6.5-284 Norma Best All-Round Cartridge?
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
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People go round and round and round about things. Purely on a personal level I think the best general purpose all use rifle round was invented more than a century ago. It's the 6.5 Swedish. Flat shooting, good bullet size, mild recoil for velocity, decent terminal effects.
Came for the 6.5 Swedish comment and wasn’t disappointed. I wholeheartedly agree.
@@brayk52 same here
Exactly. And when you take those superb GP ballistics and put them in a short action that will mag feed, you get a 6.5 creedmoor. Ballistically, they are identical (same speed for a given bullet wt). That's the best thing going for the 6.5 creedmoor is that it's modeled after a superb parent.
The Swede’s history and uses in Europe are very interesting and intriguing. I have little desire to own one. There was no way, regardless of marketing, that it would ever become as available as the 6.5 creedmoor in the US, so I’m happy we have the CM. I wouldn’t own a 6.5 if it weren’t for the CM, and that’s a darn good thing.
Love my 6.5 Swede and with hand loading is where it really shines and outperforms 6.5 creed with the same bullets
The best rifle is the one you take out hunting every time and it never lets you down, no matter what caliber.
My personal best would be a 6.5x55 Swede with a fix power 4x or 6x optic, no muss, no fuss just a solid hunting rife with good real world accuracy, a proven, extremely capable cartridge, low recoil, a pleasure to shoot, and meat in the freezer.
So many people get wound up about the newest, latest, and greatest cartridge that are barely better on paper than something that has been around 100 years or the new mega, ultra magnum round that has incredible paper ballistics, but is a literal 'pain' to shoot more than a couple rounds because of the massive recoil, which erodes a shooter confidence, accuracy plumets, its not a pleasure to shoot, and it gets put in the safe never to be touched again until it is sold.
270 win just plain works, ammo is cheap and everywhere. I'll keep my old 270 thanks.
I just bought another .270 win in a browning. I have one in a Remington.
👍👏👏👏
Yes. This ^. Why the 6.5-284 when you’ve got the .270 Win? If you want to shoot at really long range, there’s better cartridges than both. The whole short-action thing means nothing to me.
@@leifhoklin2681 I agree 100%
@@leifhoklin2681 Biggest downside of the 270, in my estimation, is the low twist rate barrels of most factory rifles in that cartridge. This is a problem if one is interested in using the long BC bullets which have become all the rage with long distance shooters, and is further exacerbated if one is using mono-metal (so lower density) bullets. So if one is looking to shoot high BC heavy for caliber cooper bullets, most factory 270 rifles are going to struggle with stabilization, however, at practical hunting distances for the vast majority of hunters such concerns are of minor importance.
For hunting to 400, all these cartridges in this range are so close it won’t matter. 270 performance at those ranges is nearly identical to the PRC. I think it’s cool we have so many great choices for hunting, regardless.
Thanks for the reality check. The way people split hairs gives the impression there an immense difference. People make it seem like
1. A .308 has a trajectory like a 45-70.
2. The 6.5s hit like a .22lr
3. The 30-30 literally stops all forward motion and just drops, Matrix style, after 100 yards.
My wife shoots the 6.5 Norma, it is a dream to reload for. Very accurate. With the right bullets it is a great all around round. I shoot a .270 weatherby mag. The Norma is not lacking. Thanks Ron.
My introduction to the 6.5-284 Norma was at Camp Perry at the National Matches. I watched long range shooters win with this cartridge. After talking to one of the gunsmiths at the Matches, I had E.R.Shaw fit a 1:8 twist barrel to a Tikka T3 action. It is a brutally accurate rifle with Hornady 129 gr SST bullets. It has accounted for many deer. It is a very light recoiling cartridge which accounts for the use by competitors at the National Matches.
In The Nordics the 6.5x55 Swede is the go to cartridge for reindeer and other deer species. The .25-'06, .243, .308 and 7mm-08 are also easily obtainable cartridges that work. As is the .30-'06.
I love the .284 case design. If I could build a .27-.284 with a 1 in 8 twist to stabilize the heavier bullets. That would be my perfect cartridge. That being said I love my 7mm-08.
If you look at the charts this shows how amazing the 7mm-08 is. The 6.5-284 outclasses it, but with significantly more muzzle last, more recoil, and more barrel wear.
Handloaders need not worry! You can load the 6.5x284 norma to out perform the 6.5 prc. The norma is plenty cartridge for any north American game animal. Thanks Ron great video. I'm a big fan!
My 6.5-284 is built on a Winchester action with Lilja 30" Palma barrel and custom furniture. Absolutely amazing rifle.
Already owning several rifles to include .17HMR, .204 Ruger, .22lr, .22 magnum, .222 Rem, .223 Rem, .243 Win, 6 CM, .257 Weatherby, .270 Win, 30-06, 300 Win Mag, .33 WCF, .45 ML, ……..I wanted something different. The builder talked me into 6.5-284 and I’m very glad he did. It’s a light rifle and low recoil makes it very pleasurable to shoot. At a MV of 2975 it still has enough FPS at 900yds for most bullets to perform as designed. Your rifle may vary, but mine shoots 3/8-1/2” groups from the bench at 200yds. I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend this caliber to any man, woman, or youth though ammo off the shelf may be difficult. I love this caliber!
Everybody has a sentimental favorite and there more than a few different cartridges available for the choosing. As a hunter who likes to shoot, I load for my favorite the .280 AI and my 7mm-08. The 6.5 PRC and 6.8 Western have impressive ballistics and will make fine hunting rounds, I see no reason to depart from my duo. I enjoyed the video and your educated opinion. It’s great to have such a variety to select from and make our own decision to choose which one is best. Thanks
100 % correct. Your two rifles will cleanly kill 95% of game around this planet. Accuracy and projectile performance are more important than caliber.
Wise choices.
Take that .280 or 7mm-8 with a 120grn Barnes TTSX bullet.
The first rifle I ever bought was a Remington Model 7 in 7mm-08 when I was 14. Saved up for that for three years. Put a Nikon 3-9x on it and have taken a deer and elk almost every year with that rifle for the last 20 years. Dropped two bear with it too. It was the best gun in my opinion for the woods of Western Washington. Now I live in SW Montana and my son uses the rifle for deer and elk. He got it for his 12th birthday and took his first buck with it a month later
I bought a 6.5x55 that on closer inspection turned out to be re chambered to 6.5-284 . It’s a bit of a Frankenstein, Oberndorf Mauser action, Swedish Mauser barrel and an aftermarket walnut stock. Super happy with the accuracy, still working up loads slowly. Looking forward to seeing how is does for deer hunting this season. Enjoy your videos always.
This shows how relevant the old .270 still is. The difference in real world hunting is merely fractional and you have a good chance to find ammo.
🙏 Can I get an Amen? 😃 Preach it! 😇 "The Gospel of the 270 Winchester"! 🤗
Was in coastal in Auburn WA a couple of days ago looking at the tikkas. Another guy and his wife were also looking at them. Guy behind the counter picked up the 270 and told the customer that it's not big enough for elk. Guy was disappointed.
I have heard that too many times and had to speak up. Told the other guy that the 270 is more than adequate for elk. Have seen a lot of people use it for elk and it works great.
Told him it was a favorite for the big mountain 🐐 It's common to shoot out to 400 yards and farther.
Told him to go on TH-cam and look up Ron Spomer outdoors.
Then I see this video tonight.
Hopefully he watched this video and buys that tikka.
🙄 Next time ask the guy behind the counter how many elk he has killed, where he is getting his information from, and is he getting paid "minimum wage" for his "expertice"! 🤣 My Grandfather killed over 500 elk while working on the firing lines near Yellowstone park with his 270 Winchester and put many other species into the Boone and Crockett Record Book (like Bison, Moose, Sheep, Mountain Goat, etc...)! 🤑 The guy behind the counter obviously doesn't have a clue what he is talking about! 🤪 How "Typical" - another "Minimum Wage Moron"! 🥳
Even more good shooting information from Ron. Count me in I’ve been watching him for years. First on TV deer hunting. Thanks again for sharing your adventures 🎥💯👍
Thanks, Ron. I like it when you mention the ethical hunting distances. There is too much desire to try to take a beautiful deer at ELR distances. Losing an animal because of it is unacceptable. I just bought a custom 6.5-284 28" bull barrel for a target rifle. The 6.5-284 is what a lot of the F-class guys are shooting as well as the straight 284 and variants. It is supposed to be a great round that is easier to find accurate nodes on and soft recoil keeps you keep on target. I ordered my barrel with a long freebore so it will shoot VLD bullets like the PRC and will be single-fed. If I were hunting with it I would select an ultra-light rifle and try to keep it below 7 LBS like my 270. That little rifle has harvested my deer every season. I appreciate how easy it is to carry.
I'm looking forward to hear what Ron says about the 6.5x284 Norma. To me it is a modern day "classic". Loaded with the 156 grain Oryx bullet it can tackle North American game up to moose in size with a well placed shot at ethical hunting distances.
I used the 156 Oryx in my.280. even very large reds were pole axed. The projectile was so reliable that it became the only projectile I used. Having said that, in my 257 Roberts I use a 100 grn TTSX and one shot kills are the norm. My 6.5 x 55 695 Tikka loves 120 grn TTSX only because it is such a mild round that the 156 Oryx is a bit slow for the powder capacity and they are a hard projectile to obtain in my country.
@@lyellclare9365 What country do you live in?
Love my 6.5-284. Just received my Defiance action to build another. Only waiting on my McMillan stock. This will be my second one. No need for creedmore or prc. Tons of Lapua brass available for the 6.5-284 and my new one will have a 25" barrel. Picking up 2 Brux 6.5mm 8T barrels when I go to WI to visit my son in July. Mine are built on long actions. I have 3 270s. Just watched a video last night on TH-cam where a hunter took his bull elk at about 500 yards with his 270 Win. I used to be a magnum fanatic and have wavered over the last 35 years coming to the realization I've never needed one. IMO, 6.5PRC is a great cartridge but my best guess is it's a real barrel burner. I'm holding out for a 7mm PRC
👍👏👏👏
I don’t have one, but a 280AI seems like a great all around choice
I absolutely love my 6.5x284 Norma. Taking it caribou hunting this year with 127gr Barnes LRX.
It's the most accurate rifle I own too and it's just a cheap old savage 111.
I enjoy your videos. I saw the 6.5CM vs the Norma. I would love to see the 6.5x55 Swede(loaded to European pressures) against the 6.5-284 Norma on your channel.
@Chris Daniel find me a rifle to borrow brother 👍
Yep! I'm VERY impressed with the 6.5 PRC....
It, along with the new 360 Buckhammer.... are likely to be my next new rifles.
Short action cartridges are slowly becoming my favorite rifles to hunt with (along with Lever and break open, single shots too)
to take advantage of the high b.c bullets , in the 6.5x284 and seating out to lands , a short action won’t fly … nonetheless my all time favorite is the 6.5x284 , i’ve harvested more deer with that cartridge than i can recall , and one bonus big bull elk ..
savage has a 2.900 + col sa mag got 3 , remington 2.800 not even good for the needmore
I really love my 6.5 Creedmoor
What ever new cartridge it may be i'll still be trudging along with my old battle axe that is the 30-30 Winchester.
just got myself a 6.5 prc for exactly this
So it's a 270 Winchester. Who would have thought! As it has been since 1925!
👍👏👏👏
Just get the 270 win. And go hunting. Ammo is everywhere so are rifles new and used. Ammo is also a lot cheaper than prc or 6.8 western. It’s been around for almost 100 years for a reason. Try and find some 25 wssm for the rifle that all the gun writers said was the best new thing not all that long ago. I think a 30-06 is much better for elk and kills deer dead too.
Thanks for the videos Ron.
Live free and stay safe..
😁 I agree with you! 👍👏👏👏
Very fun video and sound advice. Thumbs up.
Here I am, just a sincere 6.5 Grendel fan for the past 10+ years.
I think the 6.5-284 is a great cartridge however I don't see any fault in a standard length "long" action. Nor do I find a lack of handiness nor lack of efficiency with a standard length "long" action which is only 1/2" longer than a short action. The issue I would see would be in rifles like the Tikka which uses a standard long action for all the "short action" cartridges like .308, .243, etc. Tikka does this to save production costs. Not many Tikka owners are complaining about how unwieldy that 1/2" has made their rifles. To sum up: I don't see anything but a perceived psychological issue in the 1/2" difference between a standard length action and a "short" action rifle in the real world in the field hunting. The difference is mainly in conversation for argument sake.
Ron, also the longer actions can have an small advantage for the 6.5-284: You can load and shoot very long bullets as the Berger long drags, esp. they fit into the magazines. I have one rifle with the Mauser 1907 Argentino action and it works very well with long 154gr Berger bullets („Hunting VLD“)
Great video Ron! It is .270 Win for me. I have taken deer, antelope, black bear, elk, moose and groundhog with my Remington 7600, 22" 1/9" twist using ONLY 150gr Remington Core-Lokt. I know where that bullet is going and I know it is going to hit hard even at 400yds. I made a 500yd head-shot on a groundhog in 1989 that astounded me even more than my hunting buddy, but I acted like I made those kinds of shots all of the time! LOL
So you're that guy with one gun we're told to beware of!
@@RonSpomerOutdoors Yes, I am afraid so. My father had a 36yr career, (1950-1986), with the USMC and was on the USMC Rifle and Pistol Team. It was he who taught me how to shoot. He was a big fan of 30-06. I read everything I could get my hands on before I bought my rifle. I was 26yrs old with two children, a mortgage and a car payment when I chose my rifle. I have had NO reason to ever regret it. Thanks for all you do for the gun community Ron. Grace & Peace.
Thanks for sharing.
When I put the 6.5-284 bull barrel on my Savage 110 I had to switch a magnum magazine & follower to work with the larger case body but it was a tack driver out to 600 yds - my max distance so far. Still love my 260 Rem on an Rem 600 action for mountain work. Heavier bullets for 6.5 make it viable for all-around status.
It's enjoyable to handhold for all of the amazing options available today, their are so many new bullet options that can give a old but tried and true cartridge like the 270 Winchester even greater performance, yet can be overlooked because it's not the latest version of something.
I have handloaded many different cartridges, but when it comes to pulling a rifle out of the safe for a hunt I've been taking the 280 AI, it has never disappointed me. I'm greatful that Nosler had it standardized. I also like the performance of the 270 Winchester and I get fantastic performance from my overlooked 270 WSM.
Thanks Ron for giving us all something to think about.
It’s sort of like 308 the round itself will outperform 99.8% of shooters but I go to the range and they all have 6.5 creedmore. And when asked why they went with it they say because it does much better at longer ranges…..they shoot exclusively at a 100 yard range and can’t be used to hunt anything in Ohio but it’s better lol
Haha. I'm wearing the same shirt right now. Nice to see Spomer shops at Costco too!
Great Video Ron, as usual. I like the ballistics of that 6.5prc but as you well know I'm a long time follower of Jack O'Connor. I told you about the 27 inch Barrel 270win I'm building off of a Savage 111. I've done quite a bit of calculating and talking to many reputable people and I gotta tell ya I think that 270 winchester needs a 1-9 twist barrel. I've talked to Berger and used the Williams BC calculator and the 1-9 will stabalize everything from a 100grn bullet to a 170. With the 1-10 twist it's in the marginal stability area but closer to that 1.5. But Hornady is telling me that the 145ELDX needs a minimum of a 1-10 and should use something faster to really take advantage of that bullet. So I think that's exactly what I'll be doing. Also your velocities on the 270 are off by about 180fps on that 150grn bullet. I've pushed mine at 3080fps hand loads of course. With Reloader 22 and IMR 4350. It really loves the RE-22 though. I've told you before that if there is one thing the 270win loves is a longer barrel of at least 26 inches. One more thing. Have you ever heard of Preferred Barrels out of Hilldale Utah. They are the ones who are building my barrel for me. My neighbor Justin Sipp is a world renowned Gunsmith and Rifle builder. His brother bought out Match Grade Machine in Hurricane and has now started Preferred Barrels with state of the art equiptment. So there you have it. Give me your thoughts and look at Preffered Barrels and let me know what you think. I'm a 270 Winchester lover and I believe it can be made much greater with a few changes.
Your passion and knowledge for shooting is awesome.
Thank you for sharing.
The 6.5-284 you have is the Wildcat version. The 6.5-284 Norma is built for a long action. Sami OAL is 3.228, basically hodgkins website list loads for both 6.5-284 Winchester, and the norma you can see the difference!
Thanks for posting this!! I've been looking everywhere for a video like this :)
love you closing comments,, i worked in small gun stores for 14 years,, 99.9 % of us feel this way.
Thanks Daniel, I appreciate that. I was informed that you asked a question during a premiere that I wasn't able to be at. I appreciate your support of the channel and wanted to make sure your question was answered. You had asked - "What is your thoughts on a good "all around" 357 magnum round?"
The best 357 Mag. load depends on end use. Targets, protection, deer hunting? I'll assume deer hunting and an 8-inch barrel for which I recommend a 158-gr. Jacketed Soft Point at about 1,500 fps. A 180-gr. will penetrate farther, but recoil more and carry less energy. Lead semi wad cutter in 158-gr. is my second choice. Either doubles nicely for defense.
Keep the questions coming during the premieres and thanks again for supporting the channel.
You got me again. I don't know why I am interested in another obscure hunting cartridge that I may never use, but somehow you make it interesting, sir
My next Mauser build is going to be the 260 AAR 40*. (All around rifle). Also known as the 6.5/257 Roberts improved. It is VERY close to your pick. I think it will be a little easier on the barrel, but it should leave the creedmore in the dust.
Doesnt the 6.5/284 basically require a long action like the 270?? I believe it is a tad too long for a short isn't it?
I shoot a 6.5 x 55 AI and I’m here to tell you that you are going to LOVE that AAR chambering 👍
Hi Ron. Great video. I have both. My 6-284 Norma and the 6.5-284 Norma. Love that case. Great comment on the Sherman cartridges. I had a 30 Sherman mag built. Another custom rifle.
If you want a bit more power than the 6.5-284 for elk etc, What about just using a straight .284? I use one for F-Class, they have awesome accuracy and can easily run bullets of 180gn.
Ron, the best would depend on where you hunt. Wooded areas with a few pastures thrown in would be served just fine with 30-30’s and other older standards.
If you’re taking 300-400yd long shots, get a 270Win! If you’re taking even longer shots, learn to stalk, LOL!
All kidding aside, ammo availability is more important than ever. I’ve seen so many “next perfect” rounds come and go on the years, remember the number of WSM offerings 20yrs ago… the only two still standing are the 270 and 300. Over the last decade, everyone has jumped on the SA/long bullets like the 6.5Cr. but who knows if these will be popular in another decade. If I were thinking about a 300-400yd gun for ethical hunting, I’d pick the 270Win! It’s almost a century old and still kills deer as dead as they need to be!
Like you said in this video, the animals won’t know which caliber you used. But if you can’t find ammo for your new rifle… Well then, the hunter with a 270 or ‘06 will be the one to take the shot!
Availability matters!
🤠 Yep!
I think we're close. I like where you're going. Can we get the PRC in 7mm?
As in 300 PRC but in standard action ?
There is one rifle maker but he wants 5,000 abuild and he is the only one that load's the ammo. Look here on you tube for .7 PRC
I enjoy your dissertations on cartridges, informative, sometimes tongue in cheek, but your ever present common sense always comes to the fore. Your advice about the well placed shot is really the best you can give to your readers or viewers, a well placed shot with an adequate cartridge far outweighs a poorly place shot with a cannon. I have taken deer with so many calibers, to name a few, 223, 25-06, 300 Savage, 308, 30-06, 30 Nosler, 338 Win Mag, 44 magnum pistol and have never lost an animal because of the that above mentioned advice, given to me by my father, so many years ago. One thing I haven't seen you evaluate are muzzle brakes, I have put two on two very different rifles, my custom 30 Nosler and my 224 Valkyrie on an AR platform, both do an excellent job. Both are from Lilja and they perform extremely well, in fact, my 30 Nosler was my old 338 Win Mag in a tang safety Ruger 77 that I had PacNor barrels re barrel. First shot out of it with the brake and I was sold! That day I had my 25-06 at the range as well, I will swear on a stack of bibles that Nosler kicks less than my Browning composite stalker 25-06. Granted my Nosler is 50% heavier but I have put two boxes down range in one session with it and had no shoulder soreness, two boxes with the Browning and you know it for a few days! I'd love to see you do a piece on brakes, I think they belong in the long range shooters toolbox as they will allow you to shoot cartidges that would be uncomfortable for many people and open up longer range or bigger game opportunities. I loved my old 338 but hated the recoil, my custom Nosler, which was my 338, is a joy to shoot because of the brake, not to mention superior ballistics. Thanks again for all the great content Ron!
I have the 6.5PRC and the 6.8 Western and love them both. I wasn’t sure if I was gonna go with the Western of the 270win but I held out for that rifle and glad I did. As a hand loader, if the velocities are below 3000fps it’s a .5moa gun all day. Keep up the good work Ron, I greatly value what you’re doing and the knowledge. Cheers!
Have you ever been able to approach 3200 fps from a 24-inch barrel in the PRC?
@@malachiwhite356 not yet but I’m gonna work on that rifle next. So far I’ve only gotten 2850 out of retumbo and 150’s.
Great video and substantive discussion as usual, Ron, thanks for it. This has long been a lively debate, but it's really two separate issues: the classic older cartridges versus the current, new heavier for caliber bullet cartidges that require higher twist rate barrels. So it's an old "old" versus "new" technology question, and as with all things, newer technology is objectively better. My 2011 Cummins diesel Dodge truck is orders of magnitude more functional and reliable than was my first truck - a 1975 Dodge Power Wagon i got in high school in 1985. At that time, that truck was a gold standard, just lije the .270 Winchester was when introduced. I live in Tucson and have hunted deer and elk in Arizona 37 plus years since I was a teenager. So my hunting rifle collection consists of all "classic" cartridges - 6 MM Rem., .243 (my now teenaged son's first rifle), a .25-'06 (my personal favorite for Coues deer with 117 grain bullets), a .270 that Ive taken mature bull elk with single shots, a .30-'06 (my first rifle when I was 13), a 7 MM Remington Mag., and finally a .300 Win Mag. Ive been sorely tempted to get a new 6.5, though I own two 1896 Swedish Mausers chambered in the original 6.5 way back in 1894. Tack drivers but I dont hunt with them. I've been sorely tempted to pick up a basic Savage Axis II in 6.5 PRC, BUT, if I were to pick one "do it all" rifle cartridge now, sorry Ron, it's the 6.8 Western because it is demonstrably better for elk. I have both seen in person and anecdotally heard that even a well placed 6.5 round struggles humanely to kill a bull elk. The bottom line for me is that none of the new cartridges - which I grudgingly ackowledge are better on paper than the older ones I own - do anything materially better than the classic rifles I already own. My go tos now: .25-'06 for Coues, 7MM Rem Mag for elk. Case closed.
here's what is fun about this kind of vids...woot to whatever "Ron" comes up with. at the end of the day it's what ya got and how good are you with it...from 30,30 to new wiz-bang...do you're do...don't listen to these "prognosticators" practice with what ya got it will do.
I have hunted with a 264 Winchester Magnum since the mid-1970’s. It is an excellent choice. There are many great choices. I usually find my self going out the door with on r of the following: 25-06, 257 Weatherby Mag, 264 Win Mag, 270 Wby Mag. Up close, either 35 Remington or 444 Marlin for Deer and Antelope size game.
I like your well balanced discussion on all the mentioned bullets and loadings. It is a personal thing who shoots what cartridge, in my opinion the 7mm-08 is great for everything from White tail to elk. It is all up to bullet placement and knowing your rifle. Would not use the 7mm-08 on Himalayan Thar, where ranges mostly start at 250 yard and out to 600 yards. I use at .338 with 250 grain projectile for a one shot kill. You do not want those Thar taking even 2 steps after being hit.
I have done for my AR 10 the 6.5-284 Norma and the second upper in 6mm - 284 Win .
For the 6.5-284 Norma I am loading the Noma 156 grain Vilcan or the Oryx for hunting then shooting all the other bullet brands and weights of bullet for target shooting.
I am using Pac Nor supper match 26 inch barrels for both the 6.5-284 and the 6mm - 284.
The new AR 10 upper was done in 375-325 WSM for a dangerous game rifle I will be using on the Alaskan guided hunts I have done since 1989.
Great video, I guess I am just old school.
I sure enjoy your videos! You give great information and present it with a lot of fun for the audience. Keep it up sir!
You picked a very sensible, efficient, and versatile deer hunting platform. And if I were in the market for a new deer rifle, this is something I may want to consider. But my preference is in my 270. It's accurate, hard hitting, and with the right freebore in the barrel, it can shoot higher BC bullets. The 6.5 mm bullets can really tackle Rooney deer but deer are easy to kill. Elk are not and I think that I can't really appreciate a larger bore for for North American versatility. But you are definitely right that the 6.5 PRC is one fantastic round!
I personally do not yet have the skill set to take full advantage of everything the 6.5 PRC round has to offer, BUT, that doesn't mean that the 6.5 PRC round has not inspired me to learn and do the best that I can. I really enjoy that cartridge. I can remember having the thought in my head right before taking the first shot, (just at targets) to get in touch with the new rifle system and cartridge and no matter what anybody tells you about the performance and recoil of a cartridge and rifle, you will never know exactly what it feels like, until to actually send one. But I remember wondering, how hard it was gonna hammer on my shoulder, actually kinda worried, due to having the past year rotator cuff surgery's on both shoulders, and feared wrecking all that work and down time.... Fearing that this 6.5 PRC was gonna hammer like 30-06 or something... So I am kinda nervous.. Screw it, send it..... I SMILED EAR TO EAR.. piece of cake, or piece of pie, or whatever that saying is... My .223 Rem recoils harder than that of the cost effective entry level Ruger RPR in 6.5 PRC, I really really enjoy that rifle and cartridge combination. Is it perfect, NO, but neither is my skill set. I choose to believe that this combo will allow me to grow and appreciate the process of learning, as I get stronger physically, as I am still healing two shoulders, I shake allot still, due to muscle atrophy and I fatigue very quickly with in minutes. I am working on strength building these days and having a great time doing it. And to think, I use to be able to bench 230 to 240 lbs.. I would be luck if I could bench 30 lbs..LOL... The Ruger RPR in 6.5 PRC has given me hope to stay in the game. Now, if I can get my hands on fresh brass from any of the stampers.... HINT..HINT...HINT.. Norma, Petersons, ADG, Hornady, Lapua..... and if anybody knows of any other brass manufacturers, that I have not mentioned, please feel free to let me know. Thank you all. Be safe, and do your best to learn something clever at least once a day. It is good for you.
I think its like you said about availability, I quit reloading a long time ago but have lots of 243, 30-06 and 300 Wby mag. I hope my deer/elk dont mind getting killed the old fashion way.
I had been debating a new rifle/cartridge combo for the last year, it was between the 6.5-284, 6.5 PRC, and the 6.8 Western. All three have excellent ballistics, very similar. It was a tough choice but it came down to availability. Not that any of these three are common but of these the 6.5 PRC had more rifle, ammo, and reloading component option. So the 6.5 PRC was my choice (barely). Any of these three would be excellent choices.
My 6.5 PRC Browning X-Bolt Pro is my Nevada rifle and cartridge for the longer ranges and mule deer and elk we find here. But back in Pennsylvania my SAVAGE 99 C IN .308 was very effective. Today I would use 6.5 CM for Pennsylvania deer. Plenty of power for whitetails in "Penn's Woods".
270 still takes a Elk still out to 500 yds. this is why the ole girl still to this day is amazing. and there are people that think they need a 300 win mag to take whitetail at 100 yds
I love all kinds of 6.5 cartridges.
I have a 6.5x55 Krag, a 6.5x55 Swedish and a 6.5-06 and I love them all.
All of them kill any kind of deer with the right bullet.
My go to bullet now is the 120 grain ttsx.
It is fantastic for all kinds of 6.5 cartridges.
I totally prefer to use my 6.5-06 for longer shots, but it I don't like that I depend on loading all my ammo for it.
I like to go to other countries to hunt, and I am always worried about my ammo getting lost in an airport somewhere.
And if I do that with my 6.5-06, I have huge problems.
If I was to buy a rifle today for use on all kinds of deer and all kinds of distances I am willing to shoot at a deer, I would buy one in 7MM Rem Mag.
And most likely I will buy one within 2 years.
I agree so much with your assessment of the 6.5 PRC!!! But the cartridges, oh my gosh, so expensive and difficult to find!!! I have not found a single one below $6.50 (single cartridge)!! Crazy!! Hopefyll (I have been waiting for almost 6 months with a new rifle in 6.5 PRC) they will come down this decade!!!!
🤑 Yep! Should have bought a 270 Winchester! I paid $27.99/box for my Ammunition last fall and had no trouble getting what I needed! Hopefully, things will get better for you soon! If not, trade in that thing for a 270 Winchester! It shoots flatter in the Factory Ammunition anyway, just like those Horneday Superformance Ammunition 130 (3,200 ft/s) and 140 grain loads (3,090 ft/s) I paid $27.99/box for! 😉
I've been shooting a 6mm x 284 for over 20yrs and have nothing but good to say about it.Flat shooting is its big advantage, I have a 28.5 barrel on my gun so its velocity is off the charts.
Thanks Ron for the sharing, enjoyed it and that will be a toss up for some,I like them both,6.5 PRC a little less recoil to me,my son is young and he is the Western guy, great video brother see you on the next one.
I'll just buy one of each caliber, haha, and I'm working on that, too!!!
Convinced me on the .270. Get cartridges almost anywhere any time. equal to hot new numbers. A classic.
I shoot a COOPER rifle and a custom xp100 both 6.5-284. Really enjoy them both.
Looking at the ballistics on factory ammo, it's not much faster than the 6.5 Creedmoor loaded with the same weight bullets. I was just shooting one yesterday and I must say that the accuracy and mild recoil were surprising.
It is about 100 fps faster, but need 306 magazines instead of 308. Not worth it i.o
People generalize it as a Creedmoor magnum. It's just terminology but it's one way to think of it. Increased recoil (fractional), increased barrel wear (fractional), reduced magazine capacity. There's a few things to consider but I don't think the PRC is a big penalty if you're already considering the Creedmoor.
264 2.0 for the win. It's a 264 WM with a one in eight twist.
Ive been shooting the 6.5 PRC a couple years.I love it.I also shoot in in Long Range & ELR shooting.Its and awesome cartridge
Ever chronographed it?
Got 3 customs in 6.5x284 , yeah I love it
All my rifle hunting bases are covered with mostly tried and true, oldies but Goldie’s in the 30-30win, 270win, 243win, 22wmr, 22lr. I added a 300wsm which I sold a 300winmag for just to step into the 21st century a little with a modern cartridge. But if I was going to really get something brand new it would be the 6.8 western. Cheers from Canada eh 🍻🇨🇦👍🏻
Why not use the same gran bullet and see how they perform?? I'd like to know and see the difference... Thanks I love watching your show!
Too old to change 30-06 180 grain but I really do appreciate the lighter recoil ammo
180 grain is too much for deer size game. 150 grain is better for you 30-06.
great video as always ron. god bless!
I guess I don't understand how a 50fps difference between a 6 5 Swede & a 6.5-284 makes any difference. The same bullet can be loaded in both.
I shoot the 6-284! Can't go wrong with anything based on the 284 winchester. I also started playing with the 6.5 RPM which is essentially the same cartridge just full length!!
Thank you Ron for another enjoyable review of the newer versus older cartridges. I really enjoy these videos. If it was feasible I would have a rifle in all of the new calibers as well as the old ones. The most fun I had shooting was working up the loads that got me the most accurate shooting in each rifle. I would have been in shooting heaven to have some of these newer cartridges to play with. Take care and have a good week.
Good stuff Ron.
It’s my favorite of all time.
I spent 8 years as a member of a 1000 yd benchrest club, but I have not shot for six years, which means that some cartridges have come out since then. When I started 15 years ago, the 6.5-284 was very popular, but almost overnight, everybody decided that the original purpose for that case, was better, which was the 7mm-284 with an 180 grain projectile, which had a higher BC with a similar velocity and a much longer barrel life. In those days I had some good results with the 6.5-06, but at the end of the day, the 7mm was out doing the 6.5. The short 284 case has been very popular for many years in Australia and it was six years ago, the most popular non magnum case available. Some shooters even went to the 284-7.62 which was a lot better than the 308 win case, because it held more powder, but was still non magnum. Things have changed over the years because of the very high BC projectiles, that have come out over the last decade.
It is personal preference. I shot the 6.5-284 in competition (600 yds) for years. It did the job. The problem is finding ammo. I reload so it isn't a issue. But, for hunting I use a 270 Winchester. When I see a need to upgrade I'll go with 6.5 prc or 6.8 western.
Always good
Great information, i am still going to keep my 270 win.
Since last week I own a light 6,5-284 with one changebarrel in 6xc. Looking forward if they beet my other rifles in accuracy..
It is a pleasure to shoot (vihtavuori n160). Bought high BC 143 gr Norma Bondstrikes. Love it.
Ron with everything going to copper or non leaded ammo. Velocities in rifles need to be greater than before for good expansion at 300 to 400+ yards. Do you think hunters will need to get into magnum speeds to do what they used to do with cup n core? Persay from 308 to 300wm to get proper expansion?
Could be...... I like the design. (of the 6.5-284, yhat is...)
The best part....
Its been around for a LONG time too!
But, this one great cartridge that I may not ever own. Rebated rims in general, never excited me that much.
A great cartridge for a medium length action....
But from its performance, that compares to my favorite 7mm cartridge, a 280, it could be the perfect design!
I like BOTH the 260 and 7mm-08.
They dont kick, and have more than enough power to get most jobs done. Great deer cartridges!
I have 6.5 prc rifles in Christensen arms traverse and bergara. I was kinda thinking they were a bit much for whitetail but then I thought well heck I've used 30/06 with 180 gr. And 7mm Remington mag with 165.gr. and 300 rum with 200 gr. And 338 win mag with 225 gr. To take whitetail with a well placed shot where the neck met the shoulders sure lost most of the neck roast and my taxidermist wasn't happy. I haven't found one perfect whitetail caliber yet. But I figure the one you have at the time if you know it's limits and yours with it then that'll do. However I love listening to any and all of Ron's advice and opinions
Always good information! Thanks. I have had great success with my 6.5 PRC. It was one of those things that was unnecessary for what and how I hunt but it was nice to know if I do hunt other stuff at longer distance I have a rifle that will do what I need it to. I love my 30-06, 308, and 270 Win as well, but when you want to maximize your advantage and eliminate error the 6.5 PRC does that. I’m not that good at making wind calls so… this round sure does help.
I liked the 284 when I first saw one in the early 1970's when my uncle let me shoot his 88 Winchester. Back Then, the 7mm Express tripped my trigger. (Tomato/Tomatoe)
In 1994 I put together a '98 Mauser (1909 Argentine) and briefly considered the 6.5/284 But I had action length and couldnt "justify" it so I used a 270 case necked to 6.5. Sent off for reamer and had then cut a sizer die too. Then chambered a SHAW 6.5 blank and my buddy did this and cut threads. Squared and trued action then spun bbl on.
I started with a 27" bbl. (Just ta be different) later pruned to 25.5". My first break in load was a 120 BT ontop of 4350. This load shot under 1" over the hood of a jeep. With three of us shooting @ 225 ish yards!!!!!! Later I refined this load to 3250fps average! Same gun exceeds 3000 with a 140 sst!!
So that my own choice!
Another great video Ron!♥️👍🏼🤟🏽
🤷♂️ But I don't even need to reload or have a custom rifle built and can still get 3,200 ft/s with 270 Winchester Factory Horneday Superformance Ammunition for the 130 grain GMX or SST bullets (or 3,235 ft/s using Magpro powder and a 130 grain Nosler Ballistics tip bullet) or 3,090 ft/s with the 140 grain Superformance SST Factory Load! Then, using a 110 grain Nosler Accubond or Barnes TTSX bullet and Norma 204 powder, and get 3,500 ft/s muzzle velocity (more velocity than a 257 Weatherby with 25% less powder)! Yep! 🤠 Or Reloader 26 and your 150 grain bullet of choice and get over 3,000 ft/s! Try running Horneday's Ballistics Calculator with a 150 grain Nosler ABLR bullet (B.C. of 0.591) at 3,000 ft/s and see what you get? 🥳 And, with the 270 Winchester, I can get it chambered in any rifle that I want and Ammunition is cheap! Those Superformance Factory Ammunition only cost me $27.99/box last fall too! Look what every one else is paying for their Ammunition (2 to 3 times as much, at least), if they can even find it! 🤷♂️ Not me though, I don't have that problem, because I've got myself a 270 Winchester! 😁 Yep! 🤑
@@ronlowney4700 Never been a fan Ron. But its a good one no doubts!!
I am always drawn to Parallel roads.
🤷♂️ Just don't drive off the cliff trying to be different (unique)! 🚘😵
@@ronlowney4700 Its been about forty gears travelin' this road. I like the scenery.
🚘 🤑 I am glad you can still afford the gas! 🤣
I absolutely love these videos Ron, the only problem is I'm left second guessing myself about my choice in caliber. I'm a, "I'd rather have it and not need it, than a need it and not have it kind of guy!" I hunt with a 300wsm for deer (sambar, fallow and red) and there's nothing that this caliber won't kill on this continent 🇦🇺 but now I really want a 6.5prc , why? Because of all the awesome things you just covered in this video. I just wonder if it's enough for a massive sambar stag and if I'm confident enough of a hunter and marksman to make it efficient! At least I know that if I hit any of those deer with my 300wsm, they're going down! But I still want a 6.5prc anyway 🤦♂️🤣
Thanks for another great video Ron👍👍🦌💥
You aren't allowed to use a 6.5 on Sambar so that narrows it down for you
Sambar, Rusa, and Red Deer
A minimum calibre of .270" (6.85 mm) with a minimum projectile weight of 130 grains (8.45 grams)
Hog, Fallow, and Chital Deer
A minimum calibre of .243" (6.17 mm) with a minimum projectile weight of 80 grains (5.18 grams)
The 6.8 Western might be the better choice for you
@@fivex4756 I'd love one but I don't think there's ever 1 here in Australia yet!
I've never seen so many people that think they have to have something that compares to the .270 Winchester instead of just giving up and just buying one. I do wish they sold low charge cartridges for shots under 250 yards. It's just too much on a White tail at 100 yards , probably why my dad wanted me to load my own. 😎
🤔
Ron, I appreciate the scientific way you evaluate each candidate. Different cases yield different accuracies and both the 6.5 Creedmore and PRC have an excellent reputation on that front and are readily available. The question however is: are loaded factory rounds and component bullets for hunting readily available?
Randy Selbey (The Real Gunsmith) is a rifle builder, handloader and life long hunter in Wyoming for over 60 years and has studied the terminal ballistics of various bullet designs. Randy has an excellent white board mounted collection of recovered bullets from various game species. Selbey takes a very dim view of the 6.5 Creedmore because while excellent as a target bullet it fails as a game bullet on large species, merely wounding and not killing ethically.
Anyway a deeper discussion of hunting/game options for the 6.5 PRC would be appreciated. 😎
Certainly my Favorite... incredible cartridge.
Try the ABLR You will change your mind.
We've had the perfect deer cartridge and it's been on the market since 1952 and it's available everywhere and it's cheap.
Care to tell us what cartridge that is? Inquiring minds want to know.
Ron Samborski .308 Win
@@jimmyjones2426 Thanks, I agree. .308 is excellent for deer sized animals. I wouldn’t hesitate to use it for elk or even moose, with appropriate bullets and within reasonable ranges.
Ron I Love all your comparisons one note please compare the.270 with a 140 grain bullet I think you will find that it’s King .
I would like to invite some deer and elk to comment on those ballistics, seeing that they get the feel for it.