While on the surface the manga implies that your greatest desire is what fundamentally determines you, your weaknesses, and your purpose in life, I love how the Lion's curse shows that that is not the lesson here. What makes Laios such a good person, character, and ultimately a protagonist, king, and a brother, is that DESPITE his greatest desire he CHOSE Falin. He chose to believe in her sister, he chose her as the most important thing in his life. And him choosing his loved one and family over his most basic, animalistic desire showed how humans can overcome their nature to choose to be better people. His greatest desire never changed, but he valued Falin more than his desires. And that is such a beautiful exploration of human condition.
THIS oml. Laios is such a fantastic mc and such a sincerely good guy and it makes me a little sad seeing people misinterpreting him as a one-note character who only cares about monsters. As someone who would CHOSE monsters over his party, Falin, or even the world. It’s a little ironic how the Winged Lion essentially says the same thing about him when viewing his memories, and is shown to have misjudged him. Give Laios a little respect, y’all.
It only strikes me now that Kabru's chilling ability to have the perfect, most level and strategic reaction was probably because it was the only way elves would take him seriously...
Ok so Chillchuck-Marcille theory I have: when they swap races he sees her as a half foot and internally goes "oh-thats a child" bc he can now picture her age in terms of his own race. And being the dad he is, unofficially adopts her
With Kabru's adoptive mother there is a special case. She doesn't have the stuffed animals for Kabru, she has them for herself, apparently she collapses without them. She was left very mentally ill with the tragedy of losing an entire city and had to step away from duty because she was no longer mentally fit to work with the canaries. She probably felt like she killed an entire city of children...
Its also really intersting how the demon manipulated marcille by infantalizing her so she would be more dependent on him. The hood he put her in is usually only for elf children, and he brought back her dad pretty young when most of her memories of her dad were when he was old to bring her back to a younger time. He also took away her desire to maintain her hair which is important for magic use so she would have to be dependent on his power not her own.
We talk about racism in Dungeon Meshi and we don't talk about racism towards Marcille? Throughout the manga, people verbally punish her, for the cruelty of the elves and then for being a dark elf, both of whom are obviously bad people. She was trying to find a way to extend people's lives and even them out between different races, not just because of her fear of loneliness. Races with long lifespans discriminate against others, assuming they won't have the maturity to handle certain magics or even their territories... it's as bad as that last bit sounds. And to make matters worse, she is not even considered an elf by the elves, who also discriminate against her and in an even worse way. Her mere existence is seen as a crime to them, because her characteristics are an exaggerated version of those that make the elves feel they should be in charge of everything.
And this very much mirrors the experience of folks considered "mixed" by the real world: not white enough for white folks to consider you one of them (except when it's convenient for them, ofc), but also "too white" to be included with your black or brown demographic (except when it's convenient for the white folks, again ofc).
I really loved the half-elf reveal a lot. I noticed Marcille's ears are shorter and rounder than others elves (her mom and Senshi for example) but think nothing of it. Later when it's revealed it's like so obvious that it was a design choice and a trait since the other half-elf we meet also has round points in her ears. It gives you a look as how little other humans know about elves because they gatekeep everything. I also really liked that the story about how mana come to be in the world is told by an unreliable narrator, there's no way we can be certain the Lion was telling the truth about everything. Just like there are no trolls and no dark elves, because those are myths that were born from racists remarks (about tall-men and elves). I really really love how deep is the world building in Dungeon Meshi.
The fact that Marcille is a half-elf was actually teased in the nightmare chapter. however the full implication of being a half-elf was not revealed until Thistle fight.
One thing you missed was the biggest tragedy of the series, Marcille having her desire to maintain her hair being eaten by the Demon, you can tell that it was something that she was passionate about and now it is just gone.
I can’t wait to see the anime onlies reaction to that moment, there’s been a Reddit user cataloging all hairstyles in Season 1 (36 total!) and in the episode discussion threads, people were already sad when she cut her braid to make the familiars. They are NOT ready to learn that Marcille loses the desire to style her hair
47:47 actually, about that, the post-canon manga jokes about this. laios THOUGHT he’s going to have his friends be his advisors, literally had an expectations vs reality gag, but it turns out yaad hired a bunch of old white men from other countries to make up his parliament. however for whatever reason kabru managed to wiggle his way into being literally behind laios’s throne whispering him advice and such. marcille also gets appointed as magical advisor. you should check adventurer’s bible complete edition(released in february, not the old one) when it gets released in english!
Once of my favorite parts about Dungeon Meshi is how the world and its characters all feel incredibly real, which is something that really set it apart from a lot of other fantasy media for me. The way it tackles certain themes such as desires, life/death, racism, neurodivergent-coded struggles, etc feel pretty grounded and are really interesting to think about. I really love how Marcille being a half-elf is so integral to the plot, and how despite the way the elves always assume she must wish she were a full elf, she doesn't really ever have a crisis about the fact that she's mixed. Her struggles are related to a desire for equality and not wanting to be alone, but she's still very secure in her own identity, which I think is so cool. A lot of fantasy settings tackle the topic of racism via fantasy races, but I feel like there aren't a whole lot of storylines about mixed-race characters beyond just "Oh noooo I belong to two different worlds". (A little something that got me emotional was one of the extra mini comics, where Marcille finds a well-written depiction of a half-elf in one of the books she's reading, and how much it means to her to find a character whose struggles she can relate to). I also like how despite there being cultural differences between the races, they aren't all just personality monoliths. The orcs aren't inherently evil, Senshi is gentle and cares about the environment, _and_ geographic location is also taken into account in the depiction of the different cultures! In terms of its main theme of love, desire and eating... I'm definitely always gonna be a sucker for any piece of media that physically manifests love and desires through eating and food lol. But what I find really fascinating how Dungeon Meshi uses that theme but then takes it one step further with 'all living things need to eat, but what makes us human is how we can overcome those base desires for a greater purpose, and _that's_ what it really means to love' which I think is so wonderful. The way the different characters' love for their found family is so strong that even if friendship isn't their greatest desire (and the characters are allowed to have more selfish desires), they'll still put it all on the line for the sake of their friends?? Bro... 😭 I could go on and on about how it, and it's an interesting sort of spin on the 'power of friendship' trope that humanizes the characters (yet another reason why Laios is such a fascinating protagonist. I like that his greatest desire is actually hyperfixation-related rather than something totally selfless) (Also btw glad you mentioned the way Kabru's mom treats him! I haven't really seen anyone talk about that, but it's always really bugged me. It's clear she cares about him, but there's no respect at all for him as a tall-man or as an individual.)
Yessss thus!!! Marcille is secure in her identity and I love that! She just wants to be with her friends for as long as possible 😭 she doesn't even fear death she fears her friends leaving her in death 💔 ur comment *Chefs kiss*
You didn't exactly speak on this but mithrun's progression as a character is something that I really love in this series as well as his relationship with kabru. A lot of people, including myself see what happened to mithrun as a metaphor for sexual assault. And it makes sense too. a "demon" does the unthinkable to you and that unthinkable act snatches your desires from you, it maims you. Multiple times throughout the series mithrun speaks very negatively about himself and has beliefs about himself that are certainly similar to trauma experienced by a survivor. But at the end of the series, Kabru is so genuine and honest with him and gives mithrun the courage to choose to live and find happiness even though he had just lost what he thought was his entire purpose (getting revenge). Kabru and Mithrun hadn't even known each other for very long but you could tell they really developed a comraderie and a trust in one another. Seeing mithrun cry because suddenly, for the first time in a long time, he felt hopeful that he could heal from his pain and trauma and find a way to contiue on was such a powerful moment for me
Omg what a beautiful way of looking at his story. I was so happy when he find a way to keep on going in the end. I'm glad they didn't just push his character to the way side he got genuine closure 🙌🏾
i just wish he actually respected kabru. kabru cared about him a lot because kabru is a nice and kind person, but i dont think mithrun ever cared about him? he beat kabru up when he was going through a breakdown. he slapped and hit him several times. he never apologized for dehumanizing him and treating him like a tool. everyone keeps talking about mithrun mithrun mithrun, nobody but me seems to care about kabru and it sucks. no wonder ryoko kui never drew them interacting in the post-canon book
@@baaaastoos I honestly don't agree that he didn't care about or at least trust kabru in his own way. He respected kabru and his competence enough to follow and help Kabru back into the dungeon when the canaries were trying to get mithrun back out. And the fact that Kabru was able to give him hope and bring him out of his suicidal thoughts is also proof to me that mithrun respects and trusts what kabru has to say. I think it's a pretty surface level read to say mithrun and kabru don't share some level of comraderie and trust with one another
@@baaaastoos mithrun of the past wouldve treated kabru well and apologized, at least surface level. but current mithrun's whole thing is that he cared for nothing but revenge after becoming his dungeon lord exp, and while it sucks that kabru had to basically be a caretaker of a disabled person and be disrespected etc i think its reasonable for the character and circumstances at the time (how canaries are p much disrespectful to everyone but elves). the fact that it was kabru who helped him realize he can still go on would lead to more mutual respect after the ending i think. i hope
There's soo much to love about dungeon meshi but one thing i really come back to is how it's not just a food/cooking manga, it is ABOUT food, everything gets told through it. Senshi joins them because he wants to cook good food for them and they bound and grow closer over all the meals they share. Also his food trauma of course. Thistles family was arranged at the dinner table, until delgal was supposed to come back. When Laois talks about leaving Falin in his home town and feeling like he abandoned her, we see her eating alone specifically. Mithrun having a sort of survivor's guilt that manifests as seeing himself as leftovers. The villain to this world is a being of gluttony, an endless desire for food with an endless stomach. And Laois consumes his desire to best him! And then of course the series gets solved through eating Falin's dragon parts, where we also get to celebrate all the connections Laois has made over one giant banquet. Everything manages to come back to food and eating and thats so insane and fun to me
My favorite part is definitely Laios' monster transformation. I saw some people be surprised when it happened, but really, it's constantly hinted at and telegraphed. There's the dog barking scene and all the references to the chimera (like his journal and his dream). But he also regularly makes comments like how life would be "easy" if he could turn into a monster just by eating one, he's excited about the changeling mushrooms because he would "get to" be something other than a tall man, he tells the bicorn he's envious of it for being a quadrupedal monster, and those are just a few. Laios is basically, from chapter 1, looking directly at the camera and constantly saying "I don't want to be human; I want to be a monster", no joke, no exaggeration, and everyone just brushes it off.
Fionil is the other elf in the dungeon (she is also a half-elf), she showed up in the Basilisk chapter, you also find out through the Adventurer's Bible that she was originally a Canary spy (not by choice) and was sending them information about the dungeon. She then ghosted them when she met Doni cause she was so taken by his passion to be an adventurer that she decided to join him. also Ancient Magic is power, even though Dwarves have no magic affinity, they have channeled it through creating advanced tech which is why you also see them being the invading military forces more often than Elves though it seems they only invade places that have dungeons, so they have this tense alliance to keep that power in check from shorter lifespan races; Gnomes don't seem to have this sense of importance over the other races, since Tansu was trying to persuade the island lord to have one up over the Elves and to dismiss the possibility Dwarves create dungeons as nothing more than just rumors. Gnomes seem to be mediators more than anything.
Im glad you said laios defeated the demon intentionally. Lots of people think it was a happy accident, but there is a lot of evidence to show that he had a plan from before he made the deal.
he had multiple plans, even if only the final one actually worked. Though it also could be a happy accident that he decided that devouring desires was actually a pretty cool power for his Ultimate Monster to have (since he only found out what the Lion actually did/was shortly before that), as it would allow it to defeat otherwise invincible beings.
I love that despite Laios being so selfless and prone to self-sacrifice, his deepest desire wasn’t even about saving his sister. it’s another detail that humanizes him even more, and thats part of why I love this manga and the characters so much. they all feel so grounded despite the magical setting. Anyways I have nothing much to add to the discussion, loved your analysis and this in the top 5 best mangas of all time for me as well (and it’s not 5, 4, 3 or 2 btw). the world-building, the characters, the themes, the humor…just great stuff all around. there’s just so many twists and turns, and the way the plot just keeps unraveling and peeling back new layers until it crescendos at the end left me at the edge of my seat and feeling totally overwhelmed the entire time. Ryoko Kui is a master at her craft and Laios’ sort of coming-of-age storyline resonated so deeply with me and changed me as a person tbh. never would’ve thought that what seemed like a cute little gourmand manga would be so meaningful. but yeah, this is must read for like…literally everyone.
ancient magic (dark magic) accesses the infinity dimension and thus lets more demons into the world, that's why it's forbidden. It's forbidden for elves too. And they don't tell most people that because telling people 'oh yeah these demons can do anything and fulfill any wish' would be too much of a temptation. Some people would assume they could control the demon and go ahead with it despite the warnings. (*it's really all one demon but you get the idea. Gives it more access to the world and the people)
I absolutely love your enthusiasm and energy!! For my favorite parts-I was thrilled you brought up the Kabru and Laios chapter because that whole conversation makes me insane lmao. Whether it’s a platonic or romantic interpretation, their dynamic is endlessly fascinating to me, and that moment of accidental honest vulnerability put so much of Kabru’s complicated goals and conflicts into perspective in such a fun way. Aside from that, the Dungeon Rabbits chapter has a special place in my heart as simultaneously one of the funniest and most heartbreaking parts of the story. The morbidly ridiculous rabbit necromancy straight into Marcille’s devastation at seeing her future “surrounded by corpses” laid out before her so brutally, guiding her even deeper into the demon’s manipulation…..WAUUUGGHHHH IT’S SO GOOD
SPOILER!! Laios Greatest desire. in post cannon, it’s been revealed that his greatest desire was to be EATEN by a monster. Which is no longer possible since all monster in existence had become scared of him.
About Kabru and his Mom she basically treats him as a pet coddling him and dressing him up. Also one of my favorite extras is where he’s going to show of a sweet from his home town as in his actual hometown that was destroyed but she basically guilt trips him to show off an elven sweet instead it’s such a interesting look into the loss of a childs home culture in cross cultural adoption
Yeah & also in the adventure's Bible there's a section where the canaries are mocking Otta because she dates young half foot women & basically calling her a p*do (especially cuz they usually break up before the half foot turns 30). Otta then points out that half foots in general age a lot faster than everyone (especially elves), so they take advantage of life/experience more in the shorter time they have (ex. Chilchuck had kids & a wife by the time he was 13 & is turning 29 that year, the changeling bit showing that he's basically middle aged). Then tells Kabru that she at least sees "short lived races" as people instead of pets, implying that most elves basically treat everyone who lives less than a century as either children, pets, or even animals of burden at worse. Kabru's mom adopting SEVERAL children from short lived races almost feels more like, a foster home for pets than for sentient children. Kabru doesn't ever even mention having "siblings" when growing up with Misiril, like the whole estate is supposed to have kids running around & never mentions anyone besides Rin (who DIDN'T get to live w/ Kabru since the estate was TOO FULL of kids 😭)
Yeah I think if there was another side story we can see more of the development of their relationship espically now that kabru is a full adult and post dungeon plot
Hey I know you left this comments months ago but just wanted to discuss your thoughts of Misiril (Kabrus Elf’s mom), I didn’t get the “pet” viewpoint from her, she reminded me of a helicopter parent, who would never truly see her child as another but that, a child. Both due to the fact that she will live decades after her children but also just the society she was raised in (elven society) pushes that viewpoint of short-lived races. I think it’s supported by the fact that at the end of the day Kabru is allowed to leave the West. Also when in an extra she goes to visit him but she doesn’t ask and when he is upset she responds with “it must be puberty”. Kabru says that ended long ago, I think because Milsiril’s an elf she has trouble viewing her 20 adult tall man children as adults. Anyway just my ramblings lol ignore if you want :D
Glad that you stuck with the story and read the whole thing. It’s really delicious. For me, I really like how honest and considerate the exploration of autism that Laios was. It meant a lot to me that Laios was allowed to be angry and frustrated with the world and for that to be treated fairly.
My interpretation of Kabrus mom was that elves, even when they’re trying to be polite, find it hard to over look the age difference. Like it’s hard for her to fully understand that he’s a grown ass man because in comparison an elf the same age would still be a kid
Dark magic was like straight up illegal I thought? Like a major point of friction was that Marcille used Dark Magic and as soon as she left the dungeon she'd be arrested for it. Chilchuck also implies that HalfFoots aren't allowed to perform magic at all saying something along the lines of "well excuse me for being unsure of magic when every half foot who practices major suddenly goes missing for unexplained reasons." Implying a straight of elven conspiracy regarding half foots and magic use. However, during the changling arc we do see that Marcille as a half foot immediately gets hit was really bad magic sickness whenever she used a spell so half foots could be unable to handle magic and that's why they often go missing or turn up dead when practicing it.
Yeah dark magic is illegal! I think I meant to say that marcille doesn't think it's bad but that it lacks knowledge from most people even elves. And I totally missed the chilchuck thing but from what you're saying it sounds like it's not illegal for them to do magic just heavily discouraged lol
Not exactly, the elves disappeared some halflings who had found objects of ancient magic. The prohibition of ancient magic has 2 aspects. 1- There is ancient magic that was used to summon demons. 2- There is ancient magic that would balance power for the "new races" The magic that Marcille studied predated even demons, which is why it is slower. The magic common throughout the series is actually a way to talk to the demon, to make it do what you want. Marcille's magic is like programming, she creates a magic circuit with precise instructions to reach a result, instead of just praying and letting the magic see what to do.
Elves have a habit of going at their own pace, so if a half foot finds some magic contraband and gets held for questioning, the elf might keep them in confinement for TWENTY YEARS because thats not a long time for an elf, but its half a LIFETIME for a halffoot. Its why halffoots have superstitions about elves spiriting half foots away.
@@ricardom3114 I think it also a reference to lord of the rings, you know the story of a hobbit/half-foot that finds a powerful ring and after is taken to the West by elves? Exactly what happened to both Bilbo and Frodo? I mean it's also an important worldbuilding detail on how things operate in this world, but also a fun easter egg
Fionil is also a half-elf in the dungeon. She was sent by the elves to investigate the island but she fell in love with the tall-man Doni and defected. Which is why she's hiding from the canaries when they are around. Fionil and Doni are the two people who were attacked by the basilisk in like chapter 2.
My favorite part is when Laios becomes a monster and everyone can tell it’s him with barely any explanation because he’s having such a good time. The manga is so well written but the resolution with needing to eat the rest of the dragon freaked me out a lot. Also, I hate the canaries so much. They just kept sealing people in rooms where they’d die and acting confused about why Kabru doesn’t want everyone to die
Not even all elves know about the nature of ancient magic and the demon- it is classified knowledge for only the Canaries (or the Dungeon Investigation Unit, as they are officially called). It is shown that dwarven and gnomish elites also know about the demon to some extent (gnomes have a lifespan in between dwarves and elves, I believe). The elf age of maturity is 80 years old! This means that Marcille is still a minor in elf society, and Kabru would be 4 by the elf standard when he left Milsiril. Milsiril clearly has some major trauma from the dungeons herself- she's said to be a complete shut-in and has extensive scarring from her service in the Canaries/DIU. (To balance out this Milsiril defense, she knew the nature of the dungeon the whole time- she could have just told him about the demon instead of having him get tangled up in the dungeon!)
If I remember correctly, the Ancient Magic being gatekept was to put down the shorter-lived races more than anything because Elves BECAUSE see them as irresponsible children, and they don't want to clean up their "mess" or allow them to find immortality to become "equals".
AHHH dungeon meshi video!!!! :DD honestly reading it changed my relationship to food so much- seeing the way the dishes expressed the characters and their journey and the mood, making food together and eating together as an act of love, the respect for the creatures that made their survival possible, it was all so touching and made me think about my own life and approach. i think my favorite moment in the manga is senshi eating the gryphon, but honestly so many parts stick out to me, the characters interacting is just so joyful to see no matter what is going on.. i see so much of myself and my older brother in falin and laois so everything about them and their bond made me want to cry for a million years, too. dungeon meshi you will always be famous.
From my understanding the "dark arts" isn't a thing. Like dark arts are just any magical skill that the elf government doesn't like. It's not like a special type of magical but just a list of spells that are outlawed
Oh, this is gonna be a bit of a long one. Sorry bout this! Gnomes, Dwarves, and Elves are all long-lived races, while the Tall-men, Half-Foots, and Ogres are short-lived races, with Kobolds and Orcs being seen as sub-human/second class citizens. Orcs are in a worse position that Kobolds, as orcs are considered to be a "Kill on sight" group, treated about the same as monsters. Mana is a biological factor within the races, with Elves having more of it and other races having less. I think the order of Mana-quantity among the human races is like.. Elves > Gnomes > Tall-Men > Ogres > Half-foots > Dwarves. Dwarves actually have like... Lactose Intolerance, but for Magic. A short at the end of one of the manga has Senshi explain he gets an upset stomach/gassy if he eats something with too much Mana in it because the Dwarven Body doesn't process it well. The demon has modified it and made it more accessible to some and less than others, but the Demon isn't mana- the Demon is an entity from an Infinite Plane, or may be a fragment of that plane itself- so he is boundless energy, but he isn't Mana itself. Elves have their own magic system too, and Gnomes made the other magic system. Elven magic works off of very strict Commands given to the spirits, so it will produce the same result every time based on the caster's ability to instruct. The Gnomish magic system, like Falin uses, involves more "Asking nicely" and it has the potential to be insanely strong, but it is inconsistent. Enchanting is also treated like programming, as described with the shorts about the Golems. Dark magic is considered illegal even among the elves, and almost all of the Canaries are convicted of using it or being involved with it. The only thing the long lived races agree on is keeping the demon from escaping dungeons, which were made to contain the demon. And part of that is keeping people from knowing about the demon so it isn't sought out. The dungeons are a prison, and mana is condensed inside of them, but other forms of magic can work but not quite as well. At the time Kabru lived with his step-mother, when he was on the bed with all those dolls, he was around 7-10 years old and was still a child. He is 20 by the time we first meet him in the story. There is another Elven adventurer, and she is a spy for the Canaries- she's the one who was with the dude who almost got bodied by the Cockatrice. Technically the ending of the manga is "Everyone does a cannibalism to save Falin" LMAO Also fun lore fact brought up in the supplementary materials! Cannibalism used to be VERY NORMAL among Elves, but now it is frowned upon and not practiced in most areas. Some rural Elven tribes do however still engage in cannibalism.
I love how everyone's greatest criticism was that Laios of all people seemed to show a lack of urgency in getting to Falin, masquarading it as caution, all the while having the time of his life eating monsters floor after floor int he dungeon; only for the winged lion to call him out for it at the very end with his curse. Turns out critics were right all along, saving Falin may have been the priority in his mind, but not in his heart.
Fun fact: there is one other elf in the dungeon, but you only learn about her from the extra material. That duo the party saves from basilisk is a tall-man and an elf. If i remember correctly, she was sent ahead of the canaries to check things out and ended up defecting. When the canaries show up in the dungeon you can see her trying to hide under her hood, and the knowledge adds extra weight to her choice to speak up for Laios later on. She would have been risking a lot if they had recognized her.
A neat observation in the manga is that technology is locked to medieval era due to the long-lived races putting a ban on technological advancement and research. Normally fantasy settings ignore the fact that there’s little advancement done over thousands of years. This series just has it be a regulatory ban.
I think that dark arts were illegal for anyone - it was just that it wasn't as big a deal to Elves because a 200 year prison sentence is hefty but not the end of the world... I don't think we ever get a clear idea of how criminals of other races were treated (because we don't know anyone else who tried), so its possible the sentence is shorter for other races, and they were just not permitted to leave the Elf homeland and teach dark arts to anyone else. A little unclear on that front.
the intro 💀💀💀 i know theres a reason most videos about DM has been about up until where the anime's season 1 ends, but its so good to have one that encompasses the entire story (the iceberg analogy is so accurate for this story). this is the type of dungeon meshi video i have dreamed of and it was so fun to watch!! your commentary was so funny and i really resonated w your analysis (especially because the 2nd half of the manga was,,,a Lot to take in so going over it in this format helped gather all the pieces in my head) have you read/looked at the extras? theres sooo much extra info via bonus content in artbooks etc that Kui has made for this world and these characters it honestly wows me, especially how some of the smaller side characters can be expanded upon so much with just a few extras (one of my fav examples of this is a bonus comic about Benichidori and her 'routine' that gives so much insight about her character with just a little comic)
this channel is a breath of fresh air on this kind of content, personable, reasonable critical analysis of a story, really great stuff, while not being detached or just recapping like many other creators. i wish there were more channel like yours, well i guess ill go into the backlog of videos.
🥺🥺🥺 wahhh thank you so much that means a lot! I tried the whole recapping analysis thing and it came out so stiff so I tried for a more yapping kind of approach where I do analysis but in a more yaptastic type of way lmaooo
37:22 "Yall remember Falin" Atleast they still trying to solve that Unlike the prophecy that everyone literally ignored the very moment they left the golden castle, until Yaad finally reminded that at the end, and Laois be like "Oh yeah the prophecy..."
The prophecy was definitely just a thing the demon made up as a manipulation tactic to take down Thistle. This is especially evident when kensuke who was originally just had a square decoration at the handle, got transformed into a lion head by the dungeon cleaners (who are part of the demon) to make it so laios fits the prophecy's description.
What I meant is that nobody cared about the prophecy, the whole Laois became a king wouldn't happen if Yaado didn't remind them about the prophecy that Laois didn't remember and didn't care
@@njcheddar Speaking about made up prophecy Do you think that dungeon cleaner "fix" the sword was also made up by the demon? The logic of the 6th floor is that it is a cold level means slowed down the cleaner process But the sword isn't fixed at the 3rd floor which is warm?
So im still at the start of the video but something i want to clarify about the race dinamics in the manga, form what i understand ability to use magic is partly innate and determined by yhe mana reserves you have, elves have the biggest and thats why their magic system isn't used hy other races, gnomes have the second largest reserve and their magic is based on a collaboration with the spirits (asking nicely instead of commanding them) and that's why their system is used by tall men and others races has it's less mana intensive (Falin and Rin both use the gnome magic), darwes can't use magic at all and are actually resistant to magic (and consuming mana makes them go gassy, which is really funny), and half-foots have the smalles reserves, thats why has a half-foot Marcille was immediately hit with mana sickness. A lot of this is explored in the monster extras and in the adventure guide, so idk if you have read that already. Now back to the video!
And a clarification for why the elves gatekeep the dark magic from the other races, yes it's very much a patronising thing, they don't consider the other races to be mature enough to handle it, remember that dark magic is essentially dealing with the demon directly, the problem with what Marcille does with falin is that she used the magic of the dungeon directly aka giving the demon a way to interact with the world more. It's not the necromancy an issue, is that it feeds the demon ability to potentially escape the dungeon and fucks with the world (which is you know what happens). I'm not saying they are right in the way they gatekeep the information, it's also very much a power play to keep all the info to themselves to keep their political and military position strong internationally.
Plus about the infantilization, a thing you have to remember about Kabru mom Mistril (idk if I spell that right) that's shown more in the extras is that she has a lot of issues herself and yes she absolutely isn't the best mom, but she tries. Like the thing with the dolls is that it's something *she* takes comfort in, and she pushes it on Kabru in a misguided attempt to help, and while she is very smothering she does train Kabru after he insists Her problem is that she is clearly a very traumatised person from her time in the Canaries and seems to have had depression from even before that, so that combined with the elf cultural tendency to infantilize other races created a pretty bad combination. Sorry for my rant, I just think she is an interesting character and I see her to often be demonized
For the resurrection thing: the point is that since your soul can't leave your body the only thing you need to do to bring someone to life is to fix the body, so heal the wound, replenish the blood lost, rebuild anything that's missing etc, that's why it cost calories, you are pretty much speeding up healing. So once that's done you are has healthy has ever and you don't need the dungeon magic to sustain you.
Last thing, Laois becomes king of the land that was once the golden kingdom that rises from the ocean, but it does impact other countries around the world. But yeah amazing video!
Ty ty and thanks for the clarification! As for kabru's mom I don't think she's beyond retribution and I do think if there was ever a side story about those two she would definitely go through that growth. I don't think she's evil or anything and she does genuinely care for kabru. She just a lot of inner healing she has to do lmaooo
i’ve posted this as a reply to someone else but i cannot stress this enough lol. i wish people would stop bringing up mithrun (and laios!) when kabru is being talked about. kabru is my favorite character so it really makes me mad that he gets reduced to “guy who gets shipped with mithrun or laios” when he is such an interesting character separate from those two white men.
well in the story he is juxtaposed with laios as his "dark mirror"(idk how else to say it, there is a term), and while he stands on his own as a character, this story IS about relationships, so excluding the shipping fabdom things, his whole arc is very tied to other characters, but in the same way the main characters are tied to each other in the story. i also like that he doesnt just exist as a counterpoint to laios whole thing but also gets an arc where we explore him thru his interactions with mithrun, kabru is really interesting bc he doesnt change a lot, just like laios, senshi, chilchuck etc., but we get a deeper understanding of him as a person. i like that while he is presented as a shady guy it isnt about changing that part of him, its about connecting on a deeper level than analytic with other people and understanding each other, without really habing to change who you are, but how you understand each other(its very relatable to me too, its a really cool b plot that could have been its own story).
I think the reason Dark Magic was so heavily restricted was specifically because of the Lion, ie the demon linking the dungeons together. It's a wish granter, and using dark magic is rooted in drawing upon energy from the same dimension the demon hails from, inevitabely drawing the caster to the demon. The longer lived races are aware of this being, and know that letting it be known that such a being exists in the dungeons would be incredibly dangerous, which is why they cover it and dark magic up.
i worship the ground ryoko kui walks upon and pity her neck for holding up the biggest wrinkliest heaviest worldbuilding brain out there currently. along with her also goated plot writing brain gnomes are elves' rival when it comes to magic studies and research btw! they have different approaches, and have went to war using it. both are long lived races who def benefit from that.
I haven't even watched the video and I can sense the absolute banger this will be. Also finished the Dungeon Meshi manga last night, this video is the treat for completing it.❤
I loved Thissle being gassiest as s-word to Marcille but only if you pear it with a side story involving Marcille her Mom and Laios that hints that Thissle was not as knowledgeable about half-elves as he thought if not all the winged lion scenes and it's 3 Marcille Thissle and episode 2 girl
Short live races tend to idolized/demonized (there the two sides of the same depersonalizing coin) the long race there must likely to know depend on there region. So human tend to live around elf so they idolized/demonize them. "Dark Elf" being just elves that use forbidden magic but to human are seen an entire sub-species of evil Elf. They also tend to see them as peek standard of beuty. Half-foot are more likely to live around dwarves so they tend to idolized them. See them as peek masculine virtue/ strenght/ beauty. So there avertion to magic is partial cultural as there idolized race (dwarves) don't use magic and likely associated with elf in deragatory way. There is the lifespan of 60 years. Making study of magic more difficult. So mixed with elf and gnome being intolerant of acomadating differences. Gnome because there magic is tied to there religion and Elf because there just very racist. So short of elve that leave the elven land to rought it with halfling and ignore everything they know to better adapt magic to half-foot more limited mana pool as is own more specialized less flashy mana efficient spell that are tailor for and by half-foot to circunvent there limited mana pool. Half-foot be more about prestidigitation. Than flashy elf spell or healing spell like gnome magic. Good luck geting said sainty elven to dedicated there long live on "party trick" magic to the shortest live species. So conspiracy or not half -foot would have to invent there own class of magic as elven magic simple does not acomadate spell for smaller mana pool. Which explain why elf infantilized human than half-foot. They are more exposed to Tall-man than half foot. Tall man are more numerous than Elf and dwarves but Elfs and dwarve own most of the land. Which is why they are the one fighting over it. Gnome we know the least but seem to live in small devout enclaves all over with lil contact with other races. No reason is given but if anything like real life this may not be wholly there choice and more adaptation to past lost of land. Creating a more devout insular close community vertion of past gnome society. After lost land to either or both longer races. Making them deeply insecure to lose there culture and way of life and there essential non status as long life race despite technically being one. Not help there magic is more instictual as shown by Fallin attempt to teach Laois magic. Which would make it much more difficult as require one have an affinity with spirit unlike elf magic. That is more taught. Human being more numerous probably why elf are more likely to baby them. Since even if they don't live as long. They can use magic well plus elves less populous mean even low mortality rate be devastating. The canary being a great example going from honorable high steem knight of the queen to protect the short live from there folly in the dungeon to suicide squad after the last dungeon kill many canary. Making noble less likely to send there first born. So noble treat more like a Queen aproved death sentence. Which is why we get the disposable goofball (captain non withstanding as he pre date there fall of grace in elven nobility) There also the more obscure issue with using magic user. They tend to be addict. Alcoholism being the socially accepted addiction to elves. Hallucigen and harder drug in general being the non socialy accepted addiction. This steem that moderate use of said addictive substance can enhance some spell or recover mana. But high preasure in elven society put on magic user mean most elf magic user become functioning addicts at best and absolute short live wreck at worse. All of which help explain why the elf keep tab on magic use in general. Not just a mean of control but to save face there both not as in control and to save face that glorified functioning addict are tje foundamental part of there society.
Elf don't so much infantilized short live as more treat them as animal. Which is why an Elf call on Labru adopted mom on for lack of better word "reverse" racism. Which is worse than the general racism dish out to short live species. A perfect example is when the Canary that were in the village "take a human girl as evidence". There behaviour is akin to finding a wild baby bird that can't yet fly. Offering food try to getting it to sing (The tall-men racial trait is that they are very good at singing) they all look at like folk at the zoo. Than quickly lose interest. So not defending Labru adopted mom but more given the nuance that while her action are still bad. She comes from a more racist culture that see short live races as entertaining talking/singing animal at best and annoying pest that keep encroaching on there land/stuff/magic. Which in part explain Labru complicated relationship with her mother. He know how he treated was wrong but she was doing best in deeply radiactive culture. That likely without her intervention. He still be in "live" evidence room and die off old age. Because the elf apply there rule equally to everyone. Ignoring the huge leap in there lifespan. So questioning (kipnapping) can take years without warning. Even small sentences is around 20-50 years. A death sentence to many short live races. Which of course to an elf is not that long. Any attempt to adjust the rule to short live races smaller lifespan. Is again for lack of better word seeing as "reverse racism" as your not treating them as an equal elf but instead "infantalizing" them. Which should help explain why Labru mom don't care for elf society or said accusation. So elf are deeply racist and classist. Which you can see when Labru convince her mom to go to one of the many boring family meeting as she says. He is infantalized but he is a child so is more understandable. The elder take him the fastest as he show interest on the family and taking there cake. (The cake is closer to fruitcake but remove the fruit with seeds. So more uneatable) Which everyone happy to unload on him. (My head canon is they have warehouse fill with the stuff. Considering is hospitality gift. Essentially trying every day to find someone that actualy enjoy it so they can get rid there lifetime supply of the cakes they gain over there long life. I imagine it has absurd shell life. Some of it is likely century old. Adding to is infamous unedible brick status) So because of her Mom status they accept her exentric behaviour of taking short live races kids as there own children. Since the elders embrace him the rest of family had to . Which add to the very selective way they treat short live races. Which is why Labrus has very complicated relationship with elves/canary/her mother. He being very extroverted in very extroverted elf culture. Where gossip run like water. He act as sponge unlike her very introveted mother that hate how busybody her family/culture is in general. Took everything in and his fascinstion with people/his new extended family. Made him an easy favorite among the elders. As they love to reminisce the past very old gossip about the family and bloodline. Which he took in stride at very young age. So while I also strugle to call it love. I do think both his mom and her elf family try to give it to him in society that is not build to give any for any non elf. (Consider elves deeply held stereotype of half elves. I am sure many elf in that society deny that love deppending on action or low status birth.) Tldr: Elf suck even more that you think.
7:10 someone else has probably already commented this but the reason why elves gatekept all information about ancient magic away from the other races was because it was all related to demons/how dungeons worked. for example when marcille uses ancient magic to resurrect falin she explains that she was using a type of magic that takes energy from an infinite dimension, aka where the demons come from.
I liked watching your journey through this series. You mentioned in your earlier Dungeon Meshi video that you prefer sci-fi over fantasy - have you tried out Dorohedoro? Technically it looks like dystopian science fiction but it actually qualifies as fantasy because it involves magic and sorcerors. I'm just suggesting it since it has similarities with Dungeon Meshi - Found family groups that bond over food, written by a woman, characters with a wide variety of body types, leisurely world building at the start but sets up a complex lore so that when the plot hits, it hits like a truck, etc. Also, heavy gore warning.
5:47 Dungeon Meshi has a adventures guide that has extra tidbits about the world and your somewhat correct about them having more time, but it's also how magic is done. Gnome magic is used by asking spirits to preform a task for them, making it random but also making it more powerful in some cases. Elf magic works by forcing the spirit to do a command, making it so the spells are more accurate, but also meaning the power is based on the individual making it so even if ten elves study the same thing for equal amount of time, how good they are with the spell will not be equal. At least that's how I read it lol, also a fun fact: half-foots are named after humans, cause elves thought they short humans, so they were just considered short humans and not they're own race until later.
Dungeon Messi is something of a fixation of mine. And I really really really want to read it whole. In fact, it is the first ever manga I’m buying and reading. But I’m buying and reading it in Portuguese, my native language. And we only have it up to volume 6 at the moment. So I’ll be diligently waiting for each and every new volume to come put for me to spend 8$ (it’s kind of expensive in my country, specially to manga) on each volume.
Just binged the first season of the anime and then finished the manga in another day. FUCKING LOVED THIS SERIES. And I neeeeeeded this video to have someone to gush about this story, so thanks ❤ Also, my favorite part of the story is the characterization of the demon, and how fucking humanizing the author made an infinite cosmic being to be. How it grew, how it learned, how it lacked a sense of morality and allowed for all wishes (including why each race had their own characteristics and the destruction of the world), how it manipulated every person that it came across in the most effective way possible to get what it wanted (those tasty morsels of desire), and how that would be his own undoing at the hands of greedy, gluttonous, best boy Laios (but also the way they fought each other was peak thematic storytelling). Also also, the curse to Laios and that he allowed Falin’s souls to return instead of being extra cruel at the end of the two climaxes was a very nice touch. Also also also, casually eating Marcille’s desire to do her hair when she transferred lordship of the dungeon. THIS STORY WAS PEAK.
To me one of the biggest points that hits home the idea of "you are part of rhe ecosystem bc you eat within the ecosystem," is that this is the fundamental concept that Laios grasps in order to defeat the demon. It eats within the world, so it is part of the world. Like with humans not being part of the dungeon until they go into it, etc. The demon didn't ever realize that it had become part of the ecosystem of the world. So it couldn't even perceive the threat of Laios as a monster, despite the fact that the demon's magic was what transformed him. Anyone who thinks it was a happy accident that Laios monster defeated the demon is ignoring how the entire story is teaching you this lesson over and over again, and how the story shows over and over again how Laios thinks when it comes to monsters. Or boiled down even more specifically, how he triumphs in the showdown with Thistle. He uses the inclination of a monster to his advantage. But yeah, it's just really good how the story goes cosmic in scale, but still manages to iterate the same core point: ecologically or socially, you cannot be separate from the systems that you participate in.
when i read dungeon meshi i knew a lot of people shipped laios and kabru and so i was really surprised when i didn't get it and thought kabru and mithrun and their relationship was more interesting. i particularly love the scene at the end when kabru helps mithrun get up and keep living
the laios and kabru ship came more from their post-canon ending, when kabru works as laios’s advisor and promises to stay by his side. thats why most of the fanart is laios wearing king clothes and kabru wearing a tunic. mithrun and kabru never talk to each other after the story ends, not even in kui’s modern AU comics.
honestly i wish people would stop bringing up mithrun (and laios!) when kabru is being talked about. kabru is my favorite character so it really makes me mad that he gets reduced to “guy who gets shipped with mithrun or laios” when he is such an interesting character separate from those two white men.
I think all the races (tall men, half foots, elves, dwarves, gnomes, orcs) are considered human in this setting, and their terms are specifically racial?
Orcs aren't. Tall Men, Dwarves, Half-Foots, Elves, Gnomes, and Ogres. rather races that aren't considered human but aren't considered monsters are the Demi-Humans. Orcs, Kobolds, Natural Beast-folk etc. (they ended up classifying them based on their number of bones. All "Human" races have the same number of bones (Ogre's horns are growths from their skull and not true horns so they don't count them as separate bones, though they were originally considered Demi-humans before the number of bones was agreed upon as the main classifier), Demi-humans have a few extra bones but are still considered sapient/sentient enough to not simply be classified as a monster.
Tbf to thistle, one of his reasonings for thinking Marcille wanted to be a full elf was because of a half-elf’s irregular lifespan, so… 1/5 guesses right🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
There is one other elf in the dungeon! That elven mage we see in the beginning whose companion got hit by the basilisk! Her name is Fionil and she's half-tallman like Marcille (peep the rounded elf ears!) :]
You're wrong about there not being other elves in the dungeon. Literally, the first two people they meet are a "tall man" and an elf team. Also, Marcille is only a half elf. She's half "tall man". Also, Liaos tricked the demon by telling him to turn into a monster that can also consume desires. So Liaos then ate the demon's desire to consume. That's how he won.
i dont know if this is a connection you've made yet, but you should rewatch the second anime opening with the whole 'demons greatest desire plan' in mind :)
So I just finished season one the other night and I wanna ask , do they end up being able to save Falin? Or is she stuck being a bloodthirsty monster forever?
Wait, is Marcel a "Modern Bulma?" A woman in a "boy's anime" with, wants and desires and an attitude that complains. Bulma was always a personal favorite. A regular human that "moves the plot". Constantly changing fashions and can hold her own ground. Sure Bulma isn't a "perfect role model" but that's part of her charm.
@@AlleyDreamer I remember something else about Bulma that makes for an interesting comparison! I stopped watching Dragonball Super, but one of the Gods or higher beings found out that Bulma created a Time Machine. "Gently" scolded her about it. Apparently time travel is supposed to be forbidden? Funny I can memorize "Dragonball Z" and remember 70% of "Dragonball" but my memory is fuzzy on "Super". Kinda reminds me of Marcel and all of her "rule breaking" in magic in general.
During marcille's nightmare it's implied her mother told her she would outlive a lot of people in her life at her father's funeral so we got a quick hint to her being a half elf
While on the surface the manga implies that your greatest desire is what fundamentally determines you, your weaknesses, and your purpose in life, I love how the Lion's curse shows that that is not the lesson here. What makes Laios such a good person, character, and ultimately a protagonist, king, and a brother, is that DESPITE his greatest desire he CHOSE Falin. He chose to believe in her sister, he chose her as the most important thing in his life. And him choosing his loved one and family over his most basic, animalistic desire showed how humans can overcome their nature to choose to be better people. His greatest desire never changed, but he valued Falin more than his desires. And that is such a beautiful exploration of human condition.
This 🥺🥺🥺🥺 his love for his fam, falin and his whole crew ❤️
He gave up his true greatest passion in life because he knew what was more important. What a 🐐. All hail the Devourer of Evil.
THIS oml. Laios is such a fantastic mc and such a sincerely good guy and it makes me a little sad seeing people misinterpreting him as a one-note character who only cares about monsters. As someone who would CHOSE monsters over his party, Falin, or even the world. It’s a little ironic how the Winged Lion essentially says the same thing about him when viewing his memories, and is shown to have misjudged him. Give Laios a little respect, y’all.
It only strikes me now that Kabru's chilling ability to have the perfect, most level and strategic reaction was probably because it was the only way elves would take him seriously...
I can relate- using this exact strategy in a neglectful household
Ok so Chillchuck-Marcille theory I have: when they swap races he sees her as a half foot and internally goes "oh-thats a child" bc he can now picture her age in terms of his own race. And being the dad he is, unofficially adopts her
YESSS AHHH SO CUTE
With Kabru's adoptive mother there is a special case.
She doesn't have the stuffed animals for Kabru, she has them for herself, apparently she collapses without them.
She was left very mentally ill with the tragedy of losing an entire city and had to step away from duty because she was no longer mentally fit to work with the canaries.
She probably felt like she killed an entire city of children...
Ooo interesting
Its also really intersting how the demon manipulated marcille by infantalizing her so she would be more dependent on him. The hood he put her in is usually only for elf children, and he brought back her dad pretty young when most of her memories of her dad were when he was old to bring her back to a younger time. He also took away her desire to maintain her hair which is important for magic use so she would have to be dependent on his power not her own.
Omg that last part 👀👀👀
Dungeon Devil hates girlbosses😔luckily Laios ate him to save feminism.
We talk about racism in Dungeon Meshi and we don't talk about racism towards Marcille?
Throughout the manga, people verbally punish her, for the cruelty of the elves and then for being a dark elf, both of whom are obviously bad people.
She was trying to find a way to extend people's lives and even them out between different races, not just because of her fear of loneliness.
Races with long lifespans discriminate against others, assuming they won't have the maturity to handle certain magics or even their territories... it's as bad as that last bit sounds.
And to make matters worse, she is not even considered an elf by the elves, who also discriminate against her and in an even worse way.
Her mere existence is seen as a crime to them, because her characteristics are an exaggerated version of those that make the elves feel they should be in charge of everything.
THIS!!!! I did not go hard enough on the elves as they treat marcille cuz it's real bad. My poor girl just wants her fam to be with her 😭
And this very much mirrors the experience of folks considered "mixed" by the real world: not white enough for white folks to consider you one of them (except when it's convenient for them, ofc), but also "too white" to be included with your black or brown demographic (except when it's convenient for the white folks, again ofc).
I really loved the half-elf reveal a lot. I noticed Marcille's ears are shorter and rounder than others elves (her mom and Senshi for example) but think nothing of it. Later when it's revealed it's like so obvious that it was a design choice and a trait since the other half-elf we meet also has round points in her ears. It gives you a look as how little other humans know about elves because they gatekeep everything.
I also really liked that the story about how mana come to be in the world is told by an unreliable narrator, there's no way we can be certain the Lion was telling the truth about everything. Just like there are no trolls and no dark elves, because those are myths that were born from racists remarks (about tall-men and elves).
I really really love how deep is the world building in Dungeon Meshi.
Yeah i didn't even notice until someone pointed it out!
The fact that Marcille is a half-elf was actually teased in the nightmare chapter. however the full implication of being a half-elf was not revealed until Thistle fight.
One thing you missed was the biggest tragedy of the series, Marcille having her desire to maintain her hair being eaten by the Demon, you can tell that it was something that she was passionate about and now it is just gone.
But it's ok cuz now she has the best girl dad around, chilchuck to do it for her 🥺
@@AlleyDreamer not for long 🥲🥲
@@carpiim 😭😭😭 noooo
I can’t wait to see the anime onlies reaction to that moment, there’s been a Reddit user cataloging all hairstyles in Season 1 (36 total!) and in the episode discussion threads, people were already sad when she cut her braid to make the familiars. They are NOT ready to learn that Marcille loses the desire to style her hair
@@carpiimfoul comment 😭
47:47 actually, about that, the post-canon manga jokes about this. laios THOUGHT he’s going to have his friends be his advisors, literally had an expectations vs reality gag, but it turns out yaad hired a bunch of old white men from other countries to make up his parliament. however for whatever reason kabru managed to wiggle his way into being literally behind laios’s throne whispering him advice and such. marcille also gets appointed as magical advisor.
you should check adventurer’s bible complete edition(released in february, not the old one) when it gets released in english!
Damn lmaoo I need that adventures Bible
Once of my favorite parts about Dungeon Meshi is how the world and its characters all feel incredibly real, which is something that really set it apart from a lot of other fantasy media for me. The way it tackles certain themes such as desires, life/death, racism, neurodivergent-coded struggles, etc feel pretty grounded and are really interesting to think about.
I really love how Marcille being a half-elf is so integral to the plot, and how despite the way the elves always assume she must wish she were a full elf, she doesn't really ever have a crisis about the fact that she's mixed. Her struggles are related to a desire for equality and not wanting to be alone, but she's still very secure in her own identity, which I think is so cool. A lot of fantasy settings tackle the topic of racism via fantasy races, but I feel like there aren't a whole lot of storylines about mixed-race characters beyond just "Oh noooo I belong to two different worlds". (A little something that got me emotional was one of the extra mini comics, where Marcille finds a well-written depiction of a half-elf in one of the books she's reading, and how much it means to her to find a character whose struggles she can relate to).
I also like how despite there being cultural differences between the races, they aren't all just personality monoliths. The orcs aren't inherently evil, Senshi is gentle and cares about the environment, _and_ geographic location is also taken into account in the depiction of the different cultures!
In terms of its main theme of love, desire and eating... I'm definitely always gonna be a sucker for any piece of media that physically manifests love and desires through eating and food lol. But what I find really fascinating how Dungeon Meshi uses that theme but then takes it one step further with 'all living things need to eat, but what makes us human is how we can overcome those base desires for a greater purpose, and _that's_ what it really means to love' which I think is so wonderful. The way the different characters' love for their found family is so strong that even if friendship isn't their greatest desire (and the characters are allowed to have more selfish desires), they'll still put it all on the line for the sake of their friends?? Bro... 😭 I could go on and on about how it, and it's an interesting sort of spin on the 'power of friendship' trope that humanizes the characters (yet another reason why Laios is such a fascinating protagonist. I like that his greatest desire is actually hyperfixation-related rather than something totally selfless)
(Also btw glad you mentioned the way Kabru's mom treats him! I haven't really seen anyone talk about that, but it's always really bugged me. It's clear she cares about him, but there's no respect at all for him as a tall-man or as an individual.)
Yessss thus!!! Marcille is secure in her identity and I love that! She just wants to be with her friends for as long as possible 😭 she doesn't even fear death she fears her friends leaving her in death 💔 ur comment *Chefs kiss*
You didn't exactly speak on this but mithrun's progression as a character is something that I really love in this series as well as his relationship with kabru. A lot of people, including myself see what happened to mithrun as a metaphor for sexual assault. And it makes sense too. a "demon" does the unthinkable to you and that unthinkable act snatches your desires from you, it maims you. Multiple times throughout the series mithrun speaks very negatively about himself and has beliefs about himself that are certainly similar to trauma experienced by a survivor. But at the end of the series, Kabru is so genuine and honest with him and gives mithrun the courage to choose to live and find happiness even though he had just lost what he thought was his entire purpose (getting revenge). Kabru and Mithrun hadn't even known each other for very long but you could tell they really developed a comraderie and a trust in one another. Seeing mithrun cry because suddenly, for the first time in a long time, he felt hopeful that he could heal from his pain and trauma and find a way to contiue on was such a powerful moment for me
Omg what a beautiful way of looking at his story. I was so happy when he find a way to keep on going in the end. I'm glad they didn't just push his character to the way side he got genuine closure 🙌🏾
It's also interesting how they wrap Mithrun's sole desire left (drive for revenge) as actually him being suicidal
i just wish he actually respected kabru. kabru cared about him a lot because kabru is a nice and kind person, but i dont think mithrun ever cared about him? he beat kabru up when he was going through a breakdown. he slapped and hit him several times. he never apologized for dehumanizing him and treating him like a tool. everyone keeps talking about mithrun mithrun mithrun, nobody but me seems to care about kabru and it sucks. no wonder ryoko kui never drew them interacting in the post-canon book
@@baaaastoos I honestly don't agree that he didn't care about or at least trust kabru in his own way. He respected kabru and his competence enough to follow and help Kabru back into the dungeon when the canaries were trying to get mithrun back out. And the fact that Kabru was able to give him hope and bring him out of his suicidal thoughts is also proof to me that mithrun respects and trusts what kabru has to say. I think it's a pretty surface level read to say mithrun and kabru don't share some level of comraderie and trust with one another
@@baaaastoos mithrun of the past wouldve treated kabru well and apologized, at least surface level. but current mithrun's whole thing is that he cared for nothing but revenge after becoming his dungeon lord exp, and while it sucks that kabru had to basically be a caretaker of a disabled person and be disrespected etc i think its reasonable for the character and circumstances at the time (how canaries are p much disrespectful to everyone but elves). the fact that it was kabru who helped him realize he can still go on would lead to more mutual respect after the ending i think. i hope
There's soo much to love about dungeon meshi but one thing i really come back to is how it's not just a food/cooking manga, it is ABOUT food, everything gets told through it. Senshi joins them because he wants to cook good food for them and they bound and grow closer over all the meals they share. Also his food trauma of course. Thistles family was arranged at the dinner table, until delgal was supposed to come back. When Laois talks about leaving Falin in his home town and feeling like he abandoned her, we see her eating alone specifically. Mithrun having a sort of survivor's guilt that manifests as seeing himself as leftovers. The villain to this world is a being of gluttony, an endless desire for food with an endless stomach. And Laois consumes his desire to best him!
And then of course the series gets solved through eating Falin's dragon parts, where we also get to celebrate all the connections Laois has made over one giant banquet. Everything manages to come back to food and eating and thats so insane and fun to me
Laios and falin's relationship means so much to me 😭😭😭
My favorite part is definitely Laios' monster transformation. I saw some people be surprised when it happened, but really, it's constantly hinted at and telegraphed. There's the dog barking scene and all the references to the chimera (like his journal and his dream). But he also regularly makes comments like how life would be "easy" if he could turn into a monster just by eating one, he's excited about the changeling mushrooms because he would "get to" be something other than a tall man, he tells the bicorn he's envious of it for being a quadrupedal monster, and those are just a few. Laios is basically, from chapter 1, looking directly at the camera and constantly saying "I don't want to be human; I want to be a monster", no joke, no exaggeration, and everyone just brushes it off.
He really did want that dog in him 🙂↕️
Fionil is the other elf in the dungeon (she is also a half-elf), she showed up in the Basilisk chapter, you also find out through the Adventurer's Bible that she was originally a Canary spy (not by choice) and was sending them information about the dungeon. She then ghosted them when she met Doni cause she was so taken by his passion to be an adventurer that she decided to join him.
also Ancient Magic is power, even though Dwarves have no magic affinity, they have channeled it through creating advanced tech which is why you also see them being the invading military forces more often than Elves though it seems they only invade places that have dungeons, so they have this tense alliance to keep that power in check from shorter lifespan races; Gnomes don't seem to have this sense of importance over the other races, since Tansu was trying to persuade the island lord to have one up over the Elves and to dismiss the possibility Dwarves create dungeons as nothing more than just rumors. Gnomes seem to be mediators more than anything.
Omg I didn't know she was half elf ty! And I do wish we got more of the gnomes since they know so much I was so interested in that old man 😭
Im glad you said laios defeated the demon intentionally. Lots of people think it was a happy accident, but there is a lot of evidence to show that he had a plan from before he made the deal.
He's a smart boioi
he had multiple plans, even if only the final one actually worked. Though it also could be a happy accident that he decided that devouring desires was actually a pretty cool power for his Ultimate Monster to have (since he only found out what the Lion actually did/was shortly before that), as it would allow it to defeat otherwise invincible beings.
I love that despite Laios being so selfless and prone to self-sacrifice, his deepest desire wasn’t even about saving his sister. it’s another detail that humanizes him even more, and thats part of why I love this manga and the characters so much. they all feel so grounded despite the magical setting.
Anyways I have nothing much to add to the discussion, loved your analysis and this in the top 5 best mangas of all time for me as well (and it’s not 5, 4, 3 or 2 btw). the world-building, the characters, the themes, the humor…just great stuff all around. there’s just so many twists and turns, and the way the plot just keeps unraveling and peeling back new layers until it crescendos at the end left me at the edge of my seat and feeling totally overwhelmed the entire time. Ryoko Kui is a master at her craft and Laios’ sort of coming-of-age storyline resonated so deeply with me and changed me as a person tbh. never would’ve thought that what seemed like a cute little gourmand manga would be so meaningful. but yeah, this is must read for like…literally everyone.
Yes! Give characters flaws! Make them human!!!
ancient magic (dark magic) accesses the infinity dimension and thus lets more demons into the world, that's why it's forbidden. It's forbidden for elves too.
And they don't tell most people that because telling people 'oh yeah these demons can do anything and fulfill any wish' would be too much of a temptation. Some people would assume they could control the demon and go ahead with it despite the warnings.
(*it's really all one demon but you get the idea. Gives it more access to the world and the people)
I absolutely love your enthusiasm and energy!!
For my favorite parts-I was thrilled you brought up the Kabru and Laios chapter because that whole conversation makes me insane lmao. Whether it’s a platonic or romantic interpretation, their dynamic is endlessly fascinating to me, and that moment of accidental honest vulnerability put so much of Kabru’s complicated goals and conflicts into perspective in such a fun way.
Aside from that, the Dungeon Rabbits chapter has a special place in my heart as simultaneously one of the funniest and most heartbreaking parts of the story. The morbidly ridiculous rabbit necromancy straight into Marcille’s devastation at seeing her future “surrounded by corpses” laid out before her so brutally, guiding her even deeper into the demon’s manipulation…..WAUUUGGHHHH IT’S SO GOOD
Right this manga tows the line between comedy and tragedy so closely 😭😭😭
SPOILER!! Laios Greatest desire.
in post cannon, it’s been revealed that his greatest desire was to be EATEN by a monster. Which is no longer possible since all monster in existence had become scared of him.
Not to be eaten 😭😭😭
Not the vore 😭
About Kabru and his Mom she basically treats him as a pet coddling him and dressing him up. Also one of my favorite extras is where he’s going to show of a sweet from his home town as in his actual hometown that was destroyed but she basically guilt trips him to show off an elven sweet instead it’s such a interesting look into the loss of a childs home culture in cross cultural adoption
Yeah & also in the adventure's Bible there's a section where the canaries are mocking Otta because she dates young half foot women & basically calling her a p*do (especially cuz they usually break up before the half foot turns 30). Otta then points out that half foots in general age a lot faster than everyone (especially elves), so they take advantage of life/experience more in the shorter time they have (ex. Chilchuck had kids & a wife by the time he was 13 & is turning 29 that year, the changeling bit showing that he's basically middle aged). Then tells Kabru that she at least sees "short lived races" as people instead of pets, implying that most elves basically treat everyone who lives less than a century as either children, pets, or even animals of burden at worse. Kabru's mom adopting SEVERAL children from short lived races almost feels more like, a foster home for pets than for sentient children. Kabru doesn't ever even mention having "siblings" when growing up with Misiril, like the whole estate is supposed to have kids running around & never mentions anyone besides Rin (who DIDN'T get to live w/ Kabru since the estate was TOO FULL of kids 😭)
Yeah I think if there was another side story we can see more of the development of their relationship espically now that kabru is a full adult and post dungeon plot
WAIT HUHHH I NEED TO GET THE ADVENTURES BIBLE HOLD ON
I find kinda Genius how well she does the ancient advenced civilization that destroit It self
Hey I know you left this comments months ago but just wanted to discuss your thoughts of Misiril (Kabrus Elf’s mom), I didn’t get the “pet” viewpoint from her, she reminded me of a helicopter parent, who would never truly see her child as another but that, a child. Both due to the fact that she will live decades after her children but also just the society she was raised in (elven society) pushes that viewpoint of short-lived races. I think it’s supported by the fact that at the end of the day Kabru is allowed to leave the West. Also when in an extra she goes to visit him but she doesn’t ask and when he is upset she responds with “it must be puberty”. Kabru says that ended long ago, I think because Milsiril’s an elf she has trouble viewing her 20 adult tall man children as adults. Anyway just my ramblings lol ignore if you want :D
Glad that you stuck with the story and read the whole thing. It’s really delicious. For me, I really like how honest and considerate the exploration of autism that Laios was. It meant a lot to me that Laios was allowed to be angry and frustrated with the world and for that to be treated fairly.
Yes this! No woobification on my watch 😌
“You’re meant to be freer than that” is such a powerful statement.
RIGHT
44:28 ooouhhh reminds me of when someone said that kabru is just like laios except his fixation is people and not monsters😭😭
Yes! That's him lmaooo
My interpretation of Kabrus mom was that elves, even when they’re trying to be polite, find it hard to over look the age difference. Like it’s hard for her to fully understand that he’s a grown ass man because in comparison an elf the same age would still be a kid
Yeah!
Dark magic was like straight up illegal I thought? Like a major point of friction was that Marcille used Dark Magic and as soon as she left the dungeon she'd be arrested for it. Chilchuck also implies that HalfFoots aren't allowed to perform magic at all saying something along the lines of "well excuse me for being unsure of magic when every half foot who practices major suddenly goes missing for unexplained reasons." Implying a straight of elven conspiracy regarding half foots and magic use. However, during the changling arc we do see that Marcille as a half foot immediately gets hit was really bad magic sickness whenever she used a spell so half foots could be unable to handle magic and that's why they often go missing or turn up dead when practicing it.
Yeah dark magic is illegal! I think I meant to say that marcille doesn't think it's bad but that it lacks knowledge from most people even elves. And I totally missed the chilchuck thing but from what you're saying it sounds like it's not illegal for them to do magic just heavily discouraged lol
Not exactly, the elves disappeared some halflings who had found objects of ancient magic.
The prohibition of ancient magic has 2 aspects.
1- There is ancient magic that was used to summon demons.
2- There is ancient magic that would balance power for the "new races"
The magic that Marcille studied predated even demons, which is why it is slower.
The magic common throughout the series is actually a way to talk to the demon, to make it do what you want.
Marcille's magic is like programming, she creates a magic circuit with precise instructions to reach a result, instead of just praying and letting the magic see what to do.
Elves have a habit of going at their own pace, so if a half foot finds some magic contraband and gets held for questioning, the elf might keep them in confinement for TWENTY YEARS because thats not a long time for an elf, but its half a LIFETIME for a halffoot.
Its why halffoots have superstitions about elves spiriting half foots away.
@@ricardom3114 I think it also a reference to lord of the rings, you know the story of a hobbit/half-foot that finds a powerful ring and after is taken to the West by elves? Exactly what happened to both Bilbo and Frodo?
I mean it's also an important worldbuilding detail on how things operate in this world, but also a fun easter egg
Ancient magic
Fionil is also a half-elf in the dungeon. She was sent by the elves to investigate the island but she fell in love with the tall-man Doni and defected. Which is why she's hiding from the canaries when they are around. Fionil and Doni are the two people who were attacked by the basilisk in like chapter 2.
👁👄👁
Marcille’s rabbit dance was probably my favorite part of the manga. Unparalleled silliness that is absolutely HORRIFYING
Omg yeah dungeon meshi tows that line so well 😂
My favorite part is when Laios becomes a monster and everyone can tell it’s him with barely any explanation because he’s having such a good time.
The manga is so well written but the resolution with needing to eat the rest of the dragon freaked me out a lot. Also, I hate the canaries so much. They just kept sealing people in rooms where they’d die and acting confused about why Kabru doesn’t want everyone to die
Oh laios 😭😭😭 and the canaries are crazy lmaooo like y'all no, we shouldn't just kill everything and everyone 💀💀💀
LMAOOOO YEAH LAIOS IS SUCH A FREAK I LOVE HIM
Not even all elves know about the nature of ancient magic and the demon- it is classified knowledge for only the Canaries (or the Dungeon Investigation Unit, as they are officially called). It is shown that dwarven and gnomish elites also know about the demon to some extent (gnomes have a lifespan in between dwarves and elves, I believe).
The elf age of maturity is 80 years old! This means that Marcille is still a minor in elf society, and Kabru would be 4 by the elf standard when he left Milsiril. Milsiril clearly has some major trauma from the dungeons herself- she's said to be a complete shut-in and has extensive scarring from her service in the Canaries/DIU. (To balance out this Milsiril defense, she knew the nature of the dungeon the whole time- she could have just told him about the demon instead of having him get tangled up in the dungeon!)
If I remember correctly, the Ancient Magic being gatekept was to put down the shorter-lived races more than anything because Elves BECAUSE see them as irresponsible children, and they don't want to clean up their "mess" or allow them to find immortality to become "equals".
Yes!
AHHH dungeon meshi video!!!! :DD honestly reading it changed my relationship to food so much- seeing the way the dishes expressed the characters and their journey and the mood, making food together and eating together as an act of love, the respect for the creatures that made their survival possible, it was all so touching and made me think about my own life and approach. i think my favorite moment in the manga is senshi eating the gryphon, but honestly so many parts stick out to me, the characters interacting is just so joyful to see no matter what is going on.. i see so much of myself and my older brother in falin and laois so everything about them and their bond made me want to cry for a million years, too. dungeon meshi you will always be famous.
Yeah same! I love cooking but I often get really hard on myself about it. Senshi definitely helped me out 🥺
From my understanding the "dark arts" isn't a thing. Like dark arts are just any magical skill that the elf government doesn't like. It's not like a special type of magical but just a list of spells that are outlawed
Oh, this is gonna be a bit of a long one. Sorry bout this!
Gnomes, Dwarves, and Elves are all long-lived races, while the Tall-men, Half-Foots, and Ogres are short-lived races, with Kobolds and Orcs being seen as sub-human/second class citizens. Orcs are in a worse position that Kobolds, as orcs are considered to be a "Kill on sight" group, treated about the same as monsters.
Mana is a biological factor within the races, with Elves having more of it and other races having less. I think the order of Mana-quantity among the human races is like.. Elves > Gnomes > Tall-Men > Ogres > Half-foots > Dwarves. Dwarves actually have like... Lactose Intolerance, but for Magic. A short at the end of one of the manga has Senshi explain he gets an upset stomach/gassy if he eats something with too much Mana in it because the Dwarven Body doesn't process it well. The demon has modified it and made it more accessible to some and less than others, but the Demon isn't mana- the Demon is an entity from an Infinite Plane, or may be a fragment of that plane itself- so he is boundless energy, but he isn't Mana itself.
Elves have their own magic system too, and Gnomes made the other magic system. Elven magic works off of very strict Commands given to the spirits, so it will produce the same result every time based on the caster's ability to instruct. The Gnomish magic system, like Falin uses, involves more "Asking nicely" and it has the potential to be insanely strong, but it is inconsistent. Enchanting is also treated like programming, as described with the shorts about the Golems.
Dark magic is considered illegal even among the elves, and almost all of the Canaries are convicted of using it or being involved with it. The only thing the long lived races agree on is keeping the demon from escaping dungeons, which were made to contain the demon. And part of that is keeping people from knowing about the demon so it isn't sought out. The dungeons are a prison, and mana is condensed inside of them, but other forms of magic can work but not quite as well.
At the time Kabru lived with his step-mother, when he was on the bed with all those dolls, he was around 7-10 years old and was still a child. He is 20 by the time we first meet him in the story.
There is another Elven adventurer, and she is a spy for the Canaries- she's the one who was with the dude who almost got bodied by the Cockatrice.
Technically the ending of the manga is "Everyone does a cannibalism to save Falin" LMAO
Also fun lore fact brought up in the supplementary materials! Cannibalism used to be VERY NORMAL among Elves, but now it is frowned upon and not practiced in most areas. Some rural Elven tribes do however still engage in cannibalism.
Thank you so ur service and info 🫡
I love how everyone's greatest criticism was that Laios of all people seemed to show a lack of urgency in getting to Falin, masquarading it as caution, all the while having the time of his life eating monsters floor after floor int he dungeon; only for the winged lion to call him out for it at the very end with his curse. Turns out critics were right all along, saving Falin may have been the priority in his mind, but not in his heart.
Fun fact: there is one other elf in the dungeon, but you only learn about her from the extra material. That duo the party saves from basilisk is a tall-man and an elf. If i remember correctly, she was sent ahead of the canaries to check things out and ended up defecting. When the canaries show up in the dungeon you can see her trying to hide under her hood, and the knowledge adds extra weight to her choice to speak up for Laios later on. She would have been risking a lot if they had recognized her.
She’s also a half-elf like Marcille!
A neat observation in the manga is that technology is locked to medieval era due to the long-lived races putting a ban on technological advancement and research.
Normally fantasy settings ignore the fact that there’s little advancement done over thousands of years. This series just has it be a regulatory ban.
👁👄👁 the elves, gnomes, and dwarves said no cell phones
I think that dark arts were illegal for anyone - it was just that it wasn't as big a deal to Elves because a 200 year prison sentence is hefty but not the end of the world... I don't think we ever get a clear idea of how criminals of other races were treated (because we don't know anyone else who tried), so its possible the sentence is shorter for other races, and they were just not permitted to leave the Elf homeland and teach dark arts to anyone else. A little unclear on that front.
I do remember them saying that sometimes elves will keep shorter lived races for longer in jail without realizing that their lives are shorter 😭😭
the intro 💀💀💀 i know theres a reason most videos about DM has been about up until where the anime's season 1 ends, but its so good to have one that encompasses the entire story (the iceberg analogy is so accurate for this story). this is the type of dungeon meshi video i have dreamed of and it was so fun to watch!! your commentary was so funny and i really resonated w your analysis (especially because the 2nd half of the manga was,,,a Lot to take in so going over it in this format helped gather all the pieces in my head)
have you read/looked at the extras? theres sooo much extra info via bonus content in artbooks etc that Kui has made for this world and these characters it honestly wows me, especially how some of the smaller side characters can be expanded upon so much with just a few extras (one of my fav examples of this is a bonus comic about Benichidori and her 'routine' that gives so much insight about her character with just a little comic)
Thank you so much! I have the art book but I also really want the adventures Bible lol I gotta find a translation online tho
@@AlleyDreamer It's on Mangadex! (at least the first part is)
Can't wait for anime onlies to see more of Kabru, he's definitely my favorite after Laios
He definitely won over my heart
Chilchuck is my favorite middle aged girl dad he’s so sweet 😭❤️
🙌🏾🥺 he's the best
this channel is a breath of fresh air on this kind of content, personable, reasonable critical analysis of a story, really great stuff, while not being detached or just recapping like many other creators. i wish there were more channel like yours, well i guess ill go into the backlog of videos.
🥺🥺🥺 wahhh thank you so much that means a lot! I tried the whole recapping analysis thing and it came out so stiff so I tried for a more yapping kind of approach where I do analysis but in a more yaptastic type of way lmaooo
15:02 there’s also that elf that the save in the beginning, her companion gets like poisoned?
37:22 "Yall remember Falin"
Atleast they still trying to solve that
Unlike the prophecy that everyone literally ignored the very moment they left the golden castle, until Yaad finally reminded that at the end, and Laois be like "Oh yeah the prophecy..."
LMAOO they got side tracked 😭
@@AlleyDreamer You'd think a prophecy could change the behavior of some characters, but no
They just didn't give a shit
The prophecy was definitely just a thing the demon made up as a manipulation tactic to take down Thistle. This is especially evident when kensuke who was originally just had a square decoration at the handle, got transformed into a lion head by the dungeon cleaners (who are part of the demon) to make it so laios fits the prophecy's description.
What I meant is that nobody cared about the prophecy, the whole Laois became a king wouldn't happen if Yaado didn't remind them about the prophecy that Laois didn't remember and didn't care
@@njcheddar Speaking about made up prophecy
Do you think that dungeon cleaner "fix" the sword was also made up by the demon?
The logic of the 6th floor is that it is a cold level means slowed down the cleaner process
But the sword isn't fixed at the 3rd floor which is warm?
Minor correction, she does say she wants everyone to share her lifespan which is about 1000 years.
Girlypop wants to see eternity with her friends and I think we should let her
So im still at the start of the video but something i want to clarify about the race dinamics in the manga, form what i understand ability to use magic is partly innate and determined by yhe mana reserves you have, elves have the biggest and thats why their magic system isn't used hy other races, gnomes have the second largest reserve and their magic is based on a collaboration with the spirits (asking nicely instead of commanding them) and that's why their system is used by tall men and others races has it's less mana intensive (Falin and Rin both use the gnome magic), darwes can't use magic at all and are actually resistant to magic (and consuming mana makes them go gassy, which is really funny), and half-foots have the smalles reserves, thats why has a half-foot Marcille was immediately hit with mana sickness.
A lot of this is explored in the monster extras and in the adventure guide, so idk if you have read that already.
Now back to the video!
And a clarification for why the elves gatekeep the dark magic from the other races, yes it's very much a patronising thing, they don't consider the other races to be mature enough to handle it, remember that dark magic is essentially dealing with the demon directly, the problem with what Marcille does with falin is that she used the magic of the dungeon directly aka giving the demon a way to interact with the world more. It's not the necromancy an issue, is that it feeds the demon ability to potentially escape the dungeon and fucks with the world (which is you know what happens).
I'm not saying they are right in the way they gatekeep the information, it's also very much a power play to keep all the info to themselves to keep their political and military position strong internationally.
Plus about the infantilization, a thing you have to remember about Kabru mom Mistril (idk if I spell that right) that's shown more in the extras is that she has a lot of issues herself and yes she absolutely isn't the best mom, but she tries.
Like the thing with the dolls is that it's something *she* takes comfort in, and she pushes it on Kabru in a misguided attempt to help, and while she is very smothering she does train Kabru after he insists
Her problem is that she is clearly a very traumatised person from her time in the Canaries and seems to have had depression from even before that, so that combined with the elf cultural tendency to infantilize other races created a pretty bad combination.
Sorry for my rant, I just think she is an interesting character and I see her to often be demonized
For the resurrection thing: the point is that since your soul can't leave your body the only thing you need to do to bring someone to life is to fix the body, so heal the wound, replenish the blood lost, rebuild anything that's missing etc, that's why it cost calories, you are pretty much speeding up healing. So once that's done you are has healthy has ever and you don't need the dungeon magic to sustain you.
Last thing, Laois becomes king of the land that was once the golden kingdom that rises from the ocean, but it does impact other countries around the world.
But yeah amazing video!
Ty ty and thanks for the clarification! As for kabru's mom I don't think she's beyond retribution and I do think if there was ever a side story about those two she would definitely go through that growth. I don't think she's evil or anything and she does genuinely care for kabru. She just a lot of inner healing she has to do lmaooo
Elves treat Tallmen like preteens, and they treat Half-foots like rambunctious small children.
i’ve posted this as a reply to someone else but i cannot stress this enough lol. i wish people would stop bringing up mithrun (and laios!) when kabru is being talked about. kabru is my favorite character so it really makes me mad that he gets reduced to “guy who gets shipped with mithrun or laios” when he is such an interesting character separate from those two white men.
Lmaooo ur not wrong
well in the story he is juxtaposed with laios as his "dark mirror"(idk how else to say it, there is a term), and while he stands on his own as a character, this story IS about relationships, so excluding the shipping fabdom things, his whole arc is very tied to other characters, but in the same way the main characters are tied to each other in the story. i also like that he doesnt just exist as a counterpoint to laios whole thing but also gets an arc where we explore him thru his interactions with mithrun, kabru is really interesting bc he doesnt change a lot, just like laios, senshi, chilchuck etc., but we get a deeper understanding of him as a person. i like that while he is presented as a shady guy it isnt about changing that part of him, its about connecting on a deeper level than analytic with other people and understanding each other, without really habing to change who you are, but how you understand each other(its very relatable to me too, its a really cool b plot that could have been its own story).
I think the reason Dark Magic was so heavily restricted was specifically because of the Lion, ie the demon linking the dungeons together. It's a wish granter, and using dark magic is rooted in drawing upon energy from the same dimension the demon hails from, inevitabely drawing the caster to the demon. The longer lived races are aware of this being, and know that letting it be known that such a being exists in the dungeons would be incredibly dangerous, which is why they cover it and dark magic up.
Makes sense!
My favorite part of the manga?
" t h e b i t e"
Yes!
i worship the ground ryoko kui walks upon and pity her neck for holding up the biggest wrinkliest heaviest worldbuilding brain out there currently. along with her also goated plot writing brain
gnomes are elves' rival when it comes to magic studies and research btw! they have different approaches, and have went to war using it. both are long lived races who def benefit from that.
She so amazing omg
I haven't even watched the video and I can sense the absolute banger this will be. Also finished the Dungeon Meshi manga last night, this video is the treat for completing it.❤
Ayyy this manga changed me 🥺
Love to listen to someone yap about something I’m so hyperfixated on!
And I love yapping 🤝
I loved Thissle being gassiest as s-word to Marcille but only if you pear it with a side story involving Marcille her Mom and Laios that hints that Thissle was not as knowledgeable about half-elves as he thought if not all the winged lion scenes and it's 3 Marcille Thissle and episode 2 girl
Thistle and his sassy ass lmao
Thistle: You're a greedy bitch and i hate you!
Marcille: WHY!?
Thistle: Because you're too much like me!!!
Short live races tend to idolized/demonized (there the two sides of the same depersonalizing coin) the long race there must likely to know depend on there region. So human tend to live around elf so they idolized/demonize them. "Dark Elf" being just elves that use forbidden magic but to human are seen an entire sub-species of evil Elf. They also tend to see them as peek standard of beuty.
Half-foot are more likely to live around dwarves so they tend to idolized them. See them as peek masculine virtue/ strenght/ beauty.
So there avertion to magic is partial cultural as there idolized race (dwarves) don't use magic and likely associated with elf in deragatory way. There is the lifespan of 60 years. Making study of magic more difficult. So mixed with elf and gnome being intolerant of acomadating differences. Gnome because there magic is tied to there religion and Elf because there just very racist. So short of elve that leave the elven land to rought it with halfling and ignore everything they know to better adapt magic to half-foot more limited mana pool as is own more specialized less flashy mana efficient spell that are tailor for and by half-foot to circunvent there limited mana pool. Half-foot be more about prestidigitation. Than flashy elf spell or healing spell like gnome magic. Good luck geting said sainty elven to dedicated there long live on "party trick" magic to the shortest live species. So conspiracy or not half -foot would have to invent there own class of magic as elven magic simple does not acomadate spell for smaller mana pool.
Which explain why elf infantilized human than half-foot. They are more exposed to Tall-man than half foot. Tall man are more numerous than Elf and dwarves but Elfs and dwarve own most of the land. Which is why they are the one fighting over it.
Gnome we know the least but seem to live in small devout enclaves all over with lil contact with other races. No reason is given but if anything like real life this may not be wholly there choice and more adaptation to past lost of land. Creating a more devout insular close community vertion of past gnome society. After lost land to either or both longer races. Making them deeply insecure to lose there culture and way of life and there essential non status as long life race despite technically being one.
Not help there magic is more instictual as shown by Fallin attempt to teach Laois magic. Which would make it much more difficult as require one have an affinity with spirit unlike elf magic. That is more taught.
Human being more numerous probably why elf are more likely to baby them. Since even if they don't live as long. They can use magic well plus elves less populous mean even low mortality rate be devastating.
The canary being a great example going from honorable high steem knight of the queen to protect the short live from there folly in the dungeon to suicide squad after the last dungeon kill many canary. Making noble less likely to send there first born. So noble treat more like a Queen aproved death sentence. Which is why we get the disposable goofball (captain non withstanding as he pre date there fall of grace in elven nobility)
There also the more obscure issue with using magic user. They tend to be addict. Alcoholism being the socially accepted addiction to elves. Hallucigen and harder drug in general being the non socialy accepted addiction. This steem that moderate use of said addictive substance can enhance some spell or recover mana. But high preasure in elven society put on magic user mean most elf magic user become functioning addicts at best and absolute short live wreck at worse. All of which help explain why the elf keep tab on magic use in general. Not just a mean of control but to save face there both not as in control and to save face that glorified functioning addict are tje foundamental part of there society.
Elf don't so much infantilized short live as more treat them as animal. Which is why an Elf call on Labru adopted mom on for lack of better word "reverse" racism. Which is worse than the general racism dish out to short live species. A perfect example is when the Canary that were in the village "take a human girl as evidence". There behaviour is akin to finding a wild baby bird that can't yet fly. Offering food try to getting it to sing (The tall-men racial trait is that they are very good at singing) they all look at like folk at the zoo. Than quickly lose interest. So not defending Labru adopted mom but more given the nuance that while her action are still bad. She comes from a more racist culture that see short live races as entertaining talking/singing animal at best and annoying pest that keep encroaching on there land/stuff/magic. Which in part explain Labru complicated relationship with her mother. He know how he treated was wrong but she was doing best in deeply radiactive culture. That likely without her intervention. He still be in "live" evidence room and die off old age. Because the elf apply there rule equally to everyone. Ignoring the huge leap in there lifespan. So questioning (kipnapping) can take years without warning. Even small sentences is around 20-50 years. A death sentence to many short live races. Which of course to an elf is not that long. Any attempt to adjust the rule to short live races smaller lifespan. Is again for lack of better word seeing as "reverse racism" as your not treating them as an equal elf but instead "infantalizing" them. Which should help explain why Labru mom don't care for elf society or said accusation.
So elf are deeply racist and classist. Which you can see when Labru convince her mom to go to one of the many boring family meeting as she says. He is infantalized but he is a child so is more understandable. The elder take him the fastest as he show interest on the family and taking there cake. (The cake is closer to fruitcake but remove the fruit with seeds. So more uneatable) Which everyone happy to unload on him. (My head canon is they have warehouse fill with the stuff. Considering is hospitality gift. Essentially trying every day to find someone that actualy enjoy it so they can get rid there lifetime supply of the cakes they gain over there long life. I imagine it has absurd shell life. Some of it is likely century old. Adding to is infamous unedible brick status)
So because of her Mom status they accept her exentric behaviour of taking short live races kids as there own children. Since the elders embrace him the rest of family had to . Which add to the very selective way they treat short live races.
Which is why Labrus has very complicated relationship with elves/canary/her mother. He being very extroverted in very extroverted elf culture. Where gossip run like water. He act as sponge unlike her very introveted mother that hate how busybody her family/culture is in general. Took everything in and his fascinstion with people/his new extended family. Made him an easy favorite among the elders. As they love to reminisce the past very old gossip about the family and bloodline. Which he took in stride at very young age. So while I also strugle to call it love. I do think both his mom and her elf family try to give it to him in society that is not build to give any for any non elf. (Consider elves deeply held stereotype of half elves. I am sure many elf in that society deny that love deppending on action or low status birth.)
Tldr: Elf suck even more that you think.
Ooo didn't think about the reverse of Infertilization ur so right :o
7:10 someone else has probably already commented this but the reason why elves gatekept all information about ancient magic away from the other races was because it was all related to demons/how dungeons worked. for example when marcille uses ancient magic to resurrect falin she explains that she was using a type of magic that takes energy from an infinite dimension, aka where the demons come from.
YOURE SO RIGHT ABOUT EVERYTHING!!!!! THIS MANGA MAKES ME SO INSANE-
SAMEEEE
There is the one elf girl from the second floor that they helped with the cocatrice
She’s a half-elf too!
@@imaginarylivingbody7154 her ears were pointy, she is an elf
Omg I forgorrrr
@@imaginarylivingbody7154 oh she is? I didnt realize it man half elves be running this dungeon
@@cristophernunez7786 Marcile is also a half elf so the ears being pointy doesnt mean they arent a half elf
I liked watching your journey through this series. You mentioned in your earlier Dungeon Meshi video that you prefer sci-fi over fantasy - have you tried out Dorohedoro? Technically it looks like dystopian science fiction but it actually qualifies as fantasy because it involves magic and sorcerors. I'm just suggesting it since it has similarities with Dungeon Meshi - Found family groups that bond over food, written by a woman, characters with a wide variety of body types, leisurely world building at the start but sets up a complex lore so that when the plot hits, it hits like a truck, etc. Also, heavy gore warning.
I LOVE DOROHEDORO!!! I need to continue the manga lolol
@AlleyDreamer Oh, I'm so glad! I hope I can see your take on it someday.
Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from science.
It's one of my favorite manga. it's so solid throughout the entire read.
Yes! A fav forever 💓
@@AlleyDreamer real recognizes real
don’t have much to add but great video, love this series
Thank you so much for watching! 💓
Your zoom in about “that is not his greatest desire” was HILARIOUS
There is an elf in the dungeon beside Marcille & Thistle btw (she is a canaries's spy)
👁👄👁
5:47 Dungeon Meshi has a adventures guide that has extra tidbits about the world and your somewhat correct about them having more time, but it's also how magic is done.
Gnome magic is used by asking spirits to preform a task for them, making it random but also making it more powerful in some cases.
Elf magic works by forcing the spirit to do a command, making it so the spells are more accurate, but also meaning the power is based on the individual making it so even if ten elves study the same thing for equal amount of time, how good they are with the spell will not be equal.
At least that's how I read it lol, also a fun fact: half-foots are named after humans, cause elves thought they short humans, so they were just considered short humans and not they're own race until later.
Dungeon Messi is something of a fixation of mine. And I really really really want to read it whole. In fact, it is the first ever manga I’m buying and reading. But I’m buying and reading it in Portuguese, my native language. And we only have it up to volume 6 at the moment. So I’ll be diligently waiting for each and every new volume to come put for me to spend 8$ (it’s kind of expensive in my country, specially to manga) on each volume.
Just binged the first season of the anime and then finished the manga in another day. FUCKING LOVED THIS SERIES.
And I neeeeeeded this video to have someone to gush about this story, so thanks ❤
Also, my favorite part of the story is the characterization of the demon, and how fucking humanizing the author made an infinite cosmic being to be. How it grew, how it learned, how it lacked a sense of morality and allowed for all wishes (including why each race had their own characteristics and the destruction of the world), how it manipulated every person that it came across in the most effective way possible to get what it wanted (those tasty morsels of desire), and how that would be his own undoing at the hands of greedy, gluttonous, best boy Laios (but also the way they fought each other was peak thematic storytelling). Also also, the curse to Laios and that he allowed Falin’s souls to return instead of being extra cruel at the end of the two climaxes was a very nice touch. Also also also, casually eating Marcille’s desire to do her hair when she transferred lordship of the dungeon.
THIS STORY WAS PEAK.
Cosmic beings becoming human yes!!!!!
To me one of the biggest points that hits home the idea of "you are part of rhe ecosystem bc you eat within the ecosystem," is that this is the fundamental concept that Laios grasps in order to defeat the demon. It eats within the world, so it is part of the world. Like with humans not being part of the dungeon until they go into it, etc. The demon didn't ever realize that it had become part of the ecosystem of the world. So it couldn't even perceive the threat of Laios as a monster, despite the fact that the demon's magic was what transformed him.
Anyone who thinks it was a happy accident that Laios monster defeated the demon is ignoring how the entire story is teaching you this lesson over and over again, and how the story shows over and over again how Laios thinks when it comes to monsters. Or boiled down even more specifically, how he triumphs in the showdown with Thistle. He uses the inclination of a monster to his advantage.
But yeah, it's just really good how the story goes cosmic in scale, but still manages to iterate the same core point: ecologically or socially, you cannot be separate from the systems that you participate in.
when i read dungeon meshi i knew a lot of people shipped laios and kabru and so i was really surprised when i didn't get it and thought kabru and mithrun and their relationship was more interesting. i particularly love the scene at the end when kabru helps mithrun get up and keep living
the laios and kabru ship came more from their post-canon ending, when kabru works as laios’s advisor and promises to stay by his side. thats why most of the fanart is laios wearing king clothes and kabru wearing a tunic. mithrun and kabru never talk to each other after the story ends, not even in kui’s modern AU comics.
honestly i wish people would stop bringing up mithrun (and laios!) when kabru is being talked about. kabru is my favorite character so it really makes me mad that he gets reduced to “guy who gets shipped with mithrun or laios” when he is such an interesting character separate from those two white men.
I think all the races (tall men, half foots, elves, dwarves, gnomes, orcs) are considered human in this setting, and their terms are specifically racial?
Ooo I see what u mean
Orcs aren't.
Tall Men, Dwarves, Half-Foots, Elves, Gnomes, and Ogres.
rather races that aren't considered human but aren't considered monsters are the Demi-Humans. Orcs, Kobolds, Natural Beast-folk etc. (they ended up classifying them based on their number of bones. All "Human" races have the same number of bones (Ogre's horns are growths from their skull and not true horns so they don't count them as separate bones, though they were originally considered Demi-humans before the number of bones was agreed upon as the main classifier), Demi-humans have a few extra bones but are still considered sapient/sentient enough to not simply be classified as a monster.
Tbf to thistle, one of his reasonings for thinking Marcille wanted to be a full elf was because of a half-elf’s irregular lifespan, so… 1/5 guesses right🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
Lmaooo
Comment for the algo! I'm trying to limit my DM spoilers so I'm putting this in my Watch Later list. Looking forward to it!
Aww thank you! See u on the other side!
There is one other elf in the dungeon! That elven mage we see in the beginning whose companion got hit by the basilisk! Her name is Fionil and she's half-tallman like Marcille (peep the rounded elf ears!) :]
This manga and anime really has is all and portrays things so well.
Definitely a top 5
@@AlleyDreamer Heck yes
You're wrong about there not being other elves in the dungeon. Literally, the first two people they meet are a "tall man" and an elf team. Also, Marcille is only a half elf. She's half "tall man".
Also, Liaos tricked the demon by telling him to turn into a monster that can also consume desires. So Liaos then ate the demon's desire to consume.
That's how he won.
6:30 yeah tall-men only live to about 60, and 80 to an elf is only just becoming an adult (~16 for a human)
i dont know if this is a connection you've made yet, but you should rewatch the second anime opening with the whole 'demons greatest desire plan' in mind :)
👁👄👁
this was a treat to watch, I didn't even see the time pass. Also yes, Laios got that dog in him
Aww thank you so much 💓
Yes, thank you for nailing it all
🫰🏾
This is so good thank you
So I just finished season one the other night and I wanna ask , do they end up being able to save Falin? Or is she stuck being a bloodthirsty monster forever?
They save her!
@@AlleyDreamer yay thank you ☺️
Love and hunger
🙂↕️
Yeah you’re right! And resurrection actually doesn’t work outside of dungeons.
dear god i got atomically SPOILED.
Another fandom i am in 🎉🎉 i recently finished it i still need to read the manga tho
Wooo!
Amazing video! Got a little emotional too.
Aww thank you!
Wait, is Marcel a "Modern Bulma?"
A woman in a "boy's anime" with, wants and desires and an attitude that complains.
Bulma was always a personal favorite. A regular human that "moves the plot". Constantly changing fashions and can hold her own ground.
Sure Bulma isn't a "perfect role model" but that's part of her charm.
I love bulma so I love this comparison! She is definitely her own character
@@AlleyDreamer I remember something else about Bulma that makes for an interesting comparison!
I stopped watching Dragonball Super, but one of the Gods or higher beings found out that Bulma created a Time Machine. "Gently" scolded her about it. Apparently time travel is supposed to be forbidden? Funny I can memorize "Dragonball Z" and remember 70% of "Dragonball" but my memory is fuzzy on "Super".
Kinda reminds me of Marcel and all of her "rule breaking" in magic in general.
making a video about dungeon meshi and love and not mentioning farcille even ONCE is crazy.
@nitwuki listennnnnn the video was long enough talking about canon stuff. If I added in ship stuff it would be another hour long 😭😭😭
@@AlleyDreamerdo it
Nice
avoiding spoilers so i’ll be clicking off. Leaving a comment for engagement tho 🥳
Thank youuu see u later 👀
0:40 girl same
Great Video :)
Thank you!
@@AlleyDreamer Your Welcome
9:00 dont diss my girl Milsiril like that without reading the extras 😔
During marcille's nightmare it's implied her mother told her she would outlive a lot of people in her life at her father's funeral so we got a quick hint to her being a half elf
19:30 I MISSED THIS COMPLETELY! And i read the manga twice, nice reading comprehension!
Have you read the Dungeon Meshi Adventurers Bible?
No I haven't gotten my hands on it yet 😔