@@economicblast They are being silly, but the actual number is about 6x charging apps, and 1x for plugshare to find them. Note there is some overlap in apps where one will let you pay for multiple others.
I daily drive an EV and only have 3 apps. Plugshare, Chargepoint, and Shell Recharge I dont even need shell recharge, as chargepoint will activate those stations.
Imagine how upset you would be if regular gas pumps failed this often. But there are usually a few choices of stations within a few blocks of each other.
I may be stating the obvious but is it possible the magnetic strip on the card needs to face the other way. On the vid itwas always facing the same way (toward the machine) It is counter intuitive but sometimes the reader needs the mag stripe facing away from the machine
If you’re actually curious - it’s literally just unreliable confirmation of payment from terminal vendors (NAYAX being a big player) From unacceptable network latencies which time-out the charger, to disagreements on the application of the currently non-standardized charger output initialization. This is why DCFCs prefer you pay through their app as that gives them much more granular control of the process. OCPP 2.0.x is looking to address the issue of OEMs using separate networks and requiring their own apps.
As someone who personally have drove from Atlanta, Georgia to Los Angeles, California in a Chevrolet bolt EV, I completely agree with all of the points that she said in this video, they are all valid, all across the United States 😢😢😢
Lol bro a bolt gets you like 160 on 80% charge. 😊 I use it for my daily commute to work and sometimes some day trips but never in my life for an extended trip that's crazy
27% out of order is amazing. Only 10% having payment issues seemed miraculous until I saw that having to download a different app for every charger wasn't seen as an issue. When trying to use non-Tesla chargers the amount of different apps needed was the biggest pain of all, with every locality seeming to have a different provider.
if it's a place running chargers like from ChargePoint, perhaps they didn't keep the maintenance contract going. a lot of the larger companies are waiting on replacing existing hardware with a newer generation rather than fixing the old units. then you run into parts availability too.
@@RyanWilliams222 pay attention to gas station pumps. they break too, but there are just so many of them around, one just moves on to the next pump and/or station and doesn't really notice.
@@anthonyc8499 Hopefully that will be the case eventually... probably about 2+ years down the road. Currently the number of Tesla SCs available to non-Tesla vehicles is pretty limited, but slowly expanding. For instance, if you go to the Tesla charging map, it only shows 2 non-Tesla chargers available in California. So it's currently still quite an issue and will take some time to implement.
closed proprietary systems are almost always better in these early development stage situations. same reason why apple is so much more optimized since even the beginning days
@anthonyc8499 Rather, it will once the other cars actually start coming with NACS plugs and Tesla actually enables their full network to other cars. I'm personally looking to get a Model Y after the Juniper redesign, and charging is just one of several reasons it would best suit my needs.
Fun part of CCS is that the large connector and cable weight causes leverage that pulls the communication pins apart during the handshake. If the connection clip is loose enough and you dont hold the plug in the socket during the handshake, the plug weight can actually cause it to pull just far enough off the pins to sever the connection and disrupt the handshake. Excellent industrial design!
The Tesla charger is also CCS (NACS - which is CCS1), the big chargers you're seeing in the video are CCS2. That's why Tesla chargers can only charge up to 350kW, usually 250kW to be safe... CCS2 which is common everywhere outside the US in the rest of the world including Europe, Asia etc can charge up to 700kW safely even from home (especially since most countries use three phase 220-250v at home from standard sockets). Essentially Americans need charging stations, the rest of the world can fast charge at home (if you have a regular socket on your drive or garage) and so the bulkier connectors aren't such a big problem and the hit to the electricity grid is much more evenly distributed.
This was a great video. I did learn from this video that I will be keeping my ICE car for a long, long time. It would've been interesting to know how much added range Joanna got on the Rivian, how much it cost, and how long it took. I recently saw a similar video where a guy wanted to charge a Rivian in LA and between waiting for an available charger and finding one that worked, it took over an hour to get about 250 miles of range, and it cost $60. I understand these public charging rates in California are extremely high. I just drove 815 miles from Florida to Maryland in my Lincoln Town Car, getting 25.7 miles per gallon. On my trip, from one gas station to the next one, I drove 342 miles and cost $45 to fill the gas tank in about five minutes. I made the trip in one day, taking about 14 hours due to heavy traffic in some areas. If I was driving an EV, with the extra time charging and trying to find a working and available charger, it probably would have meant staying overnight at a hotel, adding at least $100 to the trip. I definitely won't be buying an EV anytime soon.
Nah if you buy a Tesla there are none of these issues and it’s much cheaper to operate than a gas/ICE car. This whole video was about non-Tesla chargers.
Yeah, after 100 years of ICE cars and being born into a world where there are 20 megawatt fuel dispensers at every intersection sure does make life easy.
Tesla owner for 4 years here. Never not once have I ever run into an issue with a Tesla Supercharger not working when I show up. Can't imagine what its like for people dealing with this issue.
The grocery store I go to has had only 1 of 4 Chargepoint Chargers operational for almost a year now. It is insane. I and other users have filled several maintenance requests for them and nothing has gotten done.
@@danielzhang1916they don't care. Teslas network is great because without it you can't use their cars. The other companies got paid by the government to install chargers, whether they work or not is not their problem, they got paid.
I believe many of the chargers are owned by individuals so they might not have the resources to keep them all fixed if they aren’t making a lot of money
Starting Friday, dockworkers in all Swedish ports will refuse to offload Teslas, cleaning crews will no longer clean showrooms, and mechanics won’t fix charging points as the labor dispute rages on.
Such a great video about the realities of EV ownership, especially if you’re an apartment dweller in LA with no dedicated home charging in the parking garage
@robertkubrick3738 I use a portable level 1 charging cord where I plug it into a standard 15/20A outlet. If I rented, I would _want_ to take the cord anyway. I set my max charging state to 70% and charge overnight. That is is fine for most people for everyday driving.
This is why I decided to opt for a Tesla. I really wanted to jump into the new i4 but logistics when taking long road trips to northern california to visit family forced me to go with Telsa and their superior Superchargers. On our recent road trip up north to saw us making a charge stop at a popular exit (Harris Ranch). There was about 6-7 non Tesla chargers with only 5 working and a line of 14 cars waiting to charge!!! That's insane!! Never seen that before. So I could totally see why the EV adoption will take a long time to happen. There was about 80++ Tesla Superchargers at the location.
The problem there is that they have to know what they’re looking for to notice. That is… knowing the maximum DCFC rate of your car which I’m guessing you have to Google when you do a rental.
Being a Tesla owner, I've never experienced any of the frustrations demonstrated in this video in any of my long distance trips (I charge at home for local driving). It's easy to see why most car companies have announced deals with Tesla to gain access to the Tesla Supercharger network.
Same. I have to believe that people who purchase non-Tesla EVs did so while being mislead about the charging situation. No one willingly buy into such an unreliable system like that. It’s not wonder virtually every EV manufacturer other than Tesla is struggling.
Yep, never an issue with Tesla and the supercharging network. Can’t wait until other cars have the NACS connector *and* work at a Tesla Super Charger! We’ll all have congestion problems but at least we’ll be able to buy an EV Truck that doesn’t look like a DeLorean on steroids.
@@PNWeBikeyeah the old reason I bought a Bolt was because the plan was to never use it for roadtrips (charge at home). Second car is a Tesla Model Y of course haha
Quick answer is that most charging companies don't regularly maintain their chargers. I don't know if this is because they are not connected so the company does not know if they are working or not. Some big charging companies are now buying Tesla charging hardware, so hopefully they also adopt the Tesla maintenance model. Like may hear are saying, if you use a Tesla and it's charger network then you hardy have any issues.
@@gund89123 To an extent. Tesla is selling its hardware globally (so far have made 2 UK deals), however, there are competitors. In the US, for NACS, it's an open patent for all to use freely. Tesla is also outsourcing its plugs production in order to not make it a US monopoly. Anyone can make the NACS plug, despite Elon personally owning the patent.
Quick answer is - nobody interested in maintaining those chargers, as (almost) nobody profits. Tesla profits albeit indirectly, so their chargers are maintained.
I will not buy a vehicle with a CCS charging port. Terrible. Only Tesla NAC super chargers are decent. I will only buy an EV with the NAC adapter already installed. Most car manufacturers and adopting the NAC charging standard. That is the way to go.
6 year Tesla owner here. I've never experienced broken Tesla Super Charger. I'm hoping with almost every EV manufacturer adopting NACS and getting access to the Super Charger network starting in 2024 that other EV owners can have the same amazing experience as Tesla owners. I love Tesla but support the adoption of electric transportation even more.
I've seen some insane lines for chargers here in my city, the bottleneck with charging times is pretty crazy. This generation of evs are not generally green unless you put some serious miles on the original battery. Then its marginal. The heavy mining required to source and process the raw materials is shocking and largely ignored when calculating how green they are. Not to mention the forced child labor and slavery associated with many of the sources. Kind of weird how many of my fellow liberals dont care that the price of their car is a result of child slavery and tax payer subsidy. The vehicles weigh a ton, you burn tires more than 2x as fast (which is a key source of carcinogens and pollutants in our air and water), the level of infrastructure development is going to be insane when you realize the energy we get from fuel is now going to need to be fed through the existing grid. We will need a level of infrastructure to support this that people don't understand because they aren't electrical engineers. Look at the cost and industrial effort behind building, installing, and maintaining just one transformer. Or the cost for just one mile of transmission lines. It's incredible. Evs are primarily a way for governments to pretend they are "taking action" without actually doing anything or offending their rich donors. They can put these costs on the taxpayer and average person instead of addressing where the massive power usage is actually happening. It's the people with lots of money and power who do what they want and don't care.
@@carlosarriaga7428 how is 50 tons of ore for one battery with a 7 year shelf life. That needs fossil fuel to be build charged and maintained, better for the environment?
So in Germany, they require you bring your own cable for Level 2 (non "super") charging. This is because the cables are the number one thing that breaks on these. So if everyone has their own cable the likelihood of it breaking is minimal. So all drivers keep the cable in their car and plug it in. They've as a result been able to deploy tons and tons of level 2 chargers which makes sense.
@@colinm_pe and how is that different to the plug on a charger cable getting many mate/de-mate cycles? Either way, it's a wear item that's going to need replacing every so often.
Title should be: Why are so many EV chargers broken in the US? Here in Germany I have never encountered a charger that doesn’t work. Public CCS chargers outnumber Tesla chargers 10:1. All charging tarifs/cards work on basically every charger. The infrastructure is way ahead of the market, most charging stations are empty most of the time.
Its the same in the UK, lucky I can have a home charger as my house has a drive, if I didn’t have my own I would not get an electric car, it’s actually impossible using public charges, it’s to hit and miss to rely on
The TH-camr Aging Wheels did his own experiment on public EV chargers, and he revealed a 4th major problem with them: Many do not charge at the full rate/capacity they are advertised at! Which means a charge advertised as only taking 15 minutes can take hours to complete!
Not just an LA or USA problem, in Sydney Australia there's always 25-60% of DC chargers out of order at any given time. Takes a long time to fix, I assumed it was a monetary issue.
Compared to how many gasoline stations that has 90% of their pumps working Plus it seldom takes more than 5 minutes to fill your tank And get at least 350 miles driving range And in almost every city, there is a gas station every mile
While the the charge point does have to communicate with multiple different types of cars and their firmware, it should all be standardised. The issue to an extent is implementation of the standard. These implementations will be improved and refined over time, as will the charging hardware, payment integration, etc. It's going to be messy, but should get better.
Yeah, it will NEVER happen. Think Android and it's hundreds of different manufactures that use that software. It's why app makers hate making apps for android - it'll work on one brand, but not another. That will never be resolved unless each brand gives up its reason for existing in the first place...
@@ThomasGlynnJr Bad analogy for a couple reasons. Android isn't a standard, it's an operating system and a moving target. Android, despite not being a standard, is hugely popular and the dominant mobile OS. A better comparison for charging communication protocols would be other standardised communication protocols. Think IP, TCP, HTTP, HTTPS, TLS(SSL), ICMP, etc. All of these - and many more - were used to load this website, stream the video, and then publish your comment and notify me of it. They all have several implementors, and they all work well enough that they're fundamental to the internet and modern society.
I love this video you went straight to the point not Bias no propaganda no hate just the truth as an EV driver my self I have this same experience here on the east coast thank you for this.
@@igvc1876 In my area there are 6kw chargers all over. At the doctor’s office, city hall, libraries, public pay-to-park lots, playgrounds, driving range, across the street from my office, more down the street. Extremely convenient. I can early adopt because in 2009 my wife and I paid off our cars. We’ve been putting “car payments” money into brokerage account since. We don’t take loans for cars anymore.
I just got back from a 6400 mile road trip in my Tesla Model 3 and had zero problems, all the Superchargers I used were working. This mess referred to is everything EXCEPT Tesla. Can't say this strongly enough! Tesla roadtrip experience is fantastic. There's a reason that the other EV makers are making deals to use Tesla's Superchargers. I've owned my Tesla for nearly 4 years and have ZERO problems charging. ZERO! 😛
@@COSMACELF1802 Supercharger stations are expanding at 30% per year. There are currently 280 new stations under construction and 547 stations awaiting permits, which will add to the existing 6,000 stations with 55,000 individual charging stalls.
@@WallyHays Just pointing out a fact. In the US there are 2 kinds of EVs, Tesla and everyone else. If only the other automakers had copied Tesla instead of looking down at them for so long.
Not everybody can charge at home, or charge fast at home, but being able to do so is so, so much better than having to visit gas stations. I've had problems with busted DC fast chargers, but I almost never charge at charging stations. Growing pains of the EV industry.
@@VoltLover00 we charged for a long time at one kilowatt with regular 110 volt AC power. Not very practical unless you have 2 days to recharge your EV after a long battery draining trip. We upgraded to 7 kW charging now. Much more useful, still not what I would consider fast charging compared to 150W or 250W Tesla superchargers.
Charging at home is really the way to go. 66% of housing units in the US have a garage or driveway. For those people an EV would be easy to own and live with.
I’m not getting an electric car until the battery issue is resolved in cold weather. I’ve seen it first hand with friends and family members that have or had an electric vehicle. When it’s cold the battery range drops significantly as the car is trying to keep the battery warm
The ONLY car I would ever recommend if you cannot charge at home is a Tesla. Period. The experience is night and day difference. I owned a Chevy Bolt EV and it was fantastic, but charging outside of home was an absolute nightmare. Don’t even consider an EV unless you can charge at home, or it’s a Tesla.
@@crftr-com yep and it's very controlled currently for CCS-1 vehicles with Tesla's own Magic Dock. The payment and authentication methods for how it'll work with adapters is still unclear.
Unlike Gas Stations, many (most), are unattended (no operator on site). So when there are 'issues'. someone (you?) must tell the service provider/owner (most sites are just leased property) and they need to schedule a tech site visit. How many qualified (per model) techs are there in LA (or any other location) ? This issue is not just limited to EV. How long do you have to wait when your Dishwasher breaks down? OMG 3 weeks in the Bay Area for warranty work! We need a better way for repairs. (I did not mention the Vandalized Elephant)
There's also the fact that a gas station is a way simpler device than a charging station, it's basically just a hose and a pump, so much more rare for it to break down.
@@noseboop4354pumps are fast more complex than you realize because of saftey issues with flammable liquids. EV charger companies only exist to collect government cheese on the initial install money
3:05 using their app also gives them more valuable information about you. One more reason for them to not improve the credit card payment at the charger.
Wow, crazy. We've had our Tesla for 5 years now and honestly have seen zero superchargers that we could charge at. Literally zero issues. Tesla's charging network is better than the cars themselves.
6:10 Based on a still small sample of data, the PlugShare ratings for non-Tesla EVs using Tesla's "Magic Dock" Superchargers are about 20% worse than the ratings provided by Tesla owners, so the Superchargers also are clearly not a panacea.
Why would you think it would instantly work as good as Tesla cars with vehicles from other manufacturers. It's going to take a little time to figure out the best way to make this happen.
@@jerryinmon2731 I don't disagree, but not giving networks and automakers that same opportunity/time wouldn't be fair either. Based on what I've seen, of all the failures on the public charging providers, about a third are due to the provider and hardware, a third are due to the user, and the rest are due to the automaker/EV itself. Tesla currently doesn't have to deal with two of those issues at all, but when they finally do open to non-Tesla EVs, they will be dealing with all three. My main point here is that Tesla has a lot of work to do if they hope to even come close to providing the same level of service to everyone on their Superchargers as they currently provide to Tesla EV drivers. By the time they get around to that (as they no doubt will), the other charging providers will have also caught up or surpassed them.
But the difference is, Tesla will figure it out and software update all the superchargers to fix it at once, whereas Shell Recharge for instance doesn't even know they don't work, and doesn't care anyway.
@@brushlessmotoring Maybe, but we'll have to wait and see. Tesla's incentive for providing exemplary service really stops at their own customers. We've already seen this with "Magic Dock," where it is essentially just an attempt to tick a box so they can access public funds. Slower charging speeds, higher prices, etc. There's no reason to expect Tesla to treat their non-Tesla EV customers as well as they treat their Tesla EV customers.
@@newscoulomb3705 I just put up a quick video of non teslas at a super charger in Deep River Ontario - the Bolt user got his expected maximum charge speed of 75kWh and the F150 seemed to be working too. I know there were some issues with Ioniq 5 and EV6’s 800V system, but that may be common to other 800V systems on a 400V charger - I don’t disagree it’s going to be harder for Tesla, as they don’t control 3rd party car’s software, but hopefully NACS solves that in time too.
PlugShare is a great crowdsource tool to help EV drivers to find high-rated stations. But, yes this is a problem that is slow to find a standard resolution
I am a Chinese and in a small city in China, I have a BYD electric car. After watching this video, I believe that there is already a significant gap between the development prospects of electric vehicles in the United States and China, and there is no chance for the United States to surpass China.
It's a cop out for the charging companies to say that it's complicated to connect to many different vehicles that's why we have standards. They are just 2 computers talking to each other through a cable that's like the most basic type of a networked connection you can possibly have.
I’m so excited to get my R1s! We have the charger installed at home already and will primarily charge that way but 100% I know I will have trouble the first few times I charge in public lol like getting gas for the first time
Based on my experience what you show in LA seems to actually be better than here in Florida! The Tesla network is absolutely the way to go… very high 98% reliability and even if there’s an odd charger out of order, the software will let you know before you get there. Even in that instance, you’ll be dealing with let’s say one stall out of order out of maybe a dozen at one location. Thank you for bringing this issue to light, this is by far away the big bad news in EV life and it seems it’s wide spread. On a recent trip to the UK I ran into similar problems. I think investors in the non-tesla networks should pay close attention to this problem. If they don’t fix these problems before Tesla’s super chargers are scaled they will be out of business. This is not a new problem either, I’ve been using charging networks since 2014 and this has perpetually been a problem. The only network in the USA which has solved the problem is Tesla . The recent decisions by most vehicle manufacturers to adopt the Tesla standard is the writing on the wall. I’ve driven my tesla over 216,000 miles through 40+ states almost exclusively using Tesla super chargers and almost never have a problem. If buying an EV, go for it, make sure to ask the dealer if the car will accept NACS in the near future and be aware than in the interim you’ll have to deal with the issues in this video until then (mostly this will not effect you if doing home charging, but definitely something to be aware of if you take road trips!)
It’s interesting that you faced “legacy” hardware issues when EV chargers haven’t been around even a decade! This will probably always be an issue and while I agree EVs will grow in percentage of automobiles on the road, I believe these issues coupled with EV costs will force ICE and other power forms to also continue to be around creating a multitude of types of automobiles for the future.
Plugin hybrids are roughly ten years old. Fords C-Max was released roughly in 2012 with 600mile gas plus 30mile electric range to cover short daily commutes and long roadtrips. These vehicles were for overnight charging at home or at a hotel, but charging networks like ChargePoint came into existence at roughly the same time as Tesla's network. That said, they were originally mostly free with almost zero demand and mostly for employee, govt building, or mall use. And, the charging standards have slowly evolved and new tech like DC charging implemented. Now, many will need to switch again to the Tesla cable connector format.
yeah EVs are only at 8% market share, it could take years to reach at least 15-20%, we are way behind on building charging infrastructure, it's ridiculous that 30% of chargers are out of order, cost and other problems need to be resolved before the market will take off, I don't know if demand for EVs will ever reach 50%
While by no means faultless, DC rapid charging reliability here in Europe is actually pretty good. A nice example is Dutch operator Fastned (live in several countries across the EU and also in the UK) where I can see how many stalls are available on the station I'm heading for, even when I'm still 15 or even 30 minutes away, on my dashboard display even through Android Auto. Plus they have auto-charge, so no messing with cards or apps after the initial setup. And their up time record is insanely great, it is in fact one of the most important things they focus on as a business. Other charging networks have similar reputations (Ionity for example). Constant remote monitoring of charging stalls and stations, pro-active servicing, and using top of the line hardware appears to be the way they achieve such results. From what I've seen and heard, US charging networks can learn a lot from how things are being done in Europe.
@ErikGeurts How come Canada doesn't have the same issues? It is really simple, America tends to resist progress with all its might. EV sales other than Tesla and a few others are poor, because the car the dealer doesn't want to sell is the EV. EV would likely put Dealerships out of business. When it comes to charging stations, there are some simple reasons there are so many problems: Costs, Costs and costs. It cost Tesla about 1/5 what it costs other companies to install a Charging Station... there are a variety of reasons for this. The other issue is maintenance, this is really difficult because you need trained staff and you need a number of stations to justify having staff and etc. If maintenance is contracted out to 3rd Party, they aren't likely to drop what they are doing to address the issue and so on. The biggest issue is cost, but it is not really just about how much. The problem is that companies were making EVs and doing nothing to support the expansion of the charging network. 80% of EV owners charge at home, so this created a supply v demand issue. The chargers were available but they spent most of the time unused. Basically, I'm saying there was no coordination. Now that the Government(s) have bought into the EV transition there is more coordination, but still not enough. They have allocated some $$$ but where is the coordination?? This is the problem and it isn't likely to be fixed anytime soon, so this is why Tesla / NACS was the only hope. Tesla simply asks/voting its users where they would like a station put and there it goes. Tesla to the rescue, but there is a problem.... Government doesn't really support NACS as the standard yet, hopefully this will change soon.
As a European I cannot even remember when it was the last time I actually had to swipe a card. That means they are really still using the magnetic strip there. Which is of course prone to be unreliable. Seems like a wonder they are not using embossed cards and coal paper any more. 🤣
@@JamesR1986 Sorry, but i must strongly disagree. EV adoption in provinces like Quebec are high and there is a pretty healthy EV community in Canada. In Quebec you can even charge on the street, at Lightposts.
I actually believe the 'hold up' or 'hesitation' to most NEW buyers of EVs is actually the 'AT HOME' charging, or specifically, LACK THEREOF... for instance, if you are an apartment dweller, or live in a group living arrangement where 'general parking' is the norm, you'll lack the ability to simply plug in when you are at 'home'... which is the MAJORITY of power any EV ever receives. I get that 'travel' charging is a big concern, but the REALITY is that most EV owners miles per year are actually right AROUND where they live and work. Until we develop an EASY and AFFORDABLE and ADAPTABLE 'at home' charging option, the U.S. adoption of EV ownership, specifically of single-vehicle households, ESPECIALLY in larger cities and metro areas, will be hindered by the real-world question: 'how, or where, do I charge every NIGHT?'
Americas unwillingness to step in and regulate standard like ports and communication is crazy. Look how nice things are in Europe by comparison. They set a standard and it largely just works the vast majority of the time.
Because America is more concerned with who gets to have the monopoly and profiteer off of the entire system, rather than ensuring the system is standardized and reliable.
Go live in Europe then. See how much more you pay in taxes and see how heavily regulated your life is and how you wont be able to build and do whatever you want over there. Sure, you can drink in the parks and walk everywhere which is nice but do it.
There is a reason the EU can't compete on tech and doesn't have a strong venture capital culture. Ireland does pretty well but generally the EU is an over-regulated mess that stifles innovation. Thus...you buy iPhones and use Google, Instagram, etc. sending your money to US companies.
Well done and love the reporting! Downloading an app just to charge though is super frustrating and hope that gets built into the car better. Until then, I just recommend a Tesla, for it's #1 supercharging network.
hmm remember when someone would say "why would i need to buy this liquid to put into an automobile when I can just feed my horse some grass/hay?" yup, that's what you sound like.
5 minutes? You really like to take your time. I'm out in just 3 minutes. Gas filling is far more reliable and faster than EV's. EV's only work for people that can charge at home and even that's a joke. Imagine having to plug in your car every night when you get home. I prefer a wireless solution... gas!
I may be stating the obvious, but from what I saw on the video the magnetic stripe on her card always faced the machine. It is counter intuitive but sometimes the reader requires the mag stripe to face away from the machine.
I want to buy an EV, but first we have to fix the problem of para sites buying up multiple houses, so that people can afford houses and have a place to charge EVs.
This is the biggest reason why I would buy a Tesla today over any other vehicle. All the agreements Tesla is signing with other EV manufacturers are great, but those charge ports won't be on the cars till 2025 or later.
And the adapters solve the port issue. So this spring, it won't be an issue for other EVs. Much sooner than you think. We will see if the adapters are provided in 2024 models or not like many did with mobile charging unit.
@AlanJohnsrud waiting to see how payments with these CCS-1/NACS adapters will work at v3 SC's; v4's look like they will have payment terminals as an option. we still have no idea how the authentication of vehicles will be handled to limit to those who signed on with Tesla. though since almost every automaker has apparently made those individual agreements with Tesla now, perhaps it'll just be through the Tesla app like their Magic Dock option, and the point will be moot.
@@petehelme7714 It will be plug and charge just like Teslas. Only those EVs who don't have agreements with Tesla will need to use locations that offer Magic Dock. Only V4 Stations have payment terminals on them.
Charging stations not being fixed means these stations are not profitable when they work. If your profit-making machine was out of order for a day, you would immediately start fixing it because you're missing out on money to recoup the investment on that machine. The reason the stations exists at all is probably some type of subsidy for the construction of the station.
Why is the federal government paying for these charging stations, I don’t remember them paying for gas stations. It is bad enough that the American tax payer has to subsidize EV’s, now we have to pay for the charging stations too, what a joke. Have a great day.
I went to the US a couple of months ago and rented an electric car and it was insanely frustrating this issue. Almost every charger was broken, the ones that were working had people that let the car almost 24/7 or I had to download an app that was only available on the US App Store , which makes absolutely no sense. It was a experience to never get another electric again
I live with in the USA but drive to Canada and i had the issue of network apps being available only in Canadian app store and not available in the USA app store which my phone is set to. Presumably Canadian ev drivers in the USA will have this issue in reverse too. Fortunately there is a way to change the country app store on the iphone or so I hear, haven’t done that yet. Maybe on the next trip.
Tesla do have experience charging other vehicles on their chargers. They have been doing this for over a year in Europe. Which should give them the experience to quickly fix any remaining compatibility problems with other brand cars when they roll out support more widely in the US (the magic dock and V4 chargers). Their new V4 charger is primarily designed to support other cars, it doesnt offer Tesla drivers any improvement over the V3 charger experience.
I guess that LA is full of legacy systems because they were the first adopters of the tech. New stations across the country I imagine will use up to date plug-n-play systems.
I bought a new Cadillac Lyriq AWD. I opted for 2 years of free charging with EVgo. There are only 3 EVgo stations within 20 miles and 2 of them are unreliable. Fortunately, I had a Lectron Vbox charger installed in my house. I can charge overnight to 100% within 8 hours. No need wasting time or money on public charging.
And this is what most homeowners will do. However, the public charging network is where most apartment dwellers will have to go. The public charging infrastructure is where things need to get better and this video highlights the weakest points.
I've been warned people about the fiction of these EV cars for well over 11 years now, and many people looked at me as if I'm some type of cro magnon caveman even though I've a longtime cyber security engineer. But now the truth is finally coming out to light
As a CPA, I've warned people about those solar panels companies telling you you'll make your money back in 8-10years. They completely ignore the time value of money and by my estimates, they'd take 15+yrs just to get your pure cost back. Entire green electric industry is an expensive feel good scam in my opinion.
A horror story, when my Tesla was on 1% of charge, the nearest supercharger was a mile or two away, only public EV chargers were there at one location, the issue? All the chargers were broken besides one, and that one was taken up by a gas car. Despite the EV parking sign, so my Tesla dies and I had to get it towed to the supercharger. Phantom drain was a bigger issue than I realized. Public EV chargers need to be fixed.
Awesome video Joanna, as always! I've had the chance to charge my Rivian at a Tesla station twice (Moses Lake, WA), and both times, the experience was perfect. Electrify America, in the Seattle area, has been spotty. EVGo appears to be, at least here, more reliable. They also have plug-and-go support for Rivian, so the process is more straightforward. When they work, the nice thing about taking a leisurely 20-30 min. to charge is I get to watch videos, like yours.
It's a bit of a red herring because you wouldn't be travelling around the city looking for a charger, you would be charging at home. She spent about a microsecond on that fact. And she did quickly mention Tesla, although her main focus was how bad it is, not how successful the one good option was that was entirely integrated, Tesla. Compared to China's EV charging infrastructure and accessability, the US is in the Dark Ages.
@@jerryinmon2731Exactly. People tend to forget that mainstream EVs have only been around for about 12-13 years with the introduction of the Nissan LEAF. We are still very much in the early adopters phase, which is why we have federal and state incentives. The more people that buy EVs, the more that these problems will be addressed. A number of automakers have already committed to using the NACS (North American Charging Standard) aka Tesla hardware. Expect to have a pretty standardized experience further down the road.
@rylans.5365 In addition, I think many of the manufacturers will also be licensing the software, firmware, and hardware from Tesla just to stay in business long enough to really begin developing their own technology.
Telsa currently has a pilot with their magic doc system at certain superchargers. This means there is a doc that can charge non teslas and it works fine.
Unfortunately the percentage of SuperChargers currently equipped with the Magic Dock CCS adapter is very small. Tesla’s plans for Magic Dock expansion are known only to them. There are other issues with nonTelsa EVs using the Magic Dock sites but that isn’t too surprising given that the Tesla network was designed exclusively for Teslas. They were not considering the needs of EVs at the time. If they intend to be an open public network they will need to.
Standardization will help. Each station should have a self-check routine that can automatically report being out of order. Security cameras may reduce the vandalism factor. On the horizon are better batteries that charge faster and hold more, but we'll still have all the legacy cars to service.
they just show how bad alternatives in US are... Tesla charging network in China just one of the many and mediocre at best... Also, Tesla uses a different connector type (compatible with the Chinese GB/T standards for AC and DC charging)
What we need is smaller batteries that are hot-swappable. Imagine batteries standardized and commonplace so that you can drive up, and a machine swaps your discharged battery for a fully charged one in about 2 minutes. Stations could stock fully charged batteries and vehicles would pull up, get the battery swapped, them move on. This hanging around for hours waiting for charging is inefficient....
This is what happens when you have a bunch of companies all making propietary tech, not even thinking of the connection between it and other software. It's been a long standing issue. I hope it gets fixed now that the Tesla charger is going to be the industry standard.
The charging standard is at least a standard, albeit not an open one. Fuel pumps and card readers are nearly all proprietary too but they still manage to make them work reliably. Tesla's stuff is all just as proprietary as the rest of them. Their advantage is that they only have to deal with one sort of car and one payment provider. Not sure they will work that much better with all cars.
@@xxwookey The tesla style plug becoming the industry standard is the 1st domino to drop. This is basically what happened with the USB-C plug and Apple. But to your point, there shouldn't be issues with payment systems that have been around and functional for decades. They should also build in the capability of working with other companies because that will bring in more revenue when it comes to who can use what chargers... These are decisions based in capitalism not common sense. They should never be a problem.
@@oculosprudentium8486 To be fair that is a rather simpler interface: the nozzle has to fit in the hole (and the nozzle has a back-pressure autostop built in which is quite clever). Electricity needs a handshake between the charger and the car and an interlock on the connector. Which isn't that hard either, and both the Chademo spec and Tesla's all in-house implementation of CCS work fine, but 20 car companies and 30 charger companies seems to have managed to write subtly incompatible implementations of the protocol. Then there is a whole extra layer of payment systems. Not that many petrol/gas pumps have built-in payment devices, although again, when they do it's a solved problem. And none of them have apps you have to download to use them, which is just a terrible 'solution'.
@@oculosprudentium8486 It's not uncommon with tech. NO different that Apple finally giving in to the USB-C charger. Just has never affected cars like this. It will work itself out as the industry starts adopting standards. I just sucks that the consumers are the ones stuck.
We had this problem before the EV-trend started, once every 3 months or so you enter a gas station and one of the pumps are out of order, it's super annoying when all the pumps are occupied and the 2 minute fill up from empty to full could easily become 3 or even 4 minutes if you have to queue.
Thank you for a very informative video. I’m awaiting delivery of a Cadillac Lyriq. I’ve asked many EV owners how they like their EV and all have enthusiastically said, “I love it”. None have emphasized charging issues unless I specifically ask. So, the positives of EVs outweigh the challenges.
Dear Joanna - I feel with you … got my first EV four weeks ago and … same issue. BUT: I live in Spain … worst infrastructure here than you can imagine but also getting there. At least I know now, I am not alone 😂
Yeah Spain seems to be a long way behind on charger installation. I hope to see that improve soon as I'd love to drive an electric camper down there, and I'm not sure how good an idea that is yet.
And the software built into the car seamlessly directs you to a working charger on your route. My 2023 Bolt can't do anything like that. GM has been making EVs for 10 years and has an infotainment system unable to tell me where chargers are.
Hey! That’s why the battery swapping is the future. Easy, safe and quick (the swapping stations are always low voltage, and, since the fresh batteries are already charged, the swap takes just few minutes).
Battery swapping requires building a lot of expensive swapping stations and having a lot of spare batteries on hand, which is also expensive. Getting the automakers to agree on a common battery standard is also a tricky problem. NIO has reportedly convinced a bunch of Chinese automakers to share a common battery size, but I'm not optimistic that it will have much success. Now that CATL is releasing 4C charging batteries that reportedly cost the same as the old batteries, it will soon be possible to charge up an EV in 15 minutes. I expect to see 6C (10 minute) charging by 2026 and 12C (5 minute) charging by 2030. I don't see how battery swapping can compete with future fast charging.
Here in Québec the chargers are great. In four and a half years of using the rapid charge networks I’ve encountered just one site with a problem 😮 . As more EV's hit the road the poor companies will disappear and good ones rise to the surface.😅
As a Tesla owner for years, I decided to rent an EV (a VW ID4) thinking it would be no problem. Boy was I mistaken. The most frustrating auto experience I've had in years was trying to get the car charged at multiple charging stations. I'm not driving an EV besides Tesla until this problem is fixed (when? how long??)
I rented a Tesla. The charging is a huge issue and i didnt even have an issue with broken charges. Its simply takes too long and there arent enough if them. There needs to be WAY more charging stations which means upgraes to the grid. There would need to be stations at every parking spot in apartment compelxes.
I travel A LOT skiing (CA, UT, CO, ID, MT, WY, NV and AZ) and I've only experienced two broken Tesla chargers in 4 yrs and an uncountable amount of broken Electrify America chargers. Either won't charge or says 300kW but you get 40kW. Charge Point and EVGo have not been seamless, but at least give you the kW advertised.
Misleading title: there are definitely bigger problems with EV Adoption, like battery production and disposal, the capacity of our actual power grid, vehicle weight, and so on... (If you are wondering, I am not a fan of the combustion engines either... both technologies have huge problems, and I think that the only viable solution is that we move beyond the era of personal transportation by car.)
The stupid part is that EV chargers should be super reliable. Gas pumps are pretty reliable - every once in a while you see one out of service, but they have very high reliability. And they have moving parts, an actual motor and belt and pump head and plumbing, along with a number of safety valves and product switching valves and sensors and stuff. An EV charger needs NONE of that stuff. No moving parts. Just a step down transformer, a high efficiency solid state rectifier with voltage regulation, payment processing equipment and a small control board to run everything. The payment processing equipment and the control board are solved problems, because the gas pumps use the same payment processing and ruggedized single board controller. And the transformer and rectifier being solid state with no moving parts, and for the transformer completely passive, they should almost never break. Its crazy that they are broken all the time. Its just bad design plain and simple.
Why didn't they just stick with the Hybrid concept and simply beef up the battery capacity so that it could run on electric for short hops and switch over to gas when on long trips? That would have saved an awful lot of headaches.
Imagine if all manufacturers made gas nozzle intake ports on their vehicles all different shapes and sizes. Fords will only get filled at Shell..chevys only at chevrons, so on.... Sounds weird right? So why didn't all EV manufacturers just follow the leader Tesla with their ports?
Without watching, I'd guess the price tag. Any money saved on gas is lost on sticker price, charging costs, wasted time, higher insurance, foam filled tires, apps/monthly fees, the total lack of resale value, and the eventual cost of battery replacement. Or it could be the poor quality, lazy construction, delayed servicing, and lack of parts problems. Could also be a conversation about the lack of infrastructure to support the folly problem. Or it could be the necessity for hazardous rare earth materials that require horribly un-ecological mining and deforesting operations. Or the battery fires. Or the problems with adding an influx of 6000 lb passenger cars to our aging road and bridge system. Gosh. There are so many problems. I'm curious what you think the "big one" is.
You missed the big one... government is making a lot of money from Gas Tax. They will soon lose that money and come after the EV owners for it (plus some more for their trouble).
At this point? My tahoe will beat ANY EV from Seattle to Florida. Snow, no snow. Ima wait till they got it working as well as what I've got now. Maybe not even then. It's a little silly to put ALL our eggs in the electric basket when we have pretty much NO idea how another harrington+ event will affect that infrastructure. We literally rotate around the biggest EMP bomb for LIGHT YEARS in any direction. And it's going off ALL the time. Getting missed by the EMPs is mostly a matter of luck.
Renting an electric car and having to download the 30 apps was one of the most insufferable experiences ever I’ve been through
ik you joking but what was the actual amount of apps you had to download and why?
@@economicblast They are being silly, but the actual number is about 6x charging apps, and 1x for plugshare to find them. Note there is some overlap in apps where one will let you pay for multiple others.
@@economicblastit was 5 for us when I rented an EV.
Agreed, same here. They need to make it easier if they ever want them to catch on. High tech solutions aren't always necessary.
I daily drive an EV and only have 3 apps. Plugshare, Chargepoint, and Shell Recharge
I dont even need shell recharge, as chargepoint will activate those stations.
Imagine how upset you would be if regular gas pumps failed this often. But there are usually a few choices of stations within a few blocks of each other.
Can't believe governments think this is better than building trains and public transportation 🚝🛤🚋
I feel for renters and condo owners. But nothing beats never having to visit one if you charge at home.
The gasoline company selling to you maintain their pumps so they can make money. If the government puts their fingers in it, it will fail.
costco and sam's pumps are always broken.
oh no. it makes you just as upset. if not more because sometimes you are stranded or face extreme range anxiety. no fun. lol
The payment issues are the most baffling. I've seen maybe one broken card reader on a gas pump in the past 5 years.
And even then, you can go inside the store to pay for the fill up
I may be stating the obvious but is it possible the magnetic strip on the card needs to face the other way. On the vid itwas always facing the same way (toward the machine) It is counter intuitive but sometimes the reader needs the mag stripe facing away from the machine
@@mpodolsky11 she said she tried the card every which way
If you’re actually curious - it’s literally just unreliable confirmation of payment from terminal vendors (NAYAX being a big player)
From unacceptable network latencies which time-out the charger, to disagreements on the application of the currently non-standardized charger output initialization.
This is why DCFCs prefer you pay through their app as that gives them much more granular control of the process.
OCPP 2.0.x is looking to address the issue of OEMs using separate networks and requiring their own apps.
Just buy Tesla no credit card involved lol
As someone who personally have drove from Atlanta, Georgia to Los Angeles, California in a Chevrolet bolt EV, I completely agree with all of the points that she said in this video, they are all valid, all across the United States 😢😢😢
Get a Tesla, works much better.
With 50 kW charging? Must have taken you a couple weeks or more.
You obviously have lots of spare time, and tons of patience 😊
In a Bolt?!? You must be a masochist
Lol bro a bolt gets you like 160 on 80% charge. 😊 I use it for my daily commute to work and sometimes some day trips but never in my life for an extended trip that's crazy
27% out of order is amazing. Only 10% having payment issues seemed miraculous until I saw that having to download a different app for every charger wasn't seen as an issue. When trying to use non-Tesla chargers the amount of different apps needed was the biggest pain of all, with every locality seeming to have a different provider.
I wouldn’t be baffled if every charger would ask different apps.
The real question is why are broken chargers not promptly fixed. I know of specific chargers that have not been repaired for months.
That, and why are they breaking so often?
I would be okay with 5-7% broken, but not 30% out of order, that is ridiculous and unacceptable for people
if it's a place running chargers like from ChargePoint, perhaps they didn't keep the maintenance contract going.
a lot of the larger companies are waiting on replacing existing hardware with a newer generation rather than fixing the old units. then you run into parts availability too.
@@RyanWilliams222 pay attention to gas station pumps. they break too, but there are just so many of them around, one just moves on to the next pump and/or station and doesn't really notice.
It's not profitable
This was one of the main reasons I went with a Tesla. I didn’t even bother looking at other options and wouldn’t until this mess is resolved.
Precisely
Everyone gaining access to Superchargers makes non-Tesla EVs a non-issue.
@@anthonyc8499 Hopefully that will be the case eventually... probably about 2+ years down the road. Currently the number of Tesla SCs available to non-Tesla vehicles is pretty limited, but slowly expanding. For instance, if you go to the Tesla charging map, it only shows 2 non-Tesla chargers available in California. So it's currently still quite an issue and will take some time to implement.
closed proprietary systems are almost always better in these early development stage situations. same reason why apple is so much more optimized since even the beginning days
@anthonyc8499 Rather, it will once the other cars actually start coming with NACS plugs and Tesla actually enables their full network to other cars.
I'm personally looking to get a Model Y after the Juniper redesign, and charging is just one of several reasons it would best suit my needs.
Fun part of CCS is that the large connector and cable weight causes leverage that pulls the communication pins apart during the handshake. If the connection clip is loose enough and you dont hold the plug in the socket during the handshake, the plug weight can actually cause it to pull just far enough off the pins to sever the connection and disrupt the handshake. Excellent industrial design!
You are correct. Also the locking tab pulls down and out necessitating keeping a wooden stick to prop up the plug handle.
The Tesla charger is also CCS (NACS - which is CCS1), the big chargers you're seeing in the video are CCS2. That's why Tesla chargers can only charge up to 350kW, usually 250kW to be safe... CCS2 which is common everywhere outside the US in the rest of the world including Europe, Asia etc can charge up to 700kW safely even from home (especially since most countries use three phase 220-250v at home from standard sockets).
Essentially Americans need charging stations, the rest of the world can fast charge at home (if you have a regular socket on your drive or garage) and so the bulkier connectors aren't such a big problem and the hit to the electricity grid is much more evenly distributed.
@@thomascrabtree
You are drunk. Go home.
@@holmiumh Sorry you don't like facts
@@thomascrabtree Nobody is charging at 700kw
I’ve never seen a video telling me “if you want an EV get Tesla” so much 😂👍🏼
It’s a commercial for Tesla 😂😂
@@Hassan-Sas Only if you're an intelligent person capable of critical reasoning. In which case, why do you read the WSJ in the first place?
Other vehicles can use Tesla chargers.
This was a great video. I did learn from this video that I will be keeping my ICE car for a long, long time. It would've been interesting to know how much added range Joanna got on the Rivian, how much it cost, and how long it took.
I recently saw a similar video where a guy wanted to charge a Rivian in LA and between waiting for an available charger and finding one that worked, it took over an hour to get about 250 miles of range, and it cost $60. I understand these public charging rates in California are extremely high.
I just drove 815 miles from Florida to Maryland in my Lincoln Town Car, getting 25.7 miles per gallon. On my trip, from one gas station to the next one, I drove 342 miles and cost $45 to fill the gas tank in about five minutes. I made the trip in one day, taking about 14 hours due to heavy traffic in some areas. If I was driving an EV, with the extra time charging and trying to find a working and available charger, it probably would have meant staying overnight at a hotel, adding at least $100 to the trip.
I definitely won't be buying an EV anytime soon.
EVs are for around town errands or commute, not long distance travel… you pick the wrong use case
Nah if you buy a Tesla there are none of these issues and it’s much cheaper to operate than a gas/ICE car. This whole video was about non-Tesla chargers.
@@angy97 ICEs work for town errands AND long distance travel. There's no need for a specific use case.
@@angy97Not so. In CA, they’re planning on banning sales of gas cars in the near future.
Yeah, after 100 years of ICE cars and being born into a world where there are 20 megawatt fuel dispensers at every intersection sure does make life easy.
Tesla owner for 4 years here. Never not once have I ever run into an issue with a Tesla Supercharger not working when I show up. Can't imagine what its like for people dealing with this issue.
And if they are not working, the car will tell you ahead of time, very often at the stall level.
Never not once have I ever
Car owner and builder 30 plus years. Not once have had a pump issue. Amazing eh?
Wait until next year💀
@@Censortubesyou are so amazing that you own a car and can build them
The grocery store I go to has had only 1 of 4 Chargepoint Chargers operational for almost a year now. It is insane. I and other users have filled several maintenance requests for them and nothing has gotten done.
it's ridiculous that 30% of chargers are out of order, how are people supposed to use them
@@danielzhang1916they don't care. Teslas network is great because without it you can't use their cars. The other companies got paid by the government to install chargers, whether they work or not is not their problem, they got paid.
And it never will because they don't make money from them being operational
I believe many of the chargers are owned by individuals so they might not have the resources to keep them all fixed if they aren’t making a lot of money
Starting Friday, dockworkers in all Swedish ports will refuse to offload Teslas, cleaning crews will no longer clean showrooms, and mechanics won’t fix charging points as the labor dispute rages on.
Would have been interesting to see Joanna’s heart rate at these chargers to see which one was the most frustrating.
Such a great video about the realities of EV ownership, especially if you’re an apartment dweller in LA with no dedicated home charging in the parking garage
This. EV snobs are privileged elitists who think single family home ownership is the norm.
My complex has four chargers and they are often out of service. The management calls and response from the operators is slow.
Only the realities for non Tesla owners
Or even if you were renting a house. You can't rewire a house you are renting unless you are leaving the charger if you move.
@robertkubrick3738 I use a portable level 1 charging cord where I plug it into a standard 15/20A outlet. If I rented, I would _want_ to take the cord anyway. I set my max charging state to 70% and charge overnight. That is is fine for most people for everyday driving.
This is why I decided to opt for a Tesla. I really wanted to jump into the new i4 but logistics when taking long road trips to northern california to visit family forced me to go with Telsa and their superior Superchargers. On our recent road trip up north to saw us making a charge stop at a popular exit (Harris Ranch). There was about 6-7 non Tesla chargers with only 5 working and a line of 14 cars waiting to charge!!! That's insane!! Never seen that before. So I could totally see why the EV adoption will take a long time to happen. There was about 80++ Tesla Superchargers at the location.
They didn't even discuss the problem of derated chargers, where you plug in and it charges much slower than it should.
The problem there is that they have to know what they’re looking for to notice. That is… knowing the maximum DCFC rate of your car which I’m guessing you have to Google when you do a rental.
Sometimes that is the car though, if it has a cold battery, it will limit too.
So many were broken she didn't even get to that part. Also, I doubt she knows what derating is
Being a Tesla owner, I've never experienced any of the frustrations demonstrated in this video in any of my long distance trips (I charge at home for local driving). It's easy to see why most car companies have announced deals with Tesla to gain access to the Tesla Supercharger network.
Tesla is a beast when it comes to charging that’s their USP
Same. I have to believe that people who purchase non-Tesla EVs did so while being mislead about the charging situation. No one willingly buy into such an unreliable system like that. It’s not wonder virtually every EV manufacturer other than Tesla is struggling.
Yep, never an issue with Tesla and the supercharging network. Can’t wait until other cars have the NACS connector *and* work at a Tesla Super Charger! We’ll all have congestion problems but at least we’ll be able to buy an EV Truck that doesn’t look like a DeLorean on steroids.
@@PNWeBikeyeah the old reason I bought a Bolt was because the plan was to never use it for roadtrips (charge at home). Second car is a Tesla Model Y of course haha
Yes, many other vehicles will be able to use the Tesla chargers = longer wait times for Tesla owners.
Quick answer is that most charging companies don't regularly maintain their chargers. I don't know if this is because they are not connected so the company does not know if they are working or not. Some big charging companies are now buying Tesla charging hardware, so hopefully they also adopt the Tesla maintenance model.
Like may hear are saying, if you use a Tesla and it's charger network then you hardy have any issues.
They don't make money selling electricity, they make money collecting government grants to install the cheapest option
This creates a monopoly though that’s the concern.
so, they no longer like money right?
and they're asking to be Disrupted
someone should grant them their wish
@@gund89123 To an extent. Tesla is selling its hardware globally (so far have made 2 UK deals), however, there are competitors. In the US, for NACS, it's an open patent for all to use freely. Tesla is also outsourcing its plugs production in order to not make it a US monopoly. Anyone can make the NACS plug, despite Elon personally owning the patent.
Quick answer is - nobody interested in maintaining those chargers, as (almost) nobody profits. Tesla profits albeit indirectly, so their chargers are maintained.
I will not buy a vehicle with a CCS charging port. Terrible. Only Tesla NAC super chargers are decent. I will only buy an EV with the NAC adapter already installed. Most car manufacturers and adopting the NAC charging standard. That is the way to go.
6 year Tesla owner here. I've never experienced broken Tesla Super Charger. I'm hoping with almost every EV manufacturer adopting NACS and getting access to the Super Charger network starting in 2024 that other EV owners can have the same amazing experience as Tesla owners. I love Tesla but support the adoption of electric transportation even more.
What's it like destroying the environment and acting like you arent?
I've seen some insane lines for chargers here in my city, the bottleneck with charging times is pretty crazy. This generation of evs are not generally green unless you put some serious miles on the original battery. Then its marginal. The heavy mining required to source and process the raw materials is shocking and largely ignored when calculating how green they are. Not to mention the forced child labor and slavery associated with many of the sources. Kind of weird how many of my fellow liberals dont care that the price of their car is a result of child slavery and tax payer subsidy. The vehicles weigh a ton, you burn tires more than 2x as fast (which is a key source of carcinogens and pollutants in our air and water), the level of infrastructure development is going to be insane when you realize the energy we get from fuel is now going to need to be fed through the existing grid. We will need a level of infrastructure to support this that people don't understand because they aren't electrical engineers. Look at the cost and industrial effort behind building, installing, and maintaining just one transformer. Or the cost for just one mile of transmission lines. It's incredible.
Evs are primarily a way for governments to pretend they are "taking action" without actually doing anything or offending their rich donors. They can put these costs on the taxpayer and average person instead of addressing where the massive power usage is actually happening. It's the people with lots of money and power who do what they want and don't care.
A electric car is more efficient and the natural gas is more efficient to make. We can also convert to renewables. @@Censortubes
@@CensortubesWhat’s like creating pollution in the air?
@@carlosarriaga7428 how is 50 tons of ore for one battery with a 7 year shelf life. That needs fossil fuel to be build charged and maintained, better for the environment?
Excellent reporting identifying problems is first step in providing improved solutions
So in Germany, they require you bring your own cable for Level 2 (non "super") charging. This is because the cables are the number one thing that breaks on these. So if everyone has their own cable the likelihood of it breaking is minimal. So all drivers keep the cable in their car and plug it in. They've as a result been able to deploy tons and tons of level 2 chargers which makes sense.
That's ridiculous. Imagine going to a gas station and then requiring you to bring your own hose
Or going to a restaurant and having to bring your own utensils, 😂
The plug in on charger would get high mate and de-mate and need to be replaced.
@@colinm_pe and how is that different to the plug on a charger cable getting many mate/de-mate cycles? Either way, it's a wear item that's going to need replacing every so often.
@@thedopplereffect00 or having a cable to plug your phone/laptop/appliances to a wall socket.
Until you can pull into a charging station, charge up, and be out in a few minutes like a gas station, EVs will still be slow to be adopted...
Hands down the Most practical review on EV.
Title should be: Why are so many EV chargers broken in the US?
Here in Germany I have never encountered a charger that doesn’t work. Public CCS chargers outnumber Tesla chargers 10:1. All charging tarifs/cards work on basically every charger. The infrastructure is way ahead of the market, most charging stations are empty most of the time.
Its the same in the UK, lucky I can have a home charger as my house has a drive, if I didn’t have my own I would not get an electric car, it’s actually impossible using public charges, it’s to hit and miss to rely on
The TH-camr Aging Wheels did his own experiment on public EV chargers, and he revealed a 4th major problem with them: Many do not charge at the full rate/capacity they are advertised at! Which means a charge advertised as only taking 15 minutes can take hours to complete!
The guy from the Motorcoach World channel also did a road trip this summer in an electric coach bus and had a similar experience.
Except for the Tesla chargers which were flawless. Don't wrap up Tesla in the legacy auto garbage.
Yeah, I'm surprised they completely forget to mentioned that in the video
@@CodyDavis91 Chicago, Chicago, not teslas kind of town! Not when it's cold anyway.
Your pieces are so good Joanna. I will watch whatever you do, even if it’s a review of junk food. ❤
It is very rare for me to find a gasoline pump that is out of order.
Not just an LA or USA problem, in Sydney Australia there's always 25-60% of DC chargers out of order at any given time. Takes a long time to fix, I assumed it was a monetary issue.
Compared to how many gasoline stations that has 90% of their pumps working
Plus it seldom takes more than 5 minutes to fill your tank
And get at least 350 miles driving range
And in almost every city, there is a gas station every mile
While the the charge point does have to communicate with multiple different types of cars and their firmware, it should all be standardised. The issue to an extent is implementation of the standard. These implementations will be improved and refined over time, as will the charging hardware, payment integration, etc. It's going to be messy, but should get better.
Yeah, it will NEVER happen. Think Android and it's hundreds of different manufactures that use that software. It's why app makers hate making apps for android - it'll work on one brand, but not another. That will never be resolved unless each brand gives up its reason for existing in the first place...
@@ThomasGlynnJr Bad analogy for a couple reasons.
Android isn't a standard, it's an operating system and a moving target.
Android, despite not being a standard, is hugely popular and the dominant mobile OS.
A better comparison for charging communication protocols would be other standardised communication protocols. Think IP, TCP, HTTP, HTTPS, TLS(SSL), ICMP, etc. All of these - and many more - were used to load this website, stream the video, and then publish your comment and notify me of it. They all have several implementors, and they all work well enough that they're fundamental to the internet and modern society.
You have to remeber every time a standard is made 2 more will be made to unify the standards XD
@@emeraldbonsai Ah yes the world post-late-capitalism, we are finally here.
@@ZeroInDaHouse Has zero to do with capitalism since CCS was politically motivated (which explains why it's such a mess).
I love this video you went straight to the point not Bias no propaganda no hate just the truth as an EV driver my self I have this same experience here on the east coast thank you for this.
I don’t have any problem with a gas fill up . Not at all . And the gas Will maintain maximum mileage , over electric vehicles.
I have never had a problem finding a gas station, ever!
maybe when people were still using horses. LOL
Good thing there have been decades and decades of people driving cars so you don't have to be inconvenienced!
@@kng128 good thing we have early adopters to suffer through this so I can get it when all the problems are resolved
@@igvc1876 In my area there are 6kw chargers all over. At the doctor’s office, city hall, libraries, public pay-to-park lots, playgrounds, driving range, across the street from my office, more down the street. Extremely convenient.
I can early adopt because in 2009 my wife and I paid off our cars. We’ve been putting “car payments” money into brokerage account since. We don’t take loans for cars anymore.
Give that money to evgo instead of zelensky because fossil fuel has it's hand out and gets subsidies.
I just got back from a 6400 mile road trip in my Tesla Model 3 and had zero problems, all the Superchargers I used were working. This mess referred to is everything EXCEPT Tesla. Can't say this strongly enough! Tesla roadtrip experience is fantastic. There's a reason that the other EV makers are making deals to use Tesla's Superchargers. I've owned my Tesla for nearly 4 years and have ZERO problems charging. ZERO! 😛
I drove to California and back three weeks ago and had zero problems with Tesla's supercharger network. And never once had to wait for a stall.
@@TrendyStone For now... but just imagine every car out there is EV and wanting to use that supercharger... let's see the world in 10 years.
@@COSMACELF1802 Supercharger stations are expanding at 30% per year. There are currently 280 new stations under construction and 547 stations awaiting permits, which will add to the existing 6,000 stations with 55,000 individual charging stalls.
This is tremendous reporting. A serious issue that I had no idea existed.
The issues only apply to non-Tesla charges.
@@That-Guy_ Yeah, but that's half the market. If there's a problem with half of an entire industry, that's significant.
@@That-Guy_Jeez, you can’t say anything about EVs without some Tesla/Elon fan boy barging in and saying something condescending and off topic.
@@WallyHays
Just pointing out a fact. In the US there are 2 kinds of EVs, Tesla and everyone else. If only the other automakers had copied Tesla instead of looking down at them for so long.
@@That-Guy_ facts entirely unrelated to the comment you were replying to.
Not everybody can charge at home, or charge fast at home, but being able to do so is so, so much better than having to visit gas stations. I've had problems with busted DC fast chargers, but I almost never charge at charging stations. Growing pains of the EV industry.
Repeatedly fast charging decreases battery life, far better to slow charge at home
@@VoltLover00 we charged for a long time at one kilowatt with regular 110 volt AC power. Not very practical unless you have 2 days to recharge your EV after a long battery draining trip. We upgraded to 7 kW charging now. Much more useful, still not what I would consider fast charging compared to 150W or 250W Tesla superchargers.
If you can't charge at home, don't buy an EV. not worth the drama
Charging at home is really the way to go. 66% of housing units in the US have a garage or driveway. For those people an EV would be easy to own and live with.
As for the Charging At Home situation
Just you wait and see when your house become Uninsurable because of owning those 4 wheeled Crematoriums.
I’m not getting an electric car until the battery issue is resolved in cold weather. I’ve seen it first hand with friends and family members that have or had an electric vehicle. When it’s cold the battery range drops significantly as the car is trying to keep the battery warm
You'd think they would insulate the battery somehow. It's the 21st Century! If they can insulate and protect Astronauts, they can protect a battery
The ONLY car I would ever recommend if you cannot charge at home is a Tesla. Period. The experience is night and day difference.
I owned a Chevy Bolt EV and it was fantastic, but charging outside of home was an absolute nightmare.
Don’t even consider an EV unless you can charge at home, or it’s a Tesla.
Excellent investigation. From the little I have viewed on TH-cam it appears the cost of EV charging is similar or exactly like expensive gasoline.
Thanks for making the case for the NACS/ Tesla charging standard.
Did you watch the video? NACS is still untested for non-vertically-integrated scenarios.
all the automakers are switching to Tesla standard, it's about time everyone gets on the same page
@@crftr-com yep and it's very controlled currently for CCS-1 vehicles with Tesla's own Magic Dock. The payment and authentication methods for how it'll work with adapters is still unclear.
Unlike Gas Stations, many (most), are unattended (no operator on site). So when there are 'issues'. someone (you?) must tell the service provider/owner (most sites are just leased property) and they need to schedule a tech site visit. How many qualified (per model) techs are there in LA (or any other location) ? This issue is not just limited to EV. How long do you have to wait when your Dishwasher breaks down? OMG 3 weeks in the Bay Area for warranty work! We need a better way for repairs. (I did not mention the Vandalized Elephant)
There's also the fact that a gas station is a way simpler device than a charging station, it's basically just a hose and a pump, so much more rare for it to break down.
@@noseboop4354pumps are fast more complex than you realize because of saftey issues with flammable liquids. EV charger companies only exist to collect government cheese on the initial install money
Never had my dishwasher leave me stranded on the road, and she looks gorgeous with bed hair in the morning.
3:05 using their app also gives them more valuable information about you. One more reason for them to not improve the credit card payment at the charger.
Wow, crazy. We've had our Tesla for 5 years now and honestly have seen zero superchargers that we could charge at. Literally zero issues. Tesla's charging network is better than the cars themselves.
6:10 Based on a still small sample of data, the PlugShare ratings for non-Tesla EVs using Tesla's "Magic Dock" Superchargers are about 20% worse than the ratings provided by Tesla owners, so the Superchargers also are clearly not a panacea.
Why would you think it would instantly work as good as Tesla cars with vehicles from other manufacturers. It's going to take a little time to figure out the best way to make this happen.
@@jerryinmon2731 I don't disagree, but not giving networks and automakers that same opportunity/time wouldn't be fair either.
Based on what I've seen, of all the failures on the public charging providers, about a third are due to the provider and hardware, a third are due to the user, and the rest are due to the automaker/EV itself. Tesla currently doesn't have to deal with two of those issues at all, but when they finally do open to non-Tesla EVs, they will be dealing with all three.
My main point here is that Tesla has a lot of work to do if they hope to even come close to providing the same level of service to everyone on their Superchargers as they currently provide to Tesla EV drivers. By the time they get around to that (as they no doubt will), the other charging providers will have also caught up or surpassed them.
But the difference is, Tesla will figure it out and software update all the superchargers to fix it at once, whereas Shell Recharge for instance doesn't even know they don't work, and doesn't care anyway.
@@brushlessmotoring Maybe, but we'll have to wait and see. Tesla's incentive for providing exemplary service really stops at their own customers. We've already seen this with "Magic Dock," where it is essentially just an attempt to tick a box so they can access public funds. Slower charging speeds, higher prices, etc. There's no reason to expect Tesla to treat their non-Tesla EV customers as well as they treat their Tesla EV customers.
@@newscoulomb3705 I just put up a quick video of non teslas at a super charger in Deep River Ontario - the Bolt user got his expected maximum charge speed of 75kWh and the F150 seemed to be working too. I know there were some issues with Ioniq 5 and EV6’s 800V system, but that may be common to other 800V systems on a 400V charger - I don’t disagree it’s going to be harder for Tesla, as they don’t control 3rd party car’s software, but hopefully NACS solves that in time too.
PlugShare is a great crowdsource tool to help EV drivers to find high-rated stations. But, yes this is a problem that is slow to find a standard resolution
I am a Chinese and in a small city in China, I have a BYD electric car.
After watching this video, I believe that there is already a significant gap between the development prospects of electric vehicles in the United States and China, and there is no chance for the United States to surpass China.
It's a cop out for the charging companies to say that it's complicated to connect to many different vehicles that's why we have standards. They are just 2 computers talking to each other through a cable that's like the most basic type of a networked connection you can possibly have.
It really isn't complicated at all. The communication even has a dedicated set of wires
@@thedopplereffect00 Right!!!!
I did that exact experiment and experienced the exact same thing. Broken. Broken. Broken.
I’m so excited to get my R1s!
We have the charger installed at home already and will primarily charge that way but 100% I know I will have trouble the first few times I charge in public lol like getting gas for the first time
Based on my experience what you show in LA seems to actually be better than here in Florida! The Tesla network is absolutely the way to go… very high 98% reliability and even if there’s an odd charger out of order, the software will let you know before you get there. Even in that instance, you’ll be dealing with let’s say one stall out of order out of maybe a dozen at one location. Thank you for bringing this issue to light, this is by far away the big bad news in EV life and it seems it’s wide spread. On a recent trip to the UK I ran into similar problems. I think investors in the non-tesla networks should pay close attention to this problem. If they don’t fix these problems before Tesla’s super chargers are scaled they will be out of business. This is not a new problem either, I’ve been using charging networks since 2014 and this has perpetually been a problem. The only network in the USA which has solved the problem is Tesla . The recent decisions by most vehicle manufacturers to adopt the Tesla standard is the writing on the wall. I’ve driven my tesla over 216,000 miles through 40+ states almost exclusively using Tesla super chargers and almost never have a problem. If buying an EV, go for it, make sure to ask the dealer if the car will accept NACS in the near future and be aware than in the interim you’ll have to deal with the issues in this video until then (mostly this will not effect you if doing home charging, but definitely something to be aware of if you take road trips!)
99.97% actually ;)
@@sebastianorye2702 lol thank you for the correction!
It’s interesting that you faced “legacy” hardware issues when EV chargers haven’t been around even a decade! This will probably always be an issue and while I agree EVs will grow in percentage of automobiles on the road, I believe these issues coupled with EV costs will force ICE and other power forms to also continue to be around creating a multitude of types of automobiles for the future.
A decade ago I was using Windows 7 and Windows XP...so...
Plugin hybrids are roughly ten years old. Fords C-Max was released roughly in 2012 with 600mile gas plus 30mile electric range to cover short daily commutes and long roadtrips. These vehicles were for overnight charging at home or at a hotel, but charging networks like ChargePoint came into existence at roughly the same time as Tesla's network. That said, they were originally mostly free with almost zero demand and mostly for employee, govt building, or mall use. And, the charging standards have slowly evolved and new tech like DC charging implemented. Now, many will need to switch again to the Tesla cable connector format.
yeah EVs are only at 8% market share, it could take years to reach at least 15-20%, we are way behind on building charging infrastructure, it's ridiculous that 30% of chargers are out of order, cost and other problems need to be resolved before the market will take off, I don't know if demand for EVs will ever reach 50%
@@andrewdiamond2697Really? Comparing car operating systems to Windows is like asking for the Blue Screen of Death while you’re on the highway …
When she said legacy I was like this is brand new tech.
While by no means faultless, DC rapid charging reliability here in Europe is actually pretty good. A nice example is Dutch operator Fastned (live in several countries across the EU and also in the UK) where I can see how many stalls are available on the station I'm heading for, even when I'm still 15 or even 30 minutes away, on my dashboard display even through Android Auto. Plus they have auto-charge, so no messing with cards or apps after the initial setup. And their up time record is insanely great, it is in fact one of the most important things they focus on as a business. Other charging networks have similar reputations (Ionity for example). Constant remote monitoring of charging stalls and stations, pro-active servicing, and using top of the line hardware appears to be the way they achieve such results. From what I've seen and heard, US charging networks can learn a lot from how things are being done in Europe.
@ErikGeurts How come Canada doesn't have the same issues? It is really simple, America tends to resist progress with all its might. EV sales other than Tesla and a few others are poor, because the car the dealer doesn't want to sell is the EV. EV would likely put Dealerships out of business.
When it comes to charging stations, there are some simple reasons there are so many problems: Costs, Costs and costs. It cost Tesla about 1/5 what it costs other companies to install a Charging Station... there are a variety of reasons for this. The other issue is maintenance, this is really difficult because you need trained staff and you need a number of stations to justify having staff and etc. If maintenance is contracted out to 3rd Party, they aren't likely to drop what they are doing to address the issue and so on. The biggest issue is cost, but it is not really just about how much. The problem is that companies were making EVs and doing nothing to support the expansion of the charging network. 80% of EV owners charge at home, so this created a supply v demand issue. The chargers were available but they spent most of the time unused.
Basically, I'm saying there was no coordination. Now that the Government(s) have bought into the EV transition there is more coordination, but still not enough. They have allocated some $$$ but where is the coordination?? This is the problem and it isn't likely to be fixed anytime soon, so this is why Tesla / NACS was the only hope. Tesla simply asks/voting its users where they would like a station put and there it goes. Tesla to the rescue, but there is a problem.... Government doesn't really support NACS as the standard yet, hopefully this will change soon.
As a European I cannot even remember when it was the last time I actually had to swipe a card. That means they are really still using the magnetic strip there. Which is of course prone to be unreliable.
Seems like a wonder they are not using embossed cards and coal paper any more. 🤣
@@tonespeaks evs won't be putting dealerships out of business. They will put people out it cars minus the elites.
@@tonespeaks Canada absolutely has the same issues that the US does, as demonstrated by any EV reviews done by The Straight Pipes.
@@JamesR1986 Sorry, but i must strongly disagree. EV adoption in provinces like Quebec are high and there is a pretty healthy EV community in Canada. In Quebec you can even charge on the street, at Lightposts.
I actually believe the 'hold up' or 'hesitation' to most NEW buyers of EVs is actually the 'AT HOME' charging, or specifically, LACK THEREOF... for instance, if you are an apartment dweller, or live in a group living arrangement where 'general parking' is the norm, you'll lack the ability to simply plug in when you are at 'home'... which is the MAJORITY of power any EV ever receives.
I get that 'travel' charging is a big concern, but the REALITY is that most EV owners miles per year are actually right AROUND where they live and work.
Until we develop an EASY and AFFORDABLE and ADAPTABLE 'at home' charging option, the U.S. adoption of EV ownership, specifically of single-vehicle households, ESPECIALLY in larger cities and metro areas, will be hindered by the real-world question: 'how, or where, do I charge every NIGHT?'
On a biz trip to Austin, got an EV rental. Could not find a working charger in the week there.left it with 5% charge.
Americas unwillingness to step in and regulate standard like ports and communication is crazy. Look how nice things are in Europe by comparison. They set a standard and it largely just works the vast majority of the time.
It's happening organically. Everyone is adopting Tesla's NACS standard in 2025. CCS and CCS2 will die in the US. Not a moment too soon!
Because America is more concerned with who gets to have the monopoly and profiteer off of the entire system, rather than ensuring the system is standardized and reliable.
Go live in Europe then. See how much more you pay in taxes and see how heavily regulated your life is and how you wont be able to build and do whatever you want over there. Sure, you can drink in the parks and walk everywhere which is nice but do it.
There is a reason the EU can't compete on tech and doesn't have a strong venture capital culture. Ireland does pretty well but generally the EU is an over-regulated mess that stifles innovation. Thus...you buy iPhones and use Google, Instagram, etc. sending your money to US companies.
@@TrendyStone, capitalism stifles innovation, not regulation. You’re thinking of exploitation. Regulation does limit that.
Well done and love the reporting! Downloading an app just to charge though is super frustrating and hope that gets built into the car better. Until then, I just recommend a Tesla, for it's #1 supercharging network.
Hmm.. I pull into a gas station, fill up, and I'm out in 5 minutes! 😂
hmm remember when someone would say "why would i need to buy this liquid to put into an automobile when I can just feed my horse some grass/hay?"
yup, that's what you sound like.
@@khoa2610 Perfect.
Good option until the system irons out its problems.
Same here, gas re-fuelling is soooo quick and reliable - it’s the future! 👍🏻
5 minutes? You really like to take your time. I'm out in just 3 minutes. Gas filling is far more reliable and faster than EV's. EV's only work for people that can charge at home and even that's a joke. Imagine having to plug in your car every night when you get home. I prefer a wireless solution... gas!
You didn't mention how long it takes to charge once the connection is made
I may be stating the obvious, but from what I saw on the video the magnetic stripe on her card always faced the machine. It is counter intuitive but sometimes the reader requires the mag stripe to face away from the machine.
I want to buy an EV, but first we have to fix the problem of para sites buying up multiple houses, so that people can afford houses and have a place to charge EVs.
MMmmmm
This video is inadvertently a commercial to purchase a Tesla good job guys 🤣
with tesla u wait in a 2 hour line instead 😂
This is the biggest reason why I would buy a Tesla today over any other vehicle. All the agreements Tesla is signing with other EV manufacturers are great, but those charge ports won't be on the cars till 2025 or later.
2025 will be here before you know it! I would actually be impressed if all the new EVs in 2025 had NACS ports.
And the adapters solve the port issue. So this spring, it won't be an issue for other EVs. Much sooner than you think. We will see if the adapters are provided in 2024 models or not like many did with mobile charging unit.
@AlanJohnsrud waiting to see how payments with these CCS-1/NACS adapters will work at v3 SC's; v4's look like they will have payment terminals as an option.
we still have no idea how the authentication of vehicles will be handled to limit to those who signed on with Tesla. though since almost every automaker has apparently made those individual agreements with Tesla now, perhaps it'll just be through the Tesla app like their Magic Dock option, and the point will be moot.
@@petehelme7714 It will be plug and charge just like Teslas. Only those EVs who don't have agreements with Tesla will need to use locations that offer Magic Dock. Only V4 Stations have payment terminals on them.
Charging stations not being fixed means these stations are not profitable when they work. If your profit-making machine was out of order for a day, you would immediately start fixing it because you're missing out on money to recoup the investment on that machine. The reason the stations exists at all is probably some type of subsidy for the construction of the station.
Why is the federal government paying for these charging stations, I don’t remember them paying for gas stations. It is bad enough that the American tax payer has to subsidize EV’s, now we have to pay for the charging stations too, what a joke. Have a great day.
I went to the US a couple of months ago and rented an electric car and it was insanely frustrating this issue. Almost every charger was broken, the ones that were working had people that let the car almost 24/7 or I had to download an app that was only available on the US App Store , which makes absolutely no sense. It was a experience to never get another electric again
I live with in the USA but drive to Canada and i had the issue of network apps being available only in Canadian app store and not available in the USA app store which my phone is set to. Presumably Canadian ev drivers in the USA will have this issue in reverse too. Fortunately there is a way to change the country app store on the iphone or so I hear, haven’t done that yet. Maybe on the next trip.
Tesla do have experience charging other vehicles on their chargers. They have been doing this for over a year in Europe. Which should give them the experience to quickly fix any remaining compatibility problems with other brand cars when they roll out support more widely in the US (the magic dock and V4 chargers).
Their new V4 charger is primarily designed to support other cars, it doesnt offer Tesla drivers any improvement over the V3 charger experience.
I guess that LA is full of legacy systems because they were the first adopters of the tech. New stations across the country I imagine will use up to date plug-n-play systems.
You did a very good job doing the animation, the layout and explaining. I am impressed.
I bought a new Cadillac Lyriq AWD.
I opted for 2 years of free charging with EVgo.
There are only 3 EVgo stations within 20 miles and 2 of them are unreliable.
Fortunately, I had a Lectron Vbox charger installed in my house. I can charge overnight to 100% within 8 hours.
No need wasting time or money on public charging.
And this is what most homeowners will do. However, the public charging network is where most apartment dwellers will have to go. The public charging infrastructure is where things need to get better and this video highlights the weakest points.
I've been warned people about the fiction of these EV cars for well over 11 years now, and many people looked at me as if I'm some type of cro magnon caveman even though I've a longtime cyber security engineer.
But now the truth is finally coming out to light
As a CPA, I've warned people about those solar panels companies telling you you'll make your money back in 8-10years. They completely ignore the time value of money and by my estimates, they'd take 15+yrs just to get your pure cost back. Entire green electric industry is an expensive feel good scam in my opinion.
A horror story, when my Tesla was on 1% of charge, the nearest supercharger was a mile or two away, only public EV chargers were there at one location, the issue? All the chargers were broken besides one, and that one was taken up by a gas car. Despite the EV parking sign, so my Tesla dies and I had to get it towed to the supercharger. Phantom drain was a bigger issue than I realized. Public EV chargers need to be fixed.
Awesome video Joanna, as always! I've had the chance to charge my Rivian at a Tesla station twice (Moses Lake, WA), and both times, the experience was perfect. Electrify America, in the Seattle area, has been spotty. EVGo appears to be, at least here, more reliable. They also have plug-and-go support for Rivian, so the process is more straightforward. When they work, the nice thing about taking a leisurely 20-30 min. to charge is I get to watch videos, like yours.
It's a bit of a red herring because you wouldn't be travelling around the city looking for a charger, you would be charging at home. She spent about a microsecond on that fact. And she did quickly mention Tesla, although her main focus was how bad it is, not how successful the one good option was that was entirely integrated, Tesla. Compared to China's EV charging infrastructure and accessability, the US is in the Dark Ages.
Sunny LA is the best case scenario. Imagine going through this during inclement weather or low temperatures.
This is not the future I want, this is not what we were promised.
Have patience. This is still in it infancy and will take time to sort it all out. It will happen but not tomorrow.
@@jerryinmon2731Exactly. People tend to forget that mainstream EVs have only been around for about 12-13 years with the introduction of the Nissan LEAF. We are still very much in the early adopters phase, which is why we have federal and state incentives. The more people that buy EVs, the more that these problems will be addressed. A number of automakers have already committed to using the NACS (North American Charging Standard) aka Tesla hardware. Expect to have a pretty standardized experience further down the road.
@rylans.5365 In addition, I think many of the manufacturers will also be licensing the software, firmware, and hardware from Tesla just to stay in business long enough to really begin developing their own technology.
10 years of Tesla ownership and road trips, and I’ve never had a problem. Their network is flawless.
Telsa currently has a pilot with their magic doc system at certain superchargers. This means there is a doc that can charge non teslas and it works fine.
There have been reported issues with a few automakers at those superchargers. I wouldn't say it works fine 100%.
Unfortunately the percentage of SuperChargers currently equipped with the Magic Dock CCS adapter is very small. Tesla’s plans for Magic Dock expansion are known only to them. There are other issues with nonTelsa EVs using the Magic Dock sites but that isn’t too surprising given that the Tesla network was designed exclusively for Teslas. They were not considering the needs of EVs at the time. If they intend to be an open public network they will need to.
Except Tesla's chargers can't charge non-Tesla's at full speed
Appreciate the feedback here.
@@VoltLover00never knew that. What speed do they charge non teslas at?
Standardization will help. Each station should have a self-check routine that can automatically report being out of order. Security cameras may reduce the vandalism factor. On the horizon are better batteries that charge faster and hold more, but we'll still have all the legacy cars to service.
they just show how bad alternatives in US are...
Tesla charging network in China just one of the many and mediocre at best...
Also, Tesla uses a different connector type (compatible with the Chinese GB/T standards for AC and DC charging)
What we need is smaller batteries that are hot-swappable. Imagine batteries standardized and commonplace so that you can drive up, and a machine swaps your discharged battery for a fully charged one in about 2 minutes. Stations could stock fully charged batteries and vehicles would pull up, get the battery swapped, them move on. This hanging around for hours waiting for charging is inefficient....
That sounds nice but expensive and even more app to break. That’s a lot of moving parts!
Great Journalism 👍. I loved every bit of this video
This is what happens when you have a bunch of companies all making propietary tech, not even thinking of the connection between it and other software. It's been a long standing issue. I hope it gets fixed now that the Tesla charger is going to be the industry standard.
The charging standard is at least a standard, albeit not an open one. Fuel pumps and card readers are nearly all proprietary too but they still manage to make them work reliably. Tesla's stuff is all just as proprietary as the rest of them. Their advantage is that they only have to deal with one sort of car and one payment provider. Not sure they will work that much better with all cars.
@@xxwookey The tesla style plug becoming the industry standard is the 1st domino to drop. This is basically what happened with the USB-C plug and Apple.
But to your point, there shouldn't be issues with payment systems that have been around and functional for decades. They should also build in the capability of working with other companies because that will bring in more revenue when it comes to who can use what chargers... These are decisions based in capitalism not common sense. They should never be a problem.
I'm laughing at the whole stupidity and craziness of these EV conundrum.
No one with gasoline fueled engines has these connections problems!!
@@oculosprudentium8486 To be fair that is a rather simpler interface: the nozzle has to fit in the hole (and the nozzle has a back-pressure autostop built in which is quite clever). Electricity needs a handshake between the charger and the car and an interlock on the connector. Which isn't that hard either, and both the Chademo spec and Tesla's all in-house implementation of CCS work fine, but 20 car companies and 30 charger companies seems to have managed to write subtly incompatible implementations of the protocol. Then there is a whole extra layer of payment systems. Not that many petrol/gas pumps have built-in payment devices, although again, when they do it's a solved problem. And none of them have apps you have to download to use them, which is just a terrible 'solution'.
@@oculosprudentium8486 It's not uncommon with tech. NO different that Apple finally giving in to the USB-C charger. Just has never affected cars like this. It will work itself out as the industry starts adopting standards.
I just sucks that the consumers are the ones stuck.
Thanks, but as an environmentalist, no EV for me. We all have to do our part to save parent Earth 🌍
We had this problem before the EV-trend started, once every 3 months or so you enter a gas station and one of the pumps are out of order, it's super annoying when all the pumps are occupied and the 2 minute fill up from empty to full could easily become 3 or even 4 minutes if you have to queue.
it's a bigger problem for EVs because there are fewer chargers than gas pumps and it takes longer to charge than to fill up with gas.
@@hackman88 Yeah, I was being a bit sarcastic.
Thank you for a very informative video. I’m awaiting delivery of a Cadillac Lyriq. I’ve asked many EV owners how they like their EV and all have enthusiastically said, “I love it”. None have emphasized charging issues unless I specifically ask. So, the positives of EVs outweigh the challenges.
Dear Joanna - I feel with you … got my first EV four weeks ago and … same issue. BUT: I live in Spain … worst infrastructure here than you can imagine but also getting there. At least I know now, I am not alone 😂
Yeah Spain seems to be a long way behind on charger installation. I hope to see that improve soon as I'd love to drive an electric camper down there, and I'm not sure how good an idea that is yet.
This is exactly why people buy Tesla if they want EV. The Tesla supercharger network is extremely reliable and seamless.
And the software built into the car seamlessly directs you to a working charger on your route. My 2023 Bolt can't do anything like that. GM has been making EVs for 10 years and has an infotainment system unable to tell me where chargers are.
Hey! That’s why the battery swapping is the future. Easy, safe and quick (the swapping stations are always low voltage, and, since the fresh batteries are already charged, the swap takes just few minutes).
Battery swapping requires building a lot of expensive swapping stations and having a lot of spare batteries on hand, which is also expensive. Getting the automakers to agree on a common battery standard is also a tricky problem. NIO has reportedly convinced a bunch of Chinese automakers to share a common battery size, but I'm not optimistic that it will have much success.
Now that CATL is releasing 4C charging batteries that reportedly cost the same as the old batteries, it will soon be possible to charge up an EV in 15 minutes. I expect to see 6C (10 minute) charging by 2026 and 12C (5 minute) charging by 2030. I don't see how battery swapping can compete with future fast charging.
Here in Québec the chargers are great. In four and a half years of using the rapid charge networks I’ve encountered just one site with a problem 😮 . As more EV's hit the road the poor companies will disappear and good ones rise to the surface.😅
That's the way capitalism should work. Let's hope it actually does, given the deplorable state of EV charging in the US, re non-Tesla systems.
As a Tesla owner for years, I decided to rent an EV (a VW ID4) thinking it would be no problem. Boy was I mistaken. The most frustrating auto experience I've had in years was trying to get the car charged at multiple charging stations. I'm not driving an EV besides Tesla until this problem is fixed (when? how long??)
I rented a Tesla. The charging is a huge issue and i didnt even have an issue with broken charges. Its simply takes too long and there arent enough if them. There needs to be WAY more charging stations which means upgraes to the grid. There would need to be stations at every parking spot in apartment compelxes.
I travel A LOT skiing (CA, UT, CO, ID, MT, WY, NV and AZ) and I've only experienced two broken Tesla chargers in 4 yrs and an uncountable amount of broken Electrify America chargers. Either won't charge or says 300kW but you get 40kW. Charge Point and EVGo have not been seamless, but at least give you the kW advertised.
As fashionable as it is to hate on Tesla, this is why they are still #1 by a mile.
Not the only reason
I love the internal combustion engine!
Yes, I love ICE too. No problems like EV's. But, some day, EV's will get it right and we can switch without the head aches. ... give it 20 years.
Misleading title: there are definitely bigger problems with EV Adoption, like battery production and disposal, the capacity of our actual power grid, vehicle weight, and so on...
(If you are wondering, I am not a fan of the combustion engines either... both technologies have huge problems, and I think that the only viable solution is that we move beyond the era of personal transportation by car.)
The stupid part is that EV chargers should be super reliable. Gas pumps are pretty reliable - every once in a while you see one out of service, but they have very high reliability. And they have moving parts, an actual motor and belt and pump head and plumbing, along with a number of safety valves and product switching valves and sensors and stuff. An EV charger needs NONE of that stuff. No moving parts. Just a step down transformer, a high efficiency solid state rectifier with voltage regulation, payment processing equipment and a small control board to run everything. The payment processing equipment and the control board are solved problems, because the gas pumps use the same payment processing and ruggedized single board controller. And the transformer and rectifier being solid state with no moving parts, and for the transformer completely passive, they should almost never break. Its crazy that they are broken all the time. Its just bad design plain and simple.
They is broke because persons insert they gum into the charge holes for a satisfying feel.
WHATTTTTT 😮
Why didn't they just stick with the Hybrid concept and simply beef up the battery capacity so that it could run on electric for short hops and switch over to gas when on long trips? That would have saved an awful lot of headaches.
Imagine if all manufacturers made gas nozzle intake ports on their vehicles all different shapes and sizes. Fords will only get filled at Shell..chevys only at chevrons, so on.... Sounds weird right? So why didn't all EV manufacturers just follow the leader Tesla with their ports?
Without watching, I'd guess the price tag. Any money saved on gas is lost on sticker price, charging costs, wasted time, higher insurance, foam filled tires, apps/monthly fees, the total lack of resale value, and the eventual cost of battery replacement.
Or it could be the poor quality, lazy construction, delayed servicing, and lack of parts problems. Could also be a conversation about the lack of infrastructure to support the folly problem. Or it could be the necessity for hazardous rare earth materials that require horribly un-ecological mining and deforesting operations. Or the battery fires. Or the problems with adding an influx of 6000 lb passenger cars to our aging road and bridge system.
Gosh. There are so many problems. I'm curious what you think the "big one" is.
You missed the big one... government is making a lot of money from Gas Tax. They will soon lose that money and come after the EV owners for it (plus some more for their trouble).
At this point? My tahoe will beat ANY EV from Seattle to Florida. Snow, no snow. Ima wait till they got it working as well as what I've got now. Maybe not even then. It's a little silly to put ALL our eggs in the electric basket when we have pretty much NO idea how another harrington+ event will affect that infrastructure. We literally rotate around the biggest EMP bomb for LIGHT YEARS in any direction. And it's going off ALL the time. Getting missed by the EMPs is mostly a matter of luck.