I have been riding for almost 2 months on my very first motorcycle, a 2016 ER6F, when I had my very first track day sponsored by Kawasaki. I was very excited for 2 weeks and was very hyped when the day came. I registered in the Beginners category and placed with some other 35 beginner riders. There was an orientation for about 5 mins and my big brain wasn't able to comprehend what the speaker was saying because of my excitement. I didn't know that I had to reduce the pressure of both of my tires so I rode the first 3 laps with 32f and 36r tire pressure. The fourth lap where my No fear, desire for speed, and lack of knowledge and experience took toll on me. I got really comfortable with the track and didn't realize I was exceeding my limit, going faster than what I could handle, target fixated on the other rider beside me, and didn't lean the bike. That's when I realized I wasn't really turning and when I looked back in front of my motorcycle, I was already at the edge of the track. I cannot recall how I managed to get off the bike, the next thing I remember was I was sliding and rolled like three times like the bike threw me off and I saw the bike rolling sideways, and ended up sliding of the track few meters next to me. I was really lucky that I only got 2 scratches, on my knee and on my wrist. Bike's side mirror was torn of the head cowl and my windshield shattered. My helmet got also scratched really deep. The moment of my accident still flashes in my mind everytime I ride deep corner and when I snap back to reality, I notice that I feel like my joints are melting and I am hyperventilating. I still haven't got my confidence back ever since and it has been a month since the accident. I always get stiff whenever I turn making it harder. That accident really taught me something.
Yep, I did and took a good ringer to the head and tore up my pretty new bike on the track. Looked and felt pretty stupid. Fixed bike and learned a good lesson.
This is why solo motorycle crash statistics are sky high. People do their licence course then thrash around on mountain roads with no further training or experience. I did it and I'm just lucky I survived long enough to get myself to track training.
I definitely had "no fear" syndrome. I've done the Haslam race school a few times. On the second Elite course I moved up to the Fireblade and it was going great, until i twisted the throttle just a bit too hard, on seeing my instructor pulling away. I high-sided through Starkey's at something like 100mph. I don't remember the crash so I'm not totally sure what happened. I broke my left collarbone, and wrist on impact. These required surgery and have been a total pain to heal. The bike hit me when I was sliding down the track and broke two ribs. Recovering from the ribs was the worst, and it's prevented me from being able to go back. I wish I had the benefit of this guidance prior to going.
Great vid. Recovering mentally now after physically from a crash myself. Suffered a TBI at the hands of another rider. I was just coming into the middle of the intermediate groups level when someone hit me from behind. Helicopter, coma, therapy. I'm now struggling a bit with fear and anxiety but am determined to get smooth and confident again. Going for some more instruction at my next track day. Cheers.
I crashed on my second session of first track day of this season. 8 month layoff from track with off-season and I just didn’t have the intermediate pace of group I got bumped up to from 2020. Made a stupid mental error and crashed. Lesson learned: never worry about faster people behind you and focus always ahead! Let them find a place to pass you especially if you are staying on race line and remaining predictable. 🤷🏻♂️
Did exactly that on my first track day - was fearless and wanted to be "one of the boys", so pushed (far) beyond my limit until I got to a heavy braking corner and overshot it (more like thought I was going to, lol). So, I panicked a bit, braked too hard for a cold road tyre with soft suspension and lost the front whilst still upright. Had plenty of time to think about it as I sat in the emergency room and then hospital for the next 8 hours, followed by about 25 hospital visits for surgery and physio. Good first track day lol. Still, lesson learnt big time. I ride for myself now, I think one of the most dangerous things you can do on a bike is trying to chase faster riders. Top video by the way
t h i c c "chasing" someone faster could be beneficial or catastrophic. I think this could alone could deserve a separate video by Dan. P.S. hope you are properly healed and riding now
Jas0nGR1 Yeah it can be beneficial but you need to know your limits and know when to back off. If you don't know when to back off you can get it deep shit. Thanks, I'm back riding but do have some permanent range of motion loss in bits of my hand. Nothing too bad. Part of the experience lol
im kinda the opposite, been riding road for 5years daily before ever going to the track and massively underestimated my skill level picking the slowest group to start in.. after the first session i went to ask to be moved up to the next group only to find the trackday manager waiting in my pit ready to have a go for lying about it being my first day... was really nice though when the first thing i said was i think i need to move up.. anyway moved up to the intermediate group and was still significantly quicker than most but not quick enough to need to move up, and wasn't really comfortable with the more aggressive overtaking in the fast group.. didn't crash since i was riding at what for me was a reasonable pace not pushing it too hard since i was already significantly better than i had expected to be and since i was riding my only way to get to work come Monday.. since then i've bought a trackbike and have great fun at the track whenever i can.. hoping to get out next week covid lockdowns permitting
yup when I was pushing out of my comfort zone .. looking for time and was asking too much for my bikes available mechanical grip.. ended up with a low side .. but learned the limit.. went out the next session within that limit and worked on consistency and the time came naturally.. improved by 2sec.. :)
I'd say braking and throttle control is the most important thing to learn to avoid crashes. Being able to do a bit of trail braking, even slightly, help the front tire staying firmly in contact with the ground, thus reducing the chances of loosing the front. My first crash happen because I was simply too slow, and a small bump on the corner made me lost traction on the front. Throttle control: not being able to keep a constant speed in some corners will shake the bike in all direction, increasing the chance of crashing. Also, accelerating too fast, and you end up highsiding like Dan during his first track day. Be smooth, and it should be fine!
It's the Ego that makes new riders crash, let go of trying to ' win ' a trackday mindset and I guarantee you won't crash. I usually go out each session trying something specific rather than just 'go quick cos trackday' Then by the end of the day it has all tied together .
My first track day was a real eye opener, trying too hard on the first session just made me slow, by sessions 2 and 3 things were smoother and faster. Really feeling good on session 4 until I messed up my entry on turn 1 which lead to running wide in turn 2 and being unable to make turn 3, straight on into gravel and was very lucky to stay upright. Take it at your own pace, ignore how fast others are, improving little things as you go along will make you much quicker and safer than trying to copy Marquez - he gets his bikes rebuilt for free.
I had been riding for two months when I did my first track day. The first day went well. But the second day, feeling a bit more confident, I pushed a little further than my abilities allowed and I crashed. Fortunately there were no broken bones, but my bike was done for the day. Looking back, besides the technical things I could have done differently, I should have taken it easier on the first few sessions before trying anything new. Thank you for all the great content on your channel. I greatly appreciate it, especially since I am a newer rider.
I guess I'm not the "no fear" guy LOL. I went for my first training on small track with my 300cc and was really nervous seeing all those who seemed experienced, but after few laps I felt comfortable. It was a small slow track and at least I didn't have to worry I might push my small engine too much to have a highside I guess. I'm driving since September and I'm more and more happy that I went for smaller displacement motorcycle.
been riding street for a good 6 years now, with a couple of trackdays under the belt, never crashed because i take things slowly and methodically, try to cram as much knowledge as possible into my brain before upping the pace or trying something new. on track this has translated my 1m12s laps into 1m6s laps over the course of about 5 trackdays. i'm getting fairly good times for the bike i'm riding and i've received compliments of people saying it's not easy doing that kind of laptime on my bike, but it's a slow old 600, and newer 600's get closer to the 1m a lap mark, so after every trackday i'm left wanting... probably gonna change up to a 1000 eventually, once i feel i've squeezed everything out of my 600. Once i took an rsv4 on that track but i was a bit scared to crash so i wasn't comfortable pushing limits, still managed a 1m3s laptime on it, and dragged elbow so i took it as a win :-P
I went to a track day after I learned how to ride a motorcycle for 4 months, and I crashed!😂 Then I realized I need to learn track skills from professionals rather than getting all the bad habits from other riders. That's why I went to California superbike school, and I still think that was the best choice I did.
I'm watching all your videos before I do a track day, want to be aware of as much as I can, take my time, and definitely be patient, the speed will come and I don't want to rush anything.
I did my first track day 10yrs after riding road bikes but had been riding dirt for 10 yrs before that. returned to dirt 25 yrs after that, while all the time road riding. 3 yrs ago started track days again, bought a track only bike and progressed up to second fastest group but lower lap times are harder. Most in the group have bikes that have 20 to 100 hp more so I try for higher corner speed but lose out on the straight. Last crash was on the road 35 years ago and none in the 20 odd track days since restarting although some off track excursions. I'm 64 and having a great time. Go for smooth and speed will come.
Three months after getting my license i just took my 17 R6 out to track on metzeler M7 tires. Lowsided during the 4th lap of the first session due to cold tires and dust right on the apex of the corner. Coaches told me i was pushing too hard on cold tires but if there hadn’t been any dust in the corner I wouldn’t have crashed. Lessons learned, always take it easy on the first session and use it as a warm up mentally and physically for the bike
+1 me as another with the "no fear" thing. Although the fear and caution existed at the beginning of the day (my second track day ever) and I was trying to educate myself as much as possible. After progressing well and moving from one of the slowest in my group to the 2nd fastest, my confidence became inflated. I'm still not entirely sure how I crashed, losing the front of the bike on the exit of a corner, and I have been scouring your videos trying to find some sort of a hint, however I totally accept it was entirely my fault caused by a lack of experience and pushing my limits too far into the unknown. After watching many of your videos I think the cause was I was starting to run wide on the exit so, like a numpty, decided to cut throttle thinking that slowing down was the answer. This in turn put too much weight through the front tyre which began to slide. As the bars wobbled back and forth I paniced, tensed up and the bike went down, and as I slid down the track on my back watching my bike disappear into the distance on it's side my thoughts were, "crap, I just painted that". Live and learn. Hopefully next time I can get away unscathed and I feel that these videos will have helped with that. Thanks.
Hi Jamie - cutting the throttle is fine as that will tighten your radius, but you likely did it too abruptly. You have to "load the tire, before you work the tire", otherwise the tire will start sliding. Such an easy mistake to make though (been there, done that). The question is why you were starting to run wide on exit to begin with? Most likely too much throttle before you had a straight line out of the corner. Work on that, and you won't have to worry about running wide :)
Although I haven't crashed on track yet I can certainly say I have on street, including just few months ago. Bit of combo of bad lean angle, low tires, and turn itself was sharp uphill right turn that I've gone through many times. Add all that, low sided, wasn't really hurt but almost lost my bike to damages.
I wish you were still making vids. You're the most informative channel for new track riders like me. I've done 7 track days and crashed twice. Not a great ratio.
Had a crash for exactly the reasons named in the first set: Inexperienced, fearless and little knowledge: Second trackday ever, a rainy day. The first two laps I felt confident and my street tyre (metzeler sportec M7) was holding up quite good despite the rain, it didn't feel slippy at all. I had the feeling I could take the next lap quicker by quite a lot. The second corner my front end washed out without any warning. Thinking about it now it was reckless to go that aggressive on a wet track with a normal street tyres XD
I think its a lot to do with panic freeze which we only overcome with experience. Top riders don't get flustered when it all goes pearshaped and are able to pull through with ease never skipping a beat and ready for the next turn
Superb assessment, whoever the muppet was that gave this a thumbs down really doesn’t get it or hasn’t experienced it. I thought you’ve nailed it, great advice from an old hand/someone with experience. Thanks man👍
I crashed twice due to being an idiot on the streets, I was very young and although fast, I was riding outside lf my capabilities. Now, been riding 12 years, but had a two year break due to finance. Been back riding 2 weeks now - god knows how I used to ride like a nutter, now I know my limits, and slowly getting more confident and increasing them. This was some great info, your videos are brilliant.
One thing that hardly gets mentioned with track days and is probably more important than tyres (even sports tourers are fine for starters) is proper suspension set up. I would bet that many crashes are caused by wrong damping and compression rates. See Dave Moss for some tips. After tweaking mine it felt sooooo much better.
My dad told me this little piece of knowledge : trackriding is like gambling. Always be prepared to pay the debt. so in short, being financialy prepared to crash makes the blow harder i guess...
Took a big trip through the gravel on my first time out yesterday. Looked too far to the outside, went wide, panicked and stood the bike up. Luckily I managed to ride it out without coming off, my mistake was focussing on the guy ahead and trying to keep up. Lesson learned, ride your own pace, even on track.
I've experienced crash which resulted from, to be honest, my instructor saying that I am doing good job and progressing quickly. It was before the recorded session - tail camera, instructor in front - I wanted to prove how fast I am. It didnt work all that well :)
My first track day I went down on my new 899. Took T1 too tight after the straight on my 3rd session and lowsided. Luckily it was only minimal damage and I got back on for the 4th session watching my lines better and actually got better after that fear of dropping the bike had already escaped.
Life at Lean I do have to say that for a first track day, the 899 or anything more than a 400cc is honesty overkill! But it was so much more expensive to rent a bike. (Probably cheaper after all was said and done) yes, I was way in over my head as well. My body positioning was terrible and even though there was room to save it, my knowledge on what to sense to save it was zero. I just had my 2nd track day and I worked on my body pos and lines with a coach in a humble manner and finally got that knee down. Being opened to constructive criticism is also key! Cheers m8, amazing channel.
Note: a lot of practice went in between my 1st and 2nd track day so entering in the beginner group on the 2nd go, I was a lot more experienced within the limits.
I would like to mention another reason riders crash that isn't often mentioned. Fatigue. It's happened to me, which of course is why I'm aware of it. At the end of a session it's easy to become tired and being tired can have a significant effect on one's mental acuity. In other words you start getting fuzzy headed because you're tired and begin to make mistakes. I think that those of us who don't work out on a regular basis are especially vulnerable. I always try to be aware of how tired I am and how it is affecting my mental sharpness. When I start to feel fatigued I slow down.
I have had some near crashes when I push too far beyond my limits - losing rear grip when I accelerate too early coming out of a turn or missing a brake marker as I approach a turn at a higher speed. Only one crash though...and that was a shifter failure coming into a tight turn. No down shifts...and thus not enough braking to make the turn...off the track and high sided down a hill. 😳😉
Excellent video. Not acknowledging how tired I was on my last session of the day... felt I was not going to make a corner and instead of just easing it in... straightened up in the grassy run-off... forgetting that grass is slippery... even with track day insurance I'm still facing a huge bill... luckily didn't get hurt. Lost focus and with it all the knowledge from my training as well.
Good Video. I will definitely keep this as I'm getting ready for my first TD this coming May. Thanks for being honest with the community about where you were on your first TD. many vloggers on youtube simply blame the bike for any issues or wrecks they encounter, but the vast majority are caused by rider error. These machines are much better riders than we are. ;)
Another excellent video mate.I wasn't fearless I got myself ready with motovoodo, twist of the wrist, learned the track and reference points on youtube I was doing really well ;).I did many track days with no problem until I became overconfident ;).I went down in dunlop last coner of mondello track to mutch throttle in full lean,small damages and no injuries but lessen learned and humble again 😁😂.
My way was always, start slow and gradually build up. Always smooth and gentle on the controls and speed will come. Instruction for anything potentially dangerous goes without saying .
So far I've never crashed a street bike, only ridden my SV650 on the street/track, I'm now at the fast end of A-group at track days, took me a year and a half about... Rode dirt bikes alot when I was younger... 😀👍 I have run off course three times... Two were false neutrals... The other was my first lap on my first track day, just didn't know the course and was going too fast...
I was never cocky or arrogant going into any track-day event. I always take the first session slow and build up my speed. When the 3 or 4 session comes around I usually have a feel for the racing line, breaking points, apexes and memorized the lay out. Soon, I am lapping or passing almost everyone. At that point it felt easy and I wasn't stressed doing so. Needless to say, an instructor then comes blowing by me at an insane pace and WOW !!! Just when you think your doing something... your just scratching the surface LOL
No crash yet after 5 track days, n 2 race days. After 15 years of no track Just bought a new track bike, aprilia rsv4 2011. Sweat ride. Doing another track day in November at LAKESIDE PARK RACEWAY
Well sadly a lot of riders are very close to their limits (which they dont know because of the no fear attitude) while riding on the street. It is when something unexpected happens like a misjudged corner when they leave their "comfort zone" and are panicking. if you are even a little bit experienced with proper riding techniques you can immediatly see who is pushing their luck while riding. The problem with some of them is their stubbornness when i tried to help them. They thought of themself as a good rider whily riding very whacky and uncontrolled. I think that it is very important to learn as much as you can about good riding so you will subconsciously will make the right decisions when there is a unexpected and dangerous situation.
buy a cheap trackbike...get an experienced rider to take you round for a load of laps to show you the racing line....STICK to the racing line once you learn it...then do lappery.lots and lots of lappery...stay inside your comfort zone,because the more laps you do-the quicker you'll get,ergo your comfort zone will be ever-expanding.you can watch/listen to all the *here's how to go quick,be safe,* videos in the world.....but you already know,don't you...that it's totally different once you're out there ON the bike......get a front and rear cam,watch yourself lapping,listen to the revs and you'll notice that as you get more laps under your belt,you're on the power more,on the power sooner,less time off the throttle,smoother on the brakes....and please guys,stop the posing...there is NOTHING worse than the guy in front of you getting his knee down in a corner but holding you up because he's going so slow while concentrating on getting his knee down,that every corner sitting behind him adds a second or two to your own laptimes.....and one last point to bear in mind...due to a variety of reasons(the bike itself,tyres,weather,busy track/empty track,etc etc)you'll have quick days and slow days...don't try to make the slow days turn into quick days...at best you'll get frustrated..at worst it'll be an ambulance job.
Loved your blog.... love your videos even more... Great transfer over. I did exactly the same on my first track day by the way... fast road rider thought i was awesome... boom off i went
i agree with all, but also dont forget about the conditions and abilitys of your bike... some riders, ride with poor brakes or poor tyres or lacking oils or suspension service. i noticed that this affects a lot of selfconfidence in braking or controlling, which tense your body and makes everything even worse.
I went to track recently and got to ride a bike that's only has 1/4 the power of what I ride on road. Yet I took it slow as it was my first time and often I was overshooting. At the end of the session I felt like I was making no progress as many were overtaking me. So I started pushing hard and I low sided.
First track day last week. Forth lap in and I flung it up the road in the wet. I was for too eager to get past the guy in front who was mega slow in corners but opening it up on the straight. The bike went from underneath me during heavy breaking. Rear set and visor too damaged to continue. Raging I spent £235 for 4 laps. So so angry still.
why I'm watching this now after I had a crash hours ago, lost concentrating, and fixed my sight on where I want to have my crash, I had the turn right got the entry but got panicked when I thought I leaned too much with high speed and it wasnt, fixed my lean angle at the wrong time and then .... got these thoughts about holding my self and slowing down on the gravel, I didnt
Great series thanks, Just one tip which I think is also vital but was missed. When going too hot into a corner and drifting too wide, despite scrubbing off the majority of your speed still heading off track inevitably, Dont panic and remember the bike will travel over grass, stone trap etc straight so if you have any run off use it! If you continue attempting to turn due to being mentally locked in cornering once your tyres leave the tarmac your repair costs will rise. Damage control if possible peeps, hope it helps.
I am still not finished with all the articles on your website :) Watching a video or two in between the articles is nice - I would even subscribe twice if I could :) In less than a week I'll have my day 4&5 on the track and will work on further progress. I am still in the "slowest" group because I am slow at stepping out of my comfort zone. This time I am there with my CBR600RR (previously with the MT-09) so I expect that it will be easier for me to progress. cheers,Mike
Hi Dan, the track day was AWESOME! You can feel that this bike was made for the track. This helped me to improve my lap time by several seconds in comparison to the ones with my Yamaha FZ09. I know that I have still a lot of room for improvement in the braking zones, but I am more than happy with my results as I enjoyed every single lap. Your articles definitely helped me to improve as I tried to tackle the following topics: Visual skill - Defined reference markers which helped me to build up speed as I was able to trust that I can go quicker. Loose grip on handlebars - I noticed that I block in right corners the inward movement of my clip ons while starting to lean it over. Trained the body position on paddock stands - was also a great stretching exercise which should be started a week before. Focused on fully opening the gas Succeeded on breaking my lean barrier - my right side was a lot weaker than the left one I realised that coming back from an hang off is the easiest when you start closing the throttle, as you easily can stabilise yourself with the knees. I just uploaded the video of my riding on the Track if you’re interested (with german comments), but don’t file obliged to watch it. Thanks a lot! Stay safe, Mike
Don't try to find out, how long you could use those expensive slicks and push the front too much at the same time. Results in a very quick lowie at a corner you could have taken faster with fresh slicks.. If the little dots on the slick seem to vanish, it's about time to change. Maybe don't wait too long before changing, its hard to feel when the front is over (or is it just Bridgestone^^)
Hi great channel with superb info and presentation. Have my first track day coming up at Brands just wondering about tyre pressures? Of course i'll be in the novice group and on road I tend to run the standard 36F and 40-42 rear pressures on my GSXR. Should I decrease pressures before i go and if so how much?
I’m doing my first track day in a week & TBH I’m a little nervous. I’m doing it on my mates track bike “gsxr 750” & ive never ridden it before or been on a track before, I’m used to that sort of power so that doesn’t bother me. My main concerns are holding people up or being so far out of position in corners that I put other riders in danger due to my crap positioning. My mate says I’m worrying too much & to just try & enjoy it & I’ll find myself riding quicker than I think I am.🤷🏻♂️😳
@@brno221973 just did my first track day a couple days after I replied to you and same Mann. I'm obsessed! So fun. I'm on the lookout for a 300 as my track bike right now.
In where i live the riding season starts in the winter, so all sport riding schools are closed now but i want to ride anyway, the question is can i apply your theories as training by my own, i mean without a coach, if yes how and where
I've seen people crash trying to chase better riders after getting passed... Follow them to your comfort level but sometimes you just gotta let them go, man.... lol
After turning in, getting on the gas to early (actually at the same time) and to aggressively has caused me to have three high sides luckily they have all been collected before disaster has struck . I know the rules but I am struggling with this.
David, put yourself in a position to pay attention to what you're doing (knock a few % off your speed), then simply learn to what for the bike to turn and get on the line you want before cracking the throttle. It's just a timing issue.
Thanks Dan I think also it is a patience issue as well Im in a hurry to be quicker but obviously this is a mistake that I must overcome before I end on the ground.
Don't get on slicks too soon. Road tyres give you far more warning of failure and time to save it, slicks go from hero to zero in the blink of an eye. That's why in racing we start on prody bikes with road tyres, learn how to slide and learn what it feels like without falling off. If you try that on slicks you will be on your back each mistake. Slicks are not a tyre to learn on.
This I can't agree on one bit. In my experience, it's the complete other way around. Road tyres are the fickle ones with scary slip characteristics and slicks have the nice progressive feedback. Some road tyres are even downright horrifying when they start to overheat, where you go from grip to greasy in an instant. You need a fair bit of speed to maintain the heat in slicks, mostly so they don't tear and ball up not lasting as long. Now, there are better "road" tyres than others for track use, but those are marginal for road anyway. Super Corsa SP, Power RS, RS10, et.c. I was actually really impressed with the Super Corsa SP's coming from proper racing slicks, but really, I got about as many laps out of a rear as I did a medium slick. These are road tyres in name only, IMO.
Damn I’m that “no fear, think I’m gonna be a natural” guy… I’ve yet to be humbled. I drove 6 hours trailered my bike got a hotel showed up at the track and got rained out two days in a row. Lot of money wasted, when the closest track is 6 hours away… I’m not sure when or if I’ll make it to an actual track again.. guess it street Rossi for me…😢 my dream is to own a track one day. Then I can ride rain or shine. 😊
Had been riding 600s on the street since 1994. Then a buddy said, “Why don’t you put your bike on the track and see how you like it?” The day after I attended the California Super Bike school I was at the DMV un-licensing both bikes. Have never been on the street again. Too dangerous for me. My strategy for not crashing was simple. I rode at 80% of my ability until 80% became boring at those speeds. Then I rode at 80% of my ability at the next speed/braking/etc. The problem was always the same, keeping my ego in check. When I pushed my limits (when someone passed me) I found that all technique went out the window. My ego is both a blessing and a curse. You can see my track work on the 600RR, Karts, Nascar and Porsches at th-cam.com/video/6PY8mEG1OIw/w-d-xo.html
My track day experience was starting with a 300, then going to a 600 and now back to the 300. In my opinion the 300 is less intimidating. After first riding the 300 and getting my doors blown off by bigger bikes mostly on the straighaways. I went to a 600. For me, I was thinking more about not crashing instead of riding technique with the 600. With the 300 I now think more about body position, later braking, hitting apex'es, earlier on the throttle, etc. Instead of not crashing. I plan on starting to actually race later this year on the 300. I haven't crashed yet. But I am taking it slowly and safely. At my age(63) safety is more important than pure speed. Main thing is. Ride smart but always have fun.
Well I think that the no fear attitude is inside every new rider that haven't crash a bike yet that is...when that happens then they will know how to mentally prepare them how to really rode a bike! Most of them fear the bike after the crash if they broke some bones or more likely loose some skins but those the survived with just scars and bruises tent to correct what they did wrong... my 1st bike was a Kawasaki 250cc and fear was left behind whenever I'm riding! If sparks don't fly on fast corners then I am disgust with myself...I'll take on that corner again and again and again... to make long story short, the was this corner near my neighborhood (lol) I ride'em everyday to work... and it was a Sunday and no traffic...zassst 120km, zrasstt 150km,zraaaassstttt 170km entering that same corner for the 3rd time and overshot it, hit the kerb, high sided a couple of trees and ended in a U-drain! Maybe I was the luckiest mothrfkr on two wheels that freekin sunday or the motogod was looking down on me, I got off with just bruises on my back.. thats how I learned to be a better rider...# respect the power, fear the rider...
I used to have a 300cc bike and rode with a buddy that had a 1050cc. I'll never forget the day he told me I was riding that thing like I wasn't scared of it. It was that day I knew I had to check my ego. 45mph curves at top speed was fun, but after a few oh shit moments I had to calm down.
You have middle aged men learning to ride fast on bikes that have much more power than Roberts and Sheene had. They have more weight, a higher CoG less brakes and high performance road tyres not factory chosen slicks. Why do you think they crash? The average rider who thinks he is fast cannot handle more than 40BHP on his first days on a track. Riding fast isnt a question of going "mad" or having bottle. The top riders are not mad at all, they are just much more experienced and can think faster than joe public. Track days are all about slowing people down, most are riding bikes that they are not good enough to ride.
This is probably my only "hardware" concern for my TD. I am a lot heavier than the bike was intended for and have not been able to get the proper fork springs and rear spring to get that corrected. I'm going to use that to focus on being smooth with my throttle application and also my braking application though and do my best to overcome this and not blame the bike. Besides - I need to put the fork down and lose some Lb's anyway. ;)
Note also I was catching very slow rider on the brakes even after braking earlier and went down 2m behind them because passing wasn't allowed and I felt I could slow in time, and actually did but wanted to slow more. My brake lever control was as good as I could have possibly done with the experience I had, couldn't even feel if the lever was actually moving with the pressure I added when front tucked. I suggest a zip tie on the fork leg, once you are using all the travel don't brake harder.
I have been riding for almost 2 months on my very first motorcycle, a 2016 ER6F, when I had my very first track day sponsored by Kawasaki. I was very excited for 2 weeks and was very hyped when the day came. I registered in the Beginners category and placed with some other 35 beginner riders. There was an orientation for about 5 mins and my big brain wasn't able to comprehend what the speaker was saying because of my excitement. I didn't know that I had to reduce the pressure of both of my tires so I rode the first 3 laps with 32f and 36r tire pressure. The fourth lap where my No fear, desire for speed, and lack of knowledge and experience took toll on me. I got really comfortable with the track and didn't realize I was exceeding my limit, going faster than what I could handle, target fixated on the other rider beside me, and didn't lean the bike. That's when I realized I wasn't really turning and when I looked back in front of my motorcycle, I was already at the edge of the track. I cannot recall how I managed to get off the bike, the next thing I remember was I was sliding and rolled like three times like the bike threw me off and I saw the bike rolling sideways, and ended up sliding of the track few meters next to me. I was really lucky that I only got 2 scratches, on my knee and on my wrist. Bike's side mirror was torn of the head cowl and my windshield shattered. My helmet got also scratched really deep.
The moment of my accident still flashes in my mind everytime I ride deep corner and when I snap back to reality, I notice that I feel like my joints are melting and I am hyperventilating. I still haven't got my confidence back ever since and it has been a month since the accident. I always get stiff whenever I turn making it harder.
That accident really taught me something.
All of this can be used on the street too. It really comes down to this... too many people ride too hard for their TRUE riding ability
Yep, I did and took a good ringer to the head and tore up my pretty new bike on the track. Looked and felt pretty stupid. Fixed bike and learned a good lesson.
This is why solo motorycle crash statistics are sky high. People do their licence course then thrash around on mountain roads with no further training or experience. I did it and I'm just lucky I survived long enough to get myself to track training.
I definitely had "no fear" syndrome. I've done the Haslam race school a few times. On the second Elite course I moved up to the Fireblade and it was going great, until i twisted the throttle just a bit too hard, on seeing my instructor pulling away. I high-sided through Starkey's at something like 100mph. I don't remember the crash so I'm not totally sure what happened. I broke my left collarbone, and wrist on impact. These required surgery and have been a total pain to heal. The bike hit me when I was sliding down the track and broke two ribs. Recovering from the ribs was the worst, and it's prevented me from being able to go back.
I wish I had the benefit of this guidance prior to going.
I'm hoping you made a full recovery
Are you all healed up nicely with the little nags and the cold winter pains ?
Great vid. Recovering mentally now after physically from a crash myself. Suffered a TBI at the hands of another rider. I was just coming into the middle of the intermediate groups level when someone hit me from behind. Helicopter, coma, therapy. I'm now struggling a bit with fear and anxiety but am determined to get smooth and confident again. Going for some more instruction at my next track day. Cheers.
I crashed on my second session of first track day of this season. 8 month layoff from track with off-season and I just didn’t have the intermediate pace of group I got bumped up to from 2020. Made a stupid mental error and crashed. Lesson learned: never worry about faster people behind you and focus always ahead! Let them find a place to pass you especially if you are staying on race line and remaining predictable. 🤷🏻♂️
Did exactly that on my first track day - was fearless and wanted to be "one of the boys", so pushed (far) beyond my limit until I got to a heavy braking corner and overshot it (more like thought I was going to, lol). So, I panicked a bit, braked too hard for a cold road tyre with soft suspension and lost the front whilst still upright.
Had plenty of time to think about it as I sat in the emergency room and then hospital for the next 8 hours, followed by about 25 hospital visits for surgery and physio. Good first track day lol.
Still, lesson learnt big time. I ride for myself now, I think one of the most dangerous things you can do on a bike is trying to chase faster riders. Top video by the way
t h i c c "chasing" someone faster could be beneficial or catastrophic. I think this could alone could deserve a separate video by Dan.
P.S. hope you are properly healed and riding now
Jas0nGR1 Yeah it can be beneficial but you need to know your limits and know when to back off. If you don't know when to back off you can get it deep shit.
Thanks, I'm back riding but do have some permanent range of motion loss in bits of my hand. Nothing too bad. Part of the experience lol
im kinda the opposite, been riding road for 5years daily before ever going to the track and massively underestimated my skill level picking the slowest group to start in.. after the first session i went to ask to be moved up to the next group only to find the trackday manager waiting in my pit ready to have a go for lying about it being my first day... was really nice though when the first thing i said was i think i need to move up.. anyway moved up to the intermediate group and was still significantly quicker than most but not quick enough to need to move up, and wasn't really comfortable with the more aggressive overtaking in the fast group.. didn't crash since i was riding at what for me was a reasonable pace not pushing it too hard since i was already significantly better than i had expected to be and since i was riding my only way to get to work come Monday.. since then i've bought a trackbike and have great fun at the track whenever i can.. hoping to get out next week covid lockdowns permitting
yup when I was pushing out of my comfort zone .. looking for time and was asking too much for my bikes available mechanical grip.. ended up with a low side .. but learned the limit.. went out the next session within that limit and worked on consistency and the time came naturally.. improved by 2sec.. :)
I'd say braking and throttle control is the most important thing to learn to avoid crashes.
Being able to do a bit of trail braking, even slightly, help the front tire staying firmly in contact with the ground, thus reducing the chances of loosing the front. My first crash happen because I was simply too slow, and a small bump on the corner made me lost traction on the front.
Throttle control: not being able to keep a constant speed in some corners will shake the bike in all direction, increasing the chance of crashing. Also, accelerating too fast, and you end up highsiding like Dan during his first track day. Be smooth, and it should be fine!
It's the Ego that makes new riders crash, let go of trying to ' win ' a trackday mindset and I guarantee you won't crash.
I usually go out each session trying something specific rather than just 'go quick cos trackday'
Then by the end of the day it has all tied together .
My first track day was a real eye opener, trying too hard on the first session just made me slow, by sessions 2 and 3 things were smoother and faster. Really feeling good on session 4 until I messed up my entry on turn 1 which lead to running wide in turn 2 and being unable to make turn 3, straight on into gravel and was very lucky to stay upright. Take it at your own pace, ignore how fast others are, improving little things as you go along will make you much quicker and safer than trying to copy Marquez - he gets his bikes rebuilt for free.
I had been riding for two months when I did my first track day. The first day went well. But the second day, feeling a bit more confident, I pushed a little further than my abilities allowed and I crashed. Fortunately there were no broken bones, but my bike was done for the day.
Looking back, besides the technical things I could have done differently, I should have taken it easier on the first few sessions before trying anything new.
Thank you for all the great content on your channel. I greatly appreciate it, especially since I am a newer rider.
I guess I'm not the "no fear" guy LOL. I went for my first training on small track with my 300cc and was really nervous seeing all those who seemed experienced, but after few laps I felt comfortable. It was a small slow track and at least I didn't have to worry I might push my small engine too much to have a highside I guess. I'm driving since September and I'm more and more happy that I went for smaller displacement motorcycle.
been riding street for a good 6 years now, with a couple of trackdays under the belt, never crashed because i take things slowly and methodically, try to cram as much knowledge as possible into my brain before upping the pace or trying something new. on track this has translated my 1m12s laps into 1m6s laps over the course of about 5 trackdays. i'm getting fairly good times for the bike i'm riding and i've received compliments of people saying it's not easy doing that kind of laptime on my bike, but it's a slow old 600, and newer 600's get closer to the 1m a lap mark, so after every trackday i'm left wanting... probably gonna change up to a 1000 eventually, once i feel i've squeezed everything out of my 600. Once i took an rsv4 on that track but i was a bit scared to crash so i wasn't comfortable pushing limits, still managed a 1m3s laptime on it, and dragged elbow so i took it as a win :-P
I went to a track day after I learned how to ride a motorcycle for 4 months, and I crashed!😂 Then I realized I need to learn track skills from professionals rather than getting all the bad habits from other riders. That's why I went to California superbike school, and I still think that was the best choice I did.
It's a great school Boyang 👍
I'm watching all your videos before I do a track day, want to be aware of as much as I can, take my time, and definitely be patient, the speed will come and I don't want to rush anything.
I did my first track day 10yrs after riding road bikes but had been riding dirt for 10 yrs before that. returned to dirt 25 yrs after that, while all the time road riding. 3 yrs ago started track days again, bought a track only bike and progressed up to second fastest group but lower lap times are harder. Most in the group have bikes that have 20 to 100 hp more so I try for higher corner speed but lose out on the straight. Last crash was on the road 35 years ago and none in the 20 odd track days since restarting although some off track excursions. I'm 64 and having a great time. Go for smooth and speed will come.
Three months after getting my license i just took my 17 R6 out to track on metzeler M7 tires. Lowsided during the 4th lap of the first session due to cold tires and dust right on the apex of the corner. Coaches told me i was pushing too hard on cold tires but if there hadn’t been any dust in the corner I wouldn’t have crashed. Lessons learned, always take it easy on the first session and use it as a warm up mentally and physically for the bike
+1 me as another with the "no fear" thing. Although the fear and caution existed at the beginning of the day (my second track day ever) and I was trying to educate myself as much as possible. After progressing well and moving from one of the slowest in my group to the 2nd fastest, my confidence became inflated. I'm still not entirely sure how I crashed, losing the front of the bike on the exit of a corner, and I have been scouring your videos trying to find some sort of a hint, however I totally accept it was entirely my fault caused by a lack of experience and pushing my limits too far into the unknown. After watching many of your videos I think the cause was I was starting to run wide on the exit so, like a numpty, decided to cut throttle thinking that slowing down was the answer. This in turn put too much weight through the front tyre which began to slide. As the bars wobbled back and forth I paniced, tensed up and the bike went down, and as I slid down the track on my back watching my bike disappear into the distance on it's side my thoughts were, "crap, I just painted that". Live and learn. Hopefully next time I can get away unscathed and I feel that these videos will have helped with that. Thanks.
Hi Jamie - cutting the throttle is fine as that will tighten your radius, but you likely did it too abruptly. You have to "load the tire, before you work the tire", otherwise the tire will start sliding. Such an easy mistake to make though (been there, done that). The question is why you were starting to run wide on exit to begin with? Most likely too much throttle before you had a straight line out of the corner. Work on that, and you won't have to worry about running wide :)
First Session, First lap, Cold tyres
Last session last chance to improve your PR.
love the quality of your videos !
Although I haven't crashed on track yet I can certainly say I have on street, including just few months ago. Bit of combo of bad lean angle, low tires, and turn itself was sharp uphill right turn that I've gone through many times. Add all that, low sided, wasn't really hurt but almost lost my bike to damages.
I wish you were still making vids. You're the most informative channel for new track riders like me. I've done 7 track days and crashed twice. Not a great ratio.
Had a crash for exactly the reasons named in the first set: Inexperienced, fearless and little knowledge:
Second trackday ever, a rainy day. The first two laps I felt confident and my street tyre (metzeler sportec M7) was holding up quite good despite the rain, it didn't feel slippy at all.
I had the feeling I could take the next lap quicker by quite a lot. The second corner my front end washed out without any warning.
Thinking about it now it was reckless to go that aggressive on a wet track with a normal street tyres XD
Sounds like a good lesson to learn early on! Every cloud and all that.
I think its a lot to do with panic freeze which we only overcome with experience.
Top riders don't get flustered when it all goes pearshaped and are able to pull through with ease never skipping a beat and ready for the next turn
You asked very good question here - "What are you trying to achieve?". All who are on the track should answer to himself on that question.
Dan, thank you so much for posting these vids - for free - for the riding community!
Superb assessment, whoever the muppet was that gave this a thumbs down really doesn’t get it or hasn’t experienced it. I thought you’ve nailed it, great advice from an old hand/someone with experience. Thanks man👍
My first track day: my R6 was totaled by lunch break.
Bugger 😭
Omg
ok we gonna need more info on this!!!
I crashed twice due to being an idiot on the streets, I was very young and although fast, I was riding outside lf my capabilities. Now, been riding 12 years, but had a two year break due to finance.
Been back riding 2 weeks now - god knows how I used to ride like a nutter, now I know my limits, and slowly getting more confident and increasing them. This was some great info, your videos are brilliant.
One thing that hardly gets mentioned with track days and is probably more important than tyres (even sports tourers are fine for starters) is proper suspension set up. I would bet that many crashes are caused by wrong damping and compression rates. See Dave Moss for some tips. After tweaking mine it felt sooooo much better.
My dad told me this little piece of knowledge : trackriding is like gambling. Always be prepared to pay the debt.
so in short, being financialy prepared to crash makes the blow harder i guess...
Took a big trip through the gravel on my first time out yesterday. Looked too far to the outside, went wide, panicked and stood the bike up. Luckily I managed to ride it out without coming off, my mistake was focussing on the guy ahead and trying to keep up. Lesson learned, ride your own pace, even on track.
A very humble video from you, Dan. Thanks again for the excellent advice. Cheers.
I've experienced crash which resulted from, to be honest, my instructor saying that I am doing good job and progressing quickly. It was before the recorded session - tail camera, instructor in front - I wanted to prove how fast I am. It didnt work all that well :)
I hear you Jakub! I was chasing my first knee down. Nobody told my right hand how to properly use the throttle though 🤦
My first track day I went down on my new 899. Took T1 too tight after the straight on my 3rd session and lowsided. Luckily it was only minimal damage and I got back on for the 4th session watching my lines better and actually got better after that fear of dropping the bike had already escaped.
I have to say I often shed a tear when I see a once pristine Ducati heading back to the pits in the wagon of shame. Glad yours wasn't too bad.
Life at Lean I do have to say that for a first track day, the 899 or anything more than a 400cc is honesty overkill! But it was so much more expensive to rent a bike. (Probably cheaper after all was said and done) yes, I was way in over my head as well. My body positioning was terrible and even though there was room to save it, my knowledge on what to sense to save it was zero. I just had my 2nd track day and I worked on my body pos and lines with a coach in a humble manner and finally got that knee down. Being opened to constructive criticism is also key! Cheers m8, amazing channel.
Note: a lot of practice went in between my 1st and 2nd track day so entering in the beginner group on the 2nd go, I was a lot more experienced within the limits.
I would like to mention another reason riders crash that isn't often mentioned. Fatigue. It's happened to me, which of course is why I'm aware of it.
At the end of a session it's easy to become tired and being tired can have a significant effect on one's mental acuity. In other words you start getting fuzzy headed because you're tired and begin to make mistakes. I think that those of us who don't work out on a regular basis are especially vulnerable. I always try to be aware of how tired I am and how it is affecting my mental sharpness. When I start to feel fatigued I slow down.
You ever thought about racing? I’d never done a trackday before I started racing (stupid I know) but the amount you learn from racing is insane...
I have had some near crashes when I push too far beyond my limits - losing rear grip when I accelerate too early coming out of a turn or missing a brake marker as I approach a turn at a higher speed. Only one crash though...and that was a shifter failure coming into a tight turn. No down shifts...and thus not enough braking to make the turn...off the track and high sided down a hill. 😳😉
Excellent video.
Not acknowledging how tired I was on my last session of the day... felt I was not going to make a corner and instead of just easing it in... straightened up in the grassy run-off... forgetting that grass is slippery... even with track day insurance I'm still facing a huge bill... luckily didn't get hurt. Lost focus and with it all the knowledge from my training as well.
Good Video. I will definitely keep this as I'm getting ready for my first TD this coming May.
Thanks for being honest with the community about where you were on your first TD. many vloggers on youtube simply blame the bike for any issues or wrecks they encounter, but the vast majority are caused by rider error. These machines are much better riders than we are. ;)
Yes I very much agree. In the track day world they blame the tyres too. "I ran off the edge of the tyre" is a personal favourite of mine.
where are you riding?
Roebling Road Raceway in Bloomingdale, GA
Another excellent video mate.I wasn't fearless I got myself ready with motovoodo, twist of the wrist, learned the track and reference points on youtube I was doing really well ;).I did many track days with no problem until I became overconfident ;).I went down in dunlop last coner of mondello track to mutch throttle in full lean,small damages and no injuries but lessen learned and humble again 😁😂.
My way was always, start slow and gradually build up. Always smooth and gentle on the controls and speed will come. Instruction for anything potentially dangerous goes without saying .
Perfectly summarized!! 👌🏼
So far I've never crashed a street bike, only ridden my SV650 on the street/track, I'm now at the fast end of A-group at track days, took me a year and a half about... Rode dirt bikes alot when I was younger... 😀👍
I have run off course three times... Two were false neutrals... The other was my first lap on my first track day, just didn't know the course and was going too fast...
I was never cocky or arrogant going into any track-day event. I always take the first session slow and build up my speed. When the 3 or 4 session comes around I usually have a feel for the racing line, breaking points, apexes and memorized the lay out.
Soon, I am lapping or passing almost everyone. At that point it felt easy and I wasn't stressed doing so. Needless to say, an instructor then comes blowing by me at an insane pace and WOW !!! Just when you think your doing something... your just scratching the surface LOL
No crash yet after 5 track days, n 2 race days. After 15 years of no track Just bought a new track bike, aprilia rsv4 2011. Sweat ride. Doing another track day in November at LAKESIDE PARK RACEWAY
Well sadly a lot of riders are very close to their limits (which they dont know because of the no fear attitude) while riding on the street. It is when something unexpected happens like a misjudged corner when they leave their "comfort zone" and are panicking.
if you are even a little bit experienced with proper riding techniques you can immediatly see who is pushing their luck while riding.
The problem with some of them is their stubbornness when i tried to help them. They thought of themself as a good rider whily riding very whacky and uncontrolled. I think that it is very important to learn as much as you can about good riding so you will subconsciously will make the right decisions when there is a unexpected and dangerous situation.
Your channel is amazing! Keep up the good work!!!
Cheers Jonathan!
I had my 1st track crash last year. Moved up to the B group and felt like I needed to be faster than I was comfortable with. Boom! Crashed!
buy a cheap trackbike...get an experienced rider to take you round for a load of laps to show you the racing line....STICK to the racing line once you learn it...then do lappery.lots and lots of lappery...stay inside your comfort zone,because the more laps you do-the quicker you'll get,ergo your comfort zone will be ever-expanding.you can watch/listen to all the *here's how to go quick,be safe,* videos in the world.....but you already know,don't you...that it's totally different once you're out there ON the bike......get a front and rear cam,watch yourself lapping,listen to the revs and you'll notice that as you get more laps under your belt,you're on the power more,on the power sooner,less time off the throttle,smoother on the brakes....and please guys,stop the posing...there is NOTHING worse than the guy in front of you getting his knee down in a corner but holding you up because he's going so slow while concentrating on getting his knee down,that every corner sitting behind him adds a second or two to your own laptimes.....and one last point to bear in mind...due to a variety of reasons(the bike itself,tyres,weather,busy track/empty track,etc etc)you'll have quick days and slow days...don't try to make the slow days turn into quick days...at best you'll get frustrated..at worst it'll be an ambulance job.
Loved your blog.... love your videos even more... Great transfer over. I did exactly the same on my first track day by the way... fast road rider thought i was awesome... boom off i went
Thanks Matthew. Really appreciate it.
i agree with all, but also dont forget about the conditions and abilitys of your bike... some riders, ride with poor brakes or poor tyres or lacking oils or suspension service. i noticed that this affects a lot of selfconfidence in braking or controlling, which tense your body and makes everything even worse.
Can you please please do a video on what to do when you get on the grass? Or overshoot a turn?
I went to track recently and got to ride a bike that's only has 1/4 the power of what I ride on road. Yet I took it slow as it was my first time and often I was overshooting. At the end of the session I felt like I was making no progress as many were overtaking me. So I started pushing hard and I low sided.
Could you do a video on what to expect on your first track day?
First track day last week. Forth lap in and I flung it up the road in the wet. I was for too eager to get past the guy in front who was mega slow in corners but opening it up on the straight. The bike went from underneath me during heavy breaking. Rear set and visor too damaged to continue. Raging I spent £235 for 4 laps. So so angry still.
So much knowledge.
why I'm watching this now after I had a crash hours ago, lost concentrating, and fixed my sight on where I want to have my crash, I had the turn right got the entry but got panicked when I thought I leaned too much with high speed and it wasnt, fixed my lean angle at the wrong time and then .... got these thoughts about holding my self and slowing down on the gravel, I didnt
Very informative video!
I love the track💚
Team AeroR
First track day yesterday, and no crashes. I was pretty slow however. ;)
Great series thanks, Just one tip which I think is also vital but was missed. When going too hot into a corner and drifting too wide, despite scrubbing off the majority of your speed still heading off track inevitably, Dont panic and remember the bike will travel over grass, stone trap etc straight so if you have any run off use it! If you continue attempting to turn due to being mentally locked in cornering once your tyres leave the tarmac your repair costs will rise. Damage control if possible peeps, hope it helps.
I agree with all of that.
I am still not finished with all the articles on your website :)
Watching a video or two in between the articles is nice - I would even subscribe twice if I could :)
In less than a week I'll have my day 4&5 on the track and will work on further progress. I am still in the "slowest" group because I am slow at stepping out of my comfort zone. This time I am there with my CBR600RR (previously with the MT-09) so I expect that it will be easier for me to progress.
cheers,Mike
Have a great time, Mike. Come back here and tell me how you get on :)
Hi Dan,
the track day was AWESOME!
You can feel that this bike was made for the track. This helped me to improve my lap time by several seconds in comparison to the ones with my Yamaha FZ09. I know that I have still a lot of room for improvement in the braking zones, but I am more than happy with my results as I enjoyed every single lap. Your articles definitely helped me to improve as I tried to tackle the following topics:
Visual skill - Defined reference markers which helped me to build up speed as I was able to trust that I can go quicker.
Loose grip on handlebars - I noticed that I block in right corners the inward movement of my clip ons while starting to lean it over.
Trained the body position on paddock stands - was also a great stretching exercise which should be started a week before.
Focused on fully opening the gas
Succeeded on breaking my lean barrier - my right side was a lot weaker than the left one
I realised that coming back from an hang off is the easiest when you start closing the throttle, as you easily can stabilise yourself with the knees.
I just uploaded the video of my riding on the Track if you’re interested (with german comments), but don’t file obliged to watch it.
Thanks a lot!
Stay safe, Mike
Don't try to find out, how long you could use those expensive slicks and push the front too much at the same time. Results in a very quick lowie at a corner you could have taken faster with fresh slicks.. If the little dots on the slick seem to vanish, it's about time to change. Maybe don't wait too long before changing, its hard to feel when the front is over (or is it just Bridgestone^^)
Hi great channel with superb info and presentation. Have my first track day coming up at Brands just wondering about tyre pressures? Of course i'll be in the novice group and on road I tend to run the standard 36F and 40-42 rear pressures on my GSXR. Should I decrease pressures before i go and if so how much?
Decrease them when you get there, assuming you're riding there. However as for which pressures that entirely depends on the make/model.
Thanks - it was a cool evening and I took the advice of the guy at the brief which was to leave them at road pressures - they worked fine. cheers
I’m doing my first track day in a week & TBH I’m a little nervous. I’m doing it on my mates track bike “gsxr 750” & ive never ridden it before or been on a track before, I’m used to that sort of power so that doesn’t bother me. My main concerns are holding people up or being so far out of position in corners that I put other riders in danger due to my crap positioning. My mate says I’m worrying too much & to just try & enjoy it & I’ll find myself riding quicker than I think I am.🤷🏻♂️😳
How’d it go?
@@PewPew702 well a year on & ive got my own track bike “zx9r” & I’m totally hooked.👍
@@brno221973 just did my first track day a couple days after I replied to you and same Mann. I'm obsessed! So fun. I'm on the lookout for a 300 as my track bike right now.
@@PewPew702 I’m at cadwell tomorrow, unfortunately not riding just helping out a mate who’s riding, no novice places left or I’d have done it.👍
Grear and keep going man;)
thanks 😘
In where i live the riding season starts in the winter, so all sport riding schools are closed now but i want to ride anyway, the question is can i apply your theories as training by my own, i mean without a coach, if yes how and where
You can practise many techniques on the road, but you have to be sensible and safe about it.
I've seen people crash trying to chase better riders after getting passed... Follow them to your comfort level but sometimes you just gotta let them go, man.... lol
After turning in, getting on the gas to early (actually at the same time) and to aggressively has caused me to have three high sides luckily they have all been collected before disaster has struck . I know the rules but I am struggling with this.
David, put yourself in a position to pay attention to what you're doing (knock a few % off your speed), then simply learn to what for the bike to turn and get on the line you want before cracking the throttle. It's just a timing issue.
Thanks Dan I think also it is a patience issue as well Im in a hurry to be quicker but obviously this is a mistake that I must overcome before I end on the ground.
Don't get on slicks too soon.
Road tyres give you far more warning of failure and time to save it, slicks go from hero to zero in the blink of an eye.
That's why in racing we start on prody bikes with road tyres, learn how to slide and learn what it feels like without falling off.
If you try that on slicks you will be on your back each mistake.
Slicks are not a tyre to learn on.
This I can't agree on one bit. In my experience, it's the complete other way around. Road tyres are the fickle ones with scary slip characteristics and slicks have the nice progressive feedback. Some road tyres are even downright horrifying when they start to overheat, where you go from grip to greasy in an instant.
You need a fair bit of speed to maintain the heat in slicks, mostly so they don't tear and ball up not lasting as long.
Now, there are better "road" tyres than others for track use, but those are marginal for road anyway. Super Corsa SP, Power RS, RS10, et.c. I was actually really impressed with the Super Corsa SP's coming from proper racing slicks, but really, I got about as many laps out of a rear as I did a medium slick. These are road tyres in name only, IMO.
Damn I’m that “no fear, think I’m gonna be a natural” guy… I’ve yet to be humbled. I drove 6 hours trailered my bike got a hotel showed up at the track and got rained out two days in a row. Lot of money wasted, when the closest track is 6 hours away… I’m not sure when or if I’ll make it to an actual track again.. guess it street Rossi for me…😢 my dream is to own a track one day. Then I can ride rain or shine. 😊
Had been riding 600s on the street since 1994. Then a buddy said, “Why don’t you put your bike on the track and see how you like it?” The day after I attended the California Super Bike school I was at the DMV un-licensing both bikes. Have never been on the street again. Too dangerous for me.
My strategy for not crashing was simple. I rode at 80% of my ability until 80% became boring at those speeds. Then I rode at 80% of my ability at the next speed/braking/etc. The problem was always the same, keeping my ego in check. When I pushed my limits (when someone passed me) I found that all technique went out the window. My ego is both a blessing and a curse.
You can see my track work on the 600RR, Karts, Nascar and Porsches at th-cam.com/video/6PY8mEG1OIw/w-d-xo.html
I want to start track riding. Would you recommend starting track on a 250?
600cc is usually my recommendation for full size tracks. There's no right or wrong answer here though. You can ride and learn on whatever you want :)
My track day experience was starting with a 300, then going to a 600 and now back to the 300. In my opinion the 300 is less intimidating. After first riding the 300 and getting my doors blown off by bigger bikes mostly on the straighaways. I went to a 600. For me, I was thinking more about not crashing instead of riding technique with the 600. With the 300 I now think more about body position, later braking, hitting apex'es, earlier on the throttle, etc. Instead of not crashing. I plan on starting to actually race later this year on the 300. I haven't crashed yet. But I am taking it slowly and safely. At my age(63) safety is more important than pure speed. Main thing is. Ride smart but always have fun.
Well I think that the no fear attitude is inside every new rider that haven't crash a bike yet that is...when that happens then they will know how to mentally prepare them how to really rode a bike! Most of them fear the bike after the crash if they broke some bones or more likely loose some skins but those the survived with just scars and bruises tent to correct what they did wrong... my 1st bike was a Kawasaki 250cc and fear was left behind whenever I'm riding! If sparks don't fly on fast corners then I am disgust with myself...I'll take on that corner again and again and again... to make long story short, the was this corner near my neighborhood (lol) I ride'em everyday to work... and it was a Sunday and no traffic...zassst 120km, zrasstt 150km,zraaaassstttt 170km entering that same corner for the 3rd time and overshot it, hit the kerb, high sided a couple of trees and ended in a U-drain! Maybe I was the luckiest mothrfkr on two wheels that freekin sunday or the motogod was looking down on me, I got off with just bruises on my back.. thats how I learned to be a better rider...# respect the power, fear the rider...
I used to have a 300cc bike and rode with a buddy that had a 1050cc. I'll never forget the day he told me I was riding that thing like I wasn't scared of it. It was that day I knew I had to check my ego. 45mph curves at top speed was fun, but after a few oh shit moments I had to calm down.
"food" on the track? must be a harley rider...
Crashing makes you faster
Everyone on the track has crashed at least once, from beginner to pro.
A crash is a crash, however fault it is, you still crashed.
You have middle aged men learning to ride fast on bikes that have much more power than Roberts and Sheene had. They have more weight, a higher CoG less brakes and high performance road tyres not factory chosen slicks. Why do you think they crash? The average rider who thinks he is fast cannot handle more than 40BHP on his first days on a track. Riding fast isnt a question of going "mad" or having bottle. The top riders are not mad at all, they are just much more experienced and can think faster than joe public. Track days are all about slowing people down, most are riding bikes that they are not good enough to ride.
I crashed on my 3rd TD due to fork springs for a rider 80-110lb heavier than me, front end folded during upright braking without warning in the dry.
This is probably my only "hardware" concern for my TD. I am a lot heavier than the bike was intended for and have not been able to get the proper fork springs and rear spring to get that corrected. I'm going to use that to focus on being smooth with my throttle application and also my braking application though and do my best to overcome this and not blame the bike. Besides - I need to put the fork down and lose some Lb's anyway. ;)
Note also I was catching very slow rider on the brakes even after braking earlier and went down 2m behind them because passing wasn't allowed and I felt I could slow in time, and actually did but wanted to slow more. My brake lever control was as good as I could have possibly done with the experience I had, couldn't even feel if the lever was actually moving with the pressure I added when front tucked.
I suggest a zip tie on the fork leg, once you are using all the travel don't brake harder.
maybe if you weren't arrogant it wouldn't have happened