NOTE - ModIo does appear to have a "Preview Mode", which can be set to allow any logged-in user to view a link without it being set to public. While this is somewhat like Steam's "Unlisted" mode, it is still a bit of a downside - mainly as you need an account and to be logged in. Traditionally, "Unlisted" can be accessed by those without an account.
Alienating the modders who want and prefer the steam workshop is to shoot the game in the chest. It was the modders that made SE1 what it became from it's early days. Without them and the workshop, the game would have remained a smallscale unknown game amongst many.
Thats the general problem with modern developers. Often times they take those that brought them to success. Fundamentally ending their career right then and there because those same people take those who followed them elsewhere to another game or community that actually has respect for them.
Something that was pretty useful in SE1 is the ease with which a player joining a multiplayer game will automatically dowload the needed mods. Do we know if this will be supported in SE2 as well?
@WiseOwl_1408 we don't know is the correct answer. it could, it could not. though from a technical standpoint it's not difficult to implement from what I can think of. check mods from server download mods on client activate mods on client when he joins server
Marek ALSO said it wasn't set in stone that they would use Mod io. It's just what they're planning on using, but they may change their mind later, and Modding isn't even coming for a few vertical slices yet...
Yes he did. However, the only way to get a developer to reconsider is to express ones worries with the current decission and as with this video does explain the key issues that one has. For me a move to Mod IO is worrying as I have had several of my favoriate games run their modding scene on the platform and it has nearly always ended with major dumpster fires every couple of months thanks to admins and creator disputes. Not that there aren't disputes on steam but they are limited to the creators amongst each other as steam is a faceless impartial arbiter of just the basic rules.
@@William0271 No, that's Workshop. Modding support isn't until VS 1.5. But even still, there's plenty of time before the game fully releases, i.e.: comes out of beta, for things to change.
@@Yokoto12343 why? No seriously I have 5000+ hours in se1 and play it on pc exclusively. And while I’m bummed I still don’t see the issue, I know why they’re doing it and I know the end goal is to have an in-game workshop which doesn’t sound too bad to me.
@@ricardosousa7150 I did. Did you? Marek literally said they would change it if we didn’t like it…. Y’all obviously don’t like it and I really don’t care that much. Looks like it’s going on the steam workshop
You didn't mention this, but another Modio negative is their list of words that's censored, such as 'could.' Apparently, it is a list that is enforced by either console platforms.
@@doltBmB There is no DRM for Steam Workshop mods. Nothing prevents you from downloading, modifying and re-uploading them to your heart's content. Lack of manual download link? Yeah, that's not a DRM.
I get the why modIO, but, since you have to create an account on both modIO and steam to upload to their respective platforms why not just have users create a steam account, and use that for the backend instead of modIO. I checked if valve allows game creators to use their APIs, and sure enough, they do, they even have a nice flow chart on how user generated content works and all the functions called to publish, update and modify the page/item. The only reason I can think of is if someone can't access the game's steam workshop if he/she hasn't bought the game. If an xbox/ps user that does not own a space engineers 1 copy on steam is willing to try to access the steam workshop, it'd be appreciated (if he/she has a steam account and is even willing to try to subscribe to something, I'd be even happier). Let's try to show keen that having steam as a backend is better.
In my playing of Space Engineers 1, I have never downloaded anything from mod I.O. That being said, for the Steam Workshop, I have currently like 3,000 mods.
@@p0sel2613 No body is saying they do clown. His point still stands, anyone wanting to use mods (pretty much the entire space engineers playerbase) will be forced to use this third party service.
@@DeagleGamesTV this “third party service” will be an in game menu it’s not like you have to download a whole new program to obtain mods and blueprints. Most games have already made the swap to modio. People always hate change and act like it’s the worst thing in the world. Modio works just fine but people have to have something to cry about.
So their goal is to "not splitting the community", but the community will split when they introduce in-game script or some mods don't work on console and the mod dev doesn't know why (because they don't have a console to debug).
No splits, they will just not allow scripting MODs ... dumbing PCs down to console levels ... simples. Bloody stupid idea, but hey it's Keen and Marek, did we expect any different?
Yeah, I get why Keen is planning to use modio, for consoles. But, not using the Steam Workshop is a deal breaker for me. I was starting to get excited about it, but when I first heard the news about not using the Steam Workshop, it is getting a big "nope" from me. Let's be real, multi-platform games hold PC gamers back due to hardware limitations of consoles and phones. I have nothing against console players, I've had one most of my life. But, why turn a 3 party transaction into a 4 party transaction?
This seems like a big mistake on Keen's part. This is a niche game for a niche community of gamers, and the modding scene via Steam Workshop is so ingrained, that nuking it outright, will cost them customers.
They should've gone for how Factorio handles mods, IMO. Or just let it be done through something like Nexus mods. Steam workshop is actually pretty bad since it _forces_ auto-updates of mods. Which can lead to a mod that requires a specific version of another mod no longer working if that second mod is updated in a way that "breaks" the mod that requires it. Versioning is important, people.
ModIO barely works half the time, when we used to host a server we recreated mods that mimiced 2 ModIO only mods, and later unlisted mods as addons to existing mods to change values. So yeah, no thanks, i was already tired of SE and hoped SE2 might revive the love i had for it, but this is again something that makes me a lot less enthusiastic for SE2.
It might be worthwhile to wait and see, modding isn't planned as a feature until vs 1.5 and it sounds like keen wants mods to be accessible from within the game with modio only as backend/alternate. I do trust steam more but we should see what keen cooks up.
sounds like it's planned to just be integrated into the game itself, just like the BeamNG mod system - there are no workshop mods, they are just hosted by BeamNG's servers and viewed/downloaded in-game, which I've never had an issue with
A mod was uploaded a couple weeks ago that pretty much made the unified grid system in SE1 so, SE2 was practically made null. I'm sticking with SE1. [It's called the 50cm Grid System if anyone wants to use it.]
Lmao it's not the same, plus the new engine improves game performance drastically. I find it strange how you people are so elitist about SE1, like...are you just poor and can't spend $30 or something?
I am more of a fan that space engineers 2 will have that baseline. and its not like that is the only thing 2 is promised to have either. Ideally it will end up as a better foundation to mod from, but only time will tell.
@@ChristoffRevan I said "pretty much" not "Exactly". SE1 is practically finished but, has been in development for 13 years only being out of Beta for 7 years. I have problems with SE1 too so, not Elitist. They plan on doing the same with SE2 which was officially announces December.5th if you don't count all the VRage3 clips we've seen through out the past few years. I'm not waiting till approximately 2038 for SE2 to be a complete game and Yeah, I'm kinda poor I live in the 21st century. I should have been investing in stocks or something 20 some years ago but, I was too busy stewing in my mother's womb. I'm not going to spend $30 on a game that's comparable to raw dough in terms of development.
@@Zandeves Absolutely, I'm sure there's more that we don't know about. When it's more fleshed out and reflects SE1 I will likely buy it but, I'm really hoping for orbital mechanics and VR support. Those are the 2 features that'll really make or break this game for me.
the problem is PC gamer don't want be bothered with Console-Kidis anyway... they want the separation Steam Workshop is not a option it's mandatory! think SE 2 will flop without steam workshop.
This decision is frankly baffling. Steam Workshop is the backbone of Space Engineers, it is in large part the reason that the game (and by proxy, Keen SWH) still exists and is still popular. Mod io is fine for users, but for modders it's not really usable, for the reasons you described and more. If mod io was able to have the same features as steam workshop, I wouldn't have a problem, but it doesn't, and since they don't own or control the platform, they cannot bolt on the needed functionality. I will not be giving Keen my money until Steam Workshop is back on the roadmap. I made a comment in the SE2 store discussion page as well.
I mean, Steam Workshop DOES lack a vital feature, which is being avaialable in other platforms. Honestly, I do think that's a more important function than any of the others in the end of the day. Still, I do think a path like Factorio's using their own solution would be better than the Workshop as well for this situation. If anything I find the fact people follow you through the /workshop/ is also like... A failure of Steam Workshop's usage even, which also makes sense since Steam /wants/ to be the hub of all activity so that nobody moves away from it. And this video is a very good example of how they keep franchies tied to their name and store! Also, Factorio basically only uses their in-game mod frontend! And honestly it's 500x better than anything Steam has >_>
Exactly. All of the PC users here who are demanding Steam Workshop be the primary modding platform don't realize that doing so would mean depriving 90% of mods from the eventual console versions of SE2, which is exactly the way things are currently with SE1. This is especially problematic for crossplay, since it makes doing modded crossplay impossible unless you only use modio mods, of which there are very few compared to the steam workshop (the steam workshop has over 30,000 SE mods, whereas modio currently only has 2300). Using modio as primary modding platform for SE2 allows all mods and blueprints to be available on all platforms, and thus enable fully unified crossplay for the eventual console versions of SE2.
@Dumbrarere This one is not on Keen's back. This is straight up on the console companies (Sony, Microsoft, etc). They don't let *any* code run on their consoles that they don't audit first, thats why console updates have limited release windows based on the time it takes for the companies to audit the updates. I *doubt* they're willing to audit mods (Also IIRC you need to pay per audit as well)
Man, just just pre-ordered SE 2 five days ago but now, after I know, that they are not planning for the Steam Workshop, I cancelled my order. I'm afraid, the game will take the same path downhill as Cities Skylines 2. A "Yeah, maybe sometime in the future perhaps." ist way too vague for me to bet on it.
I dont use mods, i have no stake in this. I still support Steam as an option. I hate that what that means is extra dev work that could go elsewhere but its clearly a great benefit to the players so id say its worth it.
I'm going too sound silly, but this is the first time ever hearing about this mod io thing. Se2 making its self out to be a harder sale the more I hear about it.
Paradox also made the move of taking the mods out of the steam workshop to their own platform (in the Cities skylines II)… And honestly? IT'S TERRIBLE.
I personally thought that it's understandable that they're opting to integrate a solution that is platform agnostic, so that both PC and console players could use it. Edit: Ah okay, I understand that it lacks some important features :/
I understand the one point of interest for mods from Keens point of view, but, with SE1, creators have been "dealing" with both platforms for however long both platforms have been working together. Myself, I'd rather talk to a community rather than the developer directly. He/she has more important things to do (Like, write the mod?) than deal with me one on one when there's thousands of other people who are asking the EXACT same question. I've already pre-ordered, and accepted the key, and it's on my wait list to be installed. Keen did absolutely wonderful things with SE1 and I really do look forward to whatever SE2 ends up being.
I have used Mod Io on Snowrunner, I didn't like it. I looked at it for SE1 as well, but have only been using Steam workshop mods for years now. I don't think there will ever be a time where console and PC gamers are 'the same'. Both sets of users game for different reasons and have different expectations. The idea does seem simpler to keep them all in one place, but simple is often just a wishlist item and impractical in reality. I hope they decide to go with Steam eventually.
I can see why if they're aiming for cross platform (off steam versions often suffer from a lack of mod access) but to ignore the workshop is a HUGE mistake because steam users can if they want sit and browse things from the launcher rather than having to load up a game. Without mods the current game lacks a lot of gameplay and like it or not sandboxes do need to give people a reason to build stuff other than "because" especially in any mode outside creative. I'm still of the mind that they shouldn't have gone with a sequel but instead made a big thing of upgrading the engine for free with a continuation of the cosmetic fluff dlcs to support the on going development. The apparent lack of what will be in the initial early access launch for 2 won't encourage people to drop cash on an upgrade and there'll be folk like myself who will be very wary following the medieval engineers being effectively abandoned to keep the space game in orbit.
I tried to support both platforms. However, Mod IO users would regularly reupload my creations with absolutely no credit. On top of that, it has nonsensical automated censorship. Am I somehow potentially swearing in some unknown language? Needless to say, I stopped uploading to Mod IO. I believe SE2 should just incorporate both and let players choose as SE1 does.
@@camerondocherty4244 KSP2 failed due to bad business decisions on Take Two and has nothing to do with players. Try doing some research about the issue before making a idiotic comment. Watch Bellular News video on the subject and that will explain what really happened to KSP2 and the studio who developed it.
There are perspectives we don't have as a community that developers see as blatant. For instance Keen might be doing this so they can pivot away from Steam since steam never gives the rights to the games you purchase. This point will probably create a major issue down the road and Keen may have to pull out of Steam just to survive. If some of the biggest parts of the game (modding and Steam Workshop) are entrenched into Steam then they will have no choice but to go down with that ship too.
And Keen will you "give" rights to the game? Riiight. BTW (definitely not a scam) I have a few bridges, very interesting plots of land, NFTs and some freshly minted coins to offer you. /s
Honestly, why Keen can't use both with unified frontend? I know (as software developer) that it would probably get quite messy, yet still possible. Would require uploading mods to both platforms and somehow keeping versions in sync, though
Its good to raise awareness on this, but I ultimately want keen to execute on their vision and not get sidetracked. Beating back the complexity is of vital importance for all software projects and teams.
The puzzling thing is we have several games now going “we’re launching our own mod thing/using another mod thing for the console players! So they can have mods!” For games that have like, seventeen console players. Like I’m sure, convinced even, that there is an absolute mad man right now just banging away on his cities skylines 2 city on the ole pee ess feev just making that controller click and clack like crazy in this intricate top down management but is his weird obstinance/proclivity really worth making the other 99.998% of us deal with paradox mods? How many people were belting out spaceships they were just dying to share on the Xbox? Really? Honest answers? Every time the communitys talk about this there clearly are some but it is a MASSIVE split so I’m not sure how you justify making it worse for >95% to make it better for
KEEN SWH- o7. If your watching and reading comments, I have a suggestion, though I suspect this might be partly the reasoning for exclusively using mod IO: The back end usage for an in-game UI maybe for an economy system, where a player can 'sell' a blue print in-game to a player so they can actually have that blueprint in-game, and pay the creator for it using an in-game money line space credits. This would boost in-game economy usage massively if you have a player to player economy mechanic where you can buy, sell, or trade blueprint without having to actually build the ship... Or have a station that would spawn player designed ships after purchase. This would be epic!
It does make sense having the user created content on all platforms in one place rather than having it split between consoles and steam(PC), less time spent on coding for 2 sharing systems. But as in the video the workshop is a great for content creators to hide designs for a while and do series collections or a collection of their most liked mods and themed mods too. I've never used Mod iO as i've never heard of it until today. I would still buy SE2 as I do enjoy those type of games and I do still enjoy playing SE.
as much as i presume steam workshop support may come in when the game is more developed, i see no reason why it shouldn't have steam workshop from the start besides the garry's mod problem, but in general i have a good feeling this will be changed soon enough. (edit: i see no reason why we shouldn't have a centralized community, on the steam workshop of course, it is just the superior choice over any and all other platforms.)
will probs take a next gen console to run the game anyway, considering the pc requirements, seems incredibly unfair to be forced to use an objectively worse system just so the consoles lot can have more mods, many of which will likely not work with console anyway
This is the cherry ontop of why I'm not buying SE2. Limited features on release, engine still sluggish, no info on server performance and now no mod support via steam?? Like what?! It's a solid no from me.
I'm looking past when we get servers for SE2. Using Mod I/O to get mods doesn't work for servers. i have had issues using mods from there on servers. it's just an overly bad idea.
Ok, I’m really not interested in “SE2” I’m not interested in any system other than steam. Some of the other platforms have removed content that I’ve paid for. And SE2 isn’t even fully functional.
Doesn't the Steam workshop have a web API? If so, with a little work, a console game could likely be written to publish or download mods from the workshop.
I think it will probably be fine it will come down to how the back end and front end is implemented to my limited understanding this is going to essentially be keen using modios servers to create their own work shop. This has positive and negative aspects I think we as a community should wait to see how it is implemented as the only thing Idont know how to solve is the multiple colaborators and the privacy. But it could be that you don’t even need a mod Io account and it just automatically works we don’t have the game yet guys.
Back in october 11 2014, Steam Workshop was the one thing that pushed me from a pirated copy to licensed one... I am deeply disappointed in this decision, and now I am more then happy it's just a sequel that can be ignored.
@@Har1ByWorld Piracy (as in the digital act) has never been stealing. Courts have been explicit in this; piracy is only ever copyright infringement, and that's not stealing or theft. Don't even say that sentence as it's implicitly going along with the misinformation campaign by large copyright holders that want to make people believe that piracy is theft at all.
@@TNH91 Copyright infringement is a form of theft of intellectual property. You are taking someone else's labor, and redistributing it. Now considering a lot of IP isn't owned by who actually works on it, I'm kinda whatever about it, and I disagree with the concept of IP as a whole, but in the system we currently exist it is ABSOLUTELY a form of theft.
There is a work around, even though it might be a bit annoying, post a 'guide' on the steam workshop with the information about the mod or blueprint or what ever so the search engine still pings the post in hits, and include a link to the mod IO location so steam specific players can navigate their way to that platform. As long as this doesn't violate any of steam's usage guidelines.
For me, its a question of just how many utilities I have running in the background. I seriously don't need yet another one of those launchers. Just about every hardware company out there has some kind of software that you need to install to make everything run properly, and nowadays, it seems that most of them have some kind of bloatware launcher that they add on top. That causes enough problems on its own without adding yet another launcher to the mix.
I trust Keen Software House implicitly and am curious about what the in-game mod viewer will look like. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, so long as they prepare for the possibility that we demand the implementation of the Steam Workshop down the line.
What's the deal? As long as the plarfoem is integrated and works from within a game, they may even use rapidshare for the backend. Like from user's perspective that's irrelevant.
Steam Workshop is where 9/10 of the mods for the current game are. This decision might end up resulting in a game with only a tenth of the mods of the current game.
The Steam Workshop is free for the developer (or rather included in the 30% cut), while ModIO is not. The reason for this change is very simple and as a developer myself I can explain it to you all. ModIO has been "paying" developers to gain market share kinda like Epic Games did back in the day with their store.
sounds like lack of steam workshop means lack of fun for at least a long time. If I made complicated mods i wouldn't even consider space engineers 2. Prototype a mod and get flooded with bug reports in dms you can't turn off. Space engineers 1 keeping the steam workshop would probably mean someone trying to retro fit SE2 into SE 1, or as much as they can
I do understand why they are putting more focus onto Mod.IO, as it would be good to have more inclusivity and stuff for console players from the get-go. But *ONLY* using Mod.IO and *NO* Steam inclusion at all is... just a really bad idea, seeing as the vast majority of the current SE1 player-base uses Steam for mods, workshop sharing, etc. and its a lot more versatile than Mod.IO. I really hope they change this. Not saying I wouldn't buy the game solely because of this, but it would just be so much better/easier if Steam support was included. I definitely think waiting and seeing where this topic goes is key for this game.
@@thegamerserpent4271 this has always been proved to not be true, plus most mods between PC and consoles have to be altered to just to work on different platforms as consoles often can't handle as much as pc's can. All they will do by moving to Mod io is cutting off more of the communities. Even if they did use mod io alot of the mods would stil be exclusively for pc users..
If they can make their own workshop interface that actually has these critical features in-game, it could work out. I'd certainly like to see them try.
if they make it so using Mod io is just as if not more convenient than the workshop for the game then this choice would make sense but if it is even slightly less convenient then just have Mod io be another OPTION rather than the soul hosting site for mods
The amount of toxicity already in the comment section is staggering for a video that's only an hour old. People calling each other "simp bot"s, clowns, idiots, etc. Constructive criticism over this decision is one thing, acting like you've been scammed out of something you haven't even paid for yet, and going out of your way to attack people over it, is another.
@Volfur2251 That's not the fault of the way mods are supplied at all. That's literally a possibility with _anything._ The best thing is when mods can just be placed in a folder and then it'll work. Then you can have several ways to automatically deal with getting the mods into that folder, like how Factorio does it with the ease of the in-game mod portal, or with some other mod manager.
Yeah because that worked so well for: 1. Cities: Skylines 2 (mods with malware) 2. Planet Coaster 2 (search still needs more work. selected categories are OR not AND, eg ticking two categories adds more results, rather than narrow it down) Keen can't even maintain their forum/bug trackers, so what makes you think they could manage their own Workshop ?
@@Flazrew not only this but most of the time this requires them to run safe guarding approval systems since if they host it they are help responsible for all the content uploaded including that of other copyright and ips, might as well remove modding entirely at that point
@Flazrew alright you three being fair points. except the CS2. Mods in VRage2 work entirely different to Unity. in VRage2 (and prop. 3) they are raw source files and get compiled by the game with only some specific code allowed. that makes it way harder if not impossible to write malware A working example would be factorio by the way. so it can be done ^^
My main concern is mainly towards mod authors. I’m not one, but I could only imagine the headache that would come with trying to update a mod when consoles has a game breaking bug but it works fine on pc. Does this mean authors have to hope the fix for one platform doesn’t break it for the other? Or would it be better for them just to have two separate versions for the platforms? Either way, it seems like a lot of extra work for mod authors to go through! Edit: I did refund my purchase of the pre-order. Seems outrageous to just destroy all of the work that’s already existed and works well!
Jack I absolutely unequivocally assure you Keen thought this all the way through and has determined that whatever it's gaining is worth the backlash. This isn't an accident or a mistake. I hope they change their mind but unless enough people either don't preorder or cancel their preorder AND MAKE IT KNOWN VIA SOCIAL MEDIA, it won't.
Well, I guess that's one game removed from my wish list. The workshop is nearly the only reason why SE is so huge to begin with. Definitely will "not" be buying this anytime soon.
@thegamerserpent4271 it's worse in every single way. Steam workshop is PERFECT. The ease of use and reliability of steam workshop is the only reason that space engineers is still popular
2 this i want to knock is was it worth it to go for mod io, like if its only 2 or 5% of people who use it then its not real where people are anyway, and how will script works as i have in most gane you cant on consoles as thay have some stress rules about that so will that mean we cant really used script in mods So yeah i fully get what you say as i had the same feeling when i heard its was useing mod io and not add the steam workshop
I will still be playing SE2 either way for my YT series and we are not sure how they will integrate their UGC update but steam workshop is a must in my eyes. Its the true roots of SE and majority of the player base is pc anyways. #MakeSE2GreatAgain
I preordered SE2 assuming it would have Steam Workshop support. I am now considering cancelling my preorder as I do not use any other modding sites period.
SE2 will prob be someting similar to Dual Universe but with better graphics it seems but the mod support makes and brakes a game not only this one (Everyone has sern Factorio and other basic games but with good mod support that has dominated those games in popularity and sales).
That may be true but we can't keep treating all games like factorio or other small and simple games,none of them are like space engineers,look at what happened to cities skylines 2 they went from workshop support to doing there own platform and it's been a disaster
im not gonna bother making a new account, assuming that's required for modio, so i wont use mods, so i wont buy SE2. The argument that it offers the same features is dumb since the workshop is 100x more convenient... now, if this meant theres an *in-game* mod browser, i wouldn't mind as much, given its a feature-complete system like Factorio's.
Do the Keen tries to speedrun Wildstar ARK "record" for killing updated/new version of the game? Same modio push, waiting for an "exclusive" deal for server hosting to drop. Without Steam WS there is no game.
Always when it comes to games, no workshop for a sequal, means no buy for me. Especially when the previous version did have it. All it does is inconvenience the player and removes the general choice given to players both on steam and pc in general. This catering to console is exactly why everyone hates bedrock for Minecraft.
I am sure, Keen is already well aware of this preference for Steam so do not dismiss this as a permanent decision. It's clearly made with the compatibility with the consoles in mind.
I held off on purchasing Kerbal 2 (so glad) and will hold off on this as well. I don't think it'll be as bad a dumpster fire, but more and more games aren't about players anymore, they're about pigeons in boxes.
NOTE - ModIo does appear to have a "Preview Mode", which can be set to allow any logged-in user to view a link without it being set to public. While this is somewhat like Steam's "Unlisted" mode, it is still a bit of a downside - mainly as you need an account and to be logged in. Traditionally, "Unlisted" can be accessed by those without an account.
Alienating the modders who want and prefer the steam workshop is to shoot the game in the chest. It was the modders that made SE1 what it became from it's early days. Without them and the workshop, the game would have remained a smallscale unknown game amongst many.
Everyone knows this will be half as successful as #1. If they are lucky.
Thats the general problem with modern developers. Often times they take those that brought them to success. Fundamentally ending their career right then and there because those same people take those who followed them elsewhere to another game or community that actually has respect for them.
100%
forget chest this shoots a nuke right down the games throat
Something that was pretty useful in SE1 is the ease with which a player joining a multiplayer game will automatically dowload the needed mods.
Do we know if this will be supported in SE2 as well?
we dont, but it can be assumed likely
@FutureDragonno it can't simp bot
@@WiseOwl_1408chill out lol, it probobly will
@WiseOwl_1408 we don't know is the correct answer. it could, it could not.
though from a technical standpoint it's not difficult to implement from what I can think of.
check mods from server
download mods on client
activate mods on client when he joins server
@@WiseOwl_1408 Why the unnecessary toxicity?
Marek ALSO said it wasn't set in stone that they would use Mod io. It's just what they're planning on using, but they may change their mind later, and Modding isn't even coming for a few vertical slices yet...
Yes he did. However, the only way to get a developer to reconsider is to express ones worries with the current decission and as with this video does explain the key issues that one has. For me a move to Mod IO is worrying as I have had several of my favoriate games run their modding scene on the platform and it has nearly always ended with major dumpster fires every couple of months thanks to admins and creator disputes. Not that there aren't disputes on steam but they are limited to the creators amongst each other as steam is a faceless impartial arbiter of just the basic rules.
Bs. Modding is the very first "Vertical slice" immediately following release
@@William0271 No, that's Workshop. Modding support isn't until VS 1.5. But even still, there's plenty of time before the game fully releases, i.e.: comes out of beta, for things to change.
Interesting to see if they pivot
Yeah we need a petition to change it to steam workshop
Lack of steam workshop means no buy for me
give the devs a chance to work on front-end customization that can literally solve all the issues jack has said
@@Yokoto12343 why? No seriously I have 5000+ hours in se1 and play it on pc exclusively. And while I’m bummed I still don’t see the issue, I know why they’re doing it and I know the end goal is to have an in-game workshop which doesn’t sound too bad to me.
@@spacegordonramsay2486 Have you seen Jack video before writing you dont see the issue!?
@@ricardosousa7150 I did. Did you? Marek literally said they would change it if we didn’t like it…. Y’all obviously don’t like it and I really don’t care that much. Looks like it’s going on the steam workshop
Let it fail. Ksp2 2.0
You didn't mention this, but another Modio negative is their list of words that's censored, such as 'could.' Apparently, it is a list that is enforced by either console platforms.
they censored 'could'? why? thats one of the high-use words
@@JNJNRobin1337 I don't know. When I messaged Modio about it they shifted blame onto the console platforms/game developers.
@@Lokiawa 'could' isnt even a bad word. no console or game developer would consider that a 'bad word' unless they arent actually a developer
@@JNJNRobin1337 Indeed. I told Xocliw this in one of his impromptu Q&A's, whether Keen will look or did look into this subject, who knows...
Mods are the lifeblood of a sandbox game. Eventually stuff gets stale, and it becomes harder to maintain that community. This is a terrible idea
ew stale space engineers mods are the microwave XD
Agreed, just look at Skyrim, over a decade and it's still one of the most relevant games out there because of the modding community.
DRM for mods is not a good thing.
Yeah, I won't be developing anything until Steam workshop support is integrated, I might not even bother to purchase the game.
@@doltBmB There is no DRM for Steam Workshop mods. Nothing prevents you from downloading, modifying and re-uploading them to your heart's content.
Lack of manual download link? Yeah, that's not a DRM.
i don't trust other than steam mod platform. I saw few of them cenzoring hard player creativity
Yah, Nexus is censoring.
@@panakap2186 valve occasionally does it aswell
steam does not censor, other places like nexus mods are very orwellian and politically biased.
yeah, nexus is sh!t, they cannot creat something good and stop you from creating and playing something good.
The creativity in question: protocol of elders of zion
I get the why modIO, but, since you have to create an account on both modIO and steam to upload to their respective platforms why not just have users create a steam account, and use that for the backend instead of modIO.
I checked if valve allows game creators to use their APIs, and sure enough, they do, they even have a nice flow chart on how user generated content works and all the functions called to publish, update and modify the page/item.
The only reason I can think of is if someone can't access the game's steam workshop if he/she hasn't bought the game. If an xbox/ps user that does not own a space engineers 1 copy on steam is willing to try to access the steam workshop, it'd be appreciated (if he/she has a steam account and is even willing to try to subscribe to something, I'd be even happier).
Let's try to show keen that having steam as a backend is better.
In my playing of Space Engineers 1, I have never downloaded anything from mod I.O. That being said, for the Steam Workshop, I have currently like 3,000 mods.
as is the case for most people specially for servers since this allows mods to be auto downloaded on connection
Forcing your customers to use a 3rd party service they are not already subscribed to...ask sony or arrowhead how that played out for them.
no one forces anyone to download custom content
@@p0sel2613 No body is saying they do clown. His point still stands, anyone wanting to use mods (pretty much the entire space engineers playerbase) will be forced to use this third party service.
@@p0sel2613 no forces us to buy the game to lets see how that will work out kid XD
@@DeagleGamesTV this “third party service” will be an in game menu it’s not like you have to download a whole new program to obtain mods and blueprints. Most games have already made the swap to modio. People always hate change and act like it’s the worst thing in the world. Modio works just fine but people have to have something to cry about.
this
So their goal is to "not splitting the community", but the community will split when they introduce in-game script or some mods don't work on console and the mod dev doesn't know why (because they don't have a console to debug).
No splits, they will just not allow scripting MODs ... dumbing PCs down to console levels ... simples.
Bloody stupid idea, but hey it's Keen and Marek, did we expect any different?
@@gordon861 ^ this is what will happen if they restrict themselves to mod io or all the mods will just end up being pc exclusive anyway
@@gordon861then they should consider going full atari 2600
Yeah, I get why Keen is planning to use modio, for consoles. But, not using the Steam Workshop is a deal breaker for me. I was starting to get excited about it, but when I first heard the news about not using the Steam Workshop, it is getting a big "nope" from me.
Let's be real, multi-platform games hold PC gamers back due to hardware limitations of consoles and phones. I have nothing against console players, I've had one most of my life. But, why turn a 3 party transaction into a 4 party transaction?
didnt they say something along the lines of
"we want to make a ingame workshop to make it easier to implement stuff"
nope
@@danielhardman234 Yes, they did.
they say they will use modio as a backend, so it would seem you use an ingame UI that just talks to the modio platform
Also that they are giving modders the DEV tools I believe
They will try to sell mods
This seems like a big mistake on Keen's part. This is a niche game for a niche community of gamers, and the modding scene via Steam Workshop is so ingrained, that nuking it outright, will cost them customers.
if there was no workshop we just simply wouldnt have had space engineers for as long as we did
Their intentions to not offer Steam Workshop support has completely killed my interest in SE2.
I don't understand why they can't use both... Maybe make it where a player is able to post their creation on both or just one.
They should've gone for how Factorio handles mods, IMO. Or just let it be done through something like Nexus mods. Steam workshop is actually pretty bad since it _forces_ auto-updates of mods. Which can lead to a mod that requires a specific version of another mod no longer working if that second mod is updated in a way that "breaks" the mod that requires it. Versioning is important, people.
ModIO barely works half the time, when we used to host a server we recreated mods that mimiced 2 ModIO only mods, and later unlisted mods as addons to existing mods to change values.
So yeah, no thanks, i was already tired of SE and hoped SE2 might revive the love i had for it, but this is again something that makes me a lot less enthusiastic for SE2.
Wasn't there a controversy about mod io's terms of service when SE first got on their platform?
Oh well. Might have to take SE2 off my wishlist.
why, youll still have access to mods and ships?
@FutureDragonkeen is a very untrustworthy company. Simp if you like
@@WiseOwl_1408 Angry much
@@WiseOwl_1408 do you have anything better to do than follow FutureDragon around instigating arguments?
It might be worthwhile to wait and see, modding isn't planned as a feature until vs 1.5 and it sounds like keen wants mods to be accessible from within the game with modio only as backend/alternate. I do trust steam more but we should see what keen cooks up.
the only reason i use mods in certain game , is because of the ease of access Steam Workshop offers, without it i dont even look for mods in games
sounds like it's planned to just be integrated into the game itself, just like the BeamNG mod system - there are no workshop mods, they are just hosted by BeamNG's servers and viewed/downloaded in-game, which I've never had an issue with
A mod was uploaded a couple weeks ago that pretty much made the unified grid system in SE1 so, SE2 was practically made null. I'm sticking with SE1. [It's called the 50cm Grid System if anyone wants to use it.]
Lmao it's not the same, plus the new engine improves game performance drastically. I find it strange how you people are so elitist about SE1, like...are you just poor and can't spend $30 or something?
I am more of a fan that space engineers 2 will have that baseline. and its not like that is the only thing 2 is promised to have either.
Ideally it will end up as a better foundation to mod from, but only time will tell.
@@ChristoffRevan I said "pretty much" not "Exactly". SE1 is practically finished but, has been in development for 13 years only being out of Beta for 7 years. I have problems with SE1 too so, not Elitist. They plan on doing the same with SE2 which was officially announces December.5th if you don't count all the VRage3 clips we've seen through out the past few years. I'm not waiting till approximately 2038 for SE2 to be a complete game and Yeah, I'm kinda poor I live in the 21st century. I should have been investing in stocks or something 20 some years ago but, I was too busy stewing in my mother's womb. I'm not going to spend $30 on a game that's comparable to raw dough in terms of development.
@@Zandeves Absolutely, I'm sure there's more that we don't know about. When it's more fleshed out and reflects SE1 I will likely buy it but, I'm really hoping for orbital mechanics and VR support. Those are the 2 features that'll really make or break this game for me.
supergrid is already a thing in SE1 since the beginning. You just have to turn it on in the setting. SE2 just has much much improved version of this.
Thanks for the info - holding off on purchase now.
the problem is PC gamer don't want be bothered with Console-Kidis anyway... they want the separation Steam Workshop is not a option it's mandatory!
think SE 2 will flop without steam workshop.
This decision is frankly baffling. Steam Workshop is the backbone of Space Engineers, it is in large part the reason that the game (and by proxy, Keen SWH) still exists and is still popular.
Mod io is fine for users, but for modders it's not really usable, for the reasons you described and more. If mod io was able to have the same features as steam workshop, I wouldn't have a problem, but it doesn't, and since they don't own or control the platform, they cannot bolt on the needed functionality.
I will not be giving Keen my money until Steam Workshop is back on the roadmap.
I made a comment in the SE2 store discussion page as well.
I mean, Steam Workshop DOES lack a vital feature, which is being avaialable in other platforms. Honestly, I do think that's a more important function than any of the others in the end of the day.
Still, I do think a path like Factorio's using their own solution would be better than the Workshop as well for this situation. If anything I find the fact people follow you through the /workshop/ is also like... A failure of Steam Workshop's usage even, which also makes sense since Steam /wants/ to be the hub of all activity so that nobody moves away from it. And this video is a very good example of how they keep franchies tied to their name and store!
Also, Factorio basically only uses their in-game mod frontend! And honestly it's 500x better than anything Steam has >_>
yes this. a in house solution would be the best
@@mz00956 I wonder if modio is paying them or something
Exactly. All of the PC users here who are demanding Steam Workshop be the primary modding platform don't realize that doing so would mean depriving 90% of mods from the eventual console versions of SE2, which is exactly the way things are currently with SE1. This is especially problematic for crossplay, since it makes doing modded crossplay impossible unless you only use modio mods, of which there are very few compared to the steam workshop (the steam workshop has over 30,000 SE mods, whereas modio currently only has 2300).
Using modio as primary modding platform for SE2 allows all mods and blueprints to be available on all platforms, and thus enable fully unified crossplay for the eventual console versions of SE2.
@@bobL761 At the same time, Keen deprived the console players of scripts and mods that use custom code, so... It doesn't exactly help their case.
@Dumbrarere This one is not on Keen's back. This is straight up on the console companies (Sony, Microsoft, etc). They don't let *any* code run on their consoles that they don't audit first, thats why console updates have limited release windows based on the time it takes for the companies to audit the updates. I *doubt* they're willing to audit mods (Also IIRC you need to pay per audit as well)
Man, just just pre-ordered SE 2 five days ago but now, after I know, that they are not planning for the Steam Workshop, I cancelled my order. I'm afraid, the game will take the same path downhill as Cities Skylines 2. A "Yeah, maybe sometime in the future perhaps." ist way too vague for me to bet on it.
I dont use mods, i have no stake in this. I still support Steam as an option. I hate that what that means is extra dev work that could go elsewhere but its clearly a great benefit to the players so id say its worth it.
I'm going too sound silly, but this is the first time ever hearing about this mod io thing. Se2 making its self out to be a harder sale the more I hear about it.
@@legofox6635 oh no, I upload and get my mods from a place other then the steam workshop, the horror
Paradox also made the move of taking the mods out of the steam workshop to their own platform (in the Cities skylines II)… And honestly? IT'S TERRIBLE.
I mean, Wube has never HAD their mods on Steam Workshop and it's /amazing/, so.
I personally thought that it's understandable that they're opting to integrate a solution that is platform agnostic, so that both PC and console players could use it. Edit: Ah okay, I understand that it lacks some important features :/
I understand the one point of interest for mods from Keens point of view, but, with SE1, creators have been "dealing" with both platforms for however long both platforms have been working together. Myself, I'd rather talk to a community rather than the developer directly. He/she has more important things to do (Like, write the mod?) than deal with me one on one when there's thousands of other people who are asking the EXACT same question.
I've already pre-ordered, and accepted the key, and it's on my wait list to be installed. Keen did absolutely wonderful things with SE1 and I really do look forward to whatever SE2 ends up being.
I have used Mod Io on Snowrunner, I didn't like it. I looked at it for SE1 as well, but have only been using Steam workshop mods for years now. I don't think there will ever be a time where console and PC gamers are 'the same'. Both sets of users game for different reasons and have different expectations. The idea does seem simpler to keep them all in one place, but simple is often just a wishlist item and impractical in reality. I hope they decide to go with Steam eventually.
I can see why if they're aiming for cross platform (off steam versions often suffer from a lack of mod access) but to ignore the workshop is a HUGE mistake because steam users can if they want sit and browse things from the launcher rather than having to load up a game.
Without mods the current game lacks a lot of gameplay and like it or not sandboxes do need to give people a reason to build stuff other than "because" especially in any mode outside creative.
I'm still of the mind that they shouldn't have gone with a sequel but instead made a big thing of upgrading the engine for free with a continuation of the cosmetic fluff dlcs to support the on going development. The apparent lack of what will be in the initial early access launch for 2 won't encourage people to drop cash on an upgrade and there'll be folk like myself who will be very wary following the medieval engineers being effectively abandoned to keep the space game in orbit.
I tried to support both platforms. However, Mod IO users would regularly reupload my creations with absolutely no credit. On top of that, it has nonsensical automated censorship.
Am I somehow potentially swearing in some unknown language?
Needless to say, I stopped uploading to Mod IO.
I believe SE2 should just incorporate both and let players choose as SE1 does.
Might as well have taken it off steam for how badly this is gonna go.
It is because of people like you that KSP2 flopped
@@camerondocherty4244 I get where you're coming from but let's be honest, KSP2 had much more fundamental issues that caused its implosion.
give the devs a chance to work on front-end customization that can literally solve all the issues jack has said
@@camerondocherty4244 KSP2 failed due to bad business decisions on Take Two and has nothing to do with players. Try doing some research about the issue before making a idiotic comment. Watch Bellular News video on the subject and that will explain what really happened to KSP2 and the studio who developed it.
@@camerondocherty4244 No actually its because of decisions like the one being discussed in the video that that shitshow flopped.
I have never used ModIO, and likely never will.
There are perspectives we don't have as a community that developers see as blatant. For instance Keen might be doing this so they can pivot away from Steam since steam never gives the rights to the games you purchase. This point will probably create a major issue down the road and Keen may have to pull out of Steam just to survive. If some of the biggest parts of the game (modding and Steam Workshop) are entrenched into Steam then they will have no choice but to go down with that ship too.
And Keen will you "give" rights to the game? Riiight.
BTW (definitely not a scam) I have a few bridges, very interesting plots of land, NFTs and some freshly minted coins to offer you. /s
Honestly, why Keen can't use both with unified frontend? I know (as software developer) that it would probably get quite messy, yet still possible. Would require uploading mods to both platforms and somehow keeping versions in sync, though
Its good to raise awareness on this, but I ultimately want keen to execute on their vision and not get sidetracked. Beating back the complexity is of vital importance for all software projects and teams.
I remember watching you as a kid I would always watch your series I'm 17 now and this is still peak
You are still a kid then.
The puzzling thing is we have several games now going “we’re launching our own mod thing/using another mod thing for the console players! So they can have mods!” For games that have like, seventeen console players. Like I’m sure, convinced even, that there is an absolute mad man right now just banging away on his cities skylines 2 city on the ole pee ess feev just making that controller click and clack like crazy in this intricate top down management but is his weird obstinance/proclivity really worth making the other 99.998% of us deal with paradox mods?
How many people were belting out spaceships they were just dying to share on the Xbox? Really? Honest answers? Every time the communitys talk about this there clearly are some but it is a MASSIVE split so I’m not sure how you justify making it worse for >95% to make it better for
If everyone just did it as well as the Factorio developers there would be no problem with having game specific mod services.
KEEN SWH- o7. If your watching and reading comments, I have a suggestion, though I suspect this might be partly the reasoning for exclusively using mod IO: The back end usage for an in-game UI maybe for an economy system, where a player can 'sell' a blue print in-game to a player so they can actually have that blueprint in-game, and pay the creator for it using an in-game money line space credits. This would boost in-game economy usage massively if you have a player to player economy mechanic where you can buy, sell, or trade blueprint without having to actually build the ship... Or have a station that would spawn player designed ships after purchase. This would be epic!
It does make sense having the user created content on all platforms in one place rather than having it split between consoles and steam(PC), less time spent on coding for 2 sharing systems. But as in the video the workshop is a great for content creators to hide designs for a while and do series collections or a collection of their most liked mods and themed mods too. I've never used Mod iO as i've never heard of it until today. I would still buy SE2 as I do enjoy those type of games and I do still enjoy playing SE.
as much as i presume steam workshop support may come in when the game is more developed, i see no reason why it shouldn't have steam workshop from the start besides the garry's mod problem, but in general i have a good feeling this will be changed soon enough. (edit: i see no reason why we shouldn't have a centralized community, on the steam workshop of course, it is just the superior choice over any and all other platforms.)
will probs take a next gen console to run the game anyway, considering the pc requirements, seems incredibly unfair to be forced to use an objectively worse system just so the consoles lot can have more mods, many of which will likely not work with console anyway
This is the cherry ontop of why I'm not buying SE2. Limited features on release, engine still sluggish, no info on server performance and now no mod support via steam?? Like what?! It's a solid no from me.
I'm looking past when we get servers for SE2. Using Mod I/O to get mods doesn't work for servers. i have had issues using mods from there on servers. it's just an overly bad idea.
Ok, I’m really not interested in “SE2” I’m not interested in any system other than steam. Some of the other platforms have removed content that I’ve paid for. And SE2 isn’t even fully functional.
You paid for a license for that content, a license that can be revoked at any moment by steam and other platforms.
Doesn't the Steam workshop have a web API? If so, with a little work, a console game could likely be written to publish or download mods from the workshop.
I imagine that is a Valve choice and not something that Keen can override.
Hmm. As a mod user, for multiple games, if it's not 'workshop' I don't use it. SE is no different.
With that said, I wonder if this will make it easier to release on Epic store?
I think it will probably be fine it will come down to how the back end and front end is implemented to my limited understanding this is going to essentially be keen using modios servers to create their own work shop. This has positive and negative aspects I think we as a community should wait to see how it is implemented as the only thing Idont know how to solve is the multiple colaborators and the privacy. But it could be that you don’t even need a mod Io account and it just automatically works we don’t have the game yet guys.
I'll wait for Steam Workshop support before buying.
Back in october 11 2014, Steam Workshop was the one thing that pushed me from a pirated copy to licensed one...
I am deeply disappointed in this decision, and now I am more then happy it's just a sequel that can be ignored.
Saying steam workshop keeps you from stealing isn't a flex
@@WiseOwl_1408 more like borrowing, since we don't own the games we purchase
@@WiseOwl_1408 if buying isnt owning then pirating isnt stealing.
@@Har1ByWorld Piracy (as in the digital act) has never been stealing. Courts have been explicit in this; piracy is only ever copyright infringement, and that's not stealing or theft. Don't even say that sentence as it's implicitly going along with the misinformation campaign by large copyright holders that want to make people believe that piracy is theft at all.
@@TNH91 Copyright infringement is a form of theft of intellectual property. You are taking someone else's labor, and redistributing it. Now considering a lot of IP isn't owned by who actually works on it, I'm kinda whatever about it, and I disagree with the concept of IP as a whole, but in the system we currently exist it is ABSOLUTELY a form of theft.
There is a work around, even though it might be a bit annoying, post a 'guide' on the steam workshop with the information about the mod or blueprint or what ever so the search engine still pings the post in hits, and include a link to the mod IO location so steam specific players can navigate their way to that platform. As long as this doesn't violate any of steam's usage guidelines.
For me, its a question of just how many utilities I have running in the background. I seriously don't need yet another one of those launchers. Just about every hardware company out there has some kind of software that you need to install to make everything run properly, and nowadays, it seems that most of them have some kind of bloatware launcher that they add on top. That causes enough problems on its own without adding yet another launcher to the mix.
I trust Keen Software House implicitly and am curious about what the in-game mod viewer will look like. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, so long as they prepare for the possibility that we demand the implementation of the Steam Workshop down the line.
You didn't buy medieval engineers did you?
Perfect. Helps out consul out 😊
Had no idea about modIO. I thought it was only the workshop. Bummer
why doesnt keen just make their own in house moding interface? i know its extra work but it makes it significantly easier to mod
no workshop NO PURCHASE!
as long as it's integrated in the game.. i don't want yet another mod manager
13 seconds in and i already see one of my reddit comments bitching about no steam workshop, what a time to be alive
Is it our bad, that there a limited console gamers? 🤨
What's the deal? As long as the plarfoem is integrated and works from within a game, they may even use rapidshare for the backend. Like from user's perspective that's irrelevant.
Steam Workshop is where 9/10 of the mods for the current game are. This decision might end up resulting in a game with only a tenth of the mods of the current game.
They have 5 years to fix that mistake. Otherwise SE1 will hold up for many years to come.
The Steam Workshop is free for the developer (or rather included in the 30% cut), while ModIO is not.
The reason for this change is very simple and as a developer myself I can explain it to you all. ModIO has been "paying" developers to gain market share kinda like Epic Games did back in the day with their store.
Just when i started to get excited for SE2 😢
Why do I even have to care about consoles again?
sounds like lack of steam workshop means lack of fun for at least a long time. If I made complicated mods i wouldn't even consider space engineers 2. Prototype a mod and get flooded with bug reports in dms you can't turn off. Space engineers 1 keeping the steam workshop would probably mean someone trying to retro fit SE2 into SE 1, or as much as they can
I do understand why they are putting more focus onto Mod.IO, as it would be good to have more inclusivity and stuff for console players from the get-go. But *ONLY* using Mod.IO and *NO* Steam inclusion at all is... just a really bad idea, seeing as the vast majority of the current SE1 player-base uses Steam for mods, workshop sharing, etc. and its a lot more versatile than Mod.IO.
I really hope they change this. Not saying I wouldn't buy the game solely because of this, but it would just be so much better/easier if Steam support was included. I definitely think waiting and seeing where this topic goes is key for this game.
Also as a pc player, im so sick and tired of my games getting feature gimped, and paywalled to placate the console audience.
@@DeagleGamesTVyet you wonder why pc games are filled with sweats or minuscule communities
The problem is if you give people steam as an option, you’ll just end up with almost everything exclusively on steam
@@thegamerserpent4271 this has always been proved to not be true, plus most mods between PC and consoles have to be altered to just to work on different platforms as consoles often can't handle as much as pc's can. All they will do by moving to Mod io is cutting off more of the communities. Even if they did use mod io alot of the mods would stil be exclusively for pc users..
@@DeagleGamesTV Placate the largest market for video games? God forbid.
Steam workshop is just plain more convenient. Having to install a new mod manager for every game is a thorn of mine.
PLEASE remember that the mod platform will be available ingame. You wont have to go outside of the game to access the workshop
But you also still won't have the features that were mentioned in the video, ala Collections and Collaborators.
So?
If they can make their own workshop interface that actually has these critical features in-game, it could work out. I'd certainly like to see them try.
Ah, yes, miscreation club all over again. Paid mods likely too.
if they make it so using Mod io is just as if not more convenient than the workshop for the game then this choice would make sense but if it is even slightly less convenient then just have Mod io be another OPTION rather than the soul hosting site for mods
The amount of toxicity already in the comment section is staggering for a video that's only an hour old. People calling each other "simp bot"s, clowns, idiots, etc.
Constructive criticism over this decision is one thing, acting like you've been scammed out of something you haven't even paid for yet, and going out of your way to attack people over it, is another.
Well, if there's all signs of the likely paid mods implementation, into the game, where modding is essential...
I'm not a fan of it either, but hey let 'em whine. I'll be enjoying the new game with my buddies lol
Why not creating a cross-platform in-game mod workshop like Fallout or Factorio, or others of the type ?
i mean even that is a double edge sword that could lead to paid mods or restricted content
@Volfur2251 That's not the fault of the way mods are supplied at all. That's literally a possibility with _anything._ The best thing is when mods can just be placed in a folder and then it'll work. Then you can have several ways to automatically deal with getting the mods into that folder, like how Factorio does it with the ease of the in-game mod portal, or with some other mod manager.
what about a self hosted system from Keen?
Do you want another miscreation club? Likely with paid mods too.
Yeah because that worked so well for:
1. Cities: Skylines 2 (mods with malware)
2. Planet Coaster 2 (search still needs more work. selected categories are OR not AND, eg ticking two categories adds more results, rather than narrow it down)
Keen can't even maintain their forum/bug trackers, so what makes you think they could manage their own Workshop ?
@@Flazrew not only this but most of the time this requires them to run safe guarding approval systems since if they host it they are help responsible for all the content uploaded including that of other copyright and ips, might as well remove modding entirely at that point
@Flazrew alright you three being fair points.
except the CS2.
Mods in VRage2 work entirely different to Unity.
in VRage2 (and prop. 3) they are raw source files and get compiled by the game with only some specific code allowed.
that makes it way harder if not impossible to write malware
A working example would be factorio by the way. so it can be done ^^
@@mz00956 and this feature i think would make it impossible for consoles so i think this doesn't really solve what they want to achieve
My main concern is mainly towards mod authors. I’m not one, but I could only imagine the headache that would come with trying to update a mod when consoles has a game breaking bug but it works fine on pc. Does this mean authors have to hope the fix for one platform doesn’t break it for the other? Or would it be better for them just to have two separate versions for the platforms? Either way, it seems like a lot of extra work for mod authors to go through!
Edit: I did refund my purchase of the pre-order. Seems outrageous to just destroy all of the work that’s already existed and works well!
Jack I absolutely unequivocally assure you Keen thought this all the way through and has determined that whatever it's gaining is worth the backlash. This isn't an accident or a mistake. I hope they change their mind but unless enough people either don't preorder or cancel their preorder AND MAKE IT KNOWN VIA SOCIAL MEDIA, it won't.
Well, I guess that's one game removed from my wish list. The workshop is nearly the only reason why SE is so huge to begin with. Definitely will "not" be buying this anytime soon.
What’s so bad about modio?
@thegamerserpent4271 it's worse in every single way. Steam workshop is PERFECT. The ease of use and reliability of steam workshop is the only reason that space engineers is still popular
@ try using it on a console and let me know how that goes
@@thegamerserpent4271 buy pc and dont be dump, you bough console knowing you will have zero acces to things like mod so it is on you.
@@Har1ByWorld"just print more money!"
they simplified killing all mods that use Scripts.............. thanks guys.........
people are forgetting the dumptrucks of cash that is sent to devs by steam competitors in the name of cross-compatibility
2 this i want to knock is was it worth it to go for mod io, like if its only 2 or 5% of people who use it then its not real where people are anyway, and how will script works as i have in most gane you cant on consoles as thay have some stress rules about that so will that mean we cant really used script in mods
So yeah i fully get what you say as i had the same feeling when i heard its was useing mod io and not add the steam workshop
It was already confirmed, that if players will want they will add Workshop support.
Players already say, that the want the Workshop but Keen still sticks to "Yeah, maybe sometime in the future perhaps." That is not very reassuring.
ive used mod io with deep rock and it feels so flimsy and just bad, it sucks at syncing with the website too
I will still be playing SE2 either way for my YT series and we are not sure how they will integrate their UGC update but steam workshop is a must in my eyes. Its the true roots of SE and majority of the player base is pc anyways. #MakeSE2GreatAgain
Privacy USED TO BE a right....
Or...
OR...
So many of us BELIEVED...
Welp...
That's a thing of the past these days...
I preordered SE2 assuming it would have Steam Workshop support. I am now considering cancelling my preorder as I do not use any other modding sites period.
SE2 will prob be someting similar to Dual Universe but with better graphics it seems but the mod support makes and brakes a game not only this one (Everyone has sern Factorio and other basic games but with good mod support that has dominated those games in popularity and sales).
That may be true but we can't keep treating all games like factorio or other small and simple games,none of them are like space engineers,look at what happened to cities skylines 2 they went from workshop support to doing there own platform and it's been a disaster
im not gonna bother making a new account, assuming that's required for modio, so i wont use mods, so i wont buy SE2. The argument that it offers the same features is dumb since the workshop is 100x more convenient... now, if this meant theres an *in-game* mod browser, i wouldn't mind as much, given its a feature-complete system like Factorio's.
Didn't they do this at the start of SE1 too ?
Do the Keen tries to speedrun Wildstar ARK "record" for killing updated/new version of the game?
Same modio push, waiting for an "exclusive" deal for server hosting to drop.
Without Steam WS there is no game.
Just wait for a bit lets get together and make a new texture pack for SE1 so it looks like SE2 . Ksp > != ksp2 i feel same will happen for SE2
Since when have Space Engineers devs ever given a shit about what the community wanted?
Always when it comes to games, no workshop for a sequal, means no buy for me. Especially when the previous version did have it. All it does is inconvenience the player and removes the general choice given to players both on steam and pc in general.
This catering to console is exactly why everyone hates bedrock for Minecraft.
I am sure, Keen is already well aware of this preference for Steam so do not dismiss this as a permanent decision. It's clearly made with the compatibility with the consoles in mind.
I held off on purchasing Kerbal 2 (so glad) and will hold off on this as well. I don't think it'll be as bad a dumpster fire, but more and more games aren't about players anymore, they're about pigeons in boxes.