I think you nailed it in your analysis. As David Crosby told Graham Nash when asked if they should have Neil Young join the CSN: "the songs, man, how could we not take him in". Ronnie Hawkins (who would be in a position to know) said Robbie wrote all those songs and had been writing them for years.
@TRamone01 I think Robbie has caught alot of flak just out of sheer jealousy and envy. He is just not as easily likeable as Levon was. He is viewed as overly calculating or Machievellian. Robbie was smart and hardworking and a helluva musician. Levon was a musical force too...I loved the guy.
@@chrismiller1183 Levon was a great singer and drummer, he was not a songwriter, nor was he good with money. Even his own father scolded him for his reckless spending. Robbie has lot's of fan, especially from women (I'm female) I suspect, he was so good looking, especially in The Last Waltz, and he had a lot of charisma. He was also very smart and savvy, so I suspect there might be some jealousy involved. By the way I think Rick was very good looking as well, he had an endearing personality and charisma as well.
Robertson worked on Martin Scorsese's movies Casino, The Departed, and Gangs of New York, and he provided music supervision for Shutter Island, The Wolf of Wall Street, and Silence.[citation needed] In Rome, he headlined the 1995 annual Labour Day concert festival with supporting acts Andrea Bocelli, Elvis Costello, and Radiohead.[citation needed] In 1996, as executive soundtrack producer, Robertson heard a demo of Change the World and sent it to Clapton as a suggestion for the soundtrack of Phenomenon, starring John Travolta. Babyface produced the track. Change the World won 1997 Grammy awards for Song of the Year and Record of the Year. In 1999, Robertson contributed songs to Oliver Stone's film, Any Given Sunday.[150] In 2000, David Geffen and Mo Ostin convinced Robertson to join DreamWorks Records as creative executive. Robertson, who persuaded Nelly Furtado to sign with the company, is actively involved with film projects and developing new artist talent, including signings of A.i., Boomkat, eastmountainsouth, and Dana Glover. On February 9, 2002, Robertson performed "Stomp Dance (Unity)" as part of the opening ceremony of the 2002 Winter Olympic Games in Salt Lake City, Utah. In 2004, he contributed the song "Shine Your Light" to the Ladder 49 soundtrack.[citation needed] In 2005, Robertson was executive producer of the definitive box set for the Band, entitled A Musical History. In 2006, he recorded with Jerry Lee Lewis on the track "Twilight", a Robertson composition, for Lewis' album Last Man Standing. On July 28, 2007, at Eric Clapton's Crossroads Guitar Festival in Bridgeview, Illinois, Robertson made a rare live appearance. Also in 2007, Robertson accepted an invitation to participate in Goin' Home: A Tribute to Fats Domino (Vanguard). With the group Galactic, Robertson contributed a version of Domino's "Goin' to the River". For the 2019 Martin Scorsese movie The Irishman, Robertson provided the score and consulted with music supervisor Randall Poster on the entire soundtrack.
Robbie saw his brothers falling into addiction and he couldn’t ride that train. As Levon said when Robertson approached him about their deterioration into drugs and alcohol, he said, “I’m not in it for my health.” I think Levon felt abandoned by Robbie bc he wouldn’t go down into a dark hole with them. Robbie and Garth were the smart ones, and they grew up at some point.
I think your right that those securing their stake and others to high went on to realize a decade later they didn't secure their properly felt portion also unwilling to admit drugs 1st screwed them over and clearer heads prevailed feeling deceived. Levon seemed to be getting on in other ventures.
@@arthurrobinson7286 They all got what legally stated. They ALSO got a lot MORE than was legally reequired. You people just don't know entertainment law, royalties and residuals. Levon Helm, the drug addict cry baby with no GED never stopped whining and making Robbie look bad. Screw him. He died with 12 million bucks in the bank. Give me a break.
@@BrevityDeeznuts SO WHAT? Nobody that I know keeps their millions in cash under their mattress, My money is invested in Stocks, Bonds, Mutual Funds, T-Bills and some real estate. SO, stop being a moron and nit-picking. Go ask your Amazon Alexa, RIGHT NOW, use the words "How much is Levon Helm worth"? she will respond "Levon Helm was worth an estmated 12 million dollars" Robbie and Garth Hudson did minimal drugs, and by the time Scorcese made "The Last Walts", Robbie and Garth were doing NO drugs and the others were stoned out of their minds,, Robbie and Garth just couldn't put up with them anymore and more important is a fact that Robbie went ABOVE and BEYOND as to what he was required to pay Band members. Levon Helm just wanted more more more and felt that working together in the studio on a song, meant WRITING the song. WRONG. Robbie wrote the songs, .Levon and the others did what was required of them be being part of the band. Putting Robbies songs together, arranging, performing. He was paid MORE than agreed to in their contract and MORE than most people in the music industry who did NOT write the songs, .Robbie should have sued Levon for slander LONG ago and should have seen that the masses of asses would one day, take sides with Levon. After all, only 5 % of the population REALLY knows what is going on in the world, so they follow each others conspiacies like a bunch of sheep. Levon Helm was an ignorant, uneducated moron, who was an OK drummer but had the PERFECT voice for the songs that Robbie wrote. Now go teach your economics class .NOT. I'm a CFP here in NYC. They knew I meant cash FIGURATIVLY not LITERALLY. Whed do you people come from? I wish public assistance would stop giving away free computers and smart phones to those in the projects who have NO education. PS Levon Helm was an ignorant cry baby. Most people in the country are ignorant cry babies .You are a perfect example of that if you suppont any claims by Levon Helm.
I am a big Ronnie Hawkins fan and also a big fan of the Band. According to Barney Hoskins' book "across the Great Divide, the friction between The rest of the band and Robbie was fueled when Rick received a royalty check from his writing credit for "Wheels on Fire" for $249,000. That made everyone wonder how much Robbie was making. Robbie also never lived at Big Pink, he lived at Albert Grossman's compound. Robbie leaving the band was a natural progression in his career. He made the connection with Scorsese with The Last Waltz than collaberated on Raging Bull.
Robbie decided to call it quits to touring, he didn't know that he would go on to work with Scorsese. He just knew he had enough of touring and dealing with 3 heroin addicts (Levon, Richard, Rick), he also had a young family 3 children all under 7 years old. I read Hoskyns book, and like he wrote they ALl made a lot of money. Certainly $250.000 back then was a lot of money, where did that go? Seems to me perhaps Robbie was better at holding on to his money than the other guys. I know from several writings that Levon spend recklessly, and then blamed Robbie when he ran out of money. Rick (and I love Rick) admitted he spend a lot of money on drugs, as did Richard.
Takes two to fight. I’ve never heard or read of Robbie saying one bad thing about Levon, except he was not well. When you’ve got three guys nodding off on heroin, it’s pretty hard to carry a band of 5. I just watched Once Wereu Brothers, a doc by Robbie on how the Band began. Robbie released a single I really like called Somewhere Down The Crazy River. He also released an album or two about his Indian roots. He went on to score a lot of movies. Robbie went to see Levon on his deathbed, and held his hand. Levon had lost consciousness by the time Robbie got there. The only negative thing I’ve ever heard Robbie say about any of them was when the guys were drunkenly smashing cars, Richard wanted to drive Robbie’s wife’s new car. She went with him, and he smashed the car with her in it. As soon as they heard about the accident, Levon jumped in a car, took off to the accident, and ran into a cop car at the scene. Another time, after they were getting set to go on tour after Big Pink, Rick smashed a car and broke his neck, so they didn’t tour to support the album. I’m so tired of hearing commenters hate on Robbie, and say Levon was The Band. They were all members of the Band. It was a band with three lead singers, with many of the songs written by Robbie for the singers’ voices. A lot of the songs were Robbie’s love of the south. Regarding drinking and drug use, I’ve heard of Levon being so out of it, he couldn’t even sit on his stool at more than one show. So there’s lots of picking on people if that’s what you’re into. I just wish we could enjoy their collective genius. The songs were and are great. That’s enough for me. BTW, Robbie is writing Part 2 of Testimony.
@@frankbrower1375Isn't this the way of all songwriters throughout the entire music industry...or any industry. Once you own the copyright it's all yours. Imagine Robby working all night on a beautiful song while the rest of the brothers are out smashing cars and being drunks.... Then comes into the studio and more or less assigns the proper voice that he imagined in his head. In this situation the voice is just a hired gun and is paid an hourly rate, not a lifelong copyright
The WRITER owns the songs and gets royalties for life. The rest of any groups are just paid for each session and each performance. Learn the law you morons.
@@frankbrower1375 Robbie Robertson was worth 50 million US dollars. Levon Helm was worth 12 million. As your Alexa if you're too lazy to look it up. The WRITER gets the royalties. .The rest of the band get paid to play the songs .Period.
It seems like Robbie was bit more shrewd and clever about his financial future. When Levon saw this happening (The Last Waltz) with Robbie tight with Marty and Robbie shown a lot in the movie ... it rubbed Levon the wrong way. That was one of the early problems. But I agree, too much is made of it. They were magical together. It's too bad Robbie and Levon never got things on track.
It's not surprising that in Mr. Robertson's book and countless interviews, he comes out the hero and innocent of any wrongdoing. The same could be said about what Mr' Helm said and wrote before he died, although he did cop to having made mistakes to a greater degree. That said, I can't say that there is a single piece of music that Mr. Robertson has created since the end of the Band that's ever stuck in my head...
I love the band now , but I was too young to fully appreciate it in it's hay day I became a fan in 1987 when he released his self titled album with songs like broken Arrow and fallen angel etc. He had many guest artists on that album including ry cooder. I was drawn to it as it was a unique and exotic perspective. It's not often you hear of artists that grew up on the 6 nations reserve. (Not in Australia anyway) In the band Robbie being a native Canadian looked outward and was hooked by the mythology of southern US culture His talent for weaving stories and images also hooked me the same way.
I enjoyed this. You have some good insights, especially about the writers' royalties. The Mantle/Martin comparison is illustrative. Unfortunately, the summer did end. As it does for most, but, thankfully, not all, of us.
What I don't understand is why people expect their favorite band(s) to stay together forever. Some do, the Stones being the first that come to mind, but musicians change and want to do different things. The Band had played together since the early 60's and The Last Waltz was in 1976, so they had a great run and it was time to move on. Does anyone think they could have had the same success playing "roots" music in the 80's? The same with the Beatles--being 70 years old I grew up with and loved them but shed no tears regarding their breakup--they were dialing it in on Abbey Road with drek like "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" and "Octopus's Garden". Both George's (All Things Must Pass) and John 's (Plastic Ono Band) post-Beatle albums were superior to "Let It Be" and "Abbey Road". Let's just be happy that the greatness of The Band and The Beatles existed for as long as it did but let it go and don't obsess over its demise.
Frankly, the Last Waltz will live on as a huge bench-mark event in rock n roll. Besides,the only people debating this history now have no iron in this.
Guess it all depends on biography you want to believe! They all were all great musicians! Even though Robbie gave them all part of the song proceeds but each wanted to sell there part of the song catalog that he shared with them back to him!! Robbie tried to help them!!
I've wondered about Robbie's (and others in the band) songwriting style. Did he bring them in 100% fully formed? Every chord change, lyric, tempo, solo... completely finished? Or did other band members make sigificant contributions to song arrangements, chord changes, perhaps even lyrics? If they used a more collaborative approach, then you can make an argument that they all should have benefited (not just one person). RIP Robbie.
To the best of my knowledge, Robbie came in with the songs even if he grilled Levon for information about the South for inspiration he was the guy who physically wrote the lyrics. The Band would have certainly contributed to the arrangements no doubt but here's the thing, arrangements are arrangements and songs are songs. The train doesn't really meet in the center unless a songwriter wants to give an arranger songwriting credit but that's up to the songwriter. an arranger can get arranging credit but it doesn't pay very much. This is an age-old argument in which Levon isn't the only person who has ever been upset about it. Ginger Baker has had the same gripe with Jack Bruce but what Ginger provided was some arrangements. Very significant arrangements at that but arrangements nevertheless. He didn't write the songs. It's a slippery slope and probably always will be a point of contention in certain bands. I've heard many musicians complain about it.
Ginger forms the band and they make all of the money. Darn. Re: Sunshine of Your Love. I think it was the producer who disputed Ginger's claim to have come up with the drum part. This is what I think: unless the musicians are hired, all band members should share writing credit. That means Ringo is owed some money. @@dannydine5263
Agreed. Ronnie Hawkins said Robbie wrote the songs. John Simon, producer of the self-titled album said Robbie brought the songs. Levon, who never wrote anything, started a controversy that will forever tarnish Robbie's accomplishment as a songwriter. Levon, his "brother" did this and stuck to it. @@tonys4396
@@tonys4396 Yeah but the real credit is trickier. If you noticed on Wikipedia. Several of their songs don't list a songwriter. It's that old thing that, disagreements over writing credits. The Band is a tough one. Sounds like Robbie had a lot of ideas and the guys made the tunes shine ... particularly the vocals of Richard, Levon and Rick. Garth was a great arranger too.
They say there's a difference between writing a song alone by yourself as opposed to writing it in a communal setting. I'm reminded how George Harrison and Ringo Starr spent hours developing their parts of the Beatles songs but didn't get songwriting credits. And as far as Lennon-McCartney in the early days Lennon had all the big ideas but towards the end McCartney wrote all the big monster hits. The best compensation I ever saw was how The Doors did it. Everybody thinks Jim Morrison wrote all of the Doors biggest hits but instead it was Robbie Krieger their guitarist. But all the songs on the first 3 albums was attributed just to The Doors. Not until The Soft Parade in 1969 did they attribute individual song writing credits. In an interview Robbie Krieger was asked was he disappointed that the song writing credit for Light My Fire is given to the whole band and not just yourself? Robbie answered that he didn't mind just as long as people know that Light My Fire was not written by Jose Feliciano. 🤣😂
Robbie and Garth seemed to avoid the drugs and alcohol that the others really abused. I always believed that Levon felt that he and the others should have gotten publishing rights to the songs. Levon and the rest of the band helped craft the song but did not write them. I know someone else who helped a famous artist do the same thing and he never got any credit. Once he left, the artist was not quite the same. Robbie did say that he visited Levon in the hospital. He stated that he held this hand. So sad.
The other guys got performance royalties for their contributions, which was proper. Three of them sold their performance royalties to Robbie in the late 70’s (Levon refused). They weren’t forced to do so: Rick needed capital for his solo album/tour (not sure why Garth and Richard sold theirs). Sandra Tooze’s excellent biography of Levon explains this process in a well written section. Insiders like Ronnie Hawkins, John Simon, and Jonathan Taplin have all states that the songwriting credits were properly handled: that Robbie took care of business while the others drugged and spent themselves out of commission. Look, I love all the guys, but I tend to agree with Ronnie Hawkins that The Band could’ve been huge if not for the addiction issues. Near the end of his life, Rick gave an interview where he estimated spending $100,000 to $200,000 ANNUALLY on drugs.
@@robertbruce6865 Wow, I never saw/heard about that interview. But it doesn't surprise me. I'm sure you've seen that doc on the making of the first two albums. It's painful to watch Rick twitching around in his chair, obviously drug related. And heartbreaking to listen to Richard, who had the greatest voice in rock and roll, and many other styles of music, unable to sing. So sad.
@@donpinger5492 Richard is my all time favorite male vocalist. The Woodstock version of Tears Of Rage moves me every time I hear it. Then, I listen to Richard’s performances on the 1976 Tour, and my heart breaks. He sounded horrible. He cleaned up for a bit, then relapsed. We know what happened next. Just heartbreaking. I’ve visited the Cheek To Cheek Lounge in Winter Park, Florida, and the Quality Inn next door where it happened. What a sad, shitty place to die. Robbie, for all of Levon’s mocking (in his “autobiography”) of his concerns about being on the road for so long, turned out to be correct after all.
@@donpinger5492 Or the famous impromptu Aint No More Cane on the Festival Express tour with Janis, Jerry, and Bob Weir...he was obviously wasted to the gills. In Sandra Tooze’s biography of Levon (and I highly recommend the book: well written and fair), Jim Weider recounts Rick’s relapse after his forced detox in a Japanese jail in 1997. Weider said that he tried to get Rick to see a doctor, since he was on junk again AND was grossly overweight. He didn’t. Then, he and Elizabeth were evicted and living in a motel when Rick went out on that last set of gigs. I can’t help but wonder how many house payments could’ve been made with the money that was spent on drugs. I read a comment online where some dum dum blamed the heartache that Danko felt from not getting songwriting credits for killing him. Bullshit. His lifestyle killed him...period. The Robbie bashing reminds me of the Mike Love bashing. They’re easy targets, and it’s a lazy narrative. I’ve seen numbskulls refer to both as talentless hacks riding on coattails. Robbie is anything BUT talentless, and Love was Brian Wilson’s best collaborator (said Brian himself). What I don’t understand, in both cases, is the desire to take sides. Why not just enjoy the damned music and appreciate the gifts that these people gave us?
@@robertbruce6865 Yeah, all sad. Robbie saw the writing on the wall. I will definitely get Sandra Tooze's book now. I've read Levon's and Robbie's both twice. And it's amusing how the people on Levon's team claim all sorts of nonsense about Robbie bashing the other guys. I felt he was quite complimentary of them, albeit somewhat truthful about the addictions. I listened to an interview with him recently and he referred to the whole addition thing as something people really didn't know much about, certainly not about dealing with it. They were young, rich, and becoming famous and there were no rules. The Beatles had a manager that essentially micromanaged them. Way different outcomes!
According to Todd Rundgen, Robbie wrote all the songs and pretty much ran the operation. The others had lots of personal problems and didn't work as hard as Robbie.
This argument is ridiculous. They DID have publishing royalties. They sold their share for quick money. Also Levon quit and would have had nothing if Robbie didnt keep it going in his absence.
I did not know they got publishing royalties but cashed them in for quick money- I totally believe it… that’s to show me that I dont know all of this story - no one will- just what we’ve read and heard- so i gotta keep a more open mind- Robbie was no saint- but neither was he the destroyer of careers- I heard him say “I just didn’t want to go on road again w a suitcase of heroin. Richard sat out this huge stadium show cause he ran out - it’s just a big black hole and they all fell in but Robbie- cause he is not suffering from the disease of addiction - Garth either - it’s kind of obvious who has it together and who doesn’t jmho
Robbie went immediately to the hospital and held Levon's hand for a good time. He did say that he wrote some songs with one of the other members in mind to sing. He was visionary in many ways. Robbie said Levon was immensely supportive and inspiring to helpimg him get started and his drumming always was a big part of the music.
be careful, Robbie SAID he went to the hospital immediately etc. In a lot of the interviews I have heard with him a lot of what he says doesn't ring true. Very self agrandising and making out the laid back good guy. that does not align with other peoples stories and views
:@@NigelMinchin If Robbie did visit Levon on his deathbed, I believe Robbie should have kept it as a private matter, not as an opportunity for publicity.
I think part of it was that Levon being the only memberfrom the south and his experiences. He felt like he was kind of an inspiration to Robbie and his writing. I mean how would Robbie being canadian ever really be able to capture that southern mythology without tge inspiration.
Totally ... it was a magical collaboration. Levon, Garth, Danko and Manuel made the songs come alive in a special way. Robbie's song ideas were turned into great classics by the entire group. The evidence is: compare Robbie's solo songs to the tunes in The Band. Compare Robbie's solo work to Levon's solo albums. The difference is night and day. Levon won Grammy's for his solo work. "Electric Dirt" and "Dirt Farmer" are great albums by Levon despite he doesn't do a lot of the writing and does many covers. Levon's voice, playing and production suggestions are priceless.
I love Joan Baez cover of The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down. Not magical and it doesn't make her the songwriter. Beyond the first two records I lose interest. Time to move on just like Robertson. @@MrGreglarry
Thanx for the anecdote about MIckey Mantle. What a shame thathis end was like that. When you put it like that the story of Robbie and Leon ispainfully clear. So sad.
Robbie wrote a lot of the songs and great guitar player . Levon Helm was an arranger and and incredible drummer /singer .Yes the had a feud and drugs played a big role in it .But as the music industry is the one who writes the lyrics owns them and gets paid the most .
When the night was young, is a great Robbie Robinson song I think it’s about him, Reflecting on his days with the band, money doesn’t talk, it’s swears ☘️32
It's "Fanny" also According to Robbie he went to the hospital to see Levon but Levon was already heavily sedated, so he held his hand. They never resolved anything before he passed.
Thanks for the clarification! I seriously always wondered about that and sang it wrong for years, lol. So sad about the final meeting between Robbie and Levon. Just truly heartbreaking
@@christopherhopkins949 Do you know where Amy Helm’s account of this is? In all honesty, I’d love to read about it. Don Imus had stated that Levon was heavily sedated (I think that Sandra Tooze’s biography of Levon said the same thing) and was unconscious...I THINK that Robbie said the same thing in “Once Were Brothers”.
I had watched a few videos with Rick Danko on stage with Ronnie Hawkins on Letterman. Later on at Massey Hall Toronto for Hawkins 60 th birthday concert along with Levon. I also saw Levon in the movie Shooter as an actor. Juno Hall of Fame awards honouring the Band on youtube, only Levon was a no show, so sad. Even after the performance backstage, Richard Manuals (who had committed suicide earlier) his kids showed up to answer for short interview with the Band members.
Levon's bitterness towards Robbie kept him away from awards ceremonies. He did not attend The Band's induction into The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, even though he had promised his manager Joe Forno Jr., they had arranged a limosine for him, had the members being placed so Levon would have minimal contact with Robbie. Last minute Levon call Forno and said he couldn't make it. Forno was very disappointed and felt betrayed, he was still booking he remainer of The Band for concets, and felt the exposure would be an advantage to them. Levon wouldn't budge even though Forno had his father (both Forno's were Woodstock native's and Forno Sr. was a judge there, and had gotten Levon out of trouble more than ones)whom Levon respected call and plead with him, to no avail.
Kind of like the Grateful Dead. Listen to Robert Hunter sing one of his songs and listen to what the Dead did with them. Then also compare the Grateful Dead with Jerry and compare it to Furthur or the GD with Trey.
A band without a creative writer is little more than a cover band.They seldom ever reach the height of fame the Band earned thanks to their original material primarily provided by Robbie. Robbie said after his thrust to put on the Last Waltz that he was tired of touring, but still wanted to write music and record it rather than touring. Robbie spent his years churning out movie music as well as reems of Indigenous based music including songs like Down the Crazy River. No one can ever be blamed for wanting to go independant. He stated in his book that the Band had agreed to continue practicing followingthe Last Waltz, but that none of the others showed up for the next session.
The issue was Publishing rights, and that Robberson had an in with Grossman, and The Lawyers, while Levon wasn't paying attention. It's fairly clear that Robberson wasn't the sole author, but from Dylan he learned about publishing right that likely should have been shared, IMHO.
It’s too bad The Band didn’t have more structured legal arrangements as a group. Ringo didn’t write much for The Beatles, but I’m sure he gets paid handsomely every time there’s a new Beatles re-release. Even Pete Best has received million dollar paydays just for being the drummer on some of the earliest Beatles tracks where he played drums. Maybe part of the problem is that The Band in 1976 wasn’t as famous as it became later. People in 1976 probably didn’t realize how huge some of those songs and film performances would end up being, but the contracts still had long term consequences. Thanks for the input
@@davidleinweber Yep, it seem pretty clear that Robbie and Grossman had.a deal for sole publishing rights, where the composition were actually more of a group effort. At least that's my understanding from both reading and talking to two people who were there. The Doors a a better example of shared publishing although clearly Morrison did most of the lyrics. Anyway, it was sad how Rick, Richard and even Levon had to struggle so long to keep the bankers at bay. Thanks for addressing this!
From what i gathered, Levon didn't think that he got proper credit. The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down was what happened to his ancestors. Robbie wrote the songs from some of Levon's stories, but didn't give him proper credit for them.
Levon's dad "inspired" the song, but the song is purely fiction, albeit scrupulously researched. PS: Still think it was the ship Robert E Lee that Virgil's wife called him to see, back in Tennesee.
It's a song, it is not a thesis on the Civil War. I don't expect songwriter who are trying to rime a song and set to music to be historically acurate. I think Robbie's point was to point out the devastation that a war leaves for both sides, not just the Civil war, but any war.@@thearab59
Robbie hasn't done much since "The Last Waltz"? Please check out a couple of his solo albums, especially. "Robbie Robertson" from 1987 - The album was nominated for a Grammy Award for "Best Rock / Vocal Album", and was certified gold in the United States in 1991. In Canada, Robertson won Album Of The Year, Best Male Vocalist Of The Year and Producer Of The Year at the Juno Award ceremony in 1989.
@@davidleinweber It's a fantastic album - give it a listen!! This is one of the best songs of the 80s in my useless opinion LOL th-cam.com/video/OaXJYBHoxuo/w-d-xo.html
Your right about Robbies songwriting......those are stories that took a lot of research etc......listen to Acadian Driftwood.....true story......also his civil war epic The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down etc........
Imo levon, and rick, and richard were a trio of strong soloists and toneful voices, that gave the band a nuanced sound, with perfectly crafted song stories from robbies pen, and sublime musicianship.
There is a benefit to bands sharing songwriting royalties. It can prevent some of the money based feuds that happen when one or two members make exponentially more money than the rest of the group. Sometimes players contribute licks or rhythmic ideas that elevate the track but don't technically constitute "songwriting." It would certainly be easy to hold a grudge in those situations if you are struggling while the writer is flush with cash. I loved the Last Waltz although I haven't seen it in at least 20 years. I read somewhere that part of the conflict was about how the film was cut with other members feeling Robbie was featured more prominently than the others. Did Levon mention that in his book? Thanks for the video. Keep rockin man.
Yes , I believe R.E.M have shared songwriting credits and it seemed to be healthy for them economically as well as in their friendships in the band . I believe U2 the same .
Levon has charm. Levon has talent. Levon’s appeal sucks you in like a beautiful woman. But he was a junkie. He wrecked car after car. He blew his money. He made zero business moves. He gave up his royalties for heroine money. Robbie was married with kids. He was writing the Night they Drove Dixie quietly on a piano so as not to wake his family while Levon was shooting heroine and partying. Robbie told a bunch of junkies he was done, and went on with his life. Here’s something NEVER mentioned in this discussion. After Robbie left, those guys were still in their prime. They were all friends with the entire music industry. They knew the Beatles. They knew every musician. Every producer. They had every opportunity to say screw Robbie, let’s prove we are our own songwriters. Let’s prove we can lead ourselves. And they came up with nothing. Clearly they were all talented musicians who were fortunate enough to have a great songwriter in their lives. There are millions of singers and musicians who can perform what has been written. The magic is in the creation. Robbie had the magic. And the work ethic. And the maturity to quit drugs and road women and settle down and become a family man and a businessman. I love Levon like we all do but I don’t feel sorry for junkies. His anger should be at the man in the mirror for being on top of the world and screwing it up with horrible decisions.
Thank You. I wasn't aware of this feud. I recently have done a TH-cam deep dive of the Band and love the music. Thanks for your measured explanation. I don't feel like you are taking sides.
@@stephenrichard9278 I used to refer to it that way as well, until I realized that there is no reciprocation from Robbie. I love Levon, but I’m of the opinion that his assertion in the revised Autobiography that Robbie effectively killed Rick Danko was one of the dirtiest lies that I’ve ever read. I only hope that it was Stephen Davis, Levon’s ghostwriter, who wrote that...but the anger behind it sure sounds a lot like Levon. I don’t care how hurt and angry Levon was about Rick’s death...it was an incredibly dirty thing to say. The sad part is that I have read comments on this thread that bought into this blatant bullshit. Howzabout a little perspective through the form of actual research? Yes, reading is hard and stuff, but then people don’t sound like jackasses afterwards. Nobody killed Rick Danko but Rick Danko. Period. I love him, but he was his own worst enemy when it came to his multi-decade drug addiction.
I was 14 in 1969. All we cared about was the British Invasion and dismissed most American groups. I had never heard the backstory of the Band. Amazing stuff going back to the late fifties I guess. What Eric Clapton said in one of the documentaries about the Band was very revealing. Thanks for the comments
@@stephenrichard9278 That’s my all time Rock and Roll “what if”: what if Clapton had struck up the nerve during his Woodstock visit in 1968 and asked them if he could join, instead of losing his nerve. One thought is that he joined the 3 in their drug issues, like he actually did in the wake of having been rejected by Pattie Harrison. Another thought is that he’s so inspired by the confidence of being allowed to join that he stays clean in the interest of the group.
thanks for the giving some clarity and context to this sad story. (Look at my lengthly previewing comments below to learn my take on this) You added some great aspects that I never considered: especially about the money.....and how they got paid salaries for a few years.., and then they reform and go back to the road -- without Robbie. And I SO agree. He WROTE and SANG those songs of the first time. And even though the three great voices would never have gotten Robbie to such heights, Robbie gets the writing credits. Money fucks up everything, huh? It's interesting how much we agree and know the same little details that makes this tale so Shakespearian and enduring. And now that Robbie is gone too -- this while thing can come out -- now that there are no more money squabbles, drugs to shoot or nooses to hang from. Robbie said it in the beginning of this new documentary. Something to the effect of "we were SO good we self-destructed." On another note -- the dreaded "rock star death a day" years are either here or approaching. As we watch all our heroes dance into history, we need to stop for a moment, and marvel that we lived in such a fantastically rich musical era. Kudos all around..... I look forward to more of our videos -- and my posts are not usually endless. It's just really cool to come across somebody who is so interested in the same thing that a lot of people don't even think about. I bet you're a musician too. haha. Peace out.
Yes, as I’ve grown older, I’ve come to realize that certain periods can be extra special in terms of creativity. In music, the late sixties and early seventies were one of those really special times. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and watching.
yes ,,,,,,,I call the 60s and 70s and 90s all Renaissances of sorts. I left the 80s out cause nobody knew what to do next and many bands just withered. But when the 90s again, NOT the mega hits - it felt a bit like re visiting great music again -- thanks @@davidleinweber
They all contributed to the success of The Band, I love all of them, but have a soft spot for Robbie and especially Rick. Cannot imagine anyone singing Stage Freight or It makes no difference but Rick.
As a writer, performer and band member... I can see both sides of the coin/argument. I'd have to side w/ Robbie, that unfortunately bands have a shelf-life. Circumstances, creativity and life just happen & change. Like a sports superstar that doesn't know enough to go out on top....Robbie saw that coming and the others didn't. Whether it was drugs, ego or money driven, it created animosity. Very understandable and a hard pill to swallow.....here! On the other side of Life? None of that matters. just Love!
Hasn't done much? You are way off here. He put out an eponymous solo album 1987, Storyville, 1991, Music for The Native Americans Review, 1994, Contact from the Underworld of Red Boy, 1998, How to Become Clairvoyant , 2011, Sinematic, 2019, a book Testimony. He was working on a sequel to Testimony. Hopefully he finished it. He also put out a slew of soundtracks. Hadly nothing.
I've always believed it was the movie that caused the split. Levon hated the movie and claimed he and the rest of the Band never received any revenue from the movie. The other stuff (about songwriting royalties and such) came later, and smells strongly of sour grapes. Nobody in 1967 (when they signed with Capitol) had any concept of a band sharing songwriting credits. Their contract was probably written about 1935. We know better now, but nobody thought of it then.
Robertson co-produced the film, so he had a completely different ( much more rewarding) financial arrangement than the rest of the band from the film’s profits
From what I've read, the problem dates further back; sometime after Big Pink but before the brown album. Levon said they just didn't have the same enthusiasm, and there were a lot of factors; drugs, mgmt, residuals, etc. The Last Waltz was the climax to a lot of acrimony. Robbie kept jumping in front of the camera throughout. They wanted the band members to come back and reshoot several songs where there were issues. Everyone except Levon went, so what you saw of him on film was all from the actual event.
@@kevinjoseph517 I've heard the opening song in the Last Waltz- Don't Do It, was totally re-recorded later and what the audience heard that night is not what we heard in the film. Very disappointing to hear that, in lieu of the Band's decision not to appear in the Woodstock film when they heard C,S & N re-recorded their numbers for the movie.
Robbie didn't quit the band. He didn't want the band to stop after the Last Waltz. He just wanted to stop touring. He really really didn't want to go on the road anymore. He even said to the other guys in 1983 when they reformed: "you guys can use the name The Band no problem. Absolutely. Of course. And if you want to go into the studio and make a beautiful record, I'd be happy to be a part of it, but I'm not going on the road."
It's hard to get a full grasp on. Obviously the other guys were hurting for money. Robbie getting the enormous bulk of residuals didn't help them become closer.
@@paulgerkin2851 That's interesting. Levon, Rick and Richard worked wonders with Robbie's songs. I've heard The Band lineup that played in the 1980s without Robbie and they were very good. They played some big shows. But they didn't reach the level they had with Robbie in it.
Good video. I appreciate your balanced view towards the issue. As a quick primer, here's how the publishing business works: songs are basically lyrics and music. Say you write the lyrics of a particular song, but your guitarist writes the music for that song. And say the song earns $1000 in publishing. Typically you would make $500 for the lyrics, the guitarist would make $500 for the music, if you set it up that way. The drummer, bassist, etc., who played on the track makes ZERO money from publishing. Why? Because they didn't write the lyrics or the music in this scenario. They PERFORMED on the RECORDING of the song, but they didn't WRITE any part of the song. Publishing only cares about who WRITES songs, not who performs on particular recordings. This is a CRITICAL distinction that most people (even musicians with major label record deals) don't understand. This is different than the RECORDING business. With recording (especially in the 60's and 70's), record companies would pay an advance to the artist/band to make a record. The artist would pay for all expenses of the recording from this advance. The record company would pay themselves BACK for the advance. If the record sells really well, the artist MIGHT make something off the sale of the record, depending on their contract. If the record didn't sell enough copies to cover the expenses, they would make another record, and the debt from the last album would be tacked on to the next record. This is why artists with low record sales eventually get dropped from the label. Record companies eventually cut their losses. Touring and merchandise sales is traditionally where the musicians would make their money. So if a band stops touring, the musicians who aren't getting paid from royalty payments or record sales are basically unemployed. So in the case of The Band, Robbie Robertson was likely making 100% of the royalties, since he wrote both the music and the lyrics of the songs that got played on the radio. The rest of the band counted on touring to make money. When Robbie ended The Band, they were unemployed...and they had no hope of getting money from publishing. It' understandable that Levon would be bitter, but that's just how the music business worked (at least in the 60's & 70's). Things have changed somewhat since streaming came along, but overall, it's a very tough business.
It's NOT understandable that Levon Helm was bitter. He was a cry baby PRICK who KNEW how it worked. Robbie paid the other members a FORTUNE over what he had to legally. Go ask your Alexa the followig "How much is Levon Helm Worth" Alexa will say Levon Helm was worth 20 million dollars at the time of his death. Robbie was worth 50 million whe he died .What the HELL is Levon crying about. HE DID"T WRITE THE SONGS and Robbie paid hin a FORTUNE, .Hekm was a PRICK cry baby.
Robbie didn't really pursue a movie career, after starring in Carny, he only was in one other movie, he said he didn't care for acting, he was use to initiating things, not being told what to do. Levon was the one that ended up in several movies, well known ones, and well received, such as "A coal miner's daugher", and "The Right Stuff", plus several others. Levon said in an interview he thought acting was pretty easy, he liked being told what to say, how to dress, and someone combing your hair.
Springsteen has an interesting comment in his book on internal band rivalries/issues. His policy was he was in charge. He distributed the money, he approved the gigs, etc. At the time I thought that was pretty harsh/selfish, but now I understand better his logic. If there is a clear direction, that's the way it is. Clearly the rest of group can do what they want individually and have the freedom to go with his direction or not. Notice the E street periodically re-unite, then Springsteen on his own, then back again. That seem healthier to me than "staying together" forever. Of course, a few millions split among the guys over the years also helps to smooth any ruffled feathers !😎
I just watched the Robertson/The Band documentary he voices and during the Last Waltz portion he keeps referring to 'we' when talking about all of the decisions made about how the concert would be done as though the other members were active in these decisions. From Helm's view, the other members didn't want to do a farewell concert and when it came to the details of said concert, they had no involvement. That it was all Robby. To be fair Robertson wanted them to take a break because of the amount of heroine use by Levon, Rick and Richard on their last tour. The concert, he said was supposed to be a break only, not the end. Robertson said the others never really wanted to get back in the studio again and he didn't want to just tour as a revue act but actually make new music. He saw that they were all still partying and Robby wasn't really a partier. He also didn't want to pen all the songs like he felt he had to on Stage Fright because the others were so jacked up on 'H' that they didn't participate in song writing anymore.
The heroin use, was not just on the last tour, it went on for some time. The Last Waltz was Robbie's idea, and he was always the one during the ground work, meeting with different people, organizing taking charge. Robbie was done touring, he felt he was pushing his luck, he was also married with 3 young children he wanted to spend more time with. Robbie was a partier, by his own admission, he was no angel, did drugs, but not heroin. Even as he was partying and doing drugs, he was still, what Barney Hoskyns wrote in his biography "Mr. Responsible". he would be up in the morning writing songs, while they others were still sleeping.
Hi, thanks for watching. It's just a little medley of "fifties chord progression" tunes I tossed into a nice fifties backing track by Now You Shred. It's Silhouettes on the Shade, Blue Moon, and a touch of Earth Angel!
having read both books I found it interesting that Levon's was written many years ago while Robbie's was written fairly recently, I believe after Levon had passed. I loved Levon's book and it struck me that Robbie's was almost a note by note answer to what Levon charges in his book. Robbie makes a point of telling how each of the Band members signed their share of the publishing rights to the songs over to him because they needed the money. there is also some insinuation that Levon's commitment to the band came into question as early as 1966 when Levon abandoned them during the Dylan tour + Robbie makes the point that The Last Waltz was not supposed to be the end of The Band but the end of them touring - but that after the concert the rest of them stopped turning up. How like life = Rashomon
Interesting. I’ve not read Robbie’s book. When did they rest of the band sign away their share of publishing rights? Is that sort of admitting their role in writing the songs was greater than ppl assume since Robertson takes full credit?
I think Robbie deserves the money for writing the songs. This reminds me of queen. Freddie insisted on whoever wrote the song gets the credit. But after he was terminal he said time is short, let’s call all future songs Queen songs.
What you miss is:they initially said was we all work on these songs.Rob got his name on the titles.The other guys were shocked.Lee said Rob was walking around with the other guys money in his pocket.In Nashville if you’re in the room when it’s written you get on the credit.The example Rob had;Life is a Carnival,That’s all.Richard said”two bits a shot,”the 2nd line.Rick gets credit w/Bob Dylan,Richard too.Tears of Rage,This wheels on fire…Bob developed the head session,get your song sketches,Get some talent get em high,they finish your arrangements.Grossman>Bobbie>Rob. Rob’d get song credit/The other guys would get this club in Bearsville…There was no big return in a bar in Bearsville!
Just wrong in all sense. Royalties are split 50/50 between recorded performance and songwriting. Performance includes contributing an amazing vocals and musicianship. Songwriting, which is a legal term, is the creator of the lyrics and melody. Before releasing each album the Band had to sign off on the credits. The contention was raised years after Robertson left the band. Some songwriters are willing to give up solo credit to keep the peace. Most do not. It's just hard to swallow getting only 1/5th of 50% while the songwriter gets that share as well as the entire other half. Life is hard.
@@Blablashutupnow Robbie got rich and started believing his own bullshit. He wrote many songs that were meant to represent Levon's life, background, and history. He even incorporated people from Levon's life into them. That shows great respect and reverence, but when money was factored in, that all went out the window. And there were 4 drug addicts in The Band, not 3. Robbie just had a different drug of choice, which probably contributed to his megalomania.
Some good thoughts. I think these sorts of fuzzy ideas about who actually wrote songs that end up on albums is one reason Nashville is so tightly closed these days. Too many lawyers. Lawyers can ruin Happy Birthday if they get involved. Thanks for watching the channel!
I've read a couple of books by the band and have seen several interviews over the years. What went on as far as song writing goes is a grey area. I love all the guys in the Band but coming up with a part or helping arrange a song is not composing the song. Legally you can only copyright lyrics and melody. This was a sticking point with Levon. I don't believe he ever wrote any material on the Band albums. Robertson got tired of trying to get these guys together and record the more their addictions got out of hand. He was also sick of the road. Rick Richard and Levon did piss away alot of their touring revenue in the 70's and reformed as a financial move in the early 80s. One could make a strong case that Robbie did write their classic's because the albums that they did after the reformed were not any good and contained mostly material written by other writers or cover tunes.
@@kevinjoseph517 Strawberry Wine and Life Is A Carnival. I can’t remember offhand if he wrote Jemima Surrender. But that was pretty much it. I think that he got a co-writing credit for the song Islands. My counter to those who read his book and accept the allegations as gospel is this: if he was such a prolific songwriter whose contributions were “stolen” by Robbie, then why weren’t the last 3 Band albums and his last two solo albums (not to mention his earlier solo stuff) laden with Levon Helm-written songs...when Robbie wasn’t there to “steal” the credits? It’s bullshit. That’s why. I love the guy, but facts are facts. His contention was that the process of having credits “stolen” was the reason that he stopped contributing...but that doesn’t hold water AFTER The Band reformed. My theory, along with some unknown named Ronald Cornett Hawkins, is that drug use by Rick, Richard, and Levon stymied the creative process and led directly to the quality going downhill after Stage Fright...which was, not so coincidentally, about the same time that the drugs became problematic.
Robbie's song writing carried the Band into greatness. I don't know there agreement so can't comment but I hope Robbie did right by his band mates. Looks a little slippery. Robbie new he had a great singer for his songs and wrote for Levon and counted on Levon taking his songs into greatness. Love Robbie but think he could have done more for his band mates.
There was a time when I believed that Levon was 100% the victim in the situation, and his accounts of the history were infallible. Now, in the same way that you imply, I can see both sides, and I wish Levon would not have died angry. Robbie was no saint; he loved the powder, and others in the group had their habits as well. But through the years I have seen where he was coming from, wanting to get out of the road lifestyle.
I liked both Levon & Robbie but I side with Robbie on this. He had every right to live his life like he wanted to live it not live it how Levon wanted him to live it. You don't get to live other people's lives for them. That's not fair. BTW I actually liked Robbie's singing. I loved his album Showdown at Big Sky. Thanks for the great program. I enjoyed it.
You are right. Robbie's son wrote on Robbie's Facebook page on Robbie' s 75 birthday, how glad he was that Robbie stopped touring and was a very hands on father, making him breakfast before taking him to little legue games.
A Band without any problems just doesn't happen, especially great bands where you need that driving force to carry on. They started out knowing they had something and hung on till that Last Waltz.
The rest of the band also arranged Robbie's songs. I kinda' think they deserved at least a partial writing credit for that, but who knows how that works in publishing.
except I don't think I've ever heard Robbie Robertson EVER badmouth levon or any other member, so its a bit of a one sided feud. Sort of like Pink Floyd. Feuds can go one way.
I love The Band, but I also feel for Robbie a little bit. In my own band, I was the only businessman, making contacts, maintaining them, and making sure we had good press. I wrote most of the songs and kept the live show together. The other guys were great, but they mostly just played the gig, they never saw all the stuff I was doing behind the scenes. When you suddenly have success, and the rest of the band is on drugs, or dropping out because of shit, or suddenly making lots of special requests, you don't really feel appreciated. But I also have to say, as far as the songs are concerned, we had a clear Gema deal. Even with my songs, we have shared the Gema distributions. Because that's how a band does it, in my opinion. I never understood why, for example, the Beatles split their rights between Lennon/McCartny. When you live together for years, experience everything together, you share. Everything.
No way do you share everything! If I'm on my own writing a song that is personal to me and then show it to the others and they put down there parts there's no way I would give them credit! There doing what a band does, do session musicians get credit?
Contracts can be written to accommodate the disparity in effort; Pareto’s Law might have guided…80% to the writer, 20% to the band, - divided and assigned to each individual band member active at the time of registering the copyright (including the song writer, band member proportion) Not equal but maybe fair’er’
Wow. Robbie Robertson didn't just retire into a cave after filming The Last Waltz in 1978. He did five solo albums and he sang on them all. In 1987, he released his first solo album, Robbie Robertson,which included a beautiful song Fallen Angel in memory of Richard Manuel who had died by suicide while touring with the remaining members of The Band in 1986. Robertson produced multiple film soundtracks over the years and worked closely with Martin Scorsese. He also produced and starred in the film Carny with Jodie Foster and Gary Busey. Robbie Robertson had been quite busy after The Last Waltz. Robbie Robertson has said he considered Levon Helm like a brother, along with the other members of The Band, from their early days and wasn't bothered by Levon's complaints in his biography and still even spoke occasionally with Levon. Robertson went to visit Levon Helm when he was dying in the hospital. Levon Helm and Robbie Robertson were two very multi-talented artists.
Robertson made it look like he wanted to get away from the rocker lifestyle in the "Last Waltz" but right after that movie came out, he and Scorsese bought a house and did Cocaine/hookers 24/7. Danko and Manuel had the biggest problems with drugs/alcohol but they sobered up in the 1980's. They needed money in the 1980's but Robertson refused to join back in the Band and I think that is what pissed Helm off the most (Manuel would commit suicide right after). As good as Robertson's songs where, they wouldn't have been so good without the rest of the Band and he needed to give them some more love back to them when they need it.
Never heard that before about robbie and Scorsese getting the house and partaking in the coke n women. Is that in his book? To me, it does appear robbie is noticeably on coke along with Levon.
Compare a Pete Townsend demo to a finished WHO song and I think you've got a comparable situation. Pete and Robbie were songwriters surrounded by incredible musicians with great chemistry. What that song turns into doesn't change writing credits. I can't think of one Bob Dylan song covered by another artist that wasn't enhanced in a good way, but you still got to pay the writer.
Roger had sense enough not to have claimed songwriting credit just because he took the song and sang it. The band members must have made a lot of money and wanted a share of royalties too. The issue has caused a lot of trouble for bands. The money.
Ronnie Hawkins has said Robbie wrote songs. John Simon, who produced Music from Big Pink and the self-titled album says Robbie brought the songs. Levon never wrote anything. The songwriter gets the royalties. That's how it works. @@MrGreglarry
@@TRamone01 I don't dispute the songwriter getting royalties. Levon's claim, not mine, is that Robbie claimed things that he shouldn't have. He said him - and Rick, Garth, Richard - were not given certain credits and opportunities to share in songwriting and other monetary deals that Robbie staked claim to.
People...there are 2 sides to this story,and I firmly believe that the truth of the matter lies somewhere in the middle. Also? Robbie simply didn't want to be in The Band any longer,and the other members never spoke badly of Robbie-only Levon. Also? The rest of the Band DID share in the song writing royalties...Robbie bought them out and they gave those royalties up of their own free will...nobody stole a damn thing from them.My take on it is that Levon seemed to think that Robbie Robertson owed him a living.And yes,I own and have read both Levons and Robbie's respective memoirs.Would the The Band have been who they were minus any one of those tremendously talented men? I think not. But the vitriol from Levon seems like a load of sour grapes,much of the time. That being said,though... LOVE The Band-ALLof them.
Really appreciate your adding some good details and perspective to the conversation. The Band definitely wouldn’t have been the same minus any one of those guys. Thanks for watching the channel
Robbie Robertson did an incredible amount after the Last Waltz. He scored nearly every Martin Scorsese movie, he did the recent documentary about the band. He acted in two movies.
I really appreciate your comments, details and clarifications! I’m always glad when people add details to the comments. I’m sure there are tons of people who know more about the personal and business dealings of the Band, though I love their music as much as anyone. I do stand by my main points that great players who played a vital role in making timeless music should have better long-term arrangements. Most of all, I hope my main point that really creative and inspiring songwriters are under appreciated sometimes, including by other musicians who play their songs. It’s really a special gift to write such catchy, evocative tunes. Some of the ones that sound so simple are actually the most special of all!!! Thanks so much for watching the channel
@@robbiedees224 That probably had a lot to do with it. His solo stuff was slick ... but it didn't have that rich sound of the south that Levon brought or the amazing vocal of Richard Emmanuel and Danko's harmony. Emmanuel was also a good songwriter. He wrote most of the tunes on the first album.
If Levon contributed so much to the writing aspect of the Band songs, why were his solo projects devoid of 'by Levon Helm' song credits? Sadly Levon didn't show for 1989 Canadian Music Hall of Fame and 1994 Rock N Roll Hall ceremonies. He took his anger to the grave. Now only Garth is with us as of 2023.
John Simon & the late Sally Grossman, very much a part of The Band's inner circle, did not believe that Robbie Robertson ripped off Levon Helm or anyone else. Robbie came in with written material that he'd composed & for which he correctly received credit. On the occasions that Robbie came in with a fragment of an idea & the others contributed, such as "Life Is A Carnival", the credit was shared between them. Too many of the comments here are ridiculous blatherings by people who have no idea how publishing and royalties work.
@@donpinger5492 There's an odd "Levon vs Robbie" mindset among a number of Band fans. Levon's book likely accounts for most of it. The last third of Barney Hoskyns biography of The Band is also very anti-Robbie, & that likely dovetails with Levon's publicly expressed anger, bitterness, & false claims of theft. Levon was a very angry guy. He became enraged at The Band's road manager when he tried to wake Levon up to tell him it was time to pack and catch a plane to the next gig. From Levon's point of view, an "employee" was telling him what to do. Well, that was the guy's job, why do you have to bite his nose off because he's doing the job you hired him for? That gives you an idea of Levon's skewed perspective. Robbie certainly didn't rip anyone off. Band producer John Simon mentions this in his memoir Truth Lies & Hearsay. These grossly misinformed Band fans raving about Robbie being "a thief" really have to get a clue, or they'll end up voting for MAGA candidates!
@@ericmalone3213 I heard on some other thread a while back that Levon was so pissed about the Robbie thing that he refused to play any of the songs Robbie wrote in concert. And I told the poster that that was a bunch of BS. I'd seen him twice after the LW and he played all the best of the Band. Bitch all he could but he actually had no problem making a second career playing Robbie's songs. And Robbie, the "Thief and Liar" never said a word about it. Basically gave the boys his blessings and even allowed them to carry on using the Band name, which he probably could have contested, if he actually was a thief and a liar.
@@donpinger5492 My hunch is, quite a lot of Band fans don't really want to consider how completely fucked up Levon, Rick & Richard were, & how much of a small or larger fortune they spent on the Devil's Dandruff when they could have been taking care of business & looking after their financial interests. Levon had a period of years where he was considerably affected by heroin & barbituate use. Robbie was always taking care of business, & didn't get his nose too deeply into the Columbian Marching Powder until after The Band broke up, when he was hanging out & then living with Martin Scorsese. I've never heard any evidence as to what exactly Robbie supposedly lied about or stole. I have heard evidence, for example, as to David Byrne taking credit for contributions Chris Franz, Tina Weymouth & Jerry Harrison made to Talking Heads music (oddly enough, Byrne sued them when they released an album as The Heads). Band fans tend to have this idyllic fantasy of brothers-in-arms harmonizing together in Big Pink, & don't especially want to reflect on the effects heavy use of substances had on the group dynamics & the music. Nor do they seem to want to understand the machinations of how music publishing works, they prefer to drink the Levon-Demonizing-Robbie kool-aid.
@@jrh11254 So did the library, where Robbie went to learn about the Civil War. But, yeah, I agree, Robbie was amazed by the south, by everything about it, good and bad, and without Levon, whom he adored, he probably couldn’t have sort of soaked it in as well as he did. Since Robbie died, I’ve gone down the Band rabbit hole. I came across a video of Robbie talking about a conversation he had with Levon, after Levon’s book ( which was written by a ghostwriter) came out. Levon took this hate toward Robbie public in his book, which was written, what, a decade after Robbie left? Robbie said when he confronted Levon, Levon said he didn’t write that much of the book. He said he was really angry about some things in his book, and wasn’t about others. Robbie mentioned, and I’ve heard him mention this more than once, that Levon had a demon inside him, and vindictive streak that was eating him up. He aimed it at different people and situations over his lifetime. I’ve known folks like that, haunted by something that comes out like poison. It’s a shame. Some people, like Roger Waters, are able to put that poison to good use. Some can’t, or don’t. I haven’t read Levon’s book, so Idon’t know if he mentioned Dylan wanted to hire only Robbie, and Robbie said no, he came with the band, and talked Dylan into hiring them all. I can understand A guy getting finished with the road. Once you lose your nerve for something, you have to get out. But making records without touring? I don’t know about that. Seems these days the touring is the only thing that makes anyone money. The corporations grab the rest. Seems to me, there should be a better basic contract drawn up by the union, where everyone involved in not just writing, but arranging and contributing to it in any way should get a good chunk of money.
No one can ever convince me that Robbie wrote everything. All the band's songs were Levon''s stories. He even cheated his band mates out of all royalties to The Last Waltz.. I Robbie got his 30 pieces of silver.
What does Levon being a Southeren have to do with the Band and their success. Garth was a genius on many instruments, Rick was a penetrating soulful singer, who could also play guitar and violin, Richard was a very soulful singer and played piano and drums, the were all Canadians as was Robbie. Not underestimating Levon's contribution, he was as talented as Rick and the others, but they all complimented eachother.
Interesting and informative. I really LOVED to hear LH sing. However your comment, "you can't play music until your eighty". Please don't tell the Stones that, they are definitely trying.
Robbie learned music on 6 Nations Reservation as well as the storytelling aspect you spoke about, from the elders. As well as his love of movies and taking inspiration from many of them. So your right on track with that aspect of his story.
Robbie looked into the acoustic guitar he was playing and saw "Nazareth" inside which inspired him to write "we pulled into Nazareth......" and on it went from there! Cool 😎
Its very sad that money issues and greed torn apart a Legendary group like The Band. I can’t say for sure if Robbie Robertson truly wrote all of the songs or if it was a collaborative effort and he snaked the other members out of publishing credits. The music business is not known for being honest or having integrity . RIP Levon,Rick and Garth.
Yes, I think America might be one of the only countries where players who play on recordings don’t get any residuals. It’s all set up for the benefit of record companies
Drugs tore The Band apart, not greed. Some unknown named Ronnie Hawkins made this exact point when he said (a quote from Sandra Tooze’s excellent biography of Levon) that he thought that they could’ve been the biggest band around had it not been for drugs. I’ll take his word for it. He also said that Heroin changed Levon’s personality to a significant degree; he believed that the addiction intensified the inner anger and distrust. The other guys all were given performers royalties, which 3 of them sold to Robbie in the late 70’s. They were estimated to bring in roughly $100,000 annually to each. I think of Danko’s admission that he spent $100,000 to $200,000 ANNUALLY on drugs, then think of him losing his home just before he died...and wonder what might have been. Garth declared bankruptcy 3 times. Robbie didn’t steal the performance royalties. He made an offer, and 3 of them took him up on it.
@@robertbruce6865 100,000$ a year for 3 years after The Last Waltz is shit money. 100,000$ after taxes,attorneys10% fees,agent fees 10-15% compared to the film and albums grosse sales is an insult. I understand why Levon had the Last Waktz movie poster in his office with giant “fuck” painted on it. The record companies learned a long time ago to rip musicians off. Drugs and addiction issues certainly made things tenuous for The Band and lots of non famous people around the world. They were happy when they were young broke and making the incredible music that’s will resonate for many many years to come, the music “business” part left the members sour on how things ended.
@@mattryan6886 No, no. Their performance royalties for their records were estimated to be $100,000 annually, not their royalties for The Last Waltz. I actually don’t think that they made anything off of The Last Waltz, which I agree is a crying shame. I have no issue with Levon’s anger on that score. I have an issue with Levon’s anger regarding songwriting credits, which is another story. Plus, while I love Levon, I’m quite disgusted by his allegation that Robbie “killed” Rick with the songwriting credit issue. That was a low blow, even for Levon, and patently absurd: Rick admitted to spending $100,000 to $200,000 annually on drugs. Chances are that he and Elizabeth aren’t evicted from their home had he spent a fraction of that on house payments.
The feud was about *Money* ... In the music business there is essentially two types of royalties: Publishing royalties And Performance royalties. Musicians don't get paid for publishing royalties unless they're the author of the music. So, imagine you're anyone in the band, you hear your performance on the radio all the time, but you are broke. 😳😧🤪
As fans, we must remember the music, more than the artists. If I'm not mistaken, The Last Waltz was the beginning of the last tour, so it's not like that was the last show. I saw The Band open for CSN in 83 or so, and they were good then too without Robbie. Junkies suck, they only have one aim in life and it is to use before cold turkey hits. Family, friends, emotions, morals go out the window. Robbie used, but not "H". There is not grace in that accept at least it's not "junkie". Drummers and singers in Rock and country and pop are arrangers but not publishers.
If you put all the stories together one thing that stands out is Robbie’s exposure to the corruption in the New York recording industry. Because he was a song writer from the get go, Ronnie Hawkins took him to NY to get an education. I think he was pretty cautious about getting ripped off and controlled his drug and alcohol use.
You have a great point. It’s good to be inspired. But if you think about it, somebody has to actually write the song - first verse, chorus, riff goes here, here’s the ending, etc. No matter how inspired you feel or how great you play, someone still has to do the grunt work of actually writing a complete song. It ain’t as easy or as glamorous as some might suppose! After that, the band definitely puts their feel, style and touches to it, but that’s not the same as actually writing a song. It’s a strange issue, but sort of an important one. Thanks for watching the channel!
This idea that Levon deserves songwriting credit because some of Robbie's songs were inspired by Levon's world in Arkansas is oft repeated and illogical . If someone writes a song about elephants, the elephants aren't entitled to songwriting credit.
'glad you mentioned Townshend & Daltrey. 'It Makes No Difference' if you keep touring like they did and Roger could keep earning money. Robbie did what was good for Robbie and it's true, just like Graham Nash, he had to deal with hard drug addicts in the band not contributing as they used to and difficult to deal with. You also think about Brian Jones vs Mick & Keith, whom wrote songs. thx
I think you nailed it in your analysis. As David Crosby told Graham Nash when asked if they should have Neil Young join the CSN: "the songs, man, how could we not take him in". Ronnie Hawkins (who would be in a position to know) said Robbie wrote all those songs and had been writing them for years.
You would think, if anyone, Ronnie Hawkins would settle the matter. Robbie didn't get the credit he deserved.
@TRamone01 I think Robbie has caught alot of flak just out of sheer jealousy and envy. He is just not as easily likeable as Levon was. He is viewed as overly calculating or Machievellian. Robbie was smart and hardworking and a helluva
musician.
Levon was a musical force too...I loved the guy.
CSN did fine without Neil, all super talented. I finally saw them.
@@chrismiller1183 Levon was a great singer and drummer, he was not a songwriter, nor was he good with money. Even his own father scolded him for his reckless spending. Robbie has lot's of fan, especially from women (I'm female) I suspect, he was so good looking, especially in The Last Waltz, and he had a lot of charisma. He was also very smart and savvy, so I suspect there might be some jealousy involved. By the way I think Rick was very good looking as well, he had an endearing personality and charisma as well.
Robertson worked on Martin Scorsese's movies Casino, The Departed, and Gangs of New York, and he provided music supervision for Shutter Island, The Wolf of Wall Street, and Silence.[citation needed] In Rome, he headlined the 1995 annual Labour Day concert festival with supporting acts Andrea Bocelli, Elvis Costello, and Radiohead.[citation needed]
In 1996, as executive soundtrack producer, Robertson heard a demo of Change the World and sent it to Clapton as a suggestion for the soundtrack of Phenomenon, starring John Travolta. Babyface produced the track. Change the World won 1997 Grammy awards for Song of the Year and Record of the Year. In 1999, Robertson contributed songs to Oliver Stone's film, Any Given Sunday.[150]
In 2000, David Geffen and Mo Ostin convinced Robertson to join DreamWorks Records as creative executive. Robertson, who persuaded Nelly Furtado to sign with the company, is actively involved with film projects and developing new artist talent, including signings of A.i., Boomkat, eastmountainsouth, and Dana Glover. On February 9, 2002, Robertson performed "Stomp Dance (Unity)" as part of the opening ceremony of the 2002 Winter Olympic Games in Salt Lake City, Utah. In 2004, he contributed the song "Shine Your Light" to the Ladder 49 soundtrack.[citation needed]
In 2005, Robertson was executive producer of the definitive box set for the Band, entitled A Musical History. In 2006, he recorded with Jerry Lee Lewis on the track "Twilight", a Robertson composition, for Lewis' album Last Man Standing. On July 28, 2007, at Eric Clapton's Crossroads Guitar Festival in Bridgeview, Illinois, Robertson made a rare live appearance. Also in 2007, Robertson accepted an invitation to participate in Goin' Home: A Tribute to Fats Domino (Vanguard). With the group Galactic, Robertson contributed a version of Domino's "Goin' to the River".
For the 2019 Martin Scorsese movie The Irishman, Robertson provided the score and consulted with music supervisor Randall Poster on the entire soundtrack.
Robbie saw his brothers falling into addiction and he couldn’t ride that train. As Levon said when Robertson approached him about their deterioration into drugs and alcohol, he said, “I’m not in it for my health.” I think Levon felt abandoned by Robbie bc he wouldn’t go down into a dark hole with them. Robbie and Garth were the smart ones, and they grew up at some point.
Correct on all counts. People just don't get it.
I think your right that those securing their stake and others to high went on to realize a decade later they didn't secure their properly felt portion also unwilling to admit drugs 1st screwed them over and clearer heads prevailed feeling deceived. Levon seemed to be getting on in other ventures.
@@arthurrobinson7286 They all got what legally stated. They ALSO got a lot MORE than was legally reequired. You people just don't know entertainment law, royalties and residuals. Levon Helm, the drug addict cry baby with no GED never stopped whining and making Robbie look bad. Screw him. He died with 12 million bucks in the bank. Give me a break.
@@BrevityDeeznuts SO WHAT? Nobody that I know keeps their millions in cash under their mattress, My money is invested in Stocks, Bonds, Mutual Funds, T-Bills and some real estate. SO, stop being a moron and nit-picking. Go ask your Amazon Alexa, RIGHT NOW, use the words "How much is Levon Helm worth"? she will respond "Levon Helm was worth an estmated 12 million dollars" Robbie and Garth Hudson did minimal drugs, and by the time Scorcese made "The Last Walts", Robbie and Garth were doing NO drugs and the others were stoned out of their minds,, Robbie and Garth just couldn't put up with them anymore and more important is a fact that Robbie went ABOVE and BEYOND as to what he was required to pay Band members. Levon Helm just wanted more more more and felt that working together in the studio on a song, meant WRITING the song. WRONG. Robbie wrote the songs, .Levon and the others did what was required of them be being part of the band. Putting Robbies songs together, arranging, performing. He was paid MORE than agreed to in their contract and MORE than most people in the music industry who did NOT write the songs, .Robbie should have sued Levon for slander LONG ago and should have seen that the masses of asses would one day, take sides with Levon. After all, only 5 % of the population REALLY knows what is going on in the world, so they follow each others conspiacies like a bunch of sheep. Levon Helm was an ignorant, uneducated moron, who was an OK drummer but had the PERFECT voice for the songs that Robbie wrote. Now go teach your economics class .NOT. I'm a CFP here in NYC. They knew I meant cash FIGURATIVLY not LITERALLY. Whed do you people come from? I wish public assistance would stop giving away free computers and smart phones to those in the projects who have NO education. PS Levon Helm was an ignorant cry baby. Most people in the country are ignorant cry babies .You are a perfect example of that if you suppont any claims by Levon Helm.
@@tonys4396
wow that's alotta cabbage even today
I am a big Ronnie Hawkins fan and also a big fan of the Band. According to Barney Hoskins' book "across the Great Divide, the friction between The rest of the band and Robbie was fueled when Rick received a royalty check from his writing credit for "Wheels on Fire" for
$249,000. That made everyone wonder how much Robbie was making. Robbie also never lived at Big Pink, he lived at Albert Grossman's compound.
Robbie leaving the band was a natural progression in his career. He made the connection with Scorsese with The Last Waltz than collaberated on Raging Bull.
Robbie decided to call it quits to touring, he didn't know that he would go on to work with Scorsese. He just knew he had enough of touring and dealing with 3 heroin addicts (Levon, Richard, Rick), he also had a young family 3 children all under 7 years old. I read Hoskyns book, and like he wrote they ALl made a lot of money. Certainly $250.000 back then was a lot of money, where did that go? Seems to me perhaps Robbie was better at holding on to his money than the other guys. I know from several writings that Levon spend recklessly, and then blamed Robbie when he ran out of money. Rick (and I love Rick) admitted he spend a lot of money on drugs, as did Richard.
Takes two to fight. I’ve never heard or read of Robbie saying one bad thing about Levon, except he was not well. When you’ve got three guys nodding off on heroin, it’s pretty hard to carry a band of 5.
I just watched Once Wereu Brothers, a doc by Robbie on how the Band began.
Robbie released a single I really like called Somewhere Down The Crazy River. He also released an album or two about his Indian roots. He went on to score a lot of movies.
Robbie went to see Levon on his deathbed, and held his hand. Levon had lost consciousness by the time Robbie got there.
The only negative thing I’ve ever heard Robbie say about any of them was when the guys were drunkenly smashing cars, Richard wanted to drive Robbie’s wife’s new car. She went with him, and he smashed the car with her in it. As soon as they heard about the accident, Levon jumped in a car, took off to the accident, and ran into a cop car at the scene.
Another time, after they were getting set to go on tour after Big Pink, Rick smashed a car and broke his neck, so they didn’t tour to support the album.
I’m so tired of hearing commenters hate on Robbie, and say Levon was The Band. They were all members of the Band. It was a band with three lead singers, with many of the songs written by Robbie for the singers’ voices. A lot of the songs were Robbie’s love of the south.
Regarding drinking and drug use, I’ve heard of Levon being so out of it, he couldn’t even sit on his stool at more than one show.
So there’s lots of picking on people if that’s what you’re into.
I just wish we could enjoy their collective genius. The songs were and are great. That’s enough for me.
BTW, Robbie is writing Part 2 of Testimony.
What would Robbie have to say that is negative? They all created beautiful music... one ends up with $50 mil while the others end up literally broke.
@@frankbrower1375Isn't this the way of all songwriters throughout the entire music industry...or any industry. Once you own the copyright it's all yours. Imagine Robby working all night on a beautiful song while the rest of the brothers are out smashing cars and being drunks.... Then comes into the studio and more or less assigns the proper voice that he imagined in his head. In this situation the voice is just a hired gun and is paid an hourly rate, not a lifelong copyright
The WRITER owns the songs and gets royalties for life. The rest of any groups are just paid for each session and each performance. Learn the law you morons.
@@frankbrower1375 Robbie Robertson was worth 50 million US dollars. Levon Helm was worth 12 million. As your Alexa if you're too lazy to look it up. The WRITER gets the royalties. .The rest of the band get paid to play the songs .Period.
It seems like Robbie was bit more shrewd and clever about his financial future. When Levon saw this happening (The Last Waltz) with Robbie tight with Marty and Robbie shown a lot in the movie ... it rubbed Levon the wrong way. That was one of the early problems. But I agree, too much is made of it. They were magical together. It's too bad Robbie and Levon never got things on track.
It's not surprising that in Mr. Robertson's book and countless interviews, he comes out the hero and innocent of any wrongdoing. The same could be said about what Mr' Helm said and wrote before he died, although he did cop to having made mistakes to a greater degree.
That said, I can't say that there is a single piece of music that Mr. Robertson has created since the end of the Band that's ever stuck in my head...
Which is the glory of The Band... "The sum is greater than the parts" Together, they were magic.
You should listen to Somewhere Down the Crazy River
@@raoulhubris no, no you shouldn't.
I love the band now , but I was too young to fully appreciate it in it's hay day
I became a fan in 1987 when he released his self titled album with songs like broken Arrow and fallen angel etc. He had many guest artists on that album including ry cooder.
I was drawn to it as it was a unique and exotic perspective. It's not often you hear of artists that grew up on the 6 nations reserve. (Not in Australia anyway)
In the band Robbie being a native Canadian looked outward and was hooked by the mythology of southern US culture
His talent for weaving stories and images also hooked me the same way.
" Showdown In Big Sky " is a good tune!
I enjoyed this. You have some good insights, especially about the writers' royalties. The Mantle/Martin comparison is illustrative. Unfortunately, the summer did end. As it does for most, but, thankfully, not all, of us.
Simplicity in a classic song is to be admired. It is actually harder to write simply than it is complex and make it work.
What I don't understand is why people expect their favorite band(s) to stay together forever. Some do, the Stones being the first that come to mind, but musicians change and want to do different things. The Band had played together since the early 60's and The Last Waltz was in 1976, so they had a great run and it was time to move on. Does anyone think they could have had the same success playing "roots" music in the 80's? The same with the Beatles--being 70 years old I grew up with and loved them but shed no tears regarding their breakup--they were dialing it in on Abbey Road with drek like "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" and "Octopus's Garden". Both George's (All Things Must Pass) and John 's (Plastic Ono Band) post-Beatle albums were superior to "Let It Be" and "Abbey Road". Let's just be happy that the greatness of The Band and The Beatles existed for as long as it did but let it go and don't obsess over its demise.
Frankly, the Last Waltz will live on as a huge bench-mark event in rock n roll. Besides,the only people debating this history now have no iron in this.
Glad I stumbled across this video. Enjoyed your even handed take.
Levon Helm was the cutest hillbilly ever lol
Great conversation… thank you. I look forward to more, friend. Have a great rest of the summer. RIP to all who have passed on 🌻🥹🕊️
Wow, my favorite TH-camr talking about my favorite band, what a coincidence!
❤ I totally enjoyed hearing some of your stories about The Band - Thank you Signed- The Shoob
A fascinating piece. Thanks. I'm not a musician, I'm a writer. I admire the those lyrics more than I have time to say here.
Can never underestimate the value of lyrics in a great song, even though many tend to overlook them!! Thanks for watching the channel
Guess it all depends on biography you want to believe! They all were all great musicians! Even though Robbie gave them all part of the song proceeds but each wanted to sell there part of the song catalog that he shared with them back to him!! Robbie tried to help them!!
I've wondered about Robbie's (and others in the band) songwriting style. Did he bring them in 100% fully formed? Every chord change, lyric, tempo, solo... completely finished? Or did other band members make sigificant contributions to song arrangements, chord changes, perhaps even lyrics? If they used a more collaborative approach, then you can make an argument that they all should have benefited (not just one person). RIP Robbie.
To the best of my knowledge, Robbie came in with the songs even if he grilled Levon for information about the South for inspiration he was the guy who physically wrote the lyrics. The Band would have certainly contributed to the arrangements no doubt but here's the thing, arrangements are arrangements and songs are songs. The train doesn't really meet in the center unless a songwriter wants to give an arranger songwriting credit but that's up to the songwriter. an arranger can get arranging credit but it doesn't pay very much. This is an age-old argument in which Levon isn't the only person who has ever been upset about it. Ginger Baker has had the same gripe with Jack Bruce but what Ginger provided was some arrangements. Very significant arrangements at that but arrangements nevertheless. He didn't write the songs. It's a slippery slope and probably always will be a point of contention in certain bands. I've heard many musicians complain about it.
Ginger forms the band and they make all of the money. Darn. Re: Sunshine of Your Love. I think it was the producer who disputed Ginger's claim to have come up with the drum part. This is what I think: unless the musicians are hired, all band members should share writing credit. That means Ringo is owed some money. @@dannydine5263
ROBERTSON wrote the songs. HE gets the royalties. PERIOD.
Agreed. Ronnie Hawkins said Robbie wrote the songs. John Simon, producer of the self-titled album said Robbie brought the songs. Levon, who never wrote anything, started a controversy that will forever tarnish Robbie's accomplishment as a songwriter. Levon, his "brother" did this and stuck to it. @@tonys4396
@@tonys4396 Yeah but the real credit is trickier. If you noticed on Wikipedia. Several of their songs don't list a songwriter. It's that old thing that, disagreements over writing credits. The Band is a tough one. Sounds like Robbie had a lot of ideas and the guys made the tunes shine ... particularly the vocals of Richard, Levon and Rick. Garth was a great arranger too.
Wonderful thought provoking insights, thanks.
They say there's a difference between writing a song alone by yourself as opposed to writing it in a communal setting. I'm reminded how George Harrison and Ringo Starr spent hours developing their parts of the Beatles songs but didn't get songwriting credits. And as far as Lennon-McCartney in the early days Lennon had all the big ideas but towards the end McCartney wrote all the big monster hits. The best compensation I ever saw was how The Doors did it. Everybody thinks Jim Morrison wrote all of the Doors biggest hits but instead it was Robbie Krieger their guitarist. But all the songs on the first 3 albums was attributed just to The Doors. Not until The Soft Parade in 1969 did they attribute individual song writing credits. In an interview Robbie Krieger was asked was he disappointed that the song writing credit for Light My Fire is given to the whole band and not just yourself? Robbie answered that he didn't mind just as long as people know that Light My Fire was not written by Jose Feliciano. 🤣😂
Robbie and Garth seemed to avoid the drugs and alcohol that the others really abused. I always believed that Levon felt that he and the others should have gotten publishing rights to the songs. Levon and the rest of the band helped craft the song but did not write them. I know someone else who helped a famous artist do the same thing and he never got any credit. Once he left, the artist was not quite the same. Robbie did say that he visited Levon in the hospital. He stated that he held this hand. So sad.
The other guys got performance royalties for their contributions, which was proper. Three of them sold their performance royalties to Robbie in the late 70’s (Levon refused). They weren’t forced to do so: Rick needed capital for his solo album/tour (not sure why Garth and Richard sold theirs). Sandra Tooze’s excellent biography of Levon explains this process in a well written section.
Insiders like Ronnie Hawkins, John Simon, and Jonathan Taplin have all states that the songwriting credits were properly handled: that Robbie took care of business while the others drugged and spent themselves out of commission.
Look, I love all the guys, but I tend to agree with Ronnie Hawkins that The Band could’ve been huge if not for the addiction issues. Near the end of his life, Rick gave an interview where he estimated spending $100,000 to $200,000 ANNUALLY on drugs.
@@robertbruce6865 Wow, I never saw/heard about that interview. But it doesn't surprise me. I'm sure you've seen that doc on the making of the first two albums. It's painful to watch Rick twitching around in his chair, obviously drug related. And heartbreaking to listen to Richard, who had the greatest voice in rock and roll, and many other styles of music, unable to sing. So sad.
@@donpinger5492 Richard is my all time favorite male vocalist. The Woodstock version of Tears Of Rage moves me every time I hear it.
Then, I listen to Richard’s performances on the 1976 Tour, and my heart breaks. He sounded horrible.
He cleaned up for a bit, then relapsed. We know what happened next. Just heartbreaking. I’ve visited the Cheek To Cheek Lounge in Winter Park, Florida, and the Quality Inn next door where it happened. What a sad, shitty place to die.
Robbie, for all of Levon’s mocking (in his “autobiography”) of his concerns about being on the road for so long, turned out to be correct after all.
@@donpinger5492 Or the famous impromptu Aint No More Cane on the Festival Express tour with Janis, Jerry, and Bob Weir...he was obviously wasted to the gills.
In Sandra Tooze’s biography of Levon (and I highly recommend the book: well written and fair), Jim Weider recounts Rick’s relapse after his forced detox in a Japanese jail in 1997. Weider said that he tried to get Rick to see a doctor, since he was on junk again AND was grossly overweight. He didn’t. Then, he and Elizabeth were evicted and living in a motel when Rick went out on that last set of gigs. I can’t help but wonder how many house payments could’ve been made with the money that was spent on drugs.
I read a comment online where some dum dum blamed the heartache that Danko felt from not getting songwriting credits for killing him. Bullshit. His lifestyle killed him...period.
The Robbie bashing reminds me of the Mike Love bashing. They’re easy targets, and it’s a lazy narrative. I’ve seen numbskulls refer to both as talentless hacks riding on coattails. Robbie is anything BUT talentless, and Love was Brian Wilson’s best collaborator (said Brian himself).
What I don’t understand, in both cases, is the desire to take sides. Why not just enjoy the damned music and appreciate the gifts that these people gave us?
@@robertbruce6865 Yeah, all sad. Robbie saw the writing on the wall. I will definitely get Sandra Tooze's book now. I've read Levon's and Robbie's both twice. And it's amusing how the people on Levon's team claim all sorts of nonsense about Robbie bashing the other guys. I felt he was quite complimentary of them, albeit somewhat truthful about the addictions. I listened to an interview with him recently and he referred to the whole addition thing as something people really didn't know much about, certainly not about dealing with it. They were young, rich, and becoming famous and there were no rules. The Beatles had a manager that essentially micromanaged them. Way different outcomes!
According to Todd Rundgen, Robbie wrote all the songs and pretty much ran the operation. The others had lots of personal problems and didn't work as hard as Robbie.
This argument is ridiculous. They DID have publishing royalties. They sold their share for quick money. Also Levon quit and would have had nothing if Robbie didnt keep it going in his absence.
I did not know they got publishing royalties but cashed them in for quick money- I totally believe it… that’s to show me that I dont know all of this story - no one will- just what we’ve read and heard- so i gotta keep a more open mind- Robbie was no saint- but neither was he the destroyer of careers- I heard him say “I just didn’t want to go on road again w a suitcase of heroin. Richard sat out this huge stadium show cause he ran out - it’s just a big black hole and they all fell in but Robbie- cause he is not suffering from the disease of addiction - Garth either - it’s kind of obvious who has it together and who doesn’t jmho
All true- thanks for setting me straight
Why are Garth and Rick's wife living in poverty? Robbie's KIDS will be rich. That bothers me.
Robbie went immediately to the hospital and held Levon's hand for a good time. He did say that he wrote some songs with one of the other members in mind to sing. He was visionary in many ways.
Robbie said Levon was immensely supportive and inspiring to helpimg him get started and his drumming always was a big part of the music.
be careful, Robbie SAID he went to the hospital immediately etc. In a lot of the interviews I have heard with him a lot of what he says doesn't ring true. Very self agrandising and making out the laid back good guy. that does not align with other peoples stories and views
:@@NigelMinchin If Robbie did visit Levon on his deathbed, I believe Robbie should have kept it as a private matter, not as an opportunity for publicity.
I think part of it was that Levon being the only memberfrom the south and his experiences. He felt like he was kind of an inspiration to Robbie and his writing. I mean how would Robbie being canadian ever really be able to capture that southern mythology without tge inspiration.
I would never had discovered the Band if it wasn’t the presence and talent of Rick & Levon.
No doubt. It was a magical lineup all the way. Thanks for watching the channel
Rick Danko is my hero.
@@susiewatkins1775 definitely great. His voice on It Makes No Difference was so perfect. Thanks for watching the video
Totally ... it was a magical collaboration. Levon, Garth, Danko and Manuel made the songs come alive in a special way. Robbie's song ideas were turned into great classics by the entire group. The evidence is: compare Robbie's solo songs to the tunes in The Band. Compare Robbie's solo work to Levon's solo albums. The difference is night and day. Levon won Grammy's for his solo work. "Electric Dirt" and "Dirt Farmer" are great albums by Levon despite he doesn't do a lot of the writing and does many covers. Levon's voice, playing and production suggestions are priceless.
I love Joan Baez cover of The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down. Not magical and it doesn't make her the songwriter. Beyond the first two records I lose interest. Time to move on just like Robertson. @@MrGreglarry
Thanx for the anecdote about MIckey Mantle. What a shame thathis end was like that. When you put it like that the story of Robbie and Leon ispainfully clear. So sad.
Robbie wrote a lot of the songs and great guitar player . Levon Helm was an arranger and and incredible drummer /singer .Yes the had a feud and drugs played a big role in it .But as the music industry is the one who writes the lyrics owns them and gets paid the most .
When the night was young, is a great Robbie Robinson song I think it’s about him, Reflecting on his days with the band, money doesn’t talk, it’s swears ☘️32
It's "Fanny" also According to Robbie he went to the hospital to see Levon but Levon was already heavily sedated, so he held his hand. They never resolved anything before he passed.
Thanks for the clarification! I seriously always wondered about that and sang it wrong for years, lol. So sad about the final meeting between Robbie and Levon. Just truly heartbreaking
@@davidleinweber : it is false, they had an extended conversation according to Amy Helm
@@christopherhopkins949 Do you know where Amy Helm’s account of this is? In all honesty, I’d love to read about it. Don Imus had stated that Levon was heavily sedated (I think that Sandra Tooze’s biography of Levon said the same thing) and was unconscious...I THINK that Robbie said the same thing in “Once Were Brothers”.
There must have been a reason Levon's daughter called Robbie and told him Levon was dying? Robbie would not have showed up without an invation.
I had watched a few videos with Rick Danko on stage with Ronnie Hawkins on Letterman. Later on at Massey Hall Toronto for Hawkins 60 th birthday concert along with Levon. I also saw Levon in the movie Shooter as an actor.
Juno Hall of Fame awards honouring the Band on youtube, only Levon was a no show, so sad. Even after the performance backstage, Richard Manuals (who had committed suicide earlier) his kids showed up to answer for short interview with the Band members.
Levon's bitterness towards Robbie kept him away from awards ceremonies. He did not attend The Band's induction into The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, even though he had promised his manager Joe Forno Jr., they had arranged a limosine for him, had the members being placed so Levon would have minimal contact with Robbie. Last minute Levon call Forno and said he couldn't make it. Forno was very disappointed and felt betrayed, he was still booking he remainer of The Band for concets, and felt the exposure would be an advantage to them. Levon wouldn't budge even though Forno had his father (both Forno's were Woodstock native's and Forno Sr. was a judge there, and had gotten Levon out of trouble more than ones)whom Levon respected call and plead with him, to no avail.
Robbie may have written it but the Band made it what it is
Kind of like the Grateful Dead. Listen to Robert Hunter sing one of his songs and listen to what the Dead did with them.
Then also compare the Grateful Dead with Jerry and compare it to Furthur or the GD with Trey.
As with any band
Spot on. Levon, Richard and Rick's vocals were amazing. Singing was not Robbie's strong suit.
A band without a creative writer is little more than a cover band.They seldom ever reach the height of fame the Band earned thanks to their original material primarily provided by Robbie.
Robbie said after his thrust to put on the Last Waltz that he was tired of touring, but still wanted to write music and record it rather than touring.
Robbie spent his years churning out movie music as well as reems of Indigenous based music including songs like Down the Crazy River. No one can ever be blamed for wanting to go independant.
He stated in his book that the Band had agreed to continue practicing followingthe Last Waltz, but that none of the others showed up for the next session.
The issue was Publishing rights, and that Robberson had an in with Grossman, and The Lawyers, while Levon wasn't paying attention. It's fairly clear that Robberson wasn't the sole author, but from Dylan he learned about publishing right that likely should have been shared, IMHO.
It’s too bad The Band didn’t have more structured legal arrangements as a group. Ringo didn’t write much for The Beatles, but I’m sure he gets paid handsomely every time there’s a new Beatles re-release. Even Pete Best has received million dollar paydays just for being the drummer on some of the earliest Beatles tracks where he played drums. Maybe part of the problem is that The Band in 1976 wasn’t as famous as it became later. People in 1976 probably didn’t realize how huge some of those songs and film performances would end up being, but the contracts still had long term consequences. Thanks for the input
@@davidleinweber Yep, it seem pretty clear that Robbie and Grossman had.a deal for sole publishing rights, where the composition were actually more of a group effort. At least that's my understanding from both reading and talking to two people who were there. The Doors a a better example of shared publishing although clearly Morrison did most of the lyrics. Anyway, it was sad how Rick, Richard and even Levon had to struggle so long to keep the bankers at bay. Thanks for addressing this!
From what i gathered, Levon didn't think that he got proper credit. The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down was what happened to his ancestors. Robbie wrote the songs from some of Levon's stories, but didn't give him proper credit for them.
Robbie wrote the song, yes from stories after visiting Levon's family, but he also went to the library and did some research.
Levon's dad "inspired" the song, but the song is purely fiction, albeit scrupulously researched.
PS: Still think it was the ship Robert E Lee that Virgil's wife called him to see, back in Tennesee.
It's a song, it is not a thesis on the Civil War. I don't expect songwriter who are trying to rime a song and set to music to be historically acurate. I think Robbie's point was to point out the devastation that a war leaves for both sides, not just the Civil war, but any war.@@thearab59
Robbie hasn't done much since "The Last Waltz"? Please check out a couple of his solo albums, especially. "Robbie Robertson" from 1987 - The album was nominated for a Grammy Award for "Best Rock / Vocal Album", and was certified gold in the United States in 1991. In Canada, Robertson won Album Of The Year, Best Male Vocalist Of The Year and Producer Of The Year at the Juno Award ceremony in 1989.
Thanks for the clarification and FYI
@@davidleinweber It's a fantastic album - give it a listen!! This is one of the best songs of the 80s in my useless opinion LOL th-cam.com/video/OaXJYBHoxuo/w-d-xo.html
Vocalist of the year? That’s ironic.
I’m fortunate to say I saw Levon live before he died. Such a great artist
Definitely
Your right about Robbies songwriting......those are stories that took a lot of research etc......listen to Acadian Driftwood.....true story......also his civil war epic The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down etc........
Levon and ricjard and harth are the influence brother😂😂
Imo levon, and rick, and richard were a trio of strong soloists and toneful voices, that gave the band a nuanced sound, with perfectly crafted song stories from robbies pen, and sublime musicianship.
There is a benefit to bands sharing songwriting royalties. It can prevent some of the money based feuds that happen when one or two members make exponentially more money than the rest of the group. Sometimes players contribute licks or rhythmic ideas that elevate the track but don't technically constitute "songwriting." It would certainly be easy to hold a grudge in those situations if you are struggling while the writer is flush with cash. I loved the Last Waltz although I haven't seen it in at least 20 years. I read somewhere that part of the conflict was about how the film was cut with other members feeling Robbie was featured more prominently than the others. Did Levon mention that in his book? Thanks for the video. Keep rockin man.
Ronnie Hawkins sarcastically quipped: Ya think there should have been more shots of Robbie?
Gotta love the Hawk.
That would be fair only if everyone was putting the same amount of effort.
One or two songwriters are the way most bands are
@@KameaMedia Damn. You beat me to it. That was funny as hell, and yeah the movie seemed to point to Robbie as "the leader". Not entirely true.
Yes , I believe R.E.M have shared songwriting credits and it seemed to be healthy for them economically as well as in their friendships in the band . I believe U2 the same .
Levon has charm. Levon has talent. Levon’s appeal sucks you in like a beautiful woman. But he was a junkie. He wrecked car after car. He blew his money. He made zero business moves. He gave up his royalties for heroine money. Robbie was married with kids. He was writing the Night they Drove Dixie quietly on a piano so as not to wake his family while Levon was shooting heroine and partying. Robbie told a bunch of junkies he was done, and went on with his life. Here’s something NEVER mentioned in this discussion. After Robbie left, those guys were still in their prime. They were all friends with the entire music industry. They knew the Beatles. They knew every musician. Every producer. They had every opportunity to say screw Robbie, let’s prove we are our own songwriters. Let’s prove we can lead ourselves. And they came up with nothing. Clearly they were all talented musicians who were fortunate enough to have a great songwriter in their lives. There are millions of singers and musicians who can perform what has been written. The magic is in the creation. Robbie had the magic. And the work ethic. And the maturity to quit drugs and road women and settle down and become a family man and a businessman. I love Levon like we all do but I don’t feel sorry for junkies. His anger should be at the man in the mirror for being on top of the world and screwing it up with horrible decisions.
Thank You. I wasn't aware of this feud. I recently have done a TH-cam deep dive of the Band and love the music. Thanks for your measured explanation. I don't feel like you are taking sides.
There WAS no “feud”. The word implies two sides, and the only “side” here was Levon. Robbie had no animosity towards Levon.
Yeah “feud” was a bad choice, after seeing more Band documentaries
@@stephenrichard9278 I used to refer to it that way as well, until I realized that there is no reciprocation from Robbie.
I love Levon, but I’m of the opinion that his assertion in the revised Autobiography that Robbie effectively killed Rick Danko was one of the dirtiest lies that I’ve ever read. I only hope that it was Stephen Davis, Levon’s ghostwriter, who wrote that...but the anger behind it sure sounds a lot like Levon. I don’t care how hurt and angry Levon was about Rick’s death...it was an incredibly dirty thing to say.
The sad part is that I have read comments on this thread that bought into this blatant bullshit. Howzabout a little perspective through the form of actual research? Yes, reading is hard and stuff, but then people don’t sound like jackasses afterwards.
Nobody killed Rick Danko but Rick Danko. Period. I love him, but he was his own worst enemy when it came to his multi-decade drug addiction.
I was 14 in 1969. All we cared about was the British Invasion and dismissed most American groups. I had never heard the backstory of the Band. Amazing stuff going back to the late fifties I guess. What Eric Clapton said in one of the documentaries about the Band was very revealing. Thanks for the comments
@@stephenrichard9278 That’s my all time Rock and Roll “what if”: what if Clapton had struck up the nerve during his Woodstock visit in 1968 and asked them if he could join, instead of losing his nerve. One thought is that he joined the 3 in their drug issues, like he actually did in the wake of having been rejected by Pattie Harrison. Another thought is that he’s so inspired by the confidence of being allowed to join that he stays clean in the interest of the group.
thanks for the giving some clarity and context to this sad story. (Look at my lengthly previewing comments below to learn my take on this) You added some great aspects that I never considered: especially about the money.....and how they got paid salaries for a few years.., and then they reform and go back to the road -- without Robbie. And I SO agree. He WROTE and SANG those songs of the first time. And even though the three great voices would never have gotten Robbie to such heights, Robbie gets the writing credits. Money fucks up everything, huh? It's interesting how much we agree and know the same little details that makes this tale so Shakespearian and enduring. And now that Robbie is gone too -- this while thing can come out -- now that there are no more money squabbles, drugs to shoot or nooses to hang from. Robbie said it in the beginning of this new documentary. Something to the effect of "we were SO good we self-destructed."
On another note -- the dreaded "rock star death a day" years are either here or approaching. As we watch all our heroes dance into history, we need to stop for a moment, and marvel that we lived in such a fantastically rich musical era. Kudos all around..... I look forward to more of our videos -- and my posts are not usually endless. It's just really cool to come across somebody who is so interested in the same thing that a lot of people don't even think about. I bet you're a musician too. haha. Peace out.
Yes, as I’ve grown older, I’ve come to realize that certain periods can be extra special in terms of creativity. In music, the late sixties and early seventies were one of those really special times. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and watching.
yes ,,,,,,,I call the 60s and 70s and 90s all Renaissances of sorts. I left the 80s out cause nobody knew what to do next and many bands just withered. But when the 90s again, NOT the mega hits - it felt a bit like re visiting great music again -- thanks
@@davidleinweber
Robbie wrote them but Levon OWNED them...his contribution was impossible with anyone else on earth...
Actually Robbie wrote them with Levon's voice and sound in mind, so of course Levon could just up and run with them.
They all contributed to the success of The Band, I love all of them, but have a soft spot for Robbie and especially Rick. Cannot imagine anyone singing Stage Freight or It makes no difference but Rick.
As a writer, performer and band member... I can see both sides of the coin/argument. I'd have to side w/ Robbie, that unfortunately bands have a shelf-life. Circumstances, creativity and life just happen & change. Like a sports superstar that doesn't know enough to go out on top....Robbie saw that coming and the others didn't. Whether it was drugs, ego or money driven, it created animosity. Very understandable and a hard pill to swallow.....here! On the other side of Life? None of that matters. just Love!
I love that house of the rising sun solo there sir
the doors had a great situation splitting everything up equally regardless of who wrote the song, so that nobody would go broke.
Don’t forget, it was Levon’s band.
Hasn't done much? You are way off here. He put out an eponymous solo album 1987, Storyville, 1991, Music for The Native Americans Review, 1994, Contact from the Underworld of Red Boy, 1998, How to Become Clairvoyant , 2011, Sinematic, 2019, a book Testimony. He was working on a sequel to Testimony. Hopefully he finished it. He also put out a slew of soundtracks. Hadly nothing.
I've always believed it was the movie that caused the split. Levon hated the movie and claimed he and the rest of the Band never received any revenue from the movie. The other stuff (about songwriting royalties and such) came later, and smells strongly of sour grapes. Nobody in 1967 (when they signed with Capitol) had any concept of a band sharing songwriting credits. Their contract was probably written about 1935. We know better now, but nobody thought of it then.
RICK N RICHARD soon saw huge money from bob dylan n the 2 co writes they did..huge money..they knew about song writing $$$$$$.
@@kevinjoseph517 I wish they'd written more. But they didn't.
Robertson co-produced the film, so he had a completely different ( much more rewarding) financial arrangement than the rest of the band from the film’s profits
Very good show bro 💪🎯
From what I've read, the problem dates further back; sometime after Big Pink but before the brown album. Levon said they just didn't have the same enthusiasm, and there were a lot of factors; drugs, mgmt, residuals, etc. The Last Waltz was the climax to a lot of acrimony. Robbie kept jumping in front of the camera throughout. They wanted the band members to come back and reshoot several songs where there were issues. Everyone except Levon went, so what you saw of him on film was all from the actual event.
Great point. Wasn’t he in Evangeline with Emmylou Harris? Was that filmed in a studio?
reshoot several songs..no rerecord out of tune bass etc..read the books n what john simon says..its rerecorded.
@@kevinjoseph517 I've heard the opening song in the Last Waltz- Don't Do It, was totally re-recorded later and what the audience heard that night is not what we heard in the film. Very disappointing to hear that, in lieu of the Band's decision not to appear in the Woodstock film when they heard C,S & N re-recorded their numbers for the movie.
Robbie didn't quit the band. He didn't want the band to stop after the Last Waltz. He just wanted to stop touring. He really really didn't want to go on the road anymore. He even said to the other guys in 1983 when they reformed: "you guys can use the name The Band no problem. Absolutely. Of course. And if you want to go into the studio and make a beautiful record, I'd be happy to be a part of it, but I'm not going on the road."
Sort of sad all the way around. I saw The Band around 84 or so without Robbie and it was still great but it always felt incomplete without him.
I didn't know that . Thanks for sharing that .
It's hard to get a full grasp on. Obviously the other guys were hurting for money. Robbie getting the enormous bulk of residuals didn't help them become closer.
@@MrGreglarry if Robbie kept recording with them but didn't tour , I can't help but wonder what their concert attendance would've been without him .
@@paulgerkin2851 That's interesting. Levon, Rick and Richard worked wonders with Robbie's songs. I've heard The Band lineup that played in the 1980s without Robbie and they were very good. They played some big shows. But they didn't reach the level they had with Robbie in it.
Good video. I appreciate your balanced view towards the issue.
As a quick primer, here's how the publishing business works: songs are basically lyrics and music. Say you write the lyrics of a particular song, but your guitarist writes the music for that song. And say the song earns $1000 in publishing. Typically you would make $500 for the lyrics, the guitarist would make $500 for the music, if you set it up that way.
The drummer, bassist, etc., who played on the track makes ZERO money from publishing. Why? Because they didn't write the lyrics or the music in this scenario. They PERFORMED on the RECORDING of the song, but they didn't WRITE any part of the song. Publishing only cares about who WRITES songs, not who performs on particular recordings. This is a CRITICAL distinction that most people (even musicians with major label record deals) don't understand.
This is different than the RECORDING business. With recording (especially in the 60's and 70's), record companies would pay an advance to the artist/band to make a record. The artist would pay for all expenses of the recording from this advance. The record company would pay themselves BACK for the advance. If the record sells really well, the artist MIGHT make something off the sale of the record, depending on their contract. If the record didn't sell enough copies to cover the expenses, they would make another record, and the debt from the last album would be tacked on to the next record. This is why artists with low record sales eventually get dropped from the label. Record companies eventually cut their losses.
Touring and merchandise sales is traditionally where the musicians would make their money. So if a band stops touring, the musicians who aren't getting paid from royalty payments or record sales are basically unemployed.
So in the case of The Band, Robbie Robertson was likely making 100% of the royalties, since he wrote both the music and the lyrics of the songs that got played on the radio. The rest of the band counted on touring to make money. When Robbie ended The Band, they were unemployed...and they had no hope of getting money from publishing. It' understandable that Levon would be bitter, but that's just how the music business worked (at least in the 60's & 70's). Things have changed somewhat since streaming came along, but overall, it's a very tough business.
It's NOT understandable that Levon Helm was bitter. He was a cry baby PRICK who KNEW how it worked. Robbie paid the other members a FORTUNE over what he had to legally. Go ask your Alexa the followig "How much is Levon Helm Worth" Alexa will say Levon Helm was worth 20 million dollars at the time of his death. Robbie was worth 50 million whe he died .What the HELL is Levon crying about. HE DID"T WRITE THE SONGS and Robbie paid hin a FORTUNE, .Hekm was a PRICK cry baby.
Robbie didn't really pursue a movie career, after starring in Carny, he only was in one other movie, he said he didn't care for acting, he was use to initiating things, not being told what to do. Levon was the one that ended up in several movies, well known ones, and well received, such as "A coal miner's daugher", and "The Right Stuff", plus several others. Levon said in an interview he thought acting was pretty easy, he liked being told what to say, how to dress, and someone combing your hair.
The Last Waltz is a big reason why The Band is still talked about at all. Levon doesn’t seem to understand that he benefited from TLW in the long run.
no
My take is he's well aware that The Last Waltz made Robbie Robertson a great deal of wealth, while the rest where hung out to dry. I'd be bitter too.
Robertson took all the royalties from TLW and the other band members were cheated out of everything.
@@rocker53zero according to a drug addict with a history of blaming everybody else for his problems
There's definitely a line drawn between who wanted to keep doing what they were doing and those who had enough.
Robertson went on to do different things, after 16 years he wanted new challenges
But his song writing nose dived.
Springsteen has an interesting comment in his book on internal band rivalries/issues. His policy was he was in charge. He distributed the money, he approved the gigs, etc. At the time I thought that was pretty harsh/selfish, but now I understand better his logic. If there is a clear direction, that's the way it is. Clearly the rest of group can do what they want individually and have the freedom to go with his direction or not. Notice the E street periodically re-unite, then Springsteen on his own, then back again. That seem healthier to me than "staying together" forever. Of course, a few millions split among the guys over the years also helps to smooth any ruffled feathers !😎
I just watched the Robertson/The Band documentary he voices and during the Last Waltz portion he keeps referring to 'we' when talking about all of the decisions made about how the concert would be done as though the other members were active in these decisions.
From Helm's view, the other members didn't want to do a farewell concert and when it came to the details of said concert, they had no involvement. That it was all Robby.
To be fair Robertson wanted them to take a break because of the amount of heroine use by Levon, Rick and Richard on their last tour. The concert, he said was supposed to be a break only, not the end. Robertson said the others never really wanted to get back in the studio again and he didn't want to just tour as a revue act but actually make new music.
He saw that they were all still partying and Robby wasn't really a partier. He also didn't want to pen all the songs like he felt he had to on Stage Fright because the others were so jacked up on 'H' that they didn't participate in song writing anymore.
The heroin use, was not just on the last tour, it went on for some time. The Last Waltz was Robbie's idea, and he was always the one during the ground work, meeting with different people, organizing taking charge. Robbie was done touring, he felt he was pushing his luck, he was also married with 3 young children he wanted to spend more time with. Robbie was a partier, by his own admission, he was no angel, did drugs, but not heroin. Even as he was partying and doing drugs, he was still, what Barney Hoskyns wrote in his biography "Mr. Responsible". he would be up in the morning writing songs, while they others were still sleeping.
Excellent perspectives
Thanks
What's the instrumental you're performing at the end?
Hi, thanks for watching. It's just a little medley of "fifties chord progression" tunes I tossed into a nice fifties backing track by Now You Shred. It's Silhouettes on the Shade, Blue Moon, and a touch of Earth Angel!
Levon Helms the best
having read both books I found it interesting that Levon's was written many years ago while Robbie's was written fairly recently, I believe after Levon had passed. I loved Levon's book and it struck me that Robbie's was almost a note by note answer to what Levon charges in his book. Robbie makes a point of telling how each of the Band members signed their share of the publishing rights to the songs over to him because they needed the money. there is also some insinuation that Levon's commitment to the band came into question as early as 1966 when Levon abandoned them during the Dylan tour + Robbie makes the point that The Last Waltz was not supposed to be the end of The Band but the end of them touring - but that after the concert the rest of them stopped turning up. How like life = Rashomon
Thanks for the great details
To me Robbies book was his way of finally saying that Levon and everybody else has had their say now it's my turn to tell you what happened.
Interesting. I’ve not read Robbie’s book. When did they rest of the band sign away their share of publishing rights?
Is that sort of admitting their role in writing the songs was greater than ppl assume since Robertson takes full credit?
I think Robbie deserves the money for writing the songs. This reminds me of queen. Freddie insisted on whoever wrote the song gets the credit. But after he was terminal he said time is short, let’s call all future songs Queen songs.
What you miss is:they initially said was we all work on these songs.Rob got his name on the titles.The other guys were shocked.Lee said Rob was walking around with the other guys money in his pocket.In Nashville if you’re in the room when it’s written you get on the credit.The example Rob had;Life is a Carnival,That’s all.Richard said”two bits a shot,”the 2nd line.Rick gets credit w/Bob Dylan,Richard too.Tears of Rage,This wheels on fire…Bob developed the head session,get your song sketches,Get some talent get em high,they finish your arrangements.Grossman>Bobbie>Rob.
Rob’d get song credit/The other guys would get this club in Bearsville…There was no big return in a bar in Bearsville!
Just wrong in all sense. Royalties are split 50/50 between recorded performance and songwriting. Performance includes contributing an amazing vocals and musicianship. Songwriting, which is a legal term, is the creator of the lyrics and melody. Before releasing each album the Band had to sign off on the credits. The contention was raised years after Robertson left the band. Some songwriters are willing to give up solo credit to keep the peace. Most do not. It's just hard to swallow getting only 1/5th of 50% while the songwriter gets that share as well as the entire other half. Life is hard.
@@Blablashutupnow Robbie got rich and started believing his own bullshit. He wrote many songs that were meant to represent Levon's life, background, and history. He even incorporated people from Levon's life into them. That shows great respect and reverence, but when money was factored in, that all went out the window. And there were 4 drug addicts in The Band, not 3. Robbie just had a different drug of choice, which probably contributed to his megalomania.
Some good thoughts. I think these sorts of fuzzy ideas about who actually wrote songs that end up on albums is one reason Nashville is so tightly closed these days. Too many lawyers. Lawyers can ruin Happy Birthday if they get involved. Thanks for watching the channel!
@@Blablashutupnow Robbie wrote the songs. The other guys just helped arrange. Not the same thing.
Ok, maybe they were shocked after the first record but what about all the others
I've read a couple of books by the band and have seen several interviews over the years. What went on as far as song writing goes is a grey area. I love all the guys in the Band but coming up with a part or helping arrange a song is not composing the song. Legally you can only copyright lyrics and melody. This was a sticking point with Levon. I don't believe he ever wrote any material on the Band albums. Robertson got tired of trying to get these guys together and record the more their addictions got out of hand. He was also sick of the road. Rick Richard and Levon did piss away alot of their touring revenue in the 70's and reformed as a financial move in the early 80s. One could make a strong case that Robbie did write their classic's because the albums that they did after the reformed were not any good and contained mostly material written by other writers or cover tunes.
strawberry wine and maybe 1-2 others.
@@kevinjoseph517 Strawberry Wine and Life Is A Carnival. I can’t remember offhand if he wrote Jemima Surrender. But that was pretty much it. I think that he got a co-writing credit for the song Islands.
My counter to those who read his book and accept the allegations as gospel is this: if he was such a prolific songwriter whose contributions were “stolen” by Robbie, then why weren’t the last 3 Band albums and his last two solo albums (not to mention his earlier solo stuff) laden with Levon Helm-written songs...when Robbie wasn’t there to “steal” the credits?
It’s bullshit. That’s why. I love the guy, but facts are facts.
His contention was that the process of having credits “stolen” was the reason that he stopped contributing...but that doesn’t hold water AFTER The Band reformed.
My theory, along with some unknown named Ronald Cornett Hawkins, is that drug use by Rick, Richard, and Levon stymied the creative process and led directly to the quality going downhill after Stage Fright...which was, not so coincidentally, about the same time that the drugs became problematic.
If any credit was stolen, it was from Robbie. I don't think he got the credit he deserved. @@robertbruce6865
Robbie's song writing carried the Band into greatness. I don't know there agreement so can't comment but I hope Robbie did right by his band mates. Looks a little slippery. Robbie new he had a great singer for his songs and wrote for Levon and counted on Levon taking his songs into greatness. Love Robbie but think he could have done more for his band mates.
There was a time when I believed that Levon was 100% the victim in the situation, and his accounts of the history were infallible. Now, in the same way that you imply, I can see both sides, and I wish Levon would not have died angry. Robbie was no saint; he loved the powder, and others in the group had their habits as well. But through the years I have seen where he was coming from, wanting to get out of the road lifestyle.
Robbie has released several awesome albums which had appearances by Garth and Rick.
I liked both Levon & Robbie but I side with Robbie on this. He had every right to live his life like he wanted to live it not live it how Levon wanted him to live it. You don't get to live other people's lives for them. That's not fair. BTW I actually liked Robbie's singing. I loved his album Showdown at Big Sky. Thanks for the great program. I enjoyed it.
You are right. Robbie's son wrote on Robbie's Facebook page on Robbie' s 75 birthday, how glad he was that Robbie stopped touring and was a very hands on father, making him breakfast before taking him to little legue games.
With the who as well. Townsend was living in a nice house while Roger Daltrey was living in a car for a long time.
A Band without any problems just doesn't happen, especially great bands where you need that driving force to carry on. They started out knowing they had something and hung on till that Last Waltz.
OMG, 4 minutes of comments stretched out to over 30 minutes.
The rest of the band also arranged Robbie's songs. I kinda' think they deserved at least a partial writing credit for that, but who knows how that works in publishing.
except I don't think I've ever heard Robbie Robertson EVER badmouth levon or any other member, so its a bit of a one sided feud. Sort of like Pink Floyd. Feuds can go one way.
I love The Band, but I also feel for Robbie a little bit. In my own band, I was the only businessman, making contacts, maintaining them, and making sure we had good press. I wrote most of the songs and kept the live show together. The other guys were great, but they mostly just played the gig, they never saw all the stuff I was doing behind the scenes.
When you suddenly have success, and the rest of the band is on drugs, or dropping out because of shit, or suddenly making lots of special requests, you don't really feel appreciated.
But I also have to say, as far as the songs are concerned, we had a clear Gema deal. Even with my songs, we have shared the Gema distributions. Because that's how a band does it, in my opinion. I never understood why, for example, the Beatles split their rights between Lennon/McCartny. When you live together for years, experience everything together, you share. Everything.
No way do you share everything! If I'm on my own writing a song that is personal to me and then show it to the others and they put down there parts there's no way I would give them credit! There doing what a band does, do session musicians get credit?
“Share”. That’s a word that ends up meaning that the same person usually ends up doing all the heavy lifting.
Contracts can be written to accommodate the disparity in effort; Pareto’s Law might have guided…80% to the writer, 20% to the band, - divided and assigned to each individual band member active at the time of registering the copyright (including the song writer, band member proportion) Not equal but maybe fair’er’
@@tkoots5894 They all did get 20 percent of the publishing rights, all but Levon willingly sold their share to Robbie.
I been to sobchoppy fla. Florida pan handle cool place gulf of Mexico
Thank you! What is the name of the song you play in the end?
Now I hear: "Blue Moon" ⭐ Lovely!
@@davidleinweber
Aha, thanks! 🙏 Can you lay out just the music?
@@davidleinweber Yes, upload
It’s Silhouettes on the Shade. Thanks
Wow. Robbie Robertson didn't just retire into a cave after filming The Last Waltz in 1978. He did five solo albums and he sang on them all. In 1987, he released his first solo album, Robbie Robertson,which included a beautiful song Fallen Angel in memory of Richard Manuel who had died by suicide while touring with the remaining members of The Band in 1986. Robertson produced multiple film soundtracks over the years and worked closely with Martin Scorsese. He also produced and starred in the film Carny with Jodie Foster and Gary Busey. Robbie Robertson had been quite busy after The Last Waltz.
Robbie Robertson has said he considered Levon Helm like a brother, along with the other members of The Band, from their early days and wasn't bothered by Levon's complaints in his biography and still even spoke occasionally with Levon. Robertson went to visit Levon Helm when he was dying in the hospital.
Levon Helm and Robbie Robertson were two very multi-talented artists.
Saw Carney the other night. Jodie Foster was great in it! Robbie was perfect for his role.
He's writing a second book chronicling his life after the Last Waltz......he's been very busy
Robertson made it look like he wanted to get away from the rocker lifestyle in the "Last Waltz" but right after that movie came out, he and Scorsese bought a house and did Cocaine/hookers 24/7. Danko and Manuel had the biggest problems with drugs/alcohol but they sobered up in the 1980's.
They needed money in the 1980's but Robertson refused to join back in the Band and I think that is what pissed Helm off the most (Manuel would commit suicide right after). As good as Robertson's songs where, they wouldn't have been so good without the rest of the Band and he needed to give them some more love back to them when they need it.
Never heard that before about robbie and Scorsese getting the house and partaking in the coke n women. Is that in his book? To me, it does appear robbie is noticeably on coke along with Levon.
Compare a Pete Townsend demo to a finished WHO song and I think you've got a comparable situation. Pete and Robbie were songwriters surrounded by incredible musicians with great chemistry. What that song turns into doesn't change writing credits. I can't think of one Bob Dylan song covered by another artist that wasn't enhanced in a good way, but you still got to pay the writer.
Roger had sense enough not to have claimed songwriting credit just because he took the song and sang it. The band members must have made a lot of money and wanted a share of royalties too. The issue has caused a lot of trouble for bands. The money.
Thanks for sharing that. Levon clearly things Robbie claimed things that were not his or should have been shared with him or the others.
Ronnie Hawkins has said Robbie wrote songs. John Simon, who produced Music from Big Pink and the self-titled album says Robbie brought the songs. Levon never wrote anything. The songwriter gets the royalties. That's how it works. @@MrGreglarry
@@TRamone01 I don't dispute the songwriter getting royalties. Levon's claim, not mine, is that Robbie claimed things that he shouldn't have. He said him - and Rick, Garth, Richard - were not given certain credits and opportunities to share in songwriting and other monetary deals that Robbie staked claim to.
Robbie writes some incredible songs and has to defend himself against taking credit he was not entitled to. It's a shame. @@MrGreglarry
Nice guitar playing !
Thanks!!
People...there are 2 sides to this story,and I firmly believe that the truth of the matter lies somewhere in the middle. Also? Robbie simply didn't want to be in The Band any longer,and the other members never spoke badly of Robbie-only Levon. Also? The rest of the Band DID share in the song writing royalties...Robbie bought them out and they gave those royalties up of their own free will...nobody stole a damn thing from them.My take on it is that Levon seemed to think that Robbie Robertson owed him a living.And yes,I own and have read both Levons and Robbie's respective memoirs.Would the The Band have been who they were minus any one of those tremendously talented men? I think not. But the vitriol from Levon seems like a load of sour grapes,much of the time. That being said,though... LOVE The Band-ALLof them.
Really appreciate your adding some good details and perspective to the conversation. The Band definitely wouldn’t have been the same minus any one of those guys. Thanks for watching the channel
Robbie Robertson did an incredible amount after the Last Waltz. He scored nearly every Martin Scorsese movie, he did the recent documentary about the band. He acted in two movies.
He also released five or six solo albums.
I really appreciate your comments, details and clarifications! I’m always glad when people add details to the comments. I’m sure there are tons of people who know more about the personal and business dealings of the Band, though I love their music as much as anyone. I do stand by my main points that great players who played a vital role in making timeless music should have better long-term arrangements. Most of all, I hope my main point that really creative and inspiring songwriters are under appreciated sometimes, including by other musicians who play their songs. It’s really a special gift to write such catchy, evocative tunes. Some of the ones that sound so simple are actually the most special of all!!! Thanks so much for watching the channel
But he never wrote the kind of songs he did with The Band.
@@MrGreglarry obviously....he did not really understand the sound of the south, of the Delta, of Arkansas.
@@robbiedees224 That probably had a lot to do with it. His solo stuff was slick ... but it didn't have that rich sound of the south that Levon brought or the amazing vocal of Richard Emmanuel and Danko's harmony. Emmanuel was also a good songwriter. He wrote most of the tunes on the first album.
Robbie Robertson did not want to tour anymore, the others did.
If Levon contributed so much to the writing aspect of the Band songs, why were his solo projects devoid of 'by Levon Helm' song credits? Sadly Levon didn't show for 1989 Canadian Music Hall of Fame and 1994 Rock N Roll Hall ceremonies. He took his anger to the grave. Now only Garth is with us as of 2023.
John Simon & the late Sally Grossman, very much a part of The Band's inner circle, did not believe that Robbie Robertson ripped off Levon Helm or anyone else. Robbie came in with written material that he'd composed & for which he correctly received credit. On the occasions that Robbie came in with a fragment of an idea & the others contributed, such as "Life Is A Carnival", the credit was shared between them. Too many of the comments here are ridiculous blatherings by people who have no idea how publishing and royalties work.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
How true, it's funny when people claim Robbie took all the credit. There's many songs he gave writing credits to others.
@@donpinger5492 There's an odd "Levon vs Robbie" mindset among a number of Band fans. Levon's book likely accounts for most of it. The last third of Barney Hoskyns biography of The Band is also very anti-Robbie, & that likely dovetails with Levon's publicly expressed anger, bitterness, & false claims of theft. Levon was a very angry guy. He became enraged at The Band's road manager when he tried to wake Levon up to tell him it was time to pack and catch a plane to the next gig. From Levon's point of view, an "employee" was telling him what to do. Well, that was the guy's job, why do you have to bite his nose off because he's doing the job you hired him for? That gives you an idea of Levon's skewed perspective. Robbie certainly didn't rip anyone off. Band producer John Simon mentions this in his memoir Truth Lies & Hearsay. These grossly misinformed Band fans raving about Robbie being "a thief" really have to get a clue, or they'll end up voting for MAGA candidates!
@@ericmalone3213 I heard on some other thread a while back that Levon was so pissed about the Robbie thing that he refused to play any of the songs Robbie wrote in concert. And I told the poster that that was a bunch of BS. I'd seen him twice after the LW and he played all the best of the Band. Bitch all he could but he actually had no problem making a second career playing Robbie's songs. And Robbie, the "Thief and Liar" never said a word about it. Basically gave the boys his blessings and even allowed them to carry on using the Band name, which he probably could have contested, if he actually was a thief and a liar.
@@donpinger5492 My hunch is, quite a lot of Band fans don't really want to consider how completely fucked up Levon, Rick & Richard were, & how much of a small or larger fortune they spent on the Devil's Dandruff when they could have been taking care of business & looking after their financial interests. Levon had a period of years where he was considerably affected by heroin & barbituate use. Robbie was always taking care of business, & didn't get his nose too deeply into the Columbian Marching Powder until after The Band broke up, when he was hanging out & then living with Martin Scorsese. I've never heard any evidence as to what exactly Robbie supposedly lied about or stole. I have heard evidence, for example, as to David Byrne taking credit for contributions Chris Franz, Tina Weymouth & Jerry Harrison made to Talking Heads music (oddly enough, Byrne sued them when they released an album as The Heads). Band fans tend to have this idyllic fantasy of brothers-in-arms harmonizing together in Big Pink, & don't especially want to reflect on the effects heavy use of substances had on the group dynamics & the music. Nor do they seem to want to understand the machinations of how music publishing works, they prefer to drink the Levon-Demonizing-Robbie kool-aid.
It would not have been The Band without Levon! The real Southerner!!
@kevinstimelsky - yes and Levon had all the stories that became the songs!!
@@jrh11254 So did the library, where Robbie went to learn about the Civil War. But, yeah, I agree, Robbie was amazed by the south, by everything about it, good and bad, and without Levon, whom he adored, he probably couldn’t have sort of soaked it in as well as he did.
Since Robbie died, I’ve gone down the Band rabbit hole. I came across a video of Robbie talking about a conversation he had with Levon, after Levon’s book ( which was written by a ghostwriter) came out. Levon took this hate toward Robbie public in his book, which was written, what, a decade after Robbie left? Robbie said when he confronted Levon, Levon said he didn’t write that much of the book. He said he was really angry about some things in his book, and wasn’t about others.
Robbie mentioned, and I’ve heard him mention this more than once, that Levon had a demon inside him, and vindictive streak that was eating him up. He aimed it at different people and situations over his lifetime. I’ve known folks like that, haunted by something that comes out like poison. It’s a shame. Some people, like Roger Waters, are able to put that poison to good use. Some can’t, or don’t.
I haven’t read Levon’s book, so Idon’t know if he mentioned Dylan wanted to hire only Robbie, and Robbie said no, he came with the band, and talked Dylan into hiring them all.
I can understand A guy getting finished with the road. Once you lose your nerve for something, you have to get out.
But making records without touring? I don’t know about that. Seems these days the touring is the only thing that makes anyone money. The corporations grab the rest. Seems to me, there should be a better basic contract drawn up by the union, where everyone involved in not just writing, but arranging and contributing to it in any way should get a good chunk of money.
As a Canadian I couldn't agree more!!!
No one can ever convince me that Robbie wrote everything. All the band's songs were Levon''s stories. He even cheated his band mates out of all royalties to The Last Waltz.. I Robbie got his 30 pieces of silver.
What does Levon being a Southeren have to do with the Band and their success. Garth was a genius on many instruments, Rick was a penetrating soulful singer, who could also play guitar and violin, Richard was a very soulful singer and played piano and drums, the were all Canadians as was Robbie. Not underestimating Levon's contribution, he was as talented as Rick and the others, but they all complimented eachother.
Interesting and informative. I really LOVED to hear LH sing.
However your comment, "you can't play music until your eighty". Please don't tell the Stones that, they are definitely trying.
Bob Dylan is 82 and still making great music.
Robbie learned music on 6 Nations Reservation as well as the storytelling aspect you spoke about, from the elders. As well as his love of movies and taking inspiration from many of them.
So your right on track with that aspect of his story.
Robbie looked into the acoustic guitar he was playing and saw "Nazareth" inside which inspired him to write "we pulled into Nazareth......" and on it went from there! Cool 😎
Its very sad that money issues and greed torn apart a Legendary group like The Band. I can’t say for sure if Robbie Robertson truly wrote all of the songs or if it was a collaborative effort and he snaked the other members out of publishing credits. The music business is not known for being honest or having integrity . RIP Levon,Rick and Garth.
Yes, I think America might be one of the only countries where players who play on recordings don’t get any residuals. It’s all set up for the benefit of record companies
Drugs tore The Band apart, not greed. Some unknown named Ronnie Hawkins made this exact point when he said (a quote from Sandra Tooze’s excellent biography of Levon) that he thought that they could’ve been the biggest band around had it not been for drugs. I’ll take his word for it. He also said that Heroin changed Levon’s personality to a significant degree; he believed that the addiction intensified the inner anger and distrust.
The other guys all were given performers royalties, which 3 of them sold to Robbie in the late 70’s. They were estimated to bring in roughly $100,000 annually to each. I think of Danko’s admission that he spent $100,000 to $200,000 ANNUALLY on drugs, then think of him losing his home just before he died...and wonder what might have been. Garth declared bankruptcy 3 times. Robbie didn’t steal the performance royalties. He made an offer, and 3 of them took him up on it.
@@robertbruce6865 100,000$ a year for 3 years after The Last Waltz is shit money. 100,000$ after taxes,attorneys10% fees,agent fees 10-15% compared to the film and albums grosse sales is an insult. I understand why Levon had the Last Waktz movie poster in his office with giant “fuck” painted on it. The record companies learned a long time ago to rip musicians off. Drugs and addiction issues certainly made things tenuous for The Band and lots of non famous people around the world. They were happy when they were young broke and making the incredible music that’s will resonate for many many years to come, the music “business” part left the members sour on how things ended.
@@mattryan6886 No, no. Their performance royalties for their records were estimated to be $100,000 annually, not their royalties for The Last Waltz. I actually don’t think that they made anything off of The Last Waltz, which I agree is a crying shame. I have no issue with Levon’s anger on that score. I have an issue with Levon’s anger regarding songwriting credits, which is another story.
Plus, while I love Levon, I’m quite disgusted by his allegation that Robbie “killed” Rick with the songwriting credit issue. That was a low blow, even for Levon, and patently absurd: Rick admitted to spending $100,000 to $200,000 annually on drugs. Chances are that he and Elizabeth aren’t evicted from their home had he spent a fraction of that on house payments.
@@mattryan6886When the suits got involved, Levon called it "getting pencil-whipped"...how appropriate.
BTW
Robbie has a great solo career...
The feud was about *Money* ...
In the music business there is essentially two types of royalties:
Publishing royalties
And
Performance royalties.
Musicians don't get paid for publishing royalties unless they're the author of the music.
So, imagine you're anyone in the band, you hear your performance on the radio all the time, but you are broke.
😳😧🤪
As fans, we must remember the music, more than the artists. If I'm not mistaken, The Last Waltz was the beginning of the last tour, so it's not like that was the last show. I saw The Band open for CSN in 83 or so, and they were good then too without Robbie. Junkies suck, they only have one aim in life and it is to use before cold turkey hits. Family, friends, emotions, morals go out the window. Robbie used, but not "H". There is not grace in that accept at least it's not "junkie". Drummers and singers in Rock and country and pop are arrangers but not publishers.
If you put all the stories together one thing that stands out is Robbie’s exposure to the corruption in the New York recording industry. Because he was a song writer from the get go, Ronnie Hawkins took him to NY to get an education. I think he was pretty cautious about getting ripped off and controlled his drug and alcohol use.
I think part of the issue was that the songs Robbie wrote were the stories and views that Levon relayed to him and he put them down on paper.
You have a great point. It’s good to be inspired. But if you think about it, somebody has to actually write the song - first verse, chorus, riff goes here, here’s the ending, etc. No matter how inspired you feel or how great you play, someone still has to do the grunt work of actually writing a complete song. It ain’t as easy or as glamorous as some might suppose! After that, the band definitely puts their feel, style and touches to it, but that’s not the same as actually writing a song. It’s a strange issue, but sort of an important one. Thanks for watching the channel!
This idea that Levon deserves songwriting credit because some of Robbie's songs were inspired by Levon's world in Arkansas is oft repeated and illogical . If someone writes a song about elephants, the elephants aren't entitled to songwriting credit.
Very nice guitar 🤙
thanks
'glad you mentioned Townshend & Daltrey. 'It Makes No Difference' if you keep touring like they did and Roger could keep earning money. Robbie did what was good for Robbie and it's true, just like Graham Nash, he had to deal with hard drug addicts in the band not contributing as they used to and difficult to deal with. You also think about Brian Jones vs Mick & Keith, whom wrote songs. thx
Yes, the Brian Jones reference is an another great example.