Spectating the #1 TikTok Flank Moira player and why it WORKS
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ม.ค. 2023
- Today, we're spectating the #1 Moira on the ladder, NolanCoronaV. Yes, you're about to learn how to be a flanking DPS Moira.
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With all those heal orbs and the way he's playing I'd almost call him a second dive tank, except the tankiness is from self-heals and a great escape ability. It's the Moira version of Wrecking Ball.
I think it’s a bit more similar to Winston, since the mobility comes in a single cooldown. The decision-making around using jump aggressively, to stage, or defensively feels like it transfers pretty well to Fade.
But yeah, I agree, this playstyle should be called tank Moira.
So the video of the greatest Moira ever has her hard throwing the game for the first 2 minutes. What skill
@@cadbane6523 Not sure why you replied to me to say this, but OK, I'll handle it.
The subtext of your comment is "I don't understand why this is effective" (plus a bit of "I wrongly think good play never fails ever" which is *weird*)
My reply to these translations of your "complaint" are: I believe that you don't get it, and I believe that you think good plays never fail. And I feel bad for you.
@joefulgham3341 let's be real. Any team that has a Moira die twice In the enemy spawn in the first 2 minutes is going to be raging. My point is this was a poor choice of a video to show that Moira can be an effective pick. If I watched this and didn't know the rank I would think the player was silver
@@cadbane6523 ...what about the other 9 minutes?
Most noticeable difference with him and a low rank moira I usually see is he utilizes his range very well there are a lot of times where lower ranks would try and close the gap on someone they are sucking instead of keeping that 20 meter succ
Yeah the range is ridiculous. You can attack while taking cover
That and the willingness to go all the way behind and then some to get an advantageous corridor. Low tank moiras often barely stay behind the enemy team, positioned basically where the enemy zenyatta should be. This guy uses the map more like a tracer or ball would
Succc
I honestly can’t believe how damn far the suck goes, based on watching everyone else you’d think it’s the same range as the OG Symmetra beam, but its like 3x longer than that
i played against him on oasis a couple weeks ago lol he was decimating our backline the entire game and had our entire team tilted
Me when I play Moira on ilios: fade into the hole
I'd say the biggest key to this playstyle is your other support.
This tbh
More like is team recognizes the Moira is prioritizing flanking so they play knowing they just have mercy heals instead of poking the same amount as they would with two healers, then going “where’s the heals???”
@@milkmilk1489 neither of these. The moiras team needs way less healing because of the pressure damage and kills he provides, and they are allowed to play just as aggressive or even more than usual because of the space he provides. The other support could be autopilot.
@@Summonick2 This. Drawing aggro is damage mitigated, as long as you don't die doing it.
@@Summonick2 maybe that works in bronze to plat
What Nolan meant by "go no backline" when asked about counters to dps Moira was going something like Lucio+Moira, etc. so you don't have a squishy backline for Moira to exploit.
Right, I didn't think he meant don't flank but rather, the enemy team counters by picking less exposable and isolated heros
That's how I understood it, yeah. In certain comps you can straight up ignore a flank Moira in favor of attacking her team who essentially has one less support.
I've been saying this. People always say Moira can't bring utility and want to rework an ability to have additional utility mechanics. Her survivability IS her utility. You can essentially function as an offtank for some time by drawing attention and creating space. And because of your survivability you can get out a lot of the time, further improved if you know how and where you can fade jump or double fade jump
The main problem with most moiras that play with team is that ber survivability isnt being used like a resource, it doesn't bring utility if all you do is play behind tank all the time. This guy knows how to use it as a resource, he knows where and when to flank, who to prioritize as a target etc.
couldnt have said it better myself
I know I’m late but I hope you learned how to aim since then and play a diff hero. Ain’t reading allat
Whats a double fade jump? 😮
I don’t know why people are surprised that aggressive moira actually works it’s been like this forever 😭
Bc most people are still in silver/gold and the Moira's play like dog water
It's just stronger now BC of the support passive, Moira is in a much better position now
people are surprised it works at this rank
@@yippeeyip4764 Id be more surprised if it worked in lower ranks. I figured out a while ago that drawing aggro can be more important that raw damage/kills alone. Never would I think to play this aggro, especially as moira. I feel like it takes very high situational awareness plus top tier mechanics to play it well, which is why I think higher ranks makes more sense for this to work.
@@padarousou Can confirm. Was spectating my buddy in silver on moira. Holding down left click till she was drier than a nun.
not moving when fighting moira is a revelation.) makes so much sense, never thought about it. you really just throw ur own aim
same for winston, i love when people ad strafe really hard and proceed to miss 50% of their point blank shots on me
Yeah she’s not really doing much damage and is relying on you freaking out lol. I remember back in OW1 I stood still and just melted a Moira with Sombra once and she accused me of aimbotting because she didn’t think it was possible for Sombra to out damage her lol
KarQ is the person to watch if you want honest and good advice for anything Overwatch. Thanks man
Yeah general play has made me better, but I’ve learnt most of my stuff from necros lmao
How much he pay you to say that
what an NPC comment
@@richiee35 he is an NPC
@@ty-xq7bl Sez u
I'm a GM Moira main and this exactly how you're supposed to play her if you want to get the most value from her. She gets a lot of hate for being "easy" but she requires an insane amount of CD management and game sense to pull her off optimally in higher tiers. Since she doesn't have an ability that gives utility you have to actually become the utility via your playstyle. Pressuring from off angles, baiting out CDs, finishing off squishies, adapting mid-fight, etc. are all things your team can utilize to win the match.
She is easy lmao
You don't even need aim lmao and other heroes also do CD management and position etc don't pretend like she is a hard hero to play that's so cringe
gm = diamond btw
@@Yaallennthen how come some ppl are sick with her and most are trash ?
She's easy bro lol
I think this also worked because the mercy adjusted her play style to adapt to what her other support was doing. This wouldn’t have worked as well if she’d try to pocket a dps instead of covering heals for the tank.
This for sure. Now with the Mercy changes where she can heal even better, she could pair with this kind of Moira really well too.
8:40 He tried to double jump off of the telephone box here. The timing is hard, and even harder to h it while being chased, so it makes sense why he missed it.
I'm usually a healing moria going for easy picks but I actually have pulled agro for my team. I'll never forget fading into the backline on Midtown and sitting on the objective to pull the enemy back over to me so my team could get through the choke.
I like playing flank Moira, I just placed diamond and going through plat was rough. I would be doing exactly the same thing on first point of this map but the difference is if I died twice like he did my team would type “we have a dps Moira gg” and stop trying or throw just to prove their point. Low ranks can be frustrating with how confused and pathological some players are.
maybe heal ur team instead?
@@ultimateblaze23 The value created from flank Moira is far better than spamming heals, did you watch the video?
@@ultimateblaze23 plat level take
Like seriously. Like we have the same rank dude how did you get here crying like a toddler over every minor inconvenience??
It’s a nuisance tbh, yesterday I was having 8k damage 8k healing in 9 minutes and my tank complained I wasn’t healing enough when she had a 1k - 6k lucio. Why do moiras get so much hate. I really don’t understand.
This Moira really just said fine I’ll be the 2nd tank
9:57 of course he uses 90% healing orb but mostly to heal himself
I love playing Moira, she's a beast! Can easily lead in heals if you want or lead in damage done if you want... Great escapes and self healing.. a beast! I try to focus on what's needed, heal a bunch while pushing but if the DPS isn't getting it done I start focusing on DPS and it always turns the tide.
I think the way this works is by moving the frontline forward. Even if nobody is dying, the enemy team lose space simply by turning around to deal with you, then your team ends up in the 4v2 and pressures out the remaining 2 enemies, forcing them to fall back to the other 3.
The heal orbs aren't neccessarily to build ult charge, it helps with tempo, otherwise you have to hide, drain health, or find a healthpack before going on the attack again.
If I see a mercy on my team I usually put out big heals as Moira so they can focus on their dmg boost.
KarQ: *Intensely explaining flanking moira strat.*
Moira Player: I just got lucky.
I've tried the playstyle several times and done well with it. I second what Nolan writes: probably about 90% are heal orbs for me too.
The most important part of "TikTok Moira" is to stay alive.
And whenever you have the chance, angle your self-heal orb to hit your team as well. Both to help and to not waste an ult-charge resource.
Learn how to calculate angles and think about what you need to do.
I recently became a Moira main and I don’t understand the hate of a Moira with high damage AND high dealing. There have been countless games where my heals are leading the lobby while at the same time having damage on par with my dps.
I wouldnt consider myself a dps Moira, but I still deal damage and pressure when appropriate (eg: throw damage orbs to pressure widow out of position, take 1v1s again isolated supports, etc.)
Every character has a kit that reflects their life. She's a former over/black watch member, oasis, current talon member. She is a biochemist that can. Change people. Moira is the epitome of survivability and adaptation. She can stay in the back and be a passive healer (but we already have an angel). She can also use her (frankly better than reaper's) shift and dark ball to harass and stay alive. Use everything she has to -do- everything. Limits are only in your mind
my buddy is a flank moira, we started going ana moira duo, and nano-boosting moiras coal is lowkey unstoppable. My guy has won the teamfight for us every time we did the combo except the one time he was nailed by sleep dart
Maybe instead of trying to kill Moira, the goal might have been trying to kill mercy. Then they can't flank Moira since they would have no healing.
This true but mercy is a difficult character to kill considering her insane mobility
Both DPS Moira and healbot Moira share the same counters. Burst damage.
Which also happens to be the counter to basically every character in the game.
Kiriko, Bap, and Ana beg to differ. All 3 have means of insane heal bursts, or other means of reversing a burst into a winning trade. Hell throw lucio in there if u include ults.
@@actuallyjustanapple this. Ana and bap have burst heals and kiriko can make you invulnerable and heal you during those I frames, so she might as well have a burst heal. Moira can heal a lot, 135 hps to be exact, but she still ends up doing heal per second healing. She can't save someone from a junkrat wombo combo. She also can't really properly duel a full hp junkrat because she does damage per second damage. And very low DPS at that.
@@jasonreid9267 it's almost as if you shouldn't be able to actively outheal incoming damage to the extent the support role is capable of doing
When you can outheal any steady damage: the solution becomes to burst everything down
The actual root cause of the issue is that healing numbers in this game are too high and there's no readily available soft antiheal (which is usually what games with extremely high healing throughput use to soft-check healing and make it impossible to directly outheal damage most of the time)
You literally could have solved the entire GOATS meta by giving dps limited amounts of antiheal
@@teejay1646slept on comment but 9 months later and most of the talking heads in ow are now pushing this point
as someone who plays moira as a mad scientist with little regard for life, the orb restoring juice is a huge QoL buff. the juice should never run out
Games like this are why the Benny Hill theme song plays in my head every time I do backline Moira
What I've noticed recently is that I'm at the same skill as T500 casual skill, so it's just my team that keeps me from getting past silver
Casual as in they're just kinda messing around, but I'm try harding at the same skill level
Very Helpful. Thanks for the content.
can you do more educational videos like this please . this was really usefull
this is not a good way to play so I wouldn't drink the coolaid, if the moira was healing instead their team would never have been pushed back at all .
@timar6868 Yes it is he’s the top 1 moira p’ayer in the world and the other healer was a main healer so no need to focus on healing, at the start, he addmits he played bad and that’s why his team got pushed
I mean he does use heal orb a lot... on himself lmao
Not sure if this is good advice at all but when I fight moira as kiriko I normally get close up and try and mirror her strafes to make aiming easier. There's probably something I'm missing with the stand still strat.
you stand still in a 1 v 1 against moira because she doesn't have to aim to hit you (Assuming no cover nearby). so just stand still and line up your shot.
@@israalqamar5658 Or mirror her strafing and don't aim at all.
@@skarloeythomas5172 or stay calm
Stand completely still and line your shots up she does the same amount of damage either way strafing just throws your aim off
Getting close isn’t that bad of an idea tbh when using a projectile character against her, she deals the same dps at either range and if you can’t get out of it may as well try to make your target bigger.
‘you can’t heal from this range’ as the winston gets the heals lmao. great vid love the moira mmm
Excellent vid! Question though why is Moiras orb yellow at times?
Hey what outro song do you use? I used to hear it on something I can't remember what though. Great vid!
Really good analysis ty
He’s really good at cycling through his fades and pee orbs when hitting the back line. Most Moiras will walk or fade into back line, wait for fade to come back and then damage orb, suck and fade back with team. A huge waste of time. He’s really not after blood like the TikTok moira hence all the pee orbs instead of damage orbs. He’s drawing a ton of attention and creating space like you said. He’ll even fade into their back and suck without being afraid of having no fade to get out bc he’ll just use pee orb and fade is back by the time he’s low, fades away and the cycle continues until at least he’s in a bad spot. It’s genius tbh
I do exactly this with kiriko though works just as well if not better in most cases tbh, been climbing for a couple of weeks and gone from gold to masters with it
18:48 you can fade jump the metal bar thing on the side of the wall. But if you mess it up you fall to your death.
Climbed to GM 2 this season with Moria. It's definitely all about not panicking. You just have to stay in a fight till you almost die doing damage or healing in that priority. Do as much damage as you can but also never let your teammates die. Never use fade till you are 30 health or lower and never die either. You can fade if someone is using a life ending cooldown on you but you better be right about that. Don't just spam orbs. Every orb has to have a meaning. If you other support is alive you are almost always throwing damage orbs and short burst healing your team. Use your healing orbs mainly to save yourself or in the cases where your other support is dead. But never throw a healing orb when your main heals can do the job. Don't spam damage orbs either into open space where there are no opponents. Finally, just don't panic but be everywhere and involved in everything and don't die and you'll be GM in no time.
I play moira as i play my tracer, looking for opportunities and keep the pressure going from angles they dont expect. Also if you fade in a quick circle and then jump you can jump even higher then going straight and jumping
The damage orb change really changed the way I play Moira. If I exhausted my piss during a won team fight, instead of using the heal orb I’d chuck a damage orb to the enemy spawn to restore a bit of piss which I would then use to heal my teammates. I could also sustain the heals while helping deal a bit of damage to squishies. Pretty OP change but I don’t mind it.
I‘m actually using heal orb 90% of the time … to heal myself
reminds me a lot of drain tank types of builds in league. fiddlesticks type stuff
Great gameplay Love Moi. That's how I use her,it works when your team is working with it.
He’s playing Moira like Sombra. You’re not there to necessarily get a ton of elims. You’re there to constantly pull agro backwards, like an dive tank in the backlines.
I haven't seen another Moira use the vertical orb technique in my entire life until now, FINALLY someone thinks like me xD
Moira- " I Heal!"
Team- "yeah, yourself"
No
Yupp, adding that 3rd point rollout to my memory bank
i often play support moira a lot, but sometimes i play as flank moira and it works a lot if you have a main healer, you dont do a lot of damage or healing overall, but the time You spent disctracting the enemies works everytime
How do you get those health status displays on the top corners of your screens?
This feels somewhat similar to how a ball would play. But a lot more constant.
Moira main here. I wouldnt say he's a DPS Moira, its one of the most balanced Moiras i've seen, honestly. And with some extra aggressiveness spice. Its a very audacious and daring way to play, sure, but he still keep in mind that healing builds up much more Utl charge than anything. And he does heal a lot his buddies and himself.
Thing is, at this rank, players are much more coordinated and dont have pathetic self-preservation instincts. Im in Diamond and i gotta keep more in the back line than going on a hard flanking approach. I will chase some folks who come too close for comfort and against which im sure i can win a duel, but otherwise, unless i observe that my teammates know very well what they're doing, i remain a bit more conservative than him. The only time i'll flank deeper is only when i can have my team in sight. And then the minute things get way too heated up, i'll fall back to a safer spot.
I really want to watch more of Nolan, but I can't seem to find where to watch him play, does someone know?
Awesome video!
I try to do that and I get called shit because my 2nd healer is ass, so I always have to be the main healer because they're the real ass, but stupid teammates don't understand
When I do this playstyle, ill usially try to take out a squishy support or a dps thats less likely to easily delete me.
I have many options.
Heal orb to keep me alive or send one to my team to heal,
Damage orb to get the kill easier,
Fade away to safety,
Or keep my abilities and try to kill with just my suck.
How do you make your display like that ? Or is that only for PC
yes its a heal orb, buts its a self heal orb to sustain being away from his team, might as well be a damage orb.
I like to Bully Hanzos and WIdows with Moira if I'm support. Kinda map dependent, but it's always great if you can make them switch off.
I played a match on new queen street where i was ana and our other support was moira. They had 500 heals by the end on the game. I could feel my brain worms acting up every time i hit tab. Somehow we won
Would love a video on how to play tank work dps Moira.
I'd say the play is ignoring her and try to roll the enemy team as fast as possible. Her survivability and ability to escape make her a really slippery hero to kill
I’ve been doing pretty well with Orissa in Plat. Didn’t realise she was as bad as roadhog with the the damage drop off. But if you position well and cycle your cool-downs she’s invincible and has great point presence.
No idea why her win rate is so low, maybe people not adjusting to the damage drop off nerf?
Ive noticed that as i play with moira, when i shoot the heal orb, it allows me to focus more of my damage beam on the enemies, and I still get decent healing.
Though unfortunately, im super low elo, so its just a crap shoot.
I'm super new to overwatch In general but I've picked up on stuff really quick and this is literally something I've been trying to to tell my buddy that I can do but I'm still learning the maps and people's play style but this has done wonders for me.
Even getting an aggressive Mercy down that's not something people expect but doesn't hurt the team while doing extra damage to get clutch elim for some fights.
Definitely love how much there is to learn with this game. They did a good job imo. I come from fps shooters.
My main counter has been team play of any kind. It's really hard to take out multiple people if you used a heal.orb to save yourself/someone. Damage orb can help vs multiple but higher skill level good luck. 🤷♂️
Every new player always goes through their "throw the game on damage support" phase before they eventually learn their fundamentals
@@teejay1646 as DPS moria though you can do a lot if the enemy isn't countering you.
The amount of times I had a good team keeping me alive while I'm in the front lines with them doing the little extra basically negating a pocket with raw DPS or forcing the pocket to push away cuz I'm sucking them from an alternative angle.
Definitely requires lots of healing awareness though as you are in the shit so keeping your help alive is the main key. Poking is 2nd.
I will never forget the moira i went against few days ago. I swear she was the most annoying moira i have ever met. She kept flanking my supporters everytime the dps and tank was busy fighting the enemy tank and dps.
Late to the party, but you can fade jump into the high ground directly bouncing on the pipes without any parkour boxes shenanigans ;o)
That's how I played Scout in TF2; get in the back and survive, distracting as much of the enemy team as possible.
I never realized how much I panic faded til I saw this damn
"Random bullshit damage" most lore accurate description of Junk 😂😂😂
the craziest thing about this playstyle to me is that when he leaves a flank, he goes backwards into first point spawn. usually i would try to fall back to my team, but forcing the enemy to either over-commit into oblivion or ignore you is interesting.
Ngl it’s pretty interesting to see high elo moiras expressing skill and playing unconventionally. However, and this is a big HOWEVER, this really only works in high elo because in order to flank Moira, your team has to have the game sense to capitalize off of 1-2 second openings and notice when the opponent supps aren’t looking. Additionally, while you play hyper-offensive Moira, your team is down a supp so they have to have good positioning and game sense to not fall apart. Lot of factors but very cool to see this work
It's basically the same way I play Genji. Maybe I should start playing Moira.
Against DPS Moira, I usually just go defensive Moira and ignore her. I’ve literally had games where there’s a Moira behind me hitting me it’s her grasp and I just heal my team and use healing Orb to cancel out her damage. Using Damage Orbs to get Resource. It just shuts her down.
Sleep dart has a wind up sound that you can hear before it shoots? I didn't even hear this I need to turn my volume up lol
at 2:20 if nolan got the health pack he would have lived but he missed by a little bit
i try this style for real great gameplay, mix healing and flank dps is jizz
Does this dude have a twitch? I wanna watch his games.
good video fr but what you said at 15:26 was crazy
Average KarQ innuendo
This is a PSA: Moira's healing stats are always inflated due to how often they heal orb themselves, do not be afraid to ask for more spread out healing when working with a moira and it feels like heals are lower than the situation requires.
Why do people wanna create stereotypes for heroes so much it’s kinda cringe.
@@marvynjeanbaptiste3206 you know what’s cringier ? Poeple who play moira
@@KyryanRose Imagina playing Moira, boring ass no skill hero
@@andrealelli7505 Imagine shit talking people who play heroes they enjoy? She may have less skill ceiling, but she easily has some of the coolest designs and abilities.
15:28 yeeeeeah boi
I want to see this played with a sombra :P
He uses heal balls a lot, but he seems to mostly be healing himself. The other support probably had 20K heals
i wouldn’t say the only threat is ana’s sleep dart if kiriko lands a headshot on moira she’s dead she has a big head for a support
So coming from a gm moira main I play her a little differently I kinda play with the tank but I do damage majority of the time to their tank and what squishes with lower health I feel like she gets the most value in a 5v5 you know it's a bad Moira when they pop there ult when they already won or lost the team fight
If you're healing and damage are about the same on moira are you playing her correctly?
Can you share more his video with your description
As a Moira (and other supports) main I'd say the best counter to flank Moira are Torb(Turret backline) and Orisa's javelin
These distraction and creating space is insane. Make me realise best moira didn’t win from passively heal in the back line. I use to be quite proud of my survival skill, not feeding just play safe heal and only dmg to clean up. But watching these high rank moira make me realise I’m way too passive in comparison. And not utilise distance enough, I do like to close distance quite a bit thinking that’ll create more panic for snipers. Also good flankers can make people so stressed it’s equivalent to a ball tracer and sombra like you can’t get rid of but constantly have to worry about it
And that is how KarQ born an evil
Old vid popped up on my page but 15:32 WHAT DID HE SAYYYY?
You could have tried to match strafe for easier shot?
Just as effective as a cracked Tracer with 1/4 the mechanical skill :D
If you know how to use cover well Moira works well
Press the Attack
I guess the main thing is what can Moira flanking do that a damage hero couldn't? Is taking that support slot to do this more valuable than a Tracer, Genji, or Sombra doing the same thing?
An insane amount of survivability that not a single damage hero has, except maybe Sombrero. And the ability to fall back and just heal if needed
I just finally hit diamond 3 as a tictoc Moira. I'm prob 80 dps to 20 heal. But I adjust my play style from defense to offense