0:00 - 4:00 Intro 4:00 What is The Passion translation (TPT)? 6:00 What are good standards/practices for Biblical interpretation/translation? 8:50 How does TPT measure up to the above? 11:15 Does TPT change the original meaning of the Bible? 14:30 Might this translation create a cult? Does it compromise the gospel? 17:20 Qualifications behind TPT reviewers Mike Wagner has hired. 19:20 Why did Brian Simmons translate it? What is his expertise/credentialing? 22:20 Why is TPT endorsed by some charismatics/scholars? 27:15 How TPT is/was done. Aramaic? 34:30 The need for the oversight of a diverse community of translators/reviewers. 37:15 Chart on TPT’s hyper-charismatic terminology 43:00 “TPT is just modern language”; valid argument? 45:20 TPT of “Christ” issue; heresy? 53:00 How is Brian Simmon’s marketing TPT and receiving criticism? 56:30 TPT compared to the Message Bible 58:00 Problematic verses/translations in TPT
I skipped on up to Problematic verses, and I don't know what you consider "heretical", *but that's heretical.* He literally (!) CHANGED THE WORD OF GOD (Holy Ghost) because he *did not like it.* Dear God! That's Luther-level "wishing he could throw" [whatever epistles he didn't like, St. James or Revelation) into the fire. I love St. Jerome (sorry): any "issues" people drum up, you can't say St. Jerome had "bad will". Most early scribes (as you yourself have said in a prior series I can't find anymore) were literally "religiously careful" to not change the Sacred Texts. (Angry Jews who felt stilted by God don't count: they MEANT to go gnostic and introduce errors) But whether you or I "care" about submission to husbands, no one of GOOD WILL would ever dare CHANGE the words! On purpose! That's like trying to "give God a hand" and God does NOT need "a hand". Remember that guy who desired to 'help' keep the Ark from falling and got STRUCK BY GOD TO DIE for it. (Oza, I think "Uzziah" in "modern translations", and maybe the understanding of the passage isn't directly a matter of salvation, but the penitent can possibly get a decent idea of how much "help" God needs from people? Maybe?) Just that minute I heard of the "correction" showed this guy who wrote a new bible has *no good will.* I can't listen beyond this point (I've heard all I need to; never would have heard of this edition if it weren't for this video). But you seem so nice - call a spade a spade, and not "a little iffy" when he is damned! (By his own actions.) We can't call evil "good" and vice versa. De fide. We can't. This translation or version has NO PART in any Christian mindset besides "evil heresy". As Biden would say, "C'mon maaaan!" (chuckle a bit here please).
2 Disclaimers: 1. I really love the guys from The Remnant Radio. Not only do I love their hearts, I love what they are trying to do with their YT channel. But I need to add a caution to those watching some of their stuff. They sometimes interview people they don’t agree with and they are very gracious about it. Those are not bad things but at times they have guests who share strange or concerning things or who are generally not safe, in my opinion, and in those interviews you don’t always see proper pushback on the “concerning things”. If you check out their content I only caution you to be aware that they have a variety of guests with a variety of theological views, some of whom are great and some of whom are concerning to me. 2. If you see this video skip a couple times it’s just because the recording glitched a couple times. Sadly, we don’t have that footage. But don’t worry, I’m going to be sharing a lot more info soon from The Passion Project and you’ll be getting interviews with top scholars I have hired to review the work. In fact, you’ll start seeing those on my channel in December. :)
I'm not fully joking when I say the Remnant Radio guys are my favorite heretics. Kinda like Michael Brown--they do so much good, but also have so much bad. I don't know what to do with them, really. But their audience definitely needed to hear from you!
Are you referring to the Todd White stuff? I think if people watch it they will know they aren't defending him, and that being said I would prefer the Church in general wouldn't become a shut in to not engaging with people with differing viewpoints.
@@storyofscripture I haven’t watched all the Todd White stuff. I’m waiting for the full interview to drop before I watch and decide what to think about it.
@@storyofscripture They actually have lots of ties to Bethel and a number of NAR tainted groups. They were feeding Todd White correct doctrine every time he slid off into heresy during the interview. It was a car wreck. Todd White is a wolf and a snake. Tim Mackie denies substitutionary penal atonement.
@Arminius I’ve only read that they associate with people in the NAR and Chan could be leaning that way. Brown was recently called an apostle by Che Ahn and to my knowledge hasn’t cleared it up.
Biblical honesty is the name of the game. If one finds oneself imposing one's interpretation into the Bible, chances are, your going the wrong way. There are verses hard to swallow, but they speak the truth & that's what really matters. Let the Bible speak for itself 😉👍
Yes, God's word should not catapult our behavior into outright slander of the brethren. Mike DID NOT bother to talk to Brian Simmons on the seemingly contradictory elements of his testimony. Mike slandered Brian Simmons out of his own cowardice and his own phobia of "NAR."
Mike's phobia of the supernatural is due to his minimalist orientation.. Unrighteous phobia is not passion. Mike's hand-picked choices of critics carefully avoid any friendly opinions of this translation. Some would call this cowardly and dishonest.
Any time anyone makes some interpretation (assumedly correct) of the Bible, we are "transforming" it. Any time you discuss the Bible, you are making your own version or translation, and that's to be expected. I don't see how the TPT is any different, as long as it's understood that the purpose is not to study as much as understanding.
I've a year ago (and months before that) appealed for the exclusion of the Passion by youversion multiple times, only vague answers, till I found out the founder is deep into the hyper charismatic movement. The chance that they will change is not impossible but will need prayer! As such I do not suggest that app anymore to others, better use the blue letter bible app!
I talked to a couple brothers at my church about their usage of the passion translation. I tried to bring it up gracefully to give them their reasoning. My inquiries didn’t seem to have made them change their mind. So I’m in a little predicament. For now, I will be in the back monitoring my church just in case they slip in doctrinal understanding, for their sake.
You attempted to help them , , that's all you can do ... The monitoring is a wise idea ... That is being a watchman on the wall ... God Bless your efforts
Your thoughtful commentary and especially your self control is to be commended!🧐🥲 Talking about this “translation “requires great patience. Awesome interview.
Just had a small point of my NAR raising blown up - thank you! I often heard that Christians meant “little Christs” as well as “followers of Christ”. The latter ONLY is true, the former is a part of the ‘little gods doctrine.’
The Suffix "ian" in the Latin actually means "out of" or "From" / relation to, to be like. Christ-ian. "Out of Christ" or "From Christ" / Like Christ or a portion of the whole. Corinth-ian: "Out of Corinth" or "From Corinth / a person or culture from or out of Corinth, One person representing the whole of Corinth. If you take the true meaning of the suffix and apply it to "little" then there is some connection as Little is described as a portion of the whole. Being "little Christs" is not heretical just linguistic gymnastics.
Hi Ruth, I've heard some of that kind of talk, but always more carefully worded--"enChristed ones" etc. There's a lot of talk about "the anointing" and that word is mentioned in 1st John, but it's hard to separate the "anointing" from "passion," though there is a scripture which gives us great warning: "For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the joints and marrow, to the dividing of soul and spirit, searching the thoughts and the intents of the heart." Because the guys I hung around knew their Watchman Nee, we were always sensitive to the sneakiness of "soulish" behavior, that is human will, emotion, intellect etc, masquerading as a genuine manifestation of the gifts of the Holy Spirit. A word of wisdom isn't just some wise idea. A word of knowledge is something a human has NO WAY of knowing by themselves. Prophecy doesn't come from our understanding, but as the Spirit give utterance. A miracle is a real miracle. Let the doctors verify it. An so on. We should have no patience for human efforts to "bring him down from heaven," as He is already present. Christ himself did not his "own will but the will of the one who sent" him. We are to endeavor to do the same. I don't know about the Passion "translation." But I knew people like Bill Johnson, who wax on and on about HOW the Holy Spirit works, through this tingly feeling or that, and fail to empower the flock with the same ANOINTING that is potentially present in all for the good of all.
I watched this on their channel and I am so happy you guys did this. A year ago when I looked it was hard to find any real breakdown. I am shocked by this translation and was so alarmed to hear form the pulpit. I love Gods word and this translation hurt my heart!
Same here. It was being preached from the pulpit at my former church and it hurt my heart too. My spirit was vexed every time I would hear it, I would get disgusted, and I would tune out of the teaching completely. I even walked out. The pastors would say that "if you haven't gotten this translation, you need to do so. It is the best!" No one wanted to hear me and I left that community.
@Porter Maxwell I don't understand how making a mistake warrants calling a church a "church". What matters is how that church responds to correction when they are approached :)
Does your "pastor" say things like "God is asking for a special seed" or "I am hearing in the spirit that someone is being called to give a thousand dollar seed"? I wouldn't even confront him, I would leave. Read your Bible. Be blessed.
@@alassmann He is NOT over MY head. How condensing! I'll put my intellect against your's any time. I understand (even if it is hard because most of the time he speaks nonsense) him perfectly - how he teaches a gnostic jesus. (yes I KNOW I used lower case)
@@alassmann Have you ever read the book Against Heresies by Saint Irenaeus of Lyon? In this book, Irenaeus attempts in great detail to explain what the Gnostics of his day believed and taught. One could very much say that it is over many people’s head. So when you comment the things that you did you only prove the fact that what Bill Johnson teaches is actually a Gnostic twist of what the Bible actually teaches.
Bill Johnson is a false prophet, and is directed by Satan. Get rid of The Passion "Treachery", use a real translation, and you will see that Bill is an absolute fraud who "preaches" people straight to hell. Good translations include: ESV, NASB, NKJV, HCSB, and sometimes the NLT and NIV. Stay away from Bethel, Hillsong, Elevation Church, Lakewood, Saddleback, and anyone else these associate with.
Mr. Winger, thank you for videos like these and your grounded teachings. Its reminded me how important it is to know the text we have been blessed with as believers in Christ. I'm struggling right now discerning what's going with regards to gifts of the spirit in my own circles, prophesy & tongues are big ones. So watching these videos, with simple reminders to examine the text has helped immensely.
The hyper-charismatic terms added into The Passion Translation... wow! It’s so fascinating, because I’ve caught on to these words in the past, but never seen them listed out or had them so blatantly pointed out in a project like this. Overall, super well done, Mike. Thank you for your work.
Never knew what the passion translation was but I saw a pocket book of psalms at Ollie's and bought it. When it said passion translation.....it got shoved under a car seat and I intend to return it but I refuse to read it. I want the actual psalms
If you're looking for a good Bible commentary get Tony Evans Study Bible ready good. Throw away the other junk so no one else can get that false Doctrine and read it. Have a blessed day my sister.
Dr. Suess! Haha, that one got me. The Passion simply fits into the same category of warping Scripture, that simple. If you are rewriting the Scripture so as to make it more palatable to your denomination and not so as to properly convey the original meaning....you are perverting Scripture.
Oh, wow. I like what Mike Said about looking up your favorite verse in TPT. Hebrews 4:12 changes a lot. Most notably, it removes reference to the fact that we are judged by God's Word. 12 For we have the living Word of God, which is full of energy,[a] and it pierces more sharply than a two-edged sword.[b] It will even penetrate to the very core of our being where soul and spirit, bone[c] and marrow meet![d] It interprets and reveals the true thoughts and secret motives of our hearts. (TPT) 12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (NIV) From the top, 1, it's much shorter. 2 Living and active does not equal full of energy. The sun is full of energy. 3 Penetrates even to the core of our being is a narrative flourish, at best. 4 Interprets and reveals is not judgement. The Greek word where "judges" is used is "kritikos" and is where the word "critique" derives. KJV and its relatives use something similar to "discern." Now I'm just wondering why none of them seem to just use the word "critiques."
Wow, is this the best they can come up with, love the truth, "we have the living Word of God" Amen, I am passionate about this, not half full, however 100 percent full. Amen, thank you Jesus!
Thank you for your information on the TPT; when I first started reading it, I was like, wow, amazing, but then I found your channel, and then in prayer, this is what I got. Deuteronomy 4:2 (KJV) 2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it," Proverbs 30:6 (KJV) 6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. In Ps. 119:89, His word is forever settled. Jn. 10:35 The scripture cannot be broken, and then see Rev. 22:18. We need to be careful and stay prayerful; the word will guide you into all truth. But here is my last thought on this. Deuteronomy 13:3 (KJV) 3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
What a badly needed video! I must send this to a couple older friends who have been believers for over 50 years and are using this 'translation' for its emotive and flowery language. It is extra-biblical and dangerous.
It’s the dentist “fish tank” soothing method of TH-cam. Sit back, relax, this is only going to hurt a little bit. Suits his voice 🤣. Mike is the compassionate dentist of Bible Study!
Thank you so much for all the work you have done to pass on to us. It's so important that we know the truth about this! It's scary how prevalent it has become and how easily people are deceived and trust what is put in front of them anymore.
This was a great video. In fact, it is rhe most PERFECT Bible lesson video ever. Your kitty put it over the too for best!!! As a "crazy" person who thanks God everyday for my animals, I truly enjoyed that little video of her. I love my Newfoundland girl so very much, but God definitely had me in mind when He spoke life into my Ragdoll cat. He is my very best friend. I'm goofy, I know 🤣 I have never even heard of such a translation. Thank you much for show casing this one. It is a blessing to know where the pitfalls are before you step.
@@CheersToYou007 The idea that prayer is two way conversation is neither taught nor modelled within Scripture. The verse you quote does not mean that christians can "hear" God speak. Rather, it means that when God speaks (through scripture or any other method He wants to), you will respond to it. Unlike the Pharisees that Jesus was speaking to at the time. I struggled a little bit with this, as I was brought up in Charismatic sircles (and am still charismatic). I did some digging when I heard this and found it to be true. Quite helpful when I have never heard God literally speak to me audibly.
@@scottspeig So, you can recognise when God is speaking to you? If not, ask God to speak to you, then take time to daily wait in your prayer closet on your knees so that he will. This is the way I was taught. Many Christians that I know have learned to communicate with God in this same manner.
ThankYou, Mike! this is golden! so much of what is presented today, has great marketing but, poor, poor scholarship. In today’s culture and climate, your expertise and commentary are necessary-- to those desiring the truth!
From the moment I converted it was so important to me to have the most reliable and accurate translation. I didn't want to miss anything of what God had to say to me. I find it difficult that mature Christian mentors of mine are using this 'translation' at the pulpit and sermon preparation. What do you think Mike, if they are using this translation all the time, is the spirit they are being led by a different one?
Quote from TPT website: - Dr. Simmons is a former missionary, linguist, minister, and Bible teacher. As a missionary, he and his wife, Candice, pioneered church plants in Central America. As a linguist, Brian co-translated the Paya-Kuna New Testament for the Paya-Kuna people of Panama. He and his wife have birthed numerous ministries, including a dynamic church in Connecticut. He is also a gifted teacher of the Bible who has authored several books and serves churches worldwide through his teaching ministry. Brian began his biblical studies with The New Tribes Bible Institute and continued on to earn his doctorate with Wagner Leadership Institute, with a specialization on prayer. While Brian serves as the lead translator for The Passion Translation, every book (including the numerous footnotes) is evaluated by respected scholars and editors.
@@jamesford5278 The bible was compiled by men who picked & chose among the manuscripts available to them (probably several hundred) & selected the ones that they thought should be included in the bible. & that agreement was hardly unanimous. Looking to the OT even the major religions can’t agree on how many books should be included. The Jews have 24 books, the Protestants 39, the Catholics 46, & the Eastern Orthodox have 51. Which one is correct? But it’s important to recognize that you don’t have the original texts. You don’t even have copies of the originals. What you have are copies of copies of copies of copies of …. you get the idea. & every time a copy was made there was an opportunity for copyist errors to creep in - especially since in many cases the copyist didn’t speak the language they were copying. (Originally in Hebrew with Aramiac in some parts to Latin to Greek then to English & others language). Worse yet it provided the copyist with an opportunity to amend the text to agree with their own personal orthodoxy. & then come to translation errors. There are plenty.
@@ZackKcaz the biggest difference in the translations today are determined on whether they come from Antioch or Alexandria and it makes a big difference.
@@jamesford5278 the Bible references cited might not be exactly as the Bible you are using. There are MANY Bibles on the market that are used by different Christian sects & all of these sects say that their book, though different, is the word of God. Such Bibles are: The Revised Standard Version 1952 & 1971, New American Standard Bible, the Living Bible, New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures used by Jehovah Witnesses, NIV, RCV & the KJV. I have not found in any of these Bibles where the "New Testament" calls itself the "New Testament," & nowhere does the "Old Testament" call itself the "Old? Testament." Also, the word "Bible" is unknown within the pages of the Bible. In addition to the many different Christian sects & Bibles, i have learned that there are also different men, not Prophets, who founded these sects & are using various interpretations of the Bible and/or man-made doctrines as their creed. I would like to share with you some thoughts that you may not have read or known about the Bible being the word of God. Briefly, let me mention that on September 8, 1957, the Jehovah's witnesses in their "Awake" magazine carried this startling headline - 50000 Errors in the Bible. If you ask a Jehovah's witness about this headline, it may be said that today most of those errors have been eliminated. How many have been eliminated, 5000? Even if 50 remain, would one attribute those errors to God?
Thanks Mike for your grace in presenting this truth, but I think its more insidious in the sense that the passion is a gateway or at least a preaching tool for new age Christianity. Putting us at the centre of the universe where we are the anointed ones and God is in awe of our faith in ourselves. I'm tired of all the new revelations that claim they dont need scholarship or review or scriptural justification. I just want to follow the truth once delivered to the saints. Thanks for your faithfulness and this project. Its important work Mike. God bless you!
I saw the man who wrote the passion translation speak I knew some of the stuff he said was way off base And I browse through the passion and I just had a check in my spirit that this was not accurate further investigation I found out I was right thank you for making this video
Thank you Mike for always using God’s Word to expose the deception of the enemy. I am trying to find a commentary on Habakkuk 2. I encountered a person that is misrepresenting this book of the Bible and taking it out of context to promote new ageism, laws of attraction, and manifestation. Do you have any videos with research against vision boards and new ageism. I have been searching TH-cam but cannot find any on your channel. Have you ever done a video specifically speaking against the misrepresentation of Habakkuk 2:2-3 or know of other sound teachers you could recommend. This person claims to be in the faith and I want to steer them away from this falsehood. I have shared scripture with them, but wanted a few videos to send too. Any assistance is appreciated, thank you very much. May the Lord continue to bless your ministry and your family.
I'm late to the party, but this is soooo good! Thank you, Mike, for your research. And Remnant Radio, y'all made me laugh. But the deception of TPT is no laughing matter. Keep presenting truth!
They will be. Stay tuned to my channel for when they drop. I’ll link them in the description boxes of the interview videos I’m doing. The first ones start coming out in December.
@@MikeWinger soooo looking forward to watch, listen and read what the scholars are saying as that will hopefully bring so much more credibility to those that are resisting the truth, also good to share with leaders in all the churches worldwide. Thank you so very much for doing that. Blessings
I really appreciated this interview. I just got in the passion Bible, but now I will return it. Well, I don’t understand is how you could say all this about the passion Bible, and not be equally as negative about the Message. Every time I read the M 0:06 essage, it seems like he’s changing and only words but meanings. I really like an answer, or if you can point me to somewhere where you go onto this in more depth. I did look at some of your other videos on different translations. I did not see something about the Message.
This was a great convo, and v helpful, but I'm not quite convinced it was done with the sensitivity and decorum assumed per the intro to the vid to the extent it's fruitfulness could be maximised in sharing with people who read and respect TPT. There was a fair amount of sass, sarcasm and jokes, at times verging on mocking, which is fine and can understand how easy it is to allow oneself to present in that way, but I think if you really wanted to reach out and speak to the people reading and respecting TPT, a dedicated vid talking, sensitively, directly to them, rather than about them (as it more came across in this vid, acknowledging that you were talking about TPT and the translator himself rather than the readers in the main, but the point stands, the tone of the presentation at times might put TPT reader's off) would have maximum effect and have more people already convinced of it's weakness being comfortable with sharing it with TPT readers (I'm not that familiar with either of the channels here, having dipped in and out here n there so apologies if either of you have that ground covered)
The first time I read this version, there was something about what I was reading that made feel uneasy about it. When digging a little bit more, I notice some meanings were different to a regular translation.
I just commented on Natalie Grant's FB page regarding TPT, she is offering it as a Christmas gift and a few others pointed out how it is not good translation. Someone even posted one of your videos Pastor Mike. Once I saw the posting I liked it and agreed with my sister that you need to pray and study more on the origins of TPT and know your Bible.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but having itching ears, they shall heap to themselves teachers in accordance with their own lusts.
What I’ve noticed often when pastors use translations/paraphrases such as The Message and The Passion particularly is that they hardly if ever exegete a passage. Often they do and are generally known for topic to text sermons where they usually have a topic they want to preach on and rip dozens of verses out of context to make their sermons sound Biblical. The unsuspecting crowd in a church building think that they’re getting God’s word when the reality is they’re really only getting a message from a guy standing on the stage who has twisted the text to agree with his topic. I’m not completely against topic to text sermons though, for example if you want to do a teaching on the Trinity you would obviously not find that doctrine in just one passage of the Bible but would have to go through several passages to show where God reveals this doctrine through several writers. One of my biggest pet-peeves is when a pastor takes a particular adjective from The Passion or The Message and builds their whole sermon around that adjective and has the crowd repeat it like 30 times throughout the sermon 🤦🏻♂️
That's poor teaching, can't blame a translation for that. There are over 4000 altogether, and yes you are right we need to whole Bibles interpretation so nothing is taken out of context.
I love Remnant Radio. Even if I don't agree with everything and everyone they bring on. I love that the different views on different fringe topics they discuss.
Came here to say this. The whole thing about he says he met an angel named Passion sounds a lot like Joseph Smith and Moroni... the Passion "Translation" has more in common with the so-called "Inspired Version" than any real translation.
“Am I the only one bothered “ by all the hypercharismatic/NAR buzzwords? No, you’re not! Been there, done that. Praise God for opening my eyes to the Truth. Have many friends still in this movement and a number who use TPT. Thanks, all of you, for this discussion.
Honestly, after listening to several of your studies, you’ve never struck me as a Charismatic. At the moment, I am dealing with my upbringing in Pentecostal churches. If you don’t mind my asking, what is the difference with you as a Charismatic and the Hyper-Charismatics?
Every word of God proves true; he is a shield to those who take refuge in him. Do not add to his words, lest he rebuke you and you be found a liar. Proverbs 30:5-6 (and this is in addition to Rev 22:18, which may or may not only be for Revelation, and Deut 4:2 which may specifically refer to the law itself. In any case, the general warning does apply.)
I'm not going to scroll through the comments to see if this was already pointed out...but...during the section including the "chart on TPT's hyper-charismatic terminology" one of the numbers is incorrect. Assuming all of the fields above the "total" row are correct, the total for TPT should be 1533 not 1087...which actually just further makes your point. Enjoying your content.
Love your zealous for God’s word , God knows what is going on , We are all under His provinces , Holy Spirit leads to the Truth and Light ! He is God who is Father in heaven!! Glory to God !!
While I’m thankful these guys gave Mike a platform to critique Brian Simmon’s misrepresentation of Scripture, I’ve seen much of Remnant Radio’s interview with Todd White and other questionable teachers they sing kumbaya with. The thing is, while they’ve enjoyed taking doctrine and theology as their niche for a talk show, folks lives are literally being destroyed by the lies of false teaching. I’m listening to the questions posed to Mike, and it seems like Remnant Radio isn’t too concerned with having a faithful translation. For instance, what’s the point in asking Mike if he thinks the Passion “translation” is going to create a cult? Seems like there was another earlier question that left me wondering about their motivations and concerns as well. Still listening...OF COURSE I should’ve known Dr. Michael Brown was going to factor into this discussion since Mike has interviewed him. I suppose he handled that as well as he could.
regarding the Greek words mentioned, which are normally translated "religious" (adj. θρῆσκος Ja.1.26) and "religion" (n. θρησκεία Ja.1.26-27, Col.2.18, Acts 26.5), and which are assumed to be the words in the NT which "really" mean "religion" / "religious", we must not forget that even *these* definitions in English are "just" translations too, ... just because they are normally translated this way and defined this way in lexicons, that does not mean they are the only possible definitions and translations... they might just as well be rendered "godliness", "worship", "devoutness" / "devout", etc... the traditional renderings are just what they are, they are our "translation traditions"... the word group comes from words for fear and trembling, then worship, reverence, devoutness, religion, ... :)
Never even heard of that one. I'll have to look into it as well in case my pastors at our church start preaching from it too (as they do with the passion and the mess[age])
When Mike is comparing the difference between a committee and one person around 10 minutes. I can just see the argument. "Well what if God inspired that one man to write the whole thing and He didn't do that with the committee." That is a tough person to have a discussion with.
Charismatic, from my understanding, means believing that the spiritual gifts of the Bible still exist today as opposed to a cessationist view that they no longer exist. This is a broad definition and can include gifts from the range of tongues to being able to raise the dead. That word has a bad rep nowadays due to NAR/"Hyper-charismatic" churches like Bethel.
@@ActiuneBaza I actually didn't know that about predestination. My current church is a Church of Christ and they teach Cessationism, but deny predestination. I am relatively new to all of this so I am not sure of all the terms and patterns yet
I read different translations, not just one. I like the TPT and MSG. I don't use them at church but for personal quiet time. I also read NKJ, NIV, NET, NLT and others to get a better picture.
I do exactly the same as you, love the Message and the Passion translations, I prefer the NASB 🙏 Did you know in the 1980s the NIV because it said we have a sinful nature once we are still born again, led thousands if not millions to under-rate what Jesus accomplished. They have since changed this. I'm reading through and listening, so far nothing has convinced myself.
Thank you Jesus Thank you my brothers in Christ I remember I read it I like in the beginning, then I left it I don’t know why I think I felt not comfortable to read it I think the holy spirit work Fake teacher who is pushing this transition too God bless you
I was sad/frustrated to learn the truth about this being a translation vs. a paraphrase. I have used TPT to help those I’ve come alongside to understand harder biblical passages. I never used it as a sole source of scripture but as a stepping stone, because I knew it wasn’t a direct translation, to understanding passages from KJV, NASB, NIV, ESV… I no longer use or reference TPT. Thank you for teaching me about proper *translation* practice
I downloaded the Blue Letter Bible because by touching any verse it shows how other versions are translated. It is the KJV that you are reading. In the third chapter of John if you touch any verse then go into the commentary then scroll down to David Terasaka M.D. He shares the medical aspects of what Jesus went through. It is very graphic. After reading it all I can say is thank you Jesus. I truly am not worthy.
😅 their website offers excerpts you can read a few verses as they’re written in the passion translation. I have very mixed feelings about it because on the one hand I think about all the Bibles that floating around in the world that people are exposed to... for example Gideon’s bibles in the hotel drawer 😂 or the Bibles in jails... some people in jail may have time on their hands and in a bad situation decide to pick up the Bible for the first time. I’m not saying this to judge as I’ve been to jail myself, but many people in there cannot read well, are below the poverty line and don’t have any higher education past high school. I can see how a “translation” like this could be good for someone in that situation because it’s easy to read and introduces the reader to the loving character of God... all that being said, I agree it’s dangerous for those endorsing the passion translation to claim anyone could use it as a primary study source that’s honestly a ridiculous claim. When it comes down to it, it seems the Passion translation, from what I’ve read, is a watered down version of scripture that seems more like a parent retelling a story to their children - we use easy words and make it sound nice and try to dance around the bad parts, knowing we will have to answer the hard questions as they grow up. If people truly want to study scripture to get the answers to those deeper and sometimes hard questions they’re still going to have to go to the source. Obviously we’re not all going to learn Hebrew and koine Greek 😂 but I think if you want to seriously study Gods word you should give great care choosing a primary Bible and I agree with many of the criteria Mike has mentioned in this and previous videos. I’m not against them doing this translation but I do think they should be upfront about what it is - a modern interpretation of the Bible, or an artistic adaptation of the Bible, not so much a “translation”.
Reading God’s word is not about hearing what we WANT to hear but what we NEED to hear. God’s word is extremely beautiful and hopeful and uplifting but only if our EARS have been transformed. Before our heart has been changed, God’s word is meant to change us. We don’t change it.
Pastor Mike, I take umbrage at your insinuation that a few courses from Rosetta Stone isn't enough to prepare me to single handedly put together a Bible translation 🧐! (Just joking 😂)
Now what? Now that we have questions about things do we resemble what any of the translations say? The problem is we don't resemble Jesus as we are called to in any translation. Yes there are groups of believers with ideas that don't line up and over emphasise different things that they shouldn't. Why I don't understand. The question is do we do the same? Do we not resemble who we really are? There are some key verses highlighted. When combined with being a living sacrifice, not doing your plan but God's. When we believe, surrender and live out His will what does it look like? We need to recognise Romans 12 in the version we hold to. All of the main versions have dynamics we should be resembling. Why are we not? 2 Peter 1 are we recognising what we have been given and partaking in it. Daniel 7:27 are we resembling this. Romans 8, do we resemble this? Or do we more resemble Acts 8:16 where they believed and had been baptized, but not baptised in the Holy Spirit yet. I'm not saying these guys are without the Spirit of God, but many even with the Spirit of God resemble those who don't. Whole denominations have built ideas and structure around living in this state of believing, being baptised and not having the Spirit fall on them. What does God want? How does He want to do it? We have to resemble what. If we have the Spirit of God we must live by the Spirit of God and not the flesh as Romans 8 says. Romans 8 has qualifying points. It talks about being in Christ. This isn't for just anyone, it's for those in Christ Jesus. Next it says we must live by the Spirit and not the flesh. It's a choice for those who have the Spirit of God to make. Are we making the right decision? Is our life living by the Spirit of God? Have we received the Spirit of God? If we answered no to any of these questions then we have disqualified ourselves from Romans 8 in any translation. Lots of ideas are going around that don't line up with the need to be in Christ Jesus. In John 14 Jesus talks about abiding in Him. He explains that the Father is going to send the Holy Spirit and that's how this continued abiding was going to happen when Jesus left them. This is the only way and we must live by this. The journey of abiding begins by receiving the Spirit of God. Without the Spirit of God you can't abide. Your abiding, being in Christ, doesn't start until you have the Spirit. If this is not what you are teaching then you are not teaching any version of the Bible. If you are not living this you are not living any version of scripture that God has given. We have to deicide to receive and live by the Spirit. We have to stir up, fan into flame the things the Spirit gives us when we have received them. Yes we don't have these authority, we must receive the Holy Spirit. You see any teaching that says we already have these gifts is wrong. Any teaching saying you already had the Spirit of God when you were born is wrong. Any teaching that says you don't have to receive the Holy Spirit to be in Christ Jesus is wrong. What that looks like and when it happens is debatable, but you must receive. New life is receiving and only starts when you receive. Once you have received then you must live by that glorious Spirit of God. If this isn't happening and what your teaching says it's okay, then you are not teaching the bible. Let's recognise what God is saying. The bible is full of the glory of Jesus. Let's be to His glory
When speaking of translations one not only has to understand the lexicon but also the idiomatic expressions. I studied linguistics and can speak five languages and read two of them. But to make exact translations as a single person is a little risky. When I read the Latin vulgate and the Koine Greek, I notice that Jerome ‘s translation of the Greek doesn’t bring across the exact meaning of the translation. This is the problem when a single person does the translation. It has happened to me when I have translated English to Italian even if Italian is my maternal language and I have spoken English since I was seven years old and grew up with speaking both languages.
You are probably better educated than the speakers above, who are denouncing words like promise, or religious, Jesus was totally against the religiousity of his day.
For newer Christians I've started recommending the Berean Study Bible because its cross references are top notch. Just enough, neither too many nor too little. I think Mike uses ESV mostly???? Their study bible is totally fine. The Apologetics Study Bible is good for answering questions that are common, too.
Years ago I got hold of a NWT and just read a few verses. My favorite to use against them is Romans 10:9 and 10:12. The conversation goes something like: Using your translation of the Bible, 10:9 says If you confess Jesus as Lord (Kurios) you will be saved. 10:12 says whosoever calls on the name of Jehovah (Kurios) shall be saved. So...your translation says Jesus and Jehovah are Kurios (supreme in authority) and, as we all know, no authority is greater than God. So, your version of the Bible really does say Jesus and Jehovah are the same. Right? (Hint: They really don't like that conversation point.)
Mr Winger / Remanent Radio, what do you think of the You Tube show, The Chosen? Is it being extra Biblical when it comes to the portrayal of Jesus? I've been watching it, it's really ministered to me, and made Jesus more real.
![[TH] FS vs BME - VCT Ascension Pacific - Lower Bracket Final](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wnygqsR2Fig/mqdefault.jpg)
0:00 - 4:00 Intro
4:00 What is The Passion translation (TPT)?
6:00 What are good standards/practices for Biblical interpretation/translation?
8:50 How does TPT measure up to the above?
11:15 Does TPT change the original meaning of the Bible?
14:30 Might this translation create a cult? Does it compromise the gospel?
17:20 Qualifications behind TPT reviewers Mike Wagner has hired.
19:20 Why did Brian Simmons translate it? What is his expertise/credentialing?
22:20 Why is TPT endorsed by some charismatics/scholars?
27:15 How TPT is/was done. Aramaic?
34:30 The need for the oversight of a diverse community of translators/reviewers.
37:15 Chart on TPT’s hyper-charismatic terminology
43:00 “TPT is just modern language”; valid argument?
45:20 TPT of “Christ” issue; heresy?
53:00 How is Brian Simmon’s marketing TPT and receiving criticism?
56:30 TPT compared to the Message Bible
58:00 Problematic verses/translations in TPT
This is awesome! Thank you Branden!
@@MikeWinger Absolutely pastor Mike, keep running well!
WOW! Thank you
What's your guy's thoughts on the TLV translation? Tree of Life translation?
Thanks
I skipped on up to Problematic verses, and I don't know what you consider "heretical", *but that's heretical.* He literally (!) CHANGED THE WORD OF GOD (Holy Ghost) because he *did not like it.* Dear God! That's Luther-level "wishing he could throw" [whatever epistles he didn't like, St. James or Revelation) into the fire. I love St. Jerome (sorry): any "issues" people drum up, you can't say St. Jerome had "bad will". Most early scribes (as you yourself have said in a prior series I can't find anymore) were literally "religiously careful" to not change the Sacred Texts. (Angry Jews who felt stilted by God don't count: they MEANT to go gnostic and introduce errors) But whether you or I "care" about submission to husbands, no one of GOOD WILL would ever dare CHANGE the words! On purpose! That's like trying to "give God a hand" and God does NOT need "a hand".
Remember that guy who desired to 'help' keep the Ark from falling and got STRUCK BY GOD TO DIE for it. (Oza, I think "Uzziah" in "modern translations", and maybe the understanding of the passage isn't directly a matter of salvation, but the penitent can possibly get a decent idea of how much "help" God needs from people? Maybe?)
Just that minute I heard of the "correction" showed this guy who wrote a new bible has *no good will.* I can't listen beyond this point (I've heard all I need to; never would have heard of this edition if it weren't for this video). But you seem so nice - call a spade a spade, and not "a little iffy" when he is damned! (By his own actions.) We can't call evil "good" and vice versa. De fide. We can't. This translation or version has NO PART in any Christian mindset besides "evil heresy". As Biden would say, "C'mon maaaan!" (chuckle a bit here please).
2 Disclaimers:
1. I really love the guys from The Remnant Radio. Not only do I love their hearts, I love what they are trying to do with their YT channel. But I need to add a caution to those watching some of their stuff. They sometimes interview people they don’t agree with and they are very gracious about it. Those are not bad things but at times they have guests who share strange or concerning things or who are generally not safe, in my opinion, and in those interviews you don’t always see proper pushback on the “concerning things”. If you check out their content I only caution you to be aware that they have a variety of guests with a variety of theological views, some of whom are great and some of whom are concerning to me.
2. If you see this video skip a couple times it’s just because the recording glitched a couple times. Sadly, we don’t have that footage. But don’t worry, I’m going to be sharing a lot more info soon from The Passion Project and you’ll be getting interviews with top scholars I have hired to review the work. In fact, you’ll start seeing those on my channel in December. :)
I so agree on point #1!
I'm not fully joking when I say the Remnant Radio guys are my favorite heretics. Kinda like Michael Brown--they do so much good, but also have so much bad. I don't know what to do with them, really. But their audience definitely needed to hear from you!
Are you referring to the Todd White stuff? I think if people watch it they will know they aren't defending him, and that being said I would prefer the Church in general wouldn't become a shut in to not engaging with people with differing viewpoints.
@@storyofscripture I haven’t watched all the Todd White stuff. I’m waiting for the full interview to drop before I watch and decide what to think about it.
@@storyofscripture They actually have lots of ties to Bethel and a number of NAR tainted groups.
They were feeding Todd White correct doctrine every time he slid off into heresy during the interview. It was a car wreck. Todd White is a wolf and a snake.
Tim Mackie denies substitutionary penal atonement.
NAR pastors: People keep saying that what we are preaching is not biblical. Brian Simmons: I can fix that!
Exactly what the Jehovahs Witnesses did!
Good one!!!
@Arminius can you give some examples of people who are labeled NAR but aren’t?
@Arminius Jacob Arminius was no better than John Calvin, both men taught apostacy, in one form or another~!
@Arminius I’ve only read that they associate with people in the NAR and Chan could be leaning that way. Brown was recently called an apostle by Che Ahn and to my knowledge hasn’t cleared it up.
God's Word should change us, not the other way around.
This comment is right on!
Biblical honesty is the name of the game. If one finds oneself imposing one's interpretation into the Bible, chances are, your going the wrong way. There are verses hard to swallow, but they speak the truth & that's what really matters. Let the Bible speak for itself 😉👍
Amen 🕊
Yes, God's word should not catapult our behavior into outright slander of the brethren. Mike DID NOT bother to talk to Brian Simmons on the seemingly contradictory elements of his testimony. Mike slandered Brian Simmons out of his own cowardice and his own phobia of "NAR."
Oh, leave it to a sister to drop the bomb on us. Well put!
I love your passion for chucking The Passion!
I see what you did there
Mike's phobia of the supernatural is due to his minimalist orientation.. Unrighteous phobia is not passion. Mike's hand-picked choices of critics carefully avoid any friendly opinions of this translation. Some would call this cowardly and dishonest.
“No invention should be taking place, just preservation. We're just translating it, we're not transforming it.”
Any time anyone makes some interpretation (assumedly correct) of the Bible, we are "transforming" it. Any time you discuss the Bible, you are making your own version or translation, and that's to be expected. I don't see how the TPT is any different, as long as it's understood that the purpose is not to study as much as understanding.
@@MrCoolerMan1 TPT adds a lot of things that were not in the original text thus, adding our own theology to the Scriptures.
@@IrorogheneOdafejirorosua Hey:) So do any commentaries on the Bible, though, no?
@@MrCoolerMan1 Please can you rephrase the question? It's not clear.
@@IrorogheneOdafejirorosua Sure, what I mean is that any commentaries that interpret or explain the Bible do the same thing, no?
I am "continuationist" too, more classical Pentecostal, but I am also such a theology geek. In that light, this conversation was very helpful, thanks.
Your cat looks like the most spoiled house pet under heaven lol
So beautiful 🥰 kitty
You haven’t met my little white Chihuahua, who gets to ride in his very own stroller... 😊💕💕. And his bunny...a Terrie/Chi mix gets lots of cuddles.
I never notice the kitties... someone always has to point them out to me.
+ 1 for "under heaven," though.
As she should be.
I’m seeing in several places; books I’m reading, articles, bible apps etc where the Passion is considered legit. So scary.
If you recall could you share some examples for me to be aware of? Thank you Seeking The Kingdom!
The simple listing of it as a translation in BibleGateway is concerning... but they list other heretical translations as well.
I've a year ago (and months before that) appealed for the exclusion of the Passion by youversion multiple times, only vague answers, till I found out the founder is deep into the hyper charismatic movement. The chance that they will change is not impossible but will need prayer! As such I do not suggest that app anymore to others, better use the blue letter bible app!
The Seeker Sensitive Emergent Social and Self Improvement Clubs sometimes use it, not just the NAR heretics. :/
@@ruthvansandt9713 was going to mention bible gateway to start.
My quick translation appraisal is John 1.
‘In the beginning, the Living Expression was already there.’
That’s gonna be a no from me.
That's messed up.
Amen. No bueno.
sounds like something the gen z bible would say,lol
Wait what ? For reals 🤔
Lol
I talked to a couple brothers at my church about their usage of the passion translation. I tried to bring it up gracefully to give them their reasoning. My inquiries didn’t seem to have made them change their mind. So I’m in a little predicament.
For now, I will be in the back monitoring my church just in case they slip in doctrinal understanding, for their sake.
You attempted to help them , , that's all you can do ... The monitoring is a wise idea ... That is being a watchman on the wall ... God Bless your efforts
Your thoughtful commentary and especially your self control is to be commended!🧐🥲 Talking about this “translation “requires great patience. Awesome interview.
Just had a small point of my NAR raising blown up - thank you! I often heard that Christians meant “little Christs” as well as “followers of Christ”. The latter ONLY is true, the former is a part of the ‘little gods doctrine.’
It means "belonging to Christ", I believe. I actually bashed a study bible on my channel for pushing the "little Christs" concept.
The Suffix "ian" in the Latin actually means "out of" or "From" / relation to, to be like.
Christ-ian. "Out of Christ" or "From Christ" / Like Christ or a portion of the whole.
Corinth-ian: "Out of Corinth" or "From Corinth / a person or culture from or out of Corinth,
One person representing the whole of Corinth.
If you take the true meaning of the suffix and apply it to "little" then there is some connection as Little is described as a portion of the whole. Being "little Christs" is not heretical just linguistic gymnastics.
Hi Ruth, I've heard some of that kind of talk, but always more carefully worded--"enChristed ones" etc. There's a lot of talk about "the anointing" and that word is mentioned in 1st John, but it's hard to separate the "anointing" from "passion," though there is a scripture which gives us great warning:
"For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the joints and marrow, to the dividing of soul and spirit, searching the thoughts and the intents of the heart."
Because the guys I hung around knew their Watchman Nee, we were always sensitive to the sneakiness of "soulish" behavior, that is human will, emotion, intellect etc, masquerading as a genuine manifestation of the gifts of the Holy Spirit. A word of wisdom isn't just some wise idea. A word of knowledge is something a human has NO WAY of knowing by themselves. Prophecy doesn't come from our understanding, but as the Spirit give utterance. A miracle is a real miracle. Let the doctors verify it. An so on.
We should have no patience for human efforts to "bring him down from heaven," as He is already present. Christ himself did not his "own will but the will of the one who sent" him. We are to endeavor to do the same.
I don't know about the Passion "translation." But I knew people like Bill Johnson, who wax on and on about HOW the Holy Spirit works, through this tingly feeling or that, and fail to empower the flock with the same ANOINTING that is potentially present in all for the good of all.
I watched this on their channel and I am so happy you guys did this. A year ago when I looked it was hard to find any real breakdown. I am shocked by this translation and was so alarmed to hear form the pulpit. I love Gods word and this translation hurt my heart!
Same here. It was being preached from the pulpit at my former church and it hurt my heart too. My spirit was vexed every time I would hear it, I would get disgusted, and I would tune out of the teaching completely. I even walked out. The pastors would say that "if you haven't gotten this translation, you need to do so. It is the best!" No one wanted to hear me and I left that community.
Thanks Mike for this my pastor uses tpt pray for me as I carefully approach him so that that I don't come across as one of them people 😂😂😂
As a woman, I can ask questions as if I'm stupid. ;) That tends to work well. "I saw here this....is that what we believe here?"
What do we burn besides witches?
@Porter Maxwell I don't understand how making a mistake warrants calling a church a "church". What matters is how that church responds to correction when they are approached :)
@Scott Helms Are you thinking what I'm thinking? See if that pastor weighs the same as a duck!
Does your "pastor" say things like "God is asking for a special seed" or "I am hearing in the spirit that someone is being called to give a thousand dollar seed"? I wouldn't even confront him, I would leave. Read your Bible. Be blessed.
If Bill Johnson says it is good, that causes me to run quickly away from it.
Yeah he teaches over your head
@@alassmann He is NOT over MY head. How condensing! I'll put my intellect against your's any time. I understand (even if it is hard because most of the time he speaks nonsense) him perfectly - how he teaches a gnostic jesus. (yes I KNOW I used lower case)
@@alassmann Have you ever read the book Against Heresies by Saint Irenaeus of Lyon? In this book, Irenaeus attempts in great detail to explain what the Gnostics of his day believed and taught. One could very much say that it is over many people’s head. So when you comment the things that you did you only prove the fact that what Bill Johnson teaches is actually a Gnostic twist of what the Bible actually teaches.
You mean your church doesn’t summon glory clouds 🤣. Yes, Bill Johnson is a heretic wolf in sheep’s clothing.
Bill Johnson is a false prophet, and is directed by Satan. Get rid of The Passion "Treachery", use a real translation, and you will see that Bill is an absolute fraud who "preaches" people straight to hell.
Good translations include: ESV, NASB, NKJV, HCSB, and sometimes the NLT and NIV. Stay away from Bethel, Hillsong, Elevation Church, Lakewood, Saddleback, and anyone else these associate with.
Mr. Winger, thank you for videos like these and your grounded teachings. Its reminded me how important it is to know the text we have been blessed with as believers in Christ. I'm struggling right now discerning what's going with regards to gifts of the spirit in my own circles, prophesy & tongues are big ones. So watching these videos, with simple reminders to examine the text has helped immensely.
The hyper-charismatic terms added into The Passion Translation... wow! It’s so fascinating, because I’ve caught on to these words in the past, but never seen them listed out or had them so blatantly pointed out in a project like this. Overall, super well done, Mike. Thank you for your work.
Never knew what the passion translation was but I saw a pocket book of psalms at Ollie's and bought it. When it said passion translation.....it got shoved under a car seat and I intend to return it but I refuse to read it. I want the actual psalms
If you're looking for a good Bible commentary get Tony Evans Study Bible ready good. Throw away the other junk so no one else can get that false Doctrine and read it. Have a blessed day my sister.
Dr. Suess!
Haha, that one got me.
The Passion simply fits into the same category of warping Scripture, that simple.
If you are rewriting the Scripture so as to make it more palatable to your denomination and not so as to properly convey the original meaning....you are perverting Scripture.
Oh, wow. I like what Mike Said about looking up your favorite verse in TPT. Hebrews 4:12 changes a lot. Most notably, it removes reference to the fact that we are judged by God's Word.
12 For we have the living Word of God, which is full of energy,[a] and it pierces more sharply than a two-edged sword.[b] It will even penetrate to the very core of our being where soul and spirit, bone[c] and marrow meet![d] It interprets and reveals the true thoughts and secret motives of our hearts. (TPT)
12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (NIV)
From the top, 1, it's much shorter. 2 Living and active does not equal full of energy. The sun is full of energy. 3 Penetrates even to the core of our being is a narrative flourish, at best. 4 Interprets and reveals is not judgement.
The Greek word where "judges" is used is "kritikos" and is where the word "critique" derives. KJV and its relatives use something similar to "discern."
Now I'm just wondering why none of them seem to just use the word "critiques."
Wow, is this the best they can come up with, love the truth, "we have the living Word of God" Amen, I am passionate about this, not half full, however 100 percent full. Amen, thank you Jesus!
Thank you for your information on the TPT; when I first started reading it, I was like, wow, amazing, but then I found your channel, and then in prayer, this is what I got. Deuteronomy 4:2 (KJV)
2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it," Proverbs 30:6 (KJV)
6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. In Ps. 119:89, His word is forever settled. Jn. 10:35 The scripture cannot be broken, and then see Rev. 22:18. We need to be careful and stay prayerful; the word will guide you into all truth. But here is my last thought on this.
Deuteronomy 13:3 (KJV)
3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
I got the DC Talk reference. I think I'm the only one that laughed. Lol. I truly enjoy your teachings. They have helped me in my Christian growth.
You aren't the only person who caught and giggled at the DC Talk reference. Jesus Freak is an iconic jam.
I saw Toby Mac open for Pope Benedict (yes really, and Kelly Clarkson also performed for some reason?) with my youth group when I was like 14.
What a badly needed video! I must send this to a couple older friends who have been believers for over 50 years and are using this 'translation' for its emotive and flowery language. It is extra-biblical and dangerous.
Lots of Love from India ❤️
I Love your videos soo much and I watch them everyday
You izza bad mamma jamma Mike!
We LOVE you, appreciate you and are grateful for you! Keep it coming!
I already saw your interview with them, but I listened to it again here. Tomorrow is thanksgiving with the family..... Great, great analysis Ps. Mike!
Everybody has blue light bookcases and I have no blue light bookcase! Do we need this to be scholarly? I need answers 😄
This is the way
Loool. It's because red light makes you look evil, yellow turns your skin magenta, and purple just isn't popular.
It’s the dentist “fish tank” soothing method of TH-cam. Sit back, relax, this is only going to hurt a little bit. Suits his voice 🤣. Mike is the compassionate dentist of Bible Study!
It makes you so fancy!
😂🤣😂
Thank you so much for all the work you have done to pass on to us. It's so important that we know the truth about this! It's scary how prevalent it has become and how easily people are deceived and trust what is put in front of them anymore.
This was a great video. In fact, it is rhe most PERFECT Bible lesson video ever. Your kitty put it over the too for best!!! As a "crazy" person who thanks God everyday for my animals, I truly enjoyed that little video of her. I love my Newfoundland girl so very much, but God definitely had me in mind when He spoke life into my Ragdoll cat. He is my very best friend. I'm goofy, I know 🤣 I have never even heard of such a translation. Thank you much for show casing this one. It is a blessing to know where the pitfalls are before you step.
Develop a personal fellowship with Christ daily so you’ll know truth from error.
Romans 12:2
John 16:13
Exactly. God speaks. "My sheep hear my voice." Prayer suppose to be a two way conversation between us and God.
@@CheersToYou007
Amen throughout the day and through His Word.
@@CheersToYou007 The idea that prayer is two way conversation is neither taught nor modelled within Scripture. The verse you quote does not mean that christians can "hear" God speak. Rather, it means that when God speaks (through scripture or any other method He wants to), you will respond to it. Unlike the Pharisees that Jesus was speaking to at the time.
I struggled a little bit with this, as I was brought up in Charismatic sircles (and am still charismatic). I did some digging when I heard this and found it to be true. Quite helpful when I have never heard God literally speak to me audibly.
@@scottspeig There is truth to what you're saying.
@@scottspeig So, you can recognise when God is speaking to you? If not, ask God to speak to you, then take time to daily wait in your prayer closet on your knees so that he will. This is the way I was taught. Many Christians that I know have learned to communicate with God in this same manner.
ThankYou, Mike! this is golden! so much of what is presented today, has great marketing but, poor, poor scholarship. In today’s culture and climate, your expertise and commentary are necessary-- to those desiring the truth!
From the moment I converted it was so important to me to have the most reliable and accurate translation. I didn't want to miss anything of what God had to say to me. I find it difficult that mature Christian mentors of mine are using this 'translation' at the pulpit and sermon preparation. What do you think Mike, if they are using this translation all the time, is the spirit they are being led by a different one?
I really appreciate the way you are presenting this with so much respect you are really a man of God. Enjoying your videos!
Do hope we see Mike Winger on Dr. Brown’s YT channel when he’s ready. Should be quite interesting!
Quote from TPT website: - Dr. Simmons is a former missionary, linguist, minister, and Bible teacher. As a missionary, he and his wife, Candice, pioneered church plants in Central America. As a linguist, Brian co-translated the Paya-Kuna New Testament for the Paya-Kuna people of Panama. He and his wife have birthed numerous ministries, including a dynamic church in Connecticut. He is also a gifted teacher of the Bible who has authored several books and serves churches worldwide through his teaching ministry. Brian began his biblical studies with The New Tribes Bible Institute and continued on to earn his doctorate with Wagner Leadership Institute, with a specialization on prayer. While Brian serves as the lead translator for The Passion Translation, every book (including the numerous footnotes) is evaluated by respected scholars and editors.
Pretty good resume I think.
I am a Messianic Believer and I totally like your comparing TPT as more like a Targum (a bad one albeit) than even a paraphrase.
That's why I use the King James, no need to change words to try to make me feel better with modern versions
Has been translated & revised numerous times. I can't believe a God inspired the bible if He didn't even preserve it
@@ZackKcaz I believe it says exactly what was meant to be said for an english speaking person to understand fully God's word.
@@jamesford5278 The bible was compiled by men who picked & chose among the manuscripts available to them (probably several hundred) & selected the ones that they thought should be included in the bible. & that agreement was hardly unanimous. Looking to the OT even the major religions can’t agree on how many books should be included. The Jews have 24 books, the Protestants 39, the Catholics 46, & the Eastern Orthodox have 51. Which one is correct?
But it’s important to recognize that you don’t have the original texts. You don’t even have copies of the originals. What you have are copies of copies of copies of copies of …. you get the idea. & every time a copy was made there was an opportunity for copyist errors to creep in - especially since in many cases the copyist didn’t speak the language they were copying. (Originally in Hebrew with Aramiac in some parts to Latin to Greek then to English & others language). Worse yet it provided the copyist with an opportunity to amend the text to agree with their own personal orthodoxy. & then come to translation errors. There are plenty.
@@ZackKcaz the biggest difference in the translations today are determined on whether they come from Antioch or Alexandria and it makes a big difference.
@@jamesford5278 the Bible references cited might not be exactly as the Bible you are using. There are MANY Bibles on the market that are used by different Christian sects & all of these sects say that their book, though different, is the word of God. Such Bibles are: The Revised Standard Version 1952 & 1971, New American Standard Bible, the Living Bible, New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures used by Jehovah Witnesses, NIV, RCV & the KJV. I have not found in any of these Bibles where the "New Testament" calls itself the "New Testament," & nowhere does the "Old Testament" call itself the "Old? Testament." Also, the word "Bible" is unknown within the pages of the Bible.
In addition to the many different Christian sects & Bibles, i have learned that there are also different men, not Prophets, who founded these sects & are using various interpretations of the Bible and/or man-made doctrines as their creed.
I would like to share with you some thoughts that you may not have read or known about the Bible being the word of God. Briefly, let me mention that on September 8, 1957, the Jehovah's witnesses in their "Awake" magazine carried this startling headline - 50000 Errors in the Bible. If you ask a Jehovah's witness about this headline, it may be said that today most of those errors have been eliminated. How many have been eliminated, 5000? Even if 50 remain, would one attribute those errors to God?
Thanks Mike for your grace in presenting this truth, but I think its more insidious in the sense that the passion is a gateway or at least a preaching tool for new age Christianity. Putting us at the centre of the universe where we are the anointed ones and God is in awe of our faith in ourselves. I'm tired of all the new revelations that claim they dont need scholarship or review or scriptural justification. I just want to follow the truth once delivered to the saints.
Thanks for your faithfulness and this project. Its important work Mike. God bless you!
I saw the man who wrote the passion translation speak I knew some of the stuff he said was way off base And I browse through the passion and I just had a check in my spirit that this was not accurate further investigation I found out I was right thank you for making this video
Thank you Mike for always using God’s Word to expose the deception of the enemy. I am trying to find a commentary on Habakkuk 2. I encountered a person that is misrepresenting this book of the Bible and taking it out of context to promote new ageism, laws of attraction, and manifestation. Do you have any videos with research against vision boards and new ageism. I have been searching TH-cam but cannot find any on your channel. Have you ever done a video specifically speaking against the misrepresentation of Habakkuk 2:2-3 or know of other sound teachers you could recommend. This person claims to be in the faith and I want to steer them away from this falsehood. I have shared scripture with them, but wanted a few videos to send too. Any assistance is appreciated, thank you very much. May the Lord continue to bless your ministry and your family.
Doreen Virtue on TH-cam has converted from the New Age to Christianity. If you google her you should find some useful information.
I'm late to the party, but this is soooo good! Thank you, Mike, for your research. And Remnant Radio, y'all made me laugh. But the deception of TPT is no laughing matter. Keep presenting truth!
I hadn't heard the DC Talk song when I took my current handle, but a friend told me about it. It fits ;p
Youngling. ;)
@@toomanymarys7355 I don't listen to CCM generally.
It was a solid album; I don't listen to much CCM but that's one I still go back to.
I took three summary points from this video and included it in my review of the Bible App to request removal of TPT. Let’s hope they follow through.
Great stuff. These articles from the scholars you've hired, are they available anywhere?
They will be. Stay tuned to my channel for when they drop. I’ll link them in the description boxes of the interview videos I’m doing. The first ones start coming out in December.
@@MikeWinger soooo looking forward to watch, listen and read what the scholars are saying as that will hopefully bring so much more credibility to those that are resisting the truth, also good to share with leaders in all the churches worldwide. Thank you so very much for doing that. Blessings
Mike THANK YOU FOR SHOWING US MOXIE, She’s sooo sweet ❤️❤️
Also amazing video thx for this!
"Passion Translation". Literally just a man's passion, lul.
But there are only 7 days in a week.
hi
I really appreciated this interview. I just got in the passion Bible, but now I will return it. Well, I don’t understand is how you could say all this about the passion Bible, and not be equally as negative about the Message. Every time I read the M 0:06 essage, it seems like he’s changing and only words but meanings. I really like an answer, or if you can point me to somewhere where you go onto this in more depth. I did look at some of your other videos on different translations. I did not see something about the Message.
This is absolutely off topic... The editing came out really well in this video.
This was a great convo, and v helpful, but I'm not quite convinced it was done with the sensitivity and decorum assumed per the intro to the vid to the extent it's fruitfulness could be maximised in sharing with people who read and respect TPT. There was a fair amount of sass, sarcasm and jokes, at times verging on mocking, which is fine and can understand how easy it is to allow oneself to present in that way, but I think if you really wanted to reach out and speak to the people reading and respecting TPT, a dedicated vid talking, sensitively, directly to them, rather than about them (as it more came across in this vid, acknowledging that you were talking about TPT and the translator himself rather than the readers in the main, but the point stands, the tone of the presentation at times might put TPT reader's off) would have maximum effect and have more people already convinced of it's weakness being comfortable with sharing it with TPT readers (I'm not that familiar with either of the channels here, having dipped in and out here n there so apologies if either of you have that ground covered)
MOXIE!!!! 😍😍😍
The first time I read this version, there was something about what I was reading that made feel uneasy about it. When digging a little bit more, I notice some meanings were different to a regular translation.
I just commented on Natalie Grant's FB page regarding TPT, she is offering it as a Christmas gift and a few others pointed out how it is not good translation. Someone even posted one of your videos Pastor Mike. Once I saw the posting I liked it and agreed with my sister that you need to pray and study more on the origins of TPT and know your Bible.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but having itching ears, they shall heap to themselves teachers in accordance with their own lusts.
What I’ve noticed often when pastors use translations/paraphrases such as The Message and The Passion particularly is that they hardly if ever exegete a passage. Often they do and are generally known for topic to text sermons where they usually have a topic they want to preach on and rip dozens of verses out of context to make their sermons sound Biblical. The unsuspecting crowd in a church building think that they’re getting God’s word when the reality is they’re really only getting a message from a guy standing on the stage who has twisted the text to agree with his topic. I’m not completely against topic to text sermons though, for example if you want to do a teaching on the Trinity you would obviously not find that doctrine in just one passage of the Bible but would have to go through several passages to show where God reveals this doctrine through several writers. One of my biggest pet-peeves is when a pastor takes a particular adjective from The Passion or The Message and builds their whole sermon around that adjective and has the crowd repeat it like 30 times throughout the sermon 🤦🏻♂️
That's poor teaching, can't blame a translation for that. There are over 4000 altogether, and yes you are right we need to whole Bibles interpretation so nothing is taken out of context.
@@Jayinseasonthe passion and message should never be used
Just to clarify, Dr. Michael Brown says to only use as a secondary version and not as your primary Bible.
What Dr Brown needs to do is sound the alarm 🚨 not encourage people to read it, even as a secondary version.
I love Remnant Radio. Even if I don't agree with everything and everyone they bring on. I love that the different views on different fringe topics they discuss.
Man, this just reminds me of Joseph Smith jr..
Came here to say this. The whole thing about he says he met an angel named Passion sounds a lot like Joseph Smith and Moroni... the Passion "Translation" has more in common with the so-called "Inspired Version" than any real translation.
“Am I the only one bothered “ by all the hypercharismatic/NAR buzzwords? No, you’re not! Been there, done that. Praise God for opening my eyes to the Truth. Have many friends still in this movement and a number who use TPT. Thanks, all of you, for this discussion.
Honestly, after listening to several of your studies, you’ve never struck me as a Charismatic. At the moment, I am dealing with my upbringing in Pentecostal churches. If you don’t mind my asking, what is the difference with you as a Charismatic and the Hyper-Charismatics?
Every word of God proves true; he is a shield to those who take refuge in him. Do not add to his words, lest he rebuke you and you be found a liar.
Proverbs 30:5-6 (and this is in addition to Rev 22:18, which may or may not only be for Revelation, and Deut 4:2 which may specifically refer to the law itself. In any case, the general warning does apply.)
I'm not going to scroll through the comments to see if this was already pointed out...but...during the section including the "chart on TPT's hyper-charismatic terminology" one of the numbers is incorrect. Assuming all of the fields above the "total" row are correct, the total for TPT should be 1533 not 1087...which actually just further makes your point. Enjoying your content.
Love your zealous for God’s word ,
God knows what is going on , We are all under His provinces , Holy Spirit leads to the Truth and Light !
He is God who is Father in heaven!!
Glory to God !!
While I’m thankful these guys gave Mike a platform to critique Brian Simmon’s misrepresentation of Scripture, I’ve seen much of Remnant Radio’s interview with Todd White and other questionable teachers they sing kumbaya with. The thing is, while they’ve enjoyed taking doctrine and theology as their niche for a talk show, folks lives are literally being destroyed by the lies of false teaching. I’m listening to the questions posed to Mike, and it seems like Remnant Radio isn’t too concerned with having a faithful translation. For instance, what’s the point in asking Mike if he thinks the Passion “translation” is going to create a cult? Seems like there was another earlier question that left me wondering about their motivations and concerns as well. Still listening...OF COURSE I should’ve known Dr. Michael Brown was going to factor into this discussion since Mike has interviewed him. I suppose he handled that as well as he could.
Brian Simmons' theology literally manufacturers false Christs (Anointed Ones). That should terrify anyone.
Thank you Mike Winger. Well done, you’ve gained a new subscriber to your channel.
regarding the Greek words mentioned, which are normally translated "religious" (adj. θρῆσκος Ja.1.26) and "religion" (n. θρησκεία Ja.1.26-27, Col.2.18, Acts 26.5), and which are assumed to be the words in the NT which "really" mean "religion" / "religious", we must not forget that even *these* definitions in English are "just" translations too, ... just because they are normally translated this way and defined this way in lexicons, that does not mean they are the only possible definitions and translations... they might just as well be rendered "godliness", "worship", "devoutness" / "devout", etc... the traditional renderings are just what they are, they are our "translation traditions"... the word group comes from words for fear and trembling, then worship, reverence, devoutness, religion, ... :)
Gotta love the Remnant Radio guys 😊🔥👌🏼
There is another awful translation called “the mirror” what is happening to the discern of the people!
Never even heard of that one. I'll have to look into it as well in case my pastors at our church start preaching from it too (as they do with the passion and the mess[age])
He has done a video on that one. It is FAR worse: It completely replaces the Gospel with deification of humanity without the Cross.
When Mike is comparing the difference between a committee and one person around 10 minutes. I can just see the argument. "Well what if God inspired that one man to write the whole thing and He didn't do that with the committee." That is a tough person to have a discussion with.
Wait, Mike.....you’re charismatic? What does that actually mean....I think I’ve had a wrong view and definition of Charismatic, then.
I'm also having similar thoughts about this
I’ve also been wondering about this.
I think he means he believes in the continuation of the gifts of the Spirit
Charismatic, from my understanding, means believing that the spiritual gifts of the Bible still exist today as opposed to a cessationist view that they no longer exist. This is a broad definition and can include gifts from the range of tongues to being able to raise the dead. That word has a bad rep nowadays due to NAR/"Hyper-charismatic" churches like Bethel.
@@ActiuneBaza I actually didn't know that about predestination. My current church is a Church of Christ and they teach Cessationism, but deny predestination. I am relatively new to all of this so I am not sure of all the terms and patterns yet
Jesus bless you
In summary ...passion translation bad.
I read different translations, not just one. I like the TPT and MSG. I don't use them at church but for personal quiet time. I also read NKJ, NIV, NET, NLT and others to get a better picture.
I wouldn’t read the message if I were
you 😬
I do exactly the same as you, love the Message and the Passion translations, I prefer the NASB 🙏 Did you know in the 1980s the NIV because it said we have a sinful nature once we are still born again, led thousands if not millions to under-rate what Jesus accomplished. They have since changed this. I'm reading through and listening, so far nothing has convinced myself.
Why would you waste time reading false translations like the passion or message?
Thank you Jesus
Thank you my brothers in Christ
I remember I read it I like in the beginning, then I left it I don’t know why
I think I felt not comfortable to read it
I think the holy spirit work
Fake teacher who is pushing this transition too
God bless you
What's your guy's thoughts on the TLV translation? Tree of Life translation?
Thanks
First 😅
Strange how that's an achievement these days 😇
@@TymP321 Right?! Haha. I guess I get to be immature every now & then. 😸🤪
@@sarahfaith316 😂
Mike MIKE! Can we down load or access a print out the chart of those words that have been compared in the various versions, we need it
I was sad/frustrated to learn the truth about this being a translation vs. a paraphrase. I have used TPT to help those I’ve come alongside to understand harder biblical passages. I never used it as a sole source of scripture but as a stepping stone, because I knew it wasn’t a direct translation, to understanding passages from KJV, NASB, NIV, ESV…
I no longer use or reference TPT. Thank you for teaching me about proper *translation* practice
Truth is a plum line......thankyou
I downloaded the Blue Letter Bible because by touching any verse it shows how other versions are translated. It is the KJV that you are reading. In the third chapter of John if you touch any verse then go into the commentary then scroll down to David Terasaka M.D. He shares the medical aspects of what Jesus went through. It is very graphic. After reading it all I can say is thank you Jesus. I truly am not worthy.
That slow drop of your head was so funny🤣
😅 their website offers excerpts you can read a few verses as they’re written in the passion translation. I have very mixed feelings about it because on the one hand I think about all the Bibles that floating around in the world that people are exposed to... for example Gideon’s bibles in the hotel drawer 😂 or the Bibles in jails... some people in jail may have time on their hands and in a bad situation decide to pick up the Bible for the first time. I’m not saying this to judge as I’ve been to jail myself, but many people in there cannot read well, are below the poverty line and don’t have any higher education past high school. I can see how a “translation” like this could be good for someone in that situation because it’s easy to read and introduces the reader to the loving character of God... all that being said, I agree it’s dangerous for those endorsing the passion translation to claim anyone could use it as a primary study source that’s honestly a ridiculous claim. When it comes down to it, it seems the Passion translation, from what I’ve read, is a watered down version of scripture that seems more like a parent retelling a story to their children - we use easy words and make it sound nice and try to dance around the bad parts, knowing we will have to answer the hard questions as they grow up. If people truly want to study scripture to get the answers to those deeper and sometimes hard questions they’re still going to have to go to the source. Obviously we’re not all going to learn Hebrew and koine Greek 😂 but I think if you want to seriously study Gods word you should give great care choosing a primary Bible and I agree with many of the criteria Mike has mentioned in this and previous videos. I’m not against them doing this translation but I do think they should be upfront about what it is - a modern interpretation of the Bible, or an artistic adaptation of the Bible, not so much a “translation”.
You explained this well, how TPT would be helpful for a person in jail, to know they are unconditionally loved by God.
@@Jayinseason ❤️
I’m waiting for the passion bible to be finished before I buy a copy 😊
Back to regular programming. Nice breakdown
Mike, can you define the differences between charismatic and evangelical?
Reading God’s word is not about hearing what we WANT to hear but what we NEED to hear.
God’s word is extremely beautiful and hopeful and uplifting but only if our EARS have been transformed. Before our heart has been changed, God’s word is meant to change us. We don’t change it.
Beautiful work, guys. Thank you!
This is my favorite episode because of the catcam featuring the illustrious "MOXIE" star of internet fame...
Pastor Mike, I take umbrage at your insinuation that a few courses from Rosetta Stone isn't enough to prepare me to single handedly put together a Bible translation 🧐!
(Just joking 😂)
Oh my goodness 🙀🙀🙀☺️☺️☺️☺️ !!! I love your cat, soooo cute 😻😻😻😻
Thank you for standing against this heresy!… that wickedness has taken over the charismatic movement.
Now what? Now that we have questions about things do we resemble what any of the translations say?
The problem is we don't resemble Jesus as we are called to in any translation.
Yes there are groups of believers with ideas that don't line up and over emphasise different things that they shouldn't. Why I don't understand.
The question is do we do the same? Do we not resemble who we really are?
There are some key verses highlighted. When combined with being a living sacrifice, not doing your plan but God's. When we believe, surrender and live out His will what does it look like?
We need to recognise Romans 12 in the version we hold to. All of the main versions have dynamics we should be resembling. Why are we not?
2 Peter 1 are we recognising what we have been given and partaking in it. Daniel 7:27 are we resembling this. Romans 8, do we resemble this? Or do we more resemble Acts 8:16 where they believed and had been baptized, but not baptised in the Holy Spirit yet. I'm not saying these guys are without the Spirit of God, but many even with the Spirit of God resemble those who don't. Whole denominations have built ideas and structure around living in this state of believing, being baptised and not having the Spirit fall on them.
What does God want? How does He want to do it?
We have to resemble what.
If we have the Spirit of God we must live by the Spirit of God and not the flesh as Romans 8 says. Romans 8 has qualifying points. It talks about being in Christ. This isn't for just anyone, it's for those in Christ Jesus. Next it says we must live by the Spirit and not the flesh. It's a choice for those who have the Spirit of God to make.
Are we making the right decision? Is our life living by the Spirit of God? Have we received the Spirit of God?
If we answered no to any of these questions then we have disqualified ourselves from Romans 8 in any translation.
Lots of ideas are going around that don't line up with the need to be in Christ Jesus. In John 14 Jesus talks about abiding in Him. He explains that the Father is going to send the Holy Spirit and that's how this continued abiding was going to happen when Jesus left them.
This is the only way and we must live by this. The journey of abiding begins by receiving the Spirit of God. Without the Spirit of God you can't abide. Your abiding, being in Christ, doesn't start until you have the Spirit.
If this is not what you are teaching then you are not teaching any version of the Bible. If you are not living this you are not living any version of scripture that God has given.
We have to deicide to receive and live by the Spirit. We have to stir up, fan into flame the things the Spirit gives us when we have received them. Yes we don't have these authority, we must receive the Holy Spirit.
You see any teaching that says we already have these gifts is wrong. Any teaching saying you already had the Spirit of God when you were born is wrong. Any teaching that says you don't have to receive the Holy Spirit to be in Christ Jesus is wrong. What that looks like and when it happens is debatable, but you must receive. New life is receiving and only starts when you receive.
Once you have received then you must live by that glorious Spirit of God.
If this isn't happening and what your teaching says it's okay, then you are not teaching the bible.
Let's recognise what God is saying. The bible is full of the glory of Jesus. Let's be to His glory
When speaking of translations one not only has to understand the lexicon but also the idiomatic expressions. I studied linguistics and can speak five languages and read two of them. But to make exact translations as a single person is a little risky. When I read the Latin vulgate and the Koine Greek, I notice that Jerome ‘s translation of the Greek doesn’t bring across the exact meaning of the translation. This is the problem when a single person does the translation. It has happened to me when I have translated English to Italian even if Italian is my maternal language and I have spoken English since I was seven years old and grew up with speaking both languages.
You are probably better educated than the speakers above, who are denouncing words like promise, or religious, Jesus was totally against the religiousity of his day.
Mike amazing video again!! And yh Moxie Y not?😂😂
Love ur passion for this project !
Blessings brother!!
Hello Brother Mike!
What are the verses in TPT that talked of 7 mountain theology? I am having a hard time finding them
What study Bibles would you recommend?
For newer Christians I've started recommending the Berean Study Bible because its cross references are top notch. Just enough, neither too many nor too little.
I think Mike uses ESV mostly???? Their study bible is totally fine.
The Apologetics Study Bible is good for answering questions that are common, too.
Thank you Pastor Mike. I like yr channel.
Years ago I got hold of a NWT and just read a few verses. My favorite to use against them is Romans 10:9 and 10:12. The conversation goes something like: Using your translation of the Bible, 10:9 says If you confess Jesus as Lord (Kurios) you will be saved. 10:12 says whosoever calls on the name of Jehovah (Kurios) shall be saved. So...your translation says Jesus and Jehovah are Kurios (supreme in authority) and, as we all know, no authority is greater than God. So, your version of the Bible really does say Jesus and Jehovah are the same. Right?
(Hint: They really don't like that conversation point.)
Mr Winger / Remanent Radio, what do you think of the You Tube show, The Chosen? Is it being extra Biblical when it comes to the portrayal of Jesus? I've been watching it, it's really ministered to me, and made Jesus more real.