There's a thing which happened in the 1930's, which is relevant to the Red vs Blue exercises mentioned here. The Japanese Imperial Navy conducted exercises intended to demonstrate the defensibility of the home islands. On more than one occasion they demonstrated that Japan would be unable to prevent the United States of America from storming the approaches. The militaristic government however didn't accept those conclusions and re-drafted them to state that Japans defences were capable of repelling maritime aggression. Moving ahead a decade and the Japanese Imperial Navy had indeed ceased being a capable force in a way which resembled, in detail, the very same assumptions their naval strategists had made about how the United States would proceed in those exercises. There's something to learn from in that....
The only other two countries gunning for Iran like the US are Saudi Arabia and Israel. Israel is like America and hasn't fought an actual war in decades. Instead the IDF is more like a police force on steroids, they just kill unarmed children and disabled people in the occupied territories and think they're like the Spartans in Halo or something. Saudi just sucks at war in general. Our government gives them high tech weaponry and a blank check to commit as much cruelty as they want in Yemen and they still can't defeat a mountain militia.
"...they just kill unarmed children and disabled people in the occupied territories and think they're like the Spartans in Halo or something." Can you cite this, please?
@@alexeistrife56 Since the Great March of Return the IDF has killed hundreds of protesters, young, disabled, and pregnant ones too. Not counting the thousands they've maimed.
Alexei Strife seriously this can’t be the first time you’ve heard of Israel genociding Palestinians simply for existing. www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/28/israeli-snipers-targeted-children-health-workers-journalists/amp/ The deaths are in the hundreds and the injured in the thousands the vast majority are unarmed and then they have the testicular fortitude to call it self defense. Chapo did a segment on it, check it out.
Watching the Tories froth at the mouth when JC asked for an investigation was especially pathetic. No one over here except low test 60 year old men in the middle class suburbs want the war.
side note on Millenium Challenge: Ripper "cheated" by not just sitting there and taking it. he also also just straight up fucking cheated. like "loaded his speedboats with multiple cruise missiles bigger than the speedboats" and "gave himself lightspeed motorcycle couriers" cheated. guy did all but hack himself a pistol that fired nukes. his goal was not to demonstrate that we could lose to Iran; his goal was to demonstrate the wargames were fucking worthless, because the second RED's commander goes even slightly off script there is no way for the simulation to model it. and he demonstrated this by going as far off-script as he could.
America doesn't lose in combat, but we have no idea how to 'win' wars. We have no idea how to translate tactical victories into operational momentum that builds into a strategic victory.
Ralf Beschke of course you haven’t. Because half your population doesn’t believe the Nazies were justified and were fighting for “individual liberty” or whatever dumbass southern schools teach kids these days.
In the American South, there are historical reenactments of Civil War camp life, battles, and the like. It isn't ALL about race and The Lost Cause, a lot of it is just history nerds getting together with other history nerds. But I suspect a lot of the MAGA types have made it into something 'darker' and in tribute The Lost Cause.
The biggest rom hack was Ripper forcing the people running the simulations to let him carry missiles weighing several tons into the small boats he sent in the suicide runs.
Hi. In my country (Türkiye) people say "the millennium challange is about Türkiye".But i read it's about Iran. how can i get more information about this military exercises. Thanks.
Just gonna drop this here (remove the space between reddit.com and the /r/) www.reddit.com /r/todayilearned/comments/n230b/til_a_war_game_was_conducted_in_2002_which/c35pi5r/ The long and short of it is that while MC2002 is an interesting thought experiment, it's not very reliable as a source of determining how badly a war in Iran will go. The simulation was flawed as fuck, there's the kind of obvious problem that "no shit will a US general know how to fuck up US forces, it's literally his job to figure out how he can get fucked", etc. Don't take MC2002 as a hard source on the death toll from a war with Iran. We have decades of pointless bloody interventions that give us a far better idea how the war will turn out, and we don't need to rely on unreliable shit.
My understanding was the general who played the Iranians in the millennium challenge basically violated the laws of physics and sent bicyclists over physically impossible distances in order to achieve his results. Could be mistaken but in general I’m not sure I’d draw conclusions from a wargame from a decade and a half ago.
he did. consider what it means that the wargame was designed such that if RED strayed from the script it was supposed to follow even a little bit, the simulation totally broke. nobody had ever bothered to model how motorcycle couriers would work. so Van Ripper just relabeled "radio" "motorcycle courier" and said "sorry fuckers you didn't give me the ability to do what I would do here, I'm improvising." then he loaded down speedboats with as much munitions as the simulation would let him (about a destroyer's worth) and had them all fire at BLUE's position at once to prove his point. the wargame a decade and a half ago did not show that Iran would effortlessly kick our ass. it showed something much scarier: we consider our enemies not following the script we've laid out for them as unworthy of contemplation as gravity deciding to reverse direction tomorrow. this is a large part of how we lost in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria. how dare those fuckers do things we didn't program into the simulation. don't they know that's against the rules. SURE FEELIN' GOOD ABOUT THIS TIME THOUGH
Grenada...an island 🌴 they invaded without realizing that it was ‘England’s’ in that Colonial way...😂 Marines arrived and were swimming within hours! ( Listen to Reagan apologize to Margaret Thatcher for this, it’s amazing.)
The Millennium Challenge 2002 is one of those events that will just keep being misrepresented. Not only did Ripper force the people running the simulation to allow him to make suicidal attacks with small boats armed with missiles that they could not carry in real life, the Blue team's position isn't as childish as it's always portrayed. Running an exercise requires planning and money, if you have 7 days to run an exercise those 7 days will be used. It's not a "mercy rule". It's simply taking advantage of the time allotted. Then Ripper went into a "rah rah technology bad Edison was a witch" rampage when the fact is that he cheated too.
@Kevin Gallagher An absurd statement from the arrogant and delusional fools who've spent decades losing wars. Wargames aren't done to "learn" anything - they're done to confirm existing biases.
You think the drumhead for war stopped because Trump changed his mind this time? Bolton et al have been foaming at the mouth over starting a war with Iran for years. They will do whatever they can to get their war. Psychopaths are like that.
To be fair, they also specifically pointed out how absurd it is that Trump seems to the the only thing holding off a war with Iran. I certainly got the feeling that if Trump had felt that war was good for his poll numbers, he'd have stayed out of the way and let it happen.
I low key have switched my position on impeachment. Trump actually seems opposed to war while Pence would probably go to war in a second. Bolton and Pompeo can beat he war drum all they want but I don’t think Trump wants to pull the trigger.
Trump doesn't want to be seen pulling the trigger because he doesn't want to be viewed as the aggressor. He will continue to try to goad Iran to shoot first so he can claim they are the aggressor, despite massing troops at their border and parking the navy off their coastline with cruise missiles aimed at Tehran. Trump asked Oman to "warn" Iran that a strike was imminent, had the military prepare to strike to make it seem real, hoping Iran would strike first in a massive opening salvo like they did in the Millennium Challenge when this same scenario occurred. Instead, Iran did nothing, and Trump was forced to call off his strike, knowing he would be unilaterally perceived as the aggressor.
Also, don’t forget Congress has the power to declare war. Not the president. He can move the troops anywhere he wants. As we learned under Reagan, telling congress tomorrow leads to catastrophe
Meh, the whole "I'm ganna move to another country to disassociate myself from America" meme is pretty obnoxious. Must be nice if you have that privilege.
@@tph2010 It isn't 'privilege' that makes someone desirable in the eyes of another country's immigration policy. You either meet the criteria or you don't.
Aaron Boone there American money makes them a primary player. Especially because they pay our officials to agree with them. In this case I do agree Bolton is the mastermind. But don’t underestimate that fascist state.
I love what you guys do, but had no idea you make like 110k a month on Patreon and hold back episodes for a week to make more money. Pretty ironic coming from socialists.
These chumps didn't read the Millennium Challenge report; but they still talk about it... That war game was an experiment that was designed to test congressional appropriations for ongoing projects and research. The point wasn't to see who could win or lose, then call it a day. They took the loss, and reset to complete the testing of integrated intelligence systems and programs. Since then, there have been advances in ship design, tactics, and information systems. The F-35 is a prime example, because that aircraft has an integrated information sharing system to coordinate inter agency deployment of force. It's not like Command & Conquer, in reality, there is no big picture of the battlefield... Until the United States built one with AI. But, I will admit, the over reliance on electronic data transmission is still a massive weakness for the U.S. military. They are still vulnerable to spam attacks from hundreds of boats and missiles. But please, do the research before spouting off.
There's a thing which happened in the 1930's, which is relevant to the Red vs Blue exercises mentioned here. The Japanese Imperial Navy conducted exercises intended to demonstrate the defensibility of the home islands. On more than one occasion they demonstrated that Japan would be unable to prevent the United States of America from storming the approaches. The militaristic government however didn't accept those conclusions and re-drafted them to state that Japans defences were capable of repelling maritime aggression.
Moving ahead a decade and the Japanese Imperial Navy had indeed ceased being a capable force in a way which resembled, in detail, the very same assumptions their naval strategists had made about how the United States would proceed in those exercises. There's something to learn from in that....
Instead, we made a list of cities to spare, then indulged all the trigger happy generals and scientists who were begging for something to nuke
The only other two countries gunning for Iran like the US are Saudi Arabia and Israel.
Israel is like America and hasn't fought an actual war in decades. Instead the IDF is more like a police force on steroids, they just kill unarmed children and disabled people in the occupied territories and think they're like the Spartans in Halo or something.
Saudi just sucks at war in general. Our government gives them high tech weaponry and a blank check to commit as much cruelty as they want in Yemen and they still can't defeat a mountain militia.
"...they just kill unarmed children and disabled people in the occupied territories and think they're like the Spartans in Halo or something."
Can you cite this, please?
@@alexeistrife56 Since the Great March of Return the IDF has killed hundreds of protesters, young, disabled, and pregnant ones too. Not counting the thousands they've maimed.
@@maiidegeese5052 That's not much of a citation.
@@alexeistrife56
1948 all the way through 2019.
Alexei Strife seriously this can’t be the first time you’ve heard of Israel genociding Palestinians simply for existing.
www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/28/israeli-snipers-targeted-children-health-workers-journalists/amp/
The deaths are in the hundreds and the injured in the thousands the vast majority are unarmed and then they have the testicular fortitude to call it self defense. Chapo did a segment on it, check it out.
Anyone else here for the commentary at 9 minutes? "When the poll numbers are down..."
Threw the controller and demanded to restart at the save point...also with god-mode enabled, Ai difficulty set to "Infant", and no-clipping.
Watching the Tories froth at the mouth when JC asked for an investigation was especially pathetic. No one over here except low test 60 year old men in the middle class suburbs want the war.
This is why the home counties need to be subject to full-on scorched earth.
Half a year later, we just droned one of Iran's most popular military figures into smithereens. Let's see how things go now.
It was still pretty chill tbh.
BACK ONCE AGAIN
side note on Millenium Challenge: Ripper "cheated" by not just sitting there and taking it. he also also just straight up fucking cheated. like "loaded his speedboats with multiple cruise missiles bigger than the speedboats" and "gave himself lightspeed motorcycle couriers" cheated. guy did all but hack himself a pistol that fired nukes.
his goal was not to demonstrate that we could lose to Iran; his goal was to demonstrate the wargames were fucking worthless, because the second RED's commander goes even slightly off script there is no way for the simulation to model it. and he demonstrated this by going as far off-script as he could.
Personally I'd be a huge fan of making the war hawks pull themselves up by the bootstraps and sending them to fight Iran. Alone.
Would make a good movie
Should upload the bit on warren and third way
The World only gets worse.
As a Iranian I don't support any war
As an American, I don't either. But our government doesn't really listen to us.
Who else is watching this after Iranian strike on American bases in Iraq?
Is that one of Amber's cats at 11:50 , or someone else's?
There's "circular logic", and then there's outright random scribbles.
Colossus: the Forbin Project! That's what your avvy is from
Paul K. Von Ripper...?! General Ripper? 😂
Satire is dead.
@@s.bakyhnh1756 yeah, life is satire at this point
Fuckin hell this is relevant again
America doesn't lose in combat, but we have no idea how to 'win' wars.
We have no idea how to translate tactical victories into operational momentum that builds into a strategic victory.
Trump sounds like a 10th grade ESL student
If the Americans attack Iran, the world will change. They will not dare to make such a mistake.
~ Former Iranian President Akhbar Rafsanjani
I’m German and I have never heard of civil war re-enactment being a thing here.
Ralf Beschke of course you haven’t. Because half your population doesn’t believe the Nazies were justified and were fighting for “individual liberty” or whatever dumbass southern schools teach kids these days.
In the American South, there are historical reenactments of Civil War camp life, battles, and the like. It isn't ALL about race and The Lost Cause, a lot of it is just history nerds getting together with other history nerds. But I suspect a lot of the MAGA types have made it into something 'darker' and in tribute The Lost Cause.
Can US citizens band together and declare our country a terrorist state? Is that a possible thing?
13:41 "restart from the savepoint" *a savepoint created by romhack*
The biggest rom hack was Ripper forcing the people running the simulations to let him carry missiles weighing several tons into the small boats he sent in the suicide runs.
Hi. In my country (Türkiye) people say "the millennium challange is about Türkiye".But i read it's about Iran. how can i get more information about this military exercises. Thanks.
11:50 for the miaow, I don't know why anyone would be here otherwise
Just gonna drop this here (remove the space between reddit.com and the /r/)
www.reddit.com /r/todayilearned/comments/n230b/til_a_war_game_was_conducted_in_2002_which/c35pi5r/
The long and short of it is that while MC2002 is an interesting thought experiment, it's not very reliable as a source of determining how badly a war in Iran will go. The simulation was flawed as fuck, there's the kind of obvious problem that "no shit will a US general know how to fuck up US forces, it's literally his job to figure out how he can get fucked", etc.
Don't take MC2002 as a hard source on the death toll from a war with Iran. We have decades of pointless bloody interventions that give us a far better idea how the war will turn out, and we don't need to rely on unreliable shit.
scary thing is - the reporter asked, "why should we trust your administration" - would they do that with biden now?
And we know now
The commander of the vessel involved in the gulf of tonkin incident was Jim Morrisons father
john quackers wow that’s something
Sorry to spoil Juneteenth, but it’s also ‘World Refugee Day.’
So...’We’ve Got Concentration Camps’. Rah.
11:50 kitty!!!!!
My understanding was the general who played the Iranians in the millennium challenge basically violated the laws of physics and sent bicyclists over physically impossible distances in order to achieve his results. Could be mistaken but in general I’m not sure I’d draw conclusions from a wargame from a decade and a half ago.
he did. consider what it means that the wargame was designed such that if RED strayed from the script it was supposed to follow even a little bit, the simulation totally broke.
nobody had ever bothered to model how motorcycle couriers would work. so Van Ripper just relabeled "radio" "motorcycle courier" and said "sorry fuckers you didn't give me the ability to do what I would do here, I'm improvising." then he loaded down speedboats with as much munitions as the simulation would let him (about a destroyer's worth) and had them all fire at BLUE's position at once to prove his point.
the wargame a decade and a half ago did not show that Iran would effortlessly kick our ass. it showed something much scarier: we consider our enemies not following the script we've laid out for them as unworthy of contemplation as gravity deciding to reverse direction tomorrow.
this is a large part of how we lost in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria. how dare those fuckers do things we didn't program into the simulation. don't they know that's against the rules.
SURE FEELIN' GOOD ABOUT THIS TIME THOUGH
Why does your post say 6/21/2019
Who's got the joint?
¿Quieres?
nick mullen
@@lemonwithalime nick mullen only does scientific dosages of cocaine.
"Your not going to get fired."
This particular comment did not age well.
Bolton’s been fired before, but he still came back in the very next Republican administration.
@@samiamrg7 Right, and when Gary Busey is our next Republican president he will be back again.
He's still on Fox and will be influencial or serve in the 2024 DeSantis administration.
Grenada...an island 🌴 they invaded without realizing that
it was ‘England’s’ in that Colonial way...😂 Marines arrived and were swimming within hours!
( Listen to Reagan apologize to Margaret Thatcher for this, it’s amazing.)
Wasn't it Raegan who invaded Grenada?
Andrew Kullar yes
@@benjaminpark5460 so why would Nixon apologise to Thatcher? And at the time Grenada was independent from the UK
Andrew Kullar : Yes, my Brain was in the 1980’s...!
Thanks, it’s an odd error: # Reagan and Thatcher.
Wait...how is it a (War) Game , if it’s a #Script...?
If it’s a script...isn’t that a ‘Play’?!
W E L P
E
L
P
The Millennium Challenge 2002 is one of those events that will just keep being misrepresented. Not only did Ripper force the people running the simulation to allow him to make suicidal attacks with small boats armed with missiles that they could not carry in real life, the Blue team's position isn't as childish as it's always portrayed. Running an exercise requires planning and money, if you have 7 days to run an exercise those 7 days will be used. It's not a "mercy rule". It's simply taking advantage of the time allotted.
Then Ripper went into a "rah rah technology bad Edison was a witch" rampage when the fact is that he cheated too.
@Kevin Gallagher An absurd statement from the arrogant and delusional fools who've spent decades losing wars. Wargames aren't done to "learn" anything - they're done to confirm existing biases.
What you call cheating has another name: improvisation and irregular warfare. And reality shows it beats the US every time.
11:50 Marty!
I'm looking forward to the end times
Oof
Meow! 11:50
But the breakfast tho
Is Molly Ringwald a part of Breakfast Media?
It's called rage quit.
but the breakfast
2:23 A mine-er incident indeed.
Welp...
LETS GO IRANIAN BOYS
This aged well
You think the drumhead for war stopped because Trump changed his mind this time? Bolton et al have been foaming at the mouth over starting a war with Iran for years. They will do whatever they can to get their war. Psychopaths are like that.
To be fair, they also specifically pointed out how absurd it is that Trump seems to the the only thing holding off a war with Iran. I certainly got the feeling that if Trump had felt that war was good for his poll numbers, he'd have stayed out of the way and let it happen.
11:51
mew
17:32 this Juneteenth bit came off gross af. Chapo settler values are screaming.
Good on you president Trump for keeping America out of another stupid war.
While gutting our social programs to massively increase our military budget....
I low key have switched my position on impeachment. Trump actually seems opposed to war while Pence would probably go to war in a second. Bolton and Pompeo can beat he war drum all they want but I don’t think Trump wants to pull the trigger.
If his ratings drop low enough it becomes worth a punt.
Trump doesn't want to be seen pulling the trigger because he doesn't want to be viewed as the aggressor. He will continue to try to goad Iran to shoot first so he can claim they are the aggressor, despite massing troops at their border and parking the navy off their coastline with cruise missiles aimed at Tehran. Trump asked Oman to "warn" Iran that a strike was imminent, had the military prepare to strike to make it seem real, hoping Iran would strike first in a massive opening salvo like they did in the Millennium Challenge when this same scenario occurred. Instead, Iran did nothing, and Trump was forced to call off his strike, knowing he would be unilaterally perceived as the aggressor.
Also, don’t forget Congress has the power to declare war. Not the president. He can move the troops anywhere he wants. As we learned under Reagan, telling congress tomorrow leads to catastrophe
Meh, the whole "I'm ganna move to another country to disassociate myself from America" meme is pretty obnoxious. Must be nice if you have that privilege.
Anyone can do it, whether you can do it easily and comfortably is another thing.
@@ashesmandalay1762 Anyone can get a visa to permanently live and work in another country?
@@tph2010 It isn't 'privilege' that makes someone desirable in the eyes of another country's immigration policy.
You either meet the criteria or you don't.
The only Civil War scholar at the University of Glasgow lmao
hasan name drop
14:04 shut up amber. Stop it with toxic masculinity
Hey I'm new to all of this ,,, is this a good podcast? Like is it comedy or horseshit politics??
Gunk MasterFlex it IS good but you need to be adept in fringe twitter irony and 90s kid references
Blastbeat Apologist this podcast ain’t irony buddy
why is nobody saying who's really behind it all...? ISRAEL!
The United States has its own interests as well. It’s more cooperation and agreement rather than the literal state of Israel being the mastermind.
hackneo64 please specify Zionism and not the jews
Unless you believe in some mad heeby black magic, you have to realise Israel is the junior partner.
Could be Israel. Could be Saudi Arabia. But it's most likely the USA with Bolton and Pompeo at the controls.
Aaron Boone there American money makes them a primary player. Especially because they pay our officials to agree with them. In this case I do agree Bolton is the mastermind. But don’t underestimate that fascist state.
I would welcome you to the UK with open arms :)
I love what you guys do, but had no idea you make like 110k a month on Patreon and hold back episodes for a week to make more money. Pretty ironic coming from socialists.
Please explain what you think socialism is
They don’t hold back episodes for a week unless they are on tour in Europe they way they have been. They gotta eat man.
Wait Why?
These chumps didn't read the Millennium Challenge report; but they still talk about it... That war game was an experiment that was designed to test congressional appropriations for ongoing projects and research. The point wasn't to see who could win or lose, then call it a day. They took the loss, and reset to complete the testing of integrated intelligence systems and programs. Since then, there have been advances in ship design, tactics, and information systems. The F-35 is a prime example, because that aircraft has an integrated information sharing system to coordinate inter agency deployment of force. It's not like Command & Conquer, in reality, there is no big picture of the battlefield... Until the United States built one with AI.
But, I will admit, the over reliance on electronic data transmission is still a massive weakness for the U.S. military. They are still vulnerable to spam attacks from hundreds of boats and missiles. But please, do the research before spouting off.
lol us got owned
The F-35 got canceled and turned out to be a trillion dollar money pit