. But because you pay to play on hardware that isn't actually yours and you accept whatever the true owners of that hardware decide to allow or not allow you to do with it. Vote with your wallet instead of trying to rationalize why the stupid arbitrary restrictions are indeed justified. Because they aren't. You should be allowed to add as much and whatever content to your gaming experience as you want on the console you already paid for. And if enough of you enforce that by boycotting overly restrictive consoles, you maybe will one day actually be able to have the freedom of a PC with the convenience of a console. Thanks for attending my TED rant.
In reference to The Blood Price I’d like to bring up the Germanic concept of “Weregild” (there’s like 9 different ways to spell it depending on language) literally “man price”, which was a way to measure the cost to a victim and/or their family for personal injury, murder, maiming, and things of that nature, which would be scaled off both the severity of the crime as well as the rank of those involved, and sometimes the price could be so high that it would extend past an individual and onto their family/clan. Edit: it’s also worth mentioning this is hardly unique to the Germanics, but it was very heavily embedded in their legal code, so for example in Wales they even had it vary by how wealthy the affected party was, so a unlanded freeman was worth less than a poor landed man, who was worth less than a rich landed man, etc. Women were also included, but their exact valuation varied by place and cultural, while slaves/thralls were considered property damage rather than weregild
@@joshrocha3758Rust is oxidization. To refer to something as "copper rust" indicates it's the copper version of rust, which is oxidization. Don't incorrectly correct people.
Honestly, the simplest explanation for the Orc/Dwarf connection is that Malacath joined forces with the Dwarves at some point since they were enemies of his enemies, the Dunmer.
I would be willing to believe that Dumalacath is like the Malacath version of a Shezzarine. Trinimac's defeat was more substantial than we usually assume, and Malacath is the name given to some sort of leftover essence that isn't quite a god, and manifests in a similar way to the leftovers of Lorkhan
I think according to the red mountain event it would be something like this Dumalacath- malacath Nerevar- azura Almalexia- boethiah Ysmir wulfarth- shor/lorkhan Vivec- molag bal Sotha sil- hermaeus mora Dagoth ur- mephala
The high elves are not the original inhabitants there descendants of the same anchant line there no more original than dark elves or wood elf snow elves and dwarfs are there cousins not there children @@hughmann9568
@@hughmann9568no the high elves are descendants of the same ancient line all other elves are there cousins not there children and the dwemer and snow elf society may be older infact.
Now that Elder Scrolls 6 was officially announced to be in production, I would love to see you guys return and redo the “Things we want in Elder Scrolls 6” serious. Especially after the release of games like Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3, and Dragons Dogma 2, which all show what could be possible in Elder Scrolls 6.
Theory: Orcs preexist the creation of Malacath. The Daedric Prince just co-opted the outcasts in order to have a loyal army. Evidence: *Topal the pilot saw Orcs an era before Trinimac became Malacath *Wood Orcs were in Valenwood before the Bosmer *Tales of Orcs facing the Atmorans predate the creation of Malacath
@basocheir According to _Before the Ages of Man,_ Orcs presence on Tamriel predate the Volthi exodus and according to the _Orcs of Skyrim,_ Orcs predate the Atmorans coming to Skyrim.
@@basocheir Orkey, Nordic God of the Orcs, is a god that was "worship[ed] during Aldmeri rule of Atmora." Also, if Orcs were in Skyrim before the Velothi exodus, then they predate both the transformation of Trinimac and the Atmoran migration.
Thats an interesting cool theory. The idea that perhaps the Orsimer split becoming the orcs and the dwemer, those who kept to their original faith and beliefs (Orcs) and those who abandoned worship the gods as they were weak or not worth following, going on a pursuit to both return to their old form, return to spirits/pure magic, and pursuit of the one truth(Dwemer). This would explain why they look different as they bred to return to a more elven look and pursued magical skill vs the Orcs who bred for strength and based on combat. Its like comparing those who stick to their beliefs despite having them rocked(Orcs) and those who see it as an awakening that the truth they once knew is incomplete(Dwemer). Thus the Dwemer pursued knowledge of Aedra, Daedra, and especially Lorkhan.
Let’s gooooo! I hadn’t expected a video from you guys today, but it’s always a pleasure whenever you post. Time to re-explore the history and secrets of the Orsimer, it seems. Malacath who was Trinimac, Orsimer who were Aldmer once. Thank you, as always!
19:22 it could make sense with malacath having some connection to the old dwemer. Especially with his keeping of volendrund (that spelling doesn’t seem right.) the hammer previously of dwarven origin and ownership.
The Dumac section got me thinking. Dunmer hold that Nerevar slew Dumac, but the battle of Red Mountain was a three -way fight between Nord, Dwemer and Chimer. It would another level of tragedy if Nerevar took his wounds not from Dumac but from fighting alongside his old friend, putting their battle aside to fight the Nordic Chief together. Going even further with the myth echo, a wounded Nerevar could have struck down the Nord as he stood over the defeated Dumac.
I love the idea that there is a duality between the fall from grace of the orcs and the ascension of the dwarves. I feel like they are narratively connected
If Elder Scrolls 6 takes place in Hammerfell or High-Rock, there needs to at least be a DLC story that takes in Orsinium that may involve the Orc worship of Malacath and Trinimac, like the Shivering Isles DLC.
Sheogorath in the Shivering Isles DLC definitely makes it sound like Malacath would have the worst daedric prince DLC. That's saying a lot- Based on what little we know, Peryite's realm is just Mehrunes Dagon but lamer, Namira's realm would inherently be unpleasant, with very few exceptions Meridia doesn't even allow mortals into the Colored Rooms (one of the reasons she's "good" since she doesn't steal you from your intended afterlife) but come on, they're called "the Colored Rooms," and Azura's Moonshadow is beautiful- So beautiful you go blind if you open your eyes there. Personally, I think Vaermina is probably next in line for having the most potentially-habitable and interesting realm (I would say Vaermina, Clavicus Vile or Hircine, but Clavicus Vile was featured to a small extent in Redguard and Hircine's realm was not explicitly and fully explored but does appear in Bloodmoon, so I think Vaermina will be first).
@@james739123 1: Unless you're a Bethesda insider I doubt you know what the story is going to be. With that said, the theories about the story that have floated around the community for the past several years do not include a strong focus on Orsinium, the orcs or Malacath. 2: Nothing I said was opinion-based. The reason I say I think Vaermina will be next is that she is the best next option given the lore and story of _the series as a whole,_ not given whatever you've convinced yourself the story of the next mainline title will be. In point of fact, as stated, every Prince that is even a viable option for an in-depth DLC like Shivering Isles or Dragonborn given their lore (which does not include Malacath) has already been featured prominently either as a major focus of a game (Clavicus Vile, Mehrunes Dagon, Molag Bal) or as the main focus of a major expansion (Hircine, Sheogorath, Hermaeus Mora). Vaermina is all that's left, as most of the realms fall into one of three categories: Nebulous and impossible to "land" on (like Mephala); Fundamentally inhospitable to living mortals, in such a way that for an expansion to take place there, lore would have to be retconned (like Azura); or already canonically redundant with or practically identical to realms that have already been prominently explored (like Boethiah). Malacath falls into the second and arguably the third categories.
Pretty much the main reason why I am hoping that TES 6 Is going to be set in Hammerfell or High Rock and Hammerfell is cause I want to be able to visit Orsinium in a mainline game. I need more Orc lore in my life and I find the conflict between Malacath and Trinimac worship to be the most interesting part of the races lore and is worthy of a questline imo, so I would really like to see that lore be expanded on.
Orcs always used to scare me when I was a kid in the old Bethesda games, Skyrim was the first of their games where I didn't feel scared of orcs but I kind of liked them, they surely seem very mysterious and unhinged.
I'm surprised you were scared of the Shrek-like orcs of Oblivion. I always thought they were funny in that game. Daggerfall was interesting. The scariest enemies based on noises and visuals were orcs and skeletons (oh god the skeletons, there's a sound mod for Skyrim that makes the bear roars sound explosive and they're almost as startling, but Daggerfall skeletons are still worse), but both were pushovers. Meanwhile vampire ancients were actually brutally hard, but they just looked like random dudes.
Incredible video. Scott you should make a video on Nerevar similar to the one you did for Reman! Would be awesome to see more of his life especially his friendship blossom with Dumac!!
TY 🙏 I actually messaged Scott and asked him if he would consider writing Nerevar's story. He said he'd give it some thought but that was a couple of days after the Reman video so 🤷♂️
Orcs on Tamriel before Aldmer or Atmorans would be very interesting. I do think the Nedes may have always been on Tamriel as well, so this could add up. Thanks for another greta video! 👏
Bjoulsae is pronounced "byool-say". The J is a Y sound, like in Icelandic. The whole "covered in the excrement of shame" thing sounds very much like Aldmeri poetic license to me. And you have to grant, between their arrogance and a general lack of taxonomic understanding, it would be in perfect character for the Aldmeri to describe the orcs thus, as a people degenerated by the shit of a daedra pwning a god who had fallen out of favor. It's an inconsistent narrative, like how the Norse mythologies weren't a single cohesive narrative but a collection of unrelated stories socketed into place to "explain" why the world was how it was. It's a made-up explanation. So I'm on board with the whole "orcs are native" thing, because that's more sound from a taconomic and anthropological standpoint. That's the science - the elven story is just fabrication.
Even if we get a mainline game all about orcs, they would probably still be in the minority unlike Morrowind and Skyrim. Orcs are extremely underrated and since the next game takes place in Hammerfell by the looks of it, we may get some more orc adventures seeing as orcs and Redguards have history. Also Hammerfell got its name from the throwing of Volendrung, the artifact most closely connected with the orcs, so playing an orc in TES6 may be more interesting than previous games
@@Ith4qua Not sure what you are actually trying to say here. But there has always been a canonical race for each protagonist in the Elder Scrolls games. We just never know what the race was until a much later installment. I would assume that Skyrim's canonical Dovahkiin is going to be a Nord, The Hero of Kvatch was an Imperial, the Nerevarine is supposed to be an Outlander, etc.
What a wondrous lie it would be if boethiah tricked Trinimac's followers into worshipping a turd, turning their backs on the true Trinimac, leaving him lost and forgotten.
I wish Bethesda would put you guys in a elders scrolls game as like historian let yall voice act your characters i have no doubt you guys could do something like that and give you like a library bc you guy are the back bone of there games rn I love you guys I love bethesda best of luck to yall and to all elder scrolls fans.
I don't know how I feel about Bethesda associating a gross story with the origin of an entire race of theirs, in addition to making their traditional lifestyle be detrimental to them, without providing a clear way for their race to attain a happy afterlife that doesn't involve Malacath.
What if the Orismer and Dwemer were originally the followers of Trinimac that were split between the ones that remained loyal after the transformation into malicath and the ones that abandoned their god . Where Dwemer metal comes from or how its made is currently a mystery, but it does match the desciption of Orichalcum you gave. Also, both societies are kind of smithing obsessed. As is Malicath/Trinimac if his realm of oblivion is any hint.
Great Video! I really love the Orsimer and think they are (characteristically) under-appreciated. ESO has done a great job of improving their lore, architecture and aesthetic. I really hope the Mongolian designs are used in ES6 more than the Skyrim-like style. Maybe the more Asian aesthetic is found in Orsinium/Trinimac followers, whilst the more angular and rugged armours are what you find in the Malacath worshipping and traditional strongholds like in Skyrim
Yeah, I think the similarity between Orcish armor and Deadric armor was very purposeful in Skyrim; its really fitting for stronghold orcs who follow Malacath. I admit, though, I see a lot of similarity between ESO's orc armors and Skyrim's, and beyond the helmets and up-turned-toe boots, neither looks very Mongolian to me. Would be VERY cool if they leaned that direction more, though.
Personally. I think that the orc dwarf connection comes from something less metaphysical. Namely an alliance. Both Dwemer and Orsimer were at odds with the rest of the mer. It would only be natural for the two to turn to each other for help and trade if they needed it.
I personally have a theory where both accounts are true, coming from the same place where I try and blend the histories. In this version the Iron Orcs are not genetically related, at least not entirely, to the Orcs of Malekath & Trinimac faiths. Essentially as we know the term Orc may refer to a series of races or tribes of taller goblin-kin, who are native & similar in appearance to Orcs, and so I propose that Iron Orcs are a direct relative of those taller goblin-kin races. And then at some point Elves arrived from Somerset or some other migrating Elven race. Maybe the Malekath theory is true and that's how they transformed, or maybe they intermixed with some of these taller goblin-kin which they called Orcs & over time like with the Bretons, a majority, or maybe even just a minority making up the ruling elite, of Orc tribes became a hybrid of both goblin-kin & Elves. In the latter theory the other Elven races pushed a narrative of impurity, seeing goblins as lesser, and these half-Elven hybrids as filthy abominations, creating the Malekath-Trinimac lie & pushing it on the natives. Maybe it was forced, maybe the Elven hybrids embraced it either through shame or from continually losing wars before they developed the ability to record their own history in written text. Much like the Dwarves did to the Falmer, the Elves forcing the Orcs into a primitive state. Only smaller branches of tribes that either lived in disconnected areas or in an isolationist state due to past or ongoing conflicts like the Iron Orcs survived, maybe also having hybrid blood, but maybe being completely pure in their goblin genetics, still looking similar to the other Orcs. Alternatively in this theory the hybrid Orcs took on the majority religion of Goblins, which seems to be Malekath, and their old deity of Trinimac either merged or was added to their joint faith, however again the other Elves saw this as an abomination mixing Trinimac, a pure Elven God, into a filthy goblin pantheon, and as such they expelled the Orcs & Trinimac from Elven society and made up a story of a God being tricked by Daedra into becoming a corrupted lesser form, impure and disconnected from the pure Elven lineages. In this version all of the history ties together & makes sense, but the Malekath is Trinimac part is a lie or a form of cultural merging. However, if we want the Trinimac-Malekath parts to also be completely true, then going back to the second paragraph above, the Elves that arrived worshipped Trinimac, like the Snow Elves worshipped Auri-El above the other Gods. Their God was corrupted, and became Malekath, and Malekath in his domineering might-makes-right nature, pushes out the other Orc & Goblin faiths, his followers become corrupted with him, and take on a similar form to the native taller goblins, and also conquer & merge with a majority of Orc tribes, until the Orcs & tall Goblins are indistinguishable. Only a few disconnected & isolated tribes survive the purge of the new pissed off War-God & his mixed up warband of hybrid cult-like followers. The Orcs eventually splinter with the idea of Orsinium, a united war-race, being lost to history, resurfacing because of his devoted followers. Only Iron Orcs, and similar tribes remain anything close to their old pure form. This solves the issue of the Iron Orcs being there for centuries, without disproving the Malekath faith. It's just a case of three or more races mixing up, and history getting muddled once again by the interference of the Gods. All it requires is for us to assume that some tall goblins still exist under the same umbrella term of Orc, and the two races look similar if-not identical. And if we use Bethesda's original deformed theory this may be what originally distinguished them. Maybe Iron Orcs/Tall Goblins had normal features, but the other Elf descended Orcs had all the weird nipple deformities & shit. To me that makes sense as the missing puzzle piece that would've solved the issue and connected the final dots in the theory, just the minor appearance differential to give us that nudge, that was unfortunately retconned and removed like so many theories and lost pieces of content in the Elder Scrolls Universe.
It's times like this that make me sad and maybe bitter. Bethesda -as a gaming studio- in the last decade or so has made me question whether or not they're really worthy of the lore of TES. There's an underlying narrative throughout the games of progressive change to the Nirn, and I'm starting to feel less confident in Bethesda's ability to keep up with the times.
I'm a geologist and historic recreationist who does quite a bit of work in chemical analysis and metalworking from history. This is literally my meat and potatoes (the orichalcium) And it really does work quite nicely.
I like your theory on orichalcum and its relation to the Orcs. Personally, I think that theory pairs well with the theory that the Orcs are the fallen Dwarves due to the fall of Trinimac. The metal associated with Orichalcum mythologically is similar to the dwarven metal that can be found in the Elder Scrolls series. It would also explain why the only way to forge the metal is by smelting already forged creations by the Dwemer, since all of the metal previously used has been changed to the modern version of orichalcum. This drastic change in phisicality and culture (Dwarf to Orc) would be nothing new, as we have seen the same thing happen to the Snow Elves. 26:26
Hear me out... Orcs always do better when they worship Trinimac (Don't know how to spell it) rather than Malacath and the story of how Malacath was formed is a story of Boethiah; the Daedric Lord of plots and deception. Is it possible that Boethiah has been deceiving the Orcs and keeping Trinimac in a weakened state using a lie called Malacath?
Should have waited for the end of the video XD. Still, the theory that Malacath is a liar (or a lie) is maybe supported by the presence of Boethiah in the myth.
Please Make a Celebrimbor (Bright Lord) build please if you have the time, it’d be really cool if you could play off of him being a ringmaker (in past) to have him work to craft a new ring of power to amplify his dragonborn nature and increase his powers of domination in a character arc
Thank you fudge muppet for your Dedication through out the years On the lore of elder scrolls. I’ve been a fan since you started it long ago. I still listen to your work and I’m 36. Maybe one day I can tell my son the story’s of this beautiful world.
Given that Volendrung fell in Hammerfell, and the traditional home of the Orcs is in the east of High Rock and Hammerfell, could the Rourkan Dwemer be the ancestors of the Orcs? Both are elvish, opposed to magic (generally), and both are great smiths. 🤔
A new video, YES! Missed you guys! I've been hoping you might get back to Skyrim with some RP Build videos on the modlist scene. Specifically hoping you'd check out LoreRim or Halls of Sovngarde. They both use Requiem and Divine Blessings religion mods. They would make ultra fun immersive RP and you guys are the Kings of RP! Glad to see you again!
I'm pretty sure that the theory about orichalcum is not what Bethesda intended, but if any of their writers are watching, it'll become canon. They've done it before. They've also just gotten stuff wrong before, and had to retcon it into working, like how they have ebony as a metal, or sulfur being red. They probably didn't know that orichalcum is based on a real alloy, as it is a public domain fantasy metal like mithril.
Hoping you guys will bring back the podcast and reunite with Drew for the episodes. The new chapter from ESO is really shaking things up and is worth coming back for. You guys said that was the case when leaving also.
Dunmer were directly cursed by azura for following tbe tribunal. Orcs were tranformed after their god's corruption (if tbe traditional telling is to be believed) its a difference of being transformed for abandoning god and transforming for continuing to follow a god
I think I posted this on the last one, but I love the poetic language/prose of TES lore. That, when combined with the utter weirdness of it all makes it my favorite series.
If Ebony is the blood of Lorkhan, could Orichalcum be the blood of Malacath after his transformation? And elves transformed into orcs when they made it into armor aka when they rubbed the “dirt” on themselves.
My new head canon is that the Orcs we play as have always been the Elves changed alongside Trinimac/Malacath, but there are at least three other kinds of Orcs who live(d) on Tamriel. The Wood Orcs were made along with the Bosmer and Khajiit. The Iron Orcs and Giant Goblins were also there, but I don't know anything about their origins.
I personally like the view of Trinimac being a tribunal entity, born of three Aedra as a necessity to betray Lorkhan and gradually torn apart by the conflict between his nature as a Knight supposed to be loyal to his first lord and the fact that he was born in betrayal, his tribunal nature eventually sundering into his three original pieces and the remaining torn shreds being reduced to two pieces. The first representing the part of himself unwilling to move on and trying to retain a semblance of his honor trying to keep and protect his changed followers and the second representing the part who embraced his new nature, abandoning his old existence entirely and placing his trust in his new allies.
The ork buildings look a lot like the dwarf buildings in style. Noticed it a while back when telepoted from a dwarf tower to a ork fortress and noticed that the towers have the same style. Would be funny if the atheist dwarves would get a god that keeps them from technological advancement, so that they never would reach the same level of world-shaping tech again.
I still dont get why the"Green Pact" has anything to do with Wood Elves not making/using metals. If anything, they should logically have a focus on metal for the sheer fact they cant use wood/plants/fibers for anything. They ironically someone make bows without using plant fibers. Why cant they mine ore and smelt? They could use magic for the fire or some alternative fuel thus not harming any trees or plants.
Green pact is all about having as little environmental impact as possible and wood elves have to use everything they kill so if a wood elf is gonna make a bow chances are they were gonna use the tree for something else and this let's them kill 2 birds with one stone
What if the imperials are the dragon in the scenario that are oppressing the nords ? Since there is always an oppressor next in line is stormcoalks and so on and so on like the caliper? Changes my thinking ....
I've been really interested in Arcwind Point lately-- do you have any videos that explore it? If not you should do an investigation and give us some theories! Thanks for all you do.
Excellent Video! I have an idea of how all these mysteries answer each other in this video: It seems like the implication of all this information seems to point to the idea that goblins and orc-kin in general are all a form of degenerated elf. Additionally, it seems only some 'orcs' originally bore relation to Malacath and there are some which were separate and leftover from prior to the shattering of Old Aldmeris and were still living on would-be Tamriel prior to being encountered by Topal the Pilot. The idea of what an orc even is by its very nature could have not just been blurry in terms of orc being a slur but that these were indeed in some way still elves that had degenerated into unrecognizable beasts over the untold eons between the shattering of Aldmeris (the pointed ears betraying their elven origin) and the arrival of Topal the Pilot. The point of this is that would explain how the iron orcs could have an orcish/goblinoid origin that was wholly separate from Trinimac's group that were indeed always there, and these non orichalcum wearing iron orcs were the result of that pre-shattering "Cave dwelling, stone worshipping and bestial" population interbreeding with a group that did indeed have origin with Trinimacs group. The process of elves degenerating into goblins is very much the same as to to what happened to the Falmer in terms of overall effect (going underground and being blinded, separating them from Auriel's light physically/spiritually weakening them) also raises some rather interesting questions into the term "dwarf-orc" and the origin of the uniquely lavender-skinned dwemer which also predate Topal's arrival. It is also notable that Malacath also seems to make the difference in how these orcs resist the degeneration of physical strength over time that was seen in these other degenerate forms of elf; like goblins and Falmer. The machinations of infighting and focus on strength found within the code of malacath and the import of grievances in orcish afterlife and its role in the growth of generational strength all seem to feed into this idea that strength/power are perpetually waning for the orcs who while the most physically imposing of the races of Tamriel remain unable to find any long-term stability outside of their strongholds.
Honestly Bethesda owes so much to people like fudgemuppet for keeping the series alive until the elder scrolls 6
Only for it to eventually bomb at release I bet
And the Entirety of Steams critical success to boot!
@@PetrusEksteen What are your race 3, body type 2's pronouns? 😂
@@insertoyouroemail I think I'm going with a black Nord, with blonde zoomer mini-dreadlock hairstyle (shaved on the sides), whose backstory as a newly-inducted vampire whose skooma blood accidentally killed their master will drive the revenge arc in the hunt for their 14th boyfriend who refused to sit in the cuck chair
@@insertoyouroemail Mods be quick on that comment delete button (or auto-detection be sensitive as h*ck)
Man, that point about real Orichalcum being brass and copper oxidizing into a patinaed green is such a good metaphysical analogy for the Orsimer
Poor Malacath, guy has one of the most indignant falls from grace . Gets crapped out by Boethia, the Nords call him "Mountain Fart", none of the other Daedric princes like him.
He did say that story was exaggerated, but no one else has ever offered a different one, so ...
"my death was greatly exageratted" - trinimac@@Mary_Beth_Reimer
and he doesnt like them his scourge banishes even princes trickery downed him but he passed through and no less powerful even passing his new form to his followers superior to their former selves
its kinda cool if u think about it. the reclamations teach the dunmer that tamriel is a great trial, so boethia gave trinimac the greatest trials as a parting lesson@@AD-en5dq
@@Mary_Beth_Reimerthe story is correct, just symbolic. Malacath is the daedric prince of the spurned and ostracized so it makes sense that he'd get called dookie just for fun
The code of Malacath reminds me of the African proverb: "The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth."
Orcs remind me of Africans too, the way they smell
@@augustsmith9553not funny, didn't laugh
@@augustsmith9553 Why don’t you explain everything you meant with that sentence in graphic detail so we all REALLY understand where you’re coming from, huh? If it’s actually funny it shouldn’t be too hard.
@@augustsmith9553that wasn’t funny at all bruh. Like not even creative or nuanced.
@@augustsmith9553 as my nigerian friend once said, intelligence chases you but you will always outrun it
"You can recognize orcs by their height and weight" says the book. "Sure let us ignore the obvious green skin" answers my brain
It is hard to ignore the tusks.
I must make a note that you could describe them by their height and weight without mentioning race/species and determine they are an orc. Say in a note or book.
Thas raycis
@@drawndown except you can't they might mistake an overly large redguard for an orc. Or any of the other races if you withhold actual indicators of species. Like the green skin colour. The tusks, etc.
Like irl I wish you good luck describing someone of sub-saharan african descent without mentioning their complexion at all.
People are surprisingly bad at understanding what is meant if you keep descriptions too vague.
@@lakkakka Thick lips, coarse woolly hair, broad noses
All the other races: "Let's call our grand city something really cool!"
Orcs: "Ok, this is Orctown."
That actually is a cool name though.
Gotta be one of my favorite genders
Well at least it's a name as practical and to the point as the people it harbors.
Imperials: "Welcome to the Imperial city of Imperial City!"
Argonians: "Our homeland shall be known as Argonia."
Bretons, living on a high rock:
Khajits, living elsewhere:
If the nords consider malacath a god who tests them in war, it could just be that overtime they began to associate that warring with death itself and combined the gods into one, or think of orkey and malacath as two aspects of the same god. Like death itself and death by battle. And if they hear other cultures around them refer to the orsimer as orcs, maybe that influenced them aswell.
My favorite race. My orc dragonborn uses the Way of The Voice to fight his rage (berseker rage)... His stronghold was burned by the Thalmor during their war against the Resguards and now he seeks vengance.
Sick backstory for your character, that’s great. Orcs rule.
I absolutely adore the Mongolian inspiration for the Orcs.
I do too, but I'm currently trying to find a way to create a halfbreed nord/orc and make it more nordic. Really squeezing the life out of ES5 lol
The Orsinium DLC and Kurog are some of the best things ESO has to offer, I loved this story a lot. Really fascinating to hear you talk about how holding onto Malacath is like holding onto vengeance, which holds the Orsimer back from truly progressing.
Yeah, me too, except for the part where I get stabbed
I always figured the dwarve orc conection was that they have the same mer ancestor. When trinimac was eaten and became malacath half of the mer who witnessed this stayed faithful and followed him in his transformation, while the other half lost their faith in gods and became the dwemer.
Thats actually a good idea
Both are also rather talented tinkerers! They have that in common.
Kind of an inverse of the Chimer / Dunmer gambit…
It's a fun theory but Nords definitely embellish, and the most likely explanation is just that Nords traditionally really hate Orcs and try to associate anything they dislike with Orcs (eg Ar'kay, god of Death, is Orkey, god of Orcs and Death, according to the Nords, who make no distinction between Arkay and Malacath since death is bad and Orcs are bad).
@@vitriolicAmaranth What about the Dunmer and Kajiit sources that also call him that?
Skyrim modders would not be able to contain themselves with 6 nippled orcs…
I wonder, how that would have inspired the Skyrim modders on LoversLab...
@@Oktokolo We are not talking about Lover’s Lab 😂
@@FernBlackwood1995 Sure we do - if we talk about 6-nippled-orc adult content.
There is no way Milk Mod Economy wouldn't support 6 nipples if they where in the base game - they got 4 right now after all...
That tells you what a terrible game Skyrim is. Even on Xbox you cant fix it with 5 gb of mods.
@@thomasrosendahl2783 Bruh. Skyland AIO 2k is already 5.5 GiB. And that's just the baseline for visual modding.
Only allowing users of your consoles to have 5 GiBs of mods is basically showing them the middle finger.
The game is old and console makers are enforcing completely ridiculous restrictions. Of course you want to add a texture overhault to a ten years old game.
Of course you also want some extra content with extra assets and also extra textures.
Skyrim is the most modded singleplayer game on the planet.
But only on PC you can actually mod it without someone else telling you what and how much you are allowed to add or change.
You poor console users don't even get automatic load order management because you aren't even allowed to use a proper mod manager.
You are literally second class players.
Not because some stupid PC master race bro like me says so. But because you pay to play on hardware that isn't actually yours and you accept whatever the true owners of that hardware decide to allow or not allow you to do with it.
Vote with your wallet instead of trying to rationalize why the stupid arbitrary restrictions are indeed justified. Because they aren't.
You should be allowed to add as much and whatever content to your gaming experience as you want on the console you already paid for.
And if enough of you enforce that by boycotting overly restrictive consoles, you maybe will one day actually be able to have the freedom of a PC with the convenience of a console.
Thanks for attending my TED rant.
In reference to The Blood Price I’d like to bring up the Germanic concept of “Weregild” (there’s like 9 different ways to spell it depending on language) literally “man price”, which was a way to measure the cost to a victim and/or their family for personal injury, murder, maiming, and things of that nature, which would be scaled off both the severity of the crime as well as the rank of those involved, and sometimes the price could be so high that it would extend past an individual and onto their family/clan.
Edit: it’s also worth mentioning this is hardly unique to the Germanics, but it was very heavily embedded in their legal code, so for example in Wales they even had it vary by how wealthy the affected party was, so a unlanded freeman was worth less than a poor landed man, who was worth less than a rich landed man, etc. Women were also included, but their exact valuation varied by place and cultural, while slaves/thralls were considered property damage rather than weregild
Missed this content like fr. Glad you’re back
26:30 the connection you are looking for is this, if oricalcum is 80% copper , the the green "corruption" is rust, copper rust is green !
Oxidation not rust
@@joshrocha3758close enough tbh, iron oxidation is called rust so it's pretty easy to call it copper rust
Oxidized copper is malachite.
@@joshrocha3758Rust is oxidization. To refer to something as "copper rust" indicates it's the copper version of rust, which is oxidization. Don't incorrectly correct people.
@@chrismanuel9768 you just dont need to be a pedant when the idea gets across to anyone who cares a healthy amount about the message lol
1:03:19 I wanna see this “improved elves” belief fully realized. Orcs have gone too long taking the short end of the stick.
All hail Malacath God-King of Poo-Poo
This but unironically
HAIL
They eat da poo poo, like ice cream.
All hail!
HAIL THE POO POO GOD KING!
Honestly, the simplest explanation for the Orc/Dwarf connection is that Malacath joined forces with the Dwarves at some point since they were enemies of his enemies, the Dunmer.
I would be willing to believe that Dumalacath is like the Malacath version of a Shezzarine. Trinimac's defeat was more substantial than we usually assume, and Malacath is the name given to some sort of leftover essence that isn't quite a god, and manifests in a similar way to the leftovers of Lorkhan
I think according to the red mountain event it would be something like this
Dumalacath- malacath
Nerevar- azura
Almalexia- boethiah
Ysmir wulfarth- shor/lorkhan
Vivec- molag bal
Sotha sil- hermaeus mora
Dagoth ur- mephala
@@mitchellaquilina2904 Id switch Alex and Vivec, but solid list
Maybe dwarfs snow elfs and orcs were all once the same people who took 3 different paths.
Interesting theory, I like that one.
Yes they all stem from the High elves. 😂 All elves do.
The high elves are not the original inhabitants there descendants of the same anchant line there no more original than dark elves or wood elf snow elves and dwarfs are there cousins not there children @@hughmann9568
@@hughmann9568no the high elves are descendants of the same ancient line all other elves are there cousins not there children and the dwemer and snow elf society may be older infact.
Bring back the Podcast
I miss the podcast so much I've rewatched them a million times
I want it back so god
Truly
yess
It's not the same without drew 😭
Now that Elder Scrolls 6 was officially announced to be in production, I would love to see you guys return and redo the “Things we want in Elder Scrolls 6” serious. Especially after the release of games like Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3, and Dragons Dogma 2, which all show what could be possible in Elder Scrolls 6.
Theory: Orcs preexist the creation of Malacath. The Daedric Prince just co-opted the outcasts in order to have a loyal army.
Evidence:
*Topal the pilot saw Orcs an era before Trinimac became Malacath
*Wood Orcs were in Valenwood before the Bosmer
*Tales of Orcs facing the Atmorans predate the creation of Malacath
I think arrival of ancient Nords/Atmoran to Tamriel is after transformation of Trinimac
@basocheir According to _Before the Ages of Man,_ Orcs presence on Tamriel predate the Volthi exodus and according to the _Orcs of Skyrim,_ Orcs predate the Atmorans coming to Skyrim.
@@badluck5647 and Trinimac transformation also predates Atmoran migration to Skyrim
@@basocheir Orkey, Nordic God of the Orcs, is a god that was "worship[ed] during Aldmeri rule of Atmora."
Also, if Orcs were in Skyrim before the Velothi exodus, then they predate both the transformation of Trinimac and the Atmoran migration.
@@basocheir Orkey, Atmoran god of the orcs, worship was taken up "during Aldmeri rule of Atmora."
If you thought they Aldmer were pretty cool before, now they're _Orsimer._
😂 Great comment
😂 best comment
Underrated comment
🤝🥹🫡
Outstanding work sir! Thank you for your service! 🎉🫡
Thats an interesting cool theory. The idea that perhaps the Orsimer split becoming the orcs and the dwemer, those who kept to their original faith and beliefs (Orcs) and those who abandoned worship the gods as they were weak or not worth following, going on a pursuit to both return to their old form, return to spirits/pure magic, and pursuit of the one truth(Dwemer). This would explain why they look different as they bred to return to a more elven look and pursued magical skill vs the Orcs who bred for strength and based on combat. Its like comparing those who stick to their beliefs despite having them rocked(Orcs) and those who see it as an awakening that the truth they once knew is incomplete(Dwemer). Thus the Dwemer pursued knowledge of Aedra, Daedra, and especially Lorkhan.
"the fabled elder scrolls 6" oof ,that hurt ;' . great video as always.
Let’s gooooo!
I hadn’t expected a video from you guys today, but it’s always a pleasure whenever you post.
Time to re-explore the history and secrets of the Orsimer, it seems.
Malacath who was Trinimac, Orsimer who were Aldmer once.
Thank you, as always!
The title could be used for everything within Elder Scrolls. Nothing is as it seems in this universe.
Good job
Like the TV headed zombies
Coda is a fever dream
Thanks, captain obvious! What would we have done without your incredible insight?
@@sleepysartorialist And what would we have done without your glorious Divine prosecution?
@@sleepysartorialist You really think this would be obvious to the tourists? You goddamn nerd.
19:22 it could make sense with malacath having some connection to the old dwemer. Especially with his keeping of volendrund (that spelling doesn’t seem right.) the hammer previously of dwarven origin and ownership.
The Dumac section got me thinking.
Dunmer hold that Nerevar slew Dumac, but the battle of Red Mountain was a three -way fight between Nord, Dwemer and Chimer.
It would another level of tragedy if Nerevar took his wounds not from Dumac but from fighting alongside his old friend, putting their battle aside to fight the Nordic Chief together.
Going even further with the myth echo, a wounded Nerevar could have struck down the Nord as he stood over the defeated Dumac.
I love the idea that there is a duality between the fall from grace of the orcs and the ascension of the dwarves. I feel like they are narratively connected
If Elder Scrolls 6 takes place in Hammerfell or High-Rock, there needs to at least be a DLC story that takes in Orsinium that may involve the Orc worship of Malacath and Trinimac, like the Shivering Isles DLC.
Sheogorath in the Shivering Isles DLC definitely makes it sound like Malacath would have the worst daedric prince DLC. That's saying a lot- Based on what little we know, Peryite's realm is just Mehrunes Dagon but lamer, Namira's realm would inherently be unpleasant, with very few exceptions Meridia doesn't even allow mortals into the Colored Rooms (one of the reasons she's "good" since she doesn't steal you from your intended afterlife) but come on, they're called "the Colored Rooms," and Azura's Moonshadow is beautiful- So beautiful you go blind if you open your eyes there.
Personally, I think Vaermina is probably next in line for having the most potentially-habitable and interesting realm (I would say Vaermina, Clavicus Vile or Hircine, but Clavicus Vile was featured to a small extent in Redguard and Hircine's realm was not explicitly and fully explored but does appear in Bloodmoon, so I think Vaermina will be first).
@@vitriolicAmaranthI'm going by what makes sense for the story, not *your* personal opinion.
@@james739123 1: Unless you're a Bethesda insider I doubt you know what the story is going to be. With that said, the theories about the story that have floated around the community for the past several years do not include a strong focus on Orsinium, the orcs or Malacath.
2: Nothing I said was opinion-based. The reason I say I think Vaermina will be next is that she is the best next option given the lore and story of _the series as a whole,_ not given whatever you've convinced yourself the story of the next mainline title will be. In point of fact, as stated, every Prince that is even a viable option for an in-depth DLC like Shivering Isles or Dragonborn given their lore (which does not include Malacath) has already been featured prominently either as a major focus of a game (Clavicus Vile, Mehrunes Dagon, Molag Bal) or as the main focus of a major expansion (Hircine, Sheogorath, Hermaeus Mora). Vaermina is all that's left, as most of the realms fall into one of three categories: Nebulous and impossible to "land" on (like Mephala); Fundamentally inhospitable to living mortals, in such a way that for an expansion to take place there, lore would have to be retconned (like Azura); or already canonically redundant with or practically identical to realms that have already been prominently explored (like Boethiah). Malacath falls into the second and arguably the third categories.
These longform videos are such a treat. I am always so impressed by how deep the lore goes.
Pretty much the main reason why I am hoping that TES 6 Is going to be set in Hammerfell or High Rock and Hammerfell is cause I want to be able to visit Orsinium in a mainline game. I need more Orc lore in my life and I find the conflict between Malacath and Trinimac worship to be the most interesting part of the races lore and is worthy of a questline imo, so I would really like to see that lore be expanded on.
Orcs always used to scare me when I was a kid in the old Bethesda games, Skyrim was the first of their games where I didn't feel scared of orcs but I kind of liked them, they surely seem very mysterious and unhinged.
I'm surprised you were scared of the Shrek-like orcs of Oblivion. I always thought they were funny in that game.
Daggerfall was interesting. The scariest enemies based on noises and visuals were orcs and skeletons (oh god the skeletons, there's a sound mod for Skyrim that makes the bear roars sound explosive and they're almost as startling, but Daggerfall skeletons are still worse), but both were pushovers. Meanwhile vampire ancients were actually brutally hard, but they just looked like random dudes.
Fudgemuppet levelled up! This video was jaw dropping. Great work.
Incredible video. Scott you should make a video on Nerevar similar to the one you did for Reman! Would be awesome to see more of his life especially his friendship blossom with Dumac!!
TY 🙏 I actually messaged Scott and asked him if he would consider writing Nerevar's story. He said he'd give it some thought but that was a couple of days after the Reman video so 🤷♂️
Why Bethesda isn’t paying you, is beyond me.
Because he does it for free
@@NoContent1991 aww yeah, tru
@@Randy_Flamethrower yeah righto mate.
@@NoContent1991 He shouldn’t be, lmao.
The Mongolian roots of the orcs date all the way back to Tolkien. He wasn’t shy about the fact that the orcs were inspired by the mongol hordes
Orcs on Tamriel before Aldmer or Atmorans would be very interesting. I do think the Nedes may have always been on Tamriel as well, so this could add up. Thanks for another greta video! 👏
Bjoulsae is pronounced "byool-say". The J is a Y sound, like in Icelandic.
The whole "covered in the excrement of shame" thing sounds very much like Aldmeri poetic license to me. And you have to grant, between their arrogance and a general lack of taxonomic understanding, it would be in perfect character for the Aldmeri to describe the orcs thus, as a people degenerated by the shit of a daedra pwning a god who had fallen out of favor. It's an inconsistent narrative, like how the Norse mythologies weren't a single cohesive narrative but a collection of unrelated stories socketed into place to "explain" why the world was how it was. It's a made-up explanation.
So I'm on board with the whole "orcs are native" thing, because that's more sound from a taconomic and anthropological standpoint. That's the science - the elven story is just fabrication.
You the man Fudge. Thanks for giving me good stuff to listen to at work
Even if we get a mainline game all about orcs, they would probably still be in the minority unlike Morrowind and Skyrim.
Orcs are extremely underrated and since the next game takes place in Hammerfell by the looks of it, we may get some more orc adventures seeing as orcs and Redguards have history.
Also Hammerfell got its name from the throwing of Volendrung, the artifact most closely connected with the orcs, so playing an orc in TES6 may be more interesting than previous games
nah probably just gonna be a character skin like the last 5 games
@@Ith4qua Not sure what you are actually trying to say here. But there has always been a canonical race for each protagonist in the Elder Scrolls games. We just never know what the race was until a much later installment. I would assume that Skyrim's canonical Dovahkiin is going to be a Nord, The Hero of Kvatch was an Imperial, the Nerevarine is supposed to be an Outlander, etc.
Don’t shit in my cornflakes, pal, I’m allowed to dream
@@mee091000there's no canonical race about any of the PC promotional material doesn't count
@@Nugundamsisntforshow Prove it
What a wondrous lie it would be if boethiah tricked Trinimac's followers into worshipping a turd, turning their backs on the true Trinimac, leaving him lost and forgotten.
This video has singlehandedly made me want to build an orc in ESO. Sadly i have all my character slots full but dang it was a great video
I wish Bethesda would put you guys in a elders scrolls game as like historian let yall voice act your characters i have no doubt you guys could do something like that and give you like a library bc you guy are the back bone of there games rn I love you guys I love bethesda best of luck to yall and to all elder scrolls fans.
I've often wondered if the Orsimer are descendants of a splinter faction of Dwemer. I've got zero proof, but I've got my suspicions.
The fact that they’re Mer could mean relation of some kind, absolutely.
I like to believe that Dumalacath is half orc. Wouldn't be too far fetched considering his war like nature.
Strangely you seemed to ignore the last piece of content on orcs and Malacath - "From Exiles to Exodus".
Scott, we need more of your fanfiction stories!!!
I don't know how I feel about Bethesda associating a gross story with the origin of an entire race of theirs, in addition to making their traditional lifestyle be detrimental to them, without providing a clear way for their race to attain a happy afterlife that doesn't involve Malacath.
What if the Orismer and Dwemer were originally the followers of Trinimac that were split between the ones that remained loyal after the transformation into malicath and the ones that abandoned their god . Where Dwemer metal comes from or how its made is currently a mystery, but it does match the desciption of Orichalcum you gave. Also, both societies are kind of smithing obsessed. As is Malicath/Trinimac if his realm of oblivion is any hint.
Definitely a latecomer to this, but on the off chance you're still getting these notifications- great work! Love your content.
Great Video! I really love the Orsimer and think they are (characteristically) under-appreciated. ESO has done a great job of improving their lore, architecture and aesthetic. I really hope the Mongolian designs are used in ES6 more than the Skyrim-like style. Maybe the more Asian aesthetic is found in Orsinium/Trinimac followers, whilst the more angular and rugged armours are what you find in the Malacath worshipping and traditional strongholds like in Skyrim
Yeah, I think the similarity between Orcish armor and Deadric armor was very purposeful in Skyrim; its really fitting for stronghold orcs who follow Malacath. I admit, though, I see a lot of similarity between ESO's orc armors and Skyrim's, and beyond the helmets and up-turned-toe boots, neither looks very Mongolian to me. Would be VERY cool if they leaned that direction more, though.
That was so much lore presented in such an engaging way. Super cool, you are doing an amazing job.
probably the best advertisement for TESO there ever was
Why do people forget there is a whole series before ESO.
I always liked the Orsimer. They're pretty cool. People are just jealous of how fierce they are.
4:05 Trinimac&cheese
These longer videos remind me how much I miss the Elder Scrolls Lore podcast y’all had :(
Personally. I think that the orc dwarf connection comes from something less metaphysical. Namely an alliance. Both Dwemer and Orsimer were at odds with the rest of the mer. It would only be natural for the two to turn to each other for help and trade if they needed it.
This might be your best work yet, thanks guys!
I personally have a theory where both accounts are true, coming from the same place where I try and blend the histories. In this version the Iron Orcs are not genetically related, at least not entirely, to the Orcs of Malekath & Trinimac faiths.
Essentially as we know the term Orc may refer to a series of races or tribes of taller goblin-kin, who are native & similar in appearance to Orcs, and so I propose that Iron Orcs are a direct relative of those taller goblin-kin races. And then at some point Elves arrived from Somerset or some other migrating Elven race. Maybe the Malekath theory is true and that's how they transformed, or maybe they intermixed with some of these taller goblin-kin which they called Orcs & over time like with the Bretons, a majority, or maybe even just a minority making up the ruling elite, of Orc tribes became a hybrid of both goblin-kin & Elves.
In the latter theory the other Elven races pushed a narrative of impurity, seeing goblins as lesser, and these half-Elven hybrids as filthy abominations, creating the Malekath-Trinimac lie & pushing it on the natives. Maybe it was forced, maybe the Elven hybrids embraced it either through shame or from continually losing wars before they developed the ability to record their own history in written text. Much like the Dwarves did to the Falmer, the Elves forcing the Orcs into a primitive state.
Only smaller branches of tribes that either lived in disconnected areas or in an isolationist state due to past or ongoing conflicts like the Iron Orcs survived, maybe also having hybrid blood, but maybe being completely pure in their goblin genetics, still looking similar to the other Orcs.
Alternatively in this theory the hybrid Orcs took on the majority religion of Goblins, which seems to be Malekath, and their old deity of Trinimac either merged or was added to their joint faith, however again the other Elves saw this as an abomination mixing Trinimac, a pure Elven God, into a filthy goblin pantheon, and as such they expelled the Orcs & Trinimac from Elven society and made up a story of a God being tricked by Daedra into becoming a corrupted lesser form, impure and disconnected from the pure Elven lineages.
In this version all of the history ties together & makes sense, but the Malekath is Trinimac part is a lie or a form of cultural merging.
However, if we want the Trinimac-Malekath parts to also be completely true, then going back to the second paragraph above, the Elves that arrived worshipped Trinimac, like the Snow Elves worshipped Auri-El above the other Gods. Their God was corrupted, and became Malekath, and Malekath in his domineering might-makes-right nature, pushes out the other Orc & Goblin faiths, his followers become corrupted with him, and take on a similar form to the native taller goblins, and also conquer & merge with a majority of Orc tribes, until the Orcs & tall Goblins are indistinguishable. Only a few disconnected & isolated tribes survive the purge of the new pissed off War-God & his mixed up warband of hybrid cult-like followers. The Orcs eventually splinter with the idea of Orsinium, a united war-race, being lost to history, resurfacing because of his devoted followers. Only Iron Orcs, and similar tribes remain anything close to their old pure form.
This solves the issue of the Iron Orcs being there for centuries, without disproving the Malekath faith. It's just a case of three or more races mixing up, and history getting muddled once again by the interference of the Gods. All it requires is for us to assume that some tall goblins still exist under the same umbrella term of Orc, and the two races look similar if-not identical.
And if we use Bethesda's original deformed theory this may be what originally distinguished them. Maybe Iron Orcs/Tall Goblins had normal features, but the other Elf descended Orcs had all the weird nipple deformities & shit.
To me that makes sense as the missing puzzle piece that would've solved the issue and connected the final dots in the theory, just the minor appearance differential to give us that nudge, that was unfortunately retconned and removed like so many theories and lost pieces of content in the Elder Scrolls Universe.
God, I love orcs in fiction. Not the shitty "big dumb brute" but this excellent nuance of brutality, community, and strength of honor. Orcs rock!
Just went I think I can move on to another franchise’s lore, fudgemuppet comes and snatches me back
It's times like this that make me sad and maybe bitter. Bethesda -as a gaming studio- in the last decade or so has made me question whether or not they're really worthy of the lore of TES. There's an underlying narrative throughout the games of progressive change to the Nirn, and I'm starting to feel less confident in Bethesda's ability to keep up with the times.
I'm a geologist and historic recreationist who does quite a bit of work in chemical analysis and metalworking from history. This is literally my meat and potatoes (the orichalcium) And it really does work quite nicely.
Perfect! Ive had a MASSIVE Malacath cooking all day an needed something to listen to as I pass as lord Boethia
So happy to see your upload. I hope that all is well with you two. Can’t wait to give this one a watch.
I like your theory on orichalcum and its relation to the Orcs. Personally, I think that theory pairs well with the theory that the Orcs are the fallen Dwarves due to the fall of Trinimac. The metal associated with Orichalcum mythologically is similar to the dwarven metal that can be found in the Elder Scrolls series. It would also explain why the only way to forge the metal is by smelting already forged creations by the Dwemer, since all of the metal previously used has been changed to the modern version of orichalcum.
This drastic change in phisicality and culture (Dwarf to Orc) would be nothing new, as we have seen the same thing happen to the Snow Elves. 26:26
This video is so AWESOME!!! Everything about was great. Loved the detail!
Hear me out... Orcs always do better when they worship Trinimac (Don't know how to spell it) rather than Malacath and the story of how Malacath was formed is a story of Boethiah; the Daedric Lord of plots and deception. Is it possible that Boethiah has been deceiving the Orcs and keeping Trinimac in a weakened state using a lie called Malacath?
Should have waited for the end of the video XD. Still, the theory that Malacath is a liar (or a lie) is maybe supported by the presence of Boethiah in the myth.
I love sleeping to these long lore vids
Please Make a Celebrimbor (Bright Lord) build please if you have the time, it’d be really cool if you could play off of him being a ringmaker (in past) to have him work to craft a new ring of power to amplify his dragonborn nature and increase his powers of domination in a character arc
Thank you fudge muppet for your
Dedication through out the years
On the lore of elder scrolls. I’ve been a fan since you started it long ago. I still listen to your work and I’m 36.
Maybe one day I can tell my son the story’s of this beautiful world.
Given that Volendrung fell in Hammerfell, and the traditional home of the Orcs is in the east of High Rock and Hammerfell, could the Rourkan Dwemer be the ancestors of the Orcs? Both are elvish, opposed to magic (generally), and both are great smiths. 🤔
A new video, YES! Missed you guys! I've been hoping you might get back to Skyrim with some RP Build videos on the modlist scene. Specifically hoping you'd check out LoreRim or Halls of Sovngarde. They both use Requiem and Divine Blessings religion mods. They would make ultra fun immersive RP and you guys are the Kings of RP!
Glad to see you again!
I'm pretty sure that the theory about orichalcum is not what Bethesda intended, but if any of their writers are watching, it'll become canon. They've done it before. They've also just gotten stuff wrong before, and had to retcon it into working, like how they have ebony as a metal, or sulfur being red. They probably didn't know that orichalcum is based on a real alloy, as it is a public domain fantasy metal like mithril.
Hoping you guys will bring back the podcast and reunite with Drew for the episodes. The new chapter from ESO is really shaking things up and is worth coming back for. You guys said that was the case when leaving also.
My question is
If orcs were elves cursed by a god, does that male them exactly like dark elves?
Dunmer were directly cursed by azura for following tbe tribunal. Orcs were tranformed after their god's corruption (if tbe traditional telling is to be believed) its a difference of being transformed for abandoning god and transforming for continuing to follow a god
I think I posted this on the last one, but I love the poetic language/prose of TES lore. That, when combined with the utter weirdness of it all makes it my favorite series.
If Ebony is the blood of Lorkhan, could Orichalcum be the blood of Malacath after his transformation? And elves transformed into orcs when they made it into armor aka when they rubbed the “dirt” on themselves.
This video about Orsimer is Awesomer than expected! 😃
I never tire of great elderscrolls lore videos
I would love it if ES VI has an orc-centric plotline.
My new head canon is that the Orcs we play as have always been the Elves changed alongside Trinimac/Malacath, but there are at least three other kinds of Orcs who live(d) on Tamriel. The Wood Orcs were made along with the Bosmer and Khajiit. The Iron Orcs and Giant Goblins were also there, but I don't know anything about their origins.
I personally like the view of Trinimac being a tribunal entity, born of three Aedra as a necessity to betray Lorkhan and gradually torn apart by the conflict between his nature as a Knight supposed to be loyal to his first lord and the fact that he was born in betrayal, his tribunal nature eventually sundering into his three original pieces and the remaining torn shreds being reduced to two pieces. The first representing the part of himself unwilling to move on and trying to retain a semblance of his honor trying to keep and protect his changed followers and the second representing the part who embraced his new nature, abandoning his old existence entirely and placing his trust in his new allies.
The ork buildings look a lot like the dwarf buildings in style.
Noticed it a while back when telepoted from a dwarf tower to a ork fortress and noticed that the towers have the same style.
Would be funny if the atheist dwarves would get a god that keeps them from technological advancement, so that they never would reach the same level of world-shaping tech again.
Interesting video. I love the Orcs! Orcs, Bretons, and Argonians are my favorite three .
This kind of content puts me at ease.
I still dont get why the"Green Pact" has anything to do with Wood Elves not making/using metals. If anything, they should logically have a focus on metal for the sheer fact they cant use wood/plants/fibers for anything. They ironically someone make bows without using plant fibers. Why cant they mine ore and smelt? They could use magic for the fire or some alternative fuel thus not harming any trees or plants.
Like plants, ores come from the land. So it’s probably something like that.
Green pact is all about having as little environmental impact as possible and wood elves have to use everything they kill so if a wood elf is gonna make a bow chances are they were gonna use the tree for something else and this let's them kill 2 birds with one stone
What if the imperials are the dragon in the scenario that are oppressing the nords ? Since there is always an oppressor next in line is stormcoalks and so on and so on like the caliper?
Changes my thinking ....
Just discovered this channel, this is incredible! Going to dig into their videos
I wanna see the oaths and curses aspect of malacath i think that would add a lot of familiarity
Another video to watch on orc lore is Honored madmans "A History of Violence." It's not the best quality video, but i still enjoyed it.
There's a Morrowind mod called "The Pig Children-Concept Art Orcs" by Petethegoat that gives them the extra nipples found in the concept art.
Fudgemuppet back in the saddle let’s go
Phenomenal video, thank you for rekindling my interest in Elder Scrolls!
I've been really interested in Arcwind Point lately-- do you have any videos that explore it? If not you should do an investigation and give us some theories! Thanks for all you do.
Excellent Video! I have an idea of how all these mysteries answer each other in this video:
It seems like the implication of all this information seems to point to the idea that goblins and orc-kin in general are all a form of degenerated elf. Additionally, it seems only some 'orcs' originally bore relation to Malacath and there are some which were separate and leftover from prior to the shattering of Old Aldmeris and were still living on would-be Tamriel prior to being encountered by Topal the Pilot. The idea of what an orc even is by its very nature could have not just been blurry in terms of orc being a slur but that these were indeed in some way still elves that had degenerated into unrecognizable beasts over the untold eons between the shattering of Aldmeris (the pointed ears betraying their elven origin) and the arrival of Topal the Pilot.
The point of this is that would explain how the iron orcs could have an orcish/goblinoid origin that was wholly separate from Trinimac's group that were indeed always there, and these non orichalcum wearing iron orcs were the result of that pre-shattering "Cave dwelling, stone worshipping and bestial" population interbreeding with a group that did indeed have origin with Trinimacs group.
The process of elves degenerating into goblins is very much the same as to to what happened to the Falmer in terms of overall effect (going underground and being blinded, separating them from Auriel's light physically/spiritually weakening them) also raises some rather interesting questions into the term "dwarf-orc" and the origin of the uniquely lavender-skinned dwemer which also predate Topal's arrival.
It is also notable that Malacath also seems to make the difference in how these orcs resist the degeneration of physical strength over time that was seen in these other degenerate forms of elf; like goblins and Falmer. The machinations of infighting and focus on strength found within the code of malacath and the import of grievances in orcish afterlife and its role in the growth of generational strength all seem to feed into this idea that strength/power are perpetually waning for the orcs who while the most physically imposing of the races of Tamriel remain unable to find any long-term stability outside of their strongholds.
What an amazing video. You clearly put SO much time and effort into this. Thanks a lot for the great entertainment 😁