These rules 100% exist because some wise guy said early on in the games history “this dungeon is fun and all but why don’t we just break through this wall and not mess with the puzzle traps?” Hence rules for individual sections of structures for one to attack and break through.
@@webbowser8834 Isn't the Tomb of Horrors located in marshy swamplands, making a digging expedition incredibly impractical? Not to mention, the multiple fake entrances that explode and that would kill your first few mining teams?
The way I do it with breaking down objects is that, unless there is some weird circumstance preventing the object from being damaged at all, the object will always break if the players hit it enough. The question is... how long will it take? For that I make them roll attack against the object and treat the attack roll like a skill check. The higher the roll, the quicker it breaks. If they roll very low it's possible a object could take days of wailing on it before it breaks.
@@Zulk_RS Or just make it an actual skill challenge. Strength obviously, but maybe also intelligence if someone wants to try and analyse where the weak points are and what are the best tools for the job. Do well on both checks and you identify a single keystone that can bring the whole wall down with a few minutes of violent smashing, fail them both and you hurl yourself feebly against the strongest portion of the wall for hours, do a bunch of injuries to yourselves and attract the attention of the people who built the wall and would rather it stay up.
@@johnnye87 It depends on how the PC wants to approach breaking the wall. Usually they just "Want to break down doors" and I make it an attack roll to figure out how long it takes
That's the main reason why I moved to running my games in Savage Worlds. Effectively, mooks have 2 HP, players and bosses have 5 (Damage calculation is different). Now I can build encounters without needing to figure out how much HP a monster needs, and guesstimate the AC-like values. It's been a real relief, honestly. XD
If I, as a GM, stopped the game to calculate the hit point value of a wall on a rock by rock basis, my players would be well within their rights to simply beat me to death with their chairs.
@@izzyliberty8720 You'd need to roll for each chair leg, and each plank in the back section, and the planks in the seating section. Additionally, you'd need to roll for each bone they attempt to break; they're going to need to work pretty hard to overcome that AC though. It's almost enough to make one miss THAC0.
I think it’s a contextual thing. Like, if the wall is say just a bunch of cinder blocks held together with nothing t but gravity tracking them individually makes a bit more sense then a wall held together with mortar which at that point is effectively one thing. But also if your player specifically is using shatter or a similar AOE then having a bunch of things with small HP is more beneficial to them then one large chunk.
I think it'd be more accurate to say you can't cut a rope that's hanging loosely with blunt damage. If it's pulled taut you could realistically break it with blunt damage, though it'd still be substantially harder to do than with slashing or piercing.
Yup. After struggling with this on an adventure as my players tried to dig through rules on damaging stone doors, I (as a new DM) not wanting to deal with the players breaking the dungeon, opted to just say "No, this material is too hard, you fail."
"okay, after repeatedly slashing at the table with your scimitar there are some grooves in the wood but your scimitar is now blunt and slightly bent, it now has the qualities of small club until you get it repaired. Also, roll a constitution save to avoid gaining a level of exhaustion."
@@burgernthemomrailer "With the stone wall now absent there is a minor landslide as loose rock and mud surge out of the hole. As you're below the water table all the surrounding soil is like a sea of mud, you can't tunnel through it without loose material from above falling in. You learn that the walls of the dungeon are placed there specifically to hold back the loose soil."
@@Treblaine “I cast Augury to figure out that that would’ve happened had I casted Stone Shape, then cast Passwall.” Or: “I cause my familiar to appear behind the wall, then Misty Step inside using its senses.” Or: “I cast Dimension Door.” Or: “I cast Polymorph to turn into an animal with a burrow speed.” Or: “I cast Fabricate and turn the mud and earth into structural supports.” Or: “I cast Water Breathing/Air Bubble and swim through the mud.”
And the Shadowrun player/GM in me can't help but remember that it even is on the list for improvised thrown weapons (along with fun things like a 'metahuman body' for really fun bar fights. Damage scales with the thrown person's body-attribute btw.) Turns out the saying is true after all: coffee helps with everything - including stupid people. You just need to throw the mug hard enough.
"You not gonna cut a rope with a hammer!" "Not with that attitude!" - Shouted the barbarian, smashing the rope so hard it catched fire and the rock beneath it melted.
See I was thinking I'd use the other side of the hammer, you know, the side that's used for pulling nails, since it's sharper you could use it to saw through, or, tie the rope to it, and just pull until it snaps
Yeah, this topic is incredibly hard to deal with especially if the dm is unprepared so this is a great video to give a dm ideas in a short 5 minutes on what to do when the party says "yeah we'll just try and take out the foundations of the castle to bring the whole thing down" (Yes that happened. No, I was not one of the party members trying to do this. I was going to use stealth)
@LtFoeHammer its also why most towers are cylinders. Having a foundation with corners means you can collapse one with just one weakened corner. Having a foundation without means you gotta dig out a bigger section
A segment of wall containing 30 bricks is MUCH stronger than 30 bricks just lying around. I'd probably increase the AC by a bit based on it's Mortar Bonus.
At that point you’d be tracking thirty individual tiny bricks which would simply have less Hp than the collective large wall. I don’t think wall form makes it harder to hit necessarily.
Medieval mortar was just wet clay, it’s only function was to provide more surface area for the bricks to stack on one another, providing greater stability. I think you should instead just increase the total structure’s hp, making it just as easy to dig through with pickaxes, or bust through with a max level paladin smite, but the wall itself less likely to collapse.
I'd say it depends. Aggregations of hard things can be more resilient to certain stresses than those same things stuck together with glue or mortar. The Practical Engineer goes into this kind of stuff pretty well if folks are interested in digging into the topic. For RPG purposes I think it's more important to take story context into account than to be realistic. Under what socioeconomic circumstances was the wall built, and to what end? The same materials will go together differently when built by experts intent on protecting something they care about vs non-craftspeople throwing something together because somebody said they'd be killed if they didn't. It's also not necessary to go into combat rounds to break down a wall that isn't fighting back. All that's needed is to consider how much time the party is willing to spend and the consequences of that time and the noises they'll make in the process. There's no need to roll dice at all. If the party has no appropriate tools or experience and they're trying to be stealthy, they can't break through a stone wall. If they're well equipped intrusion experts, they might have a move speed through walls and only take a slight penalty to stealth while using it. TL;DR: if I'm rolling for the hp of a wall, it's a stalling tactic, not an attempt to maintain a certain level of realism.
I wouldn't touch the AC for the material. The bonus I would grant the put-together structure would be to increase the minimum damage threshold. So an individual brick and a wall both have the same AC and vulnerabilities, but the wall would require you to deal a set number of damage, otherwise it is ignored because of how structurally sound it is (and of course, poorly built structures may not have such luxuries).
This suggests that mortar kinda sorta functions like object armor that takes hours to days to “don”, depending on number of bricks and how many assistants you have. It also suggests that there’s +1 mortar designed an architect wizard somewhere out there.
I have, in fact, cut rope with a hammer many times. Either the rope is between a rock and the peen of the hammer, or the rope is between wood and the claw of the hammer. - When you're a kid, building a tree fort you make do instead of walking half an hour home to get a knife or scissors.
@MonkeyJedi99 this was my thought at first. Just smash it with a hammer against another hard object, and then I simplified my thought to a barbarian would do it.
Calculate the volume of your planet then divide it into roughly castle sized peices made of stone with 500 hp. Remove hp for when players attack things like trees and neutral or good npcs. If the planet hits about a third of that hp have volcanos start generating everywhere, with volcanic eruptions building that hp back up by a certain percentage.
Well kinda depends I would say the reply above is probably a good idea. That is if it isn’t a genius loci as the liquid that is produced would probably block up volcanoes that generate at least in some capacity.
Ok so one stick of dynamite in dnd does 3d6 bludgeoning damaged and wikipedia says that the average stick contains around 1 megajoule of energy (1 million joules). For simplicitys sake lets say the max roll for a stick is equal to 1 MJ, so 18 points of damage. The gravitational binding energy of earth, which is basically the amount of energy that holds the earth together, is 2.49x10^32 joules so we need to exceed this amount to theoretically destroy the earth. So dividing that number by the 1 million joules to get the number of sticks of dynamite you would need (in reality it would prob be a lot more), 2.49x10^26 sticks and then times that by the max dmg, 18, to get 4.48x10^27 or in other words 4.48 Octillion points of damage. Thats 4.7 septillion meteor swarms with all 4 orbs in each hitting with max damage. In conclusion if u wanna destroy the planet in 5e... idk just use wish i guess. Or just give it a more achievable hitpoint value lmao (I almost certainly got a bunch of stuff wrong in this but its still prob a decent approximation)
Fun idea, martial feat that allows a character using a shield or plate/metal armor to use their object HP as temporary hit points. When those hit points are lost the item is damaged. For shields you lose the AC bonus, for armors critical threat range is increased.
I have actually seen an ability line this, but only in a very scuffed FF themed Pathfinder game called FF d20. One of the Knight Talents is called Armored Sacrifice. When themselves or an ally would be killed, they can instead direct the attack to the suit of armor they’re wearing or a shield they are using. The armor takes the damage and its hardness (the amount of damage resistance objects have) is cut in half for that attack.
@@ЗлодейБританец-э6й to be fair my first ever TTRPG was pathfinder and I was reminded of the Sundering rules. Its been awhile since I played PF so I cant remember if there was a direct feat for it involving armor
That's just how shields work in Pathfinder 2e. Use an action to raise shield for ac bonus (pf2e has a 3 action system), and if shield is raised you can use a reaction to block an attack and reduce damage
So you’re going to make Martials spend all their money on replacement equipment while distance combat characters can wield their invincible shield and wear unbreakable leather, for the benefit of some temp hp which doesn’t scale with the character unless they keep buying/finding better and better armor?
THANK YOU! I keep talking to people about generic objects in D&D and now someone finally puts a light on it! this is one of the things that can really enhance playing a strong martial character, a lot of those "barbarian doesnt know what to do other than attack" issues go away when the barbarian realizes "attack" became "Enviromental interaction"
Somehow having a +5 to Dex despite only having a 19 stat, and yet SOMEHOW despite having a +5 Dex mod, chain mail and a sheild, only managing to have a AC of 11.
Zee, I love and hate your timing on this upload man. I've been in the middle of preparing a sruvival campagin for a few days now, was just getting around to object HP stuff and breaking your weapons and tools, etc, and had basically juat resigned to borrowing stuff from Pathfinder 1e when you uploaded this. Still, you got me before I actually started the campaign, so now I am both thrilled and also humiliated. So thank you! And curse you!
Objects are immune to effects caused by CON Saves? Huh, i guess that's why Shatter has specific text indicating that it automatically damages objects...
yes but if it does 20 hp damage the timberwolf battlemech is like ah cute and is not realy efetveed at all bescue its left leg still has like over 3000hp still in the hit lofaction then bascly blasts you with a UAC 10 thats bacly does 1000hp in a 8 meter raduis that roll for two shots eacth that bacly do 1000hp 2000hp if it crits.
I once had a player use stone shape to remove a section of wall next to a puzzle door to bypass it, just as another player solved the door's puzzle. The player was panicking though... I accidentally created a situation that was FAR more terrifying to the party than I had intended it to be. After entering the dungeon, the floor behind them rose up & activated a Sphere of Annihilation, so they could now only move forwards. The sphere was the width of the hallway and moved 5 feet towards the players every round. While the party was exploring the dungeon out of combat, this meant moving 5 feet for every 30 feet the party moved, and while solving puzzles it meant moving 5 feet every 6 real-world seconds. The sphere NEVER got anywhere NEAR the party... The players saw it moving on the map, but only until they turned the first corner of the first hallway in that dungeon and then never saw it again until they needed to at the end. When they reached the treasure room, they looted it and had to wait for the sphere to catch up to them to exit, at which point the sphere part broke leaving behind a construct that was meant to be the final boss. The party was still to scared to fight it though, and I basically had to just allow them to break a wall to get out of the boss room & leave the dungeon to allow the game to progress at all... It was supposed to be a little scary, but I underestimated the effect it would have on the party. All it really did, from a purely mechanics point of view, was remove the ability to take a Short Rest inside the dungeon, and the dungeon only had two combats and three puzzles. I was inspired to create this dungeon primarily by Pikmin 2's Water Wraith.
In regards to damage threshold, I do agree that it's usually better to just pick a lane and either say they can break through or can't, but the one situation where it does come in handy is a tense situation where the players need to get through *quickly*. If it's a time crunch, they're in initiative, and trying desperately to break in/out of somewhere, the damage threshold mechanic works well as a hit-by-hit basis to show whether the characters can get the job done under pressure. Otherwise, it's just another step to slow things down if they aren't on a time limit.
I love the idea of a big-ass building having a high AC and you don't roll high enough. "What do you MEAN I missed? It's 100 feet wide!" Literally can't hit the broad side of a barn.
High AC doesn't necessarily mean the player misses. The classic "high AC" character is a knight in full armor with a shield after all, If you fail an attack against a them you probably hit their shield or armor and did no damage. But if the PC is fighting a ninja monk with no armor then 'narratively' they dodge or duck out of the way.
I think that players attacking objects is reasonably good space for rule improvising, but this makes a great framework for making rules on the fly. It has a few things to keep in mind and tools for the DM without being too excessive.
For castles and similar, take a page from BG3 say “I’m sorry. It seems a magical barrier is protecting the castle’s structure. You need to dispel the magic or deal more than 20 damage for a section to be damaged.”
The best part is that players will kinda immediately understand that they should find another way in, because an obviously made up 'plot device' is protecting it, even if that plot device isn't particularly strong. That's just having the confidence to say no but with extra steps
Absolutely incredible use of a jazz version of Chopin's prelude in E minor for the section of the video where we are now in terrifying ruling territory
Zee may accidentally create a meme of trying to cut rope with hammers, which now I want to see I Did a Thing attempt to make a rope-cutting smasher hammer
If my uncle & his 22 have anything to say about it, 26 pieces isn't enough pieces (He got frustrated with one & shot it to hell in a firing range is why)
I have been reminded how confusing some rules can be, it's quite mind boggling. Thanks Zee for this headache, I shall steal your left socks when you least expect it.
So this means that plate armors have at most 18 hp, so when you hit an opponent for more damage, their armor is destroyed? XD (it would be so stupid lol)
In 3.5 and Pathfinder that would be called Sunder. It’s a special attack type where you aim for enemy equipment instead of the enemy. As with all things in 3.5/Pathfinder, it takes several feats to become any good at it. Weapons are easy enough to understand. All weapons start with 10 hardness (5 for wooden polearms) and their HP is based on if they’re light, one handed, and two handed. A mundane 2 handed weapon has 10 hardness and 10 HP. Which seems… alarmingly small to me. Thankfully the hardness and HP both rise as they are enchanted. Armor is confusing because instead its stats are based on the material it’s made of, and there’s a table where you can figure out how much HP it should have based on thickness. I don’t know anything about that, but I do know that everything made of leather and below is soft enough to get sundered in a single strike if you try. Most people don’t use Sundering for 2 reasons. 1, it tends to destroy loot that the party wants to use for themselves. 2, it’s just not fun if you have a weapon you love dearly and someone snaps it in half. It can be dramatic, but otherwise it’s just like a monster attacking your wallet directly.
Typically you're slipping a blade between the plates of armor, or stabbing at the neck or groin when damaging an armored opponent. Though yes in older editions and other games, you can sunder armor as an action or take a feat/ability that allows you to do it.
@@lolly9804 Yeah, for weapons. But not with a fireball, lightning bolt, or like the spell that literally destroys items and the only reason it does not destroy equipment is to not abuse it, called disintegration :D
@@GlawiousAldredMarci Takes a lot of heat to burn a body to ash, even more so for metal to melt. Though sure, you're right, it's unrealistic that armor durability doesn't go down every time a magical blast of fire is aimed at the person it's protecting. If you want to be the DM that keeps a track of hundreds of object HP totals, more power to you.
One DND session I had had an tourist trap called "The Unbreakable rock", an rock that was an giant gold nugget with enchanted gems on it. It resisted all elemental elements (fire, water, light, etc.) so only non elemental physical or non elemental magical was effective on it. It had 9 googleplexians of HP, with 9's running all along down it. It also healed for it's max HP every turn. It was the main attraction of an town called Castle Dour. It raked them in huge amounts of money. Castle Dours town came under siege later in the campaign, and the unbreakable rock was the one thing unaffected by the seige, with seiger NPC's trying to break it in order to remove the crystals. Me and my party grew to love the rock so much that even though it was invincible, we took care the seigers. The town was repaired... The next siege though wasn't so lucky... The main antagonist, an 200 IQ dragon of corruption, flew over to where Castle Dour was... When we arrived it was already gone and the town was scorched with corruptive purple fire and corrupt purple gunk that pooled in such a way that they were deep pond pockets in streets. We didn't even notice that the unbreakable rock had lost it's golden splendor and was split in half until the DM said: "You find an familiar piece of stone... with 4 pieces where enchanted gems should be... Bereft of golden splendor"... This hinted that the antagonist was capable of destroying it, effortlessly we are told how if the rock was destroyed, then the main antagonist easily dealt 10 googolplex'es of damage. And that we would need to search high and low to fight the main antagonist, or use an diplomatic solution... Lest we end up dragon food.
Object health is one of the classic examples of ‘the rules are there if you NEED them’ in my eyes. Like in pathfinder there’s a bunch of rules about social interactions, ‘make an impression’ and so on and so forth but they are just there in case you as a DM or group are unsure of how to codify those encounters and want an example.
I played as a Barbarian in a campaign one time who had an Adamantine Pickaxe, and we were gonna get cheeky and break through some walls in a dungeon. This dungeon was a Pyramid in the middle of the jungle in the middle of a desert. It was also linked to the Feywild. So when I cut through a wall, all we saw was an infinite void like you'd see when you no-clip under the ground in a video game. It was funny, we were like Ok dont try that again.
Nice! I love the old school ASB look. I saw this and wondered why I'd never watched it before, then realized the dang thing had only been uploaded today!
I actually had a player who collapsed an entire building. He was a Minotaur and built for single hit damage, he had gone in to save one of the other players but it was an ambush and they got surrounded. His solution after I told him they were in an old rickety wooden building was to put the other player on his back and charge out of there doing as much damage to the structure as he could. The building collapsed as he came barreling out. It was one of the greatest moves I’ve seen in D&D
Perfect timing, Zee! One of my players just asked me if they can break enemies' weapons with their new adamantine hammer and I wasn't sure how to go about it but your video really helped, thank you!
>Be an Abyssal Tiefling Bloodrager(same) in Pathfinder 1 >GET BEEEG!! >Have a +2 Keen, Adamantine Greatsword named "crowbar" >Laugh at any and all numbers objects raise to oppose you >Get polymorphed into a sheep
Don't be afraid to override the DMG's ruling too. I had a player tell me a stone wall was 15 ac. I told him the wall was made from a different, more durable stone. It turned into an argument. In the end, I caved but now that I'm more experienced I would rule it differently.
I really liked in previous videos how you sited the page and lines in the source material like the PHB. Makes the communication and rules seem much more founded in an authority, and dramatically engages the listener. "Page 227 of the PHB states..." Sorry idk if you read these at all but theres an unsolicited opinion for you! Great video as always.
One of my favorite things about 3.5 is the drunken Monk prestige class that has proficiency with improvised weapons. Pulling out a mithral table from your portable hole in beating people with it was such a great feeling
Love your video man. I just have my players roll based on if they have a heavy weapon or not. Great sword two hits big tables, one shot if high rolled. Normal sword on big table needs about 5 or 6 maybe less if good rolls happen.
BG3 had several objects that required a minimum damage amount, one that comes to mind was the wall above the goblin camp needing more than 20 damage to inflict (at low level). The timing of this video is rather convenient, as my players are debating about how to drive off a young green dragon, one concept they had was knocking down the stone tower the dragon roosted in.
You are the best DND TH-camr, easily. You don't have as much content as others do, but the quality is absolutely sensational. You're so good, I'm going to subscribe to someone for the first time ever.
Huh, now I know how to run an idea that I had knocking around in my head for a long time. Now I have lots of ideas how to do a lot of things with my original idea. Brilliant, simply brilliant.
I would say the "damage threshold" depends on what you're using: Un-armed: maybe DT = 19 (MOST of the times, it is REALLY going to hurt in your hands), (maybe it even have some mild kind of "thorns" effect too) Hammer: maybe DT = 12 (Some times you have a bad hit, hit something particularly hard, and the impact goes into the handle & hurts you (see above too)) Pick axe: DT = 7 (it is specifically made for breaking thrugh things like this, but again, not always lucky (greatly reduced/removed "thorns")) Pneumatic hammer attached to a steampunk construct: DT = 0 (or negative?) (The wall doesn't stand a chance, automatic success?)
Our DM likes to secretly have an HP to specific scenery. For example the roof of the crumbling ancient ruins that the sorcerer just threw a fireball under. We learned this the hard way, then we forget when we fought on a bridge a few sessions later.
This is exceedingly useful information for level 14+ illusion wizards as well, since this gives rules on how much hp the objects they create are worth once "real".
Player: Ok, Imma sneak attack the wall" GM: "That only works on creatures" Player: "It worked when Jim cast Animate Objects on those bricks" GM: "Well, those *became* creatures. An inanimate object can't be a creature, it needs consciousness or at least the ability to follow orders" Player: "Oh, cool. In that case I'll cast mending on Jim's severed head and ask him to animate the wall for me once the cleric revivify on him" GM: "Mending only works on objects, not creatures." Player: "IDK, Jim's looking pretty inanimate to me" - A summary of every single time the creature/object distinction comes up in play
As someone who once played an eldritch knight using his shield and hammer as catapult spell ammo, this information would've been very useful. Thanks a ton!
This was a useful video. It always bothered me rolling attacks against a stationary door and "missing" my attack. If we aren't in initiative I feel like it should be one of two scenarios. Either "No, you can't damage it" or "at that rate of damage it take this long to get through". Maybe the it's like a skill check. Roll and attack and then calculate how long it takes them based on how good it is.
Reminder, 5e doesn't have sunder-specific rules anymore. If you want to attack your enemies weapon or spell book or whatever it uses these rules too. Breaking their sword is a good way to debuff an opponent that's otherwise hard to put down, they're still alive and a threat, but you've kneecapped their damage if they don't have a backup with a lot less damage than it would take to put them down.
Zee, you rock. Your release schedule is almost as predictable as your broken commitments to your releases. I have enjoyed all of your content on TH-cam and am eagerly awaiting the next inspired contribution to the game I love. Keep it up.
My favorite little quirk with Shatter is taking Mason's Tools proficiency. One of the suggested uses for Mason's Tools proficiency in Xanathar's is Demoliton: "Your knowledge of masonry allows you to spot weak points in brick walls. You deal double damage to such structures with your weapon attacks." So if you inspect the wall and identify a weakspot you can cast Shatter on that particular spot for double damage. I homebrewed a whole rogue subclass about the interaction, actually.
Great somone brings this up!😂 My equal favorite ttrpg the Swedish Drakar och Demonar/ Dragons and Demons ( Drakebane/ Dragonbane ) is also kinda unclear. Objects have AC/ armor class but not all have hit points abd/ or resistance. So GM gotta make it up on the fly
how many peasants with knives do you need to stab the Earth to death in a single round?
I would say rocks fall.
Not even rocks fall, that is shoe levels
that's not how you do it. you find a warlock with hellish rebuke and shove him off a cliff. have him cast it on the earth when he hits the ground.
just get a god
@@hggpi This is the Way.
Zee, if I had the self confidence to tell my friends "no", I wouldn't be a DM
xD
This is peak
I'm f**king dead xD
you won the comment championship
"Will you DM for us?"
"N- ... okay sure"
These rules 100% exist because some wise guy said early on in the games history “this dungeon is fun and all but why don’t we just break through this wall and not mess with the puzzle traps?” Hence rules for individual sections of structures for one to attack and break through.
IIRC, one of the earliest solutions to the infamous Tomb of Horrors module was "a large group of dwarves with non-magical pickaxes/shovels".
@@webbowser8834 that's a nice tomb you have there, it would be a shame if someone dug through it.
@@webbowser8834 Isn't the Tomb of Horrors located in marshy swamplands, making a digging expedition incredibly impractical?
Not to mention, the multiple fake entrances that explode and that would kill your first few mining teams?
@@Introbulus Thankfully NPC's are a renewable resource... (at least until the DM gets tired of your bullshit)
I like to pickaxe firing holes in wood or stone if i know theres shit on the other side
I prefer the "lie to the player until the pacing feels right" method for obvious reasons 😂
Rolling a bunch of dice and completely ignoring them is peak dungeon mastering.
The way I do it with breaking down objects is that, unless there is some weird circumstance preventing the object from being damaged at all, the object will always break if the players hit it enough. The question is... how long will it take? For that I make them roll attack against the object and treat the attack roll like a skill check. The higher the roll, the quicker it breaks. If they roll very low it's possible a object could take days of wailing on it before it breaks.
@@Zulk_RS Or just make it an actual skill challenge. Strength obviously, but maybe also intelligence if someone wants to try and analyse where the weak points are and what are the best tools for the job. Do well on both checks and you identify a single keystone that can bring the whole wall down with a few minutes of violent smashing, fail them both and you hurl yourself feebly against the strongest portion of the wall for hours, do a bunch of injuries to yourselves and attract the attention of the people who built the wall and would rather it stay up.
@@johnnye87 It depends on how the PC wants to approach breaking the wall. Usually they just "Want to break down doors" and I make it an attack roll to figure out how long it takes
That's the main reason why I moved to running my games in Savage Worlds. Effectively, mooks have 2 HP, players and bosses have 5 (Damage calculation is different).
Now I can build encounters without needing to figure out how much HP a monster needs, and guesstimate the AC-like values. It's been a real relief, honestly. XD
If I, as a GM, stopped the game to calculate the hit point value of a wall on a rock by rock basis, my players would be well within their rights to simply beat me to death with their chairs.
Depending on your HP maybe the chairs would break before then
@@Womcataclysm don't forget to roll the hp for the chairs
@@izzyliberty8720 You'd need to roll for each chair leg, and each plank in the back section, and the planks in the seating section.
Additionally, you'd need to roll for each bone they attempt to break; they're going to need to work pretty hard to overcome that AC though.
It's almost enough to make one miss THAC0.
I think it’s a contextual thing. Like, if the wall is say just a bunch of cinder blocks held together with nothing t but gravity tracking them individually makes a bit more sense then a wall held together with mortar which at that point is effectively one thing.
But also if your player specifically is using shatter or a similar AOE then having a bunch of things with small HP is more beneficial to them then one large chunk.
@@mlp_firewind8129
HP is arbitrary. 1 million HP for a Pebble.
"You can't cut robe with hammer"
Observe:
🪢💥🔨🪢
If you hit it hard enough, you can still snape a rope, so it wasn’t the best example.
@KieraQ0323 so you can allow a hammer to cut rope with a Nat 20.
I think it'd be more accurate to say you can't cut a rope that's hanging loosely with blunt damage. If it's pulled taut you could realistically break it with blunt damage, though it'd still be substantially harder to do than with slashing or piercing.
@@asheronwindspear552the word is "crit" and objects r immune to criticals. Its about dmg.
"Have the confidence to say no" is a very valuable DM skill.
"Just raise the HP or have the confidence to say no."
That is basically all the advice you need to run any system.
Yup. After struggling with this on an adventure as my players tried to dig through rules on damaging stone doors, I (as a new DM) not wanting to deal with the players breaking the dungeon, opted to just say "No, this material is too hard, you fail."
@@pax6833 ”I cast Stone Shape.”
"okay, after repeatedly slashing at the table with your scimitar there are some grooves in the wood but your scimitar is now blunt and slightly bent, it now has the qualities of small club until you get it repaired. Also, roll a constitution save to avoid gaining a level of exhaustion."
@@burgernthemomrailer "With the stone wall now absent there is a minor landslide as loose rock and mud surge out of the hole. As you're below the water table all the surrounding soil is like a sea of mud, you can't tunnel through it without loose material from above falling in. You learn that the walls of the dungeon are placed there specifically to hold back the loose soil."
@@Treblaine “I cast Augury to figure out that that would’ve happened had I casted Stone Shape, then cast Passwall.”
Or:
“I cause my familiar to appear behind the wall, then Misty Step inside using its senses.”
Or:
“I cast Dimension Door.”
Or:
“I cast Polymorph to turn into an animal with a burrow speed.”
Or:
“I cast Fabricate and turn the mud and earth into structural supports.”
Or:
“I cast Water Breathing/Air Bubble and swim through the mud.”
I was just watching some of your older videos this morning over coffee. And now I know how much HP my coffeepot has.
And the Shadowrun player/GM in me can't help but remember that it even is on the list for improvised thrown weapons (along with fun things like a 'metahuman body' for really fun bar fights. Damage scales with the thrown person's body-attribute btw.)
Turns out the saying is true after all: coffee helps with everything - including stupid people. You just need to throw the mug hard enough.
And how many hit points does your coffee maker have?
@@CrisMind let me check.
@@CrisMind ...Not _enough._
That means you can work out how much unarmed damage you do.
What a convenient time to see this video as I am writing terrain destruction rules for my Deep Rock Galactic homebrew
Rock and Stone, brother! :P
ROCK....AND....STONE!!!!
If you rock and stone, you're never alone!
ROCK AND STONE
We are unbreakable!
"You not gonna cut a rope with a hammer!"
"Not with that attitude!" - Shouted the barbarian, smashing the rope so hard it catched fire and the rock beneath it melted.
See I was thinking I'd use the other side of the hammer, you know, the side that's used for pulling nails, since it's sharper you could use it to saw through, or, tie the rope to it, and just pull until it snaps
It *might* be possible to cut a rope with a hammer if it's under tension
Though it's more like tearing it
Yeah, this topic is incredibly hard to deal with especially if the dm is unprepared so this is a great video to give a dm ideas in a short 5 minutes on what to do when the party says "yeah we'll just try and take out the foundations of the castle to bring the whole thing down" (Yes that happened. No, I was not one of the party members trying to do this. I was going to use stealth)
That's something real castles had to deal with! More for walls, but they had "sappers" that would tunnel underneath to collapse sections.
“Does sneak attack work on a castle?”
Also NEVER give your players a Pick or Maul of the Titans. Every wall is now a door.
@@LtFoeHammer This is the origin of the term "undermining."
@LtFoeHammer its also why most towers are cylinders. Having a foundation with corners means you can collapse one with just one weakened corner. Having a foundation without means you gotta dig out a bigger section
3:41 Well that's my favorite character now. All hail Socky, the overly critical sock-puppet™️
A segment of wall containing 30 bricks is MUCH stronger than 30 bricks just lying around.
I'd probably increase the AC by a bit based on it's Mortar Bonus.
At that point you’d be tracking thirty individual tiny bricks which would simply have less Hp than the collective large wall. I don’t think wall form makes it harder to hit necessarily.
Medieval mortar was just wet clay, it’s only function was to provide more surface area for the bricks to stack on one another, providing greater stability. I think you should instead just increase the total structure’s hp, making it just as easy to dig through with pickaxes, or bust through with a max level paladin smite, but the wall itself less likely to collapse.
I'd say it depends. Aggregations of hard things can be more resilient to certain stresses than those same things stuck together with glue or mortar. The Practical Engineer goes into this kind of stuff pretty well if folks are interested in digging into the topic.
For RPG purposes I think it's more important to take story context into account than to be realistic. Under what socioeconomic circumstances was the wall built, and to what end? The same materials will go together differently when built by experts intent on protecting something they care about vs non-craftspeople throwing something together because somebody said they'd be killed if they didn't. It's also not necessary to go into combat rounds to break down a wall that isn't fighting back. All that's needed is to consider how much time the party is willing to spend and the consequences of that time and the noises they'll make in the process. There's no need to roll dice at all. If the party has no appropriate tools or experience and they're trying to be stealthy, they can't break through a stone wall. If they're well equipped intrusion experts, they might have a move speed through walls and only take a slight penalty to stealth while using it.
TL;DR: if I'm rolling for the hp of a wall, it's a stalling tactic, not an attempt to maintain a certain level of realism.
I wouldn't touch the AC for the material. The bonus I would grant the put-together structure would be to increase the minimum damage threshold. So an individual brick and a wall both have the same AC and vulnerabilities, but the wall would require you to deal a set number of damage, otherwise it is ignored because of how structurally sound it is (and of course, poorly built structures may not have such luxuries).
This suggests that mortar kinda sorta functions like object armor that takes hours to days to “don”, depending on number of bricks and how many assistants you have.
It also suggests that there’s +1 mortar designed an architect wizard somewhere out there.
"Wouldn't cut a rope with a hammer,"
Me Laughs in Barbarian.
I have, in fact, cut rope with a hammer many times.
Either the rope is between a rock and the peen of the hammer, or the rope is between wood and the claw of the hammer.
-
When you're a kid, building a tree fort you make do instead of walking half an hour home to get a knife or scissors.
Rage can cut anything😂
@@MonkeyJedi99 Ripping isn't the same as cutting
@@ggwp1847 to the person who is now falling into the undying infinite abyss it is…
@MonkeyJedi99 this was my thought at first. Just smash it with a hammer against another hard object, and then I simplified my thought to a barbarian would do it.
So how much damage would I need to destroy a planet?
... Asking for a friend.
Calculate the volume of your planet then divide it into roughly castle sized peices made of stone with 500 hp. Remove hp for when players attack things like trees and neutral or good npcs. If the planet hits about a third of that hp have volcanos start generating everywhere, with volcanic eruptions building that hp back up by a certain percentage.
Well kinda depends I would say the reply above is probably a good idea. That is if it isn’t a genius loci as the liquid that is produced would probably block up volcanoes that generate at least in some capacity.
If we assume that Moon formed as a result of megaimpact, then ... even collision with a dwarf planet is probably not enough.
100,000 for Alderaan
1 for Krypton
Ok so one stick of dynamite in dnd does 3d6 bludgeoning damaged and wikipedia says that the average stick contains around 1 megajoule of energy (1 million joules). For simplicitys sake lets say the max roll for a stick is equal to 1 MJ, so 18 points of damage. The gravitational binding energy of earth, which is basically the amount of energy that holds the earth together, is 2.49x10^32 joules so we need to exceed this amount to theoretically destroy the earth. So dividing that number by the 1 million joules to get the number of sticks of dynamite you would need (in reality it would prob be a lot more), 2.49x10^26 sticks and then times that by the max dmg, 18, to get 4.48x10^27 or in other words 4.48 Octillion points of damage. Thats 4.7 septillion meteor swarms with all 4 orbs in each hitting with max damage. In conclusion if u wanna destroy the planet in 5e... idk just use wish i guess. Or just give it a more achievable hitpoint value lmao
(I almost certainly got a bunch of stuff wrong in this but its still prob a decent approximation)
Fun idea, martial feat that allows a character using a shield or plate/metal armor to use their object HP as temporary hit points. When those hit points are lost the item is damaged. For shields you lose the AC bonus, for armors critical threat range is increased.
I have actually seen an ability line this, but only in a very scuffed FF themed Pathfinder game called FF d20.
One of the Knight Talents is called Armored Sacrifice. When themselves or an ally would be killed, they can instead direct the attack to the suit of armor they’re wearing or a shield they are using. The armor takes the damage and its hardness (the amount of damage resistance objects have) is cut in half for that attack.
And, once again, fellas invent pathfinder, trying to make dnd less boring
@@ЗлодейБританец-э6й to be fair my first ever TTRPG was pathfinder and I was reminded of the Sundering rules. Its been awhile since I played PF so I cant remember if there was a direct feat for it involving armor
That's just how shields work in Pathfinder 2e. Use an action to raise shield for ac bonus (pf2e has a 3 action system), and if shield is raised you can use a reaction to block an attack and reduce damage
So you’re going to make Martials spend all their money on replacement equipment while distance combat characters can wield their invincible shield and wear unbreakable leather, for the benefit of some temp hp which doesn’t scale with the character unless they keep buying/finding better and better armor?
THANK YOU! I keep talking to people about generic objects in D&D and now someone finally puts a light on it! this is one of the things that can really enhance playing a strong martial character, a lot of those "barbarian doesnt know what to do other than attack" issues go away when the barbarian realizes "attack" became "Enviromental interaction"
"You're not going to cut a rope with a hammer."
Sir, I have reliable talent. I can cut it with a toothpick.
Narratively: Your DM can just say. No.
Sure you can't CUT a rope with a hammer but you can grind it down with a hammer
Pulp the rope with a hammer
"Immune to bludgeoning damage"
Throw some rope in a hydraulic press and tell me that it's immune to Bludgeoning damage.
0:06 I take so many offenses to that stat block, I don't even know where to start.
The lil guy is immune to death but isn’t allowed to have common sense
Somehow having a +5 to Dex despite only having a 19 stat, and yet SOMEHOW despite having a +5 Dex mod, chain mail and a sheild, only managing to have a AC of 11.
Having a -2 in strength despite having a score of merely 5.
It's just placeholder values on a Homebrewery monster statblock. You should see the features these filler creatures have.
Fr though. How did it get +5 to hp when it only has +1 to Con. Also, I wish I was immune to death lol.
“Why can’t I fireball this table?”
“It’s mahogany”
simply get a civil engineering degree
If I could math that good, I'd be playing pathfinder. 😏
"You are not gonna cut a rope with a hammer"
Hammer of Sharpness: Bet
aint that just a fancy axe?
@@phareye5079 perception is reality
Zee, I love and hate your timing on this upload man. I've been in the middle of preparing a sruvival campagin for a few days now, was just getting around to object HP stuff and breaking your weapons and tools, etc, and had basically juat resigned to borrowing stuff from Pathfinder 1e when you uploaded this. Still, you got me before I actually started the campaign, so now I am both thrilled and also humiliated. So thank you! And curse you!
I still like the pf1e method, it has easy tables plus hardness to make things simple and consistent.
Objects are immune to effects caused by CON Saves? Huh, i guess that's why Shatter has specific text indicating that it automatically damages objects...
yes but if it does 20 hp damage the timberwolf battlemech is like ah cute and is not realy efetveed at all bescue its left leg still has like over 3000hp still in the hit lofaction then bascly blasts you with a UAC 10 thats bacly does 1000hp in a 8 meter raduis that roll for two shots eacth that bacly do 1000hp 2000hp if it crits.
You broke these rules down and it still sounds complicated lmao.
I once had a player use stone shape to remove a section of wall next to a puzzle door to bypass it, just as another player solved the door's puzzle.
The player was panicking though... I accidentally created a situation that was FAR more terrifying to the party than I had intended it to be. After entering the dungeon, the floor behind them rose up & activated a Sphere of Annihilation, so they could now only move forwards. The sphere was the width of the hallway and moved 5 feet towards the players every round. While the party was exploring the dungeon out of combat, this meant moving 5 feet for every 30 feet the party moved, and while solving puzzles it meant moving 5 feet every 6 real-world seconds. The sphere NEVER got anywhere NEAR the party... The players saw it moving on the map, but only until they turned the first corner of the first hallway in that dungeon and then never saw it again until they needed to at the end. When they reached the treasure room, they looted it and had to wait for the sphere to catch up to them to exit, at which point the sphere part broke leaving behind a construct that was meant to be the final boss. The party was still to scared to fight it though, and I basically had to just allow them to break a wall to get out of the boss room & leave the dungeon to allow the game to progress at all...
It was supposed to be a little scary, but I underestimated the effect it would have on the party. All it really did, from a purely mechanics point of view, was remove the ability to take a Short Rest inside the dungeon, and the dungeon only had two combats and three puzzles. I was inspired to create this dungeon primarily by Pikmin 2's Water Wraith.
In regards to damage threshold, I do agree that it's usually better to just pick a lane and either say they can break through or can't, but the one situation where it does come in handy is a tense situation where the players need to get through *quickly*. If it's a time crunch, they're in initiative, and trying desperately to break in/out of somewhere, the damage threshold mechanic works well as a hit-by-hit basis to show whether the characters can get the job done under pressure. Otherwise, it's just another step to slow things down if they aren't on a time limit.
As a DM
I NEEDED this information
For that one moment I can tell my PCs and wow them
I love the idea of a big-ass building having a high AC and you don't roll high enough. "What do you MEAN I missed? It's 100 feet wide!" Literally can't hit the broad side of a barn.
"You missed!... with a cannon!" - cookie to you if you recognize that incredible generic and niche reference.
well its not that you missed, its more that you didn't do damage to the structure. like the weapon just bounces off the surface.
I think damage threshold means how toughness works in BG3: unless you do at least the threshold's damage (say, like, 20) than you do no damage at all
High AC doesn't necessarily mean the player misses. The classic "high AC" character is a knight in full armor with a shield after all, If you fail an attack against a them you probably hit their shield or armor and did no damage. But if the PC is fighting a ninja monk with no armor then 'narratively' they dodge or duck out of the way.
AC is ARMOR class, not DODGE class
welp, guess my next character is going to be a construction/demolition worker with a big hammer
Always a good day when a new Zee video drops. Keep up the great work. Looking forward to seeing more of the Cold Road story.
I think that players attacking objects is reasonably good space for rule improvising, but this makes a great framework for making rules on the fly. It has a few things to keep in mind and tools for the DM without being too excessive.
I love the jazz/supermarket version of Chopin you have in the background!
Honestly, I thought BG3 did this well with STURDY, and only certain portions of walls, etc. were ‘breakable’.
Love watching these dives into stuff ive never thought about. They are always so interesting. Plus fun art to watch. Keep up the amazing work
"You're not going to cut a rope with a hammer."
That sounds like a challenge to me.
I love how you break down DnD stuff! Gives me lots of ideas and ways of thinking for my own system I'm working on. You're an inspiration!
For castles and similar, take a page from BG3 say “I’m sorry. It seems a magical barrier is protecting the castle’s structure. You need to dispel the magic or deal more than 20 damage for a section to be damaged.”
The best part is that players will kinda immediately understand that they should find another way in, because an obviously made up 'plot device' is protecting it, even if that plot device isn't particularly strong. That's just having the confidence to say no but with extra steps
The commentary in your videos is always amusing and informative
So thank you
I feel TTRPG books could stand to feel a bit more comfortable saying "Who gives a shit? Just make it up."
If they said that there'd be no point in buying them. (Aside from art, I guess)
@@Technotoadnotafrog Some things you need professional game writers to work out the mechanics of. Some things not so much.
Absolutely incredible use of a jazz version of Chopin's prelude in E minor for the section of the video where we are now in terrifying ruling territory
Leaving it off the credits in the description was a let down. I wanted to look into it more.
But now the real question. Does a still object have the paralyzed condition?
Zee may accidentally create a meme of trying to cut rope with hammers, which now I want to see I Did a Thing attempt to make a rope-cutting smasher hammer
I've never had to use these rules and after hearing them broken down like this I'm definitely not going to use them
Ok that sign at 1:32 is A+ work, now I need to go cry in a corner thanks to PTSD regarding scheduling
Now I need to know: Is a rubics cube a single object or 26 smaller objects to break, asking for an orc.
If my uncle & his 22 have anything to say about it, 26 pieces isn't enough pieces (He got frustrated with one & shot it to hell in a firing range is why)
New Gordion Knot dropped
I can’t express how much I love the art style and smooth animation of these videos.
Woo more Zee!
I have been reminded how confusing some rules can be, it's quite mind boggling.
Thanks Zee for this headache, I shall steal your left socks when you least expect it.
where tf is that on the books 💀
it's in the Basic Rules book. It might also be in the Dungeon Master's Guide but I haven't confirmed that
Dmg I believe
The little goblin in these videos is still my favorite character. I hope you never get tired of drawing them.
1:04 What in tarnation is a WILL save?
Really well broken down. Nice work and animations!!! Love your work keep it up!
So this means that plate armors have at most 18 hp, so when you hit an opponent for more damage, their armor is destroyed? XD (it would be so stupid lol)
In 3.5 and Pathfinder that would be called Sunder. It’s a special attack type where you aim for enemy equipment instead of the enemy. As with all things in 3.5/Pathfinder, it takes several feats to become any good at it.
Weapons are easy enough to understand. All weapons start with 10 hardness (5 for wooden polearms) and their HP is based on if they’re light, one handed, and two handed. A mundane 2 handed weapon has 10 hardness and 10 HP. Which seems… alarmingly small to me. Thankfully the hardness and HP both rise as they are enchanted.
Armor is confusing because instead its stats are based on the material it’s made of, and there’s a table where you can figure out how much HP it should have based on thickness. I don’t know anything about that, but I do know that everything made of leather and below is soft enough to get sundered in a single strike if you try.
Most people don’t use Sundering for 2 reasons. 1, it tends to destroy loot that the party wants to use for themselves. 2, it’s just not fun if you have a weapon you love dearly and someone snaps it in half. It can be dramatic, but otherwise it’s just like a monster attacking your wallet directly.
Typically you're slipping a blade between the plates of armor, or stabbing at the neck or groin when damaging an armored opponent. Though yes in older editions and other games, you can sunder armor as an action or take a feat/ability that allows you to do it.
@@lolly9804 Yeah, for weapons. But not with a fireball, lightning bolt, or like the spell that literally destroys items and the only reason it does not destroy equipment is to not abuse it, called disintegration :D
@@GlawiousAldredMarci Takes a lot of heat to burn a body to ash, even more so for metal to melt. Though sure, you're right, it's unrealistic that armor durability doesn't go down every time a magical blast of fire is aimed at the person it's protecting. If you want to be the DM that keeps a track of hundreds of object HP totals, more power to you.
One DND session I had had an tourist trap called "The Unbreakable rock", an rock that was an giant gold nugget with enchanted gems on it. It resisted all elemental elements (fire, water, light, etc.) so only non elemental physical or non elemental magical was effective on it. It had 9 googleplexians of HP, with 9's running all along down it. It also healed for it's max HP every turn. It was the main attraction of an town called Castle Dour. It raked them in huge amounts of money. Castle Dours town came under siege later in the campaign, and the unbreakable rock was the one thing unaffected by the seige, with seiger NPC's trying to break it in order to remove the crystals. Me and my party grew to love the rock so much that even though it was invincible, we took care the seigers. The town was repaired... The next siege though wasn't so lucky... The main antagonist, an 200 IQ dragon of corruption, flew over to where Castle Dour was... When we arrived it was already gone and the town was scorched with corruptive purple fire and corrupt purple gunk that pooled in such a way that they were deep pond pockets in streets. We didn't even notice that the unbreakable rock had lost it's golden splendor and was split in half until the DM said: "You find an familiar piece of stone... with 4 pieces where enchanted gems should be... Bereft of golden splendor"...
This hinted that the antagonist was capable of destroying it, effortlessly we are told how if the rock was destroyed, then the main antagonist easily dealt 10 googolplex'es of damage. And that we would need to search high and low to fight the main antagonist, or use an diplomatic solution... Lest we end up dragon food.
There's something very pleasant about how much use Zee gets out of the Example Goblins this episode.
Love seeing those little guys.
This is why when a character falls in acid they might come out naked if they come out at all
Object health is one of the classic examples of ‘the rules are there if you NEED them’ in my eyes. Like in pathfinder there’s a bunch of rules about social interactions, ‘make an impression’ and so on and so forth but they are just there in case you as a DM or group are unsure of how to codify those encounters and want an example.
I played as a Barbarian in a campaign one time who had an Adamantine Pickaxe, and we were gonna get cheeky and break through some walls in a dungeon. This dungeon was a Pyramid in the middle of the jungle in the middle of a desert. It was also linked to the Feywild. So when I cut through a wall, all we saw was an infinite void like you'd see when you no-clip under the ground in a video game. It was funny, we were like Ok dont try that again.
Nice! I love the old school ASB look. I saw this and wondered why I'd never watched it before, then realized the dang thing had only been uploaded today!
I just love the idea of telling my table keep attacking the wall all the while the only thing I’m tracking is the suspense.
I actually had a player who collapsed an entire building. He was a Minotaur and built for single hit damage, he had gone in to save one of the other players but it was an ambush and they got surrounded. His solution after I told him they were in an old rickety wooden building was to put the other player on his back and charge out of there doing as much damage to the structure as he could. The building collapsed as he came barreling out. It was one of the greatest moves I’ve seen in D&D
Nice video! Hard to find interesting topics for a system that's 10 years old, but you did it!
Perfect timing, Zee! One of my players just asked me if they can break enemies' weapons with their new adamantine hammer and I wasn't sure how to go about it but your video really helped, thank you!
Accidentally clicked the notification when it popped up and was pleasantly surprised to see the zee
The object ac and hp table is one of the best discoveries i made i literally use it every session
>Be an Abyssal Tiefling Bloodrager(same) in Pathfinder 1
>GET BEEEG!!
>Have a +2 Keen, Adamantine Greatsword named "crowbar"
>Laugh at any and all numbers objects raise to oppose you
>Get polymorphed into a sheep
snapshot of every barbarian's campaign life
Remember DMs. We can say "no". Or in some cases, "yes, but...".
Don't be afraid to override the DMG's ruling too. I had a player tell me a stone wall was 15 ac. I told him the wall was made from a different, more durable stone. It turned into an argument. In the end, I caved but now that I'm more experienced I would rule it differently.
"You're not going to cut a rope with a hammer."
Zuretta, my Tiefling Barbarian, "The fuck I won't."
The background music was so good, that I decided old wooden chairs are unbreakable.
Nice. Informative. Always a pleasure!
I really liked in previous videos how you sited the page and lines in the source material like the PHB. Makes the communication and rules seem much more founded in an authority, and dramatically engages the listener.
"Page 227 of the PHB states..."
Sorry idk if you read these at all but theres an unsolicited opinion for you!
Great video as always.
This was a masterclass! Thanks Zee!
Zee: "You're not gonna cut a rope with a hammer"
Me: Oh ye of little faith
As a sorcerer who's signature move is Animate Objects, this is VERY useful...
Such an informative video. Thanks, Zee.
One of my favorite things about 3.5 is the drunken Monk prestige class that has proficiency with improvised weapons. Pulling out a mithral table from your portable hole in beating people with it was such a great feeling
Love your video man. I just have my players roll based on if they have a heavy weapon or not. Great sword two hits big tables, one shot if high rolled. Normal sword on big table needs about 5 or 6 maybe less if good rolls happen.
BG3 had several objects that required a minimum damage amount, one that comes to mind was the wall above the goblin camp needing more than 20 damage to inflict (at low level).
The timing of this video is rather convenient, as my players are debating about how to drive off a young green dragon, one concept they had was knocking down the stone tower the dragon roosted in.
You are the best DND TH-camr, easily. You don't have as much content as others do, but the quality is absolutely sensational.
You're so good, I'm going to subscribe to someone for the first time ever.
Fun! Love theory crafting you do!
Huh, now I know how to run an idea that I had knocking around in my head for a long time. Now I have lots of ideas how to do a lot of things with my original idea. Brilliant, simply brilliant.
I would say the "damage threshold" depends on what you're using:
Un-armed: maybe DT = 19 (MOST of the times, it is REALLY going to hurt in your hands), (maybe it even have some mild kind of "thorns" effect too)
Hammer: maybe DT = 12 (Some times you have a bad hit, hit something particularly hard, and the impact goes into the handle & hurts you (see above too))
Pick axe: DT = 7 (it is specifically made for breaking thrugh things like this, but again, not always lucky (greatly reduced/removed "thorns"))
Pneumatic hammer attached to a steampunk construct: DT = 0 (or negative?) (The wall doesn't stand a chance, automatic success?)
Our DM likes to secretly have an HP to specific scenery. For example the roof of the crumbling ancient ruins that the sorcerer just threw a fireball under. We learned this the hard way, then we forget when we fought on a bridge a few sessions later.
Grobulin, Animated victim. Tiny guy, chaotic sloppy. Also love that he is apparently immune to melancholy and death.
Very important in his line of work.
This is exceedingly useful information for level 14+ illusion wizards as well, since this gives rules on how much hp the objects they create are worth once "real".
Player: Ok, Imma sneak attack the wall"
GM: "That only works on creatures"
Player: "It worked when Jim cast Animate Objects on those bricks"
GM: "Well, those *became* creatures. An inanimate object can't be a creature, it needs consciousness or at least the ability to follow orders"
Player: "Oh, cool. In that case I'll cast mending on Jim's severed head and ask him to animate the wall for me once the cleric revivify on him"
GM: "Mending only works on objects, not creatures."
Player: "IDK, Jim's looking pretty inanimate to me"
- A summary of every single time the creature/object distinction comes up in play
As someone who once played an eldritch knight using his shield and hammer as catapult spell ammo, this information would've been very useful. Thanks a ton!
'scheduling conflicts that won't let your group get together' - WE HAVE THE IMMOVABLE OBJECT!!!!!
now, where's that irresistible force?
This was a useful video. It always bothered me rolling attacks against a stationary door and "missing" my attack. If we aren't in initiative I feel like it should be one of two scenarios. Either "No, you can't damage it" or "at that rate of damage it take this long to get through". Maybe the it's like a skill check. Roll and attack and then calculate how long it takes them based on how good it is.
Reminder, 5e doesn't have sunder-specific rules anymore.
If you want to attack your enemies weapon or spell book or whatever it uses these rules too. Breaking their sword is a good way to debuff an opponent that's otherwise hard to put down, they're still alive and a threat, but you've kneecapped their damage if they don't have a backup with a lot less damage than it would take to put them down.
"If it gets past large it stops being objects and starts being terrain."
Zee, you rock. Your release schedule is almost as predictable as your broken commitments to your releases. I have enjoyed all of your content on TH-cam and am eagerly awaiting the next inspired contribution to the game I love. Keep it up.
My favorite little quirk with Shatter is taking Mason's Tools proficiency. One of the suggested uses for Mason's Tools proficiency in Xanathar's is Demoliton: "Your knowledge of masonry allows you to spot weak points in brick walls. You deal double damage to such structures with your weapon attacks." So if you inspect the wall and identify a weakspot you can cast Shatter on that particular spot for double damage. I homebrewed a whole rogue subclass about the interaction, actually.
Zee: "You're not gonna cut a rope with a hammer"
Me, an intellectual Barbarian: "Challenge accepted!"
I saw that Magic Mouth, and I appreciate you putting it in the video.
"You're not going to cut a rope with a hammer."
WATCH ME!
Anyone else see the goblin in this video and think "Gabriella"? I miss Gabriella.
Great somone brings this up!😂 My equal favorite ttrpg the Swedish Drakar och Demonar/ Dragons and Demons ( Drakebane/ Dragonbane ) is also kinda unclear. Objects have AC/ armor class but not all have hit points abd/ or resistance. So GM gotta make it up on the fly