Yo good video! My first time here and you’re definitely an underrated content creator. I think you make a lot of good points in this video, though I will say I think you’re wrong about the final boss deities kinda being misunderstandings, especially Yaldaboath. The more you listen to how they combat the main characters’ arguments, the more you realize just how gaslighty these deities are. Even Izanami, who wasn’t directly responsible for a lot of the stuff in P4, definitely intentionally allowed for these things to happen (assuming I’m remembering correctly of course)
I see how you can make a strong argument for that if you view it solely from the point of view of the casts of characters' experiences in the games. But when you look at the bigger picture, the final bosses are referring to everyone, not just the main cast of characters. Yaldaboath became a God of cognition because all of societies desires gather in mementos. Their ultimate wish is to be ruled. We later see this with maruki in Royal, and even with the Wonder spin-off game, mementos don't disappear at all. It just waits for a new ruler. His situation is complicated he doesn't have good intentions, but he became a stop gap for nyx by accident. In the case of p4, izanami created the TV world to reflect people's hearts in the goal of understanding them better. So what happened afterward was just caused by those who used the TV world, meaning that the evil was a reflection of mankind's hubris in thinking themselves capable of mettling in the affairs of godly beings. As for p3, nyx pretty much doesn't even want to bring death upon everyone, but it's ryoji's function he's basically the grim reaper of the universe's pantheon. He only got drawn here by humanity's constant struggle and those who wish for it to end. The misunderstanding is that although life gets so hard that you want to die sometimes, that doesn't necessarily mean that you really want to be killed. But erebus doesn't give a damn to explain that because erebus is a personification of mankind's struggle and wish for death. Earlier, someone said that these bosses are not gods, but they are shadows. But the truth is these shadows are avatars if these gods, basically the result of what happens if they interact with our reality. So yes, you did actually fight izanami. Not a shadow pretending to be izanami. So there you have it. Thanks for watching, and I appreciate the feedback it helps me make better videos.
Admittedly I do think Izanami isn’t super bad but I was just kinda trying to say it to say it. Nyx isn’t inherently evil either, though I still don’t think it’s a misunderstanding. The way you’re saying it sounds like you’re implying that the wishes of humanity that draw these deities here are misunderstood by said deities, but I don’t think that’s true. I think these deities are simply fulfilling the wish the way people want it to be fulfilled within their hearts. The problem isn’t a misunderstanding of the wish, it’s the wish itself. I kinda feel like I kinda went on about something that was hardly related to my original comment but oh well thank you for listening!
The misunderstanding comes from them not understanding that human desires at face value have different meanings. For example, someone who wishes to be ruled over by yaldaboath doesn't actually want to be subjugated by an evil overlord. They just want purpose in their life, but they feel like the lack of purpose and the difficulty of finding one makes life impossible to live in a world like this. So they want to be given a purpose by a god, because that is the ultimate purpose one can receive. A purpose given by God. But from yaldaboath's perspective, he's never been human, so he lacks a humans point of view and line of thinking. So when he hears "I wanna be subjugated," bro actually thinks that will help that person. So that's the misunderstanding I'm referring to. We all go through it, which is why it's hard to put it into words. Especially when you try to explain it to other people who's never been in your situation. They'll misunderstand what you want to really say, that you can't find the words to say it with. But if they understood your perspective first hand, then they'll understand the nuances and undertones of what you really want to say. And I'm happy to have comments to even reply to. This channel nearly died a trillion times. So please feel free to comment more. I don't care if you go off topic. I'm having fun, I haven't felt this alive in months :D
Glad to hear my comments are helpful! Yeah I think I see what you mean by the whole how a desire is versus how it seems, and though I feel like I could still argue against it I feel like I agree with you a lot more now. Good luck growing the channel, glad you’re doing something you enjoy!
While true, shadows by nature at least the sentient ones in 4 and 5 are charactures of the larger truths. It doesn’t help that Izanami’s domain was a cognitive world she corrupted since Teddy was old enough to comment that the fog was unnatural and when the investigation team took her down with Miriad Truths, he was able to confirm that the world went back to normal. The god of control also executed pretty much any one he wished, by erasing them from the combined world, so under his world the god of control might have been Nyx 2 if not rebelled against by the Phantom Thieves.
I really hope Elizabeth and the Shadow Exterminators (SEES) find a way to save Makoto's soul. Emphasis on the *SOUL*. Makoto's body is dead and burried, he'll never come back to life. But his soul is used for the Seal. I hope they save Makoto's soul, allow him to rest in the Afterlife.
@@SleepyCoffeeOwl Dead dead. Deader than dead. Super dead. Extremely dead. His body is rotting and being eaten by worms and cockroaches. Only his bones and blue hair remain. Yes, the blue emo curtain hair is actually the only part of his that is immortal.
@@SleepyCoffeeOwl oh nooooooooooo. No no no no no no! U see my friend, us stupid and braindead, overly passionate and probably maidenless Persona 3 fanboiz (and Persona fans in general), we actually WANT Makoto to remain dead. U see, "it fits the themes of the game", "Makoto must die for his friends", "the Answer destroys everything for showing Makoto becoming a door", "the game should end with his death" etc etc. Different endings, oh we don't accept those here. Only the canon must exist!!! We literally kill one another over the character's true canon name. Oh, you must be new here, welcome to our fandom! 🙃 ((Itsucksleavewhileyoustillcanthisishell)) Oh, who am I kidding, all fandoms are the same... stay and have fun buddy, and don't listen to others.
Could be that or since igor is an interdimensionsal being he has immense power that could easily rewrite someone's geneitic structure and regenerate them from whatever is left or give them a new form entirely. I saw some theories that Elizabeth may have already succeeded, and Jose might be a reborn Yuki-kun. I wanted to save this for the future, but it is just a theory.
I never understood why people are so against mc to come to live. Whats wrong with you all? The guy is finnaly got his desires back, after he went through everything. He deserves a happy life for himself. Sacrifice as a hero is such a braindead and stupid trope
I'd never played 3 until Reload so I didn't make the connection. But with the "Shutdowns" you supposedly also had some people go psychopathic. You just never saw it in Game, (Outside Akechi's fight). So kind of "Similar but not exactly."
@@Chokahin P5 there are mental shutdowns and psychotic breakdowns, they are similar but not the same. Mental shutdows seem to be exactly like apathy syndrome while psychotic breakdowns are what you described. Mental shutdows are caused by the death of a person's shadow, while psychotic breakdowns are caused by Akechi's ability. The only question then is why some mental shutdown victims die (like Haru's father) and some don't, not sure if they ever explain that.
More or less. The mental Shutdown makes the person shut down entirely, she loses her will to function. It's similar, yes, but the difference is that the Apathy Syndrome happens because a Shadow eats the bad feelings a human being has until there's nothing left there, but the Shutdown happen because the person's other self is erased. And so far, while the Apathy Syndrome have a cure, everyone afflicted by it was cured, a Mental Shutdown is permanent. Even if you don't die right away, and your body is maintained by fluids in a hospital for an indeterminate time, you will eventually die because there's no way for your shadow to reborn out of you. I THINK, the only one that literally denied it's own shadow was Mitsuo, the P4 guy that blames himself for killing people just for people to think he's a criminal or some shit. But we know he didn't kill his shadow, or he would have been dead, he denied his other self, but that's what humans do all the time, the protagonists are forced to accept that in P4, denying and erasing are two different things I think.
Eh... hmm. So, Messiah is his 'final Persona', with Orpheus Telos being a callback to Prime Personas from the P2 Duology, from my understanding. A modified, upgraded version of the original Persona. It has no skills but what it can inherit, so it's literally just meant to be a 'make your own Persona'. Yea, it does normally use Messiah in it's Fusion, but for the story, Messiah is the 'Ultimate Persona' for Minato.
@@marcusvinicius3298Orpheus Telos is just an endgame reward for players who maxed out every social link. It's just a way for the devs to say "Thanks for putting in so much work, here's a prize". Even if you play the female route, it will retain the male Orpheus model, so they didn't put much thought into it being the canonical Awakened persona for the protagonist whereas Messiah is used during end credit sequences and promotional artwork and the like.
@@marcusvinicius3298if you go by the game yes, if you go by the movie no. The anime movie shows his final persona that lets him stand up against Nyx and walk forward/fly into Nyx’s core as Messiah. And it’s a fusion between the two personas he first summons at the start of the games/movie being Orpheus and Thanatos which feels more like a final awakening persona.
Love how the fact the following Persona games from P3 has been destroying things from what Nyx said on the final fight. Nyx' said "Mankind's fate was sealed the moment they entrusted their future to the cards" and what is shown in P4? The breaking away from destiny hence with the breaking of tarot "cards" of the Inaba gang when they summon persona. P5 directly opposes Nyx' idea as stated in the video. Would really love a Persona game that will show the culmination of all these people's hard works and contribution in finally cutting off humanity's "Desire" of death and thus Nyx doesn't have reason to fall to earth
@@MonerLaine I feel like with P5R bringing back Narukami and Yuki was a nice touch but also a bit of a test. Getting people and new comers who played P5 as their first persona to get interested in the other protags. Then with Reload being focused on Yuki. I wonder if it’s to gauge a reaction. Seeing if people are willing to be interested in the P3 protags story. Plus, with The Answer being all but confirmed people will have questions about the story. Along with the points made in this video. Nyx’s words are being broken. Yuu and Ren did so. Perhaps this could lead to a separate game or next installment bringing Nyx or P3 Hero to some degree to the story again.
Well, as long as I'm alive I'll be waiting and wishing for death, no matter how good or bad things will get. You can assume there will always be people and characters like that irl or in such stories, so the threat would never be gone even if society as a while changes fundamentally
Dude... I just accidentally clicked on this video, and was immediately hooked when I realized what it was about. I freaking love the persona games for their themes and overall messages, and this is honestly one of the coolest and most down to earth persona analysis videos I've seen yet. I really love your interpretation about how all of these games' main climaxes and gods all just stem from human misunderstanding, that's just a really neat way of looking at it. And any discussion about Nyx is always a win in my book, Nyx is honestly such an underrated part of these games, and is lowkey kind of the coolest part of Persona 3's overall story to me personally. I just love that this video is so... relatable? For lack of a better term. I've been working on a sort of "mega analysis" video series for Persona 3 over the past year and a half, and as a result, I've had many shower-thought tangents like this about the deeper aspects of these games and their stories/themes, and to stumble across this video, which feels like such a perfect 7 minute embodiment of that stream of consciousness discussion surrounding these games that's so easy to get lost in for hours; I just don't feel like I see enough of it, and for that I appreciate this a lot. You've earned a new sub man, keep it up!
I've long since also had a longing to make a greater, more in-depth breakdown of persona 3, its themes, lore, and all the interconnected plot points, but I could never seemingly put it together properly so I just came out of the shower at 3 a.m., threw on one of my old blaziers, and did my best to sort out my thoughts over a microphone. I didn't think this video would reach anyone, but so far, you are the second person who has told me that this is actually good. And for that, I am insanely grateful. I hope you also eventually make your Persona 3 video as well. And when you do I'll be the first to watch it!
@@Matagatsu Heck yeah man! Gotta love the spontaneity. I strive to have that level of "fuck it, let's do this" when it comes to making videos, so that's really inspiring to hear. This P3 video is easily the biggest thing I've ever worked on, so when it's finally finished I'm definitely gonna dial it back and make some much shorter more spontaneous stuff, cause I feel like that's really where a lot of the creativity comes from for me. I'm so glad to hear you're interested in my video! It's VERY close to being done, so expect to see it really soon. Can't wait to see what more stuff you put out too, man!
To me Nyx made up Persona 3. Everything that happened before it's reveal, to be honest, wasn't that interesting (maybe except for the Sun social link and Junpei's mini arc). Now after defeating the 12th boss on November and realizing something was wrong, the game's plot went literally from 0 to 100 and became one of the best of all time.
@ThoMario86 I'm glad something was able to carry the game for you, but for me, ever since the beginning of the game, I was instantly captivated. It was my second persona game, technically my first since I didn't beat p5 until I beat p3 and p3p. Love it so much that I'm on my 15th playthrough. Nyx was definitely a high point, though.
@@thomario8639 I certainly understand what you mean. The plot pre-betrayal/Nyx is definitely very formulaic, and not in a way that's as inherently interesting or fresh as P4's shadows or P5's palaces. I like it personally, and find it kind of simplistic in an endearing way, especially considering how grand and insane the story goes on to become, meaning that by the time your face to face with Nyx, you can think back to the first two or three shadow fights and truly FEEL like you 've come that impossibly far. But yeah I see what you mean, P3 definitely peaked at it's end for sure.
Really interesting video. I always love the videos that talk about P3 in general, and anything related to Makoto Yuki and/or saving him, and this video is on that list. Keep it up with the great work!
Oh… so persona 6 is gonna be a mashup of the persona pro tags against the seal? I would love to see the big 3 pro tags somehow join up to beat nyx up. I wish
As much as I'd love that, it doesn't make much financial sense. Not only would such a story make any future persona games feel like filler, but this would require players to have played past games, or at least P3, which is something that would hurt the potential number of people who could buy the game. I think it is more likely we could get that story as a spin-off game, which is honestly perfectly fine by me, as long as it is of good quality
@@wisefelipe there must be a reason why atlus remake p3 with reload so new player can play p3 with latest graphic and modern mechanic, there is also some leak that persona 4 is about to get remake too. It feels like they are up to something, maybe the Persona 6 is going to be saving makoto/ recurring character comeback, idk we'll see
What is very interesting is Maruki's Arc almost if not straight up implying he can literally bring souls and bodies back to life from the dead and mass change cognition. It was flawed (because of his shadow and after his second persona could have gotten the perfect timeline ending) but Actually the Garden of Eden or Elysium in real life. Implying that yes he could have been alive again already
I truly hope for is a spin-off/P3 sequel where they actually free him from being the Great Seal. My ideal ending to the P3 story would be this: Elizabeth sacrifices her immortality to the Seal, thus freeing Makoto's soul and becoming human herself. Aigis is somehow damaged after the climatic battle, her Papillon Heart breaks and she dies, but to symbolize that she's has a soul, after death she opens her eyes to see Makoto holding her, like she held him before he died. Then her soul and Makoto's move on together in the Afterlife. And if you wanna make it even more touching, have Elizabeth and his teammates be able to see them one last time and say their farewells and "we'll meet again" or "keep our seat in Heaven warm" etc. And in the credits, have artworks in blue and white where they are all together again, Elizabeth giving Makoto and Aigis a hug, Aki and Ken meeting Shinji, Mitsuru and Yukari hugging their fathers etc. That would be the best, most definitive, most perfect ending for Persona 3 imo.
I agree about this ending except the fact where aigis dies. The answer dlc actually made it clear that aigis wouldn't die any moment soon, and just Makoto moving on to the afterlife alone after saying goodbye to his friends and maybe confessing his emotions is gonna be much more impactful and emotional. And they can end it to where Makoto becomes the new Velvet Room Master in replacement of Igor for the next generation of audience that Atlus will have
THIS IS LITERALLY WHAT I THOUGHT WHEN I SAW ELIZABETH’S STORY IN P4AU THE ONLY THING THAT COULD STOP NYX IS CHANGING PEOPLE’S HEARTS??!?! I literally went insane when i first read that Atlus,,,, please give us a persona 5 arena or something where makoto comes back and is playable,,,, but dies right after cus him staying alive too much would mess up the plot of persona 3, its messages, its ending and a lot of other things a lot. Anyways, thank you for the great video!
Honestly this doesn't mess anything up, the message has already been delivered. Looking at Makoto as Messiah, returning wouldn't be madness or some kind of conflict, he just needs to be a seal as long as people don't learn the value of life. But I don't think it will happen anytime soon, he has already revived in Aigis, a "soulless" robot not only received his own soul but also the power of the savior
I have a crazy theory that might proof that Elizabeth already succeed at release Makoto's soul and that is Morgana. Remember what Morgana look like? A black cat with bright blue eyes wearing yellow scarf and keep saying that he is a human. And who is a boy with black hair bright blue eyes and wearing yellow scarf? Ryoji and Ryoji is Thanatos. In P4A Elizabeth take Thanatos with her to stop Erabus from reaching to Nyx. If my theory correct this is what happen. After somehow Elizabeth success to find a power equally to the great seal and replace it then set Makoto's soul free she left Thanatos at the Velvet room nand never came back. Then Yaldabaoth imprisoning Igor and cut Lavenza in half before that happen she used Thanatos to created Morgana then sent off to find a Wildcard to save her master.
You are right "technically" literally sees said.... Well if everyone gets "changing the hearts of people erebus will not exist so no need for the seal but strikers aside & people still wishing for demise, for what we "mostly" know mementos & by extension TV world may just be japan or hell may just be like 50% of shadows because it still exist even after yaldabouth demise.... See the third semester While your context is right it's just that we don't have the full picture
it being the same world makes me curious as to what atlus plans to do next, but at the end of the day it's their story and they can write whatever they want. The story can change so much to the point where this whole topic no longer has any weight. That's the power of great plot and hard work.
@@Matagatsu I mean rememberin Nyx is an Alien Star Destroyer which became the Moon when it hit Earth, and from that all life started appearing and quickly evolving creating the collective unconscious, this is all explained in the Persona 3 FanClub book, it's not an fan book, it's just the name, Atlus themselves made it. So like Nyx is really a being higher than every other boss in Persona, outside of Nyarlathothep. That's also the reason why the Nyx Avatar gives so much genuine life lessons, because it seen life grow and evolve in billions of years.
@@asafesseidonsapphireYES I finally found a comment about this. Nyx is an actual alien celestial body named the Star Eater and is REAL. which is why they mentioned Nyx is neither malevolent nor evil. She just wants to merge her body back. Her psyche was placed on earth while her body idles on the moon. This is what births the shadows as they are Nyx's fragments. It all gets pretty lengthy so I'll stop here.
@@Matagatsu seriously. Countering death, and by extension of P3's themes, nihilism, by living every day to the fullest and letting nothing stop you from finding happiness is not only good life advice, but a genuinely great takeaway from the entire series as a whole. In my opinion, anyway.
I don't even know what to say right now. This is the first time anyone's ever actually listened to what I had to say about anything like this. Thank you so much
"The Persona 3 Club Book explains that Nyx is a celestial-body sized alien called a Planet Eater. Nyx crashed into prehistoric Earth where her body and psyche were separated, with her body becoming the Moon and her psyche staying on Earth. Her "wave-like psyche" existed in contradiction to the psyche of early lifeforms on Earth, so life as a whole evolved to seal Nyx within the Collective Unconscious as their Shadows. The Fall is when of both Nyx parts which would, if rejoined, rip the Shadows out of the living creatures on Earth while simultaneously destroying Earth. This process is kicked underway by the events of Persona 3" So essentially the Collective Unconscious exists as an Evolution of Human Psyche as life evolved to seal the Wave-Like Psyche which was Nyx, away as their Shadows. Shadows are born from Humans, and they exist mostly to protect humanity from Nyx herself, however, they are also part of what Nix are, meaning with the correct setting, it's possible to Nix to use that collective unconsciousness to achieve her goal, which is to destroy the world. There's also an explanation that while Nyx is from outerspace, all other dieties are born from the Collective Unconsciousness of people, that's why yaldabaoth exists. Since long time past, humans believe in gods, and these gods became real through the collective unconsciousness, that's why we see Izanami, and Izanagi-no-Okami is possible to manifest himself as a Persona. A persona is literally a human being able to control his own shadow. We also see in P3 that if a person is awaken to a Persona in the wrong way or forcibly, that persona will try to kill them. Because Shadows don't attack people in the real world, but by influence of Nyx, they attack humans that enter in contact to them. The Dark Hour allowed the Shadows to come out of the collective unconsciousness to the real world and attack people, P4 the TV world created by Izanami allows people to interfere with the Shadow World, the same for P5. But in P5, we live in such a modern era, that I doubt most people, especially the young ones, believe in Gods. Instead they want to live in a frenzy-like state, where they don't have to think for themselves. That creates Yalldabaoth, and he himself is not the God of the collective unconsciousness himself. New gods can be born, and every time they start messing with people, is when shit goes downhill. Yalldabaoth is also known as the False god. The real god are the ones who entrusted Igor and the Velvet Room to mankind, and he's actually constantly seen in every game as a blue butterfly. Truth is: Every time gods try to help making, they are fucked. While these gods are moved by the collective unconsciousness of people, of wanting something specific, and they usually try to mess with a certain area first to judge the entire world based on that, they are still moved by these people. Nyx is different. She WANTS to kill people, and her influence makes people lose the will to live. "Nyx is not a manifestation of a collective thought (unlike Nyarlathotep, Izanami, Yaldabaoth, Enlil, or Salmael), but an almighty, astronomical entity who appeared from outer space." So yeah, all gods even Yaldabaoth are created by the Collective Unconsciousness to protect mankind from Nyx Psyche. Sometime they go out of control, and events like P4 and 5 happens, while every now and then the events of P3 will happen. As long as Nyx exists mankind will keep calling for her. I believe Elizabeth's mission is to literally un-seal the protagonist life force once she thinks it won't be able to impede Erebus from calling forth the Fall. She even makes sure to kick three erebu's ass to impede them to call out to nyx, hence weakening Makoto's life force.
This is actually a dope video dude. I can definitely see where you’re coming from and would be curious if the next P5 spin-off or even P6 would do something like this. Good food for thought. Great video.
Meanwhile, nyalothep is hiding in plainsight. Isn't that right, philemon? Jokes aside thank you for watching and I'm glad you think so. If The legendary philemon himself has said this was a great video, then I better take some notes and aim to keep making more organic videos like this one. Thanks so much. Your feedback helps me out tons.
Really interesting video with a rather uplifting and sweet message on how we should carry out our existence and become better people, great job dude Btw, the idea of the Phantom Thieves accidentally releasing Nyx by killing Yaldabaoth is absolutely insane and I hope Atlus tries to explore it, it would make for the ultimate meta-narrative
Meh, with how much Evangelion references in P3 and P3R is quite reminicent of the Eva Rebuilds, most likely they would eventually do it. The Answer DLC will come first, followed by the epilogue 9 years later.
Personally, I want him to becone a velvet resident after he was aved😂 Like man come onnn, PHILEMON MAH BOY LITERALLY PROVED YOUR GREATEST WISH WHEN YOU TOOK A BET WITH NYARLATOTEPH (BAD SPELLING) HUMANITY' HOPE AND POSITIVE THOUGHTS!!!!!! COME ONNNNNNNN!!!!! ATLEAST LET HIM BE A RESIDENT
🤣 it would also work out well for Elizabeth I guess. But enslavement by philemon after being set free is diabolical atlus might give you what you want.
honestly though, that's a feasible conclusion. His physical body may be destroyed/decayed in the physical world, but once he becomes a Resident, then he may be able to trascend of being normal human, and may or may not be capable of creating his own vessel to walk the world, to exist between physical and astral realm, like the Velvet Residents.
I know they don't really go into this in p much any game, sides like P1/2, but I'm under the impression that the gods are Philemon and Nyarlathotep still making bets. That's why the protag sees the blue butterfly, has the wild card ability, and has access to the Velvet Room. Those are all things Philemon gives to help humanity. Since he can't intervene directly. All the gods say the same thing about how this is humanities will, ect, ect. That said, I would be all for a DLC (maybe a spin off game if it was good enough, game play wise. My votes a fighting game since we never got a P5A.) Where you play as Elizabeth and actually find a way to save Makoto. He's the only protag that got the wrong end of the stick. The others got to continue their lives after beating their god. Which is fucked, cause he stopped ONE (1) god from destroying the world. Apparently, there's a whole host of others at the ready to do the same thing. I know that maybe cheapens the ending of P3, but I think initial sacrifice. Along with Elizabeth's struggle to get him back. Would be enough to make it feel worthwhile.
I want to believe that one day we'll get a proper conclusion to the P3/Nyx Saga but it's really starting to feel like Atlus has forgotten about that plot point
That's a pretty good video. The "BOOM!" was unnecessary and I think that the video could have been longer but your thought process it great. Keep it up!
The opening theory doesn't make sense. For one, it's implied that these beings always existed, given how much they talk about humanity's past. Even then, the moment Yaldy started controlling everyone, no one yearned for death, meaning the door didn't need to be a door anymore and Elizabeth would've probably found a way to free him
@@Matagatsu The Conception is a cataclysmic event that happens in all Shin Megami Tensei timelines. It's the end of the world and it occurs when the previous world order is at it's limit, ready to be replaced by anyone who is worthy to take the helm. Depending on who you ask, it can be considered a good or bad thing; however it is inevitable. In Shin Megami Tensei 1, If, 3, 4, Nine, and unfortunately 5; the Conception is the main reason why the protagonists take up arms. In Persona timeline, the heroes are actively delaying the Conception from happening.
I didn't even know it was called the conception, I was always confused as to why in every SMT game I've played, the world is always coming to an end. So far I've played smt 3, 4, and 5 thanks for telling me
@@Matagatsu And also, being an optional hidden boss, the strongest mf a new protagonist (or returning character) faces in the next game. Just like how Elizabeth and Margaret were also hidden bosses you could fight with their own persona arcanas. It would be as epic as facing Red in Pokemon Gold/Silver.
Isn't this the exact conclusion Yukari reached during 'The Answer' FES ending? She realized the only way to 'help' the protagonist was to live each day and ward off the darkness within her heart, otherwise she'd be empowering Erebus (the embodiment of everyone's desire to die). Kinda sucks Makoto will likely remain trapped as a seal for eternity. But at the same time, it's cool he practically evolved to become a God/Protector, similar to other protectors we can fuse/recruit (Masakado, the four heavenly pillars, etc).
Persona is definitely an interesting series. Especially the more you look into the timeline of events and even how things all connected back to Shin Megami's timeline. But Persona, especially 3 onward, is focused mostly on a similar message in each. Be true to yourself, don't hide behind false masks.
I know what you mean but is this gonna be a plot for the persona 6? Because theres 3 persona games has direct sequels like persona 4 arena or arena unltramax and persona 5 strikers but i keep think all day and i cant even move on seriously is gonna be not Happening?
It's a currently ongoing plot point that we probably won't see resolved anytime soon but it could be a spin off game or a future game that tackles death yet again, because nyx will return eventually and the more people wish for death, the more erebus will call nyx. So if someone were to remove and / or damage the great seal in an evil plot to destroy the world like in SMT, we might be seeing nyx making a come back. Now as for who might do something like that I dunno but that's up to atlus and the directors of persona 3 im a fan just like you.
haven't gotten through the whole video. But you make a convincing argument for the phantom thieves undoing S.E.E.S work. To be fair, Nyx did say "if there were more like you" so... maybe it's time? with persona 6 or 7 all teams join up?
Im wondering if the fact that atlus putting a lot of easter eggs about the events that took place in persona 3, as well as making Elizabeth leave the velvet room to go on her own journey, and atlus starting to remake persona 3 and the answer dlc is all connected to the next persona mainline game theyre cooking. It really feels like atlus is setting up a continuation about Minato's legacy in the next game
1:44 I know what you’re saying with this (you’re not undermining Makoto’s feat) but the Great Seal is obv one of the greatest feats in Persona. Makoto literally stopped an enemy that can’t be defeated in its tracks. He is the immovable object to Nyx’s unstoppable force.
Yes, and as ryoji said, normal days will return for all the party members. It was an act of self-sacrifice, but ryoji did clarify that nyx will return eventually. It's a statement that pretty much indicates that the seal might be temporary in some way. My assumption is that if humanity doesn't progress enough within the next 20 to 30 years and people keep suffering due to the unbalance of the world's state. Then I think makoto's sacrifice will be invain and the seal could either break or wear out. This means that the more time passes by, makotos' soul is being tortured with this duty brought on by self sacrifice.
Atlus could actually be setting up and paving the way for Minato's grand return. What happened to p4 and p5 made that foundation and soon enough, people will no longer yearn for nyx, making it possible to undo the seal and save Minato's soul
I have a idea of how they could bring him back and make it work. Elizabeth goes to the door and merges makotos soul with nyx putting his conscience in nyxs body becoming a pseudo death god and the trauma of having his soul being tormented by nyx could give him a herculean complex where he finds out other gods tried to destroy the world after p3 giving his accomplishment a odd sense of meaninglessness so he tries to become The absolute strongest to deal with any potential threats leading to a drive for power in good cause way which creates problems for rhe other groups and gains the kirijo groups attention leading to a crossover that this world has yet to witness. Baiscally he becomes an anime version of vergil from dmc.
I was thinking, surely Maruki's reality would result in Makoto Yuki coming back to life, and erebus would be weakened immensely due to humanity no longer wishing for death
If the gods of each game are actually just being misunderstood, and killing them speeds up the destruction of humanity; then creating a situation where the party has to kill them could be Nyarlethotep’s doing. I know that he was sealed when Philemon changed the past, but a combination of time and increasing negativity in the collective unconscious may have given him the strength to break free.
Itll just go back to persona 2 after what persona 5 did. persona 1 established the demons and the nature of the franchise. Persona 2 established that rumor can become reality and can be used to both prosper and harm. Persona 3 rumors of the end made the end come faster. Persona 4 rumors of midnight channel and the fog constantly surrounding inaba made it be. Persona 5 rumors of the phantom thieves made the cognition of the metaverse stronger as well as shape the psyche of the antagonists (Because ego and desires dont shape themselves alone but also in addition to the livelihood of the person and the rumors surrounding them). With each conclusion they deterred the "rumors" and made the world go back towards the truth and how it was meant to be. This might be a stretch but I think it would be a good place to start a theory if we tie it back to persona 2 instead of 3
When I first saw that scene playing the game I was like the Holy Grail just Thanos snapped us.Screw Yal as a boss though I "had" to Myriad Truths it with all its dam arms. Maruki reality sounds pretty nice if everyone is happy there is no Erebus or Nyx. Although Erebus is the only evil one of the two.
I wish they'd bring the earlier Persona games into the modern era. There's a lot of story in those, but it's very hard to dig out even if you can get the ancient games running these days.
I heard that there may be a remake of the earlier games coming following a potential persona 4 remake. It's not a pure confirmation, but if it's true, then it looks like thanks to the p3 reload situation, your wish may be granted soon
What if persona end off with every persons user joining together some grown some still young ready to face all their enemies with a boss rush of fighting every final boss ending off with makoto Yukis seal wearing off opening up nyx avatar and after him nyx herself shows
I think that's a cool concept, that may already be in the works. but the catch is... there is a final boss that's rumored to be returning in the near future. A boss so dangerous that every single protagonist would be needed to defeat him. A video with More on this soon
Funny I encountered this video, I was actually thinking of Kotone being released from the seal and reborn after the P5 series. I always thought Eurberus always existed it's just the dark hour destroyed the old Great Seal, so Nyx escaped. I thought that if People's hearts can change, it means the either the seal strengthens, or Eurberus loses the will the join Nyx. (Sensative phrasing ahead just a headsup) In any case, this is a reincarnation story but instead of fantasy she's reborn in the distant future (I choose the 2060's). Due to losing her body, her spirit forms into a nude body in a black void. She feels cold easily due to not having clothing aside from her iconic hairpins (like Hibiki in Symphogear) She, in the first time in years, was thinking. She thought where am I, why do I feel cold, and is Nyx gone? Then a Gold butterfly appears aka Philimon. He stated that since becoming the seal, future Persona users came to be and strengthened mankind's will. It's thanks to the recent group that the seal is no longer needed and she is allowed in to the sea of souls. But the reason he came is because he sensed that Kotone never gave up the will to live despite being dead. He came because another world in another time is in peril and he sensed that Personas are needed. He does have the power to resurrect but he can’t revive her in the same world she's born (evens so, she's legally dead). Kotone doesn’t hesitate and said she go. She knows she never see her old friends again but helping people in need is her vow. This also means that she'll truly live to the fullest. Philomon understands her will and flews into her being her rebirth. The next we see her, she's sleeping in an alley with a pink shirt, blue shirt, and a blue jacket . She wakes up and see that she ended up in a future version of Tastumi port Island. She spoted a group of techies about her age (she's an adult in her new body) fight what appears to be a Shadow. She hoped she has someway to fight and by chance her old Evoker is with her. She swiftly grabs it aim it to her head, quietly said “Persona” and bang! Orpheous returns and her new journey begins. Hope you like the concept. I think she's the one to have this story. She probably would want to be reborn after she is forced to sacrifice herself for the world. She probably would never see SEES again but her new group will bring back memories of them. Plus I was thinking of a side story where Kotone picks her clothes for the summer and she happens to find an adult version of her old summer dress (retro is commom in the future and it's my favorite outfit for her). While not directly a thoery, I wanted to share my fan story with fellow Kotone Fans. Hopee you like it.
You do realize in p3fes it is revealed that nyx is not evil and the reason why makoto sealed nyx was to prevend the negative will of mankind (erebus) from touching nyx also if the deities prevent the invasion of shadow why when we kill the deity in any game the shadow won't invade also the shadow is just the same side of the coin just like a persona in p3 nyx says that even if mankind depend on cards the arcana is the absolute true of the persona world i mean just look at social link And in so many video it is said that the actions of the phantom thieves is the solution they gave hope through sin a reddit post even said that yaldabaoth was destroyed because the purity of the sin and it's Igor Who tell us to kill yaldabaoth so....
I had to do a double take to see what video you were commenting on. Cause i dunno if you actually paid attention to anything I was saying. I'm not entitled to your time and I get that but if you don't watch everything how am I supposed to reply to you when you tell me what I already know? The whole point of this was to answer questions that we couldn't possibly know the answer to. Meaning there is no right or wrong answer because it doesn't exist as fact yet. That's why it's all theoretical and to top it off yes the shadows do prevent nyx from returning because they are a manifestation of the dark desires from within. Two sides of the same coin so by creating a society that steals the will of the masses yaldaboath essentially makes themselves a God thus preventing any other Gods or dieties from reaching these people because it's their desires that Call these dieties in the first place. So by suppressing and directing these desires for himself he prevent any potential good from happening but also by mistake prevents harm. I never once said that yaldaboath was good he was just another form of lesser evils, we became blind to the fact that igor himself also isn't good too, he's just a necessary force. That's why in persona 5 we didn't even notice that igor was replaced. The game had to tell us. If you don't do the work, nothing will change. And as for erebus he doesn't really matter. He was just written in as a manifestation of everyone's corrupted desires. They needed a boss for the team to fight and they can't have them fighting the thin air. So there you have it, erebus or not. These desires would have still called nyx cause Og p3 and p3fes didn't even mention erebus until the answer that's why I didn't mention him. He's basically just the desire for death 💀
Its more of a case of these are works of a conqueror based deity and a destruction based deity, and one is brought forth by mankind's desire for control, and the other for their end. In the end on both paths it leads to a form of end. One obviously everyone dies, and the other in due time everyone would practically become dolls due to loss of will. So yes, if Yalda won, Nyx wouldnt return, because at that point, someone else has essentially handled humanity, but thats more a Yalda victory than humanity's. Plus one of the main themes that tends to be a thing in this series is the protagonist needs to stop a god's plans that affect the cognitive world. Like do we need to go into Persona 2 and all the stuff that one pulled?
I like how other comments ignore Izanami's deeds. While Nyx trying to end all of humanity and Yaldaboth trying to rule over humanity behind the scenes, she's testing humanity. Adachi and Ame-no-Sagiri tried to make humanity become shadows and to believe the final boss, but the truth is she is the true hidden mastermind and is like a scientist observing the reactions of what happens when she gives her power to humans. In the year 2008, the Internet isn't big and I bet many people didn't get the true ending and just skip it, unlike Persona 3 and 5 where there's only a bad and good ending. I have, no knowledge of why she is in Inaba and what summoned her there though. There are no evil experiments in Inaba like in Persona 3 and Persona 5. So why is she there?
My first P3 game was reload, and after i just grinded that I’m absolutely invested in this over arching story. I’m hoping for P6 SEES and the phantom thieves and whatever new characters team up to save makoto and defeat Nyx and whoever else antagonist wise lol
I didn't think that Nyx was a "shadow deity" like Izsnsmi and Yaldabaoth were. Nyx was inside the Moon, apparently since before himans had enough sapience for shadows to develop. She seems more like a Great Old One to me.
I had similar theories when i started playing Persona, and while it is very spicy to think about all that, i came to the conclusion that it's grasping at straws, not in a bad way? like it's all about humanity facing the odds and it's desire to let go, Nyx isn't a god, it's a shadow, like any other gods in persona. It is a constant battle for balance yes but doesn't seem to be more than that. Velvet room? Igor? the particularities of each entry in the series? it's just flavor text to present particular struggles humanity faces and always faced. It isn't about teenagers facing judging gods but humanity fighting agaisnt it's own demons, or rather it's shadows
I think in p4 there is a line from igor that’s says something along the lines of “ hewas the best card user in the history of the velvet room.” Implying Igor deeply respected makoto
Thanks for the video! Sorry if this may come off as too harsh but I believe this video has quite a few misconceptions about the world of Persona. 1. Almost all 'deities' are in a human's perspective evil. - Persona 1 & 2 had Nyarlathotep, who had succeeded in destroying the whole world. - Persona 3 had Erebus, which was humanity's collective grief and negative emotion that sought death by coming into contact with Nyx. - Persona 5 had Yaldabaoth (probably the most antagonistic of the lot), who literally rigged the 'game' as it were, who still went ahead to enslave humanity even after his representative, Akechi lost. The other deities, like Izanami from Persona 4 are evil due to experimenting with humanity, then concluding that humanity seeks destruction, and either attempts to fulfill it or prevent it through their very questionable methods. THEY are the ones to interact with humanity first. They also believe that they are always in the right and all of them believe to be above human beings. It is impossible to negotiate with these conceptual beings as their existence is evidence of humanity's collective unconscious' desires. 2. Cognitive deities are the reason why shadows appear in the world, they either drag them or allow them to exit the sea of souls and enable their existence in the real world, dark hour, tv world, metaverse, whatever. Its all part of their experiment/game. Shadows also cannot exist in real life as they are beings of pure thought & energy, not having physical bodies (in normal cases, the research on 'cognitive psience', the most modern term for it in Persona 5 can be traced to Persona 1, its content has been changing hands). 3. Nyx is not really a cognitive deity like the others found in Persona. It is an alien called a Planet Eater. She crashed into prehistoric Earth, with her physical body on the moon and her psyche on Earth. Because of her presence, humanity evolved with a part of her 'psyche' as a part of their being; shadows. The cause of apathy syndrome is the freeing of an individual's shadow, as they are driven with the collective desire of becoming whole and restoring Nyx's psyche. The resulting apathy syndrome, losing all will to live, is just an unfortunate side effect. 4. The key reason that was not stated of why P3 Protagonist cannot return is not because of Nyx, but because of Erebus, humanity's collective grief and negative emotions that wants to become one with Nyx to cause the 'Fall', which would rip out every person's shadow, effectively killing them. Makoto's role as the great seal is not to stop Nyx from descending to Earth, but preventing Erebus from reaching Nyx. Even if killed, Erebus is continuously revived, as long as humanity has any negative emotions. So Elizabeth's goal is to somehow kill off Erebus permanently, therefore freeing Makoto from his role as the Great Seal. 5. The world of Persona is not coming to an end, it is just Elizabeth's wish of freeing Makoto and seeing him again. The world coming to an end already happened. - All sourced through the games and especially the P3 Club Book.
I'm just glad you watched the video. I'm not afraid of being wrong about anything that might directly conflict with what's already happened in the lore itself. I just wanted to have some fun while talking about a theory that's circled around the community ever since the release of persona 3, a theory that was also slightly catered to in P4AU by the dev team. It seemed like they originally planned some sort of large scale avengers level plot build up for an epic finale sequel that would unite both persona 3 and persona 4 in a unique way but it never got fully realized as it probably didn't get the green light My guess is that sega wanted more persona games, so epic finale showdown got scrapped and may probably have to wait until persona 10 or something. As for erebus I sort of left him out because as long as people change their hearts and stop wishing to die he'll eventually stop calling nyx Leaving no need for the great seal. Other than that I left everything open ended so that you can have your own opinion about this, so don't feel scared to state your opinion. Thanks for watching, making something on nyarlathotep right now hope to see you there too 👍
When you think about it...the final bosses of p4 and p5 are gods of Order that love man kind, trying to give mankind what they belive mankind wants...even Izanami was trying to see if the fog was what humanity wanted...it were always humans corrupted desires what led to the those "blesings becoming a hindrance"....and those gods might have awoken as result if human interference with the shadows in the godless world left qhen the major deities left Nyalathotep (chaos) and Phylemon (order)...after phylemon proved the will of mankind....then even Nyx a neutral god wanted humanity to persevere...and Izanami was proud of humanity for proving her wrong ..only the HollyGrial ..Yaldaboth....or his recarnation as Emma...both being encarnations of the Demiurge , the God of universe that isnt the real creator god couldnt understand why the phanton thieves oposed the will of humanity that created it it twice...both beings keeping humanity alive in diferent ways...one through ilution so humanity would desend to shadows inmortal beings not afraid of dead and the other by keeping humanity sasiated to the point it wont demand dead...and i trully wonder if both beings were awakened by the Door seal
Nyx is a threat, sure. But if Nyarlathotep returns that'll be the true end of everything. He's essentially the shadow of humanity as a whole and personification of every negative human emotion. He practically succeeded in destroying the world in Persona 2 all just because he made a bet that he could. It took 5 wild card persona users to defeat him.
It should be noted that it's _EXPLICITLY_ mentioned that Elizabeth is looking for ways to free Makoto from the seal and has kicked Nyx's ass YEARLY since Makoto made the Great Seal. Nyx was weakened BEFORE the defeat of Yadalbath
it's a curious thing that you say that those shadow or dark gods and entities cannot act freely, because that's also a point on the other series branch Digital Devil Saga where a black sun makes them act all those demons and so roam freely on the world
Neat video, but one slight thing. 'The moment man devoured the fruit of knowledge he sealed his fate' 'entrusting his future to the cards, man clings to a dim hope, the arcana is the means by which all is revealed' Seems like it's the fruit of knowledge of good and evil that did the 'dooming', not the cards as you said. Seems to be implying that seeking that is the dim hope. And what is the arcana so often linked to? Jolly ol SLinks and Bonds. So, fits the rest of the video, just slight nitpick.
Your kindness is much appreciated, and I promise I won't let it go to my head. I'm working on a giant nier lore video right now and a big persona lore video as well. Would appreciate your feedback on those, too. Every opinion helps me jmprove
Ok so am I right then saying makato isn’t dead because you can’t save a dead person so then am I right an he’s not dead? Because in an article I saw in regards to the dlc the answers aigis it said he died a day after he fell asleep so that would mean at the end of the game he was still alive as we never see him getting rushed to hospital. So just curious bout that
So I think the main character of persona 3 died and became the great seal to keep away nyarlethotep, who, in the eternal punishment timeline of persona 2, stated that he was the dark side of humanity’s subconscious and will always return. This leads me to believe Erebus from persona 3’s The Answer is nyarlethotep, because Erebus is humanity’s yearning for death manifested, and that is why it is attacking the great seal, which holds away nyx, who is able to bring that death and is also the Night Queen from persona 1, who also claimed to bring death and is also named Nyx. This means persona 3’s nyx could be the same to 1’s nyx, meaning nyx in 3 is a persona who remained after the death of it’s user. This is completely unique for any persona except Orpheus, who can be summoned by Aigis in The Answer after makoto (the great seal and MC of persona 4) dies and appears to Aigis in a dream. This means that all persona games from 2 onwards are in 2’s Eternal Punishment timeline, which means that Philemon, the light side of humanity’s subconscious and guide of humanity could be Yaldabaoth and Maraki at the same time, because both Yaldabaoth and Maraki were trying to guide humanity to peace and happiness, but in different ways. Elizabeth and Lavenza, however, are not the same like the others because Elizabeth left to try and free Makoto’s soul from the seal by trying to kill Erebus. The Phantom Thieves and the Investigation Team helped with this, as they stopped humanity’s apathy and changed the hearts of the wicked, helping humanity towards that goal of defeating Nyarlethotep who is Erebus, and freeing makoto’s soul from the seal, albeit unknowingly. All I can do to see if makoto’s souls is finally freed is wait for Persona 6, which we do not yet have a release date for but I have time.
But I think Philemon was split into two in the Eternal Punishment timeline, between games, because Yaldabaoth is more cruel and guides people to peace by removing the world’s entropy and the people’s ability to think for themselves, but Maraki is more kind and changed the world by allowing people to reach their desires with a little bit of altering the desires of those who are bad to make them kinder, but in doing so, he erases their memories of him because he does not want to be an idol. There are people who know of him and are devoted to his cause, but he keeps his palace (the area in which it’s ruler resides, the palace being the manifestation of it’s ruler’s distorted desires, selfless ones in Maraki’s case) hidden so that nobody who hasn’t found him by themselves can see him, his palace or his persona, again, because he does not want to be worshipped and only wants the happiness of others, even at the cost of nobody remembering him.
each persona protaginist has a rule to defeat nyx and rescue door kun. 1 persona 1 protagonists learns the power of cross travel to other world which he and she can help the female mc in p3p also and able to travel into nyx real realm. 2 persona 2 protagonists has the ability to go back in time he and she can travel point in time which makoto and the female mc still alive and train them to be stornger. 3 persona 4 protaganist has the ability to killed any evil gods it reveal in persona 5 royal that p4 protagonist has higest points needed to get the rewards in the battle which indicating that he has the storgest power among protagonist and his persona his the overpower one just using default stat on his persona without and training still the powerful persona also he killed many gods. 4 persona 5 protagonists yes i will include p5x protagonist because both of them gain the ability of a thief and also see the illusion form from the darkness. 5 persona 6 protagonists will be the key to revive him because of the color the game bring and it is green which it means recovery for the entire world. all the protagonists gain this power in there ordeal, which the only question is what is the original plan of the orginal valvet room he his the one created igor and put his desire and will into the chaos doll called igor, i can guess maybe they are preventing something big happening to end both worlds, igors world and all the human worlds including the main world, thats why he traning human to help him in the future
I never finished persona 5, but i think you are forgetting the importance of persona 4. Sure the settings is a small town area and its reach is not far. But it effect the way people is willing to see the truth hence in the true ending and people now have the possibility to work for the better instead of having an easy way out hence the wish for death for the truth to remain hidden.
![JOKER IS THE *HARDEST* BOSS IN PERSONA HISTORY! [HEARTLESS]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-wyEB8aKcg4/mqdefault.jpg)
Yo good video! My first time here and you’re definitely an underrated content creator.
I think you make a lot of good points in this video, though I will say I think you’re wrong about the final boss deities kinda being misunderstandings, especially Yaldaboath. The more you listen to how they combat the main characters’ arguments, the more you realize just how gaslighty these deities are. Even Izanami, who wasn’t directly responsible for a lot of the stuff in P4, definitely intentionally allowed for these things to happen (assuming I’m remembering correctly of course)
I see how you can make a strong argument for that if you view it solely from the point of view of the casts of characters' experiences in the games.
But when you look at the bigger picture, the final bosses are referring to everyone, not just the main cast of characters.
Yaldaboath became a God of cognition because all of societies desires gather in mementos. Their ultimate wish is to be ruled.
We later see this with maruki in Royal, and even with the Wonder spin-off game, mementos don't disappear at all. It just waits for a new ruler.
His situation is complicated he doesn't have good intentions, but he became a stop gap for nyx by accident.
In the case of p4, izanami created the TV world to reflect people's hearts in the goal of understanding them better.
So what happened afterward was just caused by those who used the TV world, meaning that the evil was a reflection of mankind's hubris in thinking themselves capable of mettling in the affairs of godly beings.
As for p3, nyx pretty much doesn't even want to bring death upon everyone, but it's ryoji's function he's basically the grim reaper of the universe's pantheon.
He only got drawn here by humanity's constant struggle and those who wish for it to end.
The misunderstanding is that although life gets so hard that you want to die sometimes, that doesn't necessarily mean that you really want to be killed.
But erebus doesn't give a damn to explain that because erebus is a personification of mankind's struggle and wish for death.
Earlier, someone said that these bosses are not gods, but they are shadows.
But the truth is these shadows are avatars if these gods, basically the result of what happens if they interact with our reality.
So yes, you did actually fight izanami. Not a shadow pretending to be izanami.
So there you have it. Thanks for watching, and I appreciate the feedback it helps me make better videos.
Admittedly I do think Izanami isn’t super bad but I was just kinda trying to say it to say it. Nyx isn’t inherently evil either, though I still don’t think it’s a misunderstanding. The way you’re saying it sounds like you’re implying that the wishes of humanity that draw these deities here are misunderstood by said deities, but I don’t think that’s true. I think these deities are simply fulfilling the wish the way people want it to be fulfilled within their hearts. The problem isn’t a misunderstanding of the wish, it’s the wish itself.
I kinda feel like I kinda went on about something that was hardly related to my original comment but oh well thank you for listening!
The misunderstanding comes from them not understanding that human desires at face value have different meanings.
For example, someone who wishes to be ruled over by yaldaboath doesn't actually want to be subjugated by an evil overlord.
They just want purpose in their life, but they feel like the lack of purpose and the difficulty of finding one makes life impossible to live in a world like this.
So they want to be given a purpose by a god, because that is the ultimate purpose one can receive. A purpose given by God.
But from yaldaboath's perspective, he's never been human, so he lacks a humans point of view and line of thinking.
So when he hears "I wanna be subjugated," bro actually thinks that will help that person.
So that's the misunderstanding I'm referring to.
We all go through it, which is why it's hard to put it into words.
Especially when you try to explain it to other people who's never been in your situation.
They'll misunderstand what you want to really say, that you can't find the words to say it with.
But if they understood your perspective first hand, then they'll understand the nuances and undertones of what you really want to say.
And I'm happy to have comments to even reply to. This channel nearly died a trillion times.
So please feel free to comment more. I don't care if you go off topic. I'm having fun, I haven't felt this alive in months :D
Glad to hear my comments are helpful!
Yeah I think I see what you mean by the whole how a desire is versus how it seems, and though I feel like I could still argue against it I feel like I agree with you a lot more now.
Good luck growing the channel, glad you’re doing something you enjoy!
While true, shadows by nature at least the sentient ones in 4 and 5 are charactures of the larger truths. It doesn’t help that Izanami’s domain was a cognitive world she corrupted since Teddy was old enough to comment that the fog was unnatural and when the investigation team took her down with Miriad Truths, he was able to confirm that the world went back to normal. The god of control also executed pretty much any one he wished, by erasing them from the combined world, so under his world the god of control might have been Nyx 2 if not rebelled against by the Phantom Thieves.
I really hope Elizabeth and the Shadow Exterminators (SEES) find a way to save Makoto's soul. Emphasis on the *SOUL*. Makoto's body is dead and burried, he'll never come back to life. But his soul is used for the Seal. I hope they save Makoto's soul, allow him to rest in the Afterlife.
And then, Makoto is freed from the seal by fusing with the fool arcana and pass the rest of eternity with Elizabeth
@@SleepyCoffeeOwl Dead dead. Deader than dead. Super dead. Extremely dead. His body is rotting and being eaten by worms and cockroaches. Only his bones and blue hair remain. Yes, the blue emo curtain hair is actually the only part of his that is immortal.
@@SleepyCoffeeOwl oh nooooooooooo. No no no no no no! U see my friend, us stupid and braindead, overly passionate and probably maidenless Persona 3 fanboiz (and Persona fans in general), we actually WANT Makoto to remain dead. U see, "it fits the themes of the game", "Makoto must die for his friends", "the Answer destroys everything for showing Makoto becoming a door", "the game should end with his death" etc etc.
Different endings, oh we don't accept those here. Only the canon must exist!!! We literally kill one another over the character's true canon name.
Oh, you must be new here, welcome to our fandom! 🙃 ((Itsucksleavewhileyoustillcanthisishell))
Oh, who am I kidding, all fandoms are the same... stay and have fun buddy, and don't listen to others.
Could be that or since igor is an interdimensionsal being he has immense power that could easily rewrite someone's geneitic structure and regenerate them from whatever is left or give them a new form entirely.
I saw some theories that Elizabeth may have already succeeded, and Jose might be a reborn Yuki-kun. I wanted to save this for the future, but it is just a theory.
I never understood why people are so against mc to come to live. Whats wrong with you all? The guy is finnaly got his desires back, after he went through everything. He deserves a happy life for himself. Sacrifice as a hero is such a braindead and stupid trope
You know it’s funny when I first played Persona 5 and saw the mental shutdown I just sat there and was like “wait isn’t this just Apathy syndrome?”
holy shit i did not realize until now lol
I'd never played 3 until Reload so I didn't make the connection. But with the "Shutdowns" you supposedly also had some people go psychopathic. You just never saw it in Game, (Outside Akechi's fight). So kind of "Similar but not exactly."
@@Chokahin P5 there are mental shutdowns and psychotic breakdowns, they are similar but not the same. Mental shutdows seem to be exactly like apathy syndrome while psychotic breakdowns are what you described.
Mental shutdows are caused by the death of a person's shadow, while psychotic breakdowns are caused by Akechi's ability.
The only question then is why some mental shutdown victims die (like Haru's father) and some don't, not sure if they ever explain that.
Oh wait, that’s true!
More or less.
The mental Shutdown makes the person shut down entirely, she loses her will to function. It's similar, yes, but the difference is that the Apathy Syndrome happens because a Shadow eats the bad feelings a human being has until there's nothing left there, but the Shutdown happen because the person's other self is erased. And so far, while the Apathy Syndrome have a cure, everyone afflicted by it was cured, a Mental Shutdown is permanent. Even if you don't die right away, and your body is maintained by fluids in a hospital for an indeterminate time, you will eventually die because there's no way for your shadow to reborn out of you.
I THINK, the only one that literally denied it's own shadow was Mitsuo, the P4 guy that blames himself for killing people just for people to think he's a criminal or some shit. But we know he didn't kill his shadow, or he would have been dead, he denied his other self, but that's what humans do all the time, the protagonists are forced to accept that in P4, denying and erasing are two different things I think.
Makoto’s Final awakened Persona was named Messiah, implying a second coming of Door-Kun.
Wasn't Orpheus Telos his Final Persona?
Eh... hmm. So, Messiah is his 'final Persona', with Orpheus Telos being a callback to Prime Personas from the P2 Duology, from my understanding. A modified, upgraded version of the original Persona. It has no skills but what it can inherit, so it's literally just meant to be a 'make your own Persona'. Yea, it does normally use Messiah in it's Fusion, but for the story, Messiah is the 'Ultimate Persona' for Minato.
@@marcusvinicius3298Orpheus Telos is just an endgame reward for players who maxed out every social link. It's just a way for the devs to say "Thanks for putting in so much work, here's a prize". Even if you play the female route, it will retain the male Orpheus model, so they didn't put much thought into it being the canonical Awakened persona for the protagonist whereas Messiah is used during end credit sequences and promotional artwork and the like.
@@marcusvinicius3298if you go by the game yes, if you go by the movie no. The anime movie shows his final persona that lets him stand up against Nyx and walk forward/fly into Nyx’s core as Messiah. And it’s a fusion between the two personas he first summons at the start of the games/movie being Orpheus and Thanatos which feels more like a final awakening persona.
To the life?
Elizabeth:…
To life…right?
Love how the fact the following Persona games from P3 has been destroying things from what Nyx said on the final fight. Nyx' said "Mankind's fate was sealed the moment they entrusted their future to the cards" and what is shown in P4? The breaking away from destiny hence with the breaking of tarot "cards" of the Inaba gang when they summon persona. P5 directly opposes Nyx' idea as stated in the video. Would really love a Persona game that will show the culmination of all these people's hard works and contribution in finally cutting off humanity's "Desire" of death and thus Nyx doesn't have reason to fall to earth
I want to believe that was the plan all along but now that the original team has moved on...i don't know
@@MonerLaine
I feel like with P5R bringing back Narukami and Yuki was a nice touch but also a bit of a test. Getting people and new comers who played P5 as their first persona to get interested in the other protags. Then with Reload being focused on Yuki. I wonder if it’s to gauge a reaction. Seeing if people are willing to be interested in the P3 protags story.
Plus, with The Answer being all but confirmed people will have questions about the story. Along with the points made in this video. Nyx’s words are being broken. Yuu and Ren did so.
Perhaps this could lead to a separate game or next installment bringing Nyx or P3 Hero to some degree to the story again.
Well, as long as I'm alive I'll be waiting and wishing for death, no matter how good or bad things will get. You can assume there will always be people and characters like that irl or in such stories, so the threat would never be gone even if society as a while changes fundamentally
Dude... I just accidentally clicked on this video, and was immediately hooked when I realized what it was about. I freaking love the persona games for their themes and overall messages, and this is honestly one of the coolest and most down to earth persona analysis videos I've seen yet. I really love your interpretation about how all of these games' main climaxes and gods all just stem from human misunderstanding, that's just a really neat way of looking at it. And any discussion about Nyx is always a win in my book, Nyx is honestly such an underrated part of these games, and is lowkey kind of the coolest part of Persona 3's overall story to me personally.
I just love that this video is so... relatable? For lack of a better term. I've been working on a sort of "mega analysis" video series for Persona 3 over the past year and a half, and as a result, I've had many shower-thought tangents like this about the deeper aspects of these games and their stories/themes, and to stumble across this video, which feels like such a perfect 7 minute embodiment of that stream of consciousness discussion surrounding these games that's so easy to get lost in for hours; I just don't feel like I see enough of it, and for that I appreciate this a lot. You've earned a new sub man, keep it up!
I've long since also had a longing to make a greater, more in-depth breakdown of persona 3, its themes, lore, and all the interconnected plot points, but I could never seemingly put it together properly
so I just came out of the shower at 3 a.m., threw on one of my old blaziers, and did my best to sort out my thoughts over a microphone.
I didn't think this video would reach anyone, but so far, you are the second person who has told me that this is actually good. And for that, I am insanely grateful.
I hope you also eventually make your Persona 3 video as well. And when you do I'll be the first to watch it!
@@Matagatsu Heck yeah man! Gotta love the spontaneity. I strive to have that level of "fuck it, let's do this" when it comes to making videos, so that's really inspiring to hear. This P3 video is easily the biggest thing I've ever worked on, so when it's finally finished I'm definitely gonna dial it back and make some much shorter more spontaneous stuff, cause I feel like that's really where a lot of the creativity comes from for me.
I'm so glad to hear you're interested in my video! It's VERY close to being done, so expect to see it really soon. Can't wait to see what more stuff you put out too, man!
To me Nyx made up Persona 3. Everything that happened before it's reveal, to be honest, wasn't that interesting (maybe except for the Sun social link and Junpei's mini arc). Now after defeating the 12th boss on November and realizing something was wrong, the game's plot went literally from 0 to 100 and became one of the best of all time.
@ThoMario86 I'm glad something was able to carry the game for you, but for me, ever since the beginning of the game, I was instantly captivated.
It was my second persona game, technically my first since I didn't beat p5 until I beat p3 and p3p. Love it so much that I'm on my 15th playthrough.
Nyx was definitely a high point, though.
@@thomario8639 I certainly understand what you mean. The plot pre-betrayal/Nyx is definitely very formulaic, and not in a way that's as inherently interesting or fresh as P4's shadows or P5's palaces. I like it personally, and find it kind of simplistic in an endearing way, especially considering how grand and insane the story goes on to become, meaning that by the time your face to face with Nyx, you can think back to the first two or three shadow fights and truly FEEL like you 've come that impossibly far. But yeah I see what you mean, P3 definitely peaked at it's end for sure.
6:18 you cant just say "hide away" and expect me not to think of verbalase immediately
I only saw a small part of this comment on my notifications, and i immediately knew what the rest of it was going to be about 🤣
Really interesting video. I always love the videos that talk about P3 in general, and anything related to Makoto Yuki and/or saving him, and this video is on that list. Keep it up with the great work!
Thanks for the encouragement I'll keep doing my best!
Oh… so persona 6 is gonna be a mashup of the persona pro tags against the seal? I would love to see the big 3 pro tags somehow join up to beat nyx up. I wish
yea you play as Elizabeth in persona 10 with 8 selectable party protag members
As much as I'd love that, it doesn't make much financial sense. Not only would such a story make any future persona games feel like filler, but this would require players to have played past games, or at least P3, which is something that would hurt the potential number of people who could buy the game.
I think it is more likely we could get that story as a spin-off game, which is honestly perfectly fine by me, as long as it is of good quality
@@wisefelipe I know it doesnt make financial sense. but a person can dream cant they XD
@@wisefelipe Which is why atlus is remaking all of these games so people can be familiar with these characters
@@wisefelipe there must be a reason why atlus remake p3 with reload so new player can play p3 with latest graphic and modern mechanic, there is also some leak that persona 4 is about to get remake too. It feels like they are up to something, maybe the Persona 6 is going to be saving makoto/ recurring character comeback, idk we'll see
Live life to the fullest, huh?
Not a bad way to bring back that blue-haired boy from door duty.
What is very interesting is Maruki's Arc almost if not straight up implying he can literally bring souls and bodies back to life from the dead and mass change cognition. It was flawed (because of his shadow and after his second persona could have gotten the perfect timeline ending) but Actually the Garden of Eden or Elysium in real life. Implying that yes he could have been alive again already
Izanami was board really, thats why she made the tv world. It was just one big game of "who dun it" for her.
Nanako is the culprit, of course
Really great and short analogy, my dude.
Also 15th playthrough and in P3? I commend your masochism and sheer will.
Thank you, Dashing Banana. Your kind words are appreciated, thank you so much for watching!!
I truly hope for is a spin-off/P3 sequel where they actually free him from being the Great Seal. My ideal ending to the P3 story would be this: Elizabeth sacrifices her immortality to the Seal, thus freeing Makoto's soul and becoming human herself. Aigis is somehow damaged after the climatic battle, her Papillon Heart breaks and she dies, but to symbolize that she's has a soul, after death she opens her eyes to see Makoto holding her, like she held him before he died. Then her soul and Makoto's move on together in the Afterlife. And if you wanna make it even more touching, have Elizabeth and his teammates be able to see them one last time and say their farewells and "we'll meet again" or "keep our seat in Heaven warm" etc. And in the credits, have artworks in blue and white where they are all together again, Elizabeth giving Makoto and Aigis a hug, Aki and Ken meeting Shinji, Mitsuru and Yukari hugging their fathers etc. That would be the best, most definitive, most perfect ending for Persona 3 imo.
I agree about this ending except the fact where aigis dies. The answer dlc actually made it clear that aigis wouldn't die any moment soon, and just Makoto moving on to the afterlife alone after saying goodbye to his friends and maybe confessing his emotions is gonna be much more impactful and emotional.
And they can end it to where Makoto becomes the new Velvet Room Master in replacement of Igor for the next generation of audience that Atlus will have
I'd say that is a fitting end for the one that did the impossible and made a miracle
Basically everyone dies
THIS IS LITERALLY WHAT I THOUGHT WHEN I SAW ELIZABETH’S STORY IN P4AU
THE ONLY THING THAT COULD STOP NYX IS CHANGING PEOPLE’S HEARTS??!?!
I literally went insane when i first read that
Atlus,,,, please give us a persona 5 arena or something where makoto comes back and is playable,,,, but dies right after cus him staying alive too much would mess up the plot of persona 3, its messages, its ending and a lot of other things a lot.
Anyways, thank you for the great video!
persona 5 collessum
Honestly this doesn't mess anything up, the message has already been delivered.
Looking at Makoto as Messiah, returning wouldn't be madness or some kind of conflict, he just needs to be a seal as long as people don't learn the value of life.
But I don't think it will happen anytime soon, he has already revived in Aigis, a "soulless" robot not only received his own soul but also the power of the savior
I have a crazy theory that might proof that Elizabeth already succeed at release Makoto's soul and that is Morgana. Remember what Morgana look like? A black cat with bright blue eyes wearing yellow scarf and keep saying that he is a human. And who is a boy with black hair bright blue eyes and wearing yellow scarf? Ryoji and Ryoji is Thanatos. In P4A Elizabeth take Thanatos with her to stop Erabus from reaching to Nyx. If my theory correct this is what happen. After somehow Elizabeth success to find a power equally to the great seal and replace it then set Makoto's soul free she left Thanatos at the Velvet room nand never came back. Then Yaldabaoth imprisoning Igor and cut Lavenza in half before that happen she used Thanatos to created Morgana then sent off to find a Wildcard to save her master.
Why are you telling me this? This is your idea. Go make a video before someone steals this theory from you
@@Matagatsu I like to sharing the idea it's more fun that way. If someone stealing my theory let cthem do. That mean they like my idea.
nah you cooked with theory bro such a cool concept that makes sense
You are right "technically" literally sees said.... Well if everyone gets "changing the hearts of people erebus will not exist so no need for the seal but strikers aside & people still wishing for demise, for what we "mostly" know mementos & by extension TV world may just be japan or hell may just be like 50% of shadows because it still exist even after yaldabouth demise.... See the third semester
While your context is right it's just that we don't have the full picture
it being the same world makes me curious as to what atlus plans to do next, but at the end of the day it's their story and they can write whatever they want.
The story can change so much to the point where this whole topic no longer has any weight. That's the power of great plot and hard work.
A lore book would be nice, though
@@Matagatsu I mean rememberin Nyx is an Alien Star Destroyer which became the Moon when it hit Earth, and from that all life started appearing and quickly evolving creating the collective unconscious, this is all explained in the Persona 3 FanClub book, it's not an fan book, it's just the name, Atlus themselves made it.
So like Nyx is really a being higher than every other boss in Persona, outside of Nyarlathothep.
That's also the reason why the Nyx Avatar gives so much genuine life lessons, because it seen life grow and evolve in billions of years.
@@asafesseidonsapphireYES I finally found a comment about this. Nyx is an actual alien celestial body named the Star Eater and is REAL. which is why they mentioned Nyx is neither malevolent nor evil. She just wants to merge her body back.
Her psyche was placed on earth while her body idles on the moon. This is what births the shadows as they are Nyx's fragments. It all gets pretty lengthy so I'll stop here.
Ah shit, This is... oh.
I'm so confused right now??
@@Matagatsu you points resonated. I don't articulate well.
WAIT REALYYY?!?!? you're not joking right?
@@Matagatsu seriously. Countering death, and by extension of P3's themes, nihilism, by living every day to the fullest and letting nothing stop you from finding happiness is not only good life advice, but a genuinely great takeaway from the entire series as a whole.
In my opinion, anyway.
I don't even know what to say right now. This is the first time anyone's ever actually listened to what I had to say about anything like this. Thank you so much
"The Persona 3 Club Book explains that Nyx is a celestial-body sized alien called a Planet Eater. Nyx crashed into prehistoric Earth where her body and psyche were separated, with her body becoming the Moon and her psyche staying on Earth. Her "wave-like psyche" existed in contradiction to the psyche of early lifeforms on Earth, so life as a whole evolved to seal Nyx within the Collective Unconscious as their Shadows. The Fall is when of both Nyx parts which would, if rejoined, rip the Shadows out of the living creatures on Earth while simultaneously destroying Earth. This process is kicked underway by the events of Persona 3"
So essentially the Collective Unconscious exists as an Evolution of Human Psyche as life evolved to seal the Wave-Like Psyche which was Nyx, away as their Shadows.
Shadows are born from Humans, and they exist mostly to protect humanity from Nyx herself, however, they are also part of what Nix are, meaning with the correct setting, it's possible to Nix to use that collective unconsciousness to achieve her goal, which is to destroy the world.
There's also an explanation that while Nyx is from outerspace, all other dieties are born from the Collective Unconsciousness of people, that's why yaldabaoth exists. Since long time past, humans believe in gods, and these gods became real through the collective unconsciousness, that's why we see Izanami, and Izanagi-no-Okami is possible to manifest himself as a Persona.
A persona is literally a human being able to control his own shadow. We also see in P3 that if a person is awaken to a Persona in the wrong way or forcibly, that persona will try to kill them. Because Shadows don't attack people in the real world, but by influence of Nyx, they attack humans that enter in contact to them. The Dark Hour allowed the Shadows to come out of the collective unconsciousness to the real world and attack people, P4 the TV world created by Izanami allows people to interfere with the Shadow World, the same for P5. But in P5, we live in such a modern era, that I doubt most people, especially the young ones, believe in Gods. Instead they want to live in a frenzy-like state, where they don't have to think for themselves. That creates Yalldabaoth, and he himself is not the God of the collective unconsciousness himself. New gods can be born, and every time they start messing with people, is when shit goes downhill.
Yalldabaoth is also known as the False god. The real god are the ones who entrusted Igor and the Velvet Room to mankind, and he's actually constantly seen in every game as a blue butterfly. Truth is: Every time gods try to help making, they are fucked. While these gods are moved by the collective unconsciousness of people, of wanting something specific, and they usually try to mess with a certain area first to judge the entire world based on that, they are still moved by these people. Nyx is different. She WANTS to kill people, and her influence makes people lose the will to live.
"Nyx is not a manifestation of a collective thought (unlike Nyarlathotep, Izanami, Yaldabaoth, Enlil, or Salmael), but an almighty, astronomical entity who appeared from outer space."
So yeah, all gods even Yaldabaoth are created by the Collective Unconsciousness to protect mankind from Nyx Psyche. Sometime they go out of control, and events like P4 and 5 happens, while every now and then the events of P3 will happen. As long as Nyx exists mankind will keep calling for her. I believe Elizabeth's mission is to literally un-seal the protagonist life force once she thinks it won't be able to impede Erebus from calling forth the Fall. She even makes sure to kick three erebu's ass to impede them to call out to nyx, hence weakening Makoto's life force.
This is actually a dope video dude. I can definitely see where you’re coming from and would be curious if the next P5 spin-off or even P6 would do something like this. Good food for thought. Great video.
Meanwhile, nyalothep is hiding in plainsight. Isn't that right, philemon? Jokes aside thank you for watching and I'm glad you think so.
If The legendary philemon himself has said this was a great video, then I better take some notes and aim to keep making more organic videos like this one. Thanks so much. Your feedback helps me out tons.
Really interesting video with a rather uplifting and sweet message on how we should carry out our existence and become better people, great job dude
Btw, the idea of the Phantom Thieves accidentally releasing Nyx by killing Yaldabaoth is absolutely insane and I hope Atlus tries to explore it, it would make for the ultimate meta-narrative
How the hell is this channel so underated???
Inconsistency is a problem I'm struggling with. I'm working on it. But I'm sure you can see the potential I'm just glad to be here at this point
god please let us have makoto back
i feel like atlus isnt doing the "save makoto" storyline anymore
Just gonna have to wait and see, who knows what might happen
Meh, with how much Evangelion references in P3 and P3R is quite reminicent of the Eva Rebuilds, most likely they would eventually do it. The Answer DLC will come first, followed by the epilogue 9 years later.
they might do something in The Answer DLC , that thing needs serious rewritting
Dang they never add him back but i can say with ease he is my favorite persona mc and persona 3 reload is my favorite game
Personally, I want him to becone a velvet resident after he was aved😂 Like man come onnn, PHILEMON MAH BOY LITERALLY PROVED YOUR GREATEST WISH WHEN YOU TOOK A BET WITH NYARLATOTEPH (BAD SPELLING) HUMANITY' HOPE AND POSITIVE THOUGHTS!!!!!! COME ONNNNNNNN!!!!! ATLEAST LET HIM BE A RESIDENT
🤣 it would also work out well for Elizabeth I guess. But enslavement by philemon after being set free is diabolical atlus might give you what you want.
honestly though, that's a feasible conclusion. His physical body may be destroyed/decayed in the physical world, but once he becomes a Resident, then he may be able to trascend of being normal human, and may or may not be capable of creating his own vessel to walk the world, to exist between physical and astral realm, like the Velvet Residents.
Been a viewer of the channel for years always love every video keep it up g 🔥
Thanks Jay preciate you man
Bring my boy back from the seal. Bring him home 😢
Wholesome af conclusion
I would like to watch your video, but I never played persona 3, so I will wait until I finish
Forget my video. Please play persona 3 it's highly underrated.
I know they don't really go into this in p much any game, sides like P1/2, but I'm under the impression that the gods are Philemon and Nyarlathotep still making bets. That's why the protag sees the blue butterfly, has the wild card ability, and has access to the Velvet Room. Those are all things Philemon gives to help humanity. Since he can't intervene directly. All the gods say the same thing about how this is humanities will, ect, ect.
That said, I would be all for a DLC (maybe a spin off game if it was good enough, game play wise. My votes a fighting game since we never got a P5A.) Where you play as Elizabeth and actually find a way to save Makoto. He's the only protag that got the wrong end of the stick. The others got to continue their lives after beating their god. Which is fucked, cause he stopped ONE (1) god from destroying the world. Apparently, there's a whole host of others at the ready to do the same thing. I know that maybe cheapens the ending of P3, but I think initial sacrifice. Along with Elizabeth's struggle to get him back. Would be enough to make it feel worthwhile.
Your channel is so underrated. Followed.
I am speechless. This is one of the best videos I EVER SEEN about persona series.
Definitely a deep dive but woa
Door-kun sealing Nyx was a miracle
Miracles don't last forever
I want to believe that one day we'll get a proper conclusion to the P3/Nyx Saga but it's really starting to feel like Atlus has forgotten about that plot point
It worry's me and about if they forget about it but I gonna say please can you please have any questions?
can't believe this guy predicted persona 6
That's a pretty good video. The "BOOM!" was unnecessary and I think that the video could have been longer but your thought process it great. Keep it up!
The opening theory doesn't make sense. For one, it's implied that these beings always existed, given how much they talk about humanity's past. Even then, the moment Yaldy started controlling everyone, no one yearned for death, meaning the door didn't need to be a door anymore and Elizabeth would've probably found a way to free him
You do realize the whole thing about the Persona timeline is kids are actively trying to prevent the Conception, right?
Enlighten me I don't know what that is
The conception is the main storyline of shin megami tensei 3: nocturne it’s a vortex world in which the new world will be reborn
@@Matagatsu The Conception is a cataclysmic event that happens in all Shin Megami Tensei timelines. It's the end of the world and it occurs when the previous world order is at it's limit, ready to be replaced by anyone who is worthy to take the helm. Depending on who you ask, it can be considered a good or bad thing; however it is inevitable.
In Shin Megami Tensei 1, If, 3, 4, Nine, and unfortunately 5; the Conception is the main reason why the protagonists take up arms. In Persona timeline, the heroes are actively delaying the Conception from happening.
I didn't even know it was called the conception, I was always confused as to why in every SMT game I've played, the world is always coming to an end. So far I've played smt 3, 4, and 5 thanks for telling me
@@Matagatsu No problem. Always happy to explain SMT Lore to a fellow fan
Man what a beautiful messaged, made my day!
Hear me out...him coming back reborn...as a Velvet Room attendant. Blue is his color after all.
i love this theory especially since all the attendants think of themselves as relatives/siblings.
@@Matagatsu And also, being an optional hidden boss, the strongest mf a new protagonist (or returning character) faces in the next game. Just like how Elizabeth and Margaret were also hidden bosses you could fight with their own persona arcanas.
It would be as epic as facing Red in Pokemon Gold/Silver.
this went crazy man thank you
Isn't this the exact conclusion Yukari reached during 'The Answer' FES ending? She realized the only way to 'help' the protagonist was to live each day and ward off the darkness within her heart, otherwise she'd be empowering Erebus (the embodiment of everyone's desire to die). Kinda sucks Makoto will likely remain trapped as a seal for eternity. But at the same time, it's cool he practically evolved to become a God/Protector, similar to other protectors we can fuse/recruit (Masakado, the four heavenly pillars, etc).
Perhaps Makoto's soul could be placed into a newer model of an Anti-Shadow Suppression Weapon and he could finally be with best girl Aigis
This is a cute idea. I'd love to see it. Would even convince the anti saving makoto camp
Persona is definitely an interesting series. Especially the more you look into the timeline of events and even how things all connected back to Shin Megami's timeline. But Persona, especially 3 onward, is focused mostly on a similar message in each. Be true to yourself, don't hide behind false masks.
I know what you mean but is this gonna be a plot for the persona 6? Because theres 3 persona games has direct sequels like persona 4 arena or arena unltramax and persona 5 strikers but i keep think all day and i cant even move on seriously is gonna be not Happening?
It's a currently ongoing plot point that we probably won't see resolved anytime soon but it could be a spin off game or a future game that tackles death yet again, because nyx will return eventually and the more people wish for death, the more erebus will call nyx.
So if someone were to remove and / or damage the great seal in an evil plot to destroy the world like in SMT, we might be seeing nyx making a come back.
Now as for who might do something like that I dunno but that's up to atlus and the directors of persona 3 im a fan just like you.
Awesome video dude! Earned a sub
haven't gotten through the whole video. But you make a convincing argument for the phantom thieves undoing S.E.E.S work. To be fair, Nyx did say "if there were more like you" so... maybe it's time? with persona 6 or 7 all teams join up?
I see you also feast on the fruit of knowledge, you already sealed your fate.
6:03 hits different if not applied to persona and instead spoken to the viewer.
Ok more like 6:14
snuck some dragon quest in there at the end. Never thought i would heat that song
Im wondering if the fact that atlus putting a lot of easter eggs about the events that took place in persona 3, as well as making Elizabeth leave the velvet room to go on her own journey, and atlus starting to remake persona 3 and the answer dlc is all connected to the next persona mainline game theyre cooking. It really feels like atlus is setting up a continuation about Minato's legacy in the next game
1:44 I know what you’re saying with this (you’re not undermining Makoto’s feat) but the Great Seal is obv one of the greatest feats in Persona. Makoto literally stopped an enemy that can’t be defeated in its tracks. He is the immovable object to Nyx’s unstoppable force.
Yes, and as ryoji said, normal days will return for all the party members. It was an act of self-sacrifice, but ryoji did clarify that nyx will return eventually.
It's a statement that pretty much indicates that the seal might be temporary in some way.
My assumption is that if humanity doesn't progress enough within the next 20 to 30 years and people keep suffering due to the unbalance of the world's state.
Then I think makoto's sacrifice will be invain and the seal could either break or wear out.
This means that the more time passes by, makotos' soul is being tortured with this duty brought on by self sacrifice.
Also, nyx don't actually need to be sealed since it's a neutral force and only comes if it's your time. So the seal wasn't actually needed
Atlus could actually be setting up and paving the way for Minato's grand return. What happened to p4 and p5 made that foundation and soon enough, people will no longer yearn for nyx, making it possible to undo the seal and save Minato's soul
Makoto is the only protagonist that dies and that's sad that he dies
i cant believe how goated this was
Bout to shed a tear 😢 thanks bruv
I have a idea of how they could bring him back and make it work. Elizabeth goes to the door and merges makotos soul with nyx putting his conscience in nyxs body becoming a pseudo death god and the trauma of having his soul being tormented by nyx could give him a herculean complex where he finds out other gods tried to destroy the world after p3 giving his accomplishment a odd sense of meaninglessness so he tries to become The absolute strongest to deal with any potential threats leading to a drive for power in good cause way which creates problems for rhe other groups and gains the kirijo groups attention leading to a crossover that this world has yet to witness. Baiscally he becomes an anime version of vergil from dmc.
I was thinking, surely Maruki's reality would result in Makoto Yuki coming back to life, and erebus would be weakened immensely due to humanity no longer wishing for death
If the gods of each game are actually just being misunderstood, and killing them speeds up the destruction of humanity; then creating a situation where the party has to kill them could be Nyarlethotep’s doing. I know that he was sealed when Philemon changed the past, but a combination of time and increasing negativity in the collective unconscious may have given him the strength to break free.
Some next level thinking right there
Itll just go back to persona 2 after what persona 5 did. persona 1 established the demons and the nature of the franchise. Persona 2 established that rumor can become reality and can be used to both prosper and harm. Persona 3 rumors of the end made the end come faster. Persona 4 rumors of midnight channel and the fog constantly surrounding inaba made it be. Persona 5 rumors of the phantom thieves made the cognition of the metaverse stronger as well as shape the psyche of the antagonists (Because ego and desires dont shape themselves alone but also in addition to the livelihood of the person and the rumors surrounding them). With each conclusion they deterred the "rumors" and made the world go back towards the truth and how it was meant to be.
This might be a stretch but I think it would be a good place to start a theory if we tie it back to persona 2 instead of 3
When I first saw that scene playing the game I was like the Holy Grail just Thanos snapped us.Screw Yal as a boss though I "had" to Myriad Truths it with all its dam arms. Maruki reality sounds pretty nice if everyone is happy there is no Erebus or Nyx. Although Erebus is the only evil one of the two.
give away part of your freedom but what makes you human is no longer there.
I mean, I wonder if 3 WORLD Personas and over 40 persona user might be able to defeat Nyx maybe
You can't Kill DEATH though, only delay it.
You can stop nyx, but you won't be able to actually defeat it. It's the literal death, if it gets killed then everyone won't have to die anymore
Yaoldobalth's grand design is honestly no better than the apathy syndrome. Can you truly call living in a world like that being alive?
I wish they'd bring the earlier Persona games into the modern era. There's a lot of story in those, but it's very hard to dig out even if you can get the ancient games running these days.
I heard that there may be a remake of the earlier games coming following a potential persona 4 remake.
It's not a pure confirmation, but if it's true, then it looks like thanks to the p3 reload situation, your wish may be granted soon
then theres persona 4 standing off to the side
I like how the footage in some parts has female protag persona 5 mod.
Am I missing something or are you refering to the P5X gameplay?
What if persona end off with every persons user joining together some grown some still young ready to face all their enemies with a boss rush of fighting every final boss ending off with makoto Yukis seal wearing off opening up nyx avatar and after him nyx herself shows
I think that's a cool concept, that may already be in the works. but the catch is... there is a final boss that's rumored to be returning in the near future. A boss so dangerous that every single protagonist would be needed to defeat him.
A video with More on this soon
@@Matagatsu do you mean nyarlathotep?
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Dude... You just made me think, you guys remember how Persona resembles some parts of Jojos?
I just remember what happened in Part 6...
OH HOLD UP. IM JUST REALIZING THIS TOO
@@Matagatsu DUDE
IMAGINE IF GET A FEMALE PROTAGONIST ON PERSONA 6
We're so done,,,,
Calling it right now final boss ultimate move. MADE IN HEAVEN. Araki wants royalties
@@Matagatsu Remember me, they are gonna MADE IN HEAVEN the world in Persona 6
What about persona 4 arena where Elizabeth routinely kills nyx over and over before he can get stronger as soon as it spawns
Elizabeth is not killing Nix She’s killing Erebus
@elementalchevalier you are not wrong but I said nyx because erebus is the key for nyx. Again you are 100% right tho
Funny I encountered this video, I was actually thinking of Kotone being released from the seal and reborn after the P5 series. I always thought Eurberus always existed it's just the dark hour destroyed the old Great Seal, so Nyx escaped. I thought that if People's hearts can change, it means the either the seal strengthens, or Eurberus loses the will the join Nyx.
(Sensative phrasing ahead just a headsup)
In any case, this is a reincarnation story but instead of fantasy she's reborn in the distant future (I choose the 2060's). Due to losing her body, her spirit forms into a nude body in a black void. She feels cold easily due to not having clothing aside from her iconic hairpins (like Hibiki in Symphogear) She, in the first time in years, was thinking. She thought where am I, why do I feel cold, and is Nyx gone?
Then a Gold butterfly appears aka Philimon. He stated that since becoming the seal, future Persona users came to be and strengthened mankind's will. It's thanks to the recent group that the seal is no longer needed and she is allowed in to the sea of souls. But the reason he came is because he sensed that Kotone never gave up the will to live despite being dead. He came because another world in another time is in peril and he sensed that Personas are needed. He does have the power to resurrect but he can’t revive her in the same world she's born (evens so, she's legally dead). Kotone doesn’t hesitate and said she go. She knows she never see her old friends again but helping people in need is her vow. This also means that she'll truly live to the fullest.
Philomon understands her will and flews into her being her rebirth. The next we see her, she's sleeping in an alley with a pink shirt, blue shirt, and a blue jacket . She wakes up and see that she ended up in a future version of Tastumi port Island. She spoted a group of techies about her age (she's an adult in her new body) fight what appears to be a Shadow. She hoped she has someway to fight and by chance her old Evoker is with her. She swiftly grabs it aim it to her head, quietly said “Persona” and bang! Orpheous returns and her new journey begins. Hope you like the concept. I think she's the one to have this story. She probably would want to be reborn after she is forced to sacrifice herself for the world. She probably would never see SEES again but her new group will bring back memories of them. Plus I was thinking of a side story where Kotone picks her clothes for the summer and she happens to find an adult version of her old summer dress (retro is commom in the future and it's my favorite outfit for her). While not directly a thoery, I wanted to share my fan story with fellow Kotone Fans. Hopee you like it.
You do realize in p3fes it is revealed that nyx is not evil and the reason why makoto sealed nyx was to prevend the negative will of mankind (erebus) from touching nyx also if the deities prevent the invasion of shadow why when we kill the deity in any game the shadow won't invade also the shadow is just the same side of the coin just like a persona in p3 nyx says that even if mankind depend on cards the arcana is the absolute true of the persona world i mean just look at social link
And in so many video it is said that the actions of the phantom thieves is the solution they gave hope through sin a reddit post even said that yaldabaoth was destroyed because the purity of the sin and it's Igor Who tell us to kill yaldabaoth so....
I had to do a double take to see what video you were commenting on. Cause i dunno if you actually paid attention to anything I was saying.
I'm not entitled to your time and I get that but if you don't watch everything how am I supposed to reply to you when you tell me what I already know?
The whole point of this was to answer questions that we couldn't possibly know the answer to.
Meaning there is no right or wrong answer because it doesn't exist as fact yet. That's why it's all theoretical and to top it off yes the shadows do prevent nyx from returning because they are a manifestation of the dark desires from within.
Two sides of the same coin so by creating a society that steals the will of the masses yaldaboath essentially makes themselves a God thus preventing any other Gods or dieties from reaching these people because it's their desires that Call these dieties in the first place.
So by suppressing and directing these desires for himself he prevent any potential good from happening but also by mistake prevents harm.
I never once said that yaldaboath was good he was just another form of lesser evils, we became blind to the fact that igor himself also isn't good too, he's just a necessary force.
That's why in persona 5 we didn't even notice that igor was replaced. The game had to tell us.
If you don't do the work, nothing will change. And as for erebus he doesn't really matter. He was just written in as a manifestation of everyone's corrupted desires. They needed a boss for the team to fight and they can't have them fighting the thin air.
So there you have it, erebus or not. These desires would have still called nyx cause Og p3 and p3fes didn't even mention erebus until the answer that's why I didn't mention him. He's basically just the desire for death 💀
Its more of a case of these are works of a conqueror based deity and a destruction based deity, and one is brought forth by mankind's desire for control, and the other for their end. In the end on both paths it leads to a form of end. One obviously everyone dies, and the other in due time everyone would practically become dolls due to loss of will. So yes, if Yalda won, Nyx wouldnt return, because at that point, someone else has essentially handled humanity, but thats more a Yalda victory than humanity's. Plus one of the main themes that tends to be a thing in this series is the protagonist needs to stop a god's plans that affect the cognitive world. Like do we need to go into Persona 2 and all the stuff that one pulled?
I like how other comments ignore Izanami's deeds. While Nyx trying to end all of humanity and Yaldaboth trying to rule over humanity behind the scenes, she's testing humanity. Adachi and Ame-no-Sagiri tried to make humanity become shadows and to believe the final boss, but the truth is she is the true hidden mastermind and is like a scientist observing the reactions of what happens when she gives her power to humans. In the year 2008, the Internet isn't big and I bet many people didn't get the true ending and just skip it, unlike Persona 3 and 5 where there's only a bad and good ending.
I have, no knowledge of why she is in Inaba and what summoned her there though. There are no evil experiments in Inaba like in Persona 3 and Persona 5. So why is she there?
My first P3 game was reload, and after i just grinded that I’m absolutely invested in this over arching story. I’m hoping for P6 SEES and the phantom thieves and whatever new characters team up to save makoto and defeat Nyx and whoever else antagonist wise lol
I didn't think that Nyx was a "shadow deity" like Izsnsmi and Yaldabaoth were. Nyx was inside the Moon, apparently since before himans had enough sapience for shadows to develop. She seems more like a Great Old One to me.
I had similar theories when i started playing Persona, and while it is very spicy to think about all that, i came to the conclusion that it's grasping at straws, not in a bad way? like it's all about humanity facing the odds and it's desire to let go, Nyx isn't a god, it's a shadow, like any other gods in persona. It is a constant battle for balance yes but doesn't seem to be more than that. Velvet room? Igor? the particularities of each entry in the series? it's just flavor text to present particular struggles humanity faces and always faced. It isn't about teenagers facing judging gods but humanity fighting agaisnt it's own demons, or rather it's shadows
I heard many people saying that Makoto will replace Igor...plot twist. What if Makoto IS Igor
I think in p4 there is a line from igor that’s says something along the lines of “ hewas the best card user in the history of the velvet room.” Implying Igor deeply respected makoto
This makes so much sense if this is true that makes so much sense of why persona 4 and 5 true final boss felt so forced and random
Thanks for the video! Sorry if this may come off as too harsh but I believe this video has quite a few misconceptions about the world of Persona.
1. Almost all 'deities' are in a human's perspective evil.
- Persona 1 & 2 had Nyarlathotep, who had succeeded in destroying the whole world.
- Persona 3 had Erebus, which was humanity's collective grief and negative emotion that sought death by coming into contact with Nyx.
- Persona 5 had Yaldabaoth (probably the most antagonistic of the lot), who literally rigged the 'game' as it were, who still went ahead to enslave humanity even after his representative, Akechi lost.
The other deities, like Izanami from Persona 4 are evil due to experimenting with humanity, then concluding that humanity seeks destruction, and either attempts to fulfill it or prevent it through their very questionable methods. THEY are the ones to interact with humanity first. They also believe that they are always in the right and all of them believe to be above human beings. It is impossible to negotiate with these conceptual beings as their existence is evidence of humanity's collective unconscious' desires.
2. Cognitive deities are the reason why shadows appear in the world, they either drag them or allow them to exit the sea of souls and enable their existence in the real world, dark hour, tv world, metaverse, whatever. Its all part of their experiment/game. Shadows also cannot exist in real life as they are beings of pure thought & energy, not having physical bodies (in normal cases, the research on 'cognitive psience', the most modern term for it in Persona 5 can be traced to Persona 1, its content has been changing hands).
3. Nyx is not really a cognitive deity like the others found in Persona. It is an alien called a Planet Eater. She crashed into prehistoric Earth, with her physical body on the moon and her psyche on Earth. Because of her presence, humanity evolved with a part of her 'psyche' as a part of their being; shadows. The cause of apathy syndrome is the freeing of an individual's shadow, as they are driven with the collective desire of becoming whole and restoring Nyx's psyche. The resulting apathy syndrome, losing all will to live, is just an unfortunate side effect.
4. The key reason that was not stated of why P3 Protagonist cannot return is not because of Nyx, but because of Erebus, humanity's collective grief and negative emotions that wants to become one with Nyx to cause the 'Fall', which would rip out every person's shadow, effectively killing them. Makoto's role as the great seal is not to stop Nyx from descending to Earth, but preventing Erebus from reaching Nyx. Even if killed, Erebus is continuously revived, as long as humanity has any negative emotions. So Elizabeth's goal is to somehow kill off Erebus permanently, therefore freeing Makoto from his role as the Great Seal.
5. The world of Persona is not coming to an end, it is just Elizabeth's wish of freeing Makoto and seeing him again. The world coming to an end already happened.
- All sourced through the games and especially the P3 Club Book.
I'm just glad you watched the video.
I'm not afraid of being wrong about anything that might directly conflict with what's already happened in the lore itself.
I just wanted to have some fun while talking about a theory that's circled around the community ever since the release of persona 3, a theory that was also slightly catered to in P4AU by the dev team.
It seemed like they originally planned some sort of large scale avengers level plot build up for an epic finale sequel that would unite both persona 3 and persona 4 in a unique way but it never got fully realized as it probably didn't get the green light
My guess is that sega wanted more persona games, so epic finale showdown got scrapped and may probably have to wait until persona 10 or something.
As for erebus I sort of left him out because as long as people change their hearts and stop wishing to die he'll eventually stop calling nyx
Leaving no need for the great seal.
Other than that I left everything open ended so that you can have your own opinion about this, so don't feel scared to state your opinion.
Thanks for watching, making something on nyarlathotep right now hope to see you there too 👍
When you think about it...the final bosses of p4 and p5 are gods of Order that love man kind, trying to give mankind what they belive mankind wants...even Izanami was trying to see if the fog was what humanity wanted...it were always humans corrupted desires what led to the those "blesings becoming a hindrance"....and those gods might have awoken as result if human interference with the shadows in the godless world left qhen the major deities left Nyalathotep (chaos) and Phylemon (order)...after phylemon proved the will of mankind....then even Nyx a neutral god wanted humanity to persevere...and Izanami was proud of humanity for proving her wrong
..only the HollyGrial ..Yaldaboth....or his recarnation as Emma...both being encarnations of the Demiurge , the God of universe that isnt the real creator god couldnt understand why the phanton thieves oposed the will of humanity that created it it twice...both beings keeping humanity alive in diferent ways...one through ilution so humanity would desend to shadows inmortal beings not afraid of dead and the other by keeping humanity sasiated to the point it wont demand dead...and i trully wonder if both beings were awakened by the Door seal
Nyx is a threat, sure. But if Nyarlathotep returns that'll be the true end of everything. He's essentially the shadow of humanity as a whole and personification of every negative human emotion. He practically succeeded in destroying the world in Persona 2 all just because he made a bet that he could. It took 5 wild card persona users to defeat him.
I'm all late but if this happens Philemon needs to return
... OH F***
I've been into Persona for so long and... I haven't really looked into this like that... Ohh boy...
It should be noted that it's _EXPLICITLY_ mentioned that Elizabeth is looking for ways to free Makoto from the seal and has kicked Nyx's ass YEARLY since Makoto made the Great Seal. Nyx was weakened BEFORE the defeat of Yadalbath
what if makoto yuki becomes a velvet room attendant???
Interesting. Thank you
Didnt door kuns soul go into aigis in the answer?
Would explain why she had the wildcard ability
It's Philemon. He gave wildcard ability to her during early scene of The Answer.
it's a curious thing that you say that those shadow or dark gods and entities cannot act freely, because that's also a point on the other series branch Digital Devil Saga where a black sun makes them act all those demons and so roam freely on the world
Neat video, but one slight thing.
'The moment man devoured the fruit of knowledge he sealed his fate'
'entrusting his future to the cards, man clings to a dim hope, the arcana is the means by which all is revealed'
Seems like it's the fruit of knowledge of good and evil that did the 'dooming', not the cards as you said. Seems to be implying that seeking that is the dim hope.
And what is the arcana so often linked to? Jolly ol SLinks and Bonds.
So, fits the rest of the video, just slight nitpick.
Nobody can save him, really save him tho, his body is dead, at most that will be freeing his soul
I cannot believe how little subs you have this video feels like something a multi million sub channel would make keep up the good work man!
Your kindness is much appreciated, and I promise I won't let it go to my head.
I'm working on a giant nier lore video right now and a big persona lore video as well.
Would appreciate your feedback on those, too. Every opinion helps me jmprove
Ok so am I right then saying makato isn’t dead because you can’t save a dead person so then am I right an he’s not dead? Because in an article I saw in regards to the dlc the answers aigis it said he died a day after he fell asleep so that would mean at the end of the game he was still alive as we never see him getting rushed to hospital. So just curious bout that
Good vidro, great message
So I think the main character of persona 3 died and became the great seal to keep away nyarlethotep, who, in the eternal punishment timeline of persona 2, stated that he was the dark side of humanity’s subconscious and will always return. This leads me to believe Erebus from persona 3’s The Answer is nyarlethotep, because Erebus is humanity’s yearning for death manifested, and that is why it is attacking the great seal, which holds away nyx, who is able to bring that death and is also the Night Queen from persona 1, who also claimed to bring death and is also named Nyx. This means persona 3’s nyx could be the same to 1’s nyx, meaning nyx in 3 is a persona who remained after the death of it’s user. This is completely unique for any persona except Orpheus, who can be summoned by Aigis in The Answer after makoto (the great seal and MC of persona 4) dies and appears to Aigis in a dream. This means that all persona games from 2 onwards are in 2’s Eternal Punishment timeline, which means that Philemon, the light side of humanity’s subconscious and guide of humanity could be Yaldabaoth and Maraki at the same time, because both Yaldabaoth and Maraki were trying to guide humanity to peace and happiness, but in different ways. Elizabeth and Lavenza, however, are not the same like the others because Elizabeth left to try and free Makoto’s soul from the seal by trying to kill Erebus. The Phantom Thieves and the Investigation Team helped with this, as they stopped humanity’s apathy and changed the hearts of the wicked, helping humanity towards that goal of defeating Nyarlethotep who is Erebus, and freeing makoto’s soul from the seal, albeit unknowingly. All I can do to see if makoto’s souls is finally freed is wait for Persona 6, which we do not yet have a release date for but I have time.
But I think Philemon was split into two in the Eternal Punishment timeline, between games, because Yaldabaoth is more cruel and guides people to peace by removing the world’s entropy and the people’s ability to think for themselves, but Maraki is more kind and changed the world by allowing people to reach their desires with a little bit of altering the desires of those who are bad to make them kinder, but in doing so, he erases their memories of him because he does not want to be an idol. There are people who know of him and are devoted to his cause, but he keeps his palace (the area in which it’s ruler resides, the palace being the manifestation of it’s ruler’s distorted desires, selfless ones in Maraki’s case) hidden so that nobody who hasn’t found him by themselves can see him, his palace or his persona, again, because he does not want to be worshipped and only wants the happiness of others, even at the cost of nobody remembering him.
Shit I misspelt Maruki as Maraki
Great vídeo men!!
each persona protaginist has a rule to defeat nyx and rescue door kun.
1 persona 1 protagonists learns the power of cross travel to other world which he and she can help the female mc in p3p also and able to travel into nyx real realm.
2 persona 2 protagonists has the ability to go back in time he and she can travel point in time which makoto and the female mc still alive and train them to be stornger.
3 persona 4 protaganist has the ability to killed any evil gods it reveal in persona 5 royal that p4 protagonist has higest points needed to get the rewards in the battle which indicating that he has the storgest power among protagonist and his persona his the overpower one just using default stat on his persona without and training still the powerful persona also he killed many gods.
4 persona 5 protagonists yes i will include p5x protagonist because both of them gain the ability of a thief and also see the illusion form from the darkness.
5 persona 6 protagonists will be the key to revive him because of the color the game bring and it is green which it means recovery for the entire world.
all the protagonists gain this power in there ordeal, which the only question is what is the original plan of the orginal valvet room he his the one created igor and put his desire and will into the chaos doll called igor, i can guess maybe they are preventing something big happening to end both worlds, igors world and all the human worlds including the main world, thats why he traning human to help him in the future
This was a really good vid
Do you think Philemon should come back?
He never left, the opposition also didn't leave either, my next upload is about this
@@Matagatsu I know he is still around but coming back as a character instead of a butterfly lol anyways gonna wait to see that vid
I never finished persona 5, but i think you are forgetting the importance of persona 4. Sure the settings is a small town area and its reach is not far. But it effect the way people is willing to see the truth hence in the true ending and people now have the possibility to work for the better instead of having an easy way out hence the wish for death for the truth to remain hidden.
I COM FROM THE FRUTURE!!! MAKOTO YUKI IS REAL NOW!! IN REAL LIFE
Jesus Christ. My god! The Apathy Syndrome was never eradicated!
🤣🤣😂😂