Good video. With many translations available, indeed a critical analysis of the Qur'an may be done without knowing Arabic. This is similarly done in critical analysis of the Bible. However, knowledge of Greek and Aramaic is helpful in deciphering words when examining historical copies of the text. For practical purposes of interpretation, having several professional translations at hand does the job 99.995% of the time.
Even as someone who speaks Arabic myself, its still hard to understand these words, and they all have different historic meaning to modern day Arabic. Thats why we also study how to read the Quran in school because knowing Arabic is not enough.
From my experience google translation made more accurate translations than CHATgpt, because Ai takes into account the translations that were already made by scholars.. However google translates, uses neutral translation word for word..
Muslims call me shameless hater but do not say a single word to the verse that commands the execution of apostates. This religion would not have survived if their book was not threating people constantly with hellfire, and if there was no apostasy law. Combine this with 1400+ years and you get the picture of middle eastern world
Part of the point of obeying Allah is in fearing His punishment, and this isn't exclusive to Islam nor is it problematic for a rational person. People who do evil will be punished, it is that simple. Those who don't want to be punished, do not do evil. Simple. As for hudood, it is part of Islam and no one denies it. The problem I see with this reasoning is it misses the point. The Hudood can only be judged right or wrong if Islam is right or wrong, so if we believe in Islam then we see no issue with it because we know it is from Allah. So what is more important is for a person to investigate the truthfulness of the prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم to ascertain whether his religion was true rather than being upset about aspects of his religion you disagree with.
I'm positive the verse "do not take christians and jews as friends" is not hateful. Muslims define the double standarts and they believe their taqiyya works on everyone.
so let us be clear your whole argument is centered at the word فا we can use فا in many diffrent ways just like فا كانا هناك ولد يلعب "There was a boy playing" not "then" to be seen. فا in conclusion can also mean in the same time
@oregonpath8756 the quran is bs. Im an arab ex muslim. Allah hadnt any better options than making the fate of humanity in the hands of a nomidian man lived between sand hills. Like fr it could have been better if he 'sent' his last messenger now with the internet and phones. Wake up. There is no god that contacted the human with a book
@@oregonpath8756 It's crap dude, just look at the book. It says nothing like the Fatihah has been revealed before and yet it's the exact same as the Lord's prayer in its subject and formatting.
@@INDIA-ep6qn Some of the things in Islam are consistent with previous revelation, and some of it abrogates previous revelation, so it is not surprising or problematic if al Fatihah is similar to the Lord's prayer they recite in Christianity
Lol this is such a lousy and weak attempt. The Quran is so fortified and protected that even if you learn Arabic you can’t just get a good understanding of the Quran. Rather, the reason why the tenants of Islam have remained preserved and unchanged for 1400 years is because whenever we want to understand the Quran, we correspond it with the Sunnah (Hadiths) and the understanding of the Salaf (the companions of the Prophet ﷺ). This gives us a complete understanding of the verse at hand. Anyone who has studied basic Tafsir would know that the highest rank of Tafsir is when a verse of the Quran explains another verse, next - when a Hadith explains a verse, then - when a scholar from the Salaf explains a verse, finally - the Arabic language. Not only are you entirely misinformed about the Islamic tradition - you are leading other Christians astray from trying to be decently level headed in seeking the genuine truth
Your entire argument boiled down to: 1. Even learning Arabic is not enough to understand the Quran. 2. There are a special group of human beings who explained Gods guidance and we need to listen to them. The Quran asks those who followed their forefathers guidance: "Even when they were misguided?" The Quran says that Prophet Ibrahim's father and people were in manifest error for following their ancestors. The Quran mentions Pharoah asking Prophet Moses: "What of our learned ancestors?" to which Moses dismissed: "Their record is with my Lord and my Lord does not forget, nor does he make mistakes"
@@INDIA-ep6qn no anyone can get a good understanding of it if they tried. The part about the Quran being “Mubeen” is about the Quran itself - as for human beings then it’s up to them to use this Quran and learn it. So the fault is on the user not the Quran
@@frostpitt you have unfortunately drawn a false analogy. When I said that there is a special group of human beings - the intention here is that these very select human beings are necessarily given authority to explain the Quran becuase the Quran itself gives them this authority: “**As for the foremost-the first of the Emigrants and the Helpers** and those who follow them in goodness, Allah is pleased with them and they are pleased with Him” (9:100) “And whoever defies the Messenger after guidance has become clear to them and follows a path **other than that of the believers**, We will let them pursue what they have chosen, then burn them in Hell-what an evil end!” (4:115) The issue with following any other human is exactly as you said. As for the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ and his companions - it is necessary for every Muslim to follow them, as they were the very people that the Quran was revealed upon
@@CourtOfKnowledge I think you come to this conclusion because you probably think every verse from the Quran is from God. I dont. The very next verse after 4:116 states God will not forgive those who make a partner with Him yet there are verses in the Quran like Obey Allah and Obey the Messenger and others like 4:115 which confuse the matter. No one alive today can confirm or attest that the Quran we have today is the same that was revealed to Prophet Muhammad. Everything they say about the matter is from 2nd hand or 10th hand opinions from more than a thousand years ago. Compare this to the evidence for the existence of God, can they compare? Compare your doctrine, which is to believe in God, the Last Day and follow the teachings of the last Prophet which were recorded later from what was remembered by the stories of the early companions to just believing in the One God the Last Day and being a righteous person. Which one is more universal and can work for ALL of mankind and which one is far more specific, tied to a specific language, culture and people and in the end, not so different from many of the other religions out there in the world? Either way, you are free to believe in what you want to believe, in the end, all of us will stand before God alone and He will judge us for what we did. Peace.
As a native arabic speaker it was frustrating to me ti highlight filthy things mentioned in the quran to non-arab muslims, as each time I want to reference a tafsir that clearly says something unethical in its original text, I find tens of english interpretations in English of the same verse.. And most of the interpretations in English have changed the original story behind a revelation or changed the initial meaning of a verse in the quran itself to make it seem more ethical and innocent.. For example the story of Zaid bin Harithah, Surah Al Ahzab-37 And how Mohammed made adoption haram because he desired sexually the wife of his adopted son, So the revelation came to him that Zaid divorces his wife so Mohammed could marry her, and made adoption haram at the same time because people at that time considered adopted sons as their real sons, and mohammed feared what people would think if they thought of him as someone who married his son's wife.. All of this story I read it from arabic tafsirs, but when it came to english, they changed the story and meanings..
They didn't change the meaning, you're just extrapolating here with ur own sense of morality, u viewing this relevalation differently than others doesn't mean the English translations have changed the Arabic
@scificyber they did in english they came up with a story that Zaid has some fights with his wife and that's why he no longer wanted her. While in arabic tafsirs, it mentioned that Mohammed once entered Zaid's House looking for him and he saw Zainab with little clothing by chance so he said out of amazement: Glory be to God, the Changer of hearts. Zainab heard the glorification and mentioned it to Zaid.
@fatimabn5136 verse and tafsir now. I'm sure you're telling the truth 🤣🤣 also why are u going to the tafsir, if the English translations changed the actual Arabic in the Qur'an, then there's no need for the tafsir?? 💀
Did you consider that maybe the English translations are meant to be explanations of the meaning for English speakers, so they gather information from tafsir as well in order to explain the ayah?
Going through various verses and different instances in the text to point out inaccuracies or mistakes is a trap. It will lead to endless debates which in turn are just a waste of time. It also isn't a convincing argument that can sway the masses. I think the Quran is an excellent book for guidance and contains profound wisdom but I don't associate it with God (shirk). A more universal argument for the Quran not being the preserved words of God is to simply mention that none of us were alive more than 1400 years ago so why would God judge all of mankind based off an event that happened more than 1400 years ago? Does the Quran not itself say that we will not be asked ANYTHING about what the people of the past did? Guess what, Prophet Muhammad and all of the Prophets mentioned in the Quran are from our past. If you learned something useful from the stories in the various scriptures, good for you, but make no mistake, to think that God would NOT judge you for what you did while you were alive and for your OWN choices makes no sense. Peace.
This is why we have tafsir, so people do not misuse their intellect and derive new meanings based on their whims. No one is being judged based on the actions of those before us, and we are not being asked about those before us. However, this does not contradict that we will be asked about our religion, prophet, and Lord. You simply took the ayah and exaggerated the meaning to a point which is not intended. The logic you used doesn't even rationally follow. You went from claiming that we will not be asked ANYTHING about the actions of past people, which is true. Then you concluded that because of this^ somehow that negates all of the prophets. Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us
@@oregonpath8756 You: "Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us" Me: My argument is not the Ayah, the Ayah just supports it. My argument started by asking questions outside of the Quran and coming to my own conclusions all outside of the Quran. The problem with Muslims is that they think everything or anything with any foundation pertaining to God and the Afterlife must begin from the Quran and this is how they shackle themselves. You think we will be asked who was the Prophet sent to us? You think we will be asked what is our Religion? Tell me, how did you come to know this? Did God tell you? Did you find it in the Quran? You were only asked to believe in God and the Day of Judgment and to be a righteous person but as is the nature of Mankind, they invent their own religions with new or altered beliefs, thus dividing Mankind even further into various sects. To believe in God, The Last Day and be a righteous person is a unifying message for all of Mankind. Religions just blind people away from this or cause them to forget. You think God will ask you who was your Prophet and what was your religion. Tell me how is this different from those who think that God wanted us to believe in an event that occurred more than 2000 years ago where the supposed son of God sacrificed himself for all of our sins and we can only be saved by believing in him? Christianity started as a belief in one God for 2 to 3 hundred years before it morphed into what it is today. Both Muslims and Christians now ask that their followers now no longer just believe in God but instead must believe all of these additional things stemming from a time before anyone of them was born. A time, given human advancement, that is completely alien to people today. How people belittle God, who created the Heavens and the Earth and everything in between. Billions of people are breathing, have hearts that beat, lungs that draw in air, blood cells that transport oxygen and contain each of our unique DNA, have neurons sending signals and are thinking thoughts at this very moment as I am typing this message. There are trees barren of leaves as some parts of the Earth go into winter and others full and blooming where the Earth is is in spring and summer. The Sun and the Moon and the stars continue on their coarse while every nano second there are those who believe in God and those that dont and those that follow a specific religion and those that don't go about their lives. All of this and near infinite more is happening all around us and will continue to happen all around us until God permits regardless of whether some people follow a religion or not. Yet Mankind thinks that God wants us to follow a specific religion and believe in a Prophet? How we belittle God by associating things with him. In the Quran his signs are mentioned in the trees/plants, the rain, the ocean, the mountains, the stars, our human condition, the bees and the animals. God provided near infinite evidence around us that point to his existence even though we can never see Him, thus it makes complete sense that He asks we ONLY believe in Him. Once we believe in Him as the creator of us and all around us, then it is natural to conclude that we will one day meet Him. The various scriptures that have survived to this day contain useful information and guidance but to think that the God who created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is in between in such perfection would want us to believe in something for which we were not even alive is simply not fair by any measure. Compare the signs that point to the existence of God to the flimsy man made arguments that each religion clings to and are proud of and that they fight each other over and will likely continue to fight each other over till Judgment Day (God only knows). Can they compare? No wonder that the Muslims around the world are in such disarray. Granted, the non-Muslim world is no heaven, but they are at least a free-er people who can make their own choices and not be indoctrinated into a world view from childhood that stunts their potential and puts hatred in their hearts for "non-believers". As I once mentioned before in another comment: In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is God, but if they all were to just settle with that, they would never know that there are those who see with two eyes. Those who only follow so called religious experts are blind. Their religious experts are one eyed men, each holding on to their scripture or prophet or religion or any combination of these things. Those who see with two eyes can see the bigger picture and realize that God only wanted Mankind to believe in Him, the Last Day and be good people. The Quran says, we became divided only AFTER God sent down his guidance or a messenger. So in other words, God wanted to unify us by sending down revelation and messengers but we only got divided further. So a good litmus test to root out corruption in the guidance is anything that divides people further like signaling out one Prophet above the others or thinking one of them was the son of God or each clinging to their ritualistic practices. Peace.
@@oregonpath8756 You: "Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us" Me: My argument is not the Ayah, the Ayah just supports it. My argument started by asking questions outside of the Quran and coming to my own conclusions all outside of the Quran. The problem with Muslims is that they think everything or anything with any foundation pertaining to God and the Afterlife must begin from the Quran and this is how they shackle themselves. You think we will be asked who was the Prophet sent to us? You think we will be asked what is our Religion? Tell me, how did you come to know this? Did God tell you? Did you find it in the Quran? You were only asked to believe in God and the Day of Judgment and to be a righteous person but as is the nature of Mankind, they invent their own religions with new or altered beliefs, thus dividing Mankind even further into various sects. To believe in God, The Last Day and be a righteous person is a unifying message for all of Mankind. Religions just blind people away from this or cause them to forget. You think God will ask you who was your Prophet and what was your religion. Tell me how is this different from those who think that God wanted us to believe in an event that occurred more than 2000 years ago where the supposed son of God sacrificed himself for all of our sins and we can only be saved by believing in him? Christianity started as a belief in one God for 2 to 3 hundred years before it morphed into what it is today. Both Muslims and Christians now ask that their followers now no longer just believe in God but instead must believe all of these additional things stemming from a time before anyone of them was born. A time, given human advancement, that is completely alien to people today. How people belittle God, who created the Heavens and the Earth and everything in between. Billions of people are breathing, have hearts that beat, lungs that draw in air, blood cells that transport oxygen and contain each of our unique DNA, have neurons sending signals and are thinking thoughts at this very moment as I am typing this message. There are trees barren of leaves as some parts of the Earth go into winter and others full and blooming where the Earth is is in spring and summer. The Sun and the Moon and the stars continue on their coarse while every nano second there are those who believe in God and those that dont and those that follow a specific religion and those that don't go about their lives. All of this and near infinite more is happening all around us and will continue to happen all around us until God permits regardless of whether some people follow a religion or not. Yet Mankind thinks that God wants us to follow a specific religion and believe in a Prophet? How we belittle God by associating things with him. In the Quran his signs are mentioned in the trees/plants, the rain, the ocean, the mountains, the stars, our human condition, the bees and the animals. God provided near infinite evidence around us that point to his existence even though we can never see Him, thus it makes complete sense that He asks we ONLY believe in Him. Once we believe in Him as the creator of us and all around us, then it is natural to conclude that we will one day meet Him. The various scriptures that have survived to this day contain useful information and guidance but to think that the God who created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is in between in such perfection would want us to believe in something for which we were not even alive is simply not fair by any measure. Compare the signs that point to the existence of God to the flimsy man made arguments that each religion clings to and are proud of and that they fight each other over and will likely continue to fight each other over till Judgment Day (God only knows). Can they compare? No wonder that the Muslims around the world are in such disarray. Granted, the non-Muslim world is no heaven, but they are at least a free-er people who can make their own choices and not be indoctrinated into a world view from childhood that stunts their potential and puts hatred in their hearts for "non-believers". As I once mentioned before in another comment: In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is God, but if they all were to just settle with that, they would never know that there are those who see with two eyes. Those who only follow so called religious experts are blind. Their religious experts are one eyed men, each holding on to their scripture or prophet or religion or any combination of these things. Those who see with two eyes can see the bigger picture and realize that God only wanted Mankind to believe in Him, the Last Day and be good people. The Quran says, we became divided only AFTER God sent down his guidance or a messenger. So in other words, God wanted to unify us by sending down revelation and messengers but we only got divided further. So a good litmus test to root out corruption in the guidance is anything that divides people further like signaling out one Prophet above the others or thinking one of them was the son of God or each clinging to their ritualistic practices. Peace.
Pointing out inaccuracies or mistakes is a completely valid approach. If the Qur'an contains a contradiction, then by its own standard is not from divinity, and it contains many contradictions despite the attempts at sophistry from the dawah community.
@@oregonpath8756 "Misuse their intellect" is a very cultish phrase, nice. Qur'an says its kitaab al-mubeen, written in simple/clear Arabic. If that was the case, you wouldn't need thousands of pages of tafsir and sharh of the tafsir and so on. Also, you cannot use the phrase "where is the logic" since logic and philosophy is haram.
Good video. With many translations available, indeed a critical analysis of the Qur'an may be done without knowing Arabic. This is similarly done in critical analysis of the Bible. However, knowledge of Greek and Aramaic is helpful in deciphering words when examining historical copies of the text. For practical purposes of interpretation, having several professional translations at hand does the job 99.995% of the time.
Even as someone who speaks Arabic myself, its still hard to understand these words, and they all have different historic meaning to modern day Arabic. Thats why we also study how to read the Quran in school because knowing Arabic is not enough.
You don't speak Arabic, you speak an Arabic dialect that itself got influenced by years of the colonizers language
@@ThePriceIsNeverRight Yeah thats Arabic today so I do speak Arabic
@@ThePriceIsNeverRightthe original Arabic language of the Quran and classical texts is preserved and engaged with to this very day lol
@@CourtOfKnowledge I know dummy, what's that has to do with my initial comment?
The "learn arabic before judging quran" card is getting old.
We don't see muslims learn Greek and Latin before judging the Bible.
@@thefunder1 As a Muslim I agree.
because muslims critizes the bible on things that even biblical schoolars agree on
because greek isn't as eloquence as Arabic.
@@MHD69420 So?
@@platorsokoli1706 Non Muslims criticize the Qur'an on things that even Muslim scholars agree on.
This is accurate.
A great book is 'Nothing to do with Islam' by Peter Townsend.
Please continue to publish videos, good sir. 🙏🏽
This is a very good and important video, thank you very much.
i read word by word translation.
you get a different feeling with the arabic layout. hits different.
3rd: TBM/BTQ Merry Christmas Hanukkah Kwanzaa New Year! Why don't you use your community tab?
From my experience google translation made more accurate translations than CHATgpt, because Ai takes into account the translations that were already made by scholars.. However google translates, uses neutral translation word for word..
Muslims call me shameless hater but do not say a single word to the verse that commands the execution of apostates.
This religion would not have survived if their book was not threating people constantly with hellfire, and if there was no apostasy law.
Combine this with 1400+ years and you get the picture of middle eastern world
there is not a single verse in the quran that calls for the executon of apostates. U clearly dont have a clue
what ur critizing
@@platorsokoli1706 lol
Part of the point of obeying Allah is in fearing His punishment, and this isn't exclusive to Islam nor is it problematic for a rational person. People who do evil will be punished, it is that simple. Those who don't want to be punished, do not do evil. Simple.
As for hudood, it is part of Islam and no one denies it. The problem I see with this reasoning is it misses the point. The Hudood can only be judged right or wrong if Islam is right or wrong, so if we believe in Islam then we see no issue with it because we know it is from Allah. So what is more important is for a person to investigate the truthfulness of the prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم to ascertain whether his religion was true rather than being upset about aspects of his religion you disagree with.
I'm positive the verse "do not take christians and jews as friends" is not hateful.
Muslims define the double standarts and they believe their taqiyya works on everyone.
@@platorsokoli1706 If you deny the hudud punishment for apostasy then you are a kafir.
so let us be clear your whole argument is centered at the word فا
we can use فا in many diffrent ways
just like فا كانا هناك ولد يلعب "There was a boy playing"
not "then" to be seen. فا in conclusion can also mean in the same time
TBM/BTQ Merry Christmas Hanukkah Kwanzaa & New Year! So are there any Muslim ex-Christian equivalents of you? Lol
Dude even arabs dont understand quran. It's hard to understand these old craps alone. You always need to refer to scholars and tafassirs
If you are a Muslim, do not use the word crap to refer to the Quran because it is the speech of Allah, it is not crap.
The god Almighty says it was his will and plan to make momo marry his adopted son's wife.
Continue believing this religion@@oregonpath8756
@oregonpath8756 the quran is bs. Im an arab ex muslim. Allah hadnt any better options than making the fate of humanity in the hands of a nomidian man lived between sand hills. Like fr it could have been better if he 'sent' his last messenger now with the internet and phones. Wake up. There is no god that contacted the human with a book
@@oregonpath8756 It's crap dude, just look at the book. It says nothing like the Fatihah has been revealed before and yet it's the exact same as the Lord's prayer in its subject and formatting.
@@INDIA-ep6qn
Some of the things in Islam are consistent with previous revelation, and some of it abrogates previous revelation, so it is not surprising or problematic if al Fatihah is similar to the Lord's prayer they recite in Christianity
Debate me
If Islam is false, then all other religion is MORE false.
You mean "let me sit you down where I have a closed mind and you have an open one while I try and psychologically manipulate you into believing my BS"
Lol this is such a lousy and weak attempt. The Quran is so fortified and protected that even if you learn Arabic you can’t just get a good understanding of the Quran. Rather, the reason why the tenants of Islam have remained preserved and unchanged for 1400 years is because whenever we want to understand the Quran, we correspond it with the Sunnah (Hadiths) and the understanding of the Salaf (the companions of the Prophet ﷺ). This gives us a complete understanding of the verse at hand.
Anyone who has studied basic Tafsir would know that the highest rank of Tafsir is when a verse of the Quran explains another verse, next - when a Hadith explains a verse, then - when a scholar from the Salaf explains a verse, finally - the Arabic language.
Not only are you entirely misinformed about the Islamic tradition - you are leading other Christians astray from trying to be decently level headed in seeking the genuine truth
If you cannot get a good understanding of the Quran even if you learn Arabic, then it is not kitaab al-mubeen. It is not a clear book.
Your entire argument boiled down to:
1. Even learning Arabic is not enough to understand the Quran.
2. There are a special group of human beings who explained Gods guidance and we need to listen to them.
The Quran asks those who followed their forefathers guidance: "Even when they were misguided?"
The Quran says that Prophet Ibrahim's father and people were in manifest error for following their ancestors.
The Quran mentions Pharoah asking Prophet Moses: "What of our learned ancestors?" to which Moses dismissed: "Their record is with my Lord and my Lord does not forget, nor does he make mistakes"
@@INDIA-ep6qn no anyone can get a good understanding of it if they tried. The part about the Quran being “Mubeen” is about the Quran itself - as for human beings then it’s up to them to use this Quran and learn it.
So the fault is on the user not the Quran
@@frostpitt you have unfortunately drawn a false analogy. When I said that there is a special group of human beings - the intention here is that these very select human beings are necessarily given authority to explain the Quran becuase the Quran itself gives them this authority:
“**As for the foremost-the first of the Emigrants and the Helpers** and those who follow them in goodness, Allah is pleased with them and they are pleased with Him”
(9:100)
“And whoever defies the Messenger after guidance has become clear to them and follows a path **other than that of the believers**, We will let them pursue what they have chosen, then burn them in Hell-what an evil end!”
(4:115)
The issue with following any other human is exactly as you said. As for the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ and his companions - it is necessary for every Muslim to follow them, as they were the very people that the Quran was revealed upon
@@CourtOfKnowledge I think you come to this conclusion because you probably think every verse from the Quran is from God. I dont.
The very next verse after 4:116 states God will not forgive those who make a partner with Him yet there are verses in the Quran like Obey Allah and Obey the Messenger and others like 4:115 which confuse the matter.
No one alive today can confirm or attest that the Quran we have today is the same that was revealed to Prophet Muhammad. Everything they say about the matter is from 2nd hand or 10th hand opinions from more than a thousand years ago. Compare this to the evidence for the existence of God, can they compare?
Compare your doctrine, which is to believe in God, the Last Day and follow the teachings of the last Prophet which were recorded later from what was remembered by the stories of the early companions to just believing in the One God the Last Day and being a righteous person. Which one is more universal and can work for ALL of mankind and which one is far more specific, tied to a specific language, culture and people and in the end, not so different from many of the other religions out there in the world?
Either way, you are free to believe in what you want to believe, in the end, all of us will stand before God alone and He will judge us for what we did.
Peace.
As a native arabic speaker it was frustrating to me ti highlight filthy things mentioned in the quran to non-arab muslims, as each time I want to reference a tafsir that clearly says something unethical in its original text, I find tens of english interpretations in English of the same verse.. And most of the interpretations in English have changed the original story behind a revelation or changed the initial meaning of a verse in the quran itself to make it seem more ethical and innocent..
For example the story of Zaid bin Harithah, Surah Al Ahzab-37
And how Mohammed made adoption haram because he desired sexually the wife of his adopted son,
So the revelation came to him that Zaid divorces his wife so Mohammed could marry her, and made adoption haram at the same time because people at that time considered adopted sons as their real sons, and mohammed feared what people would think if they thought of him as someone who married his son's wife..
All of this story I read it from arabic tafsirs, but when it came to english, they changed the story and meanings..
They didn't change the meaning, you're just extrapolating here with ur own sense of morality, u viewing this relevalation differently than others doesn't mean the English translations have changed the Arabic
@scificyber they did in english they came up with a story that Zaid has some fights with his wife and that's why he no longer wanted her. While in arabic tafsirs, it mentioned that Mohammed once entered Zaid's House looking for him and he saw Zainab with little clothing by chance so he said out of amazement:
Glory be to God, the Changer of hearts. Zainab heard the glorification and mentioned it to Zaid.
@fatimabn5136 verse and tafsir now. I'm sure you're telling the truth 🤣🤣 also why are u going to the tafsir, if the English translations changed the actual Arabic in the Qur'an, then there's no need for the tafsir?? 💀
Did you consider that maybe the English translations are meant to be explanations of the meaning for English speakers, so they gather information from tafsir as well in order to explain the ayah?
Going through various verses and different instances in the text to point out inaccuracies or mistakes is a trap. It will lead to endless debates which in turn are just a waste of time. It also isn't a convincing argument that can sway the masses.
I think the Quran is an excellent book for guidance and contains profound wisdom but I don't associate it with God (shirk).
A more universal argument for the Quran not being the preserved words of God is to simply mention that none of us were alive more than 1400 years ago so why would God judge all of mankind based off an event that happened more than 1400 years ago? Does the Quran not itself say that we will not be asked ANYTHING about what the people of the past did? Guess what, Prophet Muhammad and all of the Prophets mentioned in the Quran are from our past.
If you learned something useful from the stories in the various scriptures, good for you, but make no mistake, to think that God would NOT judge you for what you did while you were alive and for your OWN choices makes no sense.
Peace.
This is why we have tafsir, so people do not misuse their intellect and derive new meanings based on their whims. No one is being judged based on the actions of those before us, and we are not being asked about those before us. However, this does not contradict that we will be asked about our religion, prophet, and Lord. You simply took the ayah and exaggerated the meaning to a point which is not intended. The logic you used doesn't even rationally follow.
You went from claiming that we will not be asked ANYTHING about the actions of past people, which is true.
Then you concluded that because of this^ somehow that negates all of the prophets. Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us
@@oregonpath8756 You: "Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us"
Me: My argument is not the Ayah, the Ayah just supports it. My argument started by asking questions outside of the Quran and coming to my own conclusions all outside of the Quran. The problem with Muslims is that they think everything or anything with any foundation pertaining to God and the Afterlife must begin from the Quran and this is how they shackle themselves.
You think we will be asked who was the Prophet sent to us? You think we will be asked what is our Religion? Tell me, how did you come to know this? Did God tell you? Did you find it in the Quran? You were only asked to believe in God and the Day of Judgment and to be a righteous person but as is the nature of Mankind, they invent their own religions with new or altered beliefs, thus dividing Mankind even further into various sects. To believe in God, The Last Day and be a righteous person is a unifying message for all of Mankind. Religions just blind people away from this or cause them to forget.
You think God will ask you who was your Prophet and what was your religion. Tell me how is this different from those who think that God wanted us to believe in an event that occurred more than 2000 years ago where the supposed son of God sacrificed himself for all of our sins and we can only be saved by believing in him? Christianity started as a belief in one God for 2 to 3 hundred years before it morphed into what it is today. Both Muslims and Christians now ask that their followers now no longer just believe in God but instead must believe all of these additional things stemming from a time before anyone of them was born. A time, given human advancement, that is completely alien to people today.
How people belittle God, who created the Heavens and the Earth and everything in between. Billions of people are breathing, have hearts that beat, lungs that draw in air, blood cells that transport oxygen and contain each of our unique DNA, have neurons sending signals and are thinking thoughts at this very moment as I am typing this message. There are trees barren of leaves as some parts of the Earth go into winter and others full and blooming where the Earth is is in spring and summer. The Sun and the Moon and the stars continue on their coarse while every nano second there are those who believe in God and those that dont and those that follow a specific religion and those that don't go about their lives. All of this and near infinite more is happening all around us and will continue to happen all around us until God permits regardless of whether some people follow a religion or not. Yet Mankind thinks that God wants us to follow a specific religion and believe in a Prophet? How we belittle God by associating things with him.
In the Quran his signs are mentioned in the trees/plants, the rain, the ocean, the mountains, the stars, our human condition, the bees and the animals. God provided near infinite evidence around us that point to his existence even though we can never see Him, thus it makes complete sense that He asks we ONLY believe in Him. Once we believe in Him as the creator of us and all around us, then it is natural to conclude that we will one day meet Him. The various scriptures that have survived to this day contain useful information and guidance but to think that the God who created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is in between in such perfection would want us to believe in something for which we were not even alive is simply not fair by any measure. Compare the signs that point to the existence of God to the flimsy man made arguments that each religion clings to and are proud of and that they fight each other over and will likely continue to fight each other over till Judgment Day (God only knows). Can they compare?
No wonder that the Muslims around the world are in such disarray. Granted, the non-Muslim world is no heaven, but they are at least a free-er people who can make their own choices and not be indoctrinated into a world view from childhood that stunts their potential and puts hatred in their hearts for "non-believers".
As I once mentioned before in another comment: In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is God, but if they all were to just settle with that, they would never know that there are those who see with two eyes. Those who only follow so called religious experts are blind. Their religious experts are one eyed men, each holding on to their scripture or prophet or religion or any combination of these things. Those who see with two eyes can see the bigger picture and realize that God only wanted Mankind to believe in Him, the Last Day and be good people.
The Quran says, we became divided only AFTER God sent down his guidance or a messenger. So in other words, God wanted to unify us by sending down revelation and messengers but we only got divided further. So a good litmus test to root out corruption in the guidance is anything that divides people further like signaling out one Prophet above the others or thinking one of them was the son of God or each clinging to their ritualistic practices.
Peace.
@@oregonpath8756 You: "Where is the logic? We aren't being asked about the actions of past people, but we will be asked about what we did as far as who is our Lord, who was the Prophet sent to us, and what was our Religion. All of which are our OWN actions. May Allah guide you and us"
Me: My argument is not the Ayah, the Ayah just supports it. My argument started by asking questions outside of the Quran and coming to my own conclusions all outside of the Quran. The problem with Muslims is that they think everything or anything with any foundation pertaining to God and the Afterlife must begin from the Quran and this is how they shackle themselves.
You think we will be asked who was the Prophet sent to us? You think we will be asked what is our Religion? Tell me, how did you come to know this? Did God tell you? Did you find it in the Quran? You were only asked to believe in God and the Day of Judgment and to be a righteous person but as is the nature of Mankind, they invent their own religions with new or altered beliefs, thus dividing Mankind even further into various sects. To believe in God, The Last Day and be a righteous person is a unifying message for all of Mankind. Religions just blind people away from this or cause them to forget.
You think God will ask you who was your Prophet and what was your religion. Tell me how is this different from those who think that God wanted us to believe in an event that occurred more than 2000 years ago where the supposed son of God sacrificed himself for all of our sins and we can only be saved by believing in him? Christianity started as a belief in one God for 2 to 3 hundred years before it morphed into what it is today. Both Muslims and Christians now ask that their followers now no longer just believe in God but instead must believe all of these additional things stemming from a time before anyone of them was born. A time, given human advancement, that is completely alien to people today.
How people belittle God, who created the Heavens and the Earth and everything in between. Billions of people are breathing, have hearts that beat, lungs that draw in air, blood cells that transport oxygen and contain each of our unique DNA, have neurons sending signals and are thinking thoughts at this very moment as I am typing this message. There are trees barren of leaves as some parts of the Earth go into winter and others full and blooming where the Earth is is in spring and summer. The Sun and the Moon and the stars continue on their coarse while every nano second there are those who believe in God and those that dont and those that follow a specific religion and those that don't go about their lives. All of this and near infinite more is happening all around us and will continue to happen all around us until God permits regardless of whether some people follow a religion or not. Yet Mankind thinks that God wants us to follow a specific religion and believe in a Prophet? How we belittle God by associating things with him.
In the Quran his signs are mentioned in the trees/plants, the rain, the ocean, the mountains, the stars, our human condition, the bees and the animals. God provided near infinite evidence around us that point to his existence even though we can never see Him, thus it makes complete sense that He asks we ONLY believe in Him. Once we believe in Him as the creator of us and all around us, then it is natural to conclude that we will one day meet Him. The various scriptures that have survived to this day contain useful information and guidance but to think that the God who created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is in between in such perfection would want us to believe in something for which we were not even alive is simply not fair by any measure. Compare the signs that point to the existence of God to the flimsy man made arguments that each religion clings to and are proud of and that they fight each other over and will likely continue to fight each other over till Judgment Day (God only knows). Can they compare?
No wonder that the Muslims around the world are in such disarray. Granted, the non-Muslim world is no heaven, but they are at least a free-er people who can make their own choices and not be indoctrinated into a world view from childhood that stunts their potential and puts hatred in their hearts for "non-believers".
As I once mentioned before in another comment: In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is God, but if they all were to just settle with that, they would never know that there are those who see with two eyes. Those who only follow so called religious experts are blind. Their religious experts are one eyed men, each holding on to their scripture or prophet or religion or any combination of these things. Those who see with two eyes can see the bigger picture and realize that God only wanted Mankind to believe in Him, the Last Day and be good people.
The Quran says, we became divided only AFTER God sent down his guidance or a messenger. So in other words, God wanted to unify us by sending down revelation and messengers but we only got divided further. So a good litmus test to root out corruption in the guidance is anything that divides people further like signaling out one Prophet above the others or thinking one of them was the son of God or each clinging to their ritualistic practices.
Peace.
Pointing out inaccuracies or mistakes is a completely valid approach. If the Qur'an contains a contradiction, then by its own standard is not from divinity, and it contains many contradictions despite the attempts at sophistry from the dawah community.
@@oregonpath8756 "Misuse their intellect" is a very cultish phrase, nice. Qur'an says its kitaab al-mubeen, written in simple/clear Arabic. If that was the case, you wouldn't need thousands of pages of tafsir and sharh of the tafsir and so on.
Also, you cannot use the phrase "where is the logic" since logic and philosophy is haram.