@@zweisit is and but i mean ancient tomb was also there. For perspective cavern of souls was a 7 and tomb a 4 in a scale where they just ranked cards in top 10 style.
I actually think the fetch lands are significantly better than the duels. The only difference that duals have to shocks is two life, and while they are still incredibly powerful, the ability for fetchlands to fuel graveyards, shuffle at instant speed, and be whatever color whenever you need, they can even be card selection with the new surveil lands, i think whay fetches do is much more valuable than what og duals provide.
Yes fetches are way better duels would be fine and important but only one in a hundred cards without them with them they're easily 5 to 11 copies in a Deck
Honestly I like Gemstone Caverns a little better than Chrome Mox and Mox Diamond, because when you top deck it with an empty hand it still provides you with a resource you can use. The other two are absolute dead draws with an empty hand AND they trigger Rhystic Study effects and are awful into Rule of Law effects.
I think it depends on what type of deck you are playing too. Turbo decks, particularly ad nauseam decks, will prefer having the rocks, as you only get one land drop per turn.
Mana Confluence gets stopped by Yasharn though. Also City of Brass is a trigger so you can still tap it while at 1 life if you have a way to win at instant speed in response to the trigger.
Cam is 100% right on Forbidden Orchard. It is a 1. I have never felt good about using or including it. I have cut it from every single deck I play (RogSi, Atraxa, Sythis, Krark/Sakashima).
I love how there's more disagreement about lands than any of the actual spells discussed in these podcasts. Rating playability of all 5 colors worth of spells? Easy. True Duel Lands? We riot!
Forbidden Orchard griefing your opponent's Tymna draws and Ragavan attacks is an upside that y'all are missing. Is it as good as Mana Confluence? Probably not. But it's pretty solid.
In the MTGO vintage cube, you definitely pick fetches ahead of duals because triomes also exist. Fetches are a tier above duals in priority. If triomes aren't in the cube, it's much closer.
We need a second part of cEDH lands. Y’all missed so many playable and potent lands- and you even name dropped some (Otawara, Gaea’s). Personally requesting the inclusion of Plaza of Heroes
The new york knicks are named after knickerbockers. It refers to the style of pants dutch settlers wore...pants that rolled up just below the knee, which became known as "Knickerbockers", or "knickers.
Gemstone Mine's quality definitely hinges on your strategy, I think. In a Turbo deck, it's an easy auto-include. Once you start going towards a slower Stax strategy, it falls off pretty quick. Great video!
I'm a little suprised by your opinion on the Prismatic Vista I find that to be at least a 3.1 at least Personally, I will have at least a few basic lands in my deck for various reasons and having something that can deck thin or shuffle the deck can be useful I do hate that it's pricey though
Few months ago I have cut Forbidden Orchard from my Prossh list, BUT, since I realised how good early game Defense of the Heart can be (to find 2-piece creature combo) so I put Forbidden Orchard back to my deck and it works- for me, at least.
Other lands I really like are the Slow lands. I do not play them in all decks, but in two color decks and non-turbo three color decks they are good. Most of the time they come in untapped.
without dual lands and shocklands, the fetchlands would not be nearly as powerful. Tapping a land for one color on turn 1 and another color on turn 2 is where this combo really shines. It's such an old combo and so commonly used that people forget just how powerful it is. If you are new to Magic, the first 20 cards I recommend picking up are a playset of shock lands and a playset of fetch lands, Oh and a playset of original dual lands if you can afford it. You can say "yeah I just started playing Magic, so I only have 30 cards in my collection so far, but that's almost a third of the way to a deck!!"
well... if you are new to magic i think most people don't even know if they'll stick for it for a longer time. maybe the also just play very casually... and then telling them to spend about 100€ on all fetchlands + 100€ on shock lands isn't what i would tell them... that's a 200€ investment for a game you might not stick with for longer. get a precon and check if you enjoy it first.... also before spending 200€ bucks on 20 cards is still not something i would recommand, rather buy a printer with that money and suddenly you can have all you ever might want. i personally would only tell someone to buy them if they wanted to collect cards or just really really dislike playing with proxies. the only real cards i have are about 3000 commons which i just use to put them into sleeves with my printed cards so it acutally feels like a cards and doesn't wobble around lol
@@dekina1198 Hopefully, if someone is new to Magic, they can be given a box of commons, and enough basic lands for 5 mono-colored decks. Casual 60-card formats still exist, but I would recommend that players start with 40-card decks, since a brand new player's whole collection is basically a limited sealed pool. After building up confidence with these casual decks, they could go on to play sealed and draft at an LGS. The value here being the experience more than the cards themselves, but for budget reasons, I recommend cube drafting for new and old players alike.
@@carlospadilla7247 exactly! I do think that the surveil lands will see a bunch more play in budget decks going forward now that we've had a month to try em out.
I run a handful of the pain lands that also tap for colorless in my Kenrith deck for one reason, Eldrazi Displacer. You need colorless mana to activate his flicker ability, and he's my backup should I lose access to Emiel. Eldrazi Displacer is also nice because you can us him to tap opponents' creatures if need be, something Emiel can't do.
Gaea's cradle - 4.7 creature decks play this card Reflecting pool - 4.1 bad first, can't color fix. Still great (I love this card and am rating it higher than it should probably go out of personal bias) Triomes - 2.6 just run a surveil land in this slot Reveal lands - 1 bad don't give your opponent free info Buddy lands - 1.8 only run in 2 color decks, meh
I do not agree - fetch lands are better then OG Duals. Fetch lads can go for Shocks, Triom, Basic, and some other lands with "type". If you see blood moon, you can go get the "one" basic You have in deck, to get mana for remuval etc. So if we would get banned OG Duals, we would still play all fetches ;) On top of that fetches shuffle - what really metter more then people think ;) Ther is a reason why Fetches are higher priority at start then OG Duals in Cube Draft ;) Still both are top , and agree 5/5 ;P
The "Knicks" in "New York Knicks" is short for "Knickerbockers". It's a name associated with the Dutch settlers of the area that later became New York. As for "kn" in general, just weird language evolution stuff. /shrug
Fetchlands are better than duals imo overall. In 5c, I would usually play all 10 fetchlands, but only 9 or 8 duals. Your least important color combinations aren't that great really. Every fetchland gives you access to any color you want (even when playing 9 or 8 duals), but your worst duals are just bad draws.
Omg.. I thought this was new today. Then I commented on it. Then I saw my little “budget Pubstomper emblem” and saw SOMEONE HAD COMMENTED WITH MY ACCOUNT!!🤬🤬🤬🤬 Turns out this video is 2 months old.😂
"I don't play a lot of City of Traitors just because I don't like that it doesn't stick around so maybe you can help me with this...I totally forgot my question." "Is it any good?" "Is it any good! Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah" How high are you two?
It's too bad *_City of Taitors_* is banned in everything except Legacy, Vintage, Commander, and Oath Breaker. More to the point, I'm sad it's banned in Modern.
At 20:15 one of you guys mentioned how the top deck tutors plus fetching for the surveil lands, turns them all into entombs 🤣🤣. That is completely untrue and you guys should read the cards a little closer. It will make you shuffle before the surveil trigger hits the stack and waste your tutor completely
I think gemstone caverns can be overrated. While it’s a great land when it’s in the opener, if it’s not it’s almost a dead card in certain decks. For example I like to play Niv Mizzet but I don’t play gemstone because I depend on my colors way to much to risk it not being in my opener. Once I get into 4-5 color decks it can also be a little sketchy depending on your color count.
I've killed a player with a City of Brass by blinking Derevi (Emiel + Cradle). But other than this sort of niche interaction, City of Brass is better than Mana Confluence.
To play devil's advocate, I don't think I've ever seen anyone use a spirit from forbidden orchard for anything useful in my entire time playing cedh. There's always one deck in a pod that just doesn't care about having spirits or is way too behind for it to matter. There's also the upside that I've seen many times where people give away spirits for free to keep a tevesh from getting to the ultimate lmao. Idk maybe I'm biased because of the decks I play against all the time but I don't think it's bad.
Krark and sakashima don’t play city of traitors, we are a very pip heavy deck and can’t afford many colorless lands besides ancient tomb and emergence zone
Fetches are definitely better in 3+ decks because it finds all 3 colours while duals only have 2 colours If i could choose og duals or fetches id pick fetches and take shockes instead
well yes technically they should make colorless a "color" as that symbol can only be paid via colorless mana... so yes technically it would be a sixth color and technically waste lands should be a new type of basic land
yeah, sure. but appart from mono white decks i never see land tax in cEDH and even then, it's more used to kinda trim your deck to draw your important cards more often
Mana confluence is better than city of brass. The few reasons city might be better are not worth considering and are never gonna be a reason to play city but not mana confluence.
Did i completely miss it or were the triomes completely skipped? In a three color deck i am picking triomes up over surveil lands unless it combos with something
In cube you usually want to take fetch lands before dual lands, not because they are necessarily better, but because they are in higher demand/lower supply. There are usually shocks, tiomes, and now surveil lands that can all be paired with fetches.
forbidden orchard is also meh if your deck wants to connect with creatures. like najeela tokens get blocked, tymna decks doesn't want them because you wanna connect to
Hi, coming into play tapped makes them too slow/not optimal for cEDH. A 3-color deck already plays 3 duals, 3 shocks, 7 fetch lands, Command Tower, Mana Confluence, City of Brass, Exotic Orchard, Gemstone Caverns and few other 2-colored, that comes untapped (like Battlebond ones or Modern Horizon ping lands). Then there’s handful of utility lands and triomes just don’t make the cut.
color fixing in cEDH is really good even in 5c so them tapping for 3 colors isn't a huge boon. That small benefit doesn't outweigh the drawback of them coming in tapped, even if you just run one in your 99 and then fetch it when you aren't doing anything else. That last scenario has also been taken up by the surveil lands, so there really isn't any place for them.
having a turn 1 play is pretty important in cEDH, especially if you have faster decks at the table. so having lands that come is only okey if there is another upside. and tapping for 3 colors isn't enough imo. i think the once that are fetchable can be played in exactly 3 color decks. but appart from that, they mostly only see play in budget lists
i personally see Cavern of Souls as a utility land, not just mana. it's good if you play with some sort of tribal, like winota would but appart from that, there are not many decks that play it. maybe in tivit or atraxa to not get your big mana payoff countered. but i see it in no other decks. i agree about gaea's cradle tho
yeah, gitrog can really use some of those... but gitrog doesn't see much play, nor have either of cam/dylan ever played gitrog on the channel (atleast i can't remember any game) so that's probably why it wasn't even on their radar
i feel like the print count and prices of each of these lands should had been mentioned. Because let's be real, if the land can enter untapped and provide you with options of colors, it's going to be more valuable and sought after than a land that would enter tapped especially since right now we only have about three cards available in the game right now that allows lands to enter untapped.
cEDH is a competative format, so you play the best cards you have access to, and the format is so proxy friends, 300 bucks for a dual land isn't worth it if you are not looking at collecting. instead buy a printer for that money and you have all your cards you ever want
The price of the original dual lands I think should put them below the fetch lands due to accessibility issues and the fact fetches have no suitable alternative, whereas we have shock lands as replacement dual lands.
99% of the cEDH community is totally fine with proxies, so instead of buying a dual for 300€ you can also just buy a printer for 300€ and have all cards you ever want (to a little of extra expenses for ink and paper)
Cavern of Souls not making the list is a war crime
Isn't that one in utility lands? I feel like that'd make more sense lol
@@zweisit is and but i mean ancient tomb was also there. For perspective cavern of souls was a 7 and tomb a 4 in a scale where they just ranked cards in top 10 style.
But I would agree? Outside of tivit, godo, and atraxa, who runs it?
@@skylerdavis8839 Blue Farm does
They talked about it on their other land review cast I’m pretty sure
I have never passionately disagreed with a rankings list more, god i love play to win content
🤣This is an accurate comment! Still great content!
What did you disagree with?
I yelled at cam that fetchlands were printed in onslaught and finished in zendikar then the orderlies dragged me back to the old folks home.
This land is your land. This land is my land. From Underground river to the basic Island.
You win today
This game was made for you and me🎶
@@javiernaranjo8087if I'm playing Underground River and Basic Island then this game was made for me and me.
This land was made for you and me 🎶 (Rainbow Vale)
I actually think the fetch lands are significantly better than the duels. The only difference that duals have to shocks is two life, and while they are still incredibly powerful, the ability for fetchlands to fuel graveyards, shuffle at instant speed, and be whatever color whenever you need, they can even be card selection with the new surveil lands, i think whay fetches do is much more valuable than what og duals provide.
That's a good way to look at it.
Yes fetches are way better duels would be fine and important but only one in a hundred cards without them with them they're easily 5 to 11 copies in a Deck
You are correct, mostly because of a little card called Brainstorm.
Definitely. Even with a mono colored deck playing fetches lets you slim down the deck given some more consistent draws
If Duals really are better than fetches, in a 5c deck with 10 fetches you should have all 10 duals as well and I don't think that's the case
I love that when Cam gets over excited his laugh is literally hyuk hyuk hyuk hyuk
Honestly I like Gemstone Caverns a little better than Chrome Mox and Mox Diamond, because when you top deck it with an empty hand it still provides you with a resource you can use. The other two are absolute dead draws with an empty hand AND they trigger Rhystic Study effects and are awful into Rule of Law effects.
I think it depends on what type of deck you are playing too. Turbo decks, particularly ad nauseam decks, will prefer having the rocks, as you only get one land drop per turn.
@@mitchellsellers7791exactly, turbo decks will want the rocks to get a faster naus but it’ll also enable a better post-naus too
38:20 Mana Confluence is slightly better than City of Brass, Cam is always right and Food Chain always wins games.
Nah City is beter
Agreed. If you have urborg or Yavimaya, Confluence can be tapped for ⚫️ or 🟢 to prevent life loss, but Brass will deal damage no matter what
Giving your opponents a trigger to respond to is always a potential downside brass is far worse
Mana Confluence gets stopped by Yasharn though.
Also City of Brass is a trigger so you can still tap it while at 1 life if you have a way to win at instant speed in response to the trigger.
@@InmAncalagonKarn’s Sylex stops it too, although it’s rare you’d see in in cEDH though lol
4:50 OG Zendikar was the first set that had enemy colored fetches. Cam isn't totally wrong.
Diplomatic 👍
You can tutor command tower with tower winder!
Cam is 100% right on Forbidden Orchard. It is a 1. I have never felt good about using or including it. I have cut it from every single deck I play (RogSi, Atraxa, Sythis, Krark/Sakashima).
is it just me or does Glimmervoid not get enough love?
24:26 this laugh can cure any depression
HYUK hyuk hyuk hyuk hyuk hyuk a gah ha
Guys forgot: Cavern of Souls, Urza's Saga, Otawara and Boseiju!
Those were in the utility lands list they did a bit ago!!
Again every land you mentioned is a utility land
I love how there's more disagreement about lands than any of the actual spells discussed in these podcasts. Rating playability of all 5 colors worth of spells? Easy. True Duel Lands? We riot!
Forbidden Orchard griefing your opponent's Tymna draws and Ragavan attacks is an upside that y'all are missing. Is it as good as Mana Confluence? Probably not. But it's pretty solid.
In the MTGO vintage cube, you definitely pick fetches ahead of duals because triomes also exist. Fetches are a tier above duals in priority. If triomes aren't in the cube, it's much closer.
We need a second part of cEDH lands. Y’all missed so many playable and potent lands- and you even name dropped some (Otawara, Gaea’s). Personally requesting the inclusion of Plaza of Heroes
The new york knicks are named after knickerbockers. It refers to the style of pants dutch settlers wore...pants that rolled up just below the knee, which became known as "Knickerbockers", or "knickers.
I feel you cam. I also have that excited puppy loud voice energy.
The constant threat of a potential "I Think You Should Leave" reference keeps me coming back
Whenever there isn't I think "this is the greatest betrayal that's ever been seen"
City of Traitors is better than black lotus, Play to Win certified
You guys should rank all the banned cards 🙏 was inspired when you definitively decided that City of Traitors is 100% a better card then black lotus
Gemstone Mine's quality definitely hinges on your strategy, I think. In a Turbo deck, it's an easy auto-include. Once you start going towards a slower Stax strategy, it falls off pretty quick.
Great video!
It brings me untold joy that Cam has a One Piece laugh.
I'm a little suprised by your opinion on the Prismatic Vista I find that to be at least a 3.1 at least
Personally, I will have at least a few basic lands in my deck for various reasons and having something that can deck thin or shuffle the deck can be useful
I do hate that it's pricey though
Few months ago I have cut Forbidden Orchard from my Prossh list, BUT, since I realised how good early game Defense of the Heart can be (to find 2-piece creature combo) so I put Forbidden Orchard back to my deck and it works- for me, at least.
A little Surprised to not see thran quarry, Rog loves that land. I think it still sees play in Najeela and other creature based decks too.
Other lands I really like are the Slow lands. I do not play them in all decks, but in two color decks and non-turbo three color decks they are good. Most of the time they come in untapped.
I love me a good glimmervoid risky but effective
fetchlands are nr1, would rate them nr 1 just cos they can find utility as well
Great video. I'd love to see you all talk about the best combo's in cEDH soon.
Cam: *"Fetchlands are lands printed in Zendikar..."*
Onslaught: *"Am I a joke to you?"*
Edit: Cam corrected himself
in Zendikar they completed the cycle, so he is not 100% wrong
Id have ancient tomb at 5 if your playing signets.
appart from acrane signet, signets rarely see play in cEDH
@@dekina1198 He probably means talismans which do see plenty of play
Good call on terminating the decimal on 1.99. If you don't, it's just equal to 2.
Really cool part about Dylan playing Atraxa I get to hear her as a frame of reference for the next 2 months in videos. I am genuinely happy about it!.
How good would a sliver queen deck be?
Disagree that duals are better than fetches.
I can understand missing Serra’s Sanctum, but Gaea’s Cradle?!?!
same. i think the only deck that can use Serra's Sanctum would be Sythis
without dual lands and shocklands, the fetchlands would not be nearly as powerful. Tapping a land for one color on turn 1 and another color on turn 2 is where this combo really shines. It's such an old combo and so commonly used that people forget just how powerful it is. If you are new to Magic, the first 20 cards I recommend picking up are a playset of shock lands and a playset of fetch lands, Oh and a playset of original dual lands if you can afford it. You can say "yeah I just started playing Magic, so I only have 30 cards in my collection so far, but that's almost a third of the way to a deck!!"
well... if you are new to magic i think most people don't even know if they'll stick for it for a longer time. maybe the also just play very casually... and then telling them to spend about 100€ on all fetchlands + 100€ on shock lands isn't what i would tell them... that's a 200€ investment for a game you might not stick with for longer.
get a precon and check if you enjoy it first.... also before spending 200€ bucks on 20 cards is still not something i would recommand, rather buy a printer with that money and suddenly you can have all you ever might want.
i personally would only tell someone to buy them if they wanted to collect cards or just really really dislike playing with proxies.
the only real cards i have are about 3000 commons which i just use to put them into sleeves with my printed cards so it acutally feels like a cards and doesn't wobble around lol
@@dekina1198 Hopefully, if someone is new to Magic, they can be given a box of commons, and enough basic lands for 5 mono-colored decks. Casual 60-card formats still exist, but I would recommend that players start with 40-card decks, since a brand new player's whole collection is basically a limited sealed pool. After building up confidence with these casual decks, they could go on to play sealed and draft at an LGS. The value here being the experience more than the cards themselves, but for budget reasons, I recommend cube drafting for new and old players alike.
I'm so sad that the tango lands didn't get mentioned. I feel like I lean to those before even considering the surveil lands.
Remember, this is from the pov of cedh not budget and surveil lands are fetchable so Unless your 2 color deck has 40 land, why would you run these?
@@carlospadilla7247 exactly! I do think that the surveil lands will see a bunch more play in budget decks going forward now that we've had a month to try em out.
I run a handful of the pain lands that also tap for colorless in my Kenrith deck for one reason, Eldrazi Displacer. You need colorless mana to activate his flicker ability, and he's my backup should I lose access to Emiel. Eldrazi Displacer is also nice because you can us him to tap opponents' creatures if need be, something Emiel can't do.
Gaea's cradle - 4.7 creature decks play this card
Reflecting pool - 4.1 bad first, can't color fix. Still great
(I love this card and am rating it higher than it should probably go out of personal bias)
Triomes - 2.6 just run a surveil land in this slot
Reveal lands - 1 bad don't give your opponent free info
Buddy lands - 1.8 only run in 2 color decks, meh
I do not agree - fetch lands are better then OG Duals. Fetch lads can go for Shocks, Triom, Basic, and some other lands with "type". If you see blood moon, you can go get the "one" basic You have in deck, to get mana for remuval etc. So if we would get banned OG Duals, we would still play all fetches ;)
On top of that fetches shuffle - what really metter more then people think ;)
Ther is a reason why Fetches are higher priority at start then OG Duals in Cube Draft ;)
Still both are top , and agree 5/5 ;P
Fetches are always better than duals, even more now with the surveil lands
The "Knicks" in "New York Knicks" is short for "Knickerbockers". It's a name associated with the Dutch settlers of the area that later became New York. As for "kn" in general, just weird language evolution stuff.
/shrug
Fetchlands are better than duals imo overall. In 5c, I would usually play all 10 fetchlands, but only 9 or 8 duals. Your least important color combinations aren't that great really. Every fetchland gives you access to any color you want (even when playing 9 or 8 duals), but your worst duals are just bad draws.
Omg.. I thought this was new today. Then I commented on it. Then I saw my little “budget Pubstomper emblem” and saw SOMEONE HAD COMMENTED WITH MY ACCOUNT!!🤬🤬🤬🤬
Turns out this video is 2 months old.😂
"I don't play a lot of City of Traitors just because I don't like that it doesn't stick around so maybe you can help me with this...I totally forgot my question."
"Is it any good?"
"Is it any good! Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah"
How high are you two?
It's too bad *_City of Taitors_* is banned in everything except Legacy, Vintage, Commander, and Oath Breaker. More to the point, I'm sad it's banned in Modern.
At 20:15 one of you guys mentioned how the top deck tutors plus fetching for the surveil lands, turns them all into entombs 🤣🤣. That is completely untrue and you guys should read the cards a little closer. It will make you shuffle before the surveil trigger hits the stack and waste your tutor completely
I think gemstone caverns can be overrated. While it’s a great land when it’s in the opener, if it’s not it’s almost a dead card in certain decks. For example I like to play Niv Mizzet but I don’t play gemstone because I depend on my colors way to much to risk it not being in my opener. Once I get into 4-5 color decks it can also be a little sketchy depending on your color count.
I've killed a player with a City of Brass by blinking Derevi (Emiel + Cradle). But other than this sort of niche interaction, City of Brass is better than Mana Confluence.
To play devil's advocate, I don't think I've ever seen anyone use a spirit from forbidden orchard for anything useful in my entire time playing cedh. There's always one deck in a pod that just doesn't care about having spirits or is way too behind for it to matter. There's also the upside that I've seen many times where people give away spirits for free to keep a tevesh from getting to the ultimate lmao. Idk maybe I'm biased because of the decks I play against all the time but I don't think it's bad.
"Let's talk about lands. NOT utility lands, but the other lands, just mana lands!...OK then, Number ONE: fetch lands!" XD
Thanks for your content and ranking:)🎉 .
But i cant find the triome lands😢. Does this means my deck are wores then decks with standardlands?😮😂😢😂
The best deck to play Forbidden Orchard is definetely Kelsien, The Plague. One guaranted exp. counter each turn 👍🏽.
Forbidden Orchard is a solid 4 in my ikra kraum deck. Superb Synergy with Culling Ritual ;) hehehe
Krarkashima plays forbidden orchard in order to abuse snap
How are surveil lands not a 5/5!?!? They are basically timewalks! Fetchable uncounterable timewalks
Krark and sakashima don’t play city of traitors, we are a very pip heavy deck and can’t afford many colorless lands besides ancient tomb and emergence zone
Fetches are definitely better in 3+ decks because it finds all 3 colours while duals only have 2 colours
If i could choose og duals or fetches id pick fetches and take shockes instead
One of the utterly useless facts taking up space in my brain is the New York Knicks is shortened from knickerboxers.
well yes technically they should make colorless a "color" as that symbol can only be paid via colorless mana... so yes technically it would be a sixth color and technically waste lands should be a new type of basic land
Fetches are better than the OG Duals. You always wanna see a fetch over a dual outside of very specific scenarios like Oppo.
Land tax for basics are something
yeah, sure. but appart from mono white decks i never see land tax in cEDH and even then, it's more used to kinda trim your deck to draw your important cards more often
haha very random but in case no one answered the New York Knicks are named originally the New York Knickerbockers which was later shortened.
I mean I don't know the horizon lands are that much worse than basics I mean, I've ran them in some CDH decks, I know korvald doesn't hate them
Mana confluence is better than city of brass. The few reasons city might be better are not worth considering and are never gonna be a reason to play city but not mana confluence.
Did i completely miss it or were the triomes completely skipped? In a three color deck i am picking triomes up over surveil lands unless it combos with something
From a Niv boy, cascade bluffs doesn’t see play. There’s just better options even for two color decks
Pain lands and horizon lands should be a scoach higher, because you have to use them for a 4th turn to have lost more life than fetching for a shock
I feel like great hall of the citadel is pretty good. It’s like a signet that can also tap for colorless except it can filter for any combo of colors
In cube you usually want to take fetch lands before dual lands, not because they are necessarily better, but because they are in higher demand/lower supply. There are usually shocks, tiomes, and now surveil lands that can all be paired with fetches.
forbidden orchard is also meh if your deck wants to connect with creatures. like najeela tokens get blocked, tymna decks doesn't want them because you wanna connect to
Newer to cEDH but for 3/4 color decks do we not even consider triomes?
Hi, coming into play tapped makes them too slow/not optimal for cEDH. A 3-color deck already plays 3 duals, 3 shocks, 7 fetch lands, Command Tower, Mana Confluence, City of Brass, Exotic Orchard, Gemstone Caverns and few other 2-colored, that comes untapped (like Battlebond ones or Modern Horizon ping lands). Then there’s handful of utility lands and triomes just don’t make the cut.
color fixing in cEDH is really good even in 5c so them tapping for 3 colors isn't a huge boon. That small benefit doesn't outweigh the drawback of them coming in tapped, even if you just run one in your 99 and then fetch it when you aren't doing anything else. That last scenario has also been taken up by the surveil lands, so there really isn't any place for them.
having a turn 1 play is pretty important in cEDH, especially if you have faster decks at the table. so having lands that come is only okey if there is another upside. and tapping for 3 colors isn't enough imo. i think the once that are fetchable can be played in exactly 3 color decks. but appart from that, they mostly only see play in budget lists
Does anyone here think that Gemstone Caverns is a trap card, like most times just useless? On the fence about it.
What about the lands that tap for 2 colors and removes a counter? I uae it in monocolor / 2 color heavy pip comanders.
Isn’t knicks for knickers? Like the British word? I’m just guessing
Knicks are called the Knicks because of the word Knickerbacker which is what they are actually named after
pain lands deserved a higher spot. atleast 2.9/2.8. (my bias ranking is 3.5)
I didn't come to this channel to get upset about the officiating in Sixers-Knicks again 😭
I think Cam would gain winrate in cube by drafting fetches before duels.
City of Brass is better, you can win at instant speed with the damage trigger on the stack.
I think y'all are a little too low on Surveil lands, those things are literally Time Walks
Becky’s Drive-in? Are you guys in Northampton or what?
Tri-Lands don’t make the cut? Even four and five color decks?
"Fetchlands, originally printed in zendikar"
Oh no...
I agree with cam, everyone playing forbidden orchard is wrong
Gonna run the new Kambal and forbidden orchard just to trigger cam
No Gaea's Cradle? I feel like we forgot some lands existed here lol
Prismatic vista is good because it thins your deck I said what I said
I guess I'm the only one who likes filter lands 😢
city of brass is better because when i play it i can say i play the city of ass
How could you forget about Gaea's Cradle?? I agree with the test of the ranking, but forgetting that card is a crimen. Also Cavern of souls.
i personally see Cavern of Souls as a utility land, not just mana. it's good if you play with some sort of tribal, like winota would but appart from that, there are not many decks that play it. maybe in tivit or atraxa to not get your big mana payoff countered. but i see it in no other decks.
i agree about gaea's cradle tho
So many of those lands they were talking bad about, I was just thinking “Gitrog plays that…” 😂😂 but yeah, they aren’t as good in other decks
yeah, gitrog can really use some of those... but gitrog doesn't see much play, nor have either of cam/dylan ever played gitrog on the channel (atleast i can't remember any game) so that's probably why it wasn't even on their radar
i feel like the print count and prices of each of these lands should had been mentioned. Because let's be real, if the land can enter untapped and provide you with options of colors, it's going to be more valuable and sought after than a land that would enter tapped especially since right now we only have about three cards available in the game right now that allows lands to enter untapped.
cEDH is a competative format, so you play the best cards you have access to, and the format is so proxy friends, 300 bucks for a dual land isn't worth it if you are not looking at collecting. instead buy a printer for that money and you have all your cards you ever want
The price of the original dual lands I think should put them below the fetch lands due to accessibility issues and the fact fetches have no suitable alternative, whereas we have shock lands as replacement dual lands.
99% of the cEDH community is totally fine with proxies, so instead of buying a dual for 300€ you can also just buy a printer for 300€ and have all cards you ever want (to a little of extra expenses for ink and paper)
My only takeaway is that Gemstone is MINE! 😂
No Pathways? Or are these just too specific?