Yep. It's just sad that it took a terrible tragedy for them to do this. It should have been done in the first place, especially given the fact that ships sail at night, not just during the day. That's why I never could figure out why they only had part time wireless.
Greetings Davin, There is a fascinating documentary by the BBC that brilliantly took the Titanic's last night of Marconi messages and there replies from other ships and made them speak using synthesizers. Now you can listen to the tragedy of Titanic in her own words in this ingenious program. Find it on TH-cam at: C.Q.D. THIS IS TITANIC!...IN HER OWN WORDS. BBC RADIO DOCUMENTARY. 2012.mp4
SOS was used before but the White Star Line hadn't yet adopted it. It is sad that a disaster of that magnitude is required for the people in charge of regulations to finally realize the need of a common frame of operations, it seems obvious to us now but we (humans) are surprisingly reluctant to change even in the face of reality (cough.. fossil fuels.. cough).
Unfortunately, one of the survivors a young girl back then, said in a documentary I saw yesterday, that she could very clearly see a ship, not far away, not just distant lights, but very very close to them. She was still surprised why they never came to their aid.
@@Dowell318 He didn't. At least Californian's operator said he didn't. The message fro Titanic was to clear the frequency. The Californian operator simply switched off at the end of his shift.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 You're incorrect on that. The Titanic told the Californian "''Shut up, shut up! I am busy!", seconds before she hit the iceberg. Historical fact. Get your facts right.
@@Dowell318 Don't be a fool. Communications at the time were in morse, and operators used a form of shorthand to speed up their messages. Phillips' message was probably nothing more than DDD, or 'clear the frequency.' If you think Marconi Operators at the time were always polite & well-mannered, you have a romantic idea about how 20 year olds actually behaved. Being curt with their transmissions was the norm.
@@Dowell318Do some research next time fool. Titanics wireless operators were heroes, and if it weren't for they're efforts that night there may have been no survivors and then we'd truly know nothing about this disaster.
Lack of regulations really affected the disaster. The Californian only had one wireless operator, who naturally couldn’t be expected to work the machine 24/7. Therefore, when the distress signal was sent out, the operator was in bed asleep. If the regulations had stipulated an operator be on duty 24/7, they would’ve heard the call and have been able to help out.
@@shukhada6664 Do you know that majority of messages are actually from Steerage? Stop your envy cloud your judgement. Richest man on the ship and all rich men stayed back and let women and children take the life boats. Stop hating without logic.
“As it just so happened, the Carpathia’s wireless radio operator, 21-year-old Harold Cottam, was listening to the radio for a final few minutes while preparing for bed.” Does this sound like the Fear of Missing Out routine that in this era prompts us to check in online just before we go to sleep? Thank goodness for FOMO. It’s been saving lives for more than a century!
Considering how much went wrong before and during the sinking to the Titanic itself it's really unfortunate that the captain of the Californian gets so much blame almost to the point of it's his fault the ship dank in the first place. A LOT of things went wrong that night which is why so much changed in the wake of the disaster and are still being carried out to this day.
That doesn’t negate the fact that he saw a stalled ship, saw the rockets and ignored everything. All he had to do was turn on the head set and see if anyone was in distress. It’s not rocket science. The rocket colors/intervals have no barring. “A ship wouldn’t be sending out rocket flares for nothing” -as stated in the inquiry
all goe wrong when you ahve animals working with ypou. fist advise from california to titanic: we are stopped here cause there a lot of icebergs and vision is reduced, ,,,, titanic radio man, answered: SHUT UP,
@@mikehunt7360agreed. Why did he see flares and not turn the radio on that’s the number one question. My guess is he got p1ssed at being told to shut up and decided to prove a point and not help 🤦♂️ the other one raced there in 3 hours and hid warning signs meanwhile that douche didn’t bother to check his headset lol, it had to be deliberate
The thing that confuses me is why Captain Smith avoided any blame surely he is to blame more than anyone else he was in charge of Titanic and ignored all the ice warnings maybe he gets a pardon as he went down with the ship 🤔
@@paulthompson8467 yeah, but the captain had little psychopathic rich people influencing his decision. We’ll never know, but it would have been a good conversation to know what went through his head. Like he couldn’t possibly have fell for the unsinkable hype
The crew of the Californian clearly stated in the British Inquiry (the Wreck Commissioner's Inquiry) that they DID contact the captain numerous times that night. Captain Lord claimed he was asleep and had no direct knowledge of anything. The other Officers claimed that they did talk to him several times as the disaster was going on. Captain Lord did see another ship, but he claimed he saw only one masthead light and that the other ship could not have been the Titanic. Other officers aboard that night saw two masthead lights. One of them, I forget who, claimed that he told Captain Lord that the ship was indeed a passenger ship and that her lights went out prior to Captain Lord's seeing the ship.
the gulty is the company white star gave orders to: go fast and dont stop.thye wanted a record...like biden ruling america and europe accepting immigrnats, everything will sunk
Mornin, You have to know, that it was normal to say things like "shut up old man" on the radio in that time. The radio operator of the Californian maybe even laughed when receiving this "rude" message. It was a different time, back then. Greetings .
I know this is late but O.M is an endearing term, sign of respect, the receiver has been confirmed to have been laughing when this message was received.
Not really. Wireless operators of the time had a specific lingo much like computer geeks, or AI nuts today. Being told to "shut up" wasn't rude, it was commonly said in times when they were busy and they wanted everyone else to chill a bit.
Like the video said, they didn't prefix the message with the code to communicate with the bridge. He probably thought they were messing around as it was typical at the time. A lot of human errors tbh, but this is how accidents usually go.
Also, wireless back in the day had no volume control. The closer the transmitter was to the recipient, the louder the morse code signal that the operator heard. When the Californian transmitted pracitcally right on top of the Titanic, it was incredibly loud and jarring, hence the (tired and overworked) wireless operators' fiery response.
Not even true in the slightest. He used a shorthand which meant clear the air, and Evans even testified it wasn't a problem... maybe read the testimony first before commenting.
I thought that wireless operators were actually working for Marconi and not directly for the ships. That's why the Titanic's wireless operator was sending the messages from the passengers and not really caring about official ice warnings. All in all, this is like all tragic tales. A series of small events lead to a big disaster. Good job on video!
Indeed, they were employed by Marconi. Another reason Phillips did not heed Evans's warning was also because he had already delivered several ice warnings to the bridge that day. He probably thought, "Not this again!"-and considering Titanic's size, it seemed inconceivable for ice to bring it down.
@@StunningHistory True. So in the new safety laws, where they had to have radio on all night, and have more than one operator, is that when operators were employed by the ships?
@@StunningHistory that and he was working Cape Race. The equipment broke down the night before and Bride and Phillips stayed up all night to fix it despite it being against the rules. Caused passengers mail to get backed up.
@@Rebelheart1985 The Marconi company regulations stated that they were not to fix to the broken set and that they were to switch to the back up wireless which was weaker and thus shorter ranged than the main set.Had they done that, they would've been more reliant on the nearby ships to relay traffic and thus probably stayed in communication with Californian and Mesaba which would've in turn meant getting the critical final ice warnings.
There persists an incorrect reading of the 1912 Rules of the Road. Titanic was firing distress rockets exactly as prescribed: white rockets, or rockets of any color, fired at short intervals, was the known and accepted procedure for signaling distress at night. This was fully appreciated by the officers on watch on the Californian, Herbert Stone and James Gibson. At the BR Inquiry, Stone was asked if he was aware that rockets fired one at a time at short intervals was the appropriate method for signaling distress at sea, and he answered affirmatively, that was how he understood the Rules. There was no specific interval stated, merely "short intervals, one at a time" and that white was the color for distress. Chief Officer Stewart testified that the morning following the disaster, after he took over the watch from Stone, he had a feeling that "something had happened." When asked why he thought that, he replied "Because they were white rockets" that Stone had described.
Yes...but there were four classes of distress signals covered in the Rules of the Road: 1, a gun or other explosive signal fired at one minute intervals, 2, flames from a burning tar or oil barrel, 3, rockets or shells throwing stars of any colour or description, fired...at short intervals, and 4, a continuous sounding with any fog-signal apparatus. Titanic's "rockets" were "detonators used in lieu of signal cannon shells" which put them in class 1 - the correct use would be three shells fired at one minute intervals. If Californian had been seven miles from Titanic it would have quite plainly heard the detonations, along with the venting steam, and would have been alerted to Titanic's distress. Stone and Groves heard nothing because Californian was 20+ miles away and looking at an oil tanker, not Titanic.
@@Dianaemanuel Hi, I should have said probably, possibly looking at an oil tanker. There was a scramble to track down ships, after Moore of Mount Temple claimed to have seen a mystery ship, right where Boxhall saw his ship (according to Moore this vessel had distinctive colouring around the funnel). In the process of this investigation, four oil tankers were found to be on the same Boston track as the Californian - The Trautenfels, the Lindenfels, Niagara and The Paula. The design of oil tankers would match some of the details supplied by Gibson and Stone aboard Californian as to what they saw - suggesting a glare of light in her afterpart - tankers had their superstructure aft, behind the funnel. The inquiry soon ended the process of tracking down suitable ships, as they quickly came to the conclusion that the sea was swarming with ships that night and it would be all-but impossible to find the true culprit.
Stone's testimony to the British inquiry is a very good example of how badly treated the Californian's crew were by those proceedings - they were called as witnesses but were often treated like defendants, despite having had no time to prepare their 'cases' and having no counsel present to represent them. Stone's telling of events makes it clear that, as he saw them, the rocket flashes "were only about half the height of the steamer's masthead light and I thought rockets would go higher than that." He was right - signal rockets burst several hundred feet in the air. Other forms of signal pyrotechnics - roman candles, star-throwers and so on - appeared at deck level. So Stone was seeing signals that did not readily fit either of the categories of pyrotechnic he was used to. But the questioners at the inquiry then, in a very shady bit of cross-examination, drew out from Stone the definition of distress rockets as white rockets fired at regular short intervals. Which is exactly right - that is exactly the official description of distress rockets that Stone, as a First Mate, would have had to learn and recite verbatim to a Board of Trade panel to earn his 'ticket'. But that overlooked all of Stone's previous testimony that the rockets he saw that night didn't fit that description. It made it seem that he had 'confessed' to dumbly looking at distress rockets without taking action, when the crux of the matter was that the men on the bridge of the Californian that night were very unsure what they were seeing. Stone testified to seeing white rockets, bursting below the height of the vessel's masthead lamp, at intervals ranging from five to seven minutes. That's not any form of distress signal known to mariners in 1912. I'm very partial to the theory that there was some serious atmospheric distortion going on that night due to the combination of cold weather, clear skies and freakishly calm seas. The horizon was hard to discern, with the bright and perfect reflection of stars making it hard to tell where the sea ended and the sky began. It's very likely that the iceberg was hidden in this mirage/distortion from the lookouts and watchkeepers on the Titanic until they were virtually on top of it. As far as the Californian is concerned, I believe that what they were seeing was a mirage of the Titanic's lights, lifted above the true horizon and distorted by refraction in the layer of low-altitude cold air. In more normal conditions, I suspect the Titanic would not have been visible from the Californian at all. That's why Gibson thought the ship 'looked queer', why it was impossible to make sense of the Titanic's signal lamp messages and why no-one on the Californian reported hearing either the loud 'bangs' of her signal rockets or the noise of her safety valves lifting, despite this noise going on for nearly half an hour and being painfully, deafeningly loud for those on the ship: in reality the ships were much further apart than they appeared. What Stone was seeing was the Titanic's signal rockets shooting up through the mirage (they were required to rise up 600-800 feet by the regulations) - he was seeing the 'real' image of the rocket flash alongside the 'false' image of the Titanic's lights, raised above the true horizon as a mirage. That's why the flashes appeared to go no higher than half the height of the Titanic's masthead light (which was 145ft above the waterline, so the rockets would be going only a tenth as high as they should), and why Stone did not conclude that he was seeing distress signals. Like a lot of the events on the Californian that night, the rest of the ship's (in)actions can be chalked down to their lack of hindsight. They'd seen a ship approach from the east, stop at the edge of the ice field (just as they themselves had done), ignore their signal lamp, fire off some unspecific rockets, possibly flash some unintelligible lamps signals and then move away over the horizon. At what point in that sequence should the alarm bells started ringing?
Greetings Ship Geek, Again, I am so much impressed with your very professional, and smooth delivery, in reporting the history of notable ships. More so, since you claim nothing more than being a "hobbyist" in your avocation of ship historian. Thank you again for another fine ship history [of Californian]. It is a worthy installment to my Titanic archive. In my studies of ship history over the years, here is an interesting observation. British Leyland ships, from roughly 1854 to 1921, perhaps 98% of her ship's names ended in "ian". Assyrian, Bavarian, Cyrenian, Naperian, Scythian, &etc. They also named some with "an", such as Welshman, Texan, Jamaican, &etc. Most White Star line's ships had names ending in "ic" as in Titanic, Olympic, Nomadic, Adriatic, Laurentic, &etc. from 1870 to 1932 when they merged with Cunard. Cunard ship names roughly between 1870 and 1955 can be identified by names ending in "ia": Carpathia, Aurania, Mauretania, Lusitania, Scythia, &etc. And so it goes with many of the historic lines of ships. You can most often "ID" the company just by the ship's name.
@@travisbickle4360 it’s alright. Both ships are relatively smaller than the Titanic and both have a single funnel. Those kind of ships were a dime a dozen in those times.
It's common to react to our failures. On the bad side, the California didn't react to the Titanic until it was too late. But we learned from our mistakes and have saved many more lives than were lost on that fateful night.
I think it's worth exploring the theory that the Titanic and the Californian were over each other's horizons, and only able to see one another through a mirage effect. That would explain why they were unable to communicate via morse lamp, though both ships tried.
The light refraction also scrambled Titanics distress signals. The cold water mirages distorted her shape. They do the same for ice bergs 1:07 It was cloaked. It had sailed from the icy Labrador current inti the Gulf stream. She was right at the current border. It was nature's killing zone.
There's one thing about the seemingly rude answer of Phillips that most people get wrong. Because they take it by today's standards. Back in the day, it was very common for wireless operators to tell each other "to shut up" when they were busy working a station. It was fast, straight to the point and not considered to be rude. More often than not it was just banter between colleagues. To give some perspective on how informally wireless operators talked to each other, back then the phrase "GTH OM QRL" (Go to hell old man, [shut up] I'm busy) was frequently used to tell others to keep out of their communications. Phillips didn't say it that way, but it gives an insight in how they talked to each other. What Phillips said wasn't considered to be rude, and Evans even stated that in the Titanic inquiry: 8998. Commissioner: "In ordinary Marconi practice is that a common thing to be asked (said)?" Evans: - Yes. And you do not take it as an insult or anything like that. Evans also stated that, after this conversation, he still stayed up for a while and listened to Phillips' messages to Cape Race, before going to bed. It had nothing to do with Phillips being "rude", because he wasn't.
With only Phillips head had insomnia, as we know, it was seemingly chance, or, as I like to think Providence, that the operator on Carpathia heard the messages. If not, how long with those people have been in those lifeboats. I believe two other ships knew the Titanic was sinking, so I assume they eventually would have arrived, may be only a few hours after Carpathia.
How fortunate, then, that Captain Rostron had rather more understanding of the code of the sea, and didn't simply say 'We are too far away. I'm going back to bed.'
Very interesting video, nicely done! Really makes us realize how important are standard procedures and regulations when a new technology becomes popular.
@@litamtondy 16 miles at most according to Captain Lord's own log. Absolutely too far to row for inexperienced passengers for sure but clearly in visual range.
There's actually a different theory to the shut up message. The Californian being closer than cape point meant that it's messages came through extremely loudly and jack Philips was both overwhelmed and caught off guard by the loud transmission blaring through. That and that the wireless operators of the day were known for being crude and telling each other to "shut up" and "get to hell" all the time. Jack Philips actually told Bruce Ismay to get to hell while helping with lifeboats and it came up in the congressional hearings. The radio operators of the day were very informal and often more rude in a joking sort of way. Compare it to cb radio chatter or online game lobbies today and that gives a much better idea of what was going on. Mistakes were certainly made but to Monday night quarterback them to the standards out in place as a result of them isn't fair to the people who lived through and made them.
True. "Go to hell" and "shut up" - was casual and friendly. Tongue in cheek amongst operators. This video, ironically, continues to perpetuate the myth of the "irritated operator" and "asshole operator."
@@KathrynsWorldWildfireTracking False, Philips & Bride were still in the wireless room sending messages when Ismay was helping with the boats when Philips & Bride were told by Cpt Smith that they had done all, they could, they could now try and save themselves time approx 02:10am by this time Ismay was already off the ship in a lifeboat.
People often neglect that Californian had released its steam and settled. It would have taken around 90 mins just to work up propulsion, and another 1-2 hours to approach Titanic. Lifeboats took about 40 mins to deploy. It could have done little good…
@@mariamatheson5300 no one is arguing that they shouldn’t have tried. It’s just that they can’t be held responsible for the deaths of titanic passengers as widely believed.
@@mariamatheson5300 neither was captain smith. Sometimes things happen without a person to blame. Smith did everything required of contemporary best practices, and much more. They altered well south of an already very southerly route to avoid ice, and ensured there were multiple lookouts. He could not have known that the backlog of Marconi messages prevented him from getting ice warnings. He could not have known that cold water mirage, a phenomenon only documented much later, could have prevented his lookouts from spotting ice in time.
According to officers Boxhall and Pitman, Titanic was pointing west as she sank - Californian was to the north. The ship seen from Titanic was directly ahead, on the other side of the ice field. This position puts the ship Mount Temple as being the most likely candidate for the mystery ship - she was found at the scene of the crime at dawn by the Carpathia. The Californian was nowhere to be seen until 8 a.m.
The Titanic was pointing NORTH. The Mount Temple was almost 50 miles away when she got Boxhall's 41. 46 N 51.14 W, which we now know is INCORRECT. The Californian was facing South South East and was turning Starboard all night and the Titanic was also turning all night. The Californian was the mystery ship. The two men on the watch testified they saw the 8 rockets in the British Inquiry. Californian Apprentice Gibson testified that he "didn't think that steamer was firing rockets at sea for nothing. and something must be the matter with her." He also testified that Second officer Stone who also had the watch said, "There is a big side out of the water." I might have the 2 men's testimony swapped, but that is what they said. Stone testified that the ship "disappeared." around 2:05am. The Californian's Ship time or ATS was 12 minutes slower than the Titanic. Add 12 minutes and you get the Titanic's ship time/ATS as 2:17 am, just as the lights went out on the Titanic and then the ship breaks apart and "disappears." It was the Californian who was the mystery ship. They got there at about 8-830 because earlier that morning they had found out the Titanic , the ship their Midnight watch saw go down, had sank.
@@TitanicHorseRacingLover Titanic was pointing WEST. Boxhall was there, on the bridge, standing next to Captain Smith, with both of them periodically consulting the binnacle right in front of them, and so we may reasonably assume were consulting each other. To say anything else is to say that both Boxhall and Smith were wholly incompetent, both individually and collectively (Pitman too). I know a lot of self-published Titanic "experts" have made a career out of effectively besmirching Boxhall's reputation, but he was there and he was a highly experienced navigator; they weren't there and have laughable nautical credentials. I shall let Boxhall's inquiry testimony speak for itself: Senator FLETCHER. Apparently that ship came within 4 or 5 miles of the Titanic, and then turned and went away in what direction, westward or southward? Mr. BOXHALL. I do not know whether it was southwestward. I should say it was westerly. Senator FLETCHER. In westerly direction; almost in the direction which she had come? Mr. BOXHALL. Yes, sir. Titanic pointed WEST. Californian could not be the mystery ship. I now point you towards the affidavit of Dr. Quitzrau, a passenger aboard Mount Temple, who described what he heard the officers and crew say about what really went on aboard the ship on the night of the sinking.
@@tranceguide9752 No. Titanic was pointing NORTH. The Californian WAS the mystery ship. 2nd Officer Herbert Stone testified at the British Inquiry he saw a total of 8 rockets. Apprentice Gibson of the Californian said he saw 8 rockets. Both of them said that the vessel's "lights looked queer ' and Gibson said he saw a big side out of the water, and they testified that "something must be the matter with her (the vessel they saw.' Why the idiot Stone didn't realize the ship he saw was in distress, I don't know. Anyway, the Californian saw 8 rockets. The Titanic fired 8 rockets. The rules were "firing of stars or shells of ANY COLOR at few minutes intervals were distress.' That is what Stone and Gibson were seeing. Why Stone didn't go to the Captain's chartroom and INSIST that he come to the deck or Why Captain Lord did not come to the deck himself when first told of the rockets, I don't know. However, those men on the Californian's watch saw the 8 rockets that the TITANIC fired. There was no ship in between. Besides, the Mount Temple arrived about an hour and a half or so AFTER the Titanic sank.
@@TitanicHorseRacingLover Titanic pointed WEST: Boxhall, who was there, on the bridge, says she pointed west - it's as simple as that. The eye-witness observation of a single trained officer on the bridge outweighs ANY and ALL conjecture and supposition from armchair theorists, no matter how many there are. Boxhall and Pitman constitute TWO eyewitness officers. I repeat, Boxhall's observations represent those of himself AND Capt. Smith - it really defies belief the extent of the misplaced arrogance of the people who ignore Boxhall, Pitman and Smith on this. There is also ample passenger eye-witness testimony (Lawrence Beesley most notable of whom) that states Titanic resumed course for a good ten minutes after the collision: if you resume course, you head west. A crucial point to emphasise is that Titanic and Californian were in different shipping lanes. Titanic was on the southern, New York track and Californian was in the Boston track, 20 to 30 miles to the north. Californian was stationary and 20+ miles away in the Boston shipping lane. Titanic was in the New York track. For Californian to be the mystery ship, either Titanic or Californian (or both) would have to have left their respective shipping lanes which would have been a suicidal act of gross incompetence. There were four classes of distress signals covered in the Rules of the Road: 1, a gun or other explosive signal fired at one minute intervals, 2, flames from a burning tar or oil barrel, 3, rockets or shells throwing stars of any colour or description, fired...at short intervals, and 4, a continuous sounding with any fog-signal apparatus. Titanic's "rockets" were "detonators used in lieu of signal cannon shells" which put them in class 1 - the correct use would be three shells fired at one minute intervals. If Californian had been seven miles from Titanic it would have quite plainly heard the detonations, along with the venting steam, and would have been alerted to Titanic's distress. Stone and Groves heard nothing because Californian was 20+ miles away and looking at an oil tanker, not Titanic. If Titanic fired 8 rockets, the officers are guilty of gross negligence - they were obliged to send up three one minute detonators every 15 or 20 minutes - 8 rockets = 2 and 2/3 distress signals. The 8 rocket figure is an invention of Lord Mersey, Boxhall doesn't know how many rockets he sent up and remember there were two parties sending up rockets. Beesley recounts seeing the first three rockets go up in quick succession - there is nothing in eye-witness accounts to show that there was a peculiar absence of detonators sent up. As far as Stone and Groves were concerned, they saw private signal flares sent up by a fishing boat. They did not see three - one minute distress signals and certainly did not hear the accompanying detonations. Any ship with 5 to 10 miles would have plainly HEARD Titanic send up detonators and vent steam. Any ship with 2-10 miles would have plainly SEEN Titanic - a blaze of lights. Any ship STATIONARY from 10.30 p.m. to 6 a.m. within 10 miles of Titanic's position, would have been seen at daybreak by Rostron of Carpathia. Rostron is quite emphatic: Californian was NOWHERE IN SIGHT until 8 a.m. Mount Temple was found at the scene of the crime (to the west of the ice field on the New York track) at daybreak.
Titanic pointed NORTH as per her wreck site. This is proven fact. Mt. Temple is NOT the mystery ship per Captain Moore's logs. Per Captain Lord's logs, Californian is the ONLY ship that due north of Titanic. How did she point WEST when she swung due north after port ROUNDING the iceberg and her wreck bears this out? Plus her lights and Californians clearly matches each others' testimony.
Oceanliner Designs & Illustration did a good video about the Titanic's wireless operator (Jack Phillips). It's not what you think. What comes across as short and rude today was just how wireless operators (cranks) talked to each other back then. It was basically playful banter, and was to be expected. Things like GTH OM QRL (get to hell old man, shut up I'm busy) were fairly common messages that they'd send to one another back then. It wasn't meant to be rude or hateful.
that wireless operator is the real hero actually. his fact action and quick thinking brought the carpathia to the rescue. or else more would have perished
@@HarmlessPota2 him aswell. In the frozen Atlantic Ocean under the darkness of the night sky,not even moon light apparently, just so the owners of the shipping company can boast that they got to New York ahead of schedule….clearly the captain had a cash incentive to do so, can only be the reason.
I honestly had no idea there was another ship somewhat close to the Titanic when it sunk until today watching this, I thought it was completely alone in the Atlantic
Apparently, there were 8 other ships on Atlantic that night along with Titanic including Carpethia. All of them were 40-150 miles roughly away from Titanic.
From what I've seen in documentaries, that shipping lane was extremely popular. That's one of the reasons why Titanic was not outfitted with enough lifeboats for everyone on board (besides being unsinkable). At that time it was thought that they just needed boats to shuttle passengers and crew to another ship in the area. It may or may not be true but maybe made sense at the time.
During her construction not only did moving her boiler destroy the road but Dundee Harbour is built on top of the Dundee vaults with actually collapsed causing a fair few issues The Dundee vaults are whats left of the very old town back in the 1500s a tsunami hit and destroyed the harbour and so they built me streets above the old
Another reason why the Evans' warnings nearly blew out Jack Phillip's eardrums, forcing him to tell Evans to shut up? The Californian was nearby. This tragedy, like so many, could have been averted.
No. The Californian was stopped, its boilers cold, due to being surrounded by icebergs and packed ice on a moonless night with almost zero visibility. Any1, who claims, the Californian couldve made it in time, count on the assumption, that Californian was no further away than the closest estimate, 10 nautical miles, which is at best a guess. Furthermore, they assume, that the Californian wouldve started toward the Titanic immidiately at full speed, something that was impossible. Californian would first have to fire up its boilers, something u cant just do in a few minutes, it wouldve taken quite a lot of time. Nor could she have gone full speed through an icefield with no visibility. When the conditions of the Californian and her surroundings at the time is taken into account, even the best estimate doesnt have her at Titanics position until 2 hours AFTER the sinking. At that point, any1 not in a lifeboat would be long dead in the freezing water. Ofc, that doesnt mean, they shouldnt have tried. And had Captain Lord known, he definitely would have. He and his crew followed the rules at the time. Sure, the officers on duty shouldve woken up Lord, or at least woken up the wireless operator. Possibly they didnt even think of it, since having a wireless onboard was so new. In hindsight, they shouldve ignored the rules and trusted their instincts. Yes, there was some fault with Captain Lord and his crew, but he was not the villain, he was made out to be. Nothing is ever black or white, everything is somewhere in between. So is this. And regardless of where any of we desk jockeys come out on Captain Lord and the Californian, it doesnt change the fact, that Californian couldnt have changed anything, that happened that night. There was no averting this tragedy. Once the Titanic struck that iceberg, nothing could change the outcome.
@@dfuher968 I believe it could've helped at least, as opposed to doing nothing. If it bothered to send the correct Master's Service Gram (MSG) the disaster would never have happened, and we wouldn't be here talking about it over 100 hundred years later.
@@abloogywoogywoo - From what I've read, whether the Titanic received or did not receive ice warnings by radio did not make any difference. The officers already knew they could expect to see ice, and Lightoller had remarked on the fall in sea temperature that evening and warned the lookouts to watch for ice. Being a prestige express liner sailing on a clear night with perfect visibility, they would not have slowed down unless they had actually sighted danger ahead. The trouble was they were overconfident of their ability to see a berg in time. I agree with Dfuher: whatever the Californian did that night would not have changed the disaster, but Captain Lord should still have taken action to find out what was going on.
@@dfuher968 Californian's boilers were not cold. They were kept to a low level so that heat and electricity could be maintained. It certainly would've taken time, about 30 minutes, to get them back up to sufficient steam to get underway at minimal speed. But at least they would be trying to do something and the arrival of Californian could've saved at least a dozen lives of those who perished sitting in the lifeboats due to exposure. In the right circumstances, Californian could've arrived just immediately after Titanic sank and perhaps saved a few dozen more out of the water as some people lasted up to almost an hour after the sinking before succumbing. Also, Lord curiously when heading to assist the Carpathia, he took a rather odd circuitous, twisting route that was towards Titanic's CQD position. This added time and had Lord responded when he could see Titanic's lights and rockets to follow, they no doubt would've gotten there a lot quicker. So well under an hour's time once they were under full speed.
Lack of regulations on wireless radio resulted in the Californian's inaction. Lack of regulations on the number of lifeboats required resulted in the deaths of Titanic passengers.
@@dwlopez57 Yeah, I heard about that. I watched an interview from a male passenger in a 1960s video. He said that during the first few minutes, people didn't want to go in the lifeboats because it looked more dangerous than to stay on board. However when the ship started to tilt and it became obvious that the ship was indeed sinking, this is when people started to panic. Still, if they had good regulations, they would have informed the passengers that they needed to board the lifeboats, and that Titanic was slowly but definitely sinking.
@@reinerbraun670 It's bit more complex even than that. The difference in interpretation between those in charge of launching the boats in regards to Captain Smith's "women and children first" order. Lightoller interpreting it to mean women and children only and Murdoch in that if no women or children were left in a boat's vicinity, then men could board. Lightoller may well be responsible for hundreds of deaths since when some men could not board, their wives and families would not leave them.
Actually, the number of boats wouldn’t have mattered. They didn’t have time to launch all the boats properly, Collapsibles A and B were floated off because there was no time to lower them.
Or they simply failed to help thinking they didn’t actually need help, it could’ve been tiredness lack of sleep inexperience idk but clearly something was wrong with this ship and they failed to pick up on it
0:55 Over the years I have read so many theories to justify the inaction of the Californian to the Rockets fired from the deck of the Titanic. You explain the theory of "incorrect intervals". I also read that Captain Lord perhaps thought the white rockets were "company rockets". Used by ships from the same company to communicate with each other. I have GREAT sympathy for the soul of Stanley Lord, but he should have ordered his wireless operator (Cyril Evans) awake on that fateful evening. Rockets at sea, at THAT time of night....and he didn't even turn on his radio? He should have stretched a little bit....even if he could not have saved those people he would have went to his grave with a clean conscious.
I agree, but with the benefit of 110 years of hindsight, it all seems so simple and clear cut. Radio technology was very new, and perhaps Lord did not fully appreciate the ability he had at his fingertips. The resulting changes to the maritime laws seem so obvious with that same hindsight, yet they were not law at the time of Titanic’s sinking.
Captain Lord's conscience was fine, it's just his reputation that suffered. Californian was stopped for the night, so they would have taken additional time to wake up crew, build up the steam and then maneuver slowly between icebergs. The result, they arrive too late and now they would be the ship that took too long. They were going to end as the villains of this story, anyway.
@@Sheilawisz No. If Lord had seen or been told about those rockets and then IMMEDIATELY ordered his engineers to fire up the boilers to get under way to head to the Titanic no matter if took 2 days to get there no one would have blamed Lord for getting there late. But the fact that the rockets were completely ignored is why he is vilified.
One thing is certain about the British Inquiry (The Wreck Commissioner's Inquiry): The British Board Of Trade was looking for a place to divert attention from them. They didn't like having to take all the blame for the lack of enough lifeboats. Ernest Gill's allegations, combined with the testimony and evidence presented at the Inquiry, was certainly some place to divert attention. This documentary doesn't mention Ernest Gill. He was a coal stoker, called Donkeyman, on the Californian. He was allegedly paid $500 to tell the American Press that the Californian saw the Titanic and did nothing. His allegations got the Californian into all that trouble.
It’s easy to say that but we don’t know how often ships would send up rockets back then. The Californian thought they were company signals, I would imagine that rockets were fairly frequently sent up by ships.
@@EaglesNest1986 We do know as it was clearly spelled out by rules of the road at the time. And no, pyrotechnics were controlled and not sent up "fairly frequently" as you claim. Based on absolutely nothing.
Whatever the case, if Lord were such a great captain, he should have had the sense to, at the very least, investigate; and no officer or wireless operator should have been intimidated or afraid to voice their opinion. If rockets are being systematically fired, there has to be a reason. If a ship appears to be listing, mirage or no mirage, there has to be a reason. He could have covered the short distance. Captain Rostron of the Carpathian at least tried. He was a hero. Lord deserves his rotten reputation.
Yes 100% on all points! He ignored CLEAR distress signs that night... Carpathia didn't. Lord isn't going to give you a medal for defending him.... he's dead. Who cares? He was negligent, Rostron wasn't.
Ballard said the Californian could have been as close as 4.5 miles away. And the comment that the Californian was 17 miles away can't possibly be true. You can only see something 12 miles away before the earth curves too much and they are beyond the horizon. All testimony clearly said people on both Californian and Titanic could see the running lights of the other ship.
Unless of course there was another "mystery ship" between the 2. How many people onboard the Titanic would know the ship they could see was the Californian whether 4.5 or 19 miles away
@@VRTrucker The Carpathia would have known exactly where the Californian was when they arrived, and Ballard of course knew where the Titanic was so, so it's not hard to figure out that Stanley Lord was very close with the Californian.
The person responsible for the Titanic's sinking was its captain, John Smith. Had he slowed the ship down, when alerted about the presence of ice bergs, this catastrophe could have been avoided.
The way Smith acted was considered standard practice for the time. If you are going to criticise Smith, then you would have to criticise every other captains. At the subsequent enquiries, several other captains testified that they would have done the same thing in Captain Smith's position. Smith had already altered the ship's course to a more southernly route in an attempt to avoid the ice. You have to remember that Titanic was a major passenger liner with a strict schedule to keep and slowing down or stopping was not an option. Contrary to popular belief Titanic was not at full speed at the time of the collision as not all her boilers had been lit.
@@reneeparker7475 Read the transcripts from the enquiries. I can't provide online links because I read this information from many different books by respected Titanic authors and historians. I am not trying to say that Smith was blameless, I'm simply saying he acted in accordance with how things were back then. One of the reasons they didn't slow down was because it is easier to manoeuvre a ship when it is moving at speed. It looks really bad today because we have the benefit of hindsight and are looking at things through 21st century eyes, but this happened 111 years ago and standards and practices were very different back then.
@@robertmcalpine488 I have read them. I also know that the captain of any ship is responsible for that ship and all aboard her. Smith was under pressure from Bruce Ismay to set a new sailing record between Europe and America, and he caved.
@@reneeparker7475 That is one of the biggest myths about Titanic, under no circumstances were they trying to set a speed record for crossing the Atlantic, it wasn't physically possible. The Olympic class ships were several knots slower than the Cunard liners and could never have hoped to beat them. In the very competitive market against Cunard, White Star's focus and USP was on size and luxury and not speed. At no point during the voyage was Titanic at full speed, since several of her boilers had not been lit. It's also worth remembering that in an attempt to avoid the ice, Smith had altered the ship's course to a more southernly, and thus longer route.
That night inApril 1912 the captains of those three ships (Titanic, Californian and the Carpathia) did different things. The Captain of the Californian decided that he didn't like the idea of continuing through the ice field in the dark and stopped his ship until morning. The Captain of the Titanic continued at full speed until it hit an iceberg and sank killing over 1500 people. The Captain of the Carpathia steamed at full speed towards and into a known ice field that had already sunk the Titanic and missed the icebergs mostly by chance. Which ship and Captain would you prefer to cross the Atlantic with?
Add to this the fact that the Californian did not have watertight compartments like the Titanic. If it leaked in even one place, it would sink very fast.
Titanic actually had been steered further south to avoid the ice that had blocked in Californian as when Captain Smith did get ice messages, he took them seriously. But what many people don't know is that the main Marconi wireless set broke down on Saturday the day before the sinking and instead of following the Marconi company rules and switching over to the weaker back up set, Phillips and McBride spent around 6 hours working to fix the main one. This lead to the huge backlog that resulted in a number of critical messaged not being set to the Titanic's bridge and it also lead to the stress that resulted in Evans being told off.
@@saturn1188 Source? Watertight compartments were nothing new and while it may not have had automatic doors like Titanic's the crew could certainly have closed the doors manually to seal compartments.
Sure is! He was the one who just accidentally heard the Titanic’s distress call and didn’t buy the insults the officers on deck gave him when he informed them about it.
This may sound dark and perhaps misplaced , but in a way the sinking of the Titanic has forced safety regulations to be reviewed not only on the sinking vessel (more life boats) but also procedures for rescuing ships ( colored signal flares at fast intervals ) . Instead of growing a doctrine of overconfidence in a ships reliability to not sink.
Isn’t that what always happen when a disaster happens, new regulations are made, mainly as a liability from lawsuits not cause they actually care about people but to try and save their own a**es from legal trouble/action
The very idea that Captain Lord blithely declined to become a hero by merely steaming ten miles is pure nonsense. If he'd known, he would have gone in. On the other hand, he had the brains not to try 22 knots with ice warnings about.
In the morning when Captain Lord found out about the tragedy of Titanic, he sailed over to the site to help out. He asked Captain Rostron of the Carpathia if he needed any help taking on some passengers, and Rostron told him that they didn't need any help, but look to see if there were any more possible survivors. Lord and the Californian searched for several hours to if there was any survivors in the area. If anything, Lord tried to help too. It was his ship that warned Titanic. After Carpathia, it was the Californian that came to help. The other ships, after they heard Titanic sunk, went about their business. No one ship decided to come to the wreck area and keep searching for any potential survivors with the Californian.
wow I guessed you haven't done enough research about the SS Californian and its crew, Stanley Lord and his crew knew the rockets the Titanic shoot were distress rockets, Lord insisted if they were company rockets. You should research the full US and British inquiry about the SS Californian and how they threw away the log book to destroy the real evidence of how they ignored the Titanic that night.
@@newtonsthirdlawofmot bullshit. They thought they were celebration rockets and were confused because they weren’t being shot the way it was recommended. They weren’t consistent with them.
@@Rebelheart1985 wow you also haven't done your research lol. Go read the full British and US inquiry. The Californian admitted that the rockets they saw wasn't being sent up for fun. The Titanic fired a total of 8 rockets at an intervals of every two minutes also mentioned in the inquiry. You talking about not being consistent? Please do your research first before you defend the Stanley Lord for his condemning act of not helping another steamer in distress. PS he paid for that for the rest of his life and I bet you didn't know that too because you haven't done your research lol
I wonder how he felt after knowing that 1500 people died that night. Not that all the blame should be put on him, but it goes to show how much human carelessness cost. So much went wrong when it shouldn’t have. It was completely avoidable. That’s what makes the Titanic’s story so sad and frustrating.
I am 63 and had a friend who was on the Californian when he was a boy. He had a story to tell as a boy and back then didn’t get much attention. He told me about running all over the ship, even the engine rooms and up to the bridge. He told how the message came on the radio and the operator told the captain. He said they all were laughing and saying they must be having a heck of a party. It was after a few messages that they then changed course just to make sure they weren’t joking. My friend wrote a few articles in our local newspaper that I have been trying to look up.
@@becca-dn4vs Crossing an ocean isn't like following a road. The wind, weather, currents all determine the ships course of travel. Ships don't travel on a certain line even if they have the same destination. Checking on the Titanic took them several miles off course. Once they turned toward the Titanic they didn't change course. Hope this helps
Yup, ships certainly became required to have more radio operators with at least one listening at all times in order to keep watch for distress calls 24/7.
Do you have an opinion on the controversy you'd be willing to express either in the comments of this video or privately? I'd be interested to know how the family feels about it after all these years since the Titanic disaster.
The Titanic was at least 17 to 20 nautical miles, and the cool air generated Fata Morgana or positive mirage, which makes things far away look much closer. By the time that Califorina had built up steam, it would have been too late to arrive before Titanic sunk. It only had a maximum speed of 12 knots so would old have taken over an hour to an hour and a half to reach the Titanics position. Sad is the fact that the Titanic radio operator did not allow the Califoria's radio operator to transmitt his full ice warning message, the arrogant bastard paid for this with his life and the lives of his fellow crew members, more than likely. Surely hazard warnings take priority over civil traffic, I bet it did after titanic sinking.
The California had stopped because the icebergs were such a severe danger, but they start seeing flares go up left and right, and it doesn't occur to anyone to turn the radio back on? What the hell did they think flarers were for? It's not Monday morning quarterbacking to say they were clearly negligent. Whether they could have gotten there in time for a rescue, does nothing to change that the California damn well should have tried
They were very curious about what was going on, but Captain Lord still didn’t want to try navigating the dense iceberg fields while it was still dark which is why he didn’t even bother to have his radio operator awakened to check on the messages until around sunrise when it was too late.
Yep, this exactly. He ignored clear distress signs, was not surrounded by icebergs as he later claimed, and made it down within easy time according to Carpathia.
I don't blame Captain Lord. He was tired and trying to get some sleep, and his ship was safe and stopped in pack ice. I blame the officers on watch, who had a feeling that something wasn't right. They should have awoke Evans to take a listen to his headset, to see if anything was amiss... But they didn't...
Agree. Evans should have been awakened to contact "that ship firing rockets." Whether Californian realistically could have done anything remains unanswerable. Titanic was 55 minutes into its predicament before firing its first rocket. It had about an hour left. Californian would've had to get up steam and pick its way through field ice to reach it, covering up to 10 miles of sea. Not a lot of realistic hope.
Agree, the more I learn about it, I feel the crew lied and threw the blame on Captain Lord to deflect their actions. There was also a lot of confusion about the rockets and the maritime rules. Captain Lord was the scapegoat for the company.
@@RawOlympia I agree. Had it steamed over, even if it arrived after Titanic sank under, it could have picked up the people in the water and saved a lot of lives before they all froze to death. It could have been a real difference maker. Nice to know that apathy is not a uniquely modern human trait....
Radio officers on smaller ships were not required to stand watch 24 hours a right up to the end of radio telegraph at sea in 1999. The bridge The bridge was required to guard the life boat frequency 2182KHZ and channel 16 on VHF.. It's important to remember that in 1912 radio at sea was new and not completely integrated into a normal part of a ships crew. The operators on the Titanic were Marconi men not Radio Officer's in the role as regulations would later require. The change was a direct result of the loss of the Titanic.
My fact-checker sent it to me from a Reddit user (credited in the lower left of the screen with the plan). If you would like the photo, send me an email at shipgeektv@gmail.com and I'll forward it.
Because the recognition of rockets color coding.. SS Calfornian' s crew saw that rocket ( White Rockets ) And they thought it was an Partying or Celebration ahead.
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial Except white rockets were the ones used for distress sugnals at the time. Titanic carried 36 Socket Signals. White rockets with explosive heads.
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial No... they did not. Read the testimonies... NO one thought it was celebratory at freakin' 1 AM.... come on man... this is basic.
Is it correct that she carried no passengers on this trip and had a cargo of 3000 blankets and woollen jumpers? Also that some time before this incident captain Lord was commended for transferring 1000 people from one ship to another in the night in under 1 hour?
I’ll never understand why the captain wouldn’t wake the wireless operator and at least have him check in with the Titanic to see if everything is ok, even if the flares weren’t “shot at the right intervals.” What did they think Titanic was shooting them for? A bloody firework show?!
At the time it was usual for a ship to throw flares just to indicate what company they work for. After the sinking, flares can just be use to signaling for help.
Sounds like firework shows were common at the time. As for the wireless operator, this was the first trip with one. The Cap't probably didn't think of him and responded to try to contact the ship. They couldn't get the Titanic to answer the signals.
@@annabellelee4535 I highly doubt the Californian didn’t have a wireless operator prior to this trip. How did the captain try to contact Titanic without wireless? I know he saw the flares and disregarded them because they were “not used properly.” If the Californian had come to Titanics aid hundreds of lives would have been saved.
@@braydenlovetere4545 That's what I've read. I've been studying the Titanic since I was a child. Wireless was very new in 1912. Many ships didn't have wireless and many ships were like the Californian and only had one which meant limited hours. The Californian was stuck in an ice field, they were going nowhere. Pity Smith wasn't as good a captain as Lord. If Lord was in control of the Titanic, the ship would have made it safely to NY because Lord didn't speed through ice fields. Did you know a few days before another ship hit an iceberg in the same area and limped to NY? Smith knew it was dangerous.
@@braydenlovetere4545 The Californian only contacted the Titanic on that trip. Where do you read that they were in contact before since this was the Titanic's first trip? How could they be in contact on prior trips?
CQD (Come Quick Distress) was the standard wireless call for help. SOS (Save Our Souls) was only introduced during the International Radiotelegraph Convention (1906). SOS was a relatively new call and Titanic's wireless operators used both CQD and SOS on April 14th, 1912.
These anagrams have nothing to do with what they actually meant. SOS was just integrated as an easier way to signal for help aside from the complicated CQD.
I know. Some people told me it would have taken her an hour to warm up her engines, and another hour to get there. Other people have told me differently, but I suppose we'll never really know how far away she really was.
@RMS_CarpathiaOfficial the Japanese sank it and shot at my grampa while he was in the water. Totally breaking the rules of war... but he survived. Most phenomenal human being I've ever met.
There is a great video from Oceanliner designs, that talks about the wireless messenger on ships at this time and why the Titanic's messenger told the other to shut up. It was how they talked to each other. That wasn't him being rude or hurtful or anything it was how wireless operators talked to one another over the wireless.
I believe that Captain Lord was genuinely mistaken as to what he seen that night. I believe that had he received solid confirmation, he would indeed have aided Titanic. There were certainly "grey areas" that night. But surely if there was any degree of uncertainty, or discussion amongst the officers of Californian, the wireless apparatus should surely have been switched back on?? As a precaution if nothing else?
Yes.. .he was genuinely mistaken. He was tired and suffering from confirmation bias. His own wireless operator told him Titanic was the only ship in wireless range, yet he claimed that wasn't Titanic, and a steamer more his own size. Therefore, not in wireless range, probably didn't even have wireless and could only communicate via Morse lamp. He tried this, but was well over the 5 mile range for it, so that further confirmed in his mind just a small steamer incapable of communication. Why he ignored CLEAR distress rockets that night? I don't know... I'm still negligent no matter how I spin it in my favor. All he asked were are they company signals? Response was they were white rockets... that, according to the rules of the road at the time, are distress signals. He went back to sleep and decided oh well... whatever. I tried to explain this about a hundred ways myself... and I'm still negligent for ignoring signals. It didn't help that his story kept changing after the fact either. About five times no less. So there's that too. He's either a terrible navigator, or a willing liar, but either way, doesn't look good.
It doesn't matter if it's unlikely that Californian could have made a big difference - the point is that Lord didn't try. If you see someone drowning, do you say "I don't think I can get to him before he's dead, so no point getting wet."? And how would you expect everyone to view your reasoning, even if correct? Also, most people will fall unconscious after 15 minutes but not die for 45, and under some circumstances you can go a lot longer, like the cook did. If they had arrived and lowered their boats, it seems likely they might have saved a few people - if they could save even one, it would be worth it.
Exactly! At least the most Honorable Captain Arthur of the Carpathia knew what to do. DIdn't hestitate. Pointed his ship in the right direction , asked for confirmation, let his telegrapher tell Titanic they're on their way, they were too far but she gave everything, she steamed full ahead and he was risking his own ship, avoiding 4 icebergs, and made it trhough to pick up 706 people. Cook? You mean the Chief Baker Charles Joughin
Using the language of shut up was investigated and litigated, and found to be common, friendly language of operators. Their messages should have been interpreted accurately, but that Californian operator was blamed when he should not have been
I personally do not blame Lorde, he is the scapegoat. He is the person that's easy to blame for his inaction when in reality the governing regulations were out dated. I mean Captain Rostron of the Carpatia could very well have killed all of his passengers and crew and created an even larger disaster simply due to his commands (he pushed his ship beyond the limits, and sailed at full speed in an area that had ice). In regards to Lorde, I don't think he REALLY could have helped the Titanic at all. Californian is primarily a cargo vessel, so where are you going to accommodate 1500 people? The ship had enough space for about 150 people in their cabins. Soooo what put people in cargo compartments? Add on that at the time lifeboats were designed to "ferry" people from the stricken ship to the ship that was saving them (so keep that in mind.) She was SLOWER than Carpathia, which means she would take time to respond because Californian was dead stopped in the water, and most likely the boilers at idle or in a low power state. It will take time to get those boilers up to pressure. So even upon seeing the rockets and reacting immediately to help, it would have taken Lorde about 2-3 hours minimum to help (she went about 12 knots per hour, which is in the range of 7-10mph). Titanic lasted about 2.5 hours from point of impact. The rockets were not launched until 45 minutes had passed. The crew of the Titanic did use their morse lamp to contact Californian, and did communicate with them. But it was noted that the ship they were talking to had "sailed away" from Titanic. Most likely the 2 ships had drifted away from each other. So 45 minutes passed, of Lorde immediately responds to the rockets and gets under way; the earliest Lorde would have arrived on scene was during the "final plunge." This would have been the WORST time to arrive, this would have been a scene of PURE ABSOLUTE CHAOS. Go ahead and watch the scene in Titanic after the ship finally sinks, it would have summed up everything that would have occurred, IF not intensified the situation. I'm in the belief that if Californian had arrived on scene right around the final plunge, it would have made the situation WORSE, because the absolute chaos would have gotten more people killed. Procedures at the time dictated that lifeboats were to "ferry" people between the ships. Ferrying would involve arriving on scene about 1 mile away, launching their boats and have the boats from Titanic row to the Californian. The boats would ferry back and forth until Titanic sunk or everyone was safely aboard. So how do you safely rescue people out of the ocean in a chaotic state with out others getting killed in the process? Time is not on your hands because people will start dying due to hypothermia in about 15 minutes.
if you do the math::: In 2 hours Time if the Californian saved 1 person every ten seconds that would equal 720 Lives Saved // If she was able too save one person every 5 seconds that would Equal 1440 lives saved .. IT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN
You can't even spell Lord correctly... it's Lord NOT Lorde... and he should've risked it all to save everyone and he clearly ignored distress signals PER the rules of the road in that era... *sighs* Yeah OK... moving on. He's dead.. he's not giving you a medal for defending him...
Actually the Californian was stuck in an ice field which was why the ship was stopped for the night. It was too dangerous to barge ahead. Pity Smith wasn't as careful of a captain as Lord.
@@annabellelee4535 No... he stated in his log he stopped clear of the icefield... there was drifting pack ice ahead but NOTHING around. Sure maybe a berg or two but surely not as much as Carpathia risked to get there...Agreed that Smith was absolutely reckless reckless for ignoring warnings.
@@nauticusvergil If the captain of the Titanic was as good of a captain as the captain of the Californian, the Titanic would have sailed for many years instead of ending up on the bottom of the ocean. That is a fact that you cannot deny. Captain Lord stopped due to the danger and didn't even know the Titanic sank til the next morning.
@@annabellelee4535 Except I've never said Smith was a great captain. I've continually said he's a terrible captain, as is Lord. You just constantly ignore my factual statements and keep fixating on me saying Smith was great when I've never said that... he was a terrible captain who demonstrably was proven to have been speeding that night, according to Lord Mersey, and ran into an iceberg due to his own negligence. Lord absolutely knew distress signals were being fired that night, per the rules of the road, and chose to act confused about it and did nothing substantial. End of story.
@@nauticusvergil Captain Lord was a good captain, his ship didn't end up on the bottom of the ocean. You're giving opinions, not facts. Lord said to his officers to send a message using glass to see if there was a problem and there was no answer. The Titanic didn't bother to send a message through signals so why blame Captain Lord for the Titanic's negligence. There are no roads on the ocean and there are no "rules of the road". Captain Lord didn't have to risk his ship and the lives of everyone on board on a light that may or may not be a emergency beacon that wouldn't answer his message.
I’m certainly no expert in the topic, so I may be wrong, but from what I’ve gathered, the Californian was completely stopped for the night, her boilers cooled and her engines shut down. Many believe that had she immediately sailed for the Titanic as soon as she saw the rockets, she may have made it in time, but they don’t account for the fact that the Californian would have had to first undertake the strenuous process of building steam pressure up and restarting the engines, a process that could have taken more than an hour. The Carpathia however, was already moving when it got Titanic’s distress calls; all she did was turn around. Even if Captain Lord had made steam for Titanic as soon as possible, I don’t think he would have made it in time to save anyone else. More likely he would only have made the Carpathia’s job a little easier.
He was stopped EDGE of icefield per his own log, and per regulations, would've had steam up in need of emergency, which there was plenty of that night.
It actually said "short intervals." What that means? Who knows? Five minutes? Short intervals? Probably. they ignored clear distress signals that night.
Capt. Lord did everything right, by the book. Capt Smith did everything wrong. Californian was surrounded by ice. That’s why he was stopped. The steam was minimal. It’s estimated to have been able to reach the area around the same time as Carpathia. If they left after sighting the rockets.
Very good account (although it’s not true that the deck officers only tried to rouse captain Lord after Titanic had “disappeared”). Excellent research on the history and fate of the Californian. Many thanks.
You are wrong. There is only one question that needs to be asked here and it has nothing to do with wireless which is a red herring. What colour were all distress rockets in 1912??? He must have known cos he would also have carried them. And for the same purpose. He admitted being told that the "mystery ship" had fired white rockets which he decided on zero evidence were "company signals". Now if distress rockets were always white (which I suspect they were for easy identification) then he should have known that a white rocket = distress. And his decision to brand it a company signal becomes very disingenuous. So lets not focus on the wireless which is a settled issue and focus instead on his non response to distress rockets which we all know were seen by the officer on watch of the Californian and reported to the captain.
No it wasn’t.. don’t let this documentary fool you. There was no mirage. Titanic sent out 7 distress rockets… 7… they also sent multiple SOS calls via Morse code. They weren’t deceived, they just didn’t take the warnings seriously smh
The captain, or the officer on duty, could have simply awaken the wireless operator to verify why the rockets were being fired. Any commanding officer understands the need to clarify the situation if it's at all possible.
The Californian lookouts are definitely to blame imo. Should have woke Captain Lord and informed him. Seems like they had a lot of inexperienced and green crew on that ship.
@@zackfair6791 I believe they did wake up Lord and he told them to try and contact the ship using the morse lamp. That would make sense prior to wireless. Perhaps in his groggy state Lord forgot that he had wireless on board. But the officer on watch could have waken up the wireless operator on his own authority as well so your point it well taken.
Yes, he was awoken, and told them to contact via Morse lamp which was useless as they were more than 5 miles apart (try 10 -16) and he didn't awaken Evans, so it's on him.
I mean, if the Titanic did listen to the Californian, she might have made it to new york, no damage in the ship. But I do think the dude sending the iceberg message should have been more clear about the warning
There was another vessel even closer than the Californian. Earlier that evening, crew aboard the Samson could clearly see a 'huge ship with four funnels' that rapidly overtook them. When the huge ship stopped around midnight and rockets fired, they thought - wrongly - that they had been spotted. The Samson was illegally plucking seals off the ice flow and had no radio.
Honestly there were numerous ships in the area the night the Titanic suck none of them could have got there in time to rescue people the Titanic sunk so fast it was almost an hour before she even started sending distress calls the whole ship sunk in less than 3 hours so there just wasn't enough time and even if this little Schooner that was hunting seals habit tempted to go to the Titanic rescue what are they going to do there's no way in hell such a small vessel could have taken on hundreds and hundreds or thousands of people on board they would have been helpless themselves to do anything the only way that you save everyone's life that night is that you don't hit the iceberg to begin with end of story Titanic never hits the iceberg to start with everyone saved it's even calculated that even if the Titanic had enough lifeboats for everyone on board there wasn't enough time to get everyone off the ship considering that they didn't even start loading the lifeboats till almost an hour after striking the iceberg they were still trying to get the collapsible lifeboats loaded and off the ship when the ship broke in half and sank... she just sank too fast no one ever thought that it shipped that large with watertight compartments would be so damaged that she would sink in less than 3 hours most experts at the time figured that even if a ship that large was going to sink that it would take eight nine 10 hours for it to happen giving other rescue ship plenty of time to come and rescue everyone
If 2 of those ships within the disaster area had sailed toward the doomed liner, at least many could have been saved instead of many drowned. There's the big difference; nothing to do with the Titanic's size. Trust me, when people are drowning, even a small boat will do....
@@leonardolupini3484 it's not about the people it's about human performance and time any ship in the range of Titanic to get to her to rescue her by the time the Titanic sent out distress signals and when you factor in the time that the ship would have had to get her boilers running an engines up and going and then navigate an ice field in the middle of the night to get to Titanic they would have arrived just a Titanic went underneath the water and broke into throwing 1,500 people into the water by the way do you know that they only recovered 378 bodies from the ocean the other 1200 went down with the ship inside the ship now if you Google how long a human being can last in 28-degree water you will find that once a person enters water that cold you have at most 15 minutes to get them out of the water many people suffered fatal heart attacks as soon as they hit the water and died upon immersion so you have 15 minutes to get those humans out of that water or they're going to die how do you do it? So how do you get a person out of the water into the Hall of a ship the only way that you can really do it is they have the special rope ladders that you throw or cargo Nets that you throw over the side of the hall and people have to climb up the hall in water that cold most people would not have the strength to make that climb to get into the Hall people would start dying immediately upon entering water that cold people don't realize most people did not drown that night they froze to death the water is what killed people not to mention when you approach at the Carpathia did when you approach the disaster seeing you would have to stop your engines and drift into the scene as to not possibly stripe and destroy a Lifeboat remember Titanic had already been launched in her life boats so there were Lifeboat all over the disaster scene and a rescue ship would have to be very careful not to run over and sink a Lifeboat trying to rescue people there just wasn't you can do the performance evaluations there just wasn't enough time to say people what they've been able to save more than three people that were pulled from the water that night sure but we're talking maybe 50 people the only way you save everyone on the Titanic at night cuz you don't hit the iceberg to begin with by the way it's the Carpathia hours to capture and offload the survivors that were in lifeboats from the Titanic it was an arduous and strenuous operation in fact some people were so in shock and weak they couldn't even climb up the ladders into the Carpathia and the Carpathia had to use her cranes and lower cargo Nets down to the Lifeboat and literally hoist people into her Hall now imagine trying to conduct that rescue operation in the middle of the night in darkness with people who are panicking and flailing around in water the only possible way you could save everyone on the Titanic is it there had been a vessel in the immediate Jason area got Titanic's rescue call immediately after she hit the iceberg was able to come along her broadside within 15 or 20 minutes after striking the iceberg and then connect their ship with walkways to the Titanic and transfer people through catwalk but even that is extremely dangerous operation because remember the Titanic sinking a sinking ship is very unstable and prone to listing and even capsizing even that kind of operation would be extremely dangerous about the Titanic ship capsized the only reason she didn't capsize is that because of a coal bunker fire they had transferred a lot of coal over to the port side of the ship to put out the fire and that helped counterbalance the weight of the starboard list it's really the only reason why Titanic didn't capsize about an hour after the sinking in fact James Cameron found that in all their computer sinking simulation Titanic capsized on the computer simulation would capsize about an hour after hitting the iceberg and it was only when they factored in that extra coal that have been moved to the port side of the ship to offset the weight of the water is when they could stabilize the computer model to the point where the ship would completely sink and not capsize if it hadn't been for that little fact that they moved all that coal to the other side of the ship Titanic would have capsized before they even were able to get any lifeboats off and all lives would have been lost
@@leonardolupini3484 now I've researched this and there was one other way that you could save everyone off the Titanic but it would have required a well-trained crew and enough lifeboats for every person on the ship if they had started the evacuation process within 15 minutes of hitting the iceberg preparing the lifeboats and starting to evacuate the ship not waiting an hour like they did but within the first 15 minutes and if the Titanic had carried enough lifeboats for every human on the ship they could have had just enough time to offload all the people off the Titanic and two lifeboats and then the Carpathia or the Californian or the Samsung or another rescue vessel in the area could have come and started the retrieval process but that's the only way that you could save everyone since they didn't even bother to do a Lifeboat drill like they were supposed to do that Sunday morning the crew was not very well trained and lowering these lifeboats and the ship didn't have enough lifeboats for everyone on board this is just a fantasy scenario and there's no way in hell they could have got everyone off the ship waiting an entire hour after striking the iceberg they needed to start evacuating immediately after hitting the iceberg
The captain of the California was probably advised to not do anything because the Titanic was sunk intentionally and they wanted to make sure several opponents of the Federal reserve were eliminated had they shown up they probably wouldn't have been.
The Titanic was NOT sunken intentionally, the captain of the Californian was just too afraid to try moving again while it still dark so he didn’t even bother to have his radio operator awakened to check on the messages to investigate further on what they had been watching over night until around sunrise.
Very well done, thanks for posting. Would highly encourage anyone with an interest in the Titanic and the history to read the 1992/1993 Reapprasial of the Evidence (Brought about by the discovery of the Titanic's wreck in 1985) from the British Major Accident Investigation Board. It rounds out the discussion on these questions. Another good book is "The Titanic and the Mystery Ship", 2005 by Sean Mulroney. Very good reading and well researched.
The Titanic faithful don`t like reappraisals of any kind, they have the official version of the event overall from 1912 and the finding of the wreck together with stuff from the 1990s and beyond has caused them a whole load of problems. Evidence from witnesses that the ship broke in two had been effectively suppressed, but the truth came out in 1985, and the book you mention is by no means popular with them. And then there is Gardiner.
@@TheAussieHistorian2022 No, she wasn't. Captain Lord, in his evidence to the US Inquiry, reported that :- 'Well, we were surrounded by a lot of loose ice, and we were about a quarter of a mile off the edge of the field.' He also reported that Californian re-started her engines at 05.15 on 15 April, and was under way by 06.00. Thus, he was reporting 'loose ice,' and his ship was under way quickly.
While Captain Rostron was even better aware of the icebergs and charged forward beyond the Carpathia’s maximum speed to dash to the Titanic’s rescue with extra lookouts keeping an extra extremely close watch for icebergs in their path and had the ship well-prepared to slow down and turn whenever an iceberg in their path was spotted.
I'm pretty confident the ship the passengers/ crew saw from the Titanic wasn't the Californian or only just the Californian. Eva Hart said in her testimony that the ship they saw was sailing/sailed away. The Californian had stopped for the night because of the ice field. "An attractive theory, but superficial". Probably the Mount Temple was the ship that failed to help, but why?
people say its because that boat was hunting for seals and that's why it was sailing away. It wasn't Mount Temple bc they did actually try to help. Unfortunately when they arrived at the distress coordinates I think they were in a really packed ice field and the titanic had already sunk. They just were too late, and then were too far from where the titanic actually was to see any of the survivors.
@@vondonstrut218Hey.. FYI.. Its not the Mount Temple you stated that " The boat was hunting for seal" Its MV Samson, 7 miles away to the Titanic. Stop Spreading Misinformation..
After the Titanic disaster, the law was changed that wireless operators must stay on all night. Also, in 1912 SOS was a new distress signal.
Yep. It's just sad that it took a terrible tragedy for them to do this. It should have been done in the first place, especially given the fact that ships sail at night, not just during the day. That's why I never could figure out why they only had part time wireless.
Greetings Davin,
There is a fascinating documentary by the BBC that brilliantly took the Titanic's last night of Marconi messages and there replies from other ships and made them speak using synthesizers. Now you can listen to the tragedy of Titanic in her own words in this ingenious program.
Find it on TH-cam at: C.Q.D. THIS IS TITANIC!...IN HER OWN WORDS. BBC RADIO DOCUMENTARY. 2012.mp4
@@stevefranks6541 yes I've watched it
SOS was used before but the White Star Line hadn't yet adopted it. It is sad that a disaster of that magnitude is required for the people in charge of regulations to finally realize the need of a common frame of operations, it seems obvious to us now but we (humans) are surprisingly reluctant to change even in the face of reality (cough.. fossil fuels.. cough).
,,, - - - ,,, ,,, - - - ,,,
Unfortunately, one of the survivors a young girl back then, said in a documentary I saw yesterday, that she could very clearly see a ship, not far away, not just distant lights, but very very close to them. She was still surprised why they never came to their aid.
Well maybe if their radio operator hadn't told the guy to "shut up", they'd have received some aid. I'd have gone to bed as well.
@@Dowell318 He didn't. At least Californian's operator said he didn't. The message fro Titanic was to clear the frequency. The Californian operator simply switched off at the end of his shift.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 You're incorrect on that. The Titanic told the Californian "''Shut up, shut up! I am busy!", seconds before she hit the iceberg.
Historical fact. Get your facts right.
@@Dowell318 Don't be a fool. Communications at the time were in morse, and operators used a form of shorthand to speed up their messages. Phillips' message was probably nothing more than DDD, or 'clear the frequency.'
If you think Marconi Operators at the time were always polite & well-mannered, you have a romantic idea about how 20 year olds actually behaved. Being curt with their transmissions was the norm.
@@Dowell318Do some research next time fool. Titanics wireless operators were heroes, and if it weren't for they're efforts that night there may have been no survivors and then we'd truly know nothing about this disaster.
Lack of regulations really affected the disaster. The Californian only had one wireless operator, who naturally couldn’t be expected to work the machine 24/7. Therefore, when the distress signal was sent out, the operator was in bed asleep. If the regulations had stipulated an operator be on duty 24/7, they would’ve heard the call and have been able to help out.
I blame the rich. You don't need to tell the people in new york that you are able to send messages from the sea. Just tell them when you meet them
@@shukhada6664 Do you know that majority of messages are actually from Steerage? Stop your envy cloud your judgement. Richest man on the ship and all rich men stayed back and let women and children take the life boats. Stop hating without logic.
@@shukhada6664 what a nonsensical statement
rich people lilke to mock God. You will learn the worst way.
@@rammachiraju Stop shilling for them.
"Shut Up" was a common phrase upon early radio operators it was not as rude as they would say in the newspapers at that time.
“As it just so happened, the Carpathia’s wireless radio operator, 21-year-old Harold Cottam, was listening to the radio for a final few minutes while preparing for bed.” Does this sound like the Fear of Missing Out routine that in this era prompts us to check in online just before we go to sleep? Thank goodness for FOMO. It’s been saving lives for more than a century!
🤔
Considering how much went wrong before and during the sinking to the Titanic itself it's really unfortunate that the captain of the Californian gets so much blame almost to the point of it's his fault the ship dank in the first place. A LOT of things went wrong that night which is why so much changed in the wake of the disaster and are still being carried out to this day.
That doesn’t negate the fact that he saw a stalled ship, saw the rockets and ignored everything. All he had to do was turn on the head set and see if anyone was in distress. It’s not rocket science. The rocket colors/intervals have no barring. “A ship wouldn’t be sending out rocket flares for nothing” -as stated in the inquiry
all goe wrong when you ahve animals working with ypou.
fist advise from california to titanic: we are stopped here cause there a lot of icebergs and vision is reduced, ,,,, titanic radio man, answered: SHUT UP,
@@mikehunt7360agreed. Why did he see flares and not turn the radio on that’s the number one question. My guess is he got p1ssed at being told to shut up and decided to prove a point and not help 🤦♂️ the other one raced there in 3 hours and hid warning signs meanwhile that douche didn’t bother to check his headset lol, it had to be deliberate
The thing that confuses me is why Captain Smith avoided any blame surely he is to blame more than anyone else he was in charge of Titanic and ignored all the ice warnings maybe he gets a pardon as he went down with the ship 🤔
@@paulthompson8467 yeah, but the captain had little psychopathic rich people influencing his decision. We’ll never know, but it would have been a good conversation to know what went through his head. Like he couldn’t possibly have fell for the unsinkable hype
The crew of the Californian clearly stated in the British Inquiry (the Wreck Commissioner's Inquiry) that they DID contact the captain numerous times that night. Captain Lord claimed he was asleep and had no direct knowledge of anything. The other Officers claimed that they did talk to him several times as the disaster was going on. Captain Lord did see another ship, but he claimed he saw only one masthead light and that the other ship could not have been the Titanic. Other officers aboard that night saw two masthead lights. One of them, I forget who, claimed that he told Captain Lord that the ship was indeed a passenger ship and that her lights went out prior to Captain Lord's seeing the ship.
His name was Charles Victor Groves and he went on to be a shipmaster himself.
I wouldn’t call him a captain but a lazy f***ing sh*t!
He’s really gonna hold that crutch(I was asleep) all his life.
the gulty is the company white star gave orders to: go fast and dont stop.thye wanted a record...like biden ruling america and europe accepting immigrnats, everything will sunk
After seeing so many videos on ship wrecks. Many crew would lie during investigations to save their own skins and blame the Captains.
@@jeng8401 Interesting. That sounds plausible. Wonder where the truth lies in this instance.
Mornin,
You have to know, that it was normal to say things like "shut up old man" on the radio in that time. The radio operator of the Californian maybe even laughed when receiving this "rude" message. It was a different time, back then.
Greetings .
They shorted it so the actually said "Shut up O.M" OM stading for old man
I know this is late but O.M is an endearing term, sign of respect, the receiver has been confirmed to have been laughing when this message was received.
I would to like see videos on the Eastland and the Lady Elgin. Two Great Lakes disasters that are not as well known like the Edmond Fitzgerald.
Yes
Oh God... What have I dne:???!
th-cam.com/video/Rt1kSN_ItNI/w-d-xo.html
Telling the guy on the Californian to shut up after getting a warning signal was a colossal error.
I'm not sure it bothered him that much because he was going to bed. But Titanic disregarding the message lost an opportunity to maybe slow down.
Not really. Wireless operators of the time had a specific lingo much like computer geeks, or AI nuts today. Being told to "shut up" wasn't rude, it was commonly said in times when they were busy and they wanted everyone else to chill a bit.
Like the video said, they didn't prefix the message with the code to communicate with the bridge. He probably thought they were messing around as it was typical at the time. A lot of human errors tbh, but this is how accidents usually go.
Also, wireless back in the day had no volume control. The closer the transmitter was to the recipient, the louder the morse code signal that the operator heard. When the Californian transmitted pracitcally right on top of the Titanic, it was incredibly loud and jarring, hence the (tired and overworked) wireless operators' fiery response.
Not even true in the slightest. He used a shorthand which meant clear the air, and Evans even testified it wasn't a problem... maybe read the testimony first before commenting.
A fantastic, informative, interesting channel. Keep up the good work.
Thank you very much, Russell!
I thought that wireless operators were actually working for Marconi and not directly for the ships. That's why the Titanic's wireless operator was sending the messages from the passengers and not really caring about official ice warnings. All in all, this is like all tragic tales. A series of small events lead to a big disaster. Good job on video!
Indeed, they were employed by Marconi. Another reason Phillips did not heed Evans's warning was also because he had already delivered several ice warnings to the bridge that day. He probably thought, "Not this again!"-and considering Titanic's size, it seemed inconceivable for ice to bring it down.
@@StunningHistory True. So in the new safety laws, where they had to have radio on all night, and have more than one operator, is that when operators were employed by the ships?
@@StunningHistory that and he was working Cape Race. The equipment broke down the night before and Bride and Phillips stayed up all night to fix it despite it being against the rules. Caused passengers mail to get backed up.
@@Rebelheart1985 The Marconi company regulations stated that they were not to fix to the broken set and that they were to switch to the back up wireless which was weaker and thus shorter ranged than the main set.Had they done that, they would've been more reliant on the nearby ships to relay traffic and thus probably stayed in communication with Californian and Mesaba which would've in turn meant getting the critical final ice warnings.
@@StunningHistoryYep , pride and arrogance sunk that ship in the main .
Dude your narration and the quality!!!!
Subbed!
Welcome aboard! Thank you!
Absiolutely FOP shelf historic information presented in a fact based and concise manner… Thank you very much. Outstanding video narrative.
Thank you for the support!
There persists an incorrect reading of the 1912 Rules of the Road. Titanic was firing distress rockets exactly as prescribed: white rockets, or rockets of any color, fired at short intervals, was the known and accepted procedure for signaling distress at night. This was fully appreciated by the officers on watch on the Californian, Herbert Stone and James Gibson. At the BR Inquiry, Stone was asked if he was aware that rockets fired one at a time at short intervals was the appropriate method for signaling distress at sea, and he answered affirmatively, that was how he understood the Rules. There was no specific interval stated, merely "short intervals, one at a time" and that white was the color for distress. Chief Officer Stewart testified that the morning following the disaster, after he took over the watch from Stone, he had a feeling that "something had happened." When asked why he thought that, he replied "Because they were white rockets" that Stone had described.
Yes...but there were four classes of distress signals covered in the Rules of the Road: 1, a gun or other explosive signal fired at one minute intervals, 2, flames from a burning tar or oil barrel, 3, rockets or shells throwing stars of any colour or description, fired...at short intervals, and 4, a continuous sounding with any fog-signal apparatus. Titanic's "rockets" were "detonators used in lieu of signal cannon shells" which put them in class 1 - the correct use would be three shells fired at one minute intervals. If Californian had been seven miles from Titanic it would have quite plainly heard the detonations, along with the venting steam, and would have been alerted to Titanic's distress. Stone and Groves heard nothing because Californian was 20+ miles away and looking at an oil tanker, not Titanic.
@@tranceguide9752 Hi - what is your primary evidence to assert that Stone and Groves were looking at an oil tanker? Thanks.
@@Dianaemanuel Hi, I should have said probably, possibly looking at an oil tanker. There was a scramble to track down ships, after Moore of Mount Temple claimed to have seen a mystery ship, right where Boxhall saw his ship (according to Moore this vessel had distinctive colouring around the funnel). In the process of this investigation, four oil tankers were found to be on the same Boston track as the Californian - The Trautenfels, the Lindenfels, Niagara and The Paula. The design of oil tankers would match some of the details supplied by Gibson and Stone aboard Californian as to what they saw - suggesting a glare of light in her afterpart - tankers had their superstructure aft, behind the funnel. The inquiry soon ended the process of tracking down suitable ships, as they quickly came to the conclusion that the sea was swarming with ships that night and it would be all-but impossible to find the true culprit.
Stone's testimony to the British inquiry is a very good example of how badly treated the Californian's crew were by those proceedings - they were called as witnesses but were often treated like defendants, despite having had no time to prepare their 'cases' and having no counsel present to represent them. Stone's telling of events makes it clear that, as he saw them, the rocket flashes "were only about half the height of the steamer's masthead light and I thought rockets would go higher than that." He was right - signal rockets burst several hundred feet in the air. Other forms of signal pyrotechnics - roman candles, star-throwers and so on - appeared at deck level. So Stone was seeing signals that did not readily fit either of the categories of pyrotechnic he was used to. But the questioners at the inquiry then, in a very shady bit of cross-examination, drew out from Stone the definition of distress rockets as white rockets fired at regular short intervals. Which is exactly right - that is exactly the official description of distress rockets that Stone, as a First Mate, would have had to learn and recite verbatim to a Board of Trade panel to earn his 'ticket'. But that overlooked all of Stone's previous testimony that the rockets he saw that night didn't fit that description. It made it seem that he had 'confessed' to dumbly looking at distress rockets without taking action, when the crux of the matter was that the men on the bridge of the Californian that night were very unsure what they were seeing. Stone testified to seeing white rockets, bursting below the height of the vessel's masthead lamp, at intervals ranging from five to seven minutes. That's not any form of distress signal known to mariners in 1912.
I'm very partial to the theory that there was some serious atmospheric distortion going on that night due to the combination of cold weather, clear skies and freakishly calm seas. The horizon was hard to discern, with the bright and perfect reflection of stars making it hard to tell where the sea ended and the sky began. It's very likely that the iceberg was hidden in this mirage/distortion from the lookouts and watchkeepers on the Titanic until they were virtually on top of it. As far as the Californian is concerned, I believe that what they were seeing was a mirage of the Titanic's lights, lifted above the true horizon and distorted by refraction in the layer of low-altitude cold air. In more normal conditions, I suspect the Titanic would not have been visible from the Californian at all. That's why Gibson thought the ship 'looked queer', why it was impossible to make sense of the Titanic's signal lamp messages and why no-one on the Californian reported hearing either the loud 'bangs' of her signal rockets or the noise of her safety valves lifting, despite this noise going on for nearly half an hour and being painfully, deafeningly loud for those on the ship: in reality the ships were much further apart than they appeared. What Stone was seeing was the Titanic's signal rockets shooting up through the mirage (they were required to rise up 600-800 feet by the regulations) - he was seeing the 'real' image of the rocket flash alongside the 'false' image of the Titanic's lights, raised above the true horizon as a mirage. That's why the flashes appeared to go no higher than half the height of the Titanic's masthead light (which was 145ft above the waterline, so the rockets would be going only a tenth as high as they should), and why Stone did not conclude that he was seeing distress signals.
Like a lot of the events on the Californian that night, the rest of the ship's (in)actions can be chalked down to their lack of hindsight. They'd seen a ship approach from the east, stop at the edge of the ice field (just as they themselves had done), ignore their signal lamp, fire off some unspecific rockets, possibly flash some unintelligible lamps signals and then move away over the horizon. At what point in that sequence should the alarm bells started ringing?
Would you not turn on the radio just to check after seeing the rockets?
Greetings Ship Geek,
Again, I am so much impressed with your very professional, and smooth delivery, in reporting the history of notable ships. More so, since you claim nothing more than being a "hobbyist" in your avocation of ship historian.
Thank you again for another fine ship history [of Californian]. It is a worthy installment to my Titanic archive.
In my studies of ship history over the years, here is an interesting observation.
British Leyland ships, from roughly 1854 to 1921, perhaps 98% of her ship's names ended in "ian". Assyrian, Bavarian, Cyrenian, Naperian, Scythian, &etc. They also named some with "an", such as Welshman, Texan, Jamaican, &etc.
Most White Star line's ships had names ending in "ic" as in Titanic, Olympic, Nomadic, Adriatic, Laurentic, &etc. from 1870 to 1932 when they merged with Cunard.
Cunard ship names roughly between 1870 and 1955 can be identified by names ending in "ia": Carpathia, Aurania, Mauretania, Lusitania, Scythia, &etc.
And so it goes with many of the historic lines of ships. You can most often "ID" the company just by the ship's name.
And in many cases by their funnel colour.
Cool!
It’s wonderful how they tended to keep to a theme.
Nice
The SS Californian wreck from my memory still remains undiscovered when it sank during WWI.
It was found in 1999
@@travisbickle4360 The wreck of the RMS Carpathia was discovered in 1999. The SS Californian has yet to be discovered.
@@TheLockbeard I see. I always confuse between two
@@travisbickle4360 it’s alright. Both ships are relatively smaller than the Titanic and both have a single funnel. Those kind of ships were a dime a dozen in those times.
It's common to react to our failures.
On the bad side, the California didn't react to the Titanic until it was too late. But we learned from our mistakes and have saved many more lives than were lost on that fateful night.
Countless more lives were lost due to war, even just at sea. Sadly there are some things that really werent learnt from.
I think it's worth exploring the theory that the Titanic and the Californian were over each other's horizons, and only able to see one another through a mirage effect. That would explain why they were unable to communicate via morse lamp, though both ships tried.
Ships don't go over horizons, a Nikon P900 will show you that matey, perspective is the answer, think of a loooong tunnel, you dont see the end
So he should have turned on the head set
@@billb7876 google cold water mirage
@@todbenjamin7081 Even better, google fata morgana.
The light refraction also scrambled Titanics distress signals. The cold water mirages distorted her shape. They do the same for ice bergs 1:07 It was cloaked. It had sailed from the icy Labrador current inti the Gulf stream. She was right at the current border. It was nature's killing zone.
There's one thing about the seemingly rude answer of Phillips that most people get wrong. Because they take it by today's standards.
Back in the day, it was very common for wireless operators to tell each other "to shut up" when they were busy working a station. It was fast, straight to the point and not considered to be rude. More often than not it was just banter between colleagues.
To give some perspective on how informally wireless operators talked to each other, back then the phrase "GTH OM QRL" (Go to hell old man, [shut up] I'm busy) was frequently used to tell others to keep out of their communications. Phillips didn't say it that way, but it gives an insight in how they talked to each other.
What Phillips said wasn't considered to be rude, and Evans even stated that in the Titanic inquiry:
8998. Commissioner: "In ordinary Marconi practice is that a common thing to be asked (said)?"
Evans: - Yes. And you do not take it as an insult or anything like that.
Evans also stated that, after this conversation, he still stayed up for a while and listened to Phillips' messages to Cape Race, before going to bed. It had nothing to do with Phillips being "rude", because he wasn't.
With only Phillips head had insomnia, as we know, it was seemingly chance, or, as I like to think Providence, that the operator on Carpathia heard the messages. If not, how long with those people have been in those lifeboats. I believe two other ships knew the Titanic was sinking, so I assume they eventually would have arrived, may be only a few hours after Carpathia.
This was amazing, nice work!
Thank you!
Captain Lord was a scapegoat. They couldn't blame the heroes of Titanic, so let's blame another captain who kept his ship safe.
How fortunate, then, that Captain Rostron had rather more understanding of the code of the sea, and didn't simply say 'We are too far away. I'm going back to bed.'
@@dovetonsturdee7033 Pretty much this exactly! Why Rostron risked his ship and Lord did not speaks volumes to their characters.
@@nauticusvergil And how Rostron had passengers on his ship and Lord did not.
Very interesting video, nicely done!
Really makes us realize how important are standard procedures and regulations when a new technology becomes popular.
Artificial Intelligence comes to mind. Woefully slow regulation will do us in.
What made Captain smith not to send one boat to alert the California on Ttanic situation?
@@PatrickArriagahh-ir3cu I don't think you realize how far the Californian was.
@@litamtondy 16 miles at most according to Captain Lord's own log. Absolutely too far to row for inexperienced passengers for sure but clearly in visual range.
There's actually a different theory to the shut up message. The Californian being closer than cape point meant that it's messages came through extremely loudly and jack Philips was both overwhelmed and caught off guard by the loud transmission blaring through. That and that the wireless operators of the day were known for being crude and telling each other to "shut up" and "get to hell" all the time. Jack Philips actually told Bruce Ismay to get to hell while helping with lifeboats and it came up in the congressional hearings. The radio operators of the day were very informal and often more rude in a joking sort of way. Compare it to cb radio chatter or online game lobbies today and that gives a much better idea of what was going on. Mistakes were certainly made but to Monday night quarterback them to the standards out in place as a result of them isn't fair to the people who lived through and made them.
On a calm cool night at see. You would think they would of heard the Titanic breaking up.
It wasn't Jack Philips who told Ismay to "get to hell", it was 5th Officer Harold Lowe who told Ismay
True. "Go to hell" and "shut up" - was casual and friendly. Tongue in cheek amongst operators. This video, ironically, continues to perpetuate the myth of the "irritated operator" and "asshole operator."
@@KathrynsWorldWildfireTracking False, Philips & Bride were still in the wireless room sending messages when Ismay was helping with the boats when Philips & Bride were told by Cpt Smith that they had done all, they could, they could now try and save themselves time approx 02:10am by this time Ismay was already off the ship in a lifeboat.
@@KathrynsWorldWildfireTracking- yo, look for them icebergs in the water.
-go to hell, i'm busy.
That is not being an asshole, that's being a moron.
Very interesting video; well-researched and presented.
I immediately subscribed. Thank goodness for Cottam.
Welcome aboard!
People often neglect that Californian had released its steam and settled. It would have taken around 90 mins just to work up propulsion, and another 1-2 hours to approach Titanic. Lifeboats took about 40 mins to deploy. It could have done little good…
Yeah but the captain should have tried.
@@mariamatheson5300 no one is arguing that they shouldn’t have tried. It’s just that they can’t be held responsible for the deaths of titanic passengers as widely believed.
No they are definately not responsible. The one is is responsible is Captain Smith who should have been more prudent.
@@mariamatheson5300 neither was captain smith. Sometimes things happen without a person to blame. Smith did everything required of contemporary best practices, and much more. They altered well south of an already very southerly route to avoid ice, and ensured there were multiple lookouts. He could not have known that the backlog of Marconi messages prevented him from getting ice warnings. He could not have known that cold water mirage, a phenomenon only documented much later, could have prevented his lookouts from spotting ice in time.
Extraordinary!!!! Well done!!!! I absolutely love it!!!!
According to officers Boxhall and Pitman, Titanic was pointing west as she sank - Californian was to the north. The ship seen from Titanic was directly ahead, on the other side of the ice field. This position puts the ship Mount Temple as being the most likely candidate for the mystery ship - she was found at the scene of the crime at dawn by the Carpathia. The Californian was nowhere to be seen until 8 a.m.
The Titanic was pointing NORTH. The Mount Temple was almost 50 miles away when she got Boxhall's 41. 46 N 51.14 W, which we now know is INCORRECT. The Californian was facing South South East and was turning Starboard all night and the Titanic was also turning all night. The Californian was the mystery ship. The two men on the watch testified they saw the 8 rockets in the British Inquiry. Californian Apprentice Gibson testified that he "didn't think that steamer was firing rockets at sea for nothing. and something must be the matter with her." He also testified that Second officer Stone who also had the watch said, "There is a big side out of the water." I might have the 2 men's testimony swapped, but that is what they said. Stone testified that the ship "disappeared." around 2:05am. The Californian's Ship time or ATS was 12 minutes slower than the Titanic. Add 12 minutes and you get the Titanic's ship time/ATS as 2:17 am, just as the lights went out on the Titanic and then the ship breaks apart and "disappears." It was the Californian who was the mystery ship. They got there at about 8-830 because earlier that morning they had found out the Titanic , the ship their Midnight watch saw go down, had sank.
@@TitanicHorseRacingLover Titanic was pointing WEST. Boxhall was there, on the bridge, standing next to Captain Smith, with both of them periodically consulting the binnacle right in front of them, and so we may reasonably assume were consulting each other. To say anything else is to say that both Boxhall and Smith were wholly incompetent, both individually and collectively (Pitman too). I know a lot of self-published Titanic "experts" have made a career out of effectively besmirching Boxhall's reputation, but he was there and he was a highly experienced navigator; they weren't there and have laughable nautical credentials. I shall let Boxhall's inquiry testimony speak for itself:
Senator FLETCHER.
Apparently that ship came within 4 or 5 miles of the Titanic, and then turned and went away in what direction, westward or southward?
Mr. BOXHALL.
I do not know whether it was southwestward. I should say it was westerly.
Senator FLETCHER.
In westerly direction; almost in the direction which she had come?
Mr. BOXHALL.
Yes, sir.
Titanic pointed WEST. Californian could not be the mystery ship. I now point you towards the affidavit of Dr. Quitzrau, a passenger aboard Mount Temple, who described what he heard the officers and crew say about what really went on aboard the ship on the night of the sinking.
@@tranceguide9752 No. Titanic was pointing NORTH. The Californian WAS the mystery ship. 2nd Officer Herbert Stone testified at the British Inquiry he saw a total of 8 rockets. Apprentice Gibson of the Californian said he saw 8 rockets. Both of them said that the vessel's "lights looked queer ' and Gibson said he saw a big side out of the water, and they testified that "something must be the matter with her (the vessel they saw.' Why the idiot Stone didn't realize the ship he saw was in distress, I don't know. Anyway, the Californian saw 8 rockets. The Titanic fired 8 rockets. The rules were "firing of stars or shells of ANY COLOR at few minutes intervals were distress.' That is what Stone and Gibson were seeing. Why Stone didn't go to the Captain's chartroom and INSIST that he come to the deck or Why Captain Lord did not come to the deck himself when first told of the rockets, I don't know. However, those men on the Californian's watch saw the 8 rockets that the TITANIC fired. There was no ship in between. Besides, the Mount Temple arrived about an hour and a half or so AFTER the Titanic sank.
@@TitanicHorseRacingLover Titanic pointed WEST: Boxhall, who was there, on the bridge, says she pointed west - it's as simple as that. The eye-witness observation of a single trained officer on the bridge outweighs ANY and ALL conjecture and supposition from armchair theorists, no matter how many there are. Boxhall and Pitman constitute TWO eyewitness officers. I repeat, Boxhall's observations represent those of himself AND Capt. Smith - it really defies belief the extent of the misplaced arrogance of the people who ignore Boxhall, Pitman and Smith on this. There is also ample passenger eye-witness testimony (Lawrence Beesley most notable of whom) that states Titanic resumed course for a good ten minutes after the collision: if you resume course, you head west.
A crucial point to emphasise is that Titanic and Californian were in different shipping lanes. Titanic was on the southern, New York track and Californian was in the Boston track, 20 to 30 miles to the north. Californian was stationary and 20+ miles away in the Boston shipping lane. Titanic was in the New York track. For Californian to be the mystery ship, either Titanic or Californian (or both) would have to have left their respective shipping lanes which would have been a suicidal act of gross incompetence.
There were four classes of distress signals covered in the Rules of the Road: 1, a gun or other explosive signal fired at one minute intervals, 2, flames from a burning tar or oil barrel, 3, rockets or shells throwing stars of any colour or description, fired...at short intervals, and 4, a continuous sounding with any fog-signal apparatus. Titanic's "rockets" were "detonators used in lieu of signal cannon shells" which put them in class 1 - the correct use would be three shells fired at one minute intervals. If Californian had been seven miles from Titanic it would have quite plainly heard the detonations, along with the venting steam, and would have been alerted to Titanic's distress. Stone and Groves heard nothing because Californian was 20+ miles away and looking at an oil tanker, not Titanic. If Titanic fired 8 rockets, the officers are guilty of gross negligence - they were obliged to send up three one minute detonators every 15 or 20 minutes - 8 rockets = 2 and 2/3 distress signals. The 8 rocket figure is an invention of Lord Mersey, Boxhall doesn't know how many rockets he sent up and remember there were two parties sending up rockets. Beesley recounts seeing the first three rockets go up in quick succession - there is nothing in eye-witness accounts to show that there was a peculiar absence of detonators sent up. As far as Stone and Groves were concerned, they saw private signal flares sent up by a fishing boat. They did not see three - one minute distress signals and certainly did not hear the accompanying detonations. Any ship with 5 to 10 miles would have plainly HEARD Titanic send up detonators and vent steam. Any ship with 2-10 miles would have plainly SEEN Titanic - a blaze of lights. Any ship STATIONARY from 10.30 p.m. to 6 a.m. within 10 miles of Titanic's position, would have been seen at daybreak by Rostron of Carpathia. Rostron is quite emphatic: Californian was NOWHERE IN SIGHT until 8 a.m. Mount Temple was found at the scene of the crime (to the west of the ice field on the New York track) at daybreak.
Titanic pointed NORTH as per her wreck site. This is proven fact. Mt. Temple is NOT the mystery ship per Captain Moore's logs. Per Captain Lord's logs, Californian is the ONLY ship that due north of Titanic. How did she point WEST when she swung due north after port ROUNDING the iceberg and her wreck bears this out? Plus her lights and Californians clearly matches each others' testimony.
Oceanliner Designs & Illustration did a good video about the Titanic's wireless operator (Jack Phillips). It's not what you think. What comes across as short and rude today was just how wireless operators (cranks) talked to each other back then. It was basically playful banter, and was to be expected. Things like GTH OM QRL (get to hell old man, shut up I'm busy) were fairly common messages that they'd send to one another back then. It wasn't meant to be rude or hateful.
Same as the yoof of today and their mobile "cell" devices that fry their brains WTF?
Hi im californian when i warn titanic on icebergs she told me to shut up so i sleep instead and didnt help her while she was going down
Interesting video. I now want to see the wrecks of the Californian and Carpathia.
Yes
Carpathias wreck is seeable and pictures are on
@@cheems4061 tes
@@cheems4061 yes
I actually want to see the wreck of the HMS Barham.
that wireless operator is the real hero actually. his fact action and quick thinking brought the carpathia to the rescue. or else more would have perished
YES!
Bro, this one was a very good and informative video. Thank you very much.
If the captain admitted seeing distress flairs……then there’s zero excuse why he didn’t direct his ship in that direction instantly.
The captain of Titanic should have known better.
@@HarmlessPota2 him aswell. In the frozen Atlantic Ocean under the darkness of the night sky,not even moon light apparently, just so the owners of the shipping company can boast that they got to New York ahead of schedule….clearly the captain had a cash incentive to do so, can only be the reason.
He was stuck in an ice field though. He couldn't navigate in the dark, it was too dark.
@@leonleon2276
Guesswork is the root of all evil.
@@annabellelee4535 Blaming Lord was pure evil. I feel for the guy!
I honestly had no idea there was another ship somewhat close to the Titanic when it sunk until today watching this, I thought it was completely alone in the Atlantic
Apparently, there were 8 other ships on Atlantic that night along with Titanic including Carpethia. All of them were 40-150 miles roughly away from Titanic.
From what I've seen in documentaries, that shipping lane was extremely popular. That's one of the reasons why Titanic was not outfitted with enough lifeboats for everyone on board (besides being unsinkable). At that time it was thought that they just needed boats to shuttle passengers and crew to another ship in the area. It may or may not be true but maybe made sense at the time.
There was actually two. The second one was illegally hunting whales and didn’t want to get in trouble. So instead of helping they took off.
@@thepowerof6six809 is it true.. I never heard this thing..
@@thepowerof6six809 That was the one firing the white rockets which those on Californian saw.
During her construction not only did moving her boiler destroy the road but Dundee Harbour is built on top of the Dundee vaults with actually collapsed causing a fair few issues
The Dundee vaults are whats left of the very old town back in the 1500s a tsunami hit and destroyed the harbour and so they built me streets above the old
Another reason why the Evans' warnings nearly blew out Jack Phillip's eardrums, forcing him to tell Evans to shut up? The Californian was nearby. This tragedy, like so many, could have been averted.
No. The Californian was stopped, its boilers cold, due to being surrounded by icebergs and packed ice on a moonless night with almost zero visibility. Any1, who claims, the Californian couldve made it in time, count on the assumption, that Californian was no further away than the closest estimate, 10 nautical miles, which is at best a guess. Furthermore, they assume, that the Californian wouldve started toward the Titanic immidiately at full speed, something that was impossible. Californian would first have to fire up its boilers, something u cant just do in a few minutes, it wouldve taken quite a lot of time. Nor could she have gone full speed through an icefield with no visibility. When the conditions of the Californian and her surroundings at the time is taken into account, even the best estimate doesnt have her at Titanics position until 2 hours AFTER the sinking. At that point, any1 not in a lifeboat would be long dead in the freezing water.
Ofc, that doesnt mean, they shouldnt have tried. And had Captain Lord known, he definitely would have. He and his crew followed the rules at the time. Sure, the officers on duty shouldve woken up Lord, or at least woken up the wireless operator. Possibly they didnt even think of it, since having a wireless onboard was so new. In hindsight, they shouldve ignored the rules and trusted their instincts. Yes, there was some fault with Captain Lord and his crew, but he was not the villain, he was made out to be. Nothing is ever black or white, everything is somewhere in between. So is this.
And regardless of where any of we desk jockeys come out on Captain Lord and the Californian, it doesnt change the fact, that Californian couldnt have changed anything, that happened that night. There was no averting this tragedy. Once the Titanic struck that iceberg, nothing could change the outcome.
@@dfuher968 I believe it could've helped at least, as opposed to doing nothing. If it bothered to send the correct Master's Service Gram (MSG) the disaster would never have happened, and we wouldn't be here talking about it over 100 hundred years later.
@@abloogywoogywoo - From what I've read, whether the Titanic received or did not receive ice warnings by radio did not make any difference. The officers already knew they could expect to see ice, and Lightoller had remarked on the fall in sea temperature that evening and warned the lookouts to watch for ice. Being a prestige express liner sailing on a clear night with perfect visibility, they would not have slowed down unless they had actually sighted danger ahead. The trouble was they were overconfident of their ability to see a berg in time. I agree with Dfuher: whatever the Californian did that night would not have changed the disaster, but Captain Lord should still have taken action to find out what was going on.
@@dfuher968 Californian's boilers were not cold. They were kept to a low level so that heat and electricity could be maintained. It certainly would've taken time, about 30 minutes, to get them back up to sufficient steam to get underway at minimal speed. But at least they would be trying to do something and the arrival of Californian could've saved at least a dozen lives of those who perished sitting in the lifeboats due to exposure. In the right circumstances, Californian could've arrived just immediately after Titanic sank and perhaps saved a few dozen more out of the water as some people lasted up to almost an hour after the sinking before succumbing.
Also, Lord curiously when heading to assist the Carpathia, he took a rather odd circuitous, twisting route that was towards Titanic's CQD position. This added time and had Lord responded when he could see Titanic's lights and rockets to follow, they no doubt would've gotten there a lot quicker. So well under an hour's time once they were under full speed.
@@abloogywoogywoo The Californian was not the only ship to send ice warnings to Titanic, and one more warning probably wouldn't have changed anything.
Lack of regulations on wireless radio resulted in the Californian's inaction.
Lack of regulations on the number of lifeboats required resulted in the deaths of Titanic passengers.
Many of the early boats left nearly empty, because the passengers thought they would be safer on the "unsinkable" ship
@@dwlopez57 Yeah, I heard about that. I watched an interview from a male passenger in a 1960s video. He said that during the first few minutes, people didn't want to go in the lifeboats because it looked more dangerous than to stay on board. However when the ship started to tilt and it became obvious that the ship was indeed sinking, this is when people started to panic. Still, if they had good regulations, they would have informed the passengers that they needed to board the lifeboats, and that Titanic was slowly but definitely sinking.
@@reinerbraun670 It's bit more complex even than that. The difference in interpretation between those in charge of launching the boats in regards to Captain Smith's "women and children first" order.
Lightoller interpreting it to mean women and children only and Murdoch in that if no women or children were left in a boat's vicinity, then men could board.
Lightoller may well be responsible for hundreds of deaths since when some men could not board, their wives and families would not leave them.
Actually, the number of boats wouldn’t have mattered. They didn’t have time to launch all the boats properly, Collapsibles A and B were floated off because there was no time to lower them.
the titanic was designed with plenty of lifeboats but numbers were cut because of the look didnt look right by the owners
No sensible person will refuse to help others in distress
Californian was the scapegoat
Or they simply failed to help thinking they didn’t actually need help, it could’ve been tiredness lack of sleep inexperience idk but clearly something was wrong with this ship and they failed to pick up on it
0:55 Over the years I have read so many theories to justify the inaction of the Californian to the Rockets fired from the deck of the Titanic. You explain the theory of "incorrect intervals". I also read that Captain Lord perhaps thought the white rockets were "company rockets". Used by ships from the same company to communicate with each other. I have GREAT sympathy for the soul of Stanley Lord, but he should have ordered his wireless operator (Cyril Evans) awake on that fateful evening. Rockets at sea, at THAT time of night....and he didn't even turn on his radio? He should have stretched a little bit....even if he could not have saved those people he would have went to his grave with a clean conscious.
I agree, but with the benefit of 110 years of hindsight, it all seems so simple and clear cut. Radio technology was very new, and perhaps Lord did not fully appreciate the ability he had at his fingertips. The resulting changes to the maritime laws seem so obvious with that same hindsight, yet they were not law at the time of Titanic’s sinking.
@@jasona9 true, it was a sad, sad oversight. The outcome could have been completely different.
@@porschenut9 yes, very sad. So many “if only’s” in the story of the Titanic.
Captain Lord's conscience was fine, it's just his reputation that suffered. Californian was stopped for the night, so they would have taken additional time to wake up crew, build up the steam and then maneuver slowly between icebergs. The result, they arrive too late and now they would be the ship that took too long. They were going to end as the villains of this story, anyway.
@@Sheilawisz No. If Lord had seen or been told about those rockets and then IMMEDIATELY ordered his engineers to fire up the boilers to get under way to head to the Titanic no matter if took 2 days to get there no one would have blamed Lord for getting there late. But the fact that the rockets were completely ignored is why he is vilified.
One thing is certain about the British Inquiry (The Wreck Commissioner's Inquiry): The British Board Of Trade was looking for a place to divert attention from them. They didn't like having to take all the blame for the lack of enough lifeboats. Ernest Gill's allegations, combined with the testimony and evidence presented at the Inquiry, was certainly some place to divert attention. This documentary doesn't mention Ernest Gill. He was a coal stoker, called Donkeyman, on the Californian. He was allegedly paid $500 to tell the American Press that the Californian saw the Titanic and did nothing. His allegations got the Californian into all that trouble.
If I'm on the bridge of the Californian that night and see even ONE rocket, I'm sending a runner to the radio. Period.
Yes but u do know this ship was surrounded by icebergs. Period.
@@axzostavicii7765 didn’t stop the carpathia from coming to the rescue
It’s easy to say that but we don’t know how often ships would send up rockets back then. The Californian thought they were company signals, I would imagine that rockets were fairly frequently sent up by ships.
@@axzostavicii7765 Who cares? They weren't according to Californian's own LOG. PERIOD.
@@EaglesNest1986 We do know as it was clearly spelled out by rules of the road at the time. And no, pyrotechnics were controlled and not sent up "fairly frequently" as you claim. Based on absolutely nothing.
I hope soon they find the california it would be good to see her after 100 years
Whatever the case, if Lord were such a great captain, he should have had the sense to, at the very least, investigate; and no officer or wireless operator should have been intimidated or afraid to voice their opinion. If rockets are being systematically fired, there has to be a reason. If a ship appears to be listing, mirage or no mirage, there has to be a reason. He could have covered the short distance. Captain Rostron of the Carpathian at least tried. He was a hero. Lord deserves his rotten reputation.
Yes 100% on all points! He ignored CLEAR distress signs that night... Carpathia didn't. Lord isn't going to give you a medal for defending him.... he's dead. Who cares? He was negligent, Rostron wasn't.
Excellent video. Lots of stuff I had never heard before.
Thank you!
Ballard said the Californian could have been as close as 4.5 miles away. And the comment that the Californian was 17 miles away can't possibly be true. You can only see something 12 miles away before the earth curves too much and they are beyond the horizon. All testimony clearly said people on both Californian and Titanic could see the running lights of the other ship.
He said that she 'may' have been as close as 4.5 miles, but, equally, was not likely to have been more than 19 miles, away.
@@dukeford8893 Was confirmed as 19.5 miles.
Unless of course there was another "mystery ship" between the 2. How many people onboard the Titanic would know the ship they could see was the Californian whether 4.5 or 19 miles away
@@VRTrucker The Carpathia would have known exactly where the Californian was when they arrived, and Ballard of course knew where the Titanic was so, so it's not hard to figure out that Stanley Lord was very close with the Californian.
Neither ship could clearly make out each others morse lamp signals. If that were the case then they must have been at least 15 miles apart
The person responsible for the Titanic's sinking was its captain, John Smith. Had he slowed the ship down, when alerted about the presence of ice bergs, this catastrophe could have been avoided.
The way Smith acted was considered standard practice for the time. If you are going to criticise Smith, then you would have to criticise every other captains. At the subsequent enquiries, several other captains testified that they would have done the same thing in Captain Smith's position. Smith had already altered the ship's course to a more southernly route in an attempt to avoid the ice. You have to remember that Titanic was a major passenger liner with a strict schedule to keep and slowing down or stopping was not an option. Contrary to popular belief Titanic was not at full speed at the time of the collision as not all her boilers had been lit.
@@robertmcalpine488 Prove what you just said. Even Bob Ballard blames Smith.
@@reneeparker7475 Read the transcripts from the enquiries. I can't provide online links because I read this information from many different books by respected Titanic authors and historians. I am not trying to say that Smith was blameless, I'm simply saying he acted in accordance with how things were back then. One of the reasons they didn't slow down was because it is easier to manoeuvre a ship when it is moving at speed. It looks really bad today because we have the benefit of hindsight and are looking at things through 21st century eyes, but this happened 111 years ago and standards and practices were very different back then.
@@robertmcalpine488 I have read them. I also know that the captain of any ship is responsible for that ship and all aboard her. Smith was under pressure from Bruce Ismay to set a new sailing record between Europe and America, and he caved.
@@reneeparker7475 That is one of the biggest myths about Titanic, under no circumstances were they trying to set a speed record for crossing the Atlantic, it wasn't physically possible. The Olympic class ships were several knots slower than the Cunard liners and could never have hoped to beat them. In the very competitive market against Cunard, White Star's focus and USP was on size and luxury and not speed. At no point during the voyage was Titanic at full speed, since several of her boilers had not been lit. It's also worth remembering that in an attempt to avoid the ice, Smith had altered the ship's course to a more southernly, and thus longer route.
That night inApril 1912 the captains of those three ships (Titanic, Californian and the Carpathia) did different things. The Captain of the Californian decided that he didn't like the idea of continuing through the ice field in the dark and stopped his ship until morning. The Captain of the Titanic continued at full speed until it hit an iceberg and sank killing over 1500 people. The Captain of the Carpathia steamed at full speed towards and into a known ice field that had already sunk the Titanic and missed the icebergs mostly by chance.
Which ship and Captain would you prefer to cross the Atlantic with?
Add to this the fact that the Californian did not have watertight compartments like the Titanic. If it leaked in even one place, it would sink very fast.
The one that stopped, but kudos to the Carpathia for risking their safety to assist. That took real bravery.
Titanic actually had been steered further south to avoid the ice that had blocked in Californian as when Captain Smith did get ice messages, he took them seriously. But what many people don't know is that the main Marconi wireless set broke down on Saturday the day before the sinking and instead of following the Marconi company rules and switching over to the weaker back up set, Phillips and McBride spent around 6 hours working to fix the main one. This lead to the huge backlog that resulted in a number of critical messaged not being set to the Titanic's bridge and it also lead to the stress that resulted in Evans being told off.
@@saturn1188 Source? Watertight compartments were nothing new and while it may not have had automatic doors like Titanic's the crew could certainly have closed the doors manually to seal compartments.
An airship and a Flight Captain.
I wonder what happened to the ship so thanks for making this video
She's a mystery; thank you for watching!
I know
Torpedoed and sunk in WWI... not so much a mystery.
Cottam is a hero I would say.
Sure is! He was the one who just accidentally heard the Titanic’s distress call and didn’t buy the insults the officers on deck gave him when he informed them about it.
This may sound dark and perhaps misplaced , but in a way the sinking of the Titanic has forced safety regulations to be reviewed not only on the sinking vessel (more life boats) but also procedures for rescuing ships ( colored signal flares at fast intervals ) . Instead of growing a doctrine of overconfidence in a ships reliability to not sink.
Isn’t that what always happen when a disaster happens, new regulations are made, mainly as a liability from lawsuits not cause they actually care about people but to try and save their own a**es from legal trouble/action
The very idea that Captain Lord blithely declined to become a hero by merely steaming ten miles is pure nonsense. If he'd known, he would have gone in. On the other hand, he had the brains not to try 22 knots with ice warnings about.
In the morning when Captain Lord found out about the tragedy of Titanic, he sailed over to the site to help out. He asked Captain Rostron of the Carpathia if he needed any help taking on some passengers, and Rostron told him that they didn't need any help, but look to see if there were any more possible survivors. Lord and the Californian searched for several hours to if there was any survivors in the area. If anything, Lord tried to help too. It was his ship that warned Titanic. After Carpathia, it was the Californian that came to help. The other ships, after they heard Titanic sunk, went about their business. No one ship decided to come to the wreck area and keep searching for any potential survivors with the Californian.
wow I guessed you haven't done enough research about the SS Californian and its crew, Stanley Lord and his crew knew the rockets the Titanic shoot were distress rockets, Lord insisted if they were company rockets. You should research the full US and British inquiry about the SS Californian and how they threw away the log book to destroy the real evidence of how they ignored the Titanic that night.
@@newtonsthirdlawofmot True
They made a movie about it based on scripts from the enquiry. No one loses log books before this.
@@newtonsthirdlawofmot bullshit.
They thought they were celebration rockets and were confused because they weren’t being shot the way it was recommended. They weren’t consistent with them.
@@Rebelheart1985 wow you also haven't done your research lol. Go read the full British and US inquiry. The Californian admitted that the rockets they saw wasn't being sent up for fun. The Titanic fired a total of 8 rockets at an intervals of every two minutes also mentioned in the inquiry. You talking about not being consistent? Please do your research first before you defend the Stanley Lord for his condemning act of not helping another steamer in distress. PS he paid for that for the rest of his life and I bet you didn't know that too because you haven't done your research lol
I wonder how he felt after knowing that 1500 people died that night. Not that all the blame should be put on him, but it goes to show how much human carelessness cost. So much went wrong when it shouldn’t have. It was completely avoidable. That’s what makes the Titanic’s story so sad and frustrating.
I am 63 and had a friend who was on the Californian when he was a boy. He had a story to tell as a boy and back then didn’t get much attention. He told me about running all over the ship, even the engine rooms and up to the bridge. He told how the message came on the radio and the operator told the captain. He said they all were laughing and saying they must be having a heck of a party. It was after a few messages that they then changed course just to make sure they weren’t joking. My friend wrote a few articles in our local newspaper that I have been trying to look up.
I should be most interested to see this.
what was ur friends name?
@@MRVISTA-wz7vj
Claus Hedstrom
Why did they change course? Im sorry I didn't understand
@@becca-dn4vs
Crossing an ocean isn't like following a road. The wind, weather, currents all determine the ships course of travel. Ships don't travel on a certain line even if they have the same destination. Checking on the Titanic took them several miles off course. Once they turned toward the Titanic they didn't change course. Hope this helps
The Californian did inspire to set up safety standards for the ocean liners and many other ships.
Yup, ships certainly became required to have more radio operators with at least one listening at all times in order to keep watch for distress calls 24/7.
I’m back watching all the titanic videos on TH-cam after this oceangate mess
Captain Lord was my Great Great Grandfather. My name is Brittany Lord. I find all of this so intriguing!! I would love to learn more about this.
Read "The Titanic and The Californian" by Peter Padfield - a great place to start your research.
Do you have an opinion on the controversy you'd be willing to express either in the comments of this video or privately? I'd be interested to know how the family feels about it after all these years since the Titanic disaster.
Not possible since Lord only had one son, a bachelor, who had no children of his own.
@@tranceguide9752 a good book.
@@billbarrett6285 Exactly... this is BS..
Good video, thank you very much! 👍
Thanks, Frank! Glad you liked it!
Configuration of deck chairs being the essential theme of this thread.
The Titanic was at least 17 to 20 nautical miles, and the cool air generated Fata Morgana or positive mirage, which makes things far away look much closer. By the time that Califorina had built up steam, it would have been too late to arrive before Titanic sunk. It only had a maximum speed of 12 knots so would old have taken over an hour to an hour and a half to reach the Titanics position. Sad is the fact that the Titanic radio operator did not allow the Califoria's radio operator to transmitt his full ice warning message, the arrogant bastard paid for this with his life and the lives of his fellow crew members, more than likely. Surely hazard warnings take priority over civil traffic, I bet it did after titanic sinking.
Try to 10-16 miles at MOST... any further directly contradicts Lord's position by dead reckoning that he took at 10:30 PM in his log...
The California had stopped because the icebergs were such a severe danger, but they start seeing flares go up left and right, and it doesn't occur to anyone to turn the radio back on? What the hell did they think flarers were for?
It's not Monday morning quarterbacking to say they were clearly negligent. Whether they could have gotten there in time for a rescue, does nothing to change that the California damn well should have tried
They were very curious about what was going on, but Captain Lord still didn’t want to try navigating the dense iceberg fields while it was still dark which is why he didn’t even bother to have his radio operator awakened to check on the messages until around sunrise when it was too late.
Yep, this exactly. He ignored clear distress signs, was not surrounded by icebergs as he later claimed, and made it down within easy time according to Carpathia.
I don't blame Captain Lord. He was tired and trying to get some sleep, and his ship was safe and stopped in pack ice. I blame the officers on watch, who had a feeling that something wasn't right. They should have awoke Evans to take a listen to his headset, to see if anything was amiss... But they didn't...
Agree. Evans should have been awakened to contact "that ship firing rockets."
Whether Californian realistically could have done anything remains unanswerable.
Titanic was 55 minutes into its predicament before firing its first rocket.
It had about an hour left.
Californian would've had to get up steam and pick its way through field ice to reach it, covering up to 10 miles of sea.
Not a lot of realistic hope.
@@danwallach8826 Closer than the Carpathian, could have done a lot
Agree, the more I learn about it, I feel the crew lied and threw the blame on Captain Lord to deflect their actions. There was also a lot of confusion about the rockets and the maritime rules. Captain Lord was the scapegoat for the company.
@@RawOlympia I agree. Had it steamed over, even if it arrived after Titanic sank under, it could have picked up the people in the water and saved a lot of lives before they all froze to death. It could have been a real difference maker. Nice to know that apathy is not a uniquely modern human trait....
@@mikeb53 indeed there appears to be no shortage! Carpathia truly was heroic, gladly that Catpain woke up!
Radio officers on smaller ships were not required to stand watch 24 hours a right up to the end of radio telegraph at sea in 1999. The bridge The bridge was required to guard the life boat frequency 2182KHZ and channel 16 on VHF.. It's important to remember that in 1912 radio at sea was new and not completely integrated into a normal part of a ships crew. The operators on the Titanic were Marconi men not Radio Officer's in the role as regulations would later require. The change was a direct result of the loss of the Titanic.
Very nice video, thank you for sharing! By the way, where did you find the deck plan at 2:46?
My fact-checker sent it to me from a Reddit user (credited in the lower left of the screen with the plan). If you would like the photo, send me an email at shipgeektv@gmail.com and I'll forward it.
I really enjoyed this very much
I'm glad! Thank you.
Wow nice! I love classic ships👍
Why didn’t they get their wireless operator back to his station when they saw the rockets?
Because the recognition of rockets color coding.. SS Calfornian' s crew saw that rocket ( White Rockets ) And they thought it was an Partying or Celebration ahead.
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial Except white rockets were the ones used for distress sugnals at the time. Titanic carried 36 Socket Signals. White rockets with explosive heads.
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial No... they did not. Read the testimonies... NO one thought it was celebratory at freakin' 1 AM.... come on man... this is basic.
It’s sad Californian wreck remains undiscovered
Is it correct that she carried no passengers on this trip and had a cargo of 3000 blankets and woollen jumpers? Also that some time before this incident captain Lord was commended for transferring 1000 people from one ship to another in the night in under 1 hour?
I’ve never heard of Gardiner, assumption is a bad system to use when looking for the truth.
I’ll never understand why the captain wouldn’t wake the wireless operator and at least have him check in with the Titanic to see if everything is ok, even if the flares weren’t “shot at the right intervals.” What did they think Titanic was shooting them for? A bloody firework show?!
At the time it was usual for a ship to throw flares just to indicate what company they work for. After the sinking, flares can just be use to signaling for help.
Sounds like firework shows were common at the time. As for the wireless operator, this was the first trip with one. The Cap't probably didn't think of him and responded to try to contact the ship. They couldn't get the Titanic to answer the signals.
@@annabellelee4535 I highly doubt the Californian didn’t have a wireless operator prior to this trip. How did the captain try to contact Titanic without wireless? I know he saw the flares and disregarded them because they were “not used properly.” If the Californian had come to Titanics aid hundreds of lives would have been saved.
@@braydenlovetere4545 That's what I've read. I've been studying the Titanic since I was a child. Wireless was very new in 1912. Many ships didn't have wireless and many ships were like the Californian and only had one which meant limited hours. The Californian was stuck in an ice field, they were going nowhere. Pity Smith wasn't as good a captain as Lord. If Lord was in control of the Titanic, the ship would have made it safely to NY because Lord didn't speed through ice fields. Did you know a few days before another ship hit an iceberg in the same area and limped to NY? Smith knew it was dangerous.
@@braydenlovetere4545 The Californian only contacted the Titanic on that trip. Where do you read that they were in contact before since this was the Titanic's first trip? How could they be in contact on prior trips?
CQD (Come Quick Distress) was the standard wireless call for help. SOS (Save Our Souls) was only introduced during the International Radiotelegraph Convention (1906). SOS was a relatively new call and Titanic's wireless operators used both CQD and SOS on April 14th, 1912.
These anagrams have nothing to do with what they actually meant. SOS was just integrated as an easier way to signal for help aside from the complicated CQD.
@@nauticusvergil are you okay?
@@cardboardempire The anagrams don't mean what you're claiming. CQD is not "Come Quick Distress" nor is SOS "Save our Souls."
@@nauticusvergil But are you okay? Do you need help?
It's always fascinated me about the Californian that night. I still wonder if she could have made a difference?
How could she since she was stuck in an ice field. She stopped for the night since it was too dangerous to go on.
I know. Some people told me it would have taken her an hour to warm up her engines, and another hour to get there. Other people have told me differently, but I suppose we'll never really know how far away she really was.
@@annabellelee4535Yeah exactly..
@@annabellelee4535 people just seem to want a scapegoat.
@@annabellelee4535 Wasn't stuck in an icefield per Lord's own log...
PLEASE DO A DOC ON THE SINKING OF THE HMS HERMES. MY GRAMPS WAS ON THIS SHIP!
Her Majesty Ship Hermes
@RMS_CarpathiaOfficial the Japanese sank it and shot at my grampa while he was in the water. Totally breaking the rules of war... but he survived. Most phenomenal human being I've ever met.
@@lislevollgraaff1236 👍👍👍
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial HIS Majesty's Ship Hermes... King George V when commissioned... come on.
There is a great video from Oceanliner designs, that talks about the wireless messenger on ships at this time and why the Titanic's messenger told the other to shut up. It was how they talked to each other. That wasn't him being rude or hurtful or anything it was how wireless operators talked to one another over the wireless.
I believe that Captain Lord was genuinely mistaken as to what he seen that night. I believe that had he received solid confirmation, he would indeed have aided Titanic. There were certainly "grey areas" that night. But surely if there was any degree of uncertainty, or discussion amongst the officers of Californian, the wireless apparatus should surely have been switched back on?? As a precaution if nothing else?
Yes.. .he was genuinely mistaken. He was tired and suffering from confirmation bias. His own wireless operator told him Titanic was the only ship in wireless range, yet he claimed that wasn't Titanic, and a steamer more his own size. Therefore, not in wireless range, probably didn't even have wireless and could only communicate via Morse lamp. He tried this, but was well over the 5 mile range for it, so that further confirmed in his mind just a small steamer incapable of communication. Why he ignored CLEAR distress rockets that night? I don't know... I'm still negligent no matter how I spin it in my favor. All he asked were are they company signals? Response was they were white rockets... that, according to the rules of the road at the time, are distress signals. He went back to sleep and decided oh well... whatever. I tried to explain this about a hundred ways myself... and I'm still negligent for ignoring signals. It didn't help that his story kept changing after the fact either. About five times no less. So there's that too. He's either a terrible navigator, or a willing liar, but either way, doesn't look good.
It doesn't matter if it's unlikely that Californian could have made a big difference - the point is that Lord didn't try. If you see someone drowning, do you say "I don't think I can get to him before he's dead, so no point getting wet."? And how would you expect everyone to view your reasoning, even if correct? Also, most people will fall unconscious after 15 minutes but not die for 45, and under some circumstances you can go a lot longer, like the cook did. If they had arrived and lowered their boats, it seems likely they might have saved a few people - if they could save even one, it would be worth it.
Exactly! At least the most Honorable Captain Arthur of the Carpathia knew what to do. DIdn't hestitate. Pointed his ship in the right direction , asked for confirmation, let his telegrapher tell Titanic they're on their way, they were too far but she gave everything, she steamed full ahead and he was risking his own ship, avoiding 4 icebergs, and made it trhough to pick up 706 people.
Cook? You mean the Chief Baker Charles Joughin
Absolutely correct! Better to TRY and possibly fail than to do absolutely nothing at all and have a guaranteed failure which is what he opted to do...
very interesting. well done.
Using the language of shut up was investigated and litigated, and found to be common, friendly language of operators. Their messages should have been interpreted accurately, but that Californian operator was blamed when he should not have been
"Shut up."
"OK... Good night."
Ignorant and not even close to the testimony by Evans.
Good stuff dude! You should work together with Historic Travels. Definitely subbing to your channel.
Hey Devin, thanks for the sub!
You're welcome dude. I've already watched like all of your videos haha. Looking forward to more! Keep it up
I personally do not blame Lorde, he is the scapegoat. He is the person that's easy to blame for his inaction when in reality the governing regulations were out dated. I mean Captain Rostron of the Carpatia could very well have killed all of his passengers and crew and created an even larger disaster simply due to his commands (he pushed his ship beyond the limits, and sailed at full speed in an area that had ice).
In regards to Lorde, I don't think he REALLY could have helped the Titanic at all. Californian is primarily a cargo vessel, so where are you going to accommodate 1500 people? The ship had enough space for about 150 people in their cabins. Soooo what put people in cargo compartments? Add on that at the time lifeboats were designed to "ferry" people from the stricken ship to the ship that was saving them (so keep that in mind.) She was SLOWER than Carpathia, which means she would take time to respond because Californian was dead stopped in the water, and most likely the boilers at idle or in a low power state. It will take time to get those boilers up to pressure.
So even upon seeing the rockets and reacting immediately to help, it would have taken Lorde about 2-3 hours minimum to help (she went about 12 knots per hour, which is in the range of 7-10mph). Titanic lasted about 2.5 hours from point of impact. The rockets were not launched until 45 minutes had passed. The crew of the Titanic did use their morse lamp to contact Californian, and did communicate with them. But it was noted that the ship they were talking to had "sailed away" from Titanic. Most likely the 2 ships had drifted away from each other. So 45 minutes passed, of Lorde immediately responds to the rockets and gets under way; the earliest Lorde would have arrived on scene was during the "final plunge." This would have been the WORST time to arrive, this would have been a scene of PURE ABSOLUTE CHAOS. Go ahead and watch the scene in Titanic after the ship finally sinks, it would have summed up everything that would have occurred, IF not intensified the situation. I'm in the belief that if Californian had arrived on scene right around the final plunge, it would have made the situation WORSE, because the absolute chaos would have gotten more people killed.
Procedures at the time dictated that lifeboats were to "ferry" people between the ships. Ferrying would involve arriving on scene about 1 mile away, launching their boats and have the boats from Titanic row to the Californian. The boats would ferry back and forth until Titanic sunk or everyone was safely aboard. So how do you safely rescue people out of the ocean in a chaotic state with out others getting killed in the process? Time is not on your hands because people will start dying due to hypothermia in about 15 minutes.
if you do the math::: In 2 hours Time if the Californian saved 1 person every ten seconds that would equal 720 Lives Saved // If she was able too save one person every 5 seconds that would Equal 1440 lives saved .. IT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN
You can't even spell Lord correctly... it's Lord NOT Lorde... and he should've risked it all to save everyone and he clearly ignored distress signals PER the rules of the road in that era... *sighs* Yeah OK... moving on. He's dead.. he's not giving you a medal for defending him...
If the sailor could see that ship was listing, then they were close enough to rescue them.
Actually the Californian was stuck in an ice field which was why the ship was stopped for the night. It was too dangerous to barge ahead. Pity Smith wasn't as careful of a captain as Lord.
@@annabellelee4535 No... he stated in his log he stopped clear of the icefield... there was drifting pack ice ahead but NOTHING around. Sure maybe a berg or two but surely not as much as Carpathia risked to get there...Agreed that Smith was absolutely reckless reckless for ignoring warnings.
@@nauticusvergil If the captain of the Titanic was as good of a captain as the captain of the Californian, the Titanic would have sailed for many years instead of ending up on the bottom of the ocean. That is a fact that you cannot deny. Captain Lord stopped due to the danger and didn't even know the Titanic sank til the next morning.
@@annabellelee4535 Except I've never said Smith was a great captain. I've continually said he's a terrible captain, as is Lord. You just constantly ignore my factual statements and keep fixating on me saying Smith was great when I've never said that... he was a terrible captain who demonstrably was proven to have been speeding that night, according to Lord Mersey, and ran into an iceberg due to his own negligence. Lord absolutely knew distress signals were being fired that night, per the rules of the road, and chose to act confused about it and did nothing substantial. End of story.
@@nauticusvergil Captain Lord was a good captain, his ship didn't end up on the bottom of the ocean. You're giving opinions, not facts. Lord said to his officers to send a message using glass to see if there was a problem and there was no answer. The Titanic didn't bother to send a message through signals so why blame Captain Lord for the Titanic's negligence. There are no roads on the ocean and there are no "rules of the road". Captain Lord didn't have to risk his ship and the lives of everyone on board on a light that may or may not be a emergency beacon that wouldn't answer his message.
What would a rocket not fired in timed intervals indicate? The crew drunk having a party or something? I mean to me rockets going off says "Help!".
Captain Lord actually did say that the Titanic was probably just having a celebration.
@@DANIELLE_BREANNA_LACY No he didn't. He never testified to this.
I’m certainly no expert in the topic, so I may be wrong, but from what I’ve gathered, the Californian was completely stopped for the night, her boilers cooled and her engines shut down. Many believe that had she immediately sailed for the Titanic as soon as she saw the rockets, she may have made it in time, but they don’t account for the fact that the Californian would have had to first undertake the strenuous process of building steam pressure up and restarting the engines, a process that could have taken more than an hour. The Carpathia however, was already moving when it got Titanic’s distress calls; all she did was turn around. Even if Captain Lord had made steam for Titanic as soon as possible, I don’t think he would have made it in time to save anyone else. More likely he would only have made the Carpathia’s job a little easier.
good point, we don't want those two colliding
He was stopped EDGE of icefield per his own log, and per regulations, would've had steam up in need of emergency, which there was plenty of that night.
One minute intervals to be considered an emergency? Jesus Christ things were stupid back then.
It actually said "short intervals." What that means? Who knows? Five minutes? Short intervals? Probably. they ignored clear distress signals that night.
Nice video btw I was the first comment on this video
Thank you!
Also also new sub:)))))))))
Capt. Lord did everything right, by the book. Capt Smith did everything wrong. Californian was surrounded by ice. That’s why he was stopped. The steam was minimal. It’s estimated to have been able to reach the area around the same time as Carpathia. If they left after sighting the rockets.
The green flares
@@RMS_LusitaniaOfficial I do not recall them seeing green flares. WAY to low on the water. The Samson or the Mount Temple probably did.
Very good account (although it’s not true that the deck officers only tried to rouse captain Lord after Titanic had “disappeared”). Excellent research on the history and fate of the Californian. Many thanks.
Yes... they tried to rouse him during the sinking, he did nothing at all.
You are wrong. There is only one question that needs to be asked here and it has nothing to do with wireless which is a red herring.
What colour were all distress rockets in 1912??? He must have known cos he would also have carried them. And for the same purpose.
He admitted being told that the "mystery ship" had fired white rockets which he decided on zero evidence were "company signals".
Now if distress rockets were always white (which I suspect they were for easy identification) then he should have known that a white rocket = distress. And his decision to brand it a company signal becomes very disingenuous.
So lets not focus on the wireless which is a settled issue and focus instead on his non response to distress rockets which we all know were seen by the officer on watch of the Californian and reported to the captain.
Wow what a good explantation! I had no idea that a mirage was behind the Californians lack of response!
No it wasn’t.. don’t let this documentary fool you. There was no mirage. Titanic sent out 7 distress rockets… 7… they also sent multiple SOS calls via Morse code. They weren’t deceived, they just didn’t take the warnings seriously smh
The captain, or the officer on duty, could have simply awaken the wireless operator to verify why the rockets were being fired. Any commanding officer understands the need to clarify the situation if it's at all possible.
The Californian lookouts are definitely to blame imo. Should have woke Captain Lord and informed him. Seems like they had a lot of inexperienced and green crew on that ship.
@@zackfair6791 I believe they did wake up Lord and he told them to try and contact the ship using the morse lamp. That would make sense prior to wireless. Perhaps in his groggy state Lord forgot that he had wireless on board. But the officer on watch could have waken up the wireless operator on his own authority as well so your point it well taken.
Yes, he was awoken, and told them to contact via Morse lamp which was useless as they were more than 5 miles apart (try 10 -16) and he didn't awaken Evans, so it's on him.
Excellent factual report.
I mean, if the Titanic did listen to the Californian, she might have made it to new york, no damage in the ship. But I do think the dude sending the iceberg message should have been more clear about the warning
There was another vessel even closer than the Californian. Earlier that evening, crew aboard the Samson could clearly see a 'huge ship with four funnels' that rapidly overtook them. When the huge ship stopped around midnight and rockets fired, they thought - wrongly - that they had been spotted. The Samson was illegally plucking seals off the ice flow and had no radio.
Honestly there were numerous ships in the area the night the Titanic suck none of them could have got there in time to rescue people the Titanic sunk so fast it was almost an hour before she even started sending distress calls the whole ship sunk in less than 3 hours so there just wasn't enough time and even if this little Schooner that was hunting seals habit tempted to go to the Titanic rescue what are they going to do there's no way in hell such a small vessel could have taken on hundreds and hundreds or thousands of people on board they would have been helpless themselves to do anything the only way that you save everyone's life that night is that you don't hit the iceberg to begin with end of story Titanic never hits the iceberg to start with everyone saved it's even calculated that even if the Titanic had enough lifeboats for everyone on board there wasn't enough time to get everyone off the ship considering that they didn't even start loading the lifeboats till almost an hour after striking the iceberg they were still trying to get the collapsible lifeboats loaded and off the ship when the ship broke in half and sank... she just sank too fast no one ever thought that it shipped that large with watertight compartments would be so damaged that she would sink in less than 3 hours most experts at the time figured that even if a ship that large was going to sink that it would take eight nine 10 hours for it to happen giving other rescue ship plenty of time to come and rescue everyone
If 2 of those ships within the disaster area had sailed toward the doomed liner, at least many could have been saved instead of many drowned. There's the big difference; nothing to do with the Titanic's size. Trust me, when people are drowning, even a small boat will do....
@@leonardolupini3484 it's not about the people it's about human performance and time any ship in the range of Titanic to get to her to rescue her by the time the Titanic sent out distress signals and when you factor in the time that the ship would have had to get her boilers running an engines up and going and then navigate an ice field in the middle of the night to get to Titanic they would have arrived just a Titanic went underneath the water and broke into throwing 1,500 people into the water by the way do you know that they only recovered 378 bodies from the ocean the other 1200 went down with the ship inside the ship now if you Google how long a human being can last in 28-degree water you will find that once a person enters water that cold you have at most 15 minutes to get them out of the water many people suffered fatal heart attacks as soon as they hit the water and died upon immersion so you have 15 minutes to get those humans out of that water or they're going to die how do you do it? So how do you get a person out of the water into the Hall of a ship the only way that you can really do it is they have the special rope ladders that you throw or cargo Nets that you throw over the side of the hall and people have to climb up the hall in water that cold most people would not have the strength to make that climb to get into the Hall people would start dying immediately upon entering water that cold people don't realize most people did not drown that night they froze to death the water is what killed people not to mention when you approach at the Carpathia did when you approach the disaster seeing you would have to stop your engines and drift into the scene as to not possibly stripe and destroy a Lifeboat remember Titanic had already been launched in her life boats so there were Lifeboat all over the disaster scene and a rescue ship would have to be very careful not to run over and sink a Lifeboat trying to rescue people there just wasn't you can do the performance evaluations there just wasn't enough time to say people what they've been able to save more than three people that were pulled from the water that night sure but we're talking maybe 50 people the only way you save everyone on the Titanic at night cuz you don't hit the iceberg to begin with by the way it's the Carpathia hours to capture and offload the survivors that were in lifeboats from the Titanic it was an arduous and strenuous operation in fact some people were so in shock and weak they couldn't even climb up the ladders into the Carpathia and the Carpathia had to use her cranes and lower cargo Nets down to the Lifeboat and literally hoist people into her Hall now imagine trying to conduct that rescue operation in the middle of the night in darkness with people who are panicking and flailing around in water the only possible way you could save everyone on the Titanic is it there had been a vessel in the immediate Jason area got Titanic's rescue call immediately after she hit the iceberg was able to come along her broadside within 15 or 20 minutes after striking the iceberg and then connect their ship with walkways to the Titanic and transfer people through catwalk but even that is extremely dangerous operation because remember the Titanic sinking a sinking ship is very unstable and prone to listing and even capsizing even that kind of operation would be extremely dangerous about the Titanic ship capsized the only reason she didn't capsize is that because of a coal bunker fire they had transferred a lot of coal over to the port side of the ship to put out the fire and that helped counterbalance the weight of the starboard list it's really the only reason why Titanic didn't capsize about an hour after the sinking in fact James Cameron found that in all their computer sinking simulation Titanic capsized on the computer simulation would capsize about an hour after hitting the iceberg and it was only when they factored in that extra coal that have been moved to the port side of the ship to offset the weight of the water is when they could stabilize the computer model to the point where the ship would completely sink and not capsize if it hadn't been for that little fact that they moved all that coal to the other side of the ship Titanic would have capsized before they even were able to get any lifeboats off and all lives would have been lost
@@leonardolupini3484 now I've researched this and there was one other way that you could save everyone off the Titanic but it would have required a well-trained crew and enough lifeboats for every person on the ship if they had started the evacuation process within 15 minutes of hitting the iceberg preparing the lifeboats and starting to evacuate the ship not waiting an hour like they did but within the first 15 minutes and if the Titanic had carried enough lifeboats for every human on the ship they could have had just enough time to offload all the people off the Titanic and two lifeboats and then the Carpathia or the Californian or the Samsung or another rescue vessel in the area could have come and started the retrieval process but that's the only way that you could save everyone since they didn't even bother to do a Lifeboat drill like they were supposed to do that Sunday morning the crew was not very well trained and lowering these lifeboats and the ship didn't have enough lifeboats for everyone on board this is just a fantasy scenario and there's no way in hell they could have got everyone off the ship waiting an entire hour after striking the iceberg they needed to start evacuating immediately after hitting the iceberg
And the Temple!
The captain of the California was probably advised to not do anything because the Titanic was sunk intentionally and they wanted to make sure several opponents of the Federal reserve were eliminated had they shown up they probably wouldn't have been.
The Titanic was NOT sunken intentionally, the captain of the Californian was just too afraid to try moving again while it still dark so he didn’t even bother to have his radio operator awakened to check on the messages to investigate further on what they had been watching over night until around sunrise.
Crap, plain and simple. Disregard this MISINFORMATION.
Very well done, thanks for posting. Would highly encourage anyone with an interest in the Titanic and the history to read the 1992/1993 Reapprasial of the Evidence (Brought about by the discovery of the Titanic's wreck in 1985) from the British Major Accident Investigation Board. It rounds out the discussion on these questions. Another good book is "The Titanic and the Mystery Ship", 2005 by Sean Mulroney. Very good reading and well researched.
Thank you for the suggestion I am a book reader myself too
Yes thanks, I'm going to read it too
The Titanic faithful don`t like reappraisals of any kind, they have the official version of the event overall from 1912 and the finding of the wreck together with stuff from the 1990s and beyond has caused them a whole load of problems. Evidence from witnesses that the ship broke in two had been effectively suppressed, but the truth came out in 1985, and the book you mention is by no means popular with them. And then there is Gardiner.
@@aj6954 Except Robin Gardiner's a proven moron who could never definitively prove that Titanic and Olympic were actually switched... *sighs*
This is great.
Thanx 👍😎
even if the Californian had heard the messages in time it was trapped by ice and had its engines off to wait out the ice for the night
The engines were not turned off.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 they were trapped in ice and the engines were off but the boilers were on to use electricity
@@TheAussieHistorian2022 No, she wasn't. Captain Lord, in his evidence to the US Inquiry, reported that :-
'Well, we were surrounded by a lot of loose ice, and we were about a quarter of a mile off the edge of the field.'
He also reported that Californian re-started her engines at 05.15 on 15 April, and was under way by 06.00.
Thus, he was reporting 'loose ice,' and his ship was under way quickly.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 thanks for that mate. i had no idea
Boilers had steam up, per regulations. 10-16 miles away... could've made a difference. Not trapped per Lord's own log and Carpathia's testimony...
Capt Smith was a seasoned captain. He knew of the icebergs in the area. He kept charging forward
While Captain Rostron was even better aware of the icebergs and charged forward beyond the Carpathia’s maximum speed to dash to the Titanic’s rescue with extra lookouts keeping an extra extremely close watch for icebergs in their path and had the ship well-prepared to slow down and turn whenever an iceberg in their path was spotted.
I'm pretty confident the ship the passengers/ crew saw from the Titanic wasn't the Californian or only just the Californian. Eva Hart said in her testimony that the ship they saw was sailing/sailed away. The Californian had stopped for the night because of the ice field. "An attractive theory, but superficial". Probably the Mount Temple was the ship that failed to help, but why?
people say its because that boat was hunting for seals and that's why it was sailing away. It wasn't Mount Temple bc they did actually try to help. Unfortunately when they arrived at the distress coordinates I think they were in a really packed ice field and the titanic had already sunk. They just were too late, and then were too far from where the titanic actually was to see any of the survivors.
@@vondonstrut218No.. Its The MV Sampson
@@vondonstrut218Hey.. FYI.. Its not the Mount Temple you stated that " The boat was hunting for seal" Its MV Samson, 7 miles away to the Titanic. Stop Spreading Misinformation..