E29 | 110-120V. 25% Faster Home Charging on NEMA 5-20 (Tesla Model Y)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 เม.ย. 2021
- Everybody wants a faster charge, especially when you’re at home charging on 110V - 120V or out on a road trip either staying with friends and family, at a campground or anywhere in between. Come along for the ride and find out how you can take a slow charge and make it 25% faster!
Below are two quick and easy articles to learn more about electricity and electric motors. This will help as you go electric.
Learn to Speak EV
www.automobilemag.com/news/el...
The Difference between Amps vs. Volts vs. Watts
www.eatonupssystems.com/2020/... - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
5-20 is the way to go for economical charging. I am glad I came across this video. Thanks!
Glad it was helpful! NEMA 5-20 can actually work for many EV owners who don't drive all that much every day especially if they have a DC charger in the area for those occasions when they need a bit more range and faster than typical daily charging. Thanks for watching!
This should have more views. Nobody else is talking about this solution, and it's a very good one! Thanks.
Thank you for saying that. Very kind of you! I think TH-cam algorithms typically reduce my video placement because they are on the lower production quality side since I do this all as a hobby on top of my day job. 😂 Also TH-cam apparently restricts my videos to people in the 35-55 age bracket. But it’s all cool: people seem to be able to find it when they go looking. Ultimately I try to make videos about topics I don’t see many videos on, so I’m glad you found this helpful. It turns out that a NEMA 5-20 can be a great option for a lot of people who don’t typically drive a lot per day. Best of luck! And reach out if you have any questions. 🔋🔌🚘
@@goingelectric7826 Got my MYLR today actually. Immediately after watching this video, I went to check my outlet, and unfortunately it doesn't have the horizontal notch. Will try charging via the standard NEMA 5-15 for now and if it ends up being too slow I'll end up installing a NEMA 14-50. Thanks again!
Just be careful that someone didn't mistakenly screw a 20 Amp receptacle onto wiring that was designed for a 15 Amp receptacle. 15 Amp circuit needs 14 gauge wiring and a 15 Amp breaker in the panel. A 20 Amp circuit requires 12 gauge wiring (thicker wire) and a 20 Amp breaker in the panel. You are only allowed to draw 80% of the circuit rating, therefore 15 Amp circuit X .8 = 12 Amps. and 20 Amp circuit X .8 = 16 Amps.
Absolutely! Hence my CYA on checking with electricians and also asking a home-host about their wiring. If someone is putting a NEMA 5-20 receptacle on a line that can't handle it, that's a problem. The good news when I tried charging on a NEMA 5-15 with an extension cord, the car recognized that something fishy was going on and it dropped the amps down to something like 9 and it put an error on the screen as a warning.
A public place I charge at did this and the Tesla is smart enough to dial back amperage. It does this once it detects a voltage drop within a certain %.
Seriously - your videos are clutch as I’m waiting for my Model Y.. Cant thank you enough.. You’re amazing
Right on! And you are MUCH too kind!! 🙏 Bizarrely, TH-cam has stopped sharing my videos to 80% of the demographic groups they used to share them with. Glad you were able to see it! As for NEMA 5-20: very convenient!!
Welcome back and good to see you again. Your mom looked like she had a blast. Thanks for the great video on home charging. It’s nice to know there’s other options out there. Who knew!
I know right! It's funny that I get excited now about charging my car at 1.5kW vs. 1.15kW, but that extra .35kW makes quite a difference! And thanks for the kind words: it's great hearing from you as well. My mom was quite excited to make her debut and she enjoys going for rides in BlueLightning. As long as I don't punch the accelerator too often. Ha!
Shout out to Mom and her joyful model vibes!!!
I love her!! 🥰
Thanks for another wonderful video, Daniel. Your Mom is a real sweetheart, and is truly the star of the show. You do come in at a close second, though !❤️
She’ll love hearing that!! 🤣
Dan you’re the man! Appreciate your content as always! Your videos helped me during my Model Y purchase process!
Thanks for the great feedback! 🙏 It's always great helping others. I know you'll help others with their own purchases as well. Let's keep giving forward! 😊🚙
I love when somebody else does the math for me! Thank you so much for all of this investigative work! And 12% OMG range anxiety in full force I would be! 😁
😂
I wish I could like this 50 times for your lovely model. Love it!!
You are much too kind! I'll let mom know! Thank you! 💕
Dan...welcome back! You are awesome. I got my MYLR last month and have been charging at home with the nema 5-15 until our electrician can install a nema 14-50 outlet in our garage. I had purchased the nema adapter bundle for options while on he road. Thanks to your vid, I checked the outlet in the garage and can use the nema 5-20 😀. Also, thanks for the links to the articles you recommend!
Thanks for the great feedback! As we all start going electric, I think we're gonna start getting nice and familiar with the basics of electricity. Enjoy your 25% (check your panel to make sure that outlet/receptacle is rated for 20amps) and congrats on the MY! 💖🚙
PS: super cool that you can install a 14-50! Jealous!
@@goingelectric7826 last week, we used Wired Electronics to install 14-50 outlet in the garage. He tech was professional and had a sense of humor. He mentioned that they are busy installing these outlets as more and more people in our are getting Tesla’s. $1,300 and well worth it.
Will your parents allow you to have one installed at their house?
@@Epearson02130 Very cool that you were able to make the upgrade to your place. That’ll be awesome. As for my parents’ house, their electric panel has no free spaces available so an upgrade would require an all new panel. Their house has a gas stove and clothes drier so we decided it isn’t worth it. And since I always spend several days at my parents’ when I visit, the NEMA 5-20 works really well. If I ever moved into the house then theoretically I’d pay for the upgrade but for the relatively few times that I visit (compared to living in the house) it doesn’t make sense to pay for such an upgrade. Just means I get to visit my parents for longer. 😊
@@goingelectric7826 That totally makes sense. I’m sure they are happy to have you stay longer.
For a continuous load, such as EV charging, the National Electrical Code requires derating the circuit to 80%. So that is why the 5-15 and 5-20 adapters set the amperage to 12 and 16 amps respectively.
Thanks for the heads up! 🙏 There’s lots of interesting stuff for us all to learn as we go electric. Electrical education, here we come! ⚡️
Thanks for your experiments and clarifications. Quite helpful for someone considering and EV. Much appreciated.
Thanks for the kind feedback. Always trying to provide helpful feedback for people curious about EVs and what it’s really like. I’m currently living in a place for the next couple months that only has the slow NEMA 5-15 120W 1.1kW plug, but I’m finding that is plenty as long as I drive less than 45-50mi/day. And if I need more than that I can swing by a Supercharger. But if I had my own place, I would definitely install a 240V charger for faster convenience. Good luck!
Great video! The wife and I are about to take a trip to visit my parents and they definitely have 5-20 outlets in their garage. Now, I just have to convince them to let me park in there 😉
Haha... good luck with your parents! Fortunately the 5-20 outlet is close enough to the front of their garage that I can park outside and still use the mobile connector. Unfortunately a standard extension cord can't handle the load and is dangerous to use (which the car would detect and eventually shut down, which happened to me once). So I just get nice and close to the garage door and close it just above the cord so it doesn't get pinched, and the car charges well.
It’s been to long, glad you’re back :)
Very nice of you to say!! Drove from Miami up to Detroit then out past Chicago toward northwestern Illinois. Putting lots of miles on my car. Just picked up my car a couple hours ago from a detailing shop where they applied a paint protection film and ceramic coating. 🚙✨
you deserve more subscribers, Thanks for alot of information ❤️
Thanks for the kind words. 🙏 I actually enjoy the lower subscriber and viewer numbers because it lets me chat with everyone individually. Not needing to worry about advertising or viewership numbers also lets me do a little more story telling in my videos which I think is fun. But that doesn’t trigger the TH-cam algorithms. Ha!
I looked everywhere for this video, thanks a million!!!
Glad I could help! 😃
Thoroughly done
I had no idea about this. Thanks for the heads-up. I’ll have to check out my outlets.
Best of luck! I was pleasantly surprised learning that NEMA 5-20 was even a thing. It’s crazy that 500-700W can make such a noticeable difference. (PS: I’m back in the San Francisco Bay Area now charging on NEMA 5-15. It works for my daily 50-mile commute but I wish my apartment had a NEMA 5-20!) Thanks for watching!
Really enjoy your Videos!!! Fellow Tesla MA owner here👍🏽
Thanks for the great feedback!! 🙏
wow for that efforts and presentation .. should have seen this much long before
Thank you for your very kind feedback! I hope I was able to help make your charging experience just a little bit faster! :)
Some one may have mentioned this. But if you are there often you look into quick 220 system. I got one for tips I take and hotels that don't have level 2 chargers. The block heater plugs have 2 outlets on them and it is usually ether side of the buss bar witch give you 220. It is a a220-20D
That sounds like very good advice. Fortunately I have been able to do all of my travels either on 120 V or Superchargers. I now have a NEMA 14-50 240V adapter but haven’t needed it yet. But it’s always good to look into new options!
Very helpful, thank you!
Glad it was helpful! It's interesting that NEMA 5-20 outlets seem so unknown to use all - I didn't even know myself until someone pointed it out to me. It's pretty crazy that many people can actually live on a 120V 16A alone, especially if there's a DC charger in the area for the occasional faster charge if necessary. Best of luck and thanks for watching!
This is great information. Great Model Y videos.
Thanks for the kind feedback!! 🙏
Love the math focused breakdown! Just a sidenote - I heard when you wake the car up by checking the app it draws a non insignificant amount of power, so the KW estimates are probably a little higher.
Thanks for watching and reaching out. As far as I understand that is true. Reaching out to the car does activate the computer system and that consumes energy. I'm not sure that it's enormous but frequently checking the app would frequently activate the computer and would therefore frequently consume energy. So... if one were interested in maintaining battery charge over a longer period of time, one should not frequently check one's app so that the car is not frequently woken up to consume energy unnecessarily. I've left my Y parked without charging up to five weeks at a time and my typical rule is to not check the app more frequently than once a week. Doing it that way, I've noticed that the battery charge typically only declines by 0.5% per day max. It's pretty impressive.
Thank you for the info 🙏🏿
You are definitely welcome! I have found NEMA 5-20 charging to be totally sufficient for when I stay anywhere visiting friends and family for more than a day. And if people are ever curious about how much electricity I’m costing ‘em, I just take their kWh rate ($0.11 at my mom’s) and multiply that by the kWh I put into the battery (1 to 72kWh) and I offer to pay. But they never accept because people are surprised how little it really takes. Maximum $7.92 in the case of my mom’s place. But if I were somewhere with expensive daytime electricity I’d make sure to only charge at night. Best of luck exploring all the different ways to charge! 🔋🚘⚡️
Hello. I took delivery about a month ago, I used your referral code. Thanks! Actually our cars are twins Blue, white and induction.
Woo hoo!! Congrats on delivery!! And woo hoo on the referral code!! THANKS!!! 🙏 I've been staying with my parents the last couple weeks and "borrowing" some of their electricity so I'll definitely appreciate your generosity once I get back on the road and head out to New England next week. I'll let BlueLightning know he's got a twin now - I think he'll like that! 🚙😃
@@goingelectric7826 Wow, we are in Massachusetts, actually heading to Virginia next week, we will wave on the road. Love the videos.
Right on! I’ll be sure to wave! What should I check out in Massachusetts? I’ll likely be driving through on my drive through New England.
@@goingelectric7826 Wow, so many things to see here, really depends on what part of the state and how much time you plan on being here, Scusset Beach (End of Cape Cod Canal) is good. Nubble Light House (technically in ME but right outside MA), travelling Route 2 in the Western part of the state (it runs East to West), if you are spending time on the East coast, Race Point Lighthouse Area in Provincetown. If you are coming through RI Newport RI and Brenton Point State Park (take Route 138 from Connecticut as you will cross two of the most scenic bridges you will see). There are a ton of towns with covered bridges. of course the skyscrapers of Boston (traffic is terrible). Oh Warning DO NOT plan to stop at the supercharger in Dedham MA. It is a service center and where most cars are distributed. There chargers are always full with delivery vehicles so even if app says some open they will be full before you arrive and they charge very slow because of that. Sorry so long, tried to be short.
That's an excellent tip for Dedham! Haha. I will add the other locations to my Must-See list. :) Thanks!
Saw the following on reddit the other day and thought of this video.
This would almost triple the rate at which you charge on your 5-20 outlet.
No need to change the wire. You need a new breaker and receptacle but the wiring should be good.
"If you have a dedicated receptacle in your garage for a refrigerator/freezer or tools (many houses do), talk to an electrician to verify it and re-configure it to 240V, then get the appropriate adapter. Many of these dedicated plugs are 5-20, which is a “normal” plug with the horizontal/vertical hot blade which is recognizable as a “T” on the plug left blade. These (should) have 12-ga wiring and are rated for 120V/20A. To reconfigure in this situation to 240V/20A all it requires is a 6-20 receptacle, two pole 20A breaker, and some electrical tape to mark the white conductor as a hot. That change will take you from as low as 1.4kW (120V/12A) to 3.8kW (240V/16A). That is enough for - 40-50% charge in 10hr overnight."
That’s excellent feedback. Thanks! I’ll have my parents think about making that modification the next time we have an electrician out at the house. 3.8kW is MUCH better than 1.1-1.7kW!! 😃🔋
Daniel, you can do even better charging your Tesla by using a Quick 220 20-amp-type voltage converter box connected to both of your nearby, hopefully out-of-phase, 5-20 outlets at your parents' house; you'd most likely be able to charge at a rate of up to 16 amps (80-percent of load), but at 240 volts, thereby giving you about 3 times the charge rate of a regular 120 volt, 12 amp charger!
At 16 amps/240 volts, you'd get close to 15 miles per hour of charging!
There are two conditions that must match the requirements of the Quick 220 in order that this may work: 1. two out-phase, fully-dedicated 5-20 outlets with at least 12-gauge wiring to and from your electrical panel; and 2. these 5-20 outlets cannot be GFCI protected.
You may also use 5-15 outlets, provided that no more than 12 amps is the maximum output for each outlet, in comparison to 16 amps with the Quick 220 20 amp version.
At 12 amps/240 volts, you'd get close to 11 miles per hour of charging, or over twice the charge rate of a regular 12 amp/120 volt charger.
In case I can't find a regular 240-volt charger while travelling, I always carry a Quick 220 box with me along with all of the required, high-quality adapters, extension cords and connectors; and I frequently end up using it at my cottage, which does not have the capability of taking a 240-volt charger since my electrical panel is completely full and cannot be expanded any further!
Just make sure Daniel that you follow the included instructions accompanying the Quick 220 to the letter in order to ensure safety!
Just check out the capabilities and requirements of each type of Quick 220 system by viewing the numerous videos on TH-cam.
If in doubt, consult an electrician, by all means!
The Quick 220 is fully safety certified for use in Canada and the United States.
And we all want to charge as quickly, and as safely, as possible, don't we?
The sad thing is that NEMA 5-20 extension cord is significantly more expensive than a 5-15 extension cord. This can make the Quick220 for 20 Amps far more expensive than the one for 15 Amps. A fast charge might become better at some point.
@guillaumegiroux9425 More expensive, yes! Although it's a good idea to overestimate than underestimate when you deal with electricity, especially with continuous EV charging for lengthy periods.
Awesome, and informative video, thank you.
Glad I was able to provide some helpful information. Best of luck with faster charging and thanks for watching!
Unsure if this has been said or not, but if your voltage is closer to 120 instead of 110 the power advantage of having the 5-20 only increases as the higher voltage (120) x the same amperage (16amp) flat out gives you about 8-9 percent more power alone. I know people cant control what there voltage is but truly, investing in a 12gauge 25' 5-20 extension cord is a must if you are just out of reach with the plug
Thanks for reaching out!
Yep, it's definitely all a matter of volts*amps and getting the kiloWatt charging rate, and it can definitely vary significantly. Fortunately I've always managed to be just within the reach of my mobile connector and an outlet and haven't (yet) needed an extension cord.
That said, I might start looking at getting one because I'm looking to relocate to a new apartment and I'm finding that most apartments have ZERO interest in installing lines/outlets right where cars are parked, and so an extension cord might make sense if I plan on being able to charge at a new apartment parking spot.
Of course, my bigger concerns in that scenario would be: 1) how to pay the landlord for electricity that likely isn't metered formally, and then 2) how to make sure someone doesn't steal my nice expensive EV extension cord + mobile connector.
I tell ya, being an innovator has its challenges! Haha...
Daniel
Very informative , thank you for the details, would you be able to analyses NEMA 14-50 as well as some point ? or do you have any documentation that I can go and study ? thank you in advance.
HI! Thanks for watching and reaching out. (Just getting to comments now. Eeek!) I don’t have any experience with NEMA 14-50 other than what Tesla has published on their website:
“The recommended home charging installation for Tesla vehicles is a 240 volt NEMA 14-50 outlet. This outlet is commonly used for electric ranges and large recreational vehicles. Installed with a 50-amp circuit breaker, this outlet enables a recharge rate of about 25 miles per hour.”
- Voltage: Single phase, 208-250 volt AC supply, 60 hertz
- Circuit Breaker: 50 amp (125% overcurrent protection)
- Operating Current: 40 amp (maximum continuous current)
- Conductors: 6 AWG, Copper Wire Only. Upsize wiring for installations over 150 feet
- Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter: Not required
- Service Disconnect: Not required
- Receptacle Recommendation: High quality, industrial grade receptacle
Examples: Hubbell part # HBL9450A, Cooper part #5754N
- Ventilation: Not required
- Outdoors: Install with NEMA 3R rainproof enclosure
If you have the ability to install it on your property, it appears to be a good option.
In terms of time to charge: since its peak performance is 240V 40A, that means that it would charge in a best case scenario at 240*40 = 9.6kW. To charge a 78kWh Model Y battery from 0% to 100% would take 78kWh/9.6kW = 8 hours 7 minutes 30 seconds, or 0.81h or 49 minutes per 10%, which is a very nice charging speed. You’d easily wake up to a full (80%?) battery every morning no matter how much to drove the car the day before. Best of luck!!
Above and beyond. This video will get millions of views once EV really explodes. Especially Tesla sales.
Thanks for your super nice feedback! I made it a while back because I thought it was crazy no-one else had and I imagined other people would be curious. I hope it helped. Thanks for watching! 🙏
If your house has an electric stove or even a dryer then the circuit breaker box can handle a level 2 home charger!
Yes IF... your panel can handle it. If not then you need a panel upgrade along with a 240V outlet/plug/circuit brought out to where the vehicle is/are and that can come at a significant cost. Home owners will very likely upgrade their properties over the next 20-30 years to accommodate 240V EV charging (the same way they did with indoor plumbing, gas/electric service, lighting phone/Internet, HVAC systems and all the rest in the last century) but it will certainly take some time and money, just like everything else. Thanks for watching!
I have a ton of 6-20 240v outlets in my garage. Was wondering if that would be helpful when I do get an EV.
Hey! Disclaimer: I’m not an electrician so you should consult a certified one for definitive information, BUT… according to en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector it shows that a NEMA 6-20 is a rated max of 240V @ 20A which is 240*20= 4.8kW, although amps are usually dialed down 20% so 240V*16A = 3.8kW. Depending on how much you drive daily, that may be totally fine for you even though the amps are lower than what you’d get on a 14-30 or 14-50. A typical MYLR driver gets an efficiency around 285Wh/mi so that’d be 1000W/280= 3.5mi/kWh or 3.5mi*3.8kW = 13mi per hour of charge. Assuming you plugged in your car at 9pm and charged till 7am nightly, that’d give you 10 hours of charge every night 38kWh of energy, or 50% of your battery, or around 130 miles range. If you are rarely driving more than 130 miles per day, you could live on that with no problem without upgraded to a NEMA 14-50 or similar. As for whether or not your electrical system can handle a sustained 3.8kW 240V/16A charge, consult a electrician on that. Typically, however, the car will adjust its charging rate based on what it determines to be a safe charging load. Lastly, if you live somewhere with extreme cold during winter you’ll eventually want to upgrade because battery preconditioning can take up a good 3-4kW which makes charging more challenging. Good luck going electric!
Thanks👍
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
I know that super charger its 10min away from my house. I was intrigued when you said you were in IL
Hello hello! Thanks for reaching out. I have family in the Midwest so during my 48,000 mile drive around the continent during the pandemic, I was in the region frequently. (Such cheap home electricity!) Now when I visit, I typically fly so I'm not using Superchargers in that part of the country - but I do get excited anytime I notice a new Supercharger planned or opening anywhere around my parent's place. These days, most of my driving currently is within California. 😃
Just purchased a home with a Nema 6-20 adapter. My understanding is that outlet was used to run a compressor. I just ordered the 6-20 adapter and I'm hopeful it will result in some good charging rates. I have a Nema 14-50 at my permanent address, can someone run the numbers and let me know how it will compare?
Hello hello! Taking a look at the table on the Tesla website: shop.tesla.com/product/gen-2-nema-adapters, it appears that a 14-50 charges about twice as fast as a 6-20, so in your case you’ll be getting about half as many miles per hour of charge. (And the 6-20 is about three times faster than a 5-20 and 4 times faster than a 5-15. Bumping up from 120V to 240V makes a big difference - as does bumping up the amps from 20 to 50). Based on what the electrician I chatted with had mentioned, electrical systems typically reduce the amps down 20% from the stated rating. So if an outlet/adapter is rated as 20 amps it really delivers 16 amps. Then you multiply that reduced number by Volts (say, 110V or 220V) and that gets you the Watts coming into the car. Then reduce that number by 15-20% because of electrical inefficiencies and that’s really the usable Watts that you’re getting into your car. In my case, I found the actual total rate to be 38% less than the rating of the adapter/outlet (for the following equations: 1 - 0.38 = 0.62). So, a NEMA 5-15 rated at 15 amps & 120V would be 15amps * 120V = 1800W * 0.62 = 1,110W actual usable charging rate (or 1.110kW). Likewise, a 6-20 240V adapter would be: rated at 20amps * 240V = 4,800 Watts * 0.62 = 2,976W or 2.976kW usable rate. A 14-50 should be 50amps * 240V= 12,000 Watts * 0.62 = 7,440W or 7.44kW usable. Based on all that, the Tesla table seems to assume a typical driving speed of around 60mph for their mileage numbers. As always, the faster you drive, the fewer miles you get. 🚀⛽️ Good luck!
As always, it’s a good idea to take a look at your electrical panel to see what the system is capable of. It’s also good to consult an electrician if necessary to ensure that the wiring in your home can support the outlets that have been installed. As far as I understand, if it could not then the circuits should simply trip and result in a power disruption on that circuit. Good luck!
Retired electrician and model 3 owner here. I have not come across an electrical panel that I could not squeeze another circuit into. Most modern panels are UL listed to accept split or tandem breakers which can free up the space you need. If the panel needs to be replaced it should take a competent electrician a few hours to do that. Your solution is excellent for a visit , but for an extended stay or something you own you really want to get at least a 6-20 preferably a 14-50.
That's great feedback. Apparently the house has a relatively small panel on it and when my parents moved in a couple years back we looked into upgrading the panel but since they have gas for the hot water heater, stove and dryer, they figured they wouldn't need the extra capacity. Apparently I could also get a sub panel installed in the garage, so if I ever moved into the home that/those would be things I'd consider. Since most of my visits include me staying without driving much, NEMA 5-20 works well. And in the end, this whole topic of electricity, which has been ignored by much of the planet for the past 100 years or so, is rapidly going to start becoming really important for people to look into. Thanks again for reaching out!
Great video! Subbed!
Thanks for the kind words, and enjoy a 25% faster charge! 😃🔋(I’m currently charging at an apartment rental 25% slower on a 120V NEMA 5-15 plug. 😭
@@goingelectric7826 range anxiety was a huge worry of mine before buying. I live in an apartment with two charging stations (the slow 7KW type). I realized quickly, which might sound stupid, that my car spends magnitudes more hours sitting that driving. So I don’t even bother using those stations anymore, and just plug into one of the 50 or so wall outlets in the parking garage. Just went out and looked and found that they have this type of outlet! Thanks again!!
@@stevestojan Range-concern is certainly reasonable in 2022. But as you’ve discovered, most people drive few enough miles per day that they can live on 120V alone. And if they can’t then 240V is more than enough for almost everyone else. I read an interesting article once which mentioned that cars spend something like an average 90% of their existence PARKED and that they are one of the worst and most under-utilized ways to allocate capital ever invented in all of human history. Yes, world, we almost always have enough time to charge. 😂🔋
This is great though. I may be able to just swap out an existing breaker and put in the 25% socket. Sure beats upgrading to a 200 amp service panel so I can run level 2 charging. I don’t have the space to add a 60 amp breaker. Sweet
Thanks for watching! No doubt 240V@60A (effective 48A) is always most convenient, but I’m finding that a good number of people can actually live totally fine on 120V at the higher 16A from a NEMA 5-20 outlet. I think we’ll all eventually upgrade to 240V chargers - especially when 100-150kWh batteries become common, but for the rest of this decade I think people who have an EV sedan/CUV with a 60-80kWh battery AND who typically drive fewer than 45-50 miles per day can easily and cheaply live on a NEMA 5-20 outlet. As it is, I’m currently renting an apartment and charge on a NEMA 5-15 120V/12A that gets me a slow 3.7mi/h but that actually works for 2/3rds of my week, then I’m able to charge at work on those days that I do my 100mi loops. There’s a 240V public charger around the corner from my apartment and a Supercharger a mile away. I have a friend in the neighborhood with a Bolt who charges on 120V/12A for her daily 35mi commute and she almost never even needs CCS. Different people will have different needs and budgets - best of luck finding the best solution that works for you!
Yeah I would actually like to know this if it works with other electric vehicles because I can’t get a hold of the Tesla right now so I’m getting my girl a 2021 Chevy bolt with the retrofided battery on it because of the recall and I would like to know if it would charge quicker on that too
Hey! Thanks for reaching out. Once it comes time to get a new car in a couple years, I’ll definitely have GM on my list of considerations - they’re making some nice EVs with great drive trains. I just did a little bit of snooping around the interwebs and it looks like a new Bolt comes with a 66kWh battery. EV manufacturers never seem to declare the usable capacity of the battery (versus maximum battery capacity) so I imagine it’d be closer to something like 63kWh. It appears that it is capable of the following charging: AC Level 1 & 2 (110V-240v at varying amps, 1kW to 11kW), and Level 3 DC fast charging up to 55kW. Level 3 is what you’d find being built out now along highways and certain retail locations. At those speeds, you could charge from 0-100% in 63kWh/55kW in 1.14 hours (but likely 1.5-1.75 hours based on the speed curve technicalities of charging batteries when they get closer to full at higher speeds). As for Level 1 & 2, I imagine they have to work exactly the same in a Bolt and every other EV just like in a Tesla. Multiply the volts and amps coming out of the socket and that’s your kW charging speed. Then divide that into the kiloWatt hours you need to put into the battery up to 63kWh. If you were charging on Level 2 at 240v/32a at home that’d be 7.7kW, therefore 63kWh/7.7kW = 8.18 hours to get from 0-100%. Of course, most people never charge from 0-100% so in daily usage it’s much less and much shorter than that. Also, slower AC charging typically doesn’t slow down as the battery gets fuller the way DC fast charging does. So, for a basic NEMA 5-15 outlet, you’d get something like 115v/12a =1.4kW, therefore 63kWh/1.4kW = 45 hours to get from 0-100%. Based on the 260 mile range (EPA rated) that’d be 260mi/45h = 5.7mi/hour of charge. On a NEMA 5-20, you’d see somewhat faster/better numbers at 115v*16a = 1.8kW. 63kWh/1.8kW = 35 hours from 0-100%, or 7.4mi/hour of charge. So, the time to charge the battery to 100% may be less but that is because the battery capacity is less; but the rate at which you can charge the battery will largely be based on the speed of the electricity coming out of the socket rather than the car itself. I’m currently living on slow NEMA 5-15 1.3kW electricity in my apartment rental, but it works for me in almost all cases because I typically drive less than 50 miles a day. If your daughter drives less than 50-70 miles per day and could charge 10 hours a night then she could easily get 50-70mi per charge on NEMA 5-15 to NEMA 5-20. Let me know if that answers your question or if there are some other things you’d like to run though. Good luck!
You can just plug the 5-15 plug into a nema 5-20 outlet right? It’s made to accept a regular plug as well… Why do you even need the adapter? Will the Tesla not draw more just doing that?
I am trying to remember the exact experience but somehow I recall when I plugged in the NEMA 5-15 adapter - yes, it only draws at 12a vs 16a of the NEMA 5-20. Presumably the car & mobile adapter recognize which adapter is plugged in and it adjusts automatically. However you could consider manually adjusting the amps in the car if using a NEMA 5-15 plug in a NEMA 5-20. However, I’m not a certified electrician so I’d encourage you to speak with a professional before doing that.
Cool info! Thanks for suggesting this video :) 👍
PS I Love Mom 😎
I love mom, too! 🥰
When the Tesla does the regen braking, does the brake lights come on also?
Hello hello. It only comes on in the scenario that the car decelerates in such a way that it approximates regular breaking. This makes sense: in an ICE, a slight deceleration by removing your foot from the gas pedal also does not result in the brake light coming on. Likewise, a light to deceleration in an EV/Tesla does not turn on the brake light either. But if the car decelerates in a rapid fashion via regen, the brake light does come on. You can confirm this by looking at the car icon on the center display which will illuminate the rear brake light icon when it does come on in the back. 🛑🚘
Great video. Thanks for sharing all the details. So cost wise, if you charged for lesser time on 5-20, will it almost same as charging for longer time on 5-15 or will be more?
Hey! Sorry for the delay in responding... I've been off TH-cam the last little while.
RE: cost... that depends on your utility. If you're charged by the kWh, then time doesn't matter. If you get X kWh in 40 minutes or X kWh in 60 minutes, you still pay the same amount since X is the same amount of energy.
But if you pay for electricity by the minute (relatively rare, but it still happens) then you'd pay less if charging took you less time due to slightly higher power. However, as best I've experienced, those sorts of time-dependent plans are tiered to incorporate power delivery levels, so the only thing I can say is that "it's complicated" if you're paying for time and devil is in the details. You'd have to check your home power bill. When it comes to Superchargers by time, they certainly bill you according to tiered kW rates to ensure you pay more for more energy, but the calculation is somewhat complex and sometimes you can get some deals if you're on the high end of the tier compared to the low end given the same amount of time.
Best of look figuring it out if you experience that!
Great details as always. Thank you. I ended up buying the 5-20 adapter after watching your video and very happy with my decision. Thank you. 😊
@@rajtips that's excellent to hear! It's crazy how just 25% faster charging on a 120 V outlet can solve a lot of people's daily driving needs. Best of luck!
I made same mistake, bought the 6 - 20, which is a 200 +volts. I wonder if you charge with 5 - 20 with a 5 - 15 adapter, will the charger notice or still pull 2kwh?
I'm not an EV engineer or an electrician, but best I know, a 5-20 adapter cannot be used on a 5-15 outlet as the pins are different (and vice versa); nor should one exceed a circuit's capacity when charging their vehicle. Assuming the car doesn't detect and prevent this, it can cause serious safety & fire hazards to the lines/buildings where that's happening. As always, consult a certified electrician when figuring out what's best and safe for your home, and the homes of others. Good luck, and thanks for watching!
I'd buy a convertor and plug into 110v and then plug my tesla into the other end 220v. They make step up transformers. I'm gonna check loadability for continous use
Good luck with that. 😊 It seems like stepping up to 240 V doesn’t always work because apparently it drops the amps in half and there’s some risk of overloading the wiring on the circuit, but if it works for you in your setup, that’s great!
Get a quick 220. It has two cords on it and they both plug into different 120v outlets and combines them to give you 220/240v
😳
Wait what!!!? Where?
@@TheSincereSeason various sketchy internet sellers and amazon.
It...works. Technically. But there's a good damn real UL doesn't approve of those things.
In order for that to work, the plugs would have to be on two separate breakers and those breakers would have to be on opposite sides of the panel.
Hi Daniel I'm going to be picking up my new Tesla model 3 23rd of June which is this week so I wish me luck I'm gonna be plugged in to my house I don't have time to be paid $1500 to install a fast charger
Best of luck! From what I understand, the average 3 driver gets an typical efficiency around 275Wh/mi or (1000Wh/275=) 3.6mi/kWh. If you are charging on a standard NEMA 5-15 at 120V/12A (1.4kW) that would give you 3.6mi*1.4kW = 5mi per hour of charge. On a NEMA 5-20 at 120V/16A (1.9kW) you’d be getting 3.6mi*1.9kW = 6.8mi per hour of charge. Therefore, an overnight charge from 9pm to 7am would get you 50-68 miles, more than enough for the average American driver’s daily needs. And depending on where you are, and if you have peak/off-peak charging rates, you may just choose to charge before 9pm and after 9am and get even more range. So it really all depends on how much you drive each day, when you plug in and when you unplug. Best of luck, and let me know if you have any questions. (I’m currently renting an apartment in the San Francisco Bay Area and living on a NEMA 5-15 120V/12A connection in the garage and it’s just fine for me as my daily needs are around 45 miles.)
So there are houses without 220v? How is that possible? When you say you cant install a level 2 charger I get a little confused?
Hi! Thanks for watching and reaching out.
In the case of my parents' place: yep, they've got 240V like any other house, however there are a couple practical considerations that go against installing a 240V AC outlet for my EV:
1) they don't own an EV,
2) installing just for my generally-infrequent trips across America wouldn't make a lot of financial sense (whether they or I paid for it), and
3) as best I understand their home, they'd have to upgrade to an all new panel because their current panel is maxed out (major appliances in the home are powered by natural gas).
A new panel would also pile on extra cost for the upgrade just so I could charge a little faster.
If my parents - or someone else in a similar situation - were to buy an EV *and* they drove more than 40mi/day and/or lived somewhere with frigid winter weather then they'd pretty much need to pay for the upgrades.
But for people not in that situation - and for those with smaller, efficient EVs like a Tesla Model Y - charging on 120V isn't a particularly bad option.
But definitely, sooner or later most homes will be upgrading to make way for the mass electrification of our economy, but that's going to take decades and different people will be upgrading at very different times. 😃
I assumed you could run a level 2 on 220/240 with a 200 amp bus?? Maybe theirs is 100 amps?
That was great info ... as we plan our USA Tour 2021 I was wondering about picking up adapters, so this is GREAT help! ... Also mom needs to be in more videos 😁👊🏼❤️!!! Safe travels!
Ps. Keep traveling, CALIFORNIA is still WHACKED! 😜
Hopefully one day California will be a little less whacky. Ha! Good luck with your USA Tour 2021. It's totally doable. I typically charge up to 80-90% per stretch, charge every 150-180 miles and spend an average of 40 minutes charging per stop. So if you're OK with working that into your timelines, then you'll be fine. I'm the sort of person who can easily drive 5 hours without stopping, but when my dad and I took our road trip from Dallas down to Boca Chica to check out SpaceX in Texas, he thought the stops every 2.5 to 3 hours were well timed. That trip (Episode 22) was back before I got my power brake assist unit replaced and my efficiency/range was about 20-25% less than it is now so it's definitely nice to have that extra range these days. You can check out Episode 27 (13,000 mile review) for some screenshots starting at 16:22 that show my typical range in good weather at various speeds. Heads up: heavy rain and snow coming at you, or lots of water on the road or strong winds can reduce range by a pretty surprising 30% so take that into account when you look at the weather coming up on you as you drive. I've observed that I have a usable 72kWh worth of energy in the (75kWh) battery. So whatever efficiency I see that I'm getting at whatever speed I'm driving that day, I just divide 72,000 by that number and that's my range given that driving. For example, if I'm getting a decent 331Wh/mi @ 75mph, the equation would be: 72,000/331=217mi. Of course, that assumes that you're using 100% of the battery which you'd never actually do - so I always lower the range by whatever percentage is in the battery. 217mi*0.8 if I have an 80% charge, for example. If you're driving slower, say 60mph, that's a much more respectable 237Wh/mi, so: 72,000/237=304mi. OR... you can just rely on what the Energy tab is telling you based on your 5, 15 and 30 minute average readings... assuming you're not about to drive straight up a mountain. In my case, before I got that power assist brake unit replaced, I noticed a significant discrepancy between what my own efficiency calculations were telling me and what the Tesla total-range numbers were showing, and that was my first clue there was something going on with my car. Once the repair was performed, both numbers aligned. Phew! Good luck driving across America!
@@goingelectric7826 wow! Great information, thanks for taking the time! Keep up the great content! 🇺🇸👊🏼👍🏼
I just had an electrician come out today to give me an estimate on a 240v install. Gonna cost me $6k+ to have them run the pipe down from 1 level up. 🤦🏻♂️. He pointed out my garage has the regular outlet, which is 15amps and the one you have there has that little dash indicating it as a 20amp receptacle. It’s like $400ish to get that upgraded to a 5-20 from the breaker box, but doesn’t really make a big difference for me as I drive mainly on the weekends and nearby errands here n there on weekdays.
Thanks for reaching out! Sorry to hear about the 240V installation cost. YOUCH! I suppose on the bright side of things... you'll be future proofing the house for all future EVs? Um... 😭
In my apartment rental garage here in the San Francisco Bay Area where I'm now living I only charge on 120V 12A, which is typically good for 1.4kW or 4.5mi per hour at my regular driving efficiency of 3.3mi/kWh (300Wh/mi).
The good news is that my daily commute is 50 miles so if I plug in by 8pm then I have no problem departing by 7am the next morning. I also do a 100mi commute once a week and fortunately we've got 240V chargers at work that (if I can get to work earlier enough) I can plug into to get some extra juice on those longer days. So that all works for me. But if I had no work charging option then I'd be at Superchargers and that'd be both somewhat pricy and inconvenient (my landlord won't install a 240V charger). Not looking forward to buying a house of my own one day and facing an expensive 240V installation. Best of luck!!!
@@goingelectric7826 there’s also a chance he didn’t know what he was talking about. He was very confused about the layout of my unit and how he could run the wire down to the garage. I spent today mapping it out myself, and it looks like it might be pretty simple. I’ll tell the guy who’s coming next week for another estimate. My HOA admin was shocked when she heard that $6k amount. She said someone else in the complex got theirs done for under $1500.
I am not a handy man, just ordered a model 3 performance, how do I do what you are recommending? What do I need to purchase?
Hello hello. For charging on a regular home/garage 120 V socket, the car comes with a standard mobile charge cable. You can just plug that into any outlet (NEMA 5-15) and you’ll get about 1.1-1.4kW. If you take a look at the video, you will see that some houses actually have a NEMA 5-20 outlet already installed. It’s the one with the perpendicular blade on the left side of the wall socket. If you have that wall socket in your garage, you can simply buy the NEMA 5-20 adapter from Tesla and then swap it out on the mobile adapter unit that comes with your car and plug into the wall with no modifications to your home necessary. I’m not a certified electrician, but it’s my understanding if your house has that socket already installed, your electrical system should likely not have any problems sustaining a charge out of it which can average around 1.9kW… about the same amount of energy drawn from a high power microwave which would be left on for hours and hours and hours while the car charges. As for any other charging options, you may want to consult a certified electrician. Let me know if you have any questions about the contents of the video. Thanks!
@@goingelectric7826 My outlet has the old school nema 5-15, can I just swap it out for the nema 5-20 wall plug in?
@@rhsalce you would need to run that by a certified electrician to ensure your electrical system and wiring could handle it.
Great info. I didn't know about that either.
It's definitely be a helpful little adapter especially if your wiring is modern and can handle the extra few amps going through.
@@goingelectric7826 I don't see this in my condo built in 1971 I think. I do have 220v for the dryer so I should be okay if/when I go EV. Do you know when they made this adjustment to new homes?
I’m not sure on the exact year. In the case of my parents’ place (and nearly every other house apparently), 240V comes into the house although their panel doesn’t send 240V out because the kitchen and laundry appliances are gas powered. When I spoke to the electrician he mentioned that if I ever wanted an L2 charger that I could just pay to upgrade the panel (to support 240V and/or to free up extra spaces). An electrician would evaluate power usage in the home and then decide if 240V should be brought out into the garage from the main panel or a sub panel installed in the garage directly. There are actually quite a few options for many people. If your condo wiring in the garage could support 5-20 receptacles then you might install those. But I’d say if you have your own garage and could get 240V out to it then you might as well do that. A coworker of mine actually charged on NEMA 5-15 120V for six months when he first got his 3 and then charged at work during the day before he eventually got his garage upgraded to 240V. (Also, the other important thing to discover is the amps that your panel and wiring can support.) Lastly, if you simply kept 120V in the garage for a NEMA 5-20 you could consider installing a 20 amp 120V dedicated circuit just for the car. As always, consult a professional electrician for specifics.
@@goingelectric7826 Thanks! My electrical box is not far from my carport and it has the 220/240 wiring that now only goes to my dryer and possibly my newish AC. I don't think I'd have a problem but I would get a electrician to do the work. I probably couldn't run more than one of the 2 or 3 240 units at the same time but....
I'm retired and don't drive enough to really make the investment but it is so fun to learn about and maybe some day. Thanks again for the convo!
Sounds like you could easily live on a NEMA 5-15 or 5-20 exclusively. You can supercharge on long trips and then just plug in on 120V for day to day.
Hi MOM!!! I love her!!!
🥰 Mom!
Your mom is so sweet
I love her!!! 🥰
So much nema but great info
Lots of NEMA! Haha... Good luck, and thanks for watching!
Your mom is so stinking cute 🥰
I love her!!! 💖
I don’t see why you couldn’t to 240 V, you have the space for it at the top right of the breaker
Apparently the home runs on 120V because the stove and dryer (and water heater?) are gas. When they moved in there was some talk about replacing the panel to upgrade it to 240V but apparently my parents decided not to since there wasn’t any real need. I did chat with an electrician and he mentioned something about possibly installing a sib panel in the garage as an option. If I ever took ownership of the home I’d likely do the upgrade just to support charging an electric car, but in practice when I visit my parents charging on 120V works out as a great alternative as well. I’m always there long enough. 😊
@@goingelectric7826 how old is your parents house, because unless it was built in the 1930s or before, and still has the original 2 wire 120 volt service paired to a very old meter base and porcelain fuse block, and knob and tube wiring (typically only 30 amp service and only 2 - 4 circuits, some very old panels installed before the late 1920s also had fuses on both the hot and neutral wires on the circuits) it almost certainly has 240 volts available aka split phase power. Incidentally very few legacy 120 volt services remain in service.
Sounds like you’re describing my apartment in San Francisco. Ha! As for my parents’ place: Early 2000s but apparently all the panel’s circuits/ports (??) are currently being used. As far as I understand, it’s a relatively small panel because the house is also supplied with gas for the hot water heater, kitchen stove & dryer. We looked into upgrading the panel when the moved in but figured wouldn’t really need the capacity. Now that I have my car and visit on occasion that would be nice but seems like an expensive modification to make (and/or bringing a sub-panel out to the garage) just so I can charge faster. So instead I use the NEMA 5-20 plug/adapter and that works well. Ah… life on 120V!
@@goingelectric7826 wow if only 120 volt capacity, don't know how that would pass code. Because in the U S., 100 amp /240 volt is now considered the bare minimum (since the early 60s') now in Canada, if the home is small, under 860 square foot, i would have to refrence the latest code book, they will allow a 60 amp 240 v service. However they will usually throw in 100 amps for future expansion. Now as far as the very small service, I could see an exception for something such as an apartment unit, or a summer cottage. But it's possible your parents house might have 240 volts available from the pole, but the breaker panel is full of single pole breakers as they may not have needed any large electric appliances in that home. A quick and easy way you can check, assuming it is overhead service, with underground services being increasingly common, especially in more densely populated blocks, is to count the number of wires actually connected to the service entrance cable going down to the meter. If there are only two wires, usually an insulated and a bare strand, or three wires, but one of them tied back and not connected, then you have only 120 volts available. If you see all three wires connected, then you'd have the more common 120/240 volt split phase. If you see 4 wires all connected to a service entrance cable, this would indicate a 3 phase service, extremely unusual in a residential setting, with some exceptions including very large, custom built luxury homes, or a home with a large home workshop with a bunch of heavy duty electric motors ( depending on your utility company and the jurisdiction, services above 400 to 600 amps must be three phase, or single phase requiring engineer approval, )
@@goingelectric7826 lol a few yrs back when I was finished my apprenticeship, I was working alongside with the journeyman and the master electrician, updating a bungalow style home, built in 1921, had a very old meter base, the service drop was connected to knob and tube wires run down the side of the home, protected by a black iron pipe, to the meter base and a couple of porcelain fuse blocks and a knife switch with a small handle make of porcelain and having the contacts exposed, all housed in an outdoor wooden enclosure near the driveway. Only two circuits powering the entire home, as well as two 30 amp Edison base fuses on the main, fused the hot and neutral separately. The home in question was formerly occupied by a 102 year old lady, who had lived in the home for around 70 years. My master electrician, with over 20 years in the field, only ran across an old two wire service twice before, and both cases involved a home formally occupied by a very aged person who had either moved into a nursing home, or passed on.
Lol home electrical safety has improved A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT since the 1920s. 🙂
I've been saying this for a LONG time. The video is fine, but it does not need to be a almost 13 minute long!!!
Thanks for the feedback! There are lots of good straight-to-the-point educational/informational videos out there. My videos are in more of a blog/story-telling format which people either really like or really dislike. I'm happy with both. Haha. :)
1.5kwh is a lot faster than just 1kw.
Hey, thanks for watching and reaching out. It does sound crazy, but 1.5kW is MUCH faster than just 1kW. 50% makes all the difference! :)
that eaton ups systems company has a very unfortunate url...
Hi, thanks for watching! Remind me which URL that would be?
Why don't you just buy a quick 220v inverter?
Tell me more! (As far as I understand, my parents' house would need a new panel or sub panel to support 240V in their garage. Their house is all 120V because their kitchen and laundry are gas. If I ever moved in, I'd pay for the upgrade. Would an inverter serve some other purpose?)
@@goingelectric7826 It's called quick 220 box, it's portable device & it gives you 8 miles per hour. How many miles per hour did you get while using the 5-20? thanks for the video.
@@California007 Thanks for the info. I typically track kW speeds and with the NEMA 5-15 it’s 1.1kW and with the 5-20 it’s 1.5 kW. With an average efficiency over the last 33,000mi of 287Wh/mi, that works out to a practical 3.5mi/kWh… compared to the (generally fictitious) EPA rating of 4.5. So given my real world numbers, I can get a reliable 5.25 real world miles per hour on the NEMA 5-20 adapter. (The unreal EPA rating would be 6.75).
1.5kwh is a lot faster than just 1kw.
Hey, thanks for watching and reaching out. It does sound crazy, but 1.5kW is MUCH faster than just 1kW. 50% makes all the difference! :)