FNIRSI 1014D Test And Review vs Rigol DS1052E
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 พ.ค. 2024
- FNIRSI sent me one of their 1014D 100MHz Bench Oscilloscopes and asked for my opinion on using this for electronics repair work. In this video I put it through it's paces in various real life repair scenarios and compare it with my Rigol DS1052E
Buy the FNIRSI 1014D Here
s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_oFP...
Invitation to Kerry Wong for his comments
• Review/Teardown of a F...
CHAPTERS
00:00:00 Unboxing
00:03:04 Other Reviews
00:03:56 Scope Of This Review
00:06:25 Safety Warnings
00:12:27 Basic Usage
00:15:00 Frequency Response
00:22:21 Real Life Test: VRM
00:25:00 Real Life Test: Motherboard Clocks
00:28:21 Real Life Test: CPU/GPU Reads The BIOS
00:31:30 Real Life test: Audio Signal
00:32:32 SMPS PWM
00:40:18 Summing Up & A Challenge
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Richard
Finally, a fair treatment on this device. Yes, it's unfortunate that they overstate the performance so, but for my uses, it's fine. Sure, people doing high-freq RF or design work need better tools. I have relatively low standards and for audio work, confirming signals on SPI, I2C, busses or that all the data pins on a bus are at least wiggling around and not accidentally soldered to a rail, I've grown to appreciate the portability and simplicity of this scope's sibling, the FNIRSI 1013D. My own needs were somewhere uphill of the units that hijack a Soundblaster input :-) and it checks all the boxes nicely.
I wish it did protocol decoding, but it never claimed to do protocol decoding. When I want that badly enough, I'll crack out my $6 Sigrok-based logic analyzer that does that. There, too, I know the sky is the limit, but I don't NEED to see all the bits on a 64-bit RAM bus at 6+Ghz on DDR5. From my scope, I only really the ability to watch a couple of GPIO bits on STM32/BL602 /Pi - class hardware. For MY uses, a $6 LA and a $100 ($120?) O'scope are fine ... and I feel no need to talk smack to others and their purchasing choices.
Before buying, I read and watched a zillion reviews and knew what I was getting. If I'd NEEDed a 100Mhz instrument, I'd be (justifiably) angered. (That said about the $6 logic analyzer, I'll admit I'm actively watching Sipeed for that 64MB, 200Mhz, 8 channel model for $10 - I'm all about value bench tools!)
I encourage the hobbyist/repair segment to buy what you NEED, not what peer pressure talks you into.
Well presented, Richard. I came here via Hackaday and am now off to see what I can learn from your other videos. Thank you.
This has been the fairest and best most practical review that i have seen. I almost sacrificed and sold this scope at a loss, but thanks to you I will give it a second chance and use it as I need it, for signal troubleshooting . Thank you sir!
as an old hobbyist on a buget who bought one of these a year ago, you cant go wrong.
Great and fair review from a knowledgeable repair specialist. Love how respectful you are.
I bought one of these last summer and so far I am very happy with it. I am still learning and did not want to pay a lot of money. This is a good all round scope to learn with for the price. Thanks for your review.
This did have some issues with accuracy but since new firmware is available, this no longer is a problem. Also the use of a batterypack for genuine isolation is great. This is a very good purchase for audio and other low frequency work! Thank you.
I was thinking buying that one and now I am sold as it will do what I need it to do ... thanks Richard for this review
I do have FNIRSI 1014D and used it for some audio equipment repairs, really useful tool with it's two channels and generator.
I don't have an oscilloscope but i've watched some videos about it and the safety measures that should be considered before use and you explained that clearly and the real repair tests that you've shown are very useful the good thing about the fnirsi model is that any power supply with the same specs can be used that's nice. Thanks for the review
Great review, i really enjoy your videos and yes i bought a FNIRSI 1014D and i use it all the time as a hobbyist amateur electronics enthusiast. It works very well and i also use the built in signal generator for testing circuits. Thank you for an honest review!!!
Real nice and thorough review! Another great video! Thank you!
I have one of these in the workshop for the usual repairs jobs, it saves me switching on my mixed domain scope for simple repairs
Outstanding Vid and Demo. Thank you.
Richard, again you're absolutely right. With all due respect to Kerry Wong, yeah it's useful to know whether a device meets all of its ratings and specifications. However, one of the challenges in the hobbyist community is a lot of people become what I call "spec monkeys", and for some reason become blindly focused on wanting equipment with the highest specs, even if they'll never use those capabilities. But they're so narrowly focused on the tiny area they're familiar with that they have no clue about all the thousands of other uses for such a tool in the real world. It's all about cost vs. benefit, and if ANY tool gives you the benefits you need at the cost you're willing to pay, it's fine. And sadly, in the online world we also have to deal with the pervasive OMG click bait that says stuff like "Oh man, this is bad" because it gives the creator more revenue. Because let's face it, even though they'll never admit it, people love exciting clickbait.
OMG! You're absolutely right. Click!
👍👍👍
I have the Rigol DS1052E, not because it is the best, but what I could afford at the time. The only reason if I had the option to choose between these two products, is the Storage functions of the Rigol. As I do a lot of investigations that includes card repairs for a power station, saving wave forms for my reports was important. I agree that functionality for my line of work, both scopes are more than adequate for my needs. Nice review.
Thank you very much for a thorough examination of the FNIRSI 1014D, a beginner.., learnt your phrasing, as well.
Brilliant review and was surprised at the outcome..
Nice review. Very helpful to understand how the scope works.
I love this video, not just opinions but also actual use case and testing. Honestly you are what most reviews need to be. Simply saying you don't like something without comparison is a waste of TH-cam resources. Can't thank you enough!!
I really liked the examples you've shown which are coming from real life! Thanks for making this video and highlighted an objective opinion what this can be used for and what are the limitations. Other testers are either backed by the manufacturers or simply has no idea what are the real life usages. So thanks again! :)
After viewing your channel and also getting more and more into micro controllers I wanted to get an Oscilloscope. Not a high end one but one that was safe and fairly easy to use... I also saw Terry's video and was a little concerned with my purchase. I am so glad to see your review which confirms my choice.. looking forward to seeing your upcoming videos with it. Thank you so much for your honest review and exceptional channel.... Another plus to this scope I've seen is that by using a USB power pack it becomes portable and totally isolated.
yeah, I was gonna mention that, the ability to power it with a portable power bank, allows me to take it to the parking lot and diagnose can bus, this is something you cannot do with a conventional scope. For the work with microcontrollers, you really don't need anything better than this one
SO why didn't you buy a Rigol DS1102Z? Yes, a bit more expensive. But reliable 100 MHz and I2C, SPI RS232 decoders. That's what you want for microcontrollers. And more memory depth that also helps when decoding.
Fnirsi is lying to you and you are happy. So your decission was right. Warped perception!
@@MuellerNick a bit more expensive? In my view it is significantly more expensive (over 100% more in fact). For analyzing I2C or SPI you probably don't want to use the scope, there are much better tools for that. Furthermore, when you're building the device you don't really need to be able to intercept those signals, that's more for reverse engineering. I still stand by my recommendation of Fnirsi for playing with MCUs but you're making a good point
@@blackhorserepairs Oh sorry, I was **completely** wrong about both prises.
If your goal is to just see a signal and be portable, buy a Owon HDS242. Yes, still double the prise.
Or buy a power bank with mains outlet. Or a mains converter with 12 V in.
And it is really hard to understand why you do not need bus decoding when working with uC. Sounds more like a contradiction than a educated experience.
@@MuellerNick I showed both scopes (well my older Rigol) in the video, At which point could the Rigol perform any of these real life repair tasks that the Fnirsi couldn't? I like the Rigol also. For serial protocol monitoring I would use my Saleae Logic 16 to be honest.
Thank you for your practical review!!!
Thanks for the fair review. If we accept that it's really a 30MHz scope then Kerry's complaints no longer apply. I have never been wealthy, so it's always been cheap tools or no tools at all. I have had great value from my cheap tools. Just ordered one for playing with audio and power converters. Having a sig gen built in is so handy for audio aswell as for driving mosfets.
Thank you for this video. I was going to watch it yesterday but opted not to. I did watch Kenny Wong's review of this scope and had just about made up my mind to not buy it, then today i watched Black Horse Repairs video "USE CASE | Fnirsi 1014D for testing amplifiers" and he said he had watched your video, so I decided to watch yours. I have to say that both of you have changed my mind on this scope. I have an older BK Precision 2160A that I bought a few years ago and have still never learned to use it. I recently bought the little black and yellow FNIRSI Mini Pocket Handheld Oscilloscope (recommended by Adrian's Digital Basement) and that got me interested in this scope you are reviewing now. After looking at the BK Precision scope, I decided I wanted a digital benchtop scope. Not sure I'll keep the BK one after I get one of these, but I''ll have to learn how to use one or the other and then make up my mind. Thank you again for this video.
IMO, icing on the cake would have been seeing the AWG output sent to a terminated input on the Rigol. Might we expect to see that integrated into an upcoming audio episode? 🤗🥰
Thank you for the job you done
Very Useful
I have a heavy tech scope I use on my bench. I looked around for a cheap, light, portable scope I can use in the field or pop over to a friends house to check their 1985 stereo receiver. I just want to check a signal. What wasn’t mentioned is I use a USB power bank and I get a couple of hours of use on a battery. This does a nice job in a pinch. If I lose it or break it, no big loss
Ordered 3weeks ago looking for a review after purchase 😂😂 but you really helped me out I repair systems just got it hasn't still arrived trying to learn how to use it cause no clue finding full laptop motherboard training courses 😢😢😢 many Indian people dominating the system, downloading dolingo need to learn there language thanks made me more assured but if your free do a tear down
I know I'm coming to this late and am definitely a relative beginner as far as more intricate analysis and repair of electronics is concerned but this is a superb review from someone I've learned so much from. Buying equipment is such a subjective thing, what do I want to test and what for, how much money can I afford and do I really understand my needs at this stage of my hobby/career? After watching this review I can see this scope would do pretty much everything I need and more. I'd certainly be happy to have one on my bench. I started with an ancient Teletronix scope and learned some of the basics then bought a Rigol DS1202 ZE which I'm very happy with but by far exceeds my skill and needs. I suppose it gives me headroom to expand my knowledge but I did have to buy a set of differential probes to connect to hot ground as I'm working on inverter welders at the moment.
I side with Richard's view that this is a useful tool unless you work at very high frequencies and at the price point it's hard to beat.
This is my first scope, and I'm very happy with it. I needed a basic scope, and this one was $235CDN shipped, from Amazon. The unit, the power supply, a pair of 1-10x leads, and a function generator lead, and I was thrilled to see that it even included a 100x lead! I was expecting I was going to have to buy one separately, but nope! No regrets over my purchase. Pretty darn cool.
I am considering buying this, is measurement voltages accurate? I've seen a video that measurement accuracy looks bad.
As a radio amateur I build my own rigs, 80 to 10 meter band so up to 30 MHz at most. You think the FNIRSI 1014D would be something for me? I have a small budget but it has a great price.
@@ingeborgsvensson4896 Update on that... It has been giving me a weird boot error (some kind of problem with the on-board SD). It gives me a black screen unless I reflash the firmware every time I fire it up after being unplugged for more than an hour. Basically I have to keep a USB stick in the bag with the leads. Inconvenient, but still, I don't regret buying it, but for a couple hundred bucks more there are models head-and-shoulders above it. On the other hand, there are some pretty decent $60 single channel scopes available too.
@@allenpaley Thanks for the response, appreciate it. Single channel would suite me just fine as long as it works fine up to about 30-40 MHz. Can you suggest one?
@@ingeborgsvensson4896 Hey, no problem. Ah yes, I see that you're in the 30-40M range... Upon second look I see that the cheaper single-channel ones I alluded to are only rated to 200kHz, and thus fall well short of your needs. Most of my scope needs are audio-related so I was a little hasty in recommending those single channel ones (also their user interfaces have a somewhat opaque and frustrating workflow). The 1014D is probably your most cash-efficient option. And since it's from Amazon, it's pretty easy to send it back if it doesn't meet your expectations.
Dude, you're a genius; a natural. I enjoyed this so much.
I'm seriously thinking of moving to England.
There's some really interesting people there.
Great review. I have an OWON SDS1104 and it does everything I need. But I also have a little FNIRSI hand held which is also great just for checking signals a d what have you. So I fully agree with you that although your scope under test may not be super top quality, it's more than enough for a hobbyist or for basic and even complex repairs.
Good job!
Exactly. And electronics repair is definitely not a trivial use of oscilloscopes, good repair techs are amongst the best of all electronic techs and hobbyists
@@LearnElectronicsRepair I believe so.
Really liked this walkthrough. Thank you Richard. I am buying it. I’m also very interested in the signal generator feature the FRINSI has. And power it with a usb battery block for portability. No ground lift plug on the mains 😂
Great video! I am BRAND NEW to scopes and throughout the course of this week bought two multimeter style scopes (cuz they were sub $100) and found that they really weren't doing what I needed them to do. Then last night I bought one on of these on Amazon and of course almost immediately youtube leads me to Kerry's video, and I thought "oh crap"! Then today youtube suggests YOUR video and you actually DO perform a much more fair, thorough, and "everyday scenario" type review on this (insanely cheap) scope (and more importantly made me feel like I'm at least not a TOTAL idiot🤣😂) So THANK YOU! and WELL DONE!
Heya love the review so this oscilloscope can do most of the repair work as you showed us and it's isolated from the main pws yes I hope to see this scope in up coming video's
definitely you will - it also has the best display of my scopes so is very good for videos
Brilliant for audio equipment repair work
I love mine, bought with my own money
i just hot mine from banggood and thank you for your review i feel that it will do what i want my last scope was and old c r t model so this one is portable and easy to use your review was fair and helpfull
Good analysis!
Love the TFT screen.
Thank you sir.🙏 for you highly education content, i will search for more oscilloscopes, to enter the world of electronics repairs 👌
your doing an honourable job, sir
Thank you sir!
my first oscilloscope is an old agilent 54621a. it's specs are paultry by today's standards, but it's reliable and easy to use, and it's still an excellent oscilloscope for the the scope of my projects currently. don't sleep on older oscilloscopes!
Fantastic review mate. I'm an amateur who likes tinkering with vintage audio and want a cheap oscilloscope to help. From your review this ould be just what I want. Plus it has the signal generator built in. It has to be good value.
yo la compre de oferta, y me preocupaba que no funcionara para lo que queria, pero me demostraste lo contrario, muchas gracias
Thanks Richard, it looks functional enough to be a useful tool for small money, things are always improving and it's likely this will also where necessary, although for general repair it seems to be all good with your tests. I'd consider it, although your Ali link doesn't seem to be working right now, it opens a TAB and then closes it. Maybe it's my shield?.
I still have my working Thandar SC110A and MY 240V 25A AC to 240V AC out isolation transformer from when I used to repair Philips G11 TVs.
It might be interesting to also see how well the signal generator in the 1014D is performing. You already seem to have something better. But if someone is just starting out (on a budget), and they're getting not just a scope but also a siggen that can be used for repair work, it might change the bang-per-buck calculation for them.
It's exactly the case for me.
I have one of these scopes. To calibrate the probes, the manual says to connect the probe to the sig gen output and set sig gen to 1khz square wave. You then have to use the supplied tool to tweak the probe for best waveform. I actually got a beautiful square wave right out of the box. So, at least for square waves, sig gen is fine.
I've been told that an important thing is to terminate the HF loads properly. The cheap scopes often need a 50 ohm terminator (at the input of the BNC) to prevent them rolling the signal off like you saw with this cheapy scope.
I totally agree with your comments about "scope nerds" and have had many online arguments with tossers who think that because something doesn't exceed the published specs, it is totally useless.
Similar to the top speed of a car... unless that is a genuine selection criteria (eg: land speed records), that spec is totally irrelevant for every day usage.
My sentiments exactly
Exactly, its a pair of eyes into any circuit. Good enough !
I have the “tablet/touchscreen” (1013d) version of this scope. It is actually quite good for PSU, TTL, Audio & Radio (AM/FM/SW) testing/repairs.
PS: get an X100 probe for high impedance & mains voltage use.
Agree on the 100x probe. There are some from Hantek that will do the division on a budget. Obviously don't hold onto the probe and poke at live circuits 😂
That is a good review thumbs up not ignoring the downside of it for the price it cost !
I liked the review especialy the part of how to check on the SMPS Powersupply. Is it possible to post that chapter as a loose Video? Might be a nice one to find on repairing SMPS powersupplies. Would like to use that for educational purposes @ the dutch repair cafe where im a volunteer. Thanx again for great video.
FYI: I have already a Hantek 150mhz scope and the new fnrisi DSO TS3 mini scope with part tester and signal generator. Last one arived at the day your review of it got online. Thinking of buying this model also for my repaircafe workings. (Im doing mostly power supplies)
I have a Hantek DSO5202P 200MHz scope. It's similarly priced as this one (actually I bought it for less than 100 pound, but I live in Asia). Possibly it's a bit better. I think it's good enough for repair work.
This very old Rigol scope is still performing great in 2024. I love this Scope.
For someone on a tight budget - who has the need for an entry-level
Oscilloscope for occasional use- and the fact that it operates from
an isolated PSU - it is good value and does the job
The "isolated" PSU is probably not really all that "isolated".
The main issue with mains powered scopes is that the BNCs are shielded to mains ground. In most domestic mains power, that Ground is connected to mains Neutral. So you don't want to be using the negative of the scope probe on a non-(mains)-referenced point.
Yes, fnirsi should have been honest with it's real bandwith and that marketing stunt is what gives it a bad review. People don't realize that for the price, you will nowhere get a real 100mhz 7inch screen scope. For audio and arduino, this scope is awesome.
I can not afford a rigol so this is ideal for me, thank you for an informative video
Richard thank you for this, as was just about to buy a new scope. But can you tell me your thoughts on the Hantek DSO2c10 which although not electrically isolated gives better reviews and does the 100mhz. All this for £179. (They also do 150mhz with signal generator for £245. Cheers
Last year i wanted to buy an entry level scope to get back into rf fun stuff.
I saw this scope and started searching for reviews. After reading all the reviews i bought the Hantek DSO2D10. I am absolutely happy with that one.
My only gripe is the lack of integration in sigrok/pulseview. And since i am a Linux user i can't run the software supplied with the scope.
I purchased the exact same scope. I have been very pleased with it so far. However, I am quite limited in my experience and find it has more features that I know what to do. One thing it has above these reviewed scope is decoding of a signal - and I have used that.
Preferrable to have the mains isolating transformer in series with the scope or the equipment being tested (assuming there's only one isolation transformer) ?
Menonton video ini saya jadi yakin untuk membeli produk ini..
Yes, fnirsi should have been honest with it's real bandwith and that marketing stunt is what gives it a bad review. For the price, you will not find a real 100mhz 7inch screen scope. For audio and arduino, this scope is awesome. The FFT function allows you to inject a pre created WAV file to check amplifier distortion as well.
I have the same Rigol as you have and I couldn't even use it when I bought it, because the fan was so annoyingly loud. I put a quiet fan in it and while I was in there I added a stick on heatsink to a 9volt regulator which many people were claiming gets way too hot. It was the best $20 I ever spent to keep my sanity :). It's a fairly easy mod and well worth it if anyone finds their Rigol scope to be way too loud, where they can't even think straight.
The Rigol is a bit noisy though not enough so to bother me, but then the workshop can be a fairly noisy environment anyway. Regards overheating my scope is unmodified and is still working after the best part of ten years. Thanks for the tip though.
Can you do a video on how to find shorts on a circuit board etc? Step by step, the different components and what they do? As someone interested in fault finding, I’m always watching your videos thinking, how does he test for shorts? What settings the MM is on? where does he put the probes etc
Nice demonstration. In fact it is not that bad considering how much one has to spend. Of course massive shortcomings in analysis and signal fidelity. However for a lot what you demonstrated it does a good job and in some case (for instance driven by a pwr pack or fully isolated 5V PSU) is even an instrument saver being able to operate it in floating mode. One might need differential probes (expensive) and on top (anyway always recommended for any stuff near AC domestic levels or beyond 50VAC) an isolation transformer.
That one here can at least save you spending a lot of money for diff. probes. However, an isolation transformer (at least one) is a must and absolutely mandatory.
At the end of the day it is not trash and is a good secondary kit for those cases when you don't want to risk blowing up your +1 or +2k DSO.
Actually I do have an isolation transformer for the DUT, but this will work without it as you say, and anyway connecting your grounded scope to the DUT on an isolation transformer is just as hazardous (to the user) to using an isolated scope on a non isloated DUT. 😉
I love the large clear display and its ability to be operated from a battery bank.
I am looking for a way to take it outside to a grassy park and make some measurements.
I would love to use FFT mode and save the waveforms so I can share the results later.
Do you think that this would work for that, or do you have a better option?
Hey. There are uni-t dmm, ut60eu or ut60s or ut60bt which have fluke feature like yours. In diode mode, it will bleep continuously when probe shorted and will bleep once when meet pn junction
thanks.
Can this osileascope be used for washing machine and refrigerator pcb repair especially for high voltage side and low voltage?
Now then where do I start I've got my devil head on Lol ! I hope Kerry responds, Very interesting review...cheers.
I guess it's swings and roundabouts to coin a phrase. This allows you to connect the GND to a live chassis without blowing it up, which of course is useful if you don't have an isolation transformer. However the BNC terminals / probes then become live which in itself poses a serious shock risk. Always keep one hand tied behind your back. Nice and fair review thanks Richard.
My biggest complaint is that it claims to sample at 1GHz, it doesn't and the bandwidth (3dB drop in response) isnt 100MHz. I dont like falae claims. They should just sell it for what it is, an okay 30MHz scope. Its not useless, quite the opposite, when its used appropriately. I have one ttgat was given to me by someone that paid $20 for it at an Amazon clearance place. It was unopened. Its made fairly well, and has good battery life. I use it for automotive diagnostics and onsite quick checks. It doesn't have input polarity inversion, which sux for spark analysis, but its okay for most other things.
I have the FNIRSI 1014D and a Hantek MSO5202D.
The 1014D can be really bad handling some particular cases, specially with very high frequency variations in the signal. It's an fair enough scope for most cases, and is a very easy to use scope for learning the basics. The problem with the 1014D is that it seems to interpolate and reconstruct the trace and it has problems showing complex very short high amplitude bursts in higher frequencies. You can see what I mean at 23:46 when the Vcore out of the VRM is measured, at 20nS it doesn't show the ripple after the rise or fall of the signal and when the time division changes to 1uS it is there. This means it is not a real 100MHz scope. That said, I like the 1014D for the ease of use and versatility, and if it gets damaged it was cheap (cost me 140€ shipping included).
The Hantek is quite better but it also has its issues (though I bought the MSO5202D because of the included 16 channel logic analyzer, but it cost over 400€ a few years ago). Seems the newer Hantek DSO2xxx series have improved a bit, no multi channel signal analyzer but it comes with decoders for some protocols and the 2Dxx models have a signal generator.
In my opinion, the 1014D should only be bought as a secondary cheap scope (considering it can be powered by a power bank) or if you're really strapped on cash or don't want to spend much. Other than that I recommend considering the cheaper Owon and Hantek models, they are better entry level scopes.
One thing I can say about FNIRSI, they answer quickly to bug reports.
The problem is people like EEVBlog get sent test equipment work $5k to use and review. They seem to forget hobbists cant spend $1000 on a scope for a side project.
A lot of the scopes Dave has been gifted cost far, far more than $5000. (The R&S MXO 4 he got, for example, has a list price of over $35000.)* It’s kinda crazy that the scope companies nickel and dime paying customers with options and bandwidth, and then give away “loaded” versions to influencers. Of course, the actual cost to them is peanuts (see below), regardless of what options they give away.
*Though like many modern scopes, the entry-level $7000 model and the $35000 top model are 100% identical hardware. And since they’ll sell the base model for $5000 with education discounts, that means it probably only costs $2000 to build. I have the base model at work, and while it actually does everything I need, it still feels a bit weird knowing that that “200MHz” scope is actually fully capable of 1.5GHz, but is software-hobbled, with the extra bandwidth held hostage for a 5-digit ransom.
However, I don’t agree with your conclusion that channels like EEVblog don’t cater to the hobbyist. For one thing, EEVblog isn’t targeted only at hobbyists. A ton of his viewers and forum users are electronics professionals who use expensive test gear at work. I found his reviews to be very helpful when selecting my new scope at work, a scope I couldn’t possibly afford personally.
But moreover, he tests and reviews (often in more detail) tons of low-end gear. I’m sure his favorable reviews of the Rigol DS1054Z are responsible for thousands and thousands of sales of that model over the years. I expect the same to be the case with Rigol’s new models, as has also happened with low-end Siglent units.
I have ADHD and I'm very stupid so I spend like 40k to 60k whenever I do a side project to build a lab, workshop, crane, smelter, particle accelerator etc... I've got an unfortunate thing for red enameled tool chests as well so every project needs its own tool chests.
I have one and its a top Oscilloscope and a pro 25 yrs in Electronics.
I had a 1014D. Make sure the waveform doesn't touch the top or bottom edges of the screen otherwise your voltage measure will be out. As a special party trick, well at least on mine but I suspect it will be the same on all, display a signal at the bottom of the screen. Then change the Y position to move the trace towards the top of the screen. The voltage measurement will increase as the trace is moved towards the top of the screen!
Interesting. I'll be honest I don't usually use a scope for precise voltage measurement, I use my multimeter for that.
All scopes do that. When they are clipping the signal, the signal is clipped. :-)
How you set up the settings for this, because my friend had this one but he cant use properly the waveform not accurate
Thank you Richard for your take and comparison on these scopes. I am currently looking to buy a half tidy scope and was set to buy the Rigol DS1052E as this has been a very well tried and tested choice. It is still available but here in the UK it is now up around £530 mark. So the FNIRSI 1014D is certainly worth a consideration, Rigol do manufacture an updated four channel version DS1054Z for £360 which I have been contemplating and lucky enough to afford although I cannot really see the need for four channels. It has 24Meg points of deep memory which will be good for capture storage. I have come across another Rigol which I like the look of the DS1102E-Z for some £270 which is 100 MHz two channel with an external trigger and like the DS1054Z has 24 Meg points of deep memory. As a novice I Just wonder is there any real advantage of four channels over two in electronics repair. Does anyone have an opinion on this?
The DS1052E is an absolutely ancient model. It’s perplexing that Rigol even still makes it, given that the far superior DS1054Z costs the same or less. Rigol has recently announced the new 12-bit models at the same prices, and they look awesome.
As for 4 channels: of course, it depends on what you’re doing, but in my own personal experience, most commonly one is only using 1 or 2 channels, but on the occasions where you need more, it’s essential, so I think it’s good to have them. Note that 2-channel scopes almost invariably have an additional “external trigger” input, so that you can trigger off your clock signal without using up a channel, so in a sense we could call them “2.5 channel” scopes. Low-end 4-channel scopes generally do not have a separate trigger input, so in many situations you have to use one of the channels for your clock, leaving you 3 channels for signals. (Higher-price 4-channel scopes will have external trigger inputs, effectively “4.5 channel”, but we’re talking about units an order of magnitude more expensive.)
An example: suppose you’re hunting down the source of a problem that occurs sporadically. You might probe all the voltage rails simultaneously to see if one of them is glitching when the problem occurs. Or you monitor a bunch of control lines that you know should switch in a particular order. In newer devices with microcontroller control, you might need to monitor an I2C bus (two lines) and then another signal or two.
If i were a bleeding edge researcher, I'd select a more expensive option. But I'm just an old hobbiest. This scope exceeds the CRT based ones that cost a couple of degrees magnitude more in my day.
How well does it perform for measuring AM modulation %? A 5MHz AM modulated signal? Is it good enough for calibrating AM modulation on a Ham Radio, for example? Thanks!
The FNIRSI Oscilloscope is the best one on the market for its price. It's the top choice for entry-level scopes, offering much more functionality than what's typically expected at this level. I really wish I could get my hands on one, but unfortunately, I doubt I'll be able to buy it. I'm going through a tough time in real life right now, and I don't see things improving, especially since I live in a crappy, corrupted country. So, I'm still stuck with the HANTEK DSO 1070, which has a lot of problems and bugs, but it manages to do the job sometimes.
15:30 The Vpp get's lower and lower as the frequency increases.
Is this normal? Or is this a sign of bad quality of the oscilloscope?
For testing main-operated gear, why not use a mains isolation transformer on your bench?
Just because **you** almost never need to work with anything above 1Mhz or seeing a signal merely *exists* at >1Mhz, doesn't mean a company should be let off for lying about banner specs of their product. If they're lying about that, what else are they lying about? Do you have to re-verify every quantitative measurement you make, because you're not sure what bandwidth its rolling off at? Where and when can you trust it, what are the limits? Do you have to go find them all out yourself, with even better equipment to calibrate? etc.
These Chinese manufacturers just have to learn to stop lying to get sales. If they marketed these products with accurate banner specs then people everywhere would be saying "yeah it's cheap, but it does what it says on the tin, and its value for money, so go for it." Why does all the chinese OEMs get let off for lying on banner specs, but any western OEM will get held to it with a knife by their throat from reviewers?? We can't be promoting a double standard.
If your rigol turned out to roll-off at 10Mhz when it advertised itself as a 50Mhz scope, would you be so enamoured by it?
Hi Richard, nice Video.👍👍
These DSO is good for beginners or Audio repairs.
It would be nice if the DSO has a 12 volt option adaptrr for batterie.
The question is, what will you do with the scope.
Everyone must be decided itself.
Exactly that. I tested this one in some very typical repair scenarios. It is good for audio repairs but also for motherboard and gpu repairs, PSU repairs and so on.
Why would anyone want a 12V supply for a 5V USB powered scope?
If you want to use it for automotive work, plug it into a car phone charger FFS. Or just use a USB powerbank like a normal person. 😂
It is brilliant for the money!
The definition of bandwidth incorporates a signal strength cut off at -3dB. In other words the official bandwidth of a device is limited to when the input signal is attenuated to half the actual voltage level. The actual output level of the sig gen is never stated but the rigol indicated 158mV @ 7.246MHz so if we take the level of 158mV as the signal level then the bandwidth stops when the voltage level is 79mV. The Rigol indicated 68mV @ 131.6MHz so, while you can still see the signal, the scope is actually officially out of bandwidth. That is why the scope is only spec'd at 50MHz
Not half, it's -3dB power not voltage. It's more like 70% (1//sqr(2)).
I think Kerry Wong's (and my) biggest problem with this scope is that both of its topline specifications (100MHz and 1GSa/s) are misleading at best and false at worst. You displayed a signal at close to 100MHz, but you noted that the display and the frequency measurement were not ideal. I think it's a bit worse than that. I suspect that this scope really is sampling at 200MSa/S, which make it impossible for it to accurately display a waveform close to 100MHz. That's why your display was less than ideal - it was exhibiting some aliasing behaviour.
I don't have a 1014D, but I do have a FNIRSI 1013D, and I believe the two have very similar if not identical sampling hardware. Dave at EEVBlog did a detailed teardown of the 1013D and showed that it only samples at 200MSa/S, which reduces its effective bandwidth to about 30MHz.
You do show that its ground isolation is a unique feature that can be valuable in certain situations. Kudos to you for that. Note that the cheaper 1013D also can do that, although it's not a bench scope.
Here are my suggestions for better scopes:
1. If you want a full 100MHz, 1GSa/S bench scope, I would suggest the Hantek DSO2C10. If you find the right combination of sale price, coupons, and other discounts on AliExpress, I think you can pick one of these up for about $150. (I have one that I was able to buy for about $175 back in November of 2021, but I periodically check its prices, and I've seen better deals.) It doesn't have the isolation of the 1014D, but, in my opinion, it's a better scope in all other aspects. (Also, you can upgrade it to a DSO2D15 with a software hack, which raises its bandwidth to 150MHz and enables the onboard waveform generator.)
2. If you want a scope with about the same specs, but you're really pinching your pennies, I would suggest the Owon VDS1022 or VDS1022I. This is not a bench scope - it's a USB scope, with a sample rate of 100MSa/S on each of its two channels. Its advertised bandwidth is 25MHz but some on the EEVBlog forum have measured it at 30MHz or even a bit higher. The reason I suggest this scope is that you can pick it up for only $79 on AliExpress (about $20 more for the VDS1022I). For anyone that does buy this, I would highly recommend the hacked version of the software available at github.com/florentbr/OWON-VDS1022 - among other improvements, the hacked version runs on Macs and Linux machines, in addition to under Windows. You might be tempted to pooh-pooh a USB scope but it has three advantages over bench scopes: 1) It's extremely cheap; 2) Its display is as big as your computer's (even if you have a tiny laptop screen, it's still bigger than a bench scope's display - I run it on an Acer C720 Chromebook that I coverted to Linux); and 3) if you run it on a laptop, when running on the laptop's battery, you have the same ground isolation that you ably demonstrated.
Maybe Kerry went a little overboard with his criticism, but his point that it doesn't meet its topline specs is totally valid. If someone buys a FNIRSI 1014D knowing exactly what they're getting, I'd say fine, but I worry about an inexperienced budding engineer buying it because of its low price, then being disappointed when they push it to its full specs and it fails.
Hi there. Something misleading in your reply as can be taken for general statement. A 200Msa/S DSO can very much show a high fidelity 100MHz signal at no problems at all. Take an older Agilent 54622D for example. We worked with those DSO's before and it works. Combination of highe speed RAM, a specific ASIC to manage MEM to controller, graphics to display can yield astonishing responsiveness. The most costly thing is usually the front end (the real analogue part). Also the Agilent has shortcomings for single shot events (that is where a high sample rate really counts) for repetitive signals it just does fine with 1OOMHz @ 200MSa/S. Sometimes you will find the term ETS for that (Equivalent Time Sampling) using multiple samples to reconstruct the waveform.
Even in very expensive labscopes like Keysight up to 110GHz DSO series you will not see that the sample rate is 10x that of the analogue bandwidth. More so less or max. the double of the bandwidth but not 10x as so often stated. Back to the Agilent now. Combine this with a peak detection circuit of
Perhaps you're both right... one review was of a 100MHz rated instrument, the other was not. If only the instrument did not advertise itself as 100MHz... the seller is misrepresenting it, that is the real issue.
TBH the main complaint I have about it is that Hantek has a very similar product which is massively underspecced instead of overspecced (both being a lot cheaper than the Rigol and having 2 ch + function generator).
So I'm going to lean towards the Hantek instead, because I respect a company that sandbags their numbers a lot more than a company that massively inflates its numbers. With that said, most people can absolutely do very good work with either.
I will buy one? I prefer PeakTech P1404.
I bought one of these, but I have a problem. It doesn't seem to indicate the dc voltage level. When I used an old crt type scope many many years ago it would show the level of the dc component by moving the horizontal line up and/or down. I could also then measure the voltage from looking at the grid. However, with this scope if I connect to the output of a variable power supply it doesn't move the line up/down and it won't even show the voltage on the digital display. I think this is because of the noise on the line and the scope is capturing the noise, not the dc. (The power supply is a QW-MS305D). The (badly written) instructions do seem to indicate this and Fnirsi have responded to an email basically saying the same. Okay, it's not a deal breaker (I have a multimeter), but it was disappointing. However, in it's favour the screen is really good and I for my hobbyist needs it does what I need it to. If anyone has any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong I'd be interested to hear and yes I'm using the dc coupling. :)
Connecting the Ground incorrectly
one would be advised to wear brown corduroy trousers.
Didn't change probe to 10x. 1x can go up to 20mhz only
Will the Fnirsi be enough to analyze CAN bus or USB signal?
Most USB is much too fast for this scope. It is fast enough for USB 1 speeds (12Mbps and 1.5Mbps), but nowhere near fast enough for USB 2 (480Mbps), never mind USB 3 (5Gbps). Those require, for any useful analysis of USB signal integrity, a 1-1.5GHz, 5Gsa/sec for USB 2 and a 5GHz, 10-20Gsa/sec scope, respectively. (That’s scopes that cost around $10K and $40K, respectively.) With that said, unless you’re designing USB interface chips, or manufacturing and certifying USB cables, you basically have no reason to need to analyze USB signals. It’s not a simple bus that you can easily decode data on; there’s so much back-and-forth in the USB protocols that you need to have extremely deep knowledge of not only USB itself, but also intimate knowledge of the various driver types, to even begin to get anything useful out of it. Other buses, like CAN, SPI, I2C, UART, etc are far, far easier to decode into something useful.
I think Kerry's opinion was more about the fact that the scope did not meet it's stated specifications - by a very large margin - rather than a scope that just works. ie how much better is this scope at a few hundred dollars than a $50 handheld scope (in performance). Is it the same performance but with a bigger screen, case and knobs!
Well I'm hoping Kerry accepts my invite and comes over here to join the discussion. The point i am trying to make is that it is not useless junk, it displayed sine wave and told me the frequency up to 90MHz and that is pretty close to what I would expect and why do I need it to do any more?. I mentioned in the video that I think Kerry and myself may be coming into this discussion from a fundamentally different approach
@@LearnElectronicsRepair Sure, but is it worth paying a couple of hundred for this or $50 for a similar (actual) spec hand held unit!
@@LearnElectronicsRepair Mr Wong said in a comment: "To be fair, I wouldn't have any issue with the scope if the manufacturer was honest with the specs." Richard, you were also disappointed when you couldn't find a beeper on a 3 Euro multimeter during one of your recent tests and came to the conlusion: "Bin". :)
The trace on the FNIRSI had dropped by way more than 30% by the time it had hit 30mhz and so it doesn't meet it's 100mhz spec. Using low frequency test cases might be fine - but this would be no use for example looking at the FSB on even something as old as a 486.
Why no use for high frequency signals? The point I am making really is that normally when repairing you are looking for the presence of signals, not usually how big they look on the screen. The FNIRSI was displaying sine waves and telling me the frequency up to about 90MHz, the Rigol which is a 50MHz scope was doing that up to 225MHz which is the highest frequency of my RF Generator. The Rigol is not a 250MHz scope but it would tell me what I need to know. And up to 90MHz so would the FNIRSI. This frequency range covers almost all repair work I get involved with, though admitedly I'm not a radio amateur for example and did highlight this fact in the review.
Regards FSB I can't honest think of a repair scenario on any motherboard where I ever needed to look at the FSB with a scope??? It's horses for courses though - both scopes handled all the common repair scenarios I through at them (apart from the Rigol could not do the SMPS PWM) my main point is the FNIRSI is not junk, it's a really useful repair tool in the vast majority of cases.
@@LearnElectronicsRepair I have to respectfully disagree, I am often having to look for signals where the amplitude is really important - like looking at a high speed bus for conflicts for example. Just seeing a clock or not is like step 1 and you can use a logic probe for that. Checking for things like faulty clock generation even on retro PC boards would be very hit and miss with this.
I bought this item. Iam a novice,for the price it is just fine.
Out of interest, do you know the power requirements of this scope? I'm just wondering if it's possible to run it from a USB power bank in a pinch.
Yes, it runs from power bank.
I power it from my USB power bank that reads 2.4A Output, it can shut down when it's cold, below 20F but other than that it's fully capable of working around 10W supply
The supplied PSU is 5V 2A so 10W max
15:45 Notice how the oscilloscope (scam-oscope) changes sampling mode when switching from 250ns/div (realtime sampling or close to it) to 100ns/div (heavy and slow equivalent (stroboscopic) sampling mode). In 100ns/div and shorter you will not be able to measure random signals, as the scope takes multiple triggers to reconstruct the waveform.