SM64 - Blue Coin Clones
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 พ.ค. 2024
- In this video, I explain how blue coins work, and discuss whether blue coins and/or the blue coin block could be cloned to gain extra coins.
In conclusion, when you clone a blue coin, the blue coin remains on the course, but can no longer be accessed since it stays invisible and intangible without the blue coin block. When you clone the blue coin block, the block remains on the course, but is meaningless since there are no more coins to make visible. The only way to produce extra coins from cloning is to clone a blue coin and then exit through the loading point before the blue coin timer runs out. But despite my best ideas and attempts, I could not show this to be doable.
At the end, I show Mario cloning blue coins from various enemies. It is worth noting that my discussion of blue coins only pertains to the blue coins related to the blue coin block. Blue coins that come from enemies can be cloned, but since the enemy dies in the process, that blue coin can't be produced again. Consequently, no extra coins are gained from cloning a blue coin from an enemy. - เกม
"I just get stuck in some sort of limbo world"
PU'S CONFIRMED
@Z_Liv yeah how
sex
@Z_Liv we all agreed we shouldn't reply to this comment. didn't you get the memo?
@@minuspi8372…what memo? There was a memo we were supposed to get?
@@MarioMastryeah it was handed out at the last meeting, were you not there? i’m gonna have to bring this up at your next performance report
I love how "(using) speed to go faster" was your *last* idea.
Such solutions that might get access to the parallel universe and dangerous solutions only used to for desperate cause
00:51
"We need to go deeper"
this guy.
Deffinitely I love him
Hello everyone! I'm Andis, and welcome to today's cooking show! On this episode, we will be making a classic, yet somewhat modern Soap Cake! Now I know what you're thinking, who in their right mind wants a soap cake!? But we're not in our right mind so that's A-OK! But enough about that, let's get started! For ingredients, you will need cake mix, eggs, butter, milk, the most fucked up route in existence, and some fine quality soap. Begin by mixing all of the ingredients in a bowl, and add extra soap for extra taste! Now that you are all mixed, put that bad boy in the oven for 30 seconds, and think about the scrumptious cake that will soon caress your taste buds. Once baked, take that moist cake out of the oven and slather it in some icing, strawberries, and extra soap for good measure. Once done, give it to your favorite friend and be prepared to experience true rejection. Well, that's it for today's episode, until next time, stay squeaky!
1:40 let's go deeper
"We need to go deeper"
Me: (lenny)
Inverted_Paradox
I... uh... what?
"I just got stuck in some kind of limbo world"
Probably a PU so far away that the distance between the individual x planes and z planes is >32 units (you need a speed of at least 64 units)
I don't think he could have builded up so much speed before his quarter spet lined up with a PU
@@hevgamer6087 BLJ build up speed SUPER QUICKLY. Your speed basically doubles with each BLJ.
I'm not an expert, was this video made before or after the parallel universe discovery?
@@Pixelcraftian this video was made just a year before the discovery of Parallel Universes. Oldest video's are 7 years old so this could be an early demonstration of one before they had a name.
The beginning of PUs?
GabrielAKAFinn yes.
10:30
@@Jake_Josh No. PU's were known about long before this. They were even used in the 2012 120 star TAS.
The Albino Tadpole for Pannankokek 2012.
Jake Josh Pannenkoek2012*
The earliest known mention of PUs is from a GameFAQs thread in 2005
“Some limbo world”
I get halfway thru the video like “well that seems pretty cut and dry, video over” and then the mad man _clones the block_
I hope you use your talents to do something like teach, this video explained things very well and your method of testing hypotheses to flesh out the explanations is something that would lend itself very well to teaching. I'm imagining programming or something since you clearly like exploring mechanics of games
CreamyRage I'm actually a TA for a Mathematics/Computer Science course!
That explains a lot, I can imagine you do a good job based on these videos
pannenkoek2012 I would love a teacher who secretly makes money of a amazing game.
+pannenkoek2012 I like game mechanics and stuff too, but I can't program. What should I do to become a 1337 gamedev?
+DarkWave I would recommend you learn how to program.
10:41
Did you . . . get into a parallel universe? I'm pretty convinced that's a PU you ended up in.
+MegaZack30 Was thinking the same thing! Please answer.
+pannenkeok2012 there now it should show up in his notifications and hopefully he goes to the video to check the comments
+MegaZack30 I don't think so, I think he would need way more speed to get to a PU. In the video where he explains how PUs work he had to build up speed for hours to get to one.
+MasterOfTheChainsaw It's because of how many PUs he had to go through. You can easily get to a single PU with a BLJ.
+MegaZack30 My understanding is that position variables still update in PUs.
That's pannenkoek2012's uncertainty principle right there!
You should make a video explaining that outside-the-level limbo in details. I did it many times with an autofire controller, and sometimes Mario disappears but can still “move” like you did, sometimes there is a sound glitch and nothing else can happen, sometimes the camera still follows Mario who is in an invisible box, and sometimes the same thing happens except I have infinite space to move.
Craki Yeah, I probably will make a video on that down the road!
+Craki welcome to the wonderful world of paralel universes
+pannenkoek2012 Is it the floating point precision?
@@pannenkoek2012 and oh boy did you
This thread is like listening to a scientist right before he discovers nuclear energy or something.
6:43
SO WHY DON'T YOU CLONE THE GAME??
how does one clone an N64 cartridge in the real world?
By grabbing a bomb as it explodes, obviously.
Piracy
+Njihjk Zero brb flying to syria
*PPPPAAAARRRRAAAALLLLEEEELLLL UUUNNNIIIVVVEEERRRSSSEEESSS.*
Just realized that coins have 4 frames to spin! No wonder they look so laggy!
10:33 The worlds first parallel universe in sm64
Not even close. The earliest documented example of travelling to a PU that I've seen is 25 July 2005 cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/267091686423789568/392996279191339008/unknown.png
@@MariaNicolae i've been trying to figure out when PUs were first discovered and properly explained, but searching for them in this day and age just digs up shitty memes about watch for rolling rocks
@@ojcorp The term "PU" has only been in use since about 2015. If you want to find anything earlier than that searching "PU" won't yield shit. It's been known as "out of bounds" since at least 2008 (maybe 2007), but I don't know if there was a name before that one. Back in 2005 there probably wasn't a standard name for it
@@MariaNicolae when did people start to figure out how they actually work and/or use them in routes?
@@ojcorp From what I've seen, the first time PUs were utilised was in Moat Door Skip, since it was a solution to a long standing problem. Tyler Kehne did most of the figuring out how to route them
Great explanation, I enjoyed learning more about the blue coins!
I love the commentated videos. Sure most of the best videos are from the uncomentated channel but it's still nice for dyslexia or when you don't want to focus on reading too much. Also your voice is nice
Hey, at the end where you said Mario gets shot into a limbo world, did he shoot into a PU?
Clay Young Yeah he shot into the steel ball run universe haha funny joke amirite fellas
"It's a surprise tool that will help us later"
Is the "limbo world" you talk about here a parallel universe?
No, this is different. In PUs, Mario can still move normally.
This is probably a PU that's so far out Mario's stuck in place by floating-point imprecision.
But what about PU crashes?
PU crashes don't happen on (any) emulator, VC also doesn't have them
VirtigrisTheWrench: PU crashes don't happen on the emulator he was using (the power meter appears after the PU crash would have happened), so probably float imprecision (he's so many PUs out that Mario's normal 32~64 movement speed isn't enough to go to the next float, in the same way that, on a TI-89 or TI-83/84 series calc [14 digits], 1.E+16 + 100 = 1.E+16)
anyway doubles _were_ used in a few places
…unintentionally, causing things like the WiiVC BitFS 0x route to be possible
6:42 Then clone the game. :P
Blacklight Ikr
Cloning the game would be piracy. Piracy is an illegal action and will terminate your N64.exe Not to mention, all these glitches in application for the A button challenge are console tested so, good luck duplicating a N64 game pak.
_CrazyCrafter672 yep
@@virtigristhewrench It's just a joke smartass.
I'm Loving This Guys Science!! It's Awesome!!
when you started building up speed on the elevator my mind honestly melted
these videos are amazing you earned a sub ;D
Actually I think you can do this, you just have to place the HOLP at the loading point, and when you clone the teleport it appears at the loading point and you can unload the clone.
So basically in 11 minutes we go from talking about coins to taking about parallel universe
A time before parallel universes were a known phenomenon? That's craaaazy!
man you're amazing! how you discover so many things about sm64?
I bet there is no one that knows more about sm64 than you :D
That's why I need to share my knowledge! :D
Only if we could use your knowledge for things in the real world :P
***** if there was cloning in real world, i would be rich
pannenkoek2012
You know how you said you couldn't use Chuck-ya to get to the loading point faster? Well you could've just done it while holding the clone hands-free, or you could've just done it AFTER you released the clone.
*atticus* yrubsemA Or you could hold Chuckya hands-free.
Is it possible to lower the water in the main part of WD world so that you can backwards long jump and run to the loading zone?
I'm interested in this Limbo world. How did it happen? What caused it? Are there any more limbos?
QLW
Quarter Limbo World.
The fact that he's not getting anywhere means it isn't a PU.
He wouldn't have enough speed to get in PU so far away
Villfuk 02 blj's are EXTREMELY fast at increasing speed
I've discussed this in another comment chain on this video, and based on all the circumstances and the limited information we have from this video, the most likely explanation by far is Floats. There's a video about it that Pannen has put out. Bascially, Floats are used to track Mario's position (at least for our purposes, that's explained in the Watch for Rolling Rocks video). The thing about floats, is that they can technically represent values from +/- infinity, however, they get less and less precise the farther from 0 you go. Since these are used to track Mario's movement, his movement becomes more and more granular visually at distances really far away from the origin of the map, such as PUs that are far enough away. Eventually, Floats become so granular that Mario can't quarter-step between two "adjacent" values of the Float (remember that Mario's movement is accounted for at every quarter step of his next intended position, and the game will move Mario up to but not including the first invalid step). So with enough speed, Mario would me almost instantly transported a large distance away from the main map, such that he wouldn't qualify at every quarter-step moving through float points, even with such immense speed. He'd be stuck in place with his position not updating. However, as seen in the Float video, Mario can still perform the running animation, even if he's not moving anywhere.
The only other option would be a completely new glitch. Remember that PUs don't have walls, so the only things stopping Mario's movement out in a PU are Floats and OOB, both of which function on the quarter-step movement calculation. PUs don't become more granular, so were Floats factored out of the equation, Mario would just continue forever until he lost speed naturally such that he could not travel between PUs, which is not what is seen in the video. So if it's not floats, it would be a new glitch with the exact specifications Pannen described: Mario can run about as he pleases, but his position doesn't update, and the camera locks. These things are all covered by Floats, so the existence of a separate glitch is unlikely, but technically possible.
"My only other idea was to use speed to get there faster" genius lmao
It's honestly a shame your videos got memed to death *cough cough* Watch for rolling rocks *cough cough*. These videos are really entertaining and informative.
If you can clone the yellow coin spawning point, can you clone the Goomba spawning point with the mystery Goomba?
he can and has, but that's cheap
he has? i thought it was impossible since there were no loading zones or something
You can't clone any spawner without the loading zone cloning method, which is only present in DDD and WDW
But clones cant send or recive signals so it wouldn't spawn the goombas anyway. But good idea though!
Ryan Paul
But they won't unload either! If you place a spawning point clone while they're loaded, then stomp on the mystery goomba, guess what? He hasn't unloaded!
I just got my old n64 working with Super Mario 64. Sadly, both of my old controllers are broken. I will be sure to try all of these!
Nice video, did you come up with your information all by yourself and do you do it for a try-test method?
I basically do testing, make observations, formulate models that obey these observations, do more testing and observations, update the model if necessary, and repeat. Until the model makes sense for every situation!
I had an Idea for cloning a Blue Coin that might have worked, but there really isn't a point even of it is possible.
It revolves on reloading the coins and the block, which only 4 cources do and the ones it matters in don't work (RR TTC and SML, two have no way to unload, can't clone in SML in general)
The issue is it involved cloning either a coin or the block AFTER they loaded which isn't possible. Even if it was possible to clone one, to do so you'd need to clone one with the timer going, AND collect all the other coins. Probably just too strict.
I don't prefer Pannen's commentary, but I love finding out stuff like this. Basically, I prefer uncommentated pannen.
But hey, I like these videos, and so, It's still pretty good.
Theory to clone blue coins & get more:
step 1: get something you can use for cloning there & have a coin block no hand clone
Step 2: collect coins (leave at min: 1 coin)
Step 3: use the clonabe object to clone the coin before the timer ends
Step 4: let the timer end then leave the area
Step 5: return to the blue coin block
This doesn't answer any question, but...
Simultaneous events (Releasing the blue coin clone; The timer runs out)? What does happen?
Either you release a blue coin that's still there and collect it (released too early) or you release a blue coin that's not there so nothing appears (released too late). Basically, there's no interesting intermediate outcome. As far as I know, this applies to all instances of releasing a clone right when that object unloads.
pannenkoek2012
So there's really no in-between event ;-;
pannenkoek2012 I wonder if it's possible to clone blue coins in any of the modded sm64 roms out there
I was thinking the same thing, but instead of timer run out, I was thinking: entering the loading point.
This should be revisited.
10:41 Wouldn't it be possible with the parallel universes you've shown off?
that "limbo world" is a PU
blu-coin
COIN-SHAPED ADHESIVE THAT CAN BE USED FOR:
playing
fixing
sculpting
mixing together other blu-coin
omg...I love these videos but
"Mare ee oh"
Mareeooooh!11
to me it sounds like maaaario
+Inotamira Orani God no need to be so sensitive about something. we just want to say what we hear is there a problem with that?
Ladical Rad the Highlander Its Mar-eo not mare-eo
Hmmm...
Would it be possible to use the "lower the water" glitch to empty out the pipe? From there, you could Backwards Long Jump into the pipe and run to the loading point in time, since there'd be no swimming.
Unless, of course, I'm missing something about the water lowering glitch. It's just a little theory. ^^;
DRYESPLZ No, the water lowering technique doesn't apply to the regular town, only to downtown.
MY question here is: can't you clone both the block AND the blue coins? that way you can infinitely clone both! clone both a blue coin and the block before ground pounding the original block,dont collect the coin clone, reclone the coin before the timer runs out,ground pound the block and repeat infinitely.cant you do that?
...Okay, I think I get what you're saying. Which is that we need to find a way to clone the object storage system.
You're a fucking genius mate.
You could clone the switch, then before the timer runs out, clone a blue coin. When you reload it, the switch will be back, and so will the coin. It's just a question of if you can clone a coin after hitting the switch before time runs out.
In a different comment, he said cloning both of them wouldn't work.
There should be like this typical question stating:
"Can this method kill the mystery goomba?"
Lol...
The single star TAS for the vanish cap star in wdw / reds not sure has a blj into a PU which loads tje area almost instantly
bits of this remind me of Minecraft. when you die, mobs gather around your death site because you are but invisible and non solid.
But can you do it in a half A press?
Even _Better:_ No Buttons Allowed
*EVEN BETTER:* No Input Allowed.
Even Better: No Game Allowed.
An A press is an A press. You can't say it's just a half
Even even better: No Super Mario 64 and console... no emulators allowed
5:30 can we use this for the coin we saw earlier?
so what ur saying if we do multiplayer, we can , but cant regular
10:40 oh you innocent, innocent man
5:14 Stored upward pitch!
Pannen what about that 2 player thing you did to try to kill that mystery goomba? Or is that not usable for what you are trying to accomplish?
do coins from enemies only drop once or do they drop until (the game thinks) you collect them?
Does this apply to blue coins dropped by enemies?
I have some related questions. What about the coins on the sliding missions? Is it even possible to clone those? If by some fashion you get 100 coins on a course without a normal 100 coins star, do you get a 100 coin star?
So, idk if this helps or not, or if you figured this out yet, but ill comment it anyways.
At ~10:35 is this "limbo" state the PU that you showcased in your 0x A presses for the Secret Aquarium? It's apparent that, at the time, you didn't know/understand why or what this was (if it is in fact Mario going into the PU do to you gaining a ton of negative speed).
If this is the case, could you not Ground Pound the Blue Coin Block and collect a Blue Coin Clone, then BLJ on the elevator to enter the PU, and then get out of the PU into the Loading point zone of the underwater town? or is there not enough time/wrong elevation/simply not possible? or is this just an unexplored Option that you don't really want to waste time on?which i could understand.
Mary-O. Can't unhear.
When did Super Mario Maker come into this SM64 channel?
What happens if you gather all coins on the course, and then make a bunch of intangible blue coin clones near the coin block? If you ground pounded it, would they all become tangible?
It wouldn't be a productive use of time especially since WDW already has a 255 coin method anyways, and it doesn't look like there's much time left on the timer, but if you were to repeatedly enter and exit the loading point to bring the water level down below the pipe level, would you be able to get to the loading point a little faster?
Oh, no, that wouldn't work, since you wouldn't even be able to get out of the pipe with the clone. And that alternating water level overflow would let you get out, but I still don't see that working out due to the strict time limit
i hope you return one day my friend
your insight is missed
Could you clone a button then clone a blue coin right after?
then when you come back both would load right?
Maybe you could spawn a new teleport area so you can clone the coin and teleport to the area where the blue coins / block unloads on wetdry world.
Just curious, since it doesn't really matter, but would you be able to clone both the blue coin and the spawner in the SM64 multiplayer mod?
how about making blue coin cloning profitable in THI?
The things some people do for 5 coins... just kidding, great video
Could it be a Pedro Spot that disabled mario to move in limbo world, instead of the coarseness of Mario's position?
Now, I know how to fix this! Pannenkoek hope this will help! So, the problem is that they unload the real coin? What if you clone the blue coin block AND the blue coin and reload everything after collecting the blue coins! Then you will get 5 coins instead of the four. Not sure if this will work but by the logic it probably might.
0:30 Actually, contrary to popular belief, the average person perceives Mario 64 as a three dimensional game.
2:34 "...and will cut short the timer's upwards trajectory"
Is there enough time to clone both a blue coin and the blue coin block?
What I want to know is, if you clone the blue coin switch, throw it, and hit the original, collect some but not ALL the blue coins, leave the area, come back to the area, and hit the switch, will the rest of the blue coins still spawn?
such an in-depth question, and such a simple answer XD
they unload, so no.
I don't think you can hit the OG block after you clone it.
But what of you clone a blue coin and a blue clone block?
only get 1 clone
+Phanpy Tv I'd like to try it with the 2 Player thingy I'd heard about
0:20 insert good mythical morning intro
That is so interesting. Thanks a lot !
What are you using to animate your explanations?
It'd be far slower, but couldn't you lower the water level before cloning?
I know I'm 6 years late but you can only lower the water level of the town area, the main area reverts to whatever water level you entered the painting in when going back to it, and this was already on the lowest water level
10:32 Ahhh… _there_ it is… 😁
5:13 *_Y O U G O T T H E W R O N G P I T C H X D_*
4:16 Why does the clone count towards whether they're all collected, but doesn't get unloaded like an uncollected coin when the timer runs out?
If only there were a way to clone both the block and the blue coin. Getting two clones during that small time frame would be difficult if not impossible.
Can you even get two clones on WDW?
Idea to get 5 extra points. Clone the blue coin, then the block (correctly), and collect 3 blue coins, then go back again and there will be 4 blue coins (6 blue coins are there in WDW) and it works
or nope theres 5 so there will be 3 blue coins
benedanika no its 6
oh yeah you have to do the hat in hand. you don't have to clone the block "correctly".
you cant clone objects when going to and back :(
2 questions: What platform are u on and how do u clone ;-;
Would it be possible to clone BOTH the blue coin AND the Blue Coin Switch? Just a thought...
What about the blue coins that drop from eyeballs, boos etc. The default attribute of these coins would be visible just like yellow coins
its possible at tiny huge island, owait no bobombs or cork boxes to clone with
What about the blue coin at the beginning of the slide in Snowman's land? It doesn't use a block.
I think someone cut short your audio quality's upwards trajectory!
Would it be possible to clone the block, use the original, leave so it unloads, come back, and use the clone to extend the timer?
What if you do this setup: Edited in: wait, no it doesn't work. Edited in again: Wait, yeah it could work.
get blue coin,
hands-free,
hit block,
clone coin, +5 coins (5 total)
clone block,
release clone,
collect coins, +15 coins (20 total)
unload block/coin,
come back,
hit block, (loads 1 coin, the one you cloned)
collect coin +5 coins (25 total)
now that I say this it sounds pretty impossible to do in that short time limit, but maybe the teleporting secret zones might help with loading and unloading the coins/coin blocks fast.
Problem with that is that you can only clone the coin or the block from the loading zone, and if we were able to get to the loading zone right now, there wouldn't be any need for cloning the block.
"We need to go deeper." Pannenkoek2012 -2k14
What if you ground pound the blue coin block then clone the blue coin block and a blue coin before the timer runs out? There is most likely not enough time for this though.
You can't clone anything during the timer. Cloning involves going to the loading point, and doing that while the timer is running is the problem discussed in the video.
what if you clone the blue coins first, collect them and then clone the coin box? because if you leave the loading area with the coins cloned and the coin box cloned and then enter the loading area again, everything should be back to normal and you can hit the coin box again and collect more blue coins
I guess i should figure out how your picking up the map objects, i guess game shark?
It's a process called cloning, where forcing Mario to hold an unloaded object makes other objects appear in his hands. It's a glitch, so no hacking needed. Pannenkoek's made lots of videos about this if you want to find out more...
Would it be possible to clone the blue block AND a blue coin to get 1 more coin than 2 red coin clones would give you
nobody answered so ill do it myself: no. the blue coins and the block only load when you go through the loading point so you cant clone both
Merry-O