Class AB or Class D amps?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 มิ.ย. 2024
- Paul has long said he prefers the sound of Class AB amplifiers to that of Class D, but recently PS has launched some Class D hybrids. What's his opinion now? If you want to learn more, grab a copy of Paul's new book, The Audiophile's Guide. www.amazon.com/Audiophiles-Gu...
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I have a lot of amplifiers (approx. 25-30) both tubular and solid state, also vintage, modern and homemade, A AB B D, but the most beautiful sound for me is produced by a simple homemade 6Q7 + 6M6 class A single-end tubular, not loud, but very musical. Sorry for my english, greetings from Hungary.
Your english is just fine. Are the build plans for the single ended amp you describe available in english?
@@musicnut1986 look up Baby Huey amplifier. Mine is a bout 8 watts and absolutely as musical as anything I have ever heard.
www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/326920-el34-baby-huey-amplifier.html
Thanks, Sure gonna look into the 6Q7...I have also more amps but to build a new one is always fun.
@@musicnut1986 Thank you. I have shematic from amplifier block and photos from this amp.
@@richardr.5177 6Q7 is a double diode+triode tube, I only use the triode section of the tube
A survey found that men usually liked either A or A/B amplifiers, and women liked the big D amps....
So I'm a southern 35 year old revived bass head but damn I love listening to you speak and describe the sound ...great job with voice tone modulation to convey the sense of satisfaction. You just picked up a new subscriber.
I am subbed to this channel just because you Paul are so cool. Helps you talk about something I have a vague interest in :P
Good to see that class D amps are making strides. It’s all about choice and price points and the more alternatives we have the better. Class D appeals to me due to potential space limitations as long as I’m not making a big sacrifice in audio quality. For my budget the M700s are a nice sweet spot.
I propose a fun experiment, it might make a GREAT video as well!
1. you set up two listening rooms in the office - one with the best class AB amp you have and one with the best class D amp you have. Connect them as dummy amps that can be seen - but not touched! Use a pre-amp for volume control, they can touch that when listening! Actual amps PLAYING should be the same as the amps that they see, but "behind the curtains"! Have both amps "not clip" at maximum pre-amp "power" and they must be at the same loudness at max (really important)!
2. have all the people in the office go in and out every day, compare the sound, listen to them and have them fill out the forms with data like: clarity, musicality, distortion, dynamics, timbre, total score, etc. - think of like 10 parameters that can be voted from 1-10 and have someone who will make them fill it up EVERY DAY for 2 weeks! That someone can't know about the actual experiment - tell them it's an experiment on psycho-acoustics and no one is allowed to touch ANYTHING but the volume knob of the pre-amp (if even that?)!
3. Come back Tuesday night and switch amps that are "behind the curtains" - no one can see that you were even there and cables must look exactly the same as they were the day before!
4. Switch amps that they can see (but are not playing) over the weekend!
5. Switch "behind the curtains" amps back the next Tuesday night!
6. Compare notes "when you're back from vacation" and see if anyone noticed the sound change when they should and didn't when they shouldn't!
7. Do a reveal and see their reactions.
-> I reckon that there will be a lot of change in answers on Monday and no statistical evidence that they noticed the Tuesday night swap - BUT - most people will claim after the reveal: "I knew something changed every Wednesday, but didn't wanna say anything because of reason XYZ!" - it's a classic audiophile excuse! :-)
... We made a similar experiment on our "audiophile friend" when he bragged about his great new expensive speaker cables - quickly switched them when he went to the bathroom! After he returned and continued bragging about the clarity and musicality of new cables for more than a couple of songs, we revealed that we swapped out his cable and put the cheapest (but still thick) copper cable under the carpet! In the end, he claimed that "he heard something was wrong but didn't wanna say anything so he wouldn't look like an idiot"! :-D
-> please make a video and respond to this comment after you made the experiment - It MUST be a "double blind experiment" - no one can see you, no one can talk with you about it because it skews the experiment badly! Water Dowsers DO FIND WATER in a single blind experiment - no one can know what you're doing!!!
I got a class AB Rotel RB-1582 and a class D Rotel RB-1572 power amp. I now own them for about 5 or 6 years now and I have to say, they both sound great for the price range. The class D is just a bit more analytical, but absolutely no harshness in any way. The biggest difference in my opinion, is that the class D sound is more « full » at very low volume. All frequencies seem to be more easy to hear than the class AB power amp. But again, the difference is really small and you have to do an A-B comparison to really hear a clear difference. So knowing that this class D isn’t one of the newest models out there, I think that in a few years, they could sound even better than they do now. Class D amps have become so much better and continue to evolve day after day. But after all, some coloration in the sound is kind of a signature. I also own a Rowen and NAD class AB power amps and each one has its specificities that I love. For me it is more a question of taste. Do you like analytical/neutral? Go for this. Do you like warm sounding music? Go for that. 🙂
After the pandemic I will driving to psaudio to just meet you paul. Love ur videos
Don't forget to buy some snake oil, from Paul too.
@@animalmuppetmonster664 If you watch my channal you would realize i dont buy anything anymore I have over a dozen herron krell mcintosh pieces which i find time to time I cant afford to spend on modern stuff I will probably not like But i do like Paul I honestly believe he is honest most of the time to the best of his knowledge and experience but sometimes he favours brands like audioquest as he is freinds with them and you can not blame him for that its his channal and if you really dont like him no one will force you to watch but I atleast value all who had to work there way building a business for things we like. I do love he showed his home rack is all emotiva i dont think even he can afford the ps audio good stuff
Great educational video on the audio world....thanks, Paul!
I know i am going to be the most controversial here but one of my favorite recievers the huldra 8 reciever is a class b reciever and i love it.the huldra 8 is in my opinion the most beatiful reciever made. It also sounds pretty good especially for being a b class transistor reciever made in 1965.
Using the Swedish XTZ ICE Edge A2-400 right now, it drives my KLH Model 5's to the moon with the Cambridge Audio Streamer/DAC/Preamp. You are not just at the concert, you are on the stage in front of the drums next to the bass player. Everything is crisp, but yet has that nice vinyl sound to it (Cambridge), which I like, along with the bass. Very fast amp, the bass hits with no continuation, just like it is supposed to sound. Then I added the two SVS SB3000 subs, that is when the soundstage really exploded.
The KLH Model 5's are 6 ohm speakers, rated up to 200 watts. The XTZ amp delivers, and feeds the Model 5's enough juice to really open them up, with plenty of headroom left over, this amp is not going to run out of steam anytime soon.
How much would you have to spend on a Class A/B amp to get the kind of sound, power and headroom the XTZ brings to the table for under $1000? My Emotiva XPA2 has the juice, but it leaves the KLH speakers rather veiled, the XTZ is a much better fit with the Cambridge.
As I am attempting to point out, I believe much will depend on what you pair an amp like this up with. I am using the Cambridge Audio Network Streamer/DAC/Preamp, which leans just a touch towards vinyl in its sound, which matches perfectly with the uncolored and neutral XTZ Edge A2-400 amp. If I had a preamp that sounded cooler, or was using cooler sounding speakers than the KLH, then I could see using a Class A/B.
The Class D amps that we have today are pretty hard to beat in regards to value and sound. They continue to get better by the day. Look at Mark Levinson, their flagship amplifier is a Class D. The technology is now there to my mind.
The other benefit is the size factor. A unit like my XTZ Edge A2-400 looks very nice, and is small enough to easily tuck away for an uncluttered aesthetic look if you are going for a more component free environment. I can't do that with my Emotiva XPA2, which is huge and heavy, I'm not putting that on a shelf behind the TV without doing some major construction to tie into the houses structure to support the beast. I can use a couple of bungie cords and a piece of wood to safely mount the XTZ up and out of the way.
And I have had other A/B amps from Parasound and some custom $5000 A/B from years ago, I cannot even recall the brand. I simply enjoy the sound I get out of these new Class D amplifiers, and they do not break the bank, or my back if I have to move them. I can tuck them out of the way and forget about them.
Just my .02
I use Peachtree Audio class D amps in my office setup and they sound great to my ears.
Which model? How's the bass? Think it would pair well with Klipsch Heresy IVs?
Hey Paul, what about using the M1200 modules, input signal with 12Au7, and 5687 driver tube with a different variant.
My main question is if they are distinguishable enough to tell them apart if you playing both class ab and d in the same sound stage? I have a large class ab for midbass and im deciding on running either low power class ab on my midrange horns and tweeters or proper power on the class d amp. I just don't want It be noticeable. Its car audio, skar audio skv2 1300.2 A/B for my midbass. And for the mids and highs its either the Skar audio skv2-200.4D or the skv2-100.4A/B
Great guy Paul is! I've messed with well done Class D and some tubes in the mix. My ears like!
I'm leaning toward this, considering 2 700w buckeye purify monoblocks and a schiit tube preamp, i care about bass and warmth while maybe taming the highs, whats your experience with tubes?
I have the ac200 iceamp and I notice a rolloff while listening to songs with sustained long base and midrange.
Is it possible it's because the onboard power supply doesn't have a big powerful transformer like my class ab, or is it just a class d thing?
I also found I have to drive my line in with a preamp, or it is extremely anemic sounding when using a standard line directly into it out of a cd player or optical to analog dac.
Is that also a class d thing? Because my ab doesn't even output as much wattage and not only sounds louder, it also sustains low and mid range way better on (most notably older music (pre- punchy short blast beat new age stuff) (I like to think of new stuff as window rattler era, vs the old stuff rattled the entire foundation when it hit that sweet spot in the frequency for a while!)
How about with program vs instrument power? I’m still using older Crown AB amps for my Rock bands PA system. I found the newer class D amps just can’t cut it. I mean when it comes to balancing bass-drum with a cranked up Marshall JCM 800 guitar stack not to mention a screaming singer.and booming bass guitar and synth organ sounds. The AB just seems to be able to get the job done on the low/mid, low and sub frequencies.
Maximum respect Mr Paul
I prefer Class D for the bass (especially subwoofer) to get max power (dynamics) and class AB for mids and highs to get best precision.
Sounds like you would love the Devialet hybrid class A/D amps; except for the price, of course.
www.stereophile.com/content/devialet-d-premier-da-integrated-amplifier
im sure we all, if we wanted a huge sub powered by class a amp we would need a wall transformer haha
@@HareDeLune Yes, Devialet is perhaps the most creative company in audio amps lately.
@@ThinkingBetter
I would love to give one an audition. : )
@@thang1742 Yes, class A makes no sense when you go for a high power subwoofer. I like my Velodyne servo subwoofers. They are class D and with 3000 Watts peak, 1250 Watts RMS. A class D servo subwoofer is likely much more more precise than a class A traditional subwoofer btw :-)
will there be an upgraded bhk some day?
Have a Emerald Physics 100.2 SE Amp Class D love it
Wait, did I just hear Paul say class D is okay? I never thought I would hear that. Thanks Paul for your honesty. I'll be looking into those 1200's!
Wooo Wooo Wooo , hold your horses. Mr Paul is been diplomatic because he sells Class D amplifiers . I mean no disrespect to Mr Paul so let me say that load and clear . If you are looking for long lasting reliable and ruggedly built amplifier I would NOT trust Class just yet or anytime soon . An engineering rule of thumb is simplicity in any design = Reliability .
I've been noticing a trend that Paul loves anything that moves money from gullible audiophiles into Paul's pocket.
There's been class Ds available with distortion lower than human hearing can notice across the audio band for a decade, but only when Paul's company sells one does Paul change his mind :P
Hello Mr. Mc Gowan, I find your video and your products very interesting and I would be interested to know what kind of vacuum tubes are used in the M1200 because that makes a very big difference in sound and I also wanted to ask if your products are available in Germany and Is it possible to hear a sample here? Best regards Christian Klemm
I haven’t dealt with this stuff since the 1990s. Early 90s. In car audio, there was no such thing as D. It was mainly all clean AB high quality and high $$$ amps if you wanted good sound. God I miss those days with clean CD source material as the source. I was 18-19 with a 2600 watt super clean and correctly set up system in my Toyota 4 Runner. Every ride was bliss. Loved it.
I know this might not apply here but I have a Velodyne CT120 subwoofer. It recently stopped working. I would love to repair it but I'm at a loss of where to take it. I think the company doesn't even exist anymore. I just read it has a Class A/B Amplifier. I really do want to keep it but have found a Klipsch SPL 120 that seems to be close....But it has a class D Amp. Any suggestions? Help? Opinions? Thanks!
Try a current Linear Power car amplifier class AB in a studio or home if you really want to blow your mind 🤯 They are used in some world renowned recording studios today for their pure quality of sound 👌 I would put them against any high end home or studio amp out there.
2 x 25W Class D amp who lives in the BC Acoustique speakers SP-102 BT.
This active speakers play in the very uncommon broadband speakers family, with a vertical pair of 3' on 4 Ohms for each speakers.
It has a very interesting external PSU, u can upgrade. I'd go with a 200VA on 16V Linear PSU. But already stunning with the 60 W switching PSU.
It's rated 86 db, pretty OK for a small room : u have the level of a Jazz Club live session. It goes down to 40 Hz full power... with like a 3 liters enclosure.
Professor PS Audio, I don't understand how it does that. I guess some internal equalization ? @ 31.5Hz I don't hear anything anymore, that said.
My class d devialet amplifier is sold. Something about class d i can't live with.
I have ordered the gryphon diablo 120 amplifier. I can't wait
Most common car audio uses class A/B amplifiers for the mids and highs. Class D amplifiers for subwoofers. Who's to say that it's any different in home audio. However I do prefer full class A monoblocks for full range. In home audio.
For MIDRANGE speaker for car audio? Class D will output loud?
I have always preferred heavy class A, AB "high-current" amps. The heavier the better! Today class D amps have come a long way, but I still long to hear one that can match or exceed the sound from an old 200 lbs mono "KRELL" amp made in the 1990s. This class D amp to compete with the old "KRELL" may be out there and I just haven't heard it.
@@lukerestlessstudios, Thanks! I'll look into it.
wow paul , i have a big question if you are planning to buy a subwoofer let say like REL SUBWOOFER some of them used class D but also class AB in this case which one would you buy than?
Thank you Paul. There is a new amplifier technology that recently came out. The producer calls it HS Class. It works with pwm technology like the class D but the pulse is not only width modulated. It modulates the amplitude and the frequency of the pulses as well. Producer declares that the output signal reconstruction is way more precise,especially for the hi frequencies. You, as producer,should test it in your laboratory,for a comparison(maybe secretly..). I am speaking about the ItaliAcoustic HSA-05S.
All the best.
3:09 like a french cook passionately talking about his fancy menu.
@Fat Rat Yeah, I've seen that already; he said to me in the comments that he drank Windex before doing the recording.
So that explains a lot I think 😅
@Fat Rat I don't like to Klipsch my Schiit. When I do I have to use a man wipe.
good brother you are like genius audio, its experienc im with you, hi from cuba, thanks my brother, you all right
so, the BHK dual monos are A/B.... how many watts of A till it switches over to B ?
hello
Why so much power in the M1200? What is the purpose, knowing that there are almost no speakers that work at those watts?
Thank you
John
I believe icepower 1200 modules are based on newer ice edge tech, 700 modules being older tech although both these modules were releases together after the ice edge campaign.
I believe you are correct.
I have a class T amp, combines the best of both!
Edit because youtube no longer picks up my spelling errors and I didn't see that i'd spelled "combines" wrong untill now.
What make and model?
Class "T" is just bullshit marketing for Tripath's class D implementation. Tripath went bankrupt ages ago and their tech is now owned by Texas Instruments anyhow.
Class AB is a very mature design. However class D is growing very fast. There is a lot of improvement. A single improvement will affect very far better in class D. For example better mosfet datasheet. implementing better feedback, and so on. You will see always a new born better class D for every soon. Then today Class D can stand at same level clarity with class AB.
As Class D designs are moving forward, are you considering updating your M300, M700 and 1200 design now that newer technology has come out?
whats the best combo power amp with preamp or with class A
What about the price point? You only seem to review the expensive stuff. There are many Class D amplifiers under 200€ like the Tangent Ampster BT 2. Are they any good? I got the class A/B Yamaha RN 402 instead (is that amp any good?), because it ended up cheaper in a bundle deal with the Klipsch RP 600M. And I feel clueless to be frank.
trying to decide it going to the m700 from delta 250s are an upgrade or a sideways move.
yes, I know what you're driving makes a difference, but I like to try different speakers too.
opinions?
Do you think class D amplifiers are better than AB for low volume listening? Thank you!
I like Class D's (the fake ones) they hit my bench a lot, most of the TDAs got roasted. And Capacitor fatigue by the high frequency switching of the SMPS. About 400Khz or more.
fake ones?
I was wondering. A properly designed Class A/B amp the first 5 or 10 watts are really in Class A. That in that the output transistors are conducting so that the crossover ( transition between the output transistors ) distortion is kept low. If you compare the sound of a Class A/B vs a Class D, in Pauls mind, is it the fact that the A/B at very low levels is really running in Class A?
Yes, you are right that at low levels ab is usually class a. I have a triamped system with high efficiency speakers so my mids and highs are being run in class a with ab amps. Possibly my sub may dip into ab territory but without meters I don't know for sure.
For the first 10 watts to be in class A the amplifier would need to be drawing about 80 to 110W idle. Pretty awful
Ya but if all I ever knew about was the Lloyds one speaker AM clock radio, I'd probably be happy with that.
Love my class D. In a perfect world, with unlimited space and unlimited money, I would take a pair of mega AB mono’s but until I win the lottery I’ll continue to play with my NADs
Me too😊
go NADs!
Lmk D Sonic or sunfire for sound quality?
Class D Red Dragon monoblocks in my main system. Effortless clear power.
Class D = cheap sourced parts, maximum profit for the amp manufacturer (especially the guys selling $$$$ priced class D amps, wink wink).
Hi Paul! I'm using a class D amp on my Image Dynamics Mid range set, sounds good, but changing to AB would it sound more clear? Of course talking about same watts RMS to be equal
I switched from D to AB last week. Never going back.
I switched from a to ab to D. never going back.
Never say never. Tomorrow's class D will not be the same as yesterday's.
@Larry Niles
Stuck in a rut.
hey so did I from NAD to Mcintosh still running in the new amp but all ready am enjoying the sound and warmth a lot more.
I have an old Technics amp from 75' and 3 NAD class D amps from a couple years ago. Which I turn on to listen to depends on what kind of mood im in and what I want to listen to. (If it's a little cold in the room I'll use the Technics, may as well let the music help heat the house. lol)
Hi what NAD amps do you have? I'm interested in purchasing the NAD C388 and was wondering if you have this amp and how it sounds and if you like it if you're familiar with it. Thanks
@@erikquinn707 I've had two C268's power amps each in bridged mode running their own speaker for awhile and just got a 3rd to run a sub (or 2) I use a C326BEE Integrated Class AB as preamp. They sound nice to me. Low distortion, tight, in control....but kind of sanitized almost too crisp. The Technics SU-8600 is just as punchy as the NADS are when they are in unbridged stereo mode but not as controlled. The dynamic range of the SU8600 is more and it seems brighter. The NADS can't dip as close to infrasound freqs as the old guy. I don't have a C388 or any pure digital sources to plug into it.
Class D amps are getting better and better but their prices are outpacing their quality. Why would I pay $7k for a class D when I can buy a top notch Class AB amp ( read Bryston) for less then that.
Please check Lyngdorf and you will know what I mean...
Word on the street is that Paul sits and listens to his LS50 and Sprout 100 more than anything else ...
He has a shed out back where he secretly enjoys a Bose Acounstimass.
Class D seems to be getting better. I've recently heard of 2 almost "Road to Demascus" level of turn-arounds from two (until very recently) 100% consistent preferer's of class A/AB amps, the stories & pics came from 2 youtube reviewers who each heard a (different model of) a new class D amp & both guys sounded ultra surprised, more blown-away by the D-amps they had tried, both saying their new D-amp listening sessions lacked all of the sub-A/AB foibles they both independently had heard in all their previous D-amp trials/ reviews. Guttenberg's D-amp was 13 thousand & something U.S. dollars & (i agreed with the Gut') looked beautiful. It was rectangular in it's nodal points yet because of undulating curves it only had 2 parrallel or mirror-imaged curvey wooden/steel/alu'(?) Joined sides to it's chasis. top, bottom, front & back were all non' parralel, sounds imposs' or a mess but far from it.
& the other D-amp that amazed the other consistent A/AB amp preferer was also a Hypex but a 1-off model in a plain box, & supplied to him for testing different input /gain interchangable modules, no price or any mentioned plan to produce in any numbers.
Big But, ive noticed for a long time now that very well-liked B&O Ice-power modules from lowish to "As high as you could need powers" of ?-watts were always very much cheaper by far compared to Hypex's N-Core OEM module's prices... (& all of which were priced minus the switch-mode power-supplies they sold you separately) ...of similar wattages to the B&O Ice' modules, plus, those very much cheaper Ice-Power modules had onboard power supplies so wire-up & listen (well, all that i looked at did but maybe all B&O Ice' modules have?)
YES IT’S DESIRED AND SELF POWERED SPEAKERS ARE THE WAY OF THR FUTURE.
Class d has come a long way. What kills me is that high end brands now tote their “own designs “ for top dollar.
They cost nothing, a decade or so ago no audiophile would look at class d. And now they talk about how great it is. I predicted this decades ago lol
I have yet to hear what the high priced companies do to the module to make them better. I understand if it's creating a tube input stage. That may or may not work, but at least that's unique enough to understand and up for debate.
But what do the other companies do to make a class d amplifier better? Do they make their own or alter the module in some special way?
Should power amps be left on 24/7 ?
It will probably decorate the components but I will say you can if you want but it's not recommended
I use and owned all types of amps except Tube. Hypex nCore is best for all round amps
U can go mono block with their modules also they have a seperste module only for HF that pair with the main amp.
Unfortunately people have heard crappy class d amps like tpa or entry level ice modules
One should hear Hypex and Purifi audio’s amps also ice edge series
Anand Shah yes, I’ve used a variety of Hypex amplifiers and they are excellent quality for a good price.
Oh no, you have to have GaN class D. Because we all know Gallium Nitride is the soup du jour. I'm just kidding because class D technology is advancing so quickly it's hard to keep up. I'm sure we will see more advancements soon as well.
Here's a question I'm not sure is fully worthy of a ASK PAUL video, but worthy of clarification nonetheless:
Is timbre pronounced tam-ber or tim-ber? Seems each time I watch an audio or video related video and someone uses "timbre" in a sentence, they pause and add "...tamber / timber..." as I guess they're unsure too. 😟 Let's settle this once and for all, Paul! *THANKS* !!
Personally, I say tam-ber.
I've heard it pronounced tam-ber 90% of the time in the reviews I've watched.
It's tam-ber, as the origin is French. "Tim-ber" is not an accepted alternative pronunciation.
@Fat Rat
You "pique" my interest, but did you "pick" a good example?
Sometimes spelling is a clue, sometimes not.
British "garage" is pronounced like "carriage" while Americans use the French pronunciation. Considering our relative proximities to France, it seems we have our pronunciations reversed.
And how do we reconcile "tear" as in a drop from the tear duct, versus "tear" which we do to paper?
Damn, i do wish sometimes we didn't "change" for the sake of it. Class A, AB and AA were perfect. And if a transistor failed it was easy to sort, try changing a new PWM chip!!
I just got the XTZ Edge Class D ... I’ll say it sounds pretty close, in nature, to my Class AB that costs 12 times more. Class D has come a long way.
Yeah that edge uses ICE modules as well. They are truly incredible pieces of technology, especially for the money. Im still trying to find one of the new 1200w stereo modules to become available to us DIY guys. Right now they seem to only be available to OEM's. Granted I wouldn't be able to design a tube input stage like PS Audio did, which I'm sure makes those new M1200's sound glorious. Can't wait for this pandemic to calm down so I can drive over to PS Audio and give them a listen. I have a Sprout100 and absolutely love it for my Fluance RT85 turntable and Pioneer FS52's. Fantastic little budget system, still can't believe how many quality features they crammed into that little guy.
@@JC-lk3oy ICE and HYPEX amps are taking over. No sonic compromises vs $$$$ amps. Tons of power too.
Me too, I am so impressed.
John Caldes ... just get a PS or Nordost 😬
Fat Rat ... just a power amp. No balanced input. Can be set as a monoblock BUT not in bridge mode. So it’s a mono signal block with 2 sets of outputs. 😬
Two Class D Emotiva PA-1 monoblocks are gracing my stereo system since three months ago. Since 1964 I had been using tubes, and Dynaco, and McIntosh transistorized amps. Right now the Emotiva Class D Monoblocks behave so well, I feel NO need for any change, At All.
I am a technician at a music school, I would say that class D is for Pa sound where quality does not matter, outside systems where wind and background noise disturb the sound, Class D is not so heavy to carry either. Class A and A / B are for headphones / HiFi speakers where you need it to be pure analog.
Well said👍🏼
Class D is great for those who like Sonos and Bose :)
Okay but I feel a hybrid amp is a bit of a cop out on the answer. What about a fully digital amp? - Sprout is all digital isn't it?
It's all class d. But D isn't really "digital."
The consensus by people more knowledgeable than me is that class d doesn't mean, digital.
A few explain that there are aspects of class d amplifiers where one could accurately describe what the amp does to the signal as "digital," but it's not entirely accurate.
Hope that helps a smidge.
Would love to see a PS product with the Purifi amplifier modules
Any experience with Purifi? Thanks.
Who makes an integrated receiver with class A/B amp, sub out, less high-end distortion and plenty of mid-range for electric guitar, vocals and saxophone? I don't know how to find or this search is not something I really want to undertake, period. The Cambridge Audio AXR100 has nice mids, but far too much distortion in the high end (no recording is perfect).
class H vs. class D???
'In my room,in my room'you know who sang that right?
Beach Boys, greetz from Holland 😀
??????
My old vintage AB amps sound meaty compared to D. Ive never heard an Ice edge amp yet. Sounds interesting.
Yep. It's like ridin in your Tesla then jumping in my 69 Z28 and feeling that motor cammin and thumpin or ridin a Honda and riding an old Harley! Hahahahaha. You can add all the spices to grandma's recipe but it will never be as good as grandmas and u can take that to tha bank!
what has been a quality class D option on the mobile audio side? Used to be Blade amps back in the day, but they are now collector items and priced out
Would you comment on SET (Single Ended Triode) vacuum tube amplifiers. It seems to be a cult for low power and kind of high distortion, I don't get it.
Single ended triodes are, by necessity, Class A. The circuit designs are very simple. Class A is by far the best sounding amplifier topology. If it weren't for the limitations of Class A, primarily low power and low efficiency making them run hot, all amps would be Class A. All preamps are Class A.
S.E.T.s have no phase splitter, no crossover distortion and only one amplification device. It is the lone amplification device that makes them low power. They produce distortion primarily in the 2nd order and other even harmonics. Distortion rises with power output, so the more sensitive your speakers, the less distortion they produce, true for most amps. The 2nd harmonic is one octave above the primary frequency, thus it sounds pleasant. Listen to a 12 string guitar, the second strings are tuned at an octave and they sound full and beautiful.
My amps use the 45 tube (I heard someone call the 45 the Stradivarius of tubes), they are two watts per channel, and yes, 99% of the speakers out there need not apply. I built my own. When paired with the right speakers, they produce they most lifelike and beautiful sounds I have ever heard through electronic reproduction. That is why they are worth the trouble.
@@johnlebeau5471
Thank you for that wonderful information.
There is one solid state integrated amp that I have heard about, which reviewers have said sounded much like a S.E.T. amplifier: The Densen DM10 Integrated Amp.
If I remember correctly, they were made in Denmark.
They were discontinued years ago, because they were too expensive for the manufacturer to make. They originally sold for $2,500.00 and are now collector's items.
I am hoping that one day, I can have one, but I doubt it will happen.
@@HareDeLune If you can use a soldering iron, or have the inclination to learn check this out: diyaudiostore.com/collections/amp-camp-amp
Single ended transistor, yes that is possible, about 8 watts per channel and has most of the attributes of a single ended triode, since that is essentially what a transistor is. It looks professionally made when it is finished. I run one of these alongside two S.E.T.s, it powers my "inefficient" (93db/w/m) ribbon tweeters. My other drivers are 105 for the bass and 115 for my midrange horn. The amps are sold out right now, being quite popular, but DIY Audio will email you when they come in if you ask them to. $327 plus shipping, which was kind of expensive if I recall, the chassis come from Italy.
@@johnlebeau5471
Thanks!
I have been getting more interested in the DIY audio scene.
I've been thinking about checking out the amp kits that Nelson Pass sells.
I will give this one a look, too. : D
Edit: Wait, doesn't Nelson Pass run Amp Camp?!
Edit 2: Yep! There you go. Two birds with one weblink. XD
@G Guest Thanks, I built one in 1964, it was maybe 4 watts, mine didn't sound great, but I don't think I had the right speakers. It's hard for me to believe the praise after all these years.
new Marantz Model 30, Class D
I own both. For me i enjoy the class a/b much more. it just has a more musical fuller sound to it. things just sound better to me with it. a good class a/b amp in my opinion just sounds more musical and more powerful and richer. while the class d ice amps i have heard and owned have just not had the umph to music that class a/b has.
Best TH-camr apart your real job, which one you prefer? Ha ha🎉🎉🎉
Mega cool that you stay honest, and don`t Fall for pushing your current product to hard...
I have always preferred Class A/B Class D. Maybe someday class D will reach the wormth and the depth that i get out of class A/B.
Get a class A or AB if you live in a cold climate and need a space heater in your home. Get a class D if you live in a warm climate and you don’t want to heat up the room. 😂
But if that warm climate has a lot of sunshine you can run your class A amp on solar power :-)
@@rw80 Or do the same with a class D and not heat up your room and save on your electricity bill. lol
Still prefer my big 115 pound class ab amp with the first part of those watts driven in class a before switching. My preference would be a good higher powered class a. Nothing,like that liquid presentation, all sorts of details, music just emerges out of nowhere and that huge soundstage 😀
Check out Gato from denmark class D and sweet as honey
he did ask if you could tell the difference though.. Im guessing the answer is yes of course but you didnt really answer that
Putting an audio system together again. It's been many years. Back in the day had a Threshold class A monster. Put off a lot of heat but the sound was amazing. Had Klipsch corner flagship speakers it powered and mcintosh center channel amp for Klipsch flagship center channel. Definitive speakers for the surround sound and M & K sub with Lexicon processor and Threshold Fet 9 E preamp. Remember Pioneer laser disc where it was a thing?...lol How do your amps compare to say Threshold? I like Klipsch speakers but the horns are just too harsh for me on the high end. I prefer electrostatics. Looking at Martin Logan. The definitive speakers sound great technically but I find speakers that are too technical to be cold and sterile sounding. I like sound with soul and feeling but in a good way. I have heard Marantz amps are warm and musical quality but have not heard in person. I like more A to A/B amps. Have an 8 by 10 foot room in my office building where I envision Martin Logan speakers and placed for sweet spot with my leather chair, pre-amp, separate powered sub, and individual 2 channel amp in stereo mode. Mainly for CD and music listening no movies. Thoughts?
Well said Paul tks
In my experience a well-designed Class D amp easily reign superior over a well-designed Class A/B amp. Assuming both are allowed to use superior line conditioners. Superior line conditioning is IMO a requirement (not an accessory) for all components including amps. However, it's especially important for Class D because even though Class D amps are not digital, with their high-speed switching modules will induce a digital-like bi-directional noise. Bi-directional implying that the noise will go back up the AC and then into other components.
For the same reason one should never buy a stereo Class D amp or int. amp where the L&R channels share the same AC inlet. In such cases this bi-directional digital-like noise is shared between channels. And it's far worse with integrated Class D amps because the line stage must borrow AC power from one of the channels which are already sharing this bi-directional noise between both channels and that noise is passed to the line stage and then amplified.
Not so with Class D monoblock amps with superior bi-directional filtering line conditioners dedicated to each monoblock. In this config, well-designed Class D monoblock amps should be able to hold their own and then some against most any Class A/B amp. But only in this monoblock + superior line condtioners configuration.
Everything you're saying is true, and you can show the difference in crosstalk in measurements, but I doubt it's audible on good Class D designs, like those from Hypex or the latest ICEpower, or Purifi.
@@ericfranke1637 Thanks, Eric. My current monoblock Class D amps use ICEpower boards. Another Class D pair 10 years ago did not. Both behaved roughly the same when experimenting. with this bi-directional-digital-like noise The bi-directional-digital-like noise shared between L&R channels is definitely audible but not the end of the world. But any such audible noise is enough to remove Class D amps sharing same AC from being a contender with well-designed Class A/B amps that exhibit no such noise.
On the other hand, a high-powered 600wpc Class D integrated amp sharing this noise between L&R channels and then the active gain stage borrowing power from one channel and noise from both channels where the signal is then amplified and well, I'd prefer to find another hobby as it was fairly intolerable.
For music class AB and movies class D
I'm in the same camp as you Paul; comparing side-by-side, Class AB all day long. That said, when working live sound, weight is a consideration as a small production company like me. If I ran Class AB amplifiers in place of my class Ds, my amplifier rack would weigh over 300lbs. The one I tote around weighs less than 100lbs. I frequently get complimented on the sound at events I mix, so Class D really can't be that bad. Lots of people have this belief Class Ds have no bottom end; I use Class D's for the whole system, and the subs I have, hit as hard and go as low as they ever did before.
Modern and new D all the way.
If yer gonna 'stay safe in yer little room', then Paul is good company to have. : )
You are the bob ross of car audio
Man...i don't understand one effing bit of all these comments!!!!
I have the +-75 volt power supply,10 amps,thinking of buying an el chepo 500 watt D module...
Question...is a clss D amp,say 200 rms , as good,better or worse than a classical amp ? (ab,or whatever you call it, i have a bridged 200 w Rotel, for 25 years, with added heat sinks, driving 15 inchers, 4 ohms love it, almost like being there).
What is your Fav when you compare Class A to A/B ?
D for subwoofers, AB, or Class A for high fidelity.
For me class-d sounds too polite and digital, whereas AB is more real and powerful. But I prefer class A on a top level because it feels like the handbrake is completely off compared to D and a bit to AB.
Same lol
Polite? 🙄
I warned up an apple pie on my NAD. So AB does have advantages over D.
I have a BOSS katana with an AB power amp it's so loud for solid state