Manhattan Circuit Construction Technique for Homebrew Ham Radios
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2024
- This Manhattan Circuit Construction Technique for Homebrew Ham Radios is very common with ham radio homebrewers. Doug DeMaw, W1FB, wrote an article titled ”Quick-and-Easy Circuit Boards for the Beginner” detailing construction using what is referred to as dead bug or ugly construction. In the same article by Doug DeMaw, Figure 3 shows the use of printed circuit board squares glued to the main printed circuit board. The squares are used to solder component leads to for common electrical and mechanical connections. This technique is attributed to Wes Hayward, W7ZOI, and Wes suggested using hot glue as a fixitive to hold the pads in place.
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This gives "HUGE GROUND PLANE" a new meaning.
I like using SMD components on that board you can get with islands in a 0.1 inch raster. You can naively design and build, and it just works up to half a GHz or so, without any regard for stray reacrances.
I use a much better way than this but it is along the same lines, I use a 8 or 10mm mirror tube drill to just take the surface copper off the board leaving a circular pad to solder components to. Tube drills are hollow in the centre with an abrasive edge. Its easier with a press drill and takes minutes to cut many 'islands'. Use double sided copper clad boards to keep the RF shielding.
In high-school electronics shop class we etched the circuit into the copper and then drilled into the board to attach the components after covering the copper with solder
I did too. I think the point of this construction is to have a good ground plain for high frequency or low noise applications. I wouldn't use super glue though.
@@BlankBrainpcb has two sides. You could just not cut into the other side. Drill holes, go through, solder. This video already mounts stuff on the surface. PCB makes this easier. I like wires in the air. Nothing has lower k.
That's far better than this nonsense.
@@Bobsmith-yf9oyThis ground plane technique allows circuits to work up to high uhf bands and lower microwaves.. with many other techniques one has to really know rf pcb design.. I've never had a problem with unstable circuits..also it's quite easy to manage return currents to minimize emi. But yes..not my go to way to make other type of circuits at home
@@Bobsmith-yf9oy RF design is often quite an iterative process. Ofcourse if you use a tested schematic from someone else, etching would work very well. But many HAMs design their own circuitry from scratch for components they have on hand. Usually you draw up something, and start correcting values, adding extra components, moving them around etc until your circuit does what you want it to do. Simulating doesn't work anymore here, paracitic inducantces and capacitances play a large role now too.
Obviously most of these cases you need only one of such device, you already made something that's probably quite sturdily built, so there's no point to go through the whole process to etch a PCB anymore. It's a super popular technique that's been in use for decades for prototyping.
Just go dig up some pictures of circuit design techniques from engineers like Bob Pease, maybe one of the most influential analog engineers in the silicon domain to have ever lived, he'd build discrete chip designs just like this technique to debug everything before translating it into a chip, a lot of them still being in production today. I personally have built equipment with this technique that's been going for over a decade now, weekly use, never had any trouble because it was mechanically inferior.
For those wondering, this is for circuit where you need a huge ground plane. Anything high frequency, radio stuff, filters, etc. If you think a regular perf board will work, this technique is beyond your knowledge level for now
👍
Than is point-to‐point wiring or components to same points also better for amps i take it. ( like the 60s gitar-tubeamps build. With a hardboard layout ,one row of point on top and one row at other end everything 'zig-zag' to many common points . Everything as short in distance as possible the tube wire twined and solid metal casing were al ground/mass conects to.
Or is this tech in vid essentially different?
Will this board somehow give me a “ground” while living in a Waikiki high rise that has no real ground with all the PVC that’s been used for plumbing repairs? 🤔
For those wondering, this guy's arrogance places courtesy and good manners well beyond their knowledge level.
There's pretty much zero advantage of this over just etching a circuit on a pcb with a ground copper pour. Less wasted time and money too
- Reminds me of the old;
" *HEATH KIT.* "
days.
I used this technique for a radio project I built many years ago. It worked very well. I drew the grid of lines onto the board, then used a hacksaw blade to cut away the lines leaving isolated squares on the board. Then soldered each component in place on the appropriate squares. And it worked !
@@thomas-i5o7h Back in high school I used a slightly different method. I'd score the board with a utility knife then uses a laminate cutting knife to cut away the copper. They made a nice V cut through the copper as it was pulled.
@@miket2120 ; That's great !! It's always so cool to build a project entirely by hand from scratch and have it work !!
My Heathkit projects still work and look a lot better I do want a new digital oscilloscope but my Heathkit is an old friend
Another technique you can do is use a Dremel tool to remove the copper to make the islands. It took a while for my manhattans chowder tin from QRP me to arrive so I ended up using that for a transceiver project I’ve been working on.
Doesn't work with solid metal, which matters because sometimes people will use the metal of a case as part or all of the ground, while you can pretty much always cut any copper-clad that you have into small pieces for use as the "islands" in Manhatten style.
A relative is Dead-Bug style, where essentially you glue down the sonductive top of an IC, then solder to it's legs. Dead bug is highly compatible with Manhatten style.
You can also use a laser to vaporize the bits of copper you don't need. It's a bit less of a mess, but the equipment buy in is a lot more.
Would probably have a little lower capacitance than "Manhattan" construction.
Ive never once seen it done like this, and I've worked with a lot of old home made electronics.
Manhattan style is great for RF projects since you have that massive ground plane. Using protoboard can sometimes create parasitic capacitance that you might not want
Breadboards under the plastic have big ground plains and positive power rails... Works just as good and if you need a bigger ground for signal you can literally just add a chunk of thin copper tape and wire it to the ground rail.. @@JonathanKayne
About 40 years ago, at my start in radio, I used the same technics ... 😊
@@michaellegg9381Absolutely not, breadboards are pretty much the worst possible choice for any high speed digital or RF projects. They have considerable parasitic capacitance between each row and they don't have anything approaching a ground plane.
Don't forget to keep the lead lengths short. Oh, nevermind.....
Thank you! I literally asked this question yesterday. This makes a lot of sense. Having a good ground plane is very important for sensitive circuitry.
I think it's because of the purpose, ham radio. The ground plane is very important, when it's RF you're working with. Maybe not much of an explanation, but that's my conclusion. I also think it looks awesome 👍
So a ground plane is going from very low resistance to very high resistance without much of a gradient in between. So copper, mirror polish surface , air. And most parts need a pin soldered to it anyway.
Just, these parts are all so huge. Those long Leads have uFarrads of inductivity.
@@ArneChristianRosenfeldtyou mean nHenry...
@@ArneChristianRosenfeldtThe rule of thumb is 1nH/mm, so no, none of these components have microhenries of inductance in their leads.
This is such a good technique for me. I like dead bug construction. Thanks for making this video.
35 years ago there was a magazine "tehnics" every month they would print the layout for different boards and I used to carbon copy on the plate, insulate with tar and burn the rest off with acid, did you know we can build a radio with no power source? 😅
radio with no power source.. wasn't that just a germanium diode on two long wires and a crystal speaker? I think that was for longwave stations?
@@tigerchills2079With a suitable antenna and careful construction you can build a crystal set to receive short wave.
I’ve seen automotive radios from the 50s like this.
In HS electronics class, we were told to leave maximum copper so the etching bath would last a lot longer.
ha ha!
Why do Americans always mispronounce the word "solder"? It's not sodder. It's solder. It rhymes with colder and bolder.
I don’t know. Why do people from the UK add an “f” sound to the pronunciation of Lieutenant?
@lizlilly6756 I have no idea. It's crazy.
"Sodder" is how my Canadian dad said it back in the early '80s. He worked at IBM and got his job with no education because he passed their entrance test due to having electronics as a hobby as a kid and workiing in an electronics shop aa a teenager. He later became head of computer security for the biggest bank in the country and kept an eye on what hackers were capable of overcoming. "Sodder" is therefore the historical pronounciation.
No need to cut squares, too much work. Use 'dead bug' and wire point to point.
It's a valid point depending on the use case.
Burnt superglue is the worst smell. Burns the eyes.
What's the purpose of this vs a perforated thru hole tinned pcb?
You can use the entire case as the ground plain.
@@absalomdraconis Ground plane.
You get a solid ground plane and you can minimise component lead lengths (not so much in this video!).
This circuit used transistor numbers 🙏🏻
Thanks for watching
But why would you do that, when you can etch it, drill it, solder it and be done with it?
I don't see the purpose.
Good for prototyping. No need to waste time on etching and where to ground.
Though this isn’t a prototype, but follows a text book.
Wow.
A new way for me to screw things up.....😊
Why use a double sided copper clad board? It seems you only need a single ground plane.
Isn’t it a wet production process? How do you clad only a single side?
Double sided PCB stock is easier to find than single sided these days, but you are correct that single sided could be used.
I Just Use Double Sided Copper PCB Material, I Dremmel It , I Mean, I Deremmel The Squares In And Then Clip Them off And Solder To Any projectts I Have So There ARe Two Layers
I see some questions about the stray capacitance of those "MeSquares", so i did a little calculation.
C=Eplison*(A/d), Epsilon is the product of the electric constant times the relativ permittivity of FR4 in this case which is about 4.4. A = Area of overlap of the 2 plates of the capacitor, which in this case is roughly 5x5mm per "MeSquare". d= distance between the plates which is commonly on FR4 boards 1.6mm. Lets put this all into SI metrics -> (8,5*10^-12)*(4,4)*(25*10^-6):(1,6*10^-3) = ~5.8*10^-13 Farads or around 0,6 pF per "MeSquare". Time this with 15 (i counted the last circuit board he showed) and you have about 9pF capacitance on the whole board added. Not a whole lot to be fair, but in very high frequencies (Gigahertz) this might matter.
If you find an error in this calculation please do correct in the comments. ;-)
This video is a product placement promotion. "Manhattan Construction" does not require a solid copper board or the special adhesive 'ME' pads and can be performed on old style breadboards. Manhattan Construction is just a method of positioning the leads and the components through more careful planning to facilitate shorter leads and neater arrangement.
You can also "punch out" with a tool round copper discs from a copper clad circuit board and then glue those round discs to the board. I forget now the name of the tool but it's cheap and easy to find.
Called a 'hole punch'
why bother? Today you can use PCB design sofware and have a circuit board professionally made on million $ machines in a Chinese factory and posted back to you within 3 weeks, less if you pay to have it couriered. And it will cost as much as a large pizza. Oh and BTW they can manufacture boards on various substrates including Rogers and PTFE which are suited to high frequency applications. So design it, and have a pro PCB in 3 weeks!
Or!! Just bare with me a minute BUY A CHEAP BREADBOARD!! it's way easier looks better and no glue that eventually breaks off from heat or age!! And costs around the same!! This kind of crap was ditched back in the dark ages!!!!
its also called 'Dead bug' construction, which also allows gluing flat-sided components down with wires-up, soldering the joints in-the-air, and other easy and useful shenanegans.
Its 200x better than "dead bug" technique...I can't stand dead bug electronics. I mean...have some self respect. Several people in my physics dept made the ugliest, messiest, dead bug electronics for one of our big projects and not only did they not work but they looked like someone soldered together a bunch of trash from the labs garbage can. Wish they'd have used this technique instead, maybe their electronics would have actually worked.
In the 1980's and maybe even before that, you could buy ready-made adhesive pads with soldering points. The product was called "Minimount".
Идиотизм… На медном слое можно просто прорезать разделяющие борозды, создав тем самым площадки для монтажа элементов. Техника монтажа в данном видео - это забивание гвоздя микроскопом.
If solder for the Yankees is SODDER !
Is a folder a FODDER ?! 😂
Gold must be God
Sold = sod
Old = od
Bold = bod
Cold = cod
Hold = hod
Told = tod
Long time ago we used to scratch 10x10mm grid on copper clad board using a hook knife. Now i use Spice simulator for testing, then order PCB in China.
Jesus wept, its ugly, slow, expensive, unprofessional and unsuitable for anything using a chip. A Fail on all counts. Just why?
Im terrible at soldering. Always. A concern i have is that the electronic civiit will be overheated and fail when the hot solder melts onto it. Yet i watch as people calmly apply hot solder. And i have a 60 watt soldering gun ,brand truper, probably cheap demonic Chinese government counterfeit knockoffsnd the tips degrade and start ti disuntegrate and dint transfer enough heat to the flat tip of the soldering gun, thus ,poor technique on my part
So everry node (point of connection) on that circuit diagram would be equivalent to one square then... 🤔🤔🤔
Why glue on bits? Why not just cut the copper into square sections and use that? Leave a ring or rail around the rim for power and ground. A scorer would do the trick.
I don't see the advantage to this considering pre drilled prototype boards are now cheap and I would imagine faster than this. I would expect it to be easier to solder.
is there any reason this would be better than ordering boards, other than knowing you built it yourself, and maybe prototyping speed?
The gluing doesn't seem like a good idea, i would cut up a double-sided pcb and use that as pad then surface mount it to the ground plane
You can also use 10 mega ohm resistors for pads for some circuits.
It is an easy way to replicate a schematic into pcb. It also gives a great amount of ground plane
For those who cannot design a printer circuit board.. this is more expensive than ordering one these days
Anybody make audi circuits with this or would they be more prone to interference
Looks like a gigantic waste of copper that should be used for wiring instead.
Nah, just drill circular islands or just straight up use a dremmel tool to create your islands and thats it, much better
Can not subscribe to this channel. Why????????😢😢😢😢😢😢
th-cam.com/video/vq968AFgPhg/w-d-xo.html this video shows another method to the one onthis video
Looks rubbish to me. Why not use vero strip much easier and way neater
Super interesting!!
Thanks
the hell. who asked? etching pcb are better, easier, faster, cleaner
you can also cut off a piece and make small islands with the cut-off piece. if the board is double-sided, you can even solder the islands on instead of gluing them. only make sure that the solder is only on the bottom, maintaining an isolated plane on top
Does not make any sense IMHO. Just over working. Glues conductive piece OVER another conductive plate ???
There is a fiberglass substrate between the two copper pads on those squares
pretty neat will keep this in mind instead of perf board if im doing a radio project
that ground plane would really help with shielding ❤
You can use cut-up bits of copper-clad as the "islands" if you want, and a conductive case as the ground plain.
It is less job to do a proper PCB design. Then send it to a PCB fab, get it back, and assemble it. With whatever stackup and holes you want. Cheap and fast and you stay within your signal integrity limits and EMC limits...
Can I get a 4 layer PCB, where the inner layers are close to each other and supply power? Then I want an air channel spacer layer for low k and a again a thin outer layer to carry the traces.
So you basically make your own multilayer pcb😅
I know it's due to the board but god those joints are ugly
Is it just me or were two of those solder joints completely loose?
Sodder or solder?
The L is silent in the US 😬
Very interesting. I usually just hand dremmel out the copper
херня какая-то еще "техникой" называется)
Im sure theres a bit you can buy to make islands.
I would prefer to cut a one side pcb,...
NAR REAL NAME IS DEAD BUG
That's a different thing. Like an IC upside down and components soldered either directly to or with wiring.
Waist of double sided copper bords. He could glue that pads on any 1-1.5 mm thick plastic sheet.
But then you lose the ground plane.
Solder, note the L, not sodder
Tanks lol
@@RedSummitRF 😀
That's cool.
When is this going to be a "3D" pronter option? ... where ALL this is done "hands free"?
I don’t think that you can print copper. Maybe you could hammer it like gold? A robot which can bend wires would be cool. Maybe it could operate in pure H2 atmosphere for oxygen free copper. Then crossing wires can be welded easily. Wire ends are cut so that they expose 45° flat surfaces. Bend them up, to level pads for the parts. Just, how do we apply the silk layer?
Clean the solder tip you philistine!
Also known as dead bug construction.
I used drawing pins and aluminium foil on plywood for valve stuff.
It's old thecnik
This might be a stupid question: but is it common to have this many components go to ground?
Yes. Look at a random schematic you find in the internet. You will be surprised how many components have a ground pin to them somewhere in the path.
Boy those crystal leads are longggg
Why not just scratch the squares?
Or use perfboard with two sides
Why not just use the copper board?
Easy way to construct a ground plane for the entire circuit without having to design and construct a multi-layer printed circuit board.
But... WHY?
If I check my dictionary, the word is spelled "solder" and has an "l" before the "d". So, why do I hear people from the USA say "sodder"? No L! Strange!
I'm an Amateur Radio person, from VK1.
Like leftenant (lieutenant)?
Einfach normale Lochraster Platine nehmen.
Looks like an overcomplicated and unnecessary modification of a dead bug style build for noobs that dont understand electronics.
this is the furthest thing from common
If works I don't judge
Wainwright Mini-Mounts
wtf is the only name for that
Two words: Perf Board.
No stray capacitance?
That is a little shit brh😐
Does it not put a kind of capacitor at each of those pads? 2 plate of metal that have a dielectric between them is the exact definition of a capacitor.
Someone ought to build a board of just such capacitors, meaaure the capicatance of the entire board in Farads, then divide by the number of little 7x7 mm squares, and figure out the Farads if each little pad. Are you available to do the research?
Yes, the capacity between layers of pcb is used in modern consumer electronics to match impedance. Design tools help you.
buy a perf board?!?
Проект манхэттэн начало
شكرا جزيلا ❤❤
un-sliced bread board
It looks bad tho
Cool idea until one can etch their own PCBs.
You mean like 50 years ago?
what is the advantage of this vs through hole soldering
You don't have to design and order a PCB, so you can construct circuits immediately. This also gives a better ground plane for HF design as even on a double sided PCB with through hole components the ground plane has to be broken for every connection not going to ground.
Flux man Flux!
Breadboards?