I am sick and tired of hearing perfect voices, I miss all the distinct voices of the 70’s. I like the tone of a persons voice versus how well they sing❕
What are you listening to? “Diversity”? There is more music in more styles and genres available today…a hundredfold more than at any time in history. More importantly “how” are you accessing and listening to music?
@@JohnLnyc I think you are missing Brent's point a bit, John. There may be a torrent of product available now but there is little in the way of music that is not forced into a digital 'frame' and that takes away all the flavour and the diversity of form. Think of the likes of David Bowie - couldn't really sing that magnificently but he had a unique tone and style that made him a star. He wouldn't be allowed these days and would have the same bland digitally corrected tone as everyone else.
@@JohnLnyc Back in the days of the dinosaurs, you could instantly recognize a singer's voice because it had its own characteristics, etc. Now, I can't recognize any newer singers. To me, they all sound the same. I was wondering why until Phil explained auto tune.
@@dallassukerkin6878 Hi. I really can’t disagree more. First though, Bowie was an incredibly talented vocalist. He released an album just seven years ago. I don’t know what “sing that magnificently” is? That’s rather subjective. It can be objective if you reduce “singing” to technical and measurable elements. I think you offer a clue with the use of “star.” The music business has evolved. Maybe this is the issue. There are so many more genres and niches now. It is more fragmented. The Billboard Top ten was more diverse then but was it really? Bowie was nowhere near the “star” Gaga or Swift are today. Each very different and neither heavily auto-tuned (I don’t listen much so…) He was niched into “art rock” and not much liked by the Hard Rock crowd. Remember we are using hind sight with Bowie. I recall buying a Jeff Beck record based on an album cover and liking that record went to see him live unaware of Ron wood and Rod Stewart other than what they did on stage. See a vastly different time. Where I am confused is where your conclusions are coming from. That “torrent of product” is far more diverse today than ever. What do you mean by “digital frame”? It is all digital now. There are in fact far more record labels now than ever. Yes most are divvied up between three major entities. Most every mixer, producer, engineer and yes, artist will tell you digital has been a boon to the business of recording. Current artists, The Warning, have self produced three records got a deal with Lava and released one record and have another coming out. They got to the deal via a You Tube video. They are not “tuned” and have a big say in their sound. David Bendeth produced their first Lava effort. Fil has done two whole segments on them. Will they become “stars”? I don’t care for them taste-wise, but label mates Greta Van Fleet aren’t using auto tune to my ears. They quite “big.” I am guessing hindsight is really causing the issue. Are You are looking at “stars” from the past and “stars” today? If so, doesn’t really work. Let me know.
The sad thing is, as a group, the kids today don't understand that cheating is wrong. Not all kids, I am talking about the herd; This lady really believes she is producing the sound. I say unplug her and let's hear it.
@@Mrrich3 Listen to her live busking performances, she streams live quite regularly and then you can hear it. You can't beat a true live performance, warts and all but studio trickery is here to stay no matter what any of us think. C'est la vie
@@Mrrich3 actually, i think I disagree pretty strongly with this sentiment. Given the incredible heat Ms. Courtney Hadwin got when her AGT audition went viral in 2018 and she was accused by some of 'cheating' because she'd competed in other competitions before being invited onto AGT's stage, I think there's a CONSIDERABLE number of youngsters who KNOW that cheating is WRONG. Unfortunately, in that case, they heaped their ire upon someone who wasn't deserving of it. Which might also be a danger here, come to think of it.
@@kerrythomas6220 what’s that old saying “ Proof is in the pudding “ ! Yes this video that Fil introduced with that third part reaction from Music Bible is a production video one of the very few Allie has done ! Where that proof is, check out Allie’s TH-cam channel over 1300 videos the vast majority live on the street performances ! Allie and her amazing busking friends , not up on a stage or hiding out in a studio, but live one take videos on the street in front of her many, many fans ! 🎤🎸🎼
I love how you called Bullshit!!!! Excellent De-construction. BUSTED!!!!! Well done Fil. Fake music and the uneducated masses just eating it all up. Actually makes me mad and sad at the same time.The artificiality of some Pop music is boring as hell and insulting to true musicians and astute fans too.
Just wait until these phony "performers" figure it out and start using AI or algorithmic pitch correction so it's actually less obvious. Ever see one of those toy keyboards for kids where it will play the right note no matter what key they push? That is 100% the future of the music industry. Will have a producer and engineer produce a "live" version of a track for artists that mimic an actual live performance and a computer will just pitch correct in real time to match the formula they want. Just step to the mic, make some noise, and let the computers do the rest. For decades now, the "look" of a performance (and performer) has been more important than the music. Now, technology is catching up to cover for it.
Seems deception has become a part of our everyday lexicon. I love the irony of the words she's singing: "Honesty and promise me I'm never gonna find you faking". Cue the laugh track.
More like deception is the norm on social media. Images are airbrushed and edited. Stories are staged. Music and vocals are heavily doctored and edited despite being presented as though they're raw. It's all about maintaining this false sense of perfection, this veil that your life is perfect and you're so amazing and happy. "Everybody look at me and what I'm doing, feel bad for me when I want to be a victim, be jealous of me when I'm traveling the world and posting pictures about everything I'm doing". It's one of the main reasons I avoid social media like the plague it is. It's sickeningly fake and self-centered.
Your trying' to be cool, you look like a fool to me-- But even Avril Lavigne the "original singer" was selected through auditions, and the song handed to her by producers at the songwriting company the Matrix. Its not like it because Billboard #1 organically either. And that why 20 years after this song came out to target my generation, I don't listen to it, I listen to Fleetwood Mac.
@@jasondorsey7110 They've been planting people since the Beatles. I think the Monkees were the other side of the test. Like have two very similar groups but make one wholesome and the other dark and degenerate, then see which gets more popular. Clearly the Beatles did and that could explain why plants are usually degenerates, rather than wholesome. They figured out which sells better
Before was great music cuz people tried to do the best with few resources, THE CREATIVITY TO WRITE LYRICS, COMPOSE THE PARTITURE AND RECORD WERE OVER THE EDGE. Today to much tech is turning people lazy and lack of creativity. Just like Herbert wrote in Dune's intro.
Can you imagine Janis Joplin's vocals corrected? Thankfully, we got to hear her real voice, raw and unmolested. I'll take authenticity over perfection any day of the week.
Here's the thing though if Janis Joplin or any pre-90's vocalist was singing today, their management team or record label would probably insist on using pitch correction because it's a tool to enhance the product. Who would have said Lewis Capaldi needed pitch correction but it's on a lot of his live performances, literally everybody uses it although not to this extent which sounds horrific.
I tried to talk to a music producer about the evils of pitch correction once. He produced stage shows but also did some studio work. His opinion was “if you CAN make it perfect with software, why not go ahead and do that, cause perfect is better than good.” I told him that humans don’t actually like perfection as much as they think they do because we can’t actually relate to perfection. We connect the most with flawed, broken characters and imperfect art because we see ourselves in that brokenness. Unfortunately he wasn’t looking for any kind of philosophical discussion, he just cared that clients paid him to make it sound as good as possible. And we all know that clients are born and raised on marketing driven advertising-fueled pipe dreams. They think they want it pitch corrected. They think they like that sound. They think all they need is a new microphone to make it big.
It's not "perfect" anyway, it's just precise. Perfect music is entirely subjective; precise music is objectively a thing but (usually) subjectively sucks.
@@Ithirahad Additionally, there's variance between pitches as you go higher in pitch...at least on a piano. Well, on a real piano. "Perfect" may indeed hit the target pitch up around C7 or C8, but it may actually not sound right.
This is just the most refreshing video and channel to have stumbled across. Not enough is said about the high levels of manipulation in today’s videos of singers online, who portray their performances and vocals as “raw” and real… when they are not. Thank you for bringing this to light.
Amen! But also there's the disturbing aspect that this seems, to me at least, to be yet another form of dangerous abuse of teens and other young singers. Firstly, they're being taught to LIE as a normal part of their life. Secondly, it damages their self-image and undermines their self-worth, both when it's done to their own voice, and when it's done to most everyone to whom they listen. This is both immoral and child abuse, IMHO. IT MATTERS!!
@@givingin2G4Courtz That's why God gave them "parents." There are still a few with great intonation though; The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague un-reasonable facsimiles ! Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
Actually, @@lyndafaye6748 I think that's a bit 'flip' of an answer. Yes, good parents do their best to protect their children, but that doesn't mean they CAN always succeed. NOR DOES IT REMOVE ANY RESPONSIBILITY FROM THE COMMUNITY, THE SOCIETY, TO _ALSO_ PROTECT THOSE YOUNGSTERS. In fact, to ensure that those parents are not themselves abusing those children. There is PLENTY of RESPONSIBILITY to go around to all of us.
Even the pros use these tools these days. Even the best drummers in the world are quantised. Even the best singers in the world get pitch 'corrected'. Even my latest album had both done despite my protests because "Look, if you don't, the audience wont like it." Unless you're writing, recording, producing and performing all on your own, you don't get a say in it unfortunately.
I've walked passed Ali busking several times. She's genuinely really talented. She doesn't need this. And I'd say that something is lost when it is "perfected" artificially. It's the imperfections and the authenticness that makes a performance.
@@bingobriano6021 A lot of people also stop to listen (including me most weekends). Most of the videos on her TH-cam channel are one-take unedited busking videos, and some have "mistakes" although any that have big bloopers don't get posted. I tend not to listen to her other videos as they didn't sound right - and now I know why! 😊😊
@@JacoWium 😅I'm dyslexic, I punch above my weight normally... but that one will always get me as "passed" seems like the past tense of "pass"... I realise you are correct, but now that I'm thinking about it, I feel I SHOULD be right LOL I mean I just used the word "past" with a totally different meaning!
I am familiar with Allie"s work. When the clip started I thought it looked like Allie but did not sound like Allie. She has a unique voice that does not need "fixing"'. You are indeed a light in the dark tunnel of technology! Thanks for what you do.
Ahhhh, yes you recognized Allie ! I think a bunch more folks also did ! Did you notice this video is still climbing Fil’s most viewed videos ! I believe we may have had a bit of video manipulation going on, kind of ironic isn’t it ! 🎤🎸🎼
I have a good friend who is a vocal instructor. I sent this video to her with a note to show this to her students who may feel discouraged after seeing these singers on IG and YT.
@@Qyngali omg I can't believe I never thought of that being a possibility of a remaster, but holy smokes that is blasphemous if you ask me!! Yup. Gonna stick to original masters as much as possible at this point. Sheesh.
@@krollpeter Pretty sure the small to medium venue acts I like to see don't: Pat Metheny, Ray LaMontagne, Richard Thompson, Buddy Guy, etc. Besides, it's not about pitch correction per se. I guess I wouldn't really mind if Art Garfunkel used pitch correction to help him reach the notes - the guy is in his 80's. It would still be an authentic performance. I want to see real musicians on stage interacting with each other, playing different notes than the studio version, and with a real drummer and bass player - not someone singing to a soulless electronic rhythm track.
@@61hink the guy is a heavy smoker, or was, and that spoiled his voice long ago. You would possibly be surprised about what is not really live anymore. But of course I understand what you are saying and that I agree.
Pitch corrections makes everyone sound the same . We are on the road to AI replacing all vocalists and song writers anyway , future is quite bleak unfortunately
She does have a great voice and you can hear it live when she busks but i feel she also takes out most of her inflection when she records. She winds up with no personality/ emotion in the song and autotune exacerbates that
Spot on. This is the the vocalist equivalent of air-brushing models to perfection, photo-shopping nature into unnatural colors and scenes, AI manipulation, etc. "Adding chemicals" to vocals was a phrase I heard often in recording studios many years ago, but the imperfections were not erased. I appreciate the imperfections and other nuances that make a vocalist/musician unique. It makes them human. So thankful to see you bring this important subject to attention.
The problem of agents, producers and putting a team around her. On the street, the girl can sing and has plenty of quirkiness to her voice to capture peoples attention.
@@robinvegas4367 and add about 90% of the 70's singers, some of them like the Wilson sisters from Heart and Jon Anderson in advanced ages with still impressive voices. One more reason why I don't listen to any modern music.
@@kerrythomas6220 because she does’t take an audio sound room down to the street to perform ! It’s her voice, guitar,amp, and mic, you know like everyone has been hootin and hollering about in all the comments ! This young lady is one of the very few that still does it OLD SCHOOL LIVE, the vast majority of the time ! But don’t take my word go to her channel and be AMAZED out what you will find ! 🎤🎸🎼
Thank you for this breakdown. My wife calls me a music snob because I literally can’t listen to a song with heavy auto tune. Of course then I have to complain about it and that does me no good. I was so disappointed when I heard the new Rolling Stones song. I’m generally disappointed with all music coming out now and I think you really nailed the point. What are we suppose to praise?What the hell are we suppose to be impressed by? The software is so good that literally anyone, and it’s been proven by Taylor Swift, can sing a song in pitch. But pitch is not everything. I want to hear the damn mistakes because that’s where the real emotion is. Humans make mistakes and that’s what makes the performance real. I feel sorry for kids these days because we’re teaching them that they have to be perfect. I also feel that audio engineers should get to walk out on stage with the performers when they accept their GRAMMYs. Their names should in be subtext after the artist’s name on the label. There I go. See it does me no good. Thanks again!
Old Roy, when U2 went into the studio with him, practice run, Bono said he barely could be heard, then the tape rolled, like a different person, mercy.
You said what I was thinking, they’ll develop the software to incorporate ‘natural’ variations and then we’ll never be able to tell what’s real and what’s not.
Yep. This is how they'll officially kill music. They've shot it already and it's bleeding but this'll be the putting it out of it's misery. Always what happens when you get technocrats and business"men" involved in anything. They kill the soul with their sterile greed
It’s obvious that track was pitch corrected to me from my years of hearing natural true vocal recordings from the 1950’s 60’s 70’s . Young music listeners these days aren’t accustomed to hearing natural singers. All they hear is manufactured, manipulated recordings. Anyone that grew up listening to music in the golden decades should feel fortunate. “Ain’t nobody got time for that “!
I literally jumped back in my chair when the audio first came on. It's awful. But like you, I grew up in the 1960s and 70s. I had a record player, but also heard a lot of live music, because we did it, around campfires, at parties, or just to amuse ourselves.
I like to think, young people with a genuine love of music will grow to see through the manufactured pap and and learn to appreciate real skill and talent. Similar to the way I've abandoned a lot of the bland, empty hits of my youth to now appreciate a broad swath of talent. Their loss if they don't, I guess...
Completely agree with you Fil. When I listen to pitch corrected singers, I hear Woody Woodpecker rather than a human singer. On top of that, because the math in the correction algorithms struggle to correct time-domain signals in the frequency-domain, I can often hear some nasty artifacts that make the pitch transitions sound hollow (like they're being sung in a closet). I would much rather hear honest singing complete with the small imperfections and nuances that are an inseparable part of us being emotional humans and not perfect robots.
Thank you so much for staying the obvious. I have acute hearing and can hear the obvious fakery. No thank you. I loved going to hear my favorite band 6X with nary any tricks. Hearing the little real time mistakes makes me appreciate the effort they're putting into each live concerts. The voice in the video sound simply robotic and I can hear each pitch correction. It makes me cringe!
I'll be honest...in performances without instruments, a capella or at least with very tuned down instruments...i can detect autotune. But within a song with beat and louder instruments...it kind of vanishes behind the other "noises". If it is not applied very heavy..I can honestly not hear it
I appreciate your video very much. I am a choir director working with 13-18 year old students everyday. I have been teaching music privately or publicly for about 38 years and have witnessed the decline in confidence students have with their own voice as they compare themselves to what they see/hear on media. Not only do I hear it from students, but adults as well. This video may open their eyes a bit. Thank you for posting this!
Being a music laymen I found this interesting as I was not aware how prevalent pitch correction and auto tune is. Makes me appreciate singers of my 80'S era that much more.
They still had tricks in the 80's! Comping together multiple takes was common. Using chorus and delay effects to smooth out a bit of the pitch fluctuations was also common. Then they had burying the lead vocal in lots of backing vox from strong singers. And....Milli Vanilli!
It will depend on the vocalist. The original intention with Pitch correction was to save the vocalist voice and to avoid vocal nodes (Nodules on the voice box) The 2nd use in a live performance context is to again prevent injury to the Voice box, especially if a number of encores are the norm for the vocalist. My Mother was a Jazz vocalist in the 50's and her coach told her no talking an hour before her warm-ups and no talking 2 hours after the performance. I follow the same regiment. I am an Electronic Music Producer using Ableton Live 11.3.4 (Last stable release) and Reaper for Live recording, BitWig Studio 5 for Sound design. I did a Cert III in live sound production and used Logic Pro X and used Comping for an assessment for a Podcast and had to manually Pitch correct where possible. Personally I prefer Ableton and I am more familiar with EQ8 and Convolution Reverb, Glue Compressor and Valhalla super massive . I run all my mixes through a Spectrum analyser as my hearing is different to what it used to be.
It's prevalent alright, every song you hear on and off the radio uses Auto-Tune (pitch correction) in some form or another. From the very subtle to the abusive uses in Rap and R&B. This is why when artist are seen live, people say they suck cause they sound nothing like the record. 🙄I can't wait for Auto-Tune to be frowned upon so engineers can go back to using it the way it was intended.
All my life I have searched for new music. I have liked many generations of music. But now, with the protools and autotune, pitch correction, compression, reverb, and so on. I will stick with CDs of music mostly made before the turn of the century.
Agreed. Admittedly, I'm a Gen Xer, but I'm so uninspired by the current generation's music. The pop scene is just a total disaster of lameness. Even the alternative rock scene was a lot better just 10 years ago. These days I can barely tell alt rock apart from hip-hop. I understand it's been difficult for newer generation of musicians to move music culture forward like the entertainers us Gen Xers grew up with in the 80s, but jeez, at least make an attempt to be unique ... and maybe they should throw a little fun in while they're at it and stop taking themselves way to seriously. Sorry, I just had to vent.
Completely agree with you Fil. When I listen to pitch corrected singers, I hear Woody Woodpecker rather than a human singer. On top of that, because the math in the correction algorithms struggle to correct time-domain signals in the frequency-domain, I can often hear some nasty artifacts that make the pitch transitions sound hollow (like they're being sung in a closet). I would much rather hear honest singing complete with the small imperfections and nuances that are an inseparable part of us being emotional humans and not perfect robots.
Please Fil, keep exposing the fakes and frauds while these individuals try to pass the song off as authentic. You're right, most people would not know that this performance has been heavily processed. Music? No! Thank you and please continue keeping them honest. Very educational and informative.
The irony of the actual original song LYRICS here 😂. “Honestly, promise me never gonna find you FAKING…it’s all been done before…”etc etc. Bang-on analysis & reveals. Thank you so very much!
.Merry Christmas Phil! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
See loads of reaction channels reacting to the likes of Phil Collins, Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Queen, Eva Cassidy, and so on, all performing live, and they're blown away, like OMG this is live... well, that's what good music and talent looked like before technology and talent tv shows ruined it for the newer generations.
Live shows have no guarantee you are hearing an actual performance. Major artists have been lip syncing and air-playing over prerecorded tracks for so long audiences seem not to care anymore
@@kenjohnston1257, I’m sure you are correct, but I certainly hope the small venues where I’ve seen some well known stars play and sing have been the real thing.
Maybe it's my age, but pitch correction has like an electronic sound to me. You really are a genius! Truly skilled. I saw a video when the computer produced the voice, no real singer.
Just my opinion but if he was truly skilled, his reputation would be about performing not critiquing ! There's that old saying " Those who can't do, teach & and critique ! 🎤🎸🎶
@@harryfreeman8467 my Father was an amazing jazz drummer. He wasn't famous, He went up to Ronnie Scott's in London to Jam, often and played with many well known musicians. He was asked to play at the Queen's birthday many years ago, also to do a jazz cruise for a well known artist, he declined. That does not mean he was not a good musician. Not all famous artists are actually any good. I think you are confusing skill and talent with fame. However you are entitled to your opinion. Computer technology may well be the death of true talent.
@@1960ARC I think you missed my point. You don't have to be famous to be a talented or gifted musician and sounds like your Dad was very talented. My critique of Fil, he is not hanging his hat on his talent as a musician or performer, his claim to fame is critiquing other artists about auto tune and pitch correction ! He's calling out individual artists and in the case of Allie, making it sound like she is cheating and you don't have to take my word check the comments saying she should be ashamed of herself ! Fil is calling out the artists, when he should be calling out the root of the problem and that is the record labels and the recording industry ! Anything a label puts out, unless they actually do a live release, which those are few and far between is always tweaked ! Mix and mastered , certain parts of a performance both vocals and instrumentals pumped up in spots to grab the audience ! What really agitated me, is Allie is the poster child for what Fil wants, the true talent of the artist ! Yes Allie put out a few production videos, but if you take the time to check her out on all the social media platforms, the vast, vast, vast majority are live street performances in front of an audience, one and done, no chances to tweak it or fix it, the True talent of an artist, and I thought that was what Fil was looking for ! 🎤🎸🎶
To be a pop singer these days you don't have to be a singer - just have to be able to act and dress like a singer. Music is losing it's magic.. it's heart.
That's not entirely true. If you've ever heard any of the pop stars' raw voices, the vast majority of them have good voices, and can still sing well. Maybe not amazing, but competent. It's not like singing is something 1 in a million people can do. A lot of people can naturally sing. So, when someone is going to get money put behind them, they are going to pick people who can at least sing.
This is outrageous. I grew up in the 1970's and Karen Carpenter was my mentor. I celebrate her birthday every March 2. Now she could sing. I'd play the radio harmonizing thirds, fifths, and every other chord progression I could dream up. My mother had me playing piano at 5 years old. I know I sound like an old bag, but I'm 63 years old and just returned from Carnegie Hall singing Vivaldi's Gloria SSAA version. The only regret I have is I didn't practice my piano enough. I have an agent at Carnegie and can go sing there whenever ever I want. Thanks again Fil for pointing out these imposters.
Karen was an instrumentalist also, with great intonation as her backup. The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles ! Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I absolutely love Karen Carpenter's voice and singing. However, she wouldn't have been totally spot on. And that's the point. By pitch correcting you lose all the nuances and the naturalness in the voice. Of course, when I say she wouldn't have been totally spot on, I by no means mean she was a bad singer - far from it.
The danger in piling ire on the subject of the video is that Fil points out repeated that she can sing. I bet these videos earn her more than busking does but busking is showing her true self. The sadness is that the music industry took us to this place.
You're the only person who remains grounded to reality, thanks for that. I see a lot of apologists for pitch correction even saying some singers SHOULD be using pitch correction live because it's still their voices and none would care. Yes we do care, we still want to hear people who actually took their time to develop good intonation.
Here's the bottom line, fellow musicians: The more we consent to the use of pitch-faking and all the other inauthentic gimmickry, the more we train listeners' ears to neither recognize nor appreciate the real, and turn ourselves into just so much training material for AI. Keep up the fight, Fil, and know we are with you!
It seems to go along with a striving for perfection as beauty that we see in the over-perfection of grooming and makeup, video filters, as well as AI generated images. However, perfection does not make you memorable or great. The perfect example of vocal imperfection in a legend is Woody Guthrie. He was a poet and undeniably *real*. He was always self-effacing and never sang a song the same way twice. Despite his obvious imperfections, he influenced so many artists including Pete Seeger, Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen, Johnny Cash, Joan Baez, Phil Ochs, Tom Paxton, Ani DiFranco and Billy Bragg.
@@stevenvarner9806 I truly believe it is a form of abuse, just like body shaming. It's WRONG to do this to kids self-confidence, both to pitch-correct their own voices and to help them believe that perfect voices are NORMAL and they just don't measure up. We have no RIGHT to do this to people! It is immoral. It teaches deceit as a 'normal' behaviour.
But how can we define "inauthentic gimmickry"? Wa-wa pedals were considered that originally, but I'm sure glad it didn't bother Jimi Hendrix and he picked one up! To me all that matters with music, is how it sounds. And overly pitch corrected, or overly produced music just sounds bad to me, stiff and unnatural.
@@123jkjk123 , I think you've partly answered your own question. A musician must still interact with a wah-wah pedal; there's still a performative element. It could be argued that the sense of music becoming "stiff and unnatural" comes when instead of augmenting what the musician does, an effect essentially overrules the performance. Of course there's no strict dividing line, but overall, I want to experience an artist's choices.
Wonder what happened to "ear training" and "Intonation?" There are still a few with great intonation though; The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague un-reasonable facsimiles ! Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I can’t thank you enough for bringing these TH-cam singers down to earth. What happened since the great singers of the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s. It seems to me that with all this electronic voice correction, it’s impossible to determine a quality vocalist. I’ve listened to Lara Fabian, Barbara Streisand, Celine Dione and they are in a class by themselves. Love your channel.
'TH-cam singers'? This girl made her way busking on the streets of Ireland. Look up her videos. This video is an extremely weird example for that reason. She's clearly a very good singer. Pitch correction is used for basically every pop singer ever.
@@KiwiCrisis yes Fil should be praising Allie for being one of the very few TH-cam artist that the vast majority of her content are LIVE one take street performances ! The true talent of the artist, I thought that’s what he was looking for ! Hey gave Fil a challenge to find me another TH-camr that has posted more LIVE performances than Allie, still waiting to hear who he has come up with ! 🎤🎸🎼
I am almost 70 so I have heard the very best. I love music and vocals, but I reached a point where it all irritated my ears. I just assumed that I was getting grumpy, like every old person is supposed to, about young peoples music. I then discovered International music, and what an eye (and ear) opener. There is soooo much real talent out there.... Dimash being my favorite 🥰. Your videos have shown me why I always feel like my ears are bleeding when I hear the new hits on the radio. Thanks for the enlightenment and reassurance.... I'm not a grumpy, crazy, old cat lady 😆 (no cats at all)
but he says Dimash autotunes too. So there you go. Dimash must be a fraud too. I don't believe it, as true to being pitch perfect as anyone could be he is. No one is perfect all the time. Frankly I think Fil is ruining music/singing for everyone who listens to these videos. I was interested in the beginning but had to unsubscribe because it was just ruining all of it for me. I am not talking about really horrid singers but I want to just enjoy music and not have it taken apart note by note. Enough.
@@californiahiker9616 They're called " a show" now, not "singers." The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles ! Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
My issue with this audio manipulation is that in art it can be the imperfections that ultimately make something beautiful. Really appreciate your work!
As an audio engineer for 30 years it’s possible to hear the artifacts in pitch corrected vocals. It’s hard to explain but when you hear it on almost all mainstream music you know what to listen to. I have so many artist that ask me to pitch correct their vocals and I refuse to offer that. I will never use those tools. Either you can sing or you can’t. And good luck with doing it live.
You can use pitch correction live lol what kind of audio engineer won’t use pitch correction? Do you you nudge any instrument notes closer to the grid to keep things in time when editing music? What’s the difference ?
@@waves5114 - I actually have Autotune in a box, yep. I think it runs on 9 volts and can be added to a vocalist's audio chain. I bought it on a lark and I've never plugged it in. One of these days, I'll mess around to see if I can use it to open a portal to the underworld and summon some warriors. Eventually, we're going to need an army to fight the zombies. I hope the warriors don't eat humans, though; that would be unfortunate.
It's the same reason most engineers worth their salt won't waste endless hours tracking a performer who can't play their parts. When a rock band shows up and the guitarist can't play through their solo after dozens of takes, they're being sent home to practice on their own time. It's common sense that even the greatest vocalists out there still have their bad days performing live from time to time, so it boggles the mind why modern artists are setting the bar for their capabilities at the level of artificial perfection with constant pitch correction. The studio is for capturing the best possible performance and polishing it for the last few percentage points towards perfection. Recording is not meant to be for falsifying digital perfection and making yourself look like a knob when performing in front of a crowd. Last I knew, Milli Vanilli was a huge controversy and the laughing stock of the music world...
@@waves5114 The difference is that people want to see someone actually perform, not lip-sync or rely on auto-tune because they can't match pitch (this is not a criticism of usage of autotune as an FX chain tool). It's one thing to use some minor pitch correction on a studio performance for an album or to edit the spacing of some notes in a performance to tighten it to the grid. It's another to use HEAVY post-processing to correct poor performances and make the performer appear to be more consistent and talented than they are (especially in a live context!). The former is comparable to adding a layer of polish to a great performance whereas the latter is putting makeup on a hog. It's all about artistic integrity. The most impressive musicians and performers of the world are impressive because they are just as good as they present themselves to be. Their live performances are consistent with their album recordings, rather than being a facade held up by safety nets like Autotune.
For a number of years I thought that many modern singers sounded like "robots" but wasn't sure what was going on until I started viewing Wings of Pegasus and learned about pitch correction. Keep up the great work.
I think auto-tune and pitch correction is the equivalent of loading up a hand-painted oil painting on the computer. There you apply photoshop and add effects that's impossible to produce with a manual brush. Then you print it out and set it in frame from the 18th century. That's what autotune is to me.
Except.... Autotune is physically uncomfortable to me. It shreds my nerves. If I don't like a computer generated painting I feel no discomfort; I just don't like it
Auto tune is fake and it sounds fake. Not because the pitch is corrected but because there is a literal "jitter" in the vocal voicing when listening to it. That to me is the most annoying thing about pitch correction software is that tell tale micro-jitter in the voice. THAT is not a natural sound.
Millie Vanilli were definitely ahead of their time. Now all you need is the right look, the ability to come across as “relatable” and the masses will make you rich to pretend.
That is a different story: Rob and Fab did NOT sing on the records, they were in it for the picture. In the end they could sing but they had very different voices. The whole story then was that Milli Vanilli was a fraud. Even on live performances where they were supposed to sing with a backing track, they were actually playbacking. Later on we got to see the Real Milli Vanilli, which was a band with one singer and a girl singing too. But by then the audience was not listening anymore.
I've heard her youtube vids before and I've always felt there was something off with her live performances verses her "studio" ones like this. Whenever I commented as such, I was eviscerated by her followers that I was just being a hater. Fil, thank you for your analysis. I feel somewhat vindicated in my own mind anyway. I knew there was something going on!
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Within 5 seconds of listening to this recording, it was obvious pitch correction was used. The majority of her fans are pervy old men and will white knight defend her to death. Her live performances aren't anything special either. We all know why she's popular.
People would rather lie than face the truth these days, her voice is off when she's busking as well as in this video because it is fake as, she'd be better off just using her own honest voice & drop the stupid software because she sounds like AI & not a human at all! - She's better off to stay in her own lane -busking on the streets!
In all fairness, Allie has a lot of talent. Just watch her live busking videos. I do not understand why she thinks she needs autotune in some videos because she clearly doesn’t.
I'm afraid my opinion of what's been going on in the music industry since 1997 isn't fit for print... People have a right to know, so THANK YOU for exposing the sad truth. As always, looking forward to Your next analyzis and/or LS, FIL!💕🎸
@@nataliee9 - Indeed......As there always has been. It's really not worth getting too angry about plastic pop wannabe's..... They've been around for many decades already.
You’re justified in your general take, but the reality is right now is the easiest it’s ever been to find the music you want to find, just like the good ol days you’ve gotta explore, it won’t all be for you but it never has been
@tanssi382 your correct easy to find. With you tube,spotify,all the others. However the exploring is not anything like the good old days. I appreciate all kinds of music. But today I can speak to a device say play it. or look on line. In the old days you had to hear something on radio. Take some money and get to a record store or other type that sold it. Today if I want to hear a great new song multiple times I just click and play. And sound systems are much better. Back then a hit song, well you may have to go to the record store, order it, pay a deposit then come back, pick it up, take home. Then I could listen to all I wanted. Share with friends. So in those days it was much more difficult to "explore " My friends owned a popular record shop. I, being a collector was an expert with the huge catalog book of records in print. I often helped customers research and find a song they wanted desperately. It was actually a lot of fun. We interacted with real people. But your correct about how easy. I can listen to any song free on the internet. But I still have and enjoy my record collection. Their making a huge comeback. I'm glad!👍🎶☮️🎸✌️
Yeah, loads of TH-cam guitarists have been doing it for years. I used to call it out a bit but everyone jumps on you and won't have it and in the end I'm like, meh...is it even worth it. It's more the ones that are speeding up passages and what not that I'm down on.
Fil on the example of Britney Spears: "I always found it quite funny in her videos because she would always over enunciate when miming, not when actually singing - and when I said actually singing, that's another debate" 🤣 Thanks for keeping it real, Fil!!
@@poorthing Britney possessed the skills to promote herself effectively, showcase her dancing abilities, and stay in tune. She exuded charisma, demonstrated performing talent, and was a competent dancer. Similar to Madonna, Janet, and Paula, she emerged from the MTV era and the influence of the media machine. However, her singing skills were not particularly strong, and although her dancing was proficient, it often resembled an instructional tape on "How to Dance like Janet."
@@musicfromtheheart100 with 2nd thoughts I'm deleting my comment- but look forward to any future comments or insights you leave on this channel- Fil never disappoints- Happy Holidays
I attended one of their concerts in November of 2023. I was able to match my recording perfectly with the recording you referenced from March 8, 2024. I recorded me playing them simultaneously- one from my phone and the other off my tablet.
A few weeks ago, i heard a 10 year old girl sing a pop song (a friend of my daughter). She has a nice voice, but she tried to imitate that typical Auto Tune sound. I was very surprised to hear her singing like that, it sounded very strange to me! It seems that this sound is normal for these kids. They think that this is how a normal voice has to sound. I think this is very sad☹!
It's like looking at a photo of a top model on a magazine and then learn it had been photoshoped. That showed an ideal beauty that no real person can reach even when they use the product sold by that photo.
60 as of December. I loved the live recordings of the 70s. Allman Brothers Live at Filmore East, Lynyrd Skynyrd One More from the Road, Wings Over America, Frampton Comes Alive. The songs weren't perfect, but their effort is completely authentic.
RIGHT ON!!!! Seemed lkke 70s you couldn't keep up with the true talented. Musicians, the real thing. Pick up instruments and create , sing, write , they did it all👍😍🎶🎸☮️🎼📻
@ItsMeBarnaby I disagree. Saying plenty or even more today is fantasy. How many can pick up instruments together and create. There were far more back then. I see all the time even at this year's grammys. Grammy winners winning by having someone play back tracks,or a turntable no band. It couldn't be done that way before. Sure musicians who were true artists like the Beatles, Beach Boys, Hundreds of others. Guys from broken bands getting together. Like the Eagles. Check the Guinness record book's. See how many still hold records from the 60s. I have collected music since the 60s, still do. But though I see talented musicians out there. Saying there's more now than ever is far overstated. I lived through then and I am now. I've seen many live acts. Including more modern ones. But it's no way better than the past. Half the Grammy nominees can't play an instrument. How is that a musician. They maybe have a craft they practice. Check Ray Charles comments about this before he passed. His words were." I don't know what it is,but it ain't music " And Ray Charles was the real deal.🎹🎶🎸☮️
This is such a touchy topic, as a singer / songwriter trying to navigate the world of social media and content promotion while remaining true to yourself and your art. Pleasing everyone. (And learning that you don’t have to). People really are so conditioned, we have to be really intentional with our vocal editing, depending on what our goals are. I once provided vocals for an EDM producer and was told again and again I have to get the pitch right. I was already singing really well in key and had applied pitch correction knowing how specific they are in that genre. It felt like nothing was good enough, I have no idea what he was hearing! Others I leave 100% raw. It’s good to beable to know where and how to use it, if you must. I really appreciate this video.
For me, its the fact that this is being promoted as her having amazing voice control, is the problem. Its all a big lie, and makes me not want to listen to any of her music. The irony is, if you actually go and listen to her busking videos, where she is singing without pitch correction, her talent shines through, and it sounds way better than the pitch corrected stuff - theres more depth, more nuance, and way more emotion in those videos
@@antsbull3370 for sure. It’s like using edited pictures to promote makeup products knowing full well that’s not how it looks in real life. I do wish more people understood this and appreciated things in their natural state. If we weren’t constantly fed the edited stuff, there would be nothing “artificial” to compare it to.
@@antsbull3370Fil did some video manipulation of his own here ! His set up was using a third party reaction to Allie and their claims about Allie's vocals ! If you check out Allie's video she makes no claims about her vocals but that doesn't push Fil's main claim to fame these days, so to open the door to critique Allie's video he used that third party video. Funny I don't see him critiquing the video that actually made the claim. But come on he got more clicks on this video because he has a big picture of Allie on it, and he mentioned himself that Allie at the time had almost 6 million subscribers, which now she has more, so he knew exactly what he was doing, some video manipulation, ironic isn't it ! 🎤🎸🎶
Can you imagine doing a vocal break-down on all the inconsistencies in pitch control during Janis Joplin's live performance of "Ball & Chain" at Monterey? Can you imagine her going into the studio and correcting everything? Doing that would ruin one of the most iconic live performances ever. I'll take soul, warts and all, over souless anyday.
Or a breakdown of Donna Godchaux's vocals from a 70's Grateful Dead live performance? I'm sure Weir was always giving cues during performances to the sound man to turn down her microphone gain 🙂
agreed. I remember seeing Rod Stewart for the first time with Jeff Beck in 67 or 68 singing Morning Dew. What a sad thing it would be to 'enhance' a performance like that.
If I remember correctly, the first time was so good that they had her do it a second time on sunday so they could film it for the documentary. Meaning it was not a fluke and she could repeat it many times. If I'm thinking of the right doc with flowers something and love banner, great documentary by the way.
@@knh5954 You're correct about the band performing the song twice. I think they refused filming the day before over money, but agreed to play "Ball and Chain" the next day to capture Janis' riviting performance forever. great decision!
And they wonder why us older folks can't stand today's "music". I am from the 60s and 70s days when they needed talent to make it! Great review and glad your calling the fakeness out!
And they are true musicians. Sometimes not great and sometimes brilliant which is why you needed to got to a few gigs. It’s almost like they are human vs the computerised junk that is spewed out!
Just want to say that the singer in this video is not a bad singer. However, producers these days use all of the tools at their disposal, including pitch correction. But just because pitch correction has been used does not imply that the singer can't sing. And what I'm talking about is maybe being a few cents off the pitch - not whole semi-tones or more. All singers a a few cents away - and that's good because you have nuances and a naturalness to the voice. By pitch correcting so the performance is "bang on", you lose that. But like I say, do not necessarily conflate pitch-corrected performance with bad singer.
You have no idea of the insane amount of talent that goes into producing pop music. All music, but specifically pop. Forget about singing it, just try to come up with the melody and lyrics like the song in this video and then we'll see if you think it was made by people with no talent.
@@mtae5 I kind of agree. The people behind the music/production are indeed talented. Even the artists can be talented, even if they're not showing the best of themselves. However, a lot of pop is written within minutes (the basic idea) - and that usually gets embellished by the behind-the-scenes people.
Teen Irish singer Allie Sherlock has been putting up busking videos since she was a preteen. She appeared on Ellen in 2018. She really is a very talented young lady with a great voice. But she's apparently playing the game the way it's played these days.. She's working the mic really close here to make it look like it's live. No worry about popping Ps, she's not really singing! The vocal processing and effects, not to mention pitch correction are the giveaway for me. I agree with you Fil, bring back the days of honest singing!
Yes, she actually has a fantastic and also very unique voice. I find it sad that she thinks she need to autotune some videos, cos she would crush all these songs without them.
Thanks for the breakdown, Fil. At this rate we won’t need people to make music. AI can create the images as well as the music, eliminates all the fuss associated with actual people.
@@brushstroke3733 Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Phil! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I don't think you realise how disrespectful you are being to a large group of people in the music industry. If you don't like it then don't listen, but don't call it trickery or dishonesty. Music is entertainment, not a battle to show who is the most talented or skilled. If all you cared about was skill, you would probably listen to barbershop quartets and acapella but yet, no one does.
Not being disrespectful at all. And if you've taken the time to scroll through almost every post and response here, you'll realize that I"m not the only one who feels this way, and that includes Fil. How is this NOT trickery? Manipulating a performance so that it's different than the artist's actual singing voice? Not sure what else you can call it. I would rather hear a heartfelt, full on performance than an auto tuned mechanical "voice." And by the way, please reread the last sentence you wrote. "If all you cared about was skill, you would probably listen to barbershop quartets and acapella." (Um, Pentatonix, anyone?" You pretty much admitted I'm correct. Both these types of music depend 100% on talent with no outside manipulation. You just made my point. @@thepoofster2251
Fil, you're absolutey correct about the depreciation of one's own voice when you listen to something like this. I think one of the reasons is that one gets so judged on social media, whether it's body shape or voice tone. It has to be perfect or you lose so many "likes" which of course drops your self esteem and ego into the basement. The result will be that ethics and integrity fly out the door and make way for A.I. to take over. It's so sad.
I’m so glad you illustrated pitch Correction, Miming, and pre-recording, in comparison to the true/real voice. This helps me so much identify a pitch correction especially with the letter “L” this is an awesome analysis. Thank you for showing this type of mechanical singing 💕
Rick Beato had an interesting take on pitch correction when he brought his teenage daughter into the studio to listen to a few songs. She PREFERRED the auto-tuned songs much more than the natural vocals. So the kidz have been conditioned to like pitch correction.
And no doubt older people were complaining about analogous trends in music production thirty years ago (synthesizers aren't real instruments, drum machines lack the soul of a real drummer, blah blah blah), or people were complaining about innovations embraced by the likes of the Beatles in the 60s. There is nothing new under the sun, in this sense. It shouldn't be too surprising that a generation raised on particular genres and styles of music learns to appreciate the creative norms of what they're acclimatised to. Quite why you should panic over it I don't know; frankly, what other people listen to and enjoy shouldn't cause you to lose sleep at night.
A Canadian news magazine did a similar test but with orange juice. They gave the kids freshly squeezed orange juice, and then artificially processed and sweetened orange juice. Needless to say, the kids all preferred the processed crap. The market dictates what succeeds financially and therefore gets promoted more. If you've raised kids who've listened to nothing but manipulated audio, this is what you end up with.
@@DavidHughesss Actually no, there were no such complaints really. While the appreciation of their sound wasn't universal, their was an appreciation of taking music in new directions. This isn't doing that.
@@RevStickleback Yes, I'm sure there were no "traditionalists" in those days. Never mind that Dylan got booed for the crime of picking up an electric guitar, or that Schoenberg's use of chromatic scales irked many...
I agree with you 100% and by the way, you have a new subscriber my friend. Awesome channel man! I grew up listening to brand new new music from the late 60's up to last week, but my preference is music from the 1970's. Everything from Pink Floyd to Merle Haggard and anything in-between. With that said, my favorite genre is Classic Rock. I also enjoy playing some bluesy tunes while jamming with my buddies. In my opinion, the greatest music ever written & recorded is from the 70's era. As an avid musician, I noticed that music in general started sounding "strange" to my ear since the late 80's going forward. Obviously, I'm not the only one! Since the invention of Auto-Tune, Pitch Correction, Vocal Enhancer, bla, bla, bla, anyone and I mean ANYONE can appear to be a fantastic singer online. Don't get me wrong, I suppose that it's kinda fun to dabble with it while goofing around with my musician buddies, BUT, when people start making some money by POSING, LYING and PRETENDING to be a "real" singer when in fact, they can barely hold a note, that's where I draw the line! It is deceitful and total bullshit!!! I thoroughly enjoy listening to an "authentic" artists in fact, I specially like hearing the subtle flaws and nuances in their recordings. You don't ever hear that sort of thing anymore. Almost every singer online is an absolute marvel. It's freakin' embarrassing, or at least it should be. I don't know man, but I could never try to sell myself as a better musician than what I actually am. It's called integrity. You might think that I'm just an old fart who never grew out of the '70's but I can assure you that simply isn't true. I enjoy playing tunes from every decade since the 50's, however, my preference is definitely music from the 1970's. In my opinion, music from that era is so, SO much better than most of the disingenuous crap found online today. Back when "REAL" artists composed some "REAL" music that continues to stand the test of time. Back when "REAL" artists actually created some of the most complex music & lyrics to date. Then they had the balls to actually record "their songs" without the help of any bullshit software. Songs that were conceptualized, written, played and actually sung by the artist, not a danm robot! Am I ranting?....lol
I've never seen Fil ever give a negative commentary on any artist. In fact I love his smile when he shows a performer than gives his review about how great they sound. So I take his criticism seriously. Go Fil ...Give us more more!!!
Thank you for your brilliant videos, Fil. You do us a great service. "Why does it matter?" is such a revealing question. A sad reflection on our times. The world wanting to know, why they shouldn't lie ... It is at once sad and frightening. A society that has lost its way.
The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles ! Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to "America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music! .Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night" Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes! NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE. And a few a'capella's ! "I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar." FredGold&LyndaFaye The Illinois Harmony Connection.
Not social media, phony people making a bad use of social media and zillions of uninformed buyers of fake products are destroying art. I concede that it would be not so easy without social media, though. Before the internet the record labels commited lots of cases of unfair treatment and abuse, but at least there was some type of screening and supervision, and the artist had to be real (and earn their prestige by playing live).
@petecanthropus9947 It's the left-wing. The left owns social media. Today's criminally corrupt left-wing democrat party is also the problem. Millions of weak minded sheep vote for these left wing extremists.
I'm 68 and have begun to return to the music i love. You just helped me understand why I can't replicate the music i hear. I'm going back to my roots of the 70's mistakes and all. Seems so human to me.
Ive never let go of 60's and 70's music..and I was born in the 80's...hahaha...I cant listen to modern music...its shallow and soulless...glad youve returned to the good times
I'm the same my friend at 65. I love all the perfect studio albums by Queen but I also love the raw sound of street performers. Our friend Michael Shulman is an amazing violinist. His old electric stuff from early 2010 is his best. Also the amazing street guitarist Damian Salazar who never plays a wrong note in his performances over the last few years. I just love real live music because it shows who really is gifted.
Me too. I,m 71 and living on my own now, to BOOM Radio and BOOM Rock, often the songs of the 1960s and 1970s come on and it is like listening to 'Angels' because the music is so good that I cheer, bounce around, sing along, tap the kitchen surfaces, bang two saucepans together and will sometimes have tears in my eyes of the memories of those times but most of because of how so f****** GOOD our music was.
Fil isn't smiling. When the guy who naturally falls into a smile during his analysis videos puts one up in which he almost never smiles, you know that he's bummed out by what he's seeing. Thanks, Fil, for doing this. Insightful and interesting, as always.
I always appreciated his joy when he is listening to the great singers. Like you, I noticed he was not smiling this time. After watching many of his videos I really appreciate growing up in the 60s when singers had to be good to sound good.
Fil's smile, his absolute joy in the music, is infectious, and probably the main reason I keep watching. He is really upset here, and it makes me sad too.
Just recently discovered your channel and I love it! I am 66 years old, and grew up in a time when as a kid you didn't have a whole lot of money so you had to pick the album you bought very carefully because you knew you were going to listen to it over and over. I have all my albums still such as Bad Finger's No dice, the Beatles complete library, Hendrix Axis Bold as Love, Van Morrison's Astral Weeks, The Righteous Brothers, The Young Rascals, The Temptations. Yes these were artists with true talent who could actually sing, and in some cases play a mean guitar, piano or other instrument. It appears those days are very quickly disappearing.
It's more sad than disgusting. Sad what music has become. A good example of this is Fil's video of Beauty and the Beast with Emma Watson. I found that movie so painful to watch. Even if she was signing poorly or not superbly (like Emma Stone performs in La La Land), it would have sounded miles better than how it sounded. I cannot listen to it.
I do not think the public is being ripped off because I think the public is aware of and accepting of pitch correction, harmonizers, backing tracks, lip synching, etc.
@@billo6938 No, most people have no idea. I mean, they do know that those things exist, but they cannot tell whether they are looking at an enhanced performance or not.
Videos like this are amazing and needed. I think people who are autotuning, while acting like it's their natural voice, should be called out. That kind of crap needs to be discouraged. It makes it very hard to know who the heck can even sing anymore.
Videos like this really help with my confidence. I sing worship at church and of course I am going to sound scratchy some days, miss notes, go flat, and I've really had to learn not to compare myself to people on social media.
We should treasure the natural great voices even more ! The next stage is a virtual voice, a completely manipulated vocal, the guts are being ripped from great vocals, young people are being utterly mislead. The best concerts I've been to have been a group with instruments and amps, that was it and it felt alive !! I'm in my 50s now and it hurts to see what's happening to vocals in particular ☹ Keep up your great vocal and instrument analysis work Fil 👍👍
Glad someone has highlighted this, I often sing and record my vocals. However people dont appreciate the difference between organic vocals and processed vocals. When people hear my recordings they're not sure how to respond because it has flaws in it. They dont understand theres no such thing as perfection these days because the industry doesnt deem great vocals anymore it just needs a marketable face. Ive decided to just focus on an organic sound as that improves my vocal control as im constantly receiving feedback of what my vocal chords are actually doing and also timing understanding to sing on the beat or off beat. I would never get to address my weakness with off beat timing if i just used tech to do it for me as I could slide the trackline as i please. You're right its definitely confusing for the younger generation. The amount of youngsters that think they cant sing because its not pitch perfect is crazy these days and on the flip side we have people trying to convince the world that they are the greatest singer out there masking their insecurities. I dont do filters on my face so I wont start by adding filters over my sound. Lol Great video really enjoyed it. Worth subscribing for sure.
Great job with this break down. Also for those who may not know, live performances can also be auto-tuned on-the-fly with the use of a vocal processor.
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I am sick and tired of hearing perfect voices, I miss all the distinct voices of the 70’s. I like the tone of a persons voice versus how well they sing❕
What are you listening to?
“Diversity”? There is more music in more styles and genres available today…a hundredfold more than at any time in history.
More importantly “how” are you accessing and listening to music?
@@JohnLnyc I think you are missing Brent's point a bit, John. There may be a torrent of product available now but there is little in the way of music that is not forced into a digital 'frame' and that takes away all the flavour and the diversity of form. Think of the likes of David Bowie - couldn't really sing that magnificently but he had a unique tone and style that made him a star. He wouldn't be allowed these days and would have the same bland digitally corrected tone as everyone else.
@@JohnLnyc Back in the days of the dinosaurs, you could instantly recognize a singer's voice because it had its own characteristics, etc. Now, I can't recognize any newer singers. To me, they all sound the same. I was wondering why until Phil explained auto tune.
@@dallassukerkin6878 Hi. I really can’t disagree more. First though, Bowie was an incredibly talented vocalist. He released an album just seven years ago.
I don’t know what “sing that magnificently” is? That’s rather subjective. It can be objective if you reduce “singing” to technical and measurable elements. I think you offer a clue with the use of “star.” The music business has evolved. Maybe this is the issue. There are so many more genres and niches now. It is more fragmented. The Billboard Top ten was more diverse then but was it really? Bowie was nowhere near the “star” Gaga or Swift are today. Each very different and neither heavily auto-tuned (I don’t listen much so…) He was niched into “art rock” and not much liked by the Hard Rock crowd. Remember we are using hind sight with Bowie.
I recall buying a Jeff Beck record based on an album cover and liking that record went to see him live unaware of Ron wood and Rod Stewart other than what they did on stage. See a vastly different time.
Where I am confused is where your conclusions are coming from. That “torrent of product” is far more diverse today than ever.
What do you mean by “digital frame”?
It is all digital now. There are in fact far more record labels now than ever.
Yes most are divvied up between three major entities. Most every mixer, producer, engineer and yes, artist will tell you digital has been a boon to the business of recording.
Current artists, The Warning, have self produced three records got a deal with Lava and released one record and have another coming out. They got to the deal via a You Tube video. They are not “tuned” and have a big say in their sound. David Bendeth produced their first Lava effort. Fil has done two whole segments on them. Will they become “stars”?
I don’t care for them taste-wise, but label mates Greta Van Fleet aren’t using auto tune to my ears. They quite “big.”
I am guessing hindsight is really causing the issue. Are You are looking at “stars” from the past and “stars” today?
If so, doesn’t really work. Let me know.
No kidding. Can you imagine Willie Nelson's voice being manipulated like this?
I love when she sings "I'm never ever gonna fake it." Priceless!
Ouch!
The sad thing is, as a group, the kids today don't understand that cheating is wrong. Not all kids, I am talking about the herd; This lady really believes she is producing the sound. I say unplug her and let's hear it.
@@Mrrich3 Listen to her live busking performances, she streams live quite regularly and then you can hear it. You can't beat a true live performance, warts and all but studio trickery is here to stay no matter what any of us think. C'est la vie
IKR😂🤣
@@Mrrich3 actually, i think I disagree pretty strongly with this sentiment. Given the incredible heat Ms. Courtney Hadwin got when her AGT audition went viral in 2018 and she was accused by some of 'cheating' because she'd competed in other competitions before being invited onto AGT's stage, I think there's a CONSIDERABLE number of youngsters who KNOW that cheating is WRONG. Unfortunately, in that case, they heaped their ire upon someone who wasn't deserving of it. Which might also be a danger here, come to think of it.
Keep educating people, Fil! It is a battle worth fighting.
Let's fight it! I'm an instrumental performer, but this nonsense affects all of us!
Definitely, they are becoming pitch death, definitely can’t sing live. I have just subscribed. ❤
It was a great exposé video. Keep them coming Pegasus guy.
@KPC58how do you know?
@@kerrythomas6220 what’s that old saying “ Proof is in the pudding “ ! Yes this video that Fil introduced with that third part reaction from Music Bible is a production video one of the very few Allie has done ! Where that proof is, check out Allie’s TH-cam channel over 1300 videos the vast majority live on the street performances ! Allie and her amazing busking friends , not up on a stage or hiding out in a studio, but live one take videos on the street in front of her many, many fans ! 🎤🎸🎼
Glad you’re calling this crap out👍
I love how you called Bullshit!!!! Excellent De-construction. BUSTED!!!!! Well done Fil. Fake music and the uneducated masses just eating it all up. Actually makes me mad and sad at the same time.The artificiality of some Pop music is boring as hell and insulting to true musicians and astute fans too.
Amen
Within 5 seconds I knew it was auto-tune. I really think people are just uneducated to notice auto-tune and lip sync.
Sad and mad at the same time should have its own word 🤔
@@matt.willoughby smad?
Just wait until these phony "performers" figure it out and start using AI or algorithmic pitch correction so it's actually less obvious. Ever see one of those toy keyboards for kids where it will play the right note no matter what key they push? That is 100% the future of the music industry. Will have a producer and engineer produce a "live" version of a track for artists that mimic an actual live performance and a computer will just pitch correct in real time to match the formula they want. Just step to the mic, make some noise, and let the computers do the rest. For decades now, the "look" of a performance (and performer) has been more important than the music. Now, technology is catching up to cover for it.
Seems deception has become a part of our everyday lexicon. I love the irony of the words she's singing: "Honesty and promise me I'm never gonna find you faking". Cue the laugh track.
More like deception is the norm on social media. Images are airbrushed and edited. Stories are staged. Music and vocals are heavily doctored and edited despite being presented as though they're raw. It's all about maintaining this false sense of perfection, this veil that your life is perfect and you're so amazing and happy. "Everybody look at me and what I'm doing, feel bad for me when I want to be a victim, be jealous of me when I'm traveling the world and posting pictures about everything I'm doing". It's one of the main reasons I avoid social media like the plague it is. It's sickeningly fake and self-centered.
Your trying' to be cool, you look like a fool to me--
But even Avril Lavigne the "original singer" was selected through auditions, and the song handed to her by producers at the songwriting company the Matrix. Its not like it because Billboard #1 organically either. And that why 20 years after this song came out to target my generation, I don't listen to it, I listen to Fleetwood Mac.
@@cannaroe1213If they came along after 1995, they may very well just be an industry plant
@@jasondorsey7110 They've been planting people since the Beatles. I think the Monkees were the other side of the test. Like have two very similar groups but make one wholesome and the other dark and degenerate, then see which gets more popular. Clearly the Beatles did and that could explain why plants are usually degenerates, rather than wholesome. They figured out which sells better
Deception has been a part of lexicon since the word was invented.
Music isn’t about perfection, it’s about emotion ❤ Great share 👍
There's no place for those things in modern music. It's mostly all dogshit now.
What?? A toddler can beat on pots and pans with emotion. Music is about playing the right note at the right time....Fil, outstanding analysis!.
And art as well.
Beautiful Comment, and so TRUE, from a fellow professional musician!
I wonder what kind of emotion this music conveys 😒
The technology to accurately record popular music has never been better, the calibre of the music never worse.
Before was great music cuz people tried to do the best with few resources, THE CREATIVITY TO WRITE LYRICS, COMPOSE THE PARTITURE AND RECORD WERE OVER THE EDGE. Today to much tech is turning people lazy and lack of creativity. Just like Herbert wrote in Dune's intro.
Can you imagine Janis Joplin's vocals corrected? Thankfully, we got to hear her real voice, raw and unmolested. I'll take authenticity over perfection any day of the week.
Bang on, there is a clip around that actually has Janie's voice
"pitch corrected", I flat out refuse to look at it. Abomination I think..
I was thinking the same thing, I'll take Janis Joplins raw imperfect talent against this clinical rubbish any day.
Here's the thing though if Janis Joplin or any pre-90's vocalist was singing today, their management team or record label would probably insist on using pitch correction because it's a tool to enhance the product. Who would have said Lewis Capaldi needed pitch correction but it's on a lot of his live performances, literally everybody uses it although not to this extent which sounds horrific.
Or Sarah Vaughn. Or Beverly Sills.
Yeeeaaaassss!!!!!
Thank you for analyzing and giving us the truth. We appreciate your authenticity.
Shame on people like Allie who don't need to cheat but choose to cheat
Yes, reminds me of Lennon's song [with his real voice lol] Gimmie Some Truth
@@RAFchurchlawford4469 I pity her that her community apparently pushes for such immoral behaviour.
Ahhh, seek the truth and it will set you free ! The truth, you will find is on Allie Sherlock’s TH-cam Channel ! 🎤🎸🎼
I tried to talk to a music producer about the evils of pitch correction once. He produced stage shows but also did some studio work. His opinion was “if you CAN make it perfect with software, why not go ahead and do that, cause perfect is better than good.” I told him that humans don’t actually like perfection as much as they think they do because we can’t actually relate to perfection. We connect the most with flawed, broken characters and imperfect art because we see ourselves in that brokenness. Unfortunately he wasn’t looking for any kind of philosophical discussion, he just cared that clients paid him to make it sound as good as possible. And we all know that clients are born and raised on marketing driven advertising-fueled pipe dreams. They think they want it pitch corrected. They think they like that sound. They think all they need is a new microphone to make it big.
Point them towards the definition of the Uncanny valley. Let them learn themselves.
To me it sounds like a robot singing. Totally unrelatable.
Money talks...
It's not "perfect" anyway, it's just precise. Perfect music is entirely subjective; precise music is objectively a thing but (usually) subjectively sucks.
@@Ithirahad Additionally, there's variance between pitches as you go higher in pitch...at least on a piano. Well, on a real piano. "Perfect" may indeed hit the target pitch up around C7 or C8, but it may actually not sound right.
This is just the most refreshing video and channel to have stumbled across. Not enough is said about the high levels of manipulation in today’s videos of singers online, who portray their performances and vocals as “raw” and real… when they are not. Thank you for bringing this to light.
I keep hearing Rick Beato in my head saying... "Before ProTools there were Pros".
Amen! But also there's the disturbing aspect that this seems, to me at least, to be yet another form of dangerous abuse of teens and other young singers. Firstly, they're being taught to LIE as a normal part of their life. Secondly, it damages their self-image and undermines their self-worth, both when it's done to their own voice, and when it's done to most everyone to whom they listen. This is both immoral and child abuse, IMHO. IT MATTERS!!
@@givingin2G4Courtz That's why God gave them "parents."
There are still a few with great intonation though; The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague un-reasonable facsimiles !
Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
Actually, @@lyndafaye6748 I think that's a bit 'flip' of an answer. Yes, good parents do their best to protect their children, but that doesn't mean they CAN always succeed. NOR DOES IT REMOVE ANY RESPONSIBILITY FROM THE COMMUNITY, THE SOCIETY, TO _ALSO_ PROTECT THOSE YOUNGSTERS. In fact, to ensure that those parents are not themselves abusing those children. There is PLENTY of RESPONSIBILITY to go around to all of us.
There still are, but you have to look for them, rather than them just being there in front of you.
Even the pros use these tools these days. Even the best drummers in the world are quantised. Even the best singers in the world get pitch 'corrected'. Even my latest album had both done despite my protests because "Look, if you don't, the audience wont like it." Unless you're writing, recording, producing and performing all on your own, you don't get a say in it unfortunately.
I've walked passed Ali busking several times. She's genuinely really talented. She doesn't need this. And I'd say that something is lost when it is "perfected" artificially. It's the imperfections and the authenticness that makes a performance.
Walked past.
@@williamwilson6499 She busks on Grafton Street. A lot of people walk past her.
@@bingobriano6021 A lot of people also stop to listen (including me most weekends). Most of the videos on her TH-cam channel are one-take unedited busking videos, and some have "mistakes" although any that have big bloopers don't get posted. I tend not to listen to her other videos as they didn't sound right - and now I know why! 😊😊
@@bingobriano6021 That wasn't a diss, it was just grammar correction ('past', not 'passed').
@@JacoWium 😅I'm dyslexic, I punch above my weight normally... but that one will always get me as "passed" seems like the past tense of "pass"... I realise you are correct, but now that I'm thinking about it, I feel I SHOULD be right LOL I mean I just used the word "past" with a totally different meaning!
I am familiar with Allie"s work. When the clip started I thought it looked like Allie but did not sound like Allie. She has a unique voice that does not need "fixing"'. You are indeed a light in the dark tunnel of technology! Thanks for what you do.
Ahhhh, yes you recognized Allie ! I think a bunch more folks also did ! Did you notice this video is still climbing Fil’s most viewed videos ! I believe we may have had a bit of video manipulation going on, kind of ironic isn’t it ! 🎤🎸🎼
This channel needs 6M subscribers
I have a good friend who is a vocal instructor. I sent this video to her with a note to show this to her students who may feel discouraged after seeing these singers on IG and YT.
I find myself listening to music pre1995 more and more. I like lyrics and melody....not much of that nowadays
And this is why I still listen to my 70’s music. Just can’t do it!
@@donnatregaro7375 just don't buy any remasters, they even pitch correct Freddie Mercury now.
Mansplaining at its best.
@@Qyngali omg I can't believe I never thought of that being a possibility of a remaster, but holy smokes that is blasphemous if you ask me!! Yup. Gonna stick to original masters as much as possible at this point. Sheesh.
Patronize live musicians. The real musicians out there deserve your support.
They can use pitch correction live as well, or the full autotune. Even Art Garfunkel does it.
@@krollpeter Pretty sure the small to medium venue acts I like to see don't: Pat Metheny, Ray LaMontagne, Richard Thompson, Buddy Guy, etc. Besides, it's not about pitch correction per se. I guess I wouldn't really mind if Art Garfunkel used pitch correction to help him reach the notes - the guy is in his 80's. It would still be an authentic performance. I want to see real musicians on stage interacting with each other, playing different notes than the studio version, and with a real drummer and bass player - not someone singing to a soulless electronic rhythm track.
@@61hink the guy is a heavy smoker, or was, and that spoiled his voice long ago.
You would possibly be surprised about what is not really live anymore. But of course I understand what you are saying and that I agree.
Pitch corrections makes everyone sound the same . We are on the road to AI replacing all vocalists and song writers anyway , future is quite bleak unfortunately
She does have a great voice and you can hear it live when she busks but i feel she also takes out most of her inflection when she records. She winds up with no personality/ emotion in the song and autotune exacerbates that
Spot on. This is the the vocalist equivalent of air-brushing models to perfection, photo-shopping nature into unnatural colors and scenes, AI manipulation, etc. "Adding chemicals" to vocals was a phrase I heard often in recording studios many years ago, but the imperfections were not erased. I appreciate the imperfections and other nuances that make a vocalist/musician unique. It makes them human.
So thankful to see you bring this important subject to attention.
I thought of that too.
It is also like covering your gunt with a pillow.
get used to it. it’s not going anywhere. My friend just lost his job as a graphic designer because the company is doing all their art 100% AI
As impossibly difficult as it is to be that accurate on pitch... Almost impossible to sing well with that compressed posture..
The problem of agents, producers and putting a team around her. On the street, the girl can sing and has plenty of quirkiness to her voice to capture peoples attention.
Yes! Keep doing these videos. Humanity's soul is literally at stake. Thank you!
I'll listen to Linda Ronstadt, Joni Mitchell, Steve Perry, John Denver and Simon and Garfunkle. Their imperfections made them great! Pure talent 🎶
Let's give Steve Walsh of Kansas some love too. In his prime he was untouchable.
@@robinvegas4367 and add about 90% of the 70's singers, some of them like the Wilson sisters from Heart and Jon Anderson in advanced ages with still impressive voices. One more reason why I don't listen to any modern music.
Agree. Linda is one of my favorite, what a voice.
@KPC58how do you know?
@@kerrythomas6220 because she does’t take an audio sound room down to the street to perform ! It’s her voice, guitar,amp, and mic, you know like everyone has been hootin and hollering about in all the comments ! This young lady is one of the very few that still does it OLD SCHOOL LIVE, the vast majority of the time ! But don’t take my word go to her channel and be AMAZED out what you will find ! 🎤🎸🎼
Thank you for this breakdown. My wife calls me a music snob because I literally can’t listen to a song with heavy auto tune. Of course then I have to complain about it and that does me no good. I was so disappointed when I heard the new Rolling Stones song. I’m generally disappointed with all music coming out now and I think you really nailed the point. What are we suppose to praise?What the hell are we suppose to be impressed by? The software is so good that literally anyone, and it’s been proven by Taylor Swift, can sing a song in pitch. But pitch is not everything. I want to hear the damn mistakes because that’s where the real emotion is. Humans make mistakes and that’s what makes the performance real. I feel sorry for kids these days because we’re teaching them that they have to be perfect. I also feel that audio engineers should get to walk out on stage with the performers when they accept their GRAMMYs. Their names should in be subtext after the artist’s name on the label. There I go. See it does me no good. Thanks again!
💯
👍🏼
you are just supposed to conform and ask no questions
It’s not a song if auto-tune (which is basically AI) is involved.
I really love your videos and proving that some singers such as Roy Orbison didn't need autotune or anything else. Great analysis.
have you seen the glen campbell ones? love those.
Old Roy, when U2 went into the studio with him, practice run, Bono said he barely could be heard, then the tape rolled, like a different person, mercy.
I don't think ally needs it but I guess who ever makes her videos likes to play with software 😊
Roy Orbison was great and one of a kind that's for sure. Nothing fake about his voice and there will never be another one like it.
@@infinitejest.4994Wichita Lineman is my absolute favorite!
You said what I was thinking, they’ll develop the software to incorporate ‘natural’ variations and then we’ll never be able to tell what’s real and what’s not.
So then it won't matter.
Yep. This is how they'll officially kill music. They've shot it already and it's bleeding but this'll be the putting it out of it's misery. Always what happens when you get technocrats and business"men" involved in anything. They kill the soul with their sterile greed
Also it's kind of ironic she's singing a song about how faking and being dishonest sucks! Wonder if that irony was lost on her!
@@tjitjo I know right! 👍
I doubt it. They are too dumb to think of that and most everyone listening wouldn’t be able to tell the difference anyway.
It’s obvious that track was pitch corrected to me from my years of hearing natural true vocal recordings from the 1950’s 60’s 70’s . Young music listeners these days aren’t accustomed to hearing natural singers. All they hear is manufactured, manipulated recordings. Anyone that grew up listening to music in the golden decades should feel fortunate.
“Ain’t nobody got time for that “!
Technology is cool. Working to achieve a goal is uncool.
I literally jumped back in my chair when the audio first came on. It's awful. But like you, I grew up in the 1960s and 70s. I had a record player, but also heard a lot of live music, because we did it, around campfires, at parties, or just to amuse ourselves.
@@kathykrisko3228I agree. It sounds awful. Her voice is also very nasalized.
I like to think, young people with a genuine love of music will grow to see through the manufactured pap and and learn to appreciate real skill and talent. Similar to the way I've abandoned a lot of the bland, empty hits of my youth to now appreciate a broad swath of talent. Their loss if they don't, I guess...
As soon as I hear the autotune pitch correction I am out.
Completely agree with you Fil. When I listen to pitch corrected singers, I hear Woody Woodpecker rather than a human singer. On top of that, because the math in the correction algorithms struggle to correct time-domain signals in the frequency-domain, I can often hear some nasty artifacts that make the pitch transitions sound hollow (like they're being sung in a closet). I would much rather hear honest singing complete with the small imperfections and nuances that are an inseparable part of us being emotional humans and not perfect robots.
👏👏👏
Thank you so much for staying the obvious. I have acute hearing and can hear the obvious fakery. No thank you. I loved going to hear my favorite band 6X with nary any tricks. Hearing the little real time mistakes makes me appreciate the effort they're putting into each live concerts. The voice in the video sound simply robotic and I can hear each pitch correction. It makes me cringe!
Patsy Cline must be turning over in her grave.
I'll be honest...in performances without instruments, a capella or at least with very tuned down instruments...i can detect autotune. But within a song with beat and louder instruments...it kind of vanishes behind the other "noises". If it is not applied very heavy..I can honestly not hear it
I appreciate your video very much. I am a choir director working with 13-18 year old students everyday. I have been teaching music privately or publicly for about 38 years and have witnessed the decline in confidence students have with their own voice as they compare themselves to what they see/hear on media. Not only do I hear it from students, but adults as well. This video may open their eyes a bit. Thank you for posting this!
I love that you are bringing attention to this. Particularly the part about it being discouraging and setting an unrealistic bar of perfection.
a very weird definition of "perfection" to be honest
Being a music laymen I found this interesting as I was not aware how prevalent pitch correction and auto tune is. Makes me appreciate singers of my 80'S era that much more.
Right on!!!!!
They still had tricks in the 80's! Comping together multiple takes was common. Using chorus and delay effects to smooth out a bit of the pitch fluctuations was also common. Then they had burying the lead vocal in lots of backing vox from strong singers. And....Milli Vanilli!
It will depend on the vocalist. The original intention with Pitch correction was to save the vocalist voice and to avoid vocal nodes (Nodules on the voice box) The 2nd use in a live performance context is to again prevent injury to the Voice box, especially if a number of encores are the norm for the vocalist. My Mother was a Jazz vocalist in the 50's and her coach told her no talking an hour before her warm-ups and no talking 2 hours after the performance. I follow the same regiment. I am an Electronic Music Producer using Ableton Live 11.3.4 (Last stable release) and Reaper for Live recording, BitWig Studio 5 for Sound design. I did a Cert III in live sound production and used Logic Pro X and used Comping for an assessment for a Podcast and had to manually Pitch correct where possible. Personally I prefer Ableton and I am more familiar with EQ8 and Convolution Reverb, Glue Compressor and Valhalla super massive . I run all my mixes through a Spectrum analyser as my hearing is different to what it used to be.
It's prevalent alright, every song you hear on and off the radio uses Auto-Tune (pitch correction) in some form or another. From the very subtle to the abusive uses in Rap and R&B. This is why when artist are seen live, people say they suck cause they sound nothing like the record.
🙄I can't wait for Auto-Tune to be frowned upon so engineers can go back to using it the way it was intended.
Tricks are one thing, complete fraud is another.
All my life I have searched for new music. I have liked many generations of music. But now, with the protools and autotune, pitch correction, compression, reverb, and so on. I will stick with CDs of music mostly made before the turn of the century.
Agreed. Admittedly, I'm a Gen Xer, but I'm so uninspired by the current generation's music. The pop scene is just a total disaster of lameness. Even the alternative rock scene was a lot better just 10 years ago. These days I can barely tell alt rock apart from hip-hop. I understand it's been difficult for newer generation of musicians to move music culture forward like the entertainers us Gen Xers grew up with in the 80s, but jeez, at least make an attempt to be unique ... and maybe they should throw a little fun in while they're at it and stop taking themselves way to seriously. Sorry, I just had to vent.
Ditto. Still love the Strokes, Spoon, BRMC, Matt Pond PA, Teddy Thompson. From this century.
Reverb is as old as singing in the cave.
Completely agree with you Fil. When I listen to pitch corrected singers, I hear Woody Woodpecker rather than a human singer. On top of that, because the math in the correction algorithms struggle to correct time-domain signals in the frequency-domain, I can often hear some nasty artifacts that make the pitch transitions sound hollow (like they're being sung in a closet). I would much rather hear honest singing complete with the small imperfections and nuances that are an inseparable part of us being emotional humans and not perfect robots.
@@lonesomecowpoke4140 And sounds just as old.
Please Fil, keep exposing the fakes and frauds while these individuals try to pass the song off as authentic.
You're right, most people would not know that this performance has been heavily processed. Music? No!
Thank you and please continue keeping them honest. Very educational and informative.
We need the disclaimer! That will help maintain integrity. And the filter analogy is spot on as well.
It is very sad when talent is hidden behind machines. Thank you for sharing.
The irony of the actual original song LYRICS here 😂. “Honestly, promise me never gonna find you FAKING…it’s all been done before…”etc etc.
Bang-on analysis & reveals. Thank you so very much!
Live shows, real voices, and one-off performances are all I want to hear. So much of today’s popular music is just junk. Period!
.Merry Christmas Phil! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
See loads of reaction channels reacting to the likes of Phil Collins, Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Queen, Eva Cassidy, and so on, all performing live, and they're blown away, like OMG this is live... well, that's what good music and talent looked like before technology and talent tv shows ruined it for the newer generations.
Live shows have no guarantee you are hearing an actual performance. Major artists have been lip syncing and air-playing over prerecorded tracks for so long audiences seem not to care anymore
@@kenjohnston1257, I’m sure you are correct, but I certainly hope the small venues where I’ve seen some well known stars play and sing have been the real thing.
@@1DesertPirate Good point I assume they keep it real in small venues
Maybe it's my age, but pitch correction has like an electronic sound to me.
You really are a genius! Truly skilled.
I saw a video when the computer produced the voice, no real singer.
Just my opinion but if he was truly skilled, his reputation would be about performing not critiquing ! There's that old saying " Those who can't do, teach & and critique !
🎤🎸🎶
@@harryfreeman8467 my Father was an amazing jazz drummer.
He wasn't famous, He went up to Ronnie Scott's in London to Jam, often and played with many well known musicians.
He was asked to play at the Queen's birthday many years ago, also to do a jazz cruise for a well known artist, he declined.
That does not mean he was not a good musician.
Not all famous artists are actually any good.
I think you are confusing skill and talent with fame.
However you are entitled to your opinion.
Computer technology may well be the death of true talent.
Yeah it's so easy to spot, I don't understand why so many people can't recognize what auto-tune sounds like.
No. If you have good ears, you can always tell too much pitch correction. It sounds canned.
@@1960ARC I think you missed my point. You don't have to be famous to be a talented or gifted musician and sounds like your Dad was very talented. My critique of Fil, he is not hanging his hat on his talent as a musician or performer, his claim to fame is critiquing other artists about auto tune and pitch correction ! He's calling out individual artists and in the case of Allie, making it sound like she is cheating and you don't have to take my word check the comments saying she should be ashamed of herself ! Fil is calling out the artists, when he should be calling out the root of the problem and that is the record labels and the recording industry ! Anything a label puts out, unless they actually do a live release, which those are few and far between is always tweaked ! Mix and mastered , certain parts of a performance both vocals and instrumentals pumped up in spots to grab the audience ! What really agitated me, is Allie is the poster child for what Fil wants, the true talent of the artist ! Yes Allie put out a few production videos, but if you take the time to check her out on all the social media platforms, the vast, vast, vast majority are live street performances in front of an audience, one and done, no chances to tweak it or fix it, the True talent of an artist, and I thought that was what Fil was looking for ! 🎤🎸🎶
I don’t sing, but I always feel smarter after watching your videos Fil. Another great analysis.
To be a pop singer these days you don't have to be a singer - just have to be able to act and dress like a singer. Music is losing it's magic.. it's heart.
Dress and act like a stripper is more like it.
That's not entirely true. If you've ever heard any of the pop stars' raw voices, the vast majority of them have good voices, and can still sing well. Maybe not amazing, but competent. It's not like singing is something 1 in a million people can do. A lot of people can naturally sing. So, when someone is going to get money put behind them, they are going to pick people who can at least sing.
These days people listen to music with their eyes!
1973 Brady Bunch episode - Johnny Bravo "Fit the suit" - that was 50 years ago.
it's still fake if they pitch correct it or autotune.....@@trekkiejunk
This is outrageous. I grew up in the 1970's and Karen Carpenter was my mentor. I celebrate her birthday every March 2. Now she could sing. I'd play the radio harmonizing thirds, fifths, and every other chord progression I could dream up. My mother had me playing piano at 5 years old. I know I sound like an old bag, but I'm 63 years old and just returned from Carnegie Hall singing Vivaldi's Gloria SSAA version. The only regret I have is I didn't practice my piano enough. I have an agent at Carnegie and can go sing there whenever ever I want. Thanks again Fil for pointing out these imposters.
Karen Carpenter is unmatched.
Karen was an instrumentalist also, with great intonation as her backup.
The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles !
Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I absolutely love Karen Carpenter's voice and singing. However, she wouldn't have been totally spot on. And that's the point. By pitch correcting you lose all the nuances and the naturalness in the voice. Of course, when I say she wouldn't have been totally spot on, I by no means mean she was a bad singer - far from it.
karen is the best female singer,end of.
The danger in piling ire on the subject of the video is that Fil points out repeated that she can sing. I bet these videos earn her more than busking does but busking is showing her true self. The sadness is that the music industry took us to this place.
You're the only person who remains grounded to reality, thanks for that. I see a lot of apologists for pitch correction even saying some singers SHOULD be using pitch correction live because it's still their voices and none would care. Yes we do care, we still want to hear people who actually took their time to develop good intonation.
Here's the bottom line, fellow musicians: The more we consent to the use of pitch-faking and all the other inauthentic gimmickry, the more we train listeners' ears to neither recognize nor appreciate the real, and turn ourselves into just so much training material for AI. Keep up the fight, Fil, and know we are with you!
It seems to go along with a striving for perfection as beauty that we see in the over-perfection of grooming and makeup, video filters, as well as AI generated images. However, perfection does not make you memorable or great. The perfect example of vocal imperfection in a legend is Woody Guthrie. He was a poet and undeniably *real*. He was always self-effacing and never sang a song the same way twice. Despite his obvious imperfections, he influenced so many artists including Pete Seeger, Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen, Johnny Cash, Joan Baez, Phil Ochs, Tom Paxton, Ani DiFranco and Billy Bragg.
@@stevenvarner9806 I truly believe it is a form of abuse, just like body shaming. It's WRONG to do this to kids self-confidence, both to pitch-correct their own voices and to help them believe that perfect voices are NORMAL and they just don't measure up. We have no RIGHT to do this to people! It is immoral. It teaches deceit as a 'normal' behaviour.
But how can we define "inauthentic gimmickry"? Wa-wa pedals were considered that originally, but I'm sure glad it didn't bother Jimi Hendrix and he picked one up!
To me all that matters with music, is how it sounds. And overly pitch corrected, or overly produced music just sounds bad to me, stiff and unnatural.
@@123jkjk123 , I think you've partly answered your own question. A musician must still interact with a wah-wah pedal; there's still a performative element. It could be argued that the sense of music becoming "stiff and unnatural" comes when instead of augmenting what the musician does, an effect essentially overrules the performance. Of course there's no strict dividing line, but overall, I want to experience an artist's choices.
Wonder what happened to "ear training" and "Intonation?"
There are still a few with great intonation though; The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague un-reasonable facsimiles !
Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I can’t thank you enough for bringing these TH-cam singers down to earth. What happened since the great singers of the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s. It seems to me that with all this electronic voice correction, it’s impossible to determine a quality vocalist. I’ve listened to Lara Fabian, Barbara Streisand, Celine Dione and they are in a class by themselves. Love your channel.
Fabian? Why not Ricky Nelson? 😅
'TH-cam singers'? This girl made her way busking on the streets of Ireland. Look up her videos. This video is an extremely weird example for that reason. She's clearly a very good singer. Pitch correction is used for basically every pop singer ever.
@@KiwiCrisis yes Fil should be praising Allie for being one of the very few TH-cam artist that the vast majority of her content are LIVE one take street performances ! The true talent of the artist, I thought that’s what he was looking for ! Hey gave Fil a challenge to find me another TH-camr that has posted more LIVE performances than Allie, still waiting to hear who he has come up with ! 🎤🎸🎼
I am almost 70 so I have heard the very best. I love music and vocals, but I reached a point where it all irritated my ears. I just assumed that I was getting grumpy, like every old person is supposed to, about young peoples music. I then discovered International music, and what an eye (and ear) opener. There is soooo much real talent out there.... Dimash being my favorite 🥰. Your videos have shown me why I always feel like my ears are bleeding when I hear the new hits on the radio. Thanks for the enlightenment and reassurance.... I'm not a grumpy, crazy, old cat lady 😆 (no cats at all)
To me they’re all starting to sound alike!
but he says Dimash autotunes too. So there you go. Dimash must be a fraud too. I don't believe it, as true to being pitch perfect as anyone could be he is. No one is perfect all the time. Frankly I think Fil is ruining music/singing for everyone who listens to these videos. I was interested in the beginning but had to unsubscribe because it was just ruining all of it for me. I am not talking about really horrid singers but I want to just enjoy music and not have it taken apart note by note. Enough.
Listnen too Angelina jordan.If you dont
I don’t bother listening to modern music any more.
@@californiahiker9616 They're called " a show" now, not "singers."
The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles !
Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
THANK YOU for exposing these ridiculous videos.
My issue with this audio manipulation is that in art it can be the imperfections that ultimately make something beautiful. Really appreciate your work!
And one of the best examples of that is Monsters by James Blunt
Amen.
Like the crackles playing a Vinyl record
As an audio engineer for 30 years it’s possible to hear the artifacts in pitch corrected vocals. It’s hard to explain but when you hear it on almost all mainstream music you know what to listen to. I have so many artist that ask me to pitch correct their vocals and I refuse to offer that. I will never use those tools. Either you can sing or you can’t. And good luck with doing it live.
Good on ya. I don't use it either. Pitch correction on every singer no matter what is going to date so horribly.
You can use pitch correction live lol what kind of audio engineer won’t use pitch correction? Do you you nudge any instrument notes closer to the grid to keep things in time when editing music? What’s the difference ?
@@waves5114 - I actually have Autotune in a box, yep. I think it runs on 9 volts and can be added to a vocalist's audio chain. I bought it on a lark and I've never plugged it in. One of these days, I'll mess around to see if I can use it to open a portal to the underworld and summon some warriors. Eventually, we're going to need an army to fight the zombies. I hope the warriors don't eat humans, though; that would be unfortunate.
It's the same reason most engineers worth their salt won't waste endless hours tracking a performer who can't play their parts. When a rock band shows up and the guitarist can't play through their solo after dozens of takes, they're being sent home to practice on their own time. It's common sense that even the greatest vocalists out there still have their bad days performing live from time to time, so it boggles the mind why modern artists are setting the bar for their capabilities at the level of artificial perfection with constant pitch correction. The studio is for capturing the best possible performance and polishing it for the last few percentage points towards perfection. Recording is not meant to be for falsifying digital perfection and making yourself look like a knob when performing in front of a crowd. Last I knew, Milli Vanilli was a huge controversy and the laughing stock of the music world...
@@waves5114 The difference is that people want to see someone actually perform, not lip-sync or rely on auto-tune because they can't match pitch (this is not a criticism of usage of autotune as an FX chain tool). It's one thing to use some minor pitch correction on a studio performance for an album or to edit the spacing of some notes in a performance to tighten it to the grid. It's another to use HEAVY post-processing to correct poor performances and make the performer appear to be more consistent and talented than they are (especially in a live context!). The former is comparable to adding a layer of polish to a great performance whereas the latter is putting makeup on a hog. It's all about artistic integrity. The most impressive musicians and performers of the world are impressive because they are just as good as they present themselves to be. Their live performances are consistent with their album recordings, rather than being a facade held up by safety nets like Autotune.
I'm glad someone is out here exposing the lies of pitch-corrected vocals. You're becoming one of my favorite TH-camrs.
Amen to this! And that's why I'll stick with older music. My John Denver and Karen Carpenter forever and ever!❤
Kris Kristofferson, Billy Joel, Bread, Neil Diamond, Beatles, Chris Rea, Barbara Streisand...
… and Angelina Jordan
Leonard Cohen
…Van Morrison❤
Robin Gibb
For a number of years I thought that many modern singers sounded like "robots" but wasn't sure what was going on until I started viewing Wings of Pegasus and learned about pitch correction. Keep up the great work.
I think auto-tune and pitch correction is the equivalent of loading up a hand-painted oil painting on the computer. There you apply photoshop and add effects that's impossible to produce with a manual brush. Then you print it out and set it in frame from the 18th century. That's what autotune is to me.
Nice analogy..
Every cover of every magazine. Same thing. Models don't look like that...
EXACTLY…. and autotuning artists like The Eagles is like painting over a Monet or Van Gough. I’ve said that under previous TH-cam posts.
Except.... Autotune is physically uncomfortable to me. It shreds my nerves. If I don't like a computer generated painting I feel no discomfort; I just don't like it
Auto tune is fake and it sounds fake. Not because the pitch is corrected but because there is a literal "jitter" in the vocal voicing when listening to it. That to me is the most annoying thing about pitch correction software is that tell tale micro-jitter in the voice. THAT is not a natural sound.
Millie Vanilli were definitely ahead of their time. Now all you need is the right look, the ability to come across as “relatable” and the masses will make you rich to pretend.
But they actually could sing! The other one died but Fab Morvan performs live with a band and sing great.
They could have been successful had they done the voice training it takes to be a good singer. But they were great while they were fooling us.
Memory lane, M.T.V. made them a hit I believe.
That is a different story: Rob and Fab did NOT sing on the records, they were in it for the picture. In the end they could sing but they had very different voices. The whole story then was that Milli Vanilli was a fraud. Even on live performances where they were supposed to sing with a backing track, they were actually playbacking.
Later on we got to see the Real Milli Vanilli, which was a band with one singer and a girl singing too. But by then the audience was not listening anymore.
I remember when the got caught they said they could sing, and it didn't go well @@ericodijk
I've heard her youtube vids before and I've always felt there was something off with her live performances verses her "studio" ones like this. Whenever I commented as such, I was eviscerated by her followers that I was just being a hater. Fil, thank you for your analysis. I feel somewhat vindicated in my own mind anyway. I knew there was something going on!
Within 5 seconds of listening to this recording, it was obvious pitch correction was used. The majority of her fans are pervy old men and will white knight defend her to death. Her live performances aren't anything special either. We all know why she's popular.
People would rather lie than face the truth these days, her voice is off when she's busking as well as in this video because it is fake as, she'd be better off just using her own honest voice & drop the stupid software because she sounds like AI & not a human at all!
- She's better off to stay in her own lane -busking on the streets!
We live in a time of lies and deceptions…. At every levels… Music is just a collateral victim.
I have a LOT of appreciation for theatre singers in live musicals...they're the real talent...
LIVE is BEST. Nobody can mess with it!
YES!
The Best !
@@barbaramilone2800 Pitch correction can be and is used on live vocals.
In all fairness, Allie has a lot of talent. Just watch her live busking videos.
I do not understand why she thinks she needs autotune in some videos because she clearly doesn’t.
I'm afraid my opinion of what's been going on in the music industry since 1997 isn't fit for print...
People have a right to know, so THANK YOU for exposing the sad truth.
As always, looking forward to Your next analyzis and/or LS, FIL!💕🎸
We live in a time when the "magic" of producers is as or more important than the singers or bands themselves.
Thanks for clarifying these things! Great video!
Finally someone is calling this practice out...for genuine music we now have no alternative but to search back in time.
There is a lot of real music nowadays, just look further.
@@nataliee9 - Indeed......As there always has been. It's really not worth getting too angry about plastic pop wannabe's..... They've been around for many decades already.
You’re justified in your general take, but the reality is right now is the easiest it’s ever been to find the music you want to find, just like the good ol days you’ve gotta explore, it won’t all be for you but it never has been
@tanssi382 your correct easy to find. With you tube,spotify,all the others. However the exploring is not anything like the good old days. I appreciate all kinds of music. But today I can speak to a device say play it. or look on line. In the old days you had to hear something on radio. Take some money and get to a record store or other type that sold it. Today if I want to hear a great new song multiple times I just click and play. And sound systems are much better. Back then a hit song, well you may have to go to the record store, order it, pay a deposit then come back, pick it up, take home. Then I could listen to all I wanted. Share with friends. So in those days it was much more difficult to "explore " My friends owned a popular record shop. I, being a collector was an expert with the huge catalog book of records in print. I often helped customers research and find a song they wanted desperately. It was actually a lot of fun. We interacted with real people. But your correct about how easy. I can listen to any song free on the internet. But I still have and enjoy my record collection. Their making a huge comeback. I'm glad!👍🎶☮️🎸✌️
Yeah, loads of TH-cam guitarists have been doing it for years. I used to call it out a bit but everyone jumps on you and won't have it and in the end I'm like, meh...is it even worth it. It's more the ones that are speeding up passages and what not that I'm down on.
Fil on the example of Britney Spears: "I always found it quite funny in her videos because she would always over enunciate when miming, not when actually singing - and when I said actually singing, that's another debate" 🤣 Thanks for keeping it real, Fil!!
Yes, it had even said on her concert posters in fine-print at some point in her career, "Not a live performance"! 😅
That made me lol.
@@poorthing Britney possessed the skills to promote herself effectively, showcase her dancing abilities, and stay in tune. She exuded charisma, demonstrated performing talent, and was a competent dancer. Similar to Madonna, Janet, and Paula, she emerged from the MTV era and the influence of the media machine. However, her singing skills were not particularly strong, and although her dancing was proficient, it often resembled an instructional tape on "How to Dance like Janet."
@@poorthing Ah, my bad. Thanks for clarifying the intention of your original reply. "Tragic" describes her really well, I'd say.
@@musicfromtheheart100 with 2nd thoughts I'm deleting my comment-
but look forward to any future comments or insights you leave on this channel-
Fil never disappoints-
Happy Holidays
I’m sure you’ve heard how important it is what you’re doing . Your work here is rock solid. I appreciate you very much. Keep it up .
I attended one of their concerts in November of 2023. I was able to match my recording perfectly with the recording you referenced from March 8, 2024. I recorded me playing them simultaneously- one from my phone and the other off my tablet.
Who are you talking about?
A few weeks ago, i heard a 10 year old girl sing a pop song (a friend of my daughter). She has a nice voice, but she tried to imitate that typical Auto Tune sound. I was very surprised to hear her singing like that, it sounded very strange to me! It seems that this sound is normal for these kids. They think that this is how a normal voice has to sound. I think this is very sad☹!
It's like looking at a photo of a top model on a magazine and then learn it had been photoshoped. That showed an ideal beauty that no real person can reach even when they use the product sold by that photo.
Music isn't supposed to be perfect, it's supposed to evoke emotion. Imperfection is what makes it alive.
60 as of December. I loved the live recordings of the 70s. Allman Brothers Live at Filmore East, Lynyrd Skynyrd One More from the Road, Wings Over America, Frampton Comes Alive. The songs weren't perfect, but their effort is completely authentic.
RIGHT ON!!!! Seemed lkke 70s you couldn't keep up with the true talented. Musicians, the real thing. Pick up instruments and create , sing, write , they did it all👍😍🎶🎸☮️🎼📻
Exactly what you mean..
@ItsMeBarnaby I disagree. Saying plenty or even more today is fantasy. How many can pick up instruments together and create. There were far more back then. I see all the time even at this year's grammys. Grammy winners winning by having someone play back tracks,or a turntable no band. It couldn't be done that way before. Sure musicians who were true artists like the Beatles, Beach Boys, Hundreds of others. Guys from broken bands getting together. Like the Eagles. Check the Guinness record book's. See how many still hold records from the 60s. I have collected music since the 60s, still do. But though I see talented musicians out there. Saying there's more now than ever is far overstated. I lived through then and I am now. I've seen many live acts. Including more modern ones. But it's no way better than the past. Half the Grammy nominees can't play an instrument. How is that a musician. They maybe have a craft they practice. Check Ray Charles comments about this before he passed. His words were." I don't know what it is,but it ain't music " And Ray Charles was the real deal.🎹🎶🎸☮️
I disagree, it's walking al lines or imperfection and just touching perfection for a brief moment. Making you long for more of it.
This is such a touchy topic, as a singer / songwriter trying to navigate the world of social media and content promotion while remaining true to yourself and your art. Pleasing everyone. (And learning that you don’t have to). People really are so conditioned, we have to be really intentional with our vocal editing, depending on what our goals are.
I once provided vocals for an EDM producer and was told again and again I have to get the pitch right. I was already singing really well in key and had applied pitch correction knowing how specific they are in that genre. It felt like nothing was good enough, I have no idea what he was hearing!
Others I leave 100% raw. It’s good to beable to know where and how to use it, if you must.
I really appreciate this video.
For me, its the fact that this is being promoted as her having amazing voice control, is the problem. Its all a big lie, and makes me not want to listen to any of her music. The irony is, if you actually go and listen to her busking videos, where she is singing without pitch correction, her talent shines through, and it sounds way better than the pitch corrected stuff - theres more depth, more nuance, and way more emotion in those videos
@@antsbull3370 for sure. It’s like using edited pictures to promote makeup products knowing full well that’s not how it looks in real life. I do wish more people understood this and appreciated things in their natural state. If we weren’t constantly fed the edited stuff, there would be nothing “artificial” to compare it to.
@@antsbull3370Fil did some video manipulation of his own here ! His set up was using a third party reaction to Allie and their claims about Allie's vocals ! If you check out Allie's video she makes no claims about her vocals but that doesn't push Fil's main claim to fame these days, so to open the door to critique Allie's video he used that third party video. Funny I don't see him critiquing the video that actually made the claim. But come on he got more clicks on this video because he has a big picture of Allie on it, and he mentioned himself that Allie at the time had almost 6 million subscribers, which now she has more, so he knew exactly what he was doing, some video manipulation, ironic isn't it !
🎤🎸🎶
you are a fake then just like her
Can you imagine doing a vocal break-down on all the inconsistencies in pitch control during Janis Joplin's live performance of "Ball & Chain" at Monterey? Can you imagine her going into the studio and correcting everything? Doing that would ruin one of the most iconic live performances ever. I'll take soul, warts and all, over souless anyday.
Or a breakdown of Donna Godchaux's vocals from a 70's Grateful Dead live performance? I'm sure Weir was always giving cues during performances to the sound man to turn down her microphone gain 🙂
agreed. I remember seeing Rod Stewart for the first time with Jeff Beck in 67 or 68 singing Morning Dew. What a sad thing it would be to 'enhance' a performance like that.
Well, let‘s not „oversatanize“ pitch correction here. If it is carefully used, it doesn‘t take away any of the soul of the performance.
If I remember correctly, the first time was so good that they had her do it a second time on sunday so they could film it for the documentary. Meaning it was not a fluke and she could repeat it many times. If I'm thinking of the right doc with flowers something and love banner, great documentary by the way.
@@knh5954 You're correct about the band performing the song twice. I think they refused filming the day before over money, but agreed to play "Ball and Chain" the next day to capture Janis' riviting performance forever. great decision!
Nailed it, Fil. I agree with you totally! Integrity matters!
And they wonder why us older folks can't stand today's "music". I am from the 60s and 70s days when they needed talent to make it! Great review and glad your calling the fakeness out!
And they are true musicians. Sometimes not great and sometimes brilliant which is why you needed to got to a few gigs. It’s almost like they are human vs the computerised junk that is spewed out!
Just want to say that the singer in this video is not a bad singer. However, producers these days use all of the tools at their disposal, including pitch correction. But just because pitch correction has been used does not imply that the singer can't sing. And what I'm talking about is maybe being a few cents off the pitch - not whole semi-tones or more. All singers a a few cents away - and that's good because you have nuances and a naturalness to the voice. By pitch correcting so the performance is "bang on", you lose that. But like I say, do not necessarily conflate pitch-corrected performance with bad singer.
You have no idea of the insane amount of talent that goes into producing pop music. All music, but specifically pop. Forget about singing it, just try to come up with the melody and lyrics like the song in this video and then we'll see if you think it was made by people with no talent.
@@mtae5 I kind of agree. The people behind the music/production are indeed talented. Even the artists can be talented, even if they're not showing the best of themselves. However, a lot of pop is written within minutes (the basic idea) - and that usually gets embellished by the behind-the-scenes people.
@@tommysmith5479 If she was a good singer then why is she even using autotune ???
I was a 80s teen and I love 60s rock and blues 80s and back what you hear is the real deal
Evidently I was born too soon...when music was music & singing was singing.
Thanks Fil. Rock!
Teen Irish singer Allie Sherlock has been putting up busking videos since she was a preteen. She appeared on Ellen in 2018. She really is a very talented young lady with a great voice. But she's apparently playing the game the way it's played these days.. She's working the mic really close here to make it look like it's live. No worry about popping Ps, she's not really singing! The vocal processing and effects, not to mention pitch correction are the giveaway for me. I agree with you Fil, bring back the days of honest singing!
Yes, she actually has a fantastic and also very unique voice.
I find it sad that she thinks she need to autotune some videos, cos she would crush all these songs without them.
She plays more games than one.
Seems to me someone else is playing games here !
This is a VERY important video. Thank you making this.
Yes, this is very good Boomer Bait!
Great video I think that you spot on with this one young singers have a hard enough time without the bar being raised so high that it’s unattainable
Thanks for the breakdown, Fil. At this rate we won’t need people to make music. AI can create the images as well as the music, eliminates all the fuss associated with actual people.
There already using it to have singers (living and dead) sing a song they never sang before
Excellent video Fil. Thanks for calling this out. Let's just call it what it is -- Pitch correction and miming. Flat out trickery and dishonesty.
Amen.
@@brushstroke3733 Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Phil! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I don't think you realise how disrespectful you are being to a large group of people in the music industry. If you don't like it then don't listen, but don't call it trickery or dishonesty.
Music is entertainment, not a battle to show who is the most talented or skilled. If all you cared about was skill, you would probably listen to barbershop quartets and acapella but yet, no one does.
Not being disrespectful at all. And if you've taken the time to scroll through almost every post and response here, you'll realize that I"m not the only one who feels this way, and that includes Fil. How is this NOT trickery? Manipulating a performance so that it's different than the artist's actual singing voice? Not sure what else you can call it.
I would rather hear a heartfelt, full on performance than an auto tuned mechanical "voice." And by the way, please reread the last sentence you wrote. "If all you cared about was skill, you would probably listen to barbershop quartets and acapella." (Um, Pentatonix, anyone?" You pretty much admitted I'm correct. Both these types of music depend 100% on talent with no outside manipulation. You just made my point. @@thepoofster2251
Fil, you're absolutey correct about the depreciation of one's own voice when you listen to something like this. I think one of the reasons is that one gets so judged on social media, whether it's body shape or voice tone. It has to be perfect or you lose so many "likes" which of course drops your self esteem and ego into the basement. The result will be that ethics and integrity fly out the door and make way for A.I. to take over. It's so sad.
💯 bro!! Great calls. Hard to find legit talent these days.
I’m so glad you illustrated pitch Correction, Miming, and pre-recording, in comparison to the true/real voice. This helps me so much identify a pitch correction especially with the letter “L” this is an awesome analysis. Thank you for showing this type of mechanical singing 💕
i didn't realize they did this! i feel silly.
Rick Beato had an interesting take on pitch correction when he brought his teenage daughter into the studio to listen to a few songs. She PREFERRED the auto-tuned songs much more than the natural vocals. So the kidz have been conditioned to like pitch correction.
I've heard young people signing, and they often try to replicate the autotune sound when they are singing. They are just so used to it.
And no doubt older people were complaining about analogous trends in music production thirty years ago (synthesizers aren't real instruments, drum machines lack the soul of a real drummer, blah blah blah), or people were complaining about innovations embraced by the likes of the Beatles in the 60s. There is nothing new under the sun, in this sense.
It shouldn't be too surprising that a generation raised on particular genres and styles of music learns to appreciate the creative norms of what they're acclimatised to. Quite why you should panic over it I don't know; frankly, what other people listen to and enjoy shouldn't cause you to lose sleep at night.
A Canadian news magazine did a similar test but with orange juice. They gave the kids freshly squeezed orange juice, and then artificially processed and sweetened orange juice. Needless to say, the kids all preferred the processed crap.
The market dictates what succeeds financially and therefore gets promoted more.
If you've raised kids who've listened to nothing but manipulated audio, this is what you end up with.
@@DavidHughesss Actually no, there were no such complaints really. While the appreciation of their sound wasn't universal, their was an appreciation of taking music in new directions.
This isn't doing that.
@@RevStickleback Yes, I'm sure there were no "traditionalists" in those days. Never mind that Dylan got booed for the crime of picking up an electric guitar, or that Schoenberg's use of chromatic scales irked many...
You're the man Phil!
I agree with you 100% and by the way, you have a new subscriber my friend. Awesome channel man!
I grew up listening to brand new new music from the late 60's up to last week, but my preference is music from the 1970's. Everything from Pink Floyd to Merle Haggard and anything in-between. With that said, my favorite genre is Classic Rock. I also enjoy playing some bluesy tunes while jamming with my buddies. In my opinion, the greatest music ever written & recorded is from the 70's era.
As an avid musician, I noticed that music in general started sounding "strange" to my ear since the late 80's going forward. Obviously, I'm not the only one! Since the invention of Auto-Tune, Pitch Correction, Vocal Enhancer, bla, bla, bla, anyone and I mean ANYONE can appear to be a fantastic singer online.
Don't get me wrong, I suppose that it's kinda fun to dabble with it while goofing around with my musician buddies, BUT, when people start making some money by POSING, LYING and PRETENDING to be a "real" singer when in fact, they can barely hold a note, that's where I draw the line! It is deceitful and total bullshit!!!
I thoroughly enjoy listening to an "authentic" artists in fact, I specially like hearing the subtle flaws and nuances in their recordings. You don't ever hear that sort of thing anymore. Almost every singer online is an absolute marvel. It's freakin' embarrassing, or at least it should be. I don't know man, but I could never try to sell myself as a better musician than what I actually am. It's called integrity.
You might think that I'm just an old fart who never grew out of the '70's but I can assure you that simply isn't true. I enjoy playing tunes from every decade since the 50's, however, my preference is definitely music from the 1970's. In my opinion, music from that era is so, SO much better than most of the disingenuous crap found online today. Back when "REAL" artists composed some "REAL" music that continues to stand the test of time. Back when "REAL" artists actually created some of the most complex music & lyrics to date. Then they had the balls to actually record "their songs" without the help of any bullshit software. Songs that were conceptualized, written, played and actually sung by the artist, not a danm robot!
Am I ranting?....lol
I’m so glad you’re old school and you call it like it is. Love your reviews Fil
I've never seen Fil ever give a negative commentary on any artist. In fact I love his smile when he shows a performer than gives his review about how great they sound. So I take his criticism seriously. Go Fil ...Give us more more!!!
Yes. Fil is to be applauded for being neutral in his assessments. This does lend some gravitas to his insights!
Thank you for your brilliant videos, Fil. You do us a great service.
"Why does it matter?" is such a revealing question. A sad reflection on our times. The world wanting to know, why they shouldn't lie ...
It is at once sad and frightening. A society that has lost its way.
If it "doesn't matter", then she is irrelevant. AI can just do the whole song "flawlessly".
The words "music" and "talent" have evolved into some vague reasonable facsimiles !
Somehow I'm wondering if the whole "title" of " America's Got Talent" ought to be changed to
"America's got Electronics." The judges ought to be Sarah Brightman or Barbra Streisand-but then, they're too busy making REAL music!
.Merry Christmas Music Lovers! "Get it Together This Christmas!" and "It Was a Silent Night"
Ha, "artistic integrity" in a box-now it's purely "entertainment." Anything Goes!
NO PITCH CORRECTIONS ANYWHERE.
And a few a'capella's !
"I Fall to Pieces With a Touch of Classical Guitar."
FredGold&LyndaFaye
The Illinois Harmony Connection.
I love how kind and honest you are in these assessments and not harshly critical.
This is why social media is destroying art.
Not social media, phony people making a bad use of social media and zillions of uninformed buyers of fake products are destroying art. I concede that it would be not so easy without social media, though. Before the internet the record labels commited lots of cases of unfair treatment and abuse, but at least there was some type of screening and supervision, and the artist had to be real (and earn their prestige by playing live).
Destroying or Cluster B Personality Disordered people who have always been over represented on Social Media unintentionally exposing themselves.
MMM, no I think this is HOW social media is ect, ect.
@petecanthropus9947
It's the left-wing.
The left owns social media.
Today's criminally corrupt left-wing democrat party is also the problem.
Millions of weak minded sheep vote for these left wing extremists.
There is art here but it's within the very perfection of competitive ongoing technology. Even fake Picassos are still a from of art.
I'm 68 and have begun to return to the music i love. You just helped me understand why I can't replicate the music i hear. I'm going back to my roots of the 70's mistakes and all. Seems so human to me.
Ive never let go of 60's and 70's music..and I was born in the 80's...hahaha...I cant listen to modern music...its shallow and soulless...glad youve returned to the good times
I'm the same my friend at 65. I love all the perfect studio albums by Queen but I also love the raw sound of street performers. Our friend Michael Shulman is an amazing violinist. His old electric stuff from early 2010 is his best. Also the amazing street guitarist Damian Salazar who never plays a wrong note in his performances over the last few years. I just love real live music because it shows who really is gifted.
@@truthseeker7794 I was fortunate to see a Jean luc Ponty concert in the 70's. By far the best show I've ever witnessed to this day..
Me too. I,m 71 and living on my own now, to BOOM Radio and BOOM Rock, often the songs of the 1960s and 1970s come on and it is like listening to 'Angels' because the music is so good that I cheer, bounce around, sing along, tap the kitchen surfaces, bang two saucepans together and will sometimes have tears in my eyes of the memories of those times but most of because of how so f****** GOOD our music was.
Fil isn't smiling. When the guy who naturally falls into a smile during his analysis videos puts one up in which he almost never smiles, you know that he's bummed out by what he's seeing. Thanks, Fil, for doing this. Insightful and interesting, as always.
He's not smiling because his new goofy haircut...
I always appreciated his joy when he is listening to the great singers. Like you, I noticed he was not smiling this time.
After watching many of his videos I really appreciate growing up in the 60s when singers had to be good to sound good.
Good observation
Hell you're right lol he looks pissed. Love Fil.
Fil's smile, his absolute joy in the music, is infectious, and probably the main reason I keep watching. He is really upset here, and it makes me sad too.
Just recently discovered your channel and I love it! I am 66 years old, and grew up in a time when as a kid you didn't have a whole lot of money so you had to pick the album you bought very carefully because you knew you were going to listen to it over and over. I have all my albums still such as Bad Finger's No dice, the Beatles complete library, Hendrix Axis Bold as Love, Van Morrison's Astral Weeks, The Righteous Brothers, The Young Rascals, The Temptations. Yes these were artists with true talent who could actually sing, and in some cases play a mean guitar, piano or other instrument. It appears those days are very quickly disappearing.
Fil, again, thank you for your knowledgeable critique on this phoney, cheap, disgusting industry, and how the public, once again is being ripped off.
It's more sad than disgusting. Sad what music has become. A good example of this is Fil's video of Beauty and the Beast with Emma Watson. I found that movie so painful to watch. Even if she was signing poorly or not superbly (like Emma Stone performs in La La Land), it would have sounded miles better than how it sounded. I cannot listen to it.
public doesn't care... same public that thinks nfl is real
I do not think the public is being ripped off because I think the public is aware of and accepting of pitch correction, harmonizers, backing tracks, lip synching, etc.
@@billo6938 No, most people have no idea. I mean, they do know that those things exist, but they cannot tell whether they are looking at an enhanced performance or not.
How can the public be ripped off if they're not paying for music?
Thank you for your analysis and insight. Sadly, like many things in this world we are being misled
I'm so glad you get on here and point this crap out! I would rather hear someone sing from the heart, even if their voice is not perfect.
Thank you for this video !! Keep on doing !!! Many greets from Germany near Cologne
greetings from Cardiff,
south wales, uk.. 🙂
@@davidevans3227 🥰🙋🏼♀️!! I have never been in Cardiff, but my mom, long time ago. She visited a girlfriend from Berlin, who was living there...
Thanks, you're the man keepin' it real! Soon, we'll just sample sound of our voice, and A.I. will do all the singing complete with random 'offness'.
Noooooo. You are right, if course. AI is going to ruin almost everything that is human.
@joannasunday - If we _allow_ A.I. to do that, sure!
@@mightyV444 as humans, we will allow it. We F things up. We don't think ahead. We are a childish race.
I certainly appreciate your integrity and honesty. Keep speaking up, Fil. You are so refreshing!
Videos like this are amazing and needed. I think people who are autotuning, while acting like it's their natural voice, should be called out. That kind of crap needs to be discouraged. It makes it very hard to know who the heck can even sing anymore.
Videos like this really help with my confidence. I sing worship at church and of course I am going to sound scratchy some days, miss notes, go flat, and I've really had to learn not to compare myself to people on social media.
We should treasure the natural great voices even more ! The next stage is a virtual voice, a completely manipulated vocal, the guts are being ripped from great vocals, young people are being utterly mislead. The best concerts I've been to have been a group with instruments and amps, that was it and it felt alive !! I'm in my 50s now and it hurts to see what's happening to vocals in particular ☹ Keep up your great vocal and instrument analysis work Fil 👍👍
IKR! I'm 55 and had seen so many concerts in my teen years back in the early 80's. Some of my greatest memories of my teen years.
A.I. will sample every voice known, and churn out whatever. Want to hear McCartney from 1965, singing Susanna's aria from Le Nozze di Figaro? Why not?
@@argusfleibeit1165I'm crying.
@@Every_Day_islike_Sunday Me, too... "cryyyyy-ing over you... cryyyyying over you..." Roy Orbison, remember? What are we gonna do?? 🤥
@@barbaramilone2800 i have friends saying this won't last but I'm not so sure.
Glad someone has highlighted this, I often sing and record my vocals. However people dont appreciate the difference between organic vocals and processed vocals. When people hear my recordings they're not sure how to respond because it has flaws in it. They dont understand theres no such thing as perfection these days because the industry doesnt deem great vocals anymore it just needs a marketable face.
Ive decided to just focus on an organic sound as that improves my vocal control as im constantly receiving feedback of what my vocal chords are actually doing and also timing understanding to sing on the beat or off beat. I would never get to address my weakness with off beat timing if i just used tech to do it for me as I could slide the trackline as i please.
You're right its definitely confusing for the younger generation. The amount of youngsters that think they cant sing because its not pitch perfect is crazy these days and on the flip side we have people trying to convince the world that they are the greatest singer out there masking their insecurities. I dont do filters on my face so I wont start by adding filters over my sound. Lol
Great video really enjoyed it. Worth subscribing for sure.
Your level of analysis is absolutely amazing!
BRAVO, Fil
Great job with this break down. Also for those who may not know, live performances can also be auto-tuned on-the-fly with the use of a vocal processor.