The worst thing about the Madalorin s2 is that they seem to have retconned Luke thoughts on connection and how he wouldn't train Grogu if Grogu held on to his attachment to Din. It was Luke holding onto his attachment to his father that redeemed Anakin and yet Disney decides to have Luke regress back to the misguided teachings of the republic order.
I like to think it hasn't been enough time for Luke to truly understand what attachments were a detriment and which were a necessity. After all, it looked like Luke had no students at all at that point. So he still had some learning to do himself.
Well they tried to have him being his own person and not just copying the Jedi in TLJ and the fanbase pissed their pants, blame the dumb fanboys who don't get the point of the prequels.
Jolee Bindo said it best. "Love doesn't lead to the dark side. Passion can lead to rage and fear, and can be controlled... but passion is not the same thing as love. Controlling your passions while being in love... that's what they should teach you to beware. But love itself will save you... not condemn you."
Controlling your passions while being in love… isn’t that a good thing? You feel passion when your in love, but it being uncontrolled would be a path to the darkside, so how is being in control of it so you don’t fall a bad thing?
@Noah Copeland most people who watch star wars misinterpretation of the code, it's not don't care about anything, it's basically saying don't let your emotions have control over you Jolee's stories reflect this in both good and negative aspects
If Revan is correct, then that could explain in part why Anakin was so powerful. His love for Padme gave him a strength no other Jedi of his time could tap.
Not only that but in 3 years of war in a place where the only training was experience he doubled in the strength he had as a padawann which was 10 years of ready-made on peace time training, and what made that difference of 3 to 10 simple, he loved and was loved back by padme, his growth was 3 times faster as with padme being a general jedi knight than a 10 year padawann
@@gabrielguedes8576 bro. If anyone else would’ve did the same as him they still wouldn’t reach anywhere near what he reached. He was born from the force. He was a kid racer as a kid which is literally impossible for a human.
And if they had just allowed Anakin and Padme to be open about their relationship then Anakin could have got the help he needed to save her and none of the bad shit( for lack of better wording) would have happened.
"Because if you're a lover, you gotta be a fighter. Because if you don't fight for your love, what kind of love do you have?" - Keanu Reeves It would be amazing if he was cast as Revan if they decide to make a live-action version or something.
He is. There's talk of making a high republic movie where he stars as Revan. They cast him as Vitiate at first which everyone was like NOOOOO, but they fixed it. I wouldn't expect it until 2026 tho, they're focused on other things like finding a new writer for the "Dawn of the Jedi" Movie and the upcoming Ashoka show this August.
The problem with the Jedi Order is that it didn't train it's members to become strong in the Light so much as to avoid falling to the Dark at all costs. That's like becoming a monks to avoid the pitfalls of romantic passions but being expected to be able to handle those feelings at the same time. Avoidance is definitely not the same as preparedness.
Great idea, I've never thought of that before! Kind of reminds me of some team sports where a team can have the better players and coaches, but a lesser talented team beats them due to the former having a don't want to lose mentality over a desire to win mentality.
I disagree but they are a monastic type order so that would not be a defect but a inherent part of it. They did prepare them by training them to calm their emotions and to always be aware of their state of mind. You’d have them be prepared by indulging the very thing that could distract their feelings.
@@lissadawes4243 No, not to indulge in dark emotions, but rather to firstly spend more time in the study of the Light Side of the Force (as opposed to serving the Republic, which as a rule doesn't help much in that area), and secondly to teach future Jedi more about the dangers of the Dark Side as opposed to just blocking out the information from them. Kind of like what Luke Skywalker did with his New Jedi Order. i think much such knowledge could be added to a Jedi training program without going to the Dark Side and even without going as far as touching upon Grey Jedi philosophy.
eh, idk about that. Anikins really the only example I can think of. Most if the other jedi we see are compassionate but also pragmatic. Its more that they focused on universal goods more then individual ones. And honestly, it worked for a good few thosand years. I think its always been about controlling your emotions more then simply having them. like the ban against marriage is pretty similar to many irl orders, christian, muslim, or buddhist, the whole jist is that marriage is literaly placing one persons good, your spouse, above that of everyone else. Which is at odds with the Orders whole ideal.
I also think Revan took a lot from Joliee Bindo whos own philosophy was pretty close to this "Controlling your passions while being in love that is what they should teach you, but love itself will save you not condemn you" or words to that effect
Revan was a visionary of his time, he told the Jedi of his era that reform was needed but they shut him up. He was a master and much like Qui-Gon Jin was offered a seat on the high council. But he also refused for similar reasons. Revan could have taught Anakin many secrets of both the Light and the Dark, and after Palpatine was dead I think he could have safely looked into Sith discoveries from after his time.
The council tried to offer him a seat in the council. Despite Revan was right to refuse it. This nearly makes him the first youngest master in the council.
In the novels, Luke actually sought out the reborn Palpatine, and became his student, ON PURPOSE, just to dabble in the dark side. If it wasn’t for Leia and Han, he might not have turned back. This is what brought him true balance, and the power of a grandmaster.
And it's a edge jedi can have over Sith because Sith have no love. They are taught betrayal, hatred, selfishness, and greed which destroys love. The jedi give up their greatest edge by discouraging and looking to reduce their use of love.
@brianhanes5413 I'd argue that Sith are taught to embrace their strongest emotions, which love definitely fits; however, they are also taught to embrace these emotions for their personal advancement/power. It's not so much that they have no love, it's just that their manifestation of it tends to the darker aspects (jealousy and control . . . and that very well might destroy mutual love and pervert the feeling in the force wielder, but what is the dark side but a perversion of the Force? Love and Force are still present . . .). Hence Vader's love corrupted him while Bastilla's and Luke's led to redemption (for herself/maybe Revan and Vader respectively). Totally agree with your last sentence, though. Thanks to anyone reading my nerd-out . . .😂
Here's another tidbit about Revan: what he did should be impossible. In the setting, it is literally impossible due to the nature of the Light and Dark being directly opposed. Not just in their nature but also in that the Light is balance in the Force and the Dark is imbalance. It's not simply Jedi propaganda, it's actual names for those things. The lore doesn't even try to pretend that what he did in somehow harmonizing them should be impossible. It's treated as an unfathomable miracle that should be fundamentally impossible. Which both makes it acceptable to the audience and prevents it from being something just anyone can do just by accepting both sides of the Force (unlike what a ton of fanfiction claims).
This is a misunderstanding of Revan brought on by novels and SWTOR… the dark side is ALWAYS evil and corrupting, end of story. The Light Side is just a term for the force in balance. Revan used the dark… while he was evil.
I love that Revan is the person who made the Sith more powerful by inspiring the rule of two. Then in a way, found out how for the Jedi to become more powerful as well. One side learned, the other shunned the knowledge
That wasn't Revan. Bane created the Rule of Two. Prior to him, there were a ton of Sith... and they tried to share power. Bane realized that power can't be shared. It has to be absolute. One to hold the power. The other to learn and seek it. It was the duty of any Sith to obtain absolute unlimited power. Only one could hold this. The student's duty was to learn and seek enough power to surpass their Master. And replace them. And then find a student of their own. That would do the same. Palpatine broke the Rule of Two... by assuming he obtained unlimited power. And that Vader... nor any other Force weilder... would never be able to replace him. He decided he would not need to train Vader or anyone else to carry the Sith forward.
I suppose this is a good example of the difference between love and attachment according to George Lucas. Attachment is specifically the idea of owning and possessing someone, which is wrong and a path to the dark. But if you love someone dearly, and healthily, and learn to face your emotions in a way that you can let them go, that is the power of true love. That’s the true selfless live that saved Vader. The Jedi forbade love because they feared attachment, but they should have taught them to embrace their feelings while processing them healthily. It wasn’t Anakin’s love for Padme that drove him to the dark, it was the fact he never learned to process those feelings in a healthy way
It also didn't help that Palpatine effectively groomed Anakin to not process those feelings in a healthy way at all, and Yoda also accidentally screwed up in that department as well. Palps told Anakin about how he could "save it all and have it all", while Yoda told Anakin to "just let it all go", both being the 2 most extreme and terrible paths anyone can teach someone about handling love, and as a result Anakin ended up exactly how he logically would based on those 2 cases of terrible advice.
@@joshuakim5240 Yoda was right, if Anakin would have followed his advice, he wouldn't have caused Padme's death. There were no two extremes, there was a sincere wise advice and a greedy manipulation.
attachment isnt an inherently negative thing its not owning or possessing thats toxic control freak territory. Attachments exist between parents and their kids or friends or even things like your smartphone
I feel as if Obi wan also showed this in the show with his 2nd fight with vader as he become much more powerful while thinking of the ones he loves and wants to protect
EXACTLY!!! was just thinking the same thing. as soon as he started thinking about luke and espeically leia, and how he loved them and wanted to protect them, his power seemed to jump off the scales and he dominated vader
And it's a edge jedi can have over Sith because Sith have no love. They are taught betrayal, hatred, selfishness, and greed which destroys love. The jedi give up their greatest edge by discouraging and looking to reduce their use of love.
@@brianhanes5413 well, thats not...entirelyyyyy true imo. it may be a twisted form of love, and passion, but usually it a love of an ideal or power that creates a sith in the first place, no? it is the fear of loss that drives them further down. jedi for the most part, always forbade love, whether it be attachment, passion, lust, etc etc because in their eyes, such strong feelings of attachment usually lead to negative emotions when said attachments are suddenly cut off (whether thats a breakup, a death, abandonment) sith on the other hand, usually embraced love, albeit moreso...passion, which fueled all their other emotions. and cutting off these attachments, lead to anger, fear, hatred, and fueled their dark side powers. neither side, of course, is in the right. there is no BALANCE. a jedi, or a sith, who can control these overwhelming emotions and use them to protect, but not to overwhelm, or kill, that is the true power of love in the Force. at least in my opinion.
@mwbwyatt Drove Anakin yes but different people are driven by different things. Some are merely driven by hatred, rage, etc. I also wouldn't call or define what the Sith have as love not at all. Sith have passion which is an intense desire or ambition for something. Love itself is not just a feeling, love is a commitment. When you really love someone you will go above and beyond what makes sense, may be practical, etc for that person's wellbeing. In most cases, that's the opposite of how Sith are. Plageius was an exception but it was also seen as a weakness that Sidious avoided. Anakin had lots of love, when he became a Sith Lord and lost his limbs his love decreased. Jedi love is still less limited than Sith because they give their lives for people more regularly. Love often requires the putting of someone else over oneself. Where Jedi fall.short is they.put several things over it. One is the code, another is the council, but another is often the wishes of a student's master .
Revan was able to incorporate his "Shadow" in psychoanalytic terms, making him one of the most powerful Jedi ever. His point of facing emotions rather than ignoring them, is spot on. You need to accept your darker side, and use it's energy for good, rather than letting it creep up and destroy everything.
Galen Marek aka Starkiller was extremely powerful in the force because of his emotional bonds. His growing love for Juno was ultimately the source of his increased power and seeing the force spirit of his late father on the Wookiee homeworld and the pain he felt hardened his resolve to do what needed to be done. Starkiller had great potential in the force and the fact that he was able to stalemate with Sidious if not best him in force ability is a testament to how weak the Jedi of pre empire was
I hate how they say these stories are connected to others by saying they aren’t canon yet still to this day can’t make stories like Starkiller’s. Like they call this the Star Wars renaissance but yet we been getting low tier storylines compared to stuff we got before Disney. Idk just seems fishy like they have their own agenda with the series. If they really want to be successful you gotta listen to some of the passionate fans and older writers for the series cause they know Star Wars better than Disney does.
Absolutely this. We credit Revan a lot, but have to remember: Revan alone didn't return to the Light, and before KOTOR1 he lead Alek and Surick- one to darkness, the other to an arguably worse fate. It was only after learning from Jolee that Revan was able to redeem Bastila.
Revan was right. Revan's love saved Bastia. Their love and emotions made them very powerful. Revan was great visionary,he had many advantages. I agree. Had Revan lived during Clone Wars he would make much more powerful and noble Anakin. Anakin would be Grandmaster and Jedi,light side would have tremendous power. Great analysis. May the Force be with you too. Have a nice day :)
I agree with you mostly, but while Anakin would have become the most powerful Jedi, that doesn't mean he would have been made grandmaster, in fact I think he most certainly would not be made grandmaster. Also her name is Bastila Shan, not Bastia
@@Dicko2909 he would definitely take Dooku under his wing which would make Kenobi easier to sway (his master is already actively disobeying the council anyway). I imagine Revan, Qui Gon, Dooku and Kenobi busting down the door to Sidious' and Plagueis' place and starts going at it lol
Perhaps it wasn't just the positive emotions that helped them be more powerful but also the connection itself. Expanding a persons connection to the for through these loved ones. Annikan was at his most powerful when he has padme and she was pregnant. But as soon as he disconnected from them we was weakened.
I feel like this makes sense with Anikan being the chosen he was a emotional person and it exposed cracks in the Jedi way technically he destroyed both sides allowing for Jedi now to feel emotion thus bringing balance to the force
For the part you mentioned Luke studying the dark side refers to the cloned Palpatine. It didn’t last long, but it gave him a more well-rounded appreciation for the Force in its entirety.I think it was also the catalyst for him to fully accept those emotions in his New Jedi Order.
Always love Revan's unique perspective on the force - ESPECIALLY surrounding happiness and love. As you said though, his ground-breaking concepts and revolutionary ideas were regrettably overlooked and underappreciated. It's a missed opportunity of epic proportions, leaving us yearning for what could have been.
One difficulty even Revan would have had is working with how possessive Anakin was. Even well-prepared, his past made him cling to people he cared for to a degree that did help him, but in the end was also his downfall. Could this have been carefully addressed by an attentive master? Very likely. But it would also have been really tough to get out of him, as it was based on childhood trauma.
The thing with Anakin is he's a very passionate person by default. He loves and cares about things greatly. If the order had tried to adapt their lessons around this fact then things might have turned out differently. Instead he was told to let go of everything which is to basically deny who he is as a person. Revan might not have had as difficult a time with Anakin as the order did. Of course it's all speculation and we'll never know regardless, but it's an interesting topic at the very least.
He was only possessive because he was taught to shun his emotions instead of learn to control them. If he had been taught that it was okay to live as long as it is mutually agreeable then he would have known how to empathise with how other people feel.
Obvious the order shouldve taught anakin how to healthily control his emotions and have emotional intelligence but nah they basically just told him to bury his emotions which is the worst thing someone with childhood trauma should do
This original comment makes it sound like Obi-Wan wasn't attentive and is to blame for Anakin being consumed by Vader, but Obi-Wan is not at all to blame, he did a very good job training Anakin, what needed to change was the council and the Jedi Order, it was the fault of the council, not Obi-Wan
Well said, when I made my jedi counselor began of like any new Jedi, but as time went he learned to use his love to protect others, show kindness when needed, and to find when their was no other option.
Love is the key to salvation. The problem comes when you put the one you “love” ahead of everything and everyone else. That is what caused Anakin’s fall. He sacrificed the galaxy for Padme and committed evil in the process. Anakin didn’t try to save Padme for Padme’s sake. He did it for himself with no thought to what Padme actually wanted. This is the difference the Jedi failed to understand: selfless love vs selfish love.
There is nothing as selfless love tho, you being selfless in that scenario is because you need the person to be happy, you do it because you believe thats what you should do as a person, you do it because you feel better being ,,selfless,, then doing something else that might be more efficient, doing selfless act because its you ideology and morals is slefish because you need to do it, you wouldnt feel right and good not doing it the way you are programmed as person, human beings are selfish, we are literally designed this way, trying to run away from it and hoping in selflessness sounds pointless since there isnt such thing
I like the idea that Jedi grow stronger due to positive emotions & that one of the key faults of the Clone Wars Jedi was their view on attachments! They attempted to suppress their emotions to avoid attachments which left some Jedi at odds with themselves & was a key factor in Anakin's fall as had he been raised in a more nurturing environment with the Jedi freeing his mother to give him peace of mind (it would be the least they could do for the mother of the boy who flew a Naboo Starfighter during the Battle of Naboo & possible chosen one) allowing him to focus on his training! This could have potentially allowed him to form a much healthier relationship with Padme & even marry her openly (Padme's relationship with Anakin was likely only considered scandalous due to Jedi dogma regarding attachments, as the deleted scene featuring Anakin interacting with her family on Naboo indicates that her family may have been supportive of such a union given Anakin's heroic actions as a boy & dedication to protecting Padme) with the support of her family & a more permissive Jedi Council! One of the things that likely alienated the Jedi from the wider galaxy was their suppressed emotions & secretiveness, which Palpatine was likely able to use to his advantage painting them as fanatics and blaming them for the war! Jedi would also likely be stronger, possibly leading to their vision being less clouded by the growing power of the Dark Side! Additionally Qui-Gon may have been seen as less of a maverick while the council could still be weary of Anakin due to his age, they may have been more permissive about him training the boy! Also Qui-Gon may have been stronger due to them being less dogmatic about attachments thus may not have died at Maul's hands as he & Obi-Wan would have been stronger! Additionally Obi-Wan & Satine may have been able to explore their relationship more! Dooku may have been less inclined to fall to the Dark Side had Qui-Gon survived!
On the flip side, weren't they right about EVERYTHING regarding attachments? The key thing here that Anakin failed to learn was to 'Let go'. It's one of the key tenants of Buddism that was the design basis for the whole Jedi Philosophy. Anakin was held back by his desire for material possessions and material people. His mother died and instead of grieving and letting her go, he became obsessed with obtaining more power so that he could 'save them' next time. His fear of losing someone else was the poison in the well. He had a vision of Padme dying. His fear of losing her the same way he lost his mother is what drove him to, in his mad quest to avoid this future, bringing about the very thing he sought to avoid. Now this worked out to Luke's favor in that he saved his son finally freeing himself from the obsession of being a hero not for the sake of power, but for the sake of another. By no means does it excuse the inaction of the Jedi Council which has brought about the downfall of the Jedi Order numerous times. There is such a thing as being too patient to the point of Sloth. But there is some wisdom in pausing for a moment to view the wider picture and really look at the actions you're about to commit.
It's unlikely that Obi-Wan and Satine would've got together even if Obi-Wan himself had been allowed. Remember that Satine is Mandalorian, even if a pacifist, and the Mandalorian grudges against the Jedi would've been difficult and even dangerous for them both. Death Watch's numbers likely would've swelled from the Mandos who hate Jedi or don't think their leader should be with one. As much as it might be compelling to see Obi-Wan and Satine take on Mandalore and the rest of the galaxy together, it wouldn't have been worth the instability, constant assassination attempts, and scrutiny and it would've been too dangerous to try and start a family. If Obi-Wan and Satine were to be together then Satine could not be Mandalore's leader, simple as. It doesn't work the other way around because Mando grudges aren't rational. So you're back at square one.
@@graveyardshift6691 Jedi order needs no excuse. They suspected Anakin's loyalty and Palpatine intentions, and they where right on both cases. They made mistakes, obviously, but it wasn't their fault.
I've always thought that the Jedis' biggest weaknesses was their forbidding of attachments and never learning how to process and deal with their emotions rather than suppressing them. It's those two things that often lead Jedi to fall to the Dark Side.
They didn't supress emotions, they controled then, not allowing them to control you. And failing in that is what caused Anakin's ruin and the ruin of all who truly cared about him.
@@SergioCortes-kc7fc I disagree. I've always understood it as, basically, "don't feel that. Block it out." Then when they get hit with an overwhelming emotion that they can't block out, like when Anakin gave in to the Dark Side because of his overwhelming fear of losing Padme, they're not equipped to deal with it properly and lose control. That was the biggest difference between Obi-wan & Quigon Jin (I likely misspelled that). If Quigon had survived he would have been more like a father to Anakin than a typical Jedi master, like Obi-wan, and Anakin would have been better prepared to deal with those emotions and may not have fallen.
@@futuresonex Well, I'm afraid you misunderstood that. It has never been "block it", it has always been "control it". What jedi did and tought is to control emotions, that's what they actually do, say and teach. Anakin couldn't manage his emotions because he never intended to control them. He never was humble enough to learn what he was tought. And he was tought patience, control, acceptance and focus. He had all the tools he needed but he was greedy and wanted power. It was his choice. And his choice caused what he feared. Yoda gave him the wisest of advice and he preffered the manipulations of the agent of his ruin. Following Yoda's advice to be patiente and don¡t give up to the fear of losing, he would have lost nothing. It's his choice. It's his fault and no one else's.
I think Revan was so powerful because he had experienced both the light and dark side. I feel as though the path to true power lay in using both sides of the force to utilize it to its full extent. Both Jedi and Sith hinder themselves by only using one aspect of the force. In my mind, the ideal way to use the force is by allowing yourself to feel emotions like the Sith, but to not allow them to control you. Feel passion and emotion, but also be tranquil and in control of them.
But history shows that you can’t have it all. The emotions and passions for a force sensitive opens up the dangers one sees in history to want to use the Force for many things that are good but eventually lead to a perversion of that use. Indulging in the dark side will always lead to it being chosen over the light or else have serious repercussions for others. A Jedi must always choose the light and only the light.
I mean, if we're talking the so-called legends...Luke indulged the Dark Side and didn't wind up permanently evil, so...incorrect. Also, what about bringing balance to the Force? Why is the assumption that bringing balance to the Force means "having the right proportions of Dark Side and Light Side force users" and not "finding a way to balance the natural emotional nature of people who might be force users in a way that understands that negative emotions are not inherently evil and should not be shunned, but merely understood and controlled, while positive emotions are not flawless and to be worshipped, but merely understood and controlled, because the effect emotions have on ourselves and others are highly dependent on complex contextual factors, and just as the Sith are insane to simply say "FUCK IT, HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE", so too are the the old Jedi Order insane to say "FUCK FEELINGS, STOICISM STOICISM STOICISM STOICISM" Both philosophies reject reason, and both philosophies reject humanity (in this case, "humanity" applies to all sentient life in the Star Wars universe)
@@lissadawes4243the dark side is still the force. The true Jedi code, which was discontinued because many Jedi struggled to comprehend it, is an amalgamation of the force itself. "Emotion, yet Peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet Serenity. Chaos, yet Harmony. Death, yet the Force." The force is the force, it's jedi and sith that dilute it into separate opposing existences. Yes there's the son and the daughter, but there's also the father. And Anakin.
@@user-ko3sd9qj2h the dark side is the force but it is evil and the path to destruction. Also the second version of the Jedi Code is not an older code but exists alongside the other more well known. So it wasn’t discontinued. The Jedi don’t dilute the Force. They’re the ones who maintain the balance.
@@lissadawes4243 no it was the original code that's still used when training younglings. And no the dark side doesn't lead to death and destruction. Unctrollable power does. That's where the jedi failed. In the end they let fear control them, ignorance consumed them, chaos destroyed them.
%100 agreed. Emotions are a powerful way to connect to the force. Love and selflessness for those you care about are some of the greatest motivators and can't be overlooked. The Jedi Council got this seriously wrong..... .....it's a damn shame Disney never gave us Luke and his Jedi Order who were truly balanced, peaceful, embraced attachments and far superior to any Sith or dark-side wielder.
It always made sense to me that using love and serenity would give you strength in the light side of the Force. And I often wondered why the Jedi council didn't see the wisdom of that approach and cut themselves off from the true power of the force. Ultimately, this led to their downfall.
It's ironic in a way but even in the Old Republic days of the Jedi it was obvious that the most powerful force users all had things to which they had deep attachment.
That was a masterful analysis! Many Star Wars fans as well as experts still do not come to those conclusions. This was spot on and gave much food for thought! Thank you.
I agree 100% with this theory, when we review the most notable cases of users of the Force, practically all of them have walked both paths, they have formed ties with other people, be they love or friendship, and in general they have been rebellious against the jedi council of his time because his ideas were "controversial", that is why many fans have thought and considered Revan as the greatest user of the Force, maybe not in terms of brute force, but in control, wisdom and knowledge about it. Hopefully one day we would have the EU again as the central axis of the Star Wars canon story and we could see the movie trilogy based on Revan and the old republic that for many years we ask for, but the truth is that while Disney is still the owner I doubt that this is possible, having the best stories they chose to ignored and write new and terrible ones that nobody liked, the dark side has clouded their vision XD. Greetings.
I like that from Starkiller in the first game of The Force Unleashed Juno was that attachment that made him so strong, he took down Vader and equaled the Emperor until his final moments when he couldn't before.
I agree with this 100% taking the route of Pain, Anger and Hate is the Easy option! Resisting it, is the difficult one. BUT understanding both is the best imo.
I believe Revan shared part of his beliefs when he married Bastila but the Jedi said it Was Heretical and did not want him to spread his teachings to others.
In the Kenobi series, Obi Wan pulled upon love and his attachment to Leia and Luke to escape being buried by Vader and to defeat him again. So now I suppose we do have this reflected in canon with that.
It makes sense that emotions fuel the Force in many ways. If you look at the love Anakin had for Padme, you can see that it caused Anakin to make decisions that would ultimately make him stronger, trying to save her from the fate of dying in childbirth. Had he been led by anyone other than Palpatine, and found the power, think of how beautiful of a family legacy that would’ve been. Like and Leia growing up together, being trained as Jedi, Anakin having a seat on the council and being the strongest Jedi in the galaxy, ousting the sith at every turn, no Empire uprising, Palpatine being overthrown, just so much.
Attachment makes stronger in the force ? - yes Does it makes more vulnerable to falling to the darkside ? - Yes Does jedi are vary of falling down - oh yes - that is why they rejected the attachment to begin with.
Uhhh only a Sith thinks in absolutes? How about good guidance on those attachments? No wonder the Sith troll the Jedi. They have no real solution on what to do if a Jedi develops attachment. I mean, Obi Wan loved Satine and dude remained on the light side.
The Jedi misunderstood. Love itself doesn’t cause a fall, SELFISH love causes the fall. For example: anakin’s love for Padme wasn’t his undoing, it was his selfishness. He tried to save Padme FOR HIMSELF. Notice he never once asked Padme what she wanted and when she finally told him she didn’t want what he was doing, on Mustafar he flew into a rage and force choked the one he “loved.” Padme’s feelings didn’t matter, only his did. THIS is what caused his fall
@@Thiago_Alves_Souza exactly. The Jedi council refused to accept that attachment is an inevitability. People will love. It is in their nature. Even if not romantic love, we cannot deny that canonically masters and apprentices loved eachother as friends or like parent and child. It CANNOT be prevented. As a psychologist I saw immediately how destructive their philosophy would be. Surpressing natural feelings like love twists them into things like obsession. Ironically suppressing attachment is a good way to fall to the dark side
I love Star Wars. Ever since I was a child watching the original trilogy I have been so captivated by everything George created. That being said, I love your videos and how deep we go into the lore. Keep up the great work.
Same could be said for basically every religion and spiritual pathway. But there are always a minority who seem to get it. Case in point: Qui Gon. He refused to be on the council. He was not afraid of dying. He saw it that his physical death just meant a passing to the next stage. Nothing to fear at all.
The reason the Jedi outlawed emotional attachment is simply because of the natural risks involved with attachment. Most of these Star Wars concepts are true to life in some way or another. With attachments in our lives, as long as our attachments are pure, and we aren't consumed with obsession, possession, control, jealousy, fear, anger, hate, or suffering, it will make all of us a stronger person in life. If we do become obsessive, controlling, jealous, or fearful of loss in our attachments, it can consume us. The same can be said of the Force in Star Wars. The light is about a person being allied with the Force, dealing in compassion, allowing nature to resume its course, and not seeking to dominate nature. The dark side is about succumbing to temptations rooted in weakness, negative emotion, and trying to dominate the Force itself (nature), and bend it to our will as much as possible to gain power from those negative emotions, and suffering. It makes complete sense why the Jedi Order would outlaw attachments in many ways, because there is so much room for error, and most Jedi aren't wise enough, skilled enough, or completely centered enough in their own being to control their emotions under such potential burdens. Keep in mind, leading up to the Clone Wars, the Jedi have been at peace in the galaxy for over 1000 years within the Republic. Most Jedi would be at serious risk of falling to the dark side if they had strong attachments because they have never experienced the seduction of the dark side in times of intense pressure, and conflict. The path of a Jedi is a never ending journey of self reflection, and learning control of ones self above all. There are very few Jedi during the 1000 year peace who actually reached the point where they were mature enough in their knowledge of self control to handle the potential burdens of attachment, especially in times of war, and conflict. That same rule against forming attachments also partially led to the downfall of the Jedi Order. With that being said, the fall of the Jedi Order was almost inevitable, and it took an insanely powerful combination of Sith who used completely foreign tactics to pull it off destroying the Republic, and the Jedi Order from the inside out. The Republic, and the Jedi Order were destroyed long before they even knew it.
Forget canon. Canon is only the OFFICIAL timeline. There are alternative timelines and they don’t have to be canon to be just as good or better than the official line
@@gerardocovarrubias3058 He was mentioned in the Rise of Skywalker visual dictionary. Probably the only positive to come out of the entire movie really.
It was good to see Dave Filoni and company showed the power of love and even emphasize it in the Mandalorian, Star Wars Rebels, and Obi-Wan series. The Mandalorian emphasizing how their strength comes from their bonds. In Rebels, Jedi Kanan Jarrus' love for Hera Syndulla gave him the power needed to save Hera and other crew members. With Obi-Wan, his power begins to return and become stronger as his relationship with Leia develops, ultimately Kenobi uses his memories and feelings for Leia in order to overcome and defeat Vader. There are also some examples where a jedi's connection to the force becomes stronger when they have let go of their fear, which often comes from love for those close to them. Recently this is shown in Jedi Survivor when Cere Junda faces Darth Vader.
I think of it like the soft magic vs Dark Magic. Dark Magic is more immediate and obvious. (Dark side) Soft magic is subtle and discrete. (Light side) It's why the Sith can often win battles but never the "war".
Plapatine won the war tho, revan as sith almost won war, there isnt anything in nature of force telling you if you will win or not, its on the individual anyways, dark side is as difficult to use as light side, yiu can think that its easy to let your emotions go wild but force tricks still require focus being able to focus force while feeling unstoppable rage sounds kinda harsh thing to learn, they both just deffernt sides of the same coin
@Projekt Ava No Palpitine defeated his mortal foes but not his esoteric ones. He ruled the galaxy but lost control. He wanted order but lost his power. He wanted to control life itself but life itself fought back. Palpatine thought he could force the galaxy to his will but he was ultimately wrong~
@@KrazyStargazer buddy you can pull out any of this poetic shit, it doesnt change a fact, yeah he failed to be immortal, so what, no one actually ruke forever, he won the war agaisnt jedi, he killed thousands of them, ruled the galaxy for decades and no actually galaxy under the empire was stronger then ever, superior military force, strong order, and clearly good resources and economic, there is no thing like sith cant win war, or things like that, dark side and light side are bith just force, there isnt anything poetic about sith not winning, its literally about balance, there were too much jedi, then a sithe made it even again with killing most of them, a new order could jave been established and cogs of fate move on, palpatine as individual won war against jedi, then lost to their remains being Luke, yet the previous war was won, he got the control, he printed his name in to the history, and ruled whole galaxy. And did what every sith wanted, just because he didnt achieved all his ambitions doesnt mean he didnt won the war, its just simple, light side doesnt make you magically have a good end, if you think its poetic to say ,,but palaptine lost in the end to jedi,, fine lets ignore decades of him being in position of oower, lets ignore thousands of killed jedi, millions of and millions of dead people because of him, there isnt anything poetic about it, its about the individual himself, palpatine sinply won against jedi order, then there was luke as oposition, always in balance, war isnt poetic war is war
But Palpitine's true goal and endgame was always immortality and to rule over the entirety of the galaxy unopposed. Consider what Vader said "The power to destroy a planet is insignificant when compared to the power of the force." Palpitine's trueist enemy was the force itself. As much as he hated the Jedi, the Rebuplic or the Rebellion he hated that he didn't have complete control over the force. A Sith seeks ower by forcing the "Force" to do it's bidding. Just look at how they make their lightsabers. Where as a Jedi sees the force as an "Ally". Not something to be over come but something with it's own agency. If you want a more tangable example Jedi get 'force healing' and 'force ghosts'. These are skills to preserve knoledge and life. The sigh get 'sith lightning' and "force choke'. Yes im aware theirs more nuance but these are the general tendencies. The sith sacrifice the 'big picture' (aka force heaven) for power in the physical world, and Jedi loose physical power and gain spiritual power.
@@KrazyStargazer yeah thats true, then dont refer to it as battle and war, not everyones goal is imortality, its just certain individuals not being able to achieve their dreams, its not full on scale, jedi didnt won any war, achieving imortality isnt bigger succes then what ahieved some other sith, its just clowning on palpatine cuz ma guy didnt achieved it, but darth sion from kotor was imortal, nihilus could live without his physical form he just needed to devour force, vitiate achieved imortality, and lot of sith managed to hide their spirit in some artifact, dark side and light side is different, you can use basically any emotion and feeling in both, it depends on the individual, siths can heal themselves, they can be imortal, jedi can have destructive power like lightning just through different process, but jedi lsoing galaxy against palpatine was definitely jedi losing war, why? because they couldnt even stop slaughter of innocent and literally planetary destruction, dark side of the force definitelly won that day, just because it didnt lasted that long doesnt erase the fact that after palpatines victory tere was no one to opose him, luke was kid, there was no threat for him, rebels werent actuall threat also, again this is not about battles and wars
Thats not really true, there isnt anything like actuall superiority, you have various individuals that are strong with through one emotion mainly, quantity isnt everything, Sion was immortal thanks to his anger, feat that no jedi could pull off or defeat, force ghost is nice and all, but my dude sion was just casually walking around immortal, nihuls felt hunger, so strong and primal that force allowed him to consumen all life form on planet, sith just usually dont urilize or dont know how to utilize some of those emotions properly usually they use just anger, jedi are trying to achieve peace, but its not that ,,oh i feel love now i am stronger in force,, if you as jedi dont controll your emotions then you are weaker more unstable which goes against the calmness of jedi, meanwhile sith also can utilize love and other things, they just let it go wild, there isnt anything like one side of force being superior, that goes against the very nature of force, dakr side and light side are bith needed
@@johnhorton4436 peace itself is a state not specific emotion, its state of mind, if you achieve peace you are no longer malevolent, and peace can be interpreted in various ways used to do different things, someone who achieved peace can have goal of preserving knowledge and giving it to younger generetion as mentor, another one who achieved peace can see world as never ending cycle and that concept of death doesnt have any actuall value, he can acknowledge the fact that morals dont play any role in higher game, he doesnt have to have problem with sacrificing human lives for something he moght see as higher goal and still he can be in peace with himself and life, so yes everythibg can use to cause destruction or grow, both are needed in the end, love can drive someone to protect something and nurish it, or it can make one jealous or angry or overprotective which give someone will to do horrible things just to preserve what they love, hunger can be used as motivation and drive needed to achieve something in life soemthing that gives you motivation, but also hunger can drive you beyond morals and man you once was making you do atrocious things to satisfy that hunger, there is lot of nuance between feelings, emotions and states of mind, all it depends on the individual
If the original Jedi order allowed attachments, maybe Anakin wouldn't have turned to the dark side since he would be able to openly talk about his situation with the other jedi
everytime i wartch videos about revan and see images of him in the videos i can't hep but think of how interesting it would be to have a movie about him and his time period come out with keanu reeves playing as revan because of how much they look alike in a way to me
I agree with what you’re saying, but I still think the Jedi do embody love. They just want the love to be shifted towards protecting people and serving.
Yes, there are different kinds of love. But the Jedi as a group want to prevent the kind of love that forms a close attachement to one person (or a few), and not just a community. And even in that process something valuable gets lost, but the risk of "falling" gets lowered because eventually losing who you love, or the good relationship you once had with them, may come with a lot of suffering, leading to the dark side.
"Attachment is forbidden. Possession is forbidden. Compassion, which I would define as unconditional love, is essential to a Jedi's life. So you might say, that we are encouraged to love." -Anakin Its sad he actually understood what the code meant but because he never was taught how to express his emotions and instead bury them by the Jedi, he still fell. Also Lucas said that the light side is joy and love. They aren't merely just emotions, but more. Even in mourning you can find joy, if you choose it. By choosing to focus on the good memories of a loved one and by remembering the lessons they teach . Or as Rooter from land before time says "you'll always miss her. But she'll always be with you, as long as you remember the things she taught you. In a way, you'll never be apart, for you are still part of each other."
I love videos like this! Always makes me feel like what we've seen so far has just scratched the surface of what is possible with the Force, hoping I get to live to see the day someone really expands on this and takes the Force to the next level.
I wish they could demonstrate this in a movie. A scene of a force weirder combining their love for their loved one and their anger for their enemy causing them to do something awesome.
@@Blackwolf-gr6ch I can see your point. I couldn't help but see it as desperation to get the job done rather than using emotions in a healthy way if that makes sense. Also, Obi-wan never hates Vader, he's in a constant state of pity for Vader. He wants to defeat Vader out of a sense of wanting to do what needs to be done. BTW cool user name.
I mean the moment where Luke gains an edge on Vader in RotJ is when he threatens Leia. Luke doesn't fall to the dark side as was intended, but he *does* let the anger out and uses it along with his desire to protect his sister to beat an up until then superior opponent. I'd say it pretty much fulfills what you're asking. Of course one might not consider that lightsaber duel "awesome" by today's standard of CGI and power-creep, but this was back when Yoda lifting an X-wing out of a swamp was like the height of force power we'd seen.
@@HellaGust I get your point. But didn't Luke basically have a temper tantrum? I was referring more to someone who was a master of their emotions and not afraid of their anger. Granted it's a bit of a nitpick, but I really wish to see something like that.
so basically, emotions and feelings, both positive and negative, can give you power the old jedi order just had skill issue, not knowing that it was an asset which was one of the reasons we've watch many Jedi who fell to the dark side suddenly gained a power boost
I love how Revan has knowledge available for Jedi and Sith alike...a common teacher. Bane learned from revan of the rule of two. skywalker perhaps didnt learn it directly from Revan but still took on his ideology, and i think that is really neat.
It's really very simple. And you picked some pretty solid points to illustrate these exact ideas - even if I'd argue the Mortis arc and Yoda's encouter with the sisters should be considered non-canon as they steer away from this concept and muddy the truth to be more 2 equals and pick your poison. If you don't have emotion, then why do you defend the weak or the righteous? You don't care if you don't have emotion. Is anger innately evil? Is being angry at something wrong not the other half of the coin to wanting to protect what is right? Yes. Is love and marriage a weakness? Sure, but it is equally a strength. So it all comes down to 2 things: what you do AND how/why you do it. You need both. The jedi had half the answer. They discouraged any investigation towards the other half on a deeper level which led to the self-conflicting morals and code like you point out. Which in turn led many to misunderstand this on a crucial level - weakening many jedi, causing judgemental errors, and driving others to the dark side. The sith understood the other side half of the answer somewhat. But instead of having the half the jedi had to keep their emotions in check, they became slave to their emotions which became their undoing.
See, it makes a lot of sense that Revan would hold this belief. There were several examples of positive attachments between masters and padawans in his time and he had a force bond with Bastilla which aided in making him strong enough to defeat Malak. His general, Meetra Surik also had a force bond with her master and each of her own padawans and she was an extraordinarily powerful jedi.
In other Legacy stories, Tales of the Jedi (5,000 - 4,000BBY) it showed Jedi in relationships, some even had Jedi Dynasties. What was true in all these tales was that those Jedi who cared for people, who had genuine love for others were usually the strongest in the force.
For a Jedi, love is a double edge sword. Anakin's love for Padme and his desire to save her was the direct cause of his becoming Darth Vader. Granted it would be Anakin's love for his son, Luke, that gave him the strength to overcome Vader and Palpatine. One of the best visuals for this I feel was in the Kenobi series. When Vader dueled Kenobi on Mapuzo, where Vader soundly beat Obi-Wan and nearly killed him. When they dueled again on a rocky moon where Kenobi put up a better fight before nearly being buried alive by Vader. While trying to hold back the rocks Obi-Wan thought of Luke and Leia and what they meant to him. Thinking of them he throw the rocks off and confronted Vader again, this time dominating the fight and leaving Vader injured but alive.
Love for others give one the fuel to fight on on when the colorful banners of ideals do not. Compassion can create opportunities for courage that are not vain but the highest form of service. There is no purer love than to lay one's life down for another.
Nomi Sunrider was married to a Jedi before he was killed and went on to train as a Jedi. She eventually became grandmaster and severed Ulic Qel-Droma's connection to the Force as punishment for his crimes.
The concept of avoiding attachment was "if you have a loved one we are afraid that you may fall to the dark side because of the strong emotions this may lead to". How was it? fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to ...suffering.
The sith/Jedi power dynamic is analogous to real world martial arts, to westerners seen most readily in eastern martial arts movies, and what I believe is the basis for Lucas' inspiration. There have been many stories of how power comes easier for those using brute force and channeling anger into each strike, overwhelming with aggression. Almost all eastern movies teach the lesson of the "hero" over-coming with selflessness and letting go of all emotions, thereby becoming a pure warrior. It's true, anger clouds judgment and can be exploited. The One shows this dynamic well, with the hero moving like water instead of stone.
I feel a good example of this is during the kenobi series where shortly after Vader pummels obi wan, ben then channels his emotions into hammering Vader
Fascinating video in any event. It opens up some new options, in terms of a light side equal to a Sith Lord. Light side Jedi who use primarily offensive/destructive force skills, for example. But I can’t help but be concerned that it takes all the advantage out of falling to the dark side. As these Jedi can be just as powerful as a Sith Lord without having to fall themselves. It’s obviously a MUCH better deal to go light now. You’d have to be stupid to fall to the dark side, in which case you’re not lasting too long anyway. 😮
This is exactly why I will always lean towards the concept of being a grey jedi sentinel and a bendu je'daii for they were wayless rigid than the counselor and guardian orders of the jedi and the same can be said about the grey Paladin order; plus the grey jedi code and the je'daii code are way better than the jedi and sith codes because they offers true balance! 💯🔥😁😉👍
Attachments are a Jedis Achilles heel...isn't it are own ...no matter how successful how rich and powerful we as humans will become primal to protect what we love whether it be a person or a volleyball
![The Star Wars Philosopher's Guide to Every Single Lightsaber Technique [Form I - Form VII]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/2MIpVjbVl5M/mqdefault.jpg)
![The Star Wars Philosopher's Guide to Every Single Lightsaber Technique [Form I - Form VII]](/img/tr.png)
The worst thing about the Madalorin s2 is that they seem to have retconned Luke thoughts on connection and how he wouldn't train Grogu if Grogu held on to his attachment to Din. It was Luke holding onto his attachment to his father that redeemed Anakin and yet Disney decides to have Luke regress back to the misguided teachings of the republic order.
Disney doesn't know or care about Luke or what he done to become legendary hero. They have him and his actions be quickly forgotten.
It showed that he made the same mistake the Jedi in the clone wars made
I like to think it hasn't been enough time for Luke to truly understand what attachments were a detriment and which were a necessity. After all, it looked like Luke had no students at all at that point. So he still had some learning to do himself.
I agree. Disney needs to embrace Legends canon more.
Well they tried to have him being his own person and not just copying the Jedi in TLJ and the fanbase pissed their pants, blame the dumb fanboys who don't get the point of the prequels.
Jolee Bindo said it best.
"Love doesn't lead to the dark side. Passion can lead to rage and fear, and can be controlled... but passion is not the same thing as love. Controlling your passions while being in love... that's what they should teach you to beware. But love itself will save you... not condemn you."
Exactly, instead of leaving the code or following it blindly, he thought deeply on the code itself and what it means
He's one of my fav Jedi
Controlling your passions while being in love… isn’t that a good thing? You feel passion when your in love, but it being uncontrolled would be a path to the darkside, so how is being in control of it so you don’t fall a bad thing?
That man had so many wise words. Great Grey Jedi
@Noah Copeland most people who watch star wars misinterpretation of the code, it's not don't care about anything, it's basically saying don't let your emotions have control over you Jolee's stories reflect this in both good and negative aspects
If Revan is correct, then that could explain in part why Anakin was so powerful. His love for Padme gave him a strength no other Jedi of his time could tap.
Not only that but in 3 years of war in a place where the only training was experience he doubled in the strength he had as a padawann which was 10 years of ready-made on peace time training, and what made that difference of 3 to 10 simple, he loved and was loved back by padme, his growth was 3 times faster as with padme being a general jedi knight than a 10 year padawann
@@gabrielguedes8576yea. Him being the chosen one and having the highest midi count had absolutely nothing to do with it
@@dominiquewilson it did but his growth got higher by that factor
@@gabrielguedes8576 bro. If anyone else would’ve did the same as him they still wouldn’t reach anywhere near what he reached. He was born from the force. He was a kid racer as a kid which is literally impossible for a human.
And if they had just allowed Anakin and Padme to be open about their relationship then Anakin could have got the help he needed to save her and none of the bad shit( for lack of better wording) would have happened.
"Because if you're a lover, you gotta be a fighter. Because if you don't fight for your love, what kind of love do you have?"
- Keanu Reeves
It would be amazing if he was cast as Revan if they decide to make a live-action version or something.
i like how he cringed after he said that. just like me listening to it. but its true though
Very true and as a christian it is important to fight my temptations just as a husband should protect his wife.
@@user-rx3uq9fs2m Yeah. He cringed and said he was joking after, but the statement still stands.
He is. There's talk of making a high republic movie where he stars as Revan. They cast him as Vitiate at first which everyone was like NOOOOO, but they fixed it. I wouldn't expect it until 2026 tho, they're focused on other things like finding a new writer for the "Dawn of the Jedi" Movie and the upcoming Ashoka show this August.
It will be amazing if y'all stop wishing for me male characters to be emasculated humiliated nerf watered down and destroy by Disney
The problem with the Jedi Order is that it didn't train it's members to become strong in the Light so much as to avoid falling to the Dark at all costs. That's like becoming a monks to avoid the pitfalls of romantic passions but being expected to be able to handle those feelings at the same time. Avoidance is definitely not the same as preparedness.
Great idea, I've never thought of that before! Kind of reminds me of some team sports where a team can have the better players and coaches, but a lesser talented team beats them due to the former having a don't want to lose mentality over a desire to win mentality.
I disagree but they are a monastic type order so that would not be a defect but a inherent part of it. They did prepare them by training them to calm their emotions and to always be aware of their state of mind. You’d have them be prepared by indulging the very thing that could distract their feelings.
@@lissadawes4243 No, not to indulge in dark emotions, but rather to firstly spend more time in the study of the Light Side of the Force (as opposed to serving the Republic, which as a rule doesn't help much in that area), and secondly to teach future Jedi more about the dangers of the Dark Side as opposed to just blocking out the information from them. Kind of like what Luke Skywalker did with his New Jedi Order. i think much such knowledge could be added to a Jedi training program without going to the Dark Side and even without going as far as touching upon Grey Jedi philosophy.
This is a great observation
eh, idk about that. Anikins really the only example I can think of. Most if the other jedi we see are compassionate but also pragmatic. Its more that they focused on universal goods more then individual ones. And honestly, it worked for a good few thosand years.
I think its always been about controlling your emotions more then simply having them. like the ban against marriage is pretty similar to many irl orders, christian, muslim, or buddhist, the whole jist is that marriage is literaly placing one persons good, your spouse, above that of everyone else. Which is at odds with the Orders whole ideal.
I also think Revan took a lot from Joliee Bindo whos own philosophy was pretty close to this "Controlling your passions while being in love that is what they should teach you, but love itself will save you not condemn you" or words to that effect
Revan was a visionary of his time, he told the Jedi of his era that reform was needed but they shut him up. He was a master and much like Qui-Gon Jin was offered a seat on the high council. But he also refused for similar reasons. Revan could have taught Anakin many secrets of both the Light and the Dark, and after Palpatine was dead I think he could have safely looked into Sith discoveries from after his time.
Is Palpatine officially gone in star wars? I know they had some planet for cloning but I haven't been wanting to pay attention to the new star wars.
I AGREE 👍
THIS IS some of the reasons why I think the jedi are dueschbags in some cases
The council tried to offer him a seat in the council. Despite Revan was right to refuse it. This nearly makes him the first youngest master in the council.
The Jedi's no attachmenet rule is what lead to their downfall a Jedi like Anakin needed attachment to deal with his past slave life
In the novels, Luke actually sought out the reborn Palpatine, and became his student, ON PURPOSE, just to dabble in the dark side. If it wasn’t for Leia and Han, he might not have turned back. This is what brought him true balance, and the power of a grandmaster.
I like a lot of those books, but that section in particular doesn’t seem like something Luke would’ve done, and I’ve never agreed with it
I believe that was merely a what if storyline
@@jeremiahalguire8231 it was a normal story in the legends timeline
@@aliteral_watermelonz3940 oh okay
We should’ve seen that in the sequels
Revan used both the light and the dark and still realizes that love and compassion make a jedi the greatest
And it's a edge jedi can have over Sith because Sith have no love. They are taught betrayal, hatred, selfishness, and greed which destroys love. The jedi give up their greatest edge by discouraging and looking to reduce their use of love.
@brianhanes5413 I'd argue that Sith are taught to embrace their strongest emotions, which love definitely fits; however, they are also taught to embrace these emotions for their personal advancement/power. It's not so much that they have no love, it's just that their manifestation of it tends to the darker aspects (jealousy and control . . . and that very well might destroy mutual love and pervert the feeling in the force wielder, but what is the dark side but a perversion of the Force? Love and Force are still present . . .). Hence Vader's love corrupted him while Bastilla's and Luke's led to redemption (for herself/maybe Revan and Vader respectively).
Totally agree with your last sentence, though.
Thanks to anyone reading my nerd-out . . .😂
@@jonahkaun891what they aspire is lust not love, it’s ultimately fulfilling the selfish aspect rather than the selfless.
Here's another tidbit about Revan: what he did should be impossible. In the setting, it is literally impossible due to the nature of the Light and Dark being directly opposed. Not just in their nature but also in that the Light is balance in the Force and the Dark is imbalance. It's not simply Jedi propaganda, it's actual names for those things. The lore doesn't even try to pretend that what he did in somehow harmonizing them should be impossible. It's treated as an unfathomable miracle that should be fundamentally impossible. Which both makes it acceptable to the audience and prevents it from being something just anyone can do just by accepting both sides of the Force (unlike what a ton of fanfiction claims).
This is a misunderstanding of Revan brought on by novels and SWTOR… the dark side is ALWAYS evil and corrupting, end of story. The Light Side is just a term for the force in balance. Revan used the dark… while he was evil.
I love that Revan is the person who made the Sith more powerful by inspiring the rule of two. Then in a way, found out how for the Jedi to become more powerful as well.
One side learned, the other shunned the knowledge
That wasn't Revan. Bane created the Rule of Two. Prior to him, there were a ton of Sith... and they tried to share power. Bane realized that power can't be shared. It has to be absolute.
One to hold the power. The other to learn and seek it. It was the duty of any Sith to obtain absolute unlimited power. Only one could hold this. The student's duty was to learn and seek enough power to surpass their Master. And replace them. And then find a student of their own. That would do the same.
Palpatine broke the Rule of Two... by assuming he obtained unlimited power. And that Vader... nor any other Force weilder... would never be able to replace him. He decided he would not need to train Vader or anyone else to carry the Sith forward.
@@SpeedyStone
I said inspired the rule of two, not create it
Due to revan's holocrom Bane was inspired with the teachings and made the ro2.
@@SpeedyStone Bane was inspired by Revan and that is why he created that rule
man was just playing devils advocate
I suppose this is a good example of the difference between love and attachment according to George Lucas. Attachment is specifically the idea of owning and possessing someone, which is wrong and a path to the dark. But if you love someone dearly, and healthily, and learn to face your emotions in a way that you can let them go, that is the power of true love. That’s the true selfless live that saved Vader. The Jedi forbade love because they feared attachment, but they should have taught them to embrace their feelings while processing them healthily. It wasn’t Anakin’s love for Padme that drove him to the dark, it was the fact he never learned to process those feelings in a healthy way
THIS YESSS I’ve always thought that if anakin had been taught how to cope properly he wouldn’t have turned
It also didn't help that Palpatine effectively groomed Anakin to not process those feelings in a healthy way at all, and Yoda also accidentally screwed up in that department as well. Palps told Anakin about how he could "save it all and have it all", while Yoda told Anakin to "just let it all go", both being the 2 most extreme and terrible paths anyone can teach someone about handling love, and as a result Anakin ended up exactly how he logically would based on those 2 cases of terrible advice.
Jedi never forbade love, they forbade passion and attachment.
@@joshuakim5240 Yoda was right, if Anakin would have followed his advice, he wouldn't have caused Padme's death. There were no two extremes, there was a sincere wise advice and a greedy manipulation.
attachment isnt an inherently negative thing its not owning or possessing thats toxic control freak territory. Attachments exist between parents and their kids or friends or even things like your smartphone
I feel as if Obi wan also showed this in the show with his 2nd fight with vader as he become much more powerful while thinking of the ones he loves and wants to protect
EXACTLY!!! was just thinking the same thing. as soon as he started thinking about luke and espeically leia, and how he loved them and wanted to protect them, his power seemed to jump off the scales and he dominated vader
Very true
And it's a edge jedi can have over Sith because Sith have no love. They are taught betrayal, hatred, selfishness, and greed which destroys love. The jedi give up their greatest edge by discouraging and looking to reduce their use of love.
@@brianhanes5413 well, thats not...entirelyyyyy true imo. it may be a twisted form of love, and passion, but usually it a love of an ideal or power that creates a sith in the first place, no? it is the fear of loss that drives them further down.
jedi for the most part, always forbade love, whether it be attachment, passion, lust, etc etc because in their eyes, such strong feelings of attachment usually lead to negative emotions when said attachments are suddenly cut off (whether thats a breakup, a death, abandonment)
sith on the other hand, usually embraced love, albeit moreso...passion, which fueled all their other emotions. and cutting off these attachments, lead to anger, fear, hatred, and fueled their dark side powers. neither side, of course, is in the right. there is no BALANCE. a jedi, or a sith, who can control these overwhelming emotions and use them to protect, but not to overwhelm, or kill, that is the true power of love in the Force. at least in my opinion.
@mwbwyatt Drove Anakin yes but different people are driven by different things. Some are merely driven by hatred, rage, etc. I also wouldn't call or define what the Sith have as love not at all. Sith have passion which is an intense desire or ambition for something.
Love itself is not just a feeling, love is a commitment. When you really love someone you will go above and beyond what makes sense, may be practical, etc for that person's wellbeing. In most cases, that's the opposite of how Sith are. Plageius was an exception but it was also seen as a weakness that Sidious avoided.
Anakin had lots of love, when he became a Sith Lord and lost his limbs his love decreased.
Jedi love is still less limited than Sith because they give their lives for people more regularly. Love often requires the putting of someone else over oneself. Where Jedi fall.short is they.put several things over it. One is the code, another is the council, but another is often the wishes of a student's master .
Revan was able to incorporate his "Shadow" in psychoanalytic terms, making him one of the most powerful Jedi ever. His point of facing emotions rather than ignoring them, is spot on. You need to accept your darker side, and use it's energy for good, rather than letting it creep up and destroy everything.
I love that Luke acknowledged the mastery an achievements of the Sith while not belittling or demonizing them.
Galen Marek aka Starkiller was extremely powerful in the force because of his emotional bonds. His growing love for Juno was ultimately the source of his increased power and seeing the force spirit of his late father on the Wookiee homeworld and the pain he felt hardened his resolve to do what needed to be done. Starkiller had great potential in the force and the fact that he was able to stalemate with Sidious if not best him in force ability is a testament to how weak the Jedi of pre empire was
Star killer isn't cannon, and George Lucas didn't even like him.
@@WolfGuardian495 I know legends continuity isn’t canon but still is true.
@@notimeleft1parts of legends are. Namely pre episode 1
I hate how they say these stories are connected to others by saying they aren’t canon yet still to this day can’t make stories like Starkiller’s. Like they call this the Star Wars renaissance but yet we been getting low tier storylines compared to stuff we got before Disney. Idk just seems fishy like they have their own agenda with the series. If they really want to be successful you gotta listen to some of the passionate fans and older writers for the series cause they know Star Wars better than Disney does.
Don’t get me wrong though, there are some decent stories out there recently but I feel like they could do way better.
Didn’t Revan learn this from Jolee Bindo? He taught that passion can lead to the dark side, but love can bring out the light and strengthen it.
Absolutely this. We credit Revan a lot, but have to remember: Revan alone didn't return to the Light, and before KOTOR1 he lead Alek and Surick- one to darkness, the other to an arguably worse fate. It was only after learning from Jolee that Revan was able to redeem Bastila.
The Virgin Jedi: “Train children to become weaponized clinical sociopaths.”
The Chad Revan: *“No.”*
Revan was right. Revan's love saved Bastia. Their love and emotions made them very powerful. Revan was great visionary,he had many advantages. I agree. Had Revan lived during Clone Wars he would make much more powerful and noble Anakin. Anakin would be Grandmaster and Jedi,light side would have tremendous power. Great analysis. May the Force be with you too. Have a nice day :)
I agree with you mostly, but while Anakin would have become the most powerful Jedi, that doesn't mean he would have been made grandmaster, in fact I think he most certainly would not be made grandmaster. Also her name is Bastila Shan, not Bastia
@@TD-ht8dz mistype :) sorry :)
Had Revan lived in the age of Anakin both Sidious & Plagueis would have been caught, stripped of all power and imprisoned.
@@Dicko2909 very true
@@Dicko2909 he would definitely take Dooku under his wing which would make Kenobi easier to sway (his master is already actively disobeying the council anyway). I imagine Revan, Qui Gon, Dooku and Kenobi busting down the door to Sidious' and Plagueis' place and starts going at it lol
I think it is pretty crazy got the portrait at the 3:07 mark looks very much like Keanu Reeves. He sure would make an awesome Reven in my opinion
Perhaps it wasn't just the positive emotions that helped them be more powerful but also the connection itself. Expanding a persons connection to the for through these loved ones. Annikan was at his most powerful when he has padme and she was pregnant. But as soon as he disconnected from them we was weakened.
I feel like this makes sense with Anikan being the chosen he was a emotional person and it exposed cracks in the Jedi way technically he destroyed both sides allowing for Jedi now to feel emotion thus bringing balance to the force
For the part you mentioned Luke studying the dark side refers to the cloned Palpatine. It didn’t last long, but it gave him a more well-rounded appreciation for the Force in its entirety.I think it was also the catalyst for him to fully accept those emotions in his New Jedi Order.
Always love Revan's unique perspective on the force - ESPECIALLY surrounding happiness and love.
As you said though, his ground-breaking concepts and revolutionary ideas were regrettably overlooked and underappreciated.
It's a missed opportunity of epic proportions, leaving us yearning for what could have been.
One difficulty even Revan would have had is working with how possessive Anakin was. Even well-prepared, his past made him cling to people he cared for to a degree that did help him, but in the end was also his downfall. Could this have been carefully addressed by an attentive master? Very likely. But it would also have been really tough to get out of him, as it was based on childhood trauma.
The thing with Anakin is he's a very passionate person by default. He loves and cares about things greatly. If the order had tried to adapt their lessons around this fact then things might have turned out differently. Instead he was told to let go of everything which is to basically deny who he is as a person. Revan might not have had as difficult a time with Anakin as the order did. Of course it's all speculation and we'll never know regardless, but it's an interesting topic at the very least.
He was only possessive because he was taught to shun his emotions instead of learn to control them. If he had been taught that it was okay to live as long as it is mutually agreeable then he would have known how to empathise with how other people feel.
Obvious the order shouldve taught anakin how to healthily control his emotions and have emotional intelligence but nah they basically just told him to bury his emotions which is the worst thing someone with childhood trauma should do
This original comment makes it sound like Obi-Wan wasn't attentive and is to blame for Anakin being consumed by Vader, but Obi-Wan is not at all to blame, he did a very good job training Anakin, what needed to change was the council and the Jedi Order, it was the fault of the council, not Obi-Wan
@@TD-ht8dzThe order was a large part of it but obiwan definitely deserves his fair share of the blame
They seriously need to get Keanu in as revan
Well said, when I made my jedi counselor began of like any new Jedi, but as time went he learned to use his love to protect others, show kindness when needed, and to find when their was no other option.
Love is the key to salvation. The problem comes when you put the one you “love” ahead of everything and everyone else. That is what caused Anakin’s fall. He sacrificed the galaxy for Padme and committed evil in the process. Anakin didn’t try to save Padme for Padme’s sake. He did it for himself with no thought to what Padme actually wanted. This is the difference the Jedi failed to understand: selfless love vs selfish love.
There is nothing as selfless love tho, you being selfless in that scenario is because you need the person to be happy, you do it because you believe thats what you should do as a person, you do it because you feel better being ,,selfless,, then doing something else that might be more efficient, doing selfless act because its you ideology and morals is slefish because you need to do it, you wouldnt feel right and good not doing it the way you are programmed as person, human beings are selfish, we are literally designed this way, trying to run away from it and hoping in selflessness sounds pointless since there isnt such thing
I like the idea that Jedi grow stronger due to positive emotions & that one of the key faults of the Clone Wars Jedi was their view on attachments! They attempted to suppress their emotions to avoid attachments which left some Jedi at odds with themselves & was a key factor in Anakin's fall as had he been raised in a more nurturing environment with the Jedi freeing his mother to give him peace of mind (it would be the least they could do for the mother of the boy who flew a Naboo Starfighter during the Battle of Naboo & possible chosen one) allowing him to focus on his training! This could have potentially allowed him to form a much healthier relationship with Padme & even marry her openly (Padme's relationship with Anakin was likely only considered scandalous due to Jedi dogma regarding attachments, as the deleted scene featuring Anakin interacting with her family on Naboo indicates that her family may have been supportive of such a union given Anakin's heroic actions as a boy & dedication to protecting Padme) with the support of her family & a more permissive Jedi Council!
One of the things that likely alienated the Jedi from the wider galaxy was their suppressed emotions & secretiveness, which Palpatine was likely able to use to his advantage painting them as fanatics and blaming them for the war! Jedi would also likely be stronger, possibly leading to their vision being less clouded by the growing power of the Dark Side! Additionally Qui-Gon may have been seen as less of a maverick while the council could still be weary of Anakin due to his age, they may have been more permissive about him training the boy! Also Qui-Gon may have been stronger due to them being less dogmatic about attachments thus may not have died at Maul's hands as he & Obi-Wan would have been stronger! Additionally Obi-Wan & Satine may have been able to explore their relationship more! Dooku may have been less inclined to fall to the Dark Side had Qui-Gon survived!
On the flip side, weren't they right about EVERYTHING regarding attachments?
The key thing here that Anakin failed to learn was to 'Let go'. It's one of the key tenants of Buddism that was the design basis for the whole Jedi Philosophy. Anakin was held back by his desire for material possessions and material people. His mother died and instead of grieving and letting her go, he became obsessed with obtaining more power so that he could 'save them' next time. His fear of losing someone else was the poison in the well.
He had a vision of Padme dying. His fear of losing her the same way he lost his mother is what drove him to, in his mad quest to avoid this future, bringing about the very thing he sought to avoid.
Now this worked out to Luke's favor in that he saved his son finally freeing himself from the obsession of being a hero not for the sake of power, but for the sake of another.
By no means does it excuse the inaction of the Jedi Council which has brought about the downfall of the Jedi Order numerous times. There is such a thing as being too patient to the point of Sloth. But there is some wisdom in pausing for a moment to view the wider picture and really look at the actions you're about to commit.
Padme and her family could have freed Anakin's mother as well, but didn't. So don't criticize the Jedi about that.
It's unlikely that Obi-Wan and Satine would've got together even if Obi-Wan himself had been allowed.
Remember that Satine is Mandalorian, even if a pacifist, and the Mandalorian grudges against the Jedi would've been difficult and even dangerous for them both.
Death Watch's numbers likely would've swelled from the Mandos who hate Jedi or don't think their leader should be with one.
As much as it might be compelling to see Obi-Wan and Satine take on Mandalore and the rest of the galaxy together, it wouldn't have been worth the instability, constant assassination attempts, and scrutiny and it would've been too dangerous to try and start a family.
If Obi-Wan and Satine were to be together then Satine could not be Mandalore's leader, simple as. It doesn't work the other way around because Mando grudges aren't rational. So you're back at square one.
@@graveyardshift6691 Jedi order needs no excuse. They suspected Anakin's loyalty and Palpatine intentions, and they where right on both cases. They made mistakes, obviously, but it wasn't their fault.
I've always thought that the Jedis' biggest weaknesses was their forbidding of attachments and never learning how to process and deal with their emotions rather than suppressing them. It's those two things that often lead Jedi to fall to the Dark Side.
They didn't supress emotions, they controled then, not allowing them to control you. And failing in that is what caused Anakin's ruin and the ruin of all who truly cared about him.
@@SergioCortes-kc7fc I disagree. I've always understood it as, basically, "don't feel that. Block it out." Then when they get hit with an overwhelming emotion that they can't block out, like when Anakin gave in to the Dark Side because of his overwhelming fear of losing Padme, they're not equipped to deal with it properly and lose control. That was the biggest difference between Obi-wan & Quigon Jin (I likely misspelled that). If Quigon had survived he would have been more like a father to Anakin than a typical Jedi master, like Obi-wan, and Anakin would have been better prepared to deal with those emotions and may not have fallen.
@@futuresonex Well, I'm afraid you misunderstood that. It has never been "block it", it has always been "control it". What jedi did and tought is to control emotions, that's what they actually do, say and teach.
Anakin couldn't manage his emotions because he never intended to control them. He never was humble enough to learn what he was tought. And he was tought patience, control, acceptance and focus. He had all the tools he needed but he was greedy and wanted power. It was his choice. And his choice caused what he feared. Yoda gave him the wisest of advice and he preffered the manipulations of the agent of his ruin. Following Yoda's advice to be patiente and don¡t give up to the fear of losing, he would have lost nothing. It's his choice. It's his fault and no one else's.
I think Revan was so powerful because he had experienced both the light and dark side. I feel as though the path to true power lay in using both sides of the force to utilize it to its full extent. Both Jedi and Sith hinder themselves by only using one aspect of the force. In my mind, the ideal way to use the force is by allowing yourself to feel emotions like the Sith, but to not allow them to control you. Feel passion and emotion, but also be tranquil and in control of them.
But history shows that you can’t have it all. The emotions and passions for a force sensitive opens up the dangers one sees in history to want to use the Force for many things that are good but eventually lead to a perversion of that use.
Indulging in the dark side will always lead to it being chosen over the light or else have serious repercussions for others. A Jedi must always choose the light and only the light.
I mean, if we're talking the so-called legends...Luke indulged the Dark Side and didn't wind up permanently evil, so...incorrect. Also, what about bringing balance to the Force? Why is the assumption that bringing balance to the Force means "having the right proportions of Dark Side and Light Side force users" and not "finding a way to balance the natural emotional nature of people who might be force users in a way that understands that negative emotions are not inherently evil and should not be shunned, but merely understood and controlled, while positive emotions are not flawless and to be worshipped, but merely understood and controlled, because the effect emotions have on ourselves and others are highly dependent on complex contextual factors, and just as the Sith are insane to simply say "FUCK IT, HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE", so too are the the old Jedi Order insane to say "FUCK FEELINGS, STOICISM STOICISM STOICISM STOICISM"
Both philosophies reject reason, and both philosophies reject humanity (in this case, "humanity" applies to all sentient life in the Star Wars universe)
@@lissadawes4243the dark side is still the force.
The true Jedi code, which was discontinued because many Jedi struggled to comprehend it, is an amalgamation of the force itself.
"Emotion, yet Peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet Serenity.
Chaos, yet Harmony.
Death, yet the Force."
The force is the force, it's jedi and sith that dilute it into separate opposing existences. Yes there's the son and the daughter, but there's also the father. And Anakin.
@@user-ko3sd9qj2h the dark side is the force but it is evil and the path to destruction. Also the second version of the Jedi Code is not an older code but exists alongside the other more well known. So it wasn’t discontinued.
The Jedi don’t dilute the Force. They’re the ones who maintain the balance.
@@lissadawes4243 no it was the original code that's still used when training younglings.
And no the dark side doesn't lead to death and destruction. Unctrollable power does. That's where the jedi failed. In the end they let fear control them, ignorance consumed them, chaos destroyed them.
A carebear with a lightsaber would be a terrifying foe.
Just finished listening to Revan on Audible. Now im hooked on his story and philosophy. Ill be watching all your Revan vids here soon.
%100 agreed. Emotions are a powerful way to connect to the force. Love and selflessness for those you care about are some of the greatest motivators and can't be overlooked. The Jedi Council got this seriously wrong.....
.....it's a damn shame Disney never gave us Luke and his Jedi Order who were truly balanced, peaceful, embraced attachments and far superior to any Sith or dark-side wielder.
This is the Jedi order that I wish Disney could’ve given us
It always made sense to me that using love and serenity would give you strength in the light side of the Force.
And I often wondered why the Jedi council didn't see the wisdom of that approach and cut themselves off from the true power of the force.
Ultimately, this led to their downfall.
It's ironic in a way but even in the Old Republic days of the Jedi it was obvious that the most powerful force users all had things to which they had deep attachment.
My brothers thought the inquisitor in tales of the jedi that aksoka killed was darth Revan.
DO what must be done... Do not hesitate... show NO MERCY
I am Revan and in front of me, you are nothing
Lol. Revan is all things at once.
That was a masterful analysis! Many Star Wars fans as well as experts still do not come to those conclusions. This was spot on and gave much food for thought! Thank you.
I agree 100% with this theory, when we review the most notable cases of users of the Force, practically all of them have walked both paths, they have formed ties with other people, be they love or friendship, and in general they have been rebellious against the jedi council of his time because his ideas were "controversial", that is why many fans have thought and considered Revan as the greatest user of the Force, maybe not in terms of brute force, but in control, wisdom and knowledge about it.
Hopefully one day we would have the EU again as the central axis of the Star Wars canon story and we could see the movie trilogy based on Revan and the old republic that for many years we ask for, but the truth is that while Disney is still the owner I doubt that this is possible, having the best stories they chose to ignored and write new and terrible ones that nobody liked, the dark side has clouded their vision XD.
Greetings.
Very good. You made an excellent point that Luke discovered Revan's beliefs without the knowledge of his holocrons.
We were robed of the greatest version of Luke Skywalker by Disney.😢
I like that from Starkiller in the first game of The Force Unleashed
Juno was that attachment that made him so strong, he took down Vader and equaled the Emperor until his final moments when he couldn't before.
Because they are powered by Love, which is more powerful than hate.
So love has blinded you?
Yes, agreed.
@@lv4056 We are encouraged to love.
Ribrianne Rinrianne. Power of love
Huey Lewis Intensifies
imagine having the revan story as a series. most epic character to me in star wars... hope to see this in my life.
It blows me away everyday how you come up with something new and interesting about Star Wars, thanks man!
I agree with this 100% taking the route of Pain, Anger and Hate is the Easy option! Resisting it, is the difficult one. BUT understanding both is the best imo.
I believe Revan shared part of his beliefs when he married Bastila but the Jedi said it Was Heretical and did not want him to spread his teachings to others.
In the Kenobi series, Obi Wan pulled upon love and his attachment to Leia and Luke to escape being buried by Vader and to defeat him again. So now I suppose we do have this reflected in canon with that.
If only the Jedi had embraced these idea's much sooner. So many things would've turned out differently.
It makes sense that emotions fuel the Force in many ways. If you look at the love Anakin had for Padme, you can see that it caused Anakin to make decisions that would ultimately make him stronger, trying to save her from the fate of dying in childbirth. Had he been led by anyone other than Palpatine, and found the power, think of how beautiful of a family legacy that would’ve been. Like and Leia growing up together, being trained as Jedi, Anakin having a seat on the council and being the strongest Jedi in the galaxy, ousting the sith at every turn, no Empire uprising, Palpatine being overthrown, just so much.
Attachment makes stronger in the force ? - yes
Does it makes more vulnerable to falling to the darkside ? - Yes
Does jedi are vary of falling down - oh yes - that is why they rejected the attachment to begin with.
Uhhh only a Sith thinks in absolutes? How about good guidance on those attachments?
No wonder the Sith troll the Jedi. They have no real solution on what to do if a Jedi develops attachment. I mean, Obi Wan loved Satine and dude remained on the light side.
Attachment without wisdom will lead to the obsession thus Obsession will lead to the dark side.
The Jedi misunderstood. Love itself doesn’t cause a fall, SELFISH love causes the fall. For example: anakin’s love for Padme wasn’t his undoing, it was his selfishness. He tried to save Padme FOR HIMSELF. Notice he never once asked Padme what she wanted and when she finally told him she didn’t want what he was doing, on Mustafar he flew into a rage and force choked the one he “loved.” Padme’s feelings didn’t matter, only his did. THIS is what caused his fall
@@Thiago_Alves_Souza exactly. The Jedi council refused to accept that attachment is an inevitability. People will love. It is in their nature. Even if not romantic love, we cannot deny that canonically masters and apprentices loved eachother as friends or like parent and child. It CANNOT be prevented. As a psychologist I saw immediately how destructive their philosophy would be. Surpressing natural feelings like love twists them into things like obsession. Ironically suppressing attachment is a good way to fall to the dark side
@@SkycometAnimeVamp that is the point of the George Lucas's arch with Anakin, it is his selfishness that lead him to the dark side
I love Star Wars. Ever since I was a child watching the original trilogy I have been so captivated by everything George created. That being said, I love your videos and how deep we go into the lore. Keep up the great work.
True Jedi are more powerful because they have more lego studs
This was really well put! Awesome video man!
The irony of the jedi is that they constantly preached about not letting fear control you but the council was constantly ruled and shaped by fear
Same could be said for basically every religion and spiritual pathway.
But there are always a minority who seem to get it. Case in point: Qui Gon. He refused to be on the council. He was not afraid of dying. He saw it that his physical death just meant a passing to the next stage. Nothing to fear at all.
Qui gon literally discovered immortality (Force ghosts), something that Palpatine and Plagueis tried so hard to obtain.
So could we see the makings of this new Jedi order by our boy cal kestis along with his love night sister merrin
The reason the Jedi outlawed emotional attachment is simply because of the natural risks involved with attachment. Most of these Star Wars concepts are true to life in some way or another. With attachments in our lives, as long as our attachments are pure, and we aren't consumed with obsession, possession, control, jealousy, fear, anger, hate, or suffering, it will make all of us a stronger person in life. If we do become obsessive, controlling, jealous, or fearful of loss in our attachments, it can consume us. The same can be said of the Force in Star Wars. The light is about a person being allied with the Force, dealing in compassion, allowing nature to resume its course, and not seeking to dominate nature. The dark side is about succumbing to temptations rooted in weakness, negative emotion, and trying to dominate the Force itself (nature), and bend it to our will as much as possible to gain power from those negative emotions, and suffering. It makes complete sense why the Jedi Order would outlaw attachments in many ways, because there is so much room for error, and most Jedi aren't wise enough, skilled enough, or completely centered enough in their own being to control their emotions under such potential burdens. Keep in mind, leading up to the Clone Wars, the Jedi have been at peace in the galaxy for over 1000 years within the Republic. Most Jedi would be at serious risk of falling to the dark side if they had strong attachments because they have never experienced the seduction of the dark side in times of intense pressure, and conflict. The path of a Jedi is a never ending journey of self reflection, and learning control of ones self above all. There are very few Jedi during the 1000 year peace who actually reached the point where they were mature enough in their knowledge of self control to handle the potential burdens of attachment, especially in times of war, and conflict. That same rule against forming attachments also partially led to the downfall of the Jedi Order. With that being said, the fall of the Jedi Order was almost inevitable, and it took an insanely powerful combination of Sith who used completely foreign tactics to pull it off destroying the Republic, and the Jedi Order from the inside out. The Republic, and the Jedi Order were destroyed long before they even knew it.
In other words
They didn’t want to take any risks
But inaction is also a risk
In this case the inaction to address such
i wonder if revan will one day become canon like promised
why do you want him to be? canon timeline is garbage
He technically does exist in canon
@@mlggrievous yeah were
Forget canon. Canon is only the OFFICIAL timeline. There are alternative timelines and they don’t have to be canon to be just as good or better than the official line
@@gerardocovarrubias3058 He was mentioned in the Rise of Skywalker visual dictionary. Probably the only positive to come out of the entire movie really.
It was good to see Dave Filoni and company showed the power of love and even emphasize it in the Mandalorian, Star Wars Rebels, and Obi-Wan series. The Mandalorian emphasizing how their strength comes from their bonds. In Rebels, Jedi Kanan Jarrus' love for Hera Syndulla gave him the power needed to save Hera and other crew members. With Obi-Wan, his power begins to return and become stronger as his relationship with Leia develops, ultimately Kenobi uses his memories and feelings for Leia in order to overcome and defeat Vader.
There are also some examples where a jedi's connection to the force becomes stronger when they have let go of their fear, which often comes from love for those close to them. Recently this is shown in Jedi Survivor when Cere Junda faces Darth Vader.
I think of it like the soft magic vs Dark Magic.
Dark Magic is more immediate and obvious. (Dark side)
Soft magic is subtle and discrete. (Light side)
It's why the Sith can often win battles but never the "war".
Plapatine won the war tho, revan as sith almost won war, there isnt anything in nature of force telling you if you will win or not, its on the individual anyways, dark side is as difficult to use as light side, yiu can think that its easy to let your emotions go wild but force tricks still require focus being able to focus force while feeling unstoppable rage sounds kinda harsh thing to learn, they both just deffernt sides of the same coin
@Projekt Ava No Palpitine defeated his mortal foes but not his esoteric ones.
He ruled the galaxy but lost control. He wanted order but lost his power. He wanted to control life itself but life itself fought back.
Palpatine thought he could force the galaxy to his will but he was ultimately wrong~
@@KrazyStargazer buddy you can pull out any of this poetic shit, it doesnt change a fact, yeah he failed to be immortal, so what, no one actually ruke forever, he won the war agaisnt jedi, he killed thousands of them, ruled the galaxy for decades and no actually galaxy under the empire was stronger then ever, superior military force, strong order, and clearly good resources and economic, there is no thing like sith cant win war, or things like that, dark side and light side are bith just force, there isnt anything poetic about sith not winning, its literally about balance, there were too much jedi, then a sithe made it even again with killing most of them, a new order could jave been established and cogs of fate move on, palpatine as individual won war against jedi, then lost to their remains being Luke, yet the previous war was won, he got the control, he printed his name in to the history, and ruled whole galaxy. And did what every sith wanted, just because he didnt achieved all his ambitions doesnt mean he didnt won the war, its just simple, light side doesnt make you magically have a good end, if you think its poetic to say ,,but palaptine lost in the end to jedi,, fine lets ignore decades of him being in position of oower, lets ignore thousands of killed jedi, millions of and millions of dead people because of him, there isnt anything poetic about it, its about the individual himself, palpatine sinply won against jedi order, then there was luke as oposition, always in balance, war isnt poetic war is war
But Palpitine's true goal and endgame was always immortality and to rule over the entirety of the galaxy unopposed. Consider what Vader said "The power to destroy a planet is insignificant when compared to the power of the force."
Palpitine's trueist enemy was the force itself. As much as he hated the Jedi, the Rebuplic or the Rebellion he hated that he didn't have complete control over the force.
A Sith seeks ower by forcing the "Force" to do it's bidding. Just look at how they make their lightsabers.
Where as a Jedi sees the force as an "Ally". Not something to be over come but something with it's own agency.
If you want a more tangable example Jedi get 'force healing' and 'force ghosts'. These are skills to preserve knoledge and life.
The sigh get 'sith lightning' and "force choke'.
Yes im aware theirs more nuance but these are the general tendencies. The sith sacrifice the 'big picture' (aka force heaven) for power in the physical world, and Jedi loose physical power and gain spiritual power.
@@KrazyStargazer yeah thats true, then dont refer to it as battle and war, not everyones goal is imortality, its just certain individuals not being able to achieve their dreams, its not full on scale, jedi didnt won any war, achieving imortality isnt bigger succes then what ahieved some other sith, its just clowning on palpatine cuz ma guy didnt achieved it, but darth sion from kotor was imortal, nihilus could live without his physical form he just needed to devour force, vitiate achieved imortality, and lot of sith managed to hide their spirit in some artifact, dark side and light side is different, you can use basically any emotion and feeling in both, it depends on the individual, siths can heal themselves, they can be imortal, jedi can have destructive power like lightning just through different process, but jedi lsoing galaxy against palpatine was definitely jedi losing war, why? because they couldnt even stop slaughter of innocent and literally planetary destruction, dark side of the force definitelly won that day, just because it didnt lasted that long doesnt erase the fact that after palpatines victory tere was no one to opose him, luke was kid, there was no threat for him, rebels werent actuall threat also, again this is not about battles and wars
Wait I thought jolie bindo was the one you came up with the whole love stuff
This strength superiority to the sith may be because there are more emotions that are good in nature then there are bad ones possibly
Thats not really true, there isnt anything like actuall superiority, you have various individuals that are strong with through one emotion mainly, quantity isnt everything, Sion was immortal thanks to his anger, feat that no jedi could pull off or defeat, force ghost is nice and all, but my dude sion was just casually walking around immortal, nihuls felt hunger, so strong and primal that force allowed him to consumen all life form on planet, sith just usually dont urilize or dont know how to utilize some of those emotions properly usually they use just anger, jedi are trying to achieve peace, but its not that ,,oh i feel love now i am stronger in force,, if you as jedi dont controll your emotions then you are weaker more unstable which goes against the calmness of jedi, meanwhile sith also can utilize love and other things, they just let it go wild, there isnt anything like one side of force being superior, that goes against the very nature of force, dakr side and light side are bith needed
@@projektava9385 which is why I said possibly
@@johnhorton4436 thats fine, i just said there is no possibility like that, considering all emotions can be used in negative way and possitive way
@@projektava9385 can peace be used in its truest form by Malevolent beings
@@johnhorton4436 peace itself is a state not specific emotion, its state of mind, if you achieve peace you are no longer malevolent, and peace can be interpreted in various ways used to do different things, someone who achieved peace can have goal of preserving knowledge and giving it to younger generetion as mentor, another one who achieved peace can see world as never ending cycle and that concept of death doesnt have any actuall value, he can acknowledge the fact that morals dont play any role in higher game, he doesnt have to have problem with sacrificing human lives for something he moght see as higher goal and still he can be in peace with himself and life, so yes everythibg can use to cause destruction or grow, both are needed in the end, love can drive someone to protect something and nurish it, or it can make one jealous or angry or overprotective which give someone will to do horrible things just to preserve what they love, hunger can be used as motivation and drive needed to achieve something in life soemthing that gives you motivation, but also hunger can drive you beyond morals and man you once was making you do atrocious things to satisfy that hunger, there is lot of nuance between feelings, emotions and states of mind, all it depends on the individual
Revan is my favorite SW character. Awesome video to you and your team.
...NNNNNNOOOOOOO
If the original Jedi order allowed attachments, maybe Anakin wouldn't have turned to the dark side since he would be able to openly talk about his situation with the other jedi
First
Five hundred and first
N O P E
everytime i wartch videos about revan and see images of him in the videos i can't hep but think of how interesting it would be to have a movie about him and his time period come out with keanu reeves playing as revan because of how much they look alike in a way to me
I didn't know I needed to see Keanu play Revan but if they could make a good series of KOTOR with Reeves in the lead I might almost forgive Disney
I agree with what you’re saying, but I still think the Jedi do embody love. They just want the love to be shifted towards protecting people and serving.
Yes, there are different kinds of love. But the Jedi as a group want to prevent the kind of love that forms a close attachement to one person (or a few), and not just a community. And even in that process something valuable gets lost, but the risk of "falling" gets lowered because eventually losing who you love, or the good relationship you once had with them, may come with a lot of suffering, leading to the dark side.
"Attachment is forbidden. Possession is forbidden. Compassion, which I would define as unconditional love, is essential to a Jedi's life. So you might say, that we are encouraged to love." -Anakin
Its sad he actually understood what the code meant but because he never was taught how to express his emotions and instead bury them by the Jedi, he still fell.
Also Lucas said that the light side is joy and love. They aren't merely just emotions, but more. Even in mourning you can find joy, if you choose it. By choosing to focus on the good memories of a loved one and by remembering the lessons they teach .
Or as Rooter from land before time says
"you'll always miss her. But she'll always be with you, as long as you remember the things she taught you. In a way, you'll never be apart, for you are still part of each other."
I love videos like this! Always makes me feel like what we've seen so far has just scratched the surface of what is possible with the Force, hoping I get to live to see the day someone really expands on this and takes the Force to the next level.
I wish they could demonstrate this in a movie. A scene of a force weirder combining their love for their loved one and their anger for their enemy causing them to do something awesome.
Obi Wan kind of did that on his series when fighting against Vader
@@Blackwolf-gr6ch I can see your point. I couldn't help but see it as desperation to get the job done rather than using emotions in a healthy way if that makes sense. Also, Obi-wan never hates Vader, he's in a constant state of pity for Vader. He wants to defeat Vader out of a sense of wanting to do what needs to be done. BTW cool user name.
I mean the moment where Luke gains an edge on Vader in RotJ is when he threatens Leia. Luke doesn't fall to the dark side as was intended, but he *does* let the anger out and uses it along with his desire to protect his sister to beat an up until then superior opponent. I'd say it pretty much fulfills what you're asking.
Of course one might not consider that lightsaber duel "awesome" by today's standard of CGI and power-creep, but this was back when Yoda lifting an X-wing out of a swamp was like the height of force power we'd seen.
@@HellaGust I get your point. But didn't Luke basically have a temper tantrum? I was referring more to someone who was a master of their emotions and not afraid of their anger. Granted it's a bit of a nitpick, but I really wish to see something like that.
so basically, emotions and feelings, both positive and negative, can give you power
the old jedi order just had skill issue, not knowing that it was an asset
which was one of the reasons we've watch many Jedi who fell to the dark side suddenly gained a power boost
I love how Revan has knowledge available for Jedi and Sith alike...a common teacher. Bane learned from revan of the rule of two. skywalker perhaps didnt learn it directly from Revan but still took on his ideology, and i think that is really neat.
It's really very simple. And you picked some pretty solid points to illustrate these exact ideas - even if I'd argue the Mortis arc and Yoda's encouter with the sisters should be considered non-canon as they steer away from this concept and muddy the truth to be more 2 equals and pick your poison.
If you don't have emotion, then why do you defend the weak or the righteous? You don't care if you don't have emotion.
Is anger innately evil? Is being angry at something wrong not the other half of the coin to wanting to protect what is right? Yes.
Is love and marriage a weakness? Sure, but it is equally a strength.
So it all comes down to 2 things: what you do AND how/why you do it. You need both.
The jedi had half the answer. They discouraged any investigation towards the other half on a deeper level which led to the self-conflicting morals and code like you point out. Which in turn led many to misunderstand this on a crucial level - weakening many jedi, causing judgemental errors, and driving others to the dark side.
The sith understood the other side half of the answer somewhat. But instead of having the half the jedi had to keep their emotions in check, they became slave to their emotions which became their undoing.
Love the take, I hadn't thought of this before. Love the video!!
We need an alternate timeline where Anakin is trained by Qui-Gon... I think his "Living Force" approach his very close to Revan's beliefs...
PLEASE PLEASE make a theory on how revan wouldve taught anakin it sounds so intriguing
See, it makes a lot of sense that Revan would hold this belief. There were several examples of positive attachments between masters and padawans in his time and he had a force bond with Bastilla which aided in making him strong enough to defeat Malak. His general, Meetra Surik also had a force bond with her master and each of her own padawans and she was an extraordinarily powerful jedi.
In other Legacy stories, Tales of the Jedi (5,000 - 4,000BBY) it showed Jedi in relationships, some even had Jedi Dynasties.
What was true in all these tales was that those Jedi who cared for people, who had genuine love for others were usually the strongest in the force.
Just imagine how differently the SW universe would have been if the council welcomed, embraced, and encouraged Anakin’s love for Padme.
For a Jedi, love is a double edge sword. Anakin's love for Padme and his desire to save her was the direct cause of his becoming Darth Vader. Granted it would be Anakin's love for his son, Luke, that gave him the strength to overcome Vader and Palpatine. One of the best visuals for this I feel was in the Kenobi series. When Vader dueled Kenobi on Mapuzo, where Vader soundly beat Obi-Wan and nearly killed him. When they dueled again on a rocky moon where Kenobi put up a better fight before nearly being buried alive by Vader. While trying to hold back the rocks Obi-Wan thought of Luke and Leia and what they meant to him. Thinking of them he throw the rocks off and confronted Vader again, this time dominating the fight and leaving Vader injured but alive.
Love for others give one the fuel to fight on on when the colorful banners of ideals do not.
Compassion can create opportunities for courage that are not vain but the highest form of service. There is no purer love than to lay one's life down for another.
Nomi Sunrider was married to a Jedi before he was killed and went on to train as a Jedi. She eventually became grandmaster and severed Ulic Qel-Droma's connection to the Force as punishment for his crimes.
The concept of avoiding attachment was "if you have a loved one we are afraid that you may fall to the dark side because of the strong emotions this may lead to". How was it? fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to ...suffering.
Finally a Revan video again! Thanks mate! 🥳
I had not thought about the story like this before, but that was very interesting. Thank you.
The sith/Jedi power dynamic is analogous to real world martial arts, to westerners seen most readily in eastern martial arts movies, and what I believe is the basis for Lucas' inspiration. There have been many stories of how power comes easier for those using brute force and channeling anger into each strike, overwhelming with aggression. Almost all eastern movies teach the lesson of the "hero" over-coming with selflessness and letting go of all emotions, thereby becoming a pure warrior. It's true, anger clouds judgment and can be exploited. The One shows this dynamic well, with the hero moving like water instead of stone.
"good... good.... let the love flow through you"
/electrecutes his opponent with light-side lighting/
Luke Skywalker: "Everybody's gettin' laid. Therapists are also available if you're having an emotional crisis."
We need Old Republic era stories in modern film and television. It's a freaking gold mine of lore.
I feel a good example of this is during the kenobi series where shortly after Vader pummels obi wan, ben then channels his emotions into hammering Vader
Fascinating video in any event. It opens up some new options, in terms of a light side equal to a Sith Lord. Light side Jedi who use primarily offensive/destructive force skills, for example.
But I can’t help but be concerned that it takes all the advantage out of falling to the dark side. As these Jedi can be just as powerful as a Sith Lord without having to fall themselves. It’s obviously a MUCH better deal to go light now. You’d have to be stupid to fall to the dark side, in which case you’re not lasting too long anyway. 😮
This is exactly why I will always lean towards the concept of being a grey jedi sentinel and a bendu je'daii for they were wayless rigid than the counselor and guardian orders of the jedi and the same can be said about the grey Paladin order; plus the grey jedi code and the je'daii code are way better than the jedi and sith codes because they offers true balance! 💯🔥😁😉👍
Revan even had a child with Bastilla, which made him happy and more considerate of his decisions and those he loves.
And KK squandered the opportunity that this lore would have provided.
Attachments are a Jedis Achilles heel...isn't it are own ...no matter how successful how rich and powerful we as humans will become primal to protect what we love whether it be a person or a volleyball
Best holicron so far, my dude! Keep it up
Excellent video! Very thoughtful and informative! Thank you!!😊