2 25 engine Plugs, points, timing ramble
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ต.ค. 2021
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Lovely Mike, I cut my teeth on original Minis, MK1 escorts, Marinas, Maxis, etc etc.
Points had to be set on a regular basis so we had to learn quick.
Timing guns were a thing of dreams, if I changed a distributor, I would get it running and turn the radio on and use the interference from that to get the timing good enough to drive to a mates who had a timing gun.
Good tip to oil the centre shaft of the distributor. I love the sound of the distributor cap clips going back on. Takes me back to my days of owning a petrol 2A in the UK.
Right on
I never thought I’d see points again but a couple of weeks ago I cleaned some on a Ferguson tractor, same Lucas lol, she fired straight up , so satisfying, good old easy days
Can't beat the old points and coil ignition, better than that "smoke and mirrors" electronic stuff Mike. Bet it starts up very nicely.
Perfect video for a cold rainy afternoon instead of being out in the workshop tinkering with my old Volvo.
Sounds great!
Another great tutorial Mike, no one should go wrong after watching this subject. Take care, Yorkshire Rob.
Reviving memories of
Zastava 101(ex Yugoslavian car) .
Hm about a hundred years ago. In the old days, I always had a spare distributor ready in the trunk.
Cheers King Mike 🥃
Can't wait to see this beast churn out some power! Great series Mike.
Me neither
The knowledge you have is invaluable. Thanks Mike
Pure Brilliance again Mike, driving my 2.25 2a this affy so loving this. 👍🏻😉
Love your rambles on a Sunday morning with a good cuppa coffee! Good inspiration for getting into the shop this afternoon!
Yay! Thank you!
Nice work!
Thank you! Cheers!
Wonderful stuff !! That engine looks like new it’s amazing!
Thank you very much!
You made my day! realy kind person and useful information !!!
Glad I could help!
Had the Mrs wondering what I was watching as she listened in to you go on about giving the shaft a good lubing
Mike, if you haven't ordered that Chinese copy of a Zenith 36iv, DON'T! I have one and it's not worth your time. My Landy had an original Zenith that was worn out. I rebuilt it but it never ran correctly. I ordered one of the knock-offs which also never ran correctly and no amount of fiddling with it could get it to run well. The plugs were as sooty black as the inside of a diesel exhaust. I finally ordered a brand new Weber 34ICH and my 2.25 has never ran better. Yes the Weber is expensive but worth every penny in my opinion. The Weber you have can easily be rebuilt, parts are still very common.
I second this.... Never Never Never get a Zenith copy... terrible... mine would still run even with the mixture screw fully in... and HUGE amounts of black soot from the exhaust regardless of how you set it up.
This is because the bottom O ring is not compressed properly - it bleeds fuel into the venturi and no amount of fiddling will get it running right until re machined - JP and I have a plan!
And it is only to get this running on the test bench
Another great lesson 👏
Glad you liked it!
Looking forward to seeing it running 👍🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
You and me both!
Great video About the oud 2.25
Well done Mike :)
In relation to timing ATDC, don’t forget that it is static, and as soon as the engine is running, the mechanical advance will advance the spark along the lines of the numbers you tread out in the early part of the video.
Great point!
I moved over to electronic ignition on my 2 and a quarter about 5 years ago and very pleased I did. No more faffing about with points. Now Direct fuel injection, that would be VERY interesting.
LPG would be interesting!
"Where'd I put this? Where'd I put that?' - I'm just the same when working on a car.
Great video. I can't wait to hear this working. This must be a very late example of a 2.25 petrol (may even be the last 2.25 ever made) if it's using an LT77 suffix E gearbox. My previous 90 pickup had the LT77 50A suffix E gearbox with the 19J 2.5 Turbo Diesel engine, made in 1987. On Defenders at least in the UK, the 2.25 engine was only fitted up to 1985, 2.5 petrol after that until about 1994.
Great point!
Mike Common problem is the distributer is the drive from the vam sgsft the brass bish wares on vertical diesel pump and petrol
Here's one for Mike...
When the last British soldiers left Cape Town harbour in 1903, many Boers went to witness this momentous event. As the soldiers were boarding the ship, the Boers verbally abused and directed all sorts of insults towards the British..
The moment the last soldier was safely onboard , a British Officer turned to the Boers and shouted back; "You tormented us and made our lives absolutely miserable for three years! I can promise we will return the favour ten fold over many decades to come, you will regret the day you ever met us..!"
Forty six years later the the first Land Rover was off loaded at the very same dock..............
Nice one!
Further to your octane comment, 90 octane in the Haynes manual (and the proper Land Rover one) refers to Research Octane Number or RON. 90 RON is approx. USA Regular or 87 AKI/CLC., which is measures as RON+MON/2 - MON being Motor Octane Number. The USA and Canada, are as far as I am aware, the only two countries to use the RON+MON/2 system, everyone else just uses RON - even in Africa where 91-93 RON is reasonably common. UK 95 RON is approx. USA Premium or 91 AKI/CLC.
Also: you can find 3/8 BSP plugs on Amazon.
Needs 1/2 BSPP parallel thread - none here at a reasonable price - well they are but shipping is £27 for 2!
Put a refurb Kent engine in a kit car that I built. Had endless problems with timing, it ate petrol and was almost impossible to start warm ..... eventually found out it was a tooth out on the cam!
I am fitting the Weber Retroject fuel injection system from Classic Fuel Injection this month (I have a Weber 32/36 DGV at the moment on a Pierce manifold), so I should be able to give you some info on it. The ignition system and the fuel injection will be computer controlled with an oxygen sensor, and the unit is a bolt-on replacement for the DGV, so it'll be quite complex when it's done. Total cost is around £1,600.
I believe a lot of people in North America are running the Holley Sniper Autolite 1100 EFI unit, and fettling it slightly to fit the standard Series manifold. That has the advantage over my unit by using an integral self-learning ECU, whereas I have to use a separate ECU with an ignition amplifier. However, the system I am using will also be self-learning.
Looking forward to the smoke testing! The whole petrol Vs timing cleared some stuff up that I had trouble with as I could never get the engine to run right on the Haynes specs. But we have 98 octane here. I always set up the engine by ear once the spark plugs and distributor was gapped correctly and the car ran beautifully. Timing was always earlier than spec, but never had it pinking. If you're going to put on the zenith knock-off, its a brilliant carb, better gas mileage than the Weber in my experience. One thing to note though, I remember that the knock offs can warp a bit on some of other mating surface, causing air leaks. Flatten them down on a flat surface fixes that. I never had that problem though..
Years ago I bought 6 x original Zenith - all were warped out of the box = but they warp so that the O ring at the bottom of the lower casting inside the venturi would not seat right - this is a major cause of fuel getting into the venturi and no amount of adjustment would correct the problem
I had one of those five bearing Weber carb'd engines in an early 90 , I got rid of it for a 2.5TD when it started doing about 8mpg 😂 TDIs were too new at the time hence putting the 2.5TD in.
Excellent!
I try to get the OEM manual, the Haynes manual, and the Clymer manual for whatever vehicle I’m working on.
I’m just trying to maintain my old junkers so I need all the help I can get.
Would you mind doing a video on how you use the manuals and which you prefer.
I appreciate the detail you go into in your videos.
Glad to help!
In the 8.0:1 engine Static Ignition Timing set, I believe the reason for the TDC and 3º ATDC respectivelly for 90 and 85 octane fuel is because of the faster time of fuel reaction on high compression. If it happen BTDC, as is in the 7.0:1 engines, probably would decelerate the piston when its movement is in the stalling poin and consequently less power on the beggining of descent where the vertical speed is much lower, because the fuel explosion would happen befor TDC. Hope I get well expressed my idea.
oh dont go near a copy of the zenith,a genuine one [recon in uk is £325] a weber is really not ALL that good either,makes them run a bit weak and the jets are hard to clean if they get clogged up,they are borne to icing too in winter, SU HIF 44 is the best for smooth running,but a bit of job for needle setup etc and a recon carb is 320 plus
ah the good old lucas 45d, again you can get cheap points / condenser ,but there is sooooo much rubbish out there, i went for power spark electronic unit, no points!!but have a spare genuine condenser/points in spare box.....good to see you the old stuff ,its all i have known since 1983
My grandad used cigarette paper to tell him when the points were just opening lol
Doing the points brings back memories. I wish they kept the adjuster on the back of the vacuum diaphragm, as it was handy when timing the engine.
I eventually changed the points for an electronic kit. It had a switch to turn the ignition off, it was handy to prime the oil filter after an engine oil change.
When did Land Rover stop wiring up the bolts for the cam lifters?
I think it was when they went metric in 1980.
Hi Mike great content. Waiting for a 2.6l rebuild.
FYI
Burlen in the U.K. for carburetor parts.
Distributor Doctor in the U.K. for Lucas (British) parts.
Check their websites.
Yes I used Burlen for my S1 fuel pump
Lumenition optronic. Fit and forget.
Points,,,,,, if you can find some non Chinese ones these days get progressively worse every time they touch.
You may encounter an age old problem with the bsp threads, back in 1976 due to metrification the thread was changed to a metric pitch so it could be cut on metric machine tools but they did not make it common knowledge. Most combinations you can get away with it I tried to buy a 11/2 imperial tap back in the eighties but no chance they had been obsolete too long. Check your taps and dies if they have the suffix p76 which means post 1976
then they are metric. My tip is when you get your new banjo bolts is run them in with your fingers to see if they're tight I think it's likely your engine is imperial and the bolts are metric, then it will be time to dig out the old thread gauges and zuess books (remember those lol) an option then would be to run a tap through ,but the last thing you need is crap in the oil galleries at this stage of the building, good luck have fun, atb from Yorkshire.
Timing, points: lost art.
Sure is !
Be great to see fuel injection 2.3 Mike
Yes would be an interesting project - even more interesting would be LPG and electronic spark control - simpler conversion
Hi Mike - is the firing order on that distributor right? It looks like number 2 is on the number 3 position? Cheers
Those points took me back a bit....however I was disappointed to note that there was no felt pad to be oiled on the points :)
How do blue! - Really looking forward to the upcoming trike build! Built some (proper) chops in the past - not the modern hipster versions of just 'cut the rear mudguard in half, have a side mount numberplate, stick a set of apes on it and paint it all matt black. Nah. Ground up tube bending, jigs, and lots of midnight oil burnt schtuff. So, yup, a disco trike is gonna be interesting. I wonder how yer gonna keep the 4 wheel drive on just 3 wheels... LOL!!!
anyhoo - regarding the felt pad, I suggested to Mike that he sees his Upholsterer guy Jim. He should have thick enough off cuts of felt suitable to be trimmed and do the job. I reckon a 2 inch square offcut will do Mike for points and distributers pads until he's 200 years old.
@@WhosAGoodDogue Lmfao!...unfortunately the trike will be two wheel drive...three would be too expensive....and I have trouble counting past two.
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M&S clothing mostly used to say “Made in UK”, but most are now imported and quality has slipped…same with car parts….I nearly always buy OE unless I know that the product is good.
See an awful lot of outsourcing from LR now - seems rubber parts are made in Poland and Turkey makes a lot of mechanical parts. Gaskets are now made in India, and LR are having a lot of parts made in China too
North American Overland (on here) fit single point injection on a few of their series LR builds. 👍
They must use a throttle body injector - I wanted to go to multi point!
@@BritannicaRestorations Yes they do, multi point? Like putting Nike's on your granny! Would be interesting to see, especially on a home grown basis, I know a lot of the small engined car performance people buy motorbike throttle bodys and injectors as a starting point.
@@BritannicaRestorations They use the Holley Sniper system. There is one based on the Autolite 1100 used on Ford I6 engines that is the same flange pattern as the 1-barrel carbs on Landys. I actually placed an order for one earlier this year but they're backordered to infinity and beyond, so I cancelled and went with a Weber at 1/10 the price.
Hi there Mike. I’ve got a spare Duceellier distributor from my defender. It’s in great condition if you’d like it?
With regards to the copy zenith carb, there’s been lots of people who’ve suffered the little brass screws on the butterfly falling off. I would suggest removing them and loctiting them before fitting.
Thanks
Tristan
The Zenith is only to get it going - I may consider the Ducellier as I am not sure what this distributor is off
@@BritannicaRestorations I’ve got the same style distributor as you’ve got now fitted to mine. A sort of Lucas series one, they work just the same, but the vacuum advance fitting is in a different place to a proper defender distributor.
I ditched the ducellier one after finding post rebuild it wouldn’t fit. Was too short to contact the drive gear I cut the mount down and it still wouldn’t fit. I bought a new distributor and that wouldn’t fit either, as it turns out, my drive dog had disappeared and I had no idea it existed. It’s still in the bottom of the engine I think, need to get the camera on it.
Tristan
To avoid 10% ethanol in the UK we need to use the 95 octane so which static timing position would you suggest as haynes doesn't mention a position for 95? I have a 1981 88" 2.25 petrol.
Santana specified 3 BTDC as a static figure on 96 octane, but frankly ignition timing on these is a case of trial and error. If I don't have access to a rolling road, I normally advance the timing just until it starts to get pre-ignition, and back it off a shade. I think mine is running about 9 BTDC at the moment, but I had mine done on a rolling road and frankly I don't care what it is until it's just right. I am going to fuel injection this month though, with computer controlled ignition.
If you can't find a plug with pipe thread, IF you can get a brass nipple it is always parallel thread, and you can then put a cap on it.. only trouble is, as you say, Canada/N America use standard pipe.. but I would have thought you would still be able to find the old BSP stuff too??
Very hard to find here - and just out of interest, the major plumbing suppliers here in town are trade only - they may have access to plugs - but will not sell you any!
@@BritannicaRestorations Not very friendly... here in NZ I can go to any PlumbersMerchants and get whatever I want.
Did you ever consider using a tuning kit from'automotive components remanufacturing'? They reckon it puts the power up to around 100hp; new head,camshaft and manifolds s.u. carb--- Do you know anything about it? emicro engine on the tube fitted one but later fitted a v8
Lol! No!
Waaay too expensive!
£1000 for a carb kit,
£900 for a head
£220 for a cam
£460 for an exhaust manifold
Over £2,500 for 38 BHP ?
£68/BHP
You can get a decent used 300Tdi for a few hundred quid - 111 BHP and better MPG
@@BritannicaRestorations In France we cannot swap petrol for diesel and vice-versa!!!!!! however no engine number on the log book
More than likely I’m being a thick idiot. 😁 However you said the timing marks on the pulley go from -6 degrees to +6 degrees from TDC. With 7 marks on the pulley each one would be 2 degrees not 3 degrees surely??? Centre is 0 then each of the 3 marks either side would be 2.
I’m watching this on a phone so difficult to see up close.
Confused. 🙁