This is Getting Out of Control
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
- Discussing the recent rookie max contract extensions of Scotty Barnes, Cade Cunningham and Franz Wagner and whether the contracts are worth their value
#NBA #FranzWagner #OrlandoMagic #ScottyBarnes #TorontoRaptors #CadeCunningham #DetroitPistons #NBAUpdates #NBAVideos #NBARumors #NBADebates #NBANews #NBAFreeAgency #NBATrades #NBATradeRumors
My Bulls channel: / bullscentral - กีฬา
Contracts get more expensive over time so getting them signed early saves cap space. It’s a gamble but a gamble that you kinda have to make to be competitive
Not really. Max contracts and supermax contracts are based on a set percentage of the salary cap. That's why if you sign one your salary will go up every year as the cap does. So it doesn't matter when you sign it.
The players are paid half the league revenue. Welcome to the perks of strong unionization insisting on profit sharing. It’s not “out of control”, it’s workers getting their fair share.
I'm always amazed by how concerned people get when players get their bag. Quit spending other peoples money. Nobody screams when James Dolan or Mark Cuban make billions.
@@lindsayseal8504are you people confused? The amount of money each player makes directly impacts the roster the team can create. But maybe I’m jealous for not seeing it your way
Thank you bro, why can’t every day people understand how this really works
@@carl3545since the contract of superstars is capped it leaves a lot of money open for other players.
if your salary cap is 200m and you can only give 45m to your superstar it gives you 150m to spend on the other 10 guys. and if 5 of those guys are on fixed rookie deals that pay 5 mill a year then you have 125 mil to spend on 6 players.
@@thelaw2348Cause people are idiots.
if this keeps up, we're gonna be seeing role players making 100 mil a year LMAOO
They already are
elite roleplayers are key to success and worth every cent. Look at Jrue Holiday, OG Anunoby, Derrick White or Jaden McDaniels all making big money already while being the 3rd, 4th or 5th scoring option.
Well, yeah... thats kinda how it works, as in the salary cap is based on revenue. As long revenue continues to grow, so will the salary cap and theres only 15 players on a roster. We're only 15% there but when/if the salary cap is a billion then max contracts will be 350 mil and good solid players will make 100 mil. At around 2 billion the end of the bench guys would make 100 million. We are alot of tv deals away from those scenarios though.
@@BlastBeatSzEmanuel quickly 5 years for 175. 😂
It is not really funny. Just shows you the dollar is worth shit with inflation and where they plan to take poverty.
I would argue all three teams did the right thing and signed their young stars to the max.
I’m a Pistons fan, no big time free agents want to play in Detroit. Last I checked Toronto and Orlando have a history of losing their talent because they wanted to play in bigger markets.
I’m a big believer in Cade he’s had the toughest journey so far with the injuries and horrible team that was constructed around him. I expect him to really shine over the next couple seasons.
But still, why not wait until the team is actually winning to see if he can impact winning?
@@urbaindelva7869 because everyone would walk.
Detroit just sucks as a city No one wants to live there.
@@urbaindelva7869casual
Bro I PROMISE you if Scottie Barnes was on any other team other than the Raptors he would be viewed in the same tier as Paolo/Ant etc. Scottie has no ceiling lol he’s a do it all wing who impacts the game in every way. For some reason players in Toronto always seem to get overlooked.
Respectfully disagree. I like Barnes and the contract is probably fine. The reason people don't acknowledge him much is because the raps have never been a good team with him. You had one top 25 guy in Siakam, and a top 40 ish guy in OG. With both of them, a solid center, and your do everything 2nd year guy they couldn't get anything done. Just odd. Might mean nothing at all, but right now, it's at minimum a small red flag.
Lol watch Scottie play basketball and don’t look at his stat padding ways. He ain’t good, zero bag. 3rd option on a contender
Scottie is a 3rd option on a championship team. Another good stats on a bad team player. Like the kids game but will never be a #1player option on a good team.
@@Youralwayswhining4367 you know ball. His fans are delusional, anyway they soon realize what we are talking about.
@@YourWorstNightmare3333 no YALL are clueless.. the disrespect is crazy, my point is proven here. If Scottie wasn’t a Raptor all these bs comments and accusations wouldn’t exist. When he averages 25/10/7 and Raps are top 6 in the East remember this comment, all I’m gonna say. Y’all never watched a full Raptors game in ur life.
Fair points, but I don't agree for Barnes. Rookie of the year in year 1, All-star in year 3, just like Jason Tatum. In year 3 Tatum averaged 23 pts, 7 reb, 3 ast. Barnes averaged 20pts, 8 reb, 6 ast. If I'm an agent I'm like that's fair market value.
This really is a smart money play tho. The quicker you sign your big money players, the more cheap there salaries will look in the future. It’s just that simple.
exactly. if they wait 2 year then the cap goes up 25-35 mill and the players want more.
I feel that Scottie and Cade are worth these sorts of contracts, because they're both really good in their respective situations, but they've still got more to prove, and i feel that you are correct that these teams should execute patience, it's a little wild, but gotta get the bag
What you don't understand is that the market is dictating their salary.
One player gets this the others in that class want the same deal. If you don't appease them you will have disgruntled players asking for trades and teams don't want thar from their top players.
I completely agree with you on this. It's why I think what the Rockets are doing with Sengun and Green makes so much sense.
Yeah, wait it out and see how things go, you still have control over their contract next summer
Makes sense? It’s just Green and Sengun aren’t better than Cade Franz and Scottie
The reason they dont get max extension yet is because they couldnt prove yet
@@YourWorstNightmare3333sengue can be an argument
@@And.One.Hoops1 somehow you seem to hit its ok for banchero to get a rookie max but scottie barnes not to get a rookie max. banchero might get 2ppg more taking more shots a game but his stats in rebounds, assists and steals is less than scottie barnes. you look at impact stats on winning of winshare, bpm and vorp, and scottie barnes is much better by a long shot. maybe look at stats before making generalized statements?
In 2012 OKC refused to pay Harden 15 mln and traded him to Houston, when it was obvious that he was a superstar in the making. 12 years later Orlando pays Franz Wagner ( 28 % shooter from 3 by the way ) 52 mln per season. You are right,the world has gone nuts !
Players want to feel wanted. If you delay,, they will remember
I think you didn't understand how big Franz's potential really is and what importance he will have for the Magic in the future. It's not just his potential as a player, there's also his intelligence and character. For Franz, this contract primarily means responsibility. Franz is a totally new type of a super star.
Player power is out of control in the NBA. TV viewership is falling but the salary is going up every year. NO wonder Celtics are selling up.
Love what you are doing with your videos my friend! Keep going
Appreciate it brother, and thanks for being a long time watcher!
This fr gotta change giving guys coming off their rookie contract 220 million is ridiculous regardless of talent it’s juts gonna hinder teams from rounded out their rosters
yup
The NHL has a hard cap system which obviously players don’t want so it means teams have to be mindful of how they spend which is a good thing.
Your mad cuz your favorite player didn’t get the money, be quiet
They are going to regret these deals with the new CBA. Anyone outside your best two players can't be max contracts.
Editor needs a raise
if they wait 2 years then the cap goes up 25-35 mill and the players want more.
Editing on this video goes hard. Keep up the good work bro!
NBA contracts are ridiculous. Players are getting paid on “this is what we HOPE you eventually become”
I know TV deals and the cap space play a huge part, but until teams stop just handing out max contracts like Costco free samples to above avg role players (Tobias Harris, Franz, quickly etc.) then we just gonna keep seeing these over paid players yearly
Imagine how the ticket prices to go to games will change that’s what I’m thinking. I’m a Magic fan I feel Franz deserves it. Imagine what the next contract will be if he blossom into an all star 400k after 5 years
It's clear that you haven't watched Orlando Magic basketball... You have no idea how impactful Franz is...
I’ve watched quite a bit actually. Great player, not a max player. Given the Magic are going to need to give Paolo the max as well, they’re going to be in a tough spot cap wise in the near future
@@And.One.Hoops1I don‘t agree. I think you have not seen a player like Franz before.
Barnes won ROY and is an all-star why doesn’t he deserve that contract?
Nice production, Jam :)
Idk if it's possible but they gotta change the rules on the requirements players need to sign these massive deals. The current deals incentivise players to play good but not crazy, sign a life changing deal, then never get better
I will never understand giving the max extension a year early when you can match any offer in restricted free agency. If you think you’re worth a max go out and get it, then we will match it
Exactly
@@And.One.Hoops1 Yeah ok, piss off and disrespect the cornerstone franchise player you are trying to build around. These players are people and deserve the respect. Why sour a relationship if you are willing to match a max offer in the first place??? The fact that this idiot youtuber agrees with you tells me everything i need to know about his opinions and why i made a mistake of subbing in the first place. The nba is indeed a business, but also a business in dealing with real people. Gross
Cool story bro
@@And.One.Hoops1well at least you’ve debated your point accordingly. I have to concede after that banger, “cool story bro”. Lol. What a goof
Good point. That's what the suns did w/ Ayton and it worked out great for them... Oh wait, it didn't.
This is why you teach kids to be basketball players starting at 3 years old instead of A-B-C.
scottie barnes is an all star and rookie of the year by his 3rd year...has there ever been a player with these qualifications that has not gotten a max?
2021 NBA has been underwhelming unlike 2020 where they have 4 all stars.
Games are too expensive to go to
Thank you for removing the background music from this one. The usual music towards the end of the videos has been getting annoying.
I thought only player who made All Nba is eligible for Super Max contracts, but now I don't even understand
Those aren’t super max extensions
Ima magic fan and I was suprised franz got that max extension when he was shooting so bad the past year, he’s good but he just can’t get worse than 28% from 3. He can only improve that’s probably how the magic views it but I’m okay with it.
I agree. Teams should not be so quick to give up the RFA advantage unless the player is willing to take a team friendly deal.
Look how well that worked with Ayton. Suns matched and Ayton was a distraction all year and they finally had to make a bad trade.
@@lindsayseal8504 How would giving him the max a year earlier helped that situation? That one was screwed either way.
@@lindsayseal8504 They probably should have traded him a year earlier knowing that situation could happen.
Lavine contract not looking so bad besides the trade clause
I know jalen green is paining his nails red right now seeing his peers contracts
If I got a max contract early in my career I'd probably do a Ben Simmons
a - the salary cap doesn’t exist.
b - why do you care how much other people make?
c - if you do the basic math these types of contracts are inevitable.
the cap is $140m. luxury cap is 165m
if you have 2 bench warmers and 4 or 5 rookies then you have to spend 165m on 6 players. if the max you can spend on a superstar is 45m then that leaves you with a ton of money to spent on your #2/3 and top role players.
since teams have to spend money (5 billion a year) then the 450 people that make it to the league really benefit. that comes out to 10m per player per year.
I was so mad when the Knicks traded IQ over "not wanting to pay him", but watching this video and seeing him getting paid 175 mil this off season (75 mil more than Jalen Brunson), I understand what the Knicks front office was doing. I absolutely love IQ but that might just be another big gamble by the Raptors on a player who isn't yet reaching Brunson's level
They gave OG the SAME MONEY that the Sixers gave PG. At least PG has actually been an All-Star and All-NBA player. He got almost $100 million more than Brunson and Randle, who the ACTUAL stars on his team.
@@urbaindelva7869 pg is 34 years that contract is gonna age like the milk in your fridge so nah og is way better for that number
One more salary increase, and 'one and done' will refer to contracts-retirement.
Lol right?
It`s always a risk to hand out a max (rookie) deal... take a look at LaVine for example.
Lavine didn't get a max rookie deal, he got his max after his 2nd contract in the league
@@And.One.Hoops1 I know he's no longer a rookie ;-). I just wanted to point out that it's generally risky to hand out a max contract.
You can thank the new CBA rules for this.
Scottie Barnes catching strays for no reason. Barnes is worth it
Giving Ant that deal seems like a steal in comparison to most any contract we are seeing signed now
Wow as I’m watching this cade just signed a 5 year extension for $224 mil
Maybe I need to watch more Raptors basketball but i dont see how Barnes is getting $225M 😭
Only in the NBA an overhyped future role player can be paid more than a three time MVP.
Scottie is going to be a superstar! You are a casual.
Lol, casual comment
@@And.One.Hoops1 time will tell
since the NBA caps the top salary it means more guys will get the max. you can fit 3 max guys on your team.
but i see what you are saying. try to lowball guys.
You really can’t fit 3 max guys on your team anymore with the new CBA, just not practical
@@And.One.Hoops1 sorry, i should have said "three big contracts".
but you can fit 3 max if you get them all on their first deal and some teams arent anti luxury tax.
regardless, there is so much money in the NBA due to hardcapping max players. in a real free market wemby would make 90M and then lesser players would make much much less money.
would that be a better system?
why is banchero not in the franz,scottie,cade tier?
He's in a different draft class, what do you mean?
@@And.One.Hoops1 seems like you grouped paolo with guys like luka,shai,ant on who should get early max, 1:50
Oh, I see what you're saying. Yeah, I meant it more so from the fact that he's a clear #1, and already established all-star. I wouldn't consider that to be the case for Franz, Scottie, and Cade
@@And.One.Hoops1To be honest, I don’t think Paolo is much better than Cade. I think they’re actually a similar tier of player, but Paolo has a much better team.
If you are the number one or two on any team you're getting maxed, makes sense to me
What about before proving that you're worthy of it? What if Scottie Barnes never gets better than he was this past season? What if Cade proves to not be that impactful of a player? Then what?
rookie of the year ONLY all star in the 2021 draft class what the fuck are you talking about? how is it an overpay
The fans are who are paying for all these contracts. Goodluck fans 😢
The fans aren't paying, the tv contract is. Teams are signing young guys early because the cap is going to rise at least 10% every year and teams look on these contracts not at the dollar amt as much as % of the cap.
the rookie supermax extension is the dumbest contract extension ever. Why give it out? The way it works is there is a max. Say 200 mill. And there is a supermax which is say 250. The supermax can only be offered by the team that drafts the player. So if you have a guy like Haliburton, you can offer him the 250 supermax or.... because he's a restricted free agent you can just offer him the max. No other team in the league will be able to offer more then the max so the max will guarantee the player stays as per the restricted free agency rules.
This should help the bulls trade Lavine due to everyone else getting paid but they still won’t get anything 😂
Lol, you would think but there still isn't a market for him
Franz is the best in the draft class and got the best deal and has already shown he plays at a high level next to paolo banchero which is the most important part of a costar
You saw his performance against the Cavs in Game 7, right? I know that it was his first postseason, and I hope that he grows from it. But to give him THAT contract THIS soon? Idk.
Facts plus a world champ too
@@urbaindelva7869you saw his game 4 and 6 performance? And how he cooked team USA and Ant Edwards in the Semis?
@@urbaindelva7869he's 22 and it was one game. How about game 6 where he had 34/13? He's a two way player, 6'10 which has everything besides a reliable three. Btw Scottie and Cade didn't even reach this stage.
@@urbaindelva7869 that’s one game. He also lead Germany to a World Cup championship and had 26 points in the game 6 elimination game. One bad game doesn’t define a players career
Holy overpay for Franz
The worst one by far
@@And.One.Hoops1worst than Cade who barely plays?
Franz has proven way more than Cade
@@jaceygaither2581 Franz is still the best player of his class
@@jaceygaither2581franz can't shoot a 3 man shot one of the worst percent 9n higher volume 😂
Cade the only player in the draft class potentially deserving of a Max… You must be a casual fan that only looks volume stats. Scottie, Evan, Franz easily >>> than Cade and I’m very confident that no GM would take Cade over those players.
You just contradicted yourself
lol regarding scottie barns... saving this video for 5 years later. Please don't hide this video so I can serve you your crow. Scottie is someone you can build around on a good team. Also the video is very short sighted because it doesn't detail how much money is avaiable for next year... and if you don't lock up your players now, someone will just bid more in the next season... so you should compare to what you can paid them now vs how much someone can paid them the next season.
The kid is not a number one option. Regardless of having decent stats on a bad team. Most of these players aren't #1 options.
@@Youralwayswhining4367 It doesn't matter... if scottie barn isn't a number one option on championship contention team... isn't it easier to trade him on a cheaper contract? As long as NBA's revenue goes up, so will the cap and therefore it's always better to lock your key players up early.
If you think Scottie is an overpay you don’t know ball
Ah yes, the "you don't know ball" when someone's opinion differs from yours. Very profound
Not an overpay for his team but he will never be a first option in the playoffs
@@YourWorstNightmare3333all athletes are overpaid. What would they do if not sports. Most might qualify for flipping burgers.
I don’t know how Scotty Barnes Cape Cunningham are considered overpays, but Franz is crazy; all them would be considered over if you really wanna say because none of them are number one option playoff team Scotty the teams at the lottery and at least France is actually helping the magic actually be legit playoff contender
Franz is the only World Champion in his draft class respect him you stupid casual
look at bpm and vorp, they tell you the impact on winning and their value. scottie barnes on a lottery team defensively still has better bpm and vorp. which means he impacts winning more.
@@giovanni-ed7zq no I believe these guys are core pieces to building for a championship team, but I can’t see any of them being the best player on a championship team with that type of contract and if they become the best plan of championship team, they need a guy who is just as good as them or better
@@justtimes9257 look scottie barnes is in his 3rd year, we dont know if he is a number 1 option yet but his impact stats on winning of vorp bmp and winshare is the highest among his draft class. you look at all top 5 and all nba players they all had high impact stats on winning their rookie year even.
@@giovanni-ed7zq bpm and vorp 😭😭😭 nba fandom is cooked with these nerds
I think if Paulo deserves to get max so does Scottie.
Franz is the best player of that class and considered to be slightly better than Scottie Barnes just saying
@Goxilla yeah so Franz is better than Scottie but Scottie wins roty and gets all star and leads all his class in advanced stats but ok...
Toronto is not a small market team do some research 4th largest metro population in North America.
@@johnhamilton2914 when you do research you´ll find out that Barnes´ playoff stats are empty and he´s the best player on a losing team. Meanwhile Franz contributes to a young playoff team and was snubbed from last years ASG with similar stats like Barnes.
@@Goxilla sure, lets compare apples with oranges. Wagner has a lot of support from a rising young team while Barnes was playing with a bunch of G leaguers and guys with 1 foot out the door. Ask any G.M. who they take and it's Barnes hands down.
With Scottie Barnes? I think it could work out/be worth it. Inclined to agree about the the other two pictured.
Raptors fan, but Barnes isn't an overpay. He already has an all-star nod, regularly plays, and has become fairly efficient for a guy on a rebuilding team.
Franz and Cade could be worth it, but I probably would have benefitted to wait a year to see Franz gets out of the slump and what happens when Cade is not on a historically bad team.
The nba clown show
I agree with almost all of your points, but in my opinion I think Tyrese is worth the max and is a generational talent with his how he has developed and only gotten better every year and is already one of the leagues best passers, I believe he is in the trajectory to be a franchise level player
The question you should asking is if one of Cade, Barnes, or even Wagner hit the free market with zero restrictions how many teams out there would pay them max if they had the resources? A player is worth what a team is willing to pay. Period. Some player like Martin from the Heat found what the market actually though about him. Teams are not willing to overpay any longer with this apron system. Brandon Ingram is finding out right now. Plus you did not not talk about how the Rookie max goes up as the salary cap rises. These guys deserve what someone is willing to pay. It is what it is. Just hope your team made the right decision.
i dont understand how u made those points about scottie and then turn around and say you could see why cade deserves it (albeit with a caveat) you’re being contradictory throughout the video lol
How so? I mainly see it more from Cade based on potential and having a higher ceiling than guys like Scottie and Franz
@@And.One.Hoops1 these rookie extensions are made based off potential in the first place. While cade had more “potential” based off scouting prior to the draft, its been 3 years and Scottie is already an all star, won roty and took a leap in the 3rd year like previous high end players have in the past.
@@And.One.Hoops1No disrespect, but Scottie has shown to have as high a ceiling as Cade if not higher, and already has achieved more than him. If anything, he's the least overpaid of the three.
No need to be surprised. Typical american bias. Switch Barnes and Banchero’s team and everyone would be glazing barnes over banchero
Scottie earned it more then the other two did😊
Have you tried watching him run the point. Yeah not fun to watch
mhh franz is the only world champion out of these 3. if some deserved a max deal its only franz. scottie barnes has no bball IQ at all. really dont see why he is vallued so high......
saying scottie has no bball iq is just racist when he has averages 6 assists and consistently makes high level reads, no other reason but straight up racism
Thought Paolo was better than his stats suggested. Orlando would have been better of waiting another year with him as well.
Poor TS% & EPM strongly suggests Franz output was much more valuable last year than Batchelor. (+0.4/rk: 130) vs Franz (+3.5/rk: 32)
Surprised you don't think Haliburton was max worthy. Guy is All-NBA. His is the least risky of the players you mentioned.
Advanced one number stats are in line with such honors. Even if his defense is arguably mediocre.
EPM rk: #10 for the season. 20ppg/+2.5 TS. Ridiculous assist to turnover ratio. Highest AST%/AST leader in NBA this year.
Bravo using advanced stats instead of the box score. Much better way to determine impact
Fcking NERD casual
Advanced stats is the end of you
@@ctoaun23for nerds. You just need to watch to know
what’s a legacy if you can play 2-3 years & make over 100Ms 💀
Facts... i wouldnt chase a ring id just take the $$$$$
Wemby really gonna become a billionaire from just contracts 😭
chet is better
@@swish1457chet will never be wemby
Paulo is worth it but Barnes is not,gtfoh brah.
Jealous because that was the Bulls pick 😂 Also agents don't let that happen, this is the era of the NBA. None of these were surprising at all
Nope, Bulls most likely wouldn't have taken Wagner. Would love to have him on the Bulls, but he's not a max player.
@@And.One.Hoops1 he signed a Max so he is a max player
You a nobody and whatever you have to say doesn't matter
Lol, so people can’t have opinions now? Got it
@@And.One.Hoops1oh you’re a bulls fan now I get why you hate Franz
@@BrianEscobar26I guarantee you that his opinion is and always will be more valuable then yours so tell me who’s the nobody here?
Hero needs to give up on trying to grow that scraggly chin hair 😅
I have been a Magic fan for ages, but a max contract for Franz just shocked me... it will limit team's options in the future immensely. I like the guy, but it seems to be too much... Sorry Franz
Exactly, good to see some objectivity from Magic fans. Paolo you’re going to have to pay the max. Two max players severely hinders the teams’ ability to make moves on the margins
I understand cade or barnes but franz earned his , he leads to winning unlike the other 2
Franz the only one undeserved. Number 2 option and collapsed in the playoffs. Barnes made the playoffs rookie year and only all star between the 3. Cade is number 1 option and on a tanking team. Casual magic fan
career wins
Scottie 103
franz 98
cade 32
9:38 - I think Paolo and Cade are the more overrated ones in this video. Maybe Franz, a bit.
Scottie is the cream of this crop.
Paolo Banchero?
Bros acting like players won’t demand trades if they’re not happy
We won’t regret paying Cade lol. First of all who else are we gonna pay and we haven’t even got to see him with a respectable NBA roster and he’s still been great. The contract is gonna look like a steal next season.
Ya! Give it all back to the billionaire owners!
If you never watched a raptors game, I suggest you stop talking
When did I say I never watched a Raptors game?
U guys worrying about how much the player gets but do u ever ask how much the white owners makes-???? Let’s talk about that- how much white owners makes
They earn it other than playing children's games. Why you being racist? Kid you have no clue.
Let's get this video to 1 million views!
Guy says banchero deserved and questions barnes. Barnes had statistically a better season. Get off raptors nuts
Banchero is a better player and younger than Barnes, stop it
@@And.One.Hoops1based on…. your opinion??? Compare stats and come back to me. Literally 1 year difference in age. Man’s talking like its a lebron vs banchero age difference
Oh right, I forgot stats is the only thing we look at in basketball when assessing a player's talent, abilities, and potential
@@And.One.Hoops1 right.. cuz obviously.. its not like it's the only objective thing that doesn't rely on opinions and bias.. the only thing based on performance and not based on "cuz banchero is better according to my assessment's talent, abilities and potential.. lmao goofy... and i don't see you denying barnes 2024 stats > banchero 2024 stats.. even comparing scottie rookie stats vs bancheros' rookie stats, barnes is superior.. get off raptors nuts
Hes a better offensive player but by much, Barnes still has a better all-around game then Paolo in terms of potential Barnes has more to offer, but Paolo will be a offensive beast