ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ส.ค. 2024
- I've seen some Neumann TLM 103 clones out there, and one of the more legitimate ones seemed to be the GoToToolz GTZ 103. I decided to test one out and compare it not only to a real Neumann TLM 103, but also to some other mics in a similar price range to the GTZ 103.
Any support is appreciated. Thanks!
/ bigtb1717
00:00 Intro
01:04 Mic Details, Questionable Fakery
02:23 Incorrect Claims
03:33 Sound and Build Quality
04:41 Included Accessories
07:24 Comparisons - Neat Worker Bee II
08:37 Comparisons - AT2020
09:26 Comparisons - Tascam TM-280
10:24 Comparisons - TLM 103 - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
I think we should reconsider selling ones with Neumann logo. It’s true unit could be resale as original Neumann. However, it’s plenty information online how to spot fake 103, we made a few videos by ourselves to help people be informed. And so I have doubts that anyone will try to do that. When I first started do what I do my first clients were studios owners here in NYC. They had a lot of clients that smoked weed in studio and don’t know how to use recording gear carefully and properly, so idea to replace expensive Neumann equipment with affordable clones just to save studios owners some nerves and money were what created GTZ brand from a ground. I’ve never thought about making exact copy of something to make more money. All my last projects and designs don’t have any reference at all! To be honest I’m proud of it: GTZ9 is our new top seller.
Maybe I'll check out the GTZ9. Sounds interesting. Cheers!
It is stealing somebody's intellectual property and in the same time you are the sponsor of Chinese economy. Congratulations!
please show us a link of your video helping people getting informed
That noise floor difference , in the direct comparison 😮
Wow such a great and sane review! I like that you do proper A/B testing, and that you are not thinking that super expensive microphones sound that much better.
This lookalike does sound a lot different, and noise floor is important for a pro. But a person who can not distinguish between them, is better off with the clone probably :D
Still, cloning a product is equal to stealing, and it is a true crime.
Wow..... In the direct test between the clone and the real Neuman, my ears can't tell much of a difference!!!! You point out the price to performance ration and I think you are right on the money! There are other things like proximity effect and variations in voices or instrument frequencies and ranges that could make a difference, but with your voice it sounded great!!!!! I could easily use the Chinese copy for voice over with no problems! One curious thing I noticed from the test was that some of the compared mikes sounded just as good as the clone!!! People should keep that in mind especially when noting you "tapping" test that revealed a real resonance problem with the clone. Based on that factor, it might be better to go with the non-rattling AT 2020 or Tascam TM-280 (which I'm not familiar with). TERRIFIC COMPARISON!!! Many thanks BIG!!!!!!
there is more raspy high end on gtz103 than the original tlm103. also, the original has a more "beefy" mid range and low end, which might just mean the original is probably a more flat response in the mid range as opposed to the gtz103 which might not be as flat. the gtz103 can get a little too crisp on the high end, but depending on one's voice, that raspy-ness might actually help clarity. it's different, but it's pretty dang close. proximity effect is strong on the gtz, creating more mid and bass the closer you get to the mic.
Can you give a link to purchase this specific model? I went to a website and there were different types of GTZ103’s.
Excellent review. There's another model called the GTZ103+ which is supposed to have an upgraded capsule and is $100 more. I wonder how that one stacks up.
the new capsule have less noise
It's definitely step up. 103+ version is my go to vocal mic.
@InnaAlex I'm thinking of this. I really justify paying the Neumann brand so I would like something similar but cheaper.
Do you have any recordings of it I Could hear?
The real 103 definitely sounds boosted a bit from 800-2.2k I bought one off Temu was kinda feeling it fur $25 even recorded a session with it lol
I can hear some unpleasant resonances around 9k in the GTZ, where the TLM is smoother. Also, the TLM is a bit fatter in the mids or low mids. Can't say if it justifies ten times the price, as you said there's a diminishing return with price/performance.
Also in other reviews, I've not heard or seen any issues with the screw fitting mechanism, however, that could be luck of the draw with the paint finish. It would be easy to gently wool brush any excess paint layer off the screw thread and then should hopefully tighten up correctly. By all accounts the sound of the GT mics sound very good, given the price. I always hear, the mic sounds harsh, or the eq is different, in terms of mic curve. No mic is perfect and does not need eq and or de-essing on vocals at some stage. Ultimately ask yourself this, for that amazing price and extremely good sound, is anyone going to hear the difference, especially in a mix, would anyone know apart from the buyer and user? No. Finally, I've heard some top mics and other mics around this price point and greater in cost, which sound terrible, these mics sound v good, dare I say a little brighter and richer in the mid range than the Neumann, shock horror, and for 200 bucks or so, saving 3000, or so, imho, it's a no brainer. The mic police won't arrest you for getting it :)
So what is the price of the GTZ103 mic, and who is selling them???
GoToToolz is the name of the company selling them. They can be found on eBay as well.
There‘s a big difference in the highs. Neumann smooth, Gtz sharp.
throw some soothe on it ;)
Why didn’t you do a spectral analysis?
Just not something I've bothered to do on my mic reviews. Maybe I'll start at some point, but nothing planned right now.
To me, the GTZ 103 seems to have a slightly "sculpted" sound. Some will no doubt like the sound, but I tend to prefer a slightly flatter sound. In terms of performance and self noise, I'd say it's relatively close to others in its price range. So if you like the sound, I think it's a fairly safe bet. Just still not sure how to feel about them offering a Neumann branded version. If you like the sound, you might even prefer it over the TLM 103, but I definitely wouldn't say it's a sound-alike to the TLM-103.
What site did you order from???
I ordered directly from the Gototoolz website.
gtz103 says it's a large diameter condenser microphone, but the diaphragm is only 3/4 inch, not 1 inch like many other so-called large diameter mics. i wonder if the original tlm103 has a larger diaphragm. i haven't seen an actual frequency response for the gtz103, i wonder if anyone has actually tested it and graphed it. in this video, the voice sounded about the same, but if someone had a shrill voice, it might not sound as good, whereas the original might not sound as shrill.
There are a lot of mics that tend to get classified as "large" diaphragm mics that have sub-1" diaphragms. Still, the TLM-103 does have a much larger diaphragm than the GTZ-103. I'd say at least 1", but looks slightly larger to me.
@@bigtb1717 i just bought a gtz103ai and i'm testing it out. on my voice, i'm worried that it makes the higher end of my voice sound shrill, especially when you turn up the volume level. whereas i think i need a stronger mid. the high end clarity is great on this mic but the mid range using my voice lacks power. so it's definitely emphasizing my upper vocal crisp, rasp, but not emphasizing enough the mid range. i heard that at NPR where they use the u87ai, they use no processing or eq, just straight from the microphone. i don't know if they could do that on the tlm103 but maybe. they'd probably have to eq the gtz103. the gtz103 definitely is not muddy or lacking clarity like so many cheap chinese microphones, but it does lack punch in the mid range, a least with my voice. my question is, is it legit to eq a microphone, or should i search for a microphone that sounds good with my voice straight out of the box? is NPR studios a typical set up or is it strange not to process audio these days?
I'm sure there are big studios that do and those that don't apply any kind of EQ. I wouldn't worry about that. If you can get the mic you have to sound the way you want with a little EQ, go for it. On the other hand, if you don't want to have to go through the process of adding EQ or if you can't get the mic to sound the way you want with EQ, then maybe it would be worth trying something else.
But I wouldn't worry about what is or isn't the "correct" way to achieve a given result. If you find a method that achieves a result you are happy with, then it's legit, regardless of what others are doing.
@@bigtb1717 that makes sense, so i think i'll keep experimenting with the gtx103, i'm going to put a wind screen over it to see if that knocks down the high end sharpness a little, or use a pop filter and work the mic closer to increase mids and lows, finally, i might tweek with the eq a little bit as a last resort, also, i'll be trying off axis positioning. if in the end, i can't get the results i'm looking for, i may return it within 30 days.
If it sounds good without EQ just leave it. If it doesn't sound good, just start turning knobs until it does. That's the only real "secret" to good recording: do whatever is needed to make it sound good.
I think the GTZ sounds quite nasally in comparison to the Naumann, I think the worker bee was better too!
they definitely sound identical, but the GTZ has more noise
What do you mean when you say Neumann branded version?
I'm referring to the GoToToolz mic that says Neumann TLM 103, Made In Germany on it, and has a Neumann logo on it.
@@bigtb1717 Oh yea, I Just thought that was obvious hah. Saying something is "something" branded usually means that's the actual brand. Saying something modelled to look like, or after a certain brand, or in the style of a brand, or a clone of a brand would be the GTZ
@@bigtb1717 They don't say Neumann on it. Again it has a logo that's meant to look like one, or has a logo very close in shape, and colour, but a Neumann logo, is a Neumann logo lol. It would be Neumann style logo, not a Neumann logo.
I just meant the one that was made with a fake Neumann logo, that said Neumann TLM 103 on it, and said Made in Germany on it. I guess I could have said "the fake Neumann." As opposed to the "real" Neumann I also tested in the video. It wasn't just "Neumann branded," it was a Neumann, lol.
@@bigtb1717 Sorry, disregard my last comment, if I'm confused here. So that one on the right with that says Neumann is made by GTZ, and isn't a real TLM? The reason I was confused is because in my mind I was just thinking that one was an actual Neumann, and you were referring to the GTZ purple logo one on the left when you said Neumann logo, because I just thought the other one wasn't even in question since I thought it was an actual TLM 103 hah.
The microphones that GTZ offer on ebay look very similar to microphones that are being offered on Alibaba for considerably less money. I have watched a test of a Chinese TLM 103 copy here on TH-cam and it sounds very similar to the GTZ one at least in my ears.
The claim is that they are hand made and hand tuned. Maybe there is something to that claim, or maybe they simply buy generic mic bodies and capsules and solder a little diode to the back that may or may not even do anything, just so they can claim it is "custom made" in the US.
It would be very interesting to see more detail into how these mics are "made" by GoToToolz.
Has anyone opened them up so we can see the circuit/components and capsule they use?
@@AlexButler10 I took them apart. I should have shown it in the video. Maybe I'll make a follow-up.
@@bigtb1717it’s definitely Chinese wholesale. The 1:1 u87 counterfeit one looks exactly like the real thing and similar internals still doesn’t sound like OG. It’s like $600 ..I think what GTZ is doing is just sourcing the bodies of the cheaper Chinese counterfeits and the badges. Because where would you buy replica badges from in the states? I think Neumann does sell replacement parts but not in bulk.
in fact they are all made in China , i did open one and the board inside is the same found in some chinese models , also the gtz guy dont know anything about electronics , He cant say what componant on the board does what ...
It's not a drastic difference. It's super minimal.
A little noise gate will take care of that noise floor.
Then every voice is different so EQ your voice how you like it.
To be fair - the TLM103 is a musicians microphone - I really don't understand why any voice over person would look at this microphone unless it is for Disney level productions. the Rode SM7B would suffice for Voice overs. When the TLM103 really shows its literal superiority over other microphones in Audio recording for music. that said - I wonder if an RK47 mod of the GTZ103 would be a possibility
And to go even further, something far cheaper than a Shure SM7B could be used for most voice-overs/podcasts.
@@bigtb1717 I have used the SM57 for a professional podcast setting for the longest time and the sound quality was definitely 9/10 the same compared to the later SM7B! Could have 4 guests for the price of one :P Also, forgot to mention - how come you dont have tens of thousands of views? your reviews are very professional, keep it up! greets from Amsterdam.
Thanks for the kind words. And yeah, the SM57 sounds a bit different than the SM7B, but not worse. I really like it.
GTZ 103 actually sounded not bad to me. It would've been fine if they took the Neumann TLM 103 design, made it a squircle shape, colored it with the darkest gray, and sold it with a much lower price (considering its build quality). Then the budget consumers will eat it up like the BM-800.
It definitely seemed to have a bit more presence boost than the others. It's definitely a sound a lot of people like. It's possible that when used on instruments or singing vocals it would shine above some of the others. But my musical talent is basically nil, so I'm not the one to test that, unfortunately.
It sounds very similar to the original with your voice
In terms of Price difference which one is a SCAM?🤔
Well, assuming GoToToolz isn't technically lying about their mics, then I wouldn't say either one is a "scam."
you cannot tell the difference if only talking, but when you real singing or use it for another purpose... wow, there's a lot of difference. and if you always using real neumann all the time, then you move to this clone, you will frustated.
I really want that high end crystal clear sound but I dont wanna spend too much
What is your budget? I know it's difficult with only one voice as a sample, but did any of the mics in this video sound like what you are looking for?
There are lots of good options at many price levels these days.
@@bigtb1717 I like the sound of the clone TLM103 but I don’t wanna buy clones as it just doesn’t feel right. At the very most, my budget is around $250.
Both of these clones sound exactly the same. If you get the one that says GoToToolz on it, I wouldn't feel guilty about the fact that it looks a bit like a TLM 103. I understand if you still don't want to, but if you like the sound, I don't see an issue.
Otherwise, there are a lot of great mics within that budget. Podcastage here on TH-cam has a ton of great mic reviews and comparisons. As for which ones will sound just like the GTZ 103, that's a bit harder to say.
Thanks for the input. The Stellar X2/3 are mics I don't have any experience with.
@@kizu5234 every condensor microphone is an artistic copy of a copy, don't feel bad about it, do you feel bad that you can't buy a picasso?
GTZ103 sound good for a clone
...... interesting how some other smaller youtube channels who were praising their mics said that the shock mount was metal. I already suspected that they were secretly shilling sponsored products.
They are fine for the price, but I don't find them to be a better value than a lot of other mics. Considering that the two mics I got both had different style shot mounts (though, both plastic), it's possible that some of their mics come with metal shock mounts.
I'm also not a singer, by any stretch of the imagination. So it's possible that these mics stand out on vocals or with certain voices. But for spoken word, I didn't find them better than other mics in the price range.
I think these fake and or look alike knock off mics are using standard Karaoke mic capsules which cost about $5 for that component bought in batch of thousands then they put that in a the body.
It is possible that it depends on the day in terms of packaging. Another review which is two months older than this one, shows the mics are bubble wrapped. So it is not entirely accurate to say the mic always only comes in just a box. I doubt any seller would just put the mic in a wooden box with no padding, even if they were cutting on packaging costs: th-cam.com/video/t9E8ILf7s60/w-d-xo.htmlsi=9QbLwvXnxStfQYUK
I wasn't saying it shipped that way. In fact, the mic didn't even arrive in the wooden box. It was separate. I was just saying that, as a storage box, it's just a box. Edit. I forgot, the shock mount is what was separate. The mic was wrapped in plastic, and was in the wooden box. Still, it's just a box. I don't see the problem.
@@bigtb1717 , you say at 6.15, 'they also come with a little short xlr cable and a short little box, there's no padding -', which clearly gives the impression it comes with no padding, which is not the case. Firstly the others I have seen have come with bubble wrap, secondly if it is that much of an issue, just put the mic in soft wrapping, or make foam thing for the box. It really isn't and issue and does not need to be heavily implied as such.
I didn't heavily imply it was an issue. The box is just a box. You could pad it or just be careful putting it in and out of the box for storage. It's not a big deal. It's just a box. I even put text on screen to clarify that the mic came wrapped in plastic (mine didn't come in bubble wrap, but whatever, it didn't arrive damaged). It wasn't an unboxing and I wasn't commenting on shipping protection. I was talking about what it comes with. It comes with a wooden box.
@@bigtb1717 The whole tone of this video is negative re this product, when in actual fact it is an extremely good sounding using mic, by any standard, especially when not many people have 30, 000 dollars lying around. For a 200 dollar mic, or so, what do you expect it to come with? It comes with a cable and a box. Great. Everyone else got bubble wrap too.
i must say the owner of gtz is trolling here under few different account names ...
And you have a problem with that?
@@mariasmith6498 are You another account of this troll ???
@@mariasmith6498 when the real maker stand by his microphone , He dont need to hide behind fake accounts ...
@@iahorana No but just like when owners of businesses go incognito to see what employees think, I don't have a problem. Call it marketing. I've heard comparisons of this mic and I am passing on this brand, but if I had worse mics, I'd certainly buy one.
@@mariasmith6498 problem is when the oowner write overwhelming reviews on his own products like if he was a customer ... this is cheating ... like selling a model with "upgraded RK 12 capsule" and send the mic with a 12 $ K87 capsule instead ....
No know the intention was to deceive.
there is literally no difference between the tlm 103 and the gtz 103, don't spend an extra 1400 dollars on a placebo effect, imma definitely get one of these
I can hear a world of difference 😬 gtz 103 sounds like the cheap hyped 10k capsules they all have. Is a shame, still cheaper to build your own to get a class clone.
@@AlexButler10you don’t know what you’re talking about
@@AlexButler10send me a link where I can buy diy kit for $120 in total. You trying to look smart, but you are not.
Yes there is!! The Tlm 103 is not harsh on the high mid. The Gtz is. The noise floor is night and day. Very little noise on the real 103.
You are a troll who dont know what You re talking about @@user-wk7le1vn6j the componants for a U87 clone in total cost less than 60 $ , the body can be found for 10 $ ( same as gtz u87 bodies) a capsule for 20$ is easy , and a 9.5/1 very good transformer is 33 $ .... so for a tlm 103 style , You could make it for less than 80 $ easy ..... sorry for. You mate
Be totally clear: it is not a clone. It is an illegal fake posing in every way as beeing a real Neumann. Regardless of the quality is stealing. These mics end up sold to unknowing people believing they buy the real thing.
So it's a deceptive brand, breaks the law doing so, pretends to be high quality, but turns out to be the POS I expected it would be. Thanks!
GTZ 103 is one of examples of stealing somebody's intellectual property. Why nobody says that? You would like to record your songs on fake mikes and than don't want these songs to be used by others as "inspiration" (for free)? Think twice!
You must be dense
I think you have done nothing but expose the mic industry. Over rated.
You talk to much get to the point
Just another USA scam company. Chinese make better mics.
They've been making mics for over 20 years. Each NYC recoding studio had GTZ mics at some point. What this even mean? "Chinese make better mics" Chinese made Temu 87. Have you heard that trash? That's not even a mic!
gtz87 sounds much better compared to Temu 87. I didn't try gtz103 yet, but I will.
@@InnaAlex Never seen any GTZ mic in NYC studios. Maybe in apt / bedroom studios but not in pro studios. And yes China makes better mics than this cheap US company.
@@InnaAlex Dont bite the hand that feed You ....
Chinese do put the bread on your table everyday , respect them , please @@InnaAlex